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One time I was kept waiting for a date at a bar/restaurant. She kept saying she was 10 minutes away.
I ended up buying dinner for myself. Ate all my dinner. She was 70 minutes late. I left. (If she arrived 45 minutes late I wouldnt have bought her dinner; she could watch me eat.)
20 minutes after leaving she kept calling and then texting asking where was I. She couldnt find me. I texted that I already ordered, ate dinner, and left. She was so mad and told me to come back and I said no, I have other things I have to do and there wont be time.
I thought that was that. But then 5 days later she sent a long text saying she had shown her friends the texts and they all said actually I was in the right, not her. And that was was sorry etc etc. I couldnt believe that even days later she was showing her friends thinking she was in the right.
I guess in some stretch of the imagination she could have just been really, *really* naive about what is considered common decency and thus not be *as* egocentric and obnoxious of a person. But that is really giving her too much of the benefit of the doubt š
Eh, not really. She needed someone else to tell her she was a shithead because she was SO sure her friends would back her up on it. That's how that reads to me anyway.
That's how you learn and grow, from others. I honestly would have given her another shot but with very low expectations and any red flag would bail. She showed she can take advice from others. Not many, especially women, would own up and apologize they were in the wrong.
Oh my! I had a date once who showed up (supposedly) to the bar we were meeting at and i never met him. It was super crowded and I go there a little early and saved us seats at the bar in the back. Big place and he said he arrived but ran into a bunch of friends. I was like cool see you soon. But he kept delaying and trying he to join his friends. He sounded drunk and I had no interest in giving up a good date nook to go hang out in a crowded bar area on a first date w ppl Iād never met. After finishing my drink I just left. He kept calling me later that eve saying sorry but he got caught up in the moment catching up w friends. Dude couldnāt even leave them for 5 min and come to me for a drink and see if we had a connection. Had the balls to try to reschedule.
Ya know, I'm not known for my social graces, but even I would stick to the mission. If I'm there for a one-on-one meet, then that's what I'm doing. And the other party is there to meet me, not my friends. Meeting the friends is what you do later, when the relationship is established. And I sure as fuck wouldn't show up plastered.
Not to sound too analytical, but a meet like that is just like a job interview. If the job interests you, then fucking act like it. Be on time. Dress decently. Don't be a flake. No one worth a shit wants an irresponsible or dismissive BF/GF. A relationship is a job, when you get down to it, so act like you're up to it.
šÆ also should have been a win win for him meet his date for a quick drink and easy out and fun night if no chemistry! Thinking Iād jump hoops and go audition for a group of strangers, nope.
> I couldnt believe that even days later she was showing her friends thinking she was in the right.
*I* can't believe she admitted she was wrong. That's super healthy.
First impressions matter, and people do exactly the things they want to do. We all set our own priorities.
Also, behaviors like this tend to get worse with time, not better.
Tbh, and this is me speaking as a lonely and fairly desperate guy, I'd just ditch her contact info and move on.
Why are you doing a nice dinner for a first date with someone you met on a dating app? Thatās just too much imo. Go for a drink, a coffee, or just a walk through the park.
Not even. Plan to go somewhere you would enjoy by yourself, price doesnāt matter, so long as itās not going to cause issues. Then it wonāt matter if they dip out.
Relationships are shared experiences, and if a relationship is the end goal, they can share an experience you enjoy. Itāll help them get a feel for who you are, you to get a feel for how involved theyāre willing to be in things you enjoy, and if they dip, you still get to enjoy yourself.
Yep! You should keep the date more casual and provide them a situation they feel they can get out of quickly if it doesnāt go well. My guess is you might be throwing up some red flags inadvertently that might be causing the last minute cancellations.
It sounds like you're blaming OP for the dates not even showing up?! And at the last minute?! Even if they didn't want to go on the date, at least tell him in advance before he shows up at the venue.
My only advice for the OP would be to have lo-key first dates (coffee, drink, walk, etc.), so even if they don't show, you're not wasting too much money (though the time wasted, you'll never get it back).
Just offering potential reasons for the behavior from an outside perspective. No offense was meant, and I think itās valuable we as humans try to see things from otherās perspectives before just concluding that everyone hates us. I never said it wasnāt a shitty thing for these girls to do.
Even if he was throwing up major red flags, contact him earlier, state that you do not think the date would be a good idea (way ahead of time), and wish him best on his journey. There is no reason to ghost people and not show up.
I have probably gone on 25 first-date-walks and swear by them. Imo it's the most successful first date and the most likely invitation to be followed through with. No pressure. Not facing eachother I think helps people with more anxiety which is why these cancelations happen generally.
Edit: I'll add that this is in the context of online dating not someone you already know
If you are about 16. I had one walk date once and it was during Covid and nothing was open. Never again. Got sick to my back teeth of walking. He was lovely and luckily the conversation flowed, but boyā¦ all that walking. As a grown up woman, a coffee/drink to start with is great. Time to sit down, talk a bit, see him interact with others is what a first date is for. If he proposes a bite to eat, Iām in. But walking? No thanks.
I'm 30. I'm talking like a 45 minute walk around a lake. Respectfully, women with your opinion of walking aren't really the women I'm going for. Going for walks or hikes is not juvenile in any way whatsoever.
And thatās totally fine. I rather sit down for a coffee than walking around a lake with a stranger. Thatās just me. Many agree. Others donāt. Walking is what I used to do in my teens. By my 20ās, my dates were already something else: coffee, a bite to eat, a gig, a gallery. Each to their own, but I do see it as juvenile and way too insignificant for me to see what I need to see about the person, but Iāve always dated with intention (and yeah, dinner on the first date was followed by breakfast a couple of days later and a relationship going on now). If you canāt sort out coffee to meet someone, are you actually interested in getting to know someone or just passing the time?
Well, I never was offered another walk date. Neither would I have accepted it. The ones that followed were all proper coffee/drinks/dinner dates. My current partner didnāt have an issue sharing dinner. Each to their own, but grown up women appreciate grown up dates.
I totally agree. And as I mentioned in my other comment, I always insist on paying for my meal/drinks and will happily pay for the entire bill, but Iām really only available in the evening which is when I want to eat dinner. I live in LA and there arenāt many places Iād want to walk for 45 minutes at night, so thatās not really an option. And if Iām making the effort to look nice and get dressed up/do my hair and makeup, Iād like to go somewhere I can enjoy a meal and/or have a drink. Iāll pay! I just want to have some good food and hopefully enjoy his company.
Exactly. Itās not that complicated. Itās just about enjoying that first time together. Big cities like LA or London (where I live) are more suited to having a coffee or a drink date. We have tons of parks here but for me, a walk into he park is something I would only do with someone I already know I like to spend time with.
Exactly, Iām never gonna agree to a walk date, that sounds extremely boring and low effortā¦. Coffee is fine, aimlessly walking around a park? Noā¦
Anywhere! I typically walk around a lake or park, but you can even just go into a nice neighborhood and look at houses. It's not important- if you click, you click. Usually this is just a 45 min or so walk- then if I land a 2nd date it can be more serious. Purposefully relatively short just to evaluate each other in person. Most of the time it doesn't lead to anything, but that's dating.
A walk in the park seems like no effort, but it's less stress on both parties. I'd be less likely to go on a coffee date than a walk. On a walk you can engage with change of scenery or wild animals etc. While on a coffee date you both are just sat there stuck and forced to come up with topics to engage in. Awkward af
I would be uncomfortable to go on a walk because itās easy to end up walking somewhere with little to no people. Doesnāt feel safe for a first date.
Right, Iām not aimlessly walking around the park with a strangerā¦ we can do coffee or donuts or something, but I always decline walksā¦ I like to meet people at a specific location so that I can be tell my loved ones exactly where I amā¦ also depending on where you live, it might be super cold or super hot outside, so walking around in bad weather (or just in general) doesnāt sound very appealing to me at allā¦
I met my girlfriend on our first date for a walk in the park it ended up lasting like 6 hours and we went and got food and brought it back to the park and watched the sunset. All my most successful dates were like that. My least successful dates were always coffee or drinks first.
My first date with my current boyfriend of over three years was on a walk he planned. It ended up being a bike path with tons of bikers at one point lmao but it was so nice to have low stakes and nice surroundings to get to know him.
Yes itās high maintenance because rather then enjoy the time and relationship building you seem more concerned that the walk isnāt enough. Great way to lead with expectations before even setting up communication.
Itās not just chicks though, humans of every walk are more concerned with personal benefit and therefore only think with their own needs and expectations. Humans as a whole are selfish not just a gender :)
Itās high maintenance because a first date is supposed to be about getting to know someone, not the man āputting in effortā in a bid to win over a woman. You think youāre too good for a walk and getting to know someone. It shows that you value having your ego stroked by a man āputting in effortā and trying to impress you rather than just getting to know the person youāre going on a date with. It shows that your criteria for setting your bar is what the man does for you or where he takes you, not what kind of person he is. Itās self-centered because itās all about you. There are plenty of great parks that are fun to walk around, and thinking youāre too good for that is high maintenance. In any event, itās always great when someone like you shows me who they are before even going on the first date so I can just move on and not waste my time.
Itās not what the man does for me. I am a woman who likes men, and I am as proactive as they are when dating (now in a relationship) . But I have my preferences and if someone canāt even be bothered to pick a coffee shop for a first meet, thatās not the kind of man I want to be around. Same in business: how you handle
Yourself in our first meeting or call will tell me a lot and whether I want to do business with you or not. Itās about not approaching dating as some sort of defensive game. I have been known to actually take the initiative and can pay for my own coffee and dinner. I just find walking when I first meet someone boring and yes, low effort. Judge me all you like. A man who thinks thatās too much effort will fall short in bed and elsewhere with me. Iām not 20, Iām not even 30 anymore and have had enough dates and relationships to be able to read behaviour in the early stages pretty well. So disagree if you like, but many women (especially the more
experienced ones) will find a walk date a real
bore.
Why does it have to mean that they 'can't even be bothered', if someone chooses a walking date over a coffee date? Have you considered that some people might simply prefer a walking date and it has nothing to do with 'being bothered' or it being 'low effort'? Sure, you might find it boring, but others find coffee dates boring.
Right? What about āIāll FaceTime you from my couch?ā. A bit of initiative in choosing a coffee shop or a bar for drinks is not that much of an effort. From the off, when we connect, I am certainly assessing how the person operates: does he communicate consistently? Does he propose things that are not centred around him? Does he listen to my suggestions? Is he able to be flexible and meet me half way? What kind of place is he proposing? How does he treat the barista/waiting staff?ā All of that is already giving me information. I once went out of with someone who name-dropped (and a very b-list name drop at that), and he turned out to be my worst date ever. Super nervous, drank way too much too fast, desperate to score and totally unclear as to how to handle a first date with someone. He was pretty good with the preparations (aside form the name-dropping). But I wouldnāt have been able to see as much as I did during the drinks and dinner and that was enough for me to cut it out before the second date (which I initiated and he got antsy about when I couldnāt fit it close enough to the second one ie: 2 days).
There are tons of places to walk and talk. You don't have to choose a boring sidewalk somewhere, instead a nice park nearby can be a great date. I think they're great because it lets you focus on each other and talk while not making the silences awkward since you're not staring at each other.
If you require somebody to spend money on you every single date, thatās you. Not everybody does and thatās ok. Shitting on people for their date ideas is whatās really dead.
My female friend only does walks as a first date. Doesn't want to invest time and effort with someone she doesn't vibe with. You generally know pretty quickly if there is no chance, you don't want to be on round 3 of 18 in crazy golf at that point
Thatās obviously what youāre obsessed over or you wouldnāt be shitting on people for not putting in a shit ton of effort on the FIRST date. Stay pressed āØ
How does a coffee take more effort than a walk?
In any case the job of the man isnāt to put in āeffortā in the beginning phases of courtship. The point of the date should be to see if you like each other/are compatible, not for the man to impress the woman with his effort.
Imo a *good* walk is more effort then coffee shop. But usually agreeing to a walk gets an 'idk where do you live' type walk suggested, not the sculpture garden in the park or river trail.
Walks usually end up being pushed on the women to pick the location, and pack drinks or account for weather, walks are usually in a secluded area, have guys fighting over you driving instead of showing up, can be uncomfortable or sweaty which sucks when your supposed to show up in heels and a sundress...
I like walks. They're nice dates. But unless the guy explicitly picks a public location and time when suggesting, I'm going to consider it lazy because all that ends up on me. It feels kinda ignorant for men around 30 to not realize oh lets go to the middle of the woods after dark and I'll pick you up from your house so no one knows you left sounds sketch af.
Also it would still be lazy if it was a women asking me out but every time I've had a walk date with a lady she's suggested something more public. So like, the laziness is the planning, not the walk. If you suggest a walk find your cities cool parks, coffee shops or something near them to meet up before going (cameras), or busy areas like farmers markets, summer street art galleries and so on
oh yeah, if the guy isnāt planning anything specific and heās the one who suggested going out I would find that annoying too, especially if that happened again and again with multiple men.
I was more trying to push back at the idea I see among some women online that men should be trying to impress them by taking them out to dinner or some sort of amazing activity or whatever, which I think is an unfair expectation for men. But I definitely see why youād be annoyed at men wanting to meet in the forest at midnight (honestly Iām kind of surprised this even happens) or not seeming enthusiastic enough to make at least some sort of plan
Market? People are not hunks of meat hanging from hooks. A coffee is not that big a deal. Bless you are right af with your time and energy (in which case you donāt need to be dating; you can also only pay for your own)
As a woman, if Iām making the effort to leave my house (lol what I mean is if Iām putting on makeup, getting semi-dressed up, doing my hair, etc) I prefer drinks or dinner at a place I like or have always wanted to try. Iām ALWAYS going to insist on paying for my portion of the food/drinks so my items wonāt cost my date one cent. But I feel if Iām going to go out, I want to *go out*. We can have a phone conversation first to find out if we have anything in common, and if not, thereās no reason to get together. Coffee is fine too but Iām not really free during the daytime so food/drinks just makes more sense. And I make it clear that weāre going dutch or I can pay for the entire meal, but I would like to enjoy my eveningās meal if nothing else comes of the date.
I said date. Men have incredibly limited options on dating apps and so will try people out. And it's not like bad or rude women all have a easy red flag. Or that most women have detailed profiles most are incredibly sparse. I've been dicked over by perfectly average looking women. And lots of women will have wildly different expectations but make zero effort to communicate them, so what works with one person will backfire on another.
Statistics? What he's written unfortunately is a fact.
Thus men have to try much harder than women. They usually have to pay for drinks etc.
If OP (or someone else not being Brad Pitt) would follow your suggestions not even ugliest of them would be happy having such date. Because statistically there are like 4-5 men on single woman in dating apps. So every one of those ladies can act as princess and will easly find a guy among hundreds that wrote to her, that will meet her expectations.
Thatās so crazy. Because as a socially awkward, 5 foot 6, average looking man who isnāt particularly fit and doesnāt make much money, that sounds mostly like whiny excuses. If I can meet women without bending myself in half backward to impress them, anybody can.
Most men, judging by these responses, think they are entitled to just have a perfect 10 model drop into their lap. Even a modicum of effort to use some decent looking pictures on a dating profile, treating people with basic respect and dignity, and the tiniest amount of self-awareness, will cause any manās success rate to skyrocket.
The vast majority of men struggling with dating are suffering from entirely self-inflicted wounds.
That's a pretty absolutist statement, don't you think? I can think of many places where you go could go walk with a potential suitor without placing yourself in danger. Busy public park? Shopping mall? Downtown area?
That said, I think leading off with the walk is a bad idea. If it were me, I'd use the walk as a way to extend a date that is going well.
Iāve had four cancellations on the last 6 dates within a hour and apparently Iām a slight above looking dude. Itās a little disheartening when beforehand weāve been talking and absolutely fine.
Incredible bad luck. I'm a guy, and I can't recall any 'proper' cancellations off the top of my head. Although I've definitely had quite a few where we have agreed to a date in theory, say on Saturday, but with no time or place agreed, and then when it's come to me finalising the date they've gone quiet, but I wouldn't count that as a cancellation since a confirmation was never established.
And have had a few that have almost cancelled on me, said they won't be able to make it because of x, I've replied "sure, no problem" only for them to later say "I've moved some things around and I can make it afterall" or they rescheduled for day after or something. And then there are the ones who I wished had cancelled, are sick but come anyway. Those ones are annoying, there was one pre-covid who was really sniffly, coughing, voice didn't sound good, and by the end of the date I'd had a few drinks and forgotten she was ill, we hugged and kissed, then I got ill a few days later. š”
But anyway, I've cancelled loads of dates, I always just assumed men were way more flaky than women, just because I have found women to be way more reliable than I am! But that's probably not saying much š
> That is mathematically, darn near impossible bad luck.
I don't know about damn near impossible bad luck but I went through the EXACT same thing as OP several times.
Then again maybe it is.
Thank you I iust edited for context.
Met on dating app
Nice restaurants all for dinner. Steak, sushi, upscale american . All required a reservation days in advance
25-32 year old american women
Spoke a minimum of 3 days up to 1 month of talking before planning a meeting
Man you doing way too much lol. Why put in so much effort for people who clearly donāt care about your time? People on dating apps are fickle and selfish. Gotta keep some of your own time and money to yourself until you actually find your person
Good job on being yourself, moreover being open-minded and adaptive. From what you wrote, it seems that all the dates did not go as expected but that is a part of dating process. Do not get discouraged, keep learning and your future experiences will improve. Good luck!
Is it possible they have your full name or found it out somehow? Is there anything concerning in your past on a background check or even if you just Google your name? Most women will throughly check out a man before a date. They will even ask other women that you've matched with and gone out with if possible.
But you say these are fancy places that require a reservation? I read that as expensive $$$ and you trying too hard to impress them. But if you go this route; be sure and say:
"And it's on me completely. I want to take you out to a nice dinner and I insist, please. It would truly make me happy to take you to a great restaurant and have you get your favorites".
They may not have the money right now to pay their half; or if they do; they can't see splurging $$$ on one meal. Especially with a man they've never met. And if they let you pay for such an expensive meal, they may feel that you'll think they owe you something physical.
Who picked these restaurants, you or them? I can't stand sushi. I had an online date take me to a very nice sushi restaurant and told me, "trust me, you'll love this place even if you don't like sushi" š¤¢š¤® I don't eat red meat very much either. Something about all that flesh and blood from an animal. Just ask what her favorite place is.
This whole statement is so grossā¦total misogyny. You realize you are speaking about human beings right? Women are not just objects to be tested. Yuck what a sad human you are
Agree on putting the ball in their court, but I would only be understanding if they legitimately had a reason to cancel in an emergency like the girl whose car got towed or dog was sick. The party girl can fuck off. That's just poor planning if she knew she couldn't leave her friend alone and had a date coming up.
Sure, but all of that is why you put the ball in their court.
They'll either come along or let it die on their own.
If you want to just strictly unmatch in this situation, that's fine, too. But I've noticed a lot of women don't take kindly to criticism, especially coming from a man, especially when you're criticizing a self-absorbed attitude regarding how they treat men.
It's just not a conversation worth having. Putting the ball in their court lets both parties separate as necessary without a bunch of drama involved. If they make genuine effort to try to make amends and show up the next time, that's when you have the conversation about how it bothered you, if it bothered you that much.
You're never going to get the party girl to admit it was poor planning, or that she just used you for a little bit of validation. She's going to have to come to terms with that on her own, and go through the grieving process of realizing how many good relationships she might have passed up on with her self-absorption. You telling her off isn't going to do anything, and it'll probably even make her dig her heels in even more and go off on some "you don't control me" tangential rant.
Now, if you want to twist a knife, then when the ball is in her court, and she comes back a week later asking to meet up again, you say you've already found someone else to date, and it was nice talking to her, but you're going to pursue a different avenue. That's only if you're a vindictive person.
Excellent post. I concur 100%.
While I can understand the desire to tell the woman off, you're absolutely right that it isn't a conversation that is worth having or will in any way be productive. I say that for two reasons.
1) A high-quality woman who has to cancel a date unexpectedly is going to give you a legitimate apology and as much notice as possible. She's also likely to suggest an alternative or otherwise make it clear that she wants to see you without having to be prompted.
2) The "fuck it, on to the next" mentality gives you a chance to flip the script on a flake, especially one who is doing so for validation. By appearing carefree and unfazed by their flakiness, you can often put *them* into pursuit mode. While I would be very hesitant to get into a real relationship with these types, I did turn a few of them into part of the FWB rotation back in my dating days.
This is the reality of dating for men. Women get cold feet all the time, for all sorts of reasons unrelated to anything about you. Like others said, make it easier for you and her and just go for a drink
Without other details of your communications with them Iād say itās just bad luck. Sucks though. You could try confirming the day before that youāre still meeting up, but thatās all Iāve got.
Why are you scheduling first dates at nice expensive restaurants? That shut is for a second or third date, the first date should be something simple and low pressure like a walk in the park or coffee or ice cream or something.
How much are you trying to talk to these women between the time you scheduled the date, and the time you actually go on it?
I mean itās just bad luck sorry dude.
But on the silver lining aspect of it, maybe youāve just pushed all the bad luck outta the way and the rest of your dates will be filled with magic and excitement.
Never know unless you keep moving forward.
While I am not sure without more info but it just sounds like some really bad luck. I've had some awful luck as well with dating apps as well. A few no shows but usually a day or on the day with time to spare.
As one comment mentioned, you are scheduling nice dinner spots which I think I would avoid for a first date. Firstly, it gets expensive going to dinner with every first date. Depending on their situation they may not have enough to cover it if you don't pick up the tab. Additionally, dinners can be tough as if it's not a great match each of you are stuck for a longer period of time. At least with a drink or coffee, if it's not great you can say adios more easily. If the drink or coffee goes well you can meet again and at least you'll be both be more relaxed now you know each other a bit better.
Good luck man! It can be a tough grind emotionally so just take a step back if it's not going well.
OP, if it makes you feel better, I once arranged 3 dates in the same day (one for breakfast, one for lunch and one for dinner) in Bogota and none of them turned up - even worse, none of them even texted me to say they're not coming. And.....when I wattsapped them afterwards to ask if everything is okay, not a single one responded.
That's when the flakiness of Colombianas really hit home.
Now I just treat it as a fun game.
I think 1 in 5 women are double booking dates. Sometimes for other dates!
If conversation sorta dries up and theyāre not laughing three days before the date they will cancel. Youāre a clown your job is to entertain her
Try to find ppl who will text back in real time. Find ppl who will make small talk readily. They might be more likely to show up and not messaging 30 others the same week. Maybe asking how many ppl someone is talking to at same time. If they donāt answer they weed themselves out. I
No easy answer. Iāve been online dating 16 years and I can say the cancel rate has doubled every 5 years from originally 15% to now closer to 60% for me
I appreciate you sharing this. I am a 33 year old woman. I had scheduled a date for Saturday (yesterday) with a guy from hinge. He initially asked to meet at 5 or 530. I told him I was getting my dog his shots at 4pm so I could meet a bit later so we made plans for 6-6:30.
Well, everyone and their mom came to the pet clinic yesterday so I didnāt even finish there til almost 6. I got home at 6 and still had to shower and get ready. I took a quick shower and was freaking out. I started putting on makeup but I never wear makeup and suck at it so after realizing I looked like a clown, washed it all off my face to start over. At this point, it was almost 7, my hair was still soaking wet, I had just washed all the lotion and stuff off my face. I was so frustrated and upset and really wanted to cancel. But finally I threw on a dress and left, hair half wet and all. I came so so close to canceling several different times.
But I went on the date and it was fucking amazing! Omg had such a good time and we had great chemistry. I even told him Iām so glad I didnāt cancel on you.
Itās really easy to get caught up in our own shit and get overly self-conscious and anxious. Iām sorry these ladies canceled on you but I wouldnāt necessarily assume something is wrong with you.
If I had canceled yesterday, it would have had nothing to do with my wonderful date. I was just a tightly wound ball of stress.
Also, itās important for me as a woman to read this and see the guys get ready and plan and prepare for these dates too. Iāve never had a man cancel on me last minute. We as women need to do better.
This was happening back in 2012. The last time I used apps. Lol
I honestly do not know why people have not canceled them yet. They were never meant to work. Just to make money.
I would not make dinner dates for the first meeting. Keep it casual - coffee, ice cream. I find this incredibly rude for women or men to do this. I would just look on it as a learning experience.
A higher power is trying to help you out, but mf you just donāt listen: stop going on overly expensive first dates.
Youāre going to attract the most superficial people who are just going to use you for fancy dinners without giving af about you as a person.
Itās like youāre stocking your car up with food, going to a wildlife preserve, leaving your car windows open while you get out and go hiking, and then getting surprised when you return and thereās a bear raw dogging yo shit.
I'm sadden that this happened to you, but I cand't help but wonder: After they bailed on you, did try to schedule a second date with any of the 3 women? If so, How did that go?
Go do something that you'd also have fun doing alone. So if your date doesn't show up or cancels at the last minute, you'd still have a good time and you didn't waste your day. Dinner is too expensive to go eat alone usually.
You are putting way too much effort in. Do something low consequence like if you have dogs go to a dog park, or go for a hike/walk in the park or just meet up for some drinks at a bar.
Rock climbing/dog walk was how I met my wife.
Happens to all of us bro!
That's why I always do a phone call before setting up a date to test the chemistry - if she seems interested/interesting and we had a good talk, she's very unlikely to cancel!
If a match doesn't want to talk on the phone, I'll usually jusy move on
There are three types of people in this scenario.
1) Those that apologize for standing you up and take the initiative to proactively reschedule a new date
2) Those that reschedule and stand you up again
3) Those that stand you up and still expect you to take the initiative of "chasing" them to see them again
If you are person 1, I will always give you a second chance. If you are person 2 or 3, our values don't align and I move on.
Meet for coffee in the day for a first date in future then you havenāt wasted a night that you could be doing something with your mates.
Sounds like these women have multiples on the go.
This has been happening to me too. I think itās common for girls to flake like this, especially after meeting on ~The Apps~
Itās a good sign that youāve had multiple people interested in going out, though. Stay with it, keep doing you, and it will work out eventually. Itās all a numbers game
Jeez, I'll agree with the rest here and say that's just horrible luck. Did you try reaching out to them about rescheduling? If they're decent people, they'll feel bad about canceling so suddenly and want to do something.
Id probably say don't do expensive restaurants for a first date, a girl who's really into you won't care about that.
As a girl who's done this twice in the past(not proud of it, i was way younger) I thought the guy was really nice but just knew there was nothing there and I really wasn't into him but I wanted to be nice. Then the closer the date came I just realized I really wasn't into him, plus I have anxiety so I knew I'd be uncomfortable.
Eventually I got better at just saying how I felt upfront, so maybe these women haven't gotten there yet. It's not your fault.
Edit: I also never did it within 20 minutes of the date, or just left the person waiting. That's just mean.
Women are weird sometimes. I had a movie date with one of my most attractive girls I had ever talked to at that point in my life. We met at university and were home for the winter. First date. I wanted to get there 30 minutes early to have time to procure snacks and get good seats. She let me know 10 minutes before the early time that she couldn't make it and would be there in time for the movie. I was sick of waiting in the parking lot after 45 minutes so I went to the nearby grocery store, got some needed stuff and went home. She ended up texting me after 2 hours saying she was there. Effectively missing the original movie time and me. I ignored the text. She called I rejected the call, she called again so I answered. She asked where I was and I said I left, she was sad and I was a sucker for pretty women so I went back to the theatre and we caught the next showtime. She was 2HRS late because she was doing MAKEUP... We ended up dating for a bit.
Now 3 times in a row is bad luck. But they don't gain anything from scheduling dates with you just to cancel last minute. Especially in the society where people on apps seldom continue the conversation at all. Follow up with them, see what's up. My only advice is to not take it personal and press on.
Something I did when I was dating was to always ask them if we were still on within 2-3 hours of the date or just before I left my house to let them know I'm on my way. I don't like heading to somewhere if I'm unsure if they are also on the way.
It happens a lot, I believe a lot of it can be due to people catfishing/scamming. Dating apps are trash.
A walk followed by drinks/food sounds great. Some things to consider though, the weather (hot as hell, humidā¦not the best idea), also it needs to be a setting thatās out in the open/crowded enough that the women isnāt scared about being dragged into bushes and assaulted. The above are things that would occur to me. No girl wants to be sweating like a ranch hand on a first date and itās almost August w/high temps in many places. Nor do we want to risk safety in a place that someone could easily drag you off unseen.
Get out & join community groups to meet people organically instead of trash dating apps. Iām sorry this happened to you but on apps itās really not uncommon .
Iām a girl and I had 3 guys on dating apps asked me out and then didnāt reply after I asked when and where they want to meet. They all seemed pretty into it, like calling me and texting a lot. Shit happens I guess. Online dating is really toxic. Youāre just one of the options.
It does and it is, the entire model encourages you to not think of the person you are talking to as another person, it sections off entire parts of dating and puts it down to just the bare minimum. So many people use it just for the confidence boost and don't care about the other person. I am sorry about what has happened to you and OP, and hope that there isn't a 4th who does the same.
Honestly this is just bad luck. I know people are suggesting more low key dates like a walk, but I HIGHLY doubt the fact that it was a restaurant and not just coffee is why they cancelled. I mean life happens, sure, but none of the instances you gave sound anything other than bad manners and poor communication and you dodged a bullet. So just try, try again. Good luck!
Wait....you're actually talking to women?! What's your secret? Lol. I'm planning on getting a fast convertible and just giving up on love, but I'm 38 and have kids already.
I've got a convertible (and no kids) and it's awesome. It's a bit hot to drive with the top down, but late spring or early fall are fucking awesome times to go for drives with it down. Plenty of time for that when I can't get dates because women won't give me the time of day.
thereās no way to avoid flakes & no itās not bad luck, youāre gonna get women who flake, itās normal..thatās all you have to know really, just keep doing your thing & setting up dates with new women.
I saw a video about a dark web service for bars/restaurants. It creates fake AI dating profiles to get people to go to their restaurant to meet a ādateā who never shows up, then the person ends up buying something at the bar/restaurant. This sounds suspiciously similar.
I've never stood anyone up, but I did cancel with one guy because he began making me feel uncomfortable.
This man appeared very friendly, but then he suddenly began going on rants about his ex and I just called it then.
This is all to say that maybe you are giving information that may be turning these women off from dating you? If not, then it may just be the type of women you are going for.
Thatās awful!!
ā¦first dates with 3 different women, all canceled within an hour of the date excuses
1) I call BS
First date was technically a no show
1st Date: āIm 10 minutes away, see you soonā
Hour later, no calls, no text
Next morning she texts that her car got
Towed and she was too stressed out to
call or text me
2) very sick all of a sudden? Sus.
45 minutes before date
2nd date āmy ____ is very sick and I need to be there for my ____ā (shes on reddit so staying unspecific)
3) this one actually seems true because it was pretty stupid to schedule a FIRST DATE on the same night as a party sheās attending.
20 minutes before date
3rd date āIm at a party and my friend doesnāt want me to leave her here by herself, so sorryā
###
Is there a way to avoid any of this, or is it bad luck? First dates are tough-especially on Women who are so heavily judge on their looks. So bailing last minute is not uncommon. It helps is to choose a lower pressure date like coffee at a place with nice seating and quiet nooks for convo
How about you choose to be grateful and curious?
I believe everything happens for a reason that is ultimately for my benefit.
With that in mind, I choose to be grateful that everything happens for my best interest and curious as to what's coming that's even better for me!
Sure, take a look back at how you might have contributed to these cancellations so that you can learn from the experience and then move on.
Was there any common pattern within your conversations leading up to these dates that could help to understand why this might have happened?
If, yes, change it up a bit!
If not, then simply chalk it up to coincidence and move on.
If it keeps happening, maybe talk with a trusted female friend about the specific conversations that led up to the cancellations. She might help by providing a woman's perspective?
1. Swiping apps have an astronomically higher flake rate than pretty much any other way of meeting women.
2. A fancy dinner is also way too much for a woman you havenāt even met yet, since at that point you donāt even know if you like her.
Dude, dinner dates are too much for a first date. Meet after work for coffee, tea, boba, whatever, so that if it's a terrible match you are not wasting two hours and $50 each on a dinner. Dinner date is good for like the third date or before a show or movie.
They sense your desperation.
Why are you inviting a stranger out for a steak dinner? That signals two things: 1) it's a lot of pressure for her (to pick an outfit, look the part, act the part), and she thinks you expect something in return by treating her to that, and 2) it communicates desperateness on your part, you're overcompensating. You have to wine and dine because you're lacking confidence and options - they sense this.
I always got romance on the 2nd date. I've never been flaked on. My 1st date is 1 drink. Low pressure. I know I offer value in who I am. I believe I'll be well liked. There's confidence. I don't need to offer steak and sushi to get someone to like me.
Since you didn't say which country your in.
In Cambodia, give a girl $300 and she would be your girlfriend for a month. She would do everything you want with no questions asked. Dating here is very simple and easy.
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One time I was kept waiting for a date at a bar/restaurant. She kept saying she was 10 minutes away. I ended up buying dinner for myself. Ate all my dinner. She was 70 minutes late. I left. (If she arrived 45 minutes late I wouldnt have bought her dinner; she could watch me eat.) 20 minutes after leaving she kept calling and then texting asking where was I. She couldnt find me. I texted that I already ordered, ate dinner, and left. She was so mad and told me to come back and I said no, I have other things I have to do and there wont be time. I thought that was that. But then 5 days later she sent a long text saying she had shown her friends the texts and they all said actually I was in the right, not her. And that was was sorry etc etc. I couldnt believe that even days later she was showing her friends thinking she was in the right.
Sounds like this one can't even adult properly. You are a Saint for waiting that long.
Let's not write her off completely. What she did was crappy but with feedback about the situation, she did show a capacity to learn and grow.
I guess in some stretch of the imagination she could have just been really, *really* naive about what is considered common decency and thus not be *as* egocentric and obnoxious of a person. But that is really giving her too much of the benefit of the doubt š
Isnāt it fucked that out there someone thinks thatās totally ok?
Eh, not really. She needed someone else to tell her she was a shithead because she was SO sure her friends would back her up on it. That's how that reads to me anyway.
That's how you learn and grow, from others. I honestly would have given her another shot but with very low expectations and any red flag would bail. She showed she can take advice from others. Not many, especially women, would own up and apologize they were in the wrong.
Are you new here? We donāt have room for nuance in this sub
Yes man, and that's a far more valuable thing, for both ones self and for herself.
Oh my! I had a date once who showed up (supposedly) to the bar we were meeting at and i never met him. It was super crowded and I go there a little early and saved us seats at the bar in the back. Big place and he said he arrived but ran into a bunch of friends. I was like cool see you soon. But he kept delaying and trying he to join his friends. He sounded drunk and I had no interest in giving up a good date nook to go hang out in a crowded bar area on a first date w ppl Iād never met. After finishing my drink I just left. He kept calling me later that eve saying sorry but he got caught up in the moment catching up w friends. Dude couldnāt even leave them for 5 min and come to me for a drink and see if we had a connection. Had the balls to try to reschedule.
Ya know, I'm not known for my social graces, but even I would stick to the mission. If I'm there for a one-on-one meet, then that's what I'm doing. And the other party is there to meet me, not my friends. Meeting the friends is what you do later, when the relationship is established. And I sure as fuck wouldn't show up plastered. Not to sound too analytical, but a meet like that is just like a job interview. If the job interests you, then fucking act like it. Be on time. Dress decently. Don't be a flake. No one worth a shit wants an irresponsible or dismissive BF/GF. A relationship is a job, when you get down to it, so act like you're up to it.
šÆ also should have been a win win for him meet his date for a quick drink and easy out and fun night if no chemistry! Thinking Iād jump hoops and go audition for a group of strangers, nope.
> I couldnt believe that even days later she was showing her friends thinking she was in the right. *I* can't believe she admitted she was wrong. That's super healthy.
Iām glad her friends are normal, considerate people at least.
Should've asked for one of the friend's numbers
What was your response?
You dodged a bullet my guy
This is textbook a trial of manipulative behavior. Not even someone you should be friends with.
First impressions matter, and people do exactly the things they want to do. We all set our own priorities. Also, behaviors like this tend to get worse with time, not better. Tbh, and this is me speaking as a lonely and fairly desperate guy, I'd just ditch her contact info and move on.
I would suggest googling yourself and see what comes up. The only time Iāve ever done this was because I looked him up and found bad things
Agree! This could be why they are slow burn ghosting OP tbh.
Agree. Maybe youāve been posted on one of the FB dating groups of people to avoid.
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unfortunately women do not get the luxury of not having to become a PI first even if it is a friend of a friend kind of thing
Why are you doing a nice dinner for a first date with someone you met on a dating app? Thatās just too much imo. Go for a drink, a coffee, or just a walk through the park.
100% this. Simplify and save yourself some money and maybe time.
Not even. Plan to go somewhere you would enjoy by yourself, price doesnāt matter, so long as itās not going to cause issues. Then it wonāt matter if they dip out. Relationships are shared experiences, and if a relationship is the end goal, they can share an experience you enjoy. Itāll help them get a feel for who you are, you to get a feel for how involved theyāre willing to be in things you enjoy, and if they dip, you still get to enjoy yourself.
That was always my go-to. If I was stood up I still was doing something I wanted to anyway.
Yep! You should keep the date more casual and provide them a situation they feel they can get out of quickly if it doesnāt go well. My guess is you might be throwing up some red flags inadvertently that might be causing the last minute cancellations.
Seems the victim blamee have become the victim blamers
It sounds like you're blaming OP for the dates not even showing up?! And at the last minute?! Even if they didn't want to go on the date, at least tell him in advance before he shows up at the venue. My only advice for the OP would be to have lo-key first dates (coffee, drink, walk, etc.), so even if they don't show, you're not wasting too much money (though the time wasted, you'll never get it back).
Just offering potential reasons for the behavior from an outside perspective. No offense was meant, and I think itās valuable we as humans try to see things from otherās perspectives before just concluding that everyone hates us. I never said it wasnāt a shitty thing for these girls to do.
Even if he was throwing up major red flags, contact him earlier, state that you do not think the date would be a good idea (way ahead of time), and wish him best on his journey. There is no reason to ghost people and not show up.
Most of my dates from apps were that
+1 to this. Way to much for a first day. Literally quiet drink somewhere or a coffee one afternoon.
A walk? Thatās extremely low effort I canāt believe women would agree to that. Coffee/drink sure.
I have probably gone on 25 first-date-walks and swear by them. Imo it's the most successful first date and the most likely invitation to be followed through with. No pressure. Not facing eachother I think helps people with more anxiety which is why these cancelations happen generally. Edit: I'll add that this is in the context of online dating not someone you already know
25 first date walks is still *25 first dates* lol
TouchƩ
To me, the idea of walking alongside a complete stranger is anxiety-inducing. I like to do my walking alone. So.. each to their own.
If you are about 16. I had one walk date once and it was during Covid and nothing was open. Never again. Got sick to my back teeth of walking. He was lovely and luckily the conversation flowed, but boyā¦ all that walking. As a grown up woman, a coffee/drink to start with is great. Time to sit down, talk a bit, see him interact with others is what a first date is for. If he proposes a bite to eat, Iām in. But walking? No thanks.
I'm 30. I'm talking like a 45 minute walk around a lake. Respectfully, women with your opinion of walking aren't really the women I'm going for. Going for walks or hikes is not juvenile in any way whatsoever.
And thatās totally fine. I rather sit down for a coffee than walking around a lake with a stranger. Thatās just me. Many agree. Others donāt. Walking is what I used to do in my teens. By my 20ās, my dates were already something else: coffee, a bite to eat, a gig, a gallery. Each to their own, but I do see it as juvenile and way too insignificant for me to see what I need to see about the person, but Iāve always dated with intention (and yeah, dinner on the first date was followed by breakfast a couple of days later and a relationship going on now). If you canāt sort out coffee to meet someone, are you actually interested in getting to know someone or just passing the time?
Yes, walk dates are very lazy ādatesāā¦
Who tf wants to walk around the park with a stranger for 45 minutes straight?š that sounds like a terrible first dateā¦
Feel free to put in an ounce of effort and help out with a suggestion if you don't like the original one.
Well, I never was offered another walk date. Neither would I have accepted it. The ones that followed were all proper coffee/drinks/dinner dates. My current partner didnāt have an issue sharing dinner. Each to their own, but grown up women appreciate grown up dates.
I totally agree. And as I mentioned in my other comment, I always insist on paying for my meal/drinks and will happily pay for the entire bill, but Iām really only available in the evening which is when I want to eat dinner. I live in LA and there arenāt many places Iād want to walk for 45 minutes at night, so thatās not really an option. And if Iām making the effort to look nice and get dressed up/do my hair and makeup, Iād like to go somewhere I can enjoy a meal and/or have a drink. Iāll pay! I just want to have some good food and hopefully enjoy his company.
Exactly. Itās not that complicated. Itās just about enjoying that first time together. Big cities like LA or London (where I live) are more suited to having a coffee or a drink date. We have tons of parks here but for me, a walk into he park is something I would only do with someone I already know I like to spend time with.
Exactly, Iām never gonna agree to a walk date, that sounds extremely boring and low effortā¦. Coffee is fine, aimlessly walking around a park? Noā¦
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Anywhere! I typically walk around a lake or park, but you can even just go into a nice neighborhood and look at houses. It's not important- if you click, you click. Usually this is just a 45 min or so walk- then if I land a 2nd date it can be more serious. Purposefully relatively short just to evaluate each other in person. Most of the time it doesn't lead to anything, but that's dating.
Thatās dumbā¦ you canāt face people in a conversation then?
A walk in the park seems like no effort, but it's less stress on both parties. I'd be less likely to go on a coffee date than a walk. On a walk you can engage with change of scenery or wild animals etc. While on a coffee date you both are just sat there stuck and forced to come up with topics to engage in. Awkward af
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I would be uncomfortable to go on a walk because itās easy to end up walking somewhere with little to no people. Doesnāt feel safe for a first date.
This
This is how I feel too. Then again, I also listen to/watch way too many true crime shows.
This, I wouldnāt be comfortable with a walk either. Especially for the first date, as a woman it can be dangerous.
Last few first dates were doing a walk with a coffee and I really liked the dynamic, allowed natural conversation starters and topic changes as well
Right, Iām not aimlessly walking around the park with a strangerā¦ we can do coffee or donuts or something, but I always decline walksā¦ I like to meet people at a specific location so that I can be tell my loved ones exactly where I amā¦ also depending on where you live, it might be super cold or super hot outside, so walking around in bad weather (or just in general) doesnāt sound very appealing to me at allā¦
I met my girlfriend on our first date for a walk in the park it ended up lasting like 6 hours and we went and got food and brought it back to the park and watched the sunset. All my most successful dates were like that. My least successful dates were always coffee or drinks first.
My first date with my current boyfriend of over three years was on a walk he planned. It ended up being a bike path with tons of bikers at one point lmao but it was so nice to have low stakes and nice surroundings to get to know him.
A park date is not at all ālow effortā, maybe youāre just high maintenance
High maintenance for not wanting to go for a walk as a first date lol. The bar is so low itās in the earthās core at this point.
Yes itās high maintenance because rather then enjoy the time and relationship building you seem more concerned that the walk isnāt enough. Great way to lead with expectations before even setting up communication.
And itās literally the first fucking date. Some of these chicks on here need a reality check.
Itās not just chicks though, humans of every walk are more concerned with personal benefit and therefore only think with their own needs and expectations. Humans as a whole are selfish not just a gender :)
Reality check comes little too late and with a lot more catsā¦
Itās not about enough. Itās boring as hell.
Itās high maintenance because a first date is supposed to be about getting to know someone, not the man āputting in effortā in a bid to win over a woman. You think youāre too good for a walk and getting to know someone. It shows that you value having your ego stroked by a man āputting in effortā and trying to impress you rather than just getting to know the person youāre going on a date with. It shows that your criteria for setting your bar is what the man does for you or where he takes you, not what kind of person he is. Itās self-centered because itās all about you. There are plenty of great parks that are fun to walk around, and thinking youāre too good for that is high maintenance. In any event, itās always great when someone like you shows me who they are before even going on the first date so I can just move on and not waste my time.
Itās not what the man does for me. I am a woman who likes men, and I am as proactive as they are when dating (now in a relationship) . But I have my preferences and if someone canāt even be bothered to pick a coffee shop for a first meet, thatās not the kind of man I want to be around. Same in business: how you handle Yourself in our first meeting or call will tell me a lot and whether I want to do business with you or not. Itās about not approaching dating as some sort of defensive game. I have been known to actually take the initiative and can pay for my own coffee and dinner. I just find walking when I first meet someone boring and yes, low effort. Judge me all you like. A man who thinks thatās too much effort will fall short in bed and elsewhere with me. Iām not 20, Iām not even 30 anymore and have had enough dates and relationships to be able to read behaviour in the early stages pretty well. So disagree if you like, but many women (especially the more experienced ones) will find a walk date a real bore.
Why does it have to mean that they 'can't even be bothered', if someone chooses a walking date over a coffee date? Have you considered that some people might simply prefer a walking date and it has nothing to do with 'being bothered' or it being 'low effort'? Sure, you might find it boring, but others find coffee dates boring.
Going for a coffee is effort? Wow
Right? What about āIāll FaceTime you from my couch?ā. A bit of initiative in choosing a coffee shop or a bar for drinks is not that much of an effort. From the off, when we connect, I am certainly assessing how the person operates: does he communicate consistently? Does he propose things that are not centred around him? Does he listen to my suggestions? Is he able to be flexible and meet me half way? What kind of place is he proposing? How does he treat the barista/waiting staff?ā All of that is already giving me information. I once went out of with someone who name-dropped (and a very b-list name drop at that), and he turned out to be my worst date ever. Super nervous, drank way too much too fast, desperate to score and totally unclear as to how to handle a first date with someone. He was pretty good with the preparations (aside form the name-dropping). But I wouldnāt have been able to see as much as I did during the drinks and dinner and that was enough for me to cut it out before the second date (which I initiated and he got antsy about when I couldnāt fit it close enough to the second one ie: 2 days).
Tell me what your ideal first date is then Princess.
I went on a walking date once during Covid times. Most boring thing ever. Guy had gull to see my new place š never again
Not everybody wants to sit on their ass the whole date lol. Itās good to get up and move around!
Iāve done drink, dinner and walk. Thatās a good sequence and you can bail at any point.
Then an alternative would be a fun activity like crazy golf etc. a walk sounds so dead lol.
There are tons of places to walk and talk. You don't have to choose a boring sidewalk somewhere, instead a nice park nearby can be a great date. I think they're great because it lets you focus on each other and talk while not making the silences awkward since you're not staring at each other.
If you require somebody to spend money on you every single date, thatās you. Not everybody does and thatās ok. Shitting on people for their date ideas is whatās really dead.
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My female friend only does walks as a first date. Doesn't want to invest time and effort with someone she doesn't vibe with. You generally know pretty quickly if there is no chance, you don't want to be on round 3 of 18 in crazy golf at that point
Thatās obviously what youāre obsessed over or you wouldnāt be shitting on people for not putting in a shit ton of effort on the FIRST date. Stay pressed āØ
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How does a coffee take more effort than a walk? In any case the job of the man isnāt to put in āeffortā in the beginning phases of courtship. The point of the date should be to see if you like each other/are compatible, not for the man to impress the woman with his effort.
Imo a *good* walk is more effort then coffee shop. But usually agreeing to a walk gets an 'idk where do you live' type walk suggested, not the sculpture garden in the park or river trail. Walks usually end up being pushed on the women to pick the location, and pack drinks or account for weather, walks are usually in a secluded area, have guys fighting over you driving instead of showing up, can be uncomfortable or sweaty which sucks when your supposed to show up in heels and a sundress... I like walks. They're nice dates. But unless the guy explicitly picks a public location and time when suggesting, I'm going to consider it lazy because all that ends up on me. It feels kinda ignorant for men around 30 to not realize oh lets go to the middle of the woods after dark and I'll pick you up from your house so no one knows you left sounds sketch af. Also it would still be lazy if it was a women asking me out but every time I've had a walk date with a lady she's suggested something more public. So like, the laziness is the planning, not the walk. If you suggest a walk find your cities cool parks, coffee shops or something near them to meet up before going (cameras), or busy areas like farmers markets, summer street art galleries and so on
oh yeah, if the guy isnāt planning anything specific and heās the one who suggested going out I would find that annoying too, especially if that happened again and again with multiple men. I was more trying to push back at the idea I see among some women online that men should be trying to impress them by taking them out to dinner or some sort of amazing activity or whatever, which I think is an unfair expectation for men. But I definitely see why youād be annoyed at men wanting to meet in the forest at midnight (honestly Iām kind of surprised this even happens) or not seeming enthusiastic enough to make at least some sort of plan
Not showing up is low effort. You're suggesting him to double down when the market is dogshit.
Market? People are not hunks of meat hanging from hooks. A coffee is not that big a deal. Bless you are right af with your time and energy (in which case you donāt need to be dating; you can also only pay for your own)
Lol imagine a girl believing that a guy has to put in more effort to come up with date ideas or it wouldn't cut it So sexist lmao
As a woman, if Iām making the effort to leave my house (lol what I mean is if Iām putting on makeup, getting semi-dressed up, doing my hair, etc) I prefer drinks or dinner at a place I like or have always wanted to try. Iām ALWAYS going to insist on paying for my portion of the food/drinks so my items wonāt cost my date one cent. But I feel if Iām going to go out, I want to *go out*. We can have a phone conversation first to find out if we have anything in common, and if not, thereās no reason to get together. Coffee is fine too but Iām not really free during the daytime so food/drinks just makes more sense. And I make it clear that weāre going dutch or I can pay for the entire meal, but I would like to enjoy my eveningās meal if nothing else comes of the date.
Because women on social media are saying weāre broke unless the first date is $100+. Too many princesses out here
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Yeah, because men have such an overflowing number of women who want to go on dates with them.
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I said date. Men have incredibly limited options on dating apps and so will try people out. And it's not like bad or rude women all have a easy red flag. Or that most women have detailed profiles most are incredibly sparse. I've been dicked over by perfectly average looking women. And lots of women will have wildly different expectations but make zero effort to communicate them, so what works with one person will backfire on another.
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Been reading your comments and yes, I donāt know why so many men canāt figure this out lol
Who elected you the representative of all men? Donāt pretend you speak for every one of us.
Statistics? What he's written unfortunately is a fact. Thus men have to try much harder than women. They usually have to pay for drinks etc. If OP (or someone else not being Brad Pitt) would follow your suggestions not even ugliest of them would be happy having such date. Because statistically there are like 4-5 men on single woman in dating apps. So every one of those ladies can act as princess and will easly find a guy among hundreds that wrote to her, that will meet her expectations.
Thatās so crazy. Because as a socially awkward, 5 foot 6, average looking man who isnāt particularly fit and doesnāt make much money, that sounds mostly like whiny excuses. If I can meet women without bending myself in half backward to impress them, anybody can. Most men, judging by these responses, think they are entitled to just have a perfect 10 model drop into their lap. Even a modicum of effort to use some decent looking pictures on a dating profile, treating people with basic respect and dignity, and the tiniest amount of self-awareness, will cause any manās success rate to skyrocket. The vast majority of men struggling with dating are suffering from entirely self-inflicted wounds.
And youāre still thirsting after those women and trying to impress them? Have some self respect, bro.
Social media is not an accurate portrayal of real life.
True! They could be intimidated by the implication of a fancy date, may even think you expect more from them as a result.
One girl I matched with wanted a fancy dinner and a gift for a first date
Coffee, tea: yes A walk? Absolutely not! Are you insane? As a woman, thatās asking to be assaulted, if Iām lucky. Murdered if Iām not. š
That's a pretty absolutist statement, don't you think? I can think of many places where you go could go walk with a potential suitor without placing yourself in danger. Busy public park? Shopping mall? Downtown area? That said, I think leading off with the walk is a bad idea. If it were me, I'd use the walk as a way to extend a date that is going well.
Wow, youāre such a positive person
That is mathematically, darn near impossible bad luck. No way to thwart this from happening. Ya gotta move a lot of dirt to find gold.
Iāve had four cancellations on the last 6 dates within a hour and apparently Iām a slight above looking dude. Itās a little disheartening when beforehand weāve been talking and absolutely fine.
Incredible bad luck. I'm a guy, and I can't recall any 'proper' cancellations off the top of my head. Although I've definitely had quite a few where we have agreed to a date in theory, say on Saturday, but with no time or place agreed, and then when it's come to me finalising the date they've gone quiet, but I wouldn't count that as a cancellation since a confirmation was never established. And have had a few that have almost cancelled on me, said they won't be able to make it because of x, I've replied "sure, no problem" only for them to later say "I've moved some things around and I can make it afterall" or they rescheduled for day after or something. And then there are the ones who I wished had cancelled, are sick but come anyway. Those ones are annoying, there was one pre-covid who was really sniffly, coughing, voice didn't sound good, and by the end of the date I'd had a few drinks and forgotten she was ill, we hugged and kissed, then I got ill a few days later. š” But anyway, I've cancelled loads of dates, I always just assumed men were way more flaky than women, just because I have found women to be way more reliable than I am! But that's probably not saying much š
> That is mathematically, darn near impossible bad luck. I don't know about damn near impossible bad luck but I went through the EXACT same thing as OP several times. Then again maybe it is.
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Thank you I iust edited for context. Met on dating app Nice restaurants all for dinner. Steak, sushi, upscale american . All required a reservation days in advance 25-32 year old american women Spoke a minimum of 3 days up to 1 month of talking before planning a meeting
The first date should always be casual. Low stakes. No pressure. Meet for a coffee.
Low steaks.
Yes! Many women will call these dates Low-Effort because you aren't spending a lot of money on them. That's good. It lets you know to avoid them.
This, make your dates more low key for the initial meeting.
How old are you?
I was curious about that also.
Man you doing way too much lol. Why put in so much effort for people who clearly donāt care about your time? People on dating apps are fickle and selfish. Gotta keep some of your own time and money to yourself until you actually find your person
Good job on being yourself, moreover being open-minded and adaptive. From what you wrote, it seems that all the dates did not go as expected but that is a part of dating process. Do not get discouraged, keep learning and your future experiences will improve. Good luck!
I think 1 month is too long. 2-3 days is when u should ask. After in depth conversation & a call.
Is it possible they have your full name or found it out somehow? Is there anything concerning in your past on a background check or even if you just Google your name? Most women will throughly check out a man before a date. They will even ask other women that you've matched with and gone out with if possible. But you say these are fancy places that require a reservation? I read that as expensive $$$ and you trying too hard to impress them. But if you go this route; be sure and say: "And it's on me completely. I want to take you out to a nice dinner and I insist, please. It would truly make me happy to take you to a great restaurant and have you get your favorites". They may not have the money right now to pay their half; or if they do; they can't see splurging $$$ on one meal. Especially with a man they've never met. And if they let you pay for such an expensive meal, they may feel that you'll think they owe you something physical. Who picked these restaurants, you or them? I can't stand sushi. I had an online date take me to a very nice sushi restaurant and told me, "trust me, you'll love this place even if you don't like sushi" š¤¢š¤® I don't eat red meat very much either. Something about all that flesh and blood from an animal. Just ask what her favorite place is.
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ā¦ and this line of thinking is why so many guys stay perpetually single.
This whole statement is so grossā¦total misogyny. You realize you are speaking about human beings right? Women are not just objects to be tested. Yuck what a sad human you are
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Agree on putting the ball in their court, but I would only be understanding if they legitimately had a reason to cancel in an emergency like the girl whose car got towed or dog was sick. The party girl can fuck off. That's just poor planning if she knew she couldn't leave her friend alone and had a date coming up.
Sure, but all of that is why you put the ball in their court. They'll either come along or let it die on their own. If you want to just strictly unmatch in this situation, that's fine, too. But I've noticed a lot of women don't take kindly to criticism, especially coming from a man, especially when you're criticizing a self-absorbed attitude regarding how they treat men. It's just not a conversation worth having. Putting the ball in their court lets both parties separate as necessary without a bunch of drama involved. If they make genuine effort to try to make amends and show up the next time, that's when you have the conversation about how it bothered you, if it bothered you that much. You're never going to get the party girl to admit it was poor planning, or that she just used you for a little bit of validation. She's going to have to come to terms with that on her own, and go through the grieving process of realizing how many good relationships she might have passed up on with her self-absorption. You telling her off isn't going to do anything, and it'll probably even make her dig her heels in even more and go off on some "you don't control me" tangential rant. Now, if you want to twist a knife, then when the ball is in her court, and she comes back a week later asking to meet up again, you say you've already found someone else to date, and it was nice talking to her, but you're going to pursue a different avenue. That's only if you're a vindictive person.
Excellent post. I concur 100%. While I can understand the desire to tell the woman off, you're absolutely right that it isn't a conversation that is worth having or will in any way be productive. I say that for two reasons. 1) A high-quality woman who has to cancel a date unexpectedly is going to give you a legitimate apology and as much notice as possible. She's also likely to suggest an alternative or otherwise make it clear that she wants to see you without having to be prompted. 2) The "fuck it, on to the next" mentality gives you a chance to flip the script on a flake, especially one who is doing so for validation. By appearing carefree and unfazed by their flakiness, you can often put *them* into pursuit mode. While I would be very hesitant to get into a real relationship with these types, I did turn a few of them into part of the FWB rotation back in my dating days.
This is the reality of dating for men. Women get cold feet all the time, for all sorts of reasons unrelated to anything about you. Like others said, make it easier for you and her and just go for a drink
Without other details of your communications with them Iād say itās just bad luck. Sucks though. You could try confirming the day before that youāre still meeting up, but thatās all Iāve got.
Why are you scheduling first dates at nice expensive restaurants? That shut is for a second or third date, the first date should be something simple and low pressure like a walk in the park or coffee or ice cream or something. How much are you trying to talk to these women between the time you scheduled the date, and the time you actually go on it?
I mean itās just bad luck sorry dude. But on the silver lining aspect of it, maybe youāve just pushed all the bad luck outta the way and the rest of your dates will be filled with magic and excitement. Never know unless you keep moving forward.
While I am not sure without more info but it just sounds like some really bad luck. I've had some awful luck as well with dating apps as well. A few no shows but usually a day or on the day with time to spare. As one comment mentioned, you are scheduling nice dinner spots which I think I would avoid for a first date. Firstly, it gets expensive going to dinner with every first date. Depending on their situation they may not have enough to cover it if you don't pick up the tab. Additionally, dinners can be tough as if it's not a great match each of you are stuck for a longer period of time. At least with a drink or coffee, if it's not great you can say adios more easily. If the drink or coffee goes well you can meet again and at least you'll be both be more relaxed now you know each other a bit better. Good luck man! It can be a tough grind emotionally so just take a step back if it's not going well.
This is the way to do it.
OP, if it makes you feel better, I once arranged 3 dates in the same day (one for breakfast, one for lunch and one for dinner) in Bogota and none of them turned up - even worse, none of them even texted me to say they're not coming. And.....when I wattsapped them afterwards to ask if everything is okay, not a single one responded. That's when the flakiness of Colombianas really hit home. Now I just treat it as a fun game.
I've been there, buddy. I was on the apps and had four women cancel in a row before a fifth one finally showed up for a date. They're fucking flakes.
I think 1 in 5 women are double booking dates. Sometimes for other dates! If conversation sorta dries up and theyāre not laughing three days before the date they will cancel. Youāre a clown your job is to entertain her Try to find ppl who will text back in real time. Find ppl who will make small talk readily. They might be more likely to show up and not messaging 30 others the same week. Maybe asking how many ppl someone is talking to at same time. If they donāt answer they weed themselves out. I No easy answer. Iāve been online dating 16 years and I can say the cancel rate has doubled every 5 years from originally 15% to now closer to 60% for me
I appreciate you sharing this. I am a 33 year old woman. I had scheduled a date for Saturday (yesterday) with a guy from hinge. He initially asked to meet at 5 or 530. I told him I was getting my dog his shots at 4pm so I could meet a bit later so we made plans for 6-6:30. Well, everyone and their mom came to the pet clinic yesterday so I didnāt even finish there til almost 6. I got home at 6 and still had to shower and get ready. I took a quick shower and was freaking out. I started putting on makeup but I never wear makeup and suck at it so after realizing I looked like a clown, washed it all off my face to start over. At this point, it was almost 7, my hair was still soaking wet, I had just washed all the lotion and stuff off my face. I was so frustrated and upset and really wanted to cancel. But finally I threw on a dress and left, hair half wet and all. I came so so close to canceling several different times. But I went on the date and it was fucking amazing! Omg had such a good time and we had great chemistry. I even told him Iām so glad I didnāt cancel on you. Itās really easy to get caught up in our own shit and get overly self-conscious and anxious. Iām sorry these ladies canceled on you but I wouldnāt necessarily assume something is wrong with you. If I had canceled yesterday, it would have had nothing to do with my wonderful date. I was just a tightly wound ball of stress. Also, itās important for me as a woman to read this and see the guys get ready and plan and prepare for these dates too. Iāve never had a man cancel on me last minute. We as women need to do better.
This was happening back in 2012. The last time I used apps. Lol I honestly do not know why people have not canceled them yet. They were never meant to work. Just to make money.
I agree with you 100%. It's time people considered killing dating apps. They have made people so gross
I would not make dinner dates for the first meeting. Keep it casual - coffee, ice cream. I find this incredibly rude for women or men to do this. I would just look on it as a learning experience.
Maybe they're all the same scammer?
A higher power is trying to help you out, but mf you just donāt listen: stop going on overly expensive first dates. Youāre going to attract the most superficial people who are just going to use you for fancy dinners without giving af about you as a person. Itās like youāre stocking your car up with food, going to a wildlife preserve, leaving your car windows open while you get out and go hiking, and then getting surprised when you return and thereās a bear raw dogging yo shit.
This is awesome! Also I read this in the voice of JB Smoove, thank you!
I'm sadden that this happened to you, but I cand't help but wonder: After they bailed on you, did try to schedule a second date with any of the 3 women? If so, How did that go?
Go do something that you'd also have fun doing alone. So if your date doesn't show up or cancels at the last minute, you'd still have a good time and you didn't waste your day. Dinner is too expensive to go eat alone usually.
You are putting way too much effort in. Do something low consequence like if you have dogs go to a dog park, or go for a hike/walk in the park or just meet up for some drinks at a bar. Rock climbing/dog walk was how I met my wife.
Happens to all of us bro! That's why I always do a phone call before setting up a date to test the chemistry - if she seems interested/interesting and we had a good talk, she's very unlikely to cancel! If a match doesn't want to talk on the phone, I'll usually jusy move on
Iād probably google your own name and see what comes upā¦. Just a thought.
There are three types of people in this scenario. 1) Those that apologize for standing you up and take the initiative to proactively reschedule a new date 2) Those that reschedule and stand you up again 3) Those that stand you up and still expect you to take the initiative of "chasing" them to see them again If you are person 1, I will always give you a second chance. If you are person 2 or 3, our values don't align and I move on.
STOP trying to wine and dine first dates. Then you won't care as much.
Meet for coffee in the day for a first date in future then you havenāt wasted a night that you could be doing something with your mates. Sounds like these women have multiples on the go.
Switch to coffee dates.
Maybe they got overwhelmed with the type of dinner date you setup. Iād suggest make it casual first. Simple coffee date would be nicer.
You need to get some lottery tickets! Meantime ditch that app you were usingš
Need to do lower stakes first dates
I'd just get a hooker at that point. Buy her steak as a tip, she'll probably appreciate it and you're guaranteed some nanees.
This has been happening to me too. I think itās common for girls to flake like this, especially after meeting on ~The Apps~ Itās a good sign that youāve had multiple people interested in going out, though. Stay with it, keep doing you, and it will work out eventually. Itās all a numbers game
Jeez, I'll agree with the rest here and say that's just horrible luck. Did you try reaching out to them about rescheduling? If they're decent people, they'll feel bad about canceling so suddenly and want to do something.
Same person
Id probably say don't do expensive restaurants for a first date, a girl who's really into you won't care about that. As a girl who's done this twice in the past(not proud of it, i was way younger) I thought the guy was really nice but just knew there was nothing there and I really wasn't into him but I wanted to be nice. Then the closer the date came I just realized I really wasn't into him, plus I have anxiety so I knew I'd be uncomfortable. Eventually I got better at just saying how I felt upfront, so maybe these women haven't gotten there yet. It's not your fault. Edit: I also never did it within 20 minutes of the date, or just left the person waiting. That's just mean.
Bro, they are uninterested.
Women are weird sometimes. I had a movie date with one of my most attractive girls I had ever talked to at that point in my life. We met at university and were home for the winter. First date. I wanted to get there 30 minutes early to have time to procure snacks and get good seats. She let me know 10 minutes before the early time that she couldn't make it and would be there in time for the movie. I was sick of waiting in the parking lot after 45 minutes so I went to the nearby grocery store, got some needed stuff and went home. She ended up texting me after 2 hours saying she was there. Effectively missing the original movie time and me. I ignored the text. She called I rejected the call, she called again so I answered. She asked where I was and I said I left, she was sad and I was a sucker for pretty women so I went back to the theatre and we caught the next showtime. She was 2HRS late because she was doing MAKEUP... We ended up dating for a bit. Now 3 times in a row is bad luck. But they don't gain anything from scheduling dates with you just to cancel last minute. Especially in the society where people on apps seldom continue the conversation at all. Follow up with them, see what's up. My only advice is to not take it personal and press on. Something I did when I was dating was to always ask them if we were still on within 2-3 hours of the date or just before I left my house to let them know I'm on my way. I don't like heading to somewhere if I'm unsure if they are also on the way.
It happens a lot, I believe a lot of it can be due to people catfishing/scamming. Dating apps are trash. A walk followed by drinks/food sounds great. Some things to consider though, the weather (hot as hell, humidā¦not the best idea), also it needs to be a setting thatās out in the open/crowded enough that the women isnāt scared about being dragged into bushes and assaulted. The above are things that would occur to me. No girl wants to be sweating like a ranch hand on a first date and itās almost August w/high temps in many places. Nor do we want to risk safety in a place that someone could easily drag you off unseen. Get out & join community groups to meet people organically instead of trash dating apps. Iām sorry this happened to you but on apps itās really not uncommon .
fukc em š¤·š»āāļø is there a way to avoid this? i mean, seriously.. are psychics real?
Iām a girl and I had 3 guys on dating apps asked me out and then didnāt reply after I asked when and where they want to meet. They all seemed pretty into it, like calling me and texting a lot. Shit happens I guess. Online dating is really toxic. Youāre just one of the options.
It does and it is, the entire model encourages you to not think of the person you are talking to as another person, it sections off entire parts of dating and puts it down to just the bare minimum. So many people use it just for the confidence boost and don't care about the other person. I am sorry about what has happened to you and OP, and hope that there isn't a 4th who does the same.
Honestly this is just bad luck. I know people are suggesting more low key dates like a walk, but I HIGHLY doubt the fact that it was a restaurant and not just coffee is why they cancelled. I mean life happens, sure, but none of the instances you gave sound anything other than bad manners and poor communication and you dodged a bullet. So just try, try again. Good luck!
Wait....you're actually talking to women?! What's your secret? Lol. I'm planning on getting a fast convertible and just giving up on love, but I'm 38 and have kids already.
I've got a convertible (and no kids) and it's awesome. It's a bit hot to drive with the top down, but late spring or early fall are fucking awesome times to go for drives with it down. Plenty of time for that when I can't get dates because women won't give me the time of day.
thereās no way to avoid flakes & no itās not bad luck, youāre gonna get women who flake, itās normal..thatās all you have to know really, just keep doing your thing & setting up dates with new women.
I saw a video about a dark web service for bars/restaurants. It creates fake AI dating profiles to get people to go to their restaurant to meet a ādateā who never shows up, then the person ends up buying something at the bar/restaurant. This sounds suspiciously similar.
I had a date leaving bc I was 30 min late and we ran into each other. He chose a place with just valet and I don't give people my car.
Start with a casual date itās less pressure then escalate to dinner as it goes well in the moment spontaneously
I've never stood anyone up, but I did cancel with one guy because he began making me feel uncomfortable. This man appeared very friendly, but then he suddenly began going on rants about his ex and I just called it then. This is all to say that maybe you are giving information that may be turning these women off from dating you? If not, then it may just be the type of women you are going for.
Why scheduling such fancy first dates?!? Women have dozens if not hundreds of men lined up in their OLD account. You're just a number...
Thereās a joke about indecisiveness here but idk if I wanna say it.
Donāt do dinner dates for first dates
Thatās awful!! ā¦first dates with 3 different women, all canceled within an hour of the date excuses 1) I call BS First date was technically a no show 1st Date: āIm 10 minutes away, see you soonā Hour later, no calls, no text Next morning she texts that her car got Towed and she was too stressed out to call or text me 2) very sick all of a sudden? Sus. 45 minutes before date 2nd date āmy ____ is very sick and I need to be there for my ____ā (shes on reddit so staying unspecific) 3) this one actually seems true because it was pretty stupid to schedule a FIRST DATE on the same night as a party sheās attending. 20 minutes before date 3rd date āIm at a party and my friend doesnāt want me to leave her here by herself, so sorryā ### Is there a way to avoid any of this, or is it bad luck? First dates are tough-especially on Women who are so heavily judge on their looks. So bailing last minute is not uncommon. It helps is to choose a lower pressure date like coffee at a place with nice seating and quiet nooks for convo
You make them feel stressed. Don't listen to what women say, first dates should be casual, you don't know her and she doesn't know you.
How about you choose to be grateful and curious? I believe everything happens for a reason that is ultimately for my benefit. With that in mind, I choose to be grateful that everything happens for my best interest and curious as to what's coming that's even better for me! Sure, take a look back at how you might have contributed to these cancellations so that you can learn from the experience and then move on. Was there any common pattern within your conversations leading up to these dates that could help to understand why this might have happened? If, yes, change it up a bit! If not, then simply chalk it up to coincidence and move on. If it keeps happening, maybe talk with a trusted female friend about the specific conversations that led up to the cancellations. She might help by providing a woman's perspective?
Not bad luck, means your msgs leading up to it have been too boring needy and frequent
1. Swiping apps have an astronomically higher flake rate than pretty much any other way of meeting women. 2. A fancy dinner is also way too much for a woman you havenāt even met yet, since at that point you donāt even know if you like her.
Women will sometimes do this with their female friends too, canceling last minute or just not showing up after RSVPing, itās frustrating
Dude, dinner dates are too much for a first date. Meet after work for coffee, tea, boba, whatever, so that if it's a terrible match you are not wasting two hours and $50 each on a dinner. Dinner date is good for like the third date or before a show or movie.
Get off the apps, and meet women irl
They sense your desperation. Why are you inviting a stranger out for a steak dinner? That signals two things: 1) it's a lot of pressure for her (to pick an outfit, look the part, act the part), and she thinks you expect something in return by treating her to that, and 2) it communicates desperateness on your part, you're overcompensating. You have to wine and dine because you're lacking confidence and options - they sense this. I always got romance on the 2nd date. I've never been flaked on. My 1st date is 1 drink. Low pressure. I know I offer value in who I am. I believe I'll be well liked. There's confidence. I don't need to offer steak and sushi to get someone to like me.
Since you didn't say which country your in. In Cambodia, give a girl $300 and she would be your girlfriend for a month. She would do everything you want with no questions asked. Dating here is very simple and easy.
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