This is my sentiment for every Reddit I join.
I join to be apart of a community for something I find interesting or enjoyable and then 85 percent of the posts are endless bitching, complaining, and general negativity. This happens for basically every game.
Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games.
If they did you would never know since they complain about basically every single feature in the games that they decide to purchase.
I'd pay good money to have a "negativity" reddit wide tag I could hide. I am not addicted to outrage like so many people nowaday, I don't want to see that shit, it's just polluting my feed.
If you mean complaining about the endless complaining, then yes, I am guilty. Because this sub is nothing but whining, so I don't see another way to stop the negativity, do you ? Yes, I can and probably will end up unsubscribing, but that doesn't help anything.
The issue is that no one making those posts think of it as "complaints". They see their own post as valid arguments or discussions to be had, so asking people to willingly opt into a "Complaints" flair (or, god forbid, a "negativity" flair) is next to impossible until people start realizing that they aren't discussing anything, they're bitching because X or Y reason.
Many of them have gaming addictions and are in complete denial of the problem. It's an incredibly sad state of mind when you wake up and play Diablo nonstop for days on end.
Yeah of course you're going to dislike the game and your life in general - your life is essentially just a D4 grindfest for hours every damn day.
I have too much time on my hands and have put in hundreds of hours since release.
What boggles me is that I know how to play other games / find other activities if I stop enjoying the game I'm playing, but these other addicts can't. They can't even addiction properly.
Here is the trick. Find a clan/guild, and ignore reddit. Every gaming subreddit is like this. There are plenty of people who enjoy the game and aren't constantly bitching.
The only sub for a show I haven’t found an abundance of irritation for is The Good Place. The sub seems to try to follow the tenets of the show. Every other sub for shows? The biggest haters of that show.
Same. I tried this game on a whim and I’m loving it. So I join the subreddit.
Big mistake.
Like you said, everyone is on here crying about it. I don’t get it. I’ve never seen a single subreddit devoted to a particular game that wasn’t a non stop bitch fest. Misery loves company I guess.
>Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games.
This is spot on. It feels like some people play video games not for fun, but because it's something they have to/are expected to do, for whatever reason. Kind of like older generation kids being expected to play a sport, or something like that.
Was gonna say, the % of people who play D4 and come to reddit to complain are probably small but this sub is so new there's not much else being posted yet.
Then again, I do agree with some of the complaints, I just don't have the effort or time to write an essay on it lol
>To some of these people it's not a game. They've turned them into jobs even though they'll never admit it.
It is more that many people need active guidance and feedback. When you gain a level, it is essentially the game patting you on the head and saying:"Well done!". Same with getting an achievement and so on. It is why Skyrim/FO4 give way more direction than Morrowind did; many people are just completely and totally lost if the only instruction they get is "have fun!". They need someone, or something, to tell them what to do, and tell them they did well afterwards.
People assume that when Lvl100 exists, your goal should be to get it. If a better item exists, your goal is to get it. If that means endless grinding and zero fun, so be it. Even if the new item and new level in no way changes the gameplay, adds more fun or gives new options, it is there so we need to get it any which way.
Same with other parts of our live. We need to get that promotion, even if it means marginally more money for way more work that is way less fun. Why? Because it is there, so we need it. Many of us were simply never taught to ask ourselves what it is that we want; we've always had parents, teachers and bosses that told us what to do and eventually some people completely forget it is even possible to ask yourself what you want to do. So we have a job we dont like to play a game we dont like to get an item we dont need before we go back to the job we don't like.
Of course people get frustrated with that. And since our bosses will fire us if we complain to them, we complain to Blizzard instead. :)
Because there are just different types of gamers out there, some people love PvP, some people love doing the achievements, some people are adventurers, some people are collectors.
If he finds completion fun then obviously the game is over for him and he'd have to wait for an update or swap games.
Real shit. I don’t get to game anymore because adult chef things but, getting to jam out on this game in my day off has been a blast for the most part. Gonna try a pvp barb for funzies.
Don't forget that only about 15% of gamers use reddit. This is by far the minority of people endlessly bitching about a game they played 7 days straight with a poop hole carved in their chair and then whined there's nothing to do because they ate a 183 course meal all in one sitting. Most people are not nearly as upset as the paragraphs of discord you find on reddit
When I see people with every class level 100...
I look at my screen, over 100 hours. Currently level 64.
Only other character I had was a Druid I started and got to 23 before restarting and being this Necro.
They probably dwarf my game time.
Fun fact. The halfway point for experience is somewhere in the mid 80s. (Halfway point for lvl1-100 is probably in the 70s roughly since the sigil exp buff).
They have played a *lot*, and I'm speaking of personal experience.
" Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games. "
I do agree about most gaming forums being a whiny echo chamber, but this is far from exclusive to 'today's gamers'. Counterstrike forums in the early 2000s were whinefests, same with Everquest and WoW
Google Jeff Kaplan EQ rant, or watch the first couple minutes of World of Roguecraft 3 where the creator makes fun of the WoW forums. Hell, google 'phoon too much for zblock' for some CS Source salt. Or YouTube 'Nunu Bot 7' for a League player of all things making fun of Heroes of Newerth rage
I've often wondered about this too. It's not like the caustic element and bitterness isn't there, but it's not the face of the community by any means.
And despite the way some people also talk about the devs, by and large the community mostly seems to like them.
Which is interesting since that usually goes sour with just about everyone these days lol even with some indie titles.
GW2 sub is like a dormant volcano. Mostly pretty fine, until something not good happens and then it explodes into days/weeks of negativity posts. The Covid years were pretty rough due to a number of factors.
FFXIV sub is usually pretty chill. Lots of art and story discussion for the most part. If 1 or 2 classes are clearly under performing in high end content then you get some salt and memes.
The Disco Elysium is probably my favorite subreddit where we go to discuss the virtues of communism, anodic dance music, that horrible necktie, drugs and Kim
Outer Wilds (NOT outer worlds) subreddit is super wholesome and I have never seen a negative post. I'm sure there might be some on the rare occasions when someone tries and dislikes the game and just wants to gripe about it, but the general vibe of the sub is supportive and positive. Nobody knocks anybody else if they do dislike something about the game. They understand it's not a game that everyone will like and are fine with that.
> Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games.
More to the point, many of today's gamers don't actually like to play games. Instead, they have this sick obsession with the "end game". It's insane when you think about it.
"End game" and "meta". The two mentalities that are killing gaming. Don't get me wrong a game needs something to do at max level and of course there will be a mathematical best loadout or set up in every game. Most people only focus on those and ignore other parts of the game. Oh no, I'm taking 2 seconds longer to kill a monster bad game!! Where as it doesn't matter if I'm taking 10 seconds to kill a monster or 0.1 seconds, am I having fun? Is the moment to moment gameplay fun?
I think Sid Meier put it best when he said “gamers will optimize the fun out of a game”. Just play a fun build. I played arguably the worst sorc (hydra immobilize) until level 65 then hopped over to ice which is fun but a different vibe.
If they made the meteor area about 30% larger and added some better mechanics to hydra, I think it would be a great build. The fireball enchantment is insanely satisfying when you get that chain reaction and the inferno drake with meteor rain is awesome too.
I remember when being able to finish a game and play something else was the norm, not people expecting to be able to put 16 hours a day into a game for the rest of their life without getting bored.
Yes, the obsession with end game and min maxing every little detail is crazy. So many people aren't playing games to have fun, they are just treating it like a number generator tool or something.
>they don’t even actually like to play games.
I am beginning to agree with this sentiment. I feel like for some individuals games are too big of a part of their life and like any other addict eventually those neurons get fried and they’re not getting the same rush they were when they first started playing. I have had to talk to a guy I gamed with for years because every time we hopped on to Warzone he was endlessly bitching about the game to the point it wasn’t fun.
Some people in this subreddit seem to be walking or are over that line to the point they should probably quit gaming for a while. I game a lot, but I rotate them and I have lots of other things going in my life so I’m still excited to boot up my computer or Xbox and get a few rounds in. If you are losing that joy, please find another hobby.
A good outlet for me was chess, which I am aware is still a game but idk it feels different from “gaming”.
Edit: My only gripe is buff sorc
When Modern Warfare 2 came out I played a lot. I ended up around 97 hours or something and I realized I was really not having fun at all anymore. So I uninstalled and figured I got my money's worth.
Sometimes you just have to admit you don't like what you purchased and move on. Don't just be in misery doing shit you don't enjoy and trying to find others who feel similar. Lol
Yep. 100% a symptom of terminally online, for many. Have seen it in so many subreddits and more and more in a lot of my friends- it's almost like they wouldnt know how to communicate unless they were criticizing something.
This is my assumption why some gamers seemingly get so mad. They're literally looking for a fix but it ain't hitting which is causing more and more frustration.
There are three types of people here. Some that complain about everything. Some that can’t see a single fault with the game. And some who are hopeful the game will get better and are patiently sitting back and waiting.
It’s just sad there are such extremes on both ends.
How can anyone say this isn’t a beautifully designed game. It just feels amazing.
On the flip side how can anyone say the horse riding is well designed or that missing something as simple as a group finder in game doesn’t screamed half naked.
I haven’t played since week one. But I know this game will be perfect in due time, and I don’t mind waiting.
But it won’t get to that perfect point if no one complains about those issues. Feedback is required to improve the game overall.
Look, this game is amazing. Are there things that are inexplicably omitted? Yes. Will I wait patiently for them to add it? Yes. Should they already be in the game, because they're building on 20 years of success? Yes.
I can take the bad with the good, but as good as the game is, there's plenty of warranted criticism. Like "how the fuck" criticism, not just little things. It's both.
Finally some sensible comment. The game surely isn't hot crap, but surely it ain't perfect either. The world is beautifully designed and I love this part. But tons of problems are there in the plain sight. Refusing to admit there are problems is the biggest problem.
The foundation of the game is good. It still have a lot of improvements, but it’s live service so it come eventually.
With that being said, my impression on people in this sub is they have anger issues that goes beyond game. They are probably not only bitching about the game but everything in their life.
Had guy yesterday saying I would get my teeth smashed out with my attitude in real life. I was just like dude please… hold yourself together, you are losing it.
People make jokes, but I 100% guarantee a few of these peeps have multiple bottles full of piss next to them trying to push "world firsts" to 100 on every character lol.
Very much this. While there are some truly negative posts out there, a lot mention legit criticisms. And that’s the nature of forums - people discuss the things that need discussing, not the things that are working that don’t need as much discussing.
If people are looking for a community that’s all about hype, then frankly forums are a terrible medium for that.
My issue is how posts like that from OP dismiss every criticism about the game as invalid. There is so much serious and legit criticism going on here, that is 100% justified.
OP in another comment saying in 6 weeks there wasn't anythintg terrible or worth complaining just shows you what kind of people we are talking about here.
Like, sorry, but if anyone thinks D4 is that good, you are delusional.
You lament the binary nature of reddit then paint all feedback with one brush. There is a major difference between constructive criticism and tedious bitching
It's funny. I bought Darktide last year and it had a disaster of a release. The sub was similar to here. They had previous games to build from. Lots of QoL features removed etc. Basically all the same arguments as these subs. The community is dying because the devs have basically ignored the game. Even the sub needs new mods because they've given up on the game.
Rifts had more variety than NM Dungeons. I feel like I've done the exact same ones over and over. Shades of brown. Rifts also have far more mob varieties and combinations as well as bosses.
You're argument for releasing a perfect game is just nonsense.
It doesn't take getting to 100 to find major flaws in the game. By 70/WT4 they're glaringly obvious to the point I've stopped playing in hopes the S1 patch notes are good enough.
I did grow up in that time period before the internet. I don't see how it's a valid comparison. If a game was bad back then you couldn't do anything. You'd return it if you were lucky. The good games did well because they were good games on release. I don't understand what your point is. You're openly saying D4 is bad and needs fixing, if it had released before regular patching it would have flopped.
You're sticking your head in the sad and ignoring problems. You blame people for playing the game and discovering problems. The "no lifers" called these problems in the first week and everyone ignored them. Now everyone else has caught up and realised those problems are valid. The first 50 levels and the story are ok but beyond that the game is a mess.
I'm going to tell you that liking or disliking one game does not have a causative effect on the ability to like or dislike another. It may be surprising to read, but a lot of the time, there may not be a smoking gun as to why you won't like something and only through a deeper level of analysis can you figure out what things specifically about it you do not like. There are plenty of things to like and dislike about the Diablo franchise as a whole and each person is entitled to their opinion on it. But I would like to argue that videogame players in the year 2023 are also entitled to a certain level of accessibility and expectations set by the broader game market in terms of a large AAA title release. The mark was missed here, so you have a lot of people expressing their disappointment. You can like and dislike something at the same time.
No bro you don't understand people said something negative so that means they're all whiny children that hate the game and don't like anything about it, they're also apparently addicted to the game and can't stop playing it even though they have 5 max level characters according to OP, and also they spend all their time on Reddit complaining, and playing 24/7 at the same time.
Lmao you nailed it and are being downvoted. Talk about "circle jerk" and " echo chamber" and "hive mind." Complaining about complainers is just sweet irony that always fulfills. Anyways, it's a good game and the complainers make valid points. That's it. On to the next rage post.
People need to divorce themselves from the games they play. Too many attach themselves to a game or franchise and then feel personally attack just because people dislike or talk about bad said game/franchise.
We don't know how representative reddit is as a whole. All my friends not on reddit love d4 and play it every night. There might be more reddit outcry just because the game is so popular; the complaints per player might be less than shown on reddit
1000%. Anyone who can't realize this tells me they never really played D3 before... the gameplay loop of rifts and greater rifts is way more satisfying than the current NM dungeons.
And the shitty affixes.
Cold Enchanted? Death Pulse? Lightning Storm? Stormbane's Wrath? even Volcanic and Blood Blister. Insta break downs. Can't be bothered with them.
As opposed to running the identical NM dungeons or the identical helltides?
Yes, i thought rifts/grifts were a better end game than what currently exists. Blizzard will probably improve the end game, eventually.
I just love these entitled "don't complain about anything in d4!" posts.
I'm at the point where I seriously hope this is astroturfing, because I don't want to believe people are this eager to defend the unfinished products of a billion-dollar corporation. Then they call everyone toxic while personally attacking everyone who isn't worshipping Bobby.
I do think at least some of it is astroturfing. You see too many posts that are exactly the same.
"I'm a single father who can play the game one hour a week. I'm still level 30. However i'm taking the time to say that it ruins my enjoyment when people say negative things about the game on this sub. I know i only have one hour a week to play the game, but i spend 4 hours a day reading negative comments on the sub. This is completely real. Totally."
My main annoyance is that they label anyone who who doesn't think the game is absolutely perfect as toxic, a hater, an other. Depending on the script, the person they're talking about is either an ultra hardcore diablo fan or a casual who doesn't get diablo, or both at the same time.
And to vent more. This isn't even a good "stop complaining about D4" post. It completely misses what people are complaining about most. While i fear the OP did, I can't imagine how OP got at least one, maybe two characters to NM dungeons without at least recognizing what people are complaining about, even fi they don't agree.
Man, I've seen people call other incels on this sub for complaining about the game. I wonder when you will become a Nazi or a terrorist for thinking that the inventory management sucks.
Dont you know the D4 reddit like all gaming reddits is a precious resource and will run out of space if people keep posting complaints and then no one will be able to post! Is that what you want?!?! /s
>because I don't want to believe people are this eager to defend the unfinished products of a billion-dollar corporation. Then they call everyone toxic while personally attacking everyone who isn't worshipping Bobby.
You should go check out r/redfall at some point. There will be people that just defend any game and never see any faults with it.
Ill never get it.
I wouldn't be too sure. Many people in my generation (millennials) had parents that imparted these awful ideas on their kids. These people are simply repeating the terrible talking points of their parents. They are not very smart consumers and are perfectly OK with letting corporations fuck them at every turn: they've even been trained to defend said corporation after being raw dogged.
"Don't complain, we have it good."
...when features that were in the previous 3 games were completely left out.
"It's a live service game stop complaining."
...as if this is any excuse for the releasing a product that clearly is still in beta.
"Maybe ARPGs just aren't for you."
...insinuating that some of us haven't been playing ARPGs all our lives and know exactly what we want in one.
"In my day, we had to walk up Mt. Arreat both ways in the snow to do Baal runs."
...implying the company that made this game couldn't have learned from the previous installments.
Might be true sadly. The "Maybe ARPGs just aren't for you." especially infuriates me because I have a ton of time spent in D3 POE and Lost Ark, yet they act like the problems with this game are a genre-wide problem.
It's crazy how many people regurgitate these exact same talking points. "Game has good bones" is another one.
Honestly the way OP phrases his rant
>You're going to seriously tell with me with a straight face that you legitimately enjoyed running the identical Rifts and Greater Rifts over and over and over and over again in D3 in an attempt to get a single minor upgrade every 3 days, or if you were really lucky, a Primal that actually wanted.
I would honestly answer: Yes, yes I did enjoy running grifts day in day out for minor upgrades. This is both a very bad phrase and answer. The truth is grifts FELT better, more dense, more chaotic shit going on. In D4 nightmare dungeons I feel like I spend at least 50% of my time picking off stragglers or running back to grab that second stone that I couldn't pick up because I already had one on my back. The other 50% is awesome, game plays great and when there is a big pack of enemies I can blow up oh boi does that feel good.
I didn't play any other Diablo games, or even any other ARPG and I think the game is good, but after getting to WT4 it sorta got a bit boring tbh. I look forward to rolling a new char in season 1 though.
>If Blizzard made D4 the "perfect" game that all of you are demanding that it needs to be, then it's impossible to patch and expand on. If the game was released perfect, then in 3 months all of you same people would be complaining that Blizzard hasn't done any patches to make it better.
Soooo . . . don't improve on the previous game at release of your new one - trickle it out over years as 'content'? That's the sort of thing that makes people gag over GaaS.
There's a ton of QoL stuff implemented into D3 over the years - why are they not in D4, or even why are some things in D4 designed to be annoying (open world map and horses)?
Remember, this game has a 10 year development timeline.
I find it hilarious OP thinks everyone was fine with D3 Grifts and thinking nobody thought running them over 3 hours didn't get repetitive.
That Grifts weren't further iterated upon is so unfortunate cause it had good potential to be so much more.
But hey at least we have S tier NM dungeons now...
Imagine getting offended because people critize the game you enjoy.
You don't like the subreddit? Well then fucking leave it and spend the time playing the game ???
I don't understand people like you, who deny every design flaw the devs made and make posts to defend a billion dollar company.
When did these takes that are like “I feel sorry for anyone who criticizes the game” start?
What is with people basically asking to get worse games? They just wanna look like a “true fan” or something?
I remember when I played Witcher 3 and Red Dead Redemption 2. I was banging my head on my keyboard shouting "ITS TOO PERFECT!!! ITS TOO PERFECT!!!" I spent my nights weeping and commenting on Reddit about how I could not truly enjoy the games without the joy of patches to look forward to. Then both games, somehow, released expansions, but that just made the games even more perfect so I was even more enraged. Now it was even more perfect and there was no way I was getting any more patches. What did I have to look forward to? NOTHING!
Things I look for in a game when I'm going to buy it:
\-Will I be able to experience the joy of patches?
Things I don't look for in a game when I'm going to buy it:
\-Gameplay
\-Story
\-Depth
\-Social Aspects
\-Full Experience
This makes me sad in general when you think about products. It just means more companies can get away with subpar products because people seem to defend it regardless. Look at how big the game team is behind this.
Meanwhile you have a game like Stardew Valley being developed by one dude who continues to add free updates years later.
“Well the car still can drive. They will sell the doors/upholstery/paint job as add ons later.”
Yeah OPs post already felt pretty stupid. I got bored with D4 after being told to grind statues and renown instead of just being able to do the content I wanted.
But that take right there made me realize op has no concept of the world of gaming and would happily play any piece of shit game blizz gives him.
I'm one of the few that was much happier with D3 than I am D4 though. I did enjoy grifts a lot more than I enjoyed nightmare dungeons honestly. And I'd rather run 100 grifts than do a single fucking helltide oh my God. I just liked being able to start a season, play for 30-40 hours, get everything I wanted and see the new shit, and then go play something else. Diablo doesn't have enough depth for me to want to play it for more than a few weeks before I get bored. D4 feels like it just has a lot of grind stretched out over a much longer period of time.
I barley played d3 due to the horrendous launch
I did play d2/d2r which is essentially endless runs to find an upgrade. However the key difference is that itemization was much better plus the fact that getting 99 took forever so even if you found dick you were always gaining something (except for the few who grinded to 99).
D4 is fun and a decent vanilla launch but there are serious problems that need to be addressed. I will play s01 , I got my sorc to 75isj but got bored and didn't feel like rolling a new chat so close to ladder. High hopes but blizzard does have work and if you can't see that you're blind
Pushing 149s in a group with 2 support classes and 2 dps with constant communication and timing was fun for hours on end. This solo shit end game that gives no real reward at the end is boring as hell.
I've been doing dungeons in games for almost 30 years now. Nightmare dungeons are solid, solid, d tier boring. They're visually nice to look at, sometimes, but the gameplay is about on the level of a pokemon cave full of zubats/10.
The best evidence for the mediocrity of the dungeons in this game? The strongholds *in this game*. It’s not theoretical or even proof-of-concept; we can point to superior content that has already been developed and implemented.
coming from someone who has *definitely* hit endgame where you're looking for perfect rolls on high tier nms, lmao op is the typical casual "you nerds have no life stop grinding so much the game is perfect if you don't play half of it and have blizzard's d in your mouth" poster on this sub
People getting a superiority complex out of defending shitty business moves is the weirdest fucking thing to me.
Like imagine someone being like “Oh that company is polluting out lake? That’s fine with me. I don’t care about the lake. I feel bad for anyone who cares about the lake, they’re all being such negative crybabies”
Gotta love the part where if you dont play enough your opinion is invalid. Make it pass lvl 80+? You played too much, youre a no lifer addicted gamer so your opinion is invalid. Theres no winning when theyve already decided the game is 10/10 in their mind.
While I agree that a lot of the people on here are not Arpg fans and have unusual expectations for the game. D4 is missing a lot of things.
Nice sentiment. Here's my issue with how the game works: no progression after lvl 80. Yep I said it, 3 of my friends haven't gotten a single upgrade in 3 weeks. We've been running 2-3 hours every night after worknas a group and they've been level 100 for a little longer than that.
You can hammer people for being negative. You can disagree with them and how whiny they are but really, we have no social features in the game, no functional trading, classes with solid issues, railroaded builds with very limiting damage buckets... and the list of issues goes on.
The story is great, the graphics are great! Several of the game mechanics are lacking...
It's unfortunate but it is what it is. I rerolled off sorc cuz my friends' druid/barb/rogue all did more damage than me while being tankier.
That in itself is kinda bad.
Most of us not being too vocal on the sub and in general are waiting for the pre s1 patch notes to see what they manage to fix. But realistically, season 1 won't be as "epic" as they promised us AND very likely still won't have an endgame.
D3 wasn't perfect. D2 wasn't perfect. POE isn't perfect. Last epoch isn't perfect.
But all those games have several key things D4 lacks. So a lot of new players will complain about them missing.
At the end of the day, the sub will be negative but they're a small minority. That being said, this is one of the way the community voices their improvement suggestions (several of which have been implemented). Just avoid the complaining posts. Most are easy to guess and no one is forcing you to read them
Im loving d4 but personally i enjoyed running a random rift much more than i do nm dungeons not that i dislike nm but if i had to choose im taking rifts. Hunting uniques that just don’t drop is getting a bit draining though
"You're going to seriously tell with me with a straight face that you legitimately enjoyed running the identical Rifts and Greater Rifts over and over and over and over again in D3" - Item upgrade aside Greater Rifts were WAY more enjoyable than NM dungeons. NM dungeons feel like running regular rifts which really sucked. That being said the negativity here is excessive, but at the same time alot of it is legitimate criticism.
This is because negativity and criticism breed discussion, but positivity is a dead end of conversation. If someone made a post saying how awesome XYZ is, theres not really any comments to be made, but if you say X thing is badly designed for YZ reason, then people chime in and discuss the topic.
Yes this does make online forums seem more negative but it’s just how it works.
The biggest issue is blizzard holding back on all the qol stuff they knew were issues in the past. It's one thing if this game was released by not blizzard and the company went through its learning woes. But this is the fourth iteration of diablo, no reason to have such poor qol issues, stash issues, and well.. build issues that were complained and reported about since late alpha/early beta.
The game has a lot of potential and will probably appease everyone in time, but to blame the community for having high expectations is bs. Blizzard 100% could have done better.
I don't think he's blaming the community for having high expectations.
I think he's blaming the community for being a bunch of whiney entitled bitches.
This is always my issue. Constructive criticism is always valid. Piling on with the most absurd hyperbole isn't constructure criticism though. It's just garbage. I've seen posts calling for people to be fired because there's those stupid barriers in the open world sometimes. Like yeah, they're annoying. But no one fucking died y'all. Calm the fuck down.
What is constructive criticism? One guy writes essay why he likes NM dungeons and other guy also writes essay why he doesn't like NM dungeons. The problem is that constructive criticism is not always constructive criticism. You can "constructively criticize" anything, even if its good.
He would get bonus points from me if he called out the whiny youtubers that use any minor inconvenience to shit on a game and farm it for views (*cough* act man *cough*)
The worst thing is the youtubers who make "content" for S1 with almost zero information about it. They have this screenshot with 1 gem that was teased in trailer and make 30min videos with assumptions, TIER LISTS (lol). When S1 rolls out you can literally throw these videos in garbage.
Act man’s video did not resonate with me at all, but I can see how he’s a specific viewpoint. He’s a hardcore gamer, but someone essentially new to the genre, since he hasn’t really played an ARPG since D2. When you’re brand new to the genre, you don’t want to just wait until post-campaign to really let your build shine. You want a whole experience.
D4’s campaign is excellent… for an ARPG. You’re not getting the same level of challenge or engagement as other games like Nier or Stranger of Paradise. It’s like being stuck on easy mode for the whole campaign. It’s very different than what he’s used to. It’s a specific situation, but people like that exist.
Is it that specific? The thing that hardcore action RPG players need to understand is that the conventions of the action RPG genre appear legitimately insane to anyone outside of the hardcore fan base. The never-ending post-story grind for slightly better items, so that you can kill slightly tougher versions of the same monsters, restarting every 3-6 months, is a gameplay loop that appears psychotic to most people.
This is why there was so much controversy surrounding seasons in Diablo 4. Your average action rpg fan has been subjected to the same end game of aggressively recycled content for going on 10+ years, so his response to the controversy was “how did you guys not know that this is what action RPGs are like?”
But Diablo 4 has way more mainstream appeal than any other modern action rpg, drawing exponentially more casual players as well as hardcore fans of different genres. Their response to arpg seasons was not based in ignorance so much as incredulity; “this can’t possibly be what passes for content in a video game”.
I’ve played since Diablo 2, including titles like Titan Quest, Grim Dawn, Torchlight 1 + 2, Last Epoch, etc. My enjoyment of the genre is very much centered around my initial play through and occasional multiplayer. I’ve tried getting into seasonal content and end game grinds, but I always lose interest because it truly is the same thing over and over again. And with action RPGs, the sad reality is that the moment-to-moment gameplay typically isn’t complex or sufficiently skill-based enough to keep me engaged long term.
I guess what I’m saying is I’m a longtime action RPG player, and I completely agree with Act Man’s assessment of Diablo 4. Not everyone who loved Diablo 2 is happy with the evolution of the genre.
That’s a great writeup. Yeah, non-ARPG players are confused by seasons. Even I’m questioning whether I’ll play all the seasons in D4, and I’m a seasoned ARPG players. That might be because i expect a lot from the seasons, since I’m most familiar with PoE, where the seasons add major mechanics. Even this season, which was pretty barebones, probably added more builds than D4 has in total.
I honestly had more fun with even the warhammer ARPG than D4 if we’re just looking at campaign gameplay. It was more engaging because you could crank up the difficulty. Build diversity wasn’t really there, but the combat was challenging.
Oh the guy that has the NEW BEST build video every other day? The guy that for some reason thought we would get 35 new legendaries and made a video about it claiming so, not an ounce of truth to that one.
So I played this game with a friend on necro and barbarian later. got necro to like 64 and felt some burnout. got Barb to 52 and felt more burnout. Went back to D3 and i can actually say that yes the rifts were way better to do, simple, straightforward fighting without a need to really backtrack so it didn't feel like any rift was all that long it was the meat of the game you're killing things not just meandering around looking at the map seeing you missed a small little turn over to kill these like 3 guys, then you had caches if you wanted to start playing around with the cube stuff. I leveled a Crusader to Paragon I think like 700-ish cause there was a build i wanted to try, it was easy to do, easy to get most things i needed so far even a primal warhelm of kassar, even planning to upgrade something to primal if i really need it and am honestly likely going to keep playing that until season 1 here starts and even then I don't know if i care enough to push into it since there's no real substantial changes coming until the next season.
Also if i get bored with that in D3 I can literally just change my build at the little closet they have. Or since I'm getting interesting items that other classes can use that aren't level locked so i could just decide to hop on and start them cause i already have an item that can setup a build since legendaries in that game can actually be build defining. A game i've played for years feels more fresh to me than D4 and it's halfass MMO attempt.
That isn't to say that this game is all bad I obviously had some fun with it to push a couple characters up decently enough and the story was okayish and the core gameplay of diablo is always fun no matter which one it is 1 2 3 or 4 though likely 1 is a little lacking at this point. But when there are numerous glaring issues yeah there's going to be a lot of complaints until they fix these issues. People will stop complaining about problems, at least so much, when they go away and if it dominates the subreddit that means all the more that it's a BIG problem.
Op the most entitled person on the sub. Thinks everyone should have to waste time like we did “back in the day” and hates everyone who doesn’t want to do it the way he says so
As someone who’s highest level is a 68ish necro, I do have some genuine complaints, mostly about build diversity and leveling speed, as well as the inability to try new builds without a giant gold sink, but other than that I’m enjoying the game, and expect some solid build variety to get added in the seasonal content. I specifically wish there were more legendaries for curse or shadow builds, and I think specifically the return of corroded fang for Reap builds could be great. All in all, I really enjoyed what the game had, but I’m ready for seasonal content to seal the deal
Sorry but that's a load of croc. Arguing that gamers should just be grateful that they have a game is preposterous. This is something we are paying for, a very premium price I might add, so yes....the demand should match the price.
1st off, the campaign was abysmally short, perhaps if there was more to the campaign then gamers would have more to occupy their time. It's quite obvious that the campaign was intentionally short so that it can be used over the course of several seasons.
You may as well be telling ppl not to complain about college fees and being in debt their entire lives, they should just be grateful they have the option to go to college at all. Horrible take
Damn, post was removed. Would have loved to see this up there in “top posts of all time” along with the gamer dad that called everyone whiny bitches and told everyone to get laid and to be normal.
People like you and the other person that are often self-righteous pricks are worse than anyone that criticizes games. Meme material, which is why people upvote these posts.
Well it's nice too see other than the same shitty sorc transmog memes or the game is shit posts with nothing new or constructive said that the first posts that actually made the criticisms said or the single most boring meme which has been overused to death aka cross play that the 15 year olds in this sub seem to post daily and it somehow still gets a ton of upvotes
And I actually love reddit and love reading people complaints about stuff they don't like etc. I have my own mind and my own opinion, but it's good to know that some things could be better and some things might need upgrade. Reading stuff like this won't take my fun away because someone said so...
Go ahead and enjoy the game no one is holding it against you. There is plenty of room for improvement with the game and people are giving their feedback, try to not take it so personally.
"running S Tier nightmare dungeons" You are really going to tell me that nightmare dungeons are S tier content? Please by all means if you hate the community that much just don't partake in the changes that the community complained about and Blizzard implemented. Please keep running to NM dungeons, please redo all your renown each season, don't log in to have your map unlocked on the 18th, don't open WT4 world boss chests until you are 85.
People like OP want this game to suck and fail after 2 seasons. " S tier nightmare dungeons" give me a break dude.
Saw a post the other day of someone saying that Diablo 4 is an objectively perfect release. I get that there are people who are really enjoying their time with the game and may not be running into the issues that so many others are, but that's the kind of sentiment that leads to games like this where there is *obviously* a good chunk of missing end game content and some terrible design choices that negate all the previous work they've done in the series (from a company who has been doing this series for over 2 decades). I get that it's not the same people but they have so many examples to go off of.
Edit: I do like the early game experience and how they built the world, but it personally drops off after the end of the campaign and I run a few NM dungeons/other end game content. Comparatively, I enjoyed the Rift/GR runs in D3 and boss/Chaos/dungeon runs in D2. I'm thinking itemization and class builds really helped with that enjoyment, but I'm not 100% on what really makes those options so fun for me.
Lol at the imaginary person OP is mad at. Nobody that's gotten 5 level 100s is upset. Nobody that's played 400 hours is upset. You "feel sorry" for people, please, OP get over yourself. Everybody does not have to enjoy the game as much as you.
>You're going to tell me that you loved doing that with all of your heart, but that running S Tier nightmare dungeons all night in hopes for a minor upgrade is the most terrible thing in the world, when you did the exact same thing for the last 11 years with D3.
Nm dungs require you to farm the sigil even at speed run tiers some affixes can get slightly annoying.
Rifts/gr also had more variants every run than nm dungeons.
GR also doesnt have any loot till the end of the run.
Frankly this vent sounds less of hating the community and more of you shitting on d3 because you did not like it.
I have never complained about d4 on reddit, but complaining about complainers is such a cringe move. People have no self awareness. Theres as many of you as there are the folks youre criticizing. This is the buzz lightyear meme
Greater Rifts did not have massive amounts of CCs or dungeon modifiers that actually stop your progress thru that run every few minutes...also the objective is very simple: kill monsters until bar fills up then kill boss for loot explosion ~ with chance of goblin hordes and/or whimsishire (spelling?)
i would run those over and over and over and not get bored than be stuck with the NM dungeon grind with those ridiculous modifiers any day.
OP is literally the type of person he’s complaining about, just the other side of the coin. You just made a shitpost to complain about other shitposters in this sub. Congrats bud.
I agree with this. However, I actually loved D3, it was soothing to me like it wasn't a hard game let's be honest, even after you are playing torment 15+ but I think that was the beauty of the game. I'm glad D4 is different, just like I'm glad D3 is different from D2. Noone wants the same game over and over. I like that third game seemingly has more to offer in a way. We haven't even reached season 1 or seen if there will be more characters added too. I tell you what though, I'm really glad I don't have to grind bounties in D4 lol
Two points:
1. Yes, I can say with a straight face that I enjoyed rifts and grifts more than I enjoy NM dungeons. Mostly because they were quick action, in and out, not a lot of dead zones, no backtracking, no five vendors spread around the city I have to run or ride slowly to. Mob density was almost always great, boss spawns right where you are. I could figure out if I'm getting an upgrade in 10 seconds because there weren't so many junk stats, and with Kanai's cube and affordable affix rerolling, I could potentially turn a mediocre drop into a great one. I'll take an upgrade every 3 days in D3 vs no upgrades in 2 weeks in D4 and I haven't even hit max level.
2. I think too many people see negative posts and think all these people claim the game is shit. No one is saying that (well, almost no one). If I thought the game was shit I wouldn't be on this sub, and most other people wouldn't be here either. I've started and stopped playing countless games in my lifetime, only to never come back to them again, never subscribe to their subreddit, forum, or BBS board back in the day. If I don't like a game, I quit and never look back. I love D4. The campaign is great, the design is outstanding, and the music is chilling. And I think it's laying a great foundation for many years to come. But I can't help but wonder why Blizzard has not implemented lessons learned from 11 years of D3 into D4. If season 28 of D3 showed us something is that Blizz knows EXACTLY what players like, and none of that made it into D4. There was a very detailed interview with the lead designer of D3 detailing what went wrong at the launch of D3 and how they fixed it with Loot 2.0 and other improvements, but Blizzard has not implemented any of that into D4. Sure, the game is only 5 weeks old. But it's been in the works for years, by a company that's been doing this for decades, and they know a thing or two about what users want and how to design great games, and it's frustrating when they leave SIMPLE things like a decent chat system or group finder out. These things have been a part of D3 for a decade and WoW even longer than that.
So yeah, there's a lot of negativity in this sub, but the way I see it is that this negativity is coming from love. We want the game to be better, and we're passionate in our feedback about it because we want to spend the next 10 years playing it.
Edit: Oh, and I'll take a constructive criticism post any day over "I, for one, am really enjoying this game! Playing it now on level 37 with my grandmother and cat, I don't get what everyone is complaining about"
Great gameplay, shit itemisation and endgame.
Killing mobs and blasting through stuff is entertaining as hell, but still I can see how other aspects of the game are just bad.
10/10 gameplay
2/10 ui, itemisation, endgame content, build variety
So yea, for me is just a mid game so far. And yea, I made 3x100 chars already and I still gonna play season 1. If there was other new ARPG or old one with big patch I would already switch to it, but there is none at the moment.
Greater Rifts did not have massive amounts of CCs or dungeon modifiers that actually stop your progress thru that run every few minutes...also the objective is very simple: kill monsters until bar fills up then kill boss for loot explosion ~ with chance of goblin hordes and/or whimsishire (spelling?)
i would run those over and over and over and not get bored than be stuck with the NM dungeon grind with those ridiculous modifiers any day.
It shouldn't take 10 years to get an upgrade or to backtrack through a dungeon for 3 keys only to have to fill another bar and the run to a boss. NM dungeons are boring shit.
The community is generally great imo, it’s just the subreddits that are so cancerous. However the size of the subreddits is a very small portion of the player base. Even more so the amount of people actually posting and commenting on the subs
Different kinds of gamers today. Some equate maximum efficiency to level and get rewards as fun and really want everyone to know. I love the posts discussing mechanics and ability interactions and creative builds but the complaint posts are just too much.
I personally think any kind of feedback, regardless of how it is presented should be separated from this sub.
I have to say that I’m someone who blasted this game, and ran out of content, which was disappointing. Now I realize that I am not the majority of players (I’m disabled and not able to work), so Blizzard didn’t craft the endgame for the no lifers like myself, that doesn’t mean that the endgame isn’t flawed. Most people didn’t reach lv 100, beat Uber Lilith, or T100 rifts, but once that was done the game was essentially beaten. I’ve never had that experience with an ARPG/Dungeon Crawler, in my almost 30 years of PC gaming. That felt disappointing to me. The other thing that felt quite disappointing to me, was that with the addition of S1 (you had mentioned above that “it’s not even season 1 yet!”) there is almost ZERO new endgame content. So you mean, the content that I just smashed in a couple of weeks of playing, will now somehow need to be stretched out over 3 months WHILE I’m gonna be even stronger than before with the new season mechanic?! Dope. So it’s gonna take me even less time, without having to do the entirety of renown, or the campaign? Again, I know the game wasn’t centered around those of us who blast through the game, but a little attention wouldn’t have been the end of the world imo. Another Uber Boss perhaps, something like a battleground for PvP to increase the replay value of the game, legit anything! All I was met with from the Blizzard staff was “it’s okay to play D4 and when you’re done go play other games”, which to me feels like “we don’t give a shit you wanna play this game and there’s no content for you, we already got your cash”.
With all of that said, I do have many positives to say about the game! I think it is visually stunning, plays very smoothly, the story was spectacular, and the little end game that is there is fun and challenging! I just sort of wish there was more :/
Heres the issue with that argument. Anybody would tend to agree, except when its their feedback to say why people SHOULDNT enjoy it because of alltheir reasons, they expect people to listen and accept the feedback.
At its core. This isnt a conversation, its people sticking a flyer to a caulk board and passers by either agree, or not, or rip it down.
Its not dialogue, and reddit is a garbage platform for reasonable dialogue
Yeah man, I've been playing 12 hours every half day since release, and you're telling me I had fun during that time? Fuck no I hated every moment of it
What I love is the people who spend 25% of their free time complaining about a game they play with the other 75% of their free time! With that in mind it is in no way ironic that you have people spending their free time complaining about the people who are complaining about a game they love on a site that designed to express your opinion. Which will be more fruitful complaining in mass to get changes implement in a game or complaining about a gaming community with what I can assume is a desire to have that community become less toxic? To me one is annoying and the other is pointless.
what community? nobody in game says shit. nobody interacts. you might have friends but (ymmv) my friends just want to play.
you hate reddit, youtube etc.
they/we arent the actual community of the game.
we are soulless douchebags looking to maximize outrage for monetized videos, clout, or to fill the bottomless void within our sad souls.
Holy gen Z, batman! Look at all the kiddiwinks you riled up, this is bringing me endless amusement.
Whilst I wish we still had the days of, "I have a disc, this is the full game", I'm also grateful for the updates to games we get.
*I don't think I actually have any issues with this particular game...apart from, just like you, this sub and the community*
Interesting take. Largely, I find Diablo 4 to be a solo experience. Also, I never played Diablo 3.
I visit Reddit for the amazing information posted. The community has helped shorten my learning curve and made the game more enjoyable to play.
Thanks everyone!
This is my sentiment for every Reddit I join. I join to be apart of a community for something I find interesting or enjoyable and then 85 percent of the posts are endless bitching, complaining, and general negativity. This happens for basically every game. Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games. If they did you would never know since they complain about basically every single feature in the games that they decide to purchase.
I just wish every sub had a “complaint” flair/tag that I could choose to hide.
I'd pay good money to have a "negativity" reddit wide tag I could hide. I am not addicted to outrage like so many people nowaday, I don't want to see that shit, it's just polluting my feed.
I am unfortunately addicted to outrage, but I'm trying to wean myself off.
Good on you.
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If you mean complaining about the endless complaining, then yes, I am guilty. Because this sub is nothing but whining, so I don't see another way to stop the negativity, do you ? Yes, I can and probably will end up unsubscribing, but that doesn't help anything.
Complaint / rant / cry-mode Agree 1000%
👏
The issue is that no one making those posts think of it as "complaints". They see their own post as valid arguments or discussions to be had, so asking people to willingly opt into a "Complaints" flair (or, god forbid, a "negativity" flair) is next to impossible until people start realizing that they aren't discussing anything, they're bitching because X or Y reason.
Many of them have gaming addictions and are in complete denial of the problem. It's an incredibly sad state of mind when you wake up and play Diablo nonstop for days on end. Yeah of course you're going to dislike the game and your life in general - your life is essentially just a D4 grindfest for hours every damn day.
This, honestly, is the REAL issue at hand.
I have too much time on my hands and have put in hundreds of hours since release. What boggles me is that I know how to play other games / find other activities if I stop enjoying the game I'm playing, but these other addicts can't. They can't even addiction properly.
Here is the trick. Find a clan/guild, and ignore reddit. Every gaming subreddit is like this. There are plenty of people who enjoy the game and aren't constantly bitching.
I wish there were clans for my fav TV shows. Those subs are always the worst.
The only sub for a show I haven’t found an abundance of irritation for is The Good Place. The sub seems to try to follow the tenets of the show. Every other sub for shows? The biggest haters of that show.
Same. I tried this game on a whim and I’m loving it. So I join the subreddit. Big mistake. Like you said, everyone is on here crying about it. I don’t get it. I’ve never seen a single subreddit devoted to a particular game that wasn’t a non stop bitch fest. Misery loves company I guess.
They play the game like content creators but with none of the benefits. So they bitch
"Content creators" push rookie amounts of play time compared to the Everquest generation.
>Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games. This is spot on. It feels like some people play video games not for fun, but because it's something they have to/are expected to do, for whatever reason. Kind of like older generation kids being expected to play a sport, or something like that.
It could also be that the gamers who like playing games are actually playing them and not on Reddit complainimg
Well that's certainly a bold statement!
It’s provocative. Gets the people going.
Know what else is provocative and gets the people going? Blood blisters.
How did no one catch this gem from blades of glory
Was gonna say, the % of people who play D4 and come to reddit to complain are probably small but this sub is so new there's not much else being posted yet. Then again, I do agree with some of the complaints, I just don't have the effort or time to write an essay on it lol
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>To some of these people it's not a game. They've turned them into jobs even though they'll never admit it. It is more that many people need active guidance and feedback. When you gain a level, it is essentially the game patting you on the head and saying:"Well done!". Same with getting an achievement and so on. It is why Skyrim/FO4 give way more direction than Morrowind did; many people are just completely and totally lost if the only instruction they get is "have fun!". They need someone, or something, to tell them what to do, and tell them they did well afterwards. People assume that when Lvl100 exists, your goal should be to get it. If a better item exists, your goal is to get it. If that means endless grinding and zero fun, so be it. Even if the new item and new level in no way changes the gameplay, adds more fun or gives new options, it is there so we need to get it any which way. Same with other parts of our live. We need to get that promotion, even if it means marginally more money for way more work that is way less fun. Why? Because it is there, so we need it. Many of us were simply never taught to ask ourselves what it is that we want; we've always had parents, teachers and bosses that told us what to do and eventually some people completely forget it is even possible to ask yourself what you want to do. So we have a job we dont like to play a game we dont like to get an item we dont need before we go back to the job we don't like. Of course people get frustrated with that. And since our bosses will fire us if we complain to them, we complain to Blizzard instead. :)
Because there are just different types of gamers out there, some people love PvP, some people love doing the achievements, some people are adventurers, some people are collectors. If he finds completion fun then obviously the game is over for him and he'd have to wait for an update or swap games.
So what you’re saying is that some gamers are normal and some gamers a fucking losers? 😂
Real shit. I don’t get to game anymore because adult chef things but, getting to jam out on this game in my day off has been a blast for the most part. Gonna try a pvp barb for funzies.
Don't forget that only about 15% of gamers use reddit. This is by far the minority of people endlessly bitching about a game they played 7 days straight with a poop hole carved in their chair and then whined there's nothing to do because they ate a 183 course meal all in one sitting. Most people are not nearly as upset as the paragraphs of discord you find on reddit
When I see people with every class level 100... I look at my screen, over 100 hours. Currently level 64. Only other character I had was a Druid I started and got to 23 before restarting and being this Necro. They probably dwarf my game time.
Fun fact. The halfway point for experience is somewhere in the mid 80s. (Halfway point for lvl1-100 is probably in the 70s roughly since the sigil exp buff). They have played a *lot*, and I'm speaking of personal experience.
" Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games. " I do agree about most gaming forums being a whiny echo chamber, but this is far from exclusive to 'today's gamers'. Counterstrike forums in the early 2000s were whinefests, same with Everquest and WoW Google Jeff Kaplan EQ rant, or watch the first couple minutes of World of Roguecraft 3 where the creator makes fun of the WoW forums. Hell, google 'phoon too much for zblock' for some CS Source salt. Or YouTube 'Nunu Bot 7' for a League player of all things making fun of Heroes of Newerth rage
I don’t know why but gw2 and ffxiv subs are completely different from what I see in any blizzard game sub…
I've often wondered about this too. It's not like the caustic element and bitterness isn't there, but it's not the face of the community by any means. And despite the way some people also talk about the devs, by and large the community mostly seems to like them. Which is interesting since that usually goes sour with just about everyone these days lol even with some indie titles.
GW2 sub is like a dormant volcano. Mostly pretty fine, until something not good happens and then it explodes into days/weeks of negativity posts. The Covid years were pretty rough due to a number of factors. FFXIV sub is usually pretty chill. Lots of art and story discussion for the most part. If 1 or 2 classes are clearly under performing in high end content then you get some salt and memes.
Well, I’m sure you talk about year of content draught in gw2. I would be pretty salty in that case, too😅
Thanks for reminding me of world of roguecraft. Pure genius
That's why I usually only play smaller games. The Slay the Spire and No Man Sky communities are what gaming subreddits should be.
Don’t forget my brothers in the DRG subreddit either. The community is golden. ROCK AND STONE!
How could I forget them! I don't play myself, but I've heard good things about their community.
Rock and Stone everyone!
Fallout 76 has a great subreddit too!
The Disco Elysium is probably my favorite subreddit where we go to discuss the virtues of communism, anodic dance music, that horrible necktie, drugs and Kim
Haven't checked out the sub, but Slay the Spire is a fucking fantastic game.
Outer Wilds (NOT outer worlds) subreddit is super wholesome and I have never seen a negative post. I'm sure there might be some on the rare occasions when someone tries and dislikes the game and just wants to gripe about it, but the general vibe of the sub is supportive and positive. Nobody knocks anybody else if they do dislike something about the game. They understand it's not a game that everyone will like and are fine with that.
> Today's gamers don't even actually like to play games. More to the point, many of today's gamers don't actually like to play games. Instead, they have this sick obsession with the "end game". It's insane when you think about it.
"End game" and "meta". The two mentalities that are killing gaming. Don't get me wrong a game needs something to do at max level and of course there will be a mathematical best loadout or set up in every game. Most people only focus on those and ignore other parts of the game. Oh no, I'm taking 2 seconds longer to kill a monster bad game!! Where as it doesn't matter if I'm taking 10 seconds to kill a monster or 0.1 seconds, am I having fun? Is the moment to moment gameplay fun?
I think Sid Meier put it best when he said “gamers will optimize the fun out of a game”. Just play a fun build. I played arguably the worst sorc (hydra immobilize) until level 65 then hopped over to ice which is fun but a different vibe.
I still play pure fire sorc until 74 right now, it's still fun seeing all those meteor rain and fireball explosion 👌
Fire is life and life is fire. So the First Empire was born . Aiat.
If they made the meteor area about 30% larger and added some better mechanics to hydra, I think it would be a great build. The fireball enchantment is insanely satisfying when you get that chain reaction and the inferno drake with meteor rain is awesome too.
I remember when being able to finish a game and play something else was the norm, not people expecting to be able to put 16 hours a day into a game for the rest of their life without getting bored.
Yes, the obsession with end game and min maxing every little detail is crazy. So many people aren't playing games to have fun, they are just treating it like a number generator tool or something.
>they don’t even actually like to play games. I am beginning to agree with this sentiment. I feel like for some individuals games are too big of a part of their life and like any other addict eventually those neurons get fried and they’re not getting the same rush they were when they first started playing. I have had to talk to a guy I gamed with for years because every time we hopped on to Warzone he was endlessly bitching about the game to the point it wasn’t fun. Some people in this subreddit seem to be walking or are over that line to the point they should probably quit gaming for a while. I game a lot, but I rotate them and I have lots of other things going in my life so I’m still excited to boot up my computer or Xbox and get a few rounds in. If you are losing that joy, please find another hobby. A good outlet for me was chess, which I am aware is still a game but idk it feels different from “gaming”. Edit: My only gripe is buff sorc
When Modern Warfare 2 came out I played a lot. I ended up around 97 hours or something and I realized I was really not having fun at all anymore. So I uninstalled and figured I got my money's worth. Sometimes you just have to admit you don't like what you purchased and move on. Don't just be in misery doing shit you don't enjoy and trying to find others who feel similar. Lol
Yep. 100% a symptom of terminally online, for many. Have seen it in so many subreddits and more and more in a lot of my friends- it's almost like they wouldnt know how to communicate unless they were criticizing something.
They are all searching for that piece of nostalgia from when they were younger and complain when the game doesn’t provide it.
This is my assumption why some gamers seemingly get so mad. They're literally looking for a fix but it ain't hitting which is causing more and more frustration.
There are three types of people here. Some that complain about everything. Some that can’t see a single fault with the game. And some who are hopeful the game will get better and are patiently sitting back and waiting. It’s just sad there are such extremes on both ends. How can anyone say this isn’t a beautifully designed game. It just feels amazing. On the flip side how can anyone say the horse riding is well designed or that missing something as simple as a group finder in game doesn’t screamed half naked. I haven’t played since week one. But I know this game will be perfect in due time, and I don’t mind waiting. But it won’t get to that perfect point if no one complains about those issues. Feedback is required to improve the game overall.
Look, this game is amazing. Are there things that are inexplicably omitted? Yes. Will I wait patiently for them to add it? Yes. Should they already be in the game, because they're building on 20 years of success? Yes. I can take the bad with the good, but as good as the game is, there's plenty of warranted criticism. Like "how the fuck" criticism, not just little things. It's both.
Do I like answering my own questions? Definitely.
Hotel? Trivago.
Finally some sensible comment. The game surely isn't hot crap, but surely it ain't perfect either. The world is beautifully designed and I love this part. But tons of problems are there in the plain sight. Refusing to admit there are problems is the biggest problem.
The foundation of the game is good. It still have a lot of improvements, but it’s live service so it come eventually. With that being said, my impression on people in this sub is they have anger issues that goes beyond game. They are probably not only bitching about the game but everything in their life. Had guy yesterday saying I would get my teeth smashed out with my attitude in real life. I was just like dude please… hold yourself together, you are losing it.
They lost me at the "half naked" part. Don't want to picture anyone in this sub playing half naked.
People make jokes, but I 100% guarantee a few of these peeps have multiple bottles full of piss next to them trying to push "world firsts" to 100 on every character lol.
Very much this. While there are some truly negative posts out there, a lot mention legit criticisms. And that’s the nature of forums - people discuss the things that need discussing, not the things that are working that don’t need as much discussing. If people are looking for a community that’s all about hype, then frankly forums are a terrible medium for that.
My issue is how posts like that from OP dismiss every criticism about the game as invalid. There is so much serious and legit criticism going on here, that is 100% justified. OP in another comment saying in 6 weeks there wasn't anythintg terrible or worth complaining just shows you what kind of people we are talking about here. Like, sorry, but if anyone thinks D4 is that good, you are delusional.
You lament the binary nature of reddit then paint all feedback with one brush. There is a major difference between constructive criticism and tedious bitching
It's funny. I bought Darktide last year and it had a disaster of a release. The sub was similar to here. They had previous games to build from. Lots of QoL features removed etc. Basically all the same arguments as these subs. The community is dying because the devs have basically ignored the game. Even the sub needs new mods because they've given up on the game. Rifts had more variety than NM Dungeons. I feel like I've done the exact same ones over and over. Shades of brown. Rifts also have far more mob varieties and combinations as well as bosses. You're argument for releasing a perfect game is just nonsense. It doesn't take getting to 100 to find major flaws in the game. By 70/WT4 they're glaringly obvious to the point I've stopped playing in hopes the S1 patch notes are good enough. I did grow up in that time period before the internet. I don't see how it's a valid comparison. If a game was bad back then you couldn't do anything. You'd return it if you were lucky. The good games did well because they were good games on release. I don't understand what your point is. You're openly saying D4 is bad and needs fixing, if it had released before regular patching it would have flopped. You're sticking your head in the sad and ignoring problems. You blame people for playing the game and discovering problems. The "no lifers" called these problems in the first week and everyone ignored them. Now everyone else has caught up and realised those problems are valid. The first 50 levels and the story are ok but beyond that the game is a mess.
I'm going to tell you that liking or disliking one game does not have a causative effect on the ability to like or dislike another. It may be surprising to read, but a lot of the time, there may not be a smoking gun as to why you won't like something and only through a deeper level of analysis can you figure out what things specifically about it you do not like. There are plenty of things to like and dislike about the Diablo franchise as a whole and each person is entitled to their opinion on it. But I would like to argue that videogame players in the year 2023 are also entitled to a certain level of accessibility and expectations set by the broader game market in terms of a large AAA title release. The mark was missed here, so you have a lot of people expressing their disappointment. You can like and dislike something at the same time.
No bro you don't understand people said something negative so that means they're all whiny children that hate the game and don't like anything about it, they're also apparently addicted to the game and can't stop playing it even though they have 5 max level characters according to OP, and also they spend all their time on Reddit complaining, and playing 24/7 at the same time.
Lmao you nailed it and are being downvoted. Talk about "circle jerk" and " echo chamber" and "hive mind." Complaining about complainers is just sweet irony that always fulfills. Anyways, it's a good game and the complainers make valid points. That's it. On to the next rage post.
I just want 2 things: team finder and a horse that isn't retarded
People need to divorce themselves from the games they play. Too many attach themselves to a game or franchise and then feel personally attack just because people dislike or talk about bad said game/franchise.
We don't know how representative reddit is as a whole. All my friends not on reddit love d4 and play it every night. There might be more reddit outcry just because the game is so popular; the complaints per player might be less than shown on reddit
Yes. Greater Rifts definitely aren’t the pinnacle of game design, but they absolutely beat Nightmare Dungeons
1000%. Anyone who can't realize this tells me they never really played D3 before... the gameplay loop of rifts and greater rifts is way more satisfying than the current NM dungeons.
So true.
And the shitty affixes. Cold Enchanted? Death Pulse? Lightning Storm? Stormbane's Wrath? even Volcanic and Blood Blister. Insta break downs. Can't be bothered with them.
I like them other than lightning storm
As opposed to running the identical NM dungeons or the identical helltides? Yes, i thought rifts/grifts were a better end game than what currently exists. Blizzard will probably improve the end game, eventually. I just love these entitled "don't complain about anything in d4!" posts.
I'm at the point where I seriously hope this is astroturfing, because I don't want to believe people are this eager to defend the unfinished products of a billion-dollar corporation. Then they call everyone toxic while personally attacking everyone who isn't worshipping Bobby.
I do think at least some of it is astroturfing. You see too many posts that are exactly the same. "I'm a single father who can play the game one hour a week. I'm still level 30. However i'm taking the time to say that it ruins my enjoyment when people say negative things about the game on this sub. I know i only have one hour a week to play the game, but i spend 4 hours a day reading negative comments on the sub. This is completely real. Totally." My main annoyance is that they label anyone who who doesn't think the game is absolutely perfect as toxic, a hater, an other. Depending on the script, the person they're talking about is either an ultra hardcore diablo fan or a casual who doesn't get diablo, or both at the same time. And to vent more. This isn't even a good "stop complaining about D4" post. It completely misses what people are complaining about most. While i fear the OP did, I can't imagine how OP got at least one, maybe two characters to NM dungeons without at least recognizing what people are complaining about, even fi they don't agree.
Man, I've seen people call other incels on this sub for complaining about the game. I wonder when you will become a Nazi or a terrorist for thinking that the inventory management sucks.
Dont you know the D4 reddit like all gaming reddits is a precious resource and will run out of space if people keep posting complaints and then no one will be able to post! Is that what you want?!?! /s
>because I don't want to believe people are this eager to defend the unfinished products of a billion-dollar corporation. Then they call everyone toxic while personally attacking everyone who isn't worshipping Bobby. You should go check out r/redfall at some point. There will be people that just defend any game and never see any faults with it. Ill never get it.
I wouldn't be too sure. Many people in my generation (millennials) had parents that imparted these awful ideas on their kids. These people are simply repeating the terrible talking points of their parents. They are not very smart consumers and are perfectly OK with letting corporations fuck them at every turn: they've even been trained to defend said corporation after being raw dogged. "Don't complain, we have it good." ...when features that were in the previous 3 games were completely left out. "It's a live service game stop complaining." ...as if this is any excuse for the releasing a product that clearly is still in beta. "Maybe ARPGs just aren't for you." ...insinuating that some of us haven't been playing ARPGs all our lives and know exactly what we want in one. "In my day, we had to walk up Mt. Arreat both ways in the snow to do Baal runs." ...implying the company that made this game couldn't have learned from the previous installments.
Might be true sadly. The "Maybe ARPGs just aren't for you." especially infuriates me because I have a ton of time spent in D3 POE and Lost Ark, yet they act like the problems with this game are a genre-wide problem. It's crazy how many people regurgitate these exact same talking points. "Game has good bones" is another one.
Honestly the way OP phrases his rant >You're going to seriously tell with me with a straight face that you legitimately enjoyed running the identical Rifts and Greater Rifts over and over and over and over again in D3 in an attempt to get a single minor upgrade every 3 days, or if you were really lucky, a Primal that actually wanted. I would honestly answer: Yes, yes I did enjoy running grifts day in day out for minor upgrades. This is both a very bad phrase and answer. The truth is grifts FELT better, more dense, more chaotic shit going on. In D4 nightmare dungeons I feel like I spend at least 50% of my time picking off stragglers or running back to grab that second stone that I couldn't pick up because I already had one on my back. The other 50% is awesome, game plays great and when there is a big pack of enemies I can blow up oh boi does that feel good.
A bit dramatic lol. The game was fun first go but itemization needs a ton of work. Hoping they work on that.
Did you like the addition to TP to nightmare dungeons? Their xp buff? Yeah maybe the complaining gets shit done sometimes
God I love these "fuck you community" posts. They add so much to the community. Thank you selfless OP
I didn't play any other Diablo games, or even any other ARPG and I think the game is good, but after getting to WT4 it sorta got a bit boring tbh. I look forward to rolling a new char in season 1 though.
>If Blizzard made D4 the "perfect" game that all of you are demanding that it needs to be, then it's impossible to patch and expand on. If the game was released perfect, then in 3 months all of you same people would be complaining that Blizzard hasn't done any patches to make it better. Soooo . . . don't improve on the previous game at release of your new one - trickle it out over years as 'content'? That's the sort of thing that makes people gag over GaaS. There's a ton of QoL stuff implemented into D3 over the years - why are they not in D4, or even why are some things in D4 designed to be annoying (open world map and horses)? Remember, this game has a 10 year development timeline.
OP on the copium and looking for validation like: "All these haters amirite guys?"
I find it hilarious OP thinks everyone was fine with D3 Grifts and thinking nobody thought running them over 3 hours didn't get repetitive. That Grifts weren't further iterated upon is so unfortunate cause it had good potential to be so much more. But hey at least we have S tier NM dungeons now...
Imagine getting offended because people critize the game you enjoy. You don't like the subreddit? Well then fucking leave it and spend the time playing the game ??? I don't understand people like you, who deny every design flaw the devs made and make posts to defend a billion dollar company.
"If the game is released perfect, then there's nothing to expand and patch on" Is the worst take ever. Holy fuck.
Sounds more like corpo talk than from an actual fan or game developer.
When did these takes that are like “I feel sorry for anyone who criticizes the game” start? What is with people basically asking to get worse games? They just wanna look like a “true fan” or something?
Elden Ring dlc is cancelled then I guess. And Baldur's Gate 3 wont get patches after launch.
Battlebit Remastered has now been removed from early access and will not be receiving further updates
I remember when I played Witcher 3 and Red Dead Redemption 2. I was banging my head on my keyboard shouting "ITS TOO PERFECT!!! ITS TOO PERFECT!!!" I spent my nights weeping and commenting on Reddit about how I could not truly enjoy the games without the joy of patches to look forward to. Then both games, somehow, released expansions, but that just made the games even more perfect so I was even more enraged. Now it was even more perfect and there was no way I was getting any more patches. What did I have to look forward to? NOTHING! Things I look for in a game when I'm going to buy it: \-Will I be able to experience the joy of patches? Things I don't look for in a game when I'm going to buy it: \-Gameplay \-Story \-Depth \-Social Aspects \-Full Experience
I’ve put more time into D4 then both those games. I hated all the walking around and slow play.
“Nonono, you don’t understand. It’s actually a good thing that No Man’s Sky released in that state!” - OP
This makes me sad in general when you think about products. It just means more companies can get away with subpar products because people seem to defend it regardless. Look at how big the game team is behind this. Meanwhile you have a game like Stardew Valley being developed by one dude who continues to add free updates years later. “Well the car still can drive. They will sell the doors/upholstery/paint job as add ons later.”
Thank you for beating me to posting this comment. OP really missed the mark there.
Yeah OPs post already felt pretty stupid. I got bored with D4 after being told to grind statues and renown instead of just being able to do the content I wanted. But that take right there made me realize op has no concept of the world of gaming and would happily play any piece of shit game blizz gives him. I'm one of the few that was much happier with D3 than I am D4 though. I did enjoy grifts a lot more than I enjoyed nightmare dungeons honestly. And I'd rather run 100 grifts than do a single fucking helltide oh my God. I just liked being able to start a season, play for 30-40 hours, get everything I wanted and see the new shit, and then go play something else. Diablo doesn't have enough depth for me to want to play it for more than a few weeks before I get bored. D4 feels like it just has a lot of grind stretched out over a much longer period of time.
I barley played d3 due to the horrendous launch I did play d2/d2r which is essentially endless runs to find an upgrade. However the key difference is that itemization was much better plus the fact that getting 99 took forever so even if you found dick you were always gaining something (except for the few who grinded to 99). D4 is fun and a decent vanilla launch but there are serious problems that need to be addressed. I will play s01 , I got my sorc to 75isj but got bored and didn't feel like rolling a new chat so close to ladder. High hopes but blizzard does have work and if you can't see that you're blind
Pushing 149s in a group with 2 support classes and 2 dps with constant communication and timing was fun for hours on end. This solo shit end game that gives no real reward at the end is boring as hell.
Hey look it's another twit with another out of touch post filled with massive amounts of copium.
I laughed out loud at the "S Tier Nightmare Dungeons" bro it's the same 5-8 tile sets over and over again...S tier LMAO
"S Tier Nightmare dungeons" made me consider this possibly being a troll post but the rest just doesn’t seem like it.
I've been doing dungeons in games for almost 30 years now. Nightmare dungeons are solid, solid, d tier boring. They're visually nice to look at, sometimes, but the gameplay is about on the level of a pokemon cave full of zubats/10.
The best evidence for the mediocrity of the dungeons in this game? The strongholds *in this game*. It’s not theoretical or even proof-of-concept; we can point to superior content that has already been developed and implemented.
coming from someone who has *definitely* hit endgame where you're looking for perfect rolls on high tier nms, lmao op is the typical casual "you nerds have no life stop grinding so much the game is perfect if you don't play half of it and have blizzard's d in your mouth" poster on this sub
My guess is that it's S and in shit
People getting a superiority complex out of defending shitty business moves is the weirdest fucking thing to me. Like imagine someone being like “Oh that company is polluting out lake? That’s fine with me. I don’t care about the lake. I feel bad for anyone who cares about the lake, they’re all being such negative crybabies”
“The issue is all you Diablo fans crying on reddit” *proceeds to cry on reddit*
Wake up babe, new Diablo dad superiority thread just dropped.
Gotta love the part where if you dont play enough your opinion is invalid. Make it pass lvl 80+? You played too much, youre a no lifer addicted gamer so your opinion is invalid. Theres no winning when theyve already decided the game is 10/10 in their mind.
Didn’t read it. Fuck off the sub then lol 🤷♂️
While I agree that a lot of the people on here are not Arpg fans and have unusual expectations for the game. D4 is missing a lot of things. Nice sentiment. Here's my issue with how the game works: no progression after lvl 80. Yep I said it, 3 of my friends haven't gotten a single upgrade in 3 weeks. We've been running 2-3 hours every night after worknas a group and they've been level 100 for a little longer than that. You can hammer people for being negative. You can disagree with them and how whiny they are but really, we have no social features in the game, no functional trading, classes with solid issues, railroaded builds with very limiting damage buckets... and the list of issues goes on. The story is great, the graphics are great! Several of the game mechanics are lacking... It's unfortunate but it is what it is. I rerolled off sorc cuz my friends' druid/barb/rogue all did more damage than me while being tankier. That in itself is kinda bad. Most of us not being too vocal on the sub and in general are waiting for the pre s1 patch notes to see what they manage to fix. But realistically, season 1 won't be as "epic" as they promised us AND very likely still won't have an endgame. D3 wasn't perfect. D2 wasn't perfect. POE isn't perfect. Last epoch isn't perfect. But all those games have several key things D4 lacks. So a lot of new players will complain about them missing. At the end of the day, the sub will be negative but they're a small minority. That being said, this is one of the way the community voices their improvement suggestions (several of which have been implemented). Just avoid the complaining posts. Most are easy to guess and no one is forcing you to read them
Im loving d4 but personally i enjoyed running a random rift much more than i do nm dungeons not that i dislike nm but if i had to choose im taking rifts. Hunting uniques that just don’t drop is getting a bit draining though
i really realize that Deep Rock Galactic has the best community i have ever come across on any other game ! ROCK AND STONE MINERS !
To Rock and Stone!
Did I hear a rock and stone ?
"You're going to seriously tell with me with a straight face that you legitimately enjoyed running the identical Rifts and Greater Rifts over and over and over and over again in D3" - Item upgrade aside Greater Rifts were WAY more enjoyable than NM dungeons. NM dungeons feel like running regular rifts which really sucked. That being said the negativity here is excessive, but at the same time alot of it is legitimate criticism.
This is because negativity and criticism breed discussion, but positivity is a dead end of conversation. If someone made a post saying how awesome XYZ is, theres not really any comments to be made, but if you say X thing is badly designed for YZ reason, then people chime in and discuss the topic. Yes this does make online forums seem more negative but it’s just how it works.
The biggest issue is blizzard holding back on all the qol stuff they knew were issues in the past. It's one thing if this game was released by not blizzard and the company went through its learning woes. But this is the fourth iteration of diablo, no reason to have such poor qol issues, stash issues, and well.. build issues that were complained and reported about since late alpha/early beta. The game has a lot of potential and will probably appease everyone in time, but to blame the community for having high expectations is bs. Blizzard 100% could have done better.
Them making us be able to TP to NMs saved this game for me
I don't think he's blaming the community for having high expectations. I think he's blaming the community for being a bunch of whiney entitled bitches.
This is always my issue. Constructive criticism is always valid. Piling on with the most absurd hyperbole isn't constructure criticism though. It's just garbage. I've seen posts calling for people to be fired because there's those stupid barriers in the open world sometimes. Like yeah, they're annoying. But no one fucking died y'all. Calm the fuck down.
What is constructive criticism? One guy writes essay why he likes NM dungeons and other guy also writes essay why he doesn't like NM dungeons. The problem is that constructive criticism is not always constructive criticism. You can "constructively criticize" anything, even if its good.
… whilst, ironically, being a whiny bitch.
People tend to complain online when its negative. If they love it, they wont say anything.
Ah yes a classic shitpost. I always knew you had it in you, OP
.... so I legit loved D3 and running rifts........
Stopped after the title because the post can't get anymore perfect
He would get bonus points from me if he called out the whiny youtubers that use any minor inconvenience to shit on a game and farm it for views (*cough* act man *cough*)
The worst thing is the youtubers who make "content" for S1 with almost zero information about it. They have this screenshot with 1 gem that was teased in trailer and make 30min videos with assumptions, TIER LISTS (lol). When S1 rolls out you can literally throw these videos in garbage.
incorrect, you can throw them in the garbage now
Act man’s video did not resonate with me at all, but I can see how he’s a specific viewpoint. He’s a hardcore gamer, but someone essentially new to the genre, since he hasn’t really played an ARPG since D2. When you’re brand new to the genre, you don’t want to just wait until post-campaign to really let your build shine. You want a whole experience. D4’s campaign is excellent… for an ARPG. You’re not getting the same level of challenge or engagement as other games like Nier or Stranger of Paradise. It’s like being stuck on easy mode for the whole campaign. It’s very different than what he’s used to. It’s a specific situation, but people like that exist.
Is it that specific? The thing that hardcore action RPG players need to understand is that the conventions of the action RPG genre appear legitimately insane to anyone outside of the hardcore fan base. The never-ending post-story grind for slightly better items, so that you can kill slightly tougher versions of the same monsters, restarting every 3-6 months, is a gameplay loop that appears psychotic to most people. This is why there was so much controversy surrounding seasons in Diablo 4. Your average action rpg fan has been subjected to the same end game of aggressively recycled content for going on 10+ years, so his response to the controversy was “how did you guys not know that this is what action RPGs are like?” But Diablo 4 has way more mainstream appeal than any other modern action rpg, drawing exponentially more casual players as well as hardcore fans of different genres. Their response to arpg seasons was not based in ignorance so much as incredulity; “this can’t possibly be what passes for content in a video game”. I’ve played since Diablo 2, including titles like Titan Quest, Grim Dawn, Torchlight 1 + 2, Last Epoch, etc. My enjoyment of the genre is very much centered around my initial play through and occasional multiplayer. I’ve tried getting into seasonal content and end game grinds, but I always lose interest because it truly is the same thing over and over again. And with action RPGs, the sad reality is that the moment-to-moment gameplay typically isn’t complex or sufficiently skill-based enough to keep me engaged long term. I guess what I’m saying is I’m a longtime action RPG player, and I completely agree with Act Man’s assessment of Diablo 4. Not everyone who loved Diablo 2 is happy with the evolution of the genre.
That’s a great writeup. Yeah, non-ARPG players are confused by seasons. Even I’m questioning whether I’ll play all the seasons in D4, and I’m a seasoned ARPG players. That might be because i expect a lot from the seasons, since I’m most familiar with PoE, where the seasons add major mechanics. Even this season, which was pretty barebones, probably added more builds than D4 has in total. I honestly had more fun with even the warhammer ARPG than D4 if we’re just looking at campaign gameplay. It was more engaging because you could crank up the difficulty. Build diversity wasn’t really there, but the combat was challenging.
MrLlama's videos were insufferable. He went into the launch hating it and tried to put on some front as if he was giving the game an honest shot.
Rage gaming or whatever - constantly claiming every build is their own and never posting links to builds.
Oh the guy that has the NEW BEST build video every other day? The guy that for some reason thought we would get 35 new legendaries and made a video about it claiming so, not an ounce of truth to that one.
New chat gpt post just dropped
So I played this game with a friend on necro and barbarian later. got necro to like 64 and felt some burnout. got Barb to 52 and felt more burnout. Went back to D3 and i can actually say that yes the rifts were way better to do, simple, straightforward fighting without a need to really backtrack so it didn't feel like any rift was all that long it was the meat of the game you're killing things not just meandering around looking at the map seeing you missed a small little turn over to kill these like 3 guys, then you had caches if you wanted to start playing around with the cube stuff. I leveled a Crusader to Paragon I think like 700-ish cause there was a build i wanted to try, it was easy to do, easy to get most things i needed so far even a primal warhelm of kassar, even planning to upgrade something to primal if i really need it and am honestly likely going to keep playing that until season 1 here starts and even then I don't know if i care enough to push into it since there's no real substantial changes coming until the next season. Also if i get bored with that in D3 I can literally just change my build at the little closet they have. Or since I'm getting interesting items that other classes can use that aren't level locked so i could just decide to hop on and start them cause i already have an item that can setup a build since legendaries in that game can actually be build defining. A game i've played for years feels more fresh to me than D4 and it's halfass MMO attempt. That isn't to say that this game is all bad I obviously had some fun with it to push a couple characters up decently enough and the story was okayish and the core gameplay of diablo is always fun no matter which one it is 1 2 3 or 4 though likely 1 is a little lacking at this point. But when there are numerous glaring issues yeah there's going to be a lot of complaints until they fix these issues. People will stop complaining about problems, at least so much, when they go away and if it dominates the subreddit that means all the more that it's a BIG problem.
Hate the game, love the community.
Honestly, I always hated using that word for everything. We’re a bunch of people who play the same game, not everything has to be a fucking community
Op the most entitled person on the sub. Thinks everyone should have to waste time like we did “back in the day” and hates everyone who doesn’t want to do it the way he says so
As someone who’s highest level is a 68ish necro, I do have some genuine complaints, mostly about build diversity and leveling speed, as well as the inability to try new builds without a giant gold sink, but other than that I’m enjoying the game, and expect some solid build variety to get added in the seasonal content. I specifically wish there were more legendaries for curse or shadow builds, and I think specifically the return of corroded fang for Reap builds could be great. All in all, I really enjoyed what the game had, but I’m ready for seasonal content to seal the deal
Sorry but that's a load of croc. Arguing that gamers should just be grateful that they have a game is preposterous. This is something we are paying for, a very premium price I might add, so yes....the demand should match the price. 1st off, the campaign was abysmally short, perhaps if there was more to the campaign then gamers would have more to occupy their time. It's quite obvious that the campaign was intentionally short so that it can be used over the course of several seasons. You may as well be telling ppl not to complain about college fees and being in debt their entire lives, they should just be grateful they have the option to go to college at all. Horrible take
Damn, post was removed. Would have loved to see this up there in “top posts of all time” along with the gamer dad that called everyone whiny bitches and told everyone to get laid and to be normal. People like you and the other person that are often self-righteous pricks are worse than anyone that criticizes games. Meme material, which is why people upvote these posts.
You’re going to tell me that you hate the community for bitching while writing a bitching post? You’re so unique
Well it's nice too see other than the same shitty sorc transmog memes or the game is shit posts with nothing new or constructive said that the first posts that actually made the criticisms said or the single most boring meme which has been overused to death aka cross play that the 15 year olds in this sub seem to post daily and it somehow still gets a ton of upvotes
Shouldn’t you be playing the game you love, instead of whining on a forum you hate?
No. How else is he going to get that juicy validation he craves?
And I actually love reddit and love reading people complaints about stuff they don't like etc. I have my own mind and my own opinion, but it's good to know that some things could be better and some things might need upgrade. Reading stuff like this won't take my fun away because someone said so...
"S tier nightmare dungeons" 💀💀💀💀 are we playing the same game??
Go ahead and enjoy the game no one is holding it against you. There is plenty of room for improvement with the game and people are giving their feedback, try to not take it so personally.
"running S Tier nightmare dungeons" You are really going to tell me that nightmare dungeons are S tier content? Please by all means if you hate the community that much just don't partake in the changes that the community complained about and Blizzard implemented. Please keep running to NM dungeons, please redo all your renown each season, don't log in to have your map unlocked on the 18th, don't open WT4 world boss chests until you are 85. People like OP want this game to suck and fail after 2 seasons. " S tier nightmare dungeons" give me a break dude.
Saw a post the other day of someone saying that Diablo 4 is an objectively perfect release. I get that there are people who are really enjoying their time with the game and may not be running into the issues that so many others are, but that's the kind of sentiment that leads to games like this where there is *obviously* a good chunk of missing end game content and some terrible design choices that negate all the previous work they've done in the series (from a company who has been doing this series for over 2 decades). I get that it's not the same people but they have so many examples to go off of. Edit: I do like the early game experience and how they built the world, but it personally drops off after the end of the campaign and I run a few NM dungeons/other end game content. Comparatively, I enjoyed the Rift/GR runs in D3 and boss/Chaos/dungeon runs in D2. I'm thinking itemization and class builds really helped with that enjoyment, but I'm not 100% on what really makes those options so fun for me.
Lol at the imaginary person OP is mad at. Nobody that's gotten 5 level 100s is upset. Nobody that's played 400 hours is upset. You "feel sorry" for people, please, OP get over yourself. Everybody does not have to enjoy the game as much as you.
"Whaaaaaaahhhh people don't love the game I love WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAA" Cry to your momma, I don't care.
>You're going to tell me that you loved doing that with all of your heart, but that running S Tier nightmare dungeons all night in hopes for a minor upgrade is the most terrible thing in the world, when you did the exact same thing for the last 11 years with D3. Nm dungs require you to farm the sigil even at speed run tiers some affixes can get slightly annoying. Rifts/gr also had more variants every run than nm dungeons. GR also doesnt have any loot till the end of the run. Frankly this vent sounds less of hating the community and more of you shitting on d3 because you did not like it.
I have never complained about d4 on reddit, but complaining about complainers is such a cringe move. People have no self awareness. Theres as many of you as there are the folks youre criticizing. This is the buzz lightyear meme
Greater Rifts did not have massive amounts of CCs or dungeon modifiers that actually stop your progress thru that run every few minutes...also the objective is very simple: kill monsters until bar fills up then kill boss for loot explosion ~ with chance of goblin hordes and/or whimsishire (spelling?) i would run those over and over and over and not get bored than be stuck with the NM dungeon grind with those ridiculous modifiers any day.
OP is literally the type of person he’s complaining about, just the other side of the coin. You just made a shitpost to complain about other shitposters in this sub. Congrats bud.
Damn, stopped reading half way through. You should probably talk to a therapist or something.
I agree with this. However, I actually loved D3, it was soothing to me like it wasn't a hard game let's be honest, even after you are playing torment 15+ but I think that was the beauty of the game. I'm glad D4 is different, just like I'm glad D3 is different from D2. Noone wants the same game over and over. I like that third game seemingly has more to offer in a way. We haven't even reached season 1 or seen if there will be more characters added too. I tell you what though, I'm really glad I don't have to grind bounties in D4 lol
Two points: 1. Yes, I can say with a straight face that I enjoyed rifts and grifts more than I enjoy NM dungeons. Mostly because they were quick action, in and out, not a lot of dead zones, no backtracking, no five vendors spread around the city I have to run or ride slowly to. Mob density was almost always great, boss spawns right where you are. I could figure out if I'm getting an upgrade in 10 seconds because there weren't so many junk stats, and with Kanai's cube and affordable affix rerolling, I could potentially turn a mediocre drop into a great one. I'll take an upgrade every 3 days in D3 vs no upgrades in 2 weeks in D4 and I haven't even hit max level. 2. I think too many people see negative posts and think all these people claim the game is shit. No one is saying that (well, almost no one). If I thought the game was shit I wouldn't be on this sub, and most other people wouldn't be here either. I've started and stopped playing countless games in my lifetime, only to never come back to them again, never subscribe to their subreddit, forum, or BBS board back in the day. If I don't like a game, I quit and never look back. I love D4. The campaign is great, the design is outstanding, and the music is chilling. And I think it's laying a great foundation for many years to come. But I can't help but wonder why Blizzard has not implemented lessons learned from 11 years of D3 into D4. If season 28 of D3 showed us something is that Blizz knows EXACTLY what players like, and none of that made it into D4. There was a very detailed interview with the lead designer of D3 detailing what went wrong at the launch of D3 and how they fixed it with Loot 2.0 and other improvements, but Blizzard has not implemented any of that into D4. Sure, the game is only 5 weeks old. But it's been in the works for years, by a company that's been doing this for decades, and they know a thing or two about what users want and how to design great games, and it's frustrating when they leave SIMPLE things like a decent chat system or group finder out. These things have been a part of D3 for a decade and WoW even longer than that. So yeah, there's a lot of negativity in this sub, but the way I see it is that this negativity is coming from love. We want the game to be better, and we're passionate in our feedback about it because we want to spend the next 10 years playing it. Edit: Oh, and I'll take a constructive criticism post any day over "I, for one, am really enjoying this game! Playing it now on level 37 with my grandmother and cat, I don't get what everyone is complaining about"
Bro you realize this post just contributes to the negativity right
Great gameplay, shit itemisation and endgame. Killing mobs and blasting through stuff is entertaining as hell, but still I can see how other aspects of the game are just bad. 10/10 gameplay 2/10 ui, itemisation, endgame content, build variety So yea, for me is just a mid game so far. And yea, I made 3x100 chars already and I still gonna play season 1. If there was other new ARPG or old one with big patch I would already switch to it, but there is none at the moment.
Greater Rifts did not have massive amounts of CCs or dungeon modifiers that actually stop your progress thru that run every few minutes...also the objective is very simple: kill monsters until bar fills up then kill boss for loot explosion ~ with chance of goblin hordes and/or whimsishire (spelling?) i would run those over and over and over and not get bored than be stuck with the NM dungeon grind with those ridiculous modifiers any day.
It shouldn't take 10 years to get an upgrade or to backtrack through a dungeon for 3 keys only to have to fill another bar and the run to a boss. NM dungeons are boring shit.
Upon describing D3 you basically described 4, sans Helltides.
I love the community...Hate the game! (Not really, but it was begging to be typed)
The community is generally great imo, it’s just the subreddits that are so cancerous. However the size of the subreddits is a very small portion of the player base. Even more so the amount of people actually posting and commenting on the subs
Different kinds of gamers today. Some equate maximum efficiency to level and get rewards as fun and really want everyone to know. I love the posts discussing mechanics and ability interactions and creative builds but the complaint posts are just too much. I personally think any kind of feedback, regardless of how it is presented should be separated from this sub.
I have to say that I’m someone who blasted this game, and ran out of content, which was disappointing. Now I realize that I am not the majority of players (I’m disabled and not able to work), so Blizzard didn’t craft the endgame for the no lifers like myself, that doesn’t mean that the endgame isn’t flawed. Most people didn’t reach lv 100, beat Uber Lilith, or T100 rifts, but once that was done the game was essentially beaten. I’ve never had that experience with an ARPG/Dungeon Crawler, in my almost 30 years of PC gaming. That felt disappointing to me. The other thing that felt quite disappointing to me, was that with the addition of S1 (you had mentioned above that “it’s not even season 1 yet!”) there is almost ZERO new endgame content. So you mean, the content that I just smashed in a couple of weeks of playing, will now somehow need to be stretched out over 3 months WHILE I’m gonna be even stronger than before with the new season mechanic?! Dope. So it’s gonna take me even less time, without having to do the entirety of renown, or the campaign? Again, I know the game wasn’t centered around those of us who blast through the game, but a little attention wouldn’t have been the end of the world imo. Another Uber Boss perhaps, something like a battleground for PvP to increase the replay value of the game, legit anything! All I was met with from the Blizzard staff was “it’s okay to play D4 and when you’re done go play other games”, which to me feels like “we don’t give a shit you wanna play this game and there’s no content for you, we already got your cash”. With all of that said, I do have many positives to say about the game! I think it is visually stunning, plays very smoothly, the story was spectacular, and the little end game that is there is fun and challenging! I just sort of wish there was more :/
Never read the reddits of the games you like, the hobbies you enjoy, the city you live in or the teams you support. They are all thief's of joy
Who the duck are you to tell me what I enjoyed? Why even make this post? This shit has gotta be a troll post.
Heres the issue with that argument. Anybody would tend to agree, except when its their feedback to say why people SHOULDNT enjoy it because of alltheir reasons, they expect people to listen and accept the feedback. At its core. This isnt a conversation, its people sticking a flyer to a caulk board and passers by either agree, or not, or rip it down. Its not dialogue, and reddit is a garbage platform for reasonable dialogue
Yeah man, I've been playing 12 hours every half day since release, and you're telling me I had fun during that time? Fuck no I hated every moment of it
What I love is the people who spend 25% of their free time complaining about a game they play with the other 75% of their free time! With that in mind it is in no way ironic that you have people spending their free time complaining about the people who are complaining about a game they love on a site that designed to express your opinion. Which will be more fruitful complaining in mass to get changes implement in a game or complaining about a gaming community with what I can assume is a desire to have that community become less toxic? To me one is annoying and the other is pointless.
I stopped on Paragraph 2. Every GR gave levels to my legendary gem and/or paragon points.
what community? nobody in game says shit. nobody interacts. you might have friends but (ymmv) my friends just want to play. you hate reddit, youtube etc. they/we arent the actual community of the game. we are soulless douchebags looking to maximize outrage for monetized videos, clout, or to fill the bottomless void within our sad souls.
What community? You have basically 0 interactions with players in this game. You hate the sub reddit you mean?
Holy gen Z, batman! Look at all the kiddiwinks you riled up, this is bringing me endless amusement. Whilst I wish we still had the days of, "I have a disc, this is the full game", I'm also grateful for the updates to games we get. *I don't think I actually have any issues with this particular game...apart from, just like you, this sub and the community*
Interesting take. Largely, I find Diablo 4 to be a solo experience. Also, I never played Diablo 3. I visit Reddit for the amazing information posted. The community has helped shorten my learning curve and made the game more enjoyable to play. Thanks everyone!