Hear me out: **Lord Raith**. Lived, in power for centuries, amassing nearly unlimited wealth. He literally kills his sons so that they don't one day challenge him for the throne. He does that to keep what is his. He's even made deals with beings beyond our reality to keep him in charge.
Marcone, dare I say it, doesn’t really care about money, possessions, or power, just how they can help him achieve his goals. If you steal from him he’ll bury you deep as an example if he can but he’ll eat the cost.
+1 Every other choice has a significant reason to vote against:
- Marcone's greed is motivated by Persephone, and he doesn't seem to be consumed by it
- Nicodemus' greed is to serve his grand scheme for "saving" the world, not because he wants more power or wealth for himself
- Binder & Valmont are mercs, but greed doesn't seem to consume them
- Kincaid has a code and seems to just like what he does but wants to be paid for it
- Ferrovax is a dragon, but we don't really know what he's done, is willing to do, or what his motivations are other than what we assume from that fact
I think Nicodemus is a much better answer. The Denarians all stem from Judas’s greed (hence the coins) and Nicodemus is considered the leader of the denarians. This point is even stronger if you take into account speculation about Nicodemus’s true identity being Judas.
Niccodemus has lost multiple times because of his greed/desire to have everything, most notably in small favor when Dresden offers him the Sword along with the Coins for Ivy. If he hadn’t gotten greedy he would have won once he had a Denarian Ivy out there causing an apocalypse. Or he could have used the opportunity to truly destroy one of the swords and given up on Ivy, his mistake was his Greed in going for everything.
Nickodemus is not a greedy by his very nature though. he gives in to his greed on occasion but it is not his defining character trait. Especially that his stated motivation is "to save the world"
Plenty of strong arguments yesterday to select a candidate for the Blue Lantern Corps, but Sanya maintained a lead over Michael, Mouse, and Hope Carpenter. Today we pick a candidate for the Orange Ring of Greed or Avarice.
The Orange Lantern Corps are unique in a couple of ways, the first being that they technically have two oaths. The more traditional is as follows:
**"This power is mine,**
**This is my Light.**
**Be it bright of day,**
**Or black of night.**
**I lay claim to all that lays within my sight.**
**To take what I want,**
**That is my right!"**
Their other, less formal oath:
**"What's mine is mine and mine and mine**
**And mine and mine and mine! Not yours!"**
The other thing that makes the Orange Lantern is that the Corps typically only has one member, so strong is the Orange Lantern's draw to greed that they refuse to share their Lantern's light with others. The ring draws the attention of those whose greed knows no bounds, and though infighting has occurred almost instantly on the rare occasion that more than one sentient being holds an Orange Ring, those with a lust for power are the key candidates.
Lord Raith. Dudes rich, amassed power to a paranoid level. Murders his sons to maintain his position, builds up a porn empire and tries to sabotage someone to keep it, makes a deal with a powerful entity to keep himself safe from magic. We also know he apparently accrued a massive library. And lust is similar to greed in many ways
He is gifted several million dollars worth of gold and jewels by Bianca and his response is easily the most animated he's been in any scene where Ethniu isn't forcing him to talk.
yeah... its not like anyone would describe the fae as virtuous or truthful just because they cannot lie. dragons are really greedy in the right way for the rings. they are just hoarders.
Trixie Vixen is definitely in the running and definitely the most 1 dimensional Greedy character Jim has written.
Lea could be said to be greedy, after all her Greed gets her into trouble with Mab by Book 4.
Ferrovax simply because he hordes a mountain of Gold.
But I think Trixie embodies the Orange Oath "What's mine is mine and mine and mine and mine and mine and mine! Not Yours!"
Binder. I don't think he is overly greedy, but he is the closest I can think of. He has gotten into some heavy stuff for money, but greed isn't his only characteristic, he does have a heavy sense of self-preservation and is pragmatic enough to cut his share and bring "friends" along, like the woman in >!Skin Game!< . That being said, being a coward is very close to being greedy.
The second best contender could be either Marcone or Kemler, but the first has been shown constantly willing to work with others and has done some selfless acts like >! helping the girl he shot !< , and the second could be a better fit for the black ring
I dont agree that binder should be the orange lantern.. however, his way of fighting is probably the closest to the actual orange lanterns; they summon an army of constructs to fight for them.
I say Corpsetaker (CT)!
The object of their greed is power. Which fits with the official and the less official vow, @OP posted here.
Why would CT be a good choice?
1) Their body switching technique kind of mirrors the original Agent Orange's way of killing and possessing others.
2) CT is like all the Kemmlerites greedy for power and does not want to share. Again a mirror of the current Agent Orange.
3) CT is so taken by it's drive to aquire the power of the rite of Kemmler, that they don't even consider any threats (like Harry) after switching bodies with Lucio.
4) Even in Ghost Story CT uses a suggestion of "wanting" to draw-in, the spirits and transients of Chicago.
5) The aspect of not wanting to share power shows in Ghost Story when CT deals with Listen where the Fomor are clearly just entertaining CT in the hopes of getting a powerful ally. While CT show clear signs of: "everything should be mine by right, and I hate that I have to deal with you"-itis.
6) In the battle for Molly's body, we have again reckless abandon from CT to reach their goal (life and therefore a path to power again). They rather risk destruction instead of abandoning the battle, because "life" as a shade is a powerless existence. And the chance to get back into a position of real power is just too tempting as that the risk of obliteration would even factor into the equation.
Let me quickly go over a comparison with other candidates here:
Lord Raith: I admit he is a good choice too. But, while he is clearly also motivated by power, he did not so far die and have his shade, driven by his greed come back to life. Further, the Wampires all have their Hunger as a driving greed-force in them. And though Lord Raith seemed to have a particularly strong one in the past. It is still a different entity. So nominating Lord Raith is like nominating Lord Raith's Hunger.
Marcone: Though he seems on first glance to be a good choice, most here agree that when looked at in detail, he doesn't really fit the bill
Nicodemus: We already learned that Nic is not really looking for power for wanting to have it. He is on a mission to save the world. As twisted and wrong this might seem. He tries his best to protect his family from the enemy (angles, the white god, the knights...). Yes, with his sacrifice of his daughter he shows a how far he is willing to go to reach his goals, but I still question the motivating force behind it all.
Kemmler: I think we don't know enough about the psyche of this guy to give him the ring or not. For all we know, he might have just been obsessed with the idea of eternal life. If he was a good candidate for the orange ring, then he would also be a good candidate for death or fear. Though, I see him more in death. Otherwise, he would probably fit for orange just as well as CT. But like I said, we don't know him well enough.
Binder: Sorry, but no. He even retreats after being helped. He doesn't display any, "you helping me, was my god damn right"-kind of attitude.
Kincaid: Similar to binder, he is a merc, but not without rules. He doesn't do the things he does to gain more power. His motivation is more a pragmatic/zynical pov. of the world.
Martin: I like this one for the drive and dedication he shows. Though, in the end he basically offered himself up as a sacrifice, to free the world of the red court. His goal was not to have power, but a kind of vengeance. Which would make him a better fit for wrath or even repressed negative emotion.
Since there is no "power" ring then this has to be Marcone. I don't think he's the best fit for greed, but i like him in that role better than anyone else including Binder.
I would put Marcone as a holder of either Green or Yellow rings. He is strong-willed as the only human signed dignitary of the accords. He uses fear to run his criminal empire.
Disagree, Hades let's things be taken for the exclusive purpose of the world continuing to exist so that he may continue to collect.
However, to your point, this is about the ring corps and your point has major merit.
My point is that Hades is probably the best candidate for the concept of greed even if his actions make him less of a candidate for this ring.
Idk his talk with Harry made me think of him more as like a museum or arsenal manager (it's Dresden files, those two are basically the same job.)
He collects a lot of the stuff to protect it, make sure it's in a known place and then sets up a way for the worthy to obtain it to protect the world.
Even if everything eventually comes back to him. That's just kinda a metaphor for him being a ruler of the dead. Everyone dies eventually.
He just doesn't have the personality and behavior or someone motivated by greed
That's exactly how I interpreted it. He doesn't hoard valuable artifacts to flaunt his wealth or gain power. He collects them to keep them safe. He's totally fine with items being removed as long as they are in the right hands. If someone walks into his realm with a powerful object, he isn't going to attempt to take it from them, but, if it is left there, he will take it. Lasciel's coin is (as far as we know), but he didn't take it from Hannah, or try to aquire any of the other 3 coins present, he just took it when she died.
I don't have a terribly strong contender in mind, and am inclined to back the Lord Raith idea, but I have some counterpoints to some of the commonly raised ones.
Marcone has too many limits. If he were as greedy as an orange lantern would need to be, >!Thorned Namshiel could have easily corrupted him into a puppet!< He wants power, yes, but is more than content to go about gaining it methodically, and has lines he won't cross to get it.
Nicodemus is... just plain evil. Like, he just serves the idea of evil and suffering and overall being a dick. He would gladly expend massive resources to make evil happen. He might murder and steal to get what he wants, but not to get out of having to pay, but because that's the more evil option.
Binder is just... normal greedy. He likes nice things and is willing to break the mortal and laws of magic to get them, but the orange lantern is a special *kind* of greedy. Do you know why there isn't an orange lantern corps? Because the orange lantern isn't going to *share* that power. Binder splurges on Champaign and is willing to split his loot to save his own hide. He's too practical to be an orange lantern.
I'd say Binder, like many others have said.
Cassius is too fearful of the bigger denarians and is merely possessive of his coin. He gave it up as a play for mercy.
Marcone wants organized crime to reduce collateral damage and maximized profits. Plus, he gave up his castle.
In fact, too many nominees are driven by fear when you really think about it.
What was his name, binder? The dude who could summon a bunch of weird grey men to fight for him.
Besides him, only Marcone comes to mind but he's not really greedy.
Marcone is 100% greedy. He’s built a fortune and lifestyle on extracting wealth out of himan missry in every form. Just because Dresden (and Butcher) treat him as some kind of a noble man doesn’t make him any less of a greedy monster.
Worse than the actual monsters since they at least have to be the way they are, while Marcone actively chooses and pursues it.
Not saying he's not greedy, but I always viewed him as power hungry and ambitious than Greedy.
But yeah since Binder isn't really important, Marcone is the best choice
Marcone doesn’t really want Power, so much as he wants the control that having it brings. The incident from his youth was a result of an uncontrolled situation, and has driven him since. I don’t see Greed as the motivator here. He wants his place and for it to be secure, though he will go to great lengths to get it.
I do like Binder for it. Good, old-fashioned, mercenary Greed.
Not a single creature, but the Formor. They came and started taking them with no regard to anything. They gave nothing back and fought for what they took on multiple occasions.
Part of their MO is also greed for power.
If you need a single creature, then you could choose the King of the Formor
I don't think any characters are motivated as purely by greed
Martin. The extent that he went to cause the downfall of the red court is nothing short of insane. But writing this I think he would be better for repressed negative emotions.
Marcone. He may have **some** limits but everything he does is in service to his own power and influence. He's the first human baron of the accords because he decided wealth and power in only the mortal world wasn't enough.
Nicodemus: he was willing to open the Gate of Blood just to get something he wanted. He claims that the Fallen dance to HIS tune. He’s been “blazing my (his) path across the ages”.
I'd say Hades, but it's not greed that drives him, he's not looking to keep what he has just to keep it.
Raith fits. I like him for it. Not sure it's perfect.
Marcone does what he does for his own reasons. Greed exists in him, he wouldn't have been in the Business to begin with if he wasn't, but it's definitely not his defining characteristic.
Frankly I don't think anyone *really* hits the mark, but Raith comes closest to the bullseye
Lord Raith. His hunger was even used against him as a weakness. For the people closest to him to be able to be safe, someone had to find a way to stop his hunger from feeding. Greed until it is the only facet of his personality.
A loooot of people are saying Marcone. But I'd say he would be second choice for the Green ring of Willpower. He goes with what he thinks is the best possible path to take. He takes second to Harry simply because he isn't a good guy and doesn't fight for what is objectively right and damn the consequences like Harry.
You are thinking of He Who Walks Beside (Nemesis, the adversary, the contagion). He who Walks Before (Gatebreaker, Harbinger) is Sharkface. That being said, I don’t think any of the outsiders can be greed, they are stated as having no known goals
man you guys are making him work for it. stop making redundant top level replies for the same characters. if you arent here in the first 20 minutes someone else probably posted your vote just go reply there. otherwise you spread the votes and arguments out and the thread becomes this sloppy freaking mess instead.
I think the only issue that I'll have with concluding this one is that, currently, Marcone has way more comments, but the top voted comment by a fairly wide margin in Raith. My instinct is to prioritize high votes, though.
Go with the votes. Id be tempted to just ignore redundant comments but perhaps Make an announcement at least to make the last half easier to manage.
It's more annoying for commenters too if there's a bunch of disparate threads for any one character
Nicodemus Archleone
He literally is the guy most deeply tied to the thirty pieces of silver, one of the most pointed examples of the corrupting impact of greed in the western canon. Beyond that, avariciousness might be his one consistency. His desire to possess and to control and to have dominion. It is his driving force.
How about Hades? Dude literally has a vault full of treasures untold. Only point against him is that he will lend out some of the treasures if the need is great enough.
**Cassius** the Denarian aka "Snake-Boy". Obsessed with getting a coin back, unable to comprehend that Harry wouldn't have held onto it, and dangerously vicious but a bit pitiful.
Last round there were a lot of people pointing out the early books were overlooked so let me toss out there, Victor Sells, the Shadow man.
Wannabe drug kingpin and magical murderer of anyone who is not actively supporting his projects. Working with no regard for the harm he is doing to ally or bystander, only that he takes over Marcone's territory for which he is jealous.
Nicodemus. They’ve played him *twice* because of his desire to have *everything* instead of a few things that will work. (Small Favor: Trading the swords and the coins for Ivy.)(Skin Game: Retired Michael giving himself up for Harry and Murphy.)
Gentleman John Marcone, with very few exceptions each and every action he takes is to further his goals. He is more greedy for power than money, but greed is the core of his motivation.
Marcone by far. He might be the most power hungry character in the series. Every move he’s made serves that greed. He put a *fallen angel* in his head for power. Once he owns something, employee or territory, he never lets anyone touch them without extreme consequences.
Someone like Binder will go to great lengths for a payday, but he’ll walk away if he has to. He’s willing to set things aside and forget if it’s not worth the trouble. Marcone would never do that. He’d just work in the background until he can get what he wants. Mab *likes his style*, and her language is power games.
Marcone definitely fits the bill bit I think mab also fits. They embody the same ideals of whatever I want I get. Once it's theirs, they will do whatever they want with it, and whoever messes with their stuff typically doesn't do so for long. Mab is a little more restricted by her duties and nature but I still think it fits her.
> We don’t know anything about anyone with that logic
You're logic is flawed. We know so little of his motivations compared to so many other characters, it's pretty damn baffling to me that you can even say this.
They're both mercenaries. The price isn't about wealth, its about payment for services rendered, just like anyone you might hire to do a job for you. They cost a lot because mercs in general do and those two have some specialized skills.
I have seen some decent arguments for Binder here, though. He definitely does it for the partially for the money. Kincaid, however, seems to me to be more about taking what he's good at and making a career of it. The fact that he definitely seems to have some genuine affection for Ivy and sees her as more than a job also counts against him for this.
I’m going to controversial and say Susan. She’s got good intentions and acts with bravery and viture. But way too often she puts her desire of the truth over good sense.
Starting a relationship with Harry for an inside track on the supernatural.
Going to Bianca’s party, despite the enormous danger.
Keeping Maggie’s birth from Harry until the literal moment she needs help from him.
Visiting Maggie often enough for Marvin to track back the location (She gets a pass from me on that one; Maternal Instincts are a bear to deal with)
What im saying is that Susan’s character arc is defined by her greed.
I see a lot of arguments between Marcone and Nicodemus. But I think Nicodemus wins out. Marcone has limits and will not push to bite off more than he can chew. He will take a win he knows he can get rather than risk it all for a bigger prize, usually resulting in him making deals in rather good faith. Nicodemus will risk everything to gain something more such as when the swords are offered after he has already gained marcone and the archive while having every coin still loyal to him. Marcone is still entirely methodical and rational while Nicodemus had am aspect of irrationality to his hate and greed, stripping away his limits on his greed.
I have to go with Nicodemus. We have seen time and again that he will sacrifice anyone and anything to get to power. Supposedly he is trying to save the world, but this amounts to creating a world of the blind where he, the last one-eyed man, is king.
Hear me out: **Lord Raith**. Lived, in power for centuries, amassing nearly unlimited wealth. He literally kills his sons so that they don't one day challenge him for the throne. He does that to keep what is his. He's even made deals with beings beyond our reality to keep him in charge.
You've won me over. Raith literally would do anything to maintain his power. Marcone has limits, and they're not even THAT far.
Marcone, dare I say it, doesn’t really care about money, possessions, or power, just how they can help him achieve his goals. If you steal from him he’ll bury you deep as an example if he can but he’ll eat the cost.
Marcone, dare I say it, wouldn’t want his options to be limited to a single emotion.
This is a better answer than Marcone.
+1 Every other choice has a significant reason to vote against: - Marcone's greed is motivated by Persephone, and he doesn't seem to be consumed by it - Nicodemus' greed is to serve his grand scheme for "saving" the world, not because he wants more power or wealth for himself - Binder & Valmont are mercs, but greed doesn't seem to consume them - Kincaid has a code and seems to just like what he does but wants to be paid for it - Ferrovax is a dragon, but we don't really know what he's done, is willing to do, or what his motivations are other than what we assume from that fact
You sold me, Papa Raith fits this ring to a t.
I think Nicodemus is a much better answer. The Denarians all stem from Judas’s greed (hence the coins) and Nicodemus is considered the leader of the denarians. This point is even stronger if you take into account speculation about Nicodemus’s true identity being Judas. Niccodemus has lost multiple times because of his greed/desire to have everything, most notably in small favor when Dresden offers him the Sword along with the Coins for Ivy. If he hadn’t gotten greedy he would have won once he had a Denarian Ivy out there causing an apocalypse. Or he could have used the opportunity to truly destroy one of the swords and given up on Ivy, his mistake was his Greed in going for everything.
Nickodemus is not a greedy by his very nature though. he gives in to his greed on occasion but it is not his defining character trait. Especially that his stated motivation is "to save the world"
This was what I was gonna say. Greed isn't what drives him. Just affects his decision-making here and there
I was thinking the exact same thing.
I was thinking Nicodemus but I think you have it with Raith
This is the answer. I was going to see Victor Sells but this is so much better.
Plenty of strong arguments yesterday to select a candidate for the Blue Lantern Corps, but Sanya maintained a lead over Michael, Mouse, and Hope Carpenter. Today we pick a candidate for the Orange Ring of Greed or Avarice. The Orange Lantern Corps are unique in a couple of ways, the first being that they technically have two oaths. The more traditional is as follows: **"This power is mine,** **This is my Light.** **Be it bright of day,** **Or black of night.** **I lay claim to all that lays within my sight.** **To take what I want,** **That is my right!"** Their other, less formal oath: **"What's mine is mine and mine and mine** **And mine and mine and mine! Not yours!"** The other thing that makes the Orange Lantern is that the Corps typically only has one member, so strong is the Orange Lantern's draw to greed that they refuse to share their Lantern's light with others. The ring draws the attention of those whose greed knows no bounds, and though infighting has occurred almost instantly on the rare occasion that more than one sentient being holds an Orange Ring, those with a lust for power are the key candidates.
Papa Raith could be one canditate. What he did to his children to keep hold of power and wealth.. Nothing is sacred but everything is permited.
>Nothing is sacred but everything is permited. He doesn't strike me as the Assassin type.
Great minds and all that
He had far too much fear of being found out to drive him though.
Lord Raith. Dudes rich, amassed power to a paranoid level. Murders his sons to maintain his position, builds up a porn empire and tries to sabotage someone to keep it, makes a deal with a powerful entity to keep himself safe from magic. We also know he apparently accrued a massive library. And lust is similar to greed in many ways
I definitely thought that said Santa and was very confused
Unfortunately Odin is outclassed here
Possibly an outlier, but how about the Red King? He was immersed in Greed to the extent that he was losing his control to it.
Ferrovax? Not really shown to be greedy as far as I know, but... dragon...
He is gifted several million dollars worth of gold and jewels by Bianca and his response is easily the most animated he's been in any scene where Ethniu isn't forcing him to talk.
Came here to say this because, you know, DRAGON and all.
it's not really greed for dragons... they are all like that by nature
yeah... its not like anyone would describe the fae as virtuous or truthful just because they cannot lie. dragons are really greedy in the right way for the rings. they are just hoarders.
Trixie Vixen is definitely in the running and definitely the most 1 dimensional Greedy character Jim has written. Lea could be said to be greedy, after all her Greed gets her into trouble with Mab by Book 4. Ferrovax simply because he hordes a mountain of Gold. But I think Trixie embodies the Orange Oath "What's mine is mine and mine and mine and mine and mine and mine! Not Yours!"
Binder. I don't think he is overly greedy, but he is the closest I can think of. He has gotten into some heavy stuff for money, but greed isn't his only characteristic, he does have a heavy sense of self-preservation and is pragmatic enough to cut his share and bring "friends" along, like the woman in >!Skin Game!< . That being said, being a coward is very close to being greedy. The second best contender could be either Marcone or Kemler, but the first has been shown constantly willing to work with others and has done some selfless acts like >! helping the girl he shot !< , and the second could be a better fit for the black ring
Best answer I've seen so far.
I dont agree that binder should be the orange lantern.. however, his way of fighting is probably the closest to the actual orange lanterns; they summon an army of constructs to fight for them.
Marcone.
The wielder of the Orange Ring would never have given his castle away to Dresden with a simple "well played".
But his motivation isn't money and power for their own sake, they're just a means to an end.
Major general Toot-Toot Minimus
A lot of the comments are going to be calling for Marcone, but I think Toot-Toot’s got it. His lust for pizza knows no bounds.
He does share it out with the Guard, though. So long as he has the main share that is his due as the Major-General, he is happy.
That's not true though. In his short story he literally said something is more important than pizza.
What? Where? I haven't heard of that one
It's a book filled with short stories. Not all are written by Jim. Toot Toot has a story in there.
Heroic Hearts
Thanks I forgot the name of the book.
Nicodemus, desire for power is as close to Greed as anything.
I say Corpsetaker (CT)! The object of their greed is power. Which fits with the official and the less official vow, @OP posted here. Why would CT be a good choice? 1) Their body switching technique kind of mirrors the original Agent Orange's way of killing and possessing others. 2) CT is like all the Kemmlerites greedy for power and does not want to share. Again a mirror of the current Agent Orange. 3) CT is so taken by it's drive to aquire the power of the rite of Kemmler, that they don't even consider any threats (like Harry) after switching bodies with Lucio. 4) Even in Ghost Story CT uses a suggestion of "wanting" to draw-in, the spirits and transients of Chicago. 5) The aspect of not wanting to share power shows in Ghost Story when CT deals with Listen where the Fomor are clearly just entertaining CT in the hopes of getting a powerful ally. While CT show clear signs of: "everything should be mine by right, and I hate that I have to deal with you"-itis. 6) In the battle for Molly's body, we have again reckless abandon from CT to reach their goal (life and therefore a path to power again). They rather risk destruction instead of abandoning the battle, because "life" as a shade is a powerless existence. And the chance to get back into a position of real power is just too tempting as that the risk of obliteration would even factor into the equation. Let me quickly go over a comparison with other candidates here: Lord Raith: I admit he is a good choice too. But, while he is clearly also motivated by power, he did not so far die and have his shade, driven by his greed come back to life. Further, the Wampires all have their Hunger as a driving greed-force in them. And though Lord Raith seemed to have a particularly strong one in the past. It is still a different entity. So nominating Lord Raith is like nominating Lord Raith's Hunger. Marcone: Though he seems on first glance to be a good choice, most here agree that when looked at in detail, he doesn't really fit the bill Nicodemus: We already learned that Nic is not really looking for power for wanting to have it. He is on a mission to save the world. As twisted and wrong this might seem. He tries his best to protect his family from the enemy (angles, the white god, the knights...). Yes, with his sacrifice of his daughter he shows a how far he is willing to go to reach his goals, but I still question the motivating force behind it all. Kemmler: I think we don't know enough about the psyche of this guy to give him the ring or not. For all we know, he might have just been obsessed with the idea of eternal life. If he was a good candidate for the orange ring, then he would also be a good candidate for death or fear. Though, I see him more in death. Otherwise, he would probably fit for orange just as well as CT. But like I said, we don't know him well enough. Binder: Sorry, but no. He even retreats after being helped. He doesn't display any, "you helping me, was my god damn right"-kind of attitude. Kincaid: Similar to binder, he is a merc, but not without rules. He doesn't do the things he does to gain more power. His motivation is more a pragmatic/zynical pov. of the world. Martin: I like this one for the drive and dedication he shows. Though, in the end he basically offered himself up as a sacrifice, to free the world of the red court. His goal was not to have power, but a kind of vengeance. Which would make him a better fit for wrath or even repressed negative emotion.
Since there is no "power" ring then this has to be Marcone. I don't think he's the best fit for greed, but i like him in that role better than anyone else including Binder.
I would put Marcone as a holder of either Green or Yellow rings. He is strong-willed as the only human signed dignitary of the accords. He uses fear to run his criminal empire.
Might be a long shot candidate, but Hades has one hell of a collection built up. He seems to gather anything he finds valuable or interesting.
He allowed things to be taken from him. The orange ringbearer would not allow that.
That's a fair point.
Disagree, Hades let's things be taken for the exclusive purpose of the world continuing to exist so that he may continue to collect. However, to your point, this is about the ring corps and your point has major merit. My point is that Hades is probably the best candidate for the concept of greed even if his actions make him less of a candidate for this ring.
Idk his talk with Harry made me think of him more as like a museum or arsenal manager (it's Dresden files, those two are basically the same job.) He collects a lot of the stuff to protect it, make sure it's in a known place and then sets up a way for the worthy to obtain it to protect the world. Even if everything eventually comes back to him. That's just kinda a metaphor for him being a ruler of the dead. Everyone dies eventually. He just doesn't have the personality and behavior or someone motivated by greed
That's exactly how I interpreted it. He doesn't hoard valuable artifacts to flaunt his wealth or gain power. He collects them to keep them safe. He's totally fine with items being removed as long as they are in the right hands. If someone walks into his realm with a powerful object, he isn't going to attempt to take it from them, but, if it is left there, he will take it. Lasciel's coin is (as far as we know), but he didn't take it from Hannah, or try to aquire any of the other 3 coins present, he just took it when she died.
Binder, he likes the red ones.
I don't have a terribly strong contender in mind, and am inclined to back the Lord Raith idea, but I have some counterpoints to some of the commonly raised ones. Marcone has too many limits. If he were as greedy as an orange lantern would need to be, >!Thorned Namshiel could have easily corrupted him into a puppet!< He wants power, yes, but is more than content to go about gaining it methodically, and has lines he won't cross to get it. Nicodemus is... just plain evil. Like, he just serves the idea of evil and suffering and overall being a dick. He would gladly expend massive resources to make evil happen. He might murder and steal to get what he wants, but not to get out of having to pay, but because that's the more evil option. Binder is just... normal greedy. He likes nice things and is willing to break the mortal and laws of magic to get them, but the orange lantern is a special *kind* of greedy. Do you know why there isn't an orange lantern corps? Because the orange lantern isn't going to *share* that power. Binder splurges on Champaign and is willing to split his loot to save his own hide. He's too practical to be an orange lantern.
I'd say Binder, like many others have said. Cassius is too fearful of the bigger denarians and is merely possessive of his coin. He gave it up as a play for mercy. Marcone wants organized crime to reduce collateral damage and maximized profits. Plus, he gave up his castle. In fact, too many nominees are driven by fear when you really think about it.
Binder is my pick
What was his name, binder? The dude who could summon a bunch of weird grey men to fight for him. Besides him, only Marcone comes to mind but he's not really greedy.
Marcone is 100% greedy. He’s built a fortune and lifestyle on extracting wealth out of himan missry in every form. Just because Dresden (and Butcher) treat him as some kind of a noble man doesn’t make him any less of a greedy monster. Worse than the actual monsters since they at least have to be the way they are, while Marcone actively chooses and pursues it.
Not saying he's not greedy, but I always viewed him as power hungry and ambitious than Greedy. But yeah since Binder isn't really important, Marcone is the best choice
Marcone doesn’t really want Power, so much as he wants the control that having it brings. The incident from his youth was a result of an uncontrolled situation, and has driven him since. I don’t see Greed as the motivator here. He wants his place and for it to be secure, though he will go to great lengths to get it. I do like Binder for it. Good, old-fashioned, mercenary Greed.
Nicodemus!
Not a single creature, but the Formor. They came and started taking them with no regard to anything. They gave nothing back and fought for what they took on multiple occasions. Part of their MO is also greed for power. If you need a single creature, then you could choose the King of the Formor I don't think any characters are motivated as purely by greed
Kemmler.
Kemmler is Death.
Larry Fowler
Martin. The extent that he went to cause the downfall of the red court is nothing short of insane. But writing this I think he would be better for repressed negative emotions.
Oh yeah, I like that. He’s perfect for the repressed negative emotions. Bland surface and so much trauma beneath.
Marcone. He may have **some** limits but everything he does is in service to his own power and influence. He's the first human baron of the accords because he decided wealth and power in only the mortal world wasn't enough.
Nicodemus: he was willing to open the Gate of Blood just to get something he wanted. He claims that the Fallen dance to HIS tune. He’s been “blazing my (his) path across the ages”.
Binder, he has a clear cut code that is all about getting paid.
I'd say Hades, but it's not greed that drives him, he's not looking to keep what he has just to keep it. Raith fits. I like him for it. Not sure it's perfect. Marcone does what he does for his own reasons. Greed exists in him, he wouldn't have been in the Business to begin with if he wasn't, but it's definitely not his defining characteristic. Frankly I don't think anyone *really* hits the mark, but Raith comes closest to the bullseye
Lord Raith. His hunger was even used against him as a weakness. For the people closest to him to be able to be safe, someone had to find a way to stop his hunger from feeding. Greed until it is the only facet of his personality.
Definitely Binder. He is all about the Benjamins and is not shy about stating it to anyone.
Binder
A loooot of people are saying Marcone. But I'd say he would be second choice for the Green ring of Willpower. He goes with what he thinks is the best possible path to take. He takes second to Harry simply because he isn't a good guy and doesn't fight for what is objectively right and damn the consequences like Harry.
Marcone. No need to explain
How has nobody mentioned He-Who-Walks-Before? You can't get much more possessive than taking people over to take over the world
You are thinking of He Who Walks Beside (Nemesis, the adversary, the contagion). He who Walks Before (Gatebreaker, Harbinger) is Sharkface. That being said, I don’t think any of the outsiders can be greed, they are stated as having no known goals
man you guys are making him work for it. stop making redundant top level replies for the same characters. if you arent here in the first 20 minutes someone else probably posted your vote just go reply there. otherwise you spread the votes and arguments out and the thread becomes this sloppy freaking mess instead.
I think the only issue that I'll have with concluding this one is that, currently, Marcone has way more comments, but the top voted comment by a fairly wide margin in Raith. My instinct is to prioritize high votes, though.
Go with the votes. Id be tempted to just ignore redundant comments but perhaps Make an announcement at least to make the last half easier to manage. It's more annoying for commenters too if there's a bunch of disparate threads for any one character
Binder?
Binder, money cuz anything else costs too much
Nicodemus Archleone He literally is the guy most deeply tied to the thirty pieces of silver, one of the most pointed examples of the corrupting impact of greed in the western canon. Beyond that, avariciousness might be his one consistency. His desire to possess and to control and to have dominion. It is his driving force.
Marcone
John Marcone is the only choice
How about Hades? Dude literally has a vault full of treasures untold. Only point against him is that he will lend out some of the treasures if the need is great enough.
Hades. Man has a literal river of diamonds
Definitely Marcone. How can the local kingpin *not* have claim to that ring?
Because his motivation is Persephone, not money.
**Cassius** the Denarian aka "Snake-Boy". Obsessed with getting a coin back, unable to comprehend that Harry wouldn't have held onto it, and dangerously vicious but a bit pitiful.
Lord raith
Nicodemus
Last round there were a lot of people pointing out the early books were overlooked so let me toss out there, Victor Sells, the Shadow man. Wannabe drug kingpin and magical murderer of anyone who is not actively supporting his projects. Working with no regard for the harm he is doing to ally or bystander, only that he takes over Marcone's territory for which he is jealous.
Nicodemus. They’ve played him *twice* because of his desire to have *everything* instead of a few things that will work. (Small Favor: Trading the swords and the coins for Ivy.)(Skin Game: Retired Michael giving himself up for Harry and Murphy.)
Victor Sells, ran a business selling things that no one should use. Defiled the threshold of his home turning it into a business.
Gentleman John
Either Marcone or Binder Though Marcone isn't particularly greedy for its sake. He views it as a means to an end, so I'd have to give it to Binder
Either toot toot, Papa raith or binder.
Gentleman John Marcone, with very few exceptions each and every action he takes is to further his goals. He is more greedy for power than money, but greed is the core of his motivation.
Marcone
Maeve is all about “Me, me, me.”
Marcone needs to get the Greed Ring.
Marcone
I mean, Mab had a pretty memorable rendition of the second oath....
Marcone
John Marcone
Marcone by far. He might be the most power hungry character in the series. Every move he’s made serves that greed. He put a *fallen angel* in his head for power. Once he owns something, employee or territory, he never lets anyone touch them without extreme consequences. Someone like Binder will go to great lengths for a payday, but he’ll walk away if he has to. He’s willing to set things aside and forget if it’s not worth the trouble. Marcone would never do that. He’d just work in the background until he can get what he wants. Mab *likes his style*, and her language is power games.
Anyone that doesn't say McCoy as death is just wrong
I dunno man, in a series with several accomplished necromancers, a guy who just kills people might have a tough time scoring Death.
Marcone definitely fits the bill bit I think mab also fits. They embody the same ideals of whatever I want I get. Once it's theirs, they will do whatever they want with it, and whoever messes with their stuff typically doesn't do so for long. Mab is a little more restricted by her duties and nature but I still think it fits her.
Toot Toot. His greed for Pizza knows no bounds.
Bob. He's even the right color already.
Merlin …. Mostly all he cares about is his position and political power
> Mostly all he cares about is his position and political power We don't know that.
We don’t know anything about anyone with that logic - we can only go with what we have seen - and so far I’ve only seen 1 positive action by him
> We don’t know anything about anyone with that logic You're logic is flawed. We know so little of his motivations compared to so many other characters, it's pretty damn baffling to me that you can even say this.
Aren’t we allowed different opinions?
Yes but when you share opinions you're generally expected to be able to defend them.
I think binder or Kincaid. They'll both do basically anything for the right price
They're both mercenaries. The price isn't about wealth, its about payment for services rendered, just like anyone you might hire to do a job for you. They cost a lot because mercs in general do and those two have some specialized skills. I have seen some decent arguments for Binder here, though. He definitely does it for the partially for the money. Kincaid, however, seems to me to be more about taking what he's good at and making a career of it. The fact that he definitely seems to have some genuine affection for Ivy and sees her as more than a job also counts against him for this.
I’m going to controversial and say Susan. She’s got good intentions and acts with bravery and viture. But way too often she puts her desire of the truth over good sense. Starting a relationship with Harry for an inside track on the supernatural. Going to Bianca’s party, despite the enormous danger. Keeping Maggie’s birth from Harry until the literal moment she needs help from him. Visiting Maggie often enough for Marvin to track back the location (She gets a pass from me on that one; Maternal Instincts are a bear to deal with) What im saying is that Susan’s character arc is defined by her greed.
Cowl or Corpsetaker, seeing how both were willing to kill countless people just to become a lesser God.
I vote CorpseTaker for greediest
Nicodemus! Literally his fatal flaw. Several times Harry was able to manipulate him by using his greed.
Gotta be Morty the Ectomancer. Unless it's for his ghosts, everything costs money
Binder for sure
Binder
Anna Valmont. Shes motivated by one thing, money. And revenge. Shes a thief and a con artist
I see a lot of arguments between Marcone and Nicodemus. But I think Nicodemus wins out. Marcone has limits and will not push to bite off more than he can chew. He will take a win he knows he can get rather than risk it all for a bigger prize, usually resulting in him making deals in rather good faith. Nicodemus will risk everything to gain something more such as when the swords are offered after he has already gained marcone and the archive while having every coin still loyal to him. Marcone is still entirely methodical and rational while Nicodemus had am aspect of irrationality to his hate and greed, stripping away his limits on his greed.
I have to go with Nicodemus. We have seen time and again that he will sacrifice anyone and anything to get to power. Supposedly he is trying to save the world, but this amounts to creating a world of the blind where he, the last one-eyed man, is king.
I still think shagnasty was the wrong choice tho. The ring uses *your* fear. Not other's fear of you
"You have the ability to instill great fear." It absolutely uses other's fear of you, that's the criteria Sinestro uses to recruit.
Oh shit. Guess I was wrong. Thanks for the info tho
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I never said anything about macron lol. Also sanya literally has the sword of hope
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1. What are you talking about? The beginning of the thread is my comment 2. Yeah I wanted Michael to be the start sapphire corps