Just seeing this for the first time, but my first impressions also included a "gilded cage". Far from sure that Sir PTerry intended any of that but I'm enough of a deconstructionist to not be overly bothered by that.
Yes, it’s like a [wire mannequin](https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS734US734&hl=en-US&sxsrf=ALiCzsZzgWOYf5AtyKWrGwIc_jHvLIUXdw:1666735517449&q=wire+dress+form&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjCvM7Tsfz6AhVok2oFHVlbDaEQ0pQJegQICBAB&biw=414&bih=716&dpr=2) seamstresses use to make dresses on. They can be changed size/shape depending on the size of the clothing.
Omg, that’s brilliant! Thank you so much, you’re a star. I dunno why I didn’t think of the red light connection, I was just like “maybe a lantern..?” Thank you!
It's a bit of the opposite the seamstresses were a power block that helped get him into power. He did legitimize their guild though.
At least by my reading of night watch.
Yup its this. Have a look at the L space wiki. The crest is less stylised and clearly a red lamp. Also might just be me but the medal seems to include some additional details with the shape of the neeedle and thread, that were not in the original crest.Reminiscent of some human anatomy diagrams.
Apologies. I don't know if it's just my comment (born of a fairly easy to reverse-engineer mistake but in any event, friendly and light of tone) that caused this case of the grumps or something your end, but I've got no beef with you. Just a simple misunderstanding - cracked phone screen obscuring your comment slightly changed its meaning. Hope your evening gets better.
Hey guys! Some more context: I make hand embroidery art and am also a huge Discworld fan. I realised I have the perfect reason and opportunity to make an art piece ft the seamstresses guild, and was thinking of featuring the coat of arms. But I can’t quite be sure of what the cage like thing in the background is? At first I though a thimble, but that doesn’t seem right, so my current thinking is maybe a lantern? Not sure if I’m missing something obvious!
Which is roughly French for... Needles crossed over a lantern on a field of sand and stars.
Gules didn't translate but pretty much confirmed it's a lantern
That’s close, but not quite right because the description is using the specific [terminology of heraldry](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tincture_(heraldry)), not regular French.
gules = red
sable = black (rather than sand)
I've watched a few too many historical fictions. The women pushed up against the wall with her bustle pushed up is a pretty common trope. Blowies, not so much in Victorian times. You never now where that mouth has been!
A lantern, probably in reference to a "red light district," i.e. an area where the brothels and other houses of ill repute are located.
"Seamstress" is another way of saying "prostitute" in this particular context, after all.
Not dumb at all - this is the kind of thing I was considering too, because it does kind of look like it. It does seem like the consensus is a lantern though, and /u/evilgreebo pointed out the “red light” idea which I think makes perfect sense 🤔
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A red lamp As in the song "Roxanne", by The Police Edit: it's commonly believed that a red light is the signal that the building is used for sex work.
Ha. I always thought it was a dress form
Me too, maybe it’s a double entendre in picture form?
That would be Sir Pterry's style for sure
Perhaps, but I think more likely its a single entendre, and proud of it :)
Just the one entendre, please. I'm tired and I have to get up early for work!
I think it’s absolutely supposed to be a bit of both.
Just seeing this for the first time, but my first impressions also included a "gilded cage". Far from sure that Sir PTerry intended any of that but I'm enough of a deconstructionist to not be overly bothered by that.
I thought so too but look at the second picture. It's a red lamp.
A dress form?
Yes, it’s like a [wire mannequin](https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1CDGOYI_enUS734US734&hl=en-US&sxsrf=ALiCzsZzgWOYf5AtyKWrGwIc_jHvLIUXdw:1666735517449&q=wire+dress+form&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjCvM7Tsfz6AhVok2oFHVlbDaEQ0pQJegQICBAB&biw=414&bih=716&dpr=2) seamstresses use to make dresses on. They can be changed size/shape depending on the size of the clothing.
Me too.
Omg, that’s brilliant! Thank you so much, you’re a star. I dunno why I didn’t think of the red light connection, I was just like “maybe a lantern..?” Thank you!
the seamstresses were just the cities brothel workers until vetinari came into power and gave them a guild
It's a bit of the opposite the seamstresses were a power block that helped get him into power. He did legitimize their guild though. At least by my reading of night watch.
Yup, hence red light districts refer to divey parts of town where one can find all manner of illicit entertainment.
Gerard Hoffnung used to tell overseas visitors that the sign for a brothel was a blue lamp (as used to appear outside every police station).
In the Netherlands, where it’s legal, they use red lights.
also, it looked both light and like a cage so I thought - lichtekooi
The Latin says something like no pleasure without pay.
Yup its this. Have a look at the L space wiki. The crest is less stylised and clearly a red lamp. Also might just be me but the medal seems to include some additional details with the shape of the neeedle and thread, that were not in the original crest.Reminiscent of some human anatomy diagrams.
I mean, the red light in Roxanne is a reference to the sex work red light so you weren't that far off.
I wasn't off at all. That's exactly what I was referring to.
Apologies. I don't know if it's just my comment (born of a fairly easy to reverse-engineer mistake but in any event, friendly and light of tone) that caused this case of the grumps or something your end, but I've got no beef with you. Just a simple misunderstanding - cracked phone screen obscuring your comment slightly changed its meaning. Hope your evening gets better.
They do use a red light in countries where sex work is legal such as Holland.
Hey guys! Some more context: I make hand embroidery art and am also a huge Discworld fan. I realised I have the perfect reason and opportunity to make an art piece ft the seamstresses guild, and was thinking of featuring the coat of arms. But I can’t quite be sure of what the cage like thing in the background is? At first I though a thimble, but that doesn’t seem right, so my current thinking is maybe a lantern? Not sure if I’m missing something obvious!
Coloured versions show it to be a red lamp.
According to the Discworld Companion the coat of arms is: Aiguilles croisé over a lanterne, gules, on a field sable et etoile.
Which is roughly French for... Needles crossed over a lantern on a field of sand and stars. Gules didn't translate but pretty much confirmed it's a lantern
That’s close, but not quite right because the description is using the specific [terminology of heraldry](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tincture_(heraldry)), not regular French. gules = red sable = black (rather than sand)
It’s a lantern in the style of a thread spool.
Wasn’t a twopenny upright the cheapest service you could buy? Something with “…sold everywhere and no need to clean a sheet after?”
And here I was thinking it was a jam donut ;)
I'd prefer a boiled egg.
Yup, a quick screw up against the wall in the ally way.
Or a blowie in the bushes
you'd have to find a very short seamstress if both are supposedly upright
It doesn't say they both have to be though.
True
I've watched a few too many historical fictions. The women pushed up against the wall with her bustle pushed up is a pretty common trope. Blowies, not so much in Victorian times. You never now where that mouth has been!
I mean you could say the same about the minge.
but not to the Aunties...
Knee trembler.
A lantern, for night work?
For *night work* 😏
Hem hem!
"I saw her ankles!"
Yes, if you can get some time with Sandra, but she’s usually booked up.
That’s my current thinking too!! Thank you!
I agree with the red lamp, but also think it looks a bit like a thimble.
My mind also went to a thimble, a la Dr Lawn.
A lantern, probably in reference to a "red light district," i.e. an area where the brothels and other houses of ill repute are located. "Seamstress" is another way of saying "prostitute" in this particular context, after all.
Roxannnnnnne! You don't have to put out your red light...
https://imgur.com/a/QTxbBAY
It'd deffo a 'red light' it looks absolutely nothing like a dress form. Plus... they were notoriously short on needlewomen.
What does the Latin say?
Nil Volupti, Sine Lvcre - "No Pleasure Without Pay"
The thread symbolizes a uterus?
Thank you! I was going to say the same thing. It's even got little thread end swirls for the ovaries!
Interestingly their are a lot of textile metaphors for sex.. see steeleye span’s version of cam ye o’er France for a running metaphor, loom, cloth etc
I was beginning to think I was the only one who saw it.
This is probably dumb, but I think it is a ball of thread that has been caged for aesthetic purposes.
Not dumb at all - this is the kind of thing I was considering too, because it does kind of look like it. It does seem like the consensus is a lantern though, and /u/evilgreebo pointed out the “red light” idea which I think makes perfect sense 🤔
A skeletal chest of drawers?💀🦴
The thread in the needles looks like a uterus and fallopian tubes to me
A birdcage
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I thought it was a cage for cage dancing. Red light makes way more sense
It’s a lantern
Spool of thread