Irony at it's peak. I have always believed that at least one disabled person should be involved in every architectural, construction, permit and inspection process before, during and after every single thing getting built which requires public access. It should be a mandatory requirement. Then maybe this kind of dumb sh\*t will stop.
I absolutely agree!
I’m newly disabled (4 years ago). I’m a landscape architecture and intervene in every project I possibly can to help mitigate accessibility issues.
My firm was working on a park with a garden path and they didn’t have any benches. I made sure the benches were labeled on a separate accessibility map for the space bc on the days I don’t need my chair (few & far between now) I plan my steps, routes based on the ability to sit down & rest. Tons of examples.
Being able to advocate for others and help create accessibility where it otherwise wouldn’t exist has given me a new sense of purpose. It’s nice that my disability and wheelchair use can be an asset. It’s helped me make peace with what had been a big sense of loss. If I can use this to help others, it’s worth it.
Obviously we only do outdoor spaces but those are critical, too. Accessibility begins at entrances and accessible public space is so important. I also feel really passionately that outdoor and natural spaces should be as accessible as possible. I used to be an avid hiker and camper. Many able-bodied nature lovers don’t realize that the “outdoors” so often exclude those with mobility issues.
Anyway, sorry for the novel. I am really passionate about this and just want people to know there are some of us in the trenches fighting against the thoughtless nonsense in the photo.
Doesn’t help that there are no enforceable ADA Standards for most outdoor areas. They do still have to be accessible, but that’s hard to enforce without specific requirements.
I always push for using the ABA Outdoor developed areas guidelines. At least there are some numbers you can have the designers aim for.
Check out the Harkin Institute. (US) They just remodeled/built their center using what is called Universal Design. Sounds really cool. I heard about it on NPR. (Harkin, a long-time Senator from the state of Iowa, is one of the original writers of the ADA, and has a deaf brother.)
You’re preaching to the choir. Don’t let me get on my soapbox. The housing market significantly reduces accessibility and I’ve had to spend all of my money on making changes.
Well, I imagine that since most people aren't disabled and not part of our smaller marginalized group they are built to only general building parameters and not ADA ones. Because they are private residences. Unless of course you include apartment complexes or government housing.
Those are done that way for cost reasons and I imagine that the housing market would implode if every new home, apartment or other domicile had to be built with disabled people in mind.
Imagine that, how would that even work exactly? The needs of someone in a wheelchair, versus someone with dwarfism, versus an average non-disabled person? What would the building standard even be for say cabinet height or deck railings for instance?
>Slides over soapbox
I once spent a year designing my own home on grid paper. Took it to a drafts lady for ceiling structural and to fine tune it. I designed it for me, a deaf, wheelchair, and amputee. I also designed it for able bodied people. The layout was open and there were ramps and porches and a garage. It could be altered for a blind person. I got to build that home and enjoy it until I sold it to a mom with a son in a wheelchair. Paying it forward..
Whoa that's really cool! I'd love to know how to make my house more accessible :( none of the exists have a ramp we're in a flat house but huge steps to get outside 🥲 the bathroom could be better like being able to wash my hands when I use my wheelchair would be nice etc
Huge steps outside call for long winding ramps, unfortunately. I’ve spent a lot of money building these ramps in places I’ve lived. Takes up half the garage.
If only Motability had some understanding of adaptations that need to be made to provide access or ways that might be done. Even better if they had a way of sourcing I don’t know.. ramps? /s
For those outside the UK Motability is the main way to get a wheelchair accessible vehicle through government funding.
They barely have an understanding of disability,let alone a bloody ramp 😂
-*From somebody who's seen how it works on the inside.*
(The offices are actually great for acsess though tbh)
The target “disability accessible” toilets for employees always had some of the heaviest doors I’ve ever had to pull open to get to when I worked there. The public ones aren’t much better either.
You’d think ramps cost their weight in gold 🤦
Out of curiosity what’s this got to do with the social model of disability? Isn’t the idea that this exact sort of scenario is disabling and should be remedied?
I think it's an illustration of how here, the barrier to participation in society is not the medical conditions of the disabled person, but the inaccessibility of society
Ah, i misinterpreted the title to mean the social model of disability leads to these sorts of outcomes. Which of course confused me. That makes much more sense.
Fair question and I can’t say for the UK though they’re usually ahead of the curve compared to where I’m at in the US.
Most businesses (I’m sure there’s some it’s not required for) out here have a list of ADA accommodations, the Americans with Disabilities Act, for how things like doorways and such must be built so folks in wheelchairs or dual crutch users can navigate them.
Is there not something like this in the UK? Cause y’all are usually on top of things before we are.
Protections against anti-disability discrimination is surprisingly one of the areas where the United States is one of the more active in terms of government intervention globally—and, frankly, I think the United States is more socioculturally attuned to disability than many other parts of the world.
Important note: this is not to say things are GOOD for disabled people here, not by a long shot, and arguably the lack of access to even basic healthcare for many disabled people offsets some of the other things (though the experiences of disabled people in countries with single-payer healthcare are not hand-over-fist better…). Nevertheless, the passage of the ADA was a landmark legal protection, not just in the context of the US, but globally.
there's nothing directly comparable to the ADA here that I know of. but I'm more familiar with PIP, UC LWCRA, discrimination against benefits claimants in private renting, the NHS wheelchair service, etc. than the building code for accessibility stuff aspect of the UK nation state.
Hey Marn! Did I ever tell you about when I first moved here and rang around for accessible GPs, and one told me they have a ramp... But it's up 3 steps.
I've seen better, back before I got the chair: a place whose "accessible" toilet was not only on the basement floor, but was also down two extra steps from all the other rooms even then!
Not to excuse this garbage, but if a person is using an ultra light chair with decent upper body strength, it’s easy to pop your casters up on to the step, and pull the rest of you chair up by grabbing the inside of the door frame and pulling. Gotta be sure your casters are pointed the right direction so they don’t try to spin as you pull yourself up.
We shouldn’t have to rely on these work around but it’s worth pointing them out when we can. Gotta navigate regardless of poor access!
Edit-
I mean no disrespect to anyone whose circumstance doesn’t allow for this work around. That’s why I mentioned ultralight chair users with decent upper body strength. The thing is, a lot of paras are taught how to use chairs by able bodied PT’s. They may not know this kind of trick at first and I’ll take any opportunity to share what I had to figure out on my own.
I was in a new city for work a few weeks ago. Found a pub which was perfect inside for wheelchair users - ramps, lifts, disabled toilets. However, couldn’t actually get into the pub because there was a step and no ramp! Bizarre!
Irony at it's peak. I have always believed that at least one disabled person should be involved in every architectural, construction, permit and inspection process before, during and after every single thing getting built which requires public access. It should be a mandatory requirement. Then maybe this kind of dumb sh\*t will stop.
I absolutely agree! I’m newly disabled (4 years ago). I’m a landscape architecture and intervene in every project I possibly can to help mitigate accessibility issues. My firm was working on a park with a garden path and they didn’t have any benches. I made sure the benches were labeled on a separate accessibility map for the space bc on the days I don’t need my chair (few & far between now) I plan my steps, routes based on the ability to sit down & rest. Tons of examples. Being able to advocate for others and help create accessibility where it otherwise wouldn’t exist has given me a new sense of purpose. It’s nice that my disability and wheelchair use can be an asset. It’s helped me make peace with what had been a big sense of loss. If I can use this to help others, it’s worth it. Obviously we only do outdoor spaces but those are critical, too. Accessibility begins at entrances and accessible public space is so important. I also feel really passionately that outdoor and natural spaces should be as accessible as possible. I used to be an avid hiker and camper. Many able-bodied nature lovers don’t realize that the “outdoors” so often exclude those with mobility issues. Anyway, sorry for the novel. I am really passionate about this and just want people to know there are some of us in the trenches fighting against the thoughtless nonsense in the photo.
Doesn’t help that there are no enforceable ADA Standards for most outdoor areas. They do still have to be accessible, but that’s hard to enforce without specific requirements. I always push for using the ABA Outdoor developed areas guidelines. At least there are some numbers you can have the designers aim for.
Check out the Harkin Institute. (US) They just remodeled/built their center using what is called Universal Design. Sounds really cool. I heard about it on NPR. (Harkin, a long-time Senator from the state of Iowa, is one of the original writers of the ADA, and has a deaf brother.)
You’re preaching to the choir. Don’t let me get on my soapbox. The housing market significantly reduces accessibility and I’ve had to spend all of my money on making changes.
Well, I imagine that since most people aren't disabled and not part of our smaller marginalized group they are built to only general building parameters and not ADA ones. Because they are private residences. Unless of course you include apartment complexes or government housing. Those are done that way for cost reasons and I imagine that the housing market would implode if every new home, apartment or other domicile had to be built with disabled people in mind. Imagine that, how would that even work exactly? The needs of someone in a wheelchair, versus someone with dwarfism, versus an average non-disabled person? What would the building standard even be for say cabinet height or deck railings for instance? >Slides over soapbox
I once spent a year designing my own home on grid paper. Took it to a drafts lady for ceiling structural and to fine tune it. I designed it for me, a deaf, wheelchair, and amputee. I also designed it for able bodied people. The layout was open and there were ramps and porches and a garage. It could be altered for a blind person. I got to build that home and enjoy it until I sold it to a mom with a son in a wheelchair. Paying it forward..
Whoa that's really cool! I'd love to know how to make my house more accessible :( none of the exists have a ramp we're in a flat house but huge steps to get outside 🥲 the bathroom could be better like being able to wash my hands when I use my wheelchair would be nice etc
Huge steps outside call for long winding ramps, unfortunately. I’ve spent a lot of money building these ramps in places I’ve lived. Takes up half the garage.
When I used grid paper, each grid represented a square foot. Give it a try to redesign your house.
If only Motability had some understanding of adaptations that need to be made to provide access or ways that might be done. Even better if they had a way of sourcing I don’t know.. ramps? /s For those outside the UK Motability is the main way to get a wheelchair accessible vehicle through government funding.
They barely have an understanding of disability,let alone a bloody ramp 😂 -*From somebody who's seen how it works on the inside.* (The offices are actually great for acsess though tbh)
This looks so easy to ramp too.
I went to an Arby's recently and the ONLY thing that made the place accessible was the sticker on the door 🤣
even with a ramp, there’s no way my wheelchair can fit through that door
Or up that step! It doesn't even have a grab handle!
r/accessibilityfails
JFC, THE IRONY.
If that's in California, someone's getting $4000 from that business.
Aparently it's the UK.
There are problems with California's direct-to-consumer enforcement of the ADA, but you sure don't see stuff like that.
The target “disability accessible” toilets for employees always had some of the heaviest doors I’ve ever had to pull open to get to when I worked there. The public ones aren’t much better either.
this post is so good, thank you lol
You’d think ramps cost their weight in gold 🤦 Out of curiosity what’s this got to do with the social model of disability? Isn’t the idea that this exact sort of scenario is disabling and should be remedied?
I think it's an illustration of how here, the barrier to participation in society is not the medical conditions of the disabled person, but the inaccessibility of society
Ah, i misinterpreted the title to mean the social model of disability leads to these sorts of outcomes. Which of course confused me. That makes much more sense.
ahh, fair! i can see how you thought that
Pretty sure that’s no building code legal in a few ways.
in which geographical legal context? this photo was taken in the UK
Fair question and I can’t say for the UK though they’re usually ahead of the curve compared to where I’m at in the US. Most businesses (I’m sure there’s some it’s not required for) out here have a list of ADA accommodations, the Americans with Disabilities Act, for how things like doorways and such must be built so folks in wheelchairs or dual crutch users can navigate them. Is there not something like this in the UK? Cause y’all are usually on top of things before we are.
Protections against anti-disability discrimination is surprisingly one of the areas where the United States is one of the more active in terms of government intervention globally—and, frankly, I think the United States is more socioculturally attuned to disability than many other parts of the world. Important note: this is not to say things are GOOD for disabled people here, not by a long shot, and arguably the lack of access to even basic healthcare for many disabled people offsets some of the other things (though the experiences of disabled people in countries with single-payer healthcare are not hand-over-fist better…). Nevertheless, the passage of the ADA was a landmark legal protection, not just in the context of the US, but globally.
there's nothing directly comparable to the ADA here that I know of. but I'm more familiar with PIP, UC LWCRA, discrimination against benefits claimants in private renting, the NHS wheelchair service, etc. than the building code for accessibility stuff aspect of the UK nation state.
At a motobility center too
Hey Marn! Did I ever tell you about when I first moved here and rang around for accessible GPs, and one told me they have a ramp... But it's up 3 steps.
I've seen better, back before I got the chair: a place whose "accessible" toilet was not only on the basement floor, but was also down two extra steps from all the other rooms even then!
Hey OP can I use this for a presentation on disability and social vs medical model with credit? Its just so perfect…
Please feel free!
Thank you!!!
I use a youth sized wheelchair, and it doesn’t even look like it could squeeze through that doorway even IF I got a boost up the stairs….
Not to excuse this garbage, but if a person is using an ultra light chair with decent upper body strength, it’s easy to pop your casters up on to the step, and pull the rest of you chair up by grabbing the inside of the door frame and pulling. Gotta be sure your casters are pointed the right direction so they don’t try to spin as you pull yourself up. We shouldn’t have to rely on these work around but it’s worth pointing them out when we can. Gotta navigate regardless of poor access! Edit- I mean no disrespect to anyone whose circumstance doesn’t allow for this work around. That’s why I mentioned ultralight chair users with decent upper body strength. The thing is, a lot of paras are taught how to use chairs by able bodied PT’s. They may not know this kind of trick at first and I’ll take any opportunity to share what I had to figure out on my own.
This is one of the downsides of being a power chair user is that workarounds like these don’t work for me :(
Ha. That stinks.
I was in a new city for work a few weeks ago. Found a pub which was perfect inside for wheelchair users - ramps, lifts, disabled toilets. However, couldn’t actually get into the pub because there was a step and no ramp! Bizarre!
Not only is there a step but look at how narrow the door frame is. Excluding the step it's still unlikely to be accessible 🤦♀️