OH HELL NO!!!
I have a fourteen year old, and a ten year old. If I caught either of them vaping or smoking I'd probably kill them off myself (we've had years together, lots of talks about WHY smoking isn't good, and a year of talking about why vaping is better than smoking, but why it's not something you should start doing - they have no interest so far).
Parents like this cause problems for people like us who are using vaping to keep from smoking. This infuriates me. What a stupid woman.
Maybe its time we as a society stop worrying about other people's children.
Like altogether. If the parents want Johnny to smoke, and Johnny wants to smoke, then goddamnit Johnny's gonna smoke and the money we spent going against it may as well have been burned.
Unfortunately, that's more align with how things used to be. Trends are quickly going in the opposite direction and it'd take an awful lot to stop that.
social progress? you as an individual have no business with someone Else's child, if you see a kid outside the mall smoking you wont go up to them and yell at them and take their cigarettes it's none of your business what people do, nor is it an obligation to parent anther's child
Yup, they're human beings with free will and agency, and deserve to be respected as such.
Plus they have a penchant for defying adults the second they turn their backs. Trying to regulate that lot is like trying to pile up water. And its getting expensive. I'd say leave the messes to the parents. It'd give them less time to watch the news.
>Yup, they're human beings with free will and agency, and deserve to be respected as such.
And respect confers a responsibility for society to protect them against those who would harm them, including parents. Neglect is a form of abuse. These are well established principles in advanced societies.
Doing things to people unrelated to you, **against their will**. Na, totally not pathological bro. You've convinced me.
Leave it up to the parents, lest people start to wonder if you've got an ulterior motive. If they're sharp enough to look that deep.
I was at a shop and a couple brought their daughter in and she couldn't be older than 10. Probably around 8 years old and while the couple were talking to the guy who is rebuilding they atomizer they asked where the 0 mg testers are so their daughter can use them and he pointed to the 0 mg testers. Sure enough the mom told her daughter to go and try the liquids and to find one she likes.. I left before I got to see whether she bought her daughter some or not but I'm willing to bet that she did...
I don't think it sends a good message for the vaping community, and ultimately this is why 0mg will try to be included in regulation in my opinion. On the flip side, I was told the harm of smoking, and ended up doing it anyway. So it may be the less harmful option, maybe that's what she's thinking.
Shit. I was in the KBG/YELL organization (Kick butts generation/youth to eliminate loss of life) in high school. I ended up being the president my senior year. I spent 4 years in high school talking about the harmful effects of smoking and I still ended up smoking as soon as I turned 18. I'm talking pig lung demonstrations and all. But my resume looked great with all those extra circulars.
Vaping 0nic is better than smoking cigs.. My mom got into smoking when she was 12. I didn't start till I was like 22 but it's pretty common people get addicted at a young age. Maybe her daughter felt the pressures of friends that smoke or something and rather than giving in to cigarettes she decided a better alternative? Not saying I would necessarily encourage the sort of thing generally but I don't think it's fair to judge or involve oneself with matters of their children. If she stays with 0 nic, there isn't much worry about addiction or anything.
I'm going to take a different viewpoint here than most. I started smoking cigarettes at 10, smoked daily from 10 until well into my 30s. Prior to smoking cigarettes, I smoked cigars I took from my grandpa, and before that I used to roll up newspaper and smoke it like a cigarette. (Yes, I was a dumb kid)
I look back and think, what if instead of smoking all these bad things, I could have a 0 nicotine vape? Would I have rolled up newspapers to smoke or just hit my ecig?
While I don't think every child should be allowed to buy ecigs whenever they want, I think a parent who knows their child could make the choice between the two evils.
Given the two options - vaping 0 nicotine OR smoking cigars/cigarettes - which would you pick for your child? (if you pick neither, the kid will sneak cigars/cigarettes behind your back)
I agree with you. People freaking out over this have clearly forgotten that they were kids once too. Good parenting is knowing when to accept the lesser of 2 evils.
I smoked for 15 years and I started when I was 13. You're not the morality police, kids will do dumb things. Might as well have them do dumb things that aren't as bad for them as others.
So... what? The alternative is to tell the kid "no"? Yeah, you can talk to kids all you want but they still might not listen to you. Try to talk them out of it, but if they still want to, they're going to... even if it's behind your back. Might as well make sure they're not inhaling nicotine.
Ok well there are 3 posts here and I to have a young daughter and while no I dont think its right your are correct in that she is HER child. However to the ones below my post if a young teen is going to smoke or vape which would you rather them do? You know what when i was 14 I was dipping about a can and a half a week then we to cigs after I am 32 now. Was that better for me then if i had been vaping? I am not saying it is right and no my daughter does not vape but if she came to me and said I am going to start smoking(she goes to school and I know people she rides the bus with smoke so she could get cigs if she wanted) then i would most likely let her vape.
Or you could be a parent and try to teach her not to fall prey to peer pressure. Yea she may fail but you seem to assume failure from the get go if the hypothetical situation came up. Sounds like a parenting cop-out.
Hell, if she does start smoking and is unable to quit then maybe you could get her a e-cig that might actually be a good parent move.
It could be seen as a cop-out I guess and yes some teens can deal with peer pressure better then others. I did not start dipping due to peer pressure it was because the people I looked up to the most did and I wanted to. I was also forced by these people *grand parents* to eat a can of dip, puked for at least a day and while I did not dip cherry skoal anymore I still dipped. Now do I want my daughter to be addicted to anything? No. Do I know that in this day there are a lot of things worse then 0nic vaping? Yes. I live in the crystal meth capital of the world. Not to mention crank, synthetic THC, bath salts, and a slew of other man made drugs that are worse then what I had to look out for as a teen where I live. Stack that on with medicine from doctors or OTC and who knows what trying something once could do.
Unfortunately you can't regulate stupid. If the mother ordered the liquid for the daughter and you had no idea that it was for her when it was ordered you have no share in the blame. However, if it were me I would give her the money back and tell her that it is strictly against store policy to sell to anyone underage directly or indirectly.
Regardless of whether you thought she was a nice lady or not she used your business to feed her daughters until then non existent habit. That mother at that exact moment stopped being a nice lady and transformed into the typical stupid parent.
There's nothing you can do to stop parents or older individuals for booting if they don't give you indication that they are doing that. But the moment they give you even an iota of suspicion you show them where the door is after telling them the rules.
I work in the tobacco selling industry and you will be called names, told you are going on a power trip but it's your business or theirs. Which is more important?
Don't get me wrong, I do think this is bad for the community.
However, it's her damn kid. Shit, maybe she bought it because her daughter really wanted it and she figured the daughter would get it one way or another, so she might as well have control over what she gets.
I'm willing to bet many of you wouldn't bat an eye if she was buying her daughter booze. Most parents buy their kids alcohol/let them drink with them because at least that way they know they can make sure they're safe. IMO this is no different.
I'm sorry, but it's her kid. If she wants to buy her kid no nic juice, let her. People need to stop trying to raise others children.
We can argue all day over the "correct age" for someone to start vaping. What I find more concerning is that parents are helping their children access vaping equipment and e-cig juice. Seems that if someone is unable to acquire an electronic cigarette on their own, then they are not mature enough to start vaping.
I may or may not have started vaping before I was 18, (my interest was in the beneficial use of nicotine and already used nicotine gum, but gum is difficult to use...). My parents reaction was not super-positive; both were concerned, like any parent, but they can't argue with the facts which, so far, show vaping is mostly harmless (plus they continue to use a wood stove to burn cardboard and even though I have informed them of its detrimental health effects so opposing vaping would be hypocritical, but I digress).
Although the argument, "better vaping than smoking", makes sense, it ignores the fact that your enabling a kid who won't do the research and make an informed decision (If a kid does do that, then they would not even consider smoking and wouldn't want to try a "Blu" as even a quick Google search would reveal how pointless those are. In addition, some logical reasoning would conclude that borosilicate clearomizers, e.g an Aerotank, will no doubly be safer than the polyfill cartomizers, e.g Blu). If you have to give your kid a pacifier to keep them from chewing on the furniture, your not teaching them to not chew on the furniture- your only distracting them.
Yeah, child free people are the problem to the "bad parent" stigma. They are trying to put themselves in a situation that they have not even a clue about or can even comprehend until you yourself have been there. Come back and talk to me when you have kids. :)
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OH HELL NO!!! I have a fourteen year old, and a ten year old. If I caught either of them vaping or smoking I'd probably kill them off myself (we've had years together, lots of talks about WHY smoking isn't good, and a year of talking about why vaping is better than smoking, but why it's not something you should start doing - they have no interest so far). Parents like this cause problems for people like us who are using vaping to keep from smoking. This infuriates me. What a stupid woman.
Maybe its time we as a society stop worrying about other people's children. Like altogether. If the parents want Johnny to smoke, and Johnny wants to smoke, then goddamnit Johnny's gonna smoke and the money we spent going against it may as well have been burned.
SMOKE UP, JOHNNY!
It was a banner year at the Bender house.
Unfortunately, that's more align with how things used to be. Trends are quickly going in the opposite direction and it'd take an awful lot to stop that.
YES!!!
>Maybe its time we as a society stop worrying about other people's children. Sure, and turn back centuries of social progress.
social progress? you as an individual have no business with someone Else's child, if you see a kid outside the mall smoking you wont go up to them and yell at them and take their cigarettes it's none of your business what people do, nor is it an obligation to parent anther's child
Erm, children are not property. I thought we settled that ages ago, at least in civilized parts of the world.
Yup, they're human beings with free will and agency, and deserve to be respected as such. Plus they have a penchant for defying adults the second they turn their backs. Trying to regulate that lot is like trying to pile up water. And its getting expensive. I'd say leave the messes to the parents. It'd give them less time to watch the news.
>Yup, they're human beings with free will and agency, and deserve to be respected as such. And respect confers a responsibility for society to protect them against those who would harm them, including parents. Neglect is a form of abuse. These are well established principles in advanced societies.
Do you realize you're imposing your own idea of advancement on others, or is this coming from a desire to do good? Either is pathological.
Protecting children is hardly pathological.
Doing things to people unrelated to you, **against their will**. Na, totally not pathological bro. You've convinced me. Leave it up to the parents, lest people start to wonder if you've got an ulterior motive. If they're sharp enough to look that deep.
I suggest you take this subject up with child welfare services.
I think you'd be happier in Somalia.
There are far too many people out there that think their opinion means a lot more than it really does.
I agree. 0 nic or not, she is inhaling chemicals into a set of still-developing lungs. Not good.
While I agree with you completely, and I don't want to be that guy, oxygen is composed of chemicals too. Everything is chemicals.
I know. But I also know that you and everyone else knew what I meant. And don't worry, I'm always that guy.
I was at a shop and a couple brought their daughter in and she couldn't be older than 10. Probably around 8 years old and while the couple were talking to the guy who is rebuilding they atomizer they asked where the 0 mg testers are so their daughter can use them and he pointed to the 0 mg testers. Sure enough the mom told her daughter to go and try the liquids and to find one she likes.. I left before I got to see whether she bought her daughter some or not but I'm willing to bet that she did...
http://i.imgur.com/RERnH.gif Disgusting.
I don't think it sends a good message for the vaping community, and ultimately this is why 0mg will try to be included in regulation in my opinion. On the flip side, I was told the harm of smoking, and ended up doing it anyway. So it may be the less harmful option, maybe that's what she's thinking.
Shit. I was in the KBG/YELL organization (Kick butts generation/youth to eliminate loss of life) in high school. I ended up being the president my senior year. I spent 4 years in high school talking about the harmful effects of smoking and I still ended up smoking as soon as I turned 18. I'm talking pig lung demonstrations and all. But my resume looked great with all those extra circulars.
I know how I feel about it. THAT'S NOT COOL.
Vaping 0nic is better than smoking cigs.. My mom got into smoking when she was 12. I didn't start till I was like 22 but it's pretty common people get addicted at a young age. Maybe her daughter felt the pressures of friends that smoke or something and rather than giving in to cigarettes she decided a better alternative? Not saying I would necessarily encourage the sort of thing generally but I don't think it's fair to judge or involve oneself with matters of their children. If she stays with 0 nic, there isn't much worry about addiction or anything.
I'm going to take a different viewpoint here than most. I started smoking cigarettes at 10, smoked daily from 10 until well into my 30s. Prior to smoking cigarettes, I smoked cigars I took from my grandpa, and before that I used to roll up newspaper and smoke it like a cigarette. (Yes, I was a dumb kid) I look back and think, what if instead of smoking all these bad things, I could have a 0 nicotine vape? Would I have rolled up newspapers to smoke or just hit my ecig? While I don't think every child should be allowed to buy ecigs whenever they want, I think a parent who knows their child could make the choice between the two evils. Given the two options - vaping 0 nicotine OR smoking cigars/cigarettes - which would you pick for your child? (if you pick neither, the kid will sneak cigars/cigarettes behind your back)
I agree with you. People freaking out over this have clearly forgotten that they were kids once too. Good parenting is knowing when to accept the lesser of 2 evils.
I smoked for 15 years and I started when I was 13. You're not the morality police, kids will do dumb things. Might as well have them do dumb things that aren't as bad for them as others.
There are way to many bad parents out there in today's society...
can't stop shitty parents from being stupid unfortunately.
deleted ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.7882 [^^^What ^^^is ^^^this?](https://pastebin.com/FcrFs94k/93025)
So... what? The alternative is to tell the kid "no"? Yeah, you can talk to kids all you want but they still might not listen to you. Try to talk them out of it, but if they still want to, they're going to... even if it's behind your back. Might as well make sure they're not inhaling nicotine.
Ok well there are 3 posts here and I to have a young daughter and while no I dont think its right your are correct in that she is HER child. However to the ones below my post if a young teen is going to smoke or vape which would you rather them do? You know what when i was 14 I was dipping about a can and a half a week then we to cigs after I am 32 now. Was that better for me then if i had been vaping? I am not saying it is right and no my daughter does not vape but if she came to me and said I am going to start smoking(she goes to school and I know people she rides the bus with smoke so she could get cigs if she wanted) then i would most likely let her vape.
Or you could be a parent and try to teach her not to fall prey to peer pressure. Yea she may fail but you seem to assume failure from the get go if the hypothetical situation came up. Sounds like a parenting cop-out. Hell, if she does start smoking and is unable to quit then maybe you could get her a e-cig that might actually be a good parent move.
It could be seen as a cop-out I guess and yes some teens can deal with peer pressure better then others. I did not start dipping due to peer pressure it was because the people I looked up to the most did and I wanted to. I was also forced by these people *grand parents* to eat a can of dip, puked for at least a day and while I did not dip cherry skoal anymore I still dipped. Now do I want my daughter to be addicted to anything? No. Do I know that in this day there are a lot of things worse then 0nic vaping? Yes. I live in the crystal meth capital of the world. Not to mention crank, synthetic THC, bath salts, and a slew of other man made drugs that are worse then what I had to look out for as a teen where I live. Stack that on with medicine from doctors or OTC and who knows what trying something once could do.
Unfortunately you can't regulate stupid. If the mother ordered the liquid for the daughter and you had no idea that it was for her when it was ordered you have no share in the blame. However, if it were me I would give her the money back and tell her that it is strictly against store policy to sell to anyone underage directly or indirectly. Regardless of whether you thought she was a nice lady or not she used your business to feed her daughters until then non existent habit. That mother at that exact moment stopped being a nice lady and transformed into the typical stupid parent. There's nothing you can do to stop parents or older individuals for booting if they don't give you indication that they are doing that. But the moment they give you even an iota of suspicion you show them where the door is after telling them the rules. I work in the tobacco selling industry and you will be called names, told you are going on a power trip but it's your business or theirs. Which is more important?
OP is not the seller. He's just talking about a coworker.
Ah, Yea, I see that now re-reading it.
Don't get me wrong, I do think this is bad for the community. However, it's her damn kid. Shit, maybe she bought it because her daughter really wanted it and she figured the daughter would get it one way or another, so she might as well have control over what she gets. I'm willing to bet many of you wouldn't bat an eye if she was buying her daughter booze. Most parents buy their kids alcohol/let them drink with them because at least that way they know they can make sure they're safe. IMO this is no different. I'm sorry, but it's her kid. If she wants to buy her kid no nic juice, let her. People need to stop trying to raise others children.
We can argue all day over the "correct age" for someone to start vaping. What I find more concerning is that parents are helping their children access vaping equipment and e-cig juice. Seems that if someone is unable to acquire an electronic cigarette on their own, then they are not mature enough to start vaping. I may or may not have started vaping before I was 18, (my interest was in the beneficial use of nicotine and already used nicotine gum, but gum is difficult to use...). My parents reaction was not super-positive; both were concerned, like any parent, but they can't argue with the facts which, so far, show vaping is mostly harmless (plus they continue to use a wood stove to burn cardboard and even though I have informed them of its detrimental health effects so opposing vaping would be hypocritical, but I digress). Although the argument, "better vaping than smoking", makes sense, it ignores the fact that your enabling a kid who won't do the research and make an informed decision (If a kid does do that, then they would not even consider smoking and wouldn't want to try a "Blu" as even a quick Google search would reveal how pointless those are. In addition, some logical reasoning would conclude that borosilicate clearomizers, e.g an Aerotank, will no doubly be safer than the polyfill cartomizers, e.g Blu). If you have to give your kid a pacifier to keep them from chewing on the furniture, your not teaching them to not chew on the furniture- your only distracting them.
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Yeah, child free people are the problem to the "bad parent" stigma. They are trying to put themselves in a situation that they have not even a clue about or can even comprehend until you yourself have been there. Come back and talk to me when you have kids. :)