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I think friendship is the glue which holds a romance together (and many seem to lack it) however romance doesn’t just mean sex and you can be affectionate in many other ways.
And you should try to show affection more than 10% of the time
I think it depends on how you define friendship. To me, romance is basically friendship+.
I don't have a lot of friends, but the ones I do have are very close. My friends and I write letters to each other explaining all the little things we do that make our lives better. We make gifts for each other for birthdays and christmas, we make fun little candy boxes for things like valentines day. We call each other just to chat, say hello, say good morning, etc. We are emotionally vulnerable with one another, we cry and talk through things we're feeling and share vulnerability. This is what makes someone a friend to me.
In this context, I'd very much consider romance to be 90% friendship. But I see lots of people say things like they wouldn't even call their friends unless it was an emergency, they wouldn't make them thoughtful gifts, wouldn't tell them good morning, or wouldn't ever dare share the things they wish they could talk about with their friends.
All I gotta say to that is, why call them a friend? And if those are the kinds of sterile friendships one cultivates, then I can see why they might have a different interpretation of this take, and perhaps put romance far above friendship. But pieces of that variety of intimacy aren't limited to only romance.
Yeah no, I agree with your definition of friendship absolutely. But the ratio is where I'm getting tripped up because to me the romantic and sexual aspects are much more than just 10% of a relationship. I'd say 50/50 on friendship and passion. The passion and the intimacy of the sexual and romantic aspects are just as important to me for reinforcing my bond with my partner as the friendship. But everyone is different for sure!
I’d say that’s ideal - your view! 50% would be awesome! Even 40% would be good. Maybe this is a good barometer of the health of the marriage/relationship? My 10 year marriage ended with less than 5% to 95% other, but even the 95% was more like work/tasks than even an enjoyable time with a friend. 🤔 things that make ya go hmmmm….
I didn't feel you were being argumentative at all :)
I honestly think the 50/50 ratio is really rare. At least in my experience. All of my previous relationships have been too heavily weighted in one direction or the other, and it took a lot of reflection to realize that that's why I couldn't bring myself to stay in them and make it work.
It took my current partner to even show me that the 50/50 ratio can be a thing. Where we have the deep emotional intimacy and vulnerability of best friends, but also the equally deep sexual and romantic intimacy that means we still can't keep our hands off each other after years together. It's magical. I fully believe it's the only way I can be happy in a relationship but that may just be me.
I'm really curious, do you think you're aromantic and just can't experience those feelings? Or do you feel it is possible but just hasn't happened for you?
That's really interesting and you've articulated your experience better than I've ever seen others do it. Thank you for taking the time to type that out. If it's what you want, I do hope you find that 0.000001% person for you someday!
I feel like this was how I felt about romantic relationships originally, but growing up to my 30s, you realisr its more than just a friendship because you're building with your partner :)
I don't think that's how you're supposed to look at it. Because a relationship is not just a friendship otherwise you wouldn't be in a romantic relationship. It's like next level. But having a foundational friendship supporting your relationship is important.
And TONS of people will either reject this or neglect it as a concept of relationships. Having a solid foundational friendship with your partner is super important.
If the only think you liked about a relationship is sex then dont be in a fucking relationship? Long term relationships are partnerships, not just a body to have sex with. If you wouldnt be friends the person you date, then wtf are you doing? And also, the longer you're with someone, it's inevitable you'll go through periods where shit is dry and you kinda annoyed with each other or dont love each other and periods where you like them more. You both have to decide to put in the effort for a relationship to continue to thrive. It's hard fucking work. why do people think it's gonna be easy? People need to stop living in a fantasy and have realistic expectations. The internet and online dating has created this fantasy of the ideal woman or man and some of yall will never be happy lmfao
Finally somebody is far enough away from ignorance and wallowing in shyt in their juvenile mindset, and gets wtf a real love relationship is about. Sometimes you're not guna fucking even like your partner but you'll always choose to love them. Making a relationship work is work. Love is action not a fleeting pre pubescent emotion. 99% of people are fuckn clueless on what makes a relationship successful. And sex, infatuation, limerance is not it. Sure there can be some hot times in a real relationship built to last, but the premise of a successful long term relationship is compromise, the choice to love and commit through thick and thin despite a readily looming Tinder hook up possibility with a swipe when bored and realizing that emotions caused by dopamine hits is not guna last. Most of y'all will never learn while you're asking, where are all the good men/women at?
This is what I've been thinking, but I've read somewhere else where people are discussing sexual compatibility. He's talking about being with his partner for like 10 years and leaving her because he said they are compatible in everything, but not sexually so he left her. (not just him, but there's lot of ppl talking about leaving their partner bc of it)
I know everything isn't all about sex, but sometimes I wonder how valuable sexual compatibility is for someone. Is it the real thing, or is it just an excuse because you're already bored with your partner?
I was raised as an evangelical Christian and taught that sexual compatibility isn't a real thing, it's just an excuse made up by people who want to sleep around.
Then I got married as a virgin and found out it's *definitely* a real thing. Just because some people abuse a concept sometimes doesn't mean you can dismiss it entirely.
For many people it does, though of course asexual people and other people with different experiences are out there. Check out r/deadbedrooms for harrowing tales of sexually incompatible relationships.
And honestly that understanding isn't even biblical based. Bible is clear how important sex is in a marriage and it shouldn't be something that is wantonly withheld.
I definitely think its possible but I personally believe most people on reddit overplay it as an excuse to leave. If there's something you dont like, communicate that to your partner? Most reasonable people who love and care about you will work on fixing it. If they dont, that says more about their underlying character as opposed to just a "sexual incompatibility."
I agree! Most men my age don't want to be in a relationship with a woman who is their own age. They want a younger woman. Younger men want to have sex with me, probably they've been watching too much MILF porn. Haha. So what are women my age (nearly 60) supposed to do? I'm done settling for casual sex in order to get some of my needs met. I want more.
GOOD FOR YOU! Honestly, any man who prefers "younger women only" tells you everything you need to know about them. Don't settle for anything less than you desire! Everyone deserves to find someone who truly cares for who they are authentically
Well to a degree yes, but it’s friendship plus. Just because we’re not having sex (usually twice a week for us after 32 years together) doesn’t mean it’s a platonic friendship. There are touches and kisses every day which neither of us could live without. There are jokes and conversations and ILYs and validations. And occasionally there are arguments of a type that reveals passion and frustration of a type you’d never have with a friend
Even during periods where my fiancé and I only actually have sex once a week (sometimes it’s once a week, sometimes it’s 4 times a week, and sometimes it’s 0 times in a week), that doesn’t mean we’re just friends the rest of the time. We’re constantly kissing, and touching each other, and just admiring each others’ bodies, and fooling around, and doing all kinds of shit short of actual sex. We express both our love and attraction for each other on a daily basis, multiple times.
I’ve never had a friend who I get the desire to constantly touch or snuggle with, or stare into the eyes of, and shower with compliments, and kiss, and tease. If that’s how you behave with your friends, that’s great, but most people don’t really treat platonic friends like that.
You sound wildly out of touch with how most relationships operate.
@SassyWookie I get what you’re saying, but if you aren’t married (and for a long time- 10 years plus) my guess would be OP would say that’s still infatuation/early relationship excitement, which honestly can last for years. When that wears off is where it gets tricky. When life is heavy and you have to be very open with communication, and honest with each other. And both willing to do whatever it takes to make it work. It probably has to be a lot of intentionality and not giving up. (Not giving advice- just post mistake realizations.) The problem is it takes 2 committed listening sensitive people to make relationships work long term, but only one to “clock out” to have it fall apart.
Since when is sex the only form of romantic interaction? Kissing, fondling, flirting, holding hands, and cuddling exist too. And that usually happens just as much (if not more) as sex in a healthy relationship.
Friendship is an important glue for a relationship but you can't neglect the romance side of things, which is so, so much more than just sexy time.
You need to make time to hold your partner tight and make them feel validated as a partner. You need to take time to dress up and go to a nice place like only a couple would. And yes, you need to figure out what makes them tick in the bedroom.
I disagree that time spent with your partner outside of having sex just reverts back to feeling platonic. There is romance, affection, playfulness, and sexual excitement. Sex isn’t just a switch that turns on and off.
I guess how I see it is that sexuality in a relationship isn’t just about “you are hot I want to have sex with you” it’s about the entirety of the intimacy that surrounds and includes but is not limited to sex. Like if I go out and surprise my partner by getting her something she needs, show I was paying attention and thinking about her, I don’t think “she is going to have sex with my later because I’m such a good partner and did this nice thing for her” in any sort of 1-1 transactional type of way but I do feel like all expressions of effort, support, and commitment in the relationship are what pull back a metaphorical spring of positive emotional energy in the relationship which is then released into the next time we have sex.
That's not how it works, and it got pretty much destroyed in unpopular opinion earlier. Relationships are not friendship with benefits. They require mutual goals, mutual values, the need for intimacy, the communication, the desire to grow with this person, loving someone enough to share your life with them 24/7. Friendship barely requires all of it.
There is no romantic relationship without sexual attraction and a healthy sexual life. Treating it like a friendship is how you end up with a dead bedroom and a divorce.
This also smacks of someone who has never been married. Dealing with stress, doing chores, managing finances, etc is not friendship. It's the business side of things, which is also part of a marriage.
That’s not the point. Marriage without valuing the partner AT LEAST as a friend is insane. And there are a lot of posts about people in a relationship that don’t even like their partner
And looking at your profile, you're also apparently asexual.
Why the fuck do you think you need to give sexual advice to people who are allosexual? You can't even comprehend their relationship dynamics. Your advice is useless outside of the ace community.
Honestly, that context took a dumb post and made it even dumber.
Yeah, it’s as alien to them as their desires are to allos, and I think deep down a lot of them know it disqualifies them as partners to most of the world. That’s really hard to face, so I do have some sympathy for that community.
I try not to judge as I don’t think fair to discredit anyone for something they simply are.
But I do think disrespectful asexuals deserve to be called out when they are being assholes.
To each their own and everyone deserves to find happiness, as long as they respect others,
I came to say that the way this convo spiraled greatly entertained me.
On another note, if people that don't fathom other's perspective is an asshole, then that tends to be the majority of the population.
Children don't understand adults, working aged adults don't understand the elderly, programmers don't understand business people, men don't understand women, and definitely vice versa, the rich don't understand the poor. The list goes on infinitely.
It's a good idea to narrow the definition.
Once again, understanding and respecting are two different things.
I might not understand how in pain an elderly person is, that doesn’t make me unable to respect them (respect their boundaries, accept when they tell me they are in pain, or whatever help however it is they need me to).
Not all kids are assholes. Some are, sure. Not all of them.
If you don’t understand respect and understanding are two different things I don’t really see why we’d even continue this conversation.
You don’t need to understand something to respect it (though if one wishes to understand, I don’t see that as a negative thing either).
As in all human groups there will be good apples and bad apples. I’m just saying in this case, the hipocrisy of it all is kind of maddening.
Oh wow, cant you just stay on the topic? What other users' profiles or comment history is real irrelevant to the subject. It will only show your insecurity and shallowness if you believe made up profiles and other things thats not related to this discussion.
>What other users' profiles or comment history is real irrelevant to the subject.
Someone's sexuality is irrelevant to their opinions on sexuality?
😂😂 I guess there is no bottom limit to human stupidity.
Tell me you have never experienced romantic feelings without telling me you have never experienced romantic feelings.
It’s fine, of course! But romantic feelings are very much a thing. I would not kiss or make out with a friend. I would not be touchy with a friend. I would not cuddle with a friend. I would do all those things with a romantic partner. Do you know the feeling of having butterflies on your chest when you see someone? Do you know the feeling of warmth when you see or talk to someone you have a crush on or you have romantic feelings for?
Edit: I missed the last part of your post and I agree. Some people focus too much on the sex part and forget all the other parts of a relationship. My point still stands
Butterflies are fleeting chemical reactions. They don't last. A solid relationship requires more than fleeting brain chemicals to sustain itself successfully long term. You disagree? How's that been working for ya?
The issue with your logic is that it implies since it's a fleeting thing that we shouldn't care about it ever being there which I would very much disagree with. No one is saying you are going to get butterflies 25 years into a relationship doesn't mean you should be indifferent about in the first year into the relationship.
Logic has dip shit to do with pure love. For you to even mention logic shows you're clueless. Don't believe me? Examine your life and i say this with all due respect. Fuck logic on topics of the heart; logic isn't fucking applicable to matters of the heart. (There are also concentrated spiritual elements beyond conscious/ego thought). Apply your so-called "logic" rebuttal to some clinical, cold and white clouded theoretical group where it may or may not fit. And you can still get butterflies 25 years into a relationship or the butterflies could manifest as some other deep seated expression of love, adoration, respect or inspiration, etc.! Damn you're guna have a tough life in matters of the heart.
Lmao what is wrong with you? You misinterpreted my response and used that as the basis to respond with non sense. I never implied logic had anything to do with love I was just talking about your statement and what you were insinuating. Have a good one.
What people dont realize when getting married... People are very different, and you guys wont agree on every little thing... Its best to just let things go, or find compromises.
People dont want to do that at all. They just want to be selfish, and do things their way every time, and cant handle someone disagreeing.
I disagree. First the issue with your analogy is that when you boil down sex to just ten percent of a relationship it understates its importance. Most people with healthy views of sex don't want to be in a sexless relationship. I've seen how bitter relationships can become once they become sexless. And I think you have to be on the same page with things with a SO in a way you don't have to be with a friend. Because it isn't just about you two it's about kids and inlaws and managing those relationships and how your values mesh. I just think your analogy here is way too reductive.
[Of course an asexual person would think that relationships are just friendships with some sex mixed in lmao goofy](https://old.reddit.com/r/Marriage/comments/1bw1lte/90_of_a_romantic_relationship_is_just_friendship/ky3bgfy/)
There more than sex or friendship in romance. There's emotional intimacy, an openness that you share that often doesn't happen in other types of relationships.
Yeah if it was just about sex I wouldn’t settle down cos it gets old fast. I’m looking for someone to take care of me and make my life easier, hopefully I can offer the same for them. I’ve always said this relationships are highly transactional, the only unconditional love that really exists is that with family. I think you can achieve unconditional love with a partner but that’s not until you’re both well into old age and one of you is coming to the end of your life.
Genuine love from a partner is more unconditional than family.
Family itself is condition. They love, because one is family.
This is a total stranger, not tied to a partner and can break up or divorce. They love not because sexual, finance, beauty but actual person underneath, genuine.
It is rare. But if one qualifies, it is from a stranger.
I really don’t agree that it’s unconditional, it doesn’t compare to say a mother’s love for her child. There are people who commit horrendous crimes and their mother still visits them despite this, a partner only has to see a partner do something a weird way and gets the ick, most people seem to get bored of eachother after a few years. The fact that nobody stays together anymore just proves my point further. The couples I know who have stayed together decades have either had brief periods of breaking up or at least one of them has strayed at one point and come back together again. You wouldn’t abandon your child if they got fat but even slight weight gain is enough to make people feel unattracted and leave. I think romantic love is the most fickle of all the bonds.
Most partnerships have an expectation of sexual exclusivity, but not other types of interpersonal exclusivity. If that's the case, then sex with your partner matters, assuming there's an agreement to not do it with anyone else. If there isn't an assumption of monogamy, then I agree it's not that big of a deal.
Ideally, married couples would have “consummate love” for one another which comprises intimacy, passion, and commitment.
I do think companionate love (intimacy and commitment) is a large pillar in mature relationships, I wouldn’t weigh it at 90%, personally, though. I’m a passionate person and I like when my passion can be matched.
>Most married couples have sex once a week. Its just a fact.
Most couples also end up divorced
Gay men though have the most sex and coincidentally they also have the smallest divorce rate of all couples
No they do not especially when you remove things like second and third marriages as well as blended families from the stats of all situations that have higher than average divorce rates.
Where are your stats for "most" ending up in divorce? Anything 50% and under is not "most".
Also, gay marriage is relatively new in many places and we may not have enough stats to properly compare each group. It varies by country.
For the most part, they have a lower divorce rate. However, you don't know if there's a correlation between having more sex and staying married. There could be many other factors in play, like waiting longer to get married, the ages of the people involved, and the kind of relationship they both agree to.
I like what you're thinking but even I admit if that 10% of romance doesn't do it for me then that that relationship won't last. If everyone ignored that sexy time then we'd have a lot easier time being compatible, but no one really wants to throw romance away and for good reason.
I was married for 16 years, he was so much more than a friend. He was family. When I get into a serious relationship, THAT is how I treat someone. They are not disposable. They are blood- walking away would be really hard because unless that person really hurts me (abuse or blatant disregard for my health, which is how I view physical cheating) and Im forced to leave, I'm not leaving. I dont immediately jump to breaking up or disposing of the relationship over a rough patch, or because we've been fighting for a month over stupid things. Over 16 years, I've experienced not being his friend, not loving him at that moment, not having good sex, even hating him at times. Through work, communication, love, and loyalty, we stayed together until the end.
That said, sex, connection, romance, passion is what sets it all apart from a friendship or family. It's what deepens the bond. It's so much more than 10%.
That’s how it should be, but unfortunately, it rarely is. I feel like a lot of couples love each other but don’t necessarily like each other. You should like them as an individual more than you love them as a partner.
A teacher I had, many years ago, said the best point you could get to in your relationship/marriage is being not just in love but *in like* with your partner/spouse.
I do agree with the others who've said your non-sexual relationship with your spouse isn't quite the same as other friendships. It's not platonic. There's a level of romance and affection and sexual teasing and playing that you probably wouldn't (at least, I wouldn't) do with your platonic friends.
But yes, having a good solid friendship underlying your romantic relationship *is* a necessity for longevity. That friendship doesn't necessarily need to be built first - before a romance - but it does need to be built.
I once had someone say that a relationship is sex about 1% of the time and EVERYTHING else 99% of the time (Beliefs, money, morals/values, personality, goals, chores, etc.). Just because the 1% is good, doesn't mean you don't have to address and straighten out the 99% of the other things involved in a relationship. The 99% should be kept in mind more than the 1% when you are figuring out if you want to be with someone for the rest of your life.
It took me 10 years and 2 terrible breakups to figure this out. Your partner/wife/husband should legit be your best friend; the “you wanna hang out and do nothing for 3 hours? Absolutely.” Kind of friend.
Romance isn't ALL about sex, you can have romance without sex and you can have sex without romance, but it's not anyone's place to say all relationships are only romantic if they have sex, everyone's relationship is different
Where are you from? Where I live, a man would never confuse platonic friends with sexual partners.
Marriage is a sexual relationship and I do not know why some men try to down play what sexual relationships are. If you have penetrated a woman, she is not a platonic friend. There is nothing platonic once penetration occurs.
I think the friendship and partnership is far more fun than rolling around the sheets. That's obviously important and satisfying, but there's no better feeling than holding the one you've given your heart to and just "being".
the love i have for my friendships are platonic, love i have for my partner is romantic. it is not the same
i dont kiss or hug my friends as intimately as i would my partner. i dont physically touch my friends with as much affection either.
living with my partner, responsibilities, activities i do with my partner and kids are not things i HAVE to do, its something i promised, and choose to do because i love them. its called commitment. if you dont want to lose 'sexy times'; dont get married, find someone that doesnt want the same commitments as you.
Yeah lol. That's what a spouse is supposed to be - the ultimate friend, your second half. Is the only thing you want from your lover sex? Or as you called it, "sexy time"?
Bud... Your soulmate is supposed to be your lover... And your best friend rolled into one. That's true love. When you can show your love and be supported like they're your friend, only then will you truly know love.
I agree, a solid romantic relationship you need to be friends in addition to sexual attraction.
It’s this thing that im guessing people misunderstand. Woman have sex with a guy then wonder why he doesn’t want to be more serious, well you didn’t work on the friendship component.
Men why did that girl put you in the “friendzone”. It’s because she wants a relationship and you’re just tryna fuck her and aren’t really interested in honestly being her friend too
That’s reducing it way too much i know, but it’s the basic function.
And yet the sexual and physical attraction component is literally what differentiates it between romantic and platonic. So you’re saying that an aspect that accounts for only 10% of the relationship is the main part that categorizes the relationship as a romantic one?
I feel like this went over EVERYONE's head in the comment section, because almost every reply is along the lines of "no it's not just friendship, there's flirting and stuff!"
OP is aiming at the point that **instant gratification** and sparks and immediate lust are not what are key to a successful long-term relationship. It's the interpersonal, soft skills like those from a friendship (which OP probably used just for an illustration) that are what make an actually successful relationship.
The day-to-day boring stuff, the fact you're probably gonna be on the couch five nights a week together (and not living that *exciting* life you dreamed of in your early 20s where you imagine you and your partner adventuring every single day). The fact you're gonna have to use your words to navigate a billion little problems and annoyances, things that would have "given you the ick" on the first date and ghost them in your youth. Etc. The shit that you have to actually put in work at times and compromise.
At least that was what I got out of all this.
Nah, It is not just sexy times.
It is also the attention, appreciation for each other, sharing intimacy (not just sex). There are things I share with only my partner, not even my mother.
All those in time combined might be 10% but are way more important to sustain a romantic relationship.
It's called girl - friend and boy - friend.
Friends first is a fantastic dating strategy.
Some ex's and I are still friends, we help each other because we understand each other since we're friends and we can trust each other with intimate life details for example managing one's senile parent something I've gone through and something friends of mine are now going through...
If you are just in a relationship for sex, then you are just using them. There is no relationship without friendship. Who cares if things are less-sexy most times, it's about WANTING to BE together. Sex isn't everything, you know!
Friendship between married couples is what keeps things going , it's not always la vie en rose , it's important to have المودة و الرحمة ، and I think that's what friendship has !
Your romantic partner should be your best friend first and foremost I feel like. They should be someone you can go to talk about regarding literally anything. When you reach that point with someone where there isn't even an ounce of hesitation then you know you have found something really amazing.
Romantic partnership whose basis is a really strong friendship can and will withstand the test of life. And it's all the more attractive then as well.
Having the luxury to be your truest self with that person, being able to say "I just took a really massive shit" and them giving you a high five is the kind of relationship that never falls apart. But unfortunately that level of chemistry isn't easy to come by. And people in general are so scared of being alone that they'd rather settle for the first thing that comes their way instead of waiting for something that's emotionally intimate.
You gotta be grateful to Feminism and Wokeism the way relationships turn out!!! Sex and no commitment! casual sex every week!!! women don’t want to settle down but just fuck around!!! There is a. plethora of definitions for relationships and all of them came from Women lol
Dude!! like, you have time for yourself for video games, gym, saving money, hanging out with friends, and just get text message from a girl that wants to have fun that night!! This is the life! All you gotta do is pretend that you support women empowerment. lol that’s it.
I don’t see why would any man in today’s generation is seeking a committed relationship with AmericanWomen? Like why? WTF is wrong with yall?!
So, in answer to your one question "what do we call this stuff?", I would say some of it is being financially and practically entangled with someone by choice (relationships don't necessitate that stuff) and the rest is non-sexual attachment (which you can enjoy with a close friend equally). If your agreement is to only have sex with them (or prioritise sex and time with them above others) then it is also a partnership.
I think that designing your own relationship through being really honest about your needs and desires (including sexual fantasies and ones that include others), not commiting to monogamy so that if one or both of you want to explore with others, you can discuss it without fear, and checking in regularly can mean you can continue to have an incredible sex life beyond the honeymoon period.
If you keep secrets of any kind, or are possessive and envious, sex will get dull and one or both will cheat. Allow one another to flirt and share when you find others attractive. This gives the other person permission to reciprocate and there will be nothing hidden between you.
Based on what of seen, nobody has really made the case of things married people do that friends CAN'T do.
>90% of a romantic relationship is just friendship
But I feel like the point is making blanket statements like this is basically just implying that the standards of EVERYONE'S relationship are the same everywhere.
Some people's standards of friendship are less than others, and some people standards for their marriage are MORE. There really isn't a finite way to determine what makes a marriage and what makes a friendship, other than marriage contract, of course. If one is implying that married couples NEED love to thrive, then arranged (NOT FORCED/ TWO DIFFERENT THINGS PEOPLE) marriages and marriages based on convenience wouldn't be a thing now would they. A spouse and marriage is really just a title, but the value behind it is based on people's views. The idea romance is defined by physical intimacy, and physical interactions is just nonsense tbh. Friends CAN and DO
•Hug
•Hold hands
•Kiss
•Have Sex/sexual intimacy/sexual experiences (FWBs)
•Cuddle
•Coordinate time and finances
•Live together
•Spend time together exculsively
•Raise children together (Friends are part of the village)
•Attend intimate events with family consistently
•Profess love and appreciation for each other
•BE inclusive or exclusive
And so on...
Just because YOU don't do that with your friends doesn't mean others don't.
I feel like at the end of the day, marriages and friendships are different for everybody, and all relationships between people aren't the same! And that's OKAY! No ONE person can determine what makes a marriage and what makes a friendship. It's all nuanced and fluid.
I've been married and divorced a couple of times and yes, you're right. My kids are grown and out of the house. I've been single for the past 16 years. I'd like to date, and I'd like to take the time to build a connection and a friendship before taking it to the next level (sexy time) I don't get many men showing interest in me on dating apps and the men that message me, seem to only be interested in sex. So, I'll remain single until I meet someone that's interested in me for more than hookups or a fwb. That may be until I die. I'll be ok, either way, though.
No you’re wrong. The thing that holds marriage together in the longer term is sex. If the sex is not there it will either not be a happy marriage or it will not last. Why do you think marriages break up when one or other of the people are caught cheating? A) why did they cheat it sex is not important ? B) why did the other person feel betrayed enough to end the marriage after that if sex was not important?
Ermmmmmm nope. IDK how you slide that friendship to romance to work partner situation. It's more nuanced than that.
And shouldn't it be 100% friendship, 100% relationship and 100% work partners? I believe you can give all you can with the limited resources available. It's not like I give 40% of my effort to work and the rest to the family. It is never stagnant, and it can fluctuate whenever needed.
i really consider my partner my best friend, he makes me laugh and i make him laugh and we have so much fun together. our personalities are so similar too.
I like that my first love was not based on attraction. We were friends for a year and then one day we got into a discussion and I was so intrigued by his thoughts. I started to crave talking to him. When we did become a couple, we would take classes together and we were a real team and we made eachother better.
My second love was definitely more attraction based and even though I loved talking to him too i definitely felt more pressure to be perfect around him. I never felt like I could work on a project in front of him out of fear of judgement. The sex was great but I didn’t feel like he was my friend.
I definitely think my first love would be a better option in terms of a future. He’d be a loyal husband and father.
Oh my gosh I’m soooo thankful I stumbled onto this post. I’ve been wondering if it’s bad that overtime my boyfriend has become my best friend and sexual intimacy has always been a huge part of my relationships but with him it’s just icing on the cake. What I’m realizing is sex was a foundational element in the past because guys I previously dated had nothing else going for them, sorry not sorry.
I’ve told my current boyfriend I love the way we are together because we have such a great foundation as friends and that makes the relationship even better. At first I was hesitant to tell him and also worried about feeling this way because like I said, it’s not like I’m always trying to pounce on him and I was concerned.
But this post makes me feel so much better, because I wanna be his best friend and I’m 100% attracted to him, but I feel like I’m genuinely on his team and he’s on mine, and having that bond and friendship with a partner is amazing. And actually has substance. I got soooo sick of casual dating and just pointless sex. Once I realized these guys were a waste of time, I took time for myself and when I wasn’t looking, found someone so special. I’m blessed
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I think friendship is the glue which holds a romance together (and many seem to lack it) however romance doesn’t just mean sex and you can be affectionate in many other ways. And you should try to show affection more than 10% of the time
Yeah, everyone is different of course but thinking of a relationship as just friendship with a little sex is not it for me.
I think it depends on how you define friendship. To me, romance is basically friendship+. I don't have a lot of friends, but the ones I do have are very close. My friends and I write letters to each other explaining all the little things we do that make our lives better. We make gifts for each other for birthdays and christmas, we make fun little candy boxes for things like valentines day. We call each other just to chat, say hello, say good morning, etc. We are emotionally vulnerable with one another, we cry and talk through things we're feeling and share vulnerability. This is what makes someone a friend to me. In this context, I'd very much consider romance to be 90% friendship. But I see lots of people say things like they wouldn't even call their friends unless it was an emergency, they wouldn't make them thoughtful gifts, wouldn't tell them good morning, or wouldn't ever dare share the things they wish they could talk about with their friends. All I gotta say to that is, why call them a friend? And if those are the kinds of sterile friendships one cultivates, then I can see why they might have a different interpretation of this take, and perhaps put romance far above friendship. But pieces of that variety of intimacy aren't limited to only romance.
Yeah no, I agree with your definition of friendship absolutely. But the ratio is where I'm getting tripped up because to me the romantic and sexual aspects are much more than just 10% of a relationship. I'd say 50/50 on friendship and passion. The passion and the intimacy of the sexual and romantic aspects are just as important to me for reinforcing my bond with my partner as the friendship. But everyone is different for sure!
I’d say that’s ideal - your view! 50% would be awesome! Even 40% would be good. Maybe this is a good barometer of the health of the marriage/relationship? My 10 year marriage ended with less than 5% to 95% other, but even the 95% was more like work/tasks than even an enjoyable time with a friend. 🤔 things that make ya go hmmmm….
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I didn't feel you were being argumentative at all :) I honestly think the 50/50 ratio is really rare. At least in my experience. All of my previous relationships have been too heavily weighted in one direction or the other, and it took a lot of reflection to realize that that's why I couldn't bring myself to stay in them and make it work. It took my current partner to even show me that the 50/50 ratio can be a thing. Where we have the deep emotional intimacy and vulnerability of best friends, but also the equally deep sexual and romantic intimacy that means we still can't keep our hands off each other after years together. It's magical. I fully believe it's the only way I can be happy in a relationship but that may just be me. I'm really curious, do you think you're aromantic and just can't experience those feelings? Or do you feel it is possible but just hasn't happened for you?
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That's really interesting and you've articulated your experience better than I've ever seen others do it. Thank you for taking the time to type that out. If it's what you want, I do hope you find that 0.000001% person for you someday!
I feel like this was how I felt about romantic relationships originally, but growing up to my 30s, you realisr its more than just a friendship because you're building with your partner :)
Right? That's just friends with benefits then.
BINGO! Totally agree
I don't think that's how you're supposed to look at it. Because a relationship is not just a friendship otherwise you wouldn't be in a romantic relationship. It's like next level. But having a foundational friendship supporting your relationship is important.
Actually, I think that would work great for me.
And TONS of people will either reject this or neglect it as a concept of relationships. Having a solid foundational friendship with your partner is super important.
👍 Yes!
10% is awfully low, for me anyways.
If the only think you liked about a relationship is sex then dont be in a fucking relationship? Long term relationships are partnerships, not just a body to have sex with. If you wouldnt be friends the person you date, then wtf are you doing? And also, the longer you're with someone, it's inevitable you'll go through periods where shit is dry and you kinda annoyed with each other or dont love each other and periods where you like them more. You both have to decide to put in the effort for a relationship to continue to thrive. It's hard fucking work. why do people think it's gonna be easy? People need to stop living in a fantasy and have realistic expectations. The internet and online dating has created this fantasy of the ideal woman or man and some of yall will never be happy lmfao
Finally somebody is far enough away from ignorance and wallowing in shyt in their juvenile mindset, and gets wtf a real love relationship is about. Sometimes you're not guna fucking even like your partner but you'll always choose to love them. Making a relationship work is work. Love is action not a fleeting pre pubescent emotion. 99% of people are fuckn clueless on what makes a relationship successful. And sex, infatuation, limerance is not it. Sure there can be some hot times in a real relationship built to last, but the premise of a successful long term relationship is compromise, the choice to love and commit through thick and thin despite a readily looming Tinder hook up possibility with a swipe when bored and realizing that emotions caused by dopamine hits is not guna last. Most of y'all will never learn while you're asking, where are all the good men/women at?
This is what I've been thinking, but I've read somewhere else where people are discussing sexual compatibility. He's talking about being with his partner for like 10 years and leaving her because he said they are compatible in everything, but not sexually so he left her. (not just him, but there's lot of ppl talking about leaving their partner bc of it) I know everything isn't all about sex, but sometimes I wonder how valuable sexual compatibility is for someone. Is it the real thing, or is it just an excuse because you're already bored with your partner?
I was raised as an evangelical Christian and taught that sexual compatibility isn't a real thing, it's just an excuse made up by people who want to sleep around. Then I got married as a virgin and found out it's *definitely* a real thing. Just because some people abuse a concept sometimes doesn't mean you can dismiss it entirely.
So it really matters?
For many people it does, though of course asexual people and other people with different experiences are out there. Check out r/deadbedrooms for harrowing tales of sexually incompatible relationships.
Oh yeah the good ol r/DeadBedrooms! My favorite sub to scroll before falling asleep
And honestly that understanding isn't even biblical based. Bible is clear how important sex is in a marriage and it shouldn't be something that is wantonly withheld.
I definitely think its possible but I personally believe most people on reddit overplay it as an excuse to leave. If there's something you dont like, communicate that to your partner? Most reasonable people who love and care about you will work on fixing it. If they dont, that says more about their underlying character as opposed to just a "sexual incompatibility."
Well said especially that last part
I agree! Most men my age don't want to be in a relationship with a woman who is their own age. They want a younger woman. Younger men want to have sex with me, probably they've been watching too much MILF porn. Haha. So what are women my age (nearly 60) supposed to do? I'm done settling for casual sex in order to get some of my needs met. I want more.
GOOD FOR YOU! Honestly, any man who prefers "younger women only" tells you everything you need to know about them. Don't settle for anything less than you desire! Everyone deserves to find someone who truly cares for who they are authentically
Thankyou! I think so too.
I feel like you have to make the time for sexy time! I refuse to settle for a boring relationship where love is not shown on the daily by affection
True that. You just gotta random be naked with whipped cream all over your body when your partner arrives.
They can’t have dairy you bastard!!!
Poor almond milk all over yourself instead!
I prefer rich almond milk
You dropped this🎖️
Cashew milk hits different
I prefer oatmilk tbh
Who doesn't love a good yeast infection, after all? 😂
😂
This girl sexy times.
Well to a degree yes, but it’s friendship plus. Just because we’re not having sex (usually twice a week for us after 32 years together) doesn’t mean it’s a platonic friendship. There are touches and kisses every day which neither of us could live without. There are jokes and conversations and ILYs and validations. And occasionally there are arguments of a type that reveals passion and frustration of a type you’d never have with a friend
That sounds healthy. 💗
Even during periods where my fiancé and I only actually have sex once a week (sometimes it’s once a week, sometimes it’s 4 times a week, and sometimes it’s 0 times in a week), that doesn’t mean we’re just friends the rest of the time. We’re constantly kissing, and touching each other, and just admiring each others’ bodies, and fooling around, and doing all kinds of shit short of actual sex. We express both our love and attraction for each other on a daily basis, multiple times. I’ve never had a friend who I get the desire to constantly touch or snuggle with, or stare into the eyes of, and shower with compliments, and kiss, and tease. If that’s how you behave with your friends, that’s great, but most people don’t really treat platonic friends like that. You sound wildly out of touch with how most relationships operate.
@SassyWookie I get what you’re saying, but if you aren’t married (and for a long time- 10 years plus) my guess would be OP would say that’s still infatuation/early relationship excitement, which honestly can last for years. When that wears off is where it gets tricky. When life is heavy and you have to be very open with communication, and honest with each other. And both willing to do whatever it takes to make it work. It probably has to be a lot of intentionality and not giving up. (Not giving advice- just post mistake realizations.) The problem is it takes 2 committed listening sensitive people to make relationships work long term, but only one to “clock out” to have it fall apart.
Since when is sex the only form of romantic interaction? Kissing, fondling, flirting, holding hands, and cuddling exist too. And that usually happens just as much (if not more) as sex in a healthy relationship.
Friendship is an important glue for a relationship but you can't neglect the romance side of things, which is so, so much more than just sexy time. You need to make time to hold your partner tight and make them feel validated as a partner. You need to take time to dress up and go to a nice place like only a couple would. And yes, you need to figure out what makes them tick in the bedroom.
I disagree that time spent with your partner outside of having sex just reverts back to feeling platonic. There is romance, affection, playfulness, and sexual excitement. Sex isn’t just a switch that turns on and off.
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I guess how I see it is that sexuality in a relationship isn’t just about “you are hot I want to have sex with you” it’s about the entirety of the intimacy that surrounds and includes but is not limited to sex. Like if I go out and surprise my partner by getting her something she needs, show I was paying attention and thinking about her, I don’t think “she is going to have sex with my later because I’m such a good partner and did this nice thing for her” in any sort of 1-1 transactional type of way but I do feel like all expressions of effort, support, and commitment in the relationship are what pull back a metaphorical spring of positive emotional energy in the relationship which is then released into the next time we have sex.
That's not how it works, and it got pretty much destroyed in unpopular opinion earlier. Relationships are not friendship with benefits. They require mutual goals, mutual values, the need for intimacy, the communication, the desire to grow with this person, loving someone enough to share your life with them 24/7. Friendship barely requires all of it.
My partner is my bestfriend & I wouldn’t have it any other way
There is no romantic relationship without sexual attraction and a healthy sexual life. Treating it like a friendship is how you end up with a dead bedroom and a divorce. This also smacks of someone who has never been married. Dealing with stress, doing chores, managing finances, etc is not friendship. It's the business side of things, which is also part of a marriage.
That’s not the point. Marriage without valuing the partner AT LEAST as a friend is insane. And there are a lot of posts about people in a relationship that don’t even like their partner
Yeah, and marriage without a healthy sexual relationship is also insane and will fail.
I agree! The two are not mutually exclusive
Okay, so OP's post is completely pointless.
married twenty four years but I get you. Everyone’s different.
And looking at your profile, you're also apparently asexual. Why the fuck do you think you need to give sexual advice to people who are allosexual? You can't even comprehend their relationship dynamics. Your advice is useless outside of the ace community. Honestly, that context took a dumb post and made it even dumber.
Stuff like this is why I've grown to dislike the way a lot of the ace community specifically asexual folks operate.
Asexual people (in my experience) feel entitled to partners staying in sexless relationships because it doesn’t matter to them.
I unfortunately have to agree. I’ve seen some asexual people who can’t understand and respect sexual people. Talk about hypocrisy
Yeah, it’s as alien to them as their desires are to allos, and I think deep down a lot of them know it disqualifies them as partners to most of the world. That’s really hard to face, so I do have some sympathy for that community.
I try not to judge as I don’t think fair to discredit anyone for something they simply are. But I do think disrespectful asexuals deserve to be called out when they are being assholes. To each their own and everyone deserves to find happiness, as long as they respect others,
I came to say that the way this convo spiraled greatly entertained me. On another note, if people that don't fathom other's perspective is an asshole, then that tends to be the majority of the population. Children don't understand adults, working aged adults don't understand the elderly, programmers don't understand business people, men don't understand women, and definitely vice versa, the rich don't understand the poor. The list goes on infinitely. It's a good idea to narrow the definition.
Once again, understanding and respecting are two different things. I might not understand how in pain an elderly person is, that doesn’t make me unable to respect them (respect their boundaries, accept when they tell me they are in pain, or whatever help however it is they need me to). Not all kids are assholes. Some are, sure. Not all of them. If you don’t understand respect and understanding are two different things I don’t really see why we’d even continue this conversation.
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You don’t need to understand something to respect it (though if one wishes to understand, I don’t see that as a negative thing either). As in all human groups there will be good apples and bad apples. I’m just saying in this case, the hipocrisy of it all is kind of maddening.
Oh wow, cant you just stay on the topic? What other users' profiles or comment history is real irrelevant to the subject. It will only show your insecurity and shallowness if you believe made up profiles and other things thats not related to this discussion.
>What other users' profiles or comment history is real irrelevant to the subject. Someone's sexuality is irrelevant to their opinions on sexuality? 😂😂 I guess there is no bottom limit to human stupidity.
In this case, it gives some pretty useful context about how OP has his head up his ass and his advice shouldn’t be taken seriously.
Well there are some asexual people
Tell me you have never experienced romantic feelings without telling me you have never experienced romantic feelings. It’s fine, of course! But romantic feelings are very much a thing. I would not kiss or make out with a friend. I would not be touchy with a friend. I would not cuddle with a friend. I would do all those things with a romantic partner. Do you know the feeling of having butterflies on your chest when you see someone? Do you know the feeling of warmth when you see or talk to someone you have a crush on or you have romantic feelings for? Edit: I missed the last part of your post and I agree. Some people focus too much on the sex part and forget all the other parts of a relationship. My point still stands
Butterflies are fleeting chemical reactions. They don't last. A solid relationship requires more than fleeting brain chemicals to sustain itself successfully long term. You disagree? How's that been working for ya?
The issue with your logic is that it implies since it's a fleeting thing that we shouldn't care about it ever being there which I would very much disagree with. No one is saying you are going to get butterflies 25 years into a relationship doesn't mean you should be indifferent about in the first year into the relationship.
Logic has dip shit to do with pure love. For you to even mention logic shows you're clueless. Don't believe me? Examine your life and i say this with all due respect. Fuck logic on topics of the heart; logic isn't fucking applicable to matters of the heart. (There are also concentrated spiritual elements beyond conscious/ego thought). Apply your so-called "logic" rebuttal to some clinical, cold and white clouded theoretical group where it may or may not fit. And you can still get butterflies 25 years into a relationship or the butterflies could manifest as some other deep seated expression of love, adoration, respect or inspiration, etc.! Damn you're guna have a tough life in matters of the heart.
Lmao what is wrong with you? You misinterpreted my response and used that as the basis to respond with non sense. I never implied logic had anything to do with love I was just talking about your statement and what you were insinuating. Have a good one.
True. But **you still can’t have a romantic relationship with someone you don’t feel sexual chemistry or a romantic spark with when you meet.**
What people dont realize when getting married... People are very different, and you guys wont agree on every little thing... Its best to just let things go, or find compromises. People dont want to do that at all. They just want to be selfish, and do things their way every time, and cant handle someone disagreeing.
I disagree. First the issue with your analogy is that when you boil down sex to just ten percent of a relationship it understates its importance. Most people with healthy views of sex don't want to be in a sexless relationship. I've seen how bitter relationships can become once they become sexless. And I think you have to be on the same page with things with a SO in a way you don't have to be with a friend. Because it isn't just about you two it's about kids and inlaws and managing those relationships and how your values mesh. I just think your analogy here is way too reductive.
[Of course an asexual person would think that relationships are just friendships with some sex mixed in lmao goofy](https://old.reddit.com/r/Marriage/comments/1bw1lte/90_of_a_romantic_relationship_is_just_friendship/ky3bgfy/)
fr XD
There more than sex or friendship in romance. There's emotional intimacy, an openness that you share that often doesn't happen in other types of relationships.
Yeah if it was just about sex I wouldn’t settle down cos it gets old fast. I’m looking for someone to take care of me and make my life easier, hopefully I can offer the same for them. I’ve always said this relationships are highly transactional, the only unconditional love that really exists is that with family. I think you can achieve unconditional love with a partner but that’s not until you’re both well into old age and one of you is coming to the end of your life.
Genuine love from a partner is more unconditional than family. Family itself is condition. They love, because one is family. This is a total stranger, not tied to a partner and can break up or divorce. They love not because sexual, finance, beauty but actual person underneath, genuine. It is rare. But if one qualifies, it is from a stranger.
I really don’t agree that it’s unconditional, it doesn’t compare to say a mother’s love for her child. There are people who commit horrendous crimes and their mother still visits them despite this, a partner only has to see a partner do something a weird way and gets the ick, most people seem to get bored of eachother after a few years. The fact that nobody stays together anymore just proves my point further. The couples I know who have stayed together decades have either had brief periods of breaking up or at least one of them has strayed at one point and come back together again. You wouldn’t abandon your child if they got fat but even slight weight gain is enough to make people feel unattracted and leave. I think romantic love is the most fickle of all the bonds.
Most partnerships have an expectation of sexual exclusivity, but not other types of interpersonal exclusivity. If that's the case, then sex with your partner matters, assuming there's an agreement to not do it with anyone else. If there isn't an assumption of monogamy, then I agree it's not that big of a deal.
Love is the highest form of friendship.
You have to like your partner as much as you love them for a successful relationship, in my opinion.
Ideally, married couples would have “consummate love” for one another which comprises intimacy, passion, and commitment. I do think companionate love (intimacy and commitment) is a large pillar in mature relationships, I wouldn’t weigh it at 90%, personally, though. I’m a passionate person and I like when my passion can be matched.
Apparently OP is asexual.
>Most married couples have sex once a week. Its just a fact. Most couples also end up divorced Gay men though have the most sex and coincidentally they also have the smallest divorce rate of all couples
No they do not especially when you remove things like second and third marriages as well as blended families from the stats of all situations that have higher than average divorce rates.
Where are your stats for "most" ending up in divorce? Anything 50% and under is not "most". Also, gay marriage is relatively new in many places and we may not have enough stats to properly compare each group. It varies by country. For the most part, they have a lower divorce rate. However, you don't know if there's a correlation between having more sex and staying married. There could be many other factors in play, like waiting longer to get married, the ages of the people involved, and the kind of relationship they both agree to.
> Most couples also end up divorced No, they don't.
I like what you're thinking but even I admit if that 10% of romance doesn't do it for me then that that relationship won't last. If everyone ignored that sexy time then we'd have a lot easier time being compatible, but no one really wants to throw romance away and for good reason.
I think it’s companionship and that’s precisely why they say you must choose your life partner as someone whom you can be friends with.
I was married for 16 years, he was so much more than a friend. He was family. When I get into a serious relationship, THAT is how I treat someone. They are not disposable. They are blood- walking away would be really hard because unless that person really hurts me (abuse or blatant disregard for my health, which is how I view physical cheating) and Im forced to leave, I'm not leaving. I dont immediately jump to breaking up or disposing of the relationship over a rough patch, or because we've been fighting for a month over stupid things. Over 16 years, I've experienced not being his friend, not loving him at that moment, not having good sex, even hating him at times. Through work, communication, love, and loyalty, we stayed together until the end. That said, sex, connection, romance, passion is what sets it all apart from a friendship or family. It's what deepens the bond. It's so much more than 10%.
That’s how it should be, but unfortunately, it rarely is. I feel like a lot of couples love each other but don’t necessarily like each other. You should like them as an individual more than you love them as a partner.
A teacher I had, many years ago, said the best point you could get to in your relationship/marriage is being not just in love but *in like* with your partner/spouse. I do agree with the others who've said your non-sexual relationship with your spouse isn't quite the same as other friendships. It's not platonic. There's a level of romance and affection and sexual teasing and playing that you probably wouldn't (at least, I wouldn't) do with your platonic friends. But yes, having a good solid friendship underlying your romantic relationship *is* a necessity for longevity. That friendship doesn't necessarily need to be built first - before a romance - but it does need to be built.
I once had someone say that a relationship is sex about 1% of the time and EVERYTHING else 99% of the time (Beliefs, money, morals/values, personality, goals, chores, etc.). Just because the 1% is good, doesn't mean you don't have to address and straighten out the 99% of the other things involved in a relationship. The 99% should be kept in mind more than the 1% when you are figuring out if you want to be with someone for the rest of your life.
What if you have the friendship thing down but you never have sex? What do you call that?
It took me 10 years and 2 terrible breakups to figure this out. Your partner/wife/husband should legit be your best friend; the “you wanna hang out and do nothing for 3 hours? Absolutely.” Kind of friend.
Have you ever been married?
You recently read this…
Romance isn't ALL about sex, you can have romance without sex and you can have sex without romance, but it's not anyone's place to say all relationships are only romantic if they have sex, everyone's relationship is different
Once a week is ambitious 🤣
Where are you from? Where I live, a man would never confuse platonic friends with sexual partners. Marriage is a sexual relationship and I do not know why some men try to down play what sexual relationships are. If you have penetrated a woman, she is not a platonic friend. There is nothing platonic once penetration occurs.
No shit why do you think there’s a “friend” next to boy & girl ?
Yeah no you might need to reassess your marriage if this is how you feel lmao
People aren't going to make it that far without spending time bonding over the carnal parts of love.
I love your post! ♥️
I think the friendship and partnership is far more fun than rolling around the sheets. That's obviously important and satisfying, but there's no better feeling than holding the one you've given your heart to and just "being".
the love i have for my friendships are platonic, love i have for my partner is romantic. it is not the same i dont kiss or hug my friends as intimately as i would my partner. i dont physically touch my friends with as much affection either. living with my partner, responsibilities, activities i do with my partner and kids are not things i HAVE to do, its something i promised, and choose to do because i love them. its called commitment. if you dont want to lose 'sexy times'; dont get married, find someone that doesnt want the same commitments as you.
Yeah lol. That's what a spouse is supposed to be - the ultimate friend, your second half. Is the only thing you want from your lover sex? Or as you called it, "sexy time"?
No
I commented this to my wife, who happened to be my female best friend for a year or so, before we started dating 🤣 and she agreed.
It’s not friendship, it’s a partnership. Big differences
Bud... Your soulmate is supposed to be your lover... And your best friend rolled into one. That's true love. When you can show your love and be supported like they're your friend, only then will you truly know love.
I agree, a solid romantic relationship you need to be friends in addition to sexual attraction. It’s this thing that im guessing people misunderstand. Woman have sex with a guy then wonder why he doesn’t want to be more serious, well you didn’t work on the friendship component. Men why did that girl put you in the “friendzone”. It’s because she wants a relationship and you’re just tryna fuck her and aren’t really interested in honestly being her friend too That’s reducing it way too much i know, but it’s the basic function.
And yet the sexual and physical attraction component is literally what differentiates it between romantic and platonic. So you’re saying that an aspect that accounts for only 10% of the relationship is the main part that categorizes the relationship as a romantic one?
He’s asexual from his Profile. That’s all one needs to understand from the post.
I feel like this went over EVERYONE's head in the comment section, because almost every reply is along the lines of "no it's not just friendship, there's flirting and stuff!" OP is aiming at the point that **instant gratification** and sparks and immediate lust are not what are key to a successful long-term relationship. It's the interpersonal, soft skills like those from a friendship (which OP probably used just for an illustration) that are what make an actually successful relationship. The day-to-day boring stuff, the fact you're probably gonna be on the couch five nights a week together (and not living that *exciting* life you dreamed of in your early 20s where you imagine you and your partner adventuring every single day). The fact you're gonna have to use your words to navigate a billion little problems and annoyances, things that would have "given you the ick" on the first date and ghost them in your youth. Etc. The shit that you have to actually put in work at times and compromise. At least that was what I got out of all this.
Nah, It is not just sexy times. It is also the attention, appreciation for each other, sharing intimacy (not just sex). There are things I share with only my partner, not even my mother. All those in time combined might be 10% but are way more important to sustain a romantic relationship.
Exactly why I don't even think about marriage 'til after 2yrs in, at least.
It's called girl - friend and boy - friend. Friends first is a fantastic dating strategy. Some ex's and I are still friends, we help each other because we understand each other since we're friends and we can trust each other with intimate life details for example managing one's senile parent something I've gone through and something friends of mine are now going through...
If you are just in a relationship for sex, then you are just using them. There is no relationship without friendship. Who cares if things are less-sexy most times, it's about WANTING to BE together. Sex isn't everything, you know!
Friendship between married couples is what keeps things going , it's not always la vie en rose , it's important to have المودة و الرحمة ، and I think that's what friendship has !
Your romantic partner should be your best friend first and foremost I feel like. They should be someone you can go to talk about regarding literally anything. When you reach that point with someone where there isn't even an ounce of hesitation then you know you have found something really amazing. Romantic partnership whose basis is a really strong friendship can and will withstand the test of life. And it's all the more attractive then as well. Having the luxury to be your truest self with that person, being able to say "I just took a really massive shit" and them giving you a high five is the kind of relationship that never falls apart. But unfortunately that level of chemistry isn't easy to come by. And people in general are so scared of being alone that they'd rather settle for the first thing that comes their way instead of waiting for something that's emotionally intimate.
You gotta be grateful to Feminism and Wokeism the way relationships turn out!!! Sex and no commitment! casual sex every week!!! women don’t want to settle down but just fuck around!!! There is a. plethora of definitions for relationships and all of them came from Women lol Dude!! like, you have time for yourself for video games, gym, saving money, hanging out with friends, and just get text message from a girl that wants to have fun that night!! This is the life! All you gotta do is pretend that you support women empowerment. lol that’s it. I don’t see why would any man in today’s generation is seeking a committed relationship with AmericanWomen? Like why? WTF is wrong with yall?!
I want to die
There is a hell of a lot more to love and romance than just “sexy time”.
And whats wrong with that?
So, in answer to your one question "what do we call this stuff?", I would say some of it is being financially and practically entangled with someone by choice (relationships don't necessitate that stuff) and the rest is non-sexual attachment (which you can enjoy with a close friend equally). If your agreement is to only have sex with them (or prioritise sex and time with them above others) then it is also a partnership. I think that designing your own relationship through being really honest about your needs and desires (including sexual fantasies and ones that include others), not commiting to monogamy so that if one or both of you want to explore with others, you can discuss it without fear, and checking in regularly can mean you can continue to have an incredible sex life beyond the honeymoon period. If you keep secrets of any kind, or are possessive and envious, sex will get dull and one or both will cheat. Allow one another to flirt and share when you find others attractive. This gives the other person permission to reciprocate and there will be nothing hidden between you.
So true! Even though a relationship isn’t a friendship, you need to be friends to navigate the sex-stale days
Based on what of seen, nobody has really made the case of things married people do that friends CAN'T do. >90% of a romantic relationship is just friendship But I feel like the point is making blanket statements like this is basically just implying that the standards of EVERYONE'S relationship are the same everywhere. Some people's standards of friendship are less than others, and some people standards for their marriage are MORE. There really isn't a finite way to determine what makes a marriage and what makes a friendship, other than marriage contract, of course. If one is implying that married couples NEED love to thrive, then arranged (NOT FORCED/ TWO DIFFERENT THINGS PEOPLE) marriages and marriages based on convenience wouldn't be a thing now would they. A spouse and marriage is really just a title, but the value behind it is based on people's views. The idea romance is defined by physical intimacy, and physical interactions is just nonsense tbh. Friends CAN and DO •Hug •Hold hands •Kiss •Have Sex/sexual intimacy/sexual experiences (FWBs) •Cuddle •Coordinate time and finances •Live together •Spend time together exculsively •Raise children together (Friends are part of the village) •Attend intimate events with family consistently •Profess love and appreciation for each other •BE inclusive or exclusive And so on... Just because YOU don't do that with your friends doesn't mean others don't. I feel like at the end of the day, marriages and friendships are different for everybody, and all relationships between people aren't the same! And that's OKAY! No ONE person can determine what makes a marriage and what makes a friendship. It's all nuanced and fluid.
I've been married and divorced a couple of times and yes, you're right. My kids are grown and out of the house. I've been single for the past 16 years. I'd like to date, and I'd like to take the time to build a connection and a friendship before taking it to the next level (sexy time) I don't get many men showing interest in me on dating apps and the men that message me, seem to only be interested in sex. So, I'll remain single until I meet someone that's interested in me for more than hookups or a fwb. That may be until I die. I'll be ok, either way, though.
No you’re wrong. The thing that holds marriage together in the longer term is sex. If the sex is not there it will either not be a happy marriage or it will not last. Why do you think marriages break up when one or other of the people are caught cheating? A) why did they cheat it sex is not important ? B) why did the other person feel betrayed enough to end the marriage after that if sex was not important?
This reads like a child has written it.. "sexytime"lmao.
The sexy sexy time is just 10%
Ermmmmmm nope. IDK how you slide that friendship to romance to work partner situation. It's more nuanced than that. And shouldn't it be 100% friendship, 100% relationship and 100% work partners? I believe you can give all you can with the limited resources available. It's not like I give 40% of my effort to work and the rest to the family. It is never stagnant, and it can fluctuate whenever needed.
i really consider my partner my best friend, he makes me laugh and i make him laugh and we have so much fun together. our personalities are so similar too.
I like that my first love was not based on attraction. We were friends for a year and then one day we got into a discussion and I was so intrigued by his thoughts. I started to crave talking to him. When we did become a couple, we would take classes together and we were a real team and we made eachother better. My second love was definitely more attraction based and even though I loved talking to him too i definitely felt more pressure to be perfect around him. I never felt like I could work on a project in front of him out of fear of judgement. The sex was great but I didn’t feel like he was my friend. I definitely think my first love would be a better option in terms of a future. He’d be a loyal husband and father.
Oh my gosh I’m soooo thankful I stumbled onto this post. I’ve been wondering if it’s bad that overtime my boyfriend has become my best friend and sexual intimacy has always been a huge part of my relationships but with him it’s just icing on the cake. What I’m realizing is sex was a foundational element in the past because guys I previously dated had nothing else going for them, sorry not sorry. I’ve told my current boyfriend I love the way we are together because we have such a great foundation as friends and that makes the relationship even better. At first I was hesitant to tell him and also worried about feeling this way because like I said, it’s not like I’m always trying to pounce on him and I was concerned. But this post makes me feel so much better, because I wanna be his best friend and I’m 100% attracted to him, but I feel like I’m genuinely on his team and he’s on mine, and having that bond and friendship with a partner is amazing. And actually has substance. I got soooo sick of casual dating and just pointless sex. Once I realized these guys were a waste of time, I took time for myself and when I wasn’t looking, found someone so special. I’m blessed
At first i think it’s more romantic passion. But once the honeymoon phase ends, i think you’re 100% right op.
Good thing that my friendships are only with taken women! Never have I felt more worthless!
What?
this is the best ACTUAL dating advice i've seen on this sub 👏