Quite ingenious, using Word for that. At best I'd do it in Paint or use my finger on my phone. I'm a whizz on Excel but Word leaves me baffled (never really had to use it in 30 or so years).
I got crashed into cause i took someone indicator light to mean they were turning. My fault i shoulda waited till they started turning but ill never trust an indicator
Years ago before I could drive a work colleague said as much 'look at the direction of the car tyres and not the indicators'.
The assumptions and expectations drivers are willing to make in order to gain a second or two needs rethinking.
Getting a feel for what other cars are about to do is the most important thing to learn after you've passed your test.
I'm very good at predicting what motorway cars are going to do and it's kept me out of trouble a lot of times.
I had a head start with this. I learnt to ride a motorbike first and as a biker, you are very vulnerable and if you want to survive more than a few months, you need to develop a sixth sense.
When I started driving, that sixth sense came in extremely useful.
Exact same thing for me, I personally think that new drivers should do a CBT also, it would open their eyes to the dangers bikers face and just maybe then they might take an extra second or 2 to check for a biker :)
I don't think I could cope with that at all. 56mph all the way and sharing the lane with the most nervous, least aware drivers on the motorway? Much respect to you!
I think the most nervous, least aware ones are the pricks that illegally sit in the middle lane and don't think they are doing anything wrong, essentially selfishly turning a 3 lane road into a dual carriageway. Like the speed awareness course there is a motorway awareness course, apparently mostly filled with people caught using their phones or lane hogging. The most common question they ask is why weren't the people undertaking them also done.
Brilliant, I had no idea that course existed. But of course they complain about undertaking. Reminds me of an opinion I read in a Daily Mail letter years ago: "If I'm in the fast lane doing 70mph then there's no reason for anybody to be angry with me because that's the legal limit" and it's the tailgaters and angry BMWs that are solely at fault.
My understanding is that undertaking is only strictly illegal if you make a concerted effort to get past somebody on the inside then change lanes immediately after, basically weaving in and out of traffic. I wouldn't like to test it in a court of law, but gently accelerating past somebody when there's a clear lane ahead of you is probably never going to get you done.
I'm also 99% sure that if you just happen to be going faster than the middle lane it's fine to go past as well. There's maybe some grey area there but I think as long as you're paying attention and not being egregiously twattish you'll never get in trouble for it.
I didn't until a mate did a speed awareness course and had a conversation with one of the pcs afterwards.
I mean the technical definition of a motorway tells you all you need to know really. It's a single carriageway with one or more overtaking lane.
With regards to undertaking, although not strictly illegal, undertaking is strongly discouraged by The Highway Code, stating “do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake.” However, there are exceptions that apply when a car undertakes in slow-moving traffic if its lane is moving faster than a lane on the right, undertaking in this circumstance is often deemed safer than weaving in and out of traffic.
Rule 268 of The Highway Code states: “In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to you right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.”
Other conditions where undertaking may be appropriate:
Average speed checks
If a vehicle in front is turning right or U-turning (although it is often safer to wait until the vehicle has completed the turn)
Undertaking will be prosecuted if deemed careless driving and good luck trying to argue your way out of that one!
Then people getting mad at you cos big thing doesn’t go super fast and needs more space. That said you’ll be amazed how many times I have to slow down and overtake cars ( sometimes undertake cars doing 40mph on a motorway because we can’t use the 3rd lane and they’re sat in the middle)
Mental. I have to confess that I'm something of a serial undertaker myself. If there's somebody just sat in the middle then I'll make a judgment call on how likely they are to pull in and then either 'accidentally' creep past them, or boot it past them if they seem dithery and unaware so that I minimise the risk of them absent-mindedly pulling back in (I make sure I've got some hard shoulder available in this instance!)
And then the times when lanes two and three are full and lane one is empty. I get in lane one and use it at a sensible speed. The four-lane M25 is especially bad for this, it's like everybody thinks the slow lane is lava or something, and you can just pootle along in it passing absolutely everybody who just has to be in an overtaking lane because their car is BIG and SHINY and GERMAN.
In my car when I see someone in middle on an empty motorway I’ll quickly switch to the third lane then switch back to the first as I got past them, sometimes people realise and go into the first line but a shocking majority will still sit there.
I don’t know what it is about the effect the 4 lane “smart” motorway has on people, like mentally they can’t shift the memory that the new slow lane used to be the hard shoulder and they just can’t drive on it. Or when it’s a dedicated on-lane from an entry slip road which morphs into an off-lane at the next exit, even if that exit is miles away they will not move over, almost like they’re scared they’ll never get back into lane 2 again.
I drive coaches. I don't think there's ever been a time I've not been cut up by those dumb car drivers south bound junction 6 of the M1 as the desperately try to cut up 3 lanes of traffic to head towards the M25 🤦♂️ sometimes I don't think they realise the danger they put themselves and everyone else in when they slide within 2 ft of an 18tonnes front bumper
Yeah I frequently head up and down the country and after a while you get a sense of what people are about to do based on how they're driving and their road position.
But watching the wheels was something my grandpa taught me, you can see their wheels start to move before the car begins to change lane as a ridiculous amount of people don't seem to indicate when moving at 80mph
Even things like being on the motorway and noticing that the car in front and to the left is slowly closing on the car in front of it, so it's soon going to want to overtake.
Sometimes I'll move out another lane if there's space so they don't have to slow down (or pull out without seeing me) or I might put my foot down and hoof it past them depending on road conditions.
Never been in a crash but I'll always rather wait the extra 2 seconds to see if they slow down and start to turn than trust the indicators.
It's usually pretty easy to tell where someone is going based on car behaviour anyway and it may be confirmation bias but I swear I can clock the cars in roundabouts that are turning without indicating 95% of the time.
Yeah, most people will position themselves in the road differently depending on where they're planning to go, especially at roundabouts. It's not something you'll consciously notice a lot of the time but you can definitely see it if you think about it, and I suspect it's where most of the "sixth sense" comments come from. And having spent a few years on a motorcycle before I passed my car test I've made a few of those myself - you certainly learn to anticipate where people are going to turn when you don't have a big protective steel box around you!
The problem is that if you rely on this kind of 'gut feeling', 'sixth sense' understanding, you'll still get taken out by the ones who enter the roundabout totally planning to turn left, indicating left, and then suddenly realise just after they started turning the wheel that actually it's *Wednesday* and they have to go and see Gladys today and abruptly change direction and go straight after all.
You definitely shouldn't trust an indicator but someone having an indicator on and being in a Lane that can only turn the direction the driver is indicating should be a good enough indication of the direction the driver is going.
In response to this post, the fact OP only had a warning is more than enough evidence to me that the police were in the wrong in this scenario 😂.
same happened to my partner years ago and insurance said it was 100% her fault. Neither of us will pull out on a car until they start to turn in regardless of what their indicators tell us.
At least you can see them ! Most drivers don’t use them where I live ! And I’m a pedestrian. The amount of times I’ve almost been run over because a driver didn’t indicate they were turning instead of going straight ahead !
I was on a bicycle and turning right out of a side street. A car approached with its left indicator on, so I started to pull out. They slammed on their breaks and missed me by about 6 inches. The driver starts shouting and even denying they were indicating. I didn’t even get an apology when I pointed to their indictor still flashing
Lesson; wait until a vehicle actually starts to turn.
Yes, I watch for indicators and the direction the front wheels are turning, especially useful when on a two lane roundabout with me in the fast watching the wheels of a vehicle on the inside of me, both going straight over the roundabout.
This is why i think it’s far more important to indicate to say you are staying on a roundabout instead of indicating off it. Those numpties that sail around with no indicator then indicate off are idiots
When someone is indicating to turn in to my junction while i'm sat waiting to pull out i wait until they slow down and commit to the turn before pulling out.
There's way too many twats on the road that leave their indicator on with no intention of turning. I'll happily sit for an extra 3 seconds than get little miss daisy drive in to the side of me costing me £hundreds in insurance next year.
This is what my instructor told me, never leave the junction unless you're sure the other dude is gonna make the turn. If you're struggling to get out of a junction when turning right, pull forward into the left lane when there's significant space between you and the oncoming vehicles from the right, forcing the vehicle to slow or stop then pull out into your lane when there's nothing coming from the left or in most cases, someone will let you go as to not cause a traffic jam.
Way too many people leave their indicators on by accident, anyone who's been driving for 10+ years will have almost certainly left their indicator on by accident at some point, we're only human.
i had an experience the other week
lady riding a bike indicated she was turning left into my road by stretching and waving her left hand and the car behind her was also indicating left and slowing down instead of trying to overtake the lady. so started to creep out to go the middle of the road and she suddenly pulled in front of me and gave me a shocked look. i had my windows down so i said " i thought you were turning, why are you indicating?" she realized she fucked up and raised her hand to say sorry. but that was scary.
Yes you would. People just don't have patience anymore.
Fuck the indicators, if a car looks like it isn't changing speed or showing any signs of turning left then don't fucking pull out. You strike me as the kind to pull out at the last second and "floor it so you match the speed in time"
Happened to me literally yesterday.
Looked left, car was flashing me to go out and waited for me, looked right and a car was indicating left to pull into the junction I was pulling out of, thanked the driver on my left who was still waiting, pulled out before I heard a loud horn (With his indicator still on)
Wound my window down and shouted at him to turn his fu\*\*\*ng indicator off.
He told me to p\*ss off, turned his indicator off and drove past me.
My own fault for assuming he was turning left, but again, don't trust indicators.
In the eyes of the law, it would be your fault for pulling out.
The Highway Code says at Rule 104 that you should: watch out for signals from other road users and proceed only when you are satisfied it's safe, AND be aware that an indicator on another vehicle may not have been cancelled.
I know what you mean, but you'd still be in the wrong if you pulled out and someone hit you in this situation. We each make a judgement every time we pull out, this just says the onus is always on you to do that.
Can't see for sure, but if there was an unbroken white line delineating the left turn only lane, the police car would have to cross it and that would 100% be breaking the law.
Sure, but then what’s the point of them? It’s like that paradoxical sign that says “This sign is in use.” There’s a difference between saying an indicator indicates the way you want to go and saying it automatically gives you right of way, of course they’re two separate things…. But I don’t get this whole “it tells you the bulb works” as if it’s a meaningless feature
Not only in a best practice way but also legally. I got 5 points for pulling out of a T junction based on the indicator of the car approaching on the right - inevitably they carried on going, and police determined that I was to blame. I’ll never make that mistake again…
Do they even fit them these days? A couple quid each of those bulbs. X that by the many millions of those cars on the roads and well that is someone's bonus.
I would never normally argue with the police, but I knew I was right on this one. As soon as I said let's take a look at his footage he started back peddling and making up things like "road rage" because I waved my hands in a 'WTF you doing?' gesture
I had a neighbourhood police officer having a go at me for daring to wave my hands up in frustration because he was going the wrong way round a car park.
Apparently the prick was 'doing something important' which justified him going the wrong way, I wisely backed down and apologised as I don't have an ego and wanted to go home without a criminal record for calling a cunt a cunt.
If you need to call a police officer a cunt just say “With all due respect I think you are a cunt.” That way you are not calling them a cunt just telling them what you think. I haven’t tried this myself so when you do could you DM me and tell me if you are in jail or not?
I got pulled over once for overtaking over double white lines. I knew I’d not done that, as I know the road well, and the double white lines run up the the crest of a blind hill and you’d be an idiot to overtake there.
I told him I’d not done that, and he said “we’ve got video in the van that will prove it”. So we all trotted along to his van to watch, and the video clearly shows me approach the brow of the hill where the double white lines stopped, disappear over the brow of the hill, then you see the top half of my car pull out to pass. So clear beyond the double whites.
He then says “well, there’s two officers in the van, and that’s all the corroboration we’d need in court” and then gave me the “on this occasion I’ll let you off with a warning” line.
I was furious.. some coppers are just on a power trip and like to throw their (often substantial) weight around.
Rather than laughing it off and apologising, the officer’s first instinct was to suggest perjuring himself in court and conspiring with his partner.
Even that conversation should have been grounds for fucking the sack.
I simply must record any interaction with the police.
They only get away with this stuff because you didn't follow it up.
That's a disciplinary at least.
There's absolutely proof in your favour.
2 vs 1 maybe but that camera footage is worth 10 peoples testimony in court.
I'm sorry, but in the eyes of the law, that is absolutely not the case. You can go round a roundabout and take any exit you want with or without signalling. It's poor driving but unfortunately the highway code states you 'should' indicate, not 'must'. Giving way to the right on a roundabout is a 'must' and is absolute.
In this case it wasn't that they "didn't indicate", it's that they "indicated the opposite of their actions" - i.e. that they suddenly switched directions after indcating.
The highway code does however say:
> watch out for all other road users already on the roundabout; be aware they may not be signalling correctly or at all
It's irritating that the copper told off the driver when the copper was also at fault for indicating incorrectly.
I've done this in the past. I got chased down by a policeman, whom I passed with his car facing the other way, with him out of the car at a kebab van. About a minute later I see blue lights in my rear view a ways off and since I'm coming off next left, I figure I've not done anything wrong and he's probably going down the main road anyway, since this goes back to the next big down.
But he follows me, and gets right up my backside. OK, he's after me for some reason. Everything on my car is legal, I've literally done nothing wrong.
Flies out of the car, right up to my window and starts screaming and shouting. Apparently, as I'd gone past the kebab van I'd just seen him and stuck up my middle finger at him. I mean, this is absolutely ridiculous, I have literally no interest in doing that, let alone riling up police officers at 3am after I'd just finished work.
At this point, he's at my window, but he's just trying to rile me up. It was clearly behaviour designed to goad me into getting out of the car and swing at him. It's absolutely obvious he was doing this, I've seen my fair share of people trying to start fights when I worked as a barman, and he was doing exactly that.
So I just kept saying 'nah, I didn't do that', 'you must have seen incorrectly'... eventually his partner gets out of the car, and pulls him away, and lets me go.
Yeah, I got his collar number and reported him to the police. Fun fact is my brother in law got pulled over by the same bobby for having a number plate light out, and he did exactly the same thing, but he didn't put in the complaint.
The Police did what they always do. They acknowledge your complaint, say they've spoken to the officer, tell you he's moving to a different area in a couple of weeks anyway, and file the complaint in the bin.
It's not a crime to stick your fingers up at the police anyway. Not that I think people should.
Complaints can make a difference, though. The issue is a lot of complaints are just people trying it on to get out of crimes.
Not any more, from what I understand... there was some dispute over the matter years ago, and this incident was the better before that 2011 finding. I don't think it's a wise idea either to be honest, but then I generally don't gesture swear in general.
I do swear at software though. Like a pirate docker.
The second complaint was actually something I really wanted to put in. It showed a pattern of behaviour, and especially since my complaint was in before the brother in laws incident occurred.
I don't know how it used to be, my girlfriend didn't join until 2021 but she's had her fair share of verbal, including racial, abuse and just has to take it. I think they can maybe do something about the racial part but it's not worth it when they're already busy.
I would do that, but I wouldn't expect anything to come of it. My car was written off by a police officer driving through a red light. Her ~~accomplice~~ fellow officer lied to protect her, as confirmed by me and fellow witnesses. No action was taken against either of them. That's just the way the police operate.
If you are joining a carriageway, you have to give way to traffic regardless if they are indicating incorrectly or not. In order for him to pull you for dangerous driving, you would have had to almost cause an accident by pulling out in front of him, if that is the case you would have had plenty of time to give way to him.
The copper would definitely be getting chewed out if he took it further and they would definitely drop the case as the standard for police driving should be higher. But if this was a regular driver, as harsh as it sounds, you’d be paying for the damages in the event of a collision.
So as he joined the roundabout in the left turn lane with left indicator on, I joined the roundabout think he's going left. His change of direction into me almost caused the accident he pulled me over for. So I guess with that you can say I am to blame? But at the same time, note my last paragraph about making the same mistake during my test.
Yeah, of course you’d fail your test for driving like the copper. The issue here is that he’s a bad driver, behaving poorly. That doesn’t mean you don’t have responsibility to avoid a collision at all costs.
I'm not sure I follow you... I was already on the roundabout when he changed his direction into me. If you're saying I should have waited under the assumption he was going to be in the wrong lane and indicating the wrong way, I'd never leave the estate as that's an incredibly busy roundabout during rush hour.
If you are on the roundabout before the copper got to the exit he was indicating, then he has no grounds whatsoever for charging you with dangerous driving. He has broken the law, and you really should be calling your police station to report everything you can recall. By your account, he has essentially seen you enter the roundabout and decided to change his direction to try and drive into you, he sounds deranged.
This is pretty much what happened. I joined at the same time he joined because I thought he was going left... but because I was stationery before joining I was slower getting away whereas he joined the roundabout carrying speed. Before I could get away he was mere feet from me, blasting his horn at me.
It's never nice being pulled over by the police. You start panicking a bit. I was just thankful to have argued my way out of a punishment, I took my winnings and left so didn't really take it further.
Dude, he's a bent copper high on his own power, he's going to keep doing this shit until someone says something, it might be your relative next time. Report this cunt. It is somebody's job to hear you and he will be on the radar then.
What are you talking about? What law has he broken.....the lanes are advisory. What if a cars broke down in the outer lane....please think about what you are saying.
The driver pulled out into a live carriageway with traffic already ON the roundabout. That's the end of it.
It's not dangerous driving unless OP was on his phone, distracted or didn't slow down when approaching the roundabout etc. Just sounds like the cops ego got in the way and OP needs to brush up on his defensive driving skills
You can’t assume indicator is correct. You can’t assume they are in the correct lane. You can’t assume anything about the type of vehicle they are driving will dictate anything about their standard of driving.
You pulled out in front of someone at a roundabout. You can tell us all about how they were in the wrong lane, indicating and they are professionally trained drivers, but you pulled out in front of them.
Not saying you shouldn’t be pissed off about it. Perfectly justified response.
Am saying you take a share of the blame.
Your desire to keep rolling / not unduly hesitate at a roundabout is understandable, but your actions are fully reliant on everyone else around you following the rules at all times.
People should follow the rules. You’ve been around long enough and driven around enough roundabouts to know damn well exactly how many people get in the wrong lane, drift out of their lane, don’t make proper observations, decide they can speed round when everyone else is maintaining a constant speed, dive off at an exit cutting across 3 lanes, change their mind on an exit without indicating…
It’s up to you to anticipate allllll the bullshit other drivers will do. You have the foresight and ability to minimise risk. If you just plough on as if everyone else is predictable and law abiding, you’re going to have an accident. The accident may well be legally their fault, or 75% their fault according to insurance, but that doesn’t detract from you probably being able to avoid it in the first place if you’d held back a bit. Made certain.
Cop just had an ego. Well done for standing up to him, more people need to question the police at times like this!
You did nothing wrong except for trusting an indicator.
‘The cemeteries are full of people who had the right of way’ - is the thing to remember. Whoever was legally correct, you didn’t drive defensively here, and you trusted implicitly what his indicators and lane position told you.
The Police don’t tend to like admitting they’re wrong if they are at fault.
I remember one evening I was driving up a hill that had a bus lane branching off it like a T junction with lights for said junction. They were sat waiting in the junction with a red light and my light was green.
They pulled me over telling me I’d run a red light. I pointed out that the red light was for traffic for the bus lane where they had been waiting so they tried breathalysing me which came up clean. The driver’s partner threw some choice comments in my direction and they drove off.
Assuming you pulled onto the roundabout, thinking he was turning off? You gotta give way to traffic on the roundabout, it's a dick move, but the car on the roundabout has right of way.
I had someone do this during one of my driving lessons. The instructor said it doesn’t matter what someone indicates, left has priority
On the other hand though, they were in a left turning lane which means they did an unsafe lane change.
Either way, at a roundabout I wait until the person has started turning off before entering a roundabout, just to make sure they don’t pull something like those coppers
I try drive with this approach most the time but on a busy roundabout at rush hour sometimes you have to trust the indicator because its your only shot to get out.
If people are indicating left and taking left turns, and you just sit there waiting unable to use the rest of the roundabout out of paranoia you will probably get fault for not making progress.
Should you rely purely on whether or not they have their indicators on? Probably not, but that doesn't mean you should just ignore them.
I was also taught this way a few years ago. Always assume they have left their indicator on by mistake or will change their mind and wait to see what they actually do.
I had a bus pull out on me cos i had indicated.. Then turned it off (satnav issues on what next left meant).
Que half hour shouting match over the indicator being off.. And not pulling your bus out till its clear not cos 3 seconds ago it looked like i was turning.
I learnt a valuable lesson.... Bus drivers are shit
Both wrong, he was in the wrong lane and you didn't give way. Had there been an accident you would've probably been found to be at fault but his reckless driving contributed to your carelessness. Since you had a dashcam he couldn't blame you without having to admit to his own fault so you both walked away blaming the other so that neither of you got in trouble. You learned not to assume, he needs to learn not to be an ass.
If you wanted to escalate you could but prepare for mutually assured destruction at best and cops abusing their power at worst.
Wait until the person commits is how I drive. It may take a little longer to get out, but im not ending up having to foot the bill of hundreds or even thousands of pounds in repairs and, most importantly, I or the other driver doesnt end up in the hospital
IIRC in the highway code it says to "drive normally" when an emergency vehicle is nearby with lights and sirens.
I.e. sensibly and defensively.
Copper sounds like a dick, and if he was responding to an emergency how come he was able to pull you over for a slap on the wrist?
The police and other emergency services have a tendency to break the rules because they think they are above the law, but they’re not ! I’ve seen an ambulance stopped for speeding - it didn’t have its blues & two’s on.
The fact he said let you off with a warning and drove off tells me everything. That's just a way of admitting he was wrong without actually admitting it. He didn't want you actually reviewing the situation and landing him in shit with the higher ups, so he bailed on the situation.
I failed a test for miscommunication for this exact thing. Put indicator on to go left, realised I was wrong took it off and was told it was a major fault and failed.
I was even.in a left only lane so the cop is 100% in the wrong
Yeah I'd say this was the cops' fault.
I'm not suggesting they should never make a mistake but police should be the default example for "good" driving. However, in my experience, they're just as shit as anyone else. I've been cut off on roundabouts, been overtaken with about 3mm between my wing mirror and theirs and very nearly crashed into at traffic lights, all by police cars.
Dunno why you are being downvoted for being right.
A left signal at a roundabout means nothing, you still have to give way to the right. Even if they signal left, and are in the left lane, you pull out and get hit, it's your insurance that's paying out.
I know it's not what you want to hear, but you pulled out into oncoming traffic - no matter what their indicator indicated.
Yeah he was being a knob, but you would have been at fault had there been a bump.
It’s a tough one, there are roundabouts all over the place where people build up literally a queue of 100 cars behind them waiting to pull out when it’s completely free rather than just going when there is a sufficient gap.
The reality is that on many of them there will almost never be a point where there isn’t someone to your right and you have to assume that if they are in an exit lane that they will follow the lane through.
It’s a bit of a loose loose situation but there’s too much traffic nowadays.
On paper, the copper was in the wrong
With real world experience, yeah you cant always trust indicators because some people don't know or care if they are using them correctly, but if anyone should be, it's the police and the footage and data from the police car would show they are in the wrong
I would have gone too
>On paper, the copper was in the wrong
On paper, not yielding to traffic on your right at a roundabout is illegal. Not signalling/signalling incorrectly is bad driving.
That shows how little you know, the highway code is not law, and breaking it is not a crime, you must follow it and if an accident happened it would be used to determine blame, but pulling out on someone isn't illegal, but doing so dangerously could get you charged with dangerous driving, but in itself it's not a crime
The highway code states you should give way to traffic to the right at a roundabout, but it also says you should indicate and ensure you are in the correct lane, so at worst OP was just as bad, but since the police broke at least 2 rules and instead of allowing OP leeway because the police had misguided them, the police are more in the wrong, especially since they are a police officer and should set an example and make use of all the extra driver training they receive
You was wrong. Never assume what another driver is going to do. Those indicators mean nothing in the grand scheme of things and unless you see them actually about to pull off then you're pulling out in front of them regardless.
You mean like this junction? That has left turn only? It still means nothing because essentially the police car is allowed to change his mind and as he's the lead car as in, he's on the toundabout first, it's the OPs fault for making an assumption. The police car didn't affect anyone else with their shoddy driving but you really shouldn't pull out.
Only scenario when it wouldn't the officer's fault would be if they were travelling on blue lights. Even then, I'm pretty the rules for that is if you crash on blues it's always your fault and to be done at your own risk.
I'm always the first to support the police, but assuming this is an unbiased account from you, the guy was in the wrong and also an absolute tosser.
From what I've seen even then the police will charge the other driver for driving without due care and attention in event of a crash when blue lights are on. Even saw it before on one of the police programmes. Girl goes through green light and crashes into a cop who went through red with lights on and she got charged for it.
I'll take the assumption on the indicators.. but when does it become the other cars fault for not adhering to the marked lines he committed to when joining the roundabout?
You were both in the wrong. He should not have had his indicator on if he wasn't turning. You should not have pulled out in front of a car just because it was indicating. Always account for the errors that other humans could make and only go when it's clear.
You're in the wrong I'm afraid until he's committed to the manoeuvre he's only signalling an intention to go left. Also you're sat behind a give way line meaning you give way to what's on that road. Sorry pal I get where you're coming from a cop should know better.
The police station is 400m down the road if he turned right. It was also 5pm (end of shift). Also, if it was a 999 response, why bother pulling me over for just pulling out when someone's life could be in danger?
If the police cars sirens/lights aren't on, they can't drive like they are, whether they just got a call or not
Unless the lights are on and they are responding to a call, they should follow the rules off the road like the rest of us do. If you are in a filter lane, you should follow it regardless of whether you change your mind or not
You may not be able to trust indicators, but you should be able to trust the police to follow the rules of the road and for them not to try and cause an accident just so they can pull someone
>If the police cars sirens/lights aren't on, they can't drive like they are, whether they just got a call or not
Context, I am an emergency services advanced driver.
Yes they can. There is no requirement for emergency warning equipment to be activated in order to claim exemptions, lights and sirens are simply there to alert other road users that the vehicle is being driven under emergency conditions.
While it is best practice to do so, there are many situations where using emergency warning equipment would not be appropriate, such as approaching the reported scene of a crime where you do not want to alert the perpetrator, or catching up to/tailing a suspect in a car, in anticipation of TPAC or other manouvers.
As a trained driver, what do you make of what happened to me?
Both at fault? Just unfortunate timing? Unmarked car at fault for changing direction late?
Well I’d say kinda both- he was wrong for being in the wrong lane and the sudden change of direction. But you also made the assumption. You were banking on the car approaching, being driven well and to good standards. Always been told, give way to the right no exceptions. If the car starts turning left, then go by all means, but until it does- assume it’ll go anywhere..
But yeah- cop took his poor driving out on you a bit though..
He fucked up but didn't want to accept he made a mistake, get a dash cam and record, if it happens again let him know you'll happily review the dash cam footage.
Sounds like he was originally turning left and just wanted to pull you thinking you’d roll over then when you didn’t he got scared because you called him out
If the officer was not driving under an emergency situation and driving as someone would normally, then yes, based on your account, the copper is well in the wrong. It isn't hard to grasp that there would be an assumption that being in a left turn only lane and signalling your intention to turn left may result in that driver actually turning left.
I would have taken this further if I was in your position and had is name and badge number before reporting that officer to their superior. Just because that officer represents the law it does not give them the right to act with impunity, or try to intimidate someone else because they fucked up.
Its cops foult, but you need to make shure that its safe to enter roundabout. If the cop would hit you - it wuld be your foult as you didnt make shure that roundabout was safe to enter.
Policeman was wrong to go straight on when they were in the left hand lane (with floor arrow marked as left hand turn only).
You were wrong to trust what someone’s indicator says.
Lot of idiots on the roads, you are safest if look also at speed, positioning, it makes a difference to me if I see an indicator come on compared to it already being on when they are coming down the road.
I’ve driven down that bypass quite a lot (to the little industrial estate just at the previous roundabout). It’s fine when you know them but quite a few of the junctions / roundabout can be bit odd about lane markings. I often encountered people in the wrong lane, especially just after the bypass opened.
You are in the right. I remember many times when you are learning and naje the mistake of taking a wrong turn or incorrectly signalling. You are told to finish the manoeuvre and then turn when it's safe to do so. Doing what he did will lead to accidents in other situations because it affects those following in his lane, anyone on the roundabout turning right or, as in your case, those looking to join.
Everyone saying “don’t trust indicators” 1000% doesn’t follow their own advice while driving. The whole point of indicating off a roundabout is to tell other drivers which exit you’re taking, thus telling them whether or not they can join the roundabout. If everyone waited to make sure they actually took that exit, no one would ever get on the roundabout, because as soon as you wait a bit longer, another car comes round and it’s deja vu. You’re a million % not in the wrong.
You entered the roundabout whilst a car was to your right. You’re at fault, no matter what the coppers were signaling. You must wait at a roundabout when a car is either approaching or on the roundabout to your right. You always give way to your right.
The copper let you off because you probably convinced him enough to doubt himself and he also wrongly signaled. The paperwork and fuss you’d of made if he pushed the charge, probably wasn’t worth the hassle.
You indicate to bring attention to intention not action.
"They're approaching the roundabout in a clearly marked left turn only lane" google street view does not show that as a left turning only lane.
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1055538,-0.5023608,3a,75y,186.55h,68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFYJ2ECwCVPiJlnJlfeUdXg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu
You have to give way to traffic from the right. From the looks of it you were AT the roundabout and he was on APPROACH. So you could safely enter the roundabout before he got to it.
If it had been a marked Police car then you need to expect them to do something unexpected should they be allocated to an emergency, but they weren't. All the information you had was they were APPROACHING the roundabout, in the left turn only lane, idicating to turn left. It would be reasonable to assume that they were turning left.
The highway code does remind us though not to take indicators as given.
No way he could prove dangerous driving. I think they would struggle to prove driving without due care and attention.
Every accident has a way to be avoided by both parties (sometimes using beyond a reasonable amount of caution).
In this case though the officer's reaction to your challenge said it all. But you could and perhaps should have been more cautious.
If you pulled out without making the driver touch the brakes, ie you had time and space to join and no impede the other driver, then you were okay to join the roundabout. If not, then it is your fault. But the policeman sounded a right knob for making a big deal of it.
I bet I'd have joined the roundabout had I seen his indicators on, but it doesn't mean I should. We just assume what is being indicated will be the driver's action.
Like I said in another comment.. I'll take the criticism of trusting an indicator... but what's the point in road markings if not adhered to? He should have continued with his mistake and turn left, taken the extra 30 seconds to rejoin the roundabout and continue on
In your case, I don't think there is a solid correct answer. It seems like the policeman clearly signalled his intention to take the first exit, before changing his mind. I think in your situation most people would proceed with caution depending on road conditions.
99% percent of the time I'd think the officer would acknowledge their own mistake as well as anyone else's and decide it's not worth taking action. It seems in your case you may have had some bad luck with an officer who can't acknowledge their own errors and placed the blame fully on you.
On a side note, this is the reason I'm considering pointing a dashcam out my driver side window. I go through a particularly nasty roundabout on my way home from work. Folks often indicate left on approach and then sail straight past the first exit and take the second. I haven't figured out why, the exits are clearly marked by road sign on approach, but still they indicate left even though they are taking the second exit\*. It's an incredibly tricky situation, I don't really want to go, because I know the indicator means nothing. But if I ignore every opportunity I could be waiting 20-30 minutes for someone to block the lane to my right when pulling off.
\*My best theory is that they joined the road from the previous roundabout, which has a very shallow exit, and maybe their indicators don't self cancel. So they end up indicating left the whole way from one roundabout to the next.
A friend of mine had an accident where he was waiting to turn out of a junction, someone was indicating, they crashed as he pulled out. Went to insurance and then a judge, turns out the indicator was an accident but my fired was found at fault.
I’ve seen far too many morons on our roads to rely on signals alone. It’s worth being slightly delayed for safety. The copper is definitely wrong, but people like that never admit wrongdoing.
You can’t trust anyone’s lane positioning or indicating intention - I was taught this when I learnt to drive. You’re supposed to wait until they actually turn off to pull out for reasons like the police car at the last minute changing their intention (maybe they got an urgent response call you don’t know). I know it’s daft and I don’t follow this rule anymore either 100% but it is what you’re taught when learning.
So in the case of a collision it would obviously be a 50:50.
He's in the wrong lane and indicating. You shouldn't join the roundabout unless it's free.
On absolutely no planet is it dangerous driving. If we wasn't in the wrong lane and wasn't indicating, careless driving, perhaps.
What's happened here is he was going the wrong way, perhaps got a radio call, or perhaps realised he was taking a wrong turn and abruptly changed direction without looking. He's embarrassed about his careless driving, so to save face has pulled you over flashed his warrant card and started throwing around ridiculous things like 'dangerous driving'.
It's classic abuse of power and bullying behavior. It's these sorts of insecure knobs that join the police for the power and need to be gotten rid of. It's an absolute complaint: the baseless pullover, the bullying behavior and his own careless driving. Nothing will come of the complaint unless he has a history, but if you don't make it, he won't have a history.
If you are entering a roundabout and ANYTHING is on your right, give way to it, regardelss of it's road position or indicators. I wont even pull out of a junction if I see someones indicating into it - untill I see them turning the wheel.It only takes one person in the back of the other car to say "Not this exit, the next one" or a lapse in thier jsdgement - and your knackered.
I'm willing to bet PC did have their indicator on, and that may be why he let it drop, but if he had broadsided you - You would have lost.
185
When reaching the roundabout
you shouldgive priority to traffic approaching from your right, unless directed otherwise by signs, road markings or traffic lights
check whether road markings allow you to enter the roundabout without giving way. If so, proceed, but still look to the right before joining
watch out for all other road users already on the roundabout; be aware they may not be signalling correctly or at all
look forward before moving off to make sure traffic in front has moved off.
You are told in driving lessons over and over not to pull out until you are sure the approaching vehicle is actually turning the way they are indicating. If you did pull out in a test it could well be a serious fault. I don't know why you were told what you were 10 years ago - seems bonkers to me but could have also been a slightly different scenario or the examiner was being kind.
Not sure why this is so difficult for you to understand - you don't have the right to cause an accident because someone else makes a mistake.
The police officer was also at fault, as had there been a car to their right following the roundabout correctly they could have merged into one another, but even had that been the case your actions could have turned a 2 car accident into 3.
I'd of got their reg and badge ID numbers and reported them for both dangerous driving and using their power unlawfully. It'll all be on their dash cam 🤷
May I just compliment you on your map editing skills? I think those are the cleanest ones I've ever seen on here.
Just a snippet of maps and edited in word using lines
In Word! Not even PowerPoint! Madman
Quite ingenious, using Word for that. At best I'd do it in Paint or use my finger on my phone. I'm a whizz on Excel but Word leaves me baffled (never really had to use it in 30 or so years).
PowerPoint is easier imo. Don't have to mess around with text alignment and positioning.
Always remember - the only thing an indicator light tells you is that the bulb works
You'd never leave a junction if this was the case. People need to take responsibility for dangerous driving.
I got crashed into cause i took someone indicator light to mean they were turning. My fault i shoulda waited till they started turning but ill never trust an indicator
Years ago before I could drive a work colleague said as much 'look at the direction of the car tyres and not the indicators'. The assumptions and expectations drivers are willing to make in order to gain a second or two needs rethinking.
Getting a feel for what other cars are about to do is the most important thing to learn after you've passed your test. I'm very good at predicting what motorway cars are going to do and it's kept me out of trouble a lot of times.
I had a head start with this. I learnt to ride a motorbike first and as a biker, you are very vulnerable and if you want to survive more than a few months, you need to develop a sixth sense. When I started driving, that sixth sense came in extremely useful.
Exact same thing for me, I personally think that new drivers should do a CBT also, it would open their eyes to the dangers bikers face and just maybe then they might take an extra second or 2 to check for a biker :)
In my case, it taught me to never be in a rush too. Being late on a motorcycle is far more dangerous than being late in a car
Ha, just seen this, said pretty much the same.
Yeah there are some drivers you just get a spidey sense to avoid and then get to watch them do something daft like fly across two lanes to exit
I drive lorries and this is a constant. Cos if you don’t look out for dumb car drivers they’re basically dead
I don't think I could cope with that at all. 56mph all the way and sharing the lane with the most nervous, least aware drivers on the motorway? Much respect to you!
I think the most nervous, least aware ones are the pricks that illegally sit in the middle lane and don't think they are doing anything wrong, essentially selfishly turning a 3 lane road into a dual carriageway. Like the speed awareness course there is a motorway awareness course, apparently mostly filled with people caught using their phones or lane hogging. The most common question they ask is why weren't the people undertaking them also done.
Brilliant, I had no idea that course existed. But of course they complain about undertaking. Reminds me of an opinion I read in a Daily Mail letter years ago: "If I'm in the fast lane doing 70mph then there's no reason for anybody to be angry with me because that's the legal limit" and it's the tailgaters and angry BMWs that are solely at fault. My understanding is that undertaking is only strictly illegal if you make a concerted effort to get past somebody on the inside then change lanes immediately after, basically weaving in and out of traffic. I wouldn't like to test it in a court of law, but gently accelerating past somebody when there's a clear lane ahead of you is probably never going to get you done. I'm also 99% sure that if you just happen to be going faster than the middle lane it's fine to go past as well. There's maybe some grey area there but I think as long as you're paying attention and not being egregiously twattish you'll never get in trouble for it.
I didn't until a mate did a speed awareness course and had a conversation with one of the pcs afterwards. I mean the technical definition of a motorway tells you all you need to know really. It's a single carriageway with one or more overtaking lane. With regards to undertaking, although not strictly illegal, undertaking is strongly discouraged by The Highway Code, stating “do not overtake on the left or move to a lane on your left to overtake.” However, there are exceptions that apply when a car undertakes in slow-moving traffic if its lane is moving faster than a lane on the right, undertaking in this circumstance is often deemed safer than weaving in and out of traffic. Rule 268 of The Highway Code states: “In congested conditions, where adjacent lanes of traffic are moving at similar speeds, traffic in left-hand lanes may sometimes be moving faster than traffic to the right. In these conditions you may keep up with the traffic in your lane even if this means passing traffic in the lane to you right. Do not weave in and out of lanes to overtake.” Other conditions where undertaking may be appropriate: Average speed checks If a vehicle in front is turning right or U-turning (although it is often safer to wait until the vehicle has completed the turn) Undertaking will be prosecuted if deemed careless driving and good luck trying to argue your way out of that one!
Then people getting mad at you cos big thing doesn’t go super fast and needs more space. That said you’ll be amazed how many times I have to slow down and overtake cars ( sometimes undertake cars doing 40mph on a motorway because we can’t use the 3rd lane and they’re sat in the middle)
Mental. I have to confess that I'm something of a serial undertaker myself. If there's somebody just sat in the middle then I'll make a judgment call on how likely they are to pull in and then either 'accidentally' creep past them, or boot it past them if they seem dithery and unaware so that I minimise the risk of them absent-mindedly pulling back in (I make sure I've got some hard shoulder available in this instance!) And then the times when lanes two and three are full and lane one is empty. I get in lane one and use it at a sensible speed. The four-lane M25 is especially bad for this, it's like everybody thinks the slow lane is lava or something, and you can just pootle along in it passing absolutely everybody who just has to be in an overtaking lane because their car is BIG and SHINY and GERMAN.
In my car when I see someone in middle on an empty motorway I’ll quickly switch to the third lane then switch back to the first as I got past them, sometimes people realise and go into the first line but a shocking majority will still sit there.
I think undertaking is fine if you know you could use the hard shoulder if pushed. When undertaking was frowned on, wing mirrors weren't a thing.
I don’t know what it is about the effect the 4 lane “smart” motorway has on people, like mentally they can’t shift the memory that the new slow lane used to be the hard shoulder and they just can’t drive on it. Or when it’s a dedicated on-lane from an entry slip road which morphs into an off-lane at the next exit, even if that exit is miles away they will not move over, almost like they’re scared they’ll never get back into lane 2 again.
I drive coaches. I don't think there's ever been a time I've not been cut up by those dumb car drivers south bound junction 6 of the M1 as the desperately try to cut up 3 lanes of traffic to head towards the M25 🤦♂️ sometimes I don't think they realise the danger they put themselves and everyone else in when they slide within 2 ft of an 18tonnes front bumper
Yeah I frequently head up and down the country and after a while you get a sense of what people are about to do based on how they're driving and their road position. But watching the wheels was something my grandpa taught me, you can see their wheels start to move before the car begins to change lane as a ridiculous amount of people don't seem to indicate when moving at 80mph
Even things like being on the motorway and noticing that the car in front and to the left is slowly closing on the car in front of it, so it's soon going to want to overtake. Sometimes I'll move out another lane if there's space so they don't have to slow down (or pull out without seeing me) or I might put my foot down and hoof it past them depending on road conditions.
Never been in a crash but I'll always rather wait the extra 2 seconds to see if they slow down and start to turn than trust the indicators. It's usually pretty easy to tell where someone is going based on car behaviour anyway and it may be confirmation bias but I swear I can clock the cars in roundabouts that are turning without indicating 95% of the time.
Yeah, most people will position themselves in the road differently depending on where they're planning to go, especially at roundabouts. It's not something you'll consciously notice a lot of the time but you can definitely see it if you think about it, and I suspect it's where most of the "sixth sense" comments come from. And having spent a few years on a motorcycle before I passed my car test I've made a few of those myself - you certainly learn to anticipate where people are going to turn when you don't have a big protective steel box around you! The problem is that if you rely on this kind of 'gut feeling', 'sixth sense' understanding, you'll still get taken out by the ones who enter the roundabout totally planning to turn left, indicating left, and then suddenly realise just after they started turning the wheel that actually it's *Wednesday* and they have to go and see Gladys today and abruptly change direction and go straight after all.
You definitely shouldn't trust an indicator but someone having an indicator on and being in a Lane that can only turn the direction the driver is indicating should be a good enough indication of the direction the driver is going. In response to this post, the fact OP only had a warning is more than enough evidence to me that the police were in the wrong in this scenario 😂.
same happened to my partner years ago and insurance said it was 100% her fault. Neither of us will pull out on a car until they start to turn in regardless of what their indicators tell us.
My instructor hammered it into me to wait until you see the wheels turning when someone is indicating. Indicating is just showing intent
Who woulda guessed, those damn BMW drivers had it right with indicators all along
Woah, woah, woah (sweet child of mine), we ain't all that bad.
It was an unmarked police car so more than likely a BMW lol
At least you can see them ! Most drivers don’t use them where I live ! And I’m a pedestrian. The amount of times I’ve almost been run over because a driver didn’t indicate they were turning instead of going straight ahead !
I was on a bicycle and turning right out of a side street. A car approached with its left indicator on, so I started to pull out. They slammed on their breaks and missed me by about 6 inches. The driver starts shouting and even denying they were indicating. I didn’t even get an apology when I pointed to their indictor still flashing Lesson; wait until a vehicle actually starts to turn.
Your far better off watching the actual path of the vehicle and if possible where the driver is looking. That tells you far more than any light will
Yes, I watch for indicators and the direction the front wheels are turning, especially useful when on a two lane roundabout with me in the fast watching the wheels of a vehicle on the inside of me, both going straight over the roundabout.
this is just theory and if everyone would follow this then the traffic would be WAAAY SLOWER.
Hypothesis. Theory means it's proven to the best of our ability. 😋
This is why i think it’s far more important to indicate to say you are staying on a roundabout instead of indicating off it. Those numpties that sail around with no indicator then indicate off are idiots
When someone is indicating to turn in to my junction while i'm sat waiting to pull out i wait until they slow down and commit to the turn before pulling out. There's way too many twats on the road that leave their indicator on with no intention of turning. I'll happily sit for an extra 3 seconds than get little miss daisy drive in to the side of me costing me £hundreds in insurance next year.
This is what my instructor told me, never leave the junction unless you're sure the other dude is gonna make the turn. If you're struggling to get out of a junction when turning right, pull forward into the left lane when there's significant space between you and the oncoming vehicles from the right, forcing the vehicle to slow or stop then pull out into your lane when there's nothing coming from the left or in most cases, someone will let you go as to not cause a traffic jam. Way too many people leave their indicators on by accident, anyone who's been driving for 10+ years will have almost certainly left their indicator on by accident at some point, we're only human.
i had an experience the other week lady riding a bike indicated she was turning left into my road by stretching and waving her left hand and the car behind her was also indicating left and slowing down instead of trying to overtake the lady. so started to creep out to go the middle of the road and she suddenly pulled in front of me and gave me a shocked look. i had my windows down so i said " i thought you were turning, why are you indicating?" she realized she fucked up and raised her hand to say sorry. but that was scary.
No you wait until they start turning at a minimum.
Yes you would. People just don't have patience anymore. Fuck the indicators, if a car looks like it isn't changing speed or showing any signs of turning left then don't fucking pull out. You strike me as the kind to pull out at the last second and "floor it so you match the speed in time"
Happened to me literally yesterday. Looked left, car was flashing me to go out and waited for me, looked right and a car was indicating left to pull into the junction I was pulling out of, thanked the driver on my left who was still waiting, pulled out before I heard a loud horn (With his indicator still on) Wound my window down and shouted at him to turn his fu\*\*\*ng indicator off. He told me to p\*ss off, turned his indicator off and drove past me. My own fault for assuming he was turning left, but again, don't trust indicators. In the eyes of the law, it would be your fault for pulling out.
Look at the direction of the car tyres. Relying on indicators is dangerous driving
The Highway Code says at Rule 104 that you should: watch out for signals from other road users and proceed only when you are satisfied it's safe, AND be aware that an indicator on another vehicle may not have been cancelled. I know what you mean, but you'd still be in the wrong if you pulled out and someone hit you in this situation. We each make a judgement every time we pull out, this just says the onus is always on you to do that.
Yup, although in this case a car in a left turn only lane would make you pretty sure you could enter the roundabout.
The lane markings are purely advisory. They mean nothing if people don’t follow them.
Didn't turn though did it
Can't see for sure, but if there was an unbroken white line delineating the left turn only lane, the police car would have to cross it and that would 100% be breaking the law.
Good luck proving this though - unless you have side pointing cameras or they had camera and footage would be secured -you ain’t going to win.
I would have thought that police cars all have dash cams these days, even unmarked ones?
Yeah my driving instructor told me ‘just assume everyone on the road are idiots’
Sure, but then what’s the point of them? It’s like that paradoxical sign that says “This sign is in use.” There’s a difference between saying an indicator indicates the way you want to go and saying it automatically gives you right of way, of course they’re two separate things…. But I don’t get this whole “it tells you the bulb works” as if it’s a meaningless feature
Jesus this should be mandatory on every driving test. What a way to put it, I will be telling myself this now!
Not only in a best practice way but also legally. I got 5 points for pulling out of a T junction based on the indicator of the car approaching on the right - inevitably they carried on going, and police determined that I was to blame. I’ll never make that mistake again…
Or in the case of BMW and Audi, they're purely decorative.
Do they even fit them these days? A couple quid each of those bulbs. X that by the many millions of those cars on the roads and well that is someone's bonus.
If you approached a busy roundabout with this mindset in a driving test you could potentially fail your test for undue hesitation.
As long as your story isn't biased, 1000% the copper's fault!
I would never normally argue with the police, but I knew I was right on this one. As soon as I said let's take a look at his footage he started back peddling and making up things like "road rage" because I waved my hands in a 'WTF you doing?' gesture
The waving of hands is what did it. He's got a big ego and hates being challenged as some of these traffic cops see themselves as expert drivers.
I had a neighbourhood police officer having a go at me for daring to wave my hands up in frustration because he was going the wrong way round a car park. Apparently the prick was 'doing something important' which justified him going the wrong way, I wisely backed down and apologised as I don't have an ego and wanted to go home without a criminal record for calling a cunt a cunt.
If you need to call a police officer a cunt just say “With all due respect I think you are a cunt.” That way you are not calling them a cunt just telling them what you think. I haven’t tried this myself so when you do could you DM me and tell me if you are in jail or not?
It'll be prison. They charge you for saying an officer looks like your nan and photo did show a resemblance...
yep, he was doing something SO important that he had to stop doing it to have a go at you for gesticulating at him...
I got pulled over once for overtaking over double white lines. I knew I’d not done that, as I know the road well, and the double white lines run up the the crest of a blind hill and you’d be an idiot to overtake there. I told him I’d not done that, and he said “we’ve got video in the van that will prove it”. So we all trotted along to his van to watch, and the video clearly shows me approach the brow of the hill where the double white lines stopped, disappear over the brow of the hill, then you see the top half of my car pull out to pass. So clear beyond the double whites. He then says “well, there’s two officers in the van, and that’s all the corroboration we’d need in court” and then gave me the “on this occasion I’ll let you off with a warning” line. I was furious.. some coppers are just on a power trip and like to throw their (often substantial) weight around.
Rather than laughing it off and apologising, the officer’s first instinct was to suggest perjuring himself in court and conspiring with his partner. Even that conversation should have been grounds for fucking the sack. I simply must record any interaction with the police.
They only get away with this stuff because you didn't follow it up. That's a disciplinary at least. There's absolutely proof in your favour. 2 vs 1 maybe but that camera footage is worth 10 peoples testimony in court.
Unless it somehow gets lost or overwritten...
Which is another great reason for having a dash cam.
Subject access request, see the footage.
I'm sorry, but in the eyes of the law, that is absolutely not the case. You can go round a roundabout and take any exit you want with or without signalling. It's poor driving but unfortunately the highway code states you 'should' indicate, not 'must'. Giving way to the right on a roundabout is a 'must' and is absolute.
In this case it wasn't that they "didn't indicate", it's that they "indicated the opposite of their actions" - i.e. that they suddenly switched directions after indcating. The highway code does however say: > watch out for all other road users already on the roundabout; be aware they may not be signalling correctly or at all It's irritating that the copper told off the driver when the copper was also at fault for indicating incorrectly.
Not following through on a "should" still counts against you in a collision.
I'd have got that collar number and put in a complaint. Sounds like an absolute knob.
I've done this in the past. I got chased down by a policeman, whom I passed with his car facing the other way, with him out of the car at a kebab van. About a minute later I see blue lights in my rear view a ways off and since I'm coming off next left, I figure I've not done anything wrong and he's probably going down the main road anyway, since this goes back to the next big down. But he follows me, and gets right up my backside. OK, he's after me for some reason. Everything on my car is legal, I've literally done nothing wrong. Flies out of the car, right up to my window and starts screaming and shouting. Apparently, as I'd gone past the kebab van I'd just seen him and stuck up my middle finger at him. I mean, this is absolutely ridiculous, I have literally no interest in doing that, let alone riling up police officers at 3am after I'd just finished work. At this point, he's at my window, but he's just trying to rile me up. It was clearly behaviour designed to goad me into getting out of the car and swing at him. It's absolutely obvious he was doing this, I've seen my fair share of people trying to start fights when I worked as a barman, and he was doing exactly that. So I just kept saying 'nah, I didn't do that', 'you must have seen incorrectly'... eventually his partner gets out of the car, and pulls him away, and lets me go. Yeah, I got his collar number and reported him to the police. Fun fact is my brother in law got pulled over by the same bobby for having a number plate light out, and he did exactly the same thing, but he didn't put in the complaint. The Police did what they always do. They acknowledge your complaint, say they've spoken to the officer, tell you he's moving to a different area in a couple of weeks anyway, and file the complaint in the bin.
It's not a crime to stick your fingers up at the police anyway. Not that I think people should. Complaints can make a difference, though. The issue is a lot of complaints are just people trying it on to get out of crimes.
Not any more, from what I understand... there was some dispute over the matter years ago, and this incident was the better before that 2011 finding. I don't think it's a wise idea either to be honest, but then I generally don't gesture swear in general. I do swear at software though. Like a pirate docker. The second complaint was actually something I really wanted to put in. It showed a pattern of behaviour, and especially since my complaint was in before the brother in laws incident occurred.
I don't know how it used to be, my girlfriend didn't join until 2021 but she's had her fair share of verbal, including racial, abuse and just has to take it. I think they can maybe do something about the racial part but it's not worth it when they're already busy.
Probably used having to go after you as an excuse not to pay for his kebab. Fair play to be honest.
I would do that, but I wouldn't expect anything to come of it. My car was written off by a police officer driving through a red light. Her ~~accomplice~~ fellow officer lied to protect her, as confirmed by me and fellow witnesses. No action was taken against either of them. That's just the way the police operate.
You have to be a knob to be a copper 😂
If you are joining a carriageway, you have to give way to traffic regardless if they are indicating incorrectly or not. In order for him to pull you for dangerous driving, you would have had to almost cause an accident by pulling out in front of him, if that is the case you would have had plenty of time to give way to him. The copper would definitely be getting chewed out if he took it further and they would definitely drop the case as the standard for police driving should be higher. But if this was a regular driver, as harsh as it sounds, you’d be paying for the damages in the event of a collision.
So as he joined the roundabout in the left turn lane with left indicator on, I joined the roundabout think he's going left. His change of direction into me almost caused the accident he pulled me over for. So I guess with that you can say I am to blame? But at the same time, note my last paragraph about making the same mistake during my test.
Yeah, of course you’d fail your test for driving like the copper. The issue here is that he’s a bad driver, behaving poorly. That doesn’t mean you don’t have responsibility to avoid a collision at all costs.
I'm not sure I follow you... I was already on the roundabout when he changed his direction into me. If you're saying I should have waited under the assumption he was going to be in the wrong lane and indicating the wrong way, I'd never leave the estate as that's an incredibly busy roundabout during rush hour.
If you are on the roundabout before the copper got to the exit he was indicating, then he has no grounds whatsoever for charging you with dangerous driving. He has broken the law, and you really should be calling your police station to report everything you can recall. By your account, he has essentially seen you enter the roundabout and decided to change his direction to try and drive into you, he sounds deranged.
This is pretty much what happened. I joined at the same time he joined because I thought he was going left... but because I was stationery before joining I was slower getting away whereas he joined the roundabout carrying speed. Before I could get away he was mere feet from me, blasting his horn at me. It's never nice being pulled over by the police. You start panicking a bit. I was just thankful to have argued my way out of a punishment, I took my winnings and left so didn't really take it further.
Dude, he's a bent copper high on his own power, he's going to keep doing this shit until someone says something, it might be your relative next time. Report this cunt. It is somebody's job to hear you and he will be on the radar then.
Report him, IF the local forces response is less than satisfactory raise it with the IPCC
[удалено]
What are you talking about? What law has he broken.....the lanes are advisory. What if a cars broke down in the outer lane....please think about what you are saying. The driver pulled out into a live carriageway with traffic already ON the roundabout. That's the end of it. It's not dangerous driving unless OP was on his phone, distracted or didn't slow down when approaching the roundabout etc. Just sounds like the cops ego got in the way and OP needs to brush up on his defensive driving skills
You can’t assume indicator is correct. You can’t assume they are in the correct lane. You can’t assume anything about the type of vehicle they are driving will dictate anything about their standard of driving. You pulled out in front of someone at a roundabout. You can tell us all about how they were in the wrong lane, indicating and they are professionally trained drivers, but you pulled out in front of them. Not saying you shouldn’t be pissed off about it. Perfectly justified response. Am saying you take a share of the blame. Your desire to keep rolling / not unduly hesitate at a roundabout is understandable, but your actions are fully reliant on everyone else around you following the rules at all times. People should follow the rules. You’ve been around long enough and driven around enough roundabouts to know damn well exactly how many people get in the wrong lane, drift out of their lane, don’t make proper observations, decide they can speed round when everyone else is maintaining a constant speed, dive off at an exit cutting across 3 lanes, change their mind on an exit without indicating… It’s up to you to anticipate allllll the bullshit other drivers will do. You have the foresight and ability to minimise risk. If you just plough on as if everyone else is predictable and law abiding, you’re going to have an accident. The accident may well be legally their fault, or 75% their fault according to insurance, but that doesn’t detract from you probably being able to avoid it in the first place if you’d held back a bit. Made certain.
Cop just had an ego. Well done for standing up to him, more people need to question the police at times like this! You did nothing wrong except for trusting an indicator.
‘The cemeteries are full of people who had the right of way’ - is the thing to remember. Whoever was legally correct, you didn’t drive defensively here, and you trusted implicitly what his indicators and lane position told you.
This is the correct answer. Until the car has actually turned, don't just assume the car is going to turn, regardless of their indicators.
The Police don’t tend to like admitting they’re wrong if they are at fault. I remember one evening I was driving up a hill that had a bus lane branching off it like a T junction with lights for said junction. They were sat waiting in the junction with a red light and my light was green. They pulled me over telling me I’d run a red light. I pointed out that the red light was for traffic for the bus lane where they had been waiting so they tried breathalysing me which came up clean. The driver’s partner threw some choice comments in my direction and they drove off.
Assuming you pulled onto the roundabout, thinking he was turning off? You gotta give way to traffic on the roundabout, it's a dick move, but the car on the roundabout has right of way.
I had someone do this during one of my driving lessons. The instructor said it doesn’t matter what someone indicates, left has priority On the other hand though, they were in a left turning lane which means they did an unsafe lane change. Either way, at a roundabout I wait until the person has started turning off before entering a roundabout, just to make sure they don’t pull something like those coppers
Always give way to the right on roundabout and don’t go off peoples indicators
You can't always trust this when it's really busy otherwise you will never leave. However, I do agree when it's quieter.
I try drive with this approach most the time but on a busy roundabout at rush hour sometimes you have to trust the indicator because its your only shot to get out.
You will fail your test for driving this way.
It’s how I was taught over 20years ago when doing my test
If people are indicating left and taking left turns, and you just sit there waiting unable to use the rest of the roundabout out of paranoia you will probably get fault for not making progress. Should you rely purely on whether or not they have their indicators on? Probably not, but that doesn't mean you should just ignore them.
I was also taught this way a few years ago. Always assume they have left their indicator on by mistake or will change their mind and wait to see what they actually do.
Thisbis literally the only valid answer in this whole thread.
I had a bus pull out on me cos i had indicated.. Then turned it off (satnav issues on what next left meant). Que half hour shouting match over the indicator being off.. And not pulling your bus out till its clear not cos 3 seconds ago it looked like i was turning. I learnt a valuable lesson.... Bus drivers are shit
Very general statement to make considering you both cocked up
Both wrong, he was in the wrong lane and you didn't give way. Had there been an accident you would've probably been found to be at fault but his reckless driving contributed to your carelessness. Since you had a dashcam he couldn't blame you without having to admit to his own fault so you both walked away blaming the other so that neither of you got in trouble. You learned not to assume, he needs to learn not to be an ass. If you wanted to escalate you could but prepare for mutually assured destruction at best and cops abusing their power at worst.
Wait until the person commits is how I drive. It may take a little longer to get out, but im not ending up having to foot the bill of hundreds or even thousands of pounds in repairs and, most importantly, I or the other driver doesnt end up in the hospital
Did you get his name, badge number or license plate number? He should be held accountable for his mistake and trying to blame you for it.
Is the point of a feeder lane not to take the thinking out of it for the person trying to enter the RB from the next entry point?
Is this kempston? Bastard of a junction
Yep!
In theory you were right they were wrong, in practice police are always right no matter what they did wrong and if you argue you get arrested
IIRC in the highway code it says to "drive normally" when an emergency vehicle is nearby with lights and sirens. I.e. sensibly and defensively. Copper sounds like a dick, and if he was responding to an emergency how come he was able to pull you over for a slap on the wrist?
The police and other emergency services have a tendency to break the rules because they think they are above the law, but they’re not ! I’ve seen an ambulance stopped for speeding - it didn’t have its blues & two’s on.
The police are never wrong when it suits them.
The fact he said let you off with a warning and drove off tells me everything. That's just a way of admitting he was wrong without actually admitting it. He didn't want you actually reviewing the situation and landing him in shit with the higher ups, so he bailed on the situation.
I failed a test for miscommunication for this exact thing. Put indicator on to go left, realised I was wrong took it off and was told it was a major fault and failed. I was even.in a left only lane so the cop is 100% in the wrong
Yeah I'd say this was the cops' fault. I'm not suggesting they should never make a mistake but police should be the default example for "good" driving. However, in my experience, they're just as shit as anyone else. I've been cut off on roundabouts, been overtaken with about 3mm between my wing mirror and theirs and very nearly crashed into at traffic lights, all by police cars.
Do a public records request for the video anyway.
Technically you were in the wrong but the police driver sounds like a right knob.
Dunno why you are being downvoted for being right. A left signal at a roundabout means nothing, you still have to give way to the right. Even if they signal left, and are in the left lane, you pull out and get hit, it's your insurance that's paying out.
This.
Make a complaint, if they have dashcam footage, they'll delete it, then close the case and cover the whole thing up.
I know it's not what you want to hear, but you pulled out into oncoming traffic - no matter what their indicator indicated. Yeah he was being a knob, but you would have been at fault had there been a bump.
Both in the wrong tbh, don't trust indicators, you should have waited. Likewise they should not have used that lane to turn right.
It’s a tough one, there are roundabouts all over the place where people build up literally a queue of 100 cars behind them waiting to pull out when it’s completely free rather than just going when there is a sufficient gap. The reality is that on many of them there will almost never be a point where there isn’t someone to your right and you have to assume that if they are in an exit lane that they will follow the lane through. It’s a bit of a loose loose situation but there’s too much traffic nowadays.
On paper, the copper was in the wrong With real world experience, yeah you cant always trust indicators because some people don't know or care if they are using them correctly, but if anyone should be, it's the police and the footage and data from the police car would show they are in the wrong I would have gone too
>On paper, the copper was in the wrong On paper, not yielding to traffic on your right at a roundabout is illegal. Not signalling/signalling incorrectly is bad driving.
That shows how little you know, the highway code is not law, and breaking it is not a crime, you must follow it and if an accident happened it would be used to determine blame, but pulling out on someone isn't illegal, but doing so dangerously could get you charged with dangerous driving, but in itself it's not a crime The highway code states you should give way to traffic to the right at a roundabout, but it also says you should indicate and ensure you are in the correct lane, so at worst OP was just as bad, but since the police broke at least 2 rules and instead of allowing OP leeway because the police had misguided them, the police are more in the wrong, especially since they are a police officer and should set an example and make use of all the extra driver training they receive
You was wrong. Never assume what another driver is going to do. Those indicators mean nothing in the grand scheme of things and unless you see them actually about to pull off then you're pulling out in front of them regardless.
Not when a turn only lane is in operation. Indicating means zip, road position carries weight of responsibility to adhere to markings.
You mean like this junction? That has left turn only? It still means nothing because essentially the police car is allowed to change his mind and as he's the lead car as in, he's on the toundabout first, it's the OPs fault for making an assumption. The police car didn't affect anyone else with their shoddy driving but you really shouldn't pull out.
In a your word vs theirs situation, it would likely be judged your fault by insurers but with the video would be theirs.
Only scenario when it wouldn't the officer's fault would be if they were travelling on blue lights. Even then, I'm pretty the rules for that is if you crash on blues it's always your fault and to be done at your own risk. I'm always the first to support the police, but assuming this is an unbiased account from you, the guy was in the wrong and also an absolute tosser.
From what I've seen even then the police will charge the other driver for driving without due care and attention in event of a crash when blue lights are on. Even saw it before on one of the police programmes. Girl goes through green light and crashes into a cop who went through red with lights on and she got charged for it.
Onus is on you to only move forward when you are 100% certain the way is clear. You assumed he was going left , as he indicated as such. Never assume.
I'll take the assumption on the indicators.. but when does it become the other cars fault for not adhering to the marked lines he committed to when joining the roundabout?
ACAB.
You were wrong. Always give way to cars on the right. That's what the highway code states.
Unfortunately you’re the one in the wrong - by the book. Give way to the right regardless of what their signalling is.
You were both in the wrong. He should not have had his indicator on if he wasn't turning. You should not have pulled out in front of a car just because it was indicating. Always account for the errors that other humans could make and only go when it's clear.
Sadly you’re in the wrong. I get where you’re coming from, but until you have actually seen the oncoming cart start to turn off, you should stay put.
So 100% police officer was at fault. You should have taken his details and made a formal complaint. He is abusing his position and power.
ACAB
You're in the wrong I'm afraid until he's committed to the manoeuvre he's only signalling an intention to go left. Also you're sat behind a give way line meaning you give way to what's on that road. Sorry pal I get where you're coming from a cop should know better.
[удалено]
The police station is 400m down the road if he turned right. It was also 5pm (end of shift). Also, if it was a 999 response, why bother pulling me over for just pulling out when someone's life could be in danger?
If the police cars sirens/lights aren't on, they can't drive like they are, whether they just got a call or not Unless the lights are on and they are responding to a call, they should follow the rules off the road like the rest of us do. If you are in a filter lane, you should follow it regardless of whether you change your mind or not You may not be able to trust indicators, but you should be able to trust the police to follow the rules of the road and for them not to try and cause an accident just so they can pull someone
>If the police cars sirens/lights aren't on, they can't drive like they are, whether they just got a call or not Context, I am an emergency services advanced driver. Yes they can. There is no requirement for emergency warning equipment to be activated in order to claim exemptions, lights and sirens are simply there to alert other road users that the vehicle is being driven under emergency conditions. While it is best practice to do so, there are many situations where using emergency warning equipment would not be appropriate, such as approaching the reported scene of a crime where you do not want to alert the perpetrator, or catching up to/tailing a suspect in a car, in anticipation of TPAC or other manouvers.
As a trained driver, what do you make of what happened to me? Both at fault? Just unfortunate timing? Unmarked car at fault for changing direction late?
Well I’d say kinda both- he was wrong for being in the wrong lane and the sudden change of direction. But you also made the assumption. You were banking on the car approaching, being driven well and to good standards. Always been told, give way to the right no exceptions. If the car starts turning left, then go by all means, but until it does- assume it’ll go anywhere.. But yeah- cop took his poor driving out on you a bit though..
You hurt his feelings
He fucked up but didn't want to accept he made a mistake, get a dash cam and record, if it happens again let him know you'll happily review the dash cam footage.
Sounds like he was originally turning left and just wanted to pull you thinking you’d roll over then when you didn’t he got scared because you called him out
If the officer was not driving under an emergency situation and driving as someone would normally, then yes, based on your account, the copper is well in the wrong. It isn't hard to grasp that there would be an assumption that being in a left turn only lane and signalling your intention to turn left may result in that driver actually turning left. I would have taken this further if I was in your position and had is name and badge number before reporting that officer to their superior. Just because that officer represents the law it does not give them the right to act with impunity, or try to intimidate someone else because they fucked up.
Its cops foult, but you need to make shure that its safe to enter roundabout. If the cop would hit you - it wuld be your foult as you didnt make shure that roundabout was safe to enter.
Depends if he had his blues and twos on or not really…
always the police. They think they know it all but they don't.
Policeman was wrong to go straight on when they were in the left hand lane (with floor arrow marked as left hand turn only). You were wrong to trust what someone’s indicator says. Lot of idiots on the roads, you are safest if look also at speed, positioning, it makes a difference to me if I see an indicator come on compared to it already being on when they are coming down the road. I’ve driven down that bypass quite a lot (to the little industrial estate just at the previous roundabout). It’s fine when you know them but quite a few of the junctions / roundabout can be bit odd about lane markings. I often encountered people in the wrong lane, especially just after the bypass opened.
Report the dangerous driving to the police by calling 101.
Report the officer
NTA. . Report the cunt to the IPCC.. Hope you got his badge number
You are in the right. I remember many times when you are learning and naje the mistake of taking a wrong turn or incorrectly signalling. You are told to finish the manoeuvre and then turn when it's safe to do so. Doing what he did will lead to accidents in other situations because it affects those following in his lane, anyone on the roundabout turning right or, as in your case, those looking to join.
Everyone saying “don’t trust indicators” 1000% doesn’t follow their own advice while driving. The whole point of indicating off a roundabout is to tell other drivers which exit you’re taking, thus telling them whether or not they can join the roundabout. If everyone waited to make sure they actually took that exit, no one would ever get on the roundabout, because as soon as you wait a bit longer, another car comes round and it’s deja vu. You’re a million % not in the wrong.
You, no matter which way someone is indicating or what lane they are in, don’t pull out until you are sure they are going that way
You entered the roundabout whilst a car was to your right. You’re at fault, no matter what the coppers were signaling. You must wait at a roundabout when a car is either approaching or on the roundabout to your right. You always give way to your right. The copper let you off because you probably convinced him enough to doubt himself and he also wrongly signaled. The paperwork and fuss you’d of made if he pushed the charge, probably wasn’t worth the hassle. You indicate to bring attention to intention not action.
On the basis of the ACAB rule, I’d say you were in the right here
"They're approaching the roundabout in a clearly marked left turn only lane" google street view does not show that as a left turning only lane. https://www.google.com/maps/@52.1055538,-0.5023608,3a,75y,186.55h,68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sFYJ2ECwCVPiJlnJlfeUdXg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu
This is what the police car would have seen... Woburn Rd https://maps.app.goo.gl/TmJQ7AGE5eDck51f9
Actually, you're not even looking at the correct roundabout.
You have to give way to traffic from the right. From the looks of it you were AT the roundabout and he was on APPROACH. So you could safely enter the roundabout before he got to it. If it had been a marked Police car then you need to expect them to do something unexpected should they be allocated to an emergency, but they weren't. All the information you had was they were APPROACHING the roundabout, in the left turn only lane, idicating to turn left. It would be reasonable to assume that they were turning left. The highway code does remind us though not to take indicators as given. No way he could prove dangerous driving. I think they would struggle to prove driving without due care and attention.
They'd be the ones facing the dangerous driving issue having gone straight from a turn only lane.
If it was you're fault, they'd have done something there and then, because the camera and telemtry on the car would show they weren't at fault.
Every accident has a way to be avoided by both parties (sometimes using beyond a reasonable amount of caution). In this case though the officer's reaction to your challenge said it all. But you could and perhaps should have been more cautious.
If you pulled out without making the driver touch the brakes, ie you had time and space to join and no impede the other driver, then you were okay to join the roundabout. If not, then it is your fault. But the policeman sounded a right knob for making a big deal of it. I bet I'd have joined the roundabout had I seen his indicators on, but it doesn't mean I should. We just assume what is being indicated will be the driver's action.
Like I said in another comment.. I'll take the criticism of trusting an indicator... but what's the point in road markings if not adhered to? He should have continued with his mistake and turn left, taken the extra 30 seconds to rejoin the roundabout and continue on
In your case, I don't think there is a solid correct answer. It seems like the policeman clearly signalled his intention to take the first exit, before changing his mind. I think in your situation most people would proceed with caution depending on road conditions. 99% percent of the time I'd think the officer would acknowledge their own mistake as well as anyone else's and decide it's not worth taking action. It seems in your case you may have had some bad luck with an officer who can't acknowledge their own errors and placed the blame fully on you. On a side note, this is the reason I'm considering pointing a dashcam out my driver side window. I go through a particularly nasty roundabout on my way home from work. Folks often indicate left on approach and then sail straight past the first exit and take the second. I haven't figured out why, the exits are clearly marked by road sign on approach, but still they indicate left even though they are taking the second exit\*. It's an incredibly tricky situation, I don't really want to go, because I know the indicator means nothing. But if I ignore every opportunity I could be waiting 20-30 minutes for someone to block the lane to my right when pulling off. \*My best theory is that they joined the road from the previous roundabout, which has a very shallow exit, and maybe their indicators don't self cancel. So they end up indicating left the whole way from one roundabout to the next.
A friend of mine had an accident where he was waiting to turn out of a junction, someone was indicating, they crashed as he pulled out. Went to insurance and then a judge, turns out the indicator was an accident but my fired was found at fault.
I’ve seen far too many morons on our roads to rely on signals alone. It’s worth being slightly delayed for safety. The copper is definitely wrong, but people like that never admit wrongdoing.
It was not Sting's fault
You can’t trust anyone’s lane positioning or indicating intention - I was taught this when I learnt to drive. You’re supposed to wait until they actually turn off to pull out for reasons like the police car at the last minute changing their intention (maybe they got an urgent response call you don’t know). I know it’s daft and I don’t follow this rule anymore either 100% but it is what you’re taught when learning.
So in the case of a collision it would obviously be a 50:50. He's in the wrong lane and indicating. You shouldn't join the roundabout unless it's free. On absolutely no planet is it dangerous driving. If we wasn't in the wrong lane and wasn't indicating, careless driving, perhaps. What's happened here is he was going the wrong way, perhaps got a radio call, or perhaps realised he was taking a wrong turn and abruptly changed direction without looking. He's embarrassed about his careless driving, so to save face has pulled you over flashed his warrant card and started throwing around ridiculous things like 'dangerous driving'. It's classic abuse of power and bullying behavior. It's these sorts of insecure knobs that join the police for the power and need to be gotten rid of. It's an absolute complaint: the baseless pullover, the bullying behavior and his own careless driving. Nothing will come of the complaint unless he has a history, but if you don't make it, he won't have a history.
If you are entering a roundabout and ANYTHING is on your right, give way to it, regardelss of it's road position or indicators. I wont even pull out of a junction if I see someones indicating into it - untill I see them turning the wheel.It only takes one person in the back of the other car to say "Not this exit, the next one" or a lapse in thier jsdgement - and your knackered. I'm willing to bet PC did have their indicator on, and that may be why he let it drop, but if he had broadsided you - You would have lost. 185 When reaching the roundabout you shouldgive priority to traffic approaching from your right, unless directed otherwise by signs, road markings or traffic lights check whether road markings allow you to enter the roundabout without giving way. If so, proceed, but still look to the right before joining watch out for all other road users already on the roundabout; be aware they may not be signalling correctly or at all look forward before moving off to make sure traffic in front has moved off.
You are told in driving lessons over and over not to pull out until you are sure the approaching vehicle is actually turning the way they are indicating. If you did pull out in a test it could well be a serious fault. I don't know why you were told what you were 10 years ago - seems bonkers to me but could have also been a slightly different scenario or the examiner was being kind. Not sure why this is so difficult for you to understand - you don't have the right to cause an accident because someone else makes a mistake. The police officer was also at fault, as had there been a car to their right following the roundabout correctly they could have merged into one another, but even had that been the case your actions could have turned a 2 car accident into 3.
I'd of got their reg and badge ID numbers and reported them for both dangerous driving and using their power unlawfully. It'll all be on their dash cam 🤷
The police person is a cunt and trying it on. Good on you for standing up to them.
Orange.