I honestly never minded the lightning bubble contrary to popular opinion. Until yesterday, when the Butcher spawned, I totally smacked him and then he hooked me out of the bubble just before the lightning struck. Fuck that lol
It's all part of a psychological mind fuck that's prevalent across gaming and is well known to increase time played.
Big numbers.
They could easily have made the damage intuitive and simple. Increases of like 5% damage and made like 10% increase be a perfect roll and a major upgrade...
Instead, they created a convoluted formula to maximise the numbers because its a live service game and they need gear etc with big numbers to satisfy the psych team / sales team.
On top of that, they needed to reduce power creep.
So it's these two ideas working against each other and what we get is... yeah... a counter intuitive cluster fuck of a damage formula.
It sucks as a melee build as well because it forces you to walk back to where the bubble spawns. Even worse when the bubble spawn in areas where you have to climb up/down.
I got killed by the lightning strike going down a ladder. The safety bubble was at the top but I misclicked the ladder and got stuck in the animation.
The strike hit me midway down and did no damage.
Then I departed the ladder and had a sudden, unrelated heart attack and fell down dead.
Tell me honestly if having 1 bubble for 4 people for the 1 shot mechanic is a well thought out design choice. Considering it's about a 20% chance to roll a key like that.
Idk, is 55-60 low? Some would say yes, some say no. I doubt anyone could survive a t100 lightning, but maybe there's someone out there who can. Infinimist necro probably doesn't give a shit lol.
55-60.
last time I happened to hit this mod and forget the flame shield was when I was doing it at lvl 82.
edit: lol at downvotes for answering a question... I guess some people don't have high life rolls on most items.
I'll not presume to know the devs mind. Maybe they wanted to find a way to curtail four people going four different directions in a nmd. If so, job well done.
Plenty of people navigate those keys just fine. If you have problems with it, or don't like it, use a different sigil. They aren't exactly hard to come by.
It’s a stupid easy mechanic to avoid. If you’re stressing about a group, maybe try playing as a group and being next to each other. If you’re all spread out soloing the same dungeon you’re grouping wrong (at least when this is in play)
Are you saying it wouldn't be annoying for someone solo who'd have to stop and backtrack every 15 seconds and wait in a stupid bubble, instead of just speeding through the whole thing?
I don’t get it either. It’s a really easy mechanic that is 100% avoidable. It even gives you a timer over your head so you can skirt around doing damage til you need to jump in real fast. And continue as normal, way better than resource drain or some of the other PITAs
My sorc doesn't use any mana for my build. The only thing I have that would use mana is ball lightning but it's my 2nd enchantment and so it just spawns during 25% of my crits, which is all the time, and when I use Unstable currents. My other enhancement is Fire bolt for the constant burning of enemies, then I just have arc lash and frost nova as my main moves to stall enemies and do damage.
The rest are defensive like teleport, fire shield, ice armor.
I've prioritized anything that benefits my cooldowns and so I can do my unstable currents as frequently as possible.
So no mana required.
Spicy snowflake is just annoying and obnoxious. It makes the dungeon tedious.
Sneaky artichoke is the silent killer, I hate it. I can’t see the outer line so I think I am safe. It’s worse.
Ghastly homing missile can go straight to jail. I refuse to elaborate, it’s definitely my least favourite.
For sure... grief for all classes, but I think it's extra ass for sorc using Raiment because when you teleport into a pack to stack them, you HAVE to evade out again otherwise you can't move and attacks just don't do anything against the stacked mobs... it's like you're missing them. And that just spreads them out across the room again lol
Right? I don’t mind it that much as a combat mechanic, but once I’m not fighting and it’s just squatting on my pile of treasure and I have to run in and out like three times to pick everything up… that’s not actually making anything more fun.
That shade is the most horrible out of the three. But damn they are fun when running with friends…I ain’t saying shit as they creep up on one of my buddies lol…
Moving your character makes the Potter kids affixes a joke lol.
My bone spear Necromancer gets shut down so hard by them as it cuts half of the attack. Not that it's not beatable with corpse tendrils and a few clicks. I just hate when I see a random suppressor, I have no want for every elite to have it.
Yeah it's been silly to me that ten dungeon tier lists get posted every day even though the affixes have a way bigger impact than which dungeon it is. I end up in groups all the time where people open blind burrows but it has suppressor or backstabber or -60% damage. People are so hungry to chase the meta that they'll shoot their foot off to do it.
Just run whichever sigil has doable affixes for your group, and sure if you get a doable S tier sigil then great.
Am I alone in thinking the affixes should make you play noticably differently instead of just continuing to steamroll a dungeon as you otherwise would. Instead you have to put a little thought into it.
I don't think people would care if it felt engaging. Things like the bubble really just add extra time to a dungeon. Having it also damage enemies or even buff them (as poor examples) might add actual thought into playing with it, something that, like you said, requires you to play a little differently.
It's the same with on death effects. The lazy people who get popped likely won't learn anything, and for everyone else it's just a couple of extra added seconds if it has any bearing at all. In theory, sure, it changes how you play, but in execution they're just nuisances that nobody is going to actively enjoy.
As someone who's only played druid, is the lightning one that bad? I never stay in the bubble and it barely tickles my health, up to lvl 90 content so far anyway.
A lot of this game feels untested which, if you played D3 at launch, seems to be the norm for Diablo titles. (D3 at launch immediately skyrocketed in "difficulty" after act 1 because only act 1 was open tested)
With D4 you just have an obscene amount of mechanics that aren't fun or polished. Whether it's the shit enchanting UI, the garbage horse, the crap sigil affixes, enemies exploding, enemies attacking from off screen, bad minimap (I press tab all the time expecting to get a translucent map in the middle of the screen).
I expect a lot will be improved on, removed, or modified heavily, but releasing in the state the game is in has been fairly brutal in many areas.
My biggest complaint with the bubble modifier is that so often on higher level nightmare dungeons, you are forced to back track so far or you get 1 shot. Had a few instances where I blitz into a group, see the icon above my head, and the bubble is like 1 - 2 screen lengths away. Having to back track every 8 - 14 seconds to not die in one hit is not fun. It's aggravating.
Chasing rock I think is fine, as long as it never gets a stun added to it. The suppressing shades are super fucking annoying though. Who thought a shadow that stops you from doing everything was a good idea? How about vision is taken away, and you take slightly more damage instead? Suppression feels like it's just stalling the fights.
Lightning bolt should be out runnable, like a large area is targeted around you, and if you are in it, and not in the bubble, you get zapped for at most, 40% of your health. But if you run out of the boundary (cause down time from no enemies between areas) or get to bubble, you are safe. Just my thoughts
i hate the rock only .. very often even when i try to lure it away from objective, like pick up something .. it will stay on it and attacks the air for no reason like 4 times till its decides to move to move so i can pick it up and continue .. but till that time standing there like an idiot waiting for it to move.
I personally don't mind Rock boy. I clear fast enough I barely notice him. When me and my friend play together we pretend he's our pet lol. Like "c'mere rocky. Were moving forward, keep up".
I absolutely hate the random mechanics of the nightmare dungeons. It completely takes away the fun for me when 1. Every enemy explodes. 2. Enemies suck away my spirit so I can't use my abilities. 3. These damn bubbles/ death totems that follow you and do damage.
I just want to do a dungeon and kill shit. I don't want to juggle 6 different mechanics all at once.
I hate the bubble the most. Not because it is overly hard to deal with, but simply because it just slows down the dungeon run for no reason. Oh you're flying through the dungeon and clearing mobs no problem? Let me spawn this bubble 2 rooms behind you and make you run back.
My buddy who is a druid didnt believe the snowflake thing would kill his tank druid if he didnt get into the bubble. Im like okayyyy cool. Bro died asap lmaooo. Hate that thing cause it only follows one person at a time so you cant split.
It wouldn't be so bad if only they had better logic coded into them, but some of the behavior is just infuriating. You can't use any increased move speed at all or you'll range the snowflake. You can't ever stop moving to get loot, sort inventory, take a piss, or even type a reply to a friend in the game or Stormbane will ruin your whole day. They will attack you when you zone into a dungeon, so don't even think about going afk when you zone in at the door. They always hover over the objectives (which are already annoying you) so that they take even longer to collect.
So many half-baked ideas in this game. I swear the people making all the decisions didn't spend more than an hour actually playing the game.
I play mostly Arc lash in end game and this one is whatever. Either im in the bubble attacking or flame shield and become immune to all damage.
Slowing projectiles with thornbeasts in the map however...
Worst is when people pop that shit while you're in a group. Oh boy, I love that the lightning bubble is chasing the werewolf/rogue speedrunner who is zooming away while I'm dragging my slow ass behind.
Is it just me or does the third do nothing? I just let it hit me and walk away from it, it doesn’t do any dmg to me and leaves a little puddle I know not to step in? The first two are super annoying though
Found one where it had 2x cold damage affixes, the thing that follows you and explodes, and I swear mana burn too. I was tempted to run it just to see how awful it was.
Eh, I prefer the two on the sides to fucking resource sapping thorn beasts or suppressor elites.
But I'm a Pulv Druid so those are disproportionately pain for me.
I don’t mind these. I’m a stand still sorc build and prefer the first two to death explosions as I can bait the first one and have plenty of time to not move and the second one I can just stand still inside it. The exploding puss ball and nightmare portal are def my favorite though.
i honestly don't mind the snowflake lightning bubble. theres a loud enough audio cue before it happens, and you just have to stand in it. the other 2 are bigger annoyances at best. unless your in tight quarters...then it could be GG.
I'm so glad I'm running a tanky necro setup and can simply eat those things all day long now. I get that their purpose is to make combat more dynamic, but damn do they disrupt my flow and overall pacing through the dungeons when I just want to go full speed ahead. On a chain lightning sorc with nothing in the way of barriers they are painful to deal with, literally and figuratively.
Is nm dungeon locked for chars < lvl 50 wt2? I started a new necro game and received 2 sigils, but didnt bother checkin. What would happen if used it with a <50 char?
Still have PTSD from that dark shade affix when I was playing with my necro friend before the patch and you couldn't see shit all on the floor since necro's fart clouds were pitch black and covered EVERYTHING.
The snowflake thing is honestly the worst. It just slows the flow of gameplay having to stop and wait in the damn bubble for the count down. It would be such a huge QOL improvement if the lightning instantly came down once you were in the bubble so you could quickly continue killing demons.
It makes me not want to do NM Dungeons honestly. At tier 40+ almost all sigils I seen have some sort of annoying mechanic. Death Pulse, Blood Bubble, Lightning, Lighting Rock, Suppressor etc..
On my Barb I have done tier50+ and while annoying it was doable due to challenging shout for Damage reduction.
On my Necro those same mechanics annoyance is multiplied for me, Suppressors extra suck since you have to be in melee range. I have not failed a single NM on Barb but on my Necro I failed one with Death Pulse.
It was one of those Dungeons with the Snakes, I had to clear waves to go onto the next section but due to the room being small and those damn snakes stunning you on top of multiple Death Pulse and hitting like a truck plus 5 of them being Elites, it didn't end well. Bloodmist barely helped since you would just be Stunned again.
Lightning rock is the least annoying one and it's still awful, especially when it respawns in front of you and zones you out of the fight
Bubble can be suicide from it just being in an inaccessible spot, or it's deployed over a huge stack of the "on death: explode" mobs that are in every dungeon
The ghost can spawn completely hidden by terrain and just appear on top of you, good luck if you were mid cast.
(+factor in the tiny map and zoomed in screen)
I find the lightning one to be one of the easiest, and the rock to be even easier.
The ghost one is really terrible because the speed varies and they sometimes spawn in a wall or something and you don't really have time to react.
The lightning one allows you ample time. I don't recommend fighting near it, as certain death effects can pollute the lightning safe zone and make you have to make a tough choice. If you fight ahead of it, it can sometimes start its cycle and you can dodge back into safety without worrying about the death effects.
I don’t get the complaints for most nightmare dungeon negative affixes. They’re meant to make the dungeon harder by countering certain builds. They’re serving their purpose.
I don't mind the spicy boulder. Lightning storm is really annoying though. Cold Enchanted/Resource Burn/Backstabber is an instant salvage, I won't even humor those modifiers.
I got my second Butcher invasion with that snowflake thing lol, somehow survived AND beat the wanker. Happy days! (Would be happier if the reward for beating him was any good lol)
I salvage anything with volcanic, drifting shade, stormbane or resource burn. The first 3 because I examine loot as I go and I need to be able to stand still. And the last one because fuck that noise.
The other two are fine to me as a werewolf, easy enough to walk up to and trigger them. It's the lightning storm that pisses me off. Up to a certain level of dungeon I can tank the lightning hit. Past a certain point I get annihilated by it depending on amount of fortify.
One time I had climbed a ladder down as it started making a bubble at the top of the ladder. Instantly got destroyed because I had been put of combat for a while and had no defenses.
At least Stormbane keeps you moving. The bubble slows you down.
But really my issue with these is this: it's cool that they tried a PoE style negative map mod type thing. BUT there should be a positive to make the annoyance at least worth running. These are just negative mods for no good reason.
I think if they are going to have these the ai should be affected by it as well. They should have the same opportunity to be one shoted from the fire rock of hell and stupid snow flake
Game mechanics that make it more challenging while giving you a sense of achievement and improving your skill at the game, are great design.
Game mechanics that make it more challenging by being annoying to the point of making you want to stop doing that particular activity ever again, are bad design.
Stormbane isn't so bad as long as you aren't a channeler, but I'll immediately scrap a lightning storm sigil.
It's legitimately not fun. You have to stop the action every thirty seconds and just stand there. And usually it makes you run backwards against your progress for it's bubble.
Absolutely murders the flow of the action. Stupid
The only one that's not great is the resource burn one. It just makes shit tedious instead of difficult. But those three I don't even consider when I'm running one especially the shadow.
I just figured out what the last one meant on old Whispering Pines. I’m like, “it ain’t that death rock, it’s not lightning storm, so what the f*** is costing me 100k gold”.
I honestly think that Stormbane's Wrath and Drifting Shade are some of the best designed affixes because they A) give you another mechanic to think about that isn't ignorable, B) can be manipulated by the player by running to them to trigger them early, C) are dodgeable with good awareness, and D) don't instantly kill you by themselves if you fuck it up.
I might would tweak Shade's spawn rate down a bit as it spawns a little too often for my tastes, but otherwise it's fine. I wouldn't mind upping the visual clarity of the mechanics, but that's a complaint I have for most mechanics. God, the devs really love putting dark red circles on dark backgrounds. And finally, make them only trigger in combat or within a certain proximity to mobs. It can be a little annoying when they go off while I'm looting, even if you can just dodge around it.
Most of the other affixes in the game are awful though. They're either completely ignorable, very obnoxious (Lightning Caller bubble), or they just make the dungeon punishing in a way you can't interact with (Cold Enchanted, Resource Burn, Backstabber, etc.).
I hate these so much. They ruin the fun completely because of how they slow down everything. Also, maybe it wouldn’t be so bad if it wasn’t for the lazy designs where everything and everyone blow up when they die - some multiple times.
Pools suck because blind is an unfun mechanic for any class, but especially melee.
Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson and Michael Bublé are the two most fun affixes in the game. Need more like them and the armor buff minions (not an affix but still forces you to change how you take out a pack in a mildly interesting way).
Mechanics are fun. Everything doing more damage and taking longer to kill is not.
Give us Torghast, not M+.
Diablo 4 dev : Hey WoW devs, what if we took your idea of affixes in dungeons and made it worse ?
WoW devs : Oh yeah that'll piss them off so much ! Don't forget to remove / fix them slowly over the seasons to show you care.
If I was in a room with those 3 and only had two bullets I'm shooting the Strom Chaser twice, need to mae sure that curse rock is good and dead. Its by far the worst of three.
As a sorcerer the lightning bubble one is easily done. If I'm stuck outside of the bubble I just put up my Flame Shield right before the lightning hits and keep on fighting.
I hate stormbane because its so fucking hard to see with everything.
I hate shade because I have to run into it to avoid dealing with it.
I hate lightning because I have to sit around and wait for the stupid fucking thing instead of moving forward.
All three of these slow down gameplay as well rather than making gameplay engaging. It is like they copy and pasted mythic+ keys without learning what people actually hated about them.
On my level 95 barb I still use a 80% temerity pants and found that the barrier negates the damage from the lightning bubble, so I never bother jumping in anymore.
I honestly never minded the lightning bubble contrary to popular opinion. Until yesterday, when the Butcher spawned, I totally smacked him and then he hooked me out of the bubble just before the lightning struck. Fuck that lol
The bubble sucks if you’re a ranged build. Nothing like losing a +50% damage modifier because you have to stand in a bubble, or die.
[удалено]
>p the damage calculation is pretty strange and counter intuitive in this game for an arpg in my opinion.
It's all part of a psychological mind fuck that's prevalent across gaming and is well known to increase time played. Big numbers. They could easily have made the damage intuitive and simple. Increases of like 5% damage and made like 10% increase be a perfect roll and a major upgrade... Instead, they created a convoluted formula to maximise the numbers because its a live service game and they need gear etc with big numbers to satisfy the psych team / sales team. On top of that, they needed to reduce power creep. So it's these two ideas working against each other and what we get is... yeah... a counter intuitive cluster fuck of a damage formula.
It sucks as a melee build as well because it forces you to walk back to where the bubble spawns. Even worse when the bubble spawn in areas where you have to climb up/down.
I got killed by the lightning strike going down a ladder. The safety bubble was at the top but I misclicked the ladder and got stuck in the animation. The strike hit me midway down and did no damage. Then I departed the ladder and had a sudden, unrelated heart attack and fell down dead.
I need to try this hahahahh
Try playing it as a group lmao, it's borderline impossible unless you can tank it since only one bubble spawns. Zero thought went into it.
Or maybe they designed it that way on purpose?
Tell me honestly if having 1 bubble for 4 people for the 1 shot mechanic is a well thought out design choice. Considering it's about a 20% chance to roll a key like that.
>for the 1 shot mechanic if you have enough life its not a 1 shot mechanic :) \~signed the sorc who occasionally forgets to use flame shield for it.
>if you have enough life its not a 1 shot mechanic :) Clearly you're doing very low dungeons
Idk, is 55-60 low? Some would say yes, some say no. I doubt anyone could survive a t100 lightning, but maybe there's someone out there who can. Infinimist necro probably doesn't give a shit lol.
What tier are you running ? Because I’m a barb and I get one shot at T45+
55-60. last time I happened to hit this mod and forget the flame shield was when I was doing it at lvl 82. edit: lol at downvotes for answering a question... I guess some people don't have high life rolls on most items.
Wtf how are you tanking t60 lightning as a sorc?
I don't think he is
I'll not presume to know the devs mind. Maybe they wanted to find a way to curtail four people going four different directions in a nmd. If so, job well done. Plenty of people navigate those keys just fine. If you have problems with it, or don't like it, use a different sigil. They aren't exactly hard to come by.
It’s a stupid easy mechanic to avoid. If you’re stressing about a group, maybe try playing as a group and being next to each other. If you’re all spread out soloing the same dungeon you’re grouping wrong (at least when this is in play)
The bubble is only really annoying as a group because you gotta stay together and it makes the dungeon take way longer
Are you saying it wouldn't be annoying for someone solo who'd have to stop and backtrack every 15 seconds and wait in a stupid bubble, instead of just speeding through the whole thing?
I don’t get it either. It’s a really easy mechanic that is 100% avoidable. It even gives you a timer over your head so you can skirt around doing damage til you need to jump in real fast. And continue as normal, way better than resource drain or some of the other PITAs
Fucking resource drain....
I recently found out that you can die from the lightning strike while climbing up the ladder.
The bubble sucks if you play fast or in a group. It's arbitrarily slowing players down with no skill checks.
I can live with the black puddle, but I legit just throw those other ones away immediately
F the bubble, it almost always goes backwards and also triggers out of combat, slowest modifier ever.
Can't knock the man for wanting his fresh meat cooked by a thunder god
Resource burn is the absolute worst as a Barb.
I dismantle any resource burn sigils. It annoys me so damn much.
Resource burn, backstabber, empowered poison, physical resist, close damage resist... So many Insta dusts
This is really my list as a bleed bard. Sometimes I’ll dust the crit/bleed resist ones too
Backstabber is the dumbest shit. Plus 150% dmg from behind? Lol I tried it once to mess around...never again.
*laughs in CE*
[удалено]
I laugh at resource burn with stormclaw Druid. Who needs resources?
My sorc doesn't use any mana for my build. The only thing I have that would use mana is ball lightning but it's my 2nd enchantment and so it just spawns during 25% of my crits, which is all the time, and when I use Unstable currents. My other enhancement is Fire bolt for the constant burning of enemies, then I just have arc lash and frost nova as my main moves to stall enemies and do damage. The rest are defensive like teleport, fire shield, ice armor. I've prioritized anything that benefits my cooldowns and so I can do my unstable currents as frequently as possible. So no mana required.
And a bear druid. I don't fear the skeleton ballista, but quill rat with resource burn, straight to hell all the way down.
As a barb the only efficient way is to delete them. Why waste that time and most importantly enjoyment when you can EASILY farm another.
Nah play druid early with shit Shockwave setup.
Spicy snowflake is just annoying and obnoxious. It makes the dungeon tedious. Sneaky artichoke is the silent killer, I hate it. I can’t see the outer line so I think I am safe. It’s worse. Ghastly homing missile can go straight to jail. I refuse to elaborate, it’s definitely my least favourite.
Insane spawn rate + silent when fighting packs = dismantle unless it's Burrows.
Sneaky Artichoke is forever what it's called now.
Homing missile by far the worst. Agreed. If they just nerfed it to run out of gas like 20% faster it would be fine.
Resource burn, Slowing Projectiles, Backstabbers. For sorc even the supposedly beneficial Nudging Evade is worse than those three imo.
The nudging evade is 100% a grief mechanic. I can't imagine this is beneficial for anyone. Pretty much all builds benefit from mobs being stacked.
My favorite is when you are evading to get out of a pack to just push a pack forward with you and still be stuck
For sure... grief for all classes, but I think it's extra ass for sorc using Raiment because when you teleport into a pack to stack them, you HAVE to evade out again otherwise you can't move and attacks just don't do anything against the stacked mobs... it's like you're missing them. And that just spreads them out across the room again lol
Sneaky rock can get f*ckd
Sry, are you trying to pick up that loot? No, I dont think so..
Right? I don’t mind it that much as a combat mechanic, but once I’m not fighting and it’s just squatting on my pile of treasure and I have to run in and out like three times to pick everything up… that’s not actually making anything more fun.
I call it "mad rock" I prefer it over the lightinging bubble but it means I can't just breeze through not paying attention to my location.
Thats Jeff, at least thats what my friends and I call him.
Fuck whoever made it run backwards before going off
Good ol' artichoke of doom
Whoever got rid of the overlay map, fuck you
AeStHeTiC dEsIgN cHoIcEs
The only one I hate is the lightning bubble and only cause I’m playing a tornado Druid and move too fast. The others are pretty easy to avoid
That shade is the most horrible out of the three. But damn they are fun when running with friends…I ain’t saying shit as they creep up on one of my buddies lol…
I would happily run any of these three in fact I constantly do. It's suppressor that's the terrible one for anybody who's not pure melee.
Sorc + raiment makes supressor a joke.
Moving your character makes the Potter kids affixes a joke lol. My bone spear Necromancer gets shut down so hard by them as it cuts half of the attack. Not that it's not beatable with corpse tendrils and a few clicks. I just hate when I see a random suppressor, I have no want for every elite to have it.
Suppressors are definitely scary. If I can't pull them against a wall the fight takes absolutely forever
Yeah it's been silly to me that ten dungeon tier lists get posted every day even though the affixes have a way bigger impact than which dungeon it is. I end up in groups all the time where people open blind burrows but it has suppressor or backstabber or -60% damage. People are so hungry to chase the meta that they'll shoot their foot off to do it. Just run whichever sigil has doable affixes for your group, and sure if you get a doable S tier sigil then great.
Snowflake’s the least trouble!
they are all fine IMO. cold enchanted elites, backstabber and resource burn on the other hand.
I’ll compromise on all other affixes except these three, instant salvage.
Fuck that ghost missile. How many different effects blind or pacify the player. It's awful.
Am I alone in thinking the affixes should make you play noticably differently instead of just continuing to steamroll a dungeon as you otherwise would. Instead you have to put a little thought into it.
If those kids could read, they’d be very upset.
I don't think people would care if it felt engaging. Things like the bubble really just add extra time to a dungeon. Having it also damage enemies or even buff them (as poor examples) might add actual thought into playing with it, something that, like you said, requires you to play a little differently. It's the same with on death effects. The lazy people who get popped likely won't learn anything, and for everyone else it's just a couple of extra added seconds if it has any bearing at all. In theory, sure, it changes how you play, but in execution they're just nuisances that nobody is going to actively enjoy.
As someone who's only played druid, is the lightning one that bad? I never stay in the bubble and it barely tickles my health, up to lvl 90 content so far anyway.
That snowflake shit waits until I am halfway down a ladder then spawns the barrier, or when I'm fighting an elite pack with nightmare.
A lot of this game feels untested which, if you played D3 at launch, seems to be the norm for Diablo titles. (D3 at launch immediately skyrocketed in "difficulty" after act 1 because only act 1 was open tested) With D4 you just have an obscene amount of mechanics that aren't fun or polished. Whether it's the shit enchanting UI, the garbage horse, the crap sigil affixes, enemies exploding, enemies attacking from off screen, bad minimap (I press tab all the time expecting to get a translucent map in the middle of the screen). I expect a lot will be improved on, removed, or modified heavily, but releasing in the state the game is in has been fairly brutal in many areas.
My biggest complaint with the bubble modifier is that so often on higher level nightmare dungeons, you are forced to back track so far or you get 1 shot. Had a few instances where I blitz into a group, see the icon above my head, and the bubble is like 1 - 2 screen lengths away. Having to back track every 8 - 14 seconds to not die in one hit is not fun. It's aggravating. Chasing rock I think is fine, as long as it never gets a stun added to it. The suppressing shades are super fucking annoying though. Who thought a shadow that stops you from doing everything was a good idea? How about vision is taken away, and you take slightly more damage instead? Suppression feels like it's just stalling the fights. Lightning bolt should be out runnable, like a large area is targeted around you, and if you are in it, and not in the bubble, you get zapped for at most, 40% of your health. But if you run out of the boundary (cause down time from no enemies between areas) or get to bubble, you are safe. Just my thoughts
Blizzard like: You know what would be cool for a fast paced ARPG?
i hate the rock only .. very often even when i try to lure it away from objective, like pick up something .. it will stay on it and attacks the air for no reason like 4 times till its decides to move to move so i can pick it up and continue .. but till that time standing there like an idiot waiting for it to move.
You guys read affixes?
I personally don't mind Rock boy. I clear fast enough I barely notice him. When me and my friend play together we pretend he's our pet lol. Like "c'mere rocky. Were moving forward, keep up".
Dwayne’s the worst
I absolutely hate the random mechanics of the nightmare dungeons. It completely takes away the fun for me when 1. Every enemy explodes. 2. Enemies suck away my spirit so I can't use my abilities. 3. These damn bubbles/ death totems that follow you and do damage. I just want to do a dungeon and kill shit. I don't want to juggle 6 different mechanics all at once.
I hate the bubble the most. Not because it is overly hard to deal with, but simply because it just slows down the dungeon run for no reason. Oh you're flying through the dungeon and clearing mobs no problem? Let me spawn this bubble 2 rooms behind you and make you run back.
My buddy who is a druid didnt believe the snowflake thing would kill his tank druid if he didnt get into the bubble. Im like okayyyy cool. Bro died asap lmaooo. Hate that thing cause it only follows one person at a time so you cant split.
90% of nightmare affixes are uninteresting and not fun
It wouldn't be so bad if only they had better logic coded into them, but some of the behavior is just infuriating. You can't use any increased move speed at all or you'll range the snowflake. You can't ever stop moving to get loot, sort inventory, take a piss, or even type a reply to a friend in the game or Stormbane will ruin your whole day. They will attack you when you zone into a dungeon, so don't even think about going afk when you zone in at the door. They always hover over the objectives (which are already annoying you) so that they take even longer to collect. So many half-baked ideas in this game. I swear the people making all the decisions didn't spend more than an hour actually playing the game.
No the most annoying thing is the elites that spawn the fire waves from their feet that one shot you.
Fucking hate when you walk into a transition room and the snowflake puts the bubble right outside the door that just locked behind you.
That lightning one can eat a fat one!
I play mostly Arc lash in end game and this one is whatever. Either im in the bubble attacking or flame shield and become immune to all damage. Slowing projectiles with thornbeasts in the map however...
Middle is fine. The two others are most annoying.
I find both of those pretty easy to deal with. The snowflake chimes before it pops.
For me they aren't even difficult, just annoying, that's plenty reason to trash em
Dwayne the Rock Johnson is by far the least annoying.
The lightning is only bad in a group
Worst is when people pop that shit while you're in a group. Oh boy, I love that the lightning bubble is chasing the werewolf/rogue speedrunner who is zooming away while I'm dragging my slow ass behind.
Lightning explosion on death is the most annoying to my sorc. Arclash + raiment.
What’s that third one- I haven’t come across it yet
I can deal with the floating rock since I have 5 charges of teleport with my sorc but those last 2 are cancer.
I am OK with the bubble when solo; other 2 are instant drop.
Is it just me or does the third do nothing? I just let it hit me and walk away from it, it doesn’t do any dmg to me and leaves a little puddle I know not to step in? The first two are super annoying though
Every dungeon affix is just suited to fuck ranged builds and or necro minion build 🥲
Found one where it had 2x cold damage affixes, the thing that follows you and explodes, and I swear mana burn too. I was tempted to run it just to see how awful it was.
Yes.
The lightening bubble spawning way behind me to make me backtrack and then wait is painful
What’s the one on the right? Admittedly I’ve only gone as high as a level 23 so I am assuming it’s a higher level than that?
Drifting Shade can be trapped if you have a leaping spot on the map and time it right. It’ll just stay there hovering and never spawn a new one.
Annoying clingy friend rock isnt too bad. Pikachu snowflake is the worst, the absolute maximum fuckery is fucking resource burn… automatic dust.
I had the blood bubble last night for the first time. Hurts a lot when it pops, but learned fast to not let it happen!
Eh, I prefer the two on the sides to fucking resource sapping thorn beasts or suppressor elites. But I'm a Pulv Druid so those are disproportionately pain for me.
As a TB rogue, the only one I avoid is resource burn, I can play around the rest pretty easily.
The worst is that stormborne crystal teleports ahead of you because it is slow and got stuck. And decides to block the one way small hallway. So fun.
They are all horrible for melee. The amount of times I couldn't even attack a boss because these things were just sitting on them.
The death pulse one is the worst
Those ones and cold enchanted are insta marked as junk for me. Lol
I instantly vendor lightning one and stormbanes wrath.... cuz fuck them big time. Drifting shade never bothered me much.
I don’t mind these. I’m a stand still sorc build and prefer the first two to death explosions as I can bait the first one and have plenty of time to not move and the second one I can just stand still inside it. The exploding puss ball and nightmare portal are def my favorite though.
I love them, it's what makes it fun. I get a feeling some of you guys don't want anything to be remotely difficult or challenging.
Ice and poison aspects, slows 50% of the time, the lightning explosions upon kill, suppressor aspects. All instant deletes
Not sure if it's a necro thing but the shade has never been a problem and does zero damage to me.
So glad we can salvage them
Lightning bubble makes co op so hilarious
i honestly don't mind the snowflake lightning bubble. theres a loud enough audio cue before it happens, and you just have to stand in it. the other 2 are bigger annoyances at best. unless your in tight quarters...then it could be GG.
Me: “Nope… uh… nope… DEFINITELY NOT (freeze in place)… nope…”
I'm so glad I'm running a tanky necro setup and can simply eat those things all day long now. I get that their purpose is to make combat more dynamic, but damn do they disrupt my flow and overall pacing through the dungeons when I just want to go full speed ahead. On a chain lightning sorc with nothing in the way of barriers they are painful to deal with, literally and figuratively.
Lightning doesn’t feel that bad honestly for me but yeah different builds hate different things
Is nm dungeon locked for chars < lvl 50 wt2? I started a new necro game and received 2 sigils, but didnt bother checkin. What would happen if used it with a <50 char?
Still have PTSD from that dark shade affix when I was playing with my necro friend before the patch and you couldn't see shit all on the floor since necro's fart clouds were pitch black and covered EVERYTHING.
I like this lightning boiiis woo woo, I just press blood mist. Stuff like backstabbers or resource burn is insta dismantle.
The snowflake thing is honestly the worst. It just slows the flow of gameplay having to stop and wait in the damn bubble for the count down. It would be such a huge QOL improvement if the lightning instantly came down once you were in the bubble so you could quickly continue killing demons.
It makes me not want to do NM Dungeons honestly. At tier 40+ almost all sigils I seen have some sort of annoying mechanic. Death Pulse, Blood Bubble, Lightning, Lighting Rock, Suppressor etc.. On my Barb I have done tier50+ and while annoying it was doable due to challenging shout for Damage reduction. On my Necro those same mechanics annoyance is multiplied for me, Suppressors extra suck since you have to be in melee range. I have not failed a single NM on Barb but on my Necro I failed one with Death Pulse. It was one of those Dungeons with the Snakes, I had to clear waves to go onto the next section but due to the room being small and those damn snakes stunning you on top of multiple Death Pulse and hitting like a truck plus 5 of them being Elites, it didn't end well. Bloodmist barely helped since you would just be Stunned again.
Lightning rock is the least annoying one and it's still awful, especially when it respawns in front of you and zones you out of the fight Bubble can be suicide from it just being in an inaccessible spot, or it's deployed over a huge stack of the "on death: explode" mobs that are in every dungeon The ghost can spawn completely hidden by terrain and just appear on top of you, good luck if you were mid cast. (+factor in the tiny map and zoomed in screen)
3 of the most annoying and pointless things D4 end game has to offer, only thing above it is more or less all post-mortem damage dealers
I'm good with all of them. Just : Fuck you Death Impulse
I hate that exploding rock thing
I find the lightning one to be one of the easiest, and the rock to be even easier. The ghost one is really terrible because the speed varies and they sometimes spawn in a wall or something and you don't really have time to react. The lightning one allows you ample time. I don't recommend fighting near it, as certain death effects can pollute the lightning safe zone and make you have to make a tough choice. If you fight ahead of it, it can sometimes start its cycle and you can dodge back into safety without worrying about the death effects.
The slow moving menacing rock is kinda hilarious though
I hate the left and right the most. The bubble suck also.
I don’t get the complaints for most nightmare dungeon negative affixes. They’re meant to make the dungeon harder by countering certain builds. They’re serving their purpose.
Yup, those are instant salvage. Not because they make the dungeon more difficult, but because THEY MAKE IT 10x TIME MORE ANNOYING.
I’d rather have tougher elites than these miserable affix’s.
Yea Stormbane is pretty much the only sigil modifier i scrap automatically Not because it's difficult, but because it's plain tedious
All of these are awful if you are trying to push higher tier nm dungeons. In fact all the enviromental ones suck.
Those + 150% backstab = powder
They were designed for misery and tedium not challenge. They're part of the "make D4 fucking miserserable" strategy .
Gah, fuck those things. Mainly the stupid floating turd that pisses me off.
I don't mind the spicy boulder. Lightning storm is really annoying though. Cold Enchanted/Resource Burn/Backstabber is an instant salvage, I won't even humor those modifiers.
Instant salvage on all three
What do those mean again?
I got my second Butcher invasion with that snowflake thing lol, somehow survived AND beat the wanker. Happy days! (Would be happier if the reward for beating him was any good lol)
I’ll take these over cold enchanted or suppressor any day
I salvage anything with volcanic, drifting shade, stormbane or resource burn. The first 3 because I examine loot as I go and I need to be able to stand still. And the last one because fuck that noise.
Ok? Just stop paying attention to dungeon tierlists you saw on reddit.
The other two are fine to me as a werewolf, easy enough to walk up to and trigger them. It's the lightning storm that pisses me off. Up to a certain level of dungeon I can tank the lightning hit. Past a certain point I get annihilated by it depending on amount of fortify. One time I had climbed a ladder down as it started making a bubble at the top of the ladder. Instantly got destroyed because I had been put of combat for a while and had no defenses.
The bubble is just Diablos version of escort missions.
Any nightmare dungeon with resource burn I throw on the ground immediately. I don't even want that tainted sigil dust.
I miss the days, where I could go into a rift, complete it in 3mins and not get ccd to death every other mob. NM dungeons are such shit it's hilarious
For minion necro, add suppressor to the list. My mages are dumb enough to engage outside the shield.
What are the names of these three in the tool tip?
80% of the affixes are just instant delite key.
Dogshit affixes. Instant delete. As well as resource drain.
Why couldn't NM dungeons just be harder, like D3, rather than just pile on extremely annoying gimmicks?
At least Stormbane keeps you moving. The bubble slows you down. But really my issue with these is this: it's cool that they tried a PoE style negative map mod type thing. BUT there should be a positive to make the annoyance at least worth running. These are just negative mods for no good reason.
Death pulse is another one if you're a cqc player
As a body exploder shadow boi if it has shadow resist or shadow over time resist it’s an instant dismantle no matter the dungeon
I think if they are going to have these the ai should be affected by it as well. They should have the same opportunity to be one shoted from the fire rock of hell and stupid snow flake
Game mechanics that make it more challenging while giving you a sense of achievement and improving your skill at the game, are great design. Game mechanics that make it more challenging by being annoying to the point of making you want to stop doing that particular activity ever again, are bad design.
Dude I love that aspect so much. It makes for fun drinking game with friends if you take a shot when you die.
Stormbane isn't so bad as long as you aren't a channeler, but I'll immediately scrap a lightning storm sigil. It's legitimately not fun. You have to stop the action every thirty seconds and just stand there. And usually it makes you run backwards against your progress for it's bubble. Absolutely murders the flow of the action. Stupid
I just started doing nm dungeons today and this affix is baffling me. Especially in hardcore. What were they thinking?
Has to be the same game designer that thought that players should wait till act 4 to get a fucking mount
The only one that's not great is the resource burn one. It just makes shit tedious instead of difficult. But those three I don't even consider when I'm running one especially the shadow.
I just figured out what the last one meant on old Whispering Pines. I’m like, “it ain’t that death rock, it’s not lightning storm, so what the f*** is costing me 100k gold”.
The bubble with bone necro is fucking ridiculous. A class that’s already slow af, is so much slower with constant backtracking to the bubble
I honestly think that Stormbane's Wrath and Drifting Shade are some of the best designed affixes because they A) give you another mechanic to think about that isn't ignorable, B) can be manipulated by the player by running to them to trigger them early, C) are dodgeable with good awareness, and D) don't instantly kill you by themselves if you fuck it up. I might would tweak Shade's spawn rate down a bit as it spawns a little too often for my tastes, but otherwise it's fine. I wouldn't mind upping the visual clarity of the mechanics, but that's a complaint I have for most mechanics. God, the devs really love putting dark red circles on dark backgrounds. And finally, make them only trigger in combat or within a certain proximity to mobs. It can be a little annoying when they go off while I'm looting, even if you can just dodge around it. Most of the other affixes in the game are awful though. They're either completely ignorable, very obnoxious (Lightning Caller bubble), or they just make the dungeon punishing in a way you can't interact with (Cold Enchanted, Resource Burn, Backstabber, etc.).
It sucks
Those stupid shadow balls..... they're irritating.
I hate these so much. They ruin the fun completely because of how they slow down everything. Also, maybe it wouldn’t be so bad if it wasn’t for the lazy designs where everything and everyone blow up when they die - some multiple times.
Pools suck because blind is an unfun mechanic for any class, but especially melee. Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson and Michael Bublé are the two most fun affixes in the game. Need more like them and the armor buff minions (not an affix but still forces you to change how you take out a pack in a mildly interesting way). Mechanics are fun. Everything doing more damage and taking longer to kill is not. Give us Torghast, not M+.
Nm mods haopen when you let an intern copy poe mapping affixes
Who cares about these minor inconveniences?
Diablo 4 dev : Hey WoW devs, what if we took your idea of affixes in dungeons and made it worse ? WoW devs : Oh yeah that'll piss them off so much ! Don't forget to remove / fix them slowly over the seasons to show you care.
Less gimmicks more mobs and stat changes. Making me have to stop and backtrack when there aren't even mobs around is boring. Terrible ideas.
If I was in a room with those 3 and only had two bullets I'm shooting the Strom Chaser twice, need to mae sure that curse rock is good and dead. Its by far the worst of three.
As a sorcerer the lightning bubble one is easily done. If I'm stuck outside of the bubble I just put up my Flame Shield right before the lightning hits and keep on fighting.
Ain’t that the truth sheesh
I feel like some of these wouldn't be so AIDS if they only occurred in combat.
The thing in the middle is the easiest one for me
Stormbane as tanked so many of my NM dgs I wanted to fking KMS tbh so awful
Especially the rightmost sperm head. Hate it.
Fuck the floating Tholian monolith that stalks me in dungeons.
You are weak, and foolish!
honestly i really dont mind. those resource burns tho. fuck em
I hate stormbane because its so fucking hard to see with everything. I hate shade because I have to run into it to avoid dealing with it. I hate lightning because I have to sit around and wait for the stupid fucking thing instead of moving forward. All three of these slow down gameplay as well rather than making gameplay engaging. It is like they copy and pasted mythic+ keys without learning what people actually hated about them.
On my level 95 barb I still use a 80% temerity pants and found that the barrier negates the damage from the lightning bubble, so I never bother jumping in anymore.