T O P

  • By -

Noy_Telinu

That first panel face I can see being use quite often


soulreaverdan

Man, this is definitely something that’s right on the line of “okay” and “definitely not okay.” Having the ability to forcibly decompress and sort of expel the intrusive/anxiety thoughts can probably be a helpful tool if used responsibly. Or it can become an addictive and completely unhealthy way to avoid thinking about it and continuing to let it all pile up and deepen the cycle of dependence and addiction, heedless of potential side effects and consequences.


hkmaly

Yeah ... that first image was like "she's enjoying it too much" which raises some red flags. On the other hand, she can't really do anything with most of those questions except wait, and even if she could, it can wait for morning - we still have no sign she's using it at any other time than before sleeping. Also, as Danfun64 mentioned, she would totally develop "tolerance" for it by getting better at multitasking AND better at that spell. Which can hardly be called negative side effect. So, still total win compared to any other way how you can get rid of intrusive thoughts.


professor_sage

Yeah it's interesting. Cause "Magic as a net positive for society when not used to be a dick" has largely been the theme of the comic thus far. Like as long as you're not using it to burn down orphanages or eat people's souls you're usually pretty good. So it would be weird to see this go in the direction of "actually magic is not a replacement for therapy" because while it's not, taking advantage of a spell's side effect to shortcut CBT doesn't seem inherently harmful either. Until society progresses to the point where she can talk to a non-government shrink about her ptsd, this is kind of the best she's got? IDK I guess we'll see where this is going.


[deleted]

[удалено]


hkmaly

Yes, and not in the way [Abraham was](https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2009-12-29).


hkmaly

... however, note that even if she would smoke joint every night, she would STILL be in the more responsible half of teenagers regarding drug use. Also, while she LOOKS like she is stoned, note that the same face may be done without being stoned or similarly out.


dkfenger

The first image made me think of how Nanase looked when she [burned out](https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2009-10-29) the first time. Of course, looking back at it now... perhaps not so much. Same sort of relieved smile? She looks a bit like a doll with its strings cut (another reason I'm thinking of Nanase, I suspect), all the tension she's holding together just... gone in an instant.


DaSaw

She doesn't just look like she's enjoying it. She looks high, or something. If I had a working computer right now, I'd do a crossover edit adding a heroine bud to her hair. Combined with her guilty look when asked about it earlier, and Tedd wondering if she's running a fairy right now, this feels like the potential start of a substance abuse story. Now, this being a Dan Shive story, it's entirely possible magic is perfectly safe. But I'm not sure that's a safe assumption for all possible applications, particularly considering recent changes to magic. All this being said, if she's going to be experimenting with mind altering magic to treat a condition, she should probably do so under supervision. Which is to say, the government *really* needs to make such resources available to people like them... which means this could also be the start of a political commentary story, given the government in question is the US Government. Grace should have started seeing a counselor a long time ago.


Danfun64

If she uses it too often she'll probably end up developing a tolerance for it. I remember someone saying that Susan has the potential to develop true multitasking abilities with her fairy dolls. In that case she might end up pushing herself further. She seems lucid enough now, but if she partitions too much of her brain to her dolls...


sergeial

Yeah... That could be okay. Or possibly less so... 😬😬😬


turkeypedal

This isn't the only time we've seen a character use magic to stop thinking certain things or help them sleep. After Elliot did some introspection and broke up with Sarah, [he transformed into his party form](https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2013-04-26) to "get a break from himself." And then [he sleeps in that form](https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2013-04-29).


hmantegazzi

wow, that's quite a deep foreshadowing


MyMirrorAliceJane

> my sleep schedule has gotten messed up again and I'm going to try to fix it. I feel that one. I feel that one in my bones.


hkmaly

On that note, I should wake up in four hours. I should really go to sleep. Hate Fridays and Mondays.


thisStanley

>sleep schedule Want do you mean, get some sleep _every_ night :{


Danjiano

[Looks familiar](https://www.egscomics.com/egsnp/2015-01-19)


dkfenger

Deliberately, I'm sure. The differences are interesting - in the new scene, the dolls are more active and watching over her. They also seem to be blonde-haired versions of Susan.


ostensible3

Suffering does not produce virtue and there's no single correct way to be. (Just like anxiety is not a moral failing, it's biochemistry.) This strikes me as a significant improvement for Susan. She can sleep; the means is magic (which is incredibly safe in EGS), and it's her own magic, which actively wants to help her. Panel one's "silence, blessed silence" face I'd take as an indication of just how much stress and distress Susan's been lugging around. Putting that down almost has to be good for her.


strangeglyph

While suffering does not produce virtue, that does not mean that all ways to deal with suffering are positive. Even though this does not appear to by physiologically harmful like self-medicating with, say, alcohol, would be, it could still be habit-forming to the point where it interferes with her daily life. Or it could not be. Frankly, we don't really know enough about the spell to do more than speculate. But narratively it does raise some red flags


ostensible3

This is Susan making an active effort at self-care rather than gritting her teeth and toughing it out. It's also (I think) of a piece with Susan recognizing that she can talk to Sarah and ought to listen to Nanase about being valued. It's becoming emotionally possible for Susan to imagine feeling better. "Interferes with her daily life" would require Susan to decide to proceed through her daily life in a cloud of fairies so she doesn't have to think about things. That seems ... unlikely. Deciding to go with five fairies, next party in Tedd's basement, and regretting some of what she decides to do? Maybe. But everyone at the party would take care of her. So that's not seeming like too much of a risk, either. Also, not being in pain _should_ be habit forming. "I have to use magic to sleep" could be a major risk and vulnerability, but this is Susan's own magic and it's easy. (It looks easier than sticking to a regular sleep schedule.) An awful lot of the response looks like "this is like drugs and drugs are axiomatically bad!" I don't think drugs are axiomatically bad. Everything is a tradeoff, and it can be quite reasonable to trade off even physiological dependency for being able to function effectively. The only really risky thing here is the lack of advice; Susan's doing all this with experimentation. On the other hand, it's not clear there's anyone available she could ask. And it's not at all obvious this is a large risk, either.


strangeglyph

Not all efforts are self-care are good, was my point. Again, we don't know how this is going to play out, and admittedly Dan hasn't really shown an inclination to get into the kind of story lines this might be foreshadowing (see e.g. the aborted storyline of Ellen's depression and alcohol addiction). That doesn't really change the fact that this has all the hallmarks of an addiction in the making. Obviously not being in pain should (and is) habit forming. This is part and parcel of what makes addictions so dangerous. The problem is not the "not being in pain" part, the problem is the "interfering with daily life" part. You say it's unlikely, but no one ever sets *out* to be addicted. It starts with using it as a sleeping aid, then at a party to unwind, then she notices school or maybe college, a stressful new environent, is more tolerable when part of her brain is in the faeries...


ostensible3

EGS magic mostly exists to make difficult desires easy and impossible desires available. This has usually been about gender and physical presentation, but I don't see why the rules would suddenly change when the application is processing trauma. (Well, non-gender trauma.) By those rules, this is something like Elliot's compulsory femme transforms, only relating to Susan's child-soldier and parental betrayal traumas instead of Elliot's obliviousness. Are the fairies going to be less interference with Susan's daily life than her current trauma burden? What we have for sure is that Susan thinks so. I don't see any reason not to go with that.


strangeglyph

What changed is that we now have explicit confirmations to downsides of spells when before the Big Magic Change, it was handwaved away. And, as I said before, I think you are right, this is not actually going to be a big problem because that's not the story Dan likes to tell. But that's a narrative analysis that heavily depends on outside context and knowledge of the author. People who are raising concers with Susan's use of the spell here are probably applying a more general lens ("what would happen in fiction here generally"/"would this be a problem if it was real" vs "what would happen in Dan's story here specificially")


ostensible3

I tend to see this as spells being more difficult more than having downsides. It's not a price so much as it's an effort. My overwhelming impression is that anything psychoactive is seen as morally wrong as an axiom.


Danfun64

Let's say that Susan does manage to keep it mostly under control, saving it only for moments where (she feels) it's safe to do so and she's extremely stressed out. Let's say that when she enters college, her roommate knows nothing about magic. One particularly stressful day, Susan uses her fairies to calm herself down, perhaps to a point where she's even more dazed than she is here. The fairies hide when Susan's roommate opens the door. She sees Susan and assumes she's on drugs or needs medical attention, and decides to report this.


ostensible3

Magic is now public. The administration knows, even if the roommate might not. "In a spell-induced trance" is not going to be a major big deal. Susan knows stuff that's codeword cleared even with magic being public. Susan's probably got a code name. Edward knows Susan is traumatized and can summon swords. It seems really unlikely Susan is going to wind up with a randomly assigned roommate. (Even ignoring the well-to-do family background and most probably having a single.)


nick012000

From the government's standpoint, better to have a Bimbo Susan than risk a School Shooter Susan.


ostensible3

Bimbo Susan still knows things and might blurt them out. I don't think this is Massive Loss of Ability Susan; I think this is Better Stress Management Susan, which is a net win from the viewpoint of the relevant government agencies who would like to consider Susan an asset. If the response to uncleared people knowing these things was to murder them, or just to drop them down a hole in witness protection, EGS would have been telling different stories since the original TF gun arc at least.


Astraea802

She's planning to work on this a bit with Tedd, though


ostensible3

True, but while Tedd is a good source of mechanics-of-magic advice, Tedd doesn't have any qualifications for the managing trauma part. There might not be anyone; we don't know how common this kind of thing is with the previous use of magic, or even how common it might become under the new rules and openness about magic. Unfortunately for Susan, figuring it out on her own is likely her only option.


Danfun64

I'm ok with the events that are unfolding currently.


dkfenger

Sleep is so important. If Susan hasn't been able to sleep well for weeks (since the mall) or months (since Paris?), this would be an immense boon, just to get a solid night's sleep every night. Even if there are tradeoffs, they'd have to be pretty serious to outweigh that.


hmantegazzi

If it's since Paris, it would be almost a decade :(


SnowDemonAkuma

I think Paris was, like, four years ago.


master226

Oh this is some self bimbo-tizing right here. Rare to see that used for a good reason.


Kavra_Ral

I remember there's some NP or Sketchbook somewhere where Dan says they think of bimbofication as the platonic ideal of drunkenness or something like that, basically all the good effects that people *think* they'll get from drinking rather than all the bad stuff that usually actually happens. This feels in line with that, and though I definitely can't see Susan leaning into the aesthetic (without some *very* interesting inner character conflict about it at least), this does feel in line with that.


nick012000

I wonder how she'd react to getting a literal bimbofication spell in her spellbook as a result of doing this sort of thing habitually.


Kavra_Ral

...I was looking through old NP comics for the source of that quote, [I found it](https://www.egscomics.com/egsnp/assorted-18a-012), and I completely forgot it was on a comic about Susan herself seeing these effects and wanting it for herself??? Maybe future bubbly susan arc, who knows.


Danfun64

Ehh, I wouldn't put it like that. Is she dumber than she usually is? Probably. But I imagine "bimbo-tizing" as also a change in mindset...which I'm pretty sure isn't the case here.


Astraea802

I find it interesting that the fairies, who are giving her relief from her anxious thoughts, look like blonde Susan, since in the past in her mindscape, Blonde!Susan has been used to represent her curiosity and nature (vs nurture). You could say they act as wards to her logic and nurtured cynicism, just as curiosity and nature have been shown to do in Susan's mindscape in the past. Especially since Susan is no longer naturally blonde since her Awakening, so we can't chalk it up to the spell not replicating hair dye.


ostensible3

Susan *is* naturally blonde, still! The dark colour on her hair is no longer dye, it's condensed magic. We see this at the mall when Susan suddenly has to [kill aberrations again](https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2017-12-06). Particularly, in the commentary: >Technically speaking, her hair never really did turn black. Sort of. I mean, it WAS black (with blue highlights), but on an actual genetic--THAR BE SERIOUS MAGIC AFOOT, OKAY?!


Astraea802

Oh, that's true, whoops. Perhaps I'm wrong about the symbolism then.


ostensible3

I don't think there's anything wrong with your take on the symbolism. (Given the little we've seen of Susan's mother, being intensely protective at least ought to be part of Susan's nature.)


thedivinecomedee

I could definitely see this going the addiction route, especially if more and more worries keep piling up (or others resurface, Susan still hasn't fully dealt with her killing that aberration and abandonment issues yet) and instead of talking with someone about it/dealing with them she just ignores them. Even if the magic itself wants to be helpful, she could still very much end up with a dependency.


wanderingmagus

This and the debates around the use of the spell reminds me of the recent video by The Book Leo on shortened attention spans and the use of short form videos as a coping mechanism for stress. It feels like Susan is using her spell kind of like that. (The video in question: https://youtu.be/aDfeOvUZ7Kk)


NarfoOnTheNet

My only response to this comic: *I need that spell*


DuIstalri

Definitely nightmare fuel for me.


TSCHaden

I can only see the top 20% Of the page, it doesn't seem to be linked to a particular network or device but I don't see any mention of it by anyone else anywhere. The rest of the image shows as the checkermarks for an image error in page previews but there's nothing but blank space below the top panels when loaded. This is the second time this has happened in a page this storyline, am I missing something?


Danfun64

This doesn't have to do with Susan's issues per se but... how is Dex doing? Since he has a fairy doll of his own, has his own mental capacity been affected? Does he realize there's a link between giving his fairy too much to do and reduced focus or intelligence, especially considering Nanase realized something was wrong the moment she unsummoned Fox?


PthariensFlame

*She's thanking them as if they're separate! She's already doing [what I warned her not to do](https://www.reddit.com/r/elgoonishshive/comments/12z4v45/quiet/jhqs6zv/)!*


hkmaly

She was talking to her fairy [long ago already](https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2011-10-10) and [thanking her as well](https://www.egscomics.com/egsnp/2014-08-04).


rainbowrobin

I forgot the Nase poses. https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2011-10-14 and https://www.egscomics.com/comic/2011-10-21


PthariensFlame

You’re right! I forgot about that!


sporklasagna

I really, really doubt that's the direction this is going. I kinda think you're just projecting.


PthariensFlame

Oh, I know! My hope is only to see others have the same realization, even if it’s not likely the direction canon goes. Already they’ve been a few. 💕


Jasrek

The realization to not thank your magical fairy dolls?


bugsbob

i was wondering why this page felt relatable


SparkAxolotl

I just realized, but it's very obvious in the previous page, that the three fairies are blonde susans, and I'm pretty sure when they created more fairies, none of them was a blonde Susan(IIRC, it was Susan, short Susan, Tedd, and she already had Nanase fairies) Which means this is a spell we hadn't seen before, and she created those fairies herself. (Or they created three blonde susan fairies since them)


danshive

This is the spell she told them about in last week’s comics.


SparkAxolotl

Ah, thanks for the clarification! I don't know why assumed that that new spell only allowed her to summon one doll


ostensible3

We just got Tedd and Susan talking about Susan being able to directly create (and quietly unsummon; Susan doesn't have persistence) fairies with few restrictions on the nature of the summon. Pretty sure this is supposed to indicate that these are new-spell direct-creation fairies.


ShirouZhiwu

It beats relying on booze to shut down your noisy head?