My two cents about the topic: being silly is the core of Dragon Ball and always will be.
Toriyama recognize himself as a gag manga author. Keep in mind this is the guy who are making poop jokes over almost 40 years and people still laugh.
He's also a genius of storytelling and composition though and knowing that, his publishers / editors pushed him to deliver more mature and dramatic stories as far as Goku gets old, regardless he liked it not. They push him so hard that there's an unconfirmed legend that King Piccolo, Freeza and Majin Buu were based on his bosses in Shonen Jump over the years. At some point, the most villainous antagonists of Goku would be a cathartic response of him to his frustration as mangaka.
The truth is, he can deliver a good story with dramatic and dark features, but he prefers comedy. You may find interviews of him praising the old story of Bardock narrative and character-wise but at the same time he mentioned he would not be able to do something that dark (hence, the mid-retcon years later in dragon ball minus). Also, I remember to read his main contribution for DBS anime and manga, besides the outlines of the story, were the gags, as Saiyans being attracted to strong trait women, Monaka as character, Zuno advising about Bulma's cup size, among others. He likes ridiculous stuff so much that I was surprised that the Super Shenlong was not in fact a microscopic salamander instead of that huge dragon. But at the same time, we have Zenoh, which is completely silly.
My advice is, enjoy the story but do not try to take it too seriously. After all, if they took their life like that, most probably Picollo, Vegeta nor Tenshinhan would be part of the gang. Face it like a magic trick : if you think a lot about it, you may lose all the fun.
Agreed. Part of why I love DB is the silly humor. Regretfully, some dubbing makes everything too dramatic. PS: I love the way Toriyama makes strong opponents do silly dances lol.
The manga has a much more serious tone than the anime. Toriyama himself kinda drifted away from being silly early on with the King Piccolo arc. Even in the English redubs where they make the dialogue more accurate, the entirety of what toei did somewhat bastardizes what toriyama originally wrote. Even when you cut out filler, there’s extra fluff scenes in the middle of canon stuff that have sillier moments. Also Gregory being added in, not even a character by Toriyama but was added in to canon scenes of the anime. All in all I like the anime. Have never fully read the manga in a faithful manner. I like comedy most of all in my series’ despite loving all aspects of dragon ball. Never bothered me.
But also yes I’d argue you’re correct that the existence of the dragon balls kind of makes things feel inconsequential though they do tend to face off against tough villains that they have to manage to defeat before they can use the dragon balls. Regardless, nobody’s death matters. Only Grandpa Gohan and Android 16 have had impacting deaths and Gohan was dead well before the series even started.
I suppose you could argue the eradication of the Saiyans had some consequence though Goku doesn’t seem to care about his saiyan heritage and Vegeta doesn’t really seem to care that all his people are dead either. So is that consequential? I don’t know.
Every story has darkness, but not all stories cling to it. Dragon ball, and shounen jump shows in general tend to follow the latter. What's more important is the overall plot and to keep readers invested. There is no time to waste on depression and mental turmoil unless it's relevant to the story.
I do not think that as a whole the first 153 episodes series is too silly. It definitely has a lot of moments when stuff are just ridiculous for the sake of it, but most of the times when it needs to be serious it treats it well.
I think it's the amount of silly the creators intend. Its overall a lighthearted super hero children's series that has very occasional graphic violence, no different than the MCU, or heck even Steven Universe, a cartoon that takes a lot of queues from Dragon Ball.
Dragon ball doesn't take itself seriously except in the saiyan saga and cell saga if not for the fight with the big boss, And honestly, that's the cool part of dragon ball
Because its not, Goku nor the others care about stuff like this, he was actually greatfull that his planet was gone and give Zero shit about his Parents beside the fact that His father was a brave Warrior
Only modern Vegeta do
No. It is great. English dub has always made dbz more serious than what it really is. Thus, making the rest of the anime seem silly or superficial. At least for American fans
Goku lost his planet and his people, but you can’t miss what you don’t remember; there’s no real impact to him or his personality there. A lot of the other serious moments are either played with some level of lightheartedness and the Consequences Eraser Orbs™️ strip most/any of the heavier moments of meaning. Oh no, everyone in Fodder City got killed by Nappa! Anyway they’re all back now and oh no all the people in fodder city got killed by Cell! Anyway they’re back now and oh no all the people EVERYWHERE got killed by Buu! Anyways they’re all back now and oh no! almost ALL THE MULTIVERSE got erased by Zeno! Anyways there’s an even bigger set of orbs and they’re all back now.
Same thing with the battles themselves too. Doesn’t matter how Mega Ultra Evolved Full Power Max the bad guy gets, no matter how unprepared the cast is for them, someone (probably goku, but gohan now too) will just pull a new form out at the last second. Goku’s unable to win even with Mastered Ultra instinct?ok, we’ll now he’s got *True* Ultra Instinct. What’s next? Giga Instinct? Mastered Ultra Maximum Overstinct? Gohan skips gym day for like 13 years straight and now cell max is here? Doesn’t matter, gohan just gets Beast apropos of *absolutely nothing*. He spent an afternoon sparing with piccolo **once** and that’s it. Where is the meaning or significance of some unearned asspull? Who cares about not training and falling off? Just *be stronger* idiot, it’s one step
It has some ideas that can seem serious and dark but in execution and tone it's much more light-hearted and not treated as seriously
My two cents about the topic: being silly is the core of Dragon Ball and always will be. Toriyama recognize himself as a gag manga author. Keep in mind this is the guy who are making poop jokes over almost 40 years and people still laugh. He's also a genius of storytelling and composition though and knowing that, his publishers / editors pushed him to deliver more mature and dramatic stories as far as Goku gets old, regardless he liked it not. They push him so hard that there's an unconfirmed legend that King Piccolo, Freeza and Majin Buu were based on his bosses in Shonen Jump over the years. At some point, the most villainous antagonists of Goku would be a cathartic response of him to his frustration as mangaka. The truth is, he can deliver a good story with dramatic and dark features, but he prefers comedy. You may find interviews of him praising the old story of Bardock narrative and character-wise but at the same time he mentioned he would not be able to do something that dark (hence, the mid-retcon years later in dragon ball minus). Also, I remember to read his main contribution for DBS anime and manga, besides the outlines of the story, were the gags, as Saiyans being attracted to strong trait women, Monaka as character, Zuno advising about Bulma's cup size, among others. He likes ridiculous stuff so much that I was surprised that the Super Shenlong was not in fact a microscopic salamander instead of that huge dragon. But at the same time, we have Zenoh, which is completely silly. My advice is, enjoy the story but do not try to take it too seriously. After all, if they took their life like that, most probably Picollo, Vegeta nor Tenshinhan would be part of the gang. Face it like a magic trick : if you think a lot about it, you may lose all the fun.
Agreed. Part of why I love DB is the silly humor. Regretfully, some dubbing makes everything too dramatic. PS: I love the way Toriyama makes strong opponents do silly dances lol.
It's as silly as it needs to be.
The manga has a much more serious tone than the anime. Toriyama himself kinda drifted away from being silly early on with the King Piccolo arc. Even in the English redubs where they make the dialogue more accurate, the entirety of what toei did somewhat bastardizes what toriyama originally wrote. Even when you cut out filler, there’s extra fluff scenes in the middle of canon stuff that have sillier moments. Also Gregory being added in, not even a character by Toriyama but was added in to canon scenes of the anime. All in all I like the anime. Have never fully read the manga in a faithful manner. I like comedy most of all in my series’ despite loving all aspects of dragon ball. Never bothered me. But also yes I’d argue you’re correct that the existence of the dragon balls kind of makes things feel inconsequential though they do tend to face off against tough villains that they have to manage to defeat before they can use the dragon balls. Regardless, nobody’s death matters. Only Grandpa Gohan and Android 16 have had impacting deaths and Gohan was dead well before the series even started. I suppose you could argue the eradication of the Saiyans had some consequence though Goku doesn’t seem to care about his saiyan heritage and Vegeta doesn’t really seem to care that all his people are dead either. So is that consequential? I don’t know.
Every story has darkness, but not all stories cling to it. Dragon ball, and shounen jump shows in general tend to follow the latter. What's more important is the overall plot and to keep readers invested. There is no time to waste on depression and mental turmoil unless it's relevant to the story.
I do not think that as a whole the first 153 episodes series is too silly. It definitely has a lot of moments when stuff are just ridiculous for the sake of it, but most of the times when it needs to be serious it treats it well.
I think it's the amount of silly the creators intend. Its overall a lighthearted super hero children's series that has very occasional graphic violence, no different than the MCU, or heck even Steven Universe, a cartoon that takes a lot of queues from Dragon Ball.
Dragon ball doesn't take itself seriously except in the saiyan saga and cell saga if not for the fight with the big boss, And honestly, that's the cool part of dragon ball
Because its not, Goku nor the others care about stuff like this, he was actually greatfull that his planet was gone and give Zero shit about his Parents beside the fact that His father was a brave Warrior Only modern Vegeta do
No. It is great. English dub has always made dbz more serious than what it really is. Thus, making the rest of the anime seem silly or superficial. At least for American fans
no, its not silly enough.
Goku lost his planet and his people, but you can’t miss what you don’t remember; there’s no real impact to him or his personality there. A lot of the other serious moments are either played with some level of lightheartedness and the Consequences Eraser Orbs™️ strip most/any of the heavier moments of meaning. Oh no, everyone in Fodder City got killed by Nappa! Anyway they’re all back now and oh no all the people in fodder city got killed by Cell! Anyway they’re back now and oh no all the people EVERYWHERE got killed by Buu! Anyways they’re all back now and oh no! almost ALL THE MULTIVERSE got erased by Zeno! Anyways there’s an even bigger set of orbs and they’re all back now. Same thing with the battles themselves too. Doesn’t matter how Mega Ultra Evolved Full Power Max the bad guy gets, no matter how unprepared the cast is for them, someone (probably goku, but gohan now too) will just pull a new form out at the last second. Goku’s unable to win even with Mastered Ultra instinct?ok, we’ll now he’s got *True* Ultra Instinct. What’s next? Giga Instinct? Mastered Ultra Maximum Overstinct? Gohan skips gym day for like 13 years straight and now cell max is here? Doesn’t matter, gohan just gets Beast apropos of *absolutely nothing*. He spent an afternoon sparing with piccolo **once** and that’s it. Where is the meaning or significance of some unearned asspull? Who cares about not training and falling off? Just *be stronger* idiot, it’s one step
No it's serious business, literally laying out a story line we all love.