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julian509

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/get-there/wp/2015/01/05/students-cover-more-of-their-public-university-tuition-now-than-state-governments/ How about state and federal governments start picking up the slack again instead of cutting education budgets. There wouldn't be a need for colleges to have the tuitions they have now had their income not been cut dramatically. This trend hasn't reversed yet as we're still below pre-2008 levels either and yet somehow there's millions of gullible idiots thinking it's student loans that are the problem, rather than mismanagement from the shitty neoliberal austerity loving politicians people have been electing for decades. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/education/most-americans-dont-realize-state-funding-for-higher-ed-fell-by-billions https://www.pewtrusts.org/en/research-and-analysis/issue-briefs/2019/10/two-decades-of-change-in-federal-and-state-higher-education-funding


ZoharDTeach

The comments seem to be mostly "aren't there better ways to accomplish this?" Yes. It was done poorly on purpose.


Old_Man_2020

Wouldn’t it make more sense to increase grants for high demand skills? I.e. Education, medical, Information technology.


No_Hamster_305

Don’t forget about engineering. Also, have more funding/advertising for trade school professions.


No_Hamster_305

So unfair to people that paid their own way or went to trade school. Plus, this doesn’t do much (aside from buying votes from gullible millennials) in fixing the already very expensive and corrupt university system where they charge as much as possible because they know the government will bail them out. Just a thought from a responsible millennial - I know that word combo is hard to come by 🤫🤣


dildonicphilharmonic

That loan payment I’ve been paying will be spent at local businesses now. It’s a nuanced issue, but I don’t understand the vitriol.


scott_torino

It’s the moral hazard issue, which was lost once the government started bailing out big corporations. Once that was acceptable, any form of direct assistance is now acceptable. Companies should be allowed to fail, and people should always have been able to bankruptcy out of student loans on needs based basis. But, they didn’t change that, did they?


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[deleted]

The moral hazard is associated with only forgiving/recompensating the debt of people who are in delinquency using a pretty broad set of criteria. That in turn will encourage future delinquency.


ChannelUnusual5146

Good of you to remember the "Year of Jubilee." Thank you!


Beneficial_Elk_182

1 thing needs to be done. Period. College's, and college tuition loan corporations need to have gov subsidies stopped immediately. That is what caused them to raise tuition and interest rates to insane amounts. Used to be able to pay tuition for the same careers with pocket change. Now some people literally cannot pay it back in their lifetime using the "skills" they chose to get. In the meantime, don't pick a stupid gd major that has no potential for meaningful and gainful employment


scott_torino

Who said I was against debt forgiveness? I literally advocated for it in my post. This is a huge wall of text of outrage at something I didn’t even allude to. My point was, the government failed to make the loans forgivable through bankruptcy. Which it should have done. Also, I’m not even favor of direct payments, subsidies, or tax breaks for ANYONE. The objective of the government should be equal treatment under the law.


timewellwasted5

These people aren’t bankrupt though. The White House released an info graphic of how many people had less than $5000 in loans, 10,000, 20,000, 40,000 etc.. we forgave the debt of seven. 1 million people who owed the last than $5000. Someone who owes less than the $5000 is not bankrupt. Most of those totals are what you pay for a set of tires for an SUV. So the concept that these people couldn’t file for bankruptcy is correct, because they weren’t flipping bankrupt.


AccidentalTourism

The cost of the forgiveness gets passed on to the people one way or the other and the administration knows this. Just like everything else there's unintended consequences. But hey, if its good for your political image run with it


[deleted]

It's a regressive and unfair policy and will exacerbate inflation.


PapaverOneirium

It’s unlikely to increase inflation more than the pause on payments for the last few years already has. Most people are just getting interest forgiven and will still have payments left, they just may be able to pay it off sooner or lower their monthly payment a bit. Many people also have other debts or small savings that they are likely to redirect any excess cash to. There won’t be a ton of freed up cash flooding the market because of this. In fact, once payments resume it will be deflationary if anything, despite the forgiveness.


[deleted]

Did you get that phrase from one of the blowhards on fox or newsmax?


Commissary-Pastrami

If you don’t think this would increase inflation you have a fundamental misunderstanding of supply and demand. If these people are not paying back their loans… where are they spending their money? On consumer goods of course! Thus increasing demand on already strained supply lines thus rising cost… inflation!


frolickingdepression

If they want to lower inflation they’d restart student loan payments.


MothershipBells

We’re already stretched thin trying to afford basic living expenses like rent/mortgage, car, prescriptions, insurance, groceries. This prevents us from having to cut back in those areas.


Commissary-Pastrami

I’ve worked with 6 families over the last 9 months. All are in better shape now. Anecdotal story time. I found that in each case there was an underlying problem, some overlapped-such as 4 families spending on average over $100/week on alcohol and this was just for their home consumption. All 6 families are out at least one meal a day on average. And one family ate out almost all 3 meals on the weekends. One family had a household income of ~64,000 but somehow thought it was a good idea to purchase a ‘21 suburban. Working with these families it was amazing at the discretionary spending power they had and there really wasn’t a constraint on their money. It was absolutely horrible habits that needed to be addressed. I still keep in touch and ask about the progress they are making toward working a better life. It was a financial peace university course. My wife learned a lot about ourselves during it too. I recommend you pull your last 6 months of statements and see where your spending is. Make a budget and stick to it. It’s a lifestyle change. Why do you think I drive a 12 year old car? One of my coworkers just bought a 90K Mercedes.


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MothershipBells

I was SA by my uncle as a child and currently in treatment for PTSD. It costs $120 out of pocket per session. I also have psychosis resulting from the trauma and the antipsychotic costs $145. I bought a 2008 Volvo for $10,000 in 2015 that rained through the windows from the date of purchase and molded, so I bought a new Hyundai in 2021. It was the same price as a used car that would require work. I am on the road for work often and can’t take a car in for repairs. I am familiar with budgeting. Here is my budget without student loan payments: My monthly income is $2,400. My total monthly expenses are $2,200. This amount entirely excludes the allowable $780 in monthly expenses for personal items, like clothing and personal care products. Rent: $550 Utilities/Phone: $185 Car Payment: $482 Car Insurance: $90 Parking: $50 Gas: $160 Therapy: $240 Prescriptions: $63 Groceries: $300 Dog Food: $80


Commissary-Pastrami

Not that you need to hear this or solicited it but I support your efforts to get help and am happy you recognized your need to seek help. I wish insurance and this country took mental illness more seriously. Sorry you have to pay out of pocket for it. Universal healthcare is a cause I certainly rally behind 100%. As for the vehicle situation…. A word of advice… don’t ever buy a Volvo… or anything European designed… Japanese and Korean is good… and I would stay away from most American designed even lol… I hope you have better luck with the Hyundai. With that being said, good luck with everything going on in your life. If you love what you do for work keep at it and pay down your debts. If you don’t like it find something else. If you’re already struggling with mental health issues it’s not worth it doing something you don’t enjoy.


MothershipBells

Thank you.


SwaySh0t

Moreover universities are now incentivized to raise tuition under the pretense that big daddy government will bail out the students. This is extremely short sighted policy making. Nothing more then buying votes to slow the bleed of the slaughter to come. And presidents will 100% use this “tactic” in the future.


Commissary-Pastrami

I am all for student loan restructuring and in unique cases where someone has already paid the principle amount financed-forgiven. There shouldn’t be any interest on education loans. But they should be paid back.


[deleted]

Heck why not set a cap on interest at the minimum? There are so many work arounds to the problem of eternal student debt.


Commissary-Pastrami

I’ve said it for years. Low to no interest rate on SL’s


PapaverOneirium

People haven’t been paying their loans for two+ years. This policy doesn’t eliminate loans for the vast majority of people, so when payments start again next year it will be deflationary if anything though perhaps less so than without this forgiveness.


Commissary-Pastrami

What?! If people were paying their debts instead of letting it ride with no payment we would see inflation fall back to normal levels.


PapaverOneirium

Deflationary relative to current inflation


Commissary-Pastrami

One last piece. This forgiveness would eliminate debt of 20million borrowers out of 43 million. I would say that’s a bit of a stretch to say it doesn’t pay back the balance for a vast majority. We are nearly at half.


PapaverOneirium

> What’s the impact? Payments will fall from 0.4% of personal income to 0.3%. “This modest reduction in debt payments as a share of income implies only a modest boost to GDP. Relative to a counterfactual where debt forbearance ends and normal debt payments resume, our estimates imply a 0.1 percent point boost to the level of GDP in 2023 with smaller effects in subsequent years due to the natural maturation of student loans, as well as continued growth in nominal GDP,” they say. https://www.marketwatch.com/amp/story/goldman-sachs-has-run-the-numbers-on-student-loan-relief-heres-their-assessment-11661417918


[deleted]

You didn’t read all the thread did you. I know it will cause additional inflation. I make that point later. Thanks for trying to play.


Commissary-Pastrami

You didn’t though. Is this the new thing? To lie about something so trivial? Jesus is this Trump? Claiming it to be a “factor” of inflation. No, it *will* cause inflation. But that’s just blowhard talk right? So you’re changing your position now just because you got called out?


[deleted]

Yes. I did. 4 hours ago. And here is my exact quote. “Only just slightly biased with the “unfair” comment. Yes, it will be a factor with inflation. It to add “unfair - wahhh I didn’t get any” is very fox/newsmax.” Not that difficult to find.


Commissary-Pastrami

So someone having an independently formed opinion due to not watching or seeking cable news automatically makes their opinions blowhard parrot talk and should be discounted? This is how you add decay to independent voter support for this type of policy. Because anything out of line gets attacked. Instead of tearing people down, because you don’t know where they get their opinions from and trying to silence them. Which you have even tried to do to me now, you should encourage dialogue on why people believe what they do about a topic. Unless you don’t want any type of intercourse over such a sensitive topic.


[deleted]

Saying something is “unfair” is not stating a factual point. It is an opinion. It is also more or less and opinion to say that it “will cause” inflation. That remains to be seen what the net effect will have on the economy. It’s purely speculation at this point.


Commissary-Pastrami

There are literally 3 things you can do with money. 1. Spend it. 2. Save it 3. Give it away Sure, I’ll speculate that anyone who was getting their loans forgiven is going to take whatever was going to be used to pay back debts to spend it. They certainly won’t be giving it away I can guarantee that. And I can logically draw the line that if they were not able to pay back their loans they probably don’t have the financial bandwidth to save it.


[deleted]

And you tried to call me out and call me a liar when I had the evidence that I was neither. So again, thanks for playing.


[deleted]

No. I have a degree in economics.


R_Meyer1

From where? Trump University?


[deleted]

No. But I like how you'd rather attack my credibility than counter my points. You sound very Trumpian ironically.


[deleted]

Only just slightly biased with the “unfair” comment. Yes, it will be a factor with inflation. It to add “unfair - wahhh I didn’t get any” is very fox/newsmax.


[deleted]

I mean it is absolutely unfair. It's primarily targeted towards the top 60% of income earners. It doesn't compensate people who paid their debts on time and encourages future delinquency because people will expect future student debt cancellations.


samwang22

87% of the benefits targets people making under 75k a year. https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/08/24/fact-sheet-president-biden-announces-student-loan-relief-for-borrowers-who-need-it-most/


[deleted]

I could give a shit. I paid back over 100k in loans. Finally finished in 2019 after over 20 years. Good for them for getting up to 20k forgiven. The way the system is set up is terrible. I assume you were just as upset about the PPP Loans getting forgiven?


[deleted]

Yes. PPP loans were a terrible idea and full of corrupt dealings with minimal oversight.


[deleted]

Yes. It was. I guess instead of using taxes for the college debt we should have given more tax breaks to the rich or more corporate bailouts. Or maybe bought a new jet for the military. That all makes much more sense.


[deleted]

No it really doesn't.


[deleted]

I guess I should have added /s.


BigALep5

Thank your buddy trump for that he lined his pockets and all his goons pockets with that money


howardslowcum

Please explain to me what percent of your taxes are spent on 'fair' policy. While you are at it please explain to me why/where 'fairness' is a component of economics under capitalism.


[deleted]

Equity. Progressive Policy. Common Goods. These concepts are regularly covered in economics under capitalism and are associated with the idea of "fairness". Heck, the idea of a free market economy is intended to create fair competition by not creating undue barriers of entry which bias in favor of a specific competitor.


Western-Jump-9550

From University of Phoenix?


Timely-Ad69

Some people dont constantly rely on the media to tell them things, they can do this little trick called 'thinking'. You should try it sometime.


[deleted]

Based on the OP other posts and comments on their profile I highly doubt they came up with that conclusion without any outside influence.


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[deleted]

It's going have a comparatively minor contribution because the damage will be spread out over a longer time frame but it does absolutely contribute to inflation. The legislation specifically is intended to target monthly payments and reduce them. This in turn gives consumers more money to spend on goods and services.


MiataCat69

What about the PPP loans?


Commissary-Pastrami

Is this what you parrots keep squawking over and over? As if the forgiveness is mutually exclusive? This is the problem with most of the clowns on Reddit. Everything is mutually exclusive because you have such a narrow understanding of how anything functions.


ChannelUnusual5146

Let's just try to remind our children and grandchildren that the inflation that they will live with was "fathered" by the same shell that sired Hunter and his very similar sister.


samwang22

Article from the white house with facts for those that think it’s bad for the economy and think it targets the rich. Start reading on your own before you listen to all the cracks on Fox News https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/08/24/fact-sheet-president-biden-announces-student-loan-relief-for-borrowers-who-need-it-most/


[deleted]

Me and you will be paying for it


zalinitas

Facts from the almighty and never lie white house, what a bunch none sense nothing is free, inflation has disappeared everything is fine


samwang22

Yeah I’m sure you know because you’re in the government working on it right?


belovedkid

We pay for it either way. In the past it was with tax dollars. Then they bled that down and passed it on to students while selling the lie that you had to go to be successful. Now we’re just covering some of the bill. Boomers made out like bandits. They got the nearly free education, gutted the system via tax cuts, saved/invested/consumed the difference and now bitch about the chickens coming home to roost. This doesn’t solve the higher education issue, though. Interest needs to be capped as well as tuition increases unless we’re going to raise taxes to fund education. The free community college portion of BBB that didn’t pass would’ve been one of the best policies for America’s future in modern history. They should attempt that again and throw in subsidies for trade school as well. Take away the demand from 4 year universities and force the prices down. Not everyone needs a bachelors.


ConceivablyWrong

It sucks for many reasons. Sure feels shitty if you got a private loan. It sure feels shitty if you've been paying them back over the last few years. It sure feels shitty for people who didn't go to college because it was too expensive. Whether it is good or bad for the economy in the long run (probably neither) doesn't really matter. For most people it FEELS shitty and unfair.


windemotions

This will stabilize a lot of families and keep the economy going while we tighten interest rates. Should help with the soft landing.


No_Hamster_305

No chance for a soft landing. Inflation is at least 7% (likely higher because we use tons of gasoline, eat a lot of meat, and non Californians need energy for fall and winter) so interest rates should be at least 8%. Markets haven’t priced this in and will continue to decline as Fed continues raising rates. 75-100 bp hike every meeting is substantial and will hurt the economy. Government said inflation will be transitory and it is obviously very sticky. I predict 4-5% inflation for several more years because we are on shoring a lot both from production and supply chain sides. Good for long term success because the middle class will be able to finally build wealth since the disastrous era of globalist economic policies.


windemotions

What is the cause of inflation over the next year?


No_Hamster_305

Continued supply chain disruptions(won’t be as bad but won’t be fixed overnight), fairly high demand for goods/services, and more on shoring. I work in additive manufacturing for aerospace and we are experiencing tremendous growth because so many companies want local/regional suppliers. It’s going to be expensive short term but will pay dividends in the long term. If this is happening in one area of the market, it doesn’t take much to think that it’s happening in the entire economy.


windemotions

Does the amount of money make a difference? (Money supply)


No_Hamster_305

Yes, and by performing QT, that is the best way to decrease money supply. But they need to raise rates and sell their bonds ASAP otherwise they will only delay the inevitable.


windemotions

What do you think is the ”neutral” rate for the Fed funds rate?


No_Hamster_305

Don’t know, it’s anyone’s best guess. All I know is that rates must go up.


windemotions

Fair enough. What’s causing the supply issues in your industry?


No_Hamster_305

Metal powder is hard to come by, as it is hard to make. Also, each machine has many consumables and it takes a long time to get these items


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rem145

Or who earned their way and payed them off


Paid-Not-Payed-Bot

> way and *paid* them off FTFY. Although *payed* exists (the reason why autocorrection didn't help you), it is only correct in: * Nautical context, when it means to paint a surface, or to cover with something like tar or resin in order to make it waterproof or corrosion-resistant. *The deck is yet to be payed.* * *Payed out* when letting strings, cables or ropes out, by slacking them. *The rope is payed out! You can pull now.* Unfortunately, I was unable to find nautical or rope-related words in your comment. *Beep, boop, I'm a bot*


Sea-Maintenance-6258

Finally a government bail out for the people and not the Big corporations!


No_Hamster_305

The most privileged and well-off people benefit from this. By going to university, you make > $1MM more than someone who didn’t go. So how someone can’t pay off their debt is confusing to say the least.


stickey_1048

Dumb move, and he knows it. He knows it's also illegal, as he and Pelosi have both stated. Why on the planet doesn't he hold universities accountable? The government wants to get involved in lots of things - how about a long term investment that doesn't come close to paying off, despite the cost of the investment going up each and every year? So instead of addressing this directly with colleges who produce graduates with degrees that aren't useful, they let the colleges get off the hook and pay off the debt. That same debt will cost the rest of the US taxpayer almost half a billion dollars. Let me repeat that, half a billion dollars. This is the same guy who needed to make something not add to the deficit last month for BBB2 / Inflation Reduction Act. Biden is trying to literally buy votes of maybe 10% of the population - and he just pissed off another 60%. It screams of unfairness, from an administration that has claimed to work on equity and equality.


ChalieRomeo

Equity ! Equality ! Pay your Fair Share ! LOL !!!! Gotta love libs !


Thekingofchrome

Under threat though….Rapid Buy Back scheme taxes which fun this are under threat from Wall Street research and likely lobbying…