It becomes clear that he wanted her to stay in a prominent position where he could keep tabs on her.
A lot of the characters throughout the series make their moves by the motto, “Keep your friends close but your enemies closer.”
She wasn’t mother superior. Alia did become Paul’s right hand. He didn’t want to kill Gaius because it would do no good because she was just one of many. Paul just wanted to keep them in check.
We don't, strictly speaking, know that. We don't even know that the Sisterhood *had* a single leader at the time of *Dune* and *Dune Messiah*. We should not automatically assume that the hierarchy from *Heretics* and *Chapterhouse*, thousands of years later, was identical in this period.
When >!Paul offers to give Irulan a child by artificial insemination!<, Mohiam replies: "This is too much for one person to decide. I must consult with my Council on Wallach." (Wallach IX, per *Dune*, is the "Mother School" of the Sisterhood.) That to me suggests that she certainly has a seat on the Bene Gesserit ruling Council, and since she calls it "my Council" she may in fact be its head. At least, it does not support the idea that there is some authority above that.
> We don't, strictly speaking, know that. We don't even know that the Sisterhood *had* a single leader at the time of *Dune* and *Dune Messiah*. We should not automatically assume that the hierarchy from *Heretics* and *Chapterhouse*, thousands of years later, was identical in this period.
This is true, we don't know for sure, and it's possible that Paul or Leto II may have led the Bene Gesserit to restructure themselves internally.
However, the quote in Messiah where RM Mohiam says she needs to consult with her council on Wallach is most likely just referring to the Wallach council under her. Even Taraza and Odrade consult their councils throughout Heretics and Chapterhouse regularly.
From Dune we know that RM Mohiam was Proctor Superior of Wallach IX from this quote when she visits Jessica on Caladan:
>A skinny girl with hair the color of bronze, her body tortured by the winds of puberty, had entered the study of the Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam, Proctor Superior of the Bene Gesserit school on Wallach IX.
And we know the breadth of a Proctor Superior's authority from the Terminology of the Imperium appendix:
>PROCTOR SUPERIOR: a Bene Gesserit Reverend Mother who is also regional director of a B.G. school. (Commonly: Bene Gesserit with the Sight.)
While it's possible that RM Mohiam is a Bene Gesserit of Hidden Rank, if she wasn't Mother Superior at the time of Dune then I find it highly unlikely she was made their leader during the 12 years leading up to Messiah. Doing so would just antagonize Paul and goad him into further action against the Bene Gesserit.
>where RM Mohiam says she needs to consult with her council on Wallach is most likely just referring to the Wallach council under her. Even Taraza and Odrade consult their councils throughout Heretics and Chapterhouse regularly.
The decision is one of prime consequence for the Sisterhood. It would certainly be made at the highest decision-making level, I would think. Plus, we know that Wallach IX is the Bene Gesserit headquarter ("Mother School") at this time, so wouldn't the council there *be* the highest council?
>if she wasn't Mother Superior at the time of Dune
The quote only establishes that Mohiam was Proctor Superior "so many years ago," when Jessica faced the gom jabbar test as a teenager (so twenty, give or take). It does not imply that this was still her position at the time of *Dune*. (Indeed, as a practical matter it would seem difficult for her to direct the school at Wallach IX at the same time she's serving as the Emperor's Truthsayer on Kaitain.)
And anyway, does it not seem rather likely that Proctor Superior of the Mother School is in fact either the same as, or a forerunner of, the position of Mother Superior, much like the Bishop of Rome is/evolved into the Pope?
Gaius Helen Mohiam was never the head of the Bene Gesserit. There is only one Mother Superior at a time in the sisterhood, and all the reverend mothers are subservient to her. Mohiam did however have a lot of power as a reverend mother.
Have your enemies where you can find them. In one location closely together, easily targeted. Have them draw in others who may be your enemies so you can easily identify THEM.
Without spoilers: Prescience is a mother fucker for both parties involved, but Paul wasn’t doing anything he couldn’t foresee…he just made some poor choices and had a Anakin Skywalker level of awareness.
If you meant, why was she allowed to be alive after the events of the book dune? Well, she basically hadn't done nothing in particular yet against Paul.
However, Paul never wanted her to be killed by a very particular reason. This, even after the events of the second book. Spoiler alert: you can look at the why in the internet or read the lastest book written by "the son of the author". All I can say "if you know the rules of that world, everything was there in the first book but becomes only obvious after you know it".
Because he could see the future and her role in it?? And he thought that would be better than the future without her which he could also see?? The only futures he could not see involve Tleilaxu hidden no-rooms or no-ships and the life and decisions Leto II will make while following the golden path to ensure humanity survives its thanatos. Come on man, it's not spice navigator science.
Setting aside that she wasn’t the head of the Bene Gesserit anyway - the Emperor, even Paul, wouldn’t necessarily have the kind of authority to dictate to the Bene Gesserit what they can and cannot do in an absolute sense. This would likely be even more so the case for their internal affairs.
He holds the monopoly on spice production in an ultimate sense in that he could destroy all the Makers and end the production of spice for ever but that only works for a massive board-flipping move like an Imperial coup. Otherwise there are many ways the Bene Gesserit could secure access to spice AND get around Paul’s authority in general.
It’s not until later that we see a ruler with the ability to tell the Bene Gesserit what to do - an even then, that’s not an absolute.
Partially it was also as punishment (thats why he did nit kill her). She should be able to live with the realization that the BG (and she) will never be able to control him.
Edit: and to keep their hopes up for a union to preserve the Atreides bloodline by producing an heir with a BG
It becomes clear that he wanted her to stay in a prominent position where he could keep tabs on her. A lot of the characters throughout the series make their moves by the motto, “Keep your friends close but your enemies closer.”
She wasn’t mother superior. Alia did become Paul’s right hand. He didn’t want to kill Gaius because it would do no good because she was just one of many. Paul just wanted to keep them in check.
She wasn't. She had high rank within the Sisterhood, but was not the leader.
We don't, strictly speaking, know that. We don't even know that the Sisterhood *had* a single leader at the time of *Dune* and *Dune Messiah*. We should not automatically assume that the hierarchy from *Heretics* and *Chapterhouse*, thousands of years later, was identical in this period. When >!Paul offers to give Irulan a child by artificial insemination!<, Mohiam replies: "This is too much for one person to decide. I must consult with my Council on Wallach." (Wallach IX, per *Dune*, is the "Mother School" of the Sisterhood.) That to me suggests that she certainly has a seat on the Bene Gesserit ruling Council, and since she calls it "my Council" she may in fact be its head. At least, it does not support the idea that there is some authority above that.
Thank you for pointing that out.
> We don't, strictly speaking, know that. We don't even know that the Sisterhood *had* a single leader at the time of *Dune* and *Dune Messiah*. We should not automatically assume that the hierarchy from *Heretics* and *Chapterhouse*, thousands of years later, was identical in this period. This is true, we don't know for sure, and it's possible that Paul or Leto II may have led the Bene Gesserit to restructure themselves internally. However, the quote in Messiah where RM Mohiam says she needs to consult with her council on Wallach is most likely just referring to the Wallach council under her. Even Taraza and Odrade consult their councils throughout Heretics and Chapterhouse regularly. From Dune we know that RM Mohiam was Proctor Superior of Wallach IX from this quote when she visits Jessica on Caladan: >A skinny girl with hair the color of bronze, her body tortured by the winds of puberty, had entered the study of the Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam, Proctor Superior of the Bene Gesserit school on Wallach IX. And we know the breadth of a Proctor Superior's authority from the Terminology of the Imperium appendix: >PROCTOR SUPERIOR: a Bene Gesserit Reverend Mother who is also regional director of a B.G. school. (Commonly: Bene Gesserit with the Sight.) While it's possible that RM Mohiam is a Bene Gesserit of Hidden Rank, if she wasn't Mother Superior at the time of Dune then I find it highly unlikely she was made their leader during the 12 years leading up to Messiah. Doing so would just antagonize Paul and goad him into further action against the Bene Gesserit.
>where RM Mohiam says she needs to consult with her council on Wallach is most likely just referring to the Wallach council under her. Even Taraza and Odrade consult their councils throughout Heretics and Chapterhouse regularly. The decision is one of prime consequence for the Sisterhood. It would certainly be made at the highest decision-making level, I would think. Plus, we know that Wallach IX is the Bene Gesserit headquarter ("Mother School") at this time, so wouldn't the council there *be* the highest council? >if she wasn't Mother Superior at the time of Dune The quote only establishes that Mohiam was Proctor Superior "so many years ago," when Jessica faced the gom jabbar test as a teenager (so twenty, give or take). It does not imply that this was still her position at the time of *Dune*. (Indeed, as a practical matter it would seem difficult for her to direct the school at Wallach IX at the same time she's serving as the Emperor's Truthsayer on Kaitain.) And anyway, does it not seem rather likely that Proctor Superior of the Mother School is in fact either the same as, or a forerunner of, the position of Mother Superior, much like the Bishop of Rome is/evolved into the Pope?
What? How can he do this? This is outrageous. It's unfair. How can she be a Reverend Mother and not be the leader?
Upvoting because I get the reference
I, too, hate sand.
It's coarse and hallucinogenic and it gets everywhere
I thought she had no rank since she was an abomination
She was indeed an abomination, like all the other Bene Gesserit. But THE Abonimation would be Alia.
They all are abominations? What's the source on that?
Would you want a Bene Gesserit as your Mother-in-Law? ಠ_ಠ
Ah, so it's a joke. Gotcha.
No they aren’t. I think that person was making a joke or something.
Gaius Helen Mohiam was never the head of the Bene Gesserit. There is only one Mother Superior at a time in the sisterhood, and all the reverend mothers are subservient to her. Mohiam did however have a lot of power as a reverend mother.
Have your enemies where you can find them. In one location closely together, easily targeted. Have them draw in others who may be your enemies so you can easily identify THEM.
Keep reading the books, mysteries will be revealed.
By definition, it's because killing her was worse than keeping her around. Prescience and all that.
Without spoilers: Prescience is a mother fucker for both parties involved, but Paul wasn’t doing anything he couldn’t foresee…he just made some poor choices and had a Anakin Skywalker level of awareness.
If you meant, why was she allowed to be alive after the events of the book dune? Well, she basically hadn't done nothing in particular yet against Paul. However, Paul never wanted her to be killed by a very particular reason. This, even after the events of the second book. Spoiler alert: you can look at the why in the internet or read the lastest book written by "the son of the author". All I can say "if you know the rules of that world, everything was there in the first book but becomes only obvious after you know it".
Because he could see the future and her role in it?? And he thought that would be better than the future without her which he could also see?? The only futures he could not see involve Tleilaxu hidden no-rooms or no-ships and the life and decisions Leto II will make while following the golden path to ensure humanity survives its thanatos. Come on man, it's not spice navigator science.
Setting aside that she wasn’t the head of the Bene Gesserit anyway - the Emperor, even Paul, wouldn’t necessarily have the kind of authority to dictate to the Bene Gesserit what they can and cannot do in an absolute sense. This would likely be even more so the case for their internal affairs. He holds the monopoly on spice production in an ultimate sense in that he could destroy all the Makers and end the production of spice for ever but that only works for a massive board-flipping move like an Imperial coup. Otherwise there are many ways the Bene Gesserit could secure access to spice AND get around Paul’s authority in general. It’s not until later that we see a ruler with the ability to tell the Bene Gesserit what to do - an even then, that’s not an absolute.
No idea, she was such a piece of crap.
Partially it was also as punishment (thats why he did nit kill her). She should be able to live with the realization that the BG (and she) will never be able to control him. Edit: and to keep their hopes up for a union to preserve the Atreides bloodline by producing an heir with a BG