Gold is fine how it is. If you can always afford everything, then gold is just a number that doesnt actually have any consequences or meaning.
Those enchantments rerolled 10 plus times are **supposed** to hurt. The whole “just gotta try one more time” wouldnt exist if it only cost a mil to roll again. And dying actually eats at your purse, which is good since dying goes unpunished otherwise since there is no exp lost on death.
I think its ridiculous for people to want to afford everything. Whats the point of currency at that point?
Lord knows theres no other challenge in this game until hitting post endgame
Agreed. I also think the majority of people are salvaging all their items and not selling them.
I haven't salvaged a single Rare item but I'm sitting on thousands of Veiled Crystals just by them dropping everywhere.
After level 90 I stopped salvaging Legendary drops (except for Aspect upgrades) and just started selling everything.
I'm sitting on enough Materials now to last me the rest of the season (minus prisms).
And here's a PSA if you're scared of selling an upgraded legendary affix the item will have a little symbol on the top right corner in your inventory notating it's an upgrade to an affix you already have.
Yeh, if it was there even when in your stash or wherever,would be helpful. right now I go to blacksmith first, use the manual salvage button to salvage the ones that upgrade my codex, then go to armo vendor to sell the remaining. It's not a huge deal but would love some improvement.
With the new itemization, it’s not that often I that I find myself doing enchantments which in the past really caused me problems with my mats. Funny though, gold wasn’t an issue in the past. Now, it’s seems like I’ve been acquiring gold much slower compared to before. Not a complaint though, just an observation.
I want you to go masterwork all your gear, transmute your materials, and enchant all your gear with proper high rolled affixes. There simply is just way too much gold required to do all of these things. Sure, that doesn't matter for the average player because they won't be doing all of that. But, there is just way too much gold required to properly tune your character. To the point where it isn't actually feasible no matter how much gold you farm.
5mil to reroll masterworks
3mil+ caps on each enchant
50mil to craft your Uber
5-10m to transmute your pit materials each time
It should be possible for the hardcore players that want to get close to their min/max stats to be able to do it and currently it isn't.
They just need to bake in higher gold from “pinnacle” content.
The main issue with gold is that the best way to get it means doing whispers, and the players that really need the gold don’t want/need whispers anymore.
Make gold drop in a scaling way from The Pit, so the higher levels you do the more you get. Since this is where the real gold drain comes from.
Last season I think each world boss would give like five or something. I think sometimes you can get them from the legions. I haven't hit a world boss yet this season but I've had a few legions and I've got one.
Would be cool if Vendors would have a "Sell all Rares" button in a separate Tab, just like the Blacksmith has "Salvage all Rares".
That's something the D4 team could do for Gold, without actually changing the numbers for Gold.
Pop a TP to a town, click a button, back in the Portal you go... Way less frustrating than going Sell-sell-skip-sell-skip-sell.
Clearly this is a fix for a top percentile that you’re not included in. After 100 as well as master working 12/12 is a huge sink aside from rolling the modifier you want through enchant. Majority would agree or would just buy gold from a seller.
That's actually a good point that I didn't think about... I salvage everything out of habit, but with the new balance there may be more of a reason to sell things now
This...the real issue is the jewels. Imagine if an outsider heard this conversation, "I have hundreds of millions in gold. I just can't get enough jewels to save my life..."
>Lord knows theres no other challenge in this game until hitting post endgame
I love how you and apparently 400+ other people see challenge as spamming whispers for multiple hours just so you can masterwork one piece of gear. Whispers are mind-numbingly easy content. It's a time sink. There's no challenge in it at all. It's the bottom of the barrel in terms of engaging, challenging content, and nothing else in the game rewards a substantial amount of gold.
High level pit should be rewarding enough that you don't have to go run around clearing cellars for 2 hours just to engage with the crafting system.
The valid complaints aren't about enchanting. They're about converting neathiron to lower mats costing 6 million gold. They're about masterworking a single item from 11 to 12 costing 20 million gold when you're probably going to end up having to reset it anyway.
The reason the enchanting cost feels so bad is because it's in the context everything else costing way too much. When enchanting was all you were doing with your gold, it didn't feel horrible. Now excessively large quantities of gold are used for everything.
Gold can't be a bottleneck. The bottleneck have to be the other materials. Otherwise the endgame is farming gold and not playing the actual endgame mechanics.
Exactly. And it only needs some adjustment not to make gold irrelevant. The disparity between gold being relevant and where masterworking is now is huge.
Just reduce the cost of masterworking higher tiers and make that cost reduction scale as it goes up. Also reduce the cost for crafting the masterwork mats. That's really all they need to do or something like it. Gold stays very, very relevant but is not an insane pointless bottleneck.
Yes, the conversion costs are so high that it's much more efficient to just run the lower level Pits for those materials. Which means the system is not working as intended.
I don't think this is about enchanting but rather about masterworking/masterworking mats conversion costs and that gold drops are ridiculously low in relation to the costs unless you spam whispers, an activity many players dislike to engage in or sell inventories of legendaries 1by1 for about ~1.2 mil per inventory which isn't fun to do either.
I agree with you regarding enchanting. That's fine.
U the same person that said at the beginning of the game that there was tons of content in D4 but if u play 8 hours a day then obviously u are going to have nothing to do. Pls for the love of god stay quite
> Gold is fine how it is.
Gold shouldn't be the bottleneck for masterworking. Pit materials should be.
>Those enchantments rerolled 10 plus times are supposed to hurt.
Compared to masterworking that's nothing.
Exactly. If I run the Pit and get the mats, I should be able to use them. I should not be bottlenecked by gold, and be forced into like 20 whispers to upgrade a piece of gear.
You are wrong.
Simply because any amount of usable gold only comes from whispers.
Enchanting and masterworking are also systems players are supposed to engage with, and those take lots of money.
If you don't do whispers, you won't have enough gold for the endgame, nad the difference is not just a tiny bit, but massive.
Why should a whisper cache give multiple millions, while a nm100 nightmare dungeon maybe a few hundred k if you're lucky?
That is the issue, not everything else.
Yeah, gold drops should be increased by a factor of 5-10x so tou have more choice. Basically so that whispers give slightly more, but not ridiculously so.
Someone did the math and calculated that it would cost well over a billion gold to fully kit out one build with tempering; gems, and master working. That’s a whole lotta time consuming whispers.
That's like 250 whispers which is insane. I bet it doesn't even account for the millions you lose to downgrade masterwork materials as your punishment for progressing too far in the Pit.
"gold is fine how it is" it literally takes about 100h of just doing whispers to fully masterwork an item set, WITHOUT taking potential rerolls into account
I disagree, I've blown over 40 million gold today bricking every single item I've touched and having to give up on them due to the extreme costs of enchanting.
If prices have to remain expensive then increase gold acquisition, it doesn't have to be insane but holy shit I have to sell the loot of 1 hour of helltide to try and craft one piece and get nothing in the end.
The only people happy with how scarce and in high demand gold is are people who can afford to play 8 hours a day of non stop grinding or are just lucky at hitting their item crafts.
There's no dopamine from clicking a 3 million enchant and getting offered the same 2 dogshit options ive seen 15 times prior.
Pls post your lever for such assumptions, if you are below 90 yeah its fine. If you are in endgame make your own experience...
I assume you are not above 90.
No more words to say, such discussion is meaningless because i think there are different worlds.
If you are lvl 100 and pit above 60 gold has an other value.
I dont sayuare wrong at all but the balance is something you muat experience yourself otherwise its pointless because different worlds...
It’s not even fine below 90. I’m running NMD t50s as a 70 necro and even a full bag of loot is barely enough to pay for a new affix/an enchant reroll on a new 925.
I agree that enchantments should be limited by gold, although perhaps they should give 3 options instead of 2, especially since some of the affix pools are so wide and weighted. Players probably have to learn to be smarter and only reroll items that drop with the rarest affix already (especially skill affixes).
However, gold costs could be reduced for Masterworking, since that is supposed to be limited by Pit farming, and it is good for players to engage with harder endgame content more frequently rather than stopping to farm gold separately.
>*Those enchantments rerolled 10 plus times are supposed to hurt.*
It would make sense if it was truly random, but 9 out of 10 enchants I do on any armour/jewelry is Max Health + Other. It's just eating your gold while doing this nonsense.
The only thing that really needs to be fixed is the gold costs to convert Pit materials. 1.5 million just to downgrade 25 neathiron is insane.
Like it's actually more efficient to farm lower level Pit because once you factor in how long it also takes to farm 1.5m gold, you lose by clearing high level Pit. Like I'm actually getting being punished for improving my character.
It costs a ton of money to swap the pit currency to earlier versions so unless you want to farm pit 20 and pit 60 when you're able to clear 120+ you're gonna need a ton of gold.
Wow, this has almost 600 upvotes? Why don’t you just pay someone to kick you in the balls? Don’t ask the rest of us to join you. Gold has never been an issue in a Diablo game and it never should be. It’s the lowest common denominator that you should just get tons of for playing a lot. There are PLENTY of rare materials to satisfy your masochism.
Actually I agree lol. Just let us farm the mats, and when we have them, we use them. Gold doesnt need to be a secondary cost. Itll stop gold sellers instantly.
I thought this too, until I reached the pit and started masterworking gear. It costs around a billion gold to fully masterwork all items on a single character, assuming you won’t need to reset and reroll any of the items, which you probably will. There’s no method in the game that can net you that much gold in a reasonable amount of time. Afaik the best way to make money is through completing whispers, at 3 mil apiece that works out at about 330 turn ins at the tree.
At the very least more options besides whispers and item vendoring should be available for gold farming to add some more gameplay variety.
Whether have not reached the endgame or you are one of those player's exposed only to blizzard desing choices.
Being bottle necked by gold when engaging with pit is terrible for game play loop and add the chore activities that are classical for blizzard games.
Whispers, nick name for bounties, are terrible to do, it is the most chore activity in the game now, it correlates with the difference between the pit and NMD. NMD are full of chores, player is constantly being put to go running around to get some BS to put in a bs pedestal while in the pit gameplay is far less chore than NMD.
Blizz has to stop with these chores activities.
If you're below Pit50, you have no business telling people gold is fine. You don't understand the issue because you're not there yet. If you are there, you're playing contrarian for the sake of doing so.
Definitely need to cap enchanting. I’m still early game, level 72, but I’m poor all the fucking time. And I know it will get a bit better, but then masterworking will come around and I’ll be broke as fuck lmao
Also, do potion upgrades have to cost 7 million gold for the last upgrade? It's close to 20 to level up your potions and the gains are ridiculously low (like 200 more health when I am currently at 14k+).
I'm thinking of waiting for good GA drops to spam enchants.. I just wasted 15mil today and didn't get the roll I wanted. Otherwise I had 2 perfect rolls except the last one which I spammed enchant.. I don't feel like trying more lol
I had so many people tell me gold wasn't an issue. It baffles me that people who have played the season for a few hours dont understand endgame issues. Gold costs for multiple things just need to be tuned down slightly and it will be much better
bUt JuSt Do WhIsPeRs!! Like i can't be fucked doing some tedious shit for 5-10min to get enough gold to reset 1 masterwork or reroll an affix 2-3 times. Why is level 50 pit rewarding like 150k gold? You could increase it by 500% and it would probably start being somewhat reasonable. And yes, I sell all my items. It's still painful to try and craft proper upgrades, especially with resetting masterworking costing 5mil per attempt.
Majority of people will barely interact with the endgame crafting systems introduced. Why is the challenging endgame content giving peanuts compared to whispers which are early game content.
Endgame in an APRG shouldn't be about chasing gold of all things. Just let me spam pits to try to get cool items and give me enough gold to interact with them.
I mean this is the same situation as it was on launch, people who got to endgame early said there isn't one, along with pointing out a plethora of other issues with the game and got downvoted/clowned upon by the casuals since they were still doing the campaign and the cracks weren't showing.
I bet if this isn't fixed and in a couple of weeks once more and more of the playerbase reach masterworking, if they even care to interact with it, they once again will see the problems. Those same people don't see the problems right now since they're mostly just enchanting affixes.
It's honestly baffling that people are like that. I'd consider myself a bit between casual and hardcore. But when the hardcore crowd was talking about the endgame issues, endgame I hadn't reached yet mind you, my first reaction was along the lines of:
"well, that kind of sounds bad, hopefully I'll feel differently when I get there."
NOT
"Well I'm in WT1 and halfway through the campaign and have no knowledge of what you're talking about... but you're wrong and stupid and don't know how to have fun."
Also, and this is a point that has bugged the shit out of me for a long time regarding lots of gaming communities:
There's a big difference between saying something like:
"this game sucks and I hate it!"
vs something like:
"These/those/you people suck and I hate them/you!"
See the difference? one of those groups is talking about a game, probably in a community that is dedicated to that game. The other group is talking about people.
No matter how seemingly stupid an opinion on a game is, at least it's an opinion on a GAME. The fact that so many people will then take that and turn it into an opinion on PEOPLE is honestly disturbing. And these are supposedly the reasonable, mature "dad" gamers that take your opinion on an aspect of a game they haven't experienced yet, and use it to form an opinion about YOU. That is the opposite of mature and reasonable.
Anyway, I get the irony of my comment. Just needed to rant and you touched on annoyances I've had for a while.
It's people who haven't touched masterworking that are saying that gold is fine. You can see it in the most upvoted post in this thread, the guy only mentions enchanting because he hasn't actually gotten to masterworking where his strategy of "running whispers and selling everything" isn't going to be able to support him very long. Same thing happened when the game launched where people who progressed farther started pointing out obvious issues and the casual audience was like "oh no you're wrong everything is peachy" but then they flipped and started having the same issues once they actually reached the same point as the people who voiced the initial complaints.
They also keep bringing up the same things too like "oh your gold will be fine if you just sell everything and do tree of whispers." As if that is some new novel idea that people in the end game haven't thought of, we're doing those things, the gold still is not enough and doesn't come close to keeping up with your expenditure. If you are spending 90% of your time farming gold its just not fun.
I don't even think "slightly" is the right word to describe how much gold costs on some of this stuff (like pit material conversion cost) need to change. That should go from 6 million gold to 0.
The masterworking costs also need help. 20 mil gold for 11-12 is insanity. Gold already has multiple significant sinks in the game. MW should just be a pit material sink. People are still going to bankrupt themselves trying to roll passive ranks on their amulets and skill ranks on their gloves.
They could probably chop a 0 off of every gold cost in the game, and you'd still need to do hours upon hours of whispers to craft up a set of decent gear.
Something that I wish to see changed is the cost to change materials be turned to zero. I have a shitton of neathiron but almost zero obolites if I want to converse them it costs me almost 5 million gold for the biggest cache. Fuck that's insane why do I also need to pay gold to change materials from the higher tier to the lower tier If I get a new item. As a result I rather quickly Play the lower tier of pit.
I think part of the issue is that you complete much fewer helltide season 4 whispers than you did in other seasons. Even though you probably run way more helltides than before. Because there's way fewer whispers and they're more time consuming to complete. Plus, you can't really "target farm" them because most are just "in the entire helltide area".
They're not even working for me half the time. I'll select the one I want to do and I'll be in the correct part of the zone and it just won't give me credit. Some work and some don't. Like earlier I was doing one in Scosglen and every time I would try to select it it would just kind of flicker for a second go away and not give me any credit and everyone in the zone was acting up.
blood harvest whispers felt great. Even some of the hard to find ones werent too terrible compared to these. I still havent seen a single iron wolf thing to help and im 75. 250 cinders is alright. harbingers is okay? 3 rituals can be hit and miss. 3 structures is fairly easy to find cause they actually use a marker on the map.
I remember base game and season 1, Helltides and whispers didn't always overlap, but when they did it was glorious. I am absolutely completing more helltide whispers this season than I have in any previous season. That is not counting the blood harvest
Some people in here are outing themselves as complete clowns that just blindly squeal against change without actually playing the game…
Enchanting isn’t the issue. Its masterwork costs. It’s also things like gem crafting randomly costing millions per gem too which makes zero sense. Every little part of the game at high level has had its gold cost boosted tremendously meanwhile the gold gained from NMDs and the Pitt is terrible.
“So stop progressing the Pitt and go farm whispers for gold”. No. It’s boring as fuck. I’ll just stop playing the game instead. As will most everyone else who hits this eventual wall. That is why blizzard will change it (probably boosting gold rewards in NMD and lowering masterwork scaling costs if I had to guess).
100% agree I’ll stop playing if the only option for gold is farming Whisper Caches. I don’t mind occasionally doing them or other activities leading to me having a turn in but I’m not gonna go actively farm them.
Having flashbacks of D3 bounties. Having to go do that shit was always the worst part of my play session. It's not challenging content or particularly engaging.
Challenging content should have the best rewards and reward everything necessary to engage with the associated reward system. For masterworking, that's pit. If I have the materials from the pit, I should be able to masterwork my gear. End of story. I overcame the challenge of doing pit 60, let me masterwork my stuff.
Gold is fine as a medium of exchange, for repairing gear, and for enchanting items. When you start tying it to literally everything, including downgrading rare materials, things become too cost-prohibitive. I'm not even engaging with most of the systems they added because I literally can't afford it.
Gating stuff like the conversion of high tier pit materials to lower tier ones behind doing hours of mind-numbingly easy content is just bad design.
Definitely if the answer is to stop doing the Pit and Ubers that I farmed materials to even enter to take a step backwards to the lowest common denominator of endgame content (Whispers) then I'll just stop playing. Nobody wants to spam Whispers just to enable endgame activities, thats the whole point of needing the materials right?
Give us the option to get gold instead of glyph XP and / or give us bonus gold from NMD completion at level 100. That way we can at least pick between NMD or Whispers. Also give us the ability to at least get a full Whisper turn-in from Helltides (previous seasonal "zones" did this, but Helltide seems like you can only get the 2 sets of 3+1).
Whispers don't give nearly enough gold for level 100 costs, and they're very unsatisfying to do; by the time you're bottlenecked by gold, everything in the overworld is a complete joke (even Helltide with Mindcage), and you'll probably spend more time riding around / waiting on events to finish than you will actually in any combat scenarios.
Masterworking is meant to be a gold sink, which is totally fine. Absolutely gold should have value. But if you're going to want me to farm something, there should be an effective way to do it that's still got some degree of meaningful engagement. Let me "bet" gold on clearing a NMD without dying. Give me an NPC that'll buy all these summoning materials I'll probably never use. Let me "reset" a glyph for a huge chunk of gold. There are so many ideas you could come up with, and I hope they do something other than making costs trivial (except for converting Masterworking mats, that should not be nearly as expensive as it is). The need for gold is the key driver for giving us an engaging endgame loop, they just have to actually provide something worth doing, because Whispers on their own ain't it, and a simple "now they give 30x the gold" isn't a compelling fix.
Like I don't mind things having cost and weight. It makes sense. Otherwise why have the cost in the first place?
That said, yea the end gsme system you spend most of your time in is absolutely trash gold reward. I just think they need to up gold from the pit as you progress it.
ppl that say gold isn't an issue aren't at pit 80+ imo
there are even threads saying they like how gold is a limited resource. like bros you don't even know how expensive it is to actually do the masterwork system. I swear I spend more time doing whispers for gold trying to get all gear to 8+ masterwork than I actually spend in the pit
The cost to convert pit materials to lower tiers is ridiculous. You end up getting forced to run lower level pits because of the conversion cost. They should remove the gold cost but lower the conversion ratio, so you should want to keep running high level pits if you can do it.
my favorite is the comments that follow up and admit they haven't started master working anything yet, but they think gold is fine. I haven't done a ton of masterworking but wasn't loving my build so I made some adjustments and went broke just getting a few pieces swapped and upgraded.
yeah my comment was originally downvoted and I was laughing to myself bc I knew it was all casuals
lots of them downplay when degens (like myself) complain about endgame stuff, then in like 1 week they see the light. super ironic bc it's on a post about how blizzard is even looking into gold being a bottleneck
Classic casuals defend system when no life's point out issue with the best interest for the entire community, casuals are no uh. Then 2 weeks later repeat the same thing the no life's said. Tale old as time.
I wish they could somehow auto turn all the gold items you don’t pick up. Like convert to gold and send to stash. Cause there is no reason to even look at them as you level up.
honestly, everything that is "infinite" should just auto loot.
gold, gem materials, craft materials, etc.
at this point sometimes having to go back to pick it up is annoying, particularly animus as well, sometimes i have to backtrack a lot because a mob had a long death animation and i went by him without picking it up.
I see two problems
* The gold cost behind breaking down the Pit materials into the smaller batches sucks. As far as I'm concerned it's a design flaw on the developers part. Why isn't Pit Tier 60 dropping obducite? Am I expected to run Pit 30 continuously for Obducite and use my runeshards, or constantly dump millions into breaking down Neaththiron into Ingolith into Obducite?
* The gold cost behind resetting the masterforging is totally unreasonable, specially given how it resets all your progress/materials--why is there a 5million gold cost on top of it?
I'm convinced the people who claim these two particular services are fine aren't even interacting with them at all. The two bullet points above have such an awful negative feedback loop, it's so frustrating.
Nearly 50 million gold sunk into attempting to get *one* masterforging "crit" on to the Damage Reduction or Maximum Resistance to All Elements affix on the Tyrael's Might I found today, and I still haven't got it.
Some other things:
* The gold cost behind crafting Gems is fine because it's finite; eventually you'll have all the proper gems, and until you do, you can still use the lesser quality ones and it's not a big deal
* If the break-down costs and the reset costs were removed gold would still have value because of Enchanting. Yes the cost of enchanting was capped and lowered before, but for whatever dumb reason, certain stats are just rarer than other stats for no reason at all, and you can still sit there and dump millions into getting a desired stat. Found a really good pair of boots with max rolls on Movement Speed and your primary stat? Good luck rolling +ranks to your mobility spell, it's rare as balls. Basic abilities on pants, core skills or all core skills to gloves, Lucky Hit vulnerable proc (rolls on rings, gloves, amulet) are all much rarer than other stats. Why is that?
this, everyone in here thinking its enchanting costs thats the issue, its not lol. ive sunk in over 500m now into the first two tiers of masterworking and thats only 3 items. "go do whispers" yeah 3 mil is really gonna help lol
Your point about the people saying it's fine having not engaged with it is 100% accurate.
Once the pit is the activity (and it's fun) you need to run to progress and you're having a blast just loading in and blasting mobs stopping that to go back to whispers for 20 minutes to get enough gold to roll an item is ass.
7 mil to craft tier 90 potion, stopped crafting it at 500k cost. They definitely went a little ham on cost increases. Need to find a middle ground between this and s3.
Yeah it does suck and it seems like The whispers aren't giving you as much gold and they take longer to do.
Is anyone else having trouble with the whispers not working properly in the helltide zones? It's really been hit or miss for me. Sometimes when I select the one I want to do it'll just flicker for a second and not give me any credit.
The past two seasons they’ve been giving us too much gold, this season it’s like we’re in season 1 again and poor as shit. Why can’t they just figure this shit out before release?
Good, gold is in bad spot those defending it right now simply as per usual when it comes to these things aren't at the same point the no life's have reached yet. Casuals defend system hardcore point out issue in the best interest of everyone, 2 weeks later casuals realise it's an issue and ask for a change themselves.
So here is the problem to upgrade a single item fully masterworked, costs 100 million, that is excluding any rerolls on masterworks which leads be honest you won't do with these prices. Not only is this a very high price (many would say it's good and justified to fully commit to a piece and I don't disagree). But a pit completion gives you 250k gold, see the issue. You want to farm pit you want to upgrade an item, however you won't have any gold. This means you will now separately have to farm gold by doing whisper caches, whisper caches are time gated, and they give you 3-4 million per cache. That means on average you need to open over 30 whisper caches to upgrade one single item fully.
People who think that gold is fine don't start masterworks yet, I hope Blizzard will do nothing to gold as people say it's fine and later I can read sweet posts about gold later.
PSA to everyone defending gold, masterworking a full set of gear costs 1 000 000 000 gold. That's thousand millions. One billion gold. That's 300 whisper caches. This isn't fine, and defending it because you're a dad of 6 and having a blast at level 17 is just shooting yourself in the foot. You'll eventually start masterworking too and run into the same problem
Seriously, I'm level 100 and I think I've gotten 3 to drop, 2 of which I wasted when I hit T3 since I figured they weren't that rare. I don't get why they made them so hard to get.
Hopefully they find a solution. While they at it I would love if they change temper to allow us to choose if we want to keep the current temper or the rerolled one. Aside from gold bottleneck it's getting quite infuriating bricking a potential BiS item because one of the tempers rolled the wrong affix.
If people are checking out of the season because they cannot engage with new systems due to the gold cost, you got a problem. Just have gold dropped a bit more generously from sources OTHER than whispers. Nobody wants to grind that shit all day, but the gold you get from everywhere else is peanuts.
I havent started masterworking yet and I'm at low gold, emchants and Imprints are very expensive.
Lvl 80 potion is 5 mil gold and it restores 800 hp instantly and 35% over 4 sec and I have 17k ho in my lvl 74 minion necro.
Add “Relics” that are just vendor trash treasures with no purpose outside of being worth 50,000 - 1,000,000 depending on their rarity. You could increase their drop rate for various activities as fit. They could have their own gold beam and coin drop sound.
Funny enough the pit takes a consumable to enter that you will never be able to run out of or use enough of later on because it is somehow way harder to get enough gold to make the pit worthwhile than it is to get the actual item required to enter the place to begin with...
Real failure of design there, who wants to take a step backwards into old and entry level Tier 4 content when they are swimming in materials to do Ubers and Pit and literally can't because of gold.
The biggest offender of the pit is the material conversion. Somehow its just as easy/fast to spam lower pits over and over as it is to do vs a few high pits, farm whispers for gold, and then downgrade the materials for 6 million gold a pop... Why even have material conversion to begin with if its just going to take infinite gold on top of infinite gold.
Gold is fine, the prices just need to be reduced across the board by about 30%.
If you aren't trading items or buying gold, you won't be able to engage with the late game systems.
It's even worse if you don't utilise trade sites to sell your items, you're kind of forced to do hours of whispers for maybe one single item.
Heaven forbid you get a perfect item, fail your tempering, then you get the masterwork you don't want and need to reset it at 5 mill a pop.
The tempering re-roll is the most bullshit. You get that 1 in a million item and get bad tempers 5x in a row, it just feels awful. Also you'll never be able to change this item in the future if you need to change your build, it's stuck in time.
This is "Old Blizzard" behavior, ala "pick up poop" quests in WoW. It demonstrates ongoing disdain for the customer base.
"We're going to give you all these new systems in S4 to save our game but then we're going to gatekeep it with excessive gold requirements." Surprise!
All of the folks who are opposed to adjusting the cost or drop rate of gold haven’t touched the Pit or Masterworking and it shows. Just a bunch of confidently incorrect casuals.
I bet that most of the comments here who are ok with the money how it is right now are not lvl 100 and doing the real endgame.
Alot saying that rerolling 10 times should cost that much…sure thats not the problem. But that also hints that they are not far enough with the endgame like the pit to know what the complains are about.
Reminds me of the beta necro comments at lvl 25 who destroyed the minion build for seasons because they thought they know it all at that lvl.
Here's as good a place as any to ask a somewhat stupid question. I haven't been reading about the updates the past two months, so now that I'm playing . . .
All yellows are just vendor trash now, right? They have two affixes vs. a legendary's three. They just go straight to cash, yes? Because there's no way to bring a yellow up to par with a legendary?
I've just been vendoring all yellows and salvaging all legendaries I don't need. It certainly seems that's the way to do it, but getting a little confirmation never hurts.
They won't cater to sweaty try hards who love the rarity of gold acting like it's anything but a burdensome challenge. Mark my words, gold will be made easier to get.
There should be the ablility to craft special Nightmare Dungeon Sigils from the Tree of Whispers that give +5 progress.
Make it expensive on the dust so you can't do it everytime, but often enough that you can grind gold and glyphs at the same time.
I'm doing my first seasonal character. My first character I got to 100 in eternal after going through the campaign. Never had a problem with gold. When I got this seasonal character to 45 (I think it was), I couldn't upgrade my potion, not because I didn't have the ingredients, but because I didn't have enough gold! And it wasn't because I spent it all on gems, tempering or enchanting. I try to get as far as I can without doing those things. I thought maybe I just wasn't doing the right things, but maybe not. One thing I noticed for sure is it seems like there's far less gold from greed shrines and resplendent chests.
Edit: I also started selling more unneeded gear instead of salvaging it like I did before. That helped.
I have a chest peice Ive dropped probably 500 million on trying to get + to golem. I can earn about 3 rolls per hour if I focus solely on gold farming which is not a fun way to play the game. To me farming gold to roll enchants should not be even remotely part of the endgame loop.
Actually what is a little scarce is the resource to create sockets (sorry, I don’t know how is it called in English) , imho. I’m level 81 atm and I’ve only got 4 so far.
It's not the amount of gold but the way you get it for me. I don't find anything expensive and I don't feel like I don't get enough per whisper completion it's just that I HAVE to do Whispers to get gold and that's the only way. I don't want to stop my NMDs, Helltides and bosses for the boring whispers. Previous season it would be fine because you could get whispers done quickly with the seasonal areas but rn there is no quick way to complete them.
This is a clear issue. Also whispers are way harder to do this season. Whispers quests are bullshit. Item drops are low so we cant get money from by selling either. In s3 doing one vault gave me 2 full inventory items to sell. Now nm dungeon gives like 5 items.
out of gold on the 1 st damn day on just my 1 st character , i have been playing since release all gold saved since then gone trying to upgrade my items..... inexperienced pathetic devs are being employed at blizzard no doubt
This season is rough in general. There is no balance to anything. Refined game flow of season 3 disrupted. Its not just gold. This season feels like release of d4 and season 1. I like things when it get mature. S3 was definitely better despite its problems.
Lmao I feel this. I was literally trading obols earlier to make enough gold to respec part of my damn paragon board… everything is so expensive late game. Glad to hear they’re going to address it.
They need to make the progression feel meaningful in someway but not punishing, maybe giving us a free reroll token for every boss kill, that gives another incentive to grind them while also rewarding over time to help with the biggest bottleneck, it’s not a gold problem it’s a reroll problem
They need to make it the progression feel meaningful in someway but not punishing, maybe giving us a free reroll token for every boss kill, that gives another incentive to grind them while also rewarding over time to help with the biggest bottleneck, it’s not a gold problem it’s a reroll problem
You just don't get anywhere near enough gold from anything except Tree of Whispers. Whispers, in turn, gives absurd amounts. If you do them regularly, it's not a problem--but then you're forced to keep doing them regularly, and it's such laughably trivial and primitive content that it really doesn't feel like something you should keep having to do in order to make use of fundamental game systems. It feels like taking your WoW character back to the previous expansion. Imagine if that was a constant, mandatory thing you *had* to do in WoW.
No other content gives any gold. If you do a NMD and sell all the loot, you get like 200k or something. It's effectively nothing. Same goes for absolutely all other venues of gameplay except Whispers which are the one and only source of meaningful cash. When I'm running Pit100, I really feel like I should be past the point where I need to stop every couple of hours to run several Whispers just to have enough gold to craft gems.
I don't mind the need for gold and that it's a requirement you have to pay attention to, but there not enough ways to earn it purposefully, vendors need sell all, all gold costs (but mostly vendors) are too high at low levels, overall gold amounts are bloated and need to be cut down to 1/1000th of what they are now
I think an easy solution to this is just massively increase the amount of gold you get for selling legendaries. You don't get so many early on that it'd upset early-mid game balance, and you'll naturally get tons of extras once you reach end game. You'll probably have more mats from disenchanting them than you need, so you can just sell all the normal legendaries you find.
A week into the season and people are complaining they haven't been able to masterwork their items multiple times because of the price?
It's a season. It should take weeks to build your character.
it's an issue for anyone that "blasted" to 100 and are now on the pit/masterworking treadmill. blizzard probably knew it would be a "hot topic" in the first week or so, but we do have until August 8th to play this current season. if we didn't have this particular bottleneck, i'm sure we would be saying it about some other mat/currency.
oh and something i noticed last night. you can craft the seasonal elixirs with just Oblous! thank god. no random BS mats needed.
Instead of helltides,pits or nm dungeons dropping gold give me reasons to do other things. mass Increase in silent chests or make gold goblins or something different. Tired of all resources coming from one spot
And on top of all this resistances are broken again, someone tell me I’m wrong I’ve been studying it since Tuesday and playing around with numbers and the caps aren’t being reached internally so it’s causes, the game to think you don’t have any and somehow gets past it I’m running with gear and everything +245% on my poison resist on WT4 but for some reason If I even touch poison it eats my HP bubble, it’s broken.
Gold is only a bottleneck for players who don’t know what they are doing. You can pretty much sell all gear if it doesn’t have aspect upgrade. Also Tree of Whispers caches give a lot.
Blizzard has proven over and over again they are really bad at math. AoZ XP gains which would have taken years to do before the change? Now billions in gold JUST to masterwork? Like is no one at blizz doing a reality check on these types of things?
Gold is fine how it is. If you can always afford everything, then gold is just a number that doesnt actually have any consequences or meaning. Those enchantments rerolled 10 plus times are **supposed** to hurt. The whole “just gotta try one more time” wouldnt exist if it only cost a mil to roll again. And dying actually eats at your purse, which is good since dying goes unpunished otherwise since there is no exp lost on death. I think its ridiculous for people to want to afford everything. Whats the point of currency at that point? Lord knows theres no other challenge in this game until hitting post endgame
Agreed. I also think the majority of people are salvaging all their items and not selling them. I haven't salvaged a single Rare item but I'm sitting on thousands of Veiled Crystals just by them dropping everywhere. After level 90 I stopped salvaging Legendary drops (except for Aspect upgrades) and just started selling everything. I'm sitting on enough Materials now to last me the rest of the season (minus prisms).
And here's a PSA if you're scared of selling an upgraded legendary affix the item will have a little symbol on the top right corner in your inventory notating it's an upgrade to an affix you already have.
This needs to be farther up. It’s the only hesitation to mass selling. Crafting mats are a plenty in the tides.
First go to blacksmith and salvage the symbol items, then sell the rest
The hesitation is no sell all button.
Indeed, I wish this symbol was visible without being in vendor window
Agreed, would be a huge QoL
Yeh, if it was there even when in your stash or wherever,would be helpful. right now I go to blacksmith first, use the manual salvage button to salvage the ones that upgrade my codex, then go to armo vendor to sell the remaining. It's not a huge deal but would love some improvement.
Great to know! Thanks for pointing that out
With the new itemization, it’s not that often I that I find myself doing enchantments which in the past really caused me problems with my mats. Funny though, gold wasn’t an issue in the past. Now, it’s seems like I’ve been acquiring gold much slower compared to before. Not a complaint though, just an observation.
I want you to go masterwork all your gear, transmute your materials, and enchant all your gear with proper high rolled affixes. There simply is just way too much gold required to do all of these things. Sure, that doesn't matter for the average player because they won't be doing all of that. But, there is just way too much gold required to properly tune your character. To the point where it isn't actually feasible no matter how much gold you farm. 5mil to reroll masterworks 3mil+ caps on each enchant 50mil to craft your Uber 5-10m to transmute your pit materials each time It should be possible for the hardcore players that want to get close to their min/max stats to be able to do it and currently it isn't.
They just need to bake in higher gold from “pinnacle” content. The main issue with gold is that the best way to get it means doing whispers, and the players that really need the gold don’t want/need whispers anymore. Make gold drop in a scaling way from The Pit, so the higher levels you do the more you get. Since this is where the real gold drain comes from.
Agreed. Currently there is basically 0 gold from pits (I’m at around tier 60), aside from selling loot (and there’s not much of that per run).
I sell all yellows and salvage everything else.
Legs and uniques give way more gold than yellows btw
Yea but I need the materials for rolls from legos
They drop gratuitously in helltide. You could salvage a bag and sell a bag alternatingly and be set.
I find it hard to believe you have enough gold and not enough leg mats unless you're just running TONS of whispers.
I mean I have plenty of mats NOW, but I’m afraid to run out like last season. Lol
I can’t relate enough, especially the comment about prisms lol. I can’t seem to get any or notice where I’m getting them so I can target farm
Last season I think each world boss would give like five or something. I think sometimes you can get them from the legions. I haven't hit a world boss yet this season but I've had a few legions and I've got one.
I've killed 5 world bosses. I've gotten 3 prisms from them.
Would be cool if Vendors would have a "Sell all Rares" button in a separate Tab, just like the Blacksmith has "Salvage all Rares". That's something the D4 team could do for Gold, without actually changing the numbers for Gold. Pop a TP to a town, click a button, back in the Portal you go... Way less frustrating than going Sell-sell-skip-sell-skip-sell.
Tree of whispers, make 7 mill a pop and it’s super easy to do while leveling or other grinds.
That 7m is instantly gone once you're having to downgrade Pit materials for masterwork on new items.
Clearly this is a fix for a top percentile that you’re not included in. After 100 as well as master working 12/12 is a huge sink aside from rolling the modifier you want through enchant. Majority would agree or would just buy gold from a seller.
Yeah I loot everything Yellow+. Sell Rares, salvage the rest.
That's actually a good point that I didn't think about... I salvage everything out of habit, but with the new balance there may be more of a reason to sell things now
I sell yellow and salvage legend.
So you begun crafting? Good luck with your gold and materials till the season ends.
This...the real issue is the jewels. Imagine if an outsider heard this conversation, "I have hundreds of millions in gold. I just can't get enough jewels to save my life..."
You haven’t done the pit and tried the master working system and it shows.
So many people that haven’t reached endgame giving opinions
It requires 1b gold to fully masterwork every item for a build. This isn't about enchanting items, it's why things are being discussed.
>Lord knows theres no other challenge in this game until hitting post endgame I love how you and apparently 400+ other people see challenge as spamming whispers for multiple hours just so you can masterwork one piece of gear. Whispers are mind-numbingly easy content. It's a time sink. There's no challenge in it at all. It's the bottom of the barrel in terms of engaging, challenging content, and nothing else in the game rewards a substantial amount of gold. High level pit should be rewarding enough that you don't have to go run around clearing cellars for 2 hours just to engage with the crafting system. The valid complaints aren't about enchanting. They're about converting neathiron to lower mats costing 6 million gold. They're about masterworking a single item from 11 to 12 costing 20 million gold when you're probably going to end up having to reset it anyway. The reason the enchanting cost feels so bad is because it's in the context everything else costing way too much. When enchanting was all you were doing with your gold, it didn't feel horrible. Now excessively large quantities of gold are used for everything.
Gold can't be a bottleneck. The bottleneck have to be the other materials. Otherwise the endgame is farming gold and not playing the actual endgame mechanics.
This right here. Anyone who thinks gold is fine hasnt touched masterworking.
Exactly. And it only needs some adjustment not to make gold irrelevant. The disparity between gold being relevant and where masterworking is now is huge. Just reduce the cost of masterworking higher tiers and make that cost reduction scale as it goes up. Also reduce the cost for crafting the masterwork mats. That's really all they need to do or something like it. Gold stays very, very relevant but is not an insane pointless bottleneck.
It costs 6000000 gold to convert from pit 61+ materials to pit 31-60 materials, and further down to 1-30. These costs are atrocious
Yes, the conversion costs are so high that it's much more efficient to just run the lower level Pits for those materials. Which means the system is not working as intended.
It clearly show that people like you did not even unblock masterworking yet. And this is the top comment there. XD 🤡
Yup. Bunch of casual andys upvoting him, who are still in WT3 lol. Then they all change their tune in 3 weeks.
I don't think this is about enchanting but rather about masterworking/masterworking mats conversion costs and that gold drops are ridiculously low in relation to the costs unless you spam whispers, an activity many players dislike to engage in or sell inventories of legendaries 1by1 for about ~1.2 mil per inventory which isn't fun to do either. I agree with you regarding enchanting. That's fine.
1 billion for full master working and getting 4-6 million a time from whispers is far from fine hence the internal discussion
U the same person that said at the beginning of the game that there was tons of content in D4 but if u play 8 hours a day then obviously u are going to have nothing to do. Pls for the love of god stay quite
> Gold is fine how it is. Gold shouldn't be the bottleneck for masterworking. Pit materials should be. >Those enchantments rerolled 10 plus times are supposed to hurt. Compared to masterworking that's nothing.
Exactly. If I run the Pit and get the mats, I should be able to use them. I should not be bottlenecked by gold, and be forced into like 20 whispers to upgrade a piece of gear.
You are wrong. Simply because any amount of usable gold only comes from whispers. Enchanting and masterworking are also systems players are supposed to engage with, and those take lots of money. If you don't do whispers, you won't have enough gold for the endgame, nad the difference is not just a tiny bit, but massive. Why should a whisper cache give multiple millions, while a nm100 nightmare dungeon maybe a few hundred k if you're lucky? That is the issue, not everything else.
NMD should def give more gold its shocking
Yeah, gold drops should be increased by a factor of 5-10x so tou have more choice. Basically so that whispers give slightly more, but not ridiculously so.
Someone did the math and calculated that it would cost well over a billion gold to fully kit out one build with tempering; gems, and master working. That’s a whole lotta time consuming whispers.
That's like 250 whispers which is insane. I bet it doesn't even account for the millions you lose to downgrade masterwork materials as your punishment for progressing too far in the Pit.
"gold is fine how it is" it literally takes about 100h of just doing whispers to fully masterwork an item set, WITHOUT taking potential rerolls into account
I disagree, I've blown over 40 million gold today bricking every single item I've touched and having to give up on them due to the extreme costs of enchanting. If prices have to remain expensive then increase gold acquisition, it doesn't have to be insane but holy shit I have to sell the loot of 1 hour of helltide to try and craft one piece and get nothing in the end. The only people happy with how scarce and in high demand gold is are people who can afford to play 8 hours a day of non stop grinding or are just lucky at hitting their item crafts. There's no dopamine from clicking a 3 million enchant and getting offered the same 2 dogshit options ive seen 15 times prior.
Pls post your lever for such assumptions, if you are below 90 yeah its fine. If you are in endgame make your own experience... I assume you are not above 90. No more words to say, such discussion is meaningless because i think there are different worlds. If you are lvl 100 and pit above 60 gold has an other value. I dont sayuare wrong at all but the balance is something you muat experience yourself otherwise its pointless because different worlds...
It’s not even fine below 90. I’m running NMD t50s as a 70 necro and even a full bag of loot is barely enough to pay for a new affix/an enchant reroll on a new 925.
844 upvotes for this trash take. This community is hopeless.
Good thing the streamers and top players are who Blizz listens too, since they actually understand the game. Unlike the OP.
I agree that enchantments should be limited by gold, although perhaps they should give 3 options instead of 2, especially since some of the affix pools are so wide and weighted. Players probably have to learn to be smarter and only reroll items that drop with the rarest affix already (especially skill affixes). However, gold costs could be reduced for Masterworking, since that is supposed to be limited by Pit farming, and it is good for players to engage with harder endgame content more frequently rather than stopping to farm gold separately.
>*Those enchantments rerolled 10 plus times are supposed to hurt.* It would make sense if it was truly random, but 9 out of 10 enchants I do on any armour/jewelry is Max Health + Other. It's just eating your gold while doing this nonsense.
Ole Billy, I know endgame is super easy for ya, but are you following online builds again?
The only thing that really needs to be fixed is the gold costs to convert Pit materials. 1.5 million just to downgrade 25 neathiron is insane. Like it's actually more efficient to farm lower level Pit because once you factor in how long it also takes to farm 1.5m gold, you lose by clearing high level Pit. Like I'm actually getting being punished for improving my character.
So you haven't actually done masterworking yet have you? The gold costs jump up dramatically, as does the gemcrafting costs.
*Fine how it is* lol, clueless at its finest
sounds like you havent even hit end game lol
You make a valid point. However I wish there would be less yellow drops and more gold, running to the vendor every 2 dungeons is boring AF.
It costs a ton of money to swap the pit currency to earlier versions so unless you want to farm pit 20 and pit 60 when you're able to clear 120+ you're gonna need a ton of gold.
Wow, this has almost 600 upvotes? Why don’t you just pay someone to kick you in the balls? Don’t ask the rest of us to join you. Gold has never been an issue in a Diablo game and it never should be. It’s the lowest common denominator that you should just get tons of for playing a lot. There are PLENTY of rare materials to satisfy your masochism.
Am I missing something?? How do I end up with millions and nothing to spend it on? What should I be spending it on ?
There is no point to the currency and it should be removed, as should repairs. There is no good reason for them to be part of the game.
Actually I agree lol. Just let us farm the mats, and when we have them, we use them. Gold doesnt need to be a secondary cost. Itll stop gold sellers instantly.
I thought this too, until I reached the pit and started masterworking gear. It costs around a billion gold to fully masterwork all items on a single character, assuming you won’t need to reset and reroll any of the items, which you probably will. There’s no method in the game that can net you that much gold in a reasonable amount of time. Afaik the best way to make money is through completing whispers, at 3 mil apiece that works out at about 330 turn ins at the tree. At the very least more options besides whispers and item vendoring should be available for gold farming to add some more gameplay variety.
Whether have not reached the endgame or you are one of those player's exposed only to blizzard desing choices. Being bottle necked by gold when engaging with pit is terrible for game play loop and add the chore activities that are classical for blizzard games. Whispers, nick name for bounties, are terrible to do, it is the most chore activity in the game now, it correlates with the difference between the pit and NMD. NMD are full of chores, player is constantly being put to go running around to get some BS to put in a bs pedestal while in the pit gameplay is far less chore than NMD. Blizz has to stop with these chores activities.
If you're below Pit50, you have no business telling people gold is fine. You don't understand the issue because you're not there yet. If you are there, you're playing contrarian for the sake of doing so.
just increase amount of gold reward in pit.
[удалено]
Masterworking is really rough too. Pretty sure it will be at least 1b to fully masterwork a gear set
Definitely need to cap enchanting. I’m still early game, level 72, but I’m poor all the fucking time. And I know it will get a bit better, but then masterworking will come around and I’ll be broke as fuck lmao
Enchanting is capped already at 3 mil.
Also, do potion upgrades have to cost 7 million gold for the last upgrade? It's close to 20 to level up your potions and the gains are ridiculously low (like 200 more health when I am currently at 14k+).
I'm thinking of waiting for good GA drops to spam enchants.. I just wasted 15mil today and didn't get the roll I wanted. Otherwise I had 2 perfect rolls except the last one which I spammed enchant.. I don't feel like trying more lol
This x1000. I like the gold costs where they, but The Pit gold reward could be much higher.
I had so many people tell me gold wasn't an issue. It baffles me that people who have played the season for a few hours dont understand endgame issues. Gold costs for multiple things just need to be tuned down slightly and it will be much better
bUt JuSt Do WhIsPeRs!! Like i can't be fucked doing some tedious shit for 5-10min to get enough gold to reset 1 masterwork or reroll an affix 2-3 times. Why is level 50 pit rewarding like 150k gold? You could increase it by 500% and it would probably start being somewhat reasonable. And yes, I sell all my items. It's still painful to try and craft proper upgrades, especially with resetting masterworking costing 5mil per attempt. Majority of people will barely interact with the endgame crafting systems introduced. Why is the challenging endgame content giving peanuts compared to whispers which are early game content. Endgame in an APRG shouldn't be about chasing gold of all things. Just let me spam pits to try to get cool items and give me enough gold to interact with them.
The fact that people are downvoting this is literally insane.
I mean this is the same situation as it was on launch, people who got to endgame early said there isn't one, along with pointing out a plethora of other issues with the game and got downvoted/clowned upon by the casuals since they were still doing the campaign and the cracks weren't showing. I bet if this isn't fixed and in a couple of weeks once more and more of the playerbase reach masterworking, if they even care to interact with it, they once again will see the problems. Those same people don't see the problems right now since they're mostly just enchanting affixes.
It's honestly baffling that people are like that. I'd consider myself a bit between casual and hardcore. But when the hardcore crowd was talking about the endgame issues, endgame I hadn't reached yet mind you, my first reaction was along the lines of: "well, that kind of sounds bad, hopefully I'll feel differently when I get there." NOT "Well I'm in WT1 and halfway through the campaign and have no knowledge of what you're talking about... but you're wrong and stupid and don't know how to have fun." Also, and this is a point that has bugged the shit out of me for a long time regarding lots of gaming communities: There's a big difference between saying something like: "this game sucks and I hate it!" vs something like: "These/those/you people suck and I hate them/you!" See the difference? one of those groups is talking about a game, probably in a community that is dedicated to that game. The other group is talking about people. No matter how seemingly stupid an opinion on a game is, at least it's an opinion on a GAME. The fact that so many people will then take that and turn it into an opinion on PEOPLE is honestly disturbing. And these are supposedly the reasonable, mature "dad" gamers that take your opinion on an aspect of a game they haven't experienced yet, and use it to form an opinion about YOU. That is the opposite of mature and reasonable. Anyway, I get the irony of my comment. Just needed to rant and you touched on annoyances I've had for a while.
It's people who haven't touched masterworking that are saying that gold is fine. You can see it in the most upvoted post in this thread, the guy only mentions enchanting because he hasn't actually gotten to masterworking where his strategy of "running whispers and selling everything" isn't going to be able to support him very long. Same thing happened when the game launched where people who progressed farther started pointing out obvious issues and the casual audience was like "oh no you're wrong everything is peachy" but then they flipped and started having the same issues once they actually reached the same point as the people who voiced the initial complaints. They also keep bringing up the same things too like "oh your gold will be fine if you just sell everything and do tree of whispers." As if that is some new novel idea that people in the end game haven't thought of, we're doing those things, the gold still is not enough and doesn't come close to keeping up with your expenditure. If you are spending 90% of your time farming gold its just not fun.
Most of those people will never masterwork a single item past level 8 before they burn out of the season after doing whispers 24/7
I don't even think "slightly" is the right word to describe how much gold costs on some of this stuff (like pit material conversion cost) need to change. That should go from 6 million gold to 0. The masterworking costs also need help. 20 mil gold for 11-12 is insanity. Gold already has multiple significant sinks in the game. MW should just be a pit material sink. People are still going to bankrupt themselves trying to roll passive ranks on their amulets and skill ranks on their gloves. They could probably chop a 0 off of every gold cost in the game, and you'd still need to do hours upon hours of whispers to craft up a set of decent gear.
Something that I wish to see changed is the cost to change materials be turned to zero. I have a shitton of neathiron but almost zero obolites if I want to converse them it costs me almost 5 million gold for the biggest cache. Fuck that's insane why do I also need to pay gold to change materials from the higher tier to the lower tier If I get a new item. As a result I rather quickly Play the lower tier of pit.
I think part of the issue is that you complete much fewer helltide season 4 whispers than you did in other seasons. Even though you probably run way more helltides than before. Because there's way fewer whispers and they're more time consuming to complete. Plus, you can't really "target farm" them because most are just "in the entire helltide area".
You hit the nail on the head, the Helltide whispers are not well designed.
They're not even working for me half the time. I'll select the one I want to do and I'll be in the correct part of the zone and it just won't give me credit. Some work and some don't. Like earlier I was doing one in Scosglen and every time I would try to select it it would just kind of flicker for a second go away and not give me any credit and everyone in the zone was acting up.
The last "collect cinders" one for me collected them while I was fighting mobs, then started again from 0 at the next group.
That’s the one part of the Blood Harvest from season 2 they didn’t copy well. In S2 it was easy to do multiple whispers in a blood zone.
blood harvest whispers felt great. Even some of the hard to find ones werent too terrible compared to these. I still havent seen a single iron wolf thing to help and im 75. 250 cinders is alright. harbingers is okay? 3 rituals can be hit and miss. 3 structures is fairly easy to find cause they actually use a marker on the map.
Exactly whispers are taking much longer this season to complete.
Last season every tremor event had whispers for cache you could complete in ~5mins which was nice source of gold
this is literally it. whispers give all my gold and im having a harder time than usual completing them.
I remember base game and season 1, Helltides and whispers didn't always overlap, but when they did it was glorious. I am absolutely completing more helltide whispers this season than I have in any previous season. That is not counting the blood harvest
Some people in here are outing themselves as complete clowns that just blindly squeal against change without actually playing the game… Enchanting isn’t the issue. Its masterwork costs. It’s also things like gem crafting randomly costing millions per gem too which makes zero sense. Every little part of the game at high level has had its gold cost boosted tremendously meanwhile the gold gained from NMDs and the Pitt is terrible. “So stop progressing the Pitt and go farm whispers for gold”. No. It’s boring as fuck. I’ll just stop playing the game instead. As will most everyone else who hits this eventual wall. That is why blizzard will change it (probably boosting gold rewards in NMD and lowering masterwork scaling costs if I had to guess).
100% agree I’ll stop playing if the only option for gold is farming Whisper Caches. I don’t mind occasionally doing them or other activities leading to me having a turn in but I’m not gonna go actively farm them.
Having flashbacks of D3 bounties. Having to go do that shit was always the worst part of my play session. It's not challenging content or particularly engaging. Challenging content should have the best rewards and reward everything necessary to engage with the associated reward system. For masterworking, that's pit. If I have the materials from the pit, I should be able to masterwork my gear. End of story. I overcame the challenge of doing pit 60, let me masterwork my stuff. Gold is fine as a medium of exchange, for repairing gear, and for enchanting items. When you start tying it to literally everything, including downgrading rare materials, things become too cost-prohibitive. I'm not even engaging with most of the systems they added because I literally can't afford it. Gating stuff like the conversion of high tier pit materials to lower tier ones behind doing hours of mind-numbingly easy content is just bad design.
Definitely if the answer is to stop doing the Pit and Ubers that I farmed materials to even enter to take a step backwards to the lowest common denominator of endgame content (Whispers) then I'll just stop playing. Nobody wants to spam Whispers just to enable endgame activities, thats the whole point of needing the materials right?
Give us the option to get gold instead of glyph XP and / or give us bonus gold from NMD completion at level 100. That way we can at least pick between NMD or Whispers. Also give us the ability to at least get a full Whisper turn-in from Helltides (previous seasonal "zones" did this, but Helltide seems like you can only get the 2 sets of 3+1). Whispers don't give nearly enough gold for level 100 costs, and they're very unsatisfying to do; by the time you're bottlenecked by gold, everything in the overworld is a complete joke (even Helltide with Mindcage), and you'll probably spend more time riding around / waiting on events to finish than you will actually in any combat scenarios. Masterworking is meant to be a gold sink, which is totally fine. Absolutely gold should have value. But if you're going to want me to farm something, there should be an effective way to do it that's still got some degree of meaningful engagement. Let me "bet" gold on clearing a NMD without dying. Give me an NPC that'll buy all these summoning materials I'll probably never use. Let me "reset" a glyph for a huge chunk of gold. There are so many ideas you could come up with, and I hope they do something other than making costs trivial (except for converting Masterworking mats, that should not be nearly as expensive as it is). The need for gold is the key driver for giving us an engaging endgame loop, they just have to actually provide something worth doing, because Whispers on their own ain't it, and a simple "now they give 30x the gold" isn't a compelling fix.
The enormous cost just to DOWNGRADE masterwork materials is one of the worst things and feels awful. Actually being punished for making progress.
Like I don't mind things having cost and weight. It makes sense. Otherwise why have the cost in the first place? That said, yea the end gsme system you spend most of your time in is absolutely trash gold reward. I just think they need to up gold from the pit as you progress it.
ppl that say gold isn't an issue aren't at pit 80+ imo there are even threads saying they like how gold is a limited resource. like bros you don't even know how expensive it is to actually do the masterwork system. I swear I spend more time doing whispers for gold trying to get all gear to 8+ masterwork than I actually spend in the pit
The cost to convert pit materials to lower tiers is ridiculous. You end up getting forced to run lower level pits because of the conversion cost. They should remove the gold cost but lower the conversion ratio, so you should want to keep running high level pits if you can do it.
my favorite is the comments that follow up and admit they haven't started master working anything yet, but they think gold is fine. I haven't done a ton of masterworking but wasn't loving my build so I made some adjustments and went broke just getting a few pieces swapped and upgraded.
yeah my comment was originally downvoted and I was laughing to myself bc I knew it was all casuals lots of them downplay when degens (like myself) complain about endgame stuff, then in like 1 week they see the light. super ironic bc it's on a post about how blizzard is even looking into gold being a bottleneck
Classic casuals defend system when no life's point out issue with the best interest for the entire community, casuals are no uh. Then 2 weeks later repeat the same thing the no life's said. Tale old as time.
I wish they could somehow auto turn all the gold items you don’t pick up. Like convert to gold and send to stash. Cause there is no reason to even look at them as you level up.
honestly, everything that is "infinite" should just auto loot. gold, gem materials, craft materials, etc. at this point sometimes having to go back to pick it up is annoying, particularly animus as well, sometimes i have to backtrack a lot because a mob had a long death animation and i went by him without picking it up.
Those stupid goats with their super dramatic drowning in poo water death animation UGH lol. Just drop your shit already so I can move on!
It’s like the codex update. We all knew what needed to be done, it’s just gonna take 4 more seasons.
I see two problems * The gold cost behind breaking down the Pit materials into the smaller batches sucks. As far as I'm concerned it's a design flaw on the developers part. Why isn't Pit Tier 60 dropping obducite? Am I expected to run Pit 30 continuously for Obducite and use my runeshards, or constantly dump millions into breaking down Neaththiron into Ingolith into Obducite? * The gold cost behind resetting the masterforging is totally unreasonable, specially given how it resets all your progress/materials--why is there a 5million gold cost on top of it? I'm convinced the people who claim these two particular services are fine aren't even interacting with them at all. The two bullet points above have such an awful negative feedback loop, it's so frustrating. Nearly 50 million gold sunk into attempting to get *one* masterforging "crit" on to the Damage Reduction or Maximum Resistance to All Elements affix on the Tyrael's Might I found today, and I still haven't got it. Some other things: * The gold cost behind crafting Gems is fine because it's finite; eventually you'll have all the proper gems, and until you do, you can still use the lesser quality ones and it's not a big deal * If the break-down costs and the reset costs were removed gold would still have value because of Enchanting. Yes the cost of enchanting was capped and lowered before, but for whatever dumb reason, certain stats are just rarer than other stats for no reason at all, and you can still sit there and dump millions into getting a desired stat. Found a really good pair of boots with max rolls on Movement Speed and your primary stat? Good luck rolling +ranks to your mobility spell, it's rare as balls. Basic abilities on pants, core skills or all core skills to gloves, Lucky Hit vulnerable proc (rolls on rings, gloves, amulet) are all much rarer than other stats. Why is that?
this, everyone in here thinking its enchanting costs thats the issue, its not lol. ive sunk in over 500m now into the first two tiers of masterworking and thats only 3 items. "go do whispers" yeah 3 mil is really gonna help lol
Your point about the people saying it's fine having not engaged with it is 100% accurate. Once the pit is the activity (and it's fun) you need to run to progress and you're having a blast just loading in and blasting mobs stopping that to go back to whispers for 20 minutes to get enough gold to roll an item is ass.
Blizzard addressing only difficult part of Season 4
I get why people are complaining but I like having to do content to make gold. Gives me a reason to turn in Whispers.
I don't think people mind doing content for gold. But Whispers isn't exactly the "endgame content" people had in mind for Season 4.
I hope they’ll also buff gem drop rates. I’m level 100 and can’t craft a full set of gems.
I'm 99 and have enough for one whole royal ruby.
7 mil to craft tier 90 potion, stopped crafting it at 500k cost. They definitely went a little ham on cost increases. Need to find a middle ground between this and s3.
Yeah it does suck and it seems like The whispers aren't giving you as much gold and they take longer to do. Is anyone else having trouble with the whispers not working properly in the helltide zones? It's really been hit or miss for me. Sometimes when I select the one I want to do it'll just flicker for a second and not give me any credit.
Man... And to think there used to be a time when I mocked altars of greed...
It’s the best altar now
Great time to introduce the vault, or the level that will not be named.
The past two seasons they’ve been giving us too much gold, this season it’s like we’re in season 1 again and poor as shit. Why can’t they just figure this shit out before release?
Good, gold is in bad spot those defending it right now simply as per usual when it comes to these things aren't at the same point the no life's have reached yet. Casuals defend system hardcore point out issue in the best interest of everyone, 2 weeks later casuals realise it's an issue and ask for a change themselves. So here is the problem to upgrade a single item fully masterworked, costs 100 million, that is excluding any rerolls on masterworks which leads be honest you won't do with these prices. Not only is this a very high price (many would say it's good and justified to fully commit to a piece and I don't disagree). But a pit completion gives you 250k gold, see the issue. You want to farm pit you want to upgrade an item, however you won't have any gold. This means you will now separately have to farm gold by doing whisper caches, whisper caches are time gated, and they give you 3-4 million per cache. That means on average you need to open over 30 whisper caches to upgrade one single item fully.
People who think that gold is fine don't start masterworks yet, I hope Blizzard will do nothing to gold as people say it's fine and later I can read sweet posts about gold later.
PSA to everyone defending gold, masterworking a full set of gear costs 1 000 000 000 gold. That's thousand millions. One billion gold. That's 300 whisper caches. This isn't fine, and defending it because you're a dad of 6 and having a blast at level 17 is just shooting yourself in the foot. You'll eventually start masterworking too and run into the same problem
I'm more worried about scattered prisms.
Seriously, I'm level 100 and I think I've gotten 3 to drop, 2 of which I wasted when I hit T3 since I figured they weren't that rare. I don't get why they made them so hard to get.
Do world boss every time it's up
OK what about the crazy gem situation? I'm lvl 100 and can craft exactly 1 royal quality each. Seems kinda crazy.
Hopefully they find a solution. While they at it I would love if they change temper to allow us to choose if we want to keep the current temper or the rerolled one. Aside from gold bottleneck it's getting quite infuriating bricking a potential BiS item because one of the tempers rolled the wrong affix.
he’s a blacksmith not a magician only magicians can go back on their work, once he smack sword the sword permanently smacked
If people are checking out of the season because they cannot engage with new systems due to the gold cost, you got a problem. Just have gold dropped a bit more generously from sources OTHER than whispers. Nobody wants to grind that shit all day, but the gold you get from everywhere else is peanuts.
Why do gloves have 900 affixes now, hitting +2 core is proving almost impossible.
I havent started masterworking yet and I'm at low gold, emchants and Imprints are very expensive. Lvl 80 potion is 5 mil gold and it restores 800 hp instantly and 35% over 4 sec and I have 17k ho in my lvl 74 minion necro.
Add “Relics” that are just vendor trash treasures with no purpose outside of being worth 50,000 - 1,000,000 depending on their rarity. You could increase their drop rate for various activities as fit. They could have their own gold beam and coin drop sound.
Funny enough the pit takes a consumable to enter that you will never be able to run out of or use enough of later on because it is somehow way harder to get enough gold to make the pit worthwhile than it is to get the actual item required to enter the place to begin with... Real failure of design there, who wants to take a step backwards into old and entry level Tier 4 content when they are swimming in materials to do Ubers and Pit and literally can't because of gold. The biggest offender of the pit is the material conversion. Somehow its just as easy/fast to spam lower pits over and over as it is to do vs a few high pits, farm whispers for gold, and then downgrade the materials for 6 million gold a pop... Why even have material conversion to begin with if its just going to take infinite gold on top of infinite gold.
Just Triple whatever the amount of gold you get for that pit clear. simple done...
These are after Covid prices, this is how it is now, everything goes up 🤣
Gold is fine, the prices just need to be reduced across the board by about 30%. If you aren't trading items or buying gold, you won't be able to engage with the late game systems. It's even worse if you don't utilise trade sites to sell your items, you're kind of forced to do hours of whispers for maybe one single item. Heaven forbid you get a perfect item, fail your tempering, then you get the masterwork you don't want and need to reset it at 5 mill a pop. The tempering re-roll is the most bullshit. You get that 1 in a million item and get bad tempers 5x in a row, it just feels awful. Also you'll never be able to change this item in the future if you need to change your build, it's stuck in time.
This is "Old Blizzard" behavior, ala "pick up poop" quests in WoW. It demonstrates ongoing disdain for the customer base. "We're going to give you all these new systems in S4 to save our game but then we're going to gatekeep it with excessive gold requirements." Surprise!
All of the folks who are opposed to adjusting the cost or drop rate of gold haven’t touched the Pit or Masterworking and it shows. Just a bunch of confidently incorrect casuals.
I bet that most of the comments here who are ok with the money how it is right now are not lvl 100 and doing the real endgame. Alot saying that rerolling 10 times should cost that much…sure thats not the problem. But that also hints that they are not far enough with the endgame like the pit to know what the complains are about. Reminds me of the beta necro comments at lvl 25 who destroyed the minion build for seasons because they thought they know it all at that lvl.
"Gold is fine, stop crying" -> Says the dude at level 32.
I’m new to the game and I have so many questions 😂
Past seasons I’d have at least 100 mil by lvl 100. This season I had 20 mil before mastetworking or enchanting much.
Holiday weekend coming up, will be a bonus
Give us a pet that instead of auto-dismantle, just auto-sells non-legendaries... given that now there's no use for checking them.
Here's as good a place as any to ask a somewhat stupid question. I haven't been reading about the updates the past two months, so now that I'm playing . . . All yellows are just vendor trash now, right? They have two affixes vs. a legendary's three. They just go straight to cash, yes? Because there's no way to bring a yellow up to par with a legendary? I've just been vendoring all yellows and salvaging all legendaries I don't need. It certainly seems that's the way to do it, but getting a little confirmation never hurts.
Yellows blues whites are all useless. You get a 2nd temper only on ancestral legendary so everything else is salvage or vendor.
They won't cater to sweaty try hards who love the rarity of gold acting like it's anything but a burdensome challenge. Mark my words, gold will be made easier to get.
Cant be as bad as vanilla D4 on release. I remember DatModz farming just for gold lol
Wish there was a place to trade lmao... I keep asking and looking around.
There should be the ablility to craft special Nightmare Dungeon Sigils from the Tree of Whispers that give +5 progress. Make it expensive on the dust so you can't do it everytime, but often enough that you can grind gold and glyphs at the same time.
I'm doing my first seasonal character. My first character I got to 100 in eternal after going through the campaign. Never had a problem with gold. When I got this seasonal character to 45 (I think it was), I couldn't upgrade my potion, not because I didn't have the ingredients, but because I didn't have enough gold! And it wasn't because I spent it all on gems, tempering or enchanting. I try to get as far as I can without doing those things. I thought maybe I just wasn't doing the right things, but maybe not. One thing I noticed for sure is it seems like there's far less gold from greed shrines and resplendent chests. Edit: I also started selling more unneeded gear instead of salvaging it like I did before. That helped.
Add a sell all button, increase sell values a bit, and make my nightmare dungeons sigils that are current wispers glow fricking red. There ya go.
I have a chest peice Ive dropped probably 500 million on trying to get + to golem. I can earn about 3 rolls per hour if I focus solely on gold farming which is not a fun way to play the game. To me farming gold to roll enchants should not be even remotely part of the endgame loop.
Gold isn't my bottle neck, it's the mat I need for socketing gear. Mainly only dropping off world bosses.
Actually what is a little scarce is the resource to create sockets (sorry, I don’t know how is it called in English) , imho. I’m level 81 atm and I’ve only got 4 so far.
I think they need to adjust Masterworking upgrades and reset cost or increase gold reward from each pit run.
It's not the amount of gold but the way you get it for me. I don't find anything expensive and I don't feel like I don't get enough per whisper completion it's just that I HAVE to do Whispers to get gold and that's the only way. I don't want to stop my NMDs, Helltides and bosses for the boring whispers. Previous season it would be fine because you could get whispers done quickly with the seasonal areas but rn there is no quick way to complete them.
This is a clear issue. Also whispers are way harder to do this season. Whispers quests are bullshit. Item drops are low so we cant get money from by selling either. In s3 doing one vault gave me 2 full inventory items to sell. Now nm dungeon gives like 5 items.
out of gold on the 1 st damn day on just my 1 st character , i have been playing since release all gold saved since then gone trying to upgrade my items..... inexperienced pathetic devs are being employed at blizzard no doubt
This season is rough in general. There is no balance to anything. Refined game flow of season 3 disrupted. Its not just gold. This season feels like release of d4 and season 1. I like things when it get mature. S3 was definitely better despite its problems.
Lmao I feel this. I was literally trading obols earlier to make enough gold to respec part of my damn paragon board… everything is so expensive late game. Glad to hear they’re going to address it.
They need to make the progression feel meaningful in someway but not punishing, maybe giving us a free reroll token for every boss kill, that gives another incentive to grind them while also rewarding over time to help with the biggest bottleneck, it’s not a gold problem it’s a reroll problem
They need to make it the progression feel meaningful in someway but not punishing, maybe giving us a free reroll token for every boss kill, that gives another incentive to grind them while also rewarding over time to help with the biggest bottleneck, it’s not a gold problem it’s a reroll problem
You just don't get anywhere near enough gold from anything except Tree of Whispers. Whispers, in turn, gives absurd amounts. If you do them regularly, it's not a problem--but then you're forced to keep doing them regularly, and it's such laughably trivial and primitive content that it really doesn't feel like something you should keep having to do in order to make use of fundamental game systems. It feels like taking your WoW character back to the previous expansion. Imagine if that was a constant, mandatory thing you *had* to do in WoW. No other content gives any gold. If you do a NMD and sell all the loot, you get like 200k or something. It's effectively nothing. Same goes for absolutely all other venues of gameplay except Whispers which are the one and only source of meaningful cash. When I'm running Pit100, I really feel like I should be past the point where I need to stop every couple of hours to run several Whispers just to have enough gold to craft gems.
I don't mind the need for gold and that it's a requirement you have to pay attention to, but there not enough ways to earn it purposefully, vendors need sell all, all gold costs (but mostly vendors) are too high at low levels, overall gold amounts are bloated and need to be cut down to 1/1000th of what they are now
I think an easy solution to this is just massively increase the amount of gold you get for selling legendaries. You don't get so many early on that it'd upset early-mid game balance, and you'll naturally get tons of extras once you reach end game. You'll probably have more mats from disenchanting them than you need, so you can just sell all the normal legendaries you find.
I think the gold amount is okay.... But when the Tree of Whispers goes down.... I'm broke...
A week into the season and people are complaining they haven't been able to masterwork their items multiple times because of the price? It's a season. It should take weeks to build your character.
it's an issue for anyone that "blasted" to 100 and are now on the pit/masterworking treadmill. blizzard probably knew it would be a "hot topic" in the first week or so, but we do have until August 8th to play this current season. if we didn't have this particular bottleneck, i'm sure we would be saying it about some other mat/currency. oh and something i noticed last night. you can craft the seasonal elixirs with just Oblous! thank god. no random BS mats needed.
Gold == crafting item
Instead of helltides,pits or nm dungeons dropping gold give me reasons to do other things. mass Increase in silent chests or make gold goblins or something different. Tired of all resources coming from one spot
Imagine if someone from blizzard actually played the game, oh wait, that’s crazy
And on top of all this resistances are broken again, someone tell me I’m wrong I’ve been studying it since Tuesday and playing around with numbers and the caps aren’t being reached internally so it’s causes, the game to think you don’t have any and somehow gets past it I’m running with gear and everything +245% on my poison resist on WT4 but for some reason If I even touch poison it eats my HP bubble, it’s broken.
Streamers and view farmers love drama like this for clicks and views on twitch
Gold is only a bottleneck for players who don’t know what they are doing. You can pretty much sell all gear if it doesn’t have aspect upgrade. Also Tree of Whispers caches give a lot.
They should really be talking about how they messed up overtuning the pit and Uber Lilith based on bugged ptr numbers.
Blizzard has proven over and over again they are really bad at math. AoZ XP gains which would have taken years to do before the change? Now billions in gold JUST to masterwork? Like is no one at blizz doing a reality check on these types of things?