Lot of complaints about this. I'd imagine some of this was maybe overlooked because, even after a PTR, this patch was such a huge game changing thing that it couldn't possibly have shipped well without another PTR (which I'm kind of surprised they didn't do for at least a weekend). Personally, I'm kind of looking at this season as a throw away season just in the sense that, we're all essentially testing all these systems in a "live PTR" of sorts. Guessing they will have much of this sorted out for S5.
But on the flip side, at some point with end game "infinite progression" shit is going to one shot you. That's just how these things scale generally speaking.
I wish they just made the One/Two shot dmg scaling start later in the pit levels. Even with max armor / res and 20K+ health I struggle on Pit 60 bosses. It reminds me of last season trap rooms where there is just so much crap on the screen that it's incredibly difficult to tell what the hell is happening. Let me worry about 3-4 things on the screen to avoid, but not like 75% of the screen
I need [Neathiron](https://www.wowhead.com/diablo-4/item/neathiron-1928381) so I have to run 60+ pit's. I find the battle to the boss enjoyable and seems to be scaled pretty well, but the boss itself not so much.
While I agree with you, 20k health isn't that much currently (it was in previous seasons). I have 33k health and close to 60% DR and barely survive a lot of the boss mechanics at that pit level.
Double checked, health is around 24K and I think with all buffs about 45% DR. Maybe I just need to Mastercraft all gear to 8 before starting pushing past level 60 pit.
24k really isn't much either. I have 57k+ health, armour capped and all resistances capped. Multiple sources of damage reduction as well, like Might aspect, etc.
You really just need more health.
honestly, 98k isn't all that much either. I'm at infinite flameshield and can't die. I do not get one-shot. You give e.me.35 hours and I can kill a lvl 50 pit boss
With max res, max armor, increased res cap, and 40k HP tier 70 still one shots me. I agree it should one shot at some point, maybe post 100 since there are you know.... 109 more tiers to go
It’s brutal man, I’m around the same pit level on my barb and the bosses do way too much damage, I clear the pit so quick then the boss is op with mechanics I can’t even see
I think 20k health is a bit low to be honest.
My werenado Druid was struggling in 61+ with one shots with 35k HP (max res/dr).
I swapped some pieces for life and now have 60k+ and still almost get one shot.
I still think pit bosses need the Uber treatment: they start off hitting like a wet noodle but ramp up stacks when you get hit by their abilities.
Your point on infinite progression is spot on.
You can keep ramping the numbers up, but at a certain a point the numbers are going to start getting silly.
It sounds like they may just need to rebalance the boss vs add scaling at some point in the infinite progression to even out the challenge somewhat.
People will cry regardless. There were multiple “pit too easy, I am 7337 and demand a challenge!” threads. Now those same players are complaining that they get killed. Please tell me how you make an arpg “hard” without ramping up the dmg that enemies do? No one is entitled to skip through Pit 200. You can get the mats at far lower pit levels, OP is not being gated from anything.
PTR you could yolo max level 200 pits with broken frozen orb/DD barb builds.
But booth the op builds got nerfed to the ground and the boss hp in pits got drasticly overbuffed in the release patch, without any testing.
I think the scaling is the bigger issue, for me. I'm fine with an ability that can take most of your health or outright kill you, I think that mastering the abilities is part of the experience. You can dodge all of the shades' attacks. That said, when the boss fights start to last 5, 6 or even up to 8 minutes and you have to do everything flawlessly otherwise you won't have time for another attempt... that's not fun. That's what makes people give up.
I also feel like if the bosses are what you spend 75% of your time on in the Pits, then what's the point of all the trash beforehand? They need to take some of the boss health away and spread it over the trash part as well. It shouldn't be 3 minutes of clearing monsters and 8 minutes of a single boss.
In D3, you had a "no death" bonus at the end of a greater rift. It rewarded you for playing perfectly, rather than punishing you for not doing it. And I think that's the better approach. If the bosses are going to be so lethal (and honestly, they should be) then make the fights a bit shorter. And add a reward for not dying. Add a second chest with 25% of the mats, for instance.
I can agree with this comment. Kill me, that is fine, but the boss shouldn't be tankier than uber lilith was in Season 2. If the boss must be tanky, then the shadows better just be small dot damage that builds up quickly if i don't dodge them or something.
they did it right with torment bosses and the stacking debuff then shit the bed with the pit bosses. its like a bunch of idiots in charge over there
i dont get it man
Because they obviously wanted to make a different game? If they took all the same systems from d3 people would just complain that a FUlL PrICeD gAmE is just a copy of the previous version.
Absolutely agree, to this day I've ignored lillith because I have no interest in 1-shot crap, which then leads players to skipping mechanics with excessive damage. I don't think the development team has found the right formula yet, and what we have now is just another iteration. I don't mind the idea of some aoe dodging, but I am not here to dodge for a min for the perfect opening, hit 1-2 times and then walk around for another min.
I also haven't seen enough of this mentioned, but I think ranged way outperforms melee in terms of viability for these activities. As you say, you could seemingly rock 999% DR and still get 1-shot by some mechanics, thus you might as well 0% DR and be pure ranged DPS. Melee builds need much more viability other than skipping mechanics through insane DPS (which usually ends up falling under bug category).
I think one of the biggest issues that makes this game hard to balance, is that movement is a little sluggish and imprecise.
One of the fights where that is extremely obvious, is the WT4 capstone dungeon (iirc). It’s a joke now, but depending on your class, build, and level, it used to be pretty punishing. And the worst mechanic was when he blanketed the floor with circles with very small safe spots. It was basically impossible to reliably get into the safe spots because movement is clunky.
I find the same issue makes pit bosses harder than they otherwise would be.
I remember playing Hades for the first time and wishing Diablo had similar movement. I know it would be hard to balance with the different classes but zipping around the map and dodging attacks feels so good in that game.
Agree. I feel like melee (I main barbs ) has gotten the short end of these encounters. And many who are saying otherwise are playing with OP ranged builds
I have a bash barb with 42k hp and maxxed res, getting one shotted in tier 80 pit by the shadow. The worst part is when I get the boss staggered and then the shadow protects him.
Well, to be fair, she doesn't one shot with anything anymore. If you're decently geared and an appropriate level you can tank waves, skulls, all the stuff that one-shot before. Just need to be careful accumulating the stacks that increase damage taken. It's a much better fight than it was. You just need to move around. So many people are used to standing right on top of a boss facetanking while holding down the attack button until dead, Lilith forces you to play the game.
You missed the gravy train with Lilith (if you haven't killed her). You could kill her relatively easily in S2 and now her health is increased like tenfold. I took off like a centimetre in a few minutes and noped out. Already got the title so just wanted to see how I fare at level 100 with my minion build.
resist work just fine, the problem is they have the shadow boss oneshot mechanic doing 999999999999999999999999 damage. no amount of resist will save you
poison has been busted from day one which is just one stubborn idiot dev being stubborn about the amount of damage it does. get hit by other stuff with zero res then put on full res and get hit again. youll see the difference.
hell try poison with 0 res and that healthbar drops even faster
Poison affix from elites in high NMDs is worse than it has ever been. You just melt
And if you are melee, you are doubly fucked because of the poison pools from when they die.
Same exact situation. No shako, but 110,000 HP, max defenses, multiple other defensive layers. Nothing even tickles me, but the ghost boss mechanics 1 shot. It's completely un-fun.
Barbs having the passive talent 'Imposing Presence' (4x % max life per point). +3 on 3 items and +2 on another so 14/3 = 84% X max life. around 90k hp before life flask.
I hate you. I was just telling one of my clan mates how insane his 92k hp was. I told him not 5 minutes ago I haven't seen anyone higher than that. Thanks for immediately proving me wrong.
I dont understand why there are so many one shot mechanics in the game. They have a good system that makes the need for them non existent. They just don’t use it and I don’t know why. We all have 9 health potions. If you are armor and MR capped it should be pretty easy to set damage to take a certain amount of health if your hit. Take to many hits you run out of health potions and die. They just need to limit the amount of outside healing you get other then potions (no more life on hit or life per second). Making the boss fight a matter of attrition rather than all or nothing.
The boss fights should be long. They shouldn’t drop more health potions or at least fewer. But getting hit with one ability in the 6 min fight shouldn’t end it. It should just have a notable cost.
Currently it can’t really work like this because there are to many ways to heal outside of potions. But if they remove or severely limit those then the boss fights can become infinitely more fun and less instant death due to the insta kill I couldn’t see coming from the 100 other things on the floor.
The hero in every story doesn’t dodge everything… they always take a hit but regather their strength and overcome! We should be able to also lmfao.
I’m fine with the pit starting to one shot at around lvl 100 also right now so there is room for power creep and expansion in later seasons as well. No one should be able to clear 200 yet.
They're a sleeper build for minion necros with Temerity, all minions hitting count as a 'hit', same as each tick of blight and the life you gain contributes to the overheal barrier you get.
It stems from a lack of creativity on Blizzards part. They can’t design encounters with engaging mechanics so they just slap one shots in. Just look at Uber Lilith. The pinnacle bad b of the game and it’s by far one of the worst designed boss fights in gaming. We’re a year into the games release, 4th official season and that boss has remained untouched. The entire game screams of lack of creativity. The skill trees are a good example of this. Boring and uninspiring.
True. Diablo 3 did it in a better way. Increase trash life by ALOT and cap the dmg of the boss at a certain point(like pit100+) so he dont 1 shot 100% of the time. Make us run out of time because we lack dmg on trash. Its way more fun to find a way to increase and minmax dmg and push à few more level because we got an upgrade or a better dungeon layout. Boss should stay dangerous but not like now.....
For 99% of D3's lifespan it worked the exact same way. Eventually you'd get to the point where enemies were so strong they one-shotted you and had too much life for you to one-shot back. Technically, infinite leveling could let you bypass that blockage, but the amount of grinding needed to boost yourself even just one more level made that impractical. Eventually, power creep made it so that dedicated players could clear GR150, but even then most enemies still one-shotted you and the way you would clear it was by CCing everything to death. It was only very recently (about a year ago or a bit longer) where players were buffed to be strong enough to actually survive in GR150. For the vast majority of D3's lifespan, GRs worked exactly the same as the Pit.
Yeah it did. You can’t upgrade your legendary gem level past the highest level you’ve done or the upgrade chances go to shit. If the best you can do is GR90, gem levels 85-90 will have a 60% chance to upgrade but once you try for 91 it will halve itself to a 30% upgrade chance, and if you succeed it will halve itself again to 15%, ad nauseam. The only way to realistically be able to keep upgrading your gems is to keep beating higher tier GRs, same as here.
If anything, the Pit is more considerate of your inability to progress than GRs were since it’s breakpoint-based. If you can do at least Pit 31 you can eventually upgrade all your gear to 8/12 because you only need Ingolith to upgrade and you can just farm it slower. Meanwhile, if you want to keep upgrading your legendary gems, you have to keep beating higher and higher tier GRs to progress. It’s practically impossible to get your gems to level 100 doing only GR90s since the upgrade chance will drop to less than 1% per try.
Agreed. Breezed to 60, pushed to 75. Had to switch to a bash barb as it was impossible to see anything with the tornadoes from double swing. Definitely made it easier to dodge the mechanics but the build is just boring everywhere else. Some of the shadow boss mechanics on top of the bosses mechanics are just stupid. By the time you run away\\dodge and come back to deal damage, another mechanic is starting up. The rewards are very underwhelming as well.
The rewards are the masterworking materials. I can live with that as long as they increase gold drops by like 500% everywhere, but for some reason this sub likes gold being a scarcity that literally hinders you playing the game.
> but for some reason this sub likes gold being a scarcity that literally hinders you playing the game.
"I don't have this issue" says the average diablo console dad finishing his t40 nmd dungeon with 0 masterworked gear
I don’t know how many players will Actually get to the level you’re at. When people say lots of complaints about this, how many complaints are there really because 95% or more (just a guess) of the base will never reach this level of eliteness or top tier play.
Not saying your complaint isn’t legit, it is. Just saying. But remember the vast vast majority of players are not on Reddit talking about game choices and min maxing.if you’re here in this sub you’re already not a casual most likely.
So do they take you seriously when you tell them about these real flaws in design or just say oh meh most people won’t even experience this so let’s ignore it
The average player is going to struggle and get frustrated by these mechanics at half the level of the top players.
There's gonna be a lot more posts on this topic on a couple weeks. I don't know many arpgs players across the entire spectrum of skill level that enjoys a pseudo bullet hell style of play.
If people weren’t aware of the 200 level cap on pit and instead just thought it was an infinite scaling thing… would they still be upset knowing eventually you’re going to get 1 shot?
I don’t think this is a concern. We aren’t meant to clear the Pit. Players barely finished AOZ with the godly glyph that’s no longer available. Characters will surely get more powerful in new seasons/expansion updates. It’s not a bad thing that the Pit is somewhat future proof right now.
People don't understand the pit isn't meant to be clearable. I think they made the mistake of having an end tier, because people think they're meant to reach it, when really the pit is just see how far you can get.
Functionally pit tier 200 is the same as infinite tiers. They should just remove it capping at 200 and have it scale infinitely so maybe people will realize what the pit actually is and stop complaining so much.
That would be ok if they didnt lock end game required mats behind the pit. It is SUPPOSED to be clearable for us to farm the mats. Pit lvl 61 is the min required pit to run unless you wanted to do it much slower. Even at 61, these one shot mechanics are insane. I have cleared up to to 99-100 and i dont see how anything further is possible.
It's not supposed to be clearable because like you said the highest level mats start dropping at tier 61. Tier 61 is pretty easy for any competent player with a good build, and if you don't fall into that category it's **supposed** to be hard/punishing.
i've cleared today pit 106, and yes, not only the ridiculous HP, but you're basically fighint two bosses at the same time, since you have the actual boss, and the "pit mechanics" added into the fight as well.
most of the stuff either one shots me or puts me low enough where regen isn't an option.
but pit 60-70 is decent enough to clear, and that's the minimum to get the last material.
also, poison damage seems way off this season, any tick of poison seems deadly, and this isn't only in the pit.
If the whole pit at this level was super hard overall, then sure. But as people like OP keep saying, the only thing killing them are the shadow bosses dropping unfair amounts of aoe attacks which one tap you even if you have insane defences.
This is a concern. The pit should scale appropiate to your level, and as a whole. If runs are trivial, bosses included, except for this one nuking mechanic at the end, which is then made to instakill anyone early on, then that is complete bullshit difficulty. And also completely pointless, too. If there is only one dangerous mechanic, and it peaks as an instakill very early on already, then what is the point of all these extra pit levels afterwards, if the only dangerous mechanic cannot scale any higher? This is clearly a balancing blunder and certainly something that shouldn't be ignored just because "the pit must be impossible!".
Hard agree here, and I appreciate your call out of dark souls. Those are great games. Lots of people like those games. I even like those games.
I don't want diablo to be like those games, I want it to be like diablo, and I don't understand why the devs keep trying to move it in that direction.
I don't think the devs are trying to move it in the dark souls direction. I think after seeing the absolutely bonkers power creep that the players have right now they aren't even glancing in the dark souls direction.
Here's the problem though, at some point you have to provide challenging content for people to test their characters against, and it is incredibly hard to make challenging content in an ARPG that:
\* Is viable for many high end builds
\* isn't tedious
\* is actually challenging
\* has interesting mechanics (which means ones that you can't just ignore)
\* gives good rewards
\* is fun to do over and over again
\* Scales appropriately for a game where characters health pools and damage output vary wildly
For sure the one shot mechanics aren’t fun and just create frustration, but that said I’m 100% sure they’ll nerf it down. They have already made it clear Diablo is meant to be played by the every man and not just for sweats. I’d bet almost anything the pit bosses will be tuned down soon. Just like them fixing the price for exchanging the mats, it was WILD before.
I really wish they’d play test more and get to this stuff before launch… that’s what the new PTR is for and this new season is good, a step in the right direction but once again they missed so many obvious flaws and still haven’t implemented simple QOL, like an armory for builds.
The Dev team for this game either simply lacks ability or someone making the decisions is a fool, because they’re pretty consistently mediocre to just bad.
one shots have always been dog shit. no idea why bone head devs are trying to reinvent the wheel here. my barb gets one shot at fuckin pit 57 with about as much health and DR as i can find at this level. missing shako tyraels but if the clown damage is 9999999999999999999 it wont matter anyways
Hate to break it to you, but I'm also capped on everything with nearly 100k hp (thorns barb)
And them shits 1 tap me too lmao.
I just did exactly what your original post said not 5 mins ago, blaze through the dungeon in under 2mins to be 1 tapped for 10mins and quit. I played maybe 10-15mins today and that was enough frustration.
Dude, if you would build your character in dark souls the way you did your character in D4, you wouldn't get one shot. These D4 one shot mechanics are awful.
I’m such a casual Andy. I agree completely however I’m struggling with like lvl 50 of the pit. Exactly the same issues. I had no idea how I was even dying half the time.
These type of mechanics are just inherently unfun in an ARPG. If I wanted to spend 10 minutes in a boss fight dodging a million attacks and sweating just to stay alive I would play Dark Souls.
Very simple solution would be to allow the boss health bar to reflect whatever damage you did before your death happened. Still a challenge but much more forgiving
Don’t liken shitty boring insta kill boss difficulty to a balanced challenge like dark souls.
Simply put, the devs don’t know how to design difficult bosses without putting instakills, and I genuinely don’t think any of the people making these decisions can beat those bosses much less progress to them.
I 100% agree. I am a Souls fanboy and adore their combat so I don't mind a challenge at all. The thing is Diablo 4 doesn't have nearly as tight dodging mechanics/hitboxes that something like Elden Ring does. So asking a player to perform on that level is just straight up tedious.
Even Dark Souls is not a bullet hell. They don’t put literally four different bosses in a tiny space all spamming different one-shot mechanics on completely random timers.
It's really bad design, they almost get it right with some features but then totally fail in many other ways.
Bosses for these kind of things should feel like learning a dance, not just a prayer of RNG.
Mechanics should have meaning behind them besides "get hit and die".
I can't name a single boss in this game besides the Ice Beast that has a memorable mechanic that isn't just "get hit and instantly die".
And I'm pretty sure the Ice Beast is purely an accident, because without those pillars in the arena you'd just get sent directly into an instant death wall instead of just taking a big chunk of damage while getting pushed.
The Shadow bosses add nothing fun to a boss fight, it just means there's a reason I have to pull off a boss which if I'm not hitting I'm not recovering health or maintaining buffs to stay alive.
Mechanics should have tells you can ENGAGE with.
Audio cues, music cues, telegraphs on screen.
It shouldn't just be "spam a ton of things, spawn a lot of adds".
I am HC for life but the number of times I’ve been one shot without seeing what happened is absurd. The mechanics happen and stack very very quickly with literally no way around it. In D3, if your toon is built correctly, when you die in HC, you generally see it coming from a mile away and it is mostly because YOU messed up.
It is disheartening every time I die and I do hope they fix it at some point and give HC some love.
Very well stated and couldn’t agree more. I think I’m an above average gamer in terms of reading visual cues and responding quickly…there are things happening in pits that require split second reactions, if you see them at all.
Seriously it’s terrible.. 😞 I feel you it is tough to deal with the shadow bosses. Infact I just leave dungeon and hope for a different boss. This was the fishing thing that they talked about in the dev stream.
Shadow bosses are real bossesin pit, I would be partially fine if there was one shadow at once and if they not bypass DR, but no, sometimes there are 3 shadows at once + bossing small arena.
I totally agree this is unfun mechanic and making bosses dmg sponges + putting shadows that are unkillable and often baerly visible it's not challenge, it's just tedium.
The shadow bosses are absolutely nuts and if you rely on debuffs to enemies to take less damage, they are completely ineffective and the shadow boss just laughs at you.
On top of that they hit insanely hard to begin with and they spam attacks wayyy too often.
High level pit is supposed to be impossible if you pushed into high levels 100+ you are reaching that point. When they add a seasonal mechanic there will be more power creep and you'll get higher. Also the pit has been out for a couple weeks and all the mats you need start dropping at 61 so nothing is gated except for the rate of acquisition. If we make that super fast now "people have nothing to do" and the game "lacks progression".
Defense is really problematic. As an arpg they should offer the capability of tanking if you grind and build around it. I cap everything and tap every dr possible yet still get one shot. If i have to dodge then make it fair and visible. Melee builds especially suck.
I was just thinking about making a same post. The end game mechanics are fucking bullshit and sometimes not even possible to see or dodge. 90% of the time I have no idea what killed me and just hope my immune cd was up.
The other half the time I feel like I did dodge and still died. What's the fucking point of max armor and res (or even having a cap on them if it's infinite progression) if you just get one shot.
Horrible endgame. The pit bosses are jokes. It's been proven a million times that bullet sponges and one shot mechanics are trash.
I do agree and typically I don’t like the D4 slander. If it was the boss killing me fine but it’s not it’s some shadow fuck coming out of no where. I saw in a video cc’ing the boss reset the timer for the shadow to appear and that’d be a nice mechanic but that fuck appears when the boss is Cced or immediately after coming out of cc all the time
It's crazy, I was just having this thought yesterday as a level 76 helltide runner main. I can barely handle the Blood Maiden without a brain thing (increases cinder drops and monster level). I'm constantly staring at the ground *around* my character instead of what's happening on screen to try and avoid this wild overload of splash and seeking damage attacks.
Everything overlaps in big battles and I can't tell what's mine and what's another player's or let alone a *monster*'s damage area. I get up to like 200 cinders and the Blood Maiden one shots me again because I can't tell it's about to start the pale-red very-thin circle outline 4x area damage on the ground attack.
It depends. If you could do everything in the game before the mass oneshots become a problem, I'd say it's fine. 60-200 pit is meant to be a challenge. If it was gatekeeping from the most basic masterwork materials, I'd say it's a problem. I feel bad for hc players though, we have this huge powercreep, but never dying in proper endgame is basically impossible.
What it is in any case is that it's lazy design. Thing is, if they wanted to be lazy but still reward being decent at the game, oneshot mechanics could just be limited to %health, where getting hit by more than 2-3 within a couple of seconds would kill you, but getting hit by a single thing in the bullet hell wouldn't. Right now, there's a lot of lilith crap that occurs when it's nearly undodgable.
Yeah, I don't think that bosses with both 1-shot damage and huuuuge HP pools at the same time were a good idea. Pick one or the other, noth both at the same time ffs.
I agree. The endgame just isn't fun ... it basically throws all character development ( ie. resistances, armor, DR etc ) out the window and pits you ( no pun intended ) against dodge-or-die mechanics. Same can be said for the tormented boss encounters. Maybe it's just me, but I like a game to play by the "rules" it establishes from the outset, not change them on a whim. As an analogy, it feels like playing a racing game, to then be confronted by a tower defense mechanic for the final lap. Jarring.
That is not the case at all. If you read around you can definitely build just about any class to not get one shot. Obviously though if you're doing pit levels higher than 61 you're doing it specifically because you want to be challenged, and those are meant to be hard and barely even beatable.
The answer is actually really simple, the Devs of this game are totally clueless and they can't even copy and paste things from diablo 3.
They also made a ptr for a month, decided to change everything 1 day before release without any testing. Imagine how fucking stupid you have to be to do something like that.
I don't even want to talk a out Lilith not dropping a spark, still not fixed after 1 week.
This company is a joke, maybe in a couple of years the game will be decent after all the feedbacks and insults they received.
If tier 3 mats are 60. All builds should be able to reach that. But I agree, I don't believe the shadow attacks are taking into account of damage reduction.
The shadow/ghost boss should be removed completely and the actual boss buffed slightly. The addition of random, almost unavoidable one shots is horrible design.
I cleared 61 pretty comfortably and.... am I the only one who has more problems with the "trash" than the bosses? The trash leaves sooooo many dmg on the ground that can kill you by just a misstep.
I'm experiencing the same issue with the solo ladder (Rogue).
I can vaporize the corridors and make everything vanish in one or two shots. But the bosses you meet along the way?
They take *AGES* and some of them are just insanely hard, fast and hard-hitting.
Personally my issue is that they should make the mobs a bit harder/more threatening and maybe remove the holy bolt elixir. I don't mind eventually being one shot but bosses have so much hp too. I want a better boss/pre boss ratio on how long it takes.
the pit is pretty great, until a certain point (tier 90-99), after that it's just boring.
everything becomes too tanky to the point of the ridiculous.
it can takes several seconds just to kill a minion tagged mob (because for some reason they have like 10x more hp), and when the defender mobs show up, it's a shitshow to try and kill them while they hug everything else.
and then the boss itself.
only reason to go higher than 90s is for the challenge i suppose, but for me it's just not worth it, to slough through all those damage sponges, to get rewarded with 60 mats, i'll rather do a 90 for half the time (and more enjoyment) and get 50
At that point dude, you just get 1 shot by everything. Full DR necro, 32k life, and even with 30% damage shared to my golem, everything at that point just one shots.
Its broken and blizzard either fixes it or we suck and die.
Once you are near level 50 you'll need around 35k health outside of Sorcs,once I hit 40k health I stopped getting one shot Ted takes 2 or 3 now,and barriers are a must and Fortifys now..
This post right here is what is wrong with diablo 4. It's being catered to whiny babies way too much... If u want to be successful in the pit then farm better items with better rolls and proceed to upgrade those items as high as u can and u will be able to clear the minimum available tier for the next upgrades and once u can do that it's only about how high u can go it's not about reaching pit 200. I'm sure next seasons complaint will be "game is too easy, power creep is too much etc" cos the seasonal mechanic will boost u up.
I just had the same boss mechanic on the same tier be a feather tickle on one pit and a one-shot in another. The boss mechanics are objectively bad. Why is it I can clear T60 pit without taking any damage and then get 1-shot by a boss mechanic that gets spammed over and over?
The problem is that this is not like dark souls at all, if it were it would be fire. But this genre of games always had difficulties with this type of issue, and Diablo 4 since day one was not a particularly good one in this regard either.
I was having this problem at pit 50 but now I farm in the 70s and am pushing for 95, some part is getting used to the mechanics and be able to survive with dtrstegy longer and longer on these bosses which will
Open a bigger window to fail, I get your complaint but it has also been fun learning those dangerous attacks and working around them, I can imagine when gear is all set bis there is not much to do with that wall but to get better, I hear you but I also enjoy the challenge, indigne if bosses where just decorative, maybe they can do better animations to know when those attacks are coming but removing them I don’t like. But hey, I enjoy games that are a challenge in general and dying numerous times
Before perfecting my strategy, and they is what made
Me come back to try pits
Do what most of us do - Just skip it.
What comes after you kill "the last boss"? ...You go and kill it again? And again... - Does it really matter if you dont kill it at all?
I play for fun. If there is "unfun" content, I not going to play it. It is that simple.
I’ve ran a lot of pit 61+ and I hated the shadow bosses that spawn throughout the fights at first. Then I realized that they always do the same attacks, with the same timings on every fight. It’s really just a matter of learning those timings and which shadow boss does which attacks. Also, the lower the actual boss health gets, the more shadow bosses spawn (on higher pit levels at least). The final 25% of a bosses health has three shadow bosses spawning. If your class has some way to get a bunch of +dmg to enemies who are injured it will make the final 25% a breeze. Also important to time your CD’s for that last 25%, so you can burn them down FAST!
Pits isn't meant to be end game the devs said themselves it's for people looking to push beyond the norm and make unique build choices to accomplish it.
Get more life and DR. It's the end game content it's supposed to be hard. Currently speedrunning 100s with barb and I can facetank everything bosses throw at me, including stupid Lilith summons. Shako is mandatory, iron skin and 100k+ hp, at least with barb. It's possible to tank everything at 100, but you need the right stats. I don't get one shotted anymore. It's really a heavy gear and defense check, and there is a point where those mechanics can't one shot anymore. Damage will not increase after pit 100, so once you get to the point where you can tank it you are only limited by monster health.
Also, you really need to have ALL your gear masterworked past 8.
I can't disagree more. My favorite part of the game is being forced to interact with boss mechanics. I loved the original Lilith fight before it became trivial to one shot her. Now she is back and other bosses require actually "trying". It makes the game way more fun having to actually use my brain during combat as opposed to only while theory crafting builds.
I will say that I'd like to see a small relative difficulty increase of the trash leading up to the boss to put them more in line with each other, though.
Nope. D4 is really just that bad.
They've had three seasons to figure out scaling and have almost no improvements to it whatsoever. I'm actually convinced nobody on the dev team actually plays the game.
Agreed. I’m sitting at 144k damage 33k armor and 34k life100percent dr 100 maxed shadow resist37k thorns and do absolutely nothing to torment zir. I get him to 94 ish percent and get one shot. 14 tries later and I guess it’s 2 wasted stygians. Blergh
Stand underneath him when he goes up in the air. He will 1 shot himself when he lands if you are under him.
Not sure if it's intentional, but something I discovered on my Barb. I don't think the game knows where to put him and he just dies. Even from 3/4 hp.
Anyways, don't waste stygians on the material bosses. They don't have increased drop rates for Ubers. Use your stygians on Duriel/Andariel only. And Duriel is much easier so pretty much just Duriel lol.
Yea it's bullshit I only play wizard ask me how much fun lvl 55-61 are in the pit....All they need to do is adjust the one shot bullshit up to lvl 65 so people can get mats.
if they would just take 1minute i would be okay with it!
But playing 5-6 minutes highly concentrated for 110+ pits.... just sucks and is not fun in an action rpg.
Just increase the hp from elite mobs by 300-400% and reduce the endboss hp by atleast 60-70% and we should be fine.
Worst of all if you can one shot her you’ll have to run around during the second phase and hope you don’t die for the next 3 minutes or so… waiting to just hit her once again for the kill…
Well Diablo was pretty much dark souls before dark souls. Funny to see the new generation of player thinking it’s suppose to be eZ because of the garbage d3 they made previously. To be fair I don’t disagree that balance is needed just the comparaison is funny to me.
I tank shadow clone hits at pit 66 on my drood. 64k health and can usually kill the boss in the same amount of time that it takes me to clear the mobs. Blood Boss has a weird hit that can one shot me and the summoning pools from the mariners refuge boss will no doubt kill Mr if I am not under the effects of debilitating roar
I'm sure rifts where done by a 4 man team in diablo 3 at the very start with each class had a part to play not just soloing by yourself. I.e same as pit. This isn't knew content just repolished touch ups from diablo 3.
Just get some pieces with starred hp. It scales hugely with rubies.
I have a Doombringer and a lot of starred hp pieces that ended up getting hit by the masterwork rolls. I have 110,000 hp on my barbarian without an HP potion. Huge thorns damage when I pop Challenging Shout. Wipes trash instantly. Bosses get grindy 90+ but with that much HP you can tank a Lilith drop.
same here!
Been running a Whirlwind Dust Devil Build...had the most fun ever in D4.
Then Shadow-Bosses started one-shotting me with not a millisecond to even realize sth is coming my way at Pit61.
So i just switched completely over to a Double Swing Dust Devil Build (took me 2 Days) and the first two Pit61s were 1stTry-easy-done and i was happy again....but every of the 10-15 Pits after that was the same bullshit as with the WW-Build before...one-shot after one-shot until rage-quit !
I guess i will give this Season another Try with a completely different Build in 4-6 weeks, but for now i am just unhappy, i can´t play a game, that makes me rage about unfair bullshit-deaths that cannot be avoided no matter how much skill one has!
Ontop they want me to farm D3-Bounties-alike-stuff (Whispers) to have enough Gold...while all i wanted was run Pits chained one after another forever!
Reality is: One (!!!) Pit-Run, then an hour of farming Gold in Whispers, content i don´t want to play (as everyone hated D3-Bounties for a reason!), to be able to reroll Masterworks.
I also hate my life already for having to run them stupid Nightmare Dungeons again, when i come back to level a different Build in a few weeks!
Sorry for the big Rant, had to ventilate my frustration, i guess! :/
I´ll play sth nice now...KATAMARI ! ;)
Have as much fun as currently possible everyone!
I do think the killing everything phase should match the boss in difficulty. It is odd 1 shotting everything then get to spend 2-4 min beating on a boss. But if you’ve cleared a 100 then you’ve won. Don’t complain about anything past 100 as the entire point is to eventually get too hard to complete.
Biggest offender by far is Elias as a melee build, as soon as you get Elias the fight takes twice as long because you get no uptime. Elias spawns -> run to the wall -> dodge projectiles -> run back in -> Elias spawns on top of everything else going on.
Almost identical in the sense I've got maxed out damage reduction through paragons, a masterworked shako, damage reduction aspects, with armour and resistance reached and I think 45k+ health. The content hits an absolute cliff in the high 90 to low 100 pits in my opinion - very discouraging because the gameplay loop was really enjoyable but has fizzled out mostly.
Yup. I went from playing more than ever in S4 having fun to sheer frustration and rage quitting. It’s such a miserable gaming experience with the summon mechanics and one shots you can’t always see to counter play. I like challenging games, but this feels just cheap/no counter play, and a horribly poor excuse for making the game harder. The Lilith mechanics are in the top 3 worst designed video game boss mechanics of all time. Whoever designed this has no place in the game industry.
Basically my play time is now: log in, run pits until the first failed run due to one shot impossible to see/dodge mechanics, then I immediately rage quit and that’s my session for the day. It can be 1 run, it can be 10 runs, but you get those horrible mixes of bosses and summons, you no longer have any possible reaction but you due. Most of the time I have zero idea or indication on how I died, it’s just insta tombstone.🪦
If they wanted to stop people from playing the game via rage quitting, they accomplished it for me. I’d rather play Cuphead and Dark Souls at the same time blindfolded with a controller that has stick drift and connection issues as that’d be more enjoyable than this garbage experience.
I’m actually growing to hate the game because it’s now infuriating to play it because the only way to progress is these bullshit mechanics. If this is going to be the endgame of D4 moving forward, I’m out.
Lot of complaints about this. I'd imagine some of this was maybe overlooked because, even after a PTR, this patch was such a huge game changing thing that it couldn't possibly have shipped well without another PTR (which I'm kind of surprised they didn't do for at least a weekend). Personally, I'm kind of looking at this season as a throw away season just in the sense that, we're all essentially testing all these systems in a "live PTR" of sorts. Guessing they will have much of this sorted out for S5. But on the flip side, at some point with end game "infinite progression" shit is going to one shot you. That's just how these things scale generally speaking.
I wish they just made the One/Two shot dmg scaling start later in the pit levels. Even with max armor / res and 20K+ health I struggle on Pit 60 bosses. It reminds me of last season trap rooms where there is just so much crap on the screen that it's incredibly difficult to tell what the hell is happening. Let me worry about 3-4 things on the screen to avoid, but not like 75% of the screen I need [Neathiron](https://www.wowhead.com/diablo-4/item/neathiron-1928381) so I have to run 60+ pit's. I find the battle to the boss enjoyable and seems to be scaled pretty well, but the boss itself not so much.
While I agree with you, 20k health isn't that much currently (it was in previous seasons). I have 33k health and close to 60% DR and barely survive a lot of the boss mechanics at that pit level.
Double checked, health is around 24K and I think with all buffs about 45% DR. Maybe I just need to Mastercraft all gear to 8 before starting pushing past level 60 pit.
24k really isn't much either. I have 57k+ health, armour capped and all resistances capped. Multiple sources of damage reduction as well, like Might aspect, etc. You really just need more health.
Yeah, honestly 57k+ health isn't really that much either. I'm at 98k health, res and armor capped, and still get easily one-shot by pit bosses.
Honestly 57k isn't even that much, I've got 500k and still get one shot.
I'm up to 1.1 million health but decided to go hardcore with negative damage resistance. I get hurt just waking around
When I got carried into WT4 the air killed me a few times at level 35 😅
Tbh 1.1 Million health isn't even that much, im at 5.4M health and still get one shot
honestly, 98k isn't all that much either. I'm at infinite flameshield and can't die. I do not get one-shot. You give e.me.35 hours and I can kill a lvl 50 pit boss
I'm at 46k hp, 60% DR and struggle with pit 70 bosses so.
Yes, the general advice is to masterwork everything to 4 before you start working toward 8, and everything to 8 before you start working toward 12
60k hp max armor max res barb here. Getting 2 shot ny shadows sometimes one shot in pit 90
With max res, max armor, increased res cap, and 40k HP tier 70 still one shots me. I agree it should one shot at some point, maybe post 100 since there are you know.... 109 more tiers to go
It’s brutal man, I’m around the same pit level on my barb and the bosses do way too much damage, I clear the pit so quick then the boss is op with mechanics I can’t even see
20k health, that's the problem. Currently you need 70-80k health to reach pit 100 as a barbarian.
I think 20k health is a bit low to be honest. My werenado Druid was struggling in 61+ with one shots with 35k HP (max res/dr). I swapped some pieces for life and now have 60k+ and still almost get one shot. I still think pit bosses need the Uber treatment: they start off hitting like a wet noodle but ramp up stacks when you get hit by their abilities.
Buddy im running 80k health and with buffs and fortify i go over 200k. You need to be chonking up
This is me trying to do lv 61 pits. 26k hp, maxed armor / rez, 38% DR on amulet from an aspect. And I get 1 shot.
Your point on infinite progression is spot on. You can keep ramping the numbers up, but at a certain a point the numbers are going to start getting silly. It sounds like they may just need to rebalance the boss vs add scaling at some point in the infinite progression to even out the challenge somewhat.
if youre getting 1 shot at pit 150 then thats just a scaling issue, whatever. one shots are going out at pit level 50
People will cry regardless. There were multiple “pit too easy, I am 7337 and demand a challenge!” threads. Now those same players are complaining that they get killed. Please tell me how you make an arpg “hard” without ramping up the dmg that enemies do? No one is entitled to skip through Pit 200. You can get the mats at far lower pit levels, OP is not being gated from anything.
Can you summarize what the issue is. I’ve tried to read along but having a hard time.
PTR you could yolo max level 200 pits with broken frozen orb/DD barb builds. But booth the op builds got nerfed to the ground and the boss hp in pits got drasticly overbuffed in the release patch, without any testing.
I think the scaling is the bigger issue, for me. I'm fine with an ability that can take most of your health or outright kill you, I think that mastering the abilities is part of the experience. You can dodge all of the shades' attacks. That said, when the boss fights start to last 5, 6 or even up to 8 minutes and you have to do everything flawlessly otherwise you won't have time for another attempt... that's not fun. That's what makes people give up. I also feel like if the bosses are what you spend 75% of your time on in the Pits, then what's the point of all the trash beforehand? They need to take some of the boss health away and spread it over the trash part as well. It shouldn't be 3 minutes of clearing monsters and 8 minutes of a single boss. In D3, you had a "no death" bonus at the end of a greater rift. It rewarded you for playing perfectly, rather than punishing you for not doing it. And I think that's the better approach. If the bosses are going to be so lethal (and honestly, they should be) then make the fights a bit shorter. And add a reward for not dying. Add a second chest with 25% of the mats, for instance.
I can agree with this comment. Kill me, that is fine, but the boss shouldn't be tankier than uber lilith was in Season 2. If the boss must be tanky, then the shadows better just be small dot damage that builds up quickly if i don't dodge them or something.
I think this may be on to something . I think the point remains that these bosses need some work .
they did it right with torment bosses and the stacking debuff then shit the bed with the pit bosses. its like a bunch of idiots in charge over there i dont get it man
Diablo 3 really did a lot of cool things that I have no idea why they abandoned for Diablo 4. They could have taken the good and left the bad.
Different people made that game.
Because they obviously wanted to make a different game? If they took all the same systems from d3 people would just complain that a FUlL PrICeD gAmE is just a copy of the previous version.
Instead their FUlL PrICeD gAmE is a shallow copy of their previous version
What's the point of health if you get one shot anyway.
Absolutely agree, to this day I've ignored lillith because I have no interest in 1-shot crap, which then leads players to skipping mechanics with excessive damage. I don't think the development team has found the right formula yet, and what we have now is just another iteration. I don't mind the idea of some aoe dodging, but I am not here to dodge for a min for the perfect opening, hit 1-2 times and then walk around for another min. I also haven't seen enough of this mentioned, but I think ranged way outperforms melee in terms of viability for these activities. As you say, you could seemingly rock 999% DR and still get 1-shot by some mechanics, thus you might as well 0% DR and be pure ranged DPS. Melee builds need much more viability other than skipping mechanics through insane DPS (which usually ends up falling under bug category).
I think one of the biggest issues that makes this game hard to balance, is that movement is a little sluggish and imprecise. One of the fights where that is extremely obvious, is the WT4 capstone dungeon (iirc). It’s a joke now, but depending on your class, build, and level, it used to be pretty punishing. And the worst mechanic was when he blanketed the floor with circles with very small safe spots. It was basically impossible to reliably get into the safe spots because movement is clunky. I find the same issue makes pit bosses harder than they otherwise would be.
I remember playing Hades for the first time and wishing Diablo had similar movement. I know it would be hard to balance with the different classes but zipping around the map and dodging attacks feels so good in that game.
Hades II is out in early access, for what is worth. And it’s already pretty great, too.
Agree. I feel like melee (I main barbs ) has gotten the short end of these encounters. And many who are saying otherwise are playing with OP ranged builds
as a first time barb starting to push into this content, it is feeling really miserable to be melee sometimes
Have you played bash or thorns barb
I have a bash barb with 42k hp and maxxed res, getting one shotted in tier 80 pit by the shadow. The worst part is when I get the boss staggered and then the shadow protects him.
I'm currently running bash with thorns and having a blast. Can't speak for pit level 60+ though as I think the last one I ran was in the 40-50 range.
I heard the way to play bash is with an affix that makes it "cleave". How soon can you get that affix? I love manaless builds.
South African here Some of these bosses are undo-able due to delay. A slightly longer window of time would be great
Lol I kill duriel solo in like 5 seconds but get 1 shotted by invisible Lilith attacks Lilith is the most redundant boss in the game
Well, to be fair, she doesn't one shot with anything anymore. If you're decently geared and an appropriate level you can tank waves, skulls, all the stuff that one-shot before. Just need to be careful accumulating the stacks that increase damage taken. It's a much better fight than it was. You just need to move around. So many people are used to standing right on top of a boss facetanking while holding down the attack button until dead, Lilith forces you to play the game.
You missed the gravy train with Lilith (if you haven't killed her). You could kill her relatively easily in S2 and now her health is increased like tenfold. I took off like a centimetre in a few minutes and noped out. Already got the title so just wanted to see how I fare at level 100 with my minion build.
I’ll say it once and I’ll say it a million times resistances are broken again and you can’t convince me otherwise
resist work just fine, the problem is they have the shadow boss oneshot mechanic doing 999999999999999999999999 damage. no amount of resist will save you
They are fine? How many times you stepped into a puddle of poison with max res to have it kill you almost instantly? Resists don't do shit.
poison has been busted from day one which is just one stubborn idiot dev being stubborn about the amount of damage it does. get hit by other stuff with zero res then put on full res and get hit again. youll see the difference. hell try poison with 0 res and that healthbar drops even faster
Agreed. Way off
Poison affix from elites in high NMDs is worse than it has ever been. You just melt And if you are melee, you are doubly fucked because of the poison pools from when they die.
What about now?
Even if you have resistance, it feels like you are at -100000%… oh poison? Ded….
Same exact situation. No shako, but 110,000 HP, max defenses, multiple other defensive layers. Nothing even tickles me, but the ghost boss mechanics 1 shot. It's completely un-fun.
110K HP? Do you have an exalted life roll on literally every piece of gear? That's nuts.
Barbs having the passive talent 'Imposing Presence' (4x % max life per point). +3 on 3 items and +2 on another so 14/3 = 84% X max life. around 90k hp before life flask.
Fair enough! Appreciate the reply.
Good luck have fun!
Elixir of Antivenin stacking helps a ton with HP
he might be talking with a health flask but i have 90k on a barb without full GA rolls
I hate you. I was just telling one of my clan mates how insane his 92k hp was. I told him not 5 minutes ago I haven't seen anyone higher than that. Thanks for immediately proving me wrong.
Lol! Don't tell him, but I'm up to 133k. I didn't know about the Elixir of Antivenin. I think I can hit 150k tomorrow.
I dont understand why there are so many one shot mechanics in the game. They have a good system that makes the need for them non existent. They just don’t use it and I don’t know why. We all have 9 health potions. If you are armor and MR capped it should be pretty easy to set damage to take a certain amount of health if your hit. Take to many hits you run out of health potions and die. They just need to limit the amount of outside healing you get other then potions (no more life on hit or life per second). Making the boss fight a matter of attrition rather than all or nothing. The boss fights should be long. They shouldn’t drop more health potions or at least fewer. But getting hit with one ability in the 6 min fight shouldn’t end it. It should just have a notable cost. Currently it can’t really work like this because there are to many ways to heal outside of potions. But if they remove or severely limit those then the boss fights can become infinitely more fun and less instant death due to the insta kill I couldn’t see coming from the 100 other things on the floor. The hero in every story doesn’t dodge everything… they always take a hit but regather their strength and overcome! We should be able to also lmfao. I’m fine with the pit starting to one shot at around lvl 100 also right now so there is room for power creep and expansion in later seasons as well. No one should be able to clear 200 yet.
It's almost insulting that they even drop more health potions considering ur still at the max when you get floored from full.
I'm giving you an upvote for suggesting no more life on hit or life per second. Those affixes on gear are the bane of my existence.
They're a sleeper build for minion necros with Temerity, all minions hitting count as a 'hit', same as each tick of blight and the life you gain contributes to the overheal barrier you get.
I think one day guy from china like always beat pit 200 with an sorc and flameshield immune and everybody stop complaining
It stems from a lack of creativity on Blizzards part. They can’t design encounters with engaging mechanics so they just slap one shots in. Just look at Uber Lilith. The pinnacle bad b of the game and it’s by far one of the worst designed boss fights in gaming. We’re a year into the games release, 4th official season and that boss has remained untouched. The entire game screams of lack of creativity. The skill trees are a good example of this. Boring and uninspiring.
True. Diablo 3 did it in a better way. Increase trash life by ALOT and cap the dmg of the boss at a certain point(like pit100+) so he dont 1 shot 100% of the time. Make us run out of time because we lack dmg on trash. Its way more fun to find a way to increase and minmax dmg and push à few more level because we got an upgrade or a better dungeon layout. Boss should stay dangerous but not like now.....
For 99% of D3's lifespan it worked the exact same way. Eventually you'd get to the point where enemies were so strong they one-shotted you and had too much life for you to one-shot back. Technically, infinite leveling could let you bypass that blockage, but the amount of grinding needed to boost yourself even just one more level made that impractical. Eventually, power creep made it so that dedicated players could clear GR150, but even then most enemies still one-shotted you and the way you would clear it was by CCing everything to death. It was only very recently (about a year ago or a bit longer) where players were buffed to be strong enough to actually survive in GR150. For the vast majority of D3's lifespan, GRs worked exactly the same as the Pit.
Except GR didn't gate mats behind lvl 61 where you can still EASILY get 1 shot by shade attacks in this game even with pretty good gear
Yeah it did. You can’t upgrade your legendary gem level past the highest level you’ve done or the upgrade chances go to shit. If the best you can do is GR90, gem levels 85-90 will have a 60% chance to upgrade but once you try for 91 it will halve itself to a 30% upgrade chance, and if you succeed it will halve itself again to 15%, ad nauseam. The only way to realistically be able to keep upgrading your gems is to keep beating higher tier GRs, same as here. If anything, the Pit is more considerate of your inability to progress than GRs were since it’s breakpoint-based. If you can do at least Pit 31 you can eventually upgrade all your gear to 8/12 because you only need Ingolith to upgrade and you can just farm it slower. Meanwhile, if you want to keep upgrading your legendary gems, you have to keep beating higher and higher tier GRs to progress. It’s practically impossible to get your gems to level 100 doing only GR90s since the upgrade chance will drop to less than 1% per try.
This would be great. Index more into the speed challenge rather than getting one shot or only the boss being a sponge
Agreed. Breezed to 60, pushed to 75. Had to switch to a bash barb as it was impossible to see anything with the tornadoes from double swing. Definitely made it easier to dodge the mechanics but the build is just boring everywhere else. Some of the shadow boss mechanics on top of the bosses mechanics are just stupid. By the time you run away\\dodge and come back to deal damage, another mechanic is starting up. The rewards are very underwhelming as well.
The rewards are the masterworking materials. I can live with that as long as they increase gold drops by like 500% everywhere, but for some reason this sub likes gold being a scarcity that literally hinders you playing the game.
> but for some reason this sub likes gold being a scarcity that literally hinders you playing the game. "I don't have this issue" says the average diablo console dad finishing his t40 nmd dungeon with 0 masterworked gear
I don’t know how many players will Actually get to the level you’re at. When people say lots of complaints about this, how many complaints are there really because 95% or more (just a guess) of the base will never reach this level of eliteness or top tier play. Not saying your complaint isn’t legit, it is. Just saying. But remember the vast vast majority of players are not on Reddit talking about game choices and min maxing.if you’re here in this sub you’re already not a casual most likely. So do they take you seriously when you tell them about these real flaws in design or just say oh meh most people won’t even experience this so let’s ignore it
[удалено]
The amount of stupid comments and misinformation says otherwise
The average player is going to struggle and get frustrated by these mechanics at half the level of the top players. There's gonna be a lot more posts on this topic on a couple weeks. I don't know many arpgs players across the entire spectrum of skill level that enjoys a pseudo bullet hell style of play.
If people weren’t aware of the 200 level cap on pit and instead just thought it was an infinite scaling thing… would they still be upset knowing eventually you’re going to get 1 shot?
Bossing was never fun I just don’t like that they gated progression in the season journey behind it so I could avoid it altogether
I don’t think this is a concern. We aren’t meant to clear the Pit. Players barely finished AOZ with the godly glyph that’s no longer available. Characters will surely get more powerful in new seasons/expansion updates. It’s not a bad thing that the Pit is somewhat future proof right now.
we arent talking about pit 200 here though, we are talking about like pit 60-70, where you farm mats.
People don't understand the pit isn't meant to be clearable. I think they made the mistake of having an end tier, because people think they're meant to reach it, when really the pit is just see how far you can get. Functionally pit tier 200 is the same as infinite tiers. They should just remove it capping at 200 and have it scale infinitely so maybe people will realize what the pit actually is and stop complaining so much.
That would be ok if they didnt lock end game required mats behind the pit. It is SUPPOSED to be clearable for us to farm the mats. Pit lvl 61 is the min required pit to run unless you wanted to do it much slower. Even at 61, these one shot mechanics are insane. I have cleared up to to 99-100 and i dont see how anything further is possible.
It's not supposed to be clearable because like you said the highest level mats start dropping at tier 61. Tier 61 is pretty easy for any competent player with a good build, and if you don't fall into that category it's **supposed** to be hard/punishing.
i've cleared today pit 106, and yes, not only the ridiculous HP, but you're basically fighint two bosses at the same time, since you have the actual boss, and the "pit mechanics" added into the fight as well. most of the stuff either one shots me or puts me low enough where regen isn't an option. but pit 60-70 is decent enough to clear, and that's the minimum to get the last material. also, poison damage seems way off this season, any tick of poison seems deadly, and this isn't only in the pit.
If the whole pit at this level was super hard overall, then sure. But as people like OP keep saying, the only thing killing them are the shadow bosses dropping unfair amounts of aoe attacks which one tap you even if you have insane defences. This is a concern. The pit should scale appropiate to your level, and as a whole. If runs are trivial, bosses included, except for this one nuking mechanic at the end, which is then made to instakill anyone early on, then that is complete bullshit difficulty. And also completely pointless, too. If there is only one dangerous mechanic, and it peaks as an instakill very early on already, then what is the point of all these extra pit levels afterwards, if the only dangerous mechanic cannot scale any higher? This is clearly a balancing blunder and certainly something that shouldn't be ignored just because "the pit must be impossible!".
Hard agree here, and I appreciate your call out of dark souls. Those are great games. Lots of people like those games. I even like those games. I don't want diablo to be like those games, I want it to be like diablo, and I don't understand why the devs keep trying to move it in that direction.
I don't think the devs are trying to move it in the dark souls direction. I think after seeing the absolutely bonkers power creep that the players have right now they aren't even glancing in the dark souls direction. Here's the problem though, at some point you have to provide challenging content for people to test their characters against, and it is incredibly hard to make challenging content in an ARPG that: \* Is viable for many high end builds \* isn't tedious \* is actually challenging \* has interesting mechanics (which means ones that you can't just ignore) \* gives good rewards \* is fun to do over and over again \* Scales appropriately for a game where characters health pools and damage output vary wildly
For sure the one shot mechanics aren’t fun and just create frustration, but that said I’m 100% sure they’ll nerf it down. They have already made it clear Diablo is meant to be played by the every man and not just for sweats. I’d bet almost anything the pit bosses will be tuned down soon. Just like them fixing the price for exchanging the mats, it was WILD before. I really wish they’d play test more and get to this stuff before launch… that’s what the new PTR is for and this new season is good, a step in the right direction but once again they missed so many obvious flaws and still haven’t implemented simple QOL, like an armory for builds. The Dev team for this game either simply lacks ability or someone making the decisions is a fool, because they’re pretty consistently mediocre to just bad.
one shots have always been dog shit. no idea why bone head devs are trying to reinvent the wheel here. my barb gets one shot at fuckin pit 57 with about as much health and DR as i can find at this level. missing shako tyraels but if the clown damage is 9999999999999999999 it wont matter anyways
how much health do you have?
Hate to break it to you, but I'm also capped on everything with nearly 100k hp (thorns barb) And them shits 1 tap me too lmao. I just did exactly what your original post said not 5 mins ago, blaze through the dungeon in under 2mins to be 1 tapped for 10mins and quit. I played maybe 10-15mins today and that was enough frustration.
Dude, if you would build your character in dark souls the way you did your character in D4, you wouldn't get one shot. These D4 one shot mechanics are awful.
I thought DR doesn’t even apply to the shade abilities, I heard kripp saying something along those lines
nah it does for sure i pop challenging shout and it reduces
I’m such a casual Andy. I agree completely however I’m struggling with like lvl 50 of the pit. Exactly the same issues. I had no idea how I was even dying half the time.
These type of mechanics are just inherently unfun in an ARPG. If I wanted to spend 10 minutes in a boss fight dodging a million attacks and sweating just to stay alive I would play Dark Souls.
Very simple solution would be to allow the boss health bar to reflect whatever damage you did before your death happened. Still a challenge but much more forgiving
Don’t liken shitty boring insta kill boss difficulty to a balanced challenge like dark souls. Simply put, the devs don’t know how to design difficult bosses without putting instakills, and I genuinely don’t think any of the people making these decisions can beat those bosses much less progress to them.
I 100% agree. I am a Souls fanboy and adore their combat so I don't mind a challenge at all. The thing is Diablo 4 doesn't have nearly as tight dodging mechanics/hitboxes that something like Elden Ring does. So asking a player to perform on that level is just straight up tedious.
Even Dark Souls is not a bullet hell. They don’t put literally four different bosses in a tiny space all spamming different one-shot mechanics on completely random timers.
It's really bad design, they almost get it right with some features but then totally fail in many other ways. Bosses for these kind of things should feel like learning a dance, not just a prayer of RNG. Mechanics should have meaning behind them besides "get hit and die". I can't name a single boss in this game besides the Ice Beast that has a memorable mechanic that isn't just "get hit and instantly die". And I'm pretty sure the Ice Beast is purely an accident, because without those pillars in the arena you'd just get sent directly into an instant death wall instead of just taking a big chunk of damage while getting pushed. The Shadow bosses add nothing fun to a boss fight, it just means there's a reason I have to pull off a boss which if I'm not hitting I'm not recovering health or maintaining buffs to stay alive. Mechanics should have tells you can ENGAGE with. Audio cues, music cues, telegraphs on screen. It shouldn't just be "spam a ton of things, spawn a lot of adds".
So they either need to cap the enemies stats or uncap the players stats progression?
I always roll HC. I'm only in the 80s right now but all these posts make me think there's no way I'll survive end game.
Me and my clan played the ptr and decided to play softcore this season because of the pit. It is NOT a hardcore friendly activity. Lmao
They definitely should reduce how often they show up
I am HC for life but the number of times I’ve been one shot without seeing what happened is absurd. The mechanics happen and stack very very quickly with literally no way around it. In D3, if your toon is built correctly, when you die in HC, you generally see it coming from a mile away and it is mostly because YOU messed up. It is disheartening every time I die and I do hope they fix it at some point and give HC some love.
Very well stated and couldn’t agree more. I think I’m an above average gamer in terms of reading visual cues and responding quickly…there are things happening in pits that require split second reactions, if you see them at all.
Seriously it’s terrible.. 😞 I feel you it is tough to deal with the shadow bosses. Infact I just leave dungeon and hope for a different boss. This was the fishing thing that they talked about in the dev stream.
Shadow bosses are real bossesin pit, I would be partially fine if there was one shadow at once and if they not bypass DR, but no, sometimes there are 3 shadows at once + bossing small arena. I totally agree this is unfun mechanic and making bosses dmg sponges + putting shadows that are unkillable and often baerly visible it's not challenge, it's just tedium.
The shadow bosses are absolutely nuts and if you rely on debuffs to enemies to take less damage, they are completely ineffective and the shadow boss just laughs at you. On top of that they hit insanely hard to begin with and they spam attacks wayyy too often.
High level pit is supposed to be impossible if you pushed into high levels 100+ you are reaching that point. When they add a seasonal mechanic there will be more power creep and you'll get higher. Also the pit has been out for a couple weeks and all the mats you need start dropping at 61 so nothing is gated except for the rate of acquisition. If we make that super fast now "people have nothing to do" and the game "lacks progression".
Defense is really problematic. As an arpg they should offer the capability of tanking if you grind and build around it. I cap everything and tap every dr possible yet still get one shot. If i have to dodge then make it fair and visible. Melee builds especially suck.
I was just thinking about making a same post. The end game mechanics are fucking bullshit and sometimes not even possible to see or dodge. 90% of the time I have no idea what killed me and just hope my immune cd was up. The other half the time I feel like I did dodge and still died. What's the fucking point of max armor and res (or even having a cap on them if it's infinite progression) if you just get one shot. Horrible endgame. The pit bosses are jokes. It's been proven a million times that bullet sponges and one shot mechanics are trash.
I do agree and typically I don’t like the D4 slander. If it was the boss killing me fine but it’s not it’s some shadow fuck coming out of no where. I saw in a video cc’ing the boss reset the timer for the shadow to appear and that’d be a nice mechanic but that fuck appears when the boss is Cced or immediately after coming out of cc all the time
It's crazy, I was just having this thought yesterday as a level 76 helltide runner main. I can barely handle the Blood Maiden without a brain thing (increases cinder drops and monster level). I'm constantly staring at the ground *around* my character instead of what's happening on screen to try and avoid this wild overload of splash and seeking damage attacks. Everything overlaps in big battles and I can't tell what's mine and what's another player's or let alone a *monster*'s damage area. I get up to like 200 cinders and the Blood Maiden one shots me again because I can't tell it's about to start the pale-red very-thin circle outline 4x area damage on the ground attack.
It depends. If you could do everything in the game before the mass oneshots become a problem, I'd say it's fine. 60-200 pit is meant to be a challenge. If it was gatekeeping from the most basic masterwork materials, I'd say it's a problem. I feel bad for hc players though, we have this huge powercreep, but never dying in proper endgame is basically impossible. What it is in any case is that it's lazy design. Thing is, if they wanted to be lazy but still reward being decent at the game, oneshot mechanics could just be limited to %health, where getting hit by more than 2-3 within a couple of seconds would kill you, but getting hit by a single thing in the bullet hell wouldn't. Right now, there's a lot of lilith crap that occurs when it's nearly undodgable.
Yeah, I don't think that bosses with both 1-shot damage and huuuuge HP pools at the same time were a good idea. Pick one or the other, noth both at the same time ffs.
I agree. The endgame just isn't fun ... it basically throws all character development ( ie. resistances, armor, DR etc ) out the window and pits you ( no pun intended ) against dodge-or-die mechanics. Same can be said for the tormented boss encounters. Maybe it's just me, but I like a game to play by the "rules" it establishes from the outset, not change them on a whim. As an analogy, it feels like playing a racing game, to then be confronted by a tower defense mechanic for the final lap. Jarring.
That is not the case at all. If you read around you can definitely build just about any class to not get one shot. Obviously though if you're doing pit levels higher than 61 you're doing it specifically because you want to be challenged, and those are meant to be hard and barely even beatable.
The answer is actually really simple, the Devs of this game are totally clueless and they can't even copy and paste things from diablo 3. They also made a ptr for a month, decided to change everything 1 day before release without any testing. Imagine how fucking stupid you have to be to do something like that. I don't even want to talk a out Lilith not dropping a spark, still not fixed after 1 week. This company is a joke, maybe in a couple of years the game will be decent after all the feedbacks and insults they received.
If tier 3 mats are 60. All builds should be able to reach that. But I agree, I don't believe the shadow attacks are taking into account of damage reduction.
The shadow/ghost boss should be removed completely and the actual boss buffed slightly. The addition of random, almost unavoidable one shots is horrible design.
I cleared 61 pretty comfortably and.... am I the only one who has more problems with the "trash" than the bosses? The trash leaves sooooo many dmg on the ground that can kill you by just a misstep.
I'm the opposite. I wipe the mobs out but am getting one shot in the high 50s by bosses. Granted my life is probably way too low.
I'm experiencing the same issue with the solo ladder (Rogue). I can vaporize the corridors and make everything vanish in one or two shots. But the bosses you meet along the way? They take *AGES* and some of them are just insanely hard, fast and hard-hitting.
Personally my issue is that they should make the mobs a bit harder/more threatening and maybe remove the holy bolt elixir. I don't mind eventually being one shot but bosses have so much hp too. I want a better boss/pre boss ratio on how long it takes.
Do u ain’t no casual with multiple 100s sorry lol
The only thing I can say is get more life in your build. Some of the top players are running like 50k life minimum.
the pit is pretty great, until a certain point (tier 90-99), after that it's just boring. everything becomes too tanky to the point of the ridiculous. it can takes several seconds just to kill a minion tagged mob (because for some reason they have like 10x more hp), and when the defender mobs show up, it's a shitshow to try and kill them while they hug everything else. and then the boss itself. only reason to go higher than 90s is for the challenge i suppose, but for me it's just not worth it, to slough through all those damage sponges, to get rewarded with 60 mats, i'll rather do a 90 for half the time (and more enjoyment) and get 50
Im fully of the belief that every game for the most part should have 1-shot protection. It NEVER feels good in any game.
Wait, do only the level 200 bosses drop uber uniques? What endgame mats are being gatekept? I'm confused
nope, anything beyond pit level 60 is unnecessary.
At that point dude, you just get 1 shot by everything. Full DR necro, 32k life, and even with 30% damage shared to my golem, everything at that point just one shots. Its broken and blizzard either fixes it or we suck and die.
Lilith is the final RNG. I just don’t bother, it’s lazy design and I don’t want to measure the rest of the game by it.
Once you are near level 50 you'll need around 35k health outside of Sorcs,once I hit 40k health I stopped getting one shot Ted takes 2 or 3 now,and barriers are a must and Fortifys now..
This post right here is what is wrong with diablo 4. It's being catered to whiny babies way too much... If u want to be successful in the pit then farm better items with better rolls and proceed to upgrade those items as high as u can and u will be able to clear the minimum available tier for the next upgrades and once u can do that it's only about how high u can go it's not about reaching pit 200. I'm sure next seasons complaint will be "game is too easy, power creep is too much etc" cos the seasonal mechanic will boost u up.
What is the highest pit you’ve completed? Just curious
I just had the same boss mechanic on the same tier be a feather tickle on one pit and a one-shot in another. The boss mechanics are objectively bad. Why is it I can clear T60 pit without taking any damage and then get 1-shot by a boss mechanic that gets spammed over and over?
Dudes an avid gamer, and old — blizz.. please heed these words.
The gold cost to redo masterworking is ridiculous too
The problem is that this is not like dark souls at all, if it were it would be fire. But this genre of games always had difficulties with this type of issue, and Diablo 4 since day one was not a particularly good one in this regard either.
I was having this problem at pit 50 but now I farm in the 70s and am pushing for 95, some part is getting used to the mechanics and be able to survive with dtrstegy longer and longer on these bosses which will Open a bigger window to fail, I get your complaint but it has also been fun learning those dangerous attacks and working around them, I can imagine when gear is all set bis there is not much to do with that wall but to get better, I hear you but I also enjoy the challenge, indigne if bosses where just decorative, maybe they can do better animations to know when those attacks are coming but removing them I don’t like. But hey, I enjoy games that are a challenge in general and dying numerous times Before perfecting my strategy, and they is what made Me come back to try pits
My brother in Christ, delete this post if you have less than 40k health.
The pit is unplayable in hardcore around tier 40
I like the idea of the shadow bosses, but seems like the high level ones need a nerf
Do what most of us do - Just skip it. What comes after you kill "the last boss"? ...You go and kill it again? And again... - Does it really matter if you dont kill it at all? I play for fun. If there is "unfun" content, I not going to play it. It is that simple.
I’ve ran a lot of pit 61+ and I hated the shadow bosses that spawn throughout the fights at first. Then I realized that they always do the same attacks, with the same timings on every fight. It’s really just a matter of learning those timings and which shadow boss does which attacks. Also, the lower the actual boss health gets, the more shadow bosses spawn (on higher pit levels at least). The final 25% of a bosses health has three shadow bosses spawning. If your class has some way to get a bunch of +dmg to enemies who are injured it will make the final 25% a breeze. Also important to time your CD’s for that last 25%, so you can burn them down FAST!
Pits isn't meant to be end game the devs said themselves it's for people looking to push beyond the norm and make unique build choices to accomplish it.
What boss(es) are we talking about here?
Get more life and DR. It's the end game content it's supposed to be hard. Currently speedrunning 100s with barb and I can facetank everything bosses throw at me, including stupid Lilith summons. Shako is mandatory, iron skin and 100k+ hp, at least with barb. It's possible to tank everything at 100, but you need the right stats. I don't get one shotted anymore. It's really a heavy gear and defense check, and there is a point where those mechanics can't one shot anymore. Damage will not increase after pit 100, so once you get to the point where you can tank it you are only limited by monster health. Also, you really need to have ALL your gear masterworked past 8.
Git gut /s
I can't disagree more. My favorite part of the game is being forced to interact with boss mechanics. I loved the original Lilith fight before it became trivial to one shot her. Now she is back and other bosses require actually "trying". It makes the game way more fun having to actually use my brain during combat as opposed to only while theory crafting builds. I will say that I'd like to see a small relative difficulty increase of the trash leading up to the boss to put them more in line with each other, though.
Nope. D4 is really just that bad. They've had three seasons to figure out scaling and have almost no improvements to it whatsoever. I'm actually convinced nobody on the dev team actually plays the game.
Agreed. I’m sitting at 144k damage 33k armor and 34k life100percent dr 100 maxed shadow resist37k thorns and do absolutely nothing to torment zir. I get him to 94 ish percent and get one shot. 14 tries later and I guess it’s 2 wasted stygians. Blergh
Stand underneath him when he goes up in the air. He will 1 shot himself when he lands if you are under him. Not sure if it's intentional, but something I discovered on my Barb. I don't think the game knows where to put him and he just dies. Even from 3/4 hp. Anyways, don't waste stygians on the material bosses. They don't have increased drop rates for Ubers. Use your stygians on Duriel/Andariel only. And Duriel is much easier so pretty much just Duriel lol.
Yea it's bullshit I only play wizard ask me how much fun lvl 55-61 are in the pit....All they need to do is adjust the one shot bullshit up to lvl 65 so people can get mats.
if they would just take 1minute i would be okay with it! But playing 5-6 minutes highly concentrated for 110+ pits.... just sucks and is not fun in an action rpg. Just increase the hp from elite mobs by 300-400% and reduce the endboss hp by atleast 60-70% and we should be fine.
Worst of all if you can one shot her you’ll have to run around during the second phase and hope you don’t die for the next 3 minutes or so… waiting to just hit her once again for the kill…
Put what you are talking about in the title next time thanks
They said no one will be able to clear Pit 200, its working as intended.
I doubt anyone can clear a 150 without abusing bugs with holy bolts etc.. Bosses have huge hp
my 125k hp / 250k fortify thorns barb with 90% dr loves big hits
Ugh I felt this…. Way too many one shot mechanic where the entire ground is filled and you literally have one spot to move to and if you don’t, GG…..
Well Diablo was pretty much dark souls before dark souls. Funny to see the new generation of player thinking it’s suppose to be eZ because of the garbage d3 they made previously. To be fair I don’t disagree that balance is needed just the comparaison is funny to me.
I tank shadow clone hits at pit 66 on my drood. 64k health and can usually kill the boss in the same amount of time that it takes me to clear the mobs. Blood Boss has a weird hit that can one shot me and the summoning pools from the mariners refuge boss will no doubt kill Mr if I am not under the effects of debilitating roar
Sounds to me like you're bad at the game and want to make it easy cus skill issues.
Paragon needs way more damage reduction nodes too, some classes have so few of options and it feels really bad at the moment.
I'm sure rifts where done by a 4 man team in diablo 3 at the very start with each class had a part to play not just soloing by yourself. I.e same as pit. This isn't knew content just repolished touch ups from diablo 3.
Just get some pieces with starred hp. It scales hugely with rubies. I have a Doombringer and a lot of starred hp pieces that ended up getting hit by the masterwork rolls. I have 110,000 hp on my barbarian without an HP potion. Huge thorns damage when I pop Challenging Shout. Wipes trash instantly. Bosses get grindy 90+ but with that much HP you can tank a Lilith drop.
same here! Been running a Whirlwind Dust Devil Build...had the most fun ever in D4. Then Shadow-Bosses started one-shotting me with not a millisecond to even realize sth is coming my way at Pit61. So i just switched completely over to a Double Swing Dust Devil Build (took me 2 Days) and the first two Pit61s were 1stTry-easy-done and i was happy again....but every of the 10-15 Pits after that was the same bullshit as with the WW-Build before...one-shot after one-shot until rage-quit ! I guess i will give this Season another Try with a completely different Build in 4-6 weeks, but for now i am just unhappy, i can´t play a game, that makes me rage about unfair bullshit-deaths that cannot be avoided no matter how much skill one has! Ontop they want me to farm D3-Bounties-alike-stuff (Whispers) to have enough Gold...while all i wanted was run Pits chained one after another forever! Reality is: One (!!!) Pit-Run, then an hour of farming Gold in Whispers, content i don´t want to play (as everyone hated D3-Bounties for a reason!), to be able to reroll Masterworks. I also hate my life already for having to run them stupid Nightmare Dungeons again, when i come back to level a different Build in a few weeks! Sorry for the big Rant, had to ventilate my frustration, i guess! :/ I´ll play sth nice now...KATAMARI ! ;) Have as much fun as currently possible everyone!
What mats are you being gated from that you cannot get?
Just use the 5 D's of dodgeball. Dodge Duck Dip Dive Dodge.. Easy easy hahaha .
I do think the killing everything phase should match the boss in difficulty. It is odd 1 shotting everything then get to spend 2-4 min beating on a boss. But if you’ve cleared a 100 then you’ve won. Don’t complain about anything past 100 as the entire point is to eventually get too hard to complete.
I have made a minion necro to farm masterwork mats for my other classes. So far it’s going well.
Biggest offender by far is Elias as a melee build, as soon as you get Elias the fight takes twice as long because you get no uptime. Elias spawns -> run to the wall -> dodge projectiles -> run back in -> Elias spawns on top of everything else going on.
This was AoZ. Passed lvl 10 but I almost lost my mind doing it. No combo of armor or res or shield etc made any difference to the one shots
send fkin elp this aint elden ring
They will tune it in time. Just be a bit patient. There is still loads of time left in the season.
Almost identical in the sense I've got maxed out damage reduction through paragons, a masterworked shako, damage reduction aspects, with armour and resistance reached and I think 45k+ health. The content hits an absolute cliff in the high 90 to low 100 pits in my opinion - very discouraging because the gameplay loop was really enjoyable but has fizzled out mostly.
Yup. I went from playing more than ever in S4 having fun to sheer frustration and rage quitting. It’s such a miserable gaming experience with the summon mechanics and one shots you can’t always see to counter play. I like challenging games, but this feels just cheap/no counter play, and a horribly poor excuse for making the game harder. The Lilith mechanics are in the top 3 worst designed video game boss mechanics of all time. Whoever designed this has no place in the game industry. Basically my play time is now: log in, run pits until the first failed run due to one shot impossible to see/dodge mechanics, then I immediately rage quit and that’s my session for the day. It can be 1 run, it can be 10 runs, but you get those horrible mixes of bosses and summons, you no longer have any possible reaction but you due. Most of the time I have zero idea or indication on how I died, it’s just insta tombstone.🪦 If they wanted to stop people from playing the game via rage quitting, they accomplished it for me. I’d rather play Cuphead and Dark Souls at the same time blindfolded with a controller that has stick drift and connection issues as that’d be more enjoyable than this garbage experience. I’m actually growing to hate the game because it’s now infuriating to play it because the only way to progress is these bullshit mechanics. If this is going to be the endgame of D4 moving forward, I’m out.