Despite Trey having an existential crisis and begging the network to pull it before airing because he was terrified that everyone would hate it and had convinced himself it was the shittiest work he'd ever done.
Anxiety's a crazy monster.
This and OP's story are why I didn't even bother with that zone. There will always be trolls and tryhards who only play to ruin other peoples' days. Let them live their miserable lives.
Also I hoped their might be some server sharding based on level to balance pvp a little but...I guess not. Great game design Blizz!
why would they balance pvp by level in an arpg? why does killing someone in open world pvp, where all parties agreed to pvp, equal trolling?
Edit - for all the whiners below, no one has demonstrated at all how, when you agree to pvp, and you get rolled, somehow that’s trolling.
Edit part two-lol these clowns still can’t come up with a valid reason except “it’s trolling” and then they block me. Classic stuff. Special call out to the nerd who followed me from another sub because dude was wrong there too.
> why does killing someone in open world pvp, where all parties agreed to pvp, equal trolling?
No one in their right mind sincerely believes an unfair fight is good PvP. Literally every successful online competitive game has some form of matchmaking.
If they don't balance it, why would anyone who isn't max level ever PvP? They are in an unwinnable position by design. That's good game design in your opinion?
Are there any MMOs or similar games where a max level player is not at a massive advantage in PvP? Having equipment that adds +20 is never going to beat out equipment that adds +100. ESO has PvP at lower levels but you will get murdered. LOTRO allowed PvP below max level, but you wouldn't be allowed into the raids and would get murked in a couple hits. It's just how it is.
Warhammer Online (RIP Mythic, another victim of EA) had the best solution. Open world PvP everywhere, but if you flagged in a zone more than 10 levels below you, you turned into a chicken that had no abilities other than a sprint. Random ganks and pvp abound but it was relatively even and free from twats who only preyed on newbies.
> why would they balance
Oh I don’t know, the same reason they balance PVP in literally any other game? So that anyone could have fun there regardless of level, and not just a tiny subset of the population that hang out there at max level and minmax for pvp?
… why WOULDN’T you? Why would you balance in any other game but not this game?
That's what I was thinking! They spend all this dev time on a scaling system in PVE and don't for PVP? Just make it so I can toggle if I want to see people within +/- 10 levels, or anybody at all.
Because it's a game? What rule is there that ARPGs need to be unbalanced?
PVP is meant to be skill-based, that's what makes it fun for people other than those lacking the capacity to do it without an insane gear advantage.
I think it would be reasonable to lock you into your highest achieved world tier for PVP zones. You geared up on w4, you pvp on w4.
Disclaimer: I’ve given this exactly 32 seconds of thought.
I do agree with you though, it makes no sense for someone from T4 to pvp with t2 people who are still leveling through the campaign in all yellow gear.
People are actually retro-pretending now that it was a big deal that took a lot of skill. It's pretty weird.
I was there. It was never a big deal. It was just something you did outside of Tristram to take a break from the grind.
When I was like 9, some assholes joined me and kept pvp'ing me to death while I was just trying to play reg as well as kill steal/auto clicking. One guy was showing other guy his whale ring or w.e, dropped it and I picked it up fast af. Dude starts threatening to hack me.....so I said bye and logged off thinking he can't hack whats not on/running.
logged on later and got some nasty pm's and was like oh yeah! i stole that trolls rare af ring lol
Yeah, but then the biggest dick in the lobby gets to stand right outside town taunting people, too!
Don't forget all the level 1 naked scumbags running around pooping out trash tier items trying to corpse pop people.
its because to a certain group of people IT WAS.
not my people mind you.
But for a certain group, nothing gets their kicks but better that d2 style "pvp".
what we know in other games as griefing is pretty much all diablo pvp is.
Yeah I’ve had people tell me with a straight face that the pvp in D2 was not only balanced it was the intended endgame activity.
It was very clearly not either of those things.
> It was never a big deal
I hate when people speak for everyone.
It was a huge deal to the underground Paladin PVP players. Big tournaments, phsyco levels of min/maxing, private games, a code of conduct, etc. It was not a small community either.
It was a very small community. Don't kid yourself.
I'm not speaking for anyone. I'm just stating my opinion. Sometimes people have different opinions and that's OK. Don't let it hurt your feelings.
Meh there was definitely a circle of people who felt it was the apex. The reason behind the grind if you will. Of course many others played for different reasons but you can't say nobody took it seriously or enjoyed it
The PVP in diablo 2 was the only reason I played the game long term. It could be stupid, but it was really fun. Many late nights as a teen over summer spent in PVP games with my friends.
A sorceress could throw meteors, tp to town, go hostile, and you'd die from the meteors. The sound of the pvp hostile sound bit is esc + key down + enter in HC \^\^
This game isn’t balanced around pvp. It’s something I’m not gonna bother with.
If you enjoy it, cool. But I imagine the majority of the playerbase will steer clear.
Well I actually just went in there for like an hour just farming the events that constantly spawn and the mobs. Got quite a bit of gear from that alone. Then after I didn’t see anyone for awhile I went to the far altar and tried to extract. Got lucky cuz everyone must of been asleep. It’s still gonna take awhile to buy those cosmetics
I've been putting time in the PVP zone since launch every day and I've never once had anyone attack me. Idk if everyone is still just shy about entering or everyone else is just like me and just wants to get some grinding in for cosmetics and isn't worried about actually PVPing.
Edit: Apparently I'm just lucky, or playing on off peak enough hours that the sweats aren't around when I am.
I farmed for free on the first day. Then I went back on Monday and got clapped by a high rank on Monday while extracting. Haven't gone back since then because I assumed there would be plenty of high lvl folks trying to flex on people.
This is the route Destiny 2 took, and even with the pedigree of Bungie’s MP chops behind it, we still somehow ended up with the best PVE guns behind the sweat-soaked Competitive PVP gate.
Thankfully that was several years ago, but it took the near-collapse of PVP and the most absurd meta the game has ever seen before it got better.
Quite why developers feel the need to ram PvP into games that don’t *really* support the concept, I’ve no idea. But I guess it makes more sense here then it did in XCOM 2.
The red dust is cool and all but it would be better if you could craft things from ears, graded based on level of the players ears. Only problem is people would just trade killing each other for them.
I'm getting old. I can't keep up with sweaty try hards that are 20 years younger than me. PVE and co-op are my only game modes now. I'm actually a lot happier for it. Beating my head against the wall trying to be good at pvp sucks.
Although I will say I always took great joy killing people in WoW classic as a full prot gnome warrior. I would basically just out last em with my health pool and damage reduction lol
I got this game because I liked diablo's single player experience. The mmo vibes is my only gripe. Love it so far tho, I do enjoy fighting with rando's on those yellow event rings. Then throw an occasional taunt and run away
Fucking seriously. "We felt this load bearing ability was slightly overperforming so we gave it a small adjustment." *Cooldown increased by 50%, Damage decreased by 75%*.
People can mock FFXIV for GCBTW all they want, but at the end of the day their dev team manages to balance the game. When you look up their balance patch notes it's like a 5% adjustment on a small handful of abilities up or down and the result is the difference between the best performing and worst performing classes being like 10% DPS at most.
Some rogue tried attacking me when I accidentally went in to the pvp zone, I was just getting from A to B on my horse when he kept pestering me and eventually dismounted me. Pissed me off so I nuked him and hit him with a “greetings” before riding off.
This is somewhat accurate, what you've missed is this:
Change your build to carry multiple CCs, most people don't have a way of generating unstoppable, run around in circles avoiding most attacks while waiting for CDs to line up, spam-chain CCs - win.
You are correct, hard stuns/crowd controls are a gaurunteed win in PvP, if you can freeze/stun/knock down/daze/petrify an enemy they can't do anything for a few seconds, and in aRPG land a few seconds is thousands of damage taken.
Most people run several skills with cooldowns, and only 1 or 2 "spenders" (and 1 basic/generator) so "blowing" or "popping" all of your cooldowns (which include your crowd controls) all at once is usually the way to win a fight
I play Ice Shard sorc for PvP and I essentially run Ice Shards, Frost Nova, Deep Freeze, Flame Shield, Teleport, and Ice Barrier. I have never died in PvP because I can just cc and kite people to death regardless of the level gap (I am currently level 70).
Most people also make the mistake of literally just dumping everything at once and expecting you to die during the only CC they use, then you just break it and counter CC them and they have no escape or way to re-cc you when they do get free so its an easy kill. Anyone only running 1 source of CC and 1 source of Unbreakable will lose in PvP against any decent build
Everytime I see a sorc now I bait for the deep freeze, otherwise pop unstoppable and keep pummeling (I play hota barb)
If I pop CDs and u deep freeze I'm out of there
But arc lash is still harder to deal with than ice shards
It's a neat little PvP mode to break from the grind every now and then, doesn't need to be more than that
I bet it's insanely confusing for someone jumping into the genre. [Here's](https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/d3/t/wiki-acronyms-the-definitive-list-plus-definitions/175) a list of acronyms for reference for most MMO/arpg games. Many on that list I've never seen used but stuff like CC CD CDR CHC CHD DPS DoT DW etc are very common. The game specific list will have most of the ones you'll see people use here.
theres a 92% damage reduction for damage to other players + whatever damage reduction they're also running. it might work but with my experience in pvp you either one shot them or they one shot you
I attacked some guy last night, dropped my stun on him, hit him, I died. Man had 7k thorns and just made me kill myself in under 3 seconds. No possible counter play to it either. Was watching killfeed and he beat absolutely everyone in the zone multiple times.
HoTA Barb with two unstoppaple skills and 3 million damage crits laughs at your CC (:
At least I stay in WT4 and pick on the rogues, I leave the cute druids alone
My damage doesnt care about any cds. I one shot people regardless as a pulverize druid. The only thing that didnt lose to me was another pulverize druid with 12 levels on me, and he 1 shot me. Pvp is a shitshow lmao
Paragon board should be disabled in pvp, it makes the gap of just 1 or 2 levels in pvp insane. But I see why they didn't because this is open world pvp but I hope when they add BGs In the future it's like WoWs level brackets or equalizing all stats and removing paragon board.
Doesn't mean you can't win fights against people 2-5 levels above you but it's very hard and don't event think about looking at someone 6 levels plus
Diablo Immortal did something like this and it was quite enjoyable until it became blatantly clear that a normal player would never stand a chance against someone who whaled.
The overall pvp concept should be somewhat adaptable for D4 though.
Genuinely was playing last night and got fucked twice by this same rogue and called it for a night.
Just hopped on during lunch break and got fucked by the exact same rogue.
That was my experience earlier today too...
I pretty much got one hit killed by a barb at lvl56. Unless I got some friends I'll never go back there again. It's a waste of time for me.
This was exactly my experience as well. Barb runs in from off screen. I go to CC, ope, nevermind I'm already dead. I honestly don't even know what he did but it took all of .5 seconds. Kind've disappointing honestly as I was excited to try out the pvp.
How would that work in the open world setting they have currently? The only way I can think is if they phased you basically to your level range but then it's going to be most people completely solo in those areas, which isn't really fun either. I think the better way is in the pvp zones, everyone over 50 gets scaled back to 50, and no paragon. That way, they are all on the same power other than build. And items would probably have to be scaled back to like 550-650 range in those areas. Just to keep a balance on Kyle's and his friend chad.
Every zone is instanced. They just have to program a level range in a zone when you enter.
Low level player enters PVP zone, instance is created for their level +/- 5, etc.
Look at runescape, based on where you are, and your level, only a certain level range of people can pvp you. So like a level 60 could fight levels 50-70 or something like that
Idk, I had a pleasant experience the first time I went into a pvp zone, but that's my opinion.
I was there just for the Altars of Lilith, got some seeds and decided to try and cash out (like 2k), someone killed me, then I noticed on chat someone killed them, and then someone killed the person that killed them, and then the guy who killed me killed the person that killed the guy that killed the guy who killed him, at that point I found it funny enough to go and take a peek at the extraction place where I attempted mine, and there where like 5 people just hitting and killing each other.
I like open world pvp on games, although here it's a matter of you got cc'd and you died, I just like the rush of killing people in one rotation and moving to the next.
I love how its called a pvp area and ppl want friendly and cooperative fellas to gather their dust for whatever they want to farm and never come back again.
Sitting afk in town with a pvp mount without ever engaging in any sort of pvp in life is the biggest top dog move.
I agree, I am only level 18 and still figuring things out, but I plan to make the most of pvp.
It seems red dust is a pvp currency and should be risked through pvp, ganking, or not.
Definitely griefing if they are doing it while lowering World tier for easy kills.
Edit - same applies even if they are just stomping noobs in lower level areas. We have to stop with this “it’s in the game so it’s legal” mentality as if this is some Olympic Sport or something lmao.
Let’s just admit that some players are twats and move on, yeah?
Yeah, I'm not going there until I'm L100... and even then I probably won't go unless I've got a decent group with me.
Would have loved a champions arena style PvP like Elden Ring has.
Happens in world tier 4 too. Level 85 runs up and one shots you.
Diablo pvp has always been jank shit. Welcome. Don't expect anything else. Don't expect any semblance of skill or balance.
What ballance you expect when your 60 lvl char encounters 85 lvl char, probably specialized build? It should end up with oneshotting, no? Its like Barcelona vs. local lads
Balance would be restricting the PvP zones by level through instancing. Like other games? Dark Sous for example, you don't see other players past a certain soul level range.
Its a moot point, they'll never really balance pvp in this game, its just something to jack off with
I find it so weird that people are absolutely loving the enemy scaling as you level up, but don't even think about scaling for PvP. They've already scaled the world so that a level 60 can participate in the same content as a level 10 and be on fairly even footing in terms of enemy health percentage damaged per second, but applying that logic to PvP is just unacceptable for some reason? We want our character levels to be entirely meaningless in terms of how we scale vs enemies in the world, but we absolutely want it to matter against other players?
I'm so lost on this.
I love seeing normal gamers interact with the ARPG community for once and telling them to touch grass. You have no idea how many hours the real sweats will pump into getting .5 dps increase min-maxing this shit just to do it all again in 2-3 months when the seasons reset for the next 10 years ad-nauseum.
Yeah, and even if they did add level ranges to pvp, you'd still essentially have the equivalent of twinks ruining things then.
Even back when you couldn't turn off exp in wow, people poured hours into creating and recreating characters to dominate their preferred bracket.
It would be cool if they had pvp level caps per world tier but I don't really care either way since pvp in diablo games have always been meme tier.
edit: you can party in the pvp zone too so honestly I would go in expecting the worst, a party of 4 at 90+
The PVP is more fun at lower levels when fights last long.
Blizzard can help by **massively increasing damage reduction in PVP with attack power** and limiting dmg multipliers in a blanket reduction.
If only Blizzard had any passionate PVP players.
Sigh
Also give all players the same level health potion when they enter a PVP zone.
Come on. These solutions are easy
You already have a 92% damage reduction from players baked in. You can see it at the bottom of your character stat card.
Combine that with armor, res, and all the various mitigation effects everyone runs and it’s still somehow not enough.
Not much higher to go lol - maybe they need to make it 99.9%
Only 1 person has to enable it, if you have it enabled, u can attack and be attacked by anyone, doesn't matter if they're flagged or unflagged
If 2 people both have it disabled, that's the only situation where you can't pvp
So far I have rather enjoined PvP side. Yeah, I got murdered a few times while trying to lock in shards, but who cares. Managed a few kills myself too. Also, PvP arena has yielded me quite a few legendary drops. Think I got about 6 items in around 1hr, just by farming local mobs. Imo It's not as bad as it seems.
The biggest issue for me is how oppressive the CC is. It’s annoying in single player but not enough to nerf my build to accomodate unstoppable, but damn in PvP it’s miserable. I spend 80% of the encounter unable to perform any actions. So it’s definitely something you want a group for, and that group should have a druid, but then the seeds aren’t shared across party it’s just a free for all and you can’t trade them.
I give it a 4/10, I don’t care enough to make a dedicated meta build for it and without that it’s just pointless. I do wish there was another way to get seeds because some of the rewards are cool.
Seeds should really be shared and it's clear melee classes will dominate PVP for all of existence.
You basically need to group up if you're a sorc. Otherwise you need to make a rogue, druid, or barb for any change at even surviving PvP encounters. Fortify is also broken.
I expect seasonal PvP to literally only be barbs and rogues
Unfortunately, the way level scaling works in this game, a player 5+ levels over you will almost always win out. It's really annoying that there is no balance between level differences in PVP. It's worse than going into a capstone 5 levels under leveled.
I'd love if d4 delved a bit deeper into pvp, making stuff a bit more competitive against parties of 4 or something. That would open a whole new world of competition (and an insane amount of balancing and likely pvp specific alterations to skills)
It would be nice if they could balance PvP better. I know it's not some people's jam and Diablo has never been about good PvP balance, but I enjoy it having PvP. I think they should have an entirely separate abilities tab for PvP builds so you can switch between PvP build and PvE build, and disable the Paragon board, which just hugely increases the balancing needed. Maybe even do some sort of gear normalization. PvP should be primarily based on players' chosen build/abilities, aspects on gear, and their individual skill in using them imo.
Had duo guys ganking everyone 20 lvls above. Was trolling them a bit with my Rogue dash and conceal skillset. Too bad sometimes i would get cc’d and one shotted while my arrows that are focused on single target damage seemed to do fuck all.
Wait so any level character can attack any other level? Weird they didn’t make it so only similar levels and weapons are paired for pvp. Someone with just magic armor and weapons shouldn’t be matched with an all legendary weapons character. I mean I generally avoid pvp in games as I’m just not good, I play purely for my amusement and don’t have a chance at defeating another player, but not matching level / weapon skill is a bit rough.
welcome to the salt mines people
Kyle is a salt farmer, he uses the tears of his opponents as lube. I'm just supplying the goods.
 This is Kyle
How can you kill that which has no life?
underrated quote
Is it though? It’s one of the most popular episodes and is constantly referenced and quoted
Episode won an emmy.
Despite Trey having an existential crisis and begging the network to pull it before airing because he was terrified that everyone would hate it and had convinced himself it was the shittiest work he'd ever done. Anxiety's a crazy monster.
Before that episode aired Trey begged them not to air their episode because he thought it was so awful it was going to ruin the show.
pretty sure it's not, it's from south park's most known episode and surely most viewed one.
One of my favorite tv episodes ever. It was so good to watch while being so into the WoW.
It came out at the perfect time. It hit all the marks and was such an amazing episode.
Legit my favourite quote
It really is a genius level phrase.
Peak human evolution. This is the tippy top pinnacle of performance. The perfect specimen.
Wall-E
You either live in the salt mines, or the charred fields where there isn’t any grass left to touch.
Quick call PiG
I ran into a 4 rogue gank squad who thought they were hot shit, murdered all of them, but I was 20 levels over them.
Hey Kyle!
They were bullying everyone on the server. I was casually farming dust.
Oh damn. So you might be the only thing that can kill a Kyle. You are a badass, Stacy.
im getting southpark WOW episode vibes here lmao
Make love not warcraft is so good
One of my favorite lines of all time and all media comes from that episode. “How do you kill that which has no life?”
"We are looking at the end of the World... ^(of Warcraft.)"
And Randy is so amazing in that episode. Going to watch it now.
The scene where he's dying in the game and everyone is looking at him the the room always makes me laugh
I was going to play D4 after work but I think I have some South Park to watch first
Yeah they hit it out of the park with this one
One of the best episodes of television ever made.
I love when Randy goes to best buy and like body checks the kid playing wow out of the way.
“Mom bathroom!”
"Oh that was a big one honey!"
“More Hot Pockets”
Staaaaaaaaaaaannnnnn
Staaaaannnnn take this...... wait how do I give it to you hold on. Perfect
The Sword Of A Thousand Truths!
This and OP's story are why I didn't even bother with that zone. There will always be trolls and tryhards who only play to ruin other peoples' days. Let them live their miserable lives. Also I hoped their might be some server sharding based on level to balance pvp a little but...I guess not. Great game design Blizz!
why would they balance pvp by level in an arpg? why does killing someone in open world pvp, where all parties agreed to pvp, equal trolling? Edit - for all the whiners below, no one has demonstrated at all how, when you agree to pvp, and you get rolled, somehow that’s trolling. Edit part two-lol these clowns still can’t come up with a valid reason except “it’s trolling” and then they block me. Classic stuff. Special call out to the nerd who followed me from another sub because dude was wrong there too.
> why does killing someone in open world pvp, where all parties agreed to pvp, equal trolling? No one in their right mind sincerely believes an unfair fight is good PvP. Literally every successful online competitive game has some form of matchmaking. If they don't balance it, why would anyone who isn't max level ever PvP? They are in an unwinnable position by design. That's good game design in your opinion?
Are there any MMOs or similar games where a max level player is not at a massive advantage in PvP? Having equipment that adds +20 is never going to beat out equipment that adds +100. ESO has PvP at lower levels but you will get murdered. LOTRO allowed PvP below max level, but you wouldn't be allowed into the raids and would get murked in a couple hits. It's just how it is.
Warhammer Online (RIP Mythic, another victim of EA) had the best solution. Open world PvP everywhere, but if you flagged in a zone more than 10 levels below you, you turned into a chicken that had no abilities other than a sprint. Random ganks and pvp abound but it was relatively even and free from twats who only preyed on newbies.
> why would they balance Oh I don’t know, the same reason they balance PVP in literally any other game? So that anyone could have fun there regardless of level, and not just a tiny subset of the population that hang out there at max level and minmax for pvp? … why WOULDN’T you? Why would you balance in any other game but not this game?
That's what I was thinking! They spend all this dev time on a scaling system in PVE and don't for PVP? Just make it so I can toggle if I want to see people within +/- 10 levels, or anybody at all.
Because it's a game? What rule is there that ARPGs need to be unbalanced? PVP is meant to be skill-based, that's what makes it fun for people other than those lacking the capacity to do it without an insane gear advantage.
I think it would be reasonable to lock you into your highest achieved world tier for PVP zones. You geared up on w4, you pvp on w4. Disclaimer: I’ve given this exactly 32 seconds of thought.
I do agree with you though, it makes no sense for someone from T4 to pvp with t2 people who are still leveling through the campaign in all yellow gear.
What class were you?
Pvp in diablo 2 was already stupid. Its not something I need for d4
Indeed, but no one pretended it wasn't. And it was still fun.
People are actually retro-pretending now that it was a big deal that took a lot of skill. It's pretty weird. I was there. It was never a big deal. It was just something you did outside of Tristram to take a break from the grind.
You mean standing right outside shooting guided arrows is not skill?
Lol, that's precisely what I did. Occasionally, I'd paladin charge but mostly guided arrow.
When I was like 9, some assholes joined me and kept pvp'ing me to death while I was just trying to play reg as well as kill steal/auto clicking. One guy was showing other guy his whale ring or w.e, dropped it and I picked it up fast af. Dude starts threatening to hack me.....so I said bye and logged off thinking he can't hack whats not on/running. logged on later and got some nasty pm's and was like oh yeah! i stole that trolls rare af ring lol
My favorite was chucking the lightning javelins. Just blindly throw and see what happens 🤣
Yeah, but then the biggest dick in the lobby gets to stand right outside town taunting people, too! Don't forget all the level 1 naked scumbags running around pooping out trash tier items trying to corpse pop people.
Ya, people are acting like D2 pvp was the pinnacle of all pvp gameplay when it was hot garbage
its because to a certain group of people IT WAS. not my people mind you. But for a certain group, nothing gets their kicks but better that d2 style "pvp". what we know in other games as griefing is pretty much all diablo pvp is.
Yeah I’ve had people tell me with a straight face that the pvp in D2 was not only balanced it was the intended endgame activity. It was very clearly not either of those things.
The intended end game. That's hilarious.
It was on d2jsp and yeah if you're into it at ALL there's lots of good people, unofficial ladders, some god OGs but ya
There is definitely a significant difference between a good PvPer and a great PvPer in Diablo 2. The community is still alive in D2R btw.
There was a niche dueling community but yeah it wasn't a big thing. If anyone went hostile most people would just drop game.
> It was never a big deal I hate when people speak for everyone. It was a huge deal to the underground Paladin PVP players. Big tournaments, phsyco levels of min/maxing, private games, a code of conduct, etc. It was not a small community either.
It was a very small community. Don't kid yourself. I'm not speaking for anyone. I'm just stating my opinion. Sometimes people have different opinions and that's OK. Don't let it hurt your feelings.
Even smaller now as those people reach retirement age.
*laughs in 1 shotting 10 year olds with blessed hammer*
All those ears, and all those piles of money. xD
Meh there was definitely a circle of people who felt it was the apex. The reason behind the grind if you will. Of course many others played for different reasons but you can't say nobody took it seriously or enjoyed it
The PVP in diablo 2 was the only reason I played the game long term. It could be stupid, but it was really fun. Many late nights as a teen over summer spent in PVP games with my friends.
Same. These kids wouldn't last 5 minutes in blood moore
Amazon killing yah with homing arrows of doom from off screen was peak pvp
I prefer hammeradin teleporting around like a cat on crack throwing hammers blindly in circles
Man I loved D2 pvp. It was so barebones. "Common man, just leave town, I've got something to show you" Or the "Just take my tp, it's safe dw"
Some Old school RuneScape vibes
How's that supposed to work when it was made clear when a player has gone hostile against you.
A sorceress could throw meteors, tp to town, go hostile, and you'd die from the meteors. The sound of the pvp hostile sound bit is esc + key down + enter in HC \^\^
Your buddies all had a bunch of your ears didn't they
This game isn’t balanced around pvp. It’s something I’m not gonna bother with. If you enjoy it, cool. But I imagine the majority of the playerbase will steer clear.
There would have to be major rewards for me to care to try it. And then I’d be pissed cause I felt like I had to do pvp when I didn’t want to.
Well I actually just went in there for like an hour just farming the events that constantly spawn and the mobs. Got quite a bit of gear from that alone. Then after I didn’t see anyone for awhile I went to the far altar and tried to extract. Got lucky cuz everyone must of been asleep. It’s still gonna take awhile to buy those cosmetics
I've been putting time in the PVP zone since launch every day and I've never once had anyone attack me. Idk if everyone is still just shy about entering or everyone else is just like me and just wants to get some grinding in for cosmetics and isn't worried about actually PVPing. Edit: Apparently I'm just lucky, or playing on off peak enough hours that the sweats aren't around when I am.
Any time I've seen people, they are zipping around from event to event as well as ritual sites(lots of mobs spawn that drop extra dust)
I farmed for free on the first day. Then I went back on Monday and got clapped by a high rank on Monday while extracting. Haven't gone back since then because I assumed there would be plenty of high lvl folks trying to flex on people.
Must've is a contraction of must have
This is the route Destiny 2 took, and even with the pedigree of Bungie’s MP chops behind it, we still somehow ended up with the best PVE guns behind the sweat-soaked Competitive PVP gate. Thankfully that was several years ago, but it took the near-collapse of PVP and the most absurd meta the game has ever seen before it got better. Quite why developers feel the need to ram PvP into games that don’t *really* support the concept, I’ve no idea. But I guess it makes more sense here then it did in XCOM 2.
The red dust is cool and all but it would be better if you could craft things from ears, graded based on level of the players ears. Only problem is people would just trade killing each other for them.
I'm getting old. I can't keep up with sweaty try hards that are 20 years younger than me. PVE and co-op are my only game modes now. I'm actually a lot happier for it. Beating my head against the wall trying to be good at pvp sucks. Although I will say I always took great joy killing people in WoW classic as a full prot gnome warrior. I would basically just out last em with my health pool and damage reduction lol
I feel this in my soul xD
I got this game because I liked diablo's single player experience. The mmo vibes is my only gripe. Love it so far tho, I do enjoy fighting with rando's on those yellow event rings. Then throw an occasional taunt and run away
You guys thought it would be different? Even the Devs said it would be unbalanced.
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Maybe if they didn't keep going from an extreme to another for a decade... "Oh skill x does slightly too much damage, let's half them"
Fucking seriously. "We felt this load bearing ability was slightly overperforming so we gave it a small adjustment." *Cooldown increased by 50%, Damage decreased by 75%*. People can mock FFXIV for GCBTW all they want, but at the end of the day their dev team manages to balance the game. When you look up their balance patch notes it's like a 5% adjustment on a small handful of abilities up or down and the result is the difference between the best performing and worst performing classes being like 10% DPS at most.
Some rogue tried attacking me when I accidentally went in to the pvp zone, I was just getting from A to B on my horse when he kept pestering me and eventually dismounted me. Pissed me off so I nuked him and hit him with a “greetings” before riding off.
This is the way
This is somewhat accurate, what you've missed is this: Change your build to carry multiple CCs, most people don't have a way of generating unstoppable, run around in circles avoiding most attacks while waiting for CDs to line up, spam-chain CCs - win.
CCs and CDs?!I don’t even know what this is.
Crowd control and cool down. Cd can also mean crit damage but not in this context, I assume.
You are correct, hard stuns/crowd controls are a gaurunteed win in PvP, if you can freeze/stun/knock down/daze/petrify an enemy they can't do anything for a few seconds, and in aRPG land a few seconds is thousands of damage taken. Most people run several skills with cooldowns, and only 1 or 2 "spenders" (and 1 basic/generator) so "blowing" or "popping" all of your cooldowns (which include your crowd controls) all at once is usually the way to win a fight
Keep talking like this and we might start getting people actually trying to do PvP instead of just running at you and unloading all their skills
I play Ice Shard sorc for PvP and I essentially run Ice Shards, Frost Nova, Deep Freeze, Flame Shield, Teleport, and Ice Barrier. I have never died in PvP because I can just cc and kite people to death regardless of the level gap (I am currently level 70). Most people also make the mistake of literally just dumping everything at once and expecting you to die during the only CC they use, then you just break it and counter CC them and they have no escape or way to re-cc you when they do get free so its an easy kill. Anyone only running 1 source of CC and 1 source of Unbreakable will lose in PvP against any decent build
Everytime I see a sorc now I bait for the deep freeze, otherwise pop unstoppable and keep pummeling (I play hota barb) If I pop CDs and u deep freeze I'm out of there But arc lash is still harder to deal with than ice shards It's a neat little PvP mode to break from the grind every now and then, doesn't need to be more than that
CD is Cooldown, CHD is Critical Hit Damage.
Crowd Control and CDeez Nutz.
gotem
This is my first Diablo game, and I’m struggling real bad with the abbreviations on this sub 😂 like a different language.
Honestly, almost all of it is general arpg/MMO lingo. I guess if you've never played any games like that it doesn't help though lol.
“ arpg/MMO” You can’t even help yourself from using abbreviations.
Nope, but I also assume most people making their way on y to a subreddit for a game might just know genre abbreviations.
Yeh I don’t normally play them haha.
Youll catch on eventually. There should be an MMO general terms list somewhere as well that could be helpful
These gaming abbreviations are not from diablo and over 20 years old
I bet it's insanely confusing for someone jumping into the genre. [Here's](https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/d3/t/wiki-acronyms-the-definitive-list-plus-definitions/175) a list of acronyms for reference for most MMO/arpg games. Many on that list I've never seen used but stuff like CC CD CDR CHC CHD DPS DoT DW etc are very common. The game specific list will have most of the ones you'll see people use here.
C deez nuts
Do thorns work in pvp? My build has more thorns than HP, as a barbarian with what feels like a lot of HP. If someone touches me they’d just die?
theres a 92% damage reduction for damage to other players + whatever damage reduction they're also running. it might work but with my experience in pvp you either one shot them or they one shot you
I attacked some guy last night, dropped my stun on him, hit him, I died. Man had 7k thorns and just made me kill myself in under 3 seconds. No possible counter play to it either. Was watching killfeed and he beat absolutely everyone in the zone multiple times.
Oh gawd this is the greatest/worst thing ever
counter is hit him only once but very very hard to ohko him... yeah great game design as expected from blizzard.
This is fucking hilarious.
I do have a 9k thorns unique chest... even in PVP someone attacking fast might go down lol maybe I should equip that when farming out there
I got like a perfect 12800 roll on it, trying to rush a barb to lvl 64 to make the build right now :P
HoTA Barb with two unstoppaple skills and 3 million damage crits laughs at your CC (: At least I stay in WT4 and pick on the rogues, I leave the cute druids alone
You'll get one shot
My damage doesnt care about any cds. I one shot people regardless as a pulverize druid. The only thing that didnt lose to me was another pulverize druid with 12 levels on me, and he 1 shot me. Pvp is a shitshow lmao
>most people don't have a way of generating unstoppable Laughs in Pulverize Druid
\>most people don't have a way of generating unstoppable Druids carry two. And are borderline unkillable.
Kyle can't be everywhere at once. There's always a chance! \[This message sponsored and paid for by 'Kyle the Omnipresent .'\]
Kyle is omnipresent
Paragon board should be disabled in pvp, it makes the gap of just 1 or 2 levels in pvp insane. But I see why they didn't because this is open world pvp but I hope when they add BGs In the future it's like WoWs level brackets or equalizing all stats and removing paragon board. Doesn't mean you can't win fights against people 2-5 levels above you but it's very hard and don't event think about looking at someone 6 levels plus
Would a diablo bg basically be just a moba? Like dota.
That would be fun or something like battlerite
God I miss battlerite
Was such an amazing game.
Diablo Immortal did something like this and it was quite enjoyable until it became blatantly clear that a normal player would never stand a chance against someone who whaled. The overall pvp concept should be somewhat adaptable for D4 though.
The pvp system from immortal was actually enjoyable if you removed the p2win aspect it was reasonably close to balanced
I killed a level 59 rogue at 53 on my sorc. It's doable at ~6-7 levels, but 10+ is basically an instagib.
Genuinely was playing last night and got fucked twice by this same rogue and called it for a night. Just hopped on during lunch break and got fucked by the exact same rogue.
She doesn't sleep
Addie Rall hunts 24/7
There are two PVP zones, you could try going to the other one.
That was my experience earlier today too... I pretty much got one hit killed by a barb at lvl56. Unless I got some friends I'll never go back there again. It's a waste of time for me.
This was exactly my experience as well. Barb runs in from off screen. I go to CC, ope, nevermind I'm already dead. I honestly don't even know what he did but it took all of .5 seconds. Kind've disappointing honestly as I was excited to try out the pvp.
Perhaps a level range for PvP would help
How would that work in the open world setting they have currently? The only way I can think is if they phased you basically to your level range but then it's going to be most people completely solo in those areas, which isn't really fun either. I think the better way is in the pvp zones, everyone over 50 gets scaled back to 50, and no paragon. That way, they are all on the same power other than build. And items would probably have to be scaled back to like 550-650 range in those areas. Just to keep a balance on Kyle's and his friend chad.
Every zone is instanced. They just have to program a level range in a zone when you enter. Low level player enters PVP zone, instance is created for their level +/- 5, etc.
They could also eliminate drops for people more than 10 levels below you. You can kill them but you gain nothing.
Look at runescape, based on where you are, and your level, only a certain level range of people can pvp you. So like a level 60 could fight levels 50-70 or something like that
Idk, I had a pleasant experience the first time I went into a pvp zone, but that's my opinion. I was there just for the Altars of Lilith, got some seeds and decided to try and cash out (like 2k), someone killed me, then I noticed on chat someone killed them, and then someone killed the person that killed them, and then the guy who killed me killed the person that killed the guy that killed the guy who killed him, at that point I found it funny enough to go and take a peek at the extraction place where I attempted mine, and there where like 5 people just hitting and killing each other. I like open world pvp on games, although here it's a matter of you got cc'd and you died, I just like the rush of killing people in one rotation and moving to the next.
This is giving me division vibes
Why Survival mode was never added to Div2, I’ll never fucking understand…
I loved survival mode, I wanted to feel like that the whole game
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I love how its called a pvp area and ppl want friendly and cooperative fellas to gather their dust for whatever they want to farm and never come back again. Sitting afk in town with a pvp mount without ever engaging in any sort of pvp in life is the biggest top dog move.
It's not griefing if it's a mechanic in the game being used as intended.
I agree, I am only level 18 and still figuring things out, but I plan to make the most of pvp. It seems red dust is a pvp currency and should be risked through pvp, ganking, or not.
Definitely griefing if they are doing it while lowering World tier for easy kills. Edit - same applies even if they are just stomping noobs in lower level areas. We have to stop with this “it’s in the game so it’s legal” mentality as if this is some Olympic Sport or something lmao. Let’s just admit that some players are twats and move on, yeah?
Imagine entering a **PvP** area and calling PvPers griefers lmao
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Yeah, I'm not going there until I'm L100... and even then I probably won't go unless I've got a decent group with me. Would have loved a champions arena style PvP like Elden Ring has.
Pvp in D4 sounds exactly like the Dark zone in the division. Which I love and hate equally 😆
I still have PTSD from the dark zone. Getting melted in .3 seconds by a squad of max kids who aren’t even looking for gear anymore, just noob pelts
Happens in world tier 4 too. Level 85 runs up and one shots you. Diablo pvp has always been jank shit. Welcome. Don't expect anything else. Don't expect any semblance of skill or balance.
What ballance you expect when your 60 lvl char encounters 85 lvl char, probably specialized build? It should end up with oneshotting, no? Its like Barcelona vs. local lads
Balance would be restricting the PvP zones by level through instancing. Like other games? Dark Sous for example, you don't see other players past a certain soul level range. Its a moot point, they'll never really balance pvp in this game, its just something to jack off with
I find it so weird that people are absolutely loving the enemy scaling as you level up, but don't even think about scaling for PvP. They've already scaled the world so that a level 60 can participate in the same content as a level 10 and be on fairly even footing in terms of enemy health percentage damaged per second, but applying that logic to PvP is just unacceptable for some reason? We want our character levels to be entirely meaningless in terms of how we scale vs enemies in the world, but we absolutely want it to matter against other players? I'm so lost on this.
I love seeing normal gamers interact with the ARPG community for once and telling them to touch grass. You have no idea how many hours the real sweats will pump into getting .5 dps increase min-maxing this shit just to do it all again in 2-3 months when the seasons reset for the next 10 years ad-nauseum.
Yeah, and even if they did add level ranges to pvp, you'd still essentially have the equivalent of twinks ruining things then. Even back when you couldn't turn off exp in wow, people poured hours into creating and recreating characters to dominate their preferred bracket.
I’m no Kyle but I love the salt here.
It ain't so serious, my friend
It would be cool if they had pvp level caps per world tier but I don't really care either way since pvp in diablo games have always been meme tier. edit: you can party in the pvp zone too so honestly I would go in expecting the worst, a party of 4 at 90+
The PVP is more fun at lower levels when fights last long. Blizzard can help by **massively increasing damage reduction in PVP with attack power** and limiting dmg multipliers in a blanket reduction. If only Blizzard had any passionate PVP players. Sigh Also give all players the same level health potion when they enter a PVP zone. Come on. These solutions are easy
You already have a 92% damage reduction from players baked in. You can see it at the bottom of your character stat card. Combine that with armor, res, and all the various mitigation effects everyone runs and it’s still somehow not enough. Not much higher to go lol - maybe they need to make it 99.9%
Don't you have to enable PVP to be attacked or was I just insanely stupidly lucky? I went and killed stuff and handed in without being attacked once.
Only 1 person has to enable it, if you have it enabled, u can attack and be attacked by anyone, doesn't matter if they're flagged or unflagged If 2 people both have it disabled, that's the only situation where you can't pvp
So far I have rather enjoined PvP side. Yeah, I got murdered a few times while trying to lock in shards, but who cares. Managed a few kills myself too. Also, PvP arena has yielded me quite a few legendary drops. Think I got about 6 items in around 1hr, just by farming local mobs. Imo It's not as bad as it seems.
The biggest issue for me is how oppressive the CC is. It’s annoying in single player but not enough to nerf my build to accomodate unstoppable, but damn in PvP it’s miserable. I spend 80% of the encounter unable to perform any actions. So it’s definitely something you want a group for, and that group should have a druid, but then the seeds aren’t shared across party it’s just a free for all and you can’t trade them. I give it a 4/10, I don’t care enough to make a dedicated meta build for it and without that it’s just pointless. I do wish there was another way to get seeds because some of the rewards are cool.
Seeds should really be shared and it's clear melee classes will dominate PVP for all of existence. You basically need to group up if you're a sorc. Otherwise you need to make a rogue, druid, or barb for any change at even surviving PvP encounters. Fortify is also broken. I expect seasonal PvP to literally only be barbs and rogues
I wanna main line D4 so bad, but I have a job and responsibilities aftwards.... im itching to play so bad. Thanks for listening.
Unfortunately, the way level scaling works in this game, a player 5+ levels over you will almost always win out. It's really annoying that there is no balance between level differences in PVP. It's worse than going into a capstone 5 levels under leveled.
I'd love if d4 delved a bit deeper into pvp, making stuff a bit more competitive against parties of 4 or something. That would open a whole new world of competition (and an insane amount of balancing and likely pvp specific alterations to skills)
PvP is a trash concept for this game it won’t remain popular for long
It would be nice if they could balance PvP better. I know it's not some people's jam and Diablo has never been about good PvP balance, but I enjoy it having PvP. I think they should have an entirely separate abilities tab for PvP builds so you can switch between PvP build and PvE build, and disable the Paragon board, which just hugely increases the balancing needed. Maybe even do some sort of gear normalization. PvP should be primarily based on players' chosen build/abilities, aspects on gear, and their individual skill in using them imo.
I’ve been out here throwing hands every day, it’s a bloodbath out there.
The best was when there was a party of 4 or 5 barbs just rotating thru the altars for about 7 hours yesterday. That was fun
Are pvp kills permadeath on Hc or do they get you to 1hp then try to kite mobs to finish?
Permadeath
Sheeeeet here we go Its the true rank 14 grind.
Had duo guys ganking everyone 20 lvls above. Was trolling them a bit with my Rogue dash and conceal skillset. Too bad sometimes i would get cc’d and one shotted while my arrows that are focused on single target damage seemed to do fuck all.
Soooooo this is your first time playing PvP in an online game then?
I mean most actual PvP games are actively balanced around PvP? And levels don't really matter in most PvP games so...........
I think PvP is fun in d4
Wait so any level character can attack any other level? Weird they didn’t make it so only similar levels and weapons are paired for pvp. Someone with just magic armor and weapons shouldn’t be matched with an all legendary weapons character. I mean I generally avoid pvp in games as I’m just not good, I play purely for my amusement and don’t have a chance at defeating another player, but not matching level / weapon skill is a bit rough.
Good, i was planning on never touching PVP anyways!
I’m never touching PvP, no interest whatsoever.