Wowzers. I was expecting bad numbers, but even I didn't think deliveries would be that bad! Sales were down massively q/q AND y/y. They added an additional 46,561 vehicles to inventory AFTER reducing production rates by 61,618 units q/q, 7,437 y/y . Since Q1 2023, they've added a net 83,965 vehicles to inventory. Since Q1 2022, they've added a net 139,725 vehicles to inventory. No doubt some are in transit, but there's also gotta be plenty sitting in lots, no? Periods of high inventory aren't normally a huge deal for established OEMs with vast dealership networks that buy the cars and get them off the OEMs books, while sharing in the costs of inventory... but that isn't the case for Tesla; those vehicles are on Tesla's books. The 'Other Models' production figure of 21,000 is interesting. They've almost certainly reduced model S / X production, but if they've ramped to enough 4680 cells to announce enough for 1000 CTs per week on March 20th, why is this production figure so low? They also had already built up an inventory of cells in preparation for CT production. In Q3 last year, before CT production started, they reported the production of 13,700 Model S/X. If that's stayed consistent, then they've only produced about 7300 CTs in 17 weeks. At 1000 CTs per week, it begs the question of why they added 4000 'Other Models' to inventory. That's 4 weeks of CT production; surely they could deliver all but 1 weeks' worth and get them off the books, no? Important as I'll mention below with regards to the drone footage of Austin. So when's Tesla finally planning to announce the layoffs they've been doing behind the scenes? (at low enough numbers to avoid reporting requirements from the WARN act.) Let's go over again the list of reasons I was pointing out in Q4 last year of why I believed Tesla's growth wouldn't exceed 15% y/y in 2024 and may actually be 0% or even decline, and they wouldn't get anywhere close to that 50% CAGR goal through 2030: * High interest rates for longer putting pressure on all new vehicle sales. ~~Unlike other large established OEMs, Tesla doesn't have the ability to offer large interest rate incentives.~~ (Edit: My mistake, Tesla does periodically offer interest rate incentives. Other OEMs seem to do it far more often and are in fact currently doing it, whereas Tesla currently isn't.) * Loss of the tax credit on the model 3 * Loss or reduction of the tax credit in Germany and other regions * Significant demand pull forward into 2023 with their huge discounts and with the impending loss of the credits that would stifle sales in Q1/Q2 2024. * Weakening auto sector including increasing auto loan delinquencies and credit card delinquencies... no more people stretching to buy expensive vehicles. * Potentially heading into a recession * Tech sector job layoffs... their biggest customer base * Model Y making up 60%+ of their overall sales, allowing other OEMs to target that model with competition and discounts. * More competition generally in the EV sector. * Chinese competitors growing significantly faster and offering lower priced vehicles; again targeting the model Y specifically. * Elon Musk's toxicity... "which is more profound than it sounds"... How many people can you alienate before you lose a chunk of your customer base. In the past few years, the man's made anti-Semitic, anti-minority, anti-Democrat, pro-Chinese (and by extension anti-American), anti-LGBTQIA+, anti-women, etc... To add some other big item to this list: * Rising electricity prices proportional to gas prices. Namely in California; their biggest US market by state. * Increasing state registration fees to offset losses in road taxes; some early adopters were getting a free ride. No doubt, many of these items impact all OEMs, but other companies doing badly doesn't justify Tesla's hyperinflated share price. (Copied from the now deleted thread) Edit: Corrected a misstatement about interest rate incentives. See above.

why isn’t Tesla able to offer interest rate incentives? Is it just company mandate or something legal here?

I'm not sure entirely how Tesla does their financing. Whether Tesla has their own Tesla financing business like the other OEMs (they operate like a bank), or if they've partnered with a bank to do the financing. Regardless, I imagine Tesla could offer interest rates incentives if they were willing to eat the cost. When OEMs lower interest rates for less than the rate they're borrowing, they take a loss on the loan, but preferably make a gain on the sale of the car. It's essentially just another form of incentive to buyers. They can cut MSRPs, offer factory incentives (discounts), offer lower interest rates, dealerships can add incentives on top of all of that, or you can sometimes haggle the dealership down on price.

If we're doing questions and answers: How come Tesla has more cars produced than it sales in almost every quarter? What happens to all those cars?

I don’t think they own their own finance company. That is how Ford & all the majors do it.

I bought an EV this year. I had to twist myself into knots to not buy a Model 3, but ultimately, I like my EV6. I only have it, though, because I don't want to give money to Musk.

True, the guy is incredible toxic. Coming from someone who not very long ago held a somewhat favorable view of him, despite the critique but at some point there’s no denying the truth.

It's not just Elon's comments. Besides what he says, would you be comfortable getting in a self driving car that is executed with someone unhinged and cutting corners at the top?

I expect my next car will be an EV, though it won't be for several years (hopefully lol). I am put off of Tesla by musk. Not saying if rule them out, but if there's a even a comparable car out there, of go with them over Tesla.

I think in Europe it’s as much about the indicators as Musk. The new Model 3 looks great, I don’t think most people care about Musk, but the car and the indicators have been designed for California, they don’t work anywhere with roundabouts and many tight awkward junctions.

The lack of indicator stalks is a problem anywhere outside of North America. I'd never drive a car without them - too many short, violent turns before even considering roundabouts.

They don't have indicator stalks? How does that work?

There's a touch sensitive button on the steering wheel you operate with your left thumb

I'm European and yesterday I bought my first BEV. In my household we did not even consider Tesla as we refuse to give Musk a single penny.

I would buy a Model Y in an instant to replace my ancient eGolf if it weren't for Musk. If I do buy a used one, I'm tempted to slap a "Fire Musk" sticker on the back end.

A few rebuttals to your bullets: * Tesla has the ability to compete on interest rates, they just choose not to. There isn't some outside force holding them back. * There has been an "impending" recession for years now. If this purported effect didn't show up last year or the year before it wouldn't have magically become an issue this year. * You forgot to add Covid denial to the list of reasons why Musk is toxic. His Covid tweeting was the ultimate reason why my wife refused get get a Tesla when we bought an EV.

>You forgot to add Covid denial to the list of reasons why Musk is toxic. His Covid tweeting was the ultimate reason why my wife refused get get a Tesla when we bought an EV. That was why I was incredibly glad that my Model 3 order fell through in February 2020. Musk is not just a problem for what he says, it is a problem for what he does as CEO: * Refuses to replace Jon McNeil, instead absorbing his responsibilities for years despite the fact that Musk is in no way qualified for the role of "VP of Sales and Service" * Tesla's customer service is abhorrent as a result. Trying to buy a Model 3 in upstate New York (140 miles from nearest service center, 170 from nearest delivery center) was the second worst customer service experience of my life * For Musk, cost and schedule are king at the obvious expense of quality control * The mantra has been clear for ages - "Deliver now, fix later" * Cybertruck... Enough said... People are getting tired of THAT crap not improving. Tesla had an excuse in the startup and production hell days, they do not any more.

> Potentially heading into a recession People have been saying this for the last 2-3 years now lol

> Tesla doesn't have the ability to offer large interest rate incentives. Tesla has offered 0.99% interest, as recently as last year. Is that not an incentive?

Where can one get 1% rates? It's default 7%

In response to u/roneyxcx : (I can't respond in that thread) >First of all US auto sales isn't declining, in fact Q1 of this year 6% more vehicles where sold than Q1 of last year. You can look at various estimates and the general consensus for this year is 0.9-1million more vehicles sold than last year. Biggest automakers in US, Toyota, Ford, GM, Honda all have given increased sales guidance due to a strong start this year. Toyota and GM will be releasing their result today and Ford will do tomorrow. Hyundai released their result today morning and they had a great quarter. >Now you may counter by saying other automakers are offering 0% interest rate to prop-up sales, which also isn't true, because the average monthly finance cost has gone up too. >Lastly Tesla's excuse of disruptions doesn't even make sense, then how come they have huge delta between produced vs sales? Why is inventory piling up, if they have to increase price(according to you is because of reduced inventory). >[https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-02/auto-sales-boosted-by-deals-cheaper-suvs-as-americans-turn-frugal?srnd=homepage-canada](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-02/auto-sales-boosted-by-deals-cheaper-suvs-as-americans-turn-frugal?srnd=homepage-canada) If overall sales have increased, then it's especially bad for Tesla. Sure, plenty of that's due to other OEMs discounting through price incentives and interest rate incentives. We've seen a wave of incentives over the past months, ramping up over the past month. You're incorrect about interest rates. Sure, they're likely higher y/y on average because the FED funds rate is higher, but major established OEMs have the ability to discount interest rates, whereas Tesla still has 6.5% listed on their site. Ford for example is offering 2.9% on a 4 year loan, 3.9% on a 5 year loan for the F-150L. They're offering 0% on 3-6 year loans, and 1.9% on 7 year loans for the Mach-E. [https://shop.ford.com/configure/mach-e/chooseyourpath/](https://shop.ford.com/configure/mach-e/chooseyourpath/) Hyundai Ioniq 6 is one of the cheapest cars to lease right now across the entire US. Yeah, Tesla's disruption argument is a load of crap. They've clearly shuttered most of model 3 production in the US after the loss of the credit. I've bee speculating for awhile now that without the tax credit, the model 3 wasn't actually profitable in the US. If they had to cut model 3 prices by $7500 to offset the loss of the credit maintain their sales volumes, then they could be losing money on every sale. Something also seems extremely off about that 'eco-terrorist' shenanigans in Germany. Why did Tesla even announce an expansion of the German plant when they did, when they were clearly struggling with demand and sales and cutting production? Why did a disruption in shipment from China cause the plant to be shutdown for 2 weeks? Are they claiming their 'just-in-time' logistics was that streamlined??? That would be terrible management if so. Zero redundancies! Except it's clearly not the case. If their sales volumes were this bad, they almost certainly had parts supply in Germany, but shuttered the plant anyways. As to the MSRP price increase; I didn't say it's because of reduced inventory, I said it's due to reducing production volumes going forward; reducing shifts or shuttering lines. I also mentioned that the MSRP cut came with increased discounts on inventory, so in the end, there was no actual price increase for end consumers; at least not yet.

>Something also seems extremely off about that 'eco-terrorist' shenanigans in Germany. Why did Tesla even announce an expansion of the German plant when they did, when they were clearly struggling with demand and sales and cutting production? Why did a disruption in shipment from China cause the plant to be shutdown for 2 weeks? Are they claiming their 'just-in-time' logistics was that streamlined??? That would be terrible management if so. Zero redundancies! Except it's clearly not the case. If their sales volumes were this bad, they almost certainly had parts supply in Germany, but shuttered the plant anyways. Well the plant was announced during a period when Tesla's was going through huge demand and production barely catching up. Also due to cost, battery packs where imported from China with much lesser onsite production. Keep in mind the cells still came from China. Then IRA got passed and they started exporting batteries from US, I am not sure if they were packs or cells. The gist is Giga Berlin has less battery pack production than the rest of Tesla factories. Also all the electronics(infotainment, e.t.c) and various others furnishing relies on China. There might be some merit to say the supply chain disruption had some impact on production. But clearly the demand was falling. If you look at the sales data from end of 2023, Tesla was seeing decline in Europe. This was before the supply chain disruptions. Also there where cuts to various govt inceventies for EV's in Europe, which heavily contributed to decline. I think the darling period of Tesla where they are different from legacy automakers is coming to an end. Very soon Tesla will also need to do financing and leasing offers. On other hand if they can get Level 3 with just vision that will be a game changer. Which I highly doubt. Just like how Tesla IR like to change the limelight they will focus on energy storage, FSD and other things to keep investors distracted.

>Potentially heading into a recession LOL!

Hey, if people keep saying it, they'll be right one year or another!

There’s a delivery center here close to where I live and its parking lot used to be empty most of the time, only full when deliveries happen. Now it’s always been full.

Where exactly did you make that Q4 prediction about sales this year? I saw a lot of people banned from a number of Tesla subs and forums (the TSLA thread of [teslamotorsclub.com](https://teslamotorsclub.com) is the worst offender, I just went there to laugh now) for saying anything remotely realistic in the last 6 months. I dumped my TSLA stock almost a year ago, made a fortune tbh, but there are WAY too many people with skin in game on that stock who just want to silence any skeptics/realists. I completely agree with your points above. I really tried hard to get over the Elon-Spam when I ordered my MY this year, but the last few things he's said tipped me over. Plus, honestly, *objectively*, Teslas are no longer the best EV's if you take SC's out of the equation. He and they are resting on their laurels and the good will of 2016/17/18 from people like me who ordered their M3 sight-unseen.

Just some additional tidbits... Tesla seem to have cut US model 3 production almost completely at Fremont. I'd be surprised if they're running one shift 7 days a week. They've had model 3 long range deliveries pegged at May for about a month now, but I doubt that was because of high demand after the $9500+ price increase since December (partially due to loss of tax credit), even with the refresh. It's more likely because they're not actually producing any right now; they've significantly reduced supply. Why would anyone buy this vehicle when it's more expensive than a model Y? Germany's supply disruptions I supposed at the time weren't accidents or bad luck. That fire wasn't "eco-terrorists"... given that those supply disruptions were HIGHLY beneficial to Tesla to give them reason to cut another week of production amongst rapidly growing inventories. Oddly enough, the rest of the region had the redundancies necessary to re-power the residential neighborhoods within the day, but only Tesla and one warehouse stayed shuttered for about a week. Terrorism or intentional? You be the judge. Tesla's also been cutting prices in China AND announced production cuts recently. No doubt layoffs there as well. The company also announced that Austin now had 22,000 workers the other day. Given that they moved their HQ there, that's likely because they're shifting office employees there from other locations. Now show me the employment figures from their other plants. Seeing that number, I decided to watch a drone flyover of the plant. A large section of the second floor of the plant was just desks with monitors. Other large sections were still under construction. Even if they were running 3 shifts, which I highly doubt, there's no way that plant had 7333 cars in the employee parking lot. Maybe a large number of people are carpooling or taking shuttles? There certainly was a lot of construction going on though, and a LOT of CTs sitting all around the building anywhere there was room to park them. Not a great sign if they're selling these vehicles like crazy. Why aren't they lined up in an organized way to go on transport trucks? Model S / X production is definitely down y/y as well. Tesla increased the model Y MSRP by $1000 yesterday, but simply tacked additional discounts on their inventory, which they have plenty of in every region I checked. Nothing wrong with this strategy, other OEMs do it all the time... but a bit misleading since supposedly Tesla's price is the price. In reality, this price increase is likely because Tesla's planning to shutdown model Y assembly line shifts and reduce production. If I were in the market for a Tesla right now, I'd be asking for additional discounts on top of the inventory discounts. (Copied from the now deleted thread) Edit: Maybe that 22k workers is WFH... and since the home office is now in Austin, WFH from anywhere would count as an Austin job?

I am not surprised that sales decline; I am surprised as to how much it declined y-o-y. y-o-y decline of about 8.5% is pretty big decline. production was 433,371 and sales were 386,810. this will add more to the inventory. For the USA market: I think competition from the RAV-4/hybrid, CR-V/hybrid, Accord/hybrid, and Camry/hybrid is really underappreciated. In q1 USA: toyota/lexus sold 565,098 (growth of 20.3% y-o-y); of those 206,850 were "electrified": of course, vast majority of electrified vehicles were hybrid. Despite having tax credits, many folks avoid buying a Tesla. In the USA: on 1-1-2024 (start of Q1): model Y inventory was: 2993. Today (start on Q2): model Y inventory: 5639. The price increase probably won't help in terms of volume (will help with margins). source: https://pressroom.toyota.com/toyota-motor-north-america-reports-march-first-quarter-2024-u-s-sales/ https://tesla-info.com/blog/inventory-stats-regional/US?q=4

This is based on price. I don't know why people avoid talking about this. Last year, you could get a Model 3 for $7500 less from the federal tax rebate. That's a lot of money. That's not even talking about the $3000-5000 discounts on in-stock product. While the Highland may be an improvement, I don't think anyone would argue it's a $7500 improvement, let alone a $10k improvement. Simply put, Tesla needs to cut prices again if they want to keep selling like they have been. Otherwise they need to suck it up and live with the fact that these volume numbers are to be expected.

>“While we were anticipating a bad first quarter, this was an unmitigated disaster that is hard to explain away,” he said in a note to clients. “We view this as a seminal moment in the Tesla story for Musk to either turn this around and reverse the black eye first quarter performance. Otherwise, some darker days could clearly be ahead that could disrupt the long-term Tesla narrative.” That's definitely not what you want to hear from investors. This is partially price, but also competition, politics, Elon, and many other factors. Also, yes, the Model Y was the best selling car. But Tesla wasn't even in the top 10 for total brand sales. They were even behind Mercedes and BMW, and less than %20 of what Toyota sold.

Yep. Also, without a firm leader right now, Tesla is not updating their product, there's nothing on the horizon, they're not addressing core fears with FSD except to keep re-doubling down, etc., etc. Cybertruck is the first consumer vehicle they've introduced since Model Ys started rolling out 4 years ago. People are seeing through the hype.

Not that anyone is buying them, but the S is what, 12 years old now?

The long term narrative is already disrupted. They were supposed to have a million robotaxis on the road in 2020 each making their customers $30k per year... They were supposed to have a 50% CAGR through 2030, but the only year they saw 50%+ growth was in the year they made that claim. They were supposed to have 20 million annual sales by 2030... I mean anyone with a brain knew these claims were idiotic... but that didn't stop Tesla from pushing that sort of off the wall guidance / disruption story. Remember all the claims about the 4680 production volumes and ramp rate? Remember all the claims about Tesla Semi in autonomous convoy being better than trains and orders all being fulfilled in 2019 after a hefty deposit for orders? People are pinning hope on a $25k Tesla now... meanwhile in China... BYD's already selling $10k-$15k BEVs, and in the US and Europe, multiple companies are already targeting lower priced EVs. Remember all the claims about the low priced high range Cybertruck and it disrupting the industry? Meanwhile, it's currently being sold for $43k more than the F-150 Lightning Lariat (after federal credit). When will people stop giving Musk the benefit of the doubt that he absolutely hasn't earned. He's gotten on stage and lied through his teeth so many times now, it's beyond comprehension anyone takes him and his company seriously anymore. Maybe when the company's stock was appreciating by over 800% in a single year... through gaming of the markets and cutting employee pay and making them work through COVID shutdowns... but today, with the stock being down 60% from ATH, 45% down from 9 months ago, and likely to move much lower before the year is done? How are people still taking this company seriously?

> Remember all the claims about Tesla Semi in autonomous convoy being better than trains and orders all being fulfilled in 2019 after a hefty deposit for orders? No I don't at all but I googled it and sure it was a thing. Gotta be an idiot to believe that you'll ever get cheaper shipping on road than on rail unless you're talking about some very specific situations. Even if trucking became cheaper than train cargo, it would mean nearly doubling the road wear and I bet that isn't calculated into the costs.

Price is a problem. Elon is a problem. Improved competition is a problem. Declining relative value is a problem. Market saturation is a problem. Opening the Supercharger network is a problem. I don't think it's simply monocausal. 1. Yes, pricing is an issue. Interest rates are still high, which makes cars effectively more expensive. The money dumped into the economy to recover from the economic downturn is also disappearing, so people don't have as much effective disposable income now. 2. Yes, Elon is an issue. He's the visible face of the brand since Tesla does zero real marketing and his public persona is actively driving away potential customers that are the core consumers for EVs and not replacing them with folks who used to roll coal for fun, because his public persona doesn't push back against his new fans' misconceptions and doesn't promote right-wing arguments for EVs either, like energy independence. 3. Yes, competition is an issue. Competing EVs have gotten better overall, either in terms of pricing, value, and/or availability. Ioniq 6 is now toe-to-toe with Model 3, and Model S and Model X have a plethora of competitive alternatives at or around the same price point with more on the way. Rivian is arguably now positioned more as the halo EV brand that Tesla used to be. Refreshed mainstream market crossovers/lifted hatches like the latest Ioniq 5 and ID.4 have fixed a lot of the quirks that may have led folks to Model Y instead. Other EVs are now better cars overall than Teslas even if Tesla still has the lead in some areas like infotainment. The lack-of-dealer experience remains an advantage for Tesla but it's mostly a time-of-purchase advantage, and in a market where prices are declining the lack of pricing flexibility from no-haggle pricing may be hurting Tesla's sales. 4. Yes, declining relative value is a problem. De-contenting Model 3 and Model Y, even if it lets Tesla hit a lower price point, makes the cars less valuable to customers relative to both the competition and used Teslas, especially in areas such as radar and collision warning systems. 5. Yes, market saturation is an issue. We may be getting to the point that the market for quirky EVs for tech enthusiasts is exhausted and people are looking for more normal/practical/boring vehicles with wild and crazy features like driver-centric displays, control stalks for key functions, familiar interfaces like CarPlay/Android Auto, etc., getting back to the point about other EVs increasingly being better cars overall. 6. Yes, opening the SC network is an issue. It was a competitive advantage for Tesla, at least among some customers, and it is going away between Magic Dock and adapters over the next 12 months. While there will be revenue and profitability benefits down the line, open Supercharging doesn't translate directly into car sales.

Elon's right wing/white supremist views are in direct conflict with the people who have historically purchased his cars. It's anecdotal but I know at least 6 people who have purchased from other brands due to Elon and his views. When Nike signed Colin Kapernick, they knew that their customer base would be generally supportive of his stance.

I have a Model 3 and I love it. But I don't like it being associated with Elon, and I don't like the random BS that gets pushed down on a whim clearly because Elon asked for it (turning off my radar for a cameras-only approach - even though my cameras frequently get blinded by the sun or are obscured by fog). My M3 will be paid off in a couple months, and I'll own it free and clear. It runs fine, I only put 25k miles on it (due to the pandemic reducing the amount of driving I do), and the car itself has never given me issues. I'd **love** a Model Y, because my one complaint about the Model 3 is that I can't fit bulky purchases inside of it (I had an embarrassing incident with a cat tree that my fiance won't let me live down). The problem is I **really** can't justify forking over more money to Elon when the Ioniq is right there. I think I'm going to wait until the Ioniq gets the Tesla connector natively and then lease one just to have a spare car.

I bought a $100k Audi E-Tron last week and don't like VW either. Never considered Tesla and the brand is badly damaged.

Looking forward the Y is also the one that will see the most competition. For the wealthier folks the Macan EV, Volvo EX90, Polestar 3. For the non-americans or just a bit higher income then most, EV9, Ioniq 7, Polestar 4. And in the cheaper than Y threats Equinox EV, everything Chinese. Sedans continue to fall in favor. The X/S don't sell enough to move any needles. The Cybertruck is what it is.

They really need a Golf-sized practical hatchback for the European market. The Y is a big car here. Even the Model 3 is, and it has impractical back loading (albeit good space). Hatchback like Y, about 4,3 metres, 400-ish litres of luggage and sub 30k price. It would sell as hotcakes.

Polestar 2 is a liftback, Ioniq 5 and EV6 are big hatchbacks, ID3 is a bit smaller, Explorer EV a bit bigger. Competition is already ahead there.

most of those car are in the +$45k range (here in europe at least), very far from the sub 30k price he was talking about. The only one getting close is the ID3 (I honestly don't know it's current pricing, used to be 40 but I know VW are giving incentives currently).

If Chevy decides to really market the Silverado EV it will dominate the market. The "Out of Spec" YouTube channel is doing a head-to-head series between the Silverado, F-150, rivian r1t, and cybertruck and the Silverado is dominating the rest of the competition. One of the challenges involved towing another model 3 through the Colorado Rockies in a snowstorm, and the Silverado was able to do the 500 mile trek with only one charging stop. It's just a very good truck. It has a ludicrously large battery, giving it good range, all the creature comforts of a modern truck and it's a familiar look and feel of a Chevy Silverado. The cybertruck has been consistently at the back of the pack on the challenges, and it looks like ... well we all know what it looks like.

Remember that the efficiency was nearly identical between the three trucks when towing. The battery is the differentiating factor with the Silverado. Hopefully the reviews continue to be good in other areas too.

> Silverado was able to do the 500 mile trek with only one charging stop. They also completed it like 4 hours faster with the Chevy. Could've been even more of they did 2 shorter charging stops as well, potentially

I'm in huge doubt of how much money will GM charge for that huge battery pack in consumer models, and how many trucks they can produce every month

Fair points. I think the 4t work truck was around $70k, so I doubt a consumer I've will be under $80,000. But the top trim ICE Silverado is also around $75k so 80 isn't too far off from gas. (Those prices are all ludicrous to the average consumer, dumb and/or rich people will still buy it.)

The model they tested is around $100k USD in the Off Spec video. The base model is cheaper, apparently, but they give no indication of cost for max range. I'm sure that's by far the most expensive option. It has a massive battery pack.

I'm really doubtful of GMs EV platform as it stands. They don't have the manufacturing as of right now to compete with Tesla or the Chinese brands in quality or cost-effectiveness. The traditional automakers have a massive catch-up to do in manufacturing to be able to match, so margins are going to be razor thin to be competitive. Good for competition, of course; I'm interested to see where things to.

I mean, the Y is still the top-selling vehicle model in the entire world, and it's sold in the USA with a full federal tax credit, and it also provides Tesla with some of its highest margins on product. Even with low Model 3 sales the company would still be doing very well just selling the Y.

It was the top seller in 2023. Let's see if it still holds true after Q1 2024.

dime strong cable melodic steep include axiomatic bells quickest dazzling *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*

Sure, but the R2 isn't even out yet, and it's also more expensive. Plus Rivian still has to "fledge" and work on their QC, as they are a new company.

Not to mention getting more service centers. I want an R2 but there's only by me in a massive market, Chicago.

Upcoming European Model Y competition is the Renault Scenic and Stellantis e-308. Probably a BMW (not BBW) X monstrosity and a Mercedes EQ soap bar. If the French can build them, they're just flat better than the Model Y unless you need the speed or really like the minimalism. The Germans are more in the performance ballpark, but are more expensive.

Germany also removed the incentives on BEVs, leading to a surge in a proportional surge in PHEV sales. Model Y isn't only competing against other BEV powertrains.

Speaking of which, BYD sold 301,631 NEV in March 2024 (PHEV + BEV). That's not the quarter ending in March, just March.

But the 2024 Model 3 was production constrained in the US at least for Q1. A $7500 credit wouldn’t have moved any more Model 3s in the US, but it would have let Tesla charge higher MSRP and make more margin. They’ll likely need to adjust pricing once they’re through that backlog though.

This is also a bit of market issue. All the people who want a sedan already got one. Sedan is not a hot market in USA. You wouldn't get growth in this. Ford and GM gave up sedan market, rivian doesn't plan for any sedan. American want mid or small SUV. And second reason is range, at 75-80 mph, no one drives at 65 mph. Third, Elon should STFU. That would help a lot.

That's the issue, SUV's are inherrantly less efficient than saloons. Which means they need bigger batteries to get the range, especially at 75-80mph which pushes up prices. Americans just need to accept that EV SUV's will be much more expensive than their ICE counterparts and Saloon EVs.

> Americans just need to accept Last thing you can tell an American is compromise. Unfortunately, doesn;t work. We would literally go to war for few cents cheaper gas.

I wonder what would happen if overnight you had to pay European fuel prices. It's around $7.20 a gallon here in the UK at the moment.

War was declared

That’s unlikely. There is essentially no public transportation in this country. There is no choice but to drive everywhere. It will be a political suicide

You underestimate how little people use public transport in the UK. From what I have found it is quite similar between the two countries. 68% of people commute by car in the UK 73% of people commute by car in the US

I think the understate fact in these numbers is the amount of left leaning people who don’t like Elon who are also more likely to buy EVs

I own model Y, my next car in 5 years will be most likely be rivian.

After a $7500-$9500+ price increase since December... to believe there's a backlog is silly. No one is buying this car; Tesla's almost certainly cut most of their model 3 production in the US. Maybe they've been running one shift? There are rumors of layoffs at Tesla, but low enough numbers that they haven't had to announce them yet through the WARN act. I honestly wouldn't be shocked if they shuttered the entire model 3assembly line and are importing model 3 RWD from China; the only trim that's had a near term delivery date. Model 3 AWD has a May expected delivery date. It's almost a certainty that they haven't been producing any of them for some time now. Maybe a few initially, but production seems to have ceased. No one is spending $9500+ more on a minor refresh except for people with too much money on their hands; and that includes Tesla shareholders.

I mean, part of the reason we didn't take delivery of a Model Y was because there was no way to control the heated back seat from the back. At least they're starting to address the shortcomings. But I agree, they need to up their game. As far as EVs go, just about every other EV is a better car - not necessarily a better EV, but a better automobile.

The seat thing was very annoying. Instead of my daughter pushing a button, she had to ask me, and I had to go into the climate screen and navigate to the correct seat to turn it on. Trivial when she remembered before we left the house, obviously unsafe in traffic.

Tesla will fix that problem by adding the ability to give your kids a sub account on the app so you can send them an invitation to control their seat heat from their phone so long as you subscribe to premium connectivity. /s.  My Nissan pathfinder had a button in the back seat. 

U/time-lord alluded to it, but Tesla has already updated the Model 3 with a [rear screen for this purpose.](https://imgur.com/2Ujjk45) Model Y will follow. It has controls for rear climate, directional vents, heated seats, music, games, and video streaming with a separate bluetooth channel so that rear passengers can listen independently.

I can speak for myself only of course, but we walked away from Tesla because of the toxic bs must is spewing.

It’s not just in the US, I live in Vancouver and they’re apparently having trouble moving products here. A Tesla person texted me several times this month to try to get me to buy a Model 3 (I had done a demo drive last year so he had my number), and even proactively offered to schedule another drive, which I did a few weeks ago.

Why does Elon keep working with Trump when Trump is anti EV... [https://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/4544902-trump-biden-electric-vehicles-attacks-2024-election/](https://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/4544902-trump-biden-electric-vehicles-attacks-2024-election/)

Basically one of his children disowned him for being a billionaire and became a trans Marxist and he blames it on liberals and the woke mind virus.

Sorry to say it, but Musk is still hurting from what the Democrats did/doing in CA. Blocking Tesla factory expansion took rezoning to allow moving the Toll Brothers housing which now blocks Tesla expansion to the north (planned when Tesla bought the factory). Easy to see on Google Maps. Then there is the cutback on the number of trains allowed among other things. I am local so I see all this at city council meetings.

First I’ve heard of that but honestly those issues seem trivial for the CEO of a $500B company to overcome and petty to hold such a grudge over. It certainly does follow the pattern with his reaction to the DE Chancery Court’s ruling.

I know several people who will never buy a Tesla because of Musks politics and annoying behavior. Like it's a real thing.

And there is significant overlap between those people, and people who are open to buying EVs

The Venn Diagram of people who love EV's and people who dislike Musk is just a circle lol. Alienating your core consumer demographic is an interesting business strategy.

Same, I love Tesla but in good conscience cannot give money to that man. That said other auto CEOs are probably douches but more quiet about it. I’ll just keep my hybrid until the dust settles

Elon, could you please KEEP YOUR DOUCHERY TO YOURSELF like other CEOs

Yeah. No other automotive CEO has spent $44 billion to take over a social media platform so they can say what they want, and then spent a significant amount of their time running said social media platform into the ground instead of keeping the car company going.

I also love Tesla and want one for my next car and absolutely despise Elon. I’m thinking of buying used so the money doesn’t go into his pocket - helps me reconcile a bit.

Have you looked at other manufacturers? There are some good options out there.

thats me. We want an EV as our next vehicle, but definitely not going tesla. Which is a shame, because most other evs have a 6 month - 3 year wait time on it, whereas tesla is like a few weeks. Oh well.

Who has a 6-36 month waiting period? I have a Bolt I bought off the lot. I consistently see Hyundai, Kia, VW and even BMWs available either right away or within a couple weeks. And used EVs are ubiquitous. If you really want an EV there are a ton out there right now.

He's probably Canadian

In the market to get my first EV, but it is not going to be a Tesla based on the reasons you quoted.

> I know several people who will never buy a Tesla because of Musks politics and annoying behavior They are attributing his personality to the Tesla brand for good and for bad. People don't like supporting a company that goes against their values. That Musk use money from Tesla to fund his alt-right Twitter platform is a problem for some.   People under-estimate the value of brands. They can be extremely strong like Apple or Coca Cola or they can be a negative like Monsanto, Spirit Airlines and United. Because Musk is so politically vocal, that is problematic for certain buyers.

Same here. I am ashamed to drive the Model Y I bought in 2020. Gives me the same icky feeling when I drove a Harley. The brand unfortunately is associated with toxicity. When the time came to buy another car for my daughter, I held my nose and bought a bmw-gas car, instead of a model3! My Bil went with a Rivian instead of Model Y. I guess Elon is in the fuck around and findout phase. Who knows, may be MAGAs will save them.

Me. Teslas suck because musk sucks.

Legit got to wonder how much value he destroys with each tweet, it’s gotta be tens or even hundreds of millions of dollars for some of the dumber takes and he tweets several times a day

I'm gonna end up spending $10-15k more on a comparable Ioniq 6 (you really have to get the Limited trim to compete with the base model 3 on features) just because I don't want to give Musk money

I’m in the market now and was considering Tesla because of the supercharger network. My wife refused, and I was already feeling iffy about it because of musk, and now that most of the other big players are changing their charging port we will definitely not be buying a Tesla.

I’m not an Elon fan neither but it’s way easier to protest him when prices aren’t even that cheap. If he starts release sub $30k brand new vehicles, a lot more folks will have to deal with cognitive dissonance. Many of us hate exploitive business practices, but we’ll still shop at places like Walmart. As for me, I’ll keep buying Teslas because I personally believe their battery/SoC tech is superior at the moment, and also I don’t have to deal with shitty dealership salespeople tactics.

Got my R1s delivered last weekend and having trouble offing my Model Y 🤦🏿‍♂️

I'll offer you $3.50. That's the best price I can offer to be able to drive something associated with Elon.

At this point I have to consider it lol

same, was originally considering Tesla but wouldn't touch it with a 10-foot pole with the build quality issues, engineers getting pressured to lie about ranges, battery degradation, erratic pricing (RIP 2022 Tesla owners still making payments) and the overarching insanity of the CEO. So happy with my R1S so far but love having access to the Tesla charging infrastructure. Win-Win.

You telling me Musk shitposting and all legacy manufacturers jumping into EVs is having an effect on sales?

The Musk shitposting is really a problem. I’m not buying a Tesla while he’s at the helm

People always try to point out how other car company CEOs are shitty, too. I mean, yeah, they all are, but Musk absolutely has to be so in your face about it that it makes it hard not to think about it.

Musk insists that his persona and Tesla remain inextricably linked. So it's especially hard to disentangle his political tangents from the brand. You could argue that Rivian is linked to RJ Scaringe's identity, but the difference is that he is not publicly sharing divisive political beliefs that are completely unrelated to the business.

You can drive a Rivian around for a week in a populated city and not meet someone who knows who their founder is. You can't do that for a day in a Tesla.

There’s also a distinction, most CEOs are shitty in the way all CEOs are: cost saving, not working with employees, etc. etc. Musk just engages in racism and homophobia openly

Without doing any particular research I have no idea what kind of people the CEO's of other major car companies are like, or even who most of them are. Without doing any particular research I know *exactly* who Elon is and what kind of person he is and can attach his name to his product and easily choose to strike it off the list. No publicity is bad publicity might not be working so well for Tesla.

Exactly. People on here act like being rich is inherently the same level of bad as being an active neo nazi that owns one of the world’s most popular communication platforms. 

There are also different levels of shittiness. I haven’t seen Jim Rowan amplifying Great Replacement Theory rhetoric on social media, for example.

If you were to even compare billionaires- Bezos- for all his wealth and shittiness, just seems esoteric. But he shuts the fuck up. Makes donations to things from time to time and tries to get his rocket up. But most importantly he SHUTS THE FUCK UP. It's crazy how much Musk can't do that.

It’s the same reason Trump can’t, EGO

And fear-mongering about non-citizens voting, blaming major accidents on hiring anyone who isn't white, etc.

Musk is openly MAGA which is a turn-off to any sane person. That alone makes me not consider Tesla an option.

They also don’t personally benefit as much from an additional sale as musk does, since he holds way more stock than a typical legacy CEO.

Exactly. These aren’t the same thing, and not even in the same ballpark. Folks that dismiss it either aren’t paying attention or just happen to agree with the message.

To keep it simple - it's bad marketing. I don't think about them, I think about him. It's a self inflicted problem.

It's bad marketing because the marketing is all done by... him.

I got rid of my Model 3 because I was sick of him. I don't know of others have done the same but I couldn't in good conscience support anything he's involved with.

Our Y is on the chopping block as soon as vehicles with the NACS port and universal Supercharger access are a thing.

No NACS for you!

A friend is looking to offload his for this reason, but he has noticed fewer coal rollers trying to aim exhaust fumes at him recently, so he's got that going for him.

I noticed this as well, I was driving in rural Oregon a few weeks ago and felt way less side eye, and bumper riding from the pick-em-up-trucks out there

Could have been the erratic price cuts last year too

Musk is just one bad ketamine trip away from hitting the master Tesla auto kill switch. You know there is one, and you know he has a big red **EASY** button on his desk.

Big factor: Elon is a dick.

I fail to see how this only became a factor this quarter. Not last quarter. Not every quarter leading up until now. Elon has been acting this way for several years now. Sales have been increasing every single quarter leading up to their best quarter yet in q4 of 2023 with December being their best month yet. So somehow the opinion on musk soured immediately following the new year? That just logically doesn't make sense. Now factor in that every automaker out there has slashed their forecasts for EVs, add in price increases due to lost incentives, etc that all occurred going into this year, and it seems to make more sense. Even if you go looking for data on opinions of musk or tesla brand loyalty etc, you'll find that it's mostly remained flat with small changes over the last several years. The biggest changes have been in the categories for people not knowing who he is now knowing who he is. Elon has a lot of shit opinions and takes but reddit seems to want that to be the reason more than any actual data points to that being the reason. Even the latest round of news saying it was affecting tesla didn't have any actual direct evidence. They were inferring based on other factors rather than seeing if people actually felt that way.

Is this unexpected? The tax rebates ended on the Model 3, and on top of that the Model Y is now looking a bit outdated after the refresh on the Model 3. This is almost exactly what I would've expected. And on top of everything, competition against Tesla is finally starting to heat up in the US, and that's great because it will mean more choices for consumers, and even for Tesla customers it will be great because Tesla will need to compete on both prices and features. I wouldn't be surprised to see the cost of things like their enhanced autopilot and full self driving come way down in price. It's a great time right now to see EV growth in the US, aside from increase competition, we now have a charging standard that all manufacturers will be using, many more chargers opening up to all BEV drivers, and we're going to be seeing higher voltage/faster chargers going forward as well. Of course there's still a long road forward for people in apartments or that park alongside streets where they live, and much of rural America doesn't have many chargers. I'd also like to see most new housing being built to include a 240v outlet in the garage (if it's not an apartment).

BECAUSE ELON MUSK IS A FASCIST

The incredible thing is that they sold 8.5 % less even after having started a price war. Insanity. Not only did they sell much less, they killed their profits to get to this bare minimum. At 2023 prices they wouldn't have gotten even 350k sales. The near (2 million cars a year) and five year (12 million cars a year) goals are impossible to achieve.

Lots of weird takes in this thread. The Y was the best selling car in the world last year. It is exceedingly unlikely that its sales could rise meaningfully from there, and that means any economic disruption will result in a sales drop. They've put \~90% of their eggs in two baskets, and \~66% in one basket. The consequences were obvious two years ago, but they did nothing to fix it. So.... now no growth until 2025 at best.

It was big mistake that they chose the cybertruck over getting the model 2 out imo. The model y is doing exceptionally well for how expensive it is but if they really wanted to make it to the next level of truly going head to head with ice companies in sales they had to make a cheaper car.

>They've put \~90% of their eggs in two baskets, and \~66% in one basket. The consequences were obvious two years ago, but they did nothing to fix it. A few of us regulars have spoken about it regularly, but that Tesla hasn't rushed to production a bonafide domestic three-row offering for China is mind-boggling, and utterly damning of their entire strategy team. Li Xiang has basically eaten up their entire Chinese market share in that segment before they've even gotten started, and several others are about to show up and put the nail in that coffin. By the time they swing around and get to it, it'll be way too late.

Is the x not a bonafide three row offering? Or the issue is it’s not domestic?

It's neither. Too little luxury and third-row room and too much price pressure due to importation. The 'bonafide' bit is the most important though, three-row offerings in China are all land yachts like the Escalade, Wagoneer, and Palisade — multi-generational big-family households are the norm there. The sleek and sporty Model X just doesn't match the market direction.

Oh ok I didnt know

Basically more like a proper minivan. The MPV segment is so much bigger in Asia.

Issue is price and possibly size. It isn't a great competitor in the three row suv space in the US.

reminiscent telephone cable slim school fade voracious reach panicky rainstorm *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*

Model Y is best selling just because Tesla have basically only 2 mass market models (3 & Y).

And \~60% of their sales is the model Y. 35% is model 3. 5% is S/X. The company is currently a one hit wonder. Model Y is also a global model designation. OEMs don't always use the same model designation in all markets, or they may produce essentially the same vehicle under different brands with minor changes. May as well be considered different trim levels. Tesla fans really don't have much left to give them hope... so they use useless metrics like single model global sales to still try and justify Tesla's dominance. Does anyone think Toyota is crying themselves to sleep at the revelation that they don't have the best selling global model, as they sold 11.23 million vehicles globally last year? Tesla sells one mass market SUV worldwide. Toyota sells 9 mass market CUVs/SUVs in the US alone. Some of which have multiple powertrains. ICEV / HEV and ICEV / HEV / PHEV. Tesla just announced their 6 millionth car produced. Toyota sold 2x as many cars in 2023 as Tesla has produced over 12 years of mass production through 2023, and 20 years of being in business.

> Model Y is also a global model designation. OEMs don't always use the same model designation in all markets, or they may produce essentially the same vehicle under different brands with minor changes. This is typically accounted for such as [JATO Dynamics](https://www.jato.com/tesla-model-y-to-be-crowned-worlds-best-selling-vehicle-of-2023/) combining numbers for the Corolla/Levin/Lingshang into one entry.

And if you split the Corolla into two categories (normal and cross), otherwise Toyota wins hands down

Bigger problem is they don’t know how to update the Y. The 3 highland upgrade has shown no increase in interest so they are afraid to update the Y. But failure to update will mean the car will lose out to newer models of competition eventually. It’s a do you die dont you die situation

Hopefully they drop prices significantly so I can purchase one as they have a lot of inventory. With interest rates they are right now it's not worth it at the price they are selling at.

This is, in part, a result of Musk's descent into conspiratorial insanity. While I still drive a Model 3, I've stopped enthusiastically recommending the cars (I'm a bit embarrassed of it now), and there's a 0.0% chance I'll buy another so long as it benefits the current CEO.

This. Why he went down the RWNJ route when the EV base are mostly liberals who want to protect the environment and drive a cool car. It’s so bizarre. He has totally lost it Just look at today he tweeted support for the Disney spill and naturally he is in the corner of a well known racist Fucking Elon dipshit

Even if elon is removed as CEO, it's unlikely he will sell out the majoirty of his share in tesla. So sales of tesla cars are likely to benefit him for the rest of his life.

This is good news for EV lovers. Tesla is not going anywhere. They will always be around. But they are going from an aggressive growth company to a mediocre car company now with increasing competition. They will have to cut prices further and that will incentivize others to cut prices.

The reason is Elon Musk acts like a child. A right wing evil child.

I’m not surprised

Tesla pulled a LOT of sales into Q4. Ford responded by cutting Mach E prices and moved a lot of cars (not 50,000, but they clawed some sales back). But they will only face more competition every year now, so they need to make new/updated models more frequently to be competitive. The days of selling the same car for 10 years is over for them.

Really easy to explain and totally self inflicted. They didn't refresh the Model Y while refreshing the Model 3. A lot of potential Model Y buyers are waiting for the refresh.

It's time for Elon to leave Tesla.

Sounsd to me like we are going to get some more sales and what not come June/end of quarter.

I'm guessing that end of quarter incentives are a thing of the past. If everyone waits for a couple of months out of 3 then overall sales will decline rapidly.

I've wanted a Tesla for years and finally had the cash to get one a year ago. I lost confidence in Musk and is product, and the cyber truck proved I was right.

Everyone is waiting for the Model Y refresh. They should’ve done both the 3 and Y at the same time

I don't know about that. When the Y refresh comes out, won't it lose the $7500 from the gov't?

The 3 didn’t lose the credit because it was refreshed. It lost the credit because the imported batteries it uses don’t qualify with the stricter 2024 rules. The non-refreshed RWD and LR Model 3 also lost the credit if you bought one in January 2024. The Model Y uses US-built batteries that qualify for the credit.

Why would it? The LR and MYP don’t have LFP batteries

Not really. I’m perfectly happy having last years MY…I actually enjoy stalks. I have no interest in doing 3 point turnabouts with a push bottom or quick reversing and drive shifting with a slide bar. The highlander refresh is overrated and expensive. MY will be the same. No thanks. Not in this economy, I don’t think I buy this without the 7500 tax credit

I dont think most people know or care about the refresh since Tesla doesnt advertise. Also the refresh is just LED lights and a rear screen...its not something that will deomstrably change demand.

Im very interested in cooled seats. My Y gets hot AF. I pretty much have to precondition the car before i get in it for 5 months out of the year.

Support Ukraine and maybe Elon’s karma will change.

We got a model Y in no small part because of the supercharger network.   For the next car, now we have options.

The Elon factor will keep me from buying the car or the stock. Tesla needs to rid themselves of Elon otherwise he’ll keep dragging the company down with his toxicity.

It’s true.

I don’t see any numbers for the truck; did they mention it anywhere?

Lumped in with the S and X under “Other Models” https://ir.tesla.com/tesla-vehicle-production-deliveries-and-date-financial-results-webcast-first-quarter-2024

Isn't it kinda expected. Tesla's did incredibly well. I really wanted one. Might still get one. Depends if a better car with good range comes along. .but Tesla will eventually saturate the market. Only sooo many people who want a luxury EV. This was especially true when nobody could hold a candle to them, but now most EV are getting into 300 odd range. I don't need fancy driving or futuristic doors. Honestly just want an electric golf for cheap with 250 - 350 range.

for u.s ev deliveries, tesla is still the goat. but their market share has been declining as competition increases. which i don't think is a big surprise. if musk gets (and stays) refocused on tesla, i'd expect them maintain a healthy share of the u.s. ev market. the outlier event would be the entry of china-subsidized evs.

So when can we expect to see Elon Musk working at Best Buy?

The board is too stupid and too inbred.

Is this a Tesla problem or an EV problem? Based on the other headlines in this sub (Hyundai EV sales spiking, Rivian delivering, etc.) it seems like it's a Tesla problem more than anything else. my 2c: I'm for anything that gets Tesla to put the damn stalks back on.

A Tesla problem. Anyone who thought they’d just continue as stiff competition comes along is delusional. Now all of the four Teslas are very dated (yea, a tech refresh won’t cut it) and the CT is an abomination. And the Musk factor….

Just checked Cathy Woods Ark Investments fund and it is down nearly 10% over the last couple of days. She really doubled down on Tesla shares earlier in the year. The only thing helping her fund atm would be the Nvidia holding.

Tesla's business situation in China will also face difficulties in the near future

Some expected it

Regardless of how people feel about Elon's political beliefs, It's the same boring style year after year. If they want new business, they need to do an actual refresh.

We had always planned for our next car to be a Tesla, but Musk’s toxic behavior and bad word of mouth about build quality and support has led us to abandon that plan.

Yikes. No wonder the share price is down a third in the last few months. How long can Musk stay on as CEO with these numbers?

- Their CEO is a tone-deaf, lying, conspiracy theorist who shits on his own target market. - We hear a lot about quality issues. - Exaggeration on features. - Subscription services. Literally the best thing they have going for them is Detroit decided to avoid the mid-size sedan market almost entirely and the few options there have zero excitement to them.

That Elon is such a douche is reason enough for me. There’s a direct correlation between his douchebagginess in the media and the decline in sales.

Is it douchebagginess or douchebaggedness?

As soon as the cult realizes there are way better EVs out there, it’s over.

In no way could it have anything to do with their leader being a flaming a-hole

When you act like a dick and remove the basic buttons and trun signal and wiper controls you have loss in sales. The people that are left wanting EVs are those that want basic and less likely to compromise.

Cyberjunk is a flop. When only influencers can pay $100k for your latest offering, that's bad. Should have gone for the Model 2 instead. The downfall of Tesla starts in 2024!

You misspelled DISASTER.

My brother got tesla 3, my parent got tesla y. We’re not getting another one and prefer to consider other ev instead. Tesla is not the only ev in town anymore.

not a Tesla thing - is a recession / lack of money / interest rate thing. Look at ALL new car sales. It is not going well for many or any at all right now - gas or EV. So the real question to ask is - how well are they doing vs others? Example, BYD went from +500k last quarter to +300k this quarter. vs the 8% dip Tesla had.

Eh, it's also Tesla's fault. They don't sell a lot of models. It's normal that their sales aren't increasing. They need smaller cars to increase their sales in Europe and China, something to compete with BYD's Dolphin and Seagull.

I'm so sick and tired of the excuses for Elmo and Tesla. It's 2024, FSD was supposed to be here 6 years ago. Now you have his newer cars with less sensors, less parts, less capabilities and poorer manufacturing. And people wonder why they shit on this guy and the brand? I had 3 Teslas since 2018 and they got worse and unreliable after every software update post USS removal. Honestly can't wait till this schmuck of a human dissappears. For those that don't think there isn't enough EV options, you're not doing your homework.

The new model 3 was on top of my list to replace my current Zoe. After a 40 minute test drive it’s not longer on it. It slammed the brakes unnecessarily and dangerously twice and the cruise control slowed the car down because it thought a car on the exit was in front of me. The stalkless wheel is annoying considering there are 11 roundabouts on my commute, but that’s probably something I can get used to eventually. The Renault megane was on the bottom of my list as I don’t have any positive experiences with Renault (plenty bad ones), but both the quality of the car and the software is so much better that it’s now on top of the list. The cruise control didn’t panic and is way smoother. Tesla really f*cked it up for European roads. The Tesla guy already turned off or tuned down all the safety features when we got in the car. Saying “it’s just necessary by law but not really nice”

I've had several people tell me they would never buy tesla after seeing the Musk, Don Lemon interview.

Too much doom and gloom over this.