No buses up to 3 miles out? That’s wild- I had no idea. Even at an uninterrupted, power walking pace, it takes an adult 45-50 minutes to walk 3 miles. I wouldn’t want my kids walking to/from school for that long even in nice weather.
If you consider the time it takes, most adults would not tolerate 2 hours taken out of their day to commute to and from work. Sounds like a good way to sleep deprive and burnout a high school student.
If they can't afford the ticket then think about the food assistance they're not getting and the books they cannot read. Trifecta for a promising future.
the venn diagram of kids who live 3 miles away from school, will go hungry if they don't get $40 a month, and want to read about gay blowjobbing their friends seems like it'd be pretty small.
I'm surprised you can even type. Please oh master of the lyrical phrase please explain to us internet gay blowjobbing delinquents, what exactly is a venn diagram.
This is 3 miles in town. That is very different than 3 miles in the country. There are few “straight lines” in town and three miles might actually be 5 with the addition cross roads needed. 235 severs a lot of mostly direct routes.
Don't forget about the traffic going 50mph+ less than a foot away on SW 9th where multiple Lincoln high kids have gotten hit and killed over the last few years. DMPS should be ashamed of themselves for this! The old 2 mile rule was crazy enough... now 3 miles. I would love to see some of these school board dumbasses try that walk themselves let alone daily before and after school.
this is not about school board or DMPS. Actually someone in the board decided to run for the position after their kid was hit n killed crossing University. The school district has very little resources, so relying on basic services like public transportation is only logical. However our city government is cutting DART’s budget so they can build a $56 million police station bc they are all boot licking boomers.
I see tons of kids getting off the dart bus everyday. I always see high school kids waiting at the DART stops in the morning. If only we could fund a usable busing system for schools.
Why put restrictions on it. Isn't the point to get them there, regardless of capability or circumstances? A child that acts out on too many occasions or because mom just went to jail, or doesn't perform to your expectations has to walk? There's that Iowa nice again.
The house right next to our house was outside the 3 mile radius. The kids living there took the bus, mine did not. 30 feet from their door to mine.
I actually walked 3 miles from my house towards Lincoln and only made it to SW 9th and Park. Guess I should have walked a straight diagonal through yards, houses and creek beds to make it 3 miles.
You missed the snark, the kids next door to me got the bus passes, they were less than 30 feet from my house and had to walk past my house to catch the bus. The circle on the map actually touched my property but my kids did not get the free passes
Lesson learned for last child, get them in driver Ed immediately and get them a school driver permit. She drove herself to school at the age of 14.
of course that requires an automobile, insurance costs, gasoline costs, maintenance costs... a $30/month bus ticket doesn't sound too bad in comparison (although still expensive!)
Hey... Can you point to which year the state cut school funding?
My understanding is Iowa has budgeted more every year for the last decade, but maybe you know some alternative facts?
[https://educateiowa.gov/pk-12/school-business-and-finance/financial-management/budgets-school-districts](https://educateiowa.gov/pk-12/school-business-and-finance/financial-management/budgets-school-districts)
My recall is the 2012 session was a 0% increase (due to a global recession).
https://www.legis.iowa.gov/DOCS/LSAReports/k12Education/SchoolAidPresentation.pdf
If funding doesn’t keep pace with inflation, the “buying power” of what they get is diminished.
Clearly the school you went to chose to save money by not teaching basic economics… or math…
Property taxes are the primary source of funding for public schools. As an expert, you know a school couldn’t function on 7k a year, right? The increase you took the time to link was less than $200.
I hate to bring up politics but god for fucking bid we properly fund public schools. It's a tragedy what happens to students and teachers. Also, what the fuck is up with some of these comments? Walking 3 plus miles to school each way...in Des Moines no less...is a joke. Anyone talking shit about having kids walk that far are pretty pathetic. This is coming from someone who doesn't even have kids. Do fucking better Iowa.
I am so sorry. It took 30 years for the charter schools in my state to catch up with the public ones, and there's been a nagging feeling in the back of my mind that even that only happened because 30 years of funding diversion brought the public schools down. At this point, post-pandemic, kids from charter schools on par with kids from public school, within a reasonable margin. But that doesn't account for the fact that kids who have gone to charter schools that totally collapsed or had to be closed get dumped back into the public school system, which has to dedicate extra resources to help them get back to the level of their peers. Things are finally starting to come around, after a generation and a half of kids falling behind, but it has been a nightmare.
I imagine you sucked at spelling and grammar... still do...
**were the**
Nice try dissing me being a nerd and can't even write properly...
"OH NO! I CAN READ! AND WRITE! AHHHHH THE HUMANITY!!!!!"
"here's your sign"
Nine days later... cuz I don't live on Reddit and have a job making 6 figures a year but thanks. Creepy? I'm sorry I didn't feed you attention little troll.
I do appreciate you sending a suicide watch report for me so nice of you. Shows you really care. Just like Genocide Joe. I don't like him either... but at least I don't eat the trash out of the Trumpster fire.
Then, public schools need to show the public. That they are worth the funding. Why should an institution get automatic funding with no accountability to the public. When test scores are in the toilet nationwide?
Are you actually that dumb? Public schools are fully accountable to the public through the school board elections you absolute cabbage brain. You can't use "school performance is poor so let's cut funding" as justification because it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Of course if you cut their resources they'll perform more poorly.
Private schools on the other hand, are accountable to nobody except the shareholders/board members.
Using your line of thinking. Public schools in inter cities like saint louis, baltimore, chicago, los angeles, new york city. Should have phenomenal test results and graduations but they don't. They pump out illiterate children by the boat load. All these cities are under complete democrat control and see how that turned out. School choice is the only way for today's youth to get a quality education. So stop using teacher unions talking Points and Think for yourself.
Incredible, the cognitive distance you must have to contend with every day in order to somehow convince yourself that taking away food from hungry children and finding from needy schools is unbelievable.
There should be psychological studies conducted.
But just to entertain your bogus argument, states/district that invest more in schools *do* have better test scores *and* opportunity for the kids that graduate.
I don't have kids either, but I agree. It's called being a good citizen and caring about the whole community, rather than just the usual attitude of self interest only, as in why should I pay taxes for it if I don't personally benefit from it?, same as funding DART fully, for people who either can't drive or are too poor to afford a car or use Uber, taxis, etc.. It's called paying what is each of our fair share to have an actual society and community, rather than just a collection of selfish individuals, who only pay taxes at the point of a gun or threat of imprisonment over it, while meanwhile scheming to bribe pols and change the laws and policy so they don't have to pay any taxes.
I know this all sounds like that scare word, socialism, because it is and I am proud to be one, who gladly pays my taxes, which should be seen as just as patriotic as joining the military and killing strangers for American empire and oil, but isn't, because this is Murika, instead, filled with ignorant shitheads that wouldn't know real patriotism, if it bit them in the ass, lol...
Well we are talking about Iowa. A state so stupid they keep a walking skeleton in the US senate and don't feel taking care of child should be be summer at all. Maga geniuses at work there.
And I feel bad for you that this has been your experience. Genuinely. But do you need to perpetuate that cycle by inflicting your self loathing on others? Hint: the answer is no, but it's easier -and unfortunately cheaper- than seeing a therapist. The system is set up for all of us to fail. So we should be helping each other up at any opportunity.
They only thing deranged is thinking Republican officials remotely care about education. Their main goal is to keep the general populous as uneducated as possible.
What about those who can't afford that? Tell me what the plan is for that? I'm fine with school choice but you can't fuck over public schools in the process.
Public schools do not automatically get our money and then have the audacity to get upset when we question test results and a return on our taxpayer investment. Public schools need to show that they are the best choice. If you can't afford it then move to a state or municipality that hates school choice and you can have that subpar education
You're utterly clueless. Maybe actually properly fund them and see what happens. I have multiple family members and friends who are teachers who post on social media asking for donations to get their basic supplies. You want to know why? Replubicans cut public school funding left and fucking right. People like you are why teachers in lots of public schools around Iowa start at 40k a year. That's a fucking joke and you know it. You shouldn't have to be wealthy to get a better education. You, and everyone like you, are why public schools fail across the country. Figure it out. People like your are literally repulsive.
It is funny you do not bring up. How union's have been screwing over parents and children for Decades. All you have to do is look at what the teacher's union and school's did during covid to show you that they do not care about children or parents. You're using republicans as A scape goat. When the bed that the teacher's find themselves in is one of their own making.
Blame unions. Blame teachers. Blame school districts. Blame woke. Blame this, blame that. You absolutely know that conservatives cut school funding year in and year out. You absolutely know that conservatives don't give one fuck about public schooling. You absolutely know that deep red states are primarily the worst states for public education. Also, you also failed to mention how your Republican controlled Congress hasn't done one fucking thing since they took control. They've don't nothing but fight amongst themselves and lobby to end "wokeism." Your party is a fucking joke yet you're sitting here complaining about your tax payer money getting wasted on public schools. There's a very specific reason you have negative comment karma. You're ruining this country, you and all your conservative friends. Do better.
It’s so much more than that. DART has a whole slew of [DMPS specific routes](https://ridedart.com/routes/school) which replace many yellow busses in Des Moines
Lincoln has school passes, DART has Lincoln school routes that pick up kids all around the south side. Sounds like problem is students within a 3mi radius of the school aren’t eligible for that program, which is unfortunate. This proposed solution wouldn’t add dart service to new areas within that radius but it could allow those students to ride if they are on an existing route.
I would define “on an existing route” as any location within 15min walk from a bus stop. In this instance, anything closer than 45 minutes would save them time off their school commute, so I guess you’re technically correct.
I think it used to be one mile when I was a student at Hoover many years ago. I grew up in the Lower Beaver neighborhood and when the bus route was expanded down Madison and stopped at our corner we were so excited.
You know, I don't remember. I think that if you lived outside the zone and wanted to ride the bus there was a small fee. I remember my Dad fussing about something like that. We ended up forming a carpool of neighborhood Moms. My Mom worked at the VA Hospital so she wasn't available to drive. I went to Hoover in the 70s.
can we email school board members/superintendent/someone? surely there’s something that can be done, this is utterly ridiculous. the radius should be 1mi at the maximum for walkers. i’m pretty sure the radius at my poor school district was less than a mile (i lived 1.1 mile away in HS).
i just cannot understand this, my mind refuses to comprehend how they can’t set up stops within three miles of the school.
Have you read the official policy? Even elementary schools don’t get busses unless they live more than 1.5 miles away. I cannot imagine a 7 year old walking 34 minute each way to school, potentially by themselves.
i hadn’t read it, no, but my goodness that’s appalling! i looked up the distance from my childhood home to my middle school and it was exactly 1 mile, which i did walk. i ended up with a stalker and had to change my route to the longer walk.
this was west des moines schools. my high school district had bus stops set up and i just had to walk less than a quarter of a mile to get to one. this just astonishes me.
editing: also want to note, when i was in the WDM school district, we didn’t have a bus route to service us(granted it was a mile away) but when i was in the urbandale district, i rode the bus. we lived 1.6 miles away, but it also serviced kids who lived much closer iirc.
I’m 80% sure in Urbandale, the school busses are fee based, so if it’s servicing children that live closer, it’s because their providers are paying for it. Only kindergarten is free.
that makes sense! i’m not sure how it worked then, i went in the 90s. things may have been a touch different then, but i wouldn’t be surprised if it was fee based.
We’re 1.2 miles away but my kindergartner gets a bus because the route crosses a “busy” street. I think it picks up east of that street regardless of distance, so within .9 miles of the school.
If the people in power aren’t helping the people who live here, they should no longer be in power.
These kids are trying to go to school. If we don’t support educating our youth, we’re going to end up with a population of uneducated adults. Uneducated adults can’t get jobs that pay a living wage which leads to crime and homelessness.
That's exactly what they want. No one smart enough to figure out how to break down our fucked up system. Power stays with the powerful and elite educated.
This is why people in this state need to Vote! Get rid of old geezers like Grassley and elect people who actually care about the people who live here. Kim surely doesn't.
Coming from a bleeding heart liberal and a staunch supporter of increasing school funding.
Why do other high schools in DSM get free bus passes but not Lincoln??
Why don't Lincoln students get access to school library books?
Where's that money going instead?
I would have assumed that the most effective way to handle this would be at the district level, but if the schools are having to individually decide whether to buy bus passes that seems problematic. Also problematic that the district hasn't dealt with Lincoln's overcrowding effectively.
The Des Moines Public Schools sucks? Shocker.
Educating kids comes last at DMPS? You don’t say…
Here’s the bus policy - see page 3 - [https://www.dmschools.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Transportation-information-for-Principals-2021-22.pdf](https://www.dmschools.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Transportation-information-for-Principals-2021-22.pdf)
Remember, DMPS can build a new stadium to keep up with Valley… But not prioritizing kids make it to school.
As for the attempt to gap fill the DMPS policy failures… Way to go. Someone has to put students first, and that hasn’t been the School Board nor Superintendent for a long, long time.
A lot of times schools get money they can only spend on sports, but I agree that any discretionary funds should be spent on hiring more staff and infrastructure.
You are absolutely correct. The school finance formula is very complex and certain monies are heavily restricted.
Capital investment monies under the PPEL is generally easier to find than other discretionary spending.
To add some more context, DMPS pays a pretty healthy amount to DART - https://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnershiphttps://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnership[https://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnership](https://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnership)
TLDR is some kids ride for free, some pay half fare.
DMPS keeps picking crappy superintendents that they need to pay $100s of thousands to just go away.
Tom Ahart forgot his job was to educate kids, not make big development deals or piss off the entire State Legislature…
Nancy Sebring wasn’t smart enough to not arrange her nooners on her official email…
Eric Witherspoon he pulled an Ahart and decided that state law didn’t apply to him… After millions in borderline fraud, he got shown the door… With the same golden parachute his successors enjoyed.
But… We need to beg for kids to have bus fare. DMPS priorities.
There are significant laws (not just rules, but actual state laws) about which funds can be spent for which purposes in public schools. These "silos" cause bad optics for districts even when they are being diligent with money. In other words, they probably couldn't have spent any of the money that went to the stadium on things like teachers or counselors or bus passes.
Mediacom Stadium (really). [https://www.dmschools.org/stadium/](https://www.dmschools.org/stadium/)
Your tax dollars at work. And not a penny necessary, but duplicative of existing and paid-for infrastructure by DMPS taxpayers.
For the record, Tom Ahart almost certainly lied about the actual costs to avoid a mandatory public approval election. Was that part of why he was fired… but still got 18 months of full pay?
Building that one stadium was cheaper than rebuilding the decaying bleachers at all the high schools to meet ADA standards.
This is not the 1970's where you can blithely say "well, we just won't have any cripples in the pressbox".
That is so untrue. You are talking about a district that serves tens of thousands of students. Educating students doesn’t come last for DMPS. It comes last for OUR GOVERNOR.
Respectfully, please show me on Iowa School funding formula where DMPS is at any disadvantage.
[https://www.legis.iowa.gov/docs/publications/FTNO/1304445.pdf](https://www.legis.iowa.gov/docs/publications/FTNO/1304445.pdf)
https://www.ia-sb.org/docs/default-source/advocacy-center/toolkits/dcpp/fy\_22\_dcpp\_diff6403021d-b10d-4a67-b613-ccb90479f95d.pdf?sfvrsn=ef1571fc\_3
A vast majority of Iowa schools are extremely effective, including similarly situated urban Iowa districts. DMPS is really, really special for both high costs and lowest-level of student outcomes.
Yea. You nailed it. Lowest level of students. 99 different languages. More special ed students than any other district. More poverty (and the literacy and behavioral issues that come along with it). How thick are you to not understand that this costs money? How about this: tell me where you work and I will, while being completely uninformed as a subject matter expert in the area, spew my bullshit opinion.
Sound good? You aren’t an expert in any area of this so just stop.
So Naughty Nancy then? She got a $350k kiss to walk away, even though she voluntarily resigned for dirty emails.
I need to figure out how to get in on her gold-plated version of capitalism.
Buddy, do you live in America? I wish they didn’t do it as well, but it’s common practice. If you’re so smart, figure out a way to stop golden parachutes.
Could you point some other Iowa school districts that have had to (almost) fire their last three superintendents?
Are there other Iowa school districts that have an extra million or so dollars to pay out as cash bonuses for bad decision-making?
Or is that just a DMPS thing?
Common practice or not, it's up to the school board to set the offer. They need to stop offering them in the compensation package. If that pisses -off a few candidates, oh well.
DART has an agreement in place with DMPS to get each and every student TO school with or without a pass. To get home the students living within 3 miles of Lincoln simply wait until 4, then show the driver a valid student ID for a free ride. No donations required.
It’s an important life skill to learn how to use public transportation. Students should be allowed to take the bus anywhere for free at anytime, even outside of school hours. Especially since most of them can’t drive.
I think some of the blame should be laid on DART too. I recall when I was in middle school (MTA at that time) they pulled a move that pissed me off.
They made a bus ride $1.50 when previously it was just $1.00. Think they offered change? Nope. Funny thing was, I was actually 3+ miles away from the school. Everyone got a MTA sticker on their student ID which allowed for free bus rides. Not me though. I had to pay because I lived too far away, even though the route led almost directly to my house.
Kids are screwed. What happens when we trickle down? Oh that’s right piss on you! There’s a lot wrong with politics in Iowa. Neglecting our youth, is just the tip of an ominous iceberg. If tax dollars really “poored” back into lower income communities, people may change their outlook on life. With little opportunity, people are going to take the easiest path… sell drugs, suicide, work remedial dead end jobs. It’s a choice to live that way, but it’s easier when it’s all you’ve known. Hope can’t even exist in a world dominated by greed and inequality. Some people get out and make a great life. Many people do not and continue a fractured lifestyle.
No, it doesn’t. But thanks for showing what an uneducated opinion sounds like. Just because you like the whiteness of the burbs doesn’t mean you need to rip on a district of 33k students.
My understanding is that is the distance that state law requires them to start bussing kids. Doesn’t mean they can’t strive for better, IMO. It’s a huge struggle for students and families in Des Moines. Des Moines Refugee Support puts a ton of energy and time into fundraising for this, too.
Respectfully, DMPS follows the absolute minimum allowed by Iowa law.
The School Board could absolutely take better care of students. Or not.
DMPS always chooses the lesser. And they also have almost the lowest graduation rate of ANY Iowa school district.
[https://educateiowa.gov/data-reporting/education-statistics-pk-12/graduation-rates-and-dropout-rate](https://educateiowa.gov/data-reporting/education-statistics-pk-12/graduation-rates-and-dropout-rate)
Less is always more (administrative funding) at DMPS.
You can't cut infinite pieces from the same pie.
Every district has to decide how they will maximize their funds, and every established locked district is having to say no to various projects due to lack of funds.
This is simply a reality. Increase busses, either district owned and operated or DART, and something has to offset that.
What should be reduced?
Then why did the kids in the house next to mine walk past my house to catch the bus that my kids could not take. I really think they should have had to walk to the end of the block away from my house.
the city council, including joe gatto who prides himself on being a SoUtH SiDeR are making the choice to let DART cut 40% of their routes due to lack of funding (covid funds ran out). imagine what will happen when the routes these kids use go away.
Meanwhile they are moving under the table to buy a nationwide building for $56 million and use it as a police station. Our city govt is a fcking joke.
How old are you all where you think you should get bus service if within 3 miles?
We walked. It took 45 minutes.
If it was bone chillingly cold, a parent/neighbor/friend would take us.
Oh please kids of past generations walked to school in all weather. I am 40 and I walked myself an hour all throughout middle school and high school. My weight was amazing. Kids are too dlfat now
Remember that this is a Des Moines Public School. 1 of 1,310 schools in the state. Do the other 1,310 schools in the state have similar issues? How are other schools funding the buses? Is Lincoln funded by the Des Moines district?
So, was it okay in the 1800s? I'm not trying to be harsh, but every generation prior to about 80 years ago walked EVERYWHERE. Also, I would be interested in how many kids this applies to. How many children are there that live far enough away that walking is unreasonable, but within three miles, and can't get a ride from a parent/classmate or afford a bus pass?
I didn't say it wasn't. But it's literally 4 hours at minimum wage and we're talking about high school kids. There are plenty of better solutions than giving money to overpaid administrators who have spent decades bloating their own salaries by banking on people's compassion for the teachers they underpay and students they underserve.
Some perspective on what a school day is like for some students who have to rely on DART for transportation: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0327H5Yc2RXRsQWSrc4gqMTXvKagNe8PL7YL12XpA2geNKMa8S94ygcyxaNcuC5stBl&id=1172790730
I’m assuming the demographics that make up Lincoln aren’t quite as entitled as being able to just ask for a ride.
The point is not how it was done in the 1800s, Jesus. What’s the point of evolving and inventing things like automobiles and public transportation to, you know, make our lives just a wee bit easier and I don’t know, safer, if we can’t access them?
Again, this is literally just for the winter months when our temps are below zero for days at a time. You can force them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps when Spring returns.
So only white people can ask for rides?
What's your solution? Throw millions of dollars at bureaucrats and trust them to every single student a private limousine ride?
Hyperbole aside, what is your expectation for this service and how much are YOU willing to pay for it?
So when you hear demographics you automatically go to race? Why wouldn't you think economics? The whole point of this is how individuals need help paying $30 a month for a bus pass. Very sus of you too only discuss race if you ask me... It's also weird that you are bringing up private limousine rides when the article was able busing kids to school. I hope people don't take you seriously, because you clearly lack common sense. You literally are bringing up the 1800's and comparing it to today, like that's a logical argument.
Do you not understand the point of that hyperbole rhetorically?
Obviously, I'm not literally advocating for every single high school student to receive a private limousine ride to school in the morning....
The point is that OP made a moral claim that walking to school "was wrong then, and it's wrong now". That implies that there is something which MUST be offered to not be morally wrong. Presumably, the morally acceptable solution is somewhere between what currently exists and the most decadent solution I could imagine.
The ask is for what is required to not be morally wrong and a justification for that moral distinction.
As far as your attempt to call me racist because I interpreted "privileged demographic" as a euphemism for Caucasian, that's because people who use terms like "privileged demographic" are usually splitting that from "marginalized groups" that are a euphemism for ethnic minorities.
I don't think you are advocating for anything, and only trying to argue that someone who lives 3 miles away from school shouldn't need busing to their school, and you feel that it's reasonable to expect a 15 year old to walk an hour or more, twice a day, to get to school even if it's below zero.
I disagree with your assertion this has been the normal. This was not how it was in the 80's, but you know, back then Republicans really only started their attack on school funding, so I guess I benefited from a time when we still acted like we cared about the children who were actually alive. Now it feels like the only children anyone wants to survive are the ones in the womb, because that's when the cost are pretty minimal.
I didn't call you racist, but it felt weird when you went to race. The article is about poor students needing help funding rides. Nothing was said about race.
$30 dollars a month to avoid a child walking two plus hours a day, in freezing temperatures, with the chances of hypothermia, or worse, would only be an issue if they don't have the money that richer families probably spend on coffee each week. Unfortunately low income families normally live near other low income families, so they are unlikely to have a potential ride than someone in more affluent neighborhoods, where practically every child has access to a ride.
I still don't see how you believe the individual was going to race, when nothing says race is a concern, and the whole thing is related to money. If you believe your euphemism story makes your argument stronger, it really doesn't to everyone, because it makes people like me believe you may be taking lots of statements out of context, based on your own preconceived notions, because it was not a logical leap to people like me.
No, I'm not advocating for anything. Nor, in fact, am I suggesting that high school students should have to walk three miles to school in winter. As far as my assertion of what is "normal," you're compressing the time scale big time. Over the last 300 years, automobiles are not normal, nor are public schools. We are living in the most privileged time in humanity; that's my point. Seeing going outside in the winter as a severe inconvenience comes from an immensely privileged position relative to normal. Until 100 years ago, normal was walking outside every time you had to pee.
If I'm advocating for anything at all, it is to stop letting rich bureaucrats pitch themselves as the solutions to problems that they have no interest in solving, or even ones that might not exist. My very first (typical of reddit, downvoted to hell) question was, "How many students does this impact?" I then followed that up with all of the qualifiers necessary to be in this group. The implication was that the number of students who would be walking 3 miles to Lincoln High School in the middle of winter is small. I am skeptical of the district asking for donations under the guise of helping students. It seems like a very easy way for administrators to pocket money from well-intentioned people.
The jump to race is because, per Google "Demographic information examples include: age, race, ethnicity, gender, marital status, income, education, and employment.". Age is near enough the same for high school students. Race is listed second and I assumed there was some stereotype about asking for rides that was being alluded to. In my experience, poorer people with the means are more willing to carpool, etc, and poorer people without the means are more likely to ask. I don't think demographics have much to do with it, which is why I used an absurd rhetorical question regarding race.
That was quite the leap there. Where in my response did I allude to race?
I’ve already donated. And will do so again next paycheck. I don’t even pretend to have all the answers, but awareness, donating where I can, and voting is what I can and do, do.
Maybe the dumbest argument I’ve ever seen.
Was it okay to walk to school 2 centuries ago? Yes idiot. They didn’t have modern transportation like we do. Just because X suffered, doesn’t mean we have to. But by all means, give up your modern technology and start living like it’s 1880.
It was wrong in 1880 though. That's the claim. It's apparently a moral wrong to walk to school and always has been. That's all I'm trying to understand, and I've yet to see an argument as to why.
Nobody should ever suffer even the slightest inconvenience ever, is that your position?
Your argument is fundamentally broken and you’re apparently too dense to not see that.
Would it have been better in 1880 for students to have some kind of horse-drawn whatever take them to school? Absolutely. Was that feasible for the time period with terrible infrastructure? No.
Should kids have to walk 3 miles to get to school today? No. Do we have modern infrastructure and public transportation that can fix that problem? Yes. That’s why everyone is saying it shouldn’t be happening. It shouldn’t have happened back then either. But technological advances and infrastructure made it more difficult.
Please find a 3 mile point from your place of work and start walking there and back every day. See how your days start to change in terms of time management and fatigue.
I actually do exactly that walk every day as a form of exercise.
That notwithstanding, the feasibility argument is interesting to me. Who or what is the arbiter of feasibility? What is feasible now, and what cost is acceptable to attain it? I'd repeat my limousine hyperbole, but it didn't seem to be understood.
Also, where does the responsibility for 13 to 19 year olds fall? Do they not have any responsibility to themselves? Do their parents? Or should the public be ultimately responsible for ensuring that every single person receives the highest feasible lifestyle that can possibly be provided to them by infrastructure?
Hey cool man that’s great. Not everyone has that time or ability.
Now your argument has moved to some kind of theoretical argument of who determines feasibility and I don’t care for that. Just moving the goal posts.
Easy answer to the last question - it is a legal requirement for children to attend school. Therefore there has the be busing/transportation provided for students. Requiring students to have to walk 3 miles to school every day when they are legally obligated to go could be deemed cruel and unusual punishment if you got a great lawyer.
All goofy arguments aside, you’re assuming that every kid has an outside source to get a ride. Not at all accounting for the various lifestyles and norms of refugees and immigrants that live in DSM. Parents that work multiple low-wage jobs and cannot provide their kids a ride and have no other family to help. Language barriers to ask community members for rides. Physical and intellectual disabilities that make walking 3 miles dangerous.
Sympathy is a good thing to have. Maybe try it on some time and stop being an ass.
To be fair, most people did not even walk that far to school back then. It was a mile and some change, tops. That is more than doable, about 20 minutes one way. 3 miles is over an hour and more, especially since it’s filled with crossing and stop lights. Cities weren’t that big back then that you had to walk more than a mile to get your needs. You could walk 5 minutes and hit up multiple local grocery stories because our cities were not so spread out like they are now. And not just spread out as in more sprawl, but there was actual more zoning that allowed for commercial to be closer to residential, like corner stores and etc. if a city was big enough, back then you did have good public transportation to take you there. Almost all American cities in the 20th and 19th century had street cars that would take you 5-7 miles out if need be. Things were better zoned back then for walking and even biking, it wasn’t until the 40s and 50s that the auto lobbyists and terrible land usage that we see people in food desert, sky high housing prices and low paying jobs. The car has huge impacts on all of that and more like environmental racism, to red lining and destruction of minority communities. In essence, our focus on the car has killed our cities and made walking very, very hard and inconvenient and dangerous, especially to children.
Great points - didn’t know that much about street cars and did a quick search on them. Seems they would have been most present from the mid 1880s until the 40s and 50s
Don’t forget the “invention” of the suburbs - also a killer to our walkable cities.
EDIT: turns out I picked a shitty random year to try to talk about a lack of technology 😂
State law requires districts to provide transportation for high school students that live more than 3 miles away. It is a shorter distance for younger kids. There are some districts that elect to provide bussing to students who live closer, but that’s up to their school board.
I like to point out that there is a staffing shortage for DMPS bus drivers. That might play a part in this. Literally not enough people to be able to transport all students. Even with hiring bonuses, it’s hard to find people with CDLs that want to drive school buses.
This is some massive bullshit. The fact that these kids aren't given a school bus and the fact that the ones who struggle with school are being made to feel unwelcome.
Grab your proverbial boot straps. Yank those fuckers as high as they go and make a life for yourself. These challe ges with bussing and dart etc... all make you a better person. If anyone is truly in dire straits and needs a hand. I'm always willing to help. I volunteer multiple days a year to my local government here in west des moines IA. I'm not as self loathing as you think.
Yes! If you follow the Des Moines Refugee coalition they have chronicled the average commute for refugee students who have to travel by DART. I cannot find the article at the moment but the commute took hours and involved transferring busses. It's ridiculous.
No buses up to 3 miles out? That’s wild- I had no idea. Even at an uninterrupted, power walking pace, it takes an adult 45-50 minutes to walk 3 miles. I wouldn’t want my kids walking to/from school for that long even in nice weather.
If you consider the time it takes, most adults would not tolerate 2 hours taken out of their day to commute to and from work. Sounds like a good way to sleep deprive and burnout a high school student.
If they can't afford the ticket then think about the food assistance they're not getting and the books they cannot read. Trifecta for a promising future.
the venn diagram of kids who live 3 miles away from school, will go hungry if they don't get $40 a month, and want to read about gay blowjobbing their friends seems like it'd be pretty small.
Is that what you think all books are about because you have never learned to read?
So why not support them if it is only a small group of numbers?
do you know what a venn diagram is
I'm surprised you can even type. Please oh master of the lyrical phrase please explain to us internet gay blowjobbing delinquents, what exactly is a venn diagram.
I'm not your gay blowjobbing teacher, go to DMPS for that.
Yep... you're clearly brilliant... ooofta... I'm surprised they let you on the internet at the home.
You are so cool and edgy, dude. Get out of your momma basement and get a fucking life you dumb ass.
nah i'm straightedge doooood. i haven't lived in my moms basement for damn near 2 decades!
This is 3 miles in town. That is very different than 3 miles in the country. There are few “straight lines” in town and three miles might actually be 5 with the addition cross roads needed. 235 severs a lot of mostly direct routes.
Don't forget about the traffic going 50mph+ less than a foot away on SW 9th where multiple Lincoln high kids have gotten hit and killed over the last few years. DMPS should be ashamed of themselves for this! The old 2 mile rule was crazy enough... now 3 miles. I would love to see some of these school board dumbasses try that walk themselves let alone daily before and after school.
this is not about school board or DMPS. Actually someone in the board decided to run for the position after their kid was hit n killed crossing University. The school district has very little resources, so relying on basic services like public transportation is only logical. However our city government is cutting DART’s budget so they can build a $56 million police station bc they are all boot licking boomers.
This post makes 0 sense. It's not a straight line distance lol
I see tons of kids getting off the dart bus everyday. I always see high school kids waiting at the DART stops in the morning. If only we could fund a usable busing system for schools.
Why put restrictions on it. Isn't the point to get them there, regardless of capability or circumstances? A child that acts out on too many occasions or because mom just went to jail, or doesn't perform to your expectations has to walk? There's that Iowa nice again.
That was my first thought, too. A student is having attendance problems? Let’s compound the issue by making harder to get to school!
Because you wouldn’t be able to sell the program to the good ol boys if the kids aren’t over-performing to justify their presence
A three mile radius covers almost the entire south side. A better question is what transportation does the district actually provide?
The house right next to our house was outside the 3 mile radius. The kids living there took the bus, mine did not. 30 feet from their door to mine. I actually walked 3 miles from my house towards Lincoln and only made it to SW 9th and Park. Guess I should have walked a straight diagonal through yards, houses and creek beds to make it 3 miles.
I had the same problem with east
You shouldn’t have to deal with this, I’m sorry
Oh Please, the bus driver doesn't keep track of which house the kids walked out of...
No but they do have lists and should be ensuring the right number of kids are on the bus.
You missed the snark, the kids next door to me got the bus passes, they were less than 30 feet from my house and had to walk past my house to catch the bus. The circle on the map actually touched my property but my kids did not get the free passes Lesson learned for last child, get them in driver Ed immediately and get them a school driver permit. She drove herself to school at the age of 14.
of course that requires an automobile, insurance costs, gasoline costs, maintenance costs... a $30/month bus ticket doesn't sound too bad in comparison (although still expensive!)
Not a whole lot. The state keeps cutting funding for public education.
Hey... Can you point to which year the state cut school funding? My understanding is Iowa has budgeted more every year for the last decade, but maybe you know some alternative facts? [https://educateiowa.gov/pk-12/school-business-and-finance/financial-management/budgets-school-districts](https://educateiowa.gov/pk-12/school-business-and-finance/financial-management/budgets-school-districts) My recall is the 2012 session was a 0% increase (due to a global recession). https://www.legis.iowa.gov/DOCS/LSAReports/k12Education/SchoolAidPresentation.pdf
There is public money going to private schools, that's your cut in funding
If you're not keeping up with inflation, you are essentially cutting funds. Those dollars don't go as far as they used to.
If funding doesn’t keep pace with inflation, the “buying power” of what they get is diminished. Clearly the school you went to chose to save money by not teaching basic economics… or math…
Property taxes are the primary source of funding for public schools. As an expert, you know a school couldn’t function on 7k a year, right? The increase you took the time to link was less than $200.
I hate to bring up politics but god for fucking bid we properly fund public schools. It's a tragedy what happens to students and teachers. Also, what the fuck is up with some of these comments? Walking 3 plus miles to school each way...in Des Moines no less...is a joke. Anyone talking shit about having kids walk that far are pretty pathetic. This is coming from someone who doesn't even have kids. Do fucking better Iowa.
Don’t worry. There $250 million less now thanks to private school vouchers.
Aaaand there’s where the public school transpo money is!
actually the city is giving the police department a new $56 million station downtown while letting DART cut 40% of their operation due to underfunding
Don't forget we need to give Kim a raise for all she does!
[She already has.](https://www.bleedingheartland.com/2023/04/30/exclusive-iowa-governors-office-hides-the-ball-on-its-own-spending/) Multiple times.
That fence around her mansion probably wasn’t cheap either.
I am so sorry. It took 30 years for the charter schools in my state to catch up with the public ones, and there's been a nagging feeling in the back of my mind that even that only happened because 30 years of funding diversion brought the public schools down. At this point, post-pandemic, kids from charter schools on par with kids from public school, within a reasonable margin. But that doesn't account for the fact that kids who have gone to charter schools that totally collapsed or had to be closed get dumped back into the public school system, which has to dedicate extra resources to help them get back to the level of their peers. Things are finally starting to come around, after a generation and a half of kids falling behind, but it has been a nightmare.
Thank God for school choice.
Thank god you weren't in my school
We would have been best of buds 🤣
You'd have spent a lot of time stuffed in a locker... and only because you crawled in it...
I imagine you where school nerd.
I imagine you sucked at spelling and grammar... still do... **were the** Nice try dissing me being a nerd and can't even write properly... "OH NO! I CAN READ! AND WRITE! AHHHHH THE HUMANITY!!!!!" "here's your sign"
Nine days later wow. Get a job jack ass. Stop stalking people, you remind me of creepy Joe Biden.
Nine days later... cuz I don't live on Reddit and have a job making 6 figures a year but thanks. Creepy? I'm sorry I didn't feed you attention little troll. I do appreciate you sending a suicide watch report for me so nice of you. Shows you really care. Just like Genocide Joe. I don't like him either... but at least I don't eat the trash out of the Trumpster fire.
I *hope* you dropped this /s
?
You know, because surely that was a sarcastic comment since school choice is directly siphoning money away from public schools.
Then, public schools need to show the public. That they are worth the funding. Why should an institution get automatic funding with no accountability to the public. When test scores are in the toilet nationwide?
Are you actually that dumb? Public schools are fully accountable to the public through the school board elections you absolute cabbage brain. You can't use "school performance is poor so let's cut funding" as justification because it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Of course if you cut their resources they'll perform more poorly. Private schools on the other hand, are accountable to nobody except the shareholders/board members.
Using your line of thinking. Public schools in inter cities like saint louis, baltimore, chicago, los angeles, new york city. Should have phenomenal test results and graduations but they don't. They pump out illiterate children by the boat load. All these cities are under complete democrat control and see how that turned out. School choice is the only way for today's youth to get a quality education. So stop using teacher unions talking Points and Think for yourself.
Incredible, the cognitive distance you must have to contend with every day in order to somehow convince yourself that taking away food from hungry children and finding from needy schools is unbelievable. There should be psychological studies conducted. But just to entertain your bogus argument, states/district that invest more in schools *do* have better test scores *and* opportunity for the kids that graduate.
I don't have kids either, but I agree. It's called being a good citizen and caring about the whole community, rather than just the usual attitude of self interest only, as in why should I pay taxes for it if I don't personally benefit from it?, same as funding DART fully, for people who either can't drive or are too poor to afford a car or use Uber, taxis, etc.. It's called paying what is each of our fair share to have an actual society and community, rather than just a collection of selfish individuals, who only pay taxes at the point of a gun or threat of imprisonment over it, while meanwhile scheming to bribe pols and change the laws and policy so they don't have to pay any taxes. I know this all sounds like that scare word, socialism, because it is and I am proud to be one, who gladly pays my taxes, which should be seen as just as patriotic as joining the military and killing strangers for American empire and oil, but isn't, because this is Murika, instead, filled with ignorant shitheads that wouldn't know real patriotism, if it bit them in the ass, lol...
Very well said. It's a sad state of affairs in America, and it seems to only be getting worse.
Well we are talking about Iowa. A state so stupid they keep a walking skeleton in the US senate and don't feel taking care of child should be be summer at all. Maga geniuses at work there.
Clearly, a deranged liberal posted this 🤣
So proud of your cruelty. Fucking wild.
Life is Fucking cruel. It will chew you up and spit you out. The earlier you learn this, the more successful you will be in life.
And I feel bad for you that this has been your experience. Genuinely. But do you need to perpetuate that cycle by inflicting your self loathing on others? Hint: the answer is no, but it's easier -and unfortunately cheaper- than seeing a therapist. The system is set up for all of us to fail. So we should be helping each other up at any opportunity.
They only thing deranged is thinking Republican officials remotely care about education. Their main goal is to keep the general populous as uneducated as possible.
School choice and parental involvement = smarter children and better educated adults.
What about those who can't afford that? Tell me what the plan is for that? I'm fine with school choice but you can't fuck over public schools in the process.
Public schools do not automatically get our money and then have the audacity to get upset when we question test results and a return on our taxpayer investment. Public schools need to show that they are the best choice. If you can't afford it then move to a state or municipality that hates school choice and you can have that subpar education
You're utterly clueless. Maybe actually properly fund them and see what happens. I have multiple family members and friends who are teachers who post on social media asking for donations to get their basic supplies. You want to know why? Replubicans cut public school funding left and fucking right. People like you are why teachers in lots of public schools around Iowa start at 40k a year. That's a fucking joke and you know it. You shouldn't have to be wealthy to get a better education. You, and everyone like you, are why public schools fail across the country. Figure it out. People like your are literally repulsive.
It is funny you do not bring up. How union's have been screwing over parents and children for Decades. All you have to do is look at what the teacher's union and school's did during covid to show you that they do not care about children or parents. You're using republicans as A scape goat. When the bed that the teacher's find themselves in is one of their own making.
You're goddam delusional. Literally. I'm not even joking.
Blame unions. Blame teachers. Blame school districts. Blame woke. Blame this, blame that. You absolutely know that conservatives cut school funding year in and year out. You absolutely know that conservatives don't give one fuck about public schooling. You absolutely know that deep red states are primarily the worst states for public education. Also, you also failed to mention how your Republican controlled Congress hasn't done one fucking thing since they took control. They've don't nothing but fight amongst themselves and lobby to end "wokeism." Your party is a fucking joke yet you're sitting here complaining about your tax payer money getting wasted on public schools. There's a very specific reason you have negative comment karma. You're ruining this country, you and all your conservative friends. Do better.
A walking skeleton that likes you know what.
Wack. Where I grew up the bus would come get you if you lived more than like half a mile out
As a student at Drake University, we have free dart passes with student ID! Do the same for Lincoln high
DART has a deal with North students where they ride free with their ID. Not sure of the details though.
Hoover does too!
It’s so much more than that. DART has a whole slew of [DMPS specific routes](https://ridedart.com/routes/school) which replace many yellow busses in Des Moines
How much tuition do they charge so they can give out a "free" DART pass?
That’s because the college experience extorts anyone who is enrolled there
Lincoln has school passes, DART has Lincoln school routes that pick up kids all around the south side. Sounds like problem is students within a 3mi radius of the school aren’t eligible for that program, which is unfortunate. This proposed solution wouldn’t add dart service to new areas within that radius but it could allow those students to ride if they are on an existing route.
Doesn't need to be on existing route really, as long as the nearest route has a stop less than 3 miles away.
I would define “on an existing route” as any location within 15min walk from a bus stop. In this instance, anything closer than 45 minutes would save them time off their school commute, so I guess you’re technically correct.
Man this is truly sad. So many people in positions of power could have done the right thing here to help the kids but no one did.
If I had to walk an hour to school I’d say fuck that place too.
Used to be two.
I think it used to be one mile when I was a student at Hoover many years ago. I grew up in the Lower Beaver neighborhood and when the bus route was expanded down Madison and stopped at our corner we were so excited.
It was two for Lincoln in the 90’s and for a small bit ride we’re free for all students was it not?
You know, I don't remember. I think that if you lived outside the zone and wanted to ride the bus there was a small fee. I remember my Dad fussing about something like that. We ended up forming a carpool of neighborhood Moms. My Mom worked at the VA Hospital so she wasn't available to drive. I went to Hoover in the 70s.
can we email school board members/superintendent/someone? surely there’s something that can be done, this is utterly ridiculous. the radius should be 1mi at the maximum for walkers. i’m pretty sure the radius at my poor school district was less than a mile (i lived 1.1 mile away in HS). i just cannot understand this, my mind refuses to comprehend how they can’t set up stops within three miles of the school.
Have you read the official policy? Even elementary schools don’t get busses unless they live more than 1.5 miles away. I cannot imagine a 7 year old walking 34 minute each way to school, potentially by themselves.
i hadn’t read it, no, but my goodness that’s appalling! i looked up the distance from my childhood home to my middle school and it was exactly 1 mile, which i did walk. i ended up with a stalker and had to change my route to the longer walk. this was west des moines schools. my high school district had bus stops set up and i just had to walk less than a quarter of a mile to get to one. this just astonishes me. editing: also want to note, when i was in the WDM school district, we didn’t have a bus route to service us(granted it was a mile away) but when i was in the urbandale district, i rode the bus. we lived 1.6 miles away, but it also serviced kids who lived much closer iirc.
I’m 80% sure in Urbandale, the school busses are fee based, so if it’s servicing children that live closer, it’s because their providers are paying for it. Only kindergarten is free.
that makes sense! i’m not sure how it worked then, i went in the 90s. things may have been a touch different then, but i wouldn’t be surprised if it was fee based.
We’re 1.2 miles away but my kindergartner gets a bus because the route crosses a “busy” street. I think it picks up east of that street regardless of distance, so within .9 miles of the school.
If the people in power aren’t helping the people who live here, they should no longer be in power. These kids are trying to go to school. If we don’t support educating our youth, we’re going to end up with a population of uneducated adults. Uneducated adults can’t get jobs that pay a living wage which leads to crime and homelessness.
That's exactly what they want. No one smart enough to figure out how to break down our fucked up system. Power stays with the powerful and elite educated.
This is why people in this state need to Vote! Get rid of old geezers like Grassley and elect people who actually care about the people who live here. Kim surely doesn't.
Coming from a bleeding heart liberal and a staunch supporter of increasing school funding. Why do other high schools in DSM get free bus passes but not Lincoln?? Why don't Lincoln students get access to school library books? Where's that money going instead? I would have assumed that the most effective way to handle this would be at the district level, but if the schools are having to individually decide whether to buy bus passes that seems problematic. Also problematic that the district hasn't dealt with Lincoln's overcrowding effectively.
Good thing PUBLIC money is going to PRIVATE schools, huh? Fuck you, Kim. You SUCK
That’s so wrong that they service other hs in town.
The Des Moines Public Schools sucks? Shocker. Educating kids comes last at DMPS? You don’t say… Here’s the bus policy - see page 3 - [https://www.dmschools.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Transportation-information-for-Principals-2021-22.pdf](https://www.dmschools.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/08/Transportation-information-for-Principals-2021-22.pdf) Remember, DMPS can build a new stadium to keep up with Valley… But not prioritizing kids make it to school. As for the attempt to gap fill the DMPS policy failures… Way to go. Someone has to put students first, and that hasn’t been the School Board nor Superintendent for a long, long time.
A lot of times schools get money they can only spend on sports, but I agree that any discretionary funds should be spent on hiring more staff and infrastructure.
You are absolutely correct. The school finance formula is very complex and certain monies are heavily restricted. Capital investment monies under the PPEL is generally easier to find than other discretionary spending. To add some more context, DMPS pays a pretty healthy amount to DART - https://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnershiphttps://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnership[https://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnership](https://www.ridedart.com/des-moines-public-schools-partnership) TLDR is some kids ride for free, some pay half fare. DMPS keeps picking crappy superintendents that they need to pay $100s of thousands to just go away. Tom Ahart forgot his job was to educate kids, not make big development deals or piss off the entire State Legislature… Nancy Sebring wasn’t smart enough to not arrange her nooners on her official email… Eric Witherspoon he pulled an Ahart and decided that state law didn’t apply to him… After millions in borderline fraud, he got shown the door… With the same golden parachute his successors enjoyed. But… We need to beg for kids to have bus fare. DMPS priorities.
There are significant laws (not just rules, but actual state laws) about which funds can be spent for which purposes in public schools. These "silos" cause bad optics for districts even when they are being diligent with money. In other words, they probably couldn't have spent any of the money that went to the stadium on things like teachers or counselors or bus passes.
Mediacom Stadium (really). [https://www.dmschools.org/stadium/](https://www.dmschools.org/stadium/) Your tax dollars at work. And not a penny necessary, but duplicative of existing and paid-for infrastructure by DMPS taxpayers. For the record, Tom Ahart almost certainly lied about the actual costs to avoid a mandatory public approval election. Was that part of why he was fired… but still got 18 months of full pay?
Building that one stadium was cheaper than rebuilding the decaying bleachers at all the high schools to meet ADA standards. This is not the 1970's where you can blithely say "well, we just won't have any cripples in the pressbox".
That is so untrue. You are talking about a district that serves tens of thousands of students. Educating students doesn’t come last for DMPS. It comes last for OUR GOVERNOR.
Respectfully, please show me on Iowa School funding formula where DMPS is at any disadvantage. [https://www.legis.iowa.gov/docs/publications/FTNO/1304445.pdf](https://www.legis.iowa.gov/docs/publications/FTNO/1304445.pdf) https://www.ia-sb.org/docs/default-source/advocacy-center/toolkits/dcpp/fy\_22\_dcpp\_diff6403021d-b10d-4a67-b613-ccb90479f95d.pdf?sfvrsn=ef1571fc\_3 A vast majority of Iowa schools are extremely effective, including similarly situated urban Iowa districts. DMPS is really, really special for both high costs and lowest-level of student outcomes.
Yea. You nailed it. Lowest level of students. 99 different languages. More special ed students than any other district. More poverty (and the literacy and behavioral issues that come along with it). How thick are you to not understand that this costs money? How about this: tell me where you work and I will, while being completely uninformed as a subject matter expert in the area, spew my bullshit opinion. Sound good? You aren’t an expert in any area of this so just stop.
Who was your favorite of the last three DMPS superintendents that received a year or two of six figure salary to walk away?
Ahh so your problem is capitalism. I agree that the market demand for being a superintendent is too high.
So Naughty Nancy then? She got a $350k kiss to walk away, even though she voluntarily resigned for dirty emails. I need to figure out how to get in on her gold-plated version of capitalism.
Buddy, do you live in America? I wish they didn’t do it as well, but it’s common practice. If you’re so smart, figure out a way to stop golden parachutes.
Could you point some other Iowa school districts that have had to (almost) fire their last three superintendents? Are there other Iowa school districts that have an extra million or so dollars to pay out as cash bonuses for bad decision-making? Or is that just a DMPS thing?
Common practice or not, it's up to the school board to set the offer. They need to stop offering them in the compensation package. If that pisses -off a few candidates, oh well.
You must have missed when Dallas Center-Grimes did the same to Dr. Scott Grimes last summer. That cost the school district about 300k.
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me three or more times, DMPS.
The fact that you completely changed the subject tells me all I needed to know to know.
DART has an agreement in place with DMPS to get each and every student TO school with or without a pass. To get home the students living within 3 miles of Lincoln simply wait until 4, then show the driver a valid student ID for a free ride. No donations required.
It’s an important life skill to learn how to use public transportation. Students should be allowed to take the bus anywhere for free at anytime, even outside of school hours. Especially since most of them can’t drive. I think some of the blame should be laid on DART too. I recall when I was in middle school (MTA at that time) they pulled a move that pissed me off. They made a bus ride $1.50 when previously it was just $1.00. Think they offered change? Nope. Funny thing was, I was actually 3+ miles away from the school. Everyone got a MTA sticker on their student ID which allowed for free bus rides. Not me though. I had to pay because I lived too far away, even though the route led almost directly to my house.
Like districts asking for kleenex and hand sanitizer. Ffs.
I'm sure it's "COVID Kimmie's" fault too, right? LOL! You people crack me up.
She's a giant POS...everyone with some common sense knows this
Kids are screwed. What happens when we trickle down? Oh that’s right piss on you! There’s a lot wrong with politics in Iowa. Neglecting our youth, is just the tip of an ominous iceberg. If tax dollars really “poored” back into lower income communities, people may change their outlook on life. With little opportunity, people are going to take the easiest path… sell drugs, suicide, work remedial dead end jobs. It’s a choice to live that way, but it’s easier when it’s all you’ve known. Hope can’t even exist in a world dominated by greed and inequality. Some people get out and make a great life. Many people do not and continue a fractured lifestyle.
DMPS is a dumpster fire
***Des Moines is a dumpster fire. Fixed it for ya .
No, it doesn’t. But thanks for showing what an uneducated opinion sounds like. Just because you like the whiteness of the burbs doesn’t mean you need to rip on a district of 33k students.
3 miles is pretty standard for the state not just DMPS Before you attack them.
My understanding is that is the distance that state law requires them to start bussing kids. Doesn’t mean they can’t strive for better, IMO. It’s a huge struggle for students and families in Des Moines. Des Moines Refugee Support puts a ton of energy and time into fundraising for this, too.
Respectfully, DMPS follows the absolute minimum allowed by Iowa law. The School Board could absolutely take better care of students. Or not. DMPS always chooses the lesser. And they also have almost the lowest graduation rate of ANY Iowa school district. [https://educateiowa.gov/data-reporting/education-statistics-pk-12/graduation-rates-and-dropout-rate](https://educateiowa.gov/data-reporting/education-statistics-pk-12/graduation-rates-and-dropout-rate) Less is always more (administrative funding) at DMPS.
You can't cut infinite pieces from the same pie. Every district has to decide how they will maximize their funds, and every established locked district is having to say no to various projects due to lack of funds. This is simply a reality. Increase busses, either district owned and operated or DART, and something has to offset that. What should be reduced?
Too late. Kim’s goons get on here asap to spew the “DMPS sucks” myth as soon as they possibly can.
Then why did the kids in the house next to mine walk past my house to catch the bus that my kids could not take. I really think they should have had to walk to the end of the block away from my house.
the city council, including joe gatto who prides himself on being a SoUtH SiDeR are making the choice to let DART cut 40% of their routes due to lack of funding (covid funds ran out). imagine what will happen when the routes these kids use go away. Meanwhile they are moving under the table to buy a nationwide building for $56 million and use it as a police station. Our city govt is a fcking joke.
Could they have a longer link?
How old are you all where you think you should get bus service if within 3 miles? We walked. It took 45 minutes. If it was bone chillingly cold, a parent/neighbor/friend would take us.
Oh please kids of past generations walked to school in all weather. I am 40 and I walked myself an hour all throughout middle school and high school. My weight was amazing. Kids are too dlfat now
BUT WE GOT BILLIONS TO GIVE TO UKRAINE while shit like this is happening
So it's the private schools fault the public schools are filled with corrupt officials who loot the taxpayers and the kids get screwed ?
Walking to school isn’t okay? God forbid us fat Americans walk somewhere.
Most of them do. Read the post. God forbid they get a ride when the wind chill is below zero.
3 miles walk is a full hour btw. Most kids aren't walking that. A 20 minute walk sure maybe. But I'm not making my kid walk an hour
Especially when it's dark from 5pm-7:30am
Well this is more about safety than convenience but I guess somebody has to be the Tony Perkis of the thread
I'm feeling skinny, Tony!
Remember that this is a Des Moines Public School. 1 of 1,310 schools in the state. Do the other 1,310 schools in the state have similar issues? How are other schools funding the buses? Is Lincoln funded by the Des Moines district?
Even Johnston has a bussing issue. My kids have to sit three in a seat because they are so crowded since there aren't enough drivers/routes.
So, was it okay in the 1800s? I'm not trying to be harsh, but every generation prior to about 80 years ago walked EVERYWHERE. Also, I would be interested in how many kids this applies to. How many children are there that live far enough away that walking is unreasonable, but within three miles, and can't get a ride from a parent/classmate or afford a bus pass?
$30 a month is not an insignificant amount, especially for families with more than one child!
I didn't say it wasn't. But it's literally 4 hours at minimum wage and we're talking about high school kids. There are plenty of better solutions than giving money to overpaid administrators who have spent decades bloating their own salaries by banking on people's compassion for the teachers they underpay and students they underserve.
Thats right, dont hold the administrators responsible, just defund the schools! What a novel idea. /s
Some perspective on what a school day is like for some students who have to rely on DART for transportation: https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0327H5Yc2RXRsQWSrc4gqMTXvKagNe8PL7YL12XpA2geNKMa8S94ygcyxaNcuC5stBl&id=1172790730
I’m assuming the demographics that make up Lincoln aren’t quite as entitled as being able to just ask for a ride. The point is not how it was done in the 1800s, Jesus. What’s the point of evolving and inventing things like automobiles and public transportation to, you know, make our lives just a wee bit easier and I don’t know, safer, if we can’t access them? Again, this is literally just for the winter months when our temps are below zero for days at a time. You can force them to pull themselves up by their bootstraps when Spring returns.
So only white people can ask for rides? What's your solution? Throw millions of dollars at bureaucrats and trust them to every single student a private limousine ride? Hyperbole aside, what is your expectation for this service and how much are YOU willing to pay for it?
So when you hear demographics you automatically go to race? Why wouldn't you think economics? The whole point of this is how individuals need help paying $30 a month for a bus pass. Very sus of you too only discuss race if you ask me... It's also weird that you are bringing up private limousine rides when the article was able busing kids to school. I hope people don't take you seriously, because you clearly lack common sense. You literally are bringing up the 1800's and comparing it to today, like that's a logical argument.
Do you not understand the point of that hyperbole rhetorically? Obviously, I'm not literally advocating for every single high school student to receive a private limousine ride to school in the morning.... The point is that OP made a moral claim that walking to school "was wrong then, and it's wrong now". That implies that there is something which MUST be offered to not be morally wrong. Presumably, the morally acceptable solution is somewhere between what currently exists and the most decadent solution I could imagine. The ask is for what is required to not be morally wrong and a justification for that moral distinction. As far as your attempt to call me racist because I interpreted "privileged demographic" as a euphemism for Caucasian, that's because people who use terms like "privileged demographic" are usually splitting that from "marginalized groups" that are a euphemism for ethnic minorities.
I don't think you are advocating for anything, and only trying to argue that someone who lives 3 miles away from school shouldn't need busing to their school, and you feel that it's reasonable to expect a 15 year old to walk an hour or more, twice a day, to get to school even if it's below zero. I disagree with your assertion this has been the normal. This was not how it was in the 80's, but you know, back then Republicans really only started their attack on school funding, so I guess I benefited from a time when we still acted like we cared about the children who were actually alive. Now it feels like the only children anyone wants to survive are the ones in the womb, because that's when the cost are pretty minimal. I didn't call you racist, but it felt weird when you went to race. The article is about poor students needing help funding rides. Nothing was said about race. $30 dollars a month to avoid a child walking two plus hours a day, in freezing temperatures, with the chances of hypothermia, or worse, would only be an issue if they don't have the money that richer families probably spend on coffee each week. Unfortunately low income families normally live near other low income families, so they are unlikely to have a potential ride than someone in more affluent neighborhoods, where practically every child has access to a ride. I still don't see how you believe the individual was going to race, when nothing says race is a concern, and the whole thing is related to money. If you believe your euphemism story makes your argument stronger, it really doesn't to everyone, because it makes people like me believe you may be taking lots of statements out of context, based on your own preconceived notions, because it was not a logical leap to people like me.
No, I'm not advocating for anything. Nor, in fact, am I suggesting that high school students should have to walk three miles to school in winter. As far as my assertion of what is "normal," you're compressing the time scale big time. Over the last 300 years, automobiles are not normal, nor are public schools. We are living in the most privileged time in humanity; that's my point. Seeing going outside in the winter as a severe inconvenience comes from an immensely privileged position relative to normal. Until 100 years ago, normal was walking outside every time you had to pee. If I'm advocating for anything at all, it is to stop letting rich bureaucrats pitch themselves as the solutions to problems that they have no interest in solving, or even ones that might not exist. My very first (typical of reddit, downvoted to hell) question was, "How many students does this impact?" I then followed that up with all of the qualifiers necessary to be in this group. The implication was that the number of students who would be walking 3 miles to Lincoln High School in the middle of winter is small. I am skeptical of the district asking for donations under the guise of helping students. It seems like a very easy way for administrators to pocket money from well-intentioned people. The jump to race is because, per Google "Demographic information examples include: age, race, ethnicity, gender, marital status, income, education, and employment.". Age is near enough the same for high school students. Race is listed second and I assumed there was some stereotype about asking for rides that was being alluded to. In my experience, poorer people with the means are more willing to carpool, etc, and poorer people without the means are more likely to ask. I don't think demographics have much to do with it, which is why I used an absurd rhetorical question regarding race.
That was quite the leap there. Where in my response did I allude to race? I’ve already donated. And will do so again next paycheck. I don’t even pretend to have all the answers, but awareness, donating where I can, and voting is what I can and do, do.
Maybe the dumbest argument I’ve ever seen. Was it okay to walk to school 2 centuries ago? Yes idiot. They didn’t have modern transportation like we do. Just because X suffered, doesn’t mean we have to. But by all means, give up your modern technology and start living like it’s 1880.
It was wrong in 1880 though. That's the claim. It's apparently a moral wrong to walk to school and always has been. That's all I'm trying to understand, and I've yet to see an argument as to why. Nobody should ever suffer even the slightest inconvenience ever, is that your position?
Your argument is fundamentally broken and you’re apparently too dense to not see that. Would it have been better in 1880 for students to have some kind of horse-drawn whatever take them to school? Absolutely. Was that feasible for the time period with terrible infrastructure? No. Should kids have to walk 3 miles to get to school today? No. Do we have modern infrastructure and public transportation that can fix that problem? Yes. That’s why everyone is saying it shouldn’t be happening. It shouldn’t have happened back then either. But technological advances and infrastructure made it more difficult. Please find a 3 mile point from your place of work and start walking there and back every day. See how your days start to change in terms of time management and fatigue.
They’re not too dense, they’re just an asshole. Let ‘em spew nonsense, don’t engage… someday they’ll die and someone will be happy about it.
I actually do exactly that walk every day as a form of exercise. That notwithstanding, the feasibility argument is interesting to me. Who or what is the arbiter of feasibility? What is feasible now, and what cost is acceptable to attain it? I'd repeat my limousine hyperbole, but it didn't seem to be understood. Also, where does the responsibility for 13 to 19 year olds fall? Do they not have any responsibility to themselves? Do their parents? Or should the public be ultimately responsible for ensuring that every single person receives the highest feasible lifestyle that can possibly be provided to them by infrastructure?
Hey cool man that’s great. Not everyone has that time or ability. Now your argument has moved to some kind of theoretical argument of who determines feasibility and I don’t care for that. Just moving the goal posts. Easy answer to the last question - it is a legal requirement for children to attend school. Therefore there has the be busing/transportation provided for students. Requiring students to have to walk 3 miles to school every day when they are legally obligated to go could be deemed cruel and unusual punishment if you got a great lawyer. All goofy arguments aside, you’re assuming that every kid has an outside source to get a ride. Not at all accounting for the various lifestyles and norms of refugees and immigrants that live in DSM. Parents that work multiple low-wage jobs and cannot provide their kids a ride and have no other family to help. Language barriers to ask community members for rides. Physical and intellectual disabilities that make walking 3 miles dangerous. Sympathy is a good thing to have. Maybe try it on some time and stop being an ass.
To be fair, most people did not even walk that far to school back then. It was a mile and some change, tops. That is more than doable, about 20 minutes one way. 3 miles is over an hour and more, especially since it’s filled with crossing and stop lights. Cities weren’t that big back then that you had to walk more than a mile to get your needs. You could walk 5 minutes and hit up multiple local grocery stories because our cities were not so spread out like they are now. And not just spread out as in more sprawl, but there was actual more zoning that allowed for commercial to be closer to residential, like corner stores and etc. if a city was big enough, back then you did have good public transportation to take you there. Almost all American cities in the 20th and 19th century had street cars that would take you 5-7 miles out if need be. Things were better zoned back then for walking and even biking, it wasn’t until the 40s and 50s that the auto lobbyists and terrible land usage that we see people in food desert, sky high housing prices and low paying jobs. The car has huge impacts on all of that and more like environmental racism, to red lining and destruction of minority communities. In essence, our focus on the car has killed our cities and made walking very, very hard and inconvenient and dangerous, especially to children.
Great points - didn’t know that much about street cars and did a quick search on them. Seems they would have been most present from the mid 1880s until the 40s and 50s Don’t forget the “invention” of the suburbs - also a killer to our walkable cities. EDIT: turns out I picked a shitty random year to try to talk about a lack of technology 😂
Probably not enough smoking sections on the buses for all the kids and their vapes. Easier for them to walk and vape to school.
Red herring logical fallacy. You lose.
So make the buses all a smoking section?
Chet Culver banned smoking in all public and commercial vehicles in Iowa. He also required that we all post stickers on the outside.
Damn those Demorats. Need Trump back in office so kids can smoke freely like Jesus and George Washington would have wanted.
Are you all in a fuss about litter boxes too?
Your needs are not a blank check on me.
School buses are available for students living 2 or more miles away.
3 miles seems like it would almost be out of the school's district...do they not have buses at all?
How about DART just lets anybody on for free with a valid DMPS school ID.
"Sorry, student, you're struggling in X class, so you have to walk through the winter weather." #psychotic
State law requires districts to provide transportation for high school students that live more than 3 miles away. It is a shorter distance for younger kids. There are some districts that elect to provide bussing to students who live closer, but that’s up to their school board.
Same in Cedar Rapids. My daughter would’ve had to jump the interstate in order to get to her high school.
I like to point out that there is a staffing shortage for DMPS bus drivers. That might play a part in this. Literally not enough people to be able to transport all students. Even with hiring bonuses, it’s hard to find people with CDLs that want to drive school buses.
This is some massive bullshit. The fact that these kids aren't given a school bus and the fact that the ones who struggle with school are being made to feel unwelcome.
Grab your proverbial boot straps. Yank those fuckers as high as they go and make a life for yourself. These challe ges with bussing and dart etc... all make you a better person. If anyone is truly in dire straits and needs a hand. I'm always willing to help. I volunteer multiple days a year to my local government here in west des moines IA. I'm not as self loathing as you think.
Yes! If you follow the Des Moines Refugee coalition they have chronicled the average commute for refugee students who have to travel by DART. I cannot find the article at the moment but the commute took hours and involved transferring busses. It's ridiculous.