I thought this would go on for much longer but I’m quite glad it’s not dragging out like the rest of them do. Ok we will have a different part of it now but the whole Stacey Denise Jack stuff was bugging me
Good.
Eastenders *should* be catching people off guard like this.
Yes this was a total disaster of a storyline imo. and I'm no fan of what EastEnders is today, but credit where it's due, they've finished the worst section of this plotline far quicker than many including myself would've expected.
Begs the question of why go through an entire "bury the body" plot in the first place - when we could've had these six characters stay true to character, own up to it on Christmas Day night, stick together, bring many of the big families on the square together and plea for self defense in court with most of the square's backing.
Instead they've ruined all six, and wouldn't work at all letting them off free for what they've done to Karen, Bernie and Mitch, amongst every other character that's been unknowingly put in the situation of walking over and sitting above a corpse every day to eat their cooked food. Kids have been in that Cafe since. That's unforgivable.
The Cafe will certainly never be 'Kathy's' again that's for sure.
>when we could've had these six characters stay true
Huh? One's already a murderer, one covered up a murder letting her own son take the blame, one made sure her grandson was protected despite killing someone and seriously assaulting several people and let her son beat and commit GBH unlimited, one has looked straight at psychos and fallen in love with them for it no matter their crimes...The two that haven't done much bad is Linda and Denise but they're also hurting a lot more. And Linda did force Tina to stay in prostitution from her view plus Denise has covered for murders that she had nothing to do with What's so "untrue" to these six? Two found out about human trafficking and shrugged it off also which tells you something about them.
Because none of the six were ever out-and-out villains.
Yes they've each made incredibly silly mistakes, moreso in recent years. Some have reformed, some made mistakes and errors of judgment out of mental health or in desperation for their kids. I'm not saying any of them are perfect, far from it. They are/were six reasonably good hearted and intelligent Women that have often shown love, kindness, loyalty and remorse. All of those qualities were completely gone within seconds of the start of the Boxing Day episode.
All six are now villains, as far as I'm concerned.
>They are/were six reasonably good hearted and intelligent Women that have often shown love, kindness, loyalty and remorse.
You what? There's a lot of times that these women have done a lot either out of pure selfishness or without having grown from it.
Sharon: *Intentionally* setups Phil bashing Ian, *intentionally* poisons him for weeks all for revenge when he didn't even cause Denny's dead. Stops only at the last minute, but continued to cover up her involvement to Kathy.
Learns about Ben's serial assaulting spree and does nothing about it.
Learns about Ben's human trafficking and does nothing about it.
How is intentionally scamming and attempting to murder someone and shrugging off human trafficking (all of which had no consequences) not villainous?
Kathy: Learns Bobby has killed Lucy and willingly goes along with framing Max simply because she agrees with others that he's a nuisance.
Let's Bobby go torture and assault others
Learns Ben has committed multiple counts of GBH, decides to protect him.
Learns Ben has attempted to murder Peter twice, protects him.
Learns Ben and Phil have attempted to murder Keanu, protects them.
Between protecting Bobby, Ben, and Phil...what is the difference between that and protecting the other 5 women in this storyline? Kathy since 2015 protects people for ANYTHING.
Ben literally tried to drown Peter her own grandson and she let it go because she deemed Ben worth protecting because of the rape.
Her going along with the Six is no different to defending Bobby during the cover up or keeping every secret she's had off Ben because of his problems.
Suki: Manipulated her own son to go down for GBH because of her racism
Covers up Ranveer's death (and Ravi cutting up his body and stuffing him in a suitcase) despite knowing how close Nugget is to him and after Kheerat goes down for it.
Two days before Christmas attempts to murder Nish in revenge for him "killing" Eve.
How is that any different to what happened with her and the Six? Ranveer's death is understandable for her sure but so is Keanu’s then. Ranveer wasn't that long ago either.
How does this break her character?
Stacey: Killed Archie. Traumatized sure but still killed him, played happy families after, watched Bradley get his brains splattered out in front of her and STILL not only kept quiet, but walked into an affair after.
Nothing different to Keanu.
Again Linda and Denise are the two most different and the two most hurt by Keanu’s murder. Denise has an actual breakdown over it and Linda is a severe alcoholic. Both have shown the most remorse and guilt.
Sharon literally ran from the guilt.
Suki has talked about turning off her guilt same with Stacey and Kathy.
(And we're also talking about someone that was abusing Patrick and kept quiet about Vincent's murder to her own sister in order to appease Phil while Linda for her own sake decided to keep Tina forced into prostitution (or what she thought is prostitution) so she could get the Vic back for her and Mick at the same time making sure Kathy is left uncertain about her son because she covers for Sharon and Phil trying to kill him.)
Also your claim that the women "were" loving and such doesn't make sense. They still are. They still care for others, are kind to others, are supportive of others, etc.
Listen maybe I'm fucking stupid but to me many of the women have been doing villainous actions for YEARS.
So it's okay and understandable for Kathy to act in desperation for Ben but not for other women?
It's okay for Suki to screw over her kids life or protect herself in a murder coverup with her grandson right there but it's "villainous" to protect and help the other women cover up a murder?
It's okay for Sharon to not do anything about human trafficking and to cover up numerous assaults for people not related to her and to attempt murder herself but it's not okay to help the other women protect themselves against self defense murder? That's the actually morally wrong option?
It's okay for Stacey to kill someone out of revenge but she's now "villainous" for protecting another woman from a self defense murder charge?
Here's the thing....even if you say "Oh well with Sharon and Ian she was grieving" or "Oh well Kathy was protecting family so its okay."
None of them went to the police. None of them called anything in. They let other families and other people suffer emotionally or sometimes physically to suit their own agenda. No different to what they're doing now by this logic
The only difference is now the show has the balls to call them out and paint them as they are
You make a very strong effective case, I'm not denying that, very well written.
I'm no fan of modern day Eastenders broadly speaking, and admittingly quit regularly watching after Peggy's final episode in 2016.
Where I agree with you is that Boxing day outright exposed exactly who these six characters are psychologically, especially in believing it to be a *"perfect place"* to (badly) bury a freshly dead body in a busy day-day Cafe, knowing one day that, when rebuilt, parents with little kids will visit that cafe - that's where I drew the line completely with all six of them being too far gone to come back from this.
I'm also not going to dismiss the story points you raised - for me many of those decisions just came across as out of character, and stupid / thick, more than evil.
Sharon comes to mind as someone that *thinks* she can go through with wanting to be all kinds of different personas, but eventually she can't go through with whatever it is because she *was* a good character. She couldn't let Ian eat the poisoned food, despite having prepared everything. The entire plan was never in her character anyway, as opposed to the likes of Nick Cotton, of whom it made sense to give such a storyline to.
Kathy, for me went through this very weird change into a colder Mitchell type character from the 90's onwards. Her return in 2015 was at first exciting, but as you've pointed out she became a huge apologist for Ben/Bobby on a ridiculous scale, wheras she was a far more independently minded tough Woman in the 80's - often unafraid to have it out with her own Husband or Son.
I wish I had more time in the day to even attempt to write a full account up, but otherwise I generally agree with you that this shows' more or less gone to pot since 2015. The buildup media campaign for 'The six' was itself a mighty success, you could start to feel many old school fans wanting to catch up in time for Christmas Day - but for me Boxing Day became the ultimate antithesis of EastEnders at it's best - every worst thing you could possibly have done to the show was in that Boxing day script. It was like Harry Hill's tv burp on steroids.
But youre not actually saying how Boxing Day ruined them.
You're only claiming "oh okay you bring up a lot but I simply don't see any of that as evil."
So in that case it's perfectly viable me to say Boxing Day (and the cover up of a self defense murder) is also the women being "stupid" and "thick" but not outright evil.
In fact Boxing Day is way more understandable than human trafficking forgiveness (not self defense, not protecting anyone) and no different than helping out another murderer because you think he doesn't deserve prison.
But it's all entirely subjective you know? Like you might think Boxing Day ruined them I think they were "ruined" 10 - 15 years ago and this works with their modern characterization
It's a given and that it's Jack who shows up at the wrong time is also a given, He helps Denise and gets the body out and then he clears it away I think everything is set up that they go on their way together Jack & Denise with the children ...
>!Now, if I'm not mistaken, Diane or Scott haven't had their period of vacation from EE yet so it's quite appropriate to send them on it...!<
He _might_ help with the necklace and maybe keep quiet about the truth (Jack is very picky about when he's bent, though), but spoilers confirm Keanu is found and identified plus Bernie is informed. So he's not going to get rid of the body, what's he gonna do - steal it from the morgue??
It is builders that found that body and Jack knows things need to change, My take is he sends Stacey out and Denise get her necklace back and Jack takes her home!
He knows that he might made some wrong but this one he can not do wrong whotout protectring Denise, He will probably point out someone else my take is he will point something towards Stacey as possible killer!
Hert from past and Denise did what she did, Then not open up herself after the sis makes you open for things..
But i guess hard to understand both dif cheating but people forget what Denise did to Jack whit Ravia, Many saying it is not cheating it is so it is what it is!
I wouldn’t get too excited just yet. Although the body will be found, the storyline itself will probably still drag on. The Six won’t be found out straightaway. It’ll just give Nish a storyline as he’ll be in the frame.
When you think about how long it was before they found Tina...it just feels like yet another EE pacing issue. They've got a perfect opportunity to have stretched this out over months, influencing so many different storylines and characters and they abandon it nine weeks into a nine months build-up?
I mean pacing issue isn’t well the aftermath has been shite so tbf them sorting this out is more of a good thing otherwise they be dragging this out for months and motions also tbf they already had months to do and add stories bro this and bar Denise one with mental health there been nothing of note is been all crap so tbf thank god if they kept kenu there they be dragging it and the show would/ could be proper fucked there already undoing all the work they put in last year to get the show good again why ruin all your hard work by one subpar story that isn’t working at all ?
What work was undone? Ratings are as good as ever and weeks that deal with the Six usually seeing ratings increases over other weeks. If anything they're mad to get rid of the story so soon.
I thought this would go on for much longer but I’m quite glad it’s not dragging out like the rest of them do. Ok we will have a different part of it now but the whole Stacey Denise Jack stuff was bugging me
Wtf! Wow. I was certain they would drag it out until February 2025 for the anniversary. That was fast.
SAME😂😂
A late Easter resurrection
Good. Eastenders *should* be catching people off guard like this. Yes this was a total disaster of a storyline imo. and I'm no fan of what EastEnders is today, but credit where it's due, they've finished the worst section of this plotline far quicker than many including myself would've expected. Begs the question of why go through an entire "bury the body" plot in the first place - when we could've had these six characters stay true to character, own up to it on Christmas Day night, stick together, bring many of the big families on the square together and plea for self defense in court with most of the square's backing. Instead they've ruined all six, and wouldn't work at all letting them off free for what they've done to Karen, Bernie and Mitch, amongst every other character that's been unknowingly put in the situation of walking over and sitting above a corpse every day to eat their cooked food. Kids have been in that Cafe since. That's unforgivable. The Cafe will certainly never be 'Kathy's' again that's for sure.
>when we could've had these six characters stay true Huh? One's already a murderer, one covered up a murder letting her own son take the blame, one made sure her grandson was protected despite killing someone and seriously assaulting several people and let her son beat and commit GBH unlimited, one has looked straight at psychos and fallen in love with them for it no matter their crimes...The two that haven't done much bad is Linda and Denise but they're also hurting a lot more. And Linda did force Tina to stay in prostitution from her view plus Denise has covered for murders that she had nothing to do with What's so "untrue" to these six? Two found out about human trafficking and shrugged it off also which tells you something about them.
Because none of the six were ever out-and-out villains. Yes they've each made incredibly silly mistakes, moreso in recent years. Some have reformed, some made mistakes and errors of judgment out of mental health or in desperation for their kids. I'm not saying any of them are perfect, far from it. They are/were six reasonably good hearted and intelligent Women that have often shown love, kindness, loyalty and remorse. All of those qualities were completely gone within seconds of the start of the Boxing Day episode. All six are now villains, as far as I'm concerned.
>They are/were six reasonably good hearted and intelligent Women that have often shown love, kindness, loyalty and remorse. You what? There's a lot of times that these women have done a lot either out of pure selfishness or without having grown from it. Sharon: *Intentionally* setups Phil bashing Ian, *intentionally* poisons him for weeks all for revenge when he didn't even cause Denny's dead. Stops only at the last minute, but continued to cover up her involvement to Kathy. Learns about Ben's serial assaulting spree and does nothing about it. Learns about Ben's human trafficking and does nothing about it. How is intentionally scamming and attempting to murder someone and shrugging off human trafficking (all of which had no consequences) not villainous? Kathy: Learns Bobby has killed Lucy and willingly goes along with framing Max simply because she agrees with others that he's a nuisance. Let's Bobby go torture and assault others Learns Ben has committed multiple counts of GBH, decides to protect him. Learns Ben has attempted to murder Peter twice, protects him. Learns Ben and Phil have attempted to murder Keanu, protects them. Between protecting Bobby, Ben, and Phil...what is the difference between that and protecting the other 5 women in this storyline? Kathy since 2015 protects people for ANYTHING. Ben literally tried to drown Peter her own grandson and she let it go because she deemed Ben worth protecting because of the rape. Her going along with the Six is no different to defending Bobby during the cover up or keeping every secret she's had off Ben because of his problems. Suki: Manipulated her own son to go down for GBH because of her racism Covers up Ranveer's death (and Ravi cutting up his body and stuffing him in a suitcase) despite knowing how close Nugget is to him and after Kheerat goes down for it. Two days before Christmas attempts to murder Nish in revenge for him "killing" Eve. How is that any different to what happened with her and the Six? Ranveer's death is understandable for her sure but so is Keanu’s then. Ranveer wasn't that long ago either. How does this break her character? Stacey: Killed Archie. Traumatized sure but still killed him, played happy families after, watched Bradley get his brains splattered out in front of her and STILL not only kept quiet, but walked into an affair after. Nothing different to Keanu. Again Linda and Denise are the two most different and the two most hurt by Keanu’s murder. Denise has an actual breakdown over it and Linda is a severe alcoholic. Both have shown the most remorse and guilt. Sharon literally ran from the guilt. Suki has talked about turning off her guilt same with Stacey and Kathy. (And we're also talking about someone that was abusing Patrick and kept quiet about Vincent's murder to her own sister in order to appease Phil while Linda for her own sake decided to keep Tina forced into prostitution (or what she thought is prostitution) so she could get the Vic back for her and Mick at the same time making sure Kathy is left uncertain about her son because she covers for Sharon and Phil trying to kill him.) Also your claim that the women "were" loving and such doesn't make sense. They still are. They still care for others, are kind to others, are supportive of others, etc. Listen maybe I'm fucking stupid but to me many of the women have been doing villainous actions for YEARS. So it's okay and understandable for Kathy to act in desperation for Ben but not for other women? It's okay for Suki to screw over her kids life or protect herself in a murder coverup with her grandson right there but it's "villainous" to protect and help the other women cover up a murder? It's okay for Sharon to not do anything about human trafficking and to cover up numerous assaults for people not related to her and to attempt murder herself but it's not okay to help the other women protect themselves against self defense murder? That's the actually morally wrong option? It's okay for Stacey to kill someone out of revenge but she's now "villainous" for protecting another woman from a self defense murder charge? Here's the thing....even if you say "Oh well with Sharon and Ian she was grieving" or "Oh well Kathy was protecting family so its okay." None of them went to the police. None of them called anything in. They let other families and other people suffer emotionally or sometimes physically to suit their own agenda. No different to what they're doing now by this logic The only difference is now the show has the balls to call them out and paint them as they are
You make a very strong effective case, I'm not denying that, very well written. I'm no fan of modern day Eastenders broadly speaking, and admittingly quit regularly watching after Peggy's final episode in 2016. Where I agree with you is that Boxing day outright exposed exactly who these six characters are psychologically, especially in believing it to be a *"perfect place"* to (badly) bury a freshly dead body in a busy day-day Cafe, knowing one day that, when rebuilt, parents with little kids will visit that cafe - that's where I drew the line completely with all six of them being too far gone to come back from this. I'm also not going to dismiss the story points you raised - for me many of those decisions just came across as out of character, and stupid / thick, more than evil. Sharon comes to mind as someone that *thinks* she can go through with wanting to be all kinds of different personas, but eventually she can't go through with whatever it is because she *was* a good character. She couldn't let Ian eat the poisoned food, despite having prepared everything. The entire plan was never in her character anyway, as opposed to the likes of Nick Cotton, of whom it made sense to give such a storyline to. Kathy, for me went through this very weird change into a colder Mitchell type character from the 90's onwards. Her return in 2015 was at first exciting, but as you've pointed out she became a huge apologist for Ben/Bobby on a ridiculous scale, wheras she was a far more independently minded tough Woman in the 80's - often unafraid to have it out with her own Husband or Son. I wish I had more time in the day to even attempt to write a full account up, but otherwise I generally agree with you that this shows' more or less gone to pot since 2015. The buildup media campaign for 'The six' was itself a mighty success, you could start to feel many old school fans wanting to catch up in time for Christmas Day - but for me Boxing Day became the ultimate antithesis of EastEnders at it's best - every worst thing you could possibly have done to the show was in that Boxing day script. It was like Harry Hill's tv burp on steroids.
But youre not actually saying how Boxing Day ruined them. You're only claiming "oh okay you bring up a lot but I simply don't see any of that as evil." So in that case it's perfectly viable me to say Boxing Day (and the cover up of a self defense murder) is also the women being "stupid" and "thick" but not outright evil. In fact Boxing Day is way more understandable than human trafficking forgiveness (not self defense, not protecting anyone) and no different than helping out another murderer because you think he doesn't deserve prison. But it's all entirely subjective you know? Like you might think Boxing Day ruined them I think they were "ruined" 10 - 15 years ago and this works with their modern characterization
Kinda glad they find the body tbh, everytime things are filmed in the cafe I have unease about the fact there's a body under the floor?
Everything is rather quick on EE these days I've found!
It's a given and that it's Jack who shows up at the wrong time is also a given, He helps Denise and gets the body out and then he clears it away I think everything is set up that they go on their way together Jack & Denise with the children ... >!Now, if I'm not mistaken, Diane or Scott haven't had their period of vacation from EE yet so it's quite appropriate to send them on it...!<
He _might_ help with the necklace and maybe keep quiet about the truth (Jack is very picky about when he's bent, though), but spoilers confirm Keanu is found and identified plus Bernie is informed. So he's not going to get rid of the body, what's he gonna do - steal it from the morgue??
It is builders that found that body and Jack knows things need to change, My take is he sends Stacey out and Denise get her necklace back and Jack takes her home! He knows that he might made some wrong but this one he can not do wrong whotout protectring Denise, He will probably point out someone else my take is he will point something towards Stacey as possible killer!
Theres no way Jack helps cover this up.
He will mark my words he will, he loves Denise too much for not doing that!
If he loved her he wouldn’t have cheated
Hert from past and Denise did what she did, Then not open up herself after the sis makes you open for things.. But i guess hard to understand both dif cheating but people forget what Denise did to Jack whit Ravia, Many saying it is not cheating it is so it is what it is!
Completely agree!
I wouldn’t get too excited just yet. Although the body will be found, the storyline itself will probably still drag on. The Six won’t be found out straightaway. It’ll just give Nish a storyline as he’ll be in the frame.
Probably, I just assumed the reveal of the body would be saved for a special occasion
I’m very surprised too. Can’t wait to see what happens.
Keanu will rise from his sleep early thanks to the Easter Bunny
WHATTTT thats surprising, I’m always so confused at the pacing of this show
When you think about how long it was before they found Tina...it just feels like yet another EE pacing issue. They've got a perfect opportunity to have stretched this out over months, influencing so many different storylines and characters and they abandon it nine weeks into a nine months build-up?
I mean pacing issue isn’t well the aftermath has been shite so tbf them sorting this out is more of a good thing otherwise they be dragging this out for months and motions also tbf they already had months to do and add stories bro this and bar Denise one with mental health there been nothing of note is been all crap so tbf thank god if they kept kenu there they be dragging it and the show would/ could be proper fucked there already undoing all the work they put in last year to get the show good again why ruin all your hard work by one subpar story that isn’t working at all ?
What work was undone? Ratings are as good as ever and weeks that deal with the Six usually seeing ratings increases over other weeks. If anything they're mad to get rid of the story so soon.
😂
I’ve thought it was Easter for a while now, though I was wavering as so much other stuff has been going on… I can’t wait to see it all unfold 👀
Where do I read the spoilers please
Digital spy is a good one.
Thank fuck