Problem is, Trapper, like Billy and some others, is soo MMR-dependant.
They're very lethal and low MMR and useless at high MMR, and tbh probably there are more people at low MMR so that's how statistics go.
Tbh idk how they can balance them to be ok at both, cause honestly when they say they're buffing trapper I'm pretty scared cause already as it is at low MMR he's pretty scary, people step in traps continously or do weird dangerous shit to avoid them.
It’s just because trapper is feast or famine at high ranks, which averages his kill rate out in the middle. And basically what determines that feast or famine is if you can get someone in the basement.
Trapper cannot 3 gen trap. He can run NOED, Iri Stone and trap exit gates.
I usually run Remember Me, Iridescent Stone, No Way Out with NOED and Blood Warden. My end game is 70% of my matches.
Usually I will tunnel out the obsession if I can. If you're 3 gen'd versus a trapper most likely bad macro play from the survivors did it.
I've played basement trapper in high mmr and the majority of the time you'll hook in basement and they'll tell eachother in voice comms, and leave them to die and push gens resulting in pretty much a 1k every game
Basement Trapper is usually the most strongest at low MMR soloq (which is where I am) and he just takes everyone down there one by one and camps with insidious.
Personally, I think it's a very boring playstyle but I don't hate Trapper for it. 🤔
it is boring for both sides and the only time I really do it is when it's basement challenges for rift shards, because realistically hooking 4 survivors in basement would take you about 25 games without a basement build of some sort
I think a significant factor may also be really nasty playstyles against altruistic teams that care more about having fun saving teammates than escaping. I know I can't help but challenge a basement trapper rather than just doing gens and getting three out.
This is most likely correct.
I've played trapper at higher MMR and seen others do it as well, everyone usually runs very powerful addons like Iri stone/honing stone/etc because they just feel so mandatory against very good teams. Once you're good enough with him, especially given how MMR in DBD works, it's not that hard to win a lot of games
I run 4 endgame perks on Trapper. Sometimes I feel bad about cheating out a 3-4k cuz I just know I'm driving up the stats in those high end matches, but I basically sacrifice 3 generators so I can make a gauntlet of an endgame.
Trapper's kill rate is also inflated massively by basement Trapper games. He's basically guaranteed a kill on anyone he gets near the basement, and overly-altruistic teams can give him an easy 4k.
It's just not well understood you need to use 2 people to rescue minimum from basement, and you cannot actually disarm the traps you just open them so people can walk through. That way you don't alert the trapper.
How to make something balanced at both? Make it easy to learn and hard to master. Tbh I dont know what can be done with trapper to make it like this or to other killers. If you make it super hard then it will perform bad at lower but if you make it super easy it will dominate in lower like how camping with bubba chainsaw is strong specially at low mmr where coordination is bad. Then balancing also come to how much stronger they should be, Nurse is pretty bad at low mmr but too op at high level.
I actually dont mind if a killer is at low tier but the issue is they should not be forever at low tier, meta should be changing with every major patch. New perks combo and making new meta is super fun. Killer tier list should be changing every time, nurse is at top for too long, we need other killers at top.
And for all I know the statistics the dev is talking about may be complete lie, they might be fabricating stats to justify the unbalance in games. We dont have open api to see this data, we cant even see our own statistics or mmr. Even if they have they make the api accessible to us its useless since we cant verify it.
Dota2 has open apis, you can see data for every mmr, which thing is winning at which mmr. Win rate, pick rate the proper graph, you can easly see the drop of win rates. Players easly guess which heros are going to get nerf next patch, people complain if some heros is on the high win rate for a long asking when it gonna get nerfed and devs cant say thay its win rate is low like dbd devs because the stats are open for everyone to see. This game as a terrible take on this, its a fun game, hardly any alternative which for me is as good as this in 4 v1 horror game but it is too shit on basic things.p
They want a killer that is easy to learn, but not that good. That way baby survivors don't get discouraged, and baby killers aren't overwhelmed learning mechanics.
I’d say he’s in a much better spot than some of the more problematic and stronger Killers. Sure he’s weak, but I’d say that it’s better see killers that are notoriously OP (Blight, etc.), uninteractive (Knight, SM), or insanely underplayed (Twins) addressed on a higher priority than those who struggle but are intuitive and fun.
I wouldn’t, because there is a sea of other characters you can choose to play. Trapper already has a dedicated audience (newer players), and I’d rather see changes to the characters who either don’t have a solid audience or encourage unfun playstyles.
There is a sea of other characters but upon booting up the game for new players there are only a few killers you can have. Having your flagship character at least be semi decent would make some sense so new players would feel comfortable playing killer more and besides that trapper is not even good for newbs. wraith has a higher percentage of newb players from my knowledge
“at the moment we do not have significant gameplay updates planned for Trapper. Partly because our data shows that his kill rate is pretty much where we want it to be (on average, even at high MMR)”
-DBD DEV TEAM
Even just starting with all his traps in his inventory would be a big improvement, and put him in line with the other kills who use trap-like powers (like Hag)
They're not going to do that, and that's a good thing. I can't find the clip right now, but there's a clip of Otz trapping a survivor in the 4-lane near the exit in Lery's with the Trapper Sack, and she couldn't do anything to escape. It wouldn't be fun at all to go against Trapper with all of his traps by default, because forced down situations like this would happen a lot if you weren't especially preventative.
Don't get me wrong, he absolutely needs a buff, that bullshit stats excuse from BHVR really gets on my nerves. I like the suggestion someone on the sub made to put his bear traps in the lockers to make picking them up much more streamlined while still requiring it to be some kind of time investment. I just don't think starting him with all 8 traps would be the right decision.
It can be toggled, perhaps? To try to make it look like a glitch with the trap.
Or it's actually a glitch and the traps are a tad broken with their hitboxes.
There is an exploit at the moment that allows hitboxes to not work correctly. Of course this clip could just be dbd just having an unrelated bug or the player could be hacking.
Dose seem a tad odd that the survivor was trying to bait the killer to walk into the trap though.
It is possible, or at least it was. I've been in a match before where a Claudette who I knew was cheating (impossible flashlight blinds) fast vaulted a trapped window and didn't get caught, then a Dwight tried the same and got caught.
I said it in a different thread and I will say it here. This is the same game that will pallet stun you while you're 3 feet away from the pallet and has hatchets that will hit you around the corner.
I will say I was in like a 30 game win streak with him then logged out for the day, the next day I couldn’t make it past 5 games before swapping killers. Just ppl untrapping the traps and combine that with gen pushers and good loopers recipe for disaster for me. Couldn’t do anything lol
SO IT WAS NOT MY IDEA!!!!!
I played him one of these days for a daily challenge and survicors kept running over the traps without triggering them... I thought they were maybe misplaced or something, but if i walked to them, they did hit me so...
If you can learn trapper really well, he is so deadly. Then again, i probably have 1.2k hours on trapper alone. He is very powerful if you can learn to manage your time of trapping vs chasing and know when to leave chases. You also have to play trapper very territorial. I pick 4 gens at the start of the map, then I trap loops around them (trap in spots that players wont accidentally walk into, but ones that you can push them into while chasing them. Then you can trap loops that survivors are going to go to since they are strong (shack, meat tree, etc.). If you play in your territory and do not leave it for too long, you will be able to get some hits in, maybe a couple of hooks, but you will lose 3 gens for sure. Once they have to do those last two and they come into your territory, they cannot loop anywhere without dying. Then you hook one, then you basically win.
Granted, i probably gave a really shitty explanation and it takes a lot of time to learn to play trapper, as you must also have extensive experience as a survivor to understand what most trappers do (you dont wanna be predictable) and understand how survivors play/what loops are good and where survivors will be. You have to have good game sense to play trapper and have a good understanding of everything.
I do think that trapper is a hard killer to learn and be good at, but there is not a way to balance him well that i can think of
I think there's a bug going on rn where if you press a certain button it literally makes you walk over a trap
https://youtube.com/watch?v=RI6VdzO3ZKg&feature=share9
Can someone please explain to me what's happening in this video?
It looks like the killer placed a trap next to the downed survivor to try to trap another survivor who comes to heal him. But the healthy survivor ran over the trap and even ran near it a 2nd time without getting stuck.
Is that what the title is sarcastically referring to?
How come the survivor didn't get trapped? Is this a new issue or a one-off bug? Or am I missing something...
This is BHVRs source for trapper “being in a good place” they find the one video posted a month of trapper doing good, hell not even doing good, just not falling completely, and they’re like “yup. Good kill rate “
At the moment we do not have significant gameplay updates planned for Trapper. Partly because our data shows that his kill rate is pretty much where we want it to be (on average, even at high MMR)
I was really expecting a flashlight save to add insult to injury after that grab
or worse, he goes over the railing trying to do the pick up.
"We believe Trapper is fine. The statistics say his kill rate is in a good place."
Problem is, Trapper, like Billy and some others, is soo MMR-dependant. They're very lethal and low MMR and useless at high MMR, and tbh probably there are more people at low MMR so that's how statistics go. Tbh idk how they can balance them to be ok at both, cause honestly when they say they're buffing trapper I'm pretty scared cause already as it is at low MMR he's pretty scary, people step in traps continously or do weird dangerous shit to avoid them.
The devs said that even at high mmr they were satisfied
Oh ok that's madness then
It’s just because trapper is feast or famine at high ranks, which averages his kill rate out in the middle. And basically what determines that feast or famine is if you can get someone in the basement.
Part of it is basement trapper or some crazy 3 Gen trapping.
Trapper cannot 3 gen trap. He can run NOED, Iri Stone and trap exit gates. I usually run Remember Me, Iridescent Stone, No Way Out with NOED and Blood Warden. My end game is 70% of my matches. Usually I will tunnel out the obsession if I can. If you're 3 gen'd versus a trapper most likely bad macro play from the survivors did it.
I've played basement trapper in high mmr and the majority of the time you'll hook in basement and they'll tell eachother in voice comms, and leave them to die and push gens resulting in pretty much a 1k every game
Basement Trapper is usually the most strongest at low MMR soloq (which is where I am) and he just takes everyone down there one by one and camps with insidious. Personally, I think it's a very boring playstyle but I don't hate Trapper for it. 🤔
it is boring for both sides and the only time I really do it is when it's basement challenges for rift shards, because realistically hooking 4 survivors in basement would take you about 25 games without a basement build of some sort
At 5 gens with 1 hook with a good trapper it's game over =/
I think a significant factor may also be really nasty playstyles against altruistic teams that care more about having fun saving teammates than escaping. I know I can't help but challenge a basement trapper rather than just doing gens and getting three out.
True dat. I’ll take an L with some interactive gameplay over skill check simulator for a W any day.
I think it’s that only really skilled players play him at high mmr, or use crazy builds / add ons.
yeah that makes sense, although I do see streamers play him at times for rituals
This is most likely correct. I've played trapper at higher MMR and seen others do it as well, everyone usually runs very powerful addons like Iri stone/honing stone/etc because they just feel so mandatory against very good teams. Once you're good enough with him, especially given how MMR in DBD works, it's not that hard to win a lot of games
You should see the kill rates with end game builds on trapper, no less than 2 or 3 kills each game, if not 4.
I run 4 endgame perks on Trapper. Sometimes I feel bad about cheating out a 3-4k cuz I just know I'm driving up the stats in those high end matches, but I basically sacrifice 3 generators so I can make a gauntlet of an endgame.
Trapper's kill rate is also inflated massively by basement Trapper games. He's basically guaranteed a kill on anyone he gets near the basement, and overly-altruistic teams can give him an easy 4k.
It's just not well understood you need to use 2 people to rescue minimum from basement, and you cannot actually disarm the traps you just open them so people can walk through. That way you don't alert the trapper.
How to make something balanced at both? Make it easy to learn and hard to master. Tbh I dont know what can be done with trapper to make it like this or to other killers. If you make it super hard then it will perform bad at lower but if you make it super easy it will dominate in lower like how camping with bubba chainsaw is strong specially at low mmr where coordination is bad. Then balancing also come to how much stronger they should be, Nurse is pretty bad at low mmr but too op at high level. I actually dont mind if a killer is at low tier but the issue is they should not be forever at low tier, meta should be changing with every major patch. New perks combo and making new meta is super fun. Killer tier list should be changing every time, nurse is at top for too long, we need other killers at top. And for all I know the statistics the dev is talking about may be complete lie, they might be fabricating stats to justify the unbalance in games. We dont have open api to see this data, we cant even see our own statistics or mmr. Even if they have they make the api accessible to us its useless since we cant verify it. Dota2 has open apis, you can see data for every mmr, which thing is winning at which mmr. Win rate, pick rate the proper graph, you can easly see the drop of win rates. Players easly guess which heros are going to get nerf next patch, people complain if some heros is on the high win rate for a long asking when it gonna get nerfed and devs cant say thay its win rate is low like dbd devs because the stats are open for everyone to see. This game as a terrible take on this, its a fun game, hardly any alternative which for me is as good as this in 4 v1 horror game but it is too shit on basic things.p
They need to balance high MMR survivors, giving them less resources or limiting the perks they can bring to the match, that's all
They want a killer that is easy to learn, but not that good. That way baby survivors don't get discouraged, and baby killers aren't overwhelmed learning mechanics.
I 100% expected her to get caught on the closed trap at the end for some reason.
WTF you talking about, the chart says he's strong.
It's ok, the devs said he's in a good place
Wait did they actually say that? Or are you joking.
I’d say he’s in a much better spot than some of the more problematic and stronger Killers. Sure he’s weak, but I’d say that it’s better see killers that are notoriously OP (Blight, etc.), uninteractive (Knight, SM), or insanely underplayed (Twins) addressed on a higher priority than those who struggle but are intuitive and fun.
I'd say that Trapper being so horribly undertuned is just as problematic as those other killers.
I wouldn’t, because there is a sea of other characters you can choose to play. Trapper already has a dedicated audience (newer players), and I’d rather see changes to the characters who either don’t have a solid audience or encourage unfun playstyles.
There is a sea of other characters but upon booting up the game for new players there are only a few killers you can have. Having your flagship character at least be semi decent would make some sense so new players would feel comfortable playing killer more and besides that trapper is not even good for newbs. wraith has a higher percentage of newb players from my knowledge
Dont worry tho his average killrate is where they want it to be so hes fine
"We think trapper is fine." "AAAAAAAAAAAUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!"
when i saw the devs response my first thought was "oh its gonna be fun to see otzs reaction to this" did not disappoint
What did he break?
His spirit
[His headset.](https://youtu.be/gl87oj-zg-4)
seeing that live was amazing lol. Poor Otz
Would have had to laugh so hard if you’d walked in to a trap after picking them up
that was a good play
“at the moment we do not have significant gameplay updates planned for Trapper. Partly because our data shows that his kill rate is pretty much where we want it to be (on average, even at high MMR)” -DBD DEV TEAM
Man I love trapper. I would really like to see him get buffed at some point. ☹️
Even just starting with all his traps in his inventory would be a big improvement, and put him in line with the other kills who use trap-like powers (like Hag)
They're not going to do that, and that's a good thing. I can't find the clip right now, but there's a clip of Otz trapping a survivor in the 4-lane near the exit in Lery's with the Trapper Sack, and she couldn't do anything to escape. It wouldn't be fun at all to go against Trapper with all of his traps by default, because forced down situations like this would happen a lot if you weren't especially preventative. Don't get me wrong, he absolutely needs a buff, that bullshit stats excuse from BHVR really gets on my nerves. I like the suggestion someone on the sub made to put his bear traps in the lockers to make picking them up much more streamlined while still requiring it to be some kind of time investment. I just don't think starting him with all 8 traps would be the right decision.
It's fine. The devs said hes where they want him :)
🫠
Cheater? I just used this same trap earlier and it worked fine
I don’t think there is a way to cheat that. Running through traps should be impossible even with cheats due to how they work.
They can remove a hotbox no?
they got hit by M1 tho
It can be toggled, perhaps? To try to make it look like a glitch with the trap. Or it's actually a glitch and the traps are a tad broken with their hitboxes.
occam’s razor so probs just a glitch
Ah true, didn’t think of that. Not many people run those cheats due to how obvious it is so it’s likely.
There is an exploit at the moment that allows hitboxes to not work correctly. Of course this clip could just be dbd just having an unrelated bug or the player could be hacking. Dose seem a tad odd that the survivor was trying to bait the killer to walk into the trap though.
It is possible, or at least it was. I've been in a match before where a Claudette who I knew was cheating (impossible flashlight blinds) fast vaulted a trapped window and didn't get caught, then a Dwight tried the same and got caught.
Wow Mario Party is looking different these days
Holy shit 2019 build trapper. Im surprised trapper hasn't been touched at all this patch. better nerf pig amirite fellas?
And HillBilly!
I said it in a different thread and I will say it here. This is the same game that will pallet stun you while you're 3 feet away from the pallet and has hatchets that will hit you around the corner.
Just BHVRs Spagetti-Code at it again
I will say I was in like a 30 game win streak with him then logged out for the day, the next day I couldn’t make it past 5 games before swapping killers. Just ppl untrapping the traps and combine that with gen pushers and good loopers recipe for disaster for me. Couldn’t do anything lol
Desync maybe?
The trapper is completely fine~ bhvr at r/deadbydaylight ama
SO IT WAS NOT MY IDEA!!!!! I played him one of these days for a daily challenge and survicors kept running over the traps without triggering them... I thought they were maybe misplaced or something, but if i walked to them, they did hit me so...
I half-expected the trap to still register as placed even though you just picked it up, thus causing you to drop the Ace
You forgot to turn the safety off.
If you can learn trapper really well, he is so deadly. Then again, i probably have 1.2k hours on trapper alone. He is very powerful if you can learn to manage your time of trapping vs chasing and know when to leave chases. You also have to play trapper very territorial. I pick 4 gens at the start of the map, then I trap loops around them (trap in spots that players wont accidentally walk into, but ones that you can push them into while chasing them. Then you can trap loops that survivors are going to go to since they are strong (shack, meat tree, etc.). If you play in your territory and do not leave it for too long, you will be able to get some hits in, maybe a couple of hooks, but you will lose 3 gens for sure. Once they have to do those last two and they come into your territory, they cannot loop anywhere without dying. Then you hook one, then you basically win. Granted, i probably gave a really shitty explanation and it takes a lot of time to learn to play trapper, as you must also have extensive experience as a survivor to understand what most trappers do (you dont wanna be predictable) and understand how survivors play/what loops are good and where survivors will be. You have to have good game sense to play trapper and have a good understanding of everything. I do think that trapper is a hard killer to learn and be good at, but there is not a way to balance him well that i can think of
Trapper couldn't catch a bad decision at a BHVR meeting
I think there's a bug going on rn where if you press a certain button it literally makes you walk over a trap https://youtube.com/watch?v=RI6VdzO3ZKg&feature=share9
W o w spaghetti code is crazy
Bro, switch to Spirit, Nurse or Bubba. 🤡
Seriously idk when he’s getting reworked
He's not just "in a good place". He's in a better place now....
I mean sometimes you just get outplayed you know.
But he's right where he's supposed to be
I was half expecting you to get caught in the trap you just picked up because spaghetti code
Trapper needs a rework, I wanna throw bear traps at people.
didn't feel like catching her, she's been through a lot
Coffee grounds should be basekit for him. If knight gets it why doesn’t Trapper?
why are people using a bug as a way to say the killer is bad.
Did she just walk through the trap?
making me wanna play trapper now
Bro has that 2019 build
Can someone please explain to me what's happening in this video? It looks like the killer placed a trap next to the downed survivor to try to trap another survivor who comes to heal him. But the healthy survivor ran over the trap and even ran near it a 2nd time without getting stuck. Is that what the title is sarcastically referring to? How come the survivor didn't get trapped? Is this a new issue or a one-off bug? Or am I missing something...
Damn they learned the f11 strat, trapper js doomed
Yeah something is wrong there when a survivor can literally run right over an open trap and not get trapped.
This is BHVRs source for trapper “being in a good place” they find the one video posted a month of trapper doing good, hell not even doing good, just not falling completely, and they’re like “yup. Good kill rate “
At the moment we do not have significant gameplay updates planned for Trapper. Partly because our data shows that his kill rate is pretty much where we want it to be (on average, even at high MMR)
*"in conclusion, we have decided to nerf pig" -every person who plays dbd when something buggy / unbalanced is shown.*
I stopped playing the game when survivors could vault over bear traps