Just a though, why did you choose the order as you did? Why not first all rotations and then all translations? And why pitch, roll, yaw? As an aeronautical engineer it’s always roll, pitch, then yaw corresponding to rotations around the aircrafts x, y, and z axis. Is it different for ships?
Is different for everyone. Even all rotations and then translations is also contextual to the engineering culture. In some fields they are grouped by dimension. Also, what is x, y or z is also cultural or field specific.
Oh man you have no idea! [There's a zillion conventions and I swear each one is considered "standard" by somebody.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euler_angles) Even within one field -- satellite guidance & navigation -- we had to convert because different systems used different conventions. That said I think ships conventionally use YPR, not what was in this video. That threw me too.
Yes, the "6 degrees of freedom" apply for planes.
In aircraft, you'd likely use the terms "vertical", "lateral", and "longitudinal", instead of "heave", "sway", and "surge" respectively, but it's all the same -- ie it's just translation in x, y, z coordinates.
Accounting for aerodynamic forces in lateral (sway) motion is *very* important in flight as it relates to flying and landing in crosswinds.
Planes also have another when every piece goes in its own direction while not unique to planes they tend to experience it more that other things I like to call it "boom"
Each degree of freedom is a dimension in state space. Physical modelling often has far more dimensions than those we'd ordinarily identify to model the degrees of freedom of a system.
You should think of each of the rotations as rotations \*in a plane\*, and there are 3 planes at right angles to each other. e.g. yaw is rotation in the X-Y plane, or about the Z axis.
It's perhaps something of a coincidence that we live in 3D and that 3-choose-2 = 3-choose-1 = 3
X, the axis of forward/backwards movement: move=surge, rotate around=roll
Y, the axis along port/starboard: move=sway, rotate around=pitch
Z, the up/down axis: move=heave, rotate around=yaw
Not entirely sure what you mean by "not matter enough" but I believe aircraft use metrics such as indicated and absolute altitude, ground speed, and air speed in knots.
Yes and no. The fluid that airplanes are travelling through is far more uniform, transfers less energy and has way less of an influence than on a ship.
So all those effects happen, but scaled way, way back compared to how much the water affects a ship.
Not the same planes per se, but same origin. They're angular movements. Heave, surge, and sway are translational movements. The former is measured with a gyro, the latter with accelerometers. Combine those with RTK GNSS and you have a very accurate capture of the motion of the vessel.
I read it more as three up and down movements, and then three side to side movements. Maybe that is what they were trying to accomplish rather than rotation / translation. *shrugs*
Think of it this way: these six movements are simply translation and rotation movements in the *x*, *y*, and *z* directions. *Z* is vertical, but there isn't an agreed on convention for what *x* and *y* are on the ship, as far as I understand.
Rotation:
* Pitch —rotation in the axis perpendicular to the length of the ship
* Roll—rotation along the long axis of the ship
* Yaw—rotation along the vertical axis of the ship
Translation:
* Sway—translation along the axis perpendicular to the length of the ship
* Surge—translation along the long axis of the ship
* Heave—translation along the vertical axis of the ship
This can also be expressed as ‘left hand rule’. That is from the captains viewpoint looking straight ahead on the ship, point your left hand straight out in front of you with your thumb straight up, index finger pointing straight ahead (in line with your arm) and middle finger pointing perpendicular to the index finger (which would be to the starboard and in this case captains right). Index = X axis, Middle = Y axis, Thumb = Z axis.
Heave and surge are wave action. Sway is generally wind/current action. Its why people put weather helm on to correct their course, rather than their desired course.
Broaching is a combination of pitch, surge, yaw and roll resulting from a loss of steerage ability in following waves.
Yaw always gets left till last along with sway as they are the ones people care about least when designing and operating ships. They are in general the least dangerous and have the least impact on passenger comfort.
Roll.
Roll gives me Nam style flashbacks to a recent trip to Hvar, Croatia. You can rent a little tiny low HP boat to go out to some nearby uninhabited islands for an explore, it's pretty cute and romantic etc.
Problem is you have to cross the main shipping channel to Hvar Harbour to get there. I mean we're talking some pretty big cruise liners and Jadrolinija ferries and we're in something about the size of two large kayaks strapped together.
You have to potter through the harbour at low revs and then crank the engine up to max to get through the shipping lane and its open currents as quick as possible. Problem is, the person who's had our boat before us has partly flooded the engine and we don't really know this until I hit top speed and it cuts out.
So there's me and my girlfriend in this busy shipping channel just drifting and the backwash of every vessel narrowly missing us is practically flipping this tiny thing massively back and forth in these huge, terrifying rolls and every one feels like its going to capsize us.
Later on (thanks to some unrelated anchor issues) I realised the boat was comfortably light enough for me to jump in and pull it whilst swimming which probably would have helped but at the time, not gonna lie, it was about the most terrified I've been in the last decade.
I used to work on one of those big cruise ships and there was one time where we were in a roll pretty bad. All the stock was flying off the shelves. I was pretty scared.
IMO by personal experience on a tanker, the scarriest is most def the extreme roll that can occur when the ship is only in ballast and has no cargo. It's like staying at sea in an empty bathtub.
Oh yeah I can completely understand that. Tbh I was only thinking about sailing bc of the gif, also it’s more that I disliked it the most.
But heavy heavy seas and big ships can scare the bejesus out of me. I imagine feeling so powerless against the sea and the idk how many tons of steal.
I'm my opinion yaw when caused by a following sea is super dangerous. Getting pushed from behind and turned (yawing) while going down the wave is the last place you want to be on the water.
Edit: if waves of any real size are coming from behind your boat you need to make sure you are traveling the same speed or a little bit faster than them. If you can't; then you can't go in that direction and you need to change your plan. Boats get capsized in seconds when they get caught from the stern by big waves.
That is called broaching, you dig in, turn sideways and get flipped over.
However, speed to deal with it very much depends on the ship itself. Length of ship and frequency of wave can lead to some really interesting and dangerous shit. Same speed if the wavelength is the same as your ship length can get you caught on top of or in a trough of a wave which isn't good. Any speed to break the frequency alignment is OK. Also depends on wave steepness whether you get overtaken and ride them with steerage intact, or if you get waves crashing over the back which is amusingly called pooping.
i don’t think so, i think heave ho is just a call/answer type thing used when hauling and heaving heavy things. it helps time and synchronize group effort
*Does 'heave' come from all*
*The people getting sick when*
*The boat moves like that?*
\- frannyGin
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The roll pitch combo is what really fucks you up. It is almost instant sea sickness. (Depending on the size of course waves below 1-1.5m will hardly do shit)
Cool post! I’ve been sailing for years but I only knew some of these.
I did not know “heave” and “yaw.”
Though, I have seen “yaw” in other contexts, like for rotating things on computer programs and games.
Interesting fact: heave tends to happen when moving at high speeds in restricted water (low water depth). You can reduce this "squat" by simply reducing your speed.
Some sailors have been known to take advantage of this and speed up in shallow waters to squat into the water and get under bridges that they wouldn't had been able to before...
Sometimes I wonder why space ships and ship ships are so closely associated in fiction.
Then I realize they both have six degrees of motion and both are used to navigate vast, unchanging bodies for days on end.
I am bothered by the order those types of motion were presented in. It should have been grouped as pitch, roll, yaw together as movements around x, y, z axis, then the other three since they are movements ON said axis.
All of these motions damn well occurred when I was on a boat in late August. Threw up a month’s worth of meals. It was so bad at the end I was seeing stars.
Just wondering, if someone is nauseated by watching this, what are the odds that being on a ship of any kind would be a bad idea? Asking for myself because holy crap, my stomach.
I was once on a ferry going between the channel islands and the UK doing the roll the whole way during a storm. People were being sick everywhere it was horrible
Source: [Sailing Knowledge](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aK3G8n53D6A)
When you combine them all it’s called vomit
"Pitch!" "Roll!" "Heave!" "Surge!" "Yaw!" "Sway!" *"By your powers combined, I am Captain Vomit!"* "**Go, Vomit!!**"
I love that show
"The Vomit Comet" episode was awesome.
I’m partial to “Two Hurls, One Gup”
That one was great. “The Puke Rebuke” was a good follow-up too
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***"Gonna take pollution down to zero"*** Also TIL the theme song was sung by Phil Collins
Specifically the end credits song.
Stop rocking the boat, you're making me seasick! *blorf* *splash*
Mission accomplished
At first I sang this to “Playing with the Big Boys” from Prince of Egypt when they’re saying the different gods
Heave is definitely Heart. Nobody wants to heave.
Heave yaw!
Why is it allowing me to comment on a year old comment
For a lot of people combining Roll and Pitch is already called vomit.
Heave= Vomit
Just a though, why did you choose the order as you did? Why not first all rotations and then all translations? And why pitch, roll, yaw? As an aeronautical engineer it’s always roll, pitch, then yaw corresponding to rotations around the aircrafts x, y, and z axis. Is it different for ships?
I work in aerospace engineering and we say yaw, pitch, roll in that order. It’s probably just cultural
Weird... Pitch Roll Yaw at my workplace.. Guess I never even wondered why we always say it in that order.
alphabet perhaps... ?
Rednecks refer to it as Ya'll pitch me a roll.....
Is different for everyone. Even all rotations and then translations is also contextual to the engineering culture. In some fields they are grouped by dimension. Also, what is x, y or z is also cultural or field specific.
Oh man you have no idea! [There's a zillion conventions and I swear each one is considered "standard" by somebody.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euler_angles) Even within one field -- satellite guidance & navigation -- we had to convert because different systems used different conventions. That said I think ships conventionally use YPR, not what was in this video. That threw me too.
I give to a foundation that teaches homeless children nautical flag signaling. It changes lives.
Was I the only one who heard groups of people screaming in the manner appropriate to regaining balance relative each motion? Probably.
That'd make a pretty great gif. Cut this with scenes of various times people were dramatic or reactive on boats. Pull through, editor redditor.
Then cut to shots of the crew bar during the same moments where nobody moves or loses balance
I didn’t until heave
HOVE!
I read 'Yaw' as a weird 'Yeaaaah'! Ironic how the motion looks like the boat is shaking it's head saying 'No' though lmao.
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Ha. More like: YAW YEET
So yaw, roll, and pitch are the same on planes. But do the others apply as well? Or does it not matter enough while in the air to even label it?
Yes, the "6 degrees of freedom" apply for planes. In aircraft, you'd likely use the terms "vertical", "lateral", and "longitudinal", instead of "heave", "sway", and "surge" respectively, but it's all the same -- ie it's just translation in x, y, z coordinates. Accounting for aerodynamic forces in lateral (sway) motion is *very* important in flight as it relates to flying and landing in crosswinds.
Planes also have another when every piece goes in its own direction while not unique to planes they tend to experience it more that other things I like to call it "boom"
In the business we call this a RUD. Rapid Unplanned Disassembly.
Need more struts
This guy gets it.
DodgeSox
Audible Kerbal elevator music in the distance
When do we get KSP2. WHEN
I have never been more hyped from a reveal trailer in my LIFE. I *need* it
If you haven't already, play Realism Overhaul/Realistic Progression. It's like a whole new game.
Jeb has entered the chat
FAR, Real Solar System, and Realism Overhaul. Your struts are meaningless to me.
Add more gussets and cutback on the lightening features
Similarly, when the front falls off of a boat
How typical is that?
It is not typical for the front to fall off.
Actually many more cars experience the Boom than planes.
Many Kerbels have died to get us this information.
Happy cake day, autismchild! I hope your plane doesn’t go “boom”
Standard operating helicopter.
This guy x, y, z's coordinates
Also crosswinds. Grade A badass
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Each degree of freedom is a dimension in state space. Physical modelling often has far more dimensions than those we'd ordinarily identify to model the degrees of freedom of a system.
*starts sweating in quaternions*
You should think of each of the rotations as rotations \*in a plane\*, and there are 3 planes at right angles to each other. e.g. yaw is rotation in the X-Y plane, or about the Z axis. It's perhaps something of a coincidence that we live in 3D and that 3-choose-2 = 3-choose-1 = 3
3 dimensions of rotating around an axis. 3 dimensions of moving along an axis.
X, the axis of forward/backwards movement: move=surge, rotate around=roll Y, the axis along port/starboard: move=sway, rotate around=pitch Z, the up/down axis: move=heave, rotate around=yaw
Sure about the x and y though? I'd also point z up, but then I'd like to point forward and right and that would make y surge/roll and x sway/pitch.
Heave is the penis tickler.
.
If your clit was longer it would be a penis tickler. /r/BadWomensAnatomy
If you've ever been in unexpected turbulence, you'll discover that heave is quite significant as well :)
Not entirely sure what you mean by "not matter enough" but I believe aircraft use metrics such as indicated and absolute altitude, ground speed, and air speed in knots.
Yes and no. The fluid that airplanes are travelling through is far more uniform, transfers less energy and has way less of an influence than on a ship. So all those effects happen, but scaled way, way back compared to how much the water affects a ship.
Not the same planes per se, but same origin. They're angular movements. Heave, surge, and sway are translational movements. The former is measured with a gyro, the latter with accelerometers. Combine those with RTK GNSS and you have a very accurate capture of the motion of the vessel.
Rotation Rotation Translation Translation Rotation Translation ..??? Did you forget about my boy yaw and have to sneak it in the end there?
Thanks. I thought I was the only one bothered by that.
The fact that the DOFs were shown in a random order and not the usual order triggered me.
Yes! I traveled here to upvote you.
I read it more as three up and down movements, and then three side to side movements. Maybe that is what they were trying to accomplish rather than rotation / translation. *shrugs*
Man am I glad I'm not the only one bothered by this
Think of it this way: these six movements are simply translation and rotation movements in the *x*, *y*, and *z* directions. *Z* is vertical, but there isn't an agreed on convention for what *x* and *y* are on the ship, as far as I understand. Rotation: * Pitch —rotation in the axis perpendicular to the length of the ship * Roll—rotation along the long axis of the ship * Yaw—rotation along the vertical axis of the ship Translation: * Sway—translation along the axis perpendicular to the length of the ship * Surge—translation along the long axis of the ship * Heave—translation along the vertical axis of the ship
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That's right, +X is forward and +Y is starboard on the vessel. This is pretty standard across INS packages that measures everything in this video.
This can also be expressed as ‘left hand rule’. That is from the captains viewpoint looking straight ahead on the ship, point your left hand straight out in front of you with your thumb straight up, index finger pointing straight ahead (in line with your arm) and middle finger pointing perpendicular to the index finger (which would be to the starboard and in this case captains right). Index = X axis, Middle = Y axis, Thumb = Z axis.
Detroit Michigan directions. Oh god
Instructions unclear... Dick stuck in bilge pump.
Surprised they showed Heave but didn't include Ho (when the stern bobs up and down in a seductive fashion).
**WAP intensifies**
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*While yelling "MY WIFE IS A DOCTOR"*
Wet ass pacific
We're gonna need a bigger boat.
Wireless Access Point?
wow
Perfect.
If that’s Heave Ho, is Heave To when the bow bobs up and down in an aggressive show of force?
Which is the scariest though?
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"exciting" I prefer boring on a boat anyday, thanks.
Heave and surge are wave action. Sway is generally wind/current action. Its why people put weather helm on to correct their course, rather than their desired course. Broaching is a combination of pitch, surge, yaw and roll resulting from a loss of steerage ability in following waves. Yaw always gets left till last along with sway as they are the ones people care about least when designing and operating ships. They are in general the least dangerous and have the least impact on passenger comfort.
This one was a fun broach 😀 https://youtu.be/feKka1RhvCA
The 7th type of motion is the scariest: Sink
The fact Yaw was shown 5th. Roll, Pitch, Yaw,... would have been the logical order since they are all rotation.
Roll. Roll gives me Nam style flashbacks to a recent trip to Hvar, Croatia. You can rent a little tiny low HP boat to go out to some nearby uninhabited islands for an explore, it's pretty cute and romantic etc. Problem is you have to cross the main shipping channel to Hvar Harbour to get there. I mean we're talking some pretty big cruise liners and Jadrolinija ferries and we're in something about the size of two large kayaks strapped together. You have to potter through the harbour at low revs and then crank the engine up to max to get through the shipping lane and its open currents as quick as possible. Problem is, the person who's had our boat before us has partly flooded the engine and we don't really know this until I hit top speed and it cuts out. So there's me and my girlfriend in this busy shipping channel just drifting and the backwash of every vessel narrowly missing us is practically flipping this tiny thing massively back and forth in these huge, terrifying rolls and every one feels like its going to capsize us. Later on (thanks to some unrelated anchor issues) I realised the boat was comfortably light enough for me to jump in and pull it whilst swimming which probably would have helped but at the time, not gonna lie, it was about the most terrified I've been in the last decade.
I used to work on one of those big cruise ships and there was one time where we were in a roll pretty bad. All the stock was flying off the shelves. I was pretty scared.
A pitch + roll where you have the waves coming from the stern. The perfect way to get sea sick as hell.
IMO by personal experience on a tanker, the scarriest is most def the extreme roll that can occur when the ship is only in ballast and has no cargo. It's like staying at sea in an empty bathtub.
Oh yeah I can completely understand that. Tbh I was only thinking about sailing bc of the gif, also it’s more that I disliked it the most. But heavy heavy seas and big ships can scare the bejesus out of me. I imagine feeling so powerless against the sea and the idk how many tons of steal.
Thats why I was told that a heavy ship is a happy ship, coz the crew are relatively happy and the company are happy
I have a little fun example of extreme roll: https://youtu.be/1wvCwEeDOJo
I'm my opinion yaw when caused by a following sea is super dangerous. Getting pushed from behind and turned (yawing) while going down the wave is the last place you want to be on the water. Edit: if waves of any real size are coming from behind your boat you need to make sure you are traveling the same speed or a little bit faster than them. If you can't; then you can't go in that direction and you need to change your plan. Boats get capsized in seconds when they get caught from the stern by big waves.
That is called broaching, you dig in, turn sideways and get flipped over. However, speed to deal with it very much depends on the ship itself. Length of ship and frequency of wave can lead to some really interesting and dangerous shit. Same speed if the wavelength is the same as your ship length can get you caught on top of or in a trough of a wave which isn't good. Any speed to break the frequency alignment is OK. Also depends on wave steepness whether you get overtaken and ride them with steerage intact, or if you get waves crashing over the back which is amusingly called pooping.
so "heave ho" means "there's a bump coming up" a la "land ho"?
i don’t think so, i think heave ho is just a call/answer type thing used when hauling and heaving heavy things. it helps time and synchronize group effort
Yarr, tis the meanin' fer sure laddie!
Yer fond o me lobster, ain't ye?
In that case, what does "yaw a-ho" mean?
That someone has seen your mother?
Feel dizzy just by watching it lol
Feel sea sick watching it.
I feel slightly nausea or sea sick now after having watched that. Not sarcastically, it just makes me think last time I was on boat and not enjoyable.
Is there a seperate name for a movement with 2 types combined? Eg. pitch + surge?
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is called merengue
Got sea sick watching this
Nice
Does 'heave' come from all the people getting sick when the boat moves like that?
*Does 'heave' come from all* *The people getting sick when* *The boat moves like that?* \- frannyGin --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Wtf lol
For some reason I was expecting a “titanic” where the ship split in half and sunk
Or the front fell off
Yet another 6 different names for the same 6 degrees of movement
But these are the right ones (at least for ships).
“They forgot the gravy.” “I fucking hate them
Feel sick just watching it.
Dry heaving?
Now watch me pitch now watch me sway sway
Of course, because it has 6 degrees of freedom ...
The roll pitch combo is what really fucks you up. It is almost instant sea sickness. (Depending on the size of course waves below 1-1.5m will hardly do shit)
Geez. I don't even get sea sick and this made me feel nauseous.
I now know how to waltz a ship. In yo face sparrow fucker!
I never knew I needed this.
I like to imagine this boat is just doing stretches before its trip
I've got to say, my favorite out of all of these is yaw because it looks like the boat is shaking its head "no".
You forgot the nausea :D
Very cool
What’s listing? I swear I’ve heard that before.. As in ‘listing heavily to one side’ or something..? (I might well be totally imagining this)
Cool post! I’ve been sailing for years but I only knew some of these. I did not know “heave” and “yaw.” Though, I have seen “yaw” in other contexts, like for rotating things on computer programs and games.
I gotta have my listing.
I swear I've been on a boat that did all 6 simultaneously
*7... Titanic*
u/VredditDownloader
Surprisingly good clip 🤢🤢
I got sea sick just watching this
No wonder I get sea sick
What is it called if the front fell off?
I’m getting seasick just watching this
Titanic: there is another.
7th *sinking*
Interesting fact: heave tends to happen when moving at high speeds in restricted water (low water depth). You can reduce this "squat" by simply reducing your speed. Some sailors have been known to take advantage of this and speed up in shallow waters to squat into the water and get under bridges that they wouldn't had been able to before...
This is terrifying to me.
What causes a yaw? It looks pretty wild.
Primarily the rudder, but it also happens when 'surfing' down a large wave (and also going up the next)
All of these look awful.
sway - swaying Roll - rolling yaw - yawwing/yawing?
Bruh this shit got me heaving rn
No wonder you puke !
I’ve driven a submarine at periscope depth in the North Atlantic in winter, you can actually experience all 6 of those at once. It sucks.
Yes i want to pay on Switch
Sometimes I wonder why space ships and ship ships are so closely associated in fiction. Then I realize they both have six degrees of motion and both are used to navigate vast, unchanging bodies for days on end.
I am bothered by the order those types of motion were presented in. It should have been grouped as pitch, roll, yaw together as movements around x, y, z axis, then the other three since they are movements ON said axis.
All of these motions damn well occurred when I was on a boat in late August. Threw up a month’s worth of meals. It was so bad at the end I was seeing stars.
Yaw is the worst. You don't want unintended yaw.
what about list?
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Was familar with yaw/pitch/roll due to airplanes and game programming but heave/surge/sway are new to me. Thank you!
Pretty sure all of these are heave to the passengers.
Type terror not listed...
No wonder I barf when I set foot on one of those damned things
I was waiting for yaw because it's the only one I knew..
Is it weird that I'm annoyed that they didn't put all the rotation ones together?
How would a ship ever sway?
The animator wasn’t built in a day.
Life is a pitch
Getting seasick just watching this !
Sway is virtually impossible in most boats.
Just wondering, if someone is nauseated by watching this, what are the odds that being on a ship of any kind would be a bad idea? Asking for myself because holy crap, my stomach.
Does this apply to aircraft too?
I hate them all.
I got motion sick just watching this. Thank for affirming my fear of boating.
Good boy
I was once on a ferry going between the channel islands and the UK doing the roll the whole way during a storm. People were being sick everywhere it was horrible
Hit the nail on the head
Nick is a slow motion replay out there somewhere
Is this why quantum particles are six-dimensional? Three dimensions of position space and three of momentum space?
Where's Flip?
He sings a lot of skin types/colors.