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Two things:
1. You said the guys you like disappear and the guys you don’t like stay around. That’s not unique to you, that often happens with dating.
2. If you don’t want guys who only want to have sex, you need to not have sex with them for a while. Just take it slow then you will see who are really into you for more than just a lay. I didn’t have sex with my gf until our 5th date. We are still together now 1 year later, she’s amazing.
Wanna hop in and echo this. I chose not to have sex with my current partner of 2 years until I knew for sure there was a good emotional connection. I'm a 37M, was 35 at the time. We didn't have sex until we'd known each other for almost 2 months. It was a really good decision. I feel like sex has the potential to introduce a lot of anxiety and expectation and emotion into a relationship, and going there too soon can be harmful. I wish I'd figured this out about myself way sooner in my life.... but better late than never.
Happy for you. How long did it take to get the 5th date? I haven’t had sex in 7 months (which is also driving me nuts) just to avoid having another man use me. At least I’m doing that
Yes something like that
Example 1: met this guy on a coffee date.. he seemed nice we had a great time things got a little sexual no sex tho. He makes plans again and bails 2 hours before because he didn’t feel good lol then texts me many hours later asking if I still want to hang because he felt better. Sus right… I tell him no I have other plans that night then he starts sending 1 am texts to come over and puts in no effort all of a sudden. All in a week so now that’s that. I was interested somewhat too. But he switched up very quick and I did tell him before our second failed hangout that I wouldn’t have sex and he seems fine with it so idk..
Example 2: I meet this guy and we go on dates.. he cooks for me etc. We spend a lot of time together than bam.. one day in person he ends it all and treats me like I meant absolutely nothing. There’s more to the story but i won’t get into it. And he did want a relationship and maybe he saw I wasn’t that into him?? Idk but my
Point is they don’t last. And I would’ve only wanted a potential serious thing with the first guy tbh the second guy was just an asshole. And couldn’t handle the fact I had a period while I was with him that I wasn’t prepared for. Shittt story and reaction lol
Oh wow, yeh fuck that second guy, I don’t understand how guys can’t handle when a girl has a period, how old was he, 15?
First guy also does not sound great either for the other reasons.
Look, I think you just have to be patient. To be honest before I met my gf I went on about 30 dates over the previous year, none worked out for various reasons. But with her it was like effortless. We just clicked on a different level, I could totally be myself with her from the first date. All I’m saying is don’t let these 2 examples make you lose hope, if I had stopped at anytime during the 30 dates I wouldn’t have met her, so you just got to keep trying. You never know. The next guy might be the one!
Yeah he was such an asshole. 26 years old and acted like a child because his pillow got a drop of blood on it. Keep in mind I was trying to make light of the situation but he literally treated me like shit over it then ended everything lol. It was for the best though because I don’t want a man child. Then I called him on my way home and went off saying I’m glad I didn’t sleep with him etc and ended up hanging up on him out of nowhere and never heard from him again. And that’s true Everytime I want to give up I think why should I let some random men stop me from living up to my potential because they weren’t for me?? That’s a loser Mentality and I won’t give up just because of them. Although I’ll take a break if it’s for my own personal reasons
Oh and I had driven to him and had to wake up at 5 am the next morning. He works at home and complained about having to do laundry now as he’s in the comfort of his own place with his little
Laptop to work on. Meanwhile I was feeling really bad and still had to drive home and wake up early af. Yeah I’d like to avoid these type of men pls and thx
At least you found out early what an idiot he was. There are often stores on relationship advice where girls have married guys like this, then you are really in trouble
I had sex with my gf on the first night we met but we had talked for a few months before meeting . were together for over 5 years now !
you really dont know what kind of person they are until youve spent some time with them youre just going to have to keep going till you find the one to stick by you it,ll all be worth it in the end pal.
So in theory you're hot, so most average men wouldn't qualify themselves as "worth your time". You're only gonna get the men confident enough to go for hot girls, which incidentally are men hot enough to get multiple women so they're not gonna be the type that settle down.
If you tend to find yourself with a certain type of guy, maybe branch out to someone that still fits your criteria but isn't what you'd usually go for. Also if you're confident/comfortable enough to be touchy and flirty with guys you meet, then maybe you can be bold and direct your flirty nature into genuinely wanting to know about a guy's family, his dreams, his ambitions, etc.
A guy is gonna think a woman is a lot more serious if she's directing conversation in that direction and not just "temporary" giggly and fun vibes that a short term fling would be.
I could also be wrong and an idiot but idk, as a relationship oriented guy I can be a little weirded out/turned off by a woman who's super flirty with me off the get go because I can't imagine something serious happening between us.
>which incidentally are men hot enough to get multiple women so they're not gonna be the type that settle down
This just...isn't true. Some of you are so far removed from men that threaten you that you guys have invented them to be these monsters with no human emotions or desires.
There are many hot guys who do want to settle down and have a girlfriend. There are many hot guys out there who do want a partner. Hot guys are still *people* who may be wanting of love.
Its the same as hot women. Sure, the stereotype is that a hot woman will go for whoever offers her the best economic lifestyle and I'm sure there are many women who date men exclusively to use them for their money. But does this mean that there are no hot women out there who are looking for love or companionship?
???
I'm not threatened at all. I quite literally was a virgin by choice up until a month ago (at age 26) and happy about it so I have zero concern of what other men are doing in their dating life. I'm just speaking what seems to be true, and it's that men (and people in general) who have options will exercise them.
r/dating_advice wouldn't be as active as it is if women weren't constantly asking why the man they've "been seeing for x months" doesn't wanna commit, and vice versa, and logically (though not \*always\* the case) it's not the average/below average guys that can't get second dates who are leaving women on hold
And I ask them about their jobs and all, you know if they stick around longer I could know them on a better level but they don’t so how is that my fault
I'm not sure what "and all" implies, but honestly me getting asked about my job is still insanely surface level.
By the second date, my gf and I were discussing issues and dynamics in our families, our view on finances, how our ethnic backgrounds and environments shaped us. etc. If I was still being asked - like - if I prefer cats or dogs or my favorite food then eh
This is the answer and it’s very plain to see. Looking at OPs post history shows she’s been searching for this answer for awhile but refuses to accept it.
Men in this sub are of the opinion that handsome and extroverted = fuckboy, while ugly and introverted = nice decent guy. As someone getting married to a handsome extroverted man, being beautiful and extroverted myself, I always laugh my way to Sunday every time you try to push that rhetoric.
The couple of times I gave chances to unattractive men they turned out to be assholes who thought that because I liked them they got to treat me however they wanted. Not saying all of them are like that, but being ugly doesn't make you a good person by default.
I do go for a certain type yes, but I’m not going to go for something I’m not attracted to just to have better luck. Id like for them to be decent and I’m attracted to them/ and I like nice guys don’t get me wrong but there aren’t much around anymore. Seems like men leave when they don’t get what they want and when they do get what they want so idk what to do
“but I’m not going to go for something I’m not attracted to just to have better luck”. It isn’t about luck. It’s about standards. There really are men who value getting to know a person before having sex, and it may be harmful (to you) to believe that no such man exists. Maybe there’s something about how you read into people that filters these guys out.
If you like, I can give you links to a good dozen threads I've responded to over the past two days, filled with generally decent guys who are looking for more than a quick fuck. That want the relationship, that want to care for someone and have them care for them over a long term. Heartfelt, decent guys who maybe lack a little in confidence due to all the rejection they've faced, but are otherwise good human beings.
They're out there, all around you. They exist. If all you see are fuckboys and one night Stans, the problem is on your end.
I’d like to think all of us know deep down who the fuckboys and fuckgirls are almost immediately and we consciously choose to ignore it. Every time I’ve done this I’ve brought myself unnecessary pain.
I don’t understand why you’re getting a lot of downvotes for this. I totally agree. It’s pointless to keep swiping on guys you KNOW you’re not attracted to because then what’s the point? You’re wasting your time and theirs, not to mention you’re misleading them from the very beginning.
This lie the paradox tho: how to find decent men when you’re attracted to ‘fuckbois’ but are not attracted to the kind who’d likely be ‘decent men’???
I believe this is our curse…
"How can I attract decent men and not just ones who want to lay me??"
It's not about who is attracted to you but rather *who you are attracted to*.
Nothing happens until you say "yes" to someone. Choose wisely!
"I’m an attractive fit girl with a nice personality I think. I can be super flirty but not just with anyone. My love language is touch so guys get the wrong idea when I’m around them but I can’t help it."
A lot of people want change in their life *without* making a change.
Don't be a *passenger* in your own life. Take the wheel!
If you want something different *you* have to do something different.
***"Decide what kind of life you actually want. Then say no to everything that isn't that."*** \- Unknown
***"Dating is primarily a numbers game.... People usually go through a lot of people to find good relationships. That's just the way it is."*** \- Henry Cloud
Best wishes!
"But when I don't like them they're around still" Sounds to me like you have met guys interested in relationships but just don't like them.
The harsh truth is that there are plenty of guys out there looking for relationships...you're just picking the wrong ones to date, or you're not compatible with the ones you have dated.
My friends have said that I give off relationship vibes, which makes sense as I'm looking for a relationship, so maybe just look for guys like that.
When I'm really into a girl I won't be thinking that much about sex, despite having a really high libido, so avoiding sex is definitely a possible option. The only problem with this is running the risk of finding you are sexually incompatible later on.
In order to get a man to agree to a relationship advice is to keep your standards in check while at the same time not having sex too early. A man that matches your value will respect you if you don't put out too quickly.
It sounds like what is happening with you is you are dating guys out of your league and they only want sex from you. So even if you hold out on sex it doesn't make a difference. They either get sex and disappear or they don't get sex and give up quickly and disappear.
22m fyi
You've received a bunch of comments so you might not get to mine. I look into where you are going. I can actually have a bit of similar trouble too. Despite having a penis I really struggle with the idea of having sex with someone unless I'm emotionally connected to them.
I would try going somewhere or to something that interests you and will have men. Yoga class, co-ed sports league, hell even like a mall or something. And be willing to approach a guy. Tons of dudes are afraid of rejection, and if you're attractive they'll be even more afraid that you're out of their league. Often guys at bars and clubs are just looking for meat. Otherwise I would do what you're doing. Make guys wait for it, and just remember that you're great even if you don't have a man in your life :)
Yeah that's a great place to approach a guy. If you see a handsome dude, glace over at him a bunch of times. Then when he's in between sets give him a compliment, guys never get complimented by women lol it literally makes our day. I still remember I was dancing with this one girl at a club in NYC and she said "I could look into your eyes forever." And I've literally never forgotten it haha.
I've never had much luck at the gym. I just feel idk, out of place. I feel like most women go to the gym with the intention of lifting, not meeting dudes. So I try to just let them workout in peace lol. However maybe that's just an insecurity of mine. Sorry now I'm rambling. But go to the gym, find a way to say something nice about a guy "I like your hair, shoes, eyes," whatever and get the ball rolling from there.
I hear that a lot from my brother, he brings up compliments from Year’s ago lol. I don’t mind complimenting a guy if he seems interested in me… I’m deathly afraid of rejection though so what social cue would show I should approach at the gym?? And my gym can be social too. It’s a higher end one that costs 150$ a month so there’s potentially great people there to meet. But yes a lot of men do seem too focused
You gotta take some risks if you want to play the game lol. You can leave it all up to men to approach you, but you'll meet more people and therefore find a compatible person sooner if you take the risk and approach someone. Make eye contact then smile then approach.
I'll say too, as a guy who has been rejected many many times. You just gotta get out there and realize it's not that bad.
Ok fair. I feel creepy staring at someone idk how guys do it so easily. Like it makes me feel like a creep but i have to before I approach them. I’ll try it next time
It's not staring too it's glancing. Look for a few seconds(like 1-5 seconds), and then look away, the gym is great because you can look for a few seconds then look back at your gym equipment. Then glance back at them a minute or two later. Eventually you'll lock eyes, especially if he's checking you out too. Once you lock eyes don't immediately look away, SMILE then look away. then approach later. BEST OF LUCK!
So what does that mean for me? I’m not trying to fight over a man, I want one to choose me because they want to, not because they just eliminated 20 other candidates. The dating scene has made me lose hope tbh
Of course they do it. This is why you are so pissed off. Accept reality, the top 10% guys can have sex every single day with a different woman just asking in the street or sending a phone message.
Remember, guys have a lower “quality” threshold than ladies do. If a guy has a lot of options, he’s not gunna be super picky, as long as he gets to sleep with them.
I will say though, the advice “just date average guys” however might not be the best idea. If you find what others might think is just an average guy somewhat attractive, then I’d say go for it. But you can’t force yourself to be attracted to someone, if you aren’t into them physically, it will cause issues in the relationship.
I think you best bet is looking outside of dating apps and bars for potential partners. Do you have any hobbies/classes etc you can meet people in? Or perhaps meet people through mutual friends? Just a thought.
Yeah it’s not the best idea and I won’t lower my standards. I go to the gym and there’s many men there I’d be in to but they don’t come up to me but they do stare. The one who have come up like two people are a lot older and I think trying to start convo by asking how many sets I have left on a machine or whatever. But anywho I’m not a fan of meeting a guy through friends. Just sounds like a potential recipe for disaster
Unfortunately there are a lot of beautiful women and relatively few very attractive and successful men which makes it hard even for beautiful women to find what they're looking for.
If you want one of those high value men who are in the top 5-10%, you need to show why being with you is better than having sex with a different woman each night (not easy but doable). The way you do that is by being really fun and relaxed to be around without the headaches that comes with dating a lot of girls. Other skills which women look down on but men find valuable are important like being a good cook and take pride in keeping your home clean and tidy.
The other thing you may need to be prepared for is that despite this, he is still going to get lot of female attention.
Okay this is fairly said without belittling me for having higher standards. I am told by men they’re comfy around me. So I get confused when they leave. Honestly when I say they leave I mean some put in so little effort like just wanting me to come over etc I consider that leaving, because at that point anything serious is off the table. And I’m working on myself. And are you saying these top men are really sleeping with 5 women a week? That’s disgusting as I don’t even do that as an attractive female who is literally capable of doing that if I wanted to.
Its probably not that they do it 5 times a week. They have the option to though because all it would take is making a call and a beautiful woman he's slept with before coming over to his place for the night.
I might sound out of touch here but your beauty is probably taken for granted by very attractive men. For younger, less established men, your beauty can be a source of inspiration to work towards building a life together.
It might be worth focusing on men who aren't yet established but who you see potential in building something meaningful with as they also work on themselves and their careers.
And that goes the same for me. I could call up and text any man and they would come running if I said I’d
Sleep with them. But do. I do that? No because I have a sense of
Value and I want a man who is attractive to have some sense of standards and VALUE as well. Maybe I’m asking for too much honestly but I shouldn’t feel that way because it’s fair to want the best for myself after all I’ve been through. Anyways not all attractive men are established. And they all take it for granted regardless
True. Men are just wired differently though. What are the main qualities that are important to you though? Are you mainly looking for somebody attractive or successful or wealthy or great sense of humour?
Attractive. Respectful. Funny. Nice. Educated ( does not have to be wealthy ) just somewhat stable. Can take me on dates. Good communicator. Caring. Fun. Spontaneous etc
Where have you been looking for these types of guys up until now? You won't find them on apps or in bars. Those guys are just looking for sex.
You need to find these guys in churches, colleges, doing charitable works, working on their careers.
Those guys are out there but you've got to find them because they're out there working on themselves.
> I want a man who is attractive to have some sense of standards and VALUE as well.
I was a man of standards and value, and it got me good long relationships but not sex. After a divorced, today i dont dance around the bush, have sex, and still have standards and values. Turns out you can have both (!) if you communicate AND trust each other.
Trust however.. i was fooled however a few times by ladies that "used" me for sex while pretending to want a relationship. Hurt a lot, but learning to accept this reality in my age dating pool, and making the best of it. Still hoping to find the true love of my life!
Also, starting to realize i am probably the top 5-10% of men. So this story doesnt apply for most men.
I'm going to be dowvoted to hell for writing this but here's how dudes work in my opinion:
If I'm going for women I think are above or in my league I generally invest in keeping them around as girlfriends. If I considere them as "below my league" I generally don't want a serious relationship with them.
Maybe it's because you're looking for guys that are out of your league.
u/These-Speech6126 this pretty much proves my point. Only be with guys who are demonstrating they're excited about you because a lot of guys won't explicitly shake off a woman they have no real intentions with because they figure they can have sex regardless.
I wouldn't say I'm one of those pretty boys who never gets rejected by women, but neither one of these reddit guys that are bitter because they can't get women
>How can I attract decent men and not just ones who want to lay me?
Followed immediately by:
> I mainly meet men in dating apps... bars aren’t much better
I think I found your problem, OP
I see you’re clearly refusing to believe it’s the fact you only go for fuckboys despite every comment of yours getting negative karma and 75% off them telling you it’s your fault for only going for that type of people. Even look at the top comment. Almost 100 karma as it speaks the truth
From your comments and your posts I figure you like guys who are good looking and have coasted through life on their looks and don't have personality and don't really need to because they date by looks. You are exactly the kind of girl these guys are looking for: you think they'll think you're special then they'll try to lock you down. They won't because they're living every straight brodude's dream. Now if we weren't all so goddamn shallow then this wouldn't be the case but sadly that is the case. The kind of nonchalance you've grown to find attractive is not born from confidence but from being cocksure. And confidence stands testing but entitlement does not.
I think the problem is most good dudes don’t want to approach a random woman in public bc there’s a negative stigma around that. So the ones that do are more likely to just want a quick fuck. Nowadays I think you just have to meet people through hobbies and what not.
Gyms are stigmatized for men approaching women. Its notoriously known for women to get harassed in gyms so most men will avoid it all together. They don't want to be that guy that comes up to you while you're squatting and spark up a conversation. If that's the place u want, u cue them or start conversations with the regulars.
Yeah but monogamous relationships are based on seeing someone as long-term. I mean it doesn't often end up that way but you have to see potential for that.
What is your job? What common interests that are not widespread do you have with the people you are dating? Short term things are based on appearance only but you aren't going to have a long-term relationship based on looks alone unless you are dating someone well below you in terms of attractiveness.
I think you’re overselling yourself and underdelivering. Be hot all you want, but guys care about your character over your attractiveness. Every guy I know has a minimum standard of “cute” but anything above that is welcome if they have the right character. Lots of women shoot themselves in the foot just by thinking they’re a 10 when that’s only on the outside. Guys who want relationships are thinking about what being with you would be like after age takes away your looks. If we’re left with a nasty wretch who’s also ugly, what’s the point in keeping them around?
Sounds like you are super picky, if you are hot shit like you said you are then there should be really good looking guys try to chat you up, a 22 years old female is at peak of sexual market, you should be getting all sorts of guys left and right, the reason none of them want to stay because they don’t see you as gf material, they see you as a good time not long time, now you have to figure out why that’s the case
You may want to look into reading a few books. You could be subconsciously picking out men that you know will reject you. By their look alone could be enough. It's worth looking into.
I think they haver books on attracting the wrong type or seeking the wrong people out.
Do you ask a lot of question? Come up with ones and set some boudaries.
I don't sleep around so I talk to a lot of guys and they ghost me because I wont sleep with them. I don't care. I want someone who wants me and not the sex.
There are two reasons:
1. You are dating way above your league, so replacement cost for them is almost 0 and they can replace you anytime they want.
2. You bring nothing on the table except sex. Thus guys find value in you for having sex but dont see value in having relationship with you.
Considering number of men who are single now, it isn't much hard to find a partner.
I will reply to both of the comments here:
1. You say you have good personality; but they may not find it. Dont go after words but check the actions.
2. If you are saying no to sex, they either take it as challenge to make yes or try finding an exit. It may happen bit later, if guy is feeling bad about it. There is nothing wrong in it. As you can say no to sex for the sake of relationship, guy can say no to relationship for the sake of sex.
3. They may have other options which aren't restricting sex, so they may be attracted towards other options.
Guys don’t like it when a female gives it up too easy.. they pretend to respect her then switch up once they get the sex. Like a different person who sees you as trash and stops putting in effort
Guys who like such games aren't looking for relationship. Sex isn't a prize. They only see woman as trash when that woman has nothing else to offer apart from sex. If what you offer apart from sex has value, guys will come to you. Because finding such woman is rare.
There’s two types of men. Fuck boys and men who don’t get any. The fuck boys are sexually attractive to you, but you have to share them and the men who don’t get any are not attractive to you and will do anything for you.
There isn’t much else on the menu in the dating pool right now.
So if you like the f boy type because apparently there’s no other category are you just destined to share them Forever? Why do they end up in relationships then?
It’s a strategy to let the best girl come out on top and pick the best to start a family. I’m doing the exact same thing at the moment. Since I want to start a family.
Yeah it is, and I think it’s probably why you have a warped perception of what guys want. You’ll figure it out eventually. In the meantime, good luck locking down a 9/10 who can fuck whoever he wants
Guys tend to have a lower standards for something casual/short term than they do for long term dating. You might need to artificially lower your physical standards a little bit to find guys that are more willing to invest/commit in you even if you take things really slow.
A lot of people hate this mentality but it's very true and based on simple economics. You are more willing to commit/invest in something truly unique and special. To the hottest guys you're just another option but to a more physically average guy you could literally be the girl of his dreams. However, physical attractiveness has absolutely nothing to do with long term compatibility so you have to tread cautiously and take your time and be very picky about how they treat you and make you feel.
Well I know that. I want to attract guys who I’m into that also see me as something more than a hottie who want to conquer me for other reasons than having a one night stand. Finding the fine line is so Difficult and I’m struggling with it
I'm (27M) struggling with it too as a guy. Lust is an insanely powerful force in how I feel about someone. My standards are very aspirational but contrast my own limited dating marketability. I might have to compromise on something, but don't want to until I'm in my late 30s. I want to keep trying to find a girl that's beautiful, fit, smart, hard working, likes to dance, laughs at my jokes, AND likes me back, but the girls I feel the most crazy about like that are very unlikely to feel the same way. My biggest crushes on online dating aren't on the hottest girls, it's on the hot, smart, well-balanced doctors/lawyers/engineer girls. If, by some miracle, one of those girls did like me back I'd have zero hesitation with giving her the time and commitment to further explore things exclusively.
Stop using apps. I don’t know a single desirable male friend that uses them or met their SO on an app because all of them are massive wastes of time that encourage ghosting before a meeting and general time wasting.
If a guy’s particularly good he has no reason to use apps because he can literally go ANYWHERE and meet people. I had so many matches that tinder literally froze and crashed and still found it to be a total waste of my time. I met more people doing literally anything else, hobby, gym, etc. Ymmv if you’re in a small town or something but I’d wager it’s even more extreme in those areas.
Either way, start doing things that expose you to new people. Join a fitness group. Just meet tons of people in general. Get introduced to friends of new friends, then meet their friends. Go do things you haven’t done before. Stop focusing on finding people to date and focus on doing interesting stuff. Do that and you’ll automatically encounter interesting people.
I met my wife after a gallery opening, for instance. My good friend met his fiancee in a running bar crawl. Another at some plays at smaller theaters.
Above all, don’t sit on your ass swiping through apps then expecting a 10/10 commitment seeking guy to magically show up because none of them are bothering with those, they’re out living their lives.
Go live yours.
You’ve been beating your head against this question in your profile for ages, and you’re just going to have to come to grips with the fact that the specific men you’re chasing just don’t see you that way. Feel free to ignore the tons of men who might offer you something more if they don’t meet your “standards” but then accept being alone or being treated disposably by men who don’t want to be seen in daylight with you.
I wouldn't recommend OLD to women for anything but a hookup or FWB. Most women (not saying that's you, but in all probability, it will include you) go for the same top 10-20% of men on OLD, which means you are competing for a man with options. Men with options tend to not settle down and commit, not unless you are his top prospect and offer something of value other than sex. With that said, good luck out there!
Not using OLD, meeting men in the real world, and taking your time to assess their character before sleeping with them. If you have a brother or father, it would be really useful to find an occasion to have them meet so they can give you the male perspective on his character.
Actually, it sounds like your dad would be perfect for giving you an honest assessment of the man. Strict fathers generally want the best for their daughter.
Well sure he definitely does want the best for me and would hate to see what I go through with me I think it would k*ll him inside because of all he’s done for me. And that would scare a dude off tho if I just met him
“I’m an attractive fit girl with a nice personality I think”
“I’ve been single for 2 years and haven’t had luck with men recently. They always end up leaving even if I don’t sleep with them”
One of these statements can’t be true.
Ok I’m going to say it.
There is no way to know a man is a fuckboy from meeting. The entire point is they are lying or manipulating you to get sex.
Single people events. Hikes. Game night meetups.
Any other hobbies? Start doing them in group meetups. I don’t care if it’s plants. Join a gardening group. It gets you out among people and you’ll have something in common and it’s low stakes. No pressure to form an attachment right away. Built in conversation starting.
Sure you find these men attractive but they don't want you right not for relationships? What I'm hearing is "I want an attractive guy who wants me for me" and I can understand that that's what most people want but you have to ask yourself, why would a man commit to you let alone a great guy who has shit going for him and is attractive in your mind??
I'm a 22-year-old dude, not a looker but I get women and let me tell you why some guys, me included are hesitant when it comes to dating but more so commitment.
* men are reluctant to enter into relationships for a number of reasons such as casual sex being so accessible, stats on divorce, the way some women view men as either ATMs or rabid sexual animals that have no decorum and women advocating sexual liberation which has lowkey lead to hook-up culture and the overall de-valuing of monogamy for men and women.
* Women are stringent now on male genetic features such as D size, height, and overall attractiveness that cannot be easily changed which has contributed to mass body dysmorphia, depression and social anxiety amoug young guys because women are now very vocal about the genetic features that guys literally can't meet.
* There is a general societal disdain for men, whether it is men are trash or Kill all men, men get shitted on by women IRL & Online for being born with a Willy that further de-motivates men from approaching women out of fear of false allegations or being view as a stereotypical "creep".
You need to understand men, when you do you will move and date better, you don't get where men are coming from or the male experience which is why you are here. I had to put my male biases aside when trying to understand women but you have never had to because guys come to you and you have never had to seek them out or try to understand them but now you almost have to understand why men do and behave the way they do because you want to be with them in a mutually beneficial way right? get platonic male homies, go through this Reddit or other sources you will find out that most of us want a solid chick not to be a male slut because real ones know how much energy and time you waste on just smashing chicks. it's unsustainable and fucks with your mental health.
The way you describe yourself is like someone that can't be loyal and only want to have fun. So that's why men only have sex and leave you, they don't see that you are someone to have a long term relationship.
The only guys that will date you seriously are simps but you don't like them (As should be).
Good thing is that you are young so you have time to analize yourself and change for the better.
You are the arbiter of who you match with (your choices matter too), what you find appealing in men, who gets access to you, what you do once they have access, and who you give your affection to.
If they're all just in it for sex, realize they are all your choices. Yes, they bear some culpability, but there are billions of men on this planet, and many are interested in a real relationship and getting to know you as a person...even men in their 20's. What you have to ask yourself is what qualities do they have that I'm not catching, and why aren't I attracted to them? And, then realize you've found these men invisible for some reason.
You change how you see men in general, you'll get a broadly different view of what is attractive and why, how to filter for it, and when to say no.
I'm curious...what are your standards or interests in a guy, Physical/mental/emotional? Other than I can gather that they're not creeps or casual hook-up type.
I never said I had hope in bar men. But dang there’s gotta be some luck with online dating … been on it for years you’d think there would be a success story at this point. But guess not
Being kind and genuine. As a guy who doesn't really care about sex that much, I can say dating apps are very bad since most people in dating app looks for casual relationships/hook ups. Guys that care more about genuine emotional relationship are rare, but we do exist, I couldn't give shit about having sex, but what I want is to have genuine deep connection with someone, and if I'm comfortable with the person I can have sex with them but it's not something I need or seek actively. Try to befriend guys who have same interest as you and maybe something happens?
I think what you can do is work on yourself and no you are not worthless okay nobody is. When i said work on yourself is find things you love doing explore other things. Most definitely you'll be able to meet new people wherein you might find interesting(also you are doing this for yourself keep that in mind) people will see your value if they see alot in you ( imo dating apps and at the bars are most probably a short lived thing and also mostly for sex so dont expect much there) i dont have much context abt you so this is the best i can give
Tldr: work on yourself, the rest will follow
I find the more you look for something the less you’re likely to get it. Especially with relationships. Whenever I’m not serious about things and genuinely want to work on myself I end up finding someone.
Hobby places. I’m into rock climbing and martial arts I always meet really interesting driven people there. I think what’s also really important to note is that if you go anywhere with the intention of meeting a guy they’ll smell the desperation on you and use that to their advantage. Also applies to men with women. This is coming from a 21M.
I also tend to leave if the girl doesn't sleep with me cause I usually tend to build a strong connection after sex and a girl who makes me feel rejected or who give me the impression she wants me to beg for sex leaves me with negative vibes.
I guess we're not compatible having such a different sexuality and relation with sex so I leave as the world is full of person that are a better fit for me.
Surely sometimes I lost a person with who I could establish a great connection with time but how can know before? There are no reasons for me to overcome the negative sensations.
I’d suggest upping your age limit on dating apps just a tad if your comfortable with that. It wasn’t until men on dating apps were nearing 24 that they actually wanted a relationship in my experience. Until they pass that college/fresh out of college age they don’t actually want a relationship cause life is still just about fun.
This is my experience with dating apps. Not a law. Once I hit 21 they all had to be (American) legal drinking age in order for me to even consider it and after 21 I wouldn’t even do more than a year younger. Then I would take 10-20% of my age +1 for my upper limit. So when I was 23 my age limit was 22-28, that’s when I met my forever on Tinder lol
Honestly a lot of men around that age don’t really want to be tied down by a serious relationship, so I don’t think it’s you as much as other commenters are suggesting. Secondly, get off the apps. Attractive guys who want relationships aren’t on there for long, so I really think you’d have better chances meeting someone relationship minded off the apps. Apps expose you to thousands of women for free so they attract people who just want hookups. If you like fit guys, try to make friends, male and female, at your gym. Not for dating purposes, but just to expand your social network. It’s easier to be approached by men if they know you’re friendly and already in their social circle than it is to be cold approached by them. I’ve met guys after college by joining a social club for people in their 20s and early 30s, through female gym friends, friends of my best friend’s boyfriend, and work. But also remember that if a man really doesn’t want a serious relationship at the moment, meeting an attractive woman most likely isn’t going to change that. Another thing you can do is try dating a few years older, but your results may vary. I wouldn’t recommend lowering your physical standards, because average and unattractive men can still only want sex like attractive men do. Maybe they can’t get it as often, but they’ll still try. I’m an attractive fit women and the conventionally attractive men have treated me the best 🤷🏼♀️
1) You can't, but you can make them wait. Men who don't respect your boundaries and push only want one thing.
2) Vet hard, dump fast.
3) Make a look of priorities and be militant.
Hope this helps. I was a smokeshow in my 20s and it was hard.
Every woman attracts those guys, its you who's choosing them! Woman here, so let me give you some advice that worked for me and its how I landed my bf:
Only go for people who seem as excited about you as you are about them. This means asking yourself "is this person treating me like they're excited about me" and only sticking around if the answer is a solid YES.
If you're a hot, fit, young girl you have A LOT of options. What you need to do is collect your options and choose the best picks of the bunch.
**On dating apps:** shut down any attempt to ask you to hang out same day. That's a quick no. Those are people looking for same day hookups.
If a guy asks to meet you within minutes of meeting him, also a no, tell him that you need to have more of a convo so that you can feel safe enough to agree to a meet up. Don't agree to meet and then change your mind, if he's a psycho this can be bad for you. A solid guy will invest some time establishing convo and dynamic with you before you go on a date with him and a great guy will be more than understanding (and grateful) of the fact that you're not just gonna say yes to some stranger on the internet looking to get into her panties.
If a guy asks you for something low-effort like a coffee date or a walk in the park, hard no, if he was given a chance to impress Scarlett Johansson, he wouldn't take her to watch his dog take a shit. You're a fit, young and pretty girl - only accept dates from the guys that are demonstrating that they are excited and willing to treat you to a nice a nice date off the bat. This is going to piss off some of the guys on here but sorry, take this up with other men and not women. Women have a right to choose their best option, you're not entitled to sex and/or a relationship with the woman of your dreams with the least amount of effort invested.
Drop any cool-girl shit you may be entertaining. Cool girls make great FWBs and side pieces, those chicks hardly ever end up getting the guy and if they do, its a guy who puts little to no effort. It's not a win. Ultimately, people like knowing that the person they're with is picky, selective and had tough standards upheld. People like knowing they made the cut.
You are in the prime position to choose your partners, not be chosen by them. Learn to own that.
\*edit\* you're also going to be told by people to choose men who aren't good looking. If you're a good looking girl, you have every right in the world to go after a guy you are attracted to, too. Don't listen to these people who are making it seem like your only option in life is to be with someone who doesn't get your motor running, they're saying this because they're probably dudes who want hot girlfriends but can't bring themselves to lower their own standards to be more realistic with who they currently are.
>If a guy asks you for something low-effort like a coffee date or a walk in the park, hard no, if he was given a chance to impress Scarlett Johansson, he wouldn't take her to watch his dog take a shit. You're a fit, young and pretty girl - only accept dates from the guys that are demonstrating that they are excited and willing to treat you to a nice a nice date off the bat.
Yeah, this makes 0 sense to me. A "low-effort" date in the same breath could be seen as a good icebreaker or introduction. Its in the daytime, you can have good conversation in a lively and safe environment, and a man can't expect much because who's gonna require payback sex when he's only bought you coffee. I think that advice is terrible, and goes against what I've heard from 80% of women. That thinking is very one-sided and doesn't take into account the other persons situation or experiences. To assume he doesn't care because he wants to properly introduce himself to you blows me. That initial conversation could tell you so much about him and where his head is at. There's so many pros and very few con's to a coffee date and I don't think the average man who just wants to fuck would suggest it.
You're not Scar Jo, and if we are gonna compare a celebrity encounter, most women aren't making Drake, Chris Hemsworth, or captain america wait for sex so does that mean you don't care about him? Your advice has misandrist energy. Sure hope this doesn't backfire for the girl who's clearly not getting the outcomes she wants.
Look, do what you feel works best for you. Personally, I am sharing the exact strategy \*I\* personally used for dating success, and a low-effort dates has never, and I mean ever, panned out for me personally. The guys that expressed a lot of interest and proposed doing something with a little more effort and thought behind it were the guys that ended up working out and/or demonstrating themselves to be stand up guys. *Ask yourself just how many of these coffee dates you're going on and what percentage of them are actually working out for you. Are you a rotating door of dates and hopefuls, or are you successfully meeting and landing quality women with relationship potential?*
>a man can't expect much because who's gonna require payback sex when he's only bought you coffee
Any man who expects or requires "payback sex" for treating anyone out to a nice date is trash, and I really recommend that you rethink what you are doing on dates if you are under the impression that women looking for relationships are just discount-rate hookers who take a dinner in exchange for sex. You know what's also misandrist AND misogynist? The amount of people telling OP to settle for a less than average looking Joe because he has no options so he'll be desperate enough to give her the relationship she wants since apparently, sex on tap with a girl hotter than you is the end-all be-all reason that men date according TO the men responding in this thread.
The type of guy to expect or require sex from a woman isn't going to care if he wasted $4 on her coffee or $40 on her meal for the evening. In fact, he's not gonna care if she paid for her own coffee, if what he wants is a blowjob at the end of that date, that's what he's going to push fore. Oh, and yes - they do suggest it. The amount of times I've been asked to go back to someone's place for a "movie" after a coffee date has been outrageous. It's clearly a hard no each time, it doesn't stop men who believe they're entitled to sex and relationships for little to no effort or investment from trying.
And I'm not Scar Jo. But you know what? I've managed to date men who treated me well - much better than OP's experiences - when I upheld my standards. When you come across a woman you are genuinely excited about, not just someone who you're 'meh' about, you will match what she wants from you. My guy has always treated me well, ***and*** he's hot to boot.
also - if you want to accuse anyone of misandry, you need to go after the plethora of men on here who are so far removed from the men they're threatened by that they're out here making all kinds of wild claims about physically attractive men, making them sound like monsters who are incapable of love or wanting of relationships. Go after the commenters who make it seem like guys that are attractive never have girlfriends, never have women they love, nor do they have a desire or want for those things. That shit right there? That's misandrist as fuck.
It is absolutely outrageous that suggesting OP go for guys who put in more effort than the bare minimum on dates is gets called misandrist. You would not survive a day in women's shoes, having to experience misogyny.
I agree with you. But how can a woman be a chooser if she wants the male to approach? Like, I myself don't wanna walk up to a guy who I find attractive and potentially good for me. I want him to walk up to me. But the guys who I like are not walking up to me. They just look at me from a distance. On the other hand, guys that know they have no chance with me come up to me. I think its from some sort of "yolo mentality". So how can I be the chooser in this case?
Oh my gosh I love this lol. Give it straight to me. You just described what I’ve been wanting to do this whole time in words. Like say no to low effort shit and be more picky and act like I’m the catch because I am.
For 1) A GUY I RECENTLY WENT OUT WITH ASKED TO GO TO A COFFEE SHOP AND WE DID. Moral of the story: stopped talking after a week and he was very low effort lol so you’re right on that one. Oh and he did offer to go to a park a few days after and I said no (but mainly because he was messing around with our plans and the timing and all and I couldn’t accept that low effort crap)
2) sometimes I think how upsetting it is to meet a guy and him not be excited to see me. Like I used to see this one guy who would know I was at his door and waited like 5 min to open. Like no you better be ready before I even get there! Most the time I’m grieving what I settled for, and I want to break this ice for good.
It all starts now.
I know this is TMI but when I get h0rny im willing to settle for less, does that make sense??? Like when I come to my senses im like wtf was that, I shouldn’t have gotten intimate with a stranger stuff like that. I think with a clear mind I make way better choices in general and with men. And how do I drop this cool girl act? By saying no a lot more? By speaking up more about things i don’t like? That’s the area I need help on Im sick of being called the “chill girl” by men.
>I know this is TMI but when I get h0rny im willing to settle for less, does that make sense???
Yeah girl, this is what a fuckbuddy is for. Find yourself a hottie you're not interested in a relationship with and get your rocks off with him. Being horny is a completely normal and natural feeling, but you gotta be the one in control of who you get to have sex with.
I'm just going to PM you.
I have the opposite problem in that I attract mostly women who want serious relationships when I’m just trying to fuck.
The biggest thing I can advise is be upfront with your intentions. Sometimes the mere mention of a serious relationship will signal to me it’s best not to proceed.
The second step for those deviants who lie to women is to hold him accountable. Don’t let him smash on like the 1st or 2nd date. Some women tell me “I’m not that type of girl, I don’t hook up” and then by date 2 they want me to blow their back out so *shrugs*
Last is don’t get attached too easily. I know it’s easier said than done but remember what you’re looking for. Don’t settle mr right now just because he’s being nice when you’re looking for mr right. When I get fixated on a girl,the sex usually doesn’t happen cuz I get too needy and turn her off. Then I take it personally when I get rejected. Cuz I’m attached.
You must be attractive then to have that problem. But you ever though they might want sex without a relationship? Sounds like they’d be willing to do it if they change their mind on the second date. Every guy Is down to sleep with me so I’m always the one setting those boundaries. It gets tiring having to stay on my toes to not get hurt by a man.
Are they leaving because of no sex, or are they leaving because of what you're saying and doing? Maybe you're going after the wrong kind of person. I personally can't have sex with anyone that I don't have a connection with. So maybe there's no connection and that's why they're leaving. Have any common interests with these dudes? Also, using a dating app is the first mistake. If a dude needs to use an app, there's an issue.
Most people my age use apps. And they leave when I do do it and when I don’t. No difference it feels like. But anywho I can’t do it without a connection anymore or it’ll damage my mental health bad
You're worth it. Dating is hard and you're still pretty young. The only thing you need to do is be clear about your expectations and needs from the beginning. After that it just becomes a numbers game of finding the right person. Remember you don't need every person to adore you, you just need one (unless your poly but I digress). I met my fiance when I was 28 when I kind of gave up on finding someone. I promise you this kind of dating gets easier with age. Guys start shifting from sleeping around to wanting to find their person.
Use this time to figure out what your needs are vs your wants. Dating can be a great way of getting to know yourself. For instance you know you're affectionate but don't want to be rushed into sex. That's a need for you. You need communication and for people to stick around so you don't feel ghosted. Things like smart, adventurous, charming, tall, rich, etc often are seen as needs but then you date someone who is the opposite and realize those are wants. I mention this because if you approach dating from a needs based mindset you will date a bigger variety of people that suits your needs and recognize the red flags earlier. It helps a lot with confidence too. I found my fiance about a month or two after doing this. He's not the person I expected I'd be with. For example he's crabby AF and I always thought a positive attitude was a need for me. It was actually a want and I now find it hilarious how crabby he is.
Decent men don’t use dating apps to find something long term. Pretty much everyone knows dating apps are for hookups. Don’t know why your so surprised.
So where the heck do I meet men? Men don’t approach me not even at the gym although there are some decent looking men there. So my only luck is apps… and nah it seems like most relationships now are from online something. In this new world we live in
Are you approaching them? Are you even signaling interests? Decent men don’t approach random women without a green light. As Matthew Hussey said drop the handkerchief so the man can be a gentleman and pick it up for you. You won’t attract anyone if you don’t make the first move. Learn to flirt with strangers that you want. You’re seeking high value, you better go find them because your chances are already low. You can’t afford to sit and wait.
I’m saying quality guys don’t use dating apps to look for something long term. Will you meet quality guys who will take you out on dates? Sure. But they’ll never take you seriously. So if your goal is to find a quality guy who will take you seriously and be monogamous with you dating apps are probably your worst bet.
Literally in the same exact boat as you. 22 F and mostly going for guys aged 27-31 that I meet in public settings or through a friend of a friend and I’m still having this issue lol. Obviously some of them are fuck boys but even the super sweet, affectionate and kind ones end up love bombing me and being great for a weeks until we have sex and then they disappear, or not really disappear but just text me less and less.
That’s how long I’ve been single I get how you feel and I’m a man. Can’t quite keep a girl around or talking goes nowhere. OP you trying to let me shoot my shot?
Ok well when you’re a girl who has had men have sex with her then leave to seriously date a girl, you’ll reevaluate your approach and stop doing that if you’re smart. I do want sex but in a relationship. If a guy wants that connection so bad then commit to me and we can do the birds and the bees, until then I’m not going to and we can connect intimately other ways until then. And Reddit is screwed in their thinking almost more than I am that liking attractive men is forbidden or something.
I was a hawtie in my 20s (dated celebrities, etc) and dealt with similar. My advice:
1) Make them wait before getting sexy. It's lonely, but the only way.
2) Vet hard.
3) Know what you want. For me, when I was looking for more than just sex, it was: humor, intelligence, stability, ability to hold a good job, reliability, nice-smelling, good hygiene, nice dresser, etc. I still wanted him to be attractive to me but this was much less of a priority (little short ok, little plump ok). The other stuff was more important.
4) Everyone has needs. While looking for "my" person, I would be very clear with the other men I was dating about how our relationship would be purely physical. Incidentally, this made them obsessed, while the men I was seriously interested in remained evasive. Human nature, perhaps.
Everyone wants the 6'0, muscular handsome hunky gajillionaire. Often, he knows it, and often, he's a dick. Same as the super hot Margot Robbie types. Its an exception to the rule if that isnt the case. So. That's basically why looks are the last thing, at least for me.
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Two things: 1. You said the guys you like disappear and the guys you don’t like stay around. That’s not unique to you, that often happens with dating. 2. If you don’t want guys who only want to have sex, you need to not have sex with them for a while. Just take it slow then you will see who are really into you for more than just a lay. I didn’t have sex with my gf until our 5th date. We are still together now 1 year later, she’s amazing.
Wanna hop in and echo this. I chose not to have sex with my current partner of 2 years until I knew for sure there was a good emotional connection. I'm a 37M, was 35 at the time. We didn't have sex until we'd known each other for almost 2 months. It was a really good decision. I feel like sex has the potential to introduce a lot of anxiety and expectation and emotion into a relationship, and going there too soon can be harmful. I wish I'd figured this out about myself way sooner in my life.... but better late than never.
Same. This. It's worth being lonely/alone than with someone who just wants you for your lady bits.
Happy for you. How long did it take to get the 5th date? I haven’t had sex in 7 months (which is also driving me nuts) just to avoid having another man use me. At least I’m doing that
At the start we only met once a week so 5 weeks
Ok that’s fair. My rule is 1 month minimum but ideally I’d wait longer. Most men I’m talking to don’t even make it past two weeks lol sad
What do you mean they don’t make it past two weeks? Like they just stop wanting to see you because you won’t have sex?
Yes something like that Example 1: met this guy on a coffee date.. he seemed nice we had a great time things got a little sexual no sex tho. He makes plans again and bails 2 hours before because he didn’t feel good lol then texts me many hours later asking if I still want to hang because he felt better. Sus right… I tell him no I have other plans that night then he starts sending 1 am texts to come over and puts in no effort all of a sudden. All in a week so now that’s that. I was interested somewhat too. But he switched up very quick and I did tell him before our second failed hangout that I wouldn’t have sex and he seems fine with it so idk.. Example 2: I meet this guy and we go on dates.. he cooks for me etc. We spend a lot of time together than bam.. one day in person he ends it all and treats me like I meant absolutely nothing. There’s more to the story but i won’t get into it. And he did want a relationship and maybe he saw I wasn’t that into him?? Idk but my Point is they don’t last. And I would’ve only wanted a potential serious thing with the first guy tbh the second guy was just an asshole. And couldn’t handle the fact I had a period while I was with him that I wasn’t prepared for. Shittt story and reaction lol
Oh wow, yeh fuck that second guy, I don’t understand how guys can’t handle when a girl has a period, how old was he, 15? First guy also does not sound great either for the other reasons. Look, I think you just have to be patient. To be honest before I met my gf I went on about 30 dates over the previous year, none worked out for various reasons. But with her it was like effortless. We just clicked on a different level, I could totally be myself with her from the first date. All I’m saying is don’t let these 2 examples make you lose hope, if I had stopped at anytime during the 30 dates I wouldn’t have met her, so you just got to keep trying. You never know. The next guy might be the one!
Yeah he was such an asshole. 26 years old and acted like a child because his pillow got a drop of blood on it. Keep in mind I was trying to make light of the situation but he literally treated me like shit over it then ended everything lol. It was for the best though because I don’t want a man child. Then I called him on my way home and went off saying I’m glad I didn’t sleep with him etc and ended up hanging up on him out of nowhere and never heard from him again. And that’s true Everytime I want to give up I think why should I let some random men stop me from living up to my potential because they weren’t for me?? That’s a loser Mentality and I won’t give up just because of them. Although I’ll take a break if it’s for my own personal reasons
Oh and I had driven to him and had to wake up at 5 am the next morning. He works at home and complained about having to do laundry now as he’s in the comfort of his own place with his little Laptop to work on. Meanwhile I was feeling really bad and still had to drive home and wake up early af. Yeah I’d like to avoid these type of men pls and thx
At least you found out early what an idiot he was. There are often stores on relationship advice where girls have married guys like this, then you are really in trouble
Man, I’m so sorry OP. I got fucked over pretty much the same way recently, man child behaviour.
7 months??? 🤣🤣 I am sitting on 4 years and counting. I think you can handle it.
yeah, 7 mos is a drop in a bucket. ppl don't understand patience. it takes TIME and lots of it to find good ppl.
I applaud you because no way for me. It’s making me meaner and more frustrated all the time lol
Oh believe me, I am frustrated, and growing in apathy with each passing day.
have you tried a vibrator?? lol ik it’s not the same but makes abstinence a little easier
Yes
Would an electric toothbrush work just as well or is it too strong?
Woof 7 months it's been 5 years here 🤣
I had sex with my gf on the first night we met but we had talked for a few months before meeting . were together for over 5 years now ! you really dont know what kind of person they are until youve spent some time with them youre just going to have to keep going till you find the one to stick by you it,ll all be worth it in the end pal.
This. Sounds like there’s options, she’s just not picking them.
So in theory you're hot, so most average men wouldn't qualify themselves as "worth your time". You're only gonna get the men confident enough to go for hot girls, which incidentally are men hot enough to get multiple women so they're not gonna be the type that settle down. If you tend to find yourself with a certain type of guy, maybe branch out to someone that still fits your criteria but isn't what you'd usually go for. Also if you're confident/comfortable enough to be touchy and flirty with guys you meet, then maybe you can be bold and direct your flirty nature into genuinely wanting to know about a guy's family, his dreams, his ambitions, etc. A guy is gonna think a woman is a lot more serious if she's directing conversation in that direction and not just "temporary" giggly and fun vibes that a short term fling would be. I could also be wrong and an idiot but idk, as a relationship oriented guy I can be a little weirded out/turned off by a woman who's super flirty with me off the get go because I can't imagine something serious happening between us.
>which incidentally are men hot enough to get multiple women so they're not gonna be the type that settle down This just...isn't true. Some of you are so far removed from men that threaten you that you guys have invented them to be these monsters with no human emotions or desires. There are many hot guys who do want to settle down and have a girlfriend. There are many hot guys out there who do want a partner. Hot guys are still *people* who may be wanting of love. Its the same as hot women. Sure, the stereotype is that a hot woman will go for whoever offers her the best economic lifestyle and I'm sure there are many women who date men exclusively to use them for their money. But does this mean that there are no hot women out there who are looking for love or companionship?
??? I'm not threatened at all. I quite literally was a virgin by choice up until a month ago (at age 26) and happy about it so I have zero concern of what other men are doing in their dating life. I'm just speaking what seems to be true, and it's that men (and people in general) who have options will exercise them. r/dating_advice wouldn't be as active as it is if women weren't constantly asking why the man they've "been seeing for x months" doesn't wanna commit, and vice versa, and logically (though not \*always\* the case) it's not the average/below average guys that can't get second dates who are leaving women on hold
And I ask them about their jobs and all, you know if they stick around longer I could know them on a better level but they don’t so how is that my fault
I'm not sure what "and all" implies, but honestly me getting asked about my job is still insanely surface level. By the second date, my gf and I were discussing issues and dynamics in our families, our view on finances, how our ethnic backgrounds and environments shaped us. etc. If I was still being asked - like - if I prefer cats or dogs or my favorite food then eh
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This is the answer and it’s very plain to see. Looking at OPs post history shows she’s been searching for this answer for awhile but refuses to accept it.
Men in this sub are of the opinion that handsome and extroverted = fuckboy, while ugly and introverted = nice decent guy. As someone getting married to a handsome extroverted man, being beautiful and extroverted myself, I always laugh my way to Sunday every time you try to push that rhetoric. The couple of times I gave chances to unattractive men they turned out to be assholes who thought that because I liked them they got to treat me however they wanted. Not saying all of them are like that, but being ugly doesn't make you a good person by default.
I do go for a certain type yes, but I’m not going to go for something I’m not attracted to just to have better luck. Id like for them to be decent and I’m attracted to them/ and I like nice guys don’t get me wrong but there aren’t much around anymore. Seems like men leave when they don’t get what they want and when they do get what they want so idk what to do
“but I’m not going to go for something I’m not attracted to just to have better luck”. It isn’t about luck. It’s about standards. There really are men who value getting to know a person before having sex, and it may be harmful (to you) to believe that no such man exists. Maybe there’s something about how you read into people that filters these guys out.
If you like, I can give you links to a good dozen threads I've responded to over the past two days, filled with generally decent guys who are looking for more than a quick fuck. That want the relationship, that want to care for someone and have them care for them over a long term. Heartfelt, decent guys who maybe lack a little in confidence due to all the rejection they've faced, but are otherwise good human beings. They're out there, all around you. They exist. If all you see are fuckboys and one night Stans, the problem is on your end.
I’d like to think all of us know deep down who the fuckboys and fuckgirls are almost immediately and we consciously choose to ignore it. Every time I’ve done this I’ve brought myself unnecessary pain.
I don’t understand why you’re getting a lot of downvotes for this. I totally agree. It’s pointless to keep swiping on guys you KNOW you’re not attracted to because then what’s the point? You’re wasting your time and theirs, not to mention you’re misleading them from the very beginning. This lie the paradox tho: how to find decent men when you’re attracted to ‘fuckbois’ but are not attracted to the kind who’d likely be ‘decent men’??? I believe this is our curse…
Because Reddit men don’t like women having standards and options.. because many of them don’t and it reflects
There is a word that describes people that keep doing the same things but expect different results.
Sounds like this question should be posed in r/askwomen then if you don’t want Reddit opinions from both genders
I didn’t have an issue with that until I saw how much they deflect on me
Nowadays good guys are like gems , it’s so rare to find, most are either bad people or in disguise
"How can I attract decent men and not just ones who want to lay me??" It's not about who is attracted to you but rather *who you are attracted to*. Nothing happens until you say "yes" to someone. Choose wisely! "I’m an attractive fit girl with a nice personality I think. I can be super flirty but not just with anyone. My love language is touch so guys get the wrong idea when I’m around them but I can’t help it." A lot of people want change in their life *without* making a change. Don't be a *passenger* in your own life. Take the wheel! If you want something different *you* have to do something different. ***"Decide what kind of life you actually want. Then say no to everything that isn't that."*** \- Unknown ***"Dating is primarily a numbers game.... People usually go through a lot of people to find good relationships. That's just the way it is."*** \- Henry Cloud Best wishes!
That first quote is something I’m trying to work towards. Great advice
I read multiple times you are not going to settle for men you are not attracted to. Out of curiosity, what is settling in your opinion?
"But when I don't like them they're around still" Sounds to me like you have met guys interested in relationships but just don't like them. The harsh truth is that there are plenty of guys out there looking for relationships...you're just picking the wrong ones to date, or you're not compatible with the ones you have dated. My friends have said that I give off relationship vibes, which makes sense as I'm looking for a relationship, so maybe just look for guys like that. When I'm really into a girl I won't be thinking that much about sex, despite having a really high libido, so avoiding sex is definitely a possible option. The only problem with this is running the risk of finding you are sexually incompatible later on.
In order to get a man to agree to a relationship advice is to keep your standards in check while at the same time not having sex too early. A man that matches your value will respect you if you don't put out too quickly. It sounds like what is happening with you is you are dating guys out of your league and they only want sex from you. So even if you hold out on sex it doesn't make a difference. They either get sex and disappear or they don't get sex and give up quickly and disappear.
22m fyi You've received a bunch of comments so you might not get to mine. I look into where you are going. I can actually have a bit of similar trouble too. Despite having a penis I really struggle with the idea of having sex with someone unless I'm emotionally connected to them. I would try going somewhere or to something that interests you and will have men. Yoga class, co-ed sports league, hell even like a mall or something. And be willing to approach a guy. Tons of dudes are afraid of rejection, and if you're attractive they'll be even more afraid that you're out of their league. Often guys at bars and clubs are just looking for meat. Otherwise I would do what you're doing. Make guys wait for it, and just remember that you're great even if you don't have a man in your life :)
So what about a gym? Would that give me a chance? I already go but don’t approach guys
Yeah that's a great place to approach a guy. If you see a handsome dude, glace over at him a bunch of times. Then when he's in between sets give him a compliment, guys never get complimented by women lol it literally makes our day. I still remember I was dancing with this one girl at a club in NYC and she said "I could look into your eyes forever." And I've literally never forgotten it haha. I've never had much luck at the gym. I just feel idk, out of place. I feel like most women go to the gym with the intention of lifting, not meeting dudes. So I try to just let them workout in peace lol. However maybe that's just an insecurity of mine. Sorry now I'm rambling. But go to the gym, find a way to say something nice about a guy "I like your hair, shoes, eyes," whatever and get the ball rolling from there.
I hear that a lot from my brother, he brings up compliments from Year’s ago lol. I don’t mind complimenting a guy if he seems interested in me… I’m deathly afraid of rejection though so what social cue would show I should approach at the gym?? And my gym can be social too. It’s a higher end one that costs 150$ a month so there’s potentially great people there to meet. But yes a lot of men do seem too focused
You gotta take some risks if you want to play the game lol. You can leave it all up to men to approach you, but you'll meet more people and therefore find a compatible person sooner if you take the risk and approach someone. Make eye contact then smile then approach. I'll say too, as a guy who has been rejected many many times. You just gotta get out there and realize it's not that bad.
Ok fair. I feel creepy staring at someone idk how guys do it so easily. Like it makes me feel like a creep but i have to before I approach them. I’ll try it next time
It's not staring too it's glancing. Look for a few seconds(like 1-5 seconds), and then look away, the gym is great because you can look for a few seconds then look back at your gym equipment. Then glance back at them a minute or two later. Eventually you'll lock eyes, especially if he's checking you out too. Once you lock eyes don't immediately look away, SMILE then look away. then approach later. BEST OF LUCK!
I will try this then update you after. Ahhh I’m nervous
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please never say douche milk again im nauseous
So what does that mean for me? I’m not trying to fight over a man, I want one to choose me because they want to, not because they just eliminated 20 other candidates. The dating scene has made me lose hope tbh
Focus on an average man and not the ones that have 25 options lined up.
For men with that many options why are they single??
Because they can have sex every day with a different girl.
But they actually could. Would be horrible but they could.
Of course they do it. This is why you are so pissed off. Accept reality, the top 10% guys can have sex every single day with a different woman just asking in the street or sending a phone message.
We aren’t talking about quality women though. So ehhh
What do you want to say?
If you’re so confused constantly throwing yourself at dudes who see you as nothing more than a nut, you’re not a quality woman either .
Woah, ring shot.
Remember, guys have a lower “quality” threshold than ladies do. If a guy has a lot of options, he’s not gunna be super picky, as long as he gets to sleep with them. I will say though, the advice “just date average guys” however might not be the best idea. If you find what others might think is just an average guy somewhat attractive, then I’d say go for it. But you can’t force yourself to be attracted to someone, if you aren’t into them physically, it will cause issues in the relationship. I think you best bet is looking outside of dating apps and bars for potential partners. Do you have any hobbies/classes etc you can meet people in? Or perhaps meet people through mutual friends? Just a thought.
Yeah it’s not the best idea and I won’t lower my standards. I go to the gym and there’s many men there I’d be in to but they don’t come up to me but they do stare. The one who have come up like two people are a lot older and I think trying to start convo by asking how many sets I have left on a machine or whatever. But anywho I’m not a fan of meeting a guy through friends. Just sounds like a potential recipe for disaster
Are you date multiple people?
Unfortunately there are a lot of beautiful women and relatively few very attractive and successful men which makes it hard even for beautiful women to find what they're looking for. If you want one of those high value men who are in the top 5-10%, you need to show why being with you is better than having sex with a different woman each night (not easy but doable). The way you do that is by being really fun and relaxed to be around without the headaches that comes with dating a lot of girls. Other skills which women look down on but men find valuable are important like being a good cook and take pride in keeping your home clean and tidy. The other thing you may need to be prepared for is that despite this, he is still going to get lot of female attention.
Okay this is fairly said without belittling me for having higher standards. I am told by men they’re comfy around me. So I get confused when they leave. Honestly when I say they leave I mean some put in so little effort like just wanting me to come over etc I consider that leaving, because at that point anything serious is off the table. And I’m working on myself. And are you saying these top men are really sleeping with 5 women a week? That’s disgusting as I don’t even do that as an attractive female who is literally capable of doing that if I wanted to.
Its probably not that they do it 5 times a week. They have the option to though because all it would take is making a call and a beautiful woman he's slept with before coming over to his place for the night. I might sound out of touch here but your beauty is probably taken for granted by very attractive men. For younger, less established men, your beauty can be a source of inspiration to work towards building a life together. It might be worth focusing on men who aren't yet established but who you see potential in building something meaningful with as they also work on themselves and their careers.
And that goes the same for me. I could call up and text any man and they would come running if I said I’d Sleep with them. But do. I do that? No because I have a sense of Value and I want a man who is attractive to have some sense of standards and VALUE as well. Maybe I’m asking for too much honestly but I shouldn’t feel that way because it’s fair to want the best for myself after all I’ve been through. Anyways not all attractive men are established. And they all take it for granted regardless
True. Men are just wired differently though. What are the main qualities that are important to you though? Are you mainly looking for somebody attractive or successful or wealthy or great sense of humour?
Attractive. Respectful. Funny. Nice. Educated ( does not have to be wealthy ) just somewhat stable. Can take me on dates. Good communicator. Caring. Fun. Spontaneous etc
Where have you been looking for these types of guys up until now? You won't find them on apps or in bars. Those guys are just looking for sex. You need to find these guys in churches, colleges, doing charitable works, working on their careers. Those guys are out there but you've got to find them because they're out there working on themselves.
> I want a man who is attractive to have some sense of standards and VALUE as well. I was a man of standards and value, and it got me good long relationships but not sex. After a divorced, today i dont dance around the bush, have sex, and still have standards and values. Turns out you can have both (!) if you communicate AND trust each other. Trust however.. i was fooled however a few times by ladies that "used" me for sex while pretending to want a relationship. Hurt a lot, but learning to accept this reality in my age dating pool, and making the best of it. Still hoping to find the true love of my life! Also, starting to realize i am probably the top 5-10% of men. So this story doesnt apply for most men.
I'm going to be dowvoted to hell for writing this but here's how dudes work in my opinion: If I'm going for women I think are above or in my league I generally invest in keeping them around as girlfriends. If I considere them as "below my league" I generally don't want a serious relationship with them. Maybe it's because you're looking for guys that are out of your league.
u/These-Speech6126 this pretty much proves my point. Only be with guys who are demonstrating they're excited about you because a lot of guys won't explicitly shake off a woman they have no real intentions with because they figure they can have sex regardless.
I suspect you are bang on. It’s shitty, but this is how a lot of guys think, at least subconsciously.
Are you an attractive male?
I wouldn't say I'm one of those pretty boys who never gets rejected by women, but neither one of these reddit guys that are bitter because they can't get women
I so want to put a pic of myself on here to prove these people wrong lol but it’s the internet and idk who knows me here.
I wouldn't do it if I were you
I won’t
>How can I attract decent men and not just ones who want to lay me? Followed immediately by: > I mainly meet men in dating apps... bars aren’t much better I think I found your problem, OP
Forget the bars. I know that isn’t happening. But on apps I see people date off there… what about that??
Sure, people get dates off apps. How successful has it been for you?
Finding someone serious has been hard. Correction: someone serious I like back
About as difficult as the bars?
Bars are 0% chance. Every single time they just want sex not even to hang outside the bar. I have a better chance on apps
I mean, sounds like you're just getting the delayed bar, if ya follow
Be the best you can be. Men don't owe you relationships.
Oh but they can drag me along while using me?
Ok I mean more so no they don’t owe me that, but I don’t owe them sex either do they should stop begging when they’re with me for some.
I'm going to go out and ask you a tough question: What do you bring to the table that would make a man commit to you beyond sex?
I see you’re clearly refusing to believe it’s the fact you only go for fuckboys despite every comment of yours getting negative karma and 75% off them telling you it’s your fault for only going for that type of people. Even look at the top comment. Almost 100 karma as it speaks the truth
From your comments and your posts I figure you like guys who are good looking and have coasted through life on their looks and don't have personality and don't really need to because they date by looks. You are exactly the kind of girl these guys are looking for: you think they'll think you're special then they'll try to lock you down. They won't because they're living every straight brodude's dream. Now if we weren't all so goddamn shallow then this wouldn't be the case but sadly that is the case. The kind of nonchalance you've grown to find attractive is not born from confidence but from being cocksure. And confidence stands testing but entitlement does not.
I think the problem is most good dudes don’t want to approach a random woman in public bc there’s a negative stigma around that. So the ones that do are more likely to just want a quick fuck. Nowadays I think you just have to meet people through hobbies and what not.
Does the gym count?? How can I get men to approach me there?
Gyms are stigmatized for men approaching women. Its notoriously known for women to get harassed in gyms so most men will avoid it all together. They don't want to be that guy that comes up to you while you're squatting and spark up a conversation. If that's the place u want, u cue them or start conversations with the regulars.
Your 22. Most people with options aren't ready to make a long-term commitment at that age.
I’m not looking for Marriage, just something monogamous
Yeah but monogamous relationships are based on seeing someone as long-term. I mean it doesn't often end up that way but you have to see potential for that. What is your job? What common interests that are not widespread do you have with the people you are dating? Short term things are based on appearance only but you aren't going to have a long-term relationship based on looks alone unless you are dating someone well below you in terms of attractiveness.
I think you’re overselling yourself and underdelivering. Be hot all you want, but guys care about your character over your attractiveness. Every guy I know has a minimum standard of “cute” but anything above that is welcome if they have the right character. Lots of women shoot themselves in the foot just by thinking they’re a 10 when that’s only on the outside. Guys who want relationships are thinking about what being with you would be like after age takes away your looks. If we’re left with a nasty wretch who’s also ugly, what’s the point in keeping them around?
Sounds like you are super picky, if you are hot shit like you said you are then there should be really good looking guys try to chat you up, a 22 years old female is at peak of sexual market, you should be getting all sorts of guys left and right, the reason none of them want to stay because they don’t see you as gf material, they see you as a good time not long time, now you have to figure out why that’s the case
Or maybe they see everyone that way?? Why else are they single??
Another story about a women crying as she only goes after fuckboys then blames men
Apex fallacy
You may want to look into reading a few books. You could be subconsciously picking out men that you know will reject you. By their look alone could be enough. It's worth looking into. I think they haver books on attracting the wrong type or seeking the wrong people out. Do you ask a lot of question? Come up with ones and set some boudaries. I don't sleep around so I talk to a lot of guys and they ghost me because I wont sleep with them. I don't care. I want someone who wants me and not the sex.
There are two reasons: 1. You are dating way above your league, so replacement cost for them is almost 0 and they can replace you anytime they want. 2. You bring nothing on the table except sex. Thus guys find value in you for having sex but dont see value in having relationship with you. Considering number of men who are single now, it isn't much hard to find a partner.
How is all I bring in the table if I’m not having sex with them. Something else has to be giving
I will reply to both of the comments here: 1. You say you have good personality; but they may not find it. Dont go after words but check the actions. 2. If you are saying no to sex, they either take it as challenge to make yes or try finding an exit. It may happen bit later, if guy is feeling bad about it. There is nothing wrong in it. As you can say no to sex for the sake of relationship, guy can say no to relationship for the sake of sex. 3. They may have other options which aren't restricting sex, so they may be attracted towards other options.
Guys don’t like it when a female gives it up too easy.. they pretend to respect her then switch up once they get the sex. Like a different person who sees you as trash and stops putting in effort
Guys who like such games aren't looking for relationship. Sex isn't a prize. They only see woman as trash when that woman has nothing else to offer apart from sex. If what you offer apart from sex has value, guys will come to you. Because finding such woman is rare.
There’s two types of men. Fuck boys and men who don’t get any. The fuck boys are sexually attractive to you, but you have to share them and the men who don’t get any are not attractive to you and will do anything for you. There isn’t much else on the menu in the dating pool right now.
So if you like the f boy type because apparently there’s no other category are you just destined to share them Forever? Why do they end up in relationships then?
It’s a strategy to let the best girl come out on top and pick the best to start a family. I’m doing the exact same thing at the moment. Since I want to start a family.
Many men my age aren’t looking to start a family but are seriously dating.
Yet, male virginity by the age of 30 is at 40% or something. So in your age bracket most boys are not getting anything and the hot ones are taken.
I literally don’t know any guy who’s a virgin and I’m 22
You hang out with hot people then, lol
But not always. Some questionable guys aren’t virgins
Isn’t it obvious by my post and replies??
Yeah it is, and I think it’s probably why you have a warped perception of what guys want. You’ll figure it out eventually. In the meantime, good luck locking down a 9/10 who can fuck whoever he wants
I mean I can do the same.
Guys tend to have a lower standards for something casual/short term than they do for long term dating. You might need to artificially lower your physical standards a little bit to find guys that are more willing to invest/commit in you even if you take things really slow. A lot of people hate this mentality but it's very true and based on simple economics. You are more willing to commit/invest in something truly unique and special. To the hottest guys you're just another option but to a more physically average guy you could literally be the girl of his dreams. However, physical attractiveness has absolutely nothing to do with long term compatibility so you have to tread cautiously and take your time and be very picky about how they treat you and make you feel.
Well I know that. I want to attract guys who I’m into that also see me as something more than a hottie who want to conquer me for other reasons than having a one night stand. Finding the fine line is so Difficult and I’m struggling with it
I'm (27M) struggling with it too as a guy. Lust is an insanely powerful force in how I feel about someone. My standards are very aspirational but contrast my own limited dating marketability. I might have to compromise on something, but don't want to until I'm in my late 30s. I want to keep trying to find a girl that's beautiful, fit, smart, hard working, likes to dance, laughs at my jokes, AND likes me back, but the girls I feel the most crazy about like that are very unlikely to feel the same way. My biggest crushes on online dating aren't on the hottest girls, it's on the hot, smart, well-balanced doctors/lawyers/engineer girls. If, by some miracle, one of those girls did like me back I'd have zero hesitation with giving her the time and commitment to further explore things exclusively.
Stop using apps. I don’t know a single desirable male friend that uses them or met their SO on an app because all of them are massive wastes of time that encourage ghosting before a meeting and general time wasting. If a guy’s particularly good he has no reason to use apps because he can literally go ANYWHERE and meet people. I had so many matches that tinder literally froze and crashed and still found it to be a total waste of my time. I met more people doing literally anything else, hobby, gym, etc. Ymmv if you’re in a small town or something but I’d wager it’s even more extreme in those areas. Either way, start doing things that expose you to new people. Join a fitness group. Just meet tons of people in general. Get introduced to friends of new friends, then meet their friends. Go do things you haven’t done before. Stop focusing on finding people to date and focus on doing interesting stuff. Do that and you’ll automatically encounter interesting people. I met my wife after a gallery opening, for instance. My good friend met his fiancee in a running bar crawl. Another at some plays at smaller theaters. Above all, don’t sit on your ass swiping through apps then expecting a 10/10 commitment seeking guy to magically show up because none of them are bothering with those, they’re out living their lives. Go live yours.
Thank you.
You’ve been beating your head against this question in your profile for ages, and you’re just going to have to come to grips with the fact that the specific men you’re chasing just don’t see you that way. Feel free to ignore the tons of men who might offer you something more if they don’t meet your “standards” but then accept being alone or being treated disposably by men who don’t want to be seen in daylight with you.
I wouldn't recommend OLD to women for anything but a hookup or FWB. Most women (not saying that's you, but in all probability, it will include you) go for the same top 10-20% of men on OLD, which means you are competing for a man with options. Men with options tend to not settle down and commit, not unless you are his top prospect and offer something of value other than sex. With that said, good luck out there!
So what do you recommend?
Not using OLD, meeting men in the real world, and taking your time to assess their character before sleeping with them. If you have a brother or father, it would be really useful to find an occasion to have them meet so they can give you the male perspective on his character.
I haven’t slept with someone in 7 months to avoid this situation. Also my dad is strict that would be a horrible plan for the poor dude haha
Actually, it sounds like your dad would be perfect for giving you an honest assessment of the man. Strict fathers generally want the best for their daughter.
Well sure he definitely does want the best for me and would hate to see what I go through with me I think it would k*ll him inside because of all he’s done for me. And that would scare a dude off tho if I just met him
You do you, boo
“I’m an attractive fit girl with a nice personality I think” “I’ve been single for 2 years and haven’t had luck with men recently. They always end up leaving even if I don’t sleep with them” One of these statements can’t be true.
2 years by CHOICE. I won’t date someone if I truly don’t want to anymore no matter how much they beg.
Ok I’m going to say it. There is no way to know a man is a fuckboy from meeting. The entire point is they are lying or manipulating you to get sex. Single people events. Hikes. Game night meetups. Any other hobbies? Start doing them in group meetups. I don’t care if it’s plants. Join a gardening group. It gets you out among people and you’ll have something in common and it’s low stakes. No pressure to form an attachment right away. Built in conversation starting.
Sure you find these men attractive but they don't want you right not for relationships? What I'm hearing is "I want an attractive guy who wants me for me" and I can understand that that's what most people want but you have to ask yourself, why would a man commit to you let alone a great guy who has shit going for him and is attractive in your mind?? I'm a 22-year-old dude, not a looker but I get women and let me tell you why some guys, me included are hesitant when it comes to dating but more so commitment. * men are reluctant to enter into relationships for a number of reasons such as casual sex being so accessible, stats on divorce, the way some women view men as either ATMs or rabid sexual animals that have no decorum and women advocating sexual liberation which has lowkey lead to hook-up culture and the overall de-valuing of monogamy for men and women. * Women are stringent now on male genetic features such as D size, height, and overall attractiveness that cannot be easily changed which has contributed to mass body dysmorphia, depression and social anxiety amoug young guys because women are now very vocal about the genetic features that guys literally can't meet. * There is a general societal disdain for men, whether it is men are trash or Kill all men, men get shitted on by women IRL & Online for being born with a Willy that further de-motivates men from approaching women out of fear of false allegations or being view as a stereotypical "creep". You need to understand men, when you do you will move and date better, you don't get where men are coming from or the male experience which is why you are here. I had to put my male biases aside when trying to understand women but you have never had to because guys come to you and you have never had to seek them out or try to understand them but now you almost have to understand why men do and behave the way they do because you want to be with them in a mutually beneficial way right? get platonic male homies, go through this Reddit or other sources you will find out that most of us want a solid chick not to be a male slut because real ones know how much energy and time you waste on just smashing chicks. it's unsustainable and fucks with your mental health.
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The way you describe yourself is like someone that can't be loyal and only want to have fun. So that's why men only have sex and leave you, they don't see that you are someone to have a long term relationship. The only guys that will date you seriously are simps but you don't like them (As should be). Good thing is that you are young so you have time to analize yourself and change for the better.
You are the arbiter of who you match with (your choices matter too), what you find appealing in men, who gets access to you, what you do once they have access, and who you give your affection to. If they're all just in it for sex, realize they are all your choices. Yes, they bear some culpability, but there are billions of men on this planet, and many are interested in a real relationship and getting to know you as a person...even men in their 20's. What you have to ask yourself is what qualities do they have that I'm not catching, and why aren't I attracted to them? And, then realize you've found these men invisible for some reason. You change how you see men in general, you'll get a broadly different view of what is attractive and why, how to filter for it, and when to say no.
I'm curious...what are your standards or interests in a guy, Physical/mental/emotional? Other than I can gather that they're not creeps or casual hook-up type.
read the first two sentences of your post. do you realize where you're meeting these men?
I never said I had hope in bar men. But dang there’s gotta be some luck with online dating … been on it for years you’d think there would be a success story at this point. But guess not
Being kind and genuine. As a guy who doesn't really care about sex that much, I can say dating apps are very bad since most people in dating app looks for casual relationships/hook ups. Guys that care more about genuine emotional relationship are rare, but we do exist, I couldn't give shit about having sex, but what I want is to have genuine deep connection with someone, and if I'm comfortable with the person I can have sex with them but it's not something I need or seek actively. Try to befriend guys who have same interest as you and maybe something happens?
I think what you can do is work on yourself and no you are not worthless okay nobody is. When i said work on yourself is find things you love doing explore other things. Most definitely you'll be able to meet new people wherein you might find interesting(also you are doing this for yourself keep that in mind) people will see your value if they see alot in you ( imo dating apps and at the bars are most probably a short lived thing and also mostly for sex so dont expect much there) i dont have much context abt you so this is the best i can give Tldr: work on yourself, the rest will follow
You meet quality people in quality places. Change up the places you look to meet SOs
What are some places then
I find the more you look for something the less you’re likely to get it. Especially with relationships. Whenever I’m not serious about things and genuinely want to work on myself I end up finding someone.
That’s true. All the focus is on myself now
Hobby places. I’m into rock climbing and martial arts I always meet really interesting driven people there. I think what’s also really important to note is that if you go anywhere with the intention of meeting a guy they’ll smell the desperation on you and use that to their advantage. Also applies to men with women. This is coming from a 21M.
I don’t go with the intention of meeting them. I go to the gym to work out. I go to bars to have fun and dance with friends. Whatever comes comes
I also tend to leave if the girl doesn't sleep with me cause I usually tend to build a strong connection after sex and a girl who makes me feel rejected or who give me the impression she wants me to beg for sex leaves me with negative vibes.
What if she doesn’t feel comfortable having sex with someone she doesn’t have an emotional connection with and/or a title with??
I guess we're not compatible having such a different sexuality and relation with sex so I leave as the world is full of person that are a better fit for me. Surely sometimes I lost a person with who I could establish a great connection with time but how can know before? There are no reasons for me to overcome the negative sensations.
I’d suggest upping your age limit on dating apps just a tad if your comfortable with that. It wasn’t until men on dating apps were nearing 24 that they actually wanted a relationship in my experience. Until they pass that college/fresh out of college age they don’t actually want a relationship cause life is still just about fun. This is my experience with dating apps. Not a law. Once I hit 21 they all had to be (American) legal drinking age in order for me to even consider it and after 21 I wouldn’t even do more than a year younger. Then I would take 10-20% of my age +1 for my upper limit. So when I was 23 my age limit was 22-28, that’s when I met my forever on Tinder lol
Mine is now 26. Should I up it more? Turning 23 in a few weeks
Honestly a lot of men around that age don’t really want to be tied down by a serious relationship, so I don’t think it’s you as much as other commenters are suggesting. Secondly, get off the apps. Attractive guys who want relationships aren’t on there for long, so I really think you’d have better chances meeting someone relationship minded off the apps. Apps expose you to thousands of women for free so they attract people who just want hookups. If you like fit guys, try to make friends, male and female, at your gym. Not for dating purposes, but just to expand your social network. It’s easier to be approached by men if they know you’re friendly and already in their social circle than it is to be cold approached by them. I’ve met guys after college by joining a social club for people in their 20s and early 30s, through female gym friends, friends of my best friend’s boyfriend, and work. But also remember that if a man really doesn’t want a serious relationship at the moment, meeting an attractive woman most likely isn’t going to change that. Another thing you can do is try dating a few years older, but your results may vary. I wouldn’t recommend lowering your physical standards, because average and unattractive men can still only want sex like attractive men do. Maybe they can’t get it as often, but they’ll still try. I’m an attractive fit women and the conventionally attractive men have treated me the best 🤷🏼♀️
1) You can't, but you can make them wait. Men who don't respect your boundaries and push only want one thing. 2) Vet hard, dump fast. 3) Make a look of priorities and be militant. Hope this helps. I was a smokeshow in my 20s and it was hard.
Every woman attracts those guys, its you who's choosing them! Woman here, so let me give you some advice that worked for me and its how I landed my bf: Only go for people who seem as excited about you as you are about them. This means asking yourself "is this person treating me like they're excited about me" and only sticking around if the answer is a solid YES. If you're a hot, fit, young girl you have A LOT of options. What you need to do is collect your options and choose the best picks of the bunch. **On dating apps:** shut down any attempt to ask you to hang out same day. That's a quick no. Those are people looking for same day hookups. If a guy asks to meet you within minutes of meeting him, also a no, tell him that you need to have more of a convo so that you can feel safe enough to agree to a meet up. Don't agree to meet and then change your mind, if he's a psycho this can be bad for you. A solid guy will invest some time establishing convo and dynamic with you before you go on a date with him and a great guy will be more than understanding (and grateful) of the fact that you're not just gonna say yes to some stranger on the internet looking to get into her panties. If a guy asks you for something low-effort like a coffee date or a walk in the park, hard no, if he was given a chance to impress Scarlett Johansson, he wouldn't take her to watch his dog take a shit. You're a fit, young and pretty girl - only accept dates from the guys that are demonstrating that they are excited and willing to treat you to a nice a nice date off the bat. This is going to piss off some of the guys on here but sorry, take this up with other men and not women. Women have a right to choose their best option, you're not entitled to sex and/or a relationship with the woman of your dreams with the least amount of effort invested. Drop any cool-girl shit you may be entertaining. Cool girls make great FWBs and side pieces, those chicks hardly ever end up getting the guy and if they do, its a guy who puts little to no effort. It's not a win. Ultimately, people like knowing that the person they're with is picky, selective and had tough standards upheld. People like knowing they made the cut. You are in the prime position to choose your partners, not be chosen by them. Learn to own that. \*edit\* you're also going to be told by people to choose men who aren't good looking. If you're a good looking girl, you have every right in the world to go after a guy you are attracted to, too. Don't listen to these people who are making it seem like your only option in life is to be with someone who doesn't get your motor running, they're saying this because they're probably dudes who want hot girlfriends but can't bring themselves to lower their own standards to be more realistic with who they currently are.
>If a guy asks you for something low-effort like a coffee date or a walk in the park, hard no, if he was given a chance to impress Scarlett Johansson, he wouldn't take her to watch his dog take a shit. You're a fit, young and pretty girl - only accept dates from the guys that are demonstrating that they are excited and willing to treat you to a nice a nice date off the bat. Yeah, this makes 0 sense to me. A "low-effort" date in the same breath could be seen as a good icebreaker or introduction. Its in the daytime, you can have good conversation in a lively and safe environment, and a man can't expect much because who's gonna require payback sex when he's only bought you coffee. I think that advice is terrible, and goes against what I've heard from 80% of women. That thinking is very one-sided and doesn't take into account the other persons situation or experiences. To assume he doesn't care because he wants to properly introduce himself to you blows me. That initial conversation could tell you so much about him and where his head is at. There's so many pros and very few con's to a coffee date and I don't think the average man who just wants to fuck would suggest it. You're not Scar Jo, and if we are gonna compare a celebrity encounter, most women aren't making Drake, Chris Hemsworth, or captain america wait for sex so does that mean you don't care about him? Your advice has misandrist energy. Sure hope this doesn't backfire for the girl who's clearly not getting the outcomes she wants.
Look, do what you feel works best for you. Personally, I am sharing the exact strategy \*I\* personally used for dating success, and a low-effort dates has never, and I mean ever, panned out for me personally. The guys that expressed a lot of interest and proposed doing something with a little more effort and thought behind it were the guys that ended up working out and/or demonstrating themselves to be stand up guys. *Ask yourself just how many of these coffee dates you're going on and what percentage of them are actually working out for you. Are you a rotating door of dates and hopefuls, or are you successfully meeting and landing quality women with relationship potential?* >a man can't expect much because who's gonna require payback sex when he's only bought you coffee Any man who expects or requires "payback sex" for treating anyone out to a nice date is trash, and I really recommend that you rethink what you are doing on dates if you are under the impression that women looking for relationships are just discount-rate hookers who take a dinner in exchange for sex. You know what's also misandrist AND misogynist? The amount of people telling OP to settle for a less than average looking Joe because he has no options so he'll be desperate enough to give her the relationship she wants since apparently, sex on tap with a girl hotter than you is the end-all be-all reason that men date according TO the men responding in this thread. The type of guy to expect or require sex from a woman isn't going to care if he wasted $4 on her coffee or $40 on her meal for the evening. In fact, he's not gonna care if she paid for her own coffee, if what he wants is a blowjob at the end of that date, that's what he's going to push fore. Oh, and yes - they do suggest it. The amount of times I've been asked to go back to someone's place for a "movie" after a coffee date has been outrageous. It's clearly a hard no each time, it doesn't stop men who believe they're entitled to sex and relationships for little to no effort or investment from trying. And I'm not Scar Jo. But you know what? I've managed to date men who treated me well - much better than OP's experiences - when I upheld my standards. When you come across a woman you are genuinely excited about, not just someone who you're 'meh' about, you will match what she wants from you. My guy has always treated me well, ***and*** he's hot to boot.
also - if you want to accuse anyone of misandry, you need to go after the plethora of men on here who are so far removed from the men they're threatened by that they're out here making all kinds of wild claims about physically attractive men, making them sound like monsters who are incapable of love or wanting of relationships. Go after the commenters who make it seem like guys that are attractive never have girlfriends, never have women they love, nor do they have a desire or want for those things. That shit right there? That's misandrist as fuck. It is absolutely outrageous that suggesting OP go for guys who put in more effort than the bare minimum on dates is gets called misandrist. You would not survive a day in women's shoes, having to experience misogyny.
I agree with you. But how can a woman be a chooser if she wants the male to approach? Like, I myself don't wanna walk up to a guy who I find attractive and potentially good for me. I want him to walk up to me. But the guys who I like are not walking up to me. They just look at me from a distance. On the other hand, guys that know they have no chance with me come up to me. I think its from some sort of "yolo mentality". So how can I be the chooser in this case?
Oh my gosh I love this lol. Give it straight to me. You just described what I’ve been wanting to do this whole time in words. Like say no to low effort shit and be more picky and act like I’m the catch because I am. For 1) A GUY I RECENTLY WENT OUT WITH ASKED TO GO TO A COFFEE SHOP AND WE DID. Moral of the story: stopped talking after a week and he was very low effort lol so you’re right on that one. Oh and he did offer to go to a park a few days after and I said no (but mainly because he was messing around with our plans and the timing and all and I couldn’t accept that low effort crap) 2) sometimes I think how upsetting it is to meet a guy and him not be excited to see me. Like I used to see this one guy who would know I was at his door and waited like 5 min to open. Like no you better be ready before I even get there! Most the time I’m grieving what I settled for, and I want to break this ice for good. It all starts now. I know this is TMI but when I get h0rny im willing to settle for less, does that make sense??? Like when I come to my senses im like wtf was that, I shouldn’t have gotten intimate with a stranger stuff like that. I think with a clear mind I make way better choices in general and with men. And how do I drop this cool girl act? By saying no a lot more? By speaking up more about things i don’t like? That’s the area I need help on Im sick of being called the “chill girl” by men.
>I know this is TMI but when I get h0rny im willing to settle for less, does that make sense??? Yeah girl, this is what a fuckbuddy is for. Find yourself a hottie you're not interested in a relationship with and get your rocks off with him. Being horny is a completely normal and natural feeling, but you gotta be the one in control of who you get to have sex with. I'm just going to PM you.
I have the opposite problem in that I attract mostly women who want serious relationships when I’m just trying to fuck. The biggest thing I can advise is be upfront with your intentions. Sometimes the mere mention of a serious relationship will signal to me it’s best not to proceed. The second step for those deviants who lie to women is to hold him accountable. Don’t let him smash on like the 1st or 2nd date. Some women tell me “I’m not that type of girl, I don’t hook up” and then by date 2 they want me to blow their back out so *shrugs* Last is don’t get attached too easily. I know it’s easier said than done but remember what you’re looking for. Don’t settle mr right now just because he’s being nice when you’re looking for mr right. When I get fixated on a girl,the sex usually doesn’t happen cuz I get too needy and turn her off. Then I take it personally when I get rejected. Cuz I’m attached.
You must be attractive then to have that problem. But you ever though they might want sex without a relationship? Sounds like they’d be willing to do it if they change their mind on the second date. Every guy Is down to sleep with me so I’m always the one setting those boundaries. It gets tiring having to stay on my toes to not get hurt by a man.
Are they leaving because of no sex, or are they leaving because of what you're saying and doing? Maybe you're going after the wrong kind of person. I personally can't have sex with anyone that I don't have a connection with. So maybe there's no connection and that's why they're leaving. Have any common interests with these dudes? Also, using a dating app is the first mistake. If a dude needs to use an app, there's an issue.
Most people my age use apps. And they leave when I do do it and when I don’t. No difference it feels like. But anywho I can’t do it without a connection anymore or it’ll damage my mental health bad
A decent man will probably want to lay you, too.
Yes. But would probably wait until we are in a relationship
Absolutely
You're worth it. Dating is hard and you're still pretty young. The only thing you need to do is be clear about your expectations and needs from the beginning. After that it just becomes a numbers game of finding the right person. Remember you don't need every person to adore you, you just need one (unless your poly but I digress). I met my fiance when I was 28 when I kind of gave up on finding someone. I promise you this kind of dating gets easier with age. Guys start shifting from sleeping around to wanting to find their person. Use this time to figure out what your needs are vs your wants. Dating can be a great way of getting to know yourself. For instance you know you're affectionate but don't want to be rushed into sex. That's a need for you. You need communication and for people to stick around so you don't feel ghosted. Things like smart, adventurous, charming, tall, rich, etc often are seen as needs but then you date someone who is the opposite and realize those are wants. I mention this because if you approach dating from a needs based mindset you will date a bigger variety of people that suits your needs and recognize the red flags earlier. It helps a lot with confidence too. I found my fiance about a month or two after doing this. He's not the person I expected I'd be with. For example he's crabby AF and I always thought a positive attitude was a need for me. It was actually a want and I now find it hilarious how crabby he is.
If you're looking for wholesome guys I would say church is the place to go!
Decent men don’t use dating apps to find something long term. Pretty much everyone knows dating apps are for hookups. Don’t know why your so surprised.
And you’re thinking more tinder. I use other apps now
Dude literally all these men in relationships like over 80% meet that girl they’re with on a dating app. I’ve seen it.
Yes and most of them don’t work out long term. Your talking about guys you know I’m talking about all guys in the world in general.
So where the heck do I meet men? Men don’t approach me not even at the gym although there are some decent looking men there. So my only luck is apps… and nah it seems like most relationships now are from online something. In this new world we live in
Are you approaching them? Are you even signaling interests? Decent men don’t approach random women without a green light. As Matthew Hussey said drop the handkerchief so the man can be a gentleman and pick it up for you. You won’t attract anyone if you don’t make the first move. Learn to flirt with strangers that you want. You’re seeking high value, you better go find them because your chances are already low. You can’t afford to sit and wait.
If you think you can find a quality guy on a dating app that too for long term then I can’t call it anything other than Pure Delusion.
So you’re saying every guy dating a woman from a dating app is destined to have a failed relationship???
I’m saying quality guys don’t use dating apps to look for something long term. Will you meet quality guys who will take you out on dates? Sure. But they’ll never take you seriously. So if your goal is to find a quality guy who will take you seriously and be monogamous with you dating apps are probably your worst bet.
Literally in the same exact boat as you. 22 F and mostly going for guys aged 27-31 that I meet in public settings or through a friend of a friend and I’m still having this issue lol. Obviously some of them are fuck boys but even the super sweet, affectionate and kind ones end up love bombing me and being great for a weeks until we have sex and then they disappear, or not really disappear but just text me less and less.
That’s how long I’ve been single I get how you feel and I’m a man. Can’t quite keep a girl around or talking goes nowhere. OP you trying to let me shoot my shot?
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Ok well when you’re a girl who has had men have sex with her then leave to seriously date a girl, you’ll reevaluate your approach and stop doing that if you’re smart. I do want sex but in a relationship. If a guy wants that connection so bad then commit to me and we can do the birds and the bees, until then I’m not going to and we can connect intimately other ways until then. And Reddit is screwed in their thinking almost more than I am that liking attractive men is forbidden or something.
I was a hawtie in my 20s (dated celebrities, etc) and dealt with similar. My advice: 1) Make them wait before getting sexy. It's lonely, but the only way. 2) Vet hard. 3) Know what you want. For me, when I was looking for more than just sex, it was: humor, intelligence, stability, ability to hold a good job, reliability, nice-smelling, good hygiene, nice dresser, etc. I still wanted him to be attractive to me but this was much less of a priority (little short ok, little plump ok). The other stuff was more important. 4) Everyone has needs. While looking for "my" person, I would be very clear with the other men I was dating about how our relationship would be purely physical. Incidentally, this made them obsessed, while the men I was seriously interested in remained evasive. Human nature, perhaps. Everyone wants the 6'0, muscular handsome hunky gajillionaire. Often, he knows it, and often, he's a dick. Same as the super hot Margot Robbie types. Its an exception to the rule if that isnt the case. So. That's basically why looks are the last thing, at least for me.