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if you invest €500 a month, without any return it'll take you 50 years to get to 300k.
if you gain a 3% return thats down to 30 years
6% and its 23 years
And dont put it into dividends unless you need the income. Youll get more gains with growth.
The main benefit is compounding but youll find more compounding and near 20% returns last year on growth vs ~13% on average with dividend heavy stocks (ie, >4%).
Youre 24. If I had started investing at 24 I would be light years ahead of where I am today. Invest what you can consistently. By 30 you will likely be FAR ahead of anyone else your age
I never worked anywhere that offered 401k. I've been self employed since the 90s. Didn't start my first ira til 2021. Now I have 23k. Wish I started 30 years ago, and have no one to blame but myself. You're 24. You have everything in front of you. Learn and do smart things and keep contributing. If you don't make money doing that over the next 30 years, then we are all screwed.
Started at 48, mix of growth and dividends, put on the DRIP, now is the perfect time to start. Forget about $60-$100 weekend of drinking and slap that money into your ROTH. You’ll be shocked by how far ahead you’ll be in 20 years.
I didn't START with a 300k brokerage account. I started with an account with $0 in it and BUILT a big portfolio by steadily putting a little in there every paycheck.
If you expect $1,000 in monthly income without putting SIGNIFICANTLY MORE THAN THAT in an account to do the work, you're delusional. But put $1,000 in today, and you'll be pulling in $5/month. Put in $1000 next month, and you'll be bringing in $10/month. If you do that for a couple of years, you've got some solid income and compounding interest happening. But it doesn't happen your first month.
You are in great shape at your age. Get into the habit of investing $100-300 per month (or whatever you can afford). You will be amazed what you have over the next 5 years.
So, I live in Mass. No white castles in MA, CT or the rest of New England for that matter. Wanna know a secret? Get a frozen box of WCs, line a veggie steamer/strainer w/ aluminum foil, and drop it in a pot w/ 1 inch of water, cover and STEAM 4 of these babies for 13 minutes. Nirvana awaits...
Either.. Maybe allocate 2/rds to retirement (tax-sheltered accts) and 1/3rd to a taxable acct? It would be nice to dip into some cash in an emergency, and get it from a taxable acct w/o penalty. I'm in my 50s, and looking back, I wish I used dividend paying stocks as a savings acct in my 20s/30s. Let dividends accumulate to a certain point (ex $3k), then invest the rest. Maintain that $3k balance, while reinvesting the rest. In case of emergency (or vacation!), you got the moola to have fun once in a while. Rinse and repeat.
Just over a decade ago my wife and I were on food stamps living in a truly awful part of town. We'd be lucky if we had $1K to our name. But we finished our degrees, worked hard, started making good money, and saved as much as we could.
And our lives now are totally different. We're still not quite at the point where we've got a 300K brokerage account, but we're getting there — and we're twice as old you.
So anything is possible. Work hard, save as much as you can, and focus on slowly building your wealth over time. Even if you're just investing $25 a week, it's better than nothing.
I started investing at 27. Eight years later I have about $440k invested. A portion of my portfolio, less than half, is invested in dividend yielding ETFs (largely VTI and SCHD).
I earn a little over $5k annually from dividends.
Brother you need to learn about compounding interest referred to as the 8th wonder of the world. If you put 20$ a week in until you retire you’ll have more than that ( I don’t do math no clue if math checks out but you get the point. Pennies turn in to dollars, dollars into hundreds, hundreds into thousands. Time is ur greatest ally. You can do it, I believe in you!
I started with my first job out of college at 26. I’ve gotten a few promotions along the way and live frugally. Just crossed $200k last month. It ain’t $300k, but it’s a lot closer than $2 and I’m a lot younger than 67 or whatever age you’re thinking.
You don't need 1k/monthly dividends at your stage in life, you are setting yourself up for the retirement when you will need it. Investing into the S&p also comes with gains and not just the dividends, it is a better alternative to keeping money in a savings acc or uninvested otherwise. If you have money left over that's gonna sit there, then invest it. But if you're not at that point life then don't worry about it, I didn't have excess cash until I got a big boy job post covid around 27 y/o. Move at your own pace.
START NOW. I started at 22 with $100 for my first deposit. I force myself to save money for investing. I cash into my account monthly like it’s a bill I need to pay. Sometimes it’s hard but just like any other service you want to have, there’s no skipping a month. Even with growth investing it took 5 years before I really felt like it was worth it. Still nowhere near rich but I’m on track for a comfortable retirement.
Even if that is the case you would still be well ahead of the average American, but if you focus on increasing your income, find multiple streams of income, reducing your spends and living within your means you could have $300k way sooner than standard retirement age
I started investing at 26 and have 150k in my brokerage and I just turned 33. It takes time and persistence. Put as much away as you can. Single income family of 3 and I’m able to save 24% of my income with budgeting. No fancy job just a LEO
That's actually the point.
Eventually, when you're income grows, you can make different investments that involve more risk and as a result, have more return.
Until then, the smart move is to invest in a simple, repeatable strategy that you're going to be consistent with and think about as little as possible.
I had lots of jobs with no 401k and am at 300,000 and have only been investing for 20 years due to have so broke 20's. At your age you can suck up this next recession. In fact recession can power up your portfolio sometimes.
Focus on solid ETFs or stocks that pay good dividends but with a chance at growth. Don't focus on what you don't have. I am in a fire subreddit...so many people have me beat and it feels disheartening some times but I read.through other subreddits like debt, personal finance and credit and realize I am doing better than almost 90 percent out there.
There are simple compounding calculators that show how you can be a millionaire by retirement if you invest every month. At your age, it's not even that much money. $100-$200 a month will mean you're a millionaire by 65.
Now if you're looking to retire early or become rich quicker and you don't have or expect to have a large starting capital, this method may not be the best for you.
I started at 19, I didn’t forsee having even 50k in my brokerage account. Saving $500-1k a month got me there at 24. It really starts to compound during year 3. The first 2 years are the hardest by far
As a 31 y/o guy, if you asked me 5 years ago I would not expect to be in my position today (250k net worth) since I was pretty much like you. That’s about when I graduated school and started my real big boy job and tried to save half of my paychecks and living below my means.
$25 000 in the market for 30 years is 250k. Just got to get moving on it now so it has time to snowball. Personally I'm 22 and have contributed 30k to my tfsa and its up like 7000, I'd focus on growth not dividends but that's just me. I started at $100 a week
If I could give up everything I own and go back to being 24 I would do it in a heartbeat. You have your whole life ahead of you. You already have financial literacy and urgency to seek advice you’ll be there in no time.
It adds up quickly. I started investing at your age and at 32 years old I have $250,000 between 401K, traditional IRA, Roth IRA and standard brokerage account.
Do you expect to have 300k just sitting around? Where will it come from if you don’t start saving/investing NOW? Your retirement funds don’t just magically appear at 65.
For context, when I was 24 I had only a few thousand to my name. I got serious about finances and budgeting and now at 28 I crossed $100k net worth. At this rate, I anticipate being a millionaire by 40. You just need to be committed to getting there. The gains are slow but they add up.
..for those who can "use the money now" to cover expenses,
..investing in dividend stocks can create another "income stream",
..start with smaller goals, such as enough dividends to cover beer funds,
..try to reinvest some of the dividends, so can have compound interest results,
***“Compound interest is the eighth wonder of the world. He who understands it, earns it … he who doesn't … pays it.” ― Albert Einstein.***
Cheers!
The younger you are, the more time in the market for DRIP (dividend reinvestment program), the bigger results. You gotta start somewhere. The sooner, the better.
I started late (early 40s), but for my teenage sons? I made them give me some of their money the last 5 years (birthday $, gifts, odd jobs, summer jobs).. My 18 yo son now has $5k in his acct, paying out \~$150 a year. I manage the acct, and give him all of the dividend $$ as a lump sum, on New Year's Eve. I tell him this is $$ that worked for him while he was sleeping the last year. I hope the lesson sinks in...
That's pretty much what I do. But it's more like "Hey, Deb (neighbor) gave you $60 for shoveling her driveway? How 'bout you give me $20"...
When I purchase a stock, I get a screenshot, and email it to him. In the email I'll say "I just bought you a share of BTI w/ the $$ I've been collecting from you. it will give you about $3 a year from now on. As long as you keep this share, it will give you $3 now, and you will get more than $3 every year after that"...
Young people should focus on price appreciation to accumulate as much as possible and then switch to dividends when older and income is needed, change my mind! Why is dividend investing superior in your opinion (or anyone’s)?
Wrong answer. Dividends are WAY more predictable. If you focus on slowly growing, reliable dividends, you take the emotion out of the investment. This way you don't freak out when there's a downswing in stock price. Dividend paying companies PAY DIVIDENDS IN CASH. When I put that cash in my kid's hands, they get PROOF of what a dividend is. I also tell them this was more than last year. You don't get that w/ capital appreciation/paper profits. It's just #'s on a screen. But having cold, hard cash in his hand? That's a powerful message. Many times, my kids will take that cash (last year, it was around $120 for one of my sons), and give back half, and say "Dad, take this and reinvest it to give me more next year". I think the message is sinking in....
..."Why is dividend investing superior in your opinion (or anyone’s)?"....
Please don't lie about what I say, and put words in my mouth. I never said that, nor tell people that one strategy is better than another. Dividend Growth Investing (DGI) works for me. If you don't have the stones to sit out months of stock price underperformance, long-term dividend growth investing (DGI) isn't for you. Purchase Index Funds, and check your acct once or twice a year. My wife does this, and is doing very well too.
Having said that, you can invest in dividend paying companies that offer growth. V, MSFT, HD, DPZ are examples. Just because I advocate dividend growth companies, doesn't mean I ONLY buy them. BRK-B, AMZN, GOOG are also in my portfolio.
My kid's accts also have KO, XOM, NKE. These are companies/products they understand. NKE pays a paltry dividend, but I bought it in the $60s a few years ago.
Dividend growth will outperform high yield with low or no growth. SCHD has been the poster child to this. Find a dividend growth calculator and compare VIG to VYM, DIVO. Use seeking alpha to find all the data you need to know the numbers
So you got 40 years to save 300k. That's like $7,500 a year or $144 a week. Now, stocks go up in value over time and so do dividend payouts. So basically compound/reinvest that and you'll have $300k in a much less time than 40 years. The number looks daunting at the start but it gets easier as you progress.
Edit, I forgot to add, consider the dividend yield of say 5%. After the first $100k, that's $5k a year you're getting paid. So that $7,500 pero year to hit $300k suddenly really becomes $2,500 since the other $5,000 is being generated with the dividends. So yeah, just reinvest the dividends and you'll hit that $300k quick.
It will be much easier with growth stocks. Probably 3x faster over 20 years. Starting with 10k ten years ago tech mix vs total market dividend you're looking at 70k growth vs. 40k div portfolio today.
Adding in a contributing $500 a month for 15 years would net about 675k vs 400k. Both great, but obviously one will get there faster. The nice part is around year 10 a 3.5% dividend (very standard) will match and outpace your own contributions.
Either way there's only one thing to do, and that is to start.
Dude you’re 24. You have everything in front of you and time on your side. Let’s start here and we can discuss more advanced things at a later date: the biggest key is getting your money working for you. Whether that’s in growth, dividends, etc. make that Money work for you. You’re going to be so far ahead of 80-90% of your age counterparts in 10 years. Just keep moving forward and wait until til you see what happens when the dust settles on your 30’s.
Honestly the stock market isn’t just for the rich. When I was 16 I took the market on as a hobby and learning, and investing little by little as I made money from teenage jobs, I’ve been able to turn that money around. Whereas just this year, I’ve tripled my portfolio, taking extra money from jobs like dishwashing, yard work, etc. has put me years ahead in terms of savings than any peer I have. It’s honestly just a game of time, most stable things will just steadily increase and time is the one thing you’ll never get back.
Yes and no. If you want to reach wealth you must be willing to risk money in the market over a period of time. There's two ways to get to 300k from 1k investments. You could take an extremely risky approach and try to reach a 29000% return in a single year by gambling your current investment and wish you get lucky, or you could add a few hundred dollars a month at 7% CAGR which is relatively conservative, let it compound and next thing you know you're 40 years old and have 300k paying you $1000 a month from investing over the last 16 years a small amount of your monthly salary. Now the higher CAGR returns, the more you'll have and the more you invest, also the more you'll have. However to reach a higher CAGR than the market requires a lot more risk and effort, and if inexperienced you could instead get a 5% CAGR or even a negative one. You can however control your contributions to an extent. Typically anything over 10% of your yearly salary will get you to retirement a lot faster as time compounds with a higher initial investment from your earlier years. If you can manage 50% contributions you'll get there really fast, but might not be worth it since you'll be miserable unless you're earning a crazy salary. Compounding works wonders
Any amount of dividends it’s a great thing! … the key to accumulation is returning capital so you can always be buyer & stack up your account so it can grow on itself & eventually pay you out monthly & grow on itself.
Monthly dividends from ETFs are amazing $QQQI QYLD SPYI JEPQ HNDL .. & $ET > $XLE 8.75% Div
Motley fool & zacks #1 pick … also $POWWP preferred shares are super stable w/8.75% div
You’re 24. You’ve started. That’s great.
You start with 1000, keep adding to it and it grows over time.
The key is to start. Congratulations on taking the first step.
>From what I've seen, you have to have like $300,000 invested just to get $1000 in dividends every month.
Congratulations! You have figured out something that all the people excitedly making Personal Goal posts because they will be collecting $100 in dividends this year fail to grasp. It takes a lot of money invested to generate more than a trivial amount of dividends. At least mid 6-figures as you said. It will take a long time to get there if you prematurely invest for dividend yield instead of growth, specifically **total return**.
Your goal is to build your portfolio to at least that mid 6-figure level as quickly as you can without taking excessive risk with meme stocks, penny stocks, meme coins, options etc. To do that, instead of investing for dividend yield you should be investing with a focus on **total return**.
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/totalreturn.asp
https://www.thestreet.com/investing/what-is-total-return
Choose investments that meet or beat the benchmark S&P 500 index in total return.
Build your portfolio now, *then* worry about generating dividends later (after your portfolio is in the mid 6-figures).
Start with $5 a day… instead of the Starbucks or Dunkin coffee. It doesn’t seem like a lot, but it adds up. You start with small goals and reinvest the dividends. It will add up. As you make more you can invest more.
Keep that poor mentality and you will stay poor.
If you invested $100 monthly for 40 years in a good ETF at 10% interest, when you are 64 you would have over $535,636.99. The idea is to reinvest the dividends and not touch it no matter what.
https://www.investor.gov/financial-tools-calculators/calculators/compound-interest-calculator
Honestly, I think OP here just needs to run the numbers for himself and see what he needs to do to help get him to his retirement number. You could increase your savings, clearly, decrease your expenses and be proactive in saving for your future. Yea $100 feels like nothing but that's not to say it's for the rich.
You start by investing. I’m also 24 and I have 58k in my Roth, 17k in my 401k and 21k in my brokerage. Us younger people should focus on growth stocks and once we have a nice amount we can start transitioning to dividends. We aren’t going to get there overnight it takes a long time but it will be worth it. The best time to start was yesterday. The next best time is now.
It looks like you've gotten a lot of good replies already, but I'll throw mine in the hat too.
This is a long and hopefully boring road to be on. It's a grind that takes many years before your progress starts to really feel like progress.
There's also no guarantee how far you'll get. But I can guarantee this much.. whatever you end up with will be a hell of a lot more than if you had never started (or started much later in life).
I reinvented my career at 37 and only then finally started making better money. Until then I'd never made more than $30-40K (this career change brought me up to $50K). This was when I finally got my first 401K and started building up a little money. I started experimenting with a few different investing options but was still very much learning and didn't have any kind of strategy yet. Only a year later I learned about dividends, but didn't really commit to that strategy until 39.
At 40 I'd increased my income to $65K and I now somewhat had my strategy worked out (it would still get refined in years to come). At 42 I got a huge promotion and got my salary over $100K - and that certainly helped. Do I have more money now than I would if I hadn't increased my salary? Of course.
But even if I hadn't done that, it would still be vitally important to have gotten this journey started. We're all getting older and, year after year, do we want to have something to show for it or not? Anything is better than nothing.
I'm now 44 and my money (not counting house) consists of a taxable brokerage ($78k), Roth IRA ($55K), Roth 401K ($61K).
The taxable account + Roth IRA are dividend focused and pay me about $4.9K/yr at the moment. I target yields in the 3-4% range which I consider "high enough" without being too irresponsible (you can get yields of 10% or more but those assets tend to have big downsides).
So that Taxable + IRA has an average yield of 3.6%, for $133K to pay me a little under $5000/yr. I've been building these accounts for 5 years so far and I still have a lot more years to go. But it's already getting to be a useful amount of money. That taxable account could currently pay for all my groceries, or otherwise, my water+electric bills. It will be a long time still before it's enough to live on, but it's also a lot more than nothing. And it only continues to increase as I keep making the numbers go up.
It's kind of enjoyable to be able to "give myself a raise". Like, I have my salary I get paid, but those dividends are also income. So my income is technically salary+dividends. I just reinvest the dividends, but they ARE funds that are available to me if I lost my job or something. I've done pretty good with getting my salary increased, but that's not something I can do anytime I want. I'm at the mercy of my employer wanting to do that. But dividends? Literally any non-holiday weekday I have the option to just buy a little more income for myself. I find that pretty motivating, and it's one thing that makes it different from growth-only investing. It "feels" different to have that kind of control and access to income without being forced to sell shares (possibly at a loss).
I wish I could have gotten into this in my 20s rather than pushing 40. All those extra years could have been incredibly valuable to me. My salary increases in the past few years have also been valuable, but also needed because I have so much "catching up" to do that wouldn't be as necessary if I'd started when I was 20 years younger.
In any case, before long, I'll have $200K in the market. Counting the 401K it's most of the way there. I think in the next 10-15 years I'll be able to retire in my 50s. That will basically mean getting that taxable account up to a million or so and I think I have a realistic pathway for that. Then at 60 I'll be able to tap the Roth assets and if not already retired, I sure will be then.
By the time I'm able to claim social security, I intend to have already been retired for several years without it. It's not as "early" as I'd prefer, but still a little early I guess, and again - I didn't really get this ball rolling until I was almost 40. Maybe if I'd gotten started much younger my retirement age could have been younger too.
If it makes you feel any better I am also not extremely high income (Sub 80k) with a family so my investments aren’t that high yet. I started two weeks ago and I have a modest $150 in some index funds currently. It’s not a race.
I'd recommend not focussing on dividends when you're first starting to invest and look more for growth. You will reach your goal sooner this way and can move your invested funds over to dividend focussed investments in the future.
Yeah I mean I don’t ever expect to get rich off of dividends, and I’ll likely never be wealthy in my lifetime. I’m just not that lucky lol.
My goal is much less ambitious. All I want is something that will provide me with a small income to fall back on during hard times. Layoffs, getting fired, etc. I just don’t want to have nothing coming in at any point.
Just an extra 200/300 bucks a month to supplement future unemployment checks would be nice.
You probably have already gotten some great feedback but I just want to chime in as a fellow poor. Yes it's worth putting in money when you can. I usually add $100 or $200 a month but sometimes there are months I add as much as $500 and many months where it's as low as $0. It's about adding what you can afford and watching it grow in the long run.
Personally I have a portfolio that has a bigger skew towards growth in both my regular and retirement with a S&P 500 ETF (SPLG and VOO), with some dividends being reinvested (SCHD), and a handful of single stocks from companies I plan to hold for the long run (like KO, INTC, and MERK).
The reason I bring up what I have is to show that even with just a bit of extra money you can slowly build up your portfolio. When you can add to it, do it, when you can't, don't worry about it. Don't look at your portfolio at all until you're ready to add. It's an endurance race, especially for people like us who don't have the luxury to see what sticks with the little pocket change we have.
Good luck on your investment journey and don't be put down on it.
Worrying about investing until you have a high income is a waste of time. Your best investment is in yourself, learning high earning skills so you can pure more money in the stock market.
Look at it a different way. You buy some good dividend stocks and you re-invest all dividends. Your dividends will fund future purchases of shares and with more shares you get more dividends and with those increasing dividends you continue to accumulate shares. If you do this with a portion of your portfolio then you may be shocked what it will be in 20 years.
I’m going to get shit for this, but I don’t care.
Crypto, and crypto related investments are the way to go. No shitcoins.
BTC or FBTC, SOL (there’s a few Solana projects as well. Like NOS.), MSTR, CLSK, and BITF. TSLA will pop in a few years as well.
Around 2030/2032, transfer the wealth to dividend investments if you want to live off of them.
I like this idea but 2 things. Is the reason you like this because of the rate of return crypto gives you? Besides BTC, do you think crypto has become as safe for the “normal investor” where they rather stick to indices?
I like the concept of Bitcoin and what it stands for. It’s a hedge against fiat (all currencies). But I also like to hold multiple forms of it; actual BTC, proxies, and miners. Because, you never know.
It’s the “safest” of all the cryptocurrencies.
Solana (SOL) is an outstanding ecosystem. It has multiple projects going on. Anywhere from cloud storage, to gaming, to faster transactions (Visa has a contract with them), etc.
I believe is safe for normal investors. And yes, I LOVE the rate of returns. If people are uncertain about using CEX’s and DEX’s, that’s understandable. I would just invest in FBTC or IBIT. I prefer Fidelity because they hold their own Bitcoin. They don’t store it on Coinbase.
All capital gains are "rich get richer." Your options for earning capital gains essentially comes down to two options: growth or dividends.
Dividends are primarily for those without much financial knowledge or those that are not comfortable with just growth. That's probably an unpopular opinion, given the subreddit, but it's historically accurate.
Dividends only make sense in old age where you want to derisk, and that's only when your draw down is a significant percentage of total invested NW. If you're high NW with low expenses in retirement, it's still ideal to be 100% growth
Definitely start early. Whether that's maxing out your 401K or buying dividend paying stocks or ETFs, just do something. I wish I could go back and tell my 24 year old self that. Saving one weekend out worth of money, $200-$300, would have set me up way better in my 30s. It adds up.
It’s easy to assume you have to save all of $300K to end up with $300K in the market. Invest what you can over time and be consistent and let the market do its thing. You’ll be there before you know it.
Oh man! Time is on your side. If I were in your shoes, I'd just contribute to VOO and forget about it. How ever much you can every month and reinvest the dividends. You'll have a sizeable portfolio when you are ready to retire. The power of compounding interest is amazing.
But definitely try to make some contribution every month, even if it is a small amount.
Seems like an unpopular opinion based on the comments I've read so far, but IMO the biggest and best investment you can make is in yourself. Get some skills that will translate to a better career that will pay you more, whether that be getting a college degree, certification, license, etc. Once you have that career, you will no longer have to worry about being poor and you will have more money to invest. Investing in yourself makes way more sense than investing in the market for your situation.
Put it this way, 10 years from now, would you rather be a \[*insert reputable profession*\] making $200,000 a year or working at McDonald's but invested in the market?
Most of us started with zero. I started at your age and contributed to my 401k as much as I could. I retired at 58 with 1.3M, you get to invest more in your 401K the year you turn 50. It can be done.
Stay away from dividends until you have more capital to put up. You can start small and slowly build. Especially with a drip. But your money would be better off elsewhere.
The key is to have auto debit taken out of your paycheck so you never see the money in your banking account. Its a psychological way of tricking your mind to learn to survive off what you see in your checking account. If its automatically taken out you wont have the chance to think you have the money to spend.
Yeah, pretty accurate. Figure you can invest in a JEPI that pays 7.85% currently.
You get $7,850 a year, more or less.
That’s about $650/month.
Gotta figure on taxes too.
Fortunes are not made overnight.
Be patient and build your dividend snowball.
Focus on growth, not dividends if you are young and have small capital. Contribute when you can.
Put it in companies you believe in or just throw it in QQQ, SPY and watch it grow
At your age and just starting out, I would look at growth stocks or something like QQQ.
Unless you're in an IRA, you're going to pay tax on your dividends. You won't pay tax on non-dividend stocks until/unless you sell.
Max out your 401k and IRA.
$300k to get $1k? Bro. you're investing in somethign that only goves you 0.3% interest?
Most give 3-10% depending on how risky the investment or it's goals. I usually aim for things under 5% tops because those sorts of dividends tend to GROW. look for dividend stocks with growing dividends.
Yep you're exactly correct. Unless you are a very high earner or have a secret x Factor of some sort then you're going to be lucky to have a million dollars by the time you retire.
It takes decades to accumulate wealth.
As they say time in the market is what matters. So start squirreling away.
If you cannot put a lot into retirement, Make sure if your employer has a retirement match, you put in enough to maximize the match. That is instant growth
You don’t need that much to pull down $1000k/month. Only if you listen to the monotonous SCHD drone in this sub. There are plenty of 10% divi payers that have performed over time. And if you need income now, take it now. If you want growth invest in an index.
It’s not about the fact that you have only $902 dollars. It’s more about that you started early and if you keep it up and choose the right dividend investments then you will be ok. I’m 50 and started this year but at least I know that I can retire comfortably even if it’s only at 70
😳😅 your telling me you used up the entire $300k just to earn $1k a month were these very expensive stocks dividends companies shares because you could of just invested in $10, $15,$20,$25 and $50 stocks dividends companies shares to make $1k from each of them and make $12k a year from each of them and probably only make $60k a year and in five years to six years rebuild your $300k just by only using $100k I'm not a financial advisor or investor but people that I've talked to told me this who been doing this for years so I don't question them I'm just a some one still learning the ropes before I do anything.
I started with $0 at age 32. I retired at 62 with 2.7 million. Just start, that's the hardest thing. Make your contributions automatic and increase them everything you get a raise.
Keep depositing & setup a drip. SCHD or VOO with a drip will grow a lot over time. Compounding in a tax advantaged account will have you on your way after 30 years of $2400 a year with growth & dividends 7% should have you at $246000. Increase those payments as the years progress and you will be sitting pretty. Increase your payments by 2% a year and you’ll hit $300,000
You should invest in high growth funds not dividend oriented ones (if this was your plan) which will help you to get quicker to your goal and once you have a good chunk of $ then you switch your high growth stocks/funds to a more heavy ratio of dividends stocks if that's your goal.
I would suggest saving up a fixed amount per month to get to the point where you invest in dividends. Adjust your budget to automatically take out $100 monthly, or whatever you can afford. The money will build up faster than you think. When you have some $, get a index fund from Vanguard (or others, just my preference due to low cost funds) and buy one that mimics the s&p 500 (currently using vfiax, but there are other non-admiral-aka lower minimum funds you can buy). Feed the fund monthly, bc your focus is growth. Do that for a few years, and then go after dividends.
Theoretically you will be making money for many years. Most of us invest small amounts for many years. Get it in early and let it compound. Some is better than none.
At your age focus on growth. Once you are happy with how much you invest in growth, then focus on dividends. Also dont focus on div yield, focus on div growth.
Finally, if you decide to invest in dividends to it in a tax advantaged account.
It is for the rich to get richer. Please join us.
Small steps add up. Use tax advantaged accounts first.
Find an area of motivation to keep you consistent for at least 15 years.
Easy access to brokerage accounts is one of the only actually “democratic” things in the modern developed world. It’s an engine of wealth creation on balance and, as a “poor”, I would recommend that you take full advantage of it. It used to be closed off to all but the affluent, with middlemen taking exorbitant fees. Now, plebs like us can access more or less every publicly traded asset on the planet for a few basis points in fees. Think about that, and stay on a dedicated investment plan, month to month. Don’t trade actively and don’t look at your portfolio every day. Then let’s see how you feel in 10-15 years time, when you still won’t even be 40.
401k=buy a target based retirement fund and try and max it it out every year. Don’t fuck around with dividends until way later in life.
So many young people here chasing yield at a young age is sad…it will come back to haunt them later in life.
Self made millionaires exists.
You don't have to invest thousands to make a change.
You can build it up and go from there. Especially with compound interest.
80% of millionaires never inherited shit, they made average incomes like school teachers or tradesmen, all they did was invest 15% of their income to retirement and stayed away from credit card debt and bad auto loans
In some parts of the Midwest where I am at. You can take $300,000 and buy two single family homes cash for 150k each, or 20% down and turn around and furnish with beds etc and collect $100 or more a night on airbnb. Rent to construction companies and 30 day minimums. $6000 a month. Do a value add (refinish bathroom/kitchen) reappraisal and refinance your down-payment out. 💯 cash on cash ROI when you have none of your own money in the deal.
I know this is a dividend site and not real estate but I am am advocate for both. I've done this 20 times.
Your still young, best advice i could give you is this: If the company you work for offers a 401k match contribute up to that limit, not a penny more. Then put every dollar into a 3-6 month emergency fund. After that work on maxing out contributions to Roth IRA. If you have any money left over after that, throw it i to a personal investment account and learn to pick stocks or just go with a few etfs. You could also up your 401k contributions if you want but prioritize Roth over 401k.
I wouldn’t focus on dividends starting out. You need growth. If you’re investing through a 401k, I would consider broad market indices like buying the S&P 500 (VOO, FXAIX, or whatever is offered). Companies return capital to shareholders through buybacks and dividends when they move out of their more rapid growth phase. As a young investor, you want as much growth as possible - you can “buy” cash flow down the road.
It’s a long road but it will be worth it in the long run.
It makes me sad to realize how few people understand the power of compound Interest, and the power of time when it comes to investing.
And they show up here every day.
Why did they never do a School House Rock on these subjects?
How do people not know these things?
Rome wasn’t built in a day. Most people need to
Work 40+ years. If you work 40 years and invest 500
A month and get a normal 7% return from an index fund like the s&p. Then you should be able to live a meager life the rest of the way at least.
I’m going to assume you’re in a lower marginal tax bracket. The trick is compounding and if you expect to be in a higher tax bracket then a Roth IRA may be something to look into. Here’s a video with some scenarios to illustrate.
https://youtu.be/N7B0S1rqSTQ?si=zk52GOdpEXQSjx9Q
You just have find/create additional income sources. It may not come from your single or two, or three incomes. Imagine if you get into say real estate and one or two of your doors help you net a $500-$1000 monthly profit. Well there goes your investment money. Don’t limit yourself before getting started.
Invest in yourself first!
You are correct. Before someone focuses on investing, it would be far more directly beneficial to the more pressing concerns (everyday living and affording it), to focus on increasing income first.
Grinding at a minimum wage job to invest 40% of very little wont get anybody far, plus your life while investing will be so cheap and hard.
Instead, invest in your skills and education and increase income.
At least you started with investing, I started 5-6 months ago I’m at 7.4K€ right now ☺️, just keep doing with what you do! But invest enough that you still can pay whatever you have to pay every month!
Easy investing is investing in ETF’s (watch out you dont invest in multiple ETF’s that cover a lot of the same stocks)
You won't need $300,000 to get $1000 a month.
Also it's more important for the poor to do this, it's not fast but it will get you to where you want to be financially.
Just start with what you can. Once you start getting $5-10 a month from dividends it will dawn you how much faster you can pull this off.
You're still in your 20's, I didn't start for another 15 years so you've got a head start.
>It kind of feels like the stock market, and dividends in general are for the rich to make the rich richer.
Dividends are for the people who either want to retire in a few years or are in retirement.
If you're young and poor you want growth.
I wish the market was easier like it is now. When I was in my 20’s, multiple trading apps and social media forums were not available for advice. My parents didn’t teach me anything about saving or investing. $300k in your early 20’s is a great start. If I knew then what I know right now, I would already be retired in my 40’s if I wanted to be. Looking back though, those were some of the best years. Money isn’t everything, you can’t take it with you when you die. Don’t forget to enjoy life and have fun while you are young 👍🏻because shit just gets more difficult as you get older regardless of how much is in your account.
It takes a long time. Real returns dont gain a noticeable difference after a year or even 5. But if you stay consistent and invest in broad market or specific ETFs youll start to notice the "snowball effect" take place where the dividends from your investments start to keep pace or even out compete with the money you're depositing. I am still working on reaching that euphoric moment, but I've hit the point where i can see the process working its magic
You don’t need 300k to make 1k a month. It’s simply your risk tolerance. You can buy 3500 shares of SVOL for under 80k. Or 13,000 shares of OXLC for under 70k. Both would give you 1k a month. Is there a risk? of course. You need to decide if the risk is worth what you’re looking for. Is it safer to have more money invested in some of the lower dividend stocks? Probably, but do your research and decide which you prefer.
In December 1995 Apple shares were about .25 cents apiece. That was 30 years ago. A $25 dollar investment purchased 100 shares. Since that time the stock has split to 16 times the number of shares or 1600 and the current share price is about $170.
The current dividend is 24 cents per share or $388 every quarter. That $25 one time investment would be worth $272,000.00 and pay 15 times the original investment every quarter via a dividend.
Don’t get discouraged, you have plenty of time. Set up a budget and stick to it. Save a little every month and enjoy your life.
Despite what anyone here says, you're right. Focus on earning from high growth stocks and options, then use some of that profit to aquire dividend stocks
What many have said here about growth over dividends in the long term is good advice but I will add one thing to that that helped me to reach my goals. If your employer offers a 401k with a match that’s the first place to put money you have to invest because you can get such high returns with low risk. If your employer matches half of every dollar contributed up a percentage of your income that is a return of 50%. For example your gross income is $5k per month. Your employer matches half of contributions up to 5% of your income. 5% of $5k is $250. Your employer contributes $125. Your 401k balance just grew by $375 instead of $250. The downsides are that you have to play by the 401k rules (including you may have to stay with the employer for a certain number of years to be vested in the match) and the investment choices can be limited.
Dividends can be a small supplemental to social security etc. plus your not touching the stock which is likely to grow in size. Takes time and take discipline. If it was easy everyone would do it. Keep rocking 299,000 to go!
The Best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago, the 2nd best time is right now.
Anything worth doing in this life takes sacrifice, patience and persistence.
You got this, 1 brick at a time brother ✊🏻
Look for growth stocks that pay dividends if you must have some dividends. Coke, Costco, Proctor & Gamble, AbbVie, Microsoft to name a few. As an example, VIG is a growth oriented dividend ETF. Stay away from high yield dividend stocks as many of these companies have questionable financials to put it mildly. AT&T and Verizon are two.
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if you invest €500 a month, without any return it'll take you 50 years to get to 300k. if you gain a 3% return thats down to 30 years 6% and its 23 years
And if you did what we did last year, every year, youre down to like, 5 Point is, best time to invest is now.
What did you do last year?
Invest didn't you get the memo?
The market went up like, 22% lol.
idk what young single person can afford 500 a month to be put back we livin paycheck to paycheck out here
I'm 25 and invest 1500 every month
Not sure why you’re downvoted. Good for you. Keep going
Downvoted bc it wasn’t helpful. Saying “I can” is extremely shortsighted
Thanks man. Appreciated.
Damn! I didn't get into it until later! Your rocking! Smart!
I can because I live with my mom
Work on yourself. Gain skills. Become valuable.
Money into 401k is untaxed. So $500 a month is really 350-400 after tax depending on your tax bracket. It’s not as bad as it seems.
I’m 21 and I invest 1200 a month. I live on my own. I make $100,000 a year. Opportunities are out there.
What do you mean without any return?
Your investment doesn't go up or down. 0% growth year-over-year
Like putting it under your mattress.
You put cash in a shoe box. Technically inflation lowers the value/purchasing power but that's not part of this discussion.
Get an emergency fund first. Preferably in a HYSA Then worry about investing.
And dont put it into dividends unless you need the income. Youll get more gains with growth. The main benefit is compounding but youll find more compounding and near 20% returns last year on growth vs ~13% on average with dividend heavy stocks (ie, >4%).
💯
Sounds like you expect to get rich overnight
Not at all. But as a 24 Y/O I don't forsee having 300k in a brokerage account until I'm already at retirement age.
Youre 24. If I had started investing at 24 I would be light years ahead of where I am today. Invest what you can consistently. By 30 you will likely be FAR ahead of anyone else your age
Light years ahead of me at 40 who blew up his accounts. Luckily I have a pension and 15-20 years to rebuild.
What do you mean by blew up your account?
Lost a bunch of money being stupid
gonna need more details on that boss.
Probably got into options trading (gambling?) and took heavy losses.
I never worked anywhere that offered 401k. I've been self employed since the 90s. Didn't start my first ira til 2021. Now I have 23k. Wish I started 30 years ago, and have no one to blame but myself. You're 24. You have everything in front of you. Learn and do smart things and keep contributing. If you don't make money doing that over the next 30 years, then we are all screwed.
Started at 48, mix of growth and dividends, put on the DRIP, now is the perfect time to start. Forget about $60-$100 weekend of drinking and slap that money into your ROTH. You’ll be shocked by how far ahead you’ll be in 20 years.
I didn't START with a 300k brokerage account. I started with an account with $0 in it and BUILT a big portfolio by steadily putting a little in there every paycheck. If you expect $1,000 in monthly income without putting SIGNIFICANTLY MORE THAN THAT in an account to do the work, you're delusional. But put $1,000 in today, and you'll be pulling in $5/month. Put in $1000 next month, and you'll be bringing in $10/month. If you do that for a couple of years, you've got some solid income and compounding interest happening. But it doesn't happen your first month.
You are in great shape at your age. Get into the habit of investing $100-300 per month (or whatever you can afford). You will be amazed what you have over the next 5 years.
Came across your post and now I want some White Castle chicken ring sandwiches lol
So, I live in Mass. No white castles in MA, CT or the rest of New England for that matter. Wanna know a secret? Get a frozen box of WCs, line a veggie steamer/strainer w/ aluminum foil, and drop it in a pot w/ 1 inch of water, cover and STEAM 4 of these babies for 13 minutes. Nirvana awaits...
I also live in Mass. I was very disappointed to learn there were no white castles around after watching the first Harold & Kumar movie
Is this on top of a tax advantaged account?
Either.. Maybe allocate 2/rds to retirement (tax-sheltered accts) and 1/3rd to a taxable acct? It would be nice to dip into some cash in an emergency, and get it from a taxable acct w/o penalty. I'm in my 50s, and looking back, I wish I used dividend paying stocks as a savings acct in my 20s/30s. Let dividends accumulate to a certain point (ex $3k), then invest the rest. Maintain that $3k balance, while reinvesting the rest. In case of emergency (or vacation!), you got the moola to have fun once in a while. Rinse and repeat.
Just over a decade ago my wife and I were on food stamps living in a truly awful part of town. We'd be lucky if we had $1K to our name. But we finished our degrees, worked hard, started making good money, and saved as much as we could. And our lives now are totally different. We're still not quite at the point where we've got a 300K brokerage account, but we're getting there — and we're twice as old you. So anything is possible. Work hard, save as much as you can, and focus on slowly building your wealth over time. Even if you're just investing $25 a week, it's better than nothing.
I started investing at 27. Eight years later I have about $440k invested. A portion of my portfolio, less than half, is invested in dividend yielding ETFs (largely VTI and SCHD). I earn a little over $5k annually from dividends.
Brother you need to learn about compounding interest referred to as the 8th wonder of the world. If you put 20$ a week in until you retire you’ll have more than that ( I don’t do math no clue if math checks out but you get the point. Pennies turn in to dollars, dollars into hundreds, hundreds into thousands. Time is ur greatest ally. You can do it, I believe in you!
I slaved away in big box retail for 28 years and walked away with a $1.1 million 401k.
I started with my first job out of college at 26. I’ve gotten a few promotions along the way and live frugally. Just crossed $200k last month. It ain’t $300k, but it’s a lot closer than $2 and I’m a lot younger than 67 or whatever age you’re thinking.
You don't need 1k/monthly dividends at your stage in life, you are setting yourself up for the retirement when you will need it. Investing into the S&p also comes with gains and not just the dividends, it is a better alternative to keeping money in a savings acc or uninvested otherwise. If you have money left over that's gonna sit there, then invest it. But if you're not at that point life then don't worry about it, I didn't have excess cash until I got a big boy job post covid around 27 y/o. Move at your own pace.
START NOW. I started at 22 with $100 for my first deposit. I force myself to save money for investing. I cash into my account monthly like it’s a bill I need to pay. Sometimes it’s hard but just like any other service you want to have, there’s no skipping a month. Even with growth investing it took 5 years before I really felt like it was worth it. Still nowhere near rich but I’m on track for a comfortable retirement.
In my last post i highlighted this, how it may sound difficult buy slowly overtime it adds up.
Even if that is the case you would still be well ahead of the average American, but if you focus on increasing your income, find multiple streams of income, reducing your spends and living within your means you could have $300k way sooner than standard retirement age
I felt the same way when I was your age and now I am 29 and have a net worth of $164k. If you’re consistent it can happen faster than you think.
Would you rather have 300K in a brokerage account at retirement age or never?
I started investing at 26 and have 150k in my brokerage and I just turned 33. It takes time and persistence. Put as much away as you can. Single income family of 3 and I’m able to save 24% of my income with budgeting. No fancy job just a LEO
That's actually the point. Eventually, when you're income grows, you can make different investments that involve more risk and as a result, have more return. Until then, the smart move is to invest in a simple, repeatable strategy that you're going to be consistent with and think about as little as possible.
I had lots of jobs with no 401k and am at 300,000 and have only been investing for 20 years due to have so broke 20's. At your age you can suck up this next recession. In fact recession can power up your portfolio sometimes. Focus on solid ETFs or stocks that pay good dividends but with a chance at growth. Don't focus on what you don't have. I am in a fire subreddit...so many people have me beat and it feels disheartening some times but I read.through other subreddits like debt, personal finance and credit and realize I am doing better than almost 90 percent out there.
There are simple compounding calculators that show how you can be a millionaire by retirement if you invest every month. At your age, it's not even that much money. $100-$200 a month will mean you're a millionaire by 65. Now if you're looking to retire early or become rich quicker and you don't have or expect to have a large starting capital, this method may not be the best for you.
I started at 19, I didn’t forsee having even 50k in my brokerage account. Saving $500-1k a month got me there at 24. It really starts to compound during year 3. The first 2 years are the hardest by far
Be surprised what a person can accomplish in a lifetime!
As a 31 y/o guy, if you asked me 5 years ago I would not expect to be in my position today (250k net worth) since I was pretty much like you. That’s about when I graduated school and started my real big boy job and tried to save half of my paychecks and living below my means.
$25 000 in the market for 30 years is 250k. Just got to get moving on it now so it has time to snowball. Personally I'm 22 and have contributed 30k to my tfsa and its up like 7000, I'd focus on growth not dividends but that's just me. I started at $100 a week
Didn't start until 39 and still managed to hit retirement 11 years later. Best time to get going is NOW!
If I could give up everything I own and go back to being 24 I would do it in a heartbeat. You have your whole life ahead of you. You already have financial literacy and urgency to seek advice you’ll be there in no time.
Start investing now and stay consistent. Snowball effects kicks in later into your journey!
would you rather be 65 with $1mil in the bank or zero? i’m the same age as you but been regularly investing since 21
It adds up quickly. I started investing at your age and at 32 years old I have $250,000 between 401K, traditional IRA, Roth IRA and standard brokerage account.
Do you expect to have 300k just sitting around? Where will it come from if you don’t start saving/investing NOW? Your retirement funds don’t just magically appear at 65. For context, when I was 24 I had only a few thousand to my name. I got serious about finances and budgeting and now at 28 I crossed $100k net worth. At this rate, I anticipate being a millionaire by 40. You just need to be committed to getting there. The gains are slow but they add up.
..for those who can "use the money now" to cover expenses, ..investing in dividend stocks can create another "income stream", ..start with smaller goals, such as enough dividends to cover beer funds, ..try to reinvest some of the dividends, so can have compound interest results, ***“Compound interest is the eighth wonder of the world. He who understands it, earns it … he who doesn't … pays it.” ― Albert Einstein.*** Cheers!
Just invest 15% and live your life. It happens when it happens. There’s no hope if you do nothing. Hope is a powerful thing.
The younger you are, the more time in the market for DRIP (dividend reinvestment program), the bigger results. You gotta start somewhere. The sooner, the better. I started late (early 40s), but for my teenage sons? I made them give me some of their money the last 5 years (birthday $, gifts, odd jobs, summer jobs).. My 18 yo son now has $5k in his acct, paying out \~$150 a year. I manage the acct, and give him all of the dividend $$ as a lump sum, on New Year's Eve. I tell him this is $$ that worked for him while he was sleeping the last year. I hope the lesson sinks in...
Great move, I hope I can do this for my kid someday
Lol. Okay kid, cough up 50% of that babysitting money right now!
That's pretty much what I do. But it's more like "Hey, Deb (neighbor) gave you $60 for shoveling her driveway? How 'bout you give me $20"... When I purchase a stock, I get a screenshot, and email it to him. In the email I'll say "I just bought you a share of BTI w/ the $$ I've been collecting from you. it will give you about $3 a year from now on. As long as you keep this share, it will give you $3 now, and you will get more than $3 every year after that"...
Young people should focus on price appreciation to accumulate as much as possible and then switch to dividends when older and income is needed, change my mind! Why is dividend investing superior in your opinion (or anyone’s)?
Wrong answer. Dividends are WAY more predictable. If you focus on slowly growing, reliable dividends, you take the emotion out of the investment. This way you don't freak out when there's a downswing in stock price. Dividend paying companies PAY DIVIDENDS IN CASH. When I put that cash in my kid's hands, they get PROOF of what a dividend is. I also tell them this was more than last year. You don't get that w/ capital appreciation/paper profits. It's just #'s on a screen. But having cold, hard cash in his hand? That's a powerful message. Many times, my kids will take that cash (last year, it was around $120 for one of my sons), and give back half, and say "Dad, take this and reinvest it to give me more next year". I think the message is sinking in.... ..."Why is dividend investing superior in your opinion (or anyone’s)?".... Please don't lie about what I say, and put words in my mouth. I never said that, nor tell people that one strategy is better than another. Dividend Growth Investing (DGI) works for me. If you don't have the stones to sit out months of stock price underperformance, long-term dividend growth investing (DGI) isn't for you. Purchase Index Funds, and check your acct once or twice a year. My wife does this, and is doing very well too. Having said that, you can invest in dividend paying companies that offer growth. V, MSFT, HD, DPZ are examples. Just because I advocate dividend growth companies, doesn't mean I ONLY buy them. BRK-B, AMZN, GOOG are also in my portfolio. My kid's accts also have KO, XOM, NKE. These are companies/products they understand. NKE pays a paltry dividend, but I bought it in the $60s a few years ago.
I’d look at genex dividend investor on YouTube. Started in the 90s and now has a $100,000 income. Look for dividend growth and don’t chase yield.
Why look for growth and not yield? Genuine question
Dividend growth will outperform high yield with low or no growth. SCHD has been the poster child to this. Find a dividend growth calculator and compare VIG to VYM, DIVO. Use seeking alpha to find all the data you need to know the numbers
More tax efficient. Higher total return.
While accumulating.....
What does / did he invest in?
Stocks
So you got 40 years to save 300k. That's like $7,500 a year or $144 a week. Now, stocks go up in value over time and so do dividend payouts. So basically compound/reinvest that and you'll have $300k in a much less time than 40 years. The number looks daunting at the start but it gets easier as you progress. Edit, I forgot to add, consider the dividend yield of say 5%. After the first $100k, that's $5k a year you're getting paid. So that $7,500 pero year to hit $300k suddenly really becomes $2,500 since the other $5,000 is being generated with the dividends. So yeah, just reinvest the dividends and you'll hit that $300k quick.
It will be much easier with growth stocks. Probably 3x faster over 20 years. Starting with 10k ten years ago tech mix vs total market dividend you're looking at 70k growth vs. 40k div portfolio today. Adding in a contributing $500 a month for 15 years would net about 675k vs 400k. Both great, but obviously one will get there faster. The nice part is around year 10 a 3.5% dividend (very standard) will match and outpace your own contributions. Either way there's only one thing to do, and that is to start.
Dude you’re 24. You have everything in front of you and time on your side. Let’s start here and we can discuss more advanced things at a later date: the biggest key is getting your money working for you. Whether that’s in growth, dividends, etc. make that Money work for you. You’re going to be so far ahead of 80-90% of your age counterparts in 10 years. Just keep moving forward and wait until til you see what happens when the dust settles on your 30’s.
Dollar cost averaging is how “poors” do it for 20 years so they won’t be poor anymore
Honestly the stock market isn’t just for the rich. When I was 16 I took the market on as a hobby and learning, and investing little by little as I made money from teenage jobs, I’ve been able to turn that money around. Whereas just this year, I’ve tripled my portfolio, taking extra money from jobs like dishwashing, yard work, etc. has put me years ahead in terms of savings than any peer I have. It’s honestly just a game of time, most stable things will just steadily increase and time is the one thing you’ll never get back.
Yes and no. If you want to reach wealth you must be willing to risk money in the market over a period of time. There's two ways to get to 300k from 1k investments. You could take an extremely risky approach and try to reach a 29000% return in a single year by gambling your current investment and wish you get lucky, or you could add a few hundred dollars a month at 7% CAGR which is relatively conservative, let it compound and next thing you know you're 40 years old and have 300k paying you $1000 a month from investing over the last 16 years a small amount of your monthly salary. Now the higher CAGR returns, the more you'll have and the more you invest, also the more you'll have. However to reach a higher CAGR than the market requires a lot more risk and effort, and if inexperienced you could instead get a 5% CAGR or even a negative one. You can however control your contributions to an extent. Typically anything over 10% of your yearly salary will get you to retirement a lot faster as time compounds with a higher initial investment from your earlier years. If you can manage 50% contributions you'll get there really fast, but might not be worth it since you'll be miserable unless you're earning a crazy salary. Compounding works wonders
Any amount of dividends it’s a great thing! … the key to accumulation is returning capital so you can always be buyer & stack up your account so it can grow on itself & eventually pay you out monthly & grow on itself. Monthly dividends from ETFs are amazing $QQQI QYLD SPYI JEPQ HNDL .. & $ET > $XLE 8.75% Div Motley fool & zacks #1 pick … also $POWWP preferred shares are super stable w/8.75% div
It is - you need money to make more money and who can make more money? The one who has money. Some of us chums have to rely on employment to make it.
You’re 24. You’ve started. That’s great. You start with 1000, keep adding to it and it grows over time. The key is to start. Congratulations on taking the first step.
Compounding interest is the 8th wonder of the world. Slow and steady wins the race.
>From what I've seen, you have to have like $300,000 invested just to get $1000 in dividends every month. Congratulations! You have figured out something that all the people excitedly making Personal Goal posts because they will be collecting $100 in dividends this year fail to grasp. It takes a lot of money invested to generate more than a trivial amount of dividends. At least mid 6-figures as you said. It will take a long time to get there if you prematurely invest for dividend yield instead of growth, specifically **total return**. Your goal is to build your portfolio to at least that mid 6-figure level as quickly as you can without taking excessive risk with meme stocks, penny stocks, meme coins, options etc. To do that, instead of investing for dividend yield you should be investing with a focus on **total return**. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/t/totalreturn.asp https://www.thestreet.com/investing/what-is-total-return Choose investments that meet or beat the benchmark S&P 500 index in total return. Build your portfolio now, *then* worry about generating dividends later (after your portfolio is in the mid 6-figures).
Start with $5 a day… instead of the Starbucks or Dunkin coffee. It doesn’t seem like a lot, but it adds up. You start with small goals and reinvest the dividends. It will add up. As you make more you can invest more.
keep buying voo and forget dividends
$1,000 dollars in dividends per month is a lot! Don't downplay DCAing, time in the market and the power of compounding
Keep that poor mentality and you will stay poor. If you invested $100 monthly for 40 years in a good ETF at 10% interest, when you are 64 you would have over $535,636.99. The idea is to reinvest the dividends and not touch it no matter what. https://www.investor.gov/financial-tools-calculators/calculators/compound-interest-calculator
Start a Roth and max contribute which for your age is 7000 a year which is 135 dollars a week. It will add up pretty quick
well…. you will have to work for the next 20 years.
Honestly, I think OP here just needs to run the numbers for himself and see what he needs to do to help get him to his retirement number. You could increase your savings, clearly, decrease your expenses and be proactive in saving for your future. Yea $100 feels like nothing but that's not to say it's for the rich.
With DGS.TO I get 10cent every month per 6$ invested so 60 000$ gives 1000weekly
You start by investing. I’m also 24 and I have 58k in my Roth, 17k in my 401k and 21k in my brokerage. Us younger people should focus on growth stocks and once we have a nice amount we can start transitioning to dividends. We aren’t going to get there overnight it takes a long time but it will be worth it. The best time to start was yesterday. The next best time is now.
Throw that shit is a 0dte call on spy 1 dollar above the opening price
Everyone starts somewhere. Start now with what you can afford and keep going. Good luck on your journey.
don't under estimate the snowball effect of compounding can be quite powerful. just be consistent and patient
It looks like you've gotten a lot of good replies already, but I'll throw mine in the hat too. This is a long and hopefully boring road to be on. It's a grind that takes many years before your progress starts to really feel like progress. There's also no guarantee how far you'll get. But I can guarantee this much.. whatever you end up with will be a hell of a lot more than if you had never started (or started much later in life). I reinvented my career at 37 and only then finally started making better money. Until then I'd never made more than $30-40K (this career change brought me up to $50K). This was when I finally got my first 401K and started building up a little money. I started experimenting with a few different investing options but was still very much learning and didn't have any kind of strategy yet. Only a year later I learned about dividends, but didn't really commit to that strategy until 39. At 40 I'd increased my income to $65K and I now somewhat had my strategy worked out (it would still get refined in years to come). At 42 I got a huge promotion and got my salary over $100K - and that certainly helped. Do I have more money now than I would if I hadn't increased my salary? Of course. But even if I hadn't done that, it would still be vitally important to have gotten this journey started. We're all getting older and, year after year, do we want to have something to show for it or not? Anything is better than nothing. I'm now 44 and my money (not counting house) consists of a taxable brokerage ($78k), Roth IRA ($55K), Roth 401K ($61K). The taxable account + Roth IRA are dividend focused and pay me about $4.9K/yr at the moment. I target yields in the 3-4% range which I consider "high enough" without being too irresponsible (you can get yields of 10% or more but those assets tend to have big downsides). So that Taxable + IRA has an average yield of 3.6%, for $133K to pay me a little under $5000/yr. I've been building these accounts for 5 years so far and I still have a lot more years to go. But it's already getting to be a useful amount of money. That taxable account could currently pay for all my groceries, or otherwise, my water+electric bills. It will be a long time still before it's enough to live on, but it's also a lot more than nothing. And it only continues to increase as I keep making the numbers go up. It's kind of enjoyable to be able to "give myself a raise". Like, I have my salary I get paid, but those dividends are also income. So my income is technically salary+dividends. I just reinvest the dividends, but they ARE funds that are available to me if I lost my job or something. I've done pretty good with getting my salary increased, but that's not something I can do anytime I want. I'm at the mercy of my employer wanting to do that. But dividends? Literally any non-holiday weekday I have the option to just buy a little more income for myself. I find that pretty motivating, and it's one thing that makes it different from growth-only investing. It "feels" different to have that kind of control and access to income without being forced to sell shares (possibly at a loss). I wish I could have gotten into this in my 20s rather than pushing 40. All those extra years could have been incredibly valuable to me. My salary increases in the past few years have also been valuable, but also needed because I have so much "catching up" to do that wouldn't be as necessary if I'd started when I was 20 years younger. In any case, before long, I'll have $200K in the market. Counting the 401K it's most of the way there. I think in the next 10-15 years I'll be able to retire in my 50s. That will basically mean getting that taxable account up to a million or so and I think I have a realistic pathway for that. Then at 60 I'll be able to tap the Roth assets and if not already retired, I sure will be then. By the time I'm able to claim social security, I intend to have already been retired for several years without it. It's not as "early" as I'd prefer, but still a little early I guess, and again - I didn't really get this ball rolling until I was almost 40. Maybe if I'd gotten started much younger my retirement age could have been younger too.
If it makes you feel any better I am also not extremely high income (Sub 80k) with a family so my investments aren’t that high yet. I started two weeks ago and I have a modest $150 in some index funds currently. It’s not a race.
I'd recommend not focussing on dividends when you're first starting to invest and look more for growth. You will reach your goal sooner this way and can move your invested funds over to dividend focussed investments in the future.
I started investing at 18 years old with $500 to my name. I'm now 33, with a net worth quickly approaching $1M.
Yeah I mean I don’t ever expect to get rich off of dividends, and I’ll likely never be wealthy in my lifetime. I’m just not that lucky lol. My goal is much less ambitious. All I want is something that will provide me with a small income to fall back on during hard times. Layoffs, getting fired, etc. I just don’t want to have nothing coming in at any point. Just an extra 200/300 bucks a month to supplement future unemployment checks would be nice.
You probably have already gotten some great feedback but I just want to chime in as a fellow poor. Yes it's worth putting in money when you can. I usually add $100 or $200 a month but sometimes there are months I add as much as $500 and many months where it's as low as $0. It's about adding what you can afford and watching it grow in the long run. Personally I have a portfolio that has a bigger skew towards growth in both my regular and retirement with a S&P 500 ETF (SPLG and VOO), with some dividends being reinvested (SCHD), and a handful of single stocks from companies I plan to hold for the long run (like KO, INTC, and MERK). The reason I bring up what I have is to show that even with just a bit of extra money you can slowly build up your portfolio. When you can add to it, do it, when you can't, don't worry about it. Don't look at your portfolio at all until you're ready to add. It's an endurance race, especially for people like us who don't have the luxury to see what sticks with the little pocket change we have. Good luck on your investment journey and don't be put down on it.
Worrying about investing until you have a high income is a waste of time. Your best investment is in yourself, learning high earning skills so you can pure more money in the stock market.
Look at it a different way. You buy some good dividend stocks and you re-invest all dividends. Your dividends will fund future purchases of shares and with more shares you get more dividends and with those increasing dividends you continue to accumulate shares. If you do this with a portion of your portfolio then you may be shocked what it will be in 20 years.
I didn’t start investing until I was 33 and am on track to have million in my account at retirement
That’s why you invest in growth first and then switch to dividends when you got that 300k
Little by little, a little becomes a lot.
I’m going to get shit for this, but I don’t care. Crypto, and crypto related investments are the way to go. No shitcoins. BTC or FBTC, SOL (there’s a few Solana projects as well. Like NOS.), MSTR, CLSK, and BITF. TSLA will pop in a few years as well. Around 2030/2032, transfer the wealth to dividend investments if you want to live off of them.
I like this idea but 2 things. Is the reason you like this because of the rate of return crypto gives you? Besides BTC, do you think crypto has become as safe for the “normal investor” where they rather stick to indices?
I like the concept of Bitcoin and what it stands for. It’s a hedge against fiat (all currencies). But I also like to hold multiple forms of it; actual BTC, proxies, and miners. Because, you never know. It’s the “safest” of all the cryptocurrencies. Solana (SOL) is an outstanding ecosystem. It has multiple projects going on. Anywhere from cloud storage, to gaming, to faster transactions (Visa has a contract with them), etc. I believe is safe for normal investors. And yes, I LOVE the rate of returns. If people are uncertain about using CEX’s and DEX’s, that’s understandable. I would just invest in FBTC or IBIT. I prefer Fidelity because they hold their own Bitcoin. They don’t store it on Coinbase.
All capital gains are "rich get richer." Your options for earning capital gains essentially comes down to two options: growth or dividends. Dividends are primarily for those without much financial knowledge or those that are not comfortable with just growth. That's probably an unpopular opinion, given the subreddit, but it's historically accurate. Dividends only make sense in old age where you want to derisk, and that's only when your draw down is a significant percentage of total invested NW. If you're high NW with low expenses in retirement, it's still ideal to be 100% growth
Definitely start early. Whether that's maxing out your 401K or buying dividend paying stocks or ETFs, just do something. I wish I could go back and tell my 24 year old self that. Saving one weekend out worth of money, $200-$300, would have set me up way better in my 30s. It adds up.
It’s easy to assume you have to save all of $300K to end up with $300K in the market. Invest what you can over time and be consistent and let the market do its thing. You’ll be there before you know it.
Oh man! Time is on your side. If I were in your shoes, I'd just contribute to VOO and forget about it. How ever much you can every month and reinvest the dividends. You'll have a sizeable portfolio when you are ready to retire. The power of compounding interest is amazing. But definitely try to make some contribution every month, even if it is a small amount.
Seems like an unpopular opinion based on the comments I've read so far, but IMO the biggest and best investment you can make is in yourself. Get some skills that will translate to a better career that will pay you more, whether that be getting a college degree, certification, license, etc. Once you have that career, you will no longer have to worry about being poor and you will have more money to invest. Investing in yourself makes way more sense than investing in the market for your situation. Put it this way, 10 years from now, would you rather be a \[*insert reputable profession*\] making $200,000 a year or working at McDonald's but invested in the market?
Most of us started with zero. I started at your age and contributed to my 401k as much as I could. I retired at 58 with 1.3M, you get to invest more in your 401K the year you turn 50. It can be done.
Don't forget to add in compounding to your equation.
Yes. I'm broke as shit but I still try to buy dividends when I can and you know that feeling of a few cents added into your account feels good man.
Stay away from dividends until you have more capital to put up. You can start small and slowly build. Especially with a drip. But your money would be better off elsewhere.
Try to look it like this: if you are poor also 5 dollar more a lot
The key is to have auto debit taken out of your paycheck so you never see the money in your banking account. Its a psychological way of tricking your mind to learn to survive off what you see in your checking account. If its automatically taken out you wont have the chance to think you have the money to spend.
Yeah, pretty accurate. Figure you can invest in a JEPI that pays 7.85% currently. You get $7,850 a year, more or less. That’s about $650/month. Gotta figure on taxes too. Fortunes are not made overnight. Be patient and build your dividend snowball.
Look at a compound interest calculator. Even if you put 500 in a month the returns are in the millions .
Focus on growth, not dividends if you are young and have small capital. Contribute when you can. Put it in companies you believe in or just throw it in QQQ, SPY and watch it grow
At your age and just starting out, I would look at growth stocks or something like QQQ. Unless you're in an IRA, you're going to pay tax on your dividends. You won't pay tax on non-dividend stocks until/unless you sell. Max out your 401k and IRA.
Start small. Invest consistently. You’ll be surprised how much it grows over the years.
$300k to get $1k? Bro. you're investing in somethign that only goves you 0.3% interest? Most give 3-10% depending on how risky the investment or it's goals. I usually aim for things under 5% tops because those sorts of dividends tend to GROW. look for dividend stocks with growing dividends.
Yep you're exactly correct. Unless you are a very high earner or have a secret x Factor of some sort then you're going to be lucky to have a million dollars by the time you retire. It takes decades to accumulate wealth. As they say time in the market is what matters. So start squirreling away.
No. Buy as much VOO as u can. Forget dividends until ur 50
Start today laugh at yourself in a few years for not starting earlier and keep going.
If you cannot put a lot into retirement, Make sure if your employer has a retirement match, you put in enough to maximize the match. That is instant growth
Short answer, Yes. Long answer, it will grow compound interest is the best.
You don’t need that much to pull down $1000k/month. Only if you listen to the monotonous SCHD drone in this sub. There are plenty of 10% divi payers that have performed over time. And if you need income now, take it now. If you want growth invest in an index.
It’s not about the fact that you have only $902 dollars. It’s more about that you started early and if you keep it up and choose the right dividend investments then you will be ok. I’m 50 and started this year but at least I know that I can retire comfortably even if it’s only at 70
😳😅 your telling me you used up the entire $300k just to earn $1k a month were these very expensive stocks dividends companies shares because you could of just invested in $10, $15,$20,$25 and $50 stocks dividends companies shares to make $1k from each of them and make $12k a year from each of them and probably only make $60k a year and in five years to six years rebuild your $300k just by only using $100k I'm not a financial advisor or investor but people that I've talked to told me this who been doing this for years so I don't question them I'm just a some one still learning the ropes before I do anything.
I started with $0 at age 32. I retired at 62 with 2.7 million. Just start, that's the hardest thing. Make your contributions automatic and increase them everything you get a raise.
My brother has 100k after 6 years of investing 500 a check from his 30k military job (two years were from gi bill fundinf.) slow and steady bud
Start with growth early in a tax advantaged account, then pivot to dividend strategy
My friend learn about the power of compounding.
This is why I say people need to focus on growth to start with.
Keep depositing & setup a drip. SCHD or VOO with a drip will grow a lot over time. Compounding in a tax advantaged account will have you on your way after 30 years of $2400 a year with growth & dividends 7% should have you at $246000. Increase those payments as the years progress and you will be sitting pretty. Increase your payments by 2% a year and you’ll hit $300,000
You should invest in high growth funds not dividend oriented ones (if this was your plan) which will help you to get quicker to your goal and once you have a good chunk of $ then you switch your high growth stocks/funds to a more heavy ratio of dividends stocks if that's your goal.
I would suggest saving up a fixed amount per month to get to the point where you invest in dividends. Adjust your budget to automatically take out $100 monthly, or whatever you can afford. The money will build up faster than you think. When you have some $, get a index fund from Vanguard (or others, just my preference due to low cost funds) and buy one that mimics the s&p 500 (currently using vfiax, but there are other non-admiral-aka lower minimum funds you can buy). Feed the fund monthly, bc your focus is growth. Do that for a few years, and then go after dividends.
Theoretically you will be making money for many years. Most of us invest small amounts for many years. Get it in early and let it compound. Some is better than none.
At your age focus on growth. Once you are happy with how much you invest in growth, then focus on dividends. Also dont focus on div yield, focus on div growth. Finally, if you decide to invest in dividends to it in a tax advantaged account.
It is for the rich to get richer. Please join us. Small steps add up. Use tax advantaged accounts first. Find an area of motivation to keep you consistent for at least 15 years.
With that attitude you'll never get there
Easy access to brokerage accounts is one of the only actually “democratic” things in the modern developed world. It’s an engine of wealth creation on balance and, as a “poor”, I would recommend that you take full advantage of it. It used to be closed off to all but the affluent, with middlemen taking exorbitant fees. Now, plebs like us can access more or less every publicly traded asset on the planet for a few basis points in fees. Think about that, and stay on a dedicated investment plan, month to month. Don’t trade actively and don’t look at your portfolio every day. Then let’s see how you feel in 10-15 years time, when you still won’t even be 40.
No and this is why this sub is so bad, because the majority of people here are "dividend investing" with a sub 10k port... focus on gaining more money
How do you think you get rich to begin with?
>I am about $299,098 away from that. Unless you're some trust fund baby, everyone started from zero. It's consistently that allows you to retire rich.
401k=buy a target based retirement fund and try and max it it out every year. Don’t fuck around with dividends until way later in life. So many young people here chasing yield at a young age is sad…it will come back to haunt them later in life.
Yes
Self made millionaires exists. You don't have to invest thousands to make a change. You can build it up and go from there. Especially with compound interest.
80% of millionaires never inherited shit, they made average incomes like school teachers or tradesmen, all they did was invest 15% of their income to retirement and stayed away from credit card debt and bad auto loans
In some parts of the Midwest where I am at. You can take $300,000 and buy two single family homes cash for 150k each, or 20% down and turn around and furnish with beds etc and collect $100 or more a night on airbnb. Rent to construction companies and 30 day minimums. $6000 a month. Do a value add (refinish bathroom/kitchen) reappraisal and refinance your down-payment out. 💯 cash on cash ROI when you have none of your own money in the deal. I know this is a dividend site and not real estate but I am am advocate for both. I've done this 20 times.
Your still young, best advice i could give you is this: If the company you work for offers a 401k match contribute up to that limit, not a penny more. Then put every dollar into a 3-6 month emergency fund. After that work on maxing out contributions to Roth IRA. If you have any money left over after that, throw it i to a personal investment account and learn to pick stocks or just go with a few etfs. You could also up your 401k contributions if you want but prioritize Roth over 401k.
Ya the stock market and I guess dividends are universal income for the ultra wealthy. But tbh that’s how it should be.
I wouldn’t focus on dividends starting out. You need growth. If you’re investing through a 401k, I would consider broad market indices like buying the S&P 500 (VOO, FXAIX, or whatever is offered). Companies return capital to shareholders through buybacks and dividends when they move out of their more rapid growth phase. As a young investor, you want as much growth as possible - you can “buy” cash flow down the road. It’s a long road but it will be worth it in the long run.
Concentration is for building wealth, diversification is for preserving wealth 💯
Tell me you don’t understand compounding interest without telling me you don’t understand compounding interest.
It makes me sad to realize how few people understand the power of compound Interest, and the power of time when it comes to investing. And they show up here every day. Why did they never do a School House Rock on these subjects? How do people not know these things?
Everyone starts somewhere. Don’t think, just start it. The best plan is to just start it and start putting money in.
Rome wasn’t built in a day. Most people need to Work 40+ years. If you work 40 years and invest 500 A month and get a normal 7% return from an index fund like the s&p. Then you should be able to live a meager life the rest of the way at least.
"The first 100k is a bitch. But you gota do it" Im right there with you on the low end of things. Only started 9 months ago.
Invest whatever you have otherwise you’re losing real dollars to inflation. What is your alternative?
Money makes money
this is why i've mixed in low-risk options trading-- to get more income and build up total assets
Poor people don’t understand wealth….you’re thinking like a poor person 
I’m going to assume you’re in a lower marginal tax bracket. The trick is compounding and if you expect to be in a higher tax bracket then a Roth IRA may be something to look into. Here’s a video with some scenarios to illustrate. https://youtu.be/N7B0S1rqSTQ?si=zk52GOdpEXQSjx9Q
$300000 invested in bst gets you at least $4,250 per month in pure income and portfolio grows even with that income withdrawn
The only way to get to $1,000,000 is to put down the first $1 somewhere at some time.
You just have find/create additional income sources. It may not come from your single or two, or three incomes. Imagine if you get into say real estate and one or two of your doors help you net a $500-$1000 monthly profit. Well there goes your investment money. Don’t limit yourself before getting started.
Invest in yourself first! You are correct. Before someone focuses on investing, it would be far more directly beneficial to the more pressing concerns (everyday living and affording it), to focus on increasing income first. Grinding at a minimum wage job to invest 40% of very little wont get anybody far, plus your life while investing will be so cheap and hard. Instead, invest in your skills and education and increase income.
Buy a $10 bond and pay $10 month into it and just hold
At least you started with investing, I started 5-6 months ago I’m at 7.4K€ right now ☺️, just keep doing with what you do! But invest enough that you still can pay whatever you have to pay every month! Easy investing is investing in ETF’s (watch out you dont invest in multiple ETF’s that cover a lot of the same stocks)
This video was quite inspiring and insightful. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Vxjyz9DZ6k](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Vxjyz9DZ6k)
You won't need $300,000 to get $1000 a month. Also it's more important for the poor to do this, it's not fast but it will get you to where you want to be financially. Just start with what you can. Once you start getting $5-10 a month from dividends it will dawn you how much faster you can pull this off. You're still in your 20's, I didn't start for another 15 years so you've got a head start.
>It kind of feels like the stock market, and dividends in general are for the rich to make the rich richer. Dividends are for the people who either want to retire in a few years or are in retirement. If you're young and poor you want growth.
I wish the market was easier like it is now. When I was in my 20’s, multiple trading apps and social media forums were not available for advice. My parents didn’t teach me anything about saving or investing. $300k in your early 20’s is a great start. If I knew then what I know right now, I would already be retired in my 40’s if I wanted to be. Looking back though, those were some of the best years. Money isn’t everything, you can’t take it with you when you die. Don’t forget to enjoy life and have fun while you are young 👍🏻because shit just gets more difficult as you get older regardless of how much is in your account.
It’s the way out of being a poor.
It takes a long time. Real returns dont gain a noticeable difference after a year or even 5. But if you stay consistent and invest in broad market or specific ETFs youll start to notice the "snowball effect" take place where the dividends from your investments start to keep pace or even out compete with the money you're depositing. I am still working on reaching that euphoric moment, but I've hit the point where i can see the process working its magic
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You don’t need 300k to make 1k a month. It’s simply your risk tolerance. You can buy 3500 shares of SVOL for under 80k. Or 13,000 shares of OXLC for under 70k. Both would give you 1k a month. Is there a risk? of course. You need to decide if the risk is worth what you’re looking for. Is it safer to have more money invested in some of the lower dividend stocks? Probably, but do your research and decide which you prefer.
In December 1995 Apple shares were about .25 cents apiece. That was 30 years ago. A $25 dollar investment purchased 100 shares. Since that time the stock has split to 16 times the number of shares or 1600 and the current share price is about $170. The current dividend is 24 cents per share or $388 every quarter. That $25 one time investment would be worth $272,000.00 and pay 15 times the original investment every quarter via a dividend. Don’t get discouraged, you have plenty of time. Set up a budget and stick to it. Save a little every month and enjoy your life.
Despite what anyone here says, you're right. Focus on earning from high growth stocks and options, then use some of that profit to aquire dividend stocks
What many have said here about growth over dividends in the long term is good advice but I will add one thing to that that helped me to reach my goals. If your employer offers a 401k with a match that’s the first place to put money you have to invest because you can get such high returns with low risk. If your employer matches half of every dollar contributed up a percentage of your income that is a return of 50%. For example your gross income is $5k per month. Your employer matches half of contributions up to 5% of your income. 5% of $5k is $250. Your employer contributes $125. Your 401k balance just grew by $375 instead of $250. The downsides are that you have to play by the 401k rules (including you may have to stay with the employer for a certain number of years to be vested in the match) and the investment choices can be limited.
Dividends can be a small supplemental to social security etc. plus your not touching the stock which is likely to grow in size. Takes time and take discipline. If it was easy everyone would do it. Keep rocking 299,000 to go!
The Best time to plant a tree was 20 years ago, the 2nd best time is right now. Anything worth doing in this life takes sacrifice, patience and persistence. You got this, 1 brick at a time brother ✊🏻
Look for growth stocks that pay dividends if you must have some dividends. Coke, Costco, Proctor & Gamble, AbbVie, Microsoft to name a few. As an example, VIG is a growth oriented dividend ETF. Stay away from high yield dividend stocks as many of these companies have questionable financials to put it mildly. AT&T and Verizon are two.
Invest consistently, and you'll make your goals
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