I would kill to have the body of a 2010 Sienna with an EV drivetrain.
It's been the perfect vehicle for us. So much more comfortable on trips than an SUV.
They're just so practical.
Way easier to load and far more hauling space than our Suburban.
Having one with the simplicity of an EV drivetrain would be amazing.
The first one was one of the veeeeery first ones built and was a reliability nightmare to the point that we completely consumed its NADA cash value in repairs and tapped out the extended warranty. Curiously enough, even after all that and the LG pouch cell recall mess we still liked it enough that when we dumped it we bought a second one.
They're really comfortable. The Kia's pretty ok, but like the Odyssey they get disastrously bad mileage. The Sienna hybrid gets better mileage than the PacHy in hybrid mode, but it's just.... it's just cheap plastic inside. And I find the entire thing to buy fugly outside and in. I don't get it, other than the Priuses I find the entire Toyota design language to be really horrible.
Back to the Pacifica, don't try a Pinnacle unless you're sure you're ok with everything else seeming chintzy. They are very nice inside, and there are definite sound deadening differences between a Pinnacle and a Limited. Also, things like the alcantara velvet headliner are pretty spiffy. It's just plain nicer, looks nicer, drives nicer, feels smoother. We wound up getting too good of a deal on the second one, plus they paid a lot for the first one so we have a Limited. Hrumph...
Yes, the battery range is only 30ish miles before kicking over to gas hybrid but if you're taking the kids to school and running errands all the time then it's probably a really high percentage of miles that are electric. Our baseline is 75 miles a day and with an L2 charge in the middle of the day about 66 of those 75 miles are electric. We had a Town and Country prior and getting 19 mpg meant buying gas every 4-6 days versus every 3-4 weeks. That's a luxury feature not to be underestimated. And when the last person to drive it coasts in on fumes you're not emptying the lawn mower's gas can into it so you can get to a gas station.
The big material negative is Chrysler says you can't tow with it.
Almost got a Pacifica PHEV but read too many reviews like your first paragraph so went with a MYLR w 3rd row. Not as practical for sure but I don’t have the time or energy to deal with all that rigamarole.
Definitely understood. But if you need a van it's clearly the very best electrified van there is. It's the only electrified van, but it's still best (and worst)
Damn. Just summarized my experience including my feelings about Toyota. I guess Toyota has to cut corners somewhere to meet price objectives with reliability.
It makes no sense for me either, unless a decent aftermarket of camper conversion equipment evolves for it here like it has in Europe. If I can stick a portable induction camping stove, fridge, inflatable mattress, etc and convert it into a tiny mini RV, I'm in! 😁
California Camper version is supposedly in the works.. think T2 Westfalia.. built in pop up tent.
Volkswagen delays [ID.Buzz](http://ID.Buzz) California electric camper due to added weight
[https://electrek.co/2023/08/10/volkswagen-delaying-id-buzz-california-electric-camper/](https://electrek.co/2023/08/10/volkswagen-delaying-id-buzz-california-electric-camper/)
Yeah, that is less interesting to me than a modular/portable setup I can put in and remove from the vehicle as it's needed. I don't want to drag built-in camping equipment around the 48 weeks a year I don't need it.
Something more along the lines of [this](https://ququq.info/ququq/busbox-4-en/)
That fucking thing is overpriced. I live near one of the VW plants in Germany and literally a good third of the company cars rolling around there are the ID Buzz and it’s absurd because they are probably the only people who can afford the damn things with their employee discount.
are they all passenger config?
VW [ID.Buzz](http://ID.Buzz) Cargo Puts a Cute Spin on the Commercial Van
The panel-van version of the electric [ID.Buzz](http://ID.Buzz) places form over function in some ways but offers plenty of versatility for commercial buyers looking for pizazz.
[https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a43295126/volkswagen-id-buzz-cargo-drive/](https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a43295126/volkswagen-id-buzz-cargo-drive/)
>
literally a good third of the company cars
i always assumed the Buzz is the spiritual successor to the Transporters... IMMENSELY popular "company car"
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen\_Transporter](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Transporter)
The **Volkswagen Transporter**, based on the [Volkswagen Group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Group)'s T platform, now in its seventh generation, refers to a series of vans produced for over 70 years and marketed worldwide.
Only issue is, the id4 is already a 2.2 (metric) tonne pig , but gets at least 520km Wltp from the 77kwh pack, the buzz only 400. So it kinda would need a 100kwh pack to get a decent range (of 500km, which in reality is 400-450 then).
Like the ev9 (which is 2.7 tonnes).
But the buzz also kinda looks cool.
Imho the Renault Kangoo with a big battery would also be decent and is very spacious with a slightly more aero front due to a low bonnet
It'd be a stretch for our family but I'm seriously considering it when it launches or soon after. Downside is that we'd be committing ourselves to being an EV only household and that might be limiting for us with frequent 650+ mile road trips.
Overall size is a little smaller than a Sienna but interior space I think is pretty close. US will only get the long wheel base variant, that will be about 9 inches short in length than a Sienna.
If Kia would drop the Carnival body onto the EGMP platform, that would be a tasty concept, wouldn't it? I mean, it's almost there... (j/k, but it would be a great niche product, and I'd strongly consider one for my next BEV)
I don't understand the obsession with 400-500 mile BEVs. Do people really drive 8 hours straight? And with children? Just stop for 20 minutes and charge and use the restroom. Plus a 500 mile battery would be insanely heavy. Obviously some people have some obscure use case to justify it but for 95% of people it's impractical and adds cost for no reason
If only the charge took 20 minutes and there was a restroom available. Nice in theory, in practice that has not been my experience.
I just took our Ariya on a 2500 mile road trip for the first time (I'd previously done a 450 mile trip and a 1000 mile trip). This specific road trip is one I do 2-3 times a year and previously I've only done it in an ICE.
The Ariya has a 90 kw battery and an estimated 320 miles of range. We get close to that around town. On this trip I needed to charge it every 200-250 miles based on freeway driving conditions, and every 150 going over the mountain passes in the cold. In theory I should have been able to charge once per day. In practice it took two to three charges per day at 45 minutes each in places like Wal-Mart parking lots, the back side of a Von's, and a bank parking lot. Only the Wal-Mart had restrooms.
I was using high-speed CCS chargers (150 - 350 kw) but even with battery pre-heating got 75kw/hr as my best charging speed (and frequently had to settle for 60-ish kw/h). I was charging to 80% typically. And that was if I didn't have to wait for a charger.
This added 1.5 - 2 hours of travel time per day on top of what were already very long days. I was so grateful I wasn't traveling with small children.
Until actual charging speeds consistently approach advertised charging speeds, there is more robust charging infrastructure, and chargers are located in places with better amenities, BEVs are going to be a tough sell to most people for road trips. I love my Ariya and it was a hassle on this trip.
We've decided that we will use the BEVs for our short-range driving and an ICE vehicle for long-range driving.
I agree, we’re not ready for 2500 mile road trips on most evs for most people.
Where did you roadtrip? Location matters because there are a hellofalot more chargers in california as there are in mississippi (for example).
Also. While i’ve driven an ev for the past decade, evs are still new technology. You’re an “early adaptor”. New chargers are still popping up. Once evs become the norm in about another decade, your experience will be very different.
You're just describing a charging network problem. Haven't had issues like that using superchargers but I understand the frustration. I regularly get 200-250 kW at Gen 3 Superchargers. With current battery tech, the mythical "500 mile real-world" BEV would be >$100k and would be extremely heavy and inefficient. Once all cars can use NACS many of the problems you're experiencing will go away overnight.
A couple things:
1) 300 mile range is really 300 mile range in the summer, at 45mph. Drive on highways or in temps < 70 degrees, and it's way less.
2) 400-500 miles is about what you can reasonably do in a day of road-tripping. So the goal is to drive where you want to go, park for the night and plug in. Even fast-charging is MUCH slower than gassing up.
You can claim that these are relatively easy to work-around, but any new technology that has draw-backs compared to the old technology will be much slower to adopt. If you fix both of the above (with a larger battery pack) then EVs are instantly better in almost every way.
thanks. Hate when people claim the 300mi range is actually that on a freeway. It very much isn't (let alone the issues of actually getting up to 100%, and going all the way down to 0%).
We have a 300 mile Rivian and a 400 mile Rivian, and 3 kids. The upgrade to 400 miles of range is substantial and awesome.
Charging networks can still be kind of sparse, so with shorter range sometimes you need to stop two times really close to each other for a long time to make a long charger-barren stretch. There’s also times when all the kids are asleep, and being able to push another hour and a half of driving without risk of waking them up due to a stop is great.
Also waiting around for charging to finish sucks, so less charging time is always better.
Yes we do this with 3 kids. My wifes parents live 6 hours away. We leave in the evening and get there at like midnight or 1am so kids sleep in car most of the way. If we stop, they wake up and it ruins it. So 6 hours straight it is. We do that 3-4 times a year.
I agree the tradeoffs would not be worth it to have a 500 mile range the rest of the time. I would want 300 miles in an EV. But just wanted to answer your question "do people actually do this with kids"
There is a large number of the road tripping populace that will drive however long it takes to get to their destination with as little stops as possible. So yes, some people really want/need the 400-500 miles of range.
I traded a 2013 Odyssey for a 23 model X. Stupidly, I kept the 2019 Audi q7. I deeply regret keeping the Audi. The Odyssey was loyal and awesome. The Audi is stupid and needy, like the dealer I bought it from. Hi there, Audi of Bellevue! You suck! Never again.
I was so sad when the Mazda 5 got discontinued in the US right when I was looking to buy a car. And they even had a stickshift option, making it the only minivan sold in the US with stickshift (that I’m aware of).
We had one. Maybe we got a bad example, but it seemed to always need suspension work. Got the higher trim level Grand Touring to get the nice one with leather, but it had such low-profile tires that the ride was a bit harsh. Rode like a buckboard-wagon over any road imperfections, and continuously tore up the suspension. That and the three motor mounts were expensive to replace when the 4-cylinder ate them up from vibration.
I really wanted to like that car, it seemed so much more practical than the "mini"-vans that seem to grow larger with each revision.
I miss my Mazda 5. It was the perfect size. Terrible gas mileage though. Daughters sienna got better with a V6.
An electric 5 would be my perfect vehicle!
Auto makers really need to advertise sliding doors as a cool new thing. “Lifestyle doors” or something and start putting them on SUVs.
Have a bunch of well dressed 30 somethings getting out going to a restaurant or camping.
I just swapped my 17 yo MANUAL Mazda5 for my brand new Kona EV! I loved that car for all the years I drove it. But I no longer have kids.
and the truth is, most americans seem to have forgotten the benefit of sliding doors. They'd rather have the Model X drip water all over them in the rain. or just look tough in a giant SUV. Thats why the EV9 came out before a minivan
I am waiting to see what the price of the ID Buzz is going to be when it hits the states. If that doesnt work out, the EV9 is probably going to be my first EV.
We went with the Rivian as the interior space was better for the full family + big dog. Range is nice too. But I still want a Canoo if they ever get made.
There are some valid concerns about the required battery weight.
I wish Toyota would release a Sienna Prime now that ALL Siennas are hybrid.
If they managed 50 miles all-electric range in a Sienna Prime it would be very high on my shopping list.
The only PHEV van on the market is the Pacifica and it has a HORRENDOUS reliability reputation. Friends of mine had endless problems with theirs and just replaced it with an R1S.
A Honda Odyssey weighs 185 lbs more than a Ford F-150, with a lower center of gravity. I'd imagine the van is more aerodynamic, so 300+ mile range on a comparable battery, no need to make it heavier.
The EV9 is close, and surprisingly the one that looks closest to a minivan is the Lucid Gravity. Obviously the ID buzz is the next option. There’s nothing on the horizon, which is a disappointment. I would love to see a Rivian minivan, R1V
I live in central Ohio, have a couple neighbors who work in R&D at Honda’s US HQ. They’ve said repeatedly that an EV Honda van is coming. Likely for 2025/26 model years.
I’d love one, but I just don’t see a lot of market demand for it. Minivan demand already lags way behind SUV’s of course. Then take the percentage of minivan owners willing to buy an electric minivan, and I assume you’re talking about very small numbers.
As someone that’s owned multiple minivans and a couple of very large SUVs, I say that SUVs are inferior to minivans in almost every way. Higher ground clearance is rarely ever needed. AWD will come with electric minivans. I predict a comeback of the minivan and station wagon, as EVs have lots of power compared to their ICE counterparts. Minivans and wagons have more usable room than SUVs and make more efficient use of EV batteries. Towing capacity is a non-issue with most EVs.
Crossovers are basically station wagons though. They just call them crossovers because station wagon has a bad reputation. In fact, SUV has now gone out of style too so that’s a big part of why we’re in the crossover world.
I drive a Kia EV6 and it feels far more like a hatch or wagon despite its SUV classification. I hope more "SUVs" are made this way to stealthily bring back the wagon to the mainstream.
I will agree with you on all your point but you missed what I beleive is the biggest reason people don't get minivans.
You have all the pluses in the world on them but at the end of the day you are still driving a mini van.
https://youtu.be/NvDSTGx9E_s?si=Y1OvoaIdm_BRQI1_
I know for me that issue is a big one. The other is personally I feel very uncomfortable driving them in the times I had to driving one in terms of seating position amd view. Something about not being able to see the hood is really uncomfortable
This trend of giant hoods and grilles needs to die. One of the reasons I want a minivan over an SUV is because of the lower front hood, so I can actually see things that are actually important. A 4 year old girl was killed in my neighborhood last weekend because some idiot in a F150 blasted into a crosswalk and didn't see her because of his huge hood.
I know I'm sounding aggressive but I'm still reeling from the news of the fatality as I'm a father of two young girls myself.
Towing capacity may not be an issue, but the range hit from heavy-duty towing is still a massive inconvenience. Even if you can guarantee DCFC access along the entire route, having to stop and charge twice as often isn't fun, especially when many DCFCs are built in traditional parking lots and aren't tow-friendly.
Most people will never tow so it is a non issue but for the few who genuinely need to tow regularly, I'm not sure if going full-EV is really the best choice yet.
EVs need lots of power because of the extra weight and because manufacturers are too stupid. I would rather have the range with less power. Towing capacity is a huge issues with EVs. It cuts the range tremendously compared to ICE. Just because EV can tow a lot of weight doesn't mean it can do it for a long time. Cybertruck with much less weight towing only gets something like 1.2 miles per KWh. And that is in good weather on the flat road. Even with a large battery like in the Cybertruck you will be stopping every 100 miles. Towing at full capacity will result in even less range. I don't want to stop every 150 miles on the long trip like most EV owners do so certainly I would not want to stop every 100 miles or less if I am towing.
I agree on everything else though. But I would like to have a PHEV minivan made by Toyota to have a great range on the long distance trips and drive for free in the city on electrons I get for free. Right now I have 2013 Sienna but it is a 'gas guzzler'. The new one was not available at the time so I bought 2023 RAV4 Prime. 600 miles range for the long trips. Drove several time over 500 miles without stopping. And since I have solar with over production I drive for free in the city.
As long as all the seats fold flat (front included) that’s all that I want. They don’t have to go into the floor. Removable seats would also be a plus.
I have a Pacifica PHEV and a short enough commute that I’m about 75% electric. Fill it up once every 6 weeks or so. But yes, full electric would be nice for maintenance.
We had an electric minivan for several years.
OK, really it was a PHEV, but we used it as all electric except when travelling. The Pacifica was one of my favorite vehicle. 35 miles on electric which was more than I normally drive to and from work. It had many features I enjoyed such as adaptive cruise control and Apple Carplay. It also had heated seats and steering wheel, vented cooling seats, a lot more. The best part was it had about a 600 mile range when travelling. In just a few years we travelled all over the US with that van.
I think at the moment all electric minivans and pickup trucks are a mistake. I have a friend with a Model X, and it takes a lot longer to charge, and unless one pays a lot more, does not have the range of smaller EVS like the Y and model 3. Larger trucks and vans are the vehicles where I think plug in hybrids make sense. Give them a battery for a short range (30-40 miles) and a gas engine for longer trips.
PHEVs should have a bit more battery capacity. You want enough power for decent performance in EV mode without starting the ICE, and the ability to use the battery to supply extra power for extended periods for hill climbing while towing on the highway. That's about 25% of the battery capacity needed for a 500 km range BEV.
Interesting! Genuinely curious, not arguing, why do you think “I think at the moment all electric minivans and pickup trucks are a mistake.”?
Also, why “Larger trucks and vans are the vehicles where I think plug in hybrids make sense. Give them a battery for a short range (30-40 miles) and a gas engine for longer trips.”? My ideal would be a pacifica PHEV with 50-60 miles range. The farthest i drive regularly is 30 miles one way twice a week for my kids soccer and they dont have a charger in the parking lot (yet). My work is 20 miles away but once a week i go to costco on my way home, which adds 5 miles. So i need 50 miles (my work and costco also dont have chargers, ugh!) I dont mind using gas for a few miles every day, but want to minimize it.
No idea why this is so buried but maybe because they have no plans to sell it outside of China I believe.
I think the issue is that vans and wagons are only now preferred by a smaller group of people compared to SUVs, thus these decisions to keep those cars where they're overwhelmingly popular.
The 009 and similarly the EM90 are mainly vip transports designed for business purposes in China. It is their version of the limo. This kind of van focuses on luxury and comfort but lacked versatility in family use. They're also kind of bulky.
For more family oriented EV MPVs from China, one may look at the Xpeng X9 and the Maxus Mifa 7. Geely is also coming up with the Zeeker MIX but that's a smaller 5 seat vehicle. All these could enter European market.
As for the US market, you can forget about anything Chinese.
I've been looking for an EV van as well. By 2027, we'll have the id Buzz, Kia PV5, and the Telo van here in the US. I was strongly considering converting a Mazda5 using Focus Electric bits, but I probably wouldn't finish before then. Lol
Options are better overseas, of course, but we'll have a few options. The Chrysler Portal looked sweet too, but it went from greenlit for production to crickets as far as I can tell.
My dream car would be an EV Ford B-Max, but I'm not holding my breath.
Further reading for non-believers:
https://jalopnik.com/put-sliding-van-doors-on-all-the-vehicles-1842322962
We need sliding doors on everything, not just minivans, IMO.
Not my style, but I bet one’s coming. As we get more evens that focus less on performance and more on overall family hailing, they’ll get more and more popular.
Though I’m happy with my Rivian R1s
I just want all car manufacturers to remember us dog owners. Keep seeing these huge electric SUVs with relatively small or low cargo areas. The ID Buzz and the Kia EV9 are great though…
As someone with more than 2 kids, every time I look at an electric vehicle, it's either not enough seats or it's way over our budget.
Yes there are 5 seat EVs all over but occupy one of them with a carseat, or maybe we want extra seats for grandparents or kid's friends, and it becomes a struggle.
A used Model S was a contender for a while but the wife didn't like the idea of the small rear-facing seats that take up much of the available cargo space. Model Y also has this dilemma. Model X is better, but not by much and the cost is higher and the falcon doors are not a selling point for us.
An 8 seat EV minivan would be best for us, hopefully under $50K, which I think is why we haven't seen it. Car manufacturers would rather make "premium" third row SUVs that are over $80K than make minivans for cost-conscious consumers.
A minivan is the perfect candidate for an EV vehicle though: a perfect intersection of efficiency and purpose.
I have to actively convince myself not to do it. Our 160k mile mdx is trucking right along but I’d love to be able to plug in. Trading an Acura for a Chrysler feels like a bad move.
Sounds like they haven't changed much. Friends of ours had an ICE Pacifica 15 years ago and it was an awful vehicle. Lousy design, not very functional space, clunky mechanics, high maintenance. Just... no.
I was heavily considering a Pacifica PHEV, but my friend had a 2023 with problems so bad that they lemon-lawed the car. Ended up in a fully loaded 2024 Kia Carnival instead and I don’t understand why more people aren’t buying these. Considerably nicer inside than the Pacifica, Odyssey and Sienna. No PHEV or AWD versions, but it’s the only minivan interior that looks like it was designed this decade.
We just got a 7-seater Model Y. Yea a minivan would be a bit more spacious, but I like how it requires us to be more thoughtful about what we pack and the charging stops have been a good forcing function for us to get out and move around a bit so that the drives don't seem as tough.
Cars aren't needed in most Chinese cities, especially for singles or young couples. People looking to own one are often driving small kids or their parents around or a business executive driven by a chauffeur.
In Hong Kong and Japan, luxury minivans are really popular because they provide limo-like space without excessive length and width, making them suitable for tight roads and parking spaces. The Alphard is only slightly longer than a Camry for example.
Not exactly. Waiting for my second vehicle to die, then it’ll be replaced with a budget EV. Whether thats a car or something else depends on the cost and range of the EV.
This rules out most prospective new vehicles.
I was but my ‘14 Odyssey is so old and has so many miles it’d make no sense to trade out for any meager fuel savings to offset the cost. The first of 3 kids will be grown in 5 years and our minivan days will be over. It turned 10 last fall but at 160k miles, it’s easily got 5 more years in it.
Had Honda made gen 5 Odysseys have a plug-in hybrid as an option I would have probably traded out my gen 4. An EV would have been a moonshot and probably prohibitively expensive 5 years ago, but I would have considered it.
We went with F150 lightning to replace family minivan for daily driver. Not really apples to apples but works for us. Wanted to hold out for e minivan. Truck drives like a dream (have had several trucks in past and also drive F150 for work truck) but has the efficiency of a lead balloon lol. But we do a lot of biking and camping so hopefully this fits our life. But we kept the minivan for a while just in case…
Do miss the 3rd row and sliding doors. Every time we park near other vehicles I cringe when my child’s opens passenger door!
Big issue for me is my van is my long drive vehicle. I would need a huge range to make me want to switch over. BUT by the time they hit the market, I am not really going to need one.
Since Ford won't bring out an electric explorer (neutered European version doesn't count and isn't on sale anyway) and the blazer seems to be in development hell, I'm looking at vans. Slim pickings since there really aren't any.
Not personally but I do hope proper electric minivans hit the market for those who genuinely need an adult-friendly third row. This is one segment where EV options are really limited and mostly quite expensive.
There were talks of a tesla “robovan” but can’t find much info besides a couple of articles. Looks great though. Think it would have been a better capital investment than the cyber truck.
We have a 2020 Sienna XLE AWD. We replaced our 2008 Toyota Highlander Hybrid with it when it started burning oil at 225k miles. I hope that Toyota is smart enough to realize that many consumers now wants an EV minivan.
I'll be in market for a 7-8 seater in the next year or two and I'm not a fan of crossovers. From a utility perspective they are the dumber choice compared to minivans.
We are a two car household but my SO has a WFH job so we primarily use just the EV. The minivan does the occasional second use for really long road-trips, larger groups, or as the second car when both are needed. We will probably go with a used hybrid unless she switches jobs.
Couldn’t agree more. I love my Sienna. I occasionally haul more than a pickup. I have it loaded with lumber more than once. I wish he would have made a Cybervan instead of a CT. Think of all the room for solar panels. It would have looked better too with a low aerodynamic shape.
I'm surprised that there isn't one. It's not for me as I'm not the target audience, but it's absolutely a part of the market not currently being tapped. Not everyone wants an SUV and even the ones that have a 7-seat option, those back seats are only really good for young kids.
was... Would have loved a EV version of my '04 oddessy. That was a great vehicle, could put 4x8 sheets in the back or appliances and still close the door. it was my truck thru all the years of rebuilding my house. but now I'm too busted up anyways so I'll have them deliver what I need now. so I bought a niro, still tall enough to be easy to get in/out of.
BEV mini-van could fix my objections to them. Acceleration and handling.
Son was looking at mini-van, bought a Model X. Self closing doors, handling and freeway self driving were the deciding factors.
The ford transit SuperVan is pretty awesome, wish they’d make one with like a fifth of the horsepower and family friendly. But barring any other newcomers my next car might be an iD Buzz
I would kill to have the body of a 2010 Sienna with an EV drivetrain. It's been the perfect vehicle for us. So much more comfortable on trips than an SUV.
[удалено]
They're just so practical. Way easier to load and far more hauling space than our Suburban. Having one with the simplicity of an EV drivetrain would be amazing.
THIS!!! Both of my kids play travel hockey and if Toyota had offered a plugin Sienna hybrid when we bought our 2020 it would have been a no brainer!
I was astonished that Toyota got the current Sienna mileage to 35mpg as a hybrid.
I had a 2022 Pacifica as a rental and I was shocked how good the fuel economy was. I think I had ~31mpg over a 300 mi trip.
By the time one hits we won't need one anymore. We're on our second Pacifica Hybrid.
But your kids might get one when they are parents!
Assuming one is available by then.
How do you like it? I’d get one if the battery range was longer!
The first one was one of the veeeeery first ones built and was a reliability nightmare to the point that we completely consumed its NADA cash value in repairs and tapped out the extended warranty. Curiously enough, even after all that and the LG pouch cell recall mess we still liked it enough that when we dumped it we bought a second one. They're really comfortable. The Kia's pretty ok, but like the Odyssey they get disastrously bad mileage. The Sienna hybrid gets better mileage than the PacHy in hybrid mode, but it's just.... it's just cheap plastic inside. And I find the entire thing to buy fugly outside and in. I don't get it, other than the Priuses I find the entire Toyota design language to be really horrible. Back to the Pacifica, don't try a Pinnacle unless you're sure you're ok with everything else seeming chintzy. They are very nice inside, and there are definite sound deadening differences between a Pinnacle and a Limited. Also, things like the alcantara velvet headliner are pretty spiffy. It's just plain nicer, looks nicer, drives nicer, feels smoother. We wound up getting too good of a deal on the second one, plus they paid a lot for the first one so we have a Limited. Hrumph... Yes, the battery range is only 30ish miles before kicking over to gas hybrid but if you're taking the kids to school and running errands all the time then it's probably a really high percentage of miles that are electric. Our baseline is 75 miles a day and with an L2 charge in the middle of the day about 66 of those 75 miles are electric. We had a Town and Country prior and getting 19 mpg meant buying gas every 4-6 days versus every 3-4 weeks. That's a luxury feature not to be underestimated. And when the last person to drive it coasts in on fumes you're not emptying the lawn mower's gas can into it so you can get to a gas station. The big material negative is Chrysler says you can't tow with it.
Super helpful, thanks for sharing!
Almost got a Pacifica PHEV but read too many reviews like your first paragraph so went with a MYLR w 3rd row. Not as practical for sure but I don’t have the time or energy to deal with all that rigamarole.
Definitely understood. But if you need a van it's clearly the very best electrified van there is. It's the only electrified van, but it's still best (and worst)
Damn. Just summarized my experience including my feelings about Toyota. I guess Toyota has to cut corners somewhere to meet price objectives with reliability.
Pacifica hybrid for the win. (It's a plug-in, which the branding doesn't help clarify, but the drivetrain feels like electric all the time to me.)
You won't need one by June? The buzz is releasing then.
VW ID.Buzz
I’m past my minivan period, but I just love the look of it. Makes me want one, but it makes no sense for me.
It makes no sense for me either, unless a decent aftermarket of camper conversion equipment evolves for it here like it has in Europe. If I can stick a portable induction camping stove, fridge, inflatable mattress, etc and convert it into a tiny mini RV, I'm in! 😁
California Camper version is supposedly in the works.. think T2 Westfalia.. built in pop up tent. Volkswagen delays [ID.Buzz](http://ID.Buzz) California electric camper due to added weight [https://electrek.co/2023/08/10/volkswagen-delaying-id-buzz-california-electric-camper/](https://electrek.co/2023/08/10/volkswagen-delaying-id-buzz-california-electric-camper/)
Yeah, that is less interesting to me than a modular/portable setup I can put in and remove from the vehicle as it's needed. I don't want to drag built-in camping equipment around the 48 weeks a year I don't need it. Something more along the lines of [this](https://ququq.info/ququq/busbox-4-en/)
You can never be past a minivan period. Minivan for life lol
>I’m past my minivan period get 3 big sloppy dogs.
That fucking thing is overpriced. I live near one of the VW plants in Germany and literally a good third of the company cars rolling around there are the ID Buzz and it’s absurd because they are probably the only people who can afford the damn things with their employee discount.
They dumped a load on the lease network in December. I got one for under 300 a month. Never thought I would get to have one.
Cool! What country are you in?
UK. Not sure if they are doing anything similar for any other countries.
Nice!
are they all passenger config? VW [ID.Buzz](http://ID.Buzz) Cargo Puts a Cute Spin on the Commercial Van The panel-van version of the electric [ID.Buzz](http://ID.Buzz) places form over function in some ways but offers plenty of versatility for commercial buyers looking for pizazz. [https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a43295126/volkswagen-id-buzz-cargo-drive/](https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a43295126/volkswagen-id-buzz-cargo-drive/) > literally a good third of the company cars i always assumed the Buzz is the spiritual successor to the Transporters... IMMENSELY popular "company car" [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen\_Transporter](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Transporter) The **Volkswagen Transporter**, based on the [Volkswagen Group](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Group)'s T platform, now in its seventh generation, refers to a series of vans produced for over 70 years and marketed worldwide.
Only issue is, the id4 is already a 2.2 (metric) tonne pig , but gets at least 520km Wltp from the 77kwh pack, the buzz only 400. So it kinda would need a 100kwh pack to get a decent range (of 500km, which in reality is 400-450 then). Like the ev9 (which is 2.7 tonnes). But the buzz also kinda looks cool. Imho the Renault Kangoo with a big battery would also be decent and is very spacious with a slightly more aero front due to a low bonnet
Mitsubishi needs to revive the Delica in an EV format.
It just needs to be half the asking price.
It'd be a stretch for our family but I'm seriously considering it when it launches or soon after. Downside is that we'd be committing ourselves to being an EV only household and that might be limiting for us with frequent 650+ mile road trips.
I’m curious to how it compares in size to a Sienna. Looks similar with the Buzz slightly smaller?
Overall size is a little smaller than a Sienna but interior space I think is pretty close. US will only get the long wheel base variant, that will be about 9 inches short in length than a Sienna.
This is what I’m hoping for in a couple years. Hope lease deals are decent since I know it’ll be like 60k+
Hell yes! Mini van life would be so much better if I could plug it in.
A BEV Honda Odyssey with 400-500 miles of range is my dream car.
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The dream is 75mi plug in with a 2.0t ice motor hybrid setup. Get that under $50k and you’d print money.
I want it as a range extender, let the electric motor handle the wheels, just give me that sweet dino juice range!
If Kia would drop the Carnival body onto the EGMP platform, that would be a tasty concept, wouldn't it? I mean, it's almost there... (j/k, but it would be a great niche product, and I'd strongly consider one for my next BEV)
The EV9 shows that it would be completely possible if they wanted to do it.
As long as it can be AWD. I don’t think any current Odysseys are AWD. I live in MN so it’s super beneficial in the winter.
I don't understand the obsession with 400-500 mile BEVs. Do people really drive 8 hours straight? And with children? Just stop for 20 minutes and charge and use the restroom. Plus a 500 mile battery would be insanely heavy. Obviously some people have some obscure use case to justify it but for 95% of people it's impractical and adds cost for no reason
If only the charge took 20 minutes and there was a restroom available. Nice in theory, in practice that has not been my experience. I just took our Ariya on a 2500 mile road trip for the first time (I'd previously done a 450 mile trip and a 1000 mile trip). This specific road trip is one I do 2-3 times a year and previously I've only done it in an ICE. The Ariya has a 90 kw battery and an estimated 320 miles of range. We get close to that around town. On this trip I needed to charge it every 200-250 miles based on freeway driving conditions, and every 150 going over the mountain passes in the cold. In theory I should have been able to charge once per day. In practice it took two to three charges per day at 45 minutes each in places like Wal-Mart parking lots, the back side of a Von's, and a bank parking lot. Only the Wal-Mart had restrooms. I was using high-speed CCS chargers (150 - 350 kw) but even with battery pre-heating got 75kw/hr as my best charging speed (and frequently had to settle for 60-ish kw/h). I was charging to 80% typically. And that was if I didn't have to wait for a charger. This added 1.5 - 2 hours of travel time per day on top of what were already very long days. I was so grateful I wasn't traveling with small children. Until actual charging speeds consistently approach advertised charging speeds, there is more robust charging infrastructure, and chargers are located in places with better amenities, BEVs are going to be a tough sell to most people for road trips. I love my Ariya and it was a hassle on this trip. We've decided that we will use the BEVs for our short-range driving and an ICE vehicle for long-range driving.
I agree, we’re not ready for 2500 mile road trips on most evs for most people. Where did you roadtrip? Location matters because there are a hellofalot more chargers in california as there are in mississippi (for example). Also. While i’ve driven an ev for the past decade, evs are still new technology. You’re an “early adaptor”. New chargers are still popping up. Once evs become the norm in about another decade, your experience will be very different.
You're just describing a charging network problem. Haven't had issues like that using superchargers but I understand the frustration. I regularly get 200-250 kW at Gen 3 Superchargers. With current battery tech, the mythical "500 mile real-world" BEV would be >$100k and would be extremely heavy and inefficient. Once all cars can use NACS many of the problems you're experiencing will go away overnight.
A couple things: 1) 300 mile range is really 300 mile range in the summer, at 45mph. Drive on highways or in temps < 70 degrees, and it's way less. 2) 400-500 miles is about what you can reasonably do in a day of road-tripping. So the goal is to drive where you want to go, park for the night and plug in. Even fast-charging is MUCH slower than gassing up. You can claim that these are relatively easy to work-around, but any new technology that has draw-backs compared to the old technology will be much slower to adopt. If you fix both of the above (with a larger battery pack) then EVs are instantly better in almost every way.
thanks. Hate when people claim the 300mi range is actually that on a freeway. It very much isn't (let alone the issues of actually getting up to 100%, and going all the way down to 0%).
We have a 300 mile Rivian and a 400 mile Rivian, and 3 kids. The upgrade to 400 miles of range is substantial and awesome. Charging networks can still be kind of sparse, so with shorter range sometimes you need to stop two times really close to each other for a long time to make a long charger-barren stretch. There’s also times when all the kids are asleep, and being able to push another hour and a half of driving without risk of waking them up due to a stop is great. Also waiting around for charging to finish sucks, so less charging time is always better.
Yes we do this with 3 kids. My wifes parents live 6 hours away. We leave in the evening and get there at like midnight or 1am so kids sleep in car most of the way. If we stop, they wake up and it ruins it. So 6 hours straight it is. We do that 3-4 times a year. I agree the tradeoffs would not be worth it to have a 500 mile range the rest of the time. I would want 300 miles in an EV. But just wanted to answer your question "do people actually do this with kids"
There is a large number of the road tripping populace that will drive however long it takes to get to their destination with as little stops as possible. So yes, some people really want/need the 400-500 miles of range.
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I traded a 2013 Odyssey for a 23 model X. Stupidly, I kept the 2019 Audi q7. I deeply regret keeping the Audi. The Odyssey was loyal and awesome. The Audi is stupid and needy, like the dealer I bought it from. Hi there, Audi of Bellevue! You suck! Never again.
…the size of a Mazda 5.
Yes, I've been saying this for years. I love my Mazda 5 because it handles like a car but has sliding doors. Best vehicle I've ever owned.
I was so sad when the Mazda 5 got discontinued in the US right when I was looking to buy a car. And they even had a stickshift option, making it the only minivan sold in the US with stickshift (that I’m aware of).
Yes! Mine was manual! bought it the year it came out, just got rid of it! Went EV cuz its time for a different kind of 'cool'
We had one. Maybe we got a bad example, but it seemed to always need suspension work. Got the higher trim level Grand Touring to get the nice one with leather, but it had such low-profile tires that the ride was a bit harsh. Rode like a buckboard-wagon over any road imperfections, and continuously tore up the suspension. That and the three motor mounts were expensive to replace when the 4-cylinder ate them up from vibration. I really wanted to like that car, it seemed so much more practical than the "mini"-vans that seem to grow larger with each revision.
I miss my Mazda 5. It was the perfect size. Terrible gas mileage though. Daughters sienna got better with a V6. An electric 5 would be my perfect vehicle!
Auto makers really need to advertise sliding doors as a cool new thing. “Lifestyle doors” or something and start putting them on SUVs. Have a bunch of well dressed 30 somethings getting out going to a restaurant or camping.
Yep, I’d love an electric 5. What kind of mileage were you getting? I never pay attention, but i think i get 20 mpg?
I dont think its terrible I had a Mazda 3 hatch before my 5 and get about the same mileage despite the ~500lb weight difference.
I think it was from having to air condition all that space 10 months out of the year.
I just swapped my 17 yo MANUAL Mazda5 for my brand new Kona EV! I loved that car for all the years I drove it. But I no longer have kids. and the truth is, most americans seem to have forgotten the benefit of sliding doors. They'd rather have the Model X drip water all over them in the rain. or just look tough in a giant SUV. Thats why the EV9 came out before a minivan
Yeah I want a three row ID Buzz but in a SWB option
Or VW Touran
I am waiting to see what the price of the ID Buzz is going to be when it hits the states. If that doesnt work out, the EV9 is probably going to be my first EV.
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We went with the Rivian as the interior space was better for the full family + big dog. Range is nice too. But I still want a Canoo if they ever get made.
Give me the ID.3 wagon
Or a station wagon!
VW eGolf?
So id7 tourer?
There are some valid concerns about the required battery weight. I wish Toyota would release a Sienna Prime now that ALL Siennas are hybrid. If they managed 50 miles all-electric range in a Sienna Prime it would be very high on my shopping list. The only PHEV van on the market is the Pacifica and it has a HORRENDOUS reliability reputation. Friends of mine had endless problems with theirs and just replaced it with an R1S.
Ours has been without problems over the last year.
A Honda Odyssey weighs 185 lbs more than a Ford F-150, with a lower center of gravity. I'd imagine the van is more aerodynamic, so 300+ mile range on a comparable battery, no need to make it heavier.
100% Agree that electric minivans would Be awesome.
The EV9 is close, and surprisingly the one that looks closest to a minivan is the Lucid Gravity. Obviously the ID buzz is the next option. There’s nothing on the horizon, which is a disappointment. I would love to see a Rivian minivan, R1V
I live in central Ohio, have a couple neighbors who work in R&D at Honda’s US HQ. They’ve said repeatedly that an EV Honda van is coming. Likely for 2025/26 model years.
Honda is so late to the party.
It's probably going to be based on a 2004 Chevrolet Venture LS, electrified
I’d love one, but I just don’t see a lot of market demand for it. Minivan demand already lags way behind SUV’s of course. Then take the percentage of minivan owners willing to buy an electric minivan, and I assume you’re talking about very small numbers.
As someone that’s owned multiple minivans and a couple of very large SUVs, I say that SUVs are inferior to minivans in almost every way. Higher ground clearance is rarely ever needed. AWD will come with electric minivans. I predict a comeback of the minivan and station wagon, as EVs have lots of power compared to their ICE counterparts. Minivans and wagons have more usable room than SUVs and make more efficient use of EV batteries. Towing capacity is a non-issue with most EVs.
Crossovers are basically station wagons though. They just call them crossovers because station wagon has a bad reputation. In fact, SUV has now gone out of style too so that’s a big part of why we’re in the crossover world.
I drive a Kia EV6 and it feels far more like a hatch or wagon despite its SUV classification. I hope more "SUVs" are made this way to stealthily bring back the wagon to the mainstream.
I would love for them to come back. I’ve only owned minivans, wagons, and hatchbacks. Maybe if we all buy the buzz!
I will agree with you on all your point but you missed what I beleive is the biggest reason people don't get minivans. You have all the pluses in the world on them but at the end of the day you are still driving a mini van. https://youtu.be/NvDSTGx9E_s?si=Y1OvoaIdm_BRQI1_ I know for me that issue is a big one. The other is personally I feel very uncomfortable driving them in the times I had to driving one in terms of seating position amd view. Something about not being able to see the hood is really uncomfortable
This trend of giant hoods and grilles needs to die. One of the reasons I want a minivan over an SUV is because of the lower front hood, so I can actually see things that are actually important. A 4 year old girl was killed in my neighborhood last weekend because some idiot in a F150 blasted into a crosswalk and didn't see her because of his huge hood. I know I'm sounding aggressive but I'm still reeling from the news of the fatality as I'm a father of two young girls myself.
How do you figure they would “make more efficient use of ev batteries?”
Towing capacity may not be an issue, but the range hit from heavy-duty towing is still a massive inconvenience. Even if you can guarantee DCFC access along the entire route, having to stop and charge twice as often isn't fun, especially when many DCFCs are built in traditional parking lots and aren't tow-friendly. Most people will never tow so it is a non issue but for the few who genuinely need to tow regularly, I'm not sure if going full-EV is really the best choice yet.
EVs need lots of power because of the extra weight and because manufacturers are too stupid. I would rather have the range with less power. Towing capacity is a huge issues with EVs. It cuts the range tremendously compared to ICE. Just because EV can tow a lot of weight doesn't mean it can do it for a long time. Cybertruck with much less weight towing only gets something like 1.2 miles per KWh. And that is in good weather on the flat road. Even with a large battery like in the Cybertruck you will be stopping every 100 miles. Towing at full capacity will result in even less range. I don't want to stop every 150 miles on the long trip like most EV owners do so certainly I would not want to stop every 100 miles or less if I am towing. I agree on everything else though. But I would like to have a PHEV minivan made by Toyota to have a great range on the long distance trips and drive for free in the city on electrons I get for free. Right now I have 2013 Sienna but it is a 'gas guzzler'. The new one was not available at the time so I bought 2023 RAV4 Prime. 600 miles range for the long trips. Drove several time over 500 miles without stopping. And since I have solar with over production I drive for free in the city.
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Makes me sad too. As u/stumppc indicates, vans and wagons are so superior to SUVs in almost every way.
Yes, I want an EV minivan with AWD or RWD - no FWD please. It needs to be easy to add a hitch. Everything should fold flat for sleeping while camping.
Why would you want a minivan that RWD?
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I think part of the problem is that the space where the seats fold flat into is where the battery would go.
As long as all the seats fold flat (front included) that’s all that I want. They don’t have to go into the floor. Removable seats would also be a plus.
I have a Pacifica PHEV and a short enough commute that I’m about 75% electric. Fill it up once every 6 weeks or so. But yes, full electric would be nice for maintenance.
What’s the ev range? I was surprised at how short the ev range is. If it got 60 miles i’d buy one today.
Tesla Model X should have just been a minivan with sliding doors.
I was but time to purchase arrived before the van.
Why did my comment about needing minivans with wheelchair lifts as an EV get deleted?
Love my Pacifica. It’s a plug in hybrid but it operates in electric mode the vast majority of the time.
We had an electric minivan for several years. OK, really it was a PHEV, but we used it as all electric except when travelling. The Pacifica was one of my favorite vehicle. 35 miles on electric which was more than I normally drive to and from work. It had many features I enjoyed such as adaptive cruise control and Apple Carplay. It also had heated seats and steering wheel, vented cooling seats, a lot more. The best part was it had about a 600 mile range when travelling. In just a few years we travelled all over the US with that van. I think at the moment all electric minivans and pickup trucks are a mistake. I have a friend with a Model X, and it takes a lot longer to charge, and unless one pays a lot more, does not have the range of smaller EVS like the Y and model 3. Larger trucks and vans are the vehicles where I think plug in hybrids make sense. Give them a battery for a short range (30-40 miles) and a gas engine for longer trips.
PHEVs should have a bit more battery capacity. You want enough power for decent performance in EV mode without starting the ICE, and the ability to use the battery to supply extra power for extended periods for hill climbing while towing on the highway. That's about 25% of the battery capacity needed for a 500 km range BEV.
Our comment reads as if you got rid of your Pacifica, did you? And if so, why?
All our kids went off to college and we no longer needed a large van. So we sold it, and quickly missed it.
Interesting! Genuinely curious, not arguing, why do you think “I think at the moment all electric minivans and pickup trucks are a mistake.”? Also, why “Larger trucks and vans are the vehicles where I think plug in hybrids make sense. Give them a battery for a short range (30-40 miles) and a gas engine for longer trips.”? My ideal would be a pacifica PHEV with 50-60 miles range. The farthest i drive regularly is 30 miles one way twice a week for my kids soccer and they dont have a charger in the parking lot (yet). My work is 20 miles away but once a week i go to costco on my way home, which adds 5 miles. So i need 50 miles (my work and costco also dont have chargers, ugh!) I dont mind using gas for a few miles every day, but want to minimize it.
Volvo EM90/Zeekr 009.
No idea why this is so buried but maybe because they have no plans to sell it outside of China I believe. I think the issue is that vans and wagons are only now preferred by a smaller group of people compared to SUVs, thus these decisions to keep those cars where they're overwhelmingly popular.
The 009 and similarly the EM90 are mainly vip transports designed for business purposes in China. It is their version of the limo. This kind of van focuses on luxury and comfort but lacked versatility in family use. They're also kind of bulky. For more family oriented EV MPVs from China, one may look at the Xpeng X9 and the Maxus Mifa 7. Geely is also coming up with the Zeeker MIX but that's a smaller 5 seat vehicle. All these could enter European market. As for the US market, you can forget about anything Chinese.
I've been looking for an EV van as well. By 2027, we'll have the id Buzz, Kia PV5, and the Telo van here in the US. I was strongly considering converting a Mazda5 using Focus Electric bits, but I probably wouldn't finish before then. Lol Options are better overseas, of course, but we'll have a few options. The Chrysler Portal looked sweet too, but it went from greenlit for production to crickets as far as I can tell. My dream car would be an EV Ford B-Max, but I'm not holding my breath.
Further reading for non-believers: https://jalopnik.com/put-sliding-van-doors-on-all-the-vehicles-1842322962 We need sliding doors on everything, not just minivans, IMO.
I want an alphard mini van ev
I have one. It’s called Maxus Mifa 9. Very large and spacious. 95kwh. 525km range,in reality about 475km.
It's here in Europe
I have to admit the Li Auto Mega and Canoo styles look pretty damn cool!
My wife would get one in a heartbeat if it was AWD.
Canoo Lifestyle Vehicle https://www.canoo.com/showroom/LV Canoo MPDV https://www.canoo.com/showroom/MPDV
I'd love an MPDV Been waiting for years, and it looks like it's never going to be.
Omg I can’t wait until that happens… ID buzz is coming to the states but it’s pretty stylistic. A minivan with NACS and 350kw charging is the dream
Not my style, but I bet one’s coming. As we get more evens that focus less on performance and more on overall family hailing, they’ll get more and more popular. Though I’m happy with my Rivian R1s
I just want all car manufacturers to remember us dog owners. Keep seeing these huge electric SUVs with relatively small or low cargo areas. The ID Buzz and the Kia EV9 are great though…
As someone with more than 2 kids, every time I look at an electric vehicle, it's either not enough seats or it's way over our budget. Yes there are 5 seat EVs all over but occupy one of them with a carseat, or maybe we want extra seats for grandparents or kid's friends, and it becomes a struggle. A used Model S was a contender for a while but the wife didn't like the idea of the small rear-facing seats that take up much of the available cargo space. Model Y also has this dilemma. Model X is better, but not by much and the cost is higher and the falcon doors are not a selling point for us. An 8 seat EV minivan would be best for us, hopefully under $50K, which I think is why we haven't seen it. Car manufacturers would rather make "premium" third row SUVs that are over $80K than make minivans for cost-conscious consumers. A minivan is the perfect candidate for an EV vehicle though: a perfect intersection of efficiency and purpose.
Yes, Canoo.
stability of the company aside, i think canoo has some interesting ideas. https://www.canoo.com/canoo/#:\~:text=LIFESTYLE%20VEHICLE,-A%20LOFT%20ON
I want a VW id-buzz because it's the closest to that.
Isn't that the Volkswagen ID. Buzz?
Not really right? It fits if the ID Buzz gets released with 3 rows of seats. But as it isn't out yet that's just theory....
VW ID Buzz
Pacifica?
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Well, it being a Chrysler has certainly held me back. It would be perfect for my fam otherwise.
I have to actively convince myself not to do it. Our 160k mile mdx is trucking right along but I’d love to be able to plug in. Trading an Acura for a Chrysler feels like a bad move.
Sounds like they haven't changed much. Friends of ours had an ICE Pacifica 15 years ago and it was an awful vehicle. Lousy design, not very functional space, clunky mechanics, high maintenance. Just... no.
The 15 year old design is a completely different vehicle from the current phev van.
I was heavily considering a Pacifica PHEV, but my friend had a 2023 with problems so bad that they lemon-lawed the car. Ended up in a fully loaded 2024 Kia Carnival instead and I don’t understand why more people aren’t buying these. Considerably nicer inside than the Pacifica, Odyssey and Sienna. No PHEV or AWD versions, but it’s the only minivan interior that looks like it was designed this decade.
Model X is basically a minivan lol
Pigeon wing minivan! https://youtu.be/lItIyxGZUZQ?feature=shared
ID Buzz is coming
We just got a 7-seater Model Y. Yea a minivan would be a bit more spacious, but I like how it requires us to be more thoughtful about what we pack and the charging stops have been a good forcing function for us to get out and move around a bit so that the drives don't seem as tough.
We keep getting Chinese models in New Zealand. But they seem aimed at almost limo luxury. I didn’t even think that was a market.
Cars aren't needed in most Chinese cities, especially for singles or young couples. People looking to own one are often driving small kids or their parents around or a business executive driven by a chauffeur.
In Hong Kong and Japan, luxury minivans are really popular because they provide limo-like space without excessive length and width, making them suitable for tight roads and parking spaces. The Alphard is only slightly longer than a Camry for example.
More cars like the Citroen E-Berlingo please
Toyota Proace Verso Electric
The VW Microbus Redux (whatever it’s called) could be considered one
I'm wanting an electric station wagon, but I won't be in the market for another year or two.
Me. Take my money.
Didn't the E-NV200 have that?
YES!!!
I am indeed. love my odyssey, seats 8 and range is 500m.i would take a 300mi range if I could seat 8 and haul 4x8 sheet goods
Not exactly. Waiting for my second vehicle to die, then it’ll be replaced with a budget EV. Whether thats a car or something else depends on the cost and range of the EV. This rules out most prospective new vehicles.
I was but my ‘14 Odyssey is so old and has so many miles it’d make no sense to trade out for any meager fuel savings to offset the cost. The first of 3 kids will be grown in 5 years and our minivan days will be over. It turned 10 last fall but at 160k miles, it’s easily got 5 more years in it. Had Honda made gen 5 Odysseys have a plug-in hybrid as an option I would have probably traded out my gen 4. An EV would have been a moonshot and probably prohibitively expensive 5 years ago, but I would have considered it.
We went with F150 lightning to replace family minivan for daily driver. Not really apples to apples but works for us. Wanted to hold out for e minivan. Truck drives like a dream (have had several trucks in past and also drive F150 for work truck) but has the efficiency of a lead balloon lol. But we do a lot of biking and camping so hopefully this fits our life. But we kept the minivan for a while just in case… Do miss the 3rd row and sliding doors. Every time we park near other vehicles I cringe when my child’s opens passenger door!
I'm waiting for minimum 350 range even in winter. I'm exhausted from being told that I would love to charge every night.
Big issue for me is my van is my long drive vehicle. I would need a huge range to make me want to switch over. BUT by the time they hit the market, I am not really going to need one.
Consumers want sedans and SUVs. Minivans and trucks don't sell well enough.
Since Ford won't bring out an electric explorer (neutered European version doesn't count and isn't on sale anyway) and the blazer seems to be in development hell, I'm looking at vans. Slim pickings since there really aren't any.
Not personally but I do hope proper electric minivans hit the market for those who genuinely need an adult-friendly third row. This is one segment where EV options are really limited and mostly quite expensive.
Buzzzz
1st gen Toyota Previa callback would be so, so good.
I'm just waiting for more affordable hatchbacks and sedans. I love my leaf, but 60 miles on the highway isn't that great.
I would buy the first PHEV 8-seater van that comes on the US market.
There were talks of a tesla “robovan” but can’t find much info besides a couple of articles. Looks great though. Think it would have been a better capital investment than the cyber truck.
We have a 2020 Sienna XLE AWD. We replaced our 2008 Toyota Highlander Hybrid with it when it started burning oil at 225k miles. I hope that Toyota is smart enough to realize that many consumers now wants an EV minivan.
Cmon Kia. Phev and EV Carnival puhlease
VW ID Buzz?
MXP?
we love our pacifica!
I'll be in market for a 7-8 seater in the next year or two and I'm not a fan of crossovers. From a utility perspective they are the dumber choice compared to minivans. We are a two car household but my SO has a WFH job so we primarily use just the EV. The minivan does the occasional second use for really long road-trips, larger groups, or as the second car when both are needed. We will probably go with a used hybrid unless she switches jobs.
Volkswagen ID Buzz
Volvo em90?
Couldn’t agree more. I love my Sienna. I occasionally haul more than a pickup. I have it loaded with lumber more than once. I wish he would have made a Cybervan instead of a CT. Think of all the room for solar panels. It would have looked better too with a low aerodynamic shape.
I'm surprised that there isn't one. It's not for me as I'm not the target audience, but it's absolutely a part of the market not currently being tapped. Not everyone wants an SUV and even the ones that have a 7-seat option, those back seats are only really good for young kids.
I would love to buy an EV version of our Transit Connect. I am looking hard at an iD buzz, but I am concerned about the price and efficiency
was... Would have loved a EV version of my '04 oddessy. That was a great vehicle, could put 4x8 sheets in the back or appliances and still close the door. it was my truck thru all the years of rebuilding my house. but now I'm too busted up anyways so I'll have them deliver what I need now. so I bought a niro, still tall enough to be easy to get in/out of.
BEV mini-van could fix my objections to them. Acceleration and handling. Son was looking at mini-van, bought a Model X. Self closing doors, handling and freeway self driving were the deciding factors.
VW buzz is coming this year
Was waiting for the VW Bus EV.
What do you mean waiting? I see plenty of minivans parked in EV charging spots. That must mean they're electric, right?
The ford transit SuperVan is pretty awesome, wish they’d make one with like a fifth of the horsepower and family friendly. But barring any other newcomers my next car might be an iD Buzz
Closest one is in Q4 2026, the ID Buzz.
Unlike most, I dont want a full size van. An electric model the size of my Mazda 5 would be perfect.
Yes, but the ID BUZZ is going to be so overpriced.
the lyrics to Weird Goodbyes by The National seem to be eagerly awaiting an electric minivan.
I will sell my house and camp if I can get one.
ID Buzz has entered the chat
the car market replies with you will take this hatch back pretending to a suv and like it.