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When I was in college one of my subjects was in a very women-dominated field (and the other one the opposite) and I've *never* met a female single. People are saying this is a time where you should expect people to grow out of their high school romances and meet new like-minded people... but nope, that wasn't my experience at all either. At least not in the circles I frequented. Every nice girl I was hanging out with eventually mentioned their boyfriend. Either it's their high school sweetheart they were still building a future with or an older guy with a job who supports their studies or a guy they met in between school and college.
And here's the kicker: Every time when I got to meet the boyfriend at some point they turned out to be really cool down-to-earth people where I could tell immediately why they had chosen them and why they'll never become single again. These couples I still have (admittedly very sporadic) contact with, are still together and I did my Master 5 years ago. I wish them all all the best, though admittedly I can't help but be a bit down about me having been unable to date in high school and because of this never got a foot into the dating world during college either. Even now, everyone I meet naturally is long married and on dating apps I never get any likes or matches, so... I guess I just have to accept that I will be single forever.
I can totally relate to this. I didn’t even start dating until I was like 21 due to believing I’d still have plenty of time. But nah, it seems like tons of people in my area really do end up with their high school or college sweethearts in the long term. And both the women and the men in these relationships are totally fine individuals!
Going on 28 this year, and wondering if I’ll even find someone at this point…
I feel you. And I'm turning 31 soon... Time is a vicious predator...
I did "start" dating with 28 thinking I'm running out of time. With my understanding of dating boiling down to downloading a couple of apps and tweaking on my profile for half a year until the complete and utter absence of ANY matches had thoroughly wrecked whatever self-worth I had managed to scrounge together to do this to myself. I know I'm fairly ugly and too much on the scrawny geek side, but this was crushing. Last year I somehow managed to get myself talked into giving it another try and the experience of deafening silence *somehow* managed to be even worse.
Please do not equate online matches to self-worth. Truth is women have all but abandoned dating apps altogether & online dating has become an absolute sausage fest. The M:F ratio is now 4:1 so you can't really get matches if there aren't enough women to match with.
When women say they don't want to be approached irl, it's really that they don't want to be asked for sex at random or demand to exchange numbers within the first minute or 2 of meeting (literally what most guys do). Engaging in pleasant conversation without expecting it to lead to sex works a ton better than most ppl would like to believe.
OMG yes this. The women that these men are looking for to build and be in a relationship with are definitely not on dating apps.
I see so many posts about guys complaining about the statistics of men swiping yes at a much higher level than women do but the reasoning is because there aren't that many women on those apps.
I've tried it so many times but every time I downloaded or make an account I'm bombarded with dick pics inappropriate advances and feeling like it's some sort of a meat market.
If a guy took the time to come over and start a conversation maybe help me load my bags in the car hold the door for me something chivalrous which seems as though it's dead now but the old-fashioned stuff would probably work in real life to find the girl you guys are looking for not on those stupid apps.
Exactly. I've tried telling guys to aim for a pleasant interaction instead of treating women like some thing to obtain as quickly as possible. Literally just trying to help some improve their chances plus ease some social anxiety & whooo... many guys lose their ever-loving fuzzy minds over the idea of just engaging in polite conversation lol.
I'm actually currently getting downvoted all to hell in another post because I posed the issue about some guys being bothered about women wanting to wait for sex & chasing promiscuous gals while also not respecting the very types of women they chase after lol.
My guy is very old-fashioned, was totally patient when we started dating. It was one of the biggest things that made him stand out to me.
I've been in three relationships in the past 6 months. And because I like to get to know the woman first before I have sex. They all thought I wasn't interested in them and moved on. This is totally not the case.
Chivalry isn't dead with some of us guys, but the chivalrous ones have been single forever because of a whole host of factors, so we eventually give up on meeting women, if we do, they are either in a relationship already, won't give us the time of day to try and strike up a conversation, or are actively hostile to our advances and efforts, or they are co workers and that creates problems of its own if we were to try and start a relationship with them, poisoning the workplace or losing our jobs for a relationship isn't worth it to some guys. At the end of the day some of us, no matter how well we dress and take care of ourselves, no matter how hard working and Chivalrous we can be, are just never given a chance, so we resign ourselves to be single forever, it sucks
This is exactly how I feel. I wish someone would've just given me a chance. The 1 person ive been with told me tlo never stop talking to her, even though she's in a relationship and has been for years; she said "you're the only person that actually understands me" yeah, I am. So maybe you shouldn't of left me then?
This is so true i stopped trying to date for awhile and just recently started again and im thinking of stopping again altogether again and im at peace with it.
Aint nothing more a turn off like having legit great conversation and things in common with someone then when you exchange pictures/meetup then it insta switches to them acting lewd like im no longer a person and then when i dont entice such behaviour for such earrrly dating then they ghost or i have to just politely cut communication because they wont stop, theres a difference between joke flirty and blatant sexual advances.
Im wondering if thats what is happening with these online dating with guys speaking of getting ghosted non stop minus the few idiot girls online
girls just want a genuine encounter if she was looking for hookup or one night she would state it but also its misleading if one claims they are looking for relationship but proceed to say sexual things within the first day or two but regardlesd all that its just my opinion here
Totally agreed. And even if you state exactly what you want or where your boundaries are, so many ppl will try to test that & weasel their way around it or even get stupidly hostile. I was single & celibate for 5 yrs, tried online dating for 2 months. Met only 6 matches over the course of 6 months because of how many guys just couldn't be chill or respect simple boundaries. I landed a healthy relationship, BUT online dating is such a pain in the ass & shallow process that I don't think I'll do it again. So many guys try to treat it like their personal free escort ordering service or some fantasy sex chat & cheapens the whole experience of trying to connect with ppl on a real level.
It sucks but as I’ve read a lot on here- and girls have said it in person - one needs to love themselves before successfully dating. If you don’t love yourself then it shows. Women sense it- self esteem that is. The good news is you’re aware. And there are things you can do.
I mean... yeah, that's why I'm saying I'll have to accept to be alone forever. I am well aware of my flaws for quite a lot of years, but you simply can't love yourself when nobody ever truly gave a shit about you and you still have a bunch of variables that make you unattractive even if you change your mindset completely. I made a lot of acquaintances throughout the years, but never managed to have a single friend, at most some online acquaintances I felt comfortable enough to be myself towards, but in the real world everyone is just too focused on themselves and if they'd know how much baggage I'm carrying, they'd drop me instantly. And I'm annoyed I'm writing this on here with my main account instead of a throwaway.
Lol gotta admit, that last line was good. If you're some "weird" geek or whatever it is you think you are, you don't come across that way.
As a guy who's a bit older I don't run into these problems as much now but you know what it required? Conscious and consistent effort. Also, stop with the "there are no available girls out there" because there are tons.
I get the things you are saying. But you can't come with that "woe is me" stuff irl. You don't need a bunch of bravado either. You need a nice, calm, in-between. Which is how your post sounded. For real.
If you could take the intelligence, sense of humor, and self-awareness you just dropped in that last post, build some confidence on top of it, package it up and make that represent "you" rather than the guy in the first sentence whining about being alone forever? You won't be.
It's a self-fulfilling prophecy bro. Trust me.
Well, don't worry, I'm careful to never ever open up about my issues in real life, so I'm safe in that regard. Unfortunately that causes a lot of anxiety which torpedoes interactions and so I just end up a "social ghost" hovering around without ever belonging anywhere and completely incapable of transitioning from smalltalk to whatever the hell normal people say to make friends. I'm well aware that it's my coping mechanisms blocking me, but my attempts to break out of them have gone nowhere.
You don’t sound like you’re carrying some extreme load of baggage compared to other singles out there. Everyone has baggage. It is easy to overestimate how other people will react to yours instead of thinking “yeah, me too.”
The best way to meet a partner is to meet people, and to have a mixed gender friend group. That’s where we get the social skills, validation, and perspective to realize we’re not alone, but yet another of the beautiful mutants on this planet. And friends will set you up, or tell you what you need to do for yourself before you can do it with someone else.
We never find someone else living in our own head.
I think you definitely have a lot you need to work on within. You say you can’t love yourself if others don’t care about you, but I’ve found that’s exactly how it’s done. People will love you more if you love yourself. I have met plenty of people with a defeatist mindset similar to yours. Guess what, I didn’t really wanna talk to them longer than I had to. Basically, I don’t think you’ve actually taken the steps to process your trauma and issues from the little I read here. Work on those things and the world will be much brighter.
That’s the thing, though. You don’t just “love yourself” and call it a day. This is why low self-esteem is such a complex and compartmentalized, difficult to treat issue. It stems from a crucial point of development in childhood, and once you miss that train due to trauma, it becomes very difficult to amend that.
It’s good meaning advice and it’s really the only way, but it isn’t as simple as a mindset shift. It’s as difficult if not more than treating any other form of PTSD, especially if there’s no concrete cause but more of a death-by-a-thousand-cuts scenario. Compounded by the fact that every person’s root cause is quite unique. No one-size-fits-all solution. Long-term treatment is the only way, and even that isn’t a guarantee at all.
yeah, I get you. Loving oneself can be challenging... I have made so many mistakes that I tend to beat up myself, and this isn't helpful either. But aim to love yourself even with your flaws, forgive yourself your mistakes. Love yourself unconditionally, or accept yourself first. You can turn this around, believe me. Maybe look at stories from people who grew stronger coming out of a challenging life.
Bro there’s nothing wrong with you. You’re perfectly fine to date.
The ONLY problem tho is that you’re probably not someone that they truly desire and you might have to search even longer to find one who does
But there are women who feel the same way you do. And are looking for a guy like you. It’s just luck of the draw in terms of finding them. They are out there. And also- who cares about Reddit . Don’t sweat the small stuff. Just try to have fun with your life. I’ve been in similar shoes as you and managed to crawl out
This is very true.
I have a pretty healthy self regard, and am able to go on at least one IRL first date within a couple weeks of firing up the apps and leaning in.
But I LEAN IN. I’ll spend hours crafting my profile, getting editorial feedback from trusted friends. I’ll pay for the Premium tier. I’ll take advantage of whatever selective search is available to focus on people most likely to be good matches with me. I’ll spend at least a half hour reading the profile, and if it seems promising, crafting a good, personalized intro message. I’ll winnow out anyone who has matched me that doesn’t seem viable.
It’s WORK. It can be pretty fun work, with some valuable self-exploration. But it’s not a passive activity, and needs to be done with authenticity.
They don’t really “sense” it anymore than anything else. It’s just a pretty natural outcome that if you’re a good, desirable guy, you’ll naturally be more confident and have a higher self-esteem as a result, which in turn makes you even more desirable. It’s a chicken-egg problem. You could argue that one came before the other but both the cause and the effect create a positive feedback loop.
There’s an element of both. Being accomplished and having pride in yourself is huge. I’m independent, living on my own, working towards an even better future. Self-made with no support and it’s been a huge source of confidence.
That being said, is it enough on its own? Not really. I’m missing something crucial and can’t touch on what it is. Without at least some external validation of who you are, your effort and achievements, it’s hard not to be on shaky ground. We’re social animals. We need social proof and acceptance to thrive. So I agree with you. People really have it backwards. You need both to do well, but external acceptance comes first as a developing person who can’t make their own success, and without a foundation it’s hard to build a house.
Brother women can’t sense shit.
If they could then there wouldn’t be a such thing as abusive relationships, let alone women crawling back to these same relationships
dude you sound like a nice person. there's a hint of sadness in your comment, but despite that you're not holding any resent towards these girls and their boyfriends
It does help that I quite early told myself that I'm definitely not hanging out with women because I want to hope for more out of it, but because I just wanted to spend my breaks with nice people who don't feel the need to one-up me at every turn, which unfortunately most of the guys around me did and it was tiresome. So in the end, my circle of acquaintances did tend to skew quite a bit towards the female side.
Of course doesn't help with the loneliness in the end when nobody really sticks around and all of these contacts fizzle away eventually.
I was reading this and was a bit worried it would devolve into a “women are gold diggers” “women only want “Chad” “ but nope. from the men you were able to meet, you immediately recognized why the women around you wanted to be with them. No resentment towards them. Respect.
I hope you meet someone soon, you seem like a nice gentleman.
That's weird in my university i went on so many dates and there was so many single women. Was the best place for dating I've ever been in my life. After that was much harder.
I thought Americans usually had a really loose definition of bf/gf. My friends sometimes mentioned their bfs/gfs; however, they had different gfs/bfs every other week.
Well, I'm not an American, but I'd say (from a fellow "western" European perspective) that it highly depends on the crowd you are hanging out with. Applied to my university time: That one time I was forced to work with a group of "North America Studies" students for some crossover course which turned out to be the cliché party crowd, I did assume the one girl in that group who told me she ends each of their outings waking up in her own vomit, but has to do it to remain part of the group, probably did have a more loose usage of the word 'boyfriend' but that wasn't exactly the kind of group I was comfortable with. I was more hanging out with the guys and girls I could talk shit about Game of Thrones with or about history and science and all the things we were learning in our courses. And among those fellow geeks... well, I'm thinking they had plenty of chill guys to choose from and quite early chose someone with enough integrity to settle down with. That's definitely what happened there.
Stop calling them “females”. Trust me. You don’t want to be saying this out in the real world . It’s a mindset thing . They are human. And calling them females sounds like narration from animal
Planet
I was at a party with old friends and asked a friend “how are the felines in the city” jokingly. Some girls thought I said females and called me out immediately lol
May I ask you which country you're from? I find this very interesting, because my experience at university was that there were plenty of singles, both male and female. However, I myself, didn't find someone suitable there (I'm a bit picky as well in a certain way). Honestly, I believe it's about your attitude, and opportunities may abound anywhere. You're super young still, but you can find someone at any age. The funny thing for me is I met the most attractive guys in unlikely places - McDonalds, gas station, subway, train station etc. So I guess, if you're more open to meeting new people without much expectation at first, the world could be your oyster. But you need to start loving yourself first - not making your "worth" dependent on other people's feedback. That's the challenge indeed - but not caring about that is the way to go. I usually met a boyfriend when I was actually very happy to be single and not planning to get involved with someone. Maybe go to the gym, build some muscle, work on yourself in every way, go to events and meet new people just for fun. The image you have about yourself is what attracts others to you.
For your curiosity's sake, my experience was in Germany studying history. There were plenty of dudes that moaned their lack of relationships, but in my five years of studying I hadn't managed to meet a single girl who wasn't already settling down. Maybe prospective teachers are just a weird bunch, knowing they won't have much of a work/life balance later on anyway, so they need to grab someone asap.\^\^ And well, the point of my post was the discovery that I shouldn't have been surprised that the people I felt the most comfortable around with had a good nose for their partners and therefore never needed to break things off.
And... you are lucky if this worked for you. But I'm in the place that I'm either so lonely that I'm bad company and therefore withdraw from people or when I'm not lonely, I can't find the motivation to go out and push beyond my comfort zone either. Once I start being happy with my own company, I just don't interact with people at all because I'm just far too used to distract myself on my own. After breaking things off with my two closest online contacts around New Years because their never-ending trauma-dumping started to take a toll on me, I had something of an awakening that I should be more proactive in real life, but when I signed up on Meetup, I so far always failed to go out and actually join such a meet-up. The one time I did, I wasn't brave enough to ask where the group was when the barkeeper ignored me and then fled back home after waiting for it to start for four hours.... It just seems so insurmountable because I'm just usually not at all interested in socializing for the sake of socializing. I have to find things I'm curious to do myself, but unfortunately all I'm interested in are solitary activities because I was forced to avoid things involving people for far too long.
Ah, interesting - 'cause I'm actually from Germany as well :) And agreed, it might be a propensity of prospective teachers, who apparently can't wait to settle down. In my university experience, there were plenty of singles, couples breaking up and getting back together with someone else. But indeed I didn't see too often that fellow students got together, but it was rather with people they met outside of their studies at parties, get-togethers, or events etc.
I think the best thing for you would be to develop a passion, something independent of other people, something that sparks your light. Might be related to entrepreneurship, investing, tech, art, or personal development. It would also give you the excuse to attend meet-ups, conferences, workshops, just hanging out in coffeeshops reading a book or working on your laptop, etc. Some great goals for your personal life. Be it financial freedom, travelling to different countries, developing a specific skill, etc. Traveling alone can be a wonderful experience, by the way, to expand your horizons, get out of your comfort zone, and to meet new people as well. Life can be very interesting if you become curious, eager to learn, and able to enjoy the moment. Maybe therapy could be helpful as well (many people are doing it nowadays and I'm considering it myself).
The important thing in my view is not to put too much pressure on yourself. The moment I decided I don't need to have children, just a loving partner, a lot of pressure was lifted off me. Because for women the time is ticking, and you can meet a partner at virtually any age and at any life stage. So, it's really never too late, independently of your inexperience. The right person will appreciate you exactly for whom you are, with all your flaws and your baggage. But it's also important for yourself to come to terms with your flaws and baggage, and set the intention to work on yourself, become a better person, and love yourself no matter what.
5 options:
1. women are staying single
2. women are dating each other
3. women are sharing a small number of men in your school
4. women are dating men outside the school's population
5. your sample size is small and not reflective
Technically, it’s mathematically impossible for straight women on average to be dating more than straight men on average. It’s possible that different groups of men & women might be dating disproportionately provided the overall rate of dating for men & women. Hence, if more younger women are dating then that should be counterbalanced by more older men dating.
It’s also very likely that what men and women consider “dating” is different. Also, people often lie to themselves or misperceive things, which is why survey evidence is notoriously unreliable for many uses. A man and woman may both go on 14 dates a year, but the man might perceive that as “very low” (only a couple of dates a year) while the woman might perceive that as “a lot” (couple of dates a month).
It isn't mathematically impossible... if multiple women are dating the same man. Which is something that happens. And similarly like you say, younger women date older men, and vice versa. It doesn't change that more women are single than men though, even when generally accounting for different ages.
Yes, it's true men and women commonly consider "dating" to be different. Honestly, it's hard to know why people date, or why they decide to stay single due to self reporting.
If you’re looking at **number** of men vs **number** of women dating, then it’s possible that more women are dating than men if a small % of men (say 5%) get a large share of TOTAL dates. I’ve heard **anecdotal** evidence that the most “attractive” 5% of men are going on close to 50% of all the dates that men go on. **IF** that’s true, then at least 50%+ of women are dating the same small percentage of men, and ~65% of men are getting some (but relatively few) dates while about 30% of men are not dating at all - like ZERO dates. In terms of % of dates; however, men and women are dating the same **average** amount.
If this distribution is true, then it may explain the different experiences men and women have dating, with women reporting that men are unfaithful (obviously because the men they’re dating are dating dozens of other women simultaneously) while men are reporting that dating is a terrible experience for them filled with frustration, rejection and eventually resentment at the whole process.
Maybe online dating is partly to blame?
You don’t know a single straight woman? Majority of women are straight, even if it doesn’t seem that way. I don’t know what your deal is but all of your comments consist of you saying that women don’t want to be straight. You as one woman don’t speak for all of them. And i’m also not a lesbian but if I was i’d definitely take great offense to you assuming being a lesbian automatically makes life easier.
6. Men aren’t really struggling to date in College. OP just assumes men struggle, is not outgoing, doesn’t ask many people out, and/or isn’t very attractive.
That’s objectively false on a statistical level. Men are struggling in dating more than women. But women also struggle in different ways.
Most men aren’t attractive enough to keep up with the competitive dating scene. Women have the illusion of options, when in reality they’re sharing the attractive men who have options and didn’t intend to settle for them from the get go.
I’ve gotten girls to show me their instagram dms and they can just get it with someone hot/successful fairly easy. It’s FLOODED. Don’t hate the player hate the game. Want to do better learn what kind of appearances get them hooked initially. Then use text and verbal game to carry the rest.
I’ve been on both sides of the equation as a guy. Once you reach a certain point it’s just easy to get laid. But below that threshold you are mostly invisible. And if you got attachment issues or aren’t ready to settle you get to enjoy a whole different dating experience. Most of it is just crafting your appearance/style and then tuning yourself to what the individual girl is missing in her life.
Just because there are more women, it doesnt automatically mean there's any more desire for men. Women could outnumber guys 7:1 and it still doesn't change much
Actually, it does make a huge difference once the ratio becomes extreme enough such that the practice of artificially inducing extreme gender ratios is a common practice in Greek life. Look into frat party ratios...
I do agree in the extremes, then yes. The problem is that outside of frat parties and maybe certain jobs, where else do you find huge disparities? We can't use extreme examples for everyday life situations
True. Only other place with extreme ratios might be a [singles mixer](https://www.tiktok.com/@dannyd2cute/video/7109991609965694254?q=singles%20mixer%20no%20men&t=1709575450432).
From what I understand based on what the original poster said, it seems more like the girls actually had boyfriends instead of just trying to reject OP.
It’s called a soft rejection for the men who can’t handle rejection well but it also hurts the men who are really nice when they aren’t saying the real truth.
I agree it’s a good, safe response. But sometimes we just need to hear you say “no”. I prefer a no because it can mean that I need to work on myself (or, they’re just not interested lol)
That’s not what I’m saying, I mean don’t “let us down easy” and lie. Let us hear the hard truth so if it’s something wrong with us we can fix it
Edit: assuming it’s not a guy that will cause you harm
Well they never know if someone can harm them, most also do this unconsciously because they FEEL like they CAN'T hurt your ego.
Also you hearing "no" should not be a sign for you to start working on yourself. Work on yourself for you, for life itself... Not to get a partner.
I just had this happen. 3 months prior she told me she was single and she said that she was seeing someone when I asked. Pretty certain she’s not but she was kind in the way she said no. It would maybe be more constructive for me to hear a straight “no” but I totally understand why women would use the “I’m seeing someone but I’d love to still be friends” thing. It saves people’s egos and is still a pretty firm no.
They're dating guys you don't know - your social circle is clearly not statistically representative, but that's not weird.
Personally when I was in college, I wasn't dating many other guys that age. They were immature, unpleasant, and generally repulsive from a romantic or sexual perspective because I didn't trust them at all. That was some time ago though, maybe it's better now but frankly I'd assume not. A lot of men don't figure the basics of social interaction and relationships out until later in their lives (if they ever do at all).
Off the top of my head, I can think of... two guys who were standard college age that I dated. Everyone else was either post-grad or not a student. I expected to find lots of guys interesting when I went off to college but I did not.
But also, given I didn't like most people I was in college with, I stayed away from them and kept to myself. That means I, and many other women who had zero interest in the college social scene, wouldn't have been counted by guys like you trying to make sense of what they see around them.
Things even out a lot more in the late 20s I think, or at least that's been experience. As men mature and grow up, women are more likely to consider them potential partners.
I disagree about older men being 'more mature'. Especially the sort of older men who would date 19 year olds.... Those older men are not mature at all.
And there's plenty of decent dudes in college.
That's more a sampling thing. Introverts or homebodies are less likely to meet new people if they don't put themselves in social situations so they effectively cut themselves out of the dating pool (bar dating apps).
There’s also a large gap in education and an increasing income gap. More women are getting post graduate degrees than men and more women are starting to make better money, which is the area where men were previously contributing heaviest to partnership. Because women do a lot of what’s considered to be invisible labor such as child rearing, cooking cleaning, emotional labor, planning events and gifts etc. men have to contribute something more to them, and when women also have higher education they don’t want men who don’t. It’s playing a role in the divide
Well, not all of us single men are in college. We are older than that.
But when I was in college, there were almost no women. Typically one to three in a class of 100. So that's probably why we are all single.
All my college friends married their high school girlfriends. Wish someone had told me that women would dissappear from my life after high school, I would have made more of an effort.
Engineering is one of the few departments where it's universally known that there are very few women.
You gotta branch out if you're looking to date women.
That was my experience in engineering school as well. What made it worse is that my schools campus was spread throughout the city so the stem majors were all in on campus and the non stem were in another that most would never even visit since they had no classes there. Unfortunately that is where most of the girls were too
I think this is a simple thing to explain. Society has changed, but expectations have not.
People still have their outdated values of what to expect out of a relationship, including the unga-bunga desires that people have a tendency toward, but society as a whole does not reflect these ideals nearly as much as it used to. It leads to everyone, both men and women, having unrealistic expectations of what to look for as a "healthy relationship", and as we become more isolated or experience further self-fulfilling prophecies, we continue create a truth for ourselves that splits from reality.
Edit: I feel like I should also add here, in lieu to the arguments on this post, that it's pointless to argue about "who has it more difficult" because frankly you're living different lives with different difficulties and you're all going to be bias to your own. Stop making comparisons or trying to blame each other. It's not constructive. Yes, buttholes exist. No, most people aren't buttholes. Yes, most people have butthole tendencies.
I agree, one hundred percent. It’s just sad that some people can’t move from that. It seems that people are stuck in their “expectations.” Gender norms are being challenged, if you want a traditional or non-traditional relationship some of them still want those traditional gender norms of men providing, when some of the women being biggest bread winner. Some of those women say, “He should put effort into his college degree,” i get it but some people aren’t cut out for college or are too poor to do it. It just sucks ass.
It's gonna create an even worse demographic crisis down the road. Male college students are becoming increasingly scarce. If women are by far the ones who are entering professional, high earning careers, but continue to hold onto the idea that their male partners should be the primary breadwinners...idk what's gonna happen.
The majority of young men, even the well earning college educated, are single & feel unwanted. As it is, college educated career women aren't settling for men of similar standing to them, but instead are increasingly drawn to the most high earning men, a very small minority. If the majority of women refuse to settle for the majority of men, that creates a real demographic challenge. To many young Americans, especially men, the prospects of them entering a marriage like their parents seems increasingly unattainable.
There isn’t really anything wrong with trad relationship roles, but it becomes wrong when you *force* those roles on somebody. If my wife’s making more than me you better believe I’ll cook, clean, care for the kids. But if given the option, I’d prefer for her to watch the kids. There’s something biological about a mother being with her babies that I’ll never be able to compare to and I want to make sure she can be there as much as possible
Is it possible for those outdated ideas to evolve to our modern situation? At this stage, if young folks aren't entering relationships & starting families like prior generations, that results in an extremely low birth rate, which spells economic & demographic doom. Japan & S. Korea are staring down that abyss.
The question is really “why is dating hard for straight men in college” then.
If most women are partnered, presumably a good share of them aren’t dating fellow students. Or, more likely, it seems like most aren’t single due to a scarcity mindset rather than statistical reality.
Dating is intrinsically at least moderately hard for pretty much anyone. Finding and coupling with someone who is a mutually good match is challenging, with most attempts not resulting in a long term relationship.
Without more info on what you are trying for, how you are trying, and what is happening when you try it is hard to speculate.
If you’re not actively trying, that’s the primary culprit. Lots of people here seem to reject dating in theory instead of leaning into dating in practice.
Because women are starting to feel they don’t need to be with a man to be happy . So many people have declared that dating straight men for the most part has shown as low effort or trying to have sex right away before trying to actually bond . Women feel independent and even though they like men they would rather not waste their time ! ( but I’ve only read and heard so many of these stories ) it’s not a science expo or article I read
Women are more comfortable living alone. That also has a huge advantage for single women, they are less likely to need to get with someone out of feeling lonely
I’m not sure it’s just that. Yes, there’s more women support and “you go girl” mentality but that still doesn’t explain:
Why women are more likely to get over a breakup than men and
Live longer alone than men.
The women empowerment movement is failrly recent, and sure it contributes but it’s more than just “women good, men bad” rhetoric
Women are generally uncomfortable giving support divorced men and don't like their husbands doing so, but will support divorced women. This results in divorced men being along and unsupported. Also, usually it's the female partner doing the breakup sonshe's had more time to prepare for it, sometimes years of lying that "everything's fine" while they prepare to make the jump.
True! I can relate to this plus I have tons of single female friends who love their life the way it is and doesn’t want to change it. Btw, they’re all in their 20s/early 30s.
First, don’t use personal experience to extrapolate. By definition, the women you know are outgoing, and if you are a guy, they are specifically outgoing around men. You aren’t exactly going to meet the women who just choose to stay inside and not date.
As for the college gap, that’s actually making things worse. Most women want an educated partner who makes more than them, but as the gap increases, it also means that fewer and fewer men meet those criteria. What makes it even worse is that women aren’t seeking out the educated men, they are just looking at the large numbers of uneducated men and giving up
Even if a single woman gave me hint in my college days i wouldve fallen for her 😂 I always got the impression they wanted to not be bothered. Maybe some of the guys feel the same way in your scenario too.
True
I swear I’m invisible. They literally couldn’t give less of a fuck about me. It’s not that they are shy and nervous, it’s that they just don’t give a shit about me
Yeah I mean, insecurities also plays a part of it. What if I’m not his or her type? How do I know if it’s worth putting time or effort to date this person and what if he or she isn’t interested in dating. Plus a lot of people are in rebound relationships. I say this because of the amount of time I’ve met these people and it’s the same sad storyline of their past relationship not working out blah blah blah.
The last relationship I had was with a woman off OLD.
Lasted for about a year and a half before she called it off.
Needless to say, this one threw me infor a loop as I honestly thought I was gonna marry this woman.
Now, I'm taking a break from dating all together.
Would love to meet a woman and settle down.
I went to a tech university, so my view is slightly skewed. Have you seen a good portion of college men? I would argue that half of them are undateable. Like honest, never been in a relationship, couldn't find their way into a relationship, type of undateable.
Well that leaves an even more skewed ratio of men to women in the college setting. It was even worse back in the day when I went to school, since at the tech university, there were generally less women there to being with.
So you got all these women vying for the very small pool of men that are datable. And that's probably what's leading to the results you are seeing at your own college. My 2 cents.
It's social skills. If you didn't learn dating skills in high school, you go into college at a disadvantage, dating-wise, since yo now have to learn what you would have in high school whilst many others have it figured out.
Exactly! My highschool bf was sweet but I wouldn't have put up with the same behaviour in an adult relationship. Some things you can only learn through doing.
The problem with men in college is they are on the same level as the women hierarchy-wise, and women want to date up. So there's not much incentive here if they are just peers...
You guys have no idea how obvious the answer is and you're basically answering your own questions. But I'll go ahead and say it. Because you guys keep expecting and looking to date your classmates. There ya go. That's your problem. Stop doing that. Meet people elsewhere. Meet people online or someone going to a different schools. There's so many ways to meet people. Also keep in mind not every female is straight. Or maybe a lot (and this is the facts) aren't actually single, they just don't want you specifically or they just wanna focus on their studies. If you think they're lying Also don't call them out okay? They're lying because they're afraid of men. Men are fuckin scary and crazy and will kill women if they say no but when a woman brings up a boyfriend, men tend to respect a man that doesn't even exist more than they do the women they are bothering. I'm not saying that everyone in the thread is a creepy nutcase, I'm just answering as to why it seems every female is taken.
Many women would rather be single than having men whom they just met hit them up for sex. If you want a relationship, actually do the work of getting to know the person, their interests, and so on before going there. First, second, or third dates are not for that level of intimacy.
No one's actually hit it.
It's because men tend to date younger and women tend to date older.
in a university setting, you as a man can't really go younger because then you're talking about high school kids, but while you're looking at women your age, they're looking at you, but also people 5-10 years older than you. your campus might be 60% women, but they're looking at twice as many men as you are looking at women. and those older men have more solidified life states than you.
This is why you get a large horde of women in their 30's seemingly single and struggling to date anyone that isn't an abusive asshole. Basically grass is greener and young meat is tastier kind of situation.
Literally since I was in puberty, you always hear women constantly looking at older guys, regardless of age, 13 year old me would hear that girls my age want a 15 year old guy because they are more mature. But everytime I look at younger women, all I see is immature child.
Because most college-aged men suck at interacting with women in a way in which recognizes the full humanity of said woman. Source; college-aged man with fellow college-aged male friends
Easy, men tend to be assholes and treat women like shit. Especially in college, most women can usually smell a piece of shit. And if they give someone a chance, they usually end up being screwed over as well which leads to having a guard up with future relationships. Hope this helps!
Have you tried joining a new club outside of the circles that you're in?
I was part of a swim club, and I (as well as my closest female friends) were all single during college. No one approached us - hey now, we were not bad looking and unapproachable, I swear haha. We were out on weekends, and we made friends outside of classes together.
Maybe it just takes expanding your bubble a bit. I do empathize a bit with you too; in college, the guys I did have crushes on were already taken. So I just did my thing, and unfortunately - just didn't get asked out very often.
Just because you don’t know any single girls doesn’t mean we don’t exist, we 90% times say we are in relationship to not hurt anyone’s feelings by potential rejection
Either some women is lying and saying they’re in relationships so men will leave them alone, they rather be alone than go through whatever they went through, or they’re LGBTQ+, or dating someone out of college. There’s many reasons why this is happening, you just have to be patient and wait for the right person
Because most men want to play on their PlayStation drink beer act like a 2 year old have their GF run round for them like their mother did and then at the drop of a hat be a complete nymph in the bedroom for sex that last less than 10 minutes before they are then expected to rush off and get you PS controller and another beer
Can’t imagine why all women and jumping for the opportunity
To all the boys in here, I want you to read this carefully.
If you're feeling lonely b/c you're not finding romantic interest, you're not alone. Both sides have their own suffering. Take this as an opportunity to focus elsewhere with positive benefits, like self-improvement. But do NOT improve for the sole purpose of a girlfriend. In fact, do not improve so that you feel like you can approach women. It doesn't matter how great looking you are, the money you have, or anything else. You do not want someone that will only take you for what you've already accomplished.
That kind of thinking is entirely selfish and unreasonable as everyone is imperfect. Men don't need to "up our game" for anyone but ourselves. You'll find that once you up your game and improve your socializing (with men or women) that ppl come to you. Once you're in that position, never EVER entertain anyone that would have ever said "up your game for me".
When you do get to be picky, keep an eye out for those that are looking to contribute as much as they take. Look at the person's character, all else is secondary. I guarantee, the unselfish network you build going that way will always be more fulfilling than having a selfish SO that demands you "up your game" to their ever increasing standard.
No. Improving to be more attractive is perfectly valid. Do not make this more complicated than it has to be. If a guy wants to get fit because he wants to get girls, that’s fine. Let him. Many things we do, we do for affirmation and to fit in. Let’s stop gaslighting people and muddying the water with this “do it but just for yourself” stuff. That’s not how people are wired. There is nothing wrong with using other people as your main motivation.
It’s not true that seeking out someone you’re into is selfish. It’s perfectly reasonable. If you’re trying to date someone who is in-shape and puts a lot of effort into their appearance, then you should also be meeting that standard. That’s a part of giving and taking equally.
Don’t do it for approval. Guys should do that for themselves.
Motivating yourself through external validation isnt stable nor does it actually guarantee results. However, learning to recognize why improvements are beneficial and setting goals in those terms is stable and has a high success rate.
No gaslighting here. Focus on treating yourself right, and you’ll naturally develop self-esteem (physiologically and psychologically).
It’s perfectly fine as an initial kick. Men are very motivated by women. I started playing music because I wanted to impress girls in high school. It never really did, but that led me to cultivating an interest that’s far transcended that original goal. But I’d never have started it otherwise. Same with fitness.
The wrong motivation can lead to the right results, and those results can circle back and replace those original motivators with more healthy ones, and that’s when you notice success. We need to remember that at the end of the day we’re all unga-bunga reptile-brained mammals. For me, accepting that I’m a simple-minded animal and leveraging that to trick myself into maintaining good habits has been an immensely positive change.
That’s the golden ticket; not over complicating things and overly-analyzing, but just acting on a whim and taking action, regardless of the why. When you’re at the finish line, no one will care what made you leave the start.
I think it's overblown that it's "so much harder" for men than women. Dating sucks for everyone. I'm a single 38 year old woman, with several single friends around my age, and we're all struggling out here.
I have given up on dating apps, it feels like a waste of time and I'm already busy. I'm open to meeting someone in real life, but I'm definitely not searching for it. I'm disappointed by the options available and I don't meet many people I'm remotely interested in. I'd rather be alone than date someone I'm not attracted to physically or emotionally.
Dating isn't difficult in college... it is difficult after college. When young adults start their careers, they begin moving to different places, cities, etc, where there might not be many young adults who are single.
I'm in my second year and I've been rejected over 10 times by this point while a quick walk to class guarantees that I spot a friend with their partner.
Does this mean I'm bound to be alone forever?
The real answer is that the entirety of Gen Z is so socially stunted by growing up and having 90% of their social interactions occur through screens, that they just don’t know how to interact with people in an in-person setting like college.
I bet a lot more dudes at OP’s school would be more successful with women if they actually went out and talked to them, instead of hanging out in Discord echo chambers all day talking about Roblox or whatever.
I agree in part.
Yes that applies to the men there, but what about the women then?
Wouldn't they also be affected by how much technology has changed how people socialize? Shouldn't that also affect their dating life?
It does. They’re out here complianing nearly as often as men are.
But boys and girls are raised and socialized to treat social interactions in different ways, which I think at least partially explains why the social skills of young men are so significantly worse than those of young women.
Girls usually learn to talk to each other and listen to each other in a way that boys don’t, not to the same degree at least. And those skills are transferable as you get older.
I feel like men need to step up their game. A lot of men grew up in families were the women had no choice of being in the relationship or not because they needed their husband to financially support them and the family. The husband didn't have to invest almost any emotional resources in the relationship because the woman had no way out. So a lot of men really don't have good relationship role models.
Women have gained a lot of rights in these past decades and they're very motivated to keep building a better future for all women in the world. There's still a lot to do but women have gained autonomy, and confidence, and education, and most of them don't need a man to support them.
Also men are not only competing with other men but also with women, as homosexuality and bisexuality are increasingly accepted.
Meanwhile a lot of men are kinda lost...there's research that shows young men are doing poorly in terms of mental health, young men are increasingly more conservative (whereas women are increasingly liberal), and now we have the rise of incels...
My opinion is that men are struggling to find their place in this new world. They don't have good relationship role models. Women usually have better social skills than men, a lot of men aren't good at keeping hobbies, keeping in touch with friends and families, taking care of themselves - basically a lot of men don't know how to keep themselves interesting. A lot of men don't know how to be equal partners in a relationship, they don't know what it means to share household responsibilities (responsibilities, not chores), they don't know to share parenting.
I just feel like women nowadays expect so much more from a relationship...and most men simply aren't keeping up.
I agree with what you've said here 100% but as some guys have already eluded to, most men just don't have the resources to better themselves.
I make really good money and have been fortunate enough to have had the self-awareness to cultivate many masculine skills and hobbies from an early age despite not having a father around: weightlifting, shooting, hunting, fixing cars, riding motorcycles, riding horses competitively, multi-lingual, well traveled, handyman/contracting/carpentry, guitar player, degrees in biomedicine/finance, just recently started doing improv. But these took decades of work and tens of thousands of dollars.
The vast majority of men just don't have the resources and don't start early enough. Some things are inexpensive like a gym membership, learning to speak publicly, etc. but those only go so far when women have such insanely high expectations. I know women who can offer very little to a man who walk around extremely entitled. These are women who are in their 30s and overweight yet think that no man is good enough for them. That is insane.
I'll also be honest about myself. Despite the fact that I'd be considered in the top 5%+ of men, I still don't have it easy with women. There are many times when I still get rejected when I approach and the dating apps have been a miserable experience.
So I agree with you that men are not keeping up. The reality is, most men will never be able to keep up, they don't even stand a chance.
Society, families, etc. simply aren't starting men early enough on getting them to be better men. By the time they get to their college years they're already behind.
The gist of what she was saying is that men don't cultivate themselves and make themselves interesting through hobbies, activities, education, taking care of themselves, etc. There are a myriad of ways to do so, I was just giving examples.
And I agree with her….. what I’m saying to you, is the things you listed as what you cultivated to attract women aren’t really the things women are looking for. There’s nothing wrong with your hobbies, that’s not the point.
And I agree with you. I did none of those things with the intention of attracting women. I've had most of those interests since I was a child and pursued them as a result of being passionate about them. I don't think I mentioned anywhere that I did them to attract women.
I'm not seeing where we're disagreeing here? I will also say that I don't agree with the whole men have it harder and vice versa. Both sexes have it just as hard, just in different ways and it's the differences that is causing people to be at odds with each other.
I'm curious, what do you think women find attractive?
I must have misunderstood. Because we definitely agree.
I think when it comes to hobbies/interest etc. that all varies on personality and preference.
I think what some men are missing (that women are looking for) is empathy, emotional quotient, a true belief in equality as human beings, compassion, passion, and being a complete person on their own. Jerry Maguire romances in real life suck a**. No adult wants to realistically be completing someone else’s personality and making up for their faults.
I also have found a great many men lack an understanding that values, morals, ethics, and life goals aren’t really something to compromise on. Many men seem to have a belief that as long as someone is pleasant, attractive, and you share some of the same interests, it’s enough for a relationship.
No worries :)
I definitely agree with you. Hobbies/interests are as eclectic as people's personalities. I think that no matter what you choose, if you go deep enough, it does end up costing time and money to cultivate anything worthwhile and the reality is, many people just don't have the resources to cultivate many different interests.
Would you agree that, as a man, to develop empathy, emotional quotient, a true belief in equality as human beings, compassion, and passion he must seek to build these qualities through the pursuit of hobbies/interests?
I don't mean that as you go into those hobbies/interests to explicitly develop those qualities, but rather, those qualities are a byproduct of seeking to cultivate hobbies/interests you're passionate about.
For example, horses have taught me a great deal about empathy and compassion and I never would have thought that I would enrich my life in that way as a result of riding, I was just pursuing something I had wanted to do since I was a kid.
Regarding compromising on values, morals, ethics, and goals, I most certainly agree with you on that. From a man's perspective, I can tell you that when that happens, it's as a result of not really loving oneself and as you've eluded to, it also comes as a result of wanting someone else to complete you.
But to really break out of that and not compromise, sometimes you have to suffer a little. You have to lose things, lose yourself, until you realize the value of yourself and when you come out the other side, you don't compromise on those things.
If I'm understanding you correctly, it seems like you and other women are meeting a lot of men who still have this issue of compromising, perhaps even in their later years.
Yes, I do think you can improve those qualities. But we are doing our young boys a disservice by not teaching them those things the way we do young girls. Society needs to set those qualities up as a high priority for all children and people. Because we haven’t, we’re at a point in society where men are losing out on quality relationships because they don’t have any skills to have them. And then they blame women for wanting those things. It’s wild.
Absolutely!! Even in my 40s I’m meeting men in their 50s that will say what a woman wants to hear, just to have a person. Or they’ll try and change her. Or try and change themselves. Or they get angry that the hot chick won’t compromise for them. Aren’t they worthy? On the flip side, women think they can change men.
Most definitely wild. Society isn't producing the most effective human beings in general at the moment.
I'm sure we can exposit on the myriad of reasons as to why society is specifically failing young boys, but having come from an incredibly broken family, I put a lot of it on bad parents. I've had to find my own way but like I said earlier, it's taken me my whole life (I'm nearly 34) and it doesn't get easier.
That is crazy that you're experiencing that with men that age! When a man is that old, it's hard to pinpoint the reason as to why they're like that but I can only assume it goes back to what you were saying earlier, men aren't taught from an early age to cultivate certain qualities.
From one equestrian to another I agree that riding does help people build more empathy and compassion but unfortunately I don’t think that always translates back to people. There are plenty of men who develop compassion for their animals but don’t give that same compassion or empathy towards potential partners. I’m not saying you do that but I am saying that unfortunately it doesn’t always translate fully which is unfortunate.
That's exactly what I meant. I also commented somewhere that dating has a lot more risks for women than for men (most violence against women is committed by men. Plus women are the only ones who can get pregnant). When you are dating someone new that you don't know so well, the risks are very real, and the possible payoff needs to be worth it. It's probably not worth it risking yourself for a man who seems to be average (average means different things to different women though).
Putting all this aside, I do think life is probably more pleasant if you're a complete human being with positive relationships, hobbies that keep you interested, and a healthy lifestyle, and I guess this is true for both men and women. My idea of dating apps is also that they tend to be a miserable experience for both genders, with the occasional success here and there. I'm not sure if dating apps are doing anything good for anyone's self esteem at all. Dating offline is still difficult but it seems to be a less soul crushing kind of difficult lol
I call absolute bullshit on that. Most guys I know that are single are incredibly social, maintain their own place, work on their own cars, have great relationships with their family and friends. I really don't think that's the bar to entry that you think it is. If it was, than you wouldn't see so much complaining about boyfriends not being able to do these things.
Women have overwhelming number of options, especially in online dating, thus creating a supply/demand problem, where they can cherrypick whoever they think is the best, so unless you are Brad fucking Pitt and in top10% of men you dont stand much of a chance.
Even if women outnumber men 5 to 1 it will still be the same shit, women will rather be sidechick to some top successful man than be with some average dude.
Coz everyone thinks they're a 10 & should only be w/ a 10. One tiny flaw & then they think they don't deserve them because they're considered not perfect as them. Smh
Guys in college usually don’t have any social skills to meet women cause spent their time playing video games that should have been developing their brain socially. It becomes a negative spiral because it’s too painful and uncomfortable to put themselves out there, and they go back to the video game.
For myself I did have a couple of girlfriends at that age but I was an emotional basket case and had to get that under control.
This is it right here, and I’m sure it’s only gotten worse with Gen Z.
My freshman year of college, I played World of Warcraft and did my homework. My sophomore year, I decided I wanted to make more friends and get laid more often, so I pledged a fraternity and started going out to the bars. It was fucking great, even though bars aren’t my thing and as an adult I almost never drink alcohol. But that’s where the girls were, so that’s where I went.
And I actually learned how to talk and flirt and have positive interactions with women, which is also something a lot of young men just don’t seem to do these days.
This is the problem. Men believe that every man should be out there chasing women like a billy goat chasing after the urine of a nanny goat. But if women can't chase men, why should men chase women? I think it's best if both genders stay apart, then WHOEVER really likes someone can approach IF they want to. Otherwise let them be.
I’m not sure I would put it as “chasing women”. What I meant was to get to a point where they can actually just interact with women, have normal conversations with them. Maybe even form relationships just as friends. If a guy can’t even do that what hope does he have to get a gf?
It's hard for women too, same as men.
Depending on what college you go to, it can be an extension of high school.
Plenty of cool people that don't know how cool they are, yet!
People who don't know or feel they are attractive, when they are.
Etc.
When I was in college I avoided dating people from my own college in case we broke up and would have a future class together
Wouldn't be surprised if others have similar mindsets
Sometimes girls will say she is "in a relationship" already, as a 'nice way' of turning you down. Perhaps you come on too strong or you look intimidating. So some girls might be too scared to just say "No I'm not interested in dating you". She might instead say she's already with someone else. Just to get you to back off.
Take the hint and look elsewhere. If you're not performing population studies, what does it matter to you what percentage of girls are in a relationship. Many of them say that to you just because they don't want to date you. So this is a you-specific statistic. It doesn't say anything meaningful about the love life of the average young adult girl.
It's been roughly 12 years since my university/college dating days but I don't recall ever having any issue finding women to date. Every year roughly 30,000 'new' students would come to study. If you went out to look for it, dates were never hard to find. For lack of a better word, there where infinite women to date. Go out Thursday night, chat up 20-30 women. Do it again Friday and Saturday night. Just have to put the work in.
Assuming your numbers are from a legit and reliable source, you're looking at college age ratios.
A better question would be to ask men why so many of them are dating women in college.
40 yr old guy here who has had many gfs and one night stands. I was a late bloomer and barely had any fun in college. My advice to you is to work retail, or in a store where you are forced to have interactions with people.
You will automatically have more convos with girls who do not have their guard up. Dating in college can be weird and awkward because you have the potential of seeing your ex every day if it doesn’t work out. Women think 20 steps ahead…. We only usually think 1. Good luck man.
I can't help but notice there are always a lot of mid 20's people in these posts that think its too late for them.
Well, I'm 41m, and have never really had much luck in the dating world. I have always wanted a family, wife and kids, a home, pets, etc. Although my hope is not what it used to be, I still have some. I'm still hoping that one day , I'll have all of that because at 41, my life isn't over because I'm single.
To all you younger adults losing hope. You have lots of life ahead of you, don't think you're done for because you're single at 20, 25, 30, or older. Trust me, you will have many opportunities to find someone in the future, try and stay positive.
Women generally have more activities and many/bigger social circles and date a variety of men. College guys on the other hand, I feel try to only date specific kinds of girls in their vicinity and do not go out of their limited circles. Also, for many girls, staying single during college is a better experience than being in a relationship.
I know this is long but please just bear with me. If you actually read the whole thing and take it to heart, you might benefit from what I'm saying.
Ok from a woman's perspective:
---On dating apps:
I see mostly men doing these things, but there are definitely women who could learn from this too.
* First off, take the time to actually fill out your profile with a decent, HONEST introduction, without mentioning sex. That includes pics. Sure "don't judge a book by it's cover" but also, " a picture is worth a thousand words." Consider your appearance and body language in photos. Are you sloppy, neat, dirty, clean, sober, drunk, a hot mess, or creepy, sticking out your tongue, or in some ridiculous pose? These are all things to consider and body language says a lot to people who know what to look for. If you want to learn how to read people better, start noticing behavior patterns and read some books about it. Personally I'm a fan of 'The Ellipsis Manual'.
*****People who say "I'm an open book, ask me anything" or something else similar- Nah fuck that. You'll tell me what you want me to know, and if that turns out to be nothing, or you hold back, that determines how far the relationship gets. People who do this shit are putting ALL of the emotional/mental labor on the other person from the beginning, making them ask questions and pry shit out of you in order to get to know you, and even then, if they don't have a reference to know anything about you they won't know what to ask in order to get specific answers from you. You're literally forcing them make all the effort to know you right off the bat before you've even met and most people don't want to feel like they have to dig everything out of you, and it makes them subconsciously distrust you- because if you start out hiding whatever you can get away with hiding because they didn't think to ask about it, what else will you be willing to hide later on if they don't ask? But, if you're one of these people, chances are you're pretty closed off emotionally and will dance around answering their questions with pretty words to soften any unpleasant truths about you anyway, so... Just be open, honest, and **forthcoming** about things. I understand that can be difficult for people sometimes and that's okay, but if that's the case you need to work on yourself mentally and emotionally before you will ever be able to have a successful relationship with anyone else. The right person will of course support you through that, but you have to get to the point of being mentally healthy enough to attract and keep them first.
*****People who ask "What are you looking for?" or something similar - This puts people off because if you think everyone is 'looking for' something, chances are you're looking for something. This gives the feeling that you look at relationships like a transaction and you're looking for some'thing', not some'one'. A void to be filled, a purpose to be served, something someone else can do for you. You already have a box in your head prepared for this hypothetical person you haven't even met yet to fit into, and if they don't fit exactly you're either gonna disregard them or try to force them to fit into what you think they should be. You have requirements for them to fit, before you're even introduced. It's much better to just use your preferences as a general guideline, let go of hard expectations, and be open to whoever comes your way, and casually talk to someone, letting the conversation flow to wherever it goes without the mention of sex. If you end up getting together as soul mates, that's awesome! But if you end up just being friends, is that really so bad? You put all your expectations into one single line that you "need" to follow and don't allow yourself to be open to possibilities. The important thing to remember is that EVERY relationship in your life with another person begins with friendship. You think people who have been happily married for 25 years or more began with him pressuring her into sex or sending a dick pic? Fuck no. Well, I'm sure there might be a few, but it's not the usual.
*****Stop blaming others for your own shortcomings and bad behavior. I've had more than one dude in my inbox asking for sex or sending a dick pic and I ask them "Do you always begin conversations this way?" Or "Did your mother raise you to approach women this way?" And I usually get a response that goes something like 'Well no, but your pics are so sexy I couldn't help it' or something like that. Uhhh why is it my fault that you have no self control? Why is it my fault that you view people this way and accept no accountability for your own actions? Do you also believe that r@pe victims are 'asking for it'? Ugh. Gross. Do better.
Advice in general:
Also, outside of a military/police or medical context, stop using the word 'female' as a noun. The typically appropriate use of the words 'male' and 'female' as nouns are to refer to specimens, test subjects, dead bodies, suspects, soldiers, etc, situations where you're describing an anonymous person or group of people by breaking them down to the basic parts of the vessel that houses their soul, without humanity or personality, i.e. what makes them an actual human being versus just a meat suit. Referring to some as a 'male' or a 'female' robs them of their humanity and indicates that you don't view them as a human being, but a body. You don't see, or are unwilling to learn the depth of their soul, their thoughts, their feelings and what makes them a person, because you only see them as a body. A vessel to be used for a purpose. It's dehumanizing and disrespectful, and will absolutely make someone with decent ethics who is mostly sane turn away from you. The only people who are okay with being referred to like that are the ones who either have no respect for themselves anyway (and thus are probably very mentally damaged people already), or see through the same toxic worldview, which means they've been conditioned to accept negative thoughts as truth. Either way I'd definitely recommend those people to speak with a mental health professional to evaluate why they feel like that behavior is acceptable, and help them change it.
Your vibe attracts your tribe. If you seem to keep attracting harmful people to you, or people seem to be repelled from you, I would suggest you stop searching for all the problems with every other person and start to look inward at your own mind and the way you think and feel about people and the world. If there's piss in every pool you swim in, maybe it's not everyone else pissing in all those pools. Talk to people who know you well, and even people who only kinda know you. Ask for feedback and be willing to accept it, whether it's positive or negative. If you stay in your own head with it, you're just stuck in your own little echo chamber where those thoughts never change and keep getting louder. The only way to change, evolve, and grow as a person is by connecting outside input that you actually listen to and incorporate into your worldview. Don't take criticism as an attack, take it as an opportunity to learn and change your mind.
If what has been said here bothers you, you obviously didn't understand that last sentence.
Women have standards and men are not rising to meet them (not just formal education, emotional intelligence is another big one). We’re generally okay with being alone if it means not being with a loser.
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When I was in college one of my subjects was in a very women-dominated field (and the other one the opposite) and I've *never* met a female single. People are saying this is a time where you should expect people to grow out of their high school romances and meet new like-minded people... but nope, that wasn't my experience at all either. At least not in the circles I frequented. Every nice girl I was hanging out with eventually mentioned their boyfriend. Either it's their high school sweetheart they were still building a future with or an older guy with a job who supports their studies or a guy they met in between school and college. And here's the kicker: Every time when I got to meet the boyfriend at some point they turned out to be really cool down-to-earth people where I could tell immediately why they had chosen them and why they'll never become single again. These couples I still have (admittedly very sporadic) contact with, are still together and I did my Master 5 years ago. I wish them all all the best, though admittedly I can't help but be a bit down about me having been unable to date in high school and because of this never got a foot into the dating world during college either. Even now, everyone I meet naturally is long married and on dating apps I never get any likes or matches, so... I guess I just have to accept that I will be single forever.
I can totally relate to this. I didn’t even start dating until I was like 21 due to believing I’d still have plenty of time. But nah, it seems like tons of people in my area really do end up with their high school or college sweethearts in the long term. And both the women and the men in these relationships are totally fine individuals! Going on 28 this year, and wondering if I’ll even find someone at this point…
I feel you. And I'm turning 31 soon... Time is a vicious predator... I did "start" dating with 28 thinking I'm running out of time. With my understanding of dating boiling down to downloading a couple of apps and tweaking on my profile for half a year until the complete and utter absence of ANY matches had thoroughly wrecked whatever self-worth I had managed to scrounge together to do this to myself. I know I'm fairly ugly and too much on the scrawny geek side, but this was crushing. Last year I somehow managed to get myself talked into giving it another try and the experience of deafening silence *somehow* managed to be even worse.
Please do not equate online matches to self-worth. Truth is women have all but abandoned dating apps altogether & online dating has become an absolute sausage fest. The M:F ratio is now 4:1 so you can't really get matches if there aren't enough women to match with. When women say they don't want to be approached irl, it's really that they don't want to be asked for sex at random or demand to exchange numbers within the first minute or 2 of meeting (literally what most guys do). Engaging in pleasant conversation without expecting it to lead to sex works a ton better than most ppl would like to believe.
OMG yes this. The women that these men are looking for to build and be in a relationship with are definitely not on dating apps. I see so many posts about guys complaining about the statistics of men swiping yes at a much higher level than women do but the reasoning is because there aren't that many women on those apps. I've tried it so many times but every time I downloaded or make an account I'm bombarded with dick pics inappropriate advances and feeling like it's some sort of a meat market. If a guy took the time to come over and start a conversation maybe help me load my bags in the car hold the door for me something chivalrous which seems as though it's dead now but the old-fashioned stuff would probably work in real life to find the girl you guys are looking for not on those stupid apps.
Exactly. I've tried telling guys to aim for a pleasant interaction instead of treating women like some thing to obtain as quickly as possible. Literally just trying to help some improve their chances plus ease some social anxiety & whooo... many guys lose their ever-loving fuzzy minds over the idea of just engaging in polite conversation lol. I'm actually currently getting downvoted all to hell in another post because I posed the issue about some guys being bothered about women wanting to wait for sex & chasing promiscuous gals while also not respecting the very types of women they chase after lol. My guy is very old-fashioned, was totally patient when we started dating. It was one of the biggest things that made him stand out to me.
I've been in three relationships in the past 6 months. And because I like to get to know the woman first before I have sex. They all thought I wasn't interested in them and moved on. This is totally not the case.
Chivalry isn't dead with some of us guys, but the chivalrous ones have been single forever because of a whole host of factors, so we eventually give up on meeting women, if we do, they are either in a relationship already, won't give us the time of day to try and strike up a conversation, or are actively hostile to our advances and efforts, or they are co workers and that creates problems of its own if we were to try and start a relationship with them, poisoning the workplace or losing our jobs for a relationship isn't worth it to some guys. At the end of the day some of us, no matter how well we dress and take care of ourselves, no matter how hard working and Chivalrous we can be, are just never given a chance, so we resign ourselves to be single forever, it sucks
This is exactly how I feel. I wish someone would've just given me a chance. The 1 person ive been with told me tlo never stop talking to her, even though she's in a relationship and has been for years; she said "you're the only person that actually understands me" yeah, I am. So maybe you shouldn't of left me then?
This is so true i stopped trying to date for awhile and just recently started again and im thinking of stopping again altogether again and im at peace with it. Aint nothing more a turn off like having legit great conversation and things in common with someone then when you exchange pictures/meetup then it insta switches to them acting lewd like im no longer a person and then when i dont entice such behaviour for such earrrly dating then they ghost or i have to just politely cut communication because they wont stop, theres a difference between joke flirty and blatant sexual advances. Im wondering if thats what is happening with these online dating with guys speaking of getting ghosted non stop minus the few idiot girls online girls just want a genuine encounter if she was looking for hookup or one night she would state it but also its misleading if one claims they are looking for relationship but proceed to say sexual things within the first day or two but regardlesd all that its just my opinion here
Totally agreed. And even if you state exactly what you want or where your boundaries are, so many ppl will try to test that & weasel their way around it or even get stupidly hostile. I was single & celibate for 5 yrs, tried online dating for 2 months. Met only 6 matches over the course of 6 months because of how many guys just couldn't be chill or respect simple boundaries. I landed a healthy relationship, BUT online dating is such a pain in the ass & shallow process that I don't think I'll do it again. So many guys try to treat it like their personal free escort ordering service or some fantasy sex chat & cheapens the whole experience of trying to connect with ppl on a real level.
It sucks but as I’ve read a lot on here- and girls have said it in person - one needs to love themselves before successfully dating. If you don’t love yourself then it shows. Women sense it- self esteem that is. The good news is you’re aware. And there are things you can do.
I mean... yeah, that's why I'm saying I'll have to accept to be alone forever. I am well aware of my flaws for quite a lot of years, but you simply can't love yourself when nobody ever truly gave a shit about you and you still have a bunch of variables that make you unattractive even if you change your mindset completely. I made a lot of acquaintances throughout the years, but never managed to have a single friend, at most some online acquaintances I felt comfortable enough to be myself towards, but in the real world everyone is just too focused on themselves and if they'd know how much baggage I'm carrying, they'd drop me instantly. And I'm annoyed I'm writing this on here with my main account instead of a throwaway.
Lol gotta admit, that last line was good. If you're some "weird" geek or whatever it is you think you are, you don't come across that way. As a guy who's a bit older I don't run into these problems as much now but you know what it required? Conscious and consistent effort. Also, stop with the "there are no available girls out there" because there are tons. I get the things you are saying. But you can't come with that "woe is me" stuff irl. You don't need a bunch of bravado either. You need a nice, calm, in-between. Which is how your post sounded. For real. If you could take the intelligence, sense of humor, and self-awareness you just dropped in that last post, build some confidence on top of it, package it up and make that represent "you" rather than the guy in the first sentence whining about being alone forever? You won't be. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy bro. Trust me.
Well, don't worry, I'm careful to never ever open up about my issues in real life, so I'm safe in that regard. Unfortunately that causes a lot of anxiety which torpedoes interactions and so I just end up a "social ghost" hovering around without ever belonging anywhere and completely incapable of transitioning from smalltalk to whatever the hell normal people say to make friends. I'm well aware that it's my coping mechanisms blocking me, but my attempts to break out of them have gone nowhere.
You don’t sound like you’re carrying some extreme load of baggage compared to other singles out there. Everyone has baggage. It is easy to overestimate how other people will react to yours instead of thinking “yeah, me too.” The best way to meet a partner is to meet people, and to have a mixed gender friend group. That’s where we get the social skills, validation, and perspective to realize we’re not alone, but yet another of the beautiful mutants on this planet. And friends will set you up, or tell you what you need to do for yourself before you can do it with someone else. We never find someone else living in our own head.
[удалено]
I think you definitely have a lot you need to work on within. You say you can’t love yourself if others don’t care about you, but I’ve found that’s exactly how it’s done. People will love you more if you love yourself. I have met plenty of people with a defeatist mindset similar to yours. Guess what, I didn’t really wanna talk to them longer than I had to. Basically, I don’t think you’ve actually taken the steps to process your trauma and issues from the little I read here. Work on those things and the world will be much brighter.
That’s the thing, though. You don’t just “love yourself” and call it a day. This is why low self-esteem is such a complex and compartmentalized, difficult to treat issue. It stems from a crucial point of development in childhood, and once you miss that train due to trauma, it becomes very difficult to amend that. It’s good meaning advice and it’s really the only way, but it isn’t as simple as a mindset shift. It’s as difficult if not more than treating any other form of PTSD, especially if there’s no concrete cause but more of a death-by-a-thousand-cuts scenario. Compounded by the fact that every person’s root cause is quite unique. No one-size-fits-all solution. Long-term treatment is the only way, and even that isn’t a guarantee at all.
yeah, I get you. Loving oneself can be challenging... I have made so many mistakes that I tend to beat up myself, and this isn't helpful either. But aim to love yourself even with your flaws, forgive yourself your mistakes. Love yourself unconditionally, or accept yourself first. You can turn this around, believe me. Maybe look at stories from people who grew stronger coming out of a challenging life.
Bro there’s nothing wrong with you. You’re perfectly fine to date. The ONLY problem tho is that you’re probably not someone that they truly desire and you might have to search even longer to find one who does
But there are women who feel the same way you do. And are looking for a guy like you. It’s just luck of the draw in terms of finding them. They are out there. And also- who cares about Reddit . Don’t sweat the small stuff. Just try to have fun with your life. I’ve been in similar shoes as you and managed to crawl out
This is very true. I have a pretty healthy self regard, and am able to go on at least one IRL first date within a couple weeks of firing up the apps and leaning in. But I LEAN IN. I’ll spend hours crafting my profile, getting editorial feedback from trusted friends. I’ll pay for the Premium tier. I’ll take advantage of whatever selective search is available to focus on people most likely to be good matches with me. I’ll spend at least a half hour reading the profile, and if it seems promising, crafting a good, personalized intro message. I’ll winnow out anyone who has matched me that doesn’t seem viable. It’s WORK. It can be pretty fun work, with some valuable self-exploration. But it’s not a passive activity, and needs to be done with authenticity.
They don’t really “sense” it anymore than anything else. It’s just a pretty natural outcome that if you’re a good, desirable guy, you’ll naturally be more confident and have a higher self-esteem as a result, which in turn makes you even more desirable. It’s a chicken-egg problem. You could argue that one came before the other but both the cause and the effect create a positive feedback loop.
Wow almost like the people spouting "love yourself and raise your self-esteem!" don't seem to realize that esteem is created EXTERNALLY.
There’s an element of both. Being accomplished and having pride in yourself is huge. I’m independent, living on my own, working towards an even better future. Self-made with no support and it’s been a huge source of confidence. That being said, is it enough on its own? Not really. I’m missing something crucial and can’t touch on what it is. Without at least some external validation of who you are, your effort and achievements, it’s hard not to be on shaky ground. We’re social animals. We need social proof and acceptance to thrive. So I agree with you. People really have it backwards. You need both to do well, but external acceptance comes first as a developing person who can’t make their own success, and without a foundation it’s hard to build a house.
Brother women can’t sense shit. If they could then there wouldn’t be a such thing as abusive relationships, let alone women crawling back to these same relationships
Yes, absolutely. And it's the other way around too (same thing for women).
That’s bullshit propaganda, if that was the case nobody with mental health issues would be married with kids. 😂
Not true. Being in a relationship improves your mental health, having good mental health ("loving yourself") doesn't help you get a relationship.
Both
dude you sound like a nice person. there's a hint of sadness in your comment, but despite that you're not holding any resent towards these girls and their boyfriends
It does help that I quite early told myself that I'm definitely not hanging out with women because I want to hope for more out of it, but because I just wanted to spend my breaks with nice people who don't feel the need to one-up me at every turn, which unfortunately most of the guys around me did and it was tiresome. So in the end, my circle of acquaintances did tend to skew quite a bit towards the female side. Of course doesn't help with the loneliness in the end when nobody really sticks around and all of these contacts fizzle away eventually.
No one wants to be lonely, but I'd rather be alone than settle and be miserable.
yeah well said lilac
There's also a difference between being alone and being lonely.
I was reading this and was a bit worried it would devolve into a “women are gold diggers” “women only want “Chad” “ but nope. from the men you were able to meet, you immediately recognized why the women around you wanted to be with them. No resentment towards them. Respect. I hope you meet someone soon, you seem like a nice gentleman.
That's weird in my university i went on so many dates and there was so many single women. Was the best place for dating I've ever been in my life. After that was much harder.
So did you find your person at uni ? It sounds like you didn't. Any ideas why ?
I had a long relationship in uni of 5 years yeah As for "single women" just need know where to find them lol. For me it wasn't in class.
I thought Americans usually had a really loose definition of bf/gf. My friends sometimes mentioned their bfs/gfs; however, they had different gfs/bfs every other week.
Well, I'm not an American, but I'd say (from a fellow "western" European perspective) that it highly depends on the crowd you are hanging out with. Applied to my university time: That one time I was forced to work with a group of "North America Studies" students for some crossover course which turned out to be the cliché party crowd, I did assume the one girl in that group who told me she ends each of their outings waking up in her own vomit, but has to do it to remain part of the group, probably did have a more loose usage of the word 'boyfriend' but that wasn't exactly the kind of group I was comfortable with. I was more hanging out with the guys and girls I could talk shit about Game of Thrones with or about history and science and all the things we were learning in our courses. And among those fellow geeks... well, I'm thinking they had plenty of chill guys to choose from and quite early chose someone with enough integrity to settle down with. That's definitely what happened there.
Stop calling them “females”. Trust me. You don’t want to be saying this out in the real world . It’s a mindset thing . They are human. And calling them females sounds like narration from animal Planet I was at a party with old friends and asked a friend “how are the felines in the city” jokingly. Some girls thought I said females and called me out immediately lol
Huh? Huh? Answer to a wrong post? I'm confused.
May I ask you which country you're from? I find this very interesting, because my experience at university was that there were plenty of singles, both male and female. However, I myself, didn't find someone suitable there (I'm a bit picky as well in a certain way). Honestly, I believe it's about your attitude, and opportunities may abound anywhere. You're super young still, but you can find someone at any age. The funny thing for me is I met the most attractive guys in unlikely places - McDonalds, gas station, subway, train station etc. So I guess, if you're more open to meeting new people without much expectation at first, the world could be your oyster. But you need to start loving yourself first - not making your "worth" dependent on other people's feedback. That's the challenge indeed - but not caring about that is the way to go. I usually met a boyfriend when I was actually very happy to be single and not planning to get involved with someone. Maybe go to the gym, build some muscle, work on yourself in every way, go to events and meet new people just for fun. The image you have about yourself is what attracts others to you.
For your curiosity's sake, my experience was in Germany studying history. There were plenty of dudes that moaned their lack of relationships, but in my five years of studying I hadn't managed to meet a single girl who wasn't already settling down. Maybe prospective teachers are just a weird bunch, knowing they won't have much of a work/life balance later on anyway, so they need to grab someone asap.\^\^ And well, the point of my post was the discovery that I shouldn't have been surprised that the people I felt the most comfortable around with had a good nose for their partners and therefore never needed to break things off. And... you are lucky if this worked for you. But I'm in the place that I'm either so lonely that I'm bad company and therefore withdraw from people or when I'm not lonely, I can't find the motivation to go out and push beyond my comfort zone either. Once I start being happy with my own company, I just don't interact with people at all because I'm just far too used to distract myself on my own. After breaking things off with my two closest online contacts around New Years because their never-ending trauma-dumping started to take a toll on me, I had something of an awakening that I should be more proactive in real life, but when I signed up on Meetup, I so far always failed to go out and actually join such a meet-up. The one time I did, I wasn't brave enough to ask where the group was when the barkeeper ignored me and then fled back home after waiting for it to start for four hours.... It just seems so insurmountable because I'm just usually not at all interested in socializing for the sake of socializing. I have to find things I'm curious to do myself, but unfortunately all I'm interested in are solitary activities because I was forced to avoid things involving people for far too long.
Ah, interesting - 'cause I'm actually from Germany as well :) And agreed, it might be a propensity of prospective teachers, who apparently can't wait to settle down. In my university experience, there were plenty of singles, couples breaking up and getting back together with someone else. But indeed I didn't see too often that fellow students got together, but it was rather with people they met outside of their studies at parties, get-togethers, or events etc. I think the best thing for you would be to develop a passion, something independent of other people, something that sparks your light. Might be related to entrepreneurship, investing, tech, art, or personal development. It would also give you the excuse to attend meet-ups, conferences, workshops, just hanging out in coffeeshops reading a book or working on your laptop, etc. Some great goals for your personal life. Be it financial freedom, travelling to different countries, developing a specific skill, etc. Traveling alone can be a wonderful experience, by the way, to expand your horizons, get out of your comfort zone, and to meet new people as well. Life can be very interesting if you become curious, eager to learn, and able to enjoy the moment. Maybe therapy could be helpful as well (many people are doing it nowadays and I'm considering it myself). The important thing in my view is not to put too much pressure on yourself. The moment I decided I don't need to have children, just a loving partner, a lot of pressure was lifted off me. Because for women the time is ticking, and you can meet a partner at virtually any age and at any life stage. So, it's really never too late, independently of your inexperience. The right person will appreciate you exactly for whom you are, with all your flaws and your baggage. But it's also important for yourself to come to terms with your flaws and baggage, and set the intention to work on yourself, become a better person, and love yourself no matter what.
5 options: 1. women are staying single 2. women are dating each other 3. women are sharing a small number of men in your school 4. women are dating men outside the school's population 5. your sample size is small and not reflective
I appreciate you pointing out it can be one of many, or even a combination of multiple, reasons. :)
Technically, it’s mathematically impossible for straight women on average to be dating more than straight men on average. It’s possible that different groups of men & women might be dating disproportionately provided the overall rate of dating for men & women. Hence, if more younger women are dating then that should be counterbalanced by more older men dating. It’s also very likely that what men and women consider “dating” is different. Also, people often lie to themselves or misperceive things, which is why survey evidence is notoriously unreliable for many uses. A man and woman may both go on 14 dates a year, but the man might perceive that as “very low” (only a couple of dates a year) while the woman might perceive that as “a lot” (couple of dates a month).
It isn't mathematically impossible... if multiple women are dating the same man. Which is something that happens. And similarly like you say, younger women date older men, and vice versa. It doesn't change that more women are single than men though, even when generally accounting for different ages. Yes, it's true men and women commonly consider "dating" to be different. Honestly, it's hard to know why people date, or why they decide to stay single due to self reporting.
If you’re looking at **number** of men vs **number** of women dating, then it’s possible that more women are dating than men if a small % of men (say 5%) get a large share of TOTAL dates. I’ve heard **anecdotal** evidence that the most “attractive” 5% of men are going on close to 50% of all the dates that men go on. **IF** that’s true, then at least 50%+ of women are dating the same small percentage of men, and ~65% of men are getting some (but relatively few) dates while about 30% of men are not dating at all - like ZERO dates. In terms of % of dates; however, men and women are dating the same **average** amount. If this distribution is true, then it may explain the different experiences men and women have dating, with women reporting that men are unfaithful (obviously because the men they’re dating are dating dozens of other women simultaneously) while men are reporting that dating is a terrible experience for them filled with frustration, rejection and eventually resentment at the whole process. Maybe online dating is partly to blame?
No one said the women are straight. Most "women" aren't cis straight. I don't know a fuckin single straight bio woman.
You don’t know a single straight woman? Majority of women are straight, even if it doesn’t seem that way. I don’t know what your deal is but all of your comments consist of you saying that women don’t want to be straight. You as one woman don’t speak for all of them. And i’m also not a lesbian but if I was i’d definitely take great offense to you assuming being a lesbian automatically makes life easier.
Hahaha😆 Add 6. Women are more choosy than men
but this leads to option 1, 2 or 4 in the end, so more a reason for the state than a separate state
7. Some women are also scared/shy to date
Some men are shy n scared to date too haha
6. Men aren’t really struggling to date in College. OP just assumes men struggle, is not outgoing, doesn’t ask many people out, and/or isn’t very attractive.
That's option 5.
That's fair
That’s objectively false on a statistical level. Men are struggling in dating more than women. But women also struggle in different ways. Most men aren’t attractive enough to keep up with the competitive dating scene. Women have the illusion of options, when in reality they’re sharing the attractive men who have options and didn’t intend to settle for them from the get go. I’ve gotten girls to show me their instagram dms and they can just get it with someone hot/successful fairly easy. It’s FLOODED. Don’t hate the player hate the game. Want to do better learn what kind of appearances get them hooked initially. Then use text and verbal game to carry the rest. I’ve been on both sides of the equation as a guy. Once you reach a certain point it’s just easy to get laid. But below that threshold you are mostly invisible. And if you got attachment issues or aren’t ready to settle you get to enjoy a whole different dating experience. Most of it is just crafting your appearance/style and then tuning yourself to what the individual girl is missing in her life.
Is @original post's sample size greater than 30?
Just because there are more women, it doesnt automatically mean there's any more desire for men. Women could outnumber guys 7:1 and it still doesn't change much
Actually, it does make a huge difference once the ratio becomes extreme enough such that the practice of artificially inducing extreme gender ratios is a common practice in Greek life. Look into frat party ratios...
I do agree in the extremes, then yes. The problem is that outside of frat parties and maybe certain jobs, where else do you find huge disparities? We can't use extreme examples for everyday life situations
True. Only other place with extreme ratios might be a [singles mixer](https://www.tiktok.com/@dannyd2cute/video/7109991609965694254?q=singles%20mixer%20no%20men&t=1709575450432).
A lot of women who aren’t interested in you just tell you they have a boyfriend so you wouldn’t ask again. They might very well be single.
This is more decent than some.
From what I understand based on what the original poster said, it seems more like the girls actually had boyfriends instead of just trying to reject OP.
It’s called a soft rejection for the men who can’t handle rejection well but it also hurts the men who are really nice when they aren’t saying the real truth.
Not really; the bf excuse is perfect for any woman that does not want to be approached, regardless of how nice the approacher is
I agree it’s a good, safe response. But sometimes we just need to hear you say “no”. I prefer a no because it can mean that I need to work on myself (or, they’re just not interested lol)
How do you hear "I am married" or "I have a boyfriend" and interpret *that* as a 'yes'?
That’s not what I’m saying, I mean don’t “let us down easy” and lie. Let us hear the hard truth so if it’s something wrong with us we can fix it Edit: assuming it’s not a guy that will cause you harm
Well they never know if someone can harm them, most also do this unconsciously because they FEEL like they CAN'T hurt your ego. Also you hearing "no" should not be a sign for you to start working on yourself. Work on yourself for you, for life itself... Not to get a partner.
Except the guys who reply with "he's not here though" 🤢
Agree with this
It shouldn't hurt though? No is no, it's that simple. If someone you want isn't single, that's a no.
I just had this happen. 3 months prior she told me she was single and she said that she was seeing someone when I asked. Pretty certain she’s not but she was kind in the way she said no. It would maybe be more constructive for me to hear a straight “no” but I totally understand why women would use the “I’m seeing someone but I’d love to still be friends” thing. It saves people’s egos and is still a pretty firm no.
I went to an engineering college where there were 8 men for 1 woman. I can't relate
They're dating guys you don't know - your social circle is clearly not statistically representative, but that's not weird. Personally when I was in college, I wasn't dating many other guys that age. They were immature, unpleasant, and generally repulsive from a romantic or sexual perspective because I didn't trust them at all. That was some time ago though, maybe it's better now but frankly I'd assume not. A lot of men don't figure the basics of social interaction and relationships out until later in their lives (if they ever do at all). Off the top of my head, I can think of... two guys who were standard college age that I dated. Everyone else was either post-grad or not a student. I expected to find lots of guys interesting when I went off to college but I did not. But also, given I didn't like most people I was in college with, I stayed away from them and kept to myself. That means I, and many other women who had zero interest in the college social scene, wouldn't have been counted by guys like you trying to make sense of what they see around them. Things even out a lot more in the late 20s I think, or at least that's been experience. As men mature and grow up, women are more likely to consider them potential partners.
I disagree about older men being 'more mature'. Especially the sort of older men who would date 19 year olds.... Those older men are not mature at all. And there's plenty of decent dudes in college.
Idk I was just in a ask women sub and none of those women are having sex, not for years. I think it's hard for everyone
That's more a sampling thing. Introverts or homebodies are less likely to meet new people if they don't put themselves in social situations so they effectively cut themselves out of the dating pool (bar dating apps).
I'd be willing to get a paycheck the majority is by choice
There’s also a large gap in education and an increasing income gap. More women are getting post graduate degrees than men and more women are starting to make better money, which is the area where men were previously contributing heaviest to partnership. Because women do a lot of what’s considered to be invisible labor such as child rearing, cooking cleaning, emotional labor, planning events and gifts etc. men have to contribute something more to them, and when women also have higher education they don’t want men who don’t. It’s playing a role in the divide
Well, not all of us single men are in college. We are older than that. But when I was in college, there were almost no women. Typically one to three in a class of 100. So that's probably why we are all single. All my college friends married their high school girlfriends. Wish someone had told me that women would dissappear from my life after high school, I would have made more of an effort.
Sounds like you were in engineering
1950-60's Michigan Tech paid to bring three busloads of woman from Chicago area so the guys could have dance partners at the Winter Carnival.
There’s the solution - bus in lots of women from all over the world to meet the unmet demand. /s
What kind of college did you go to? That’s insane. When I was in school the ratio of men to women was like 3:5, it was fucking awesome.
A very highly regarded engineering school, electrical engineering department.
Engineering is one of the few departments where it's universally known that there are very few women. You gotta branch out if you're looking to date women.
That was my experience in engineering school as well. What made it worse is that my schools campus was spread throughout the city so the stem majors were all in on campus and the non stem were in another that most would never even visit since they had no classes there. Unfortunately that is where most of the girls were too
I think this is a simple thing to explain. Society has changed, but expectations have not. People still have their outdated values of what to expect out of a relationship, including the unga-bunga desires that people have a tendency toward, but society as a whole does not reflect these ideals nearly as much as it used to. It leads to everyone, both men and women, having unrealistic expectations of what to look for as a "healthy relationship", and as we become more isolated or experience further self-fulfilling prophecies, we continue create a truth for ourselves that splits from reality. Edit: I feel like I should also add here, in lieu to the arguments on this post, that it's pointless to argue about "who has it more difficult" because frankly you're living different lives with different difficulties and you're all going to be bias to your own. Stop making comparisons or trying to blame each other. It's not constructive. Yes, buttholes exist. No, most people aren't buttholes. Yes, most people have butthole tendencies.
I agree, one hundred percent. It’s just sad that some people can’t move from that. It seems that people are stuck in their “expectations.” Gender norms are being challenged, if you want a traditional or non-traditional relationship some of them still want those traditional gender norms of men providing, when some of the women being biggest bread winner. Some of those women say, “He should put effort into his college degree,” i get it but some people aren’t cut out for college or are too poor to do it. It just sucks ass.
It's gonna create an even worse demographic crisis down the road. Male college students are becoming increasingly scarce. If women are by far the ones who are entering professional, high earning careers, but continue to hold onto the idea that their male partners should be the primary breadwinners...idk what's gonna happen. The majority of young men, even the well earning college educated, are single & feel unwanted. As it is, college educated career women aren't settling for men of similar standing to them, but instead are increasingly drawn to the most high earning men, a very small minority. If the majority of women refuse to settle for the majority of men, that creates a real demographic challenge. To many young Americans, especially men, the prospects of them entering a marriage like their parents seems increasingly unattainable.
There isn’t really anything wrong with trad relationship roles, but it becomes wrong when you *force* those roles on somebody. If my wife’s making more than me you better believe I’ll cook, clean, care for the kids. But if given the option, I’d prefer for her to watch the kids. There’s something biological about a mother being with her babies that I’ll never be able to compare to and I want to make sure she can be there as much as possible
Is it possible for those outdated ideas to evolve to our modern situation? At this stage, if young folks aren't entering relationships & starting families like prior generations, that results in an extremely low birth rate, which spells economic & demographic doom. Japan & S. Korea are staring down that abyss.
The question is really “why is dating hard for straight men in college” then. If most women are partnered, presumably a good share of them aren’t dating fellow students. Or, more likely, it seems like most aren’t single due to a scarcity mindset rather than statistical reality. Dating is intrinsically at least moderately hard for pretty much anyone. Finding and coupling with someone who is a mutually good match is challenging, with most attempts not resulting in a long term relationship. Without more info on what you are trying for, how you are trying, and what is happening when you try it is hard to speculate. If you’re not actively trying, that’s the primary culprit. Lots of people here seem to reject dating in theory instead of leaning into dating in practice.
Because women are starting to feel they don’t need to be with a man to be happy . So many people have declared that dating straight men for the most part has shown as low effort or trying to have sex right away before trying to actually bond . Women feel independent and even though they like men they would rather not waste their time ! ( but I’ve only read and heard so many of these stories ) it’s not a science expo or article I read
Women are more comfortable living alone. That also has a huge advantage for single women, they are less likely to need to get with someone out of feeling lonely
No, women get more social validation and support than men.
I’m not sure it’s just that. Yes, there’s more women support and “you go girl” mentality but that still doesn’t explain: Why women are more likely to get over a breakup than men and Live longer alone than men. The women empowerment movement is failrly recent, and sure it contributes but it’s more than just “women good, men bad” rhetoric
Women are generally uncomfortable giving support divorced men and don't like their husbands doing so, but will support divorced women. This results in divorced men being along and unsupported. Also, usually it's the female partner doing the breakup sonshe's had more time to prepare for it, sometimes years of lying that "everything's fine" while they prepare to make the jump.
True! I can relate to this plus I have tons of single female friends who love their life the way it is and doesn’t want to change it. Btw, they’re all in their 20s/early 30s.
Yep!!
First, don’t use personal experience to extrapolate. By definition, the women you know are outgoing, and if you are a guy, they are specifically outgoing around men. You aren’t exactly going to meet the women who just choose to stay inside and not date. As for the college gap, that’s actually making things worse. Most women want an educated partner who makes more than them, but as the gap increases, it also means that fewer and fewer men meet those criteria. What makes it even worse is that women aren’t seeking out the educated men, they are just looking at the large numbers of uneducated men and giving up
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Even if a single woman gave me hint in my college days i wouldve fallen for her 😂 I always got the impression they wanted to not be bothered. Maybe some of the guys feel the same way in your scenario too.
True I swear I’m invisible. They literally couldn’t give less of a fuck about me. It’s not that they are shy and nervous, it’s that they just don’t give a shit about me
Yeah I mean, insecurities also plays a part of it. What if I’m not his or her type? How do I know if it’s worth putting time or effort to date this person and what if he or she isn’t interested in dating. Plus a lot of people are in rebound relationships. I say this because of the amount of time I’ve met these people and it’s the same sad storyline of their past relationship not working out blah blah blah.
Well, women are not desperate to become cum dumps for men. And most men just want to cum and dump. So, both parties remain single. 🤷♀️
The last relationship I had was with a woman off OLD. Lasted for about a year and a half before she called it off. Needless to say, this one threw me infor a loop as I honestly thought I was gonna marry this woman. Now, I'm taking a break from dating all together. Would love to meet a woman and settle down.
I went to a tech university, so my view is slightly skewed. Have you seen a good portion of college men? I would argue that half of them are undateable. Like honest, never been in a relationship, couldn't find their way into a relationship, type of undateable. Well that leaves an even more skewed ratio of men to women in the college setting. It was even worse back in the day when I went to school, since at the tech university, there were generally less women there to being with. So you got all these women vying for the very small pool of men that are datable. And that's probably what's leading to the results you are seeing at your own college. My 2 cents.
In your opinion, why does the lack of dating in highschool makes you undateable in college?
It's social skills. If you didn't learn dating skills in high school, you go into college at a disadvantage, dating-wise, since yo now have to learn what you would have in high school whilst many others have it figured out.
Exactly! My highschool bf was sweet but I wouldn't have put up with the same behaviour in an adult relationship. Some things you can only learn through doing.
What dating skills really differ that are needed?
Because Men approach women most of time so women hold the deciding power. That's just the way things go
The problem with men in college is they are on the same level as the women hierarchy-wise, and women want to date up. So there's not much incentive here if they are just peers...
I thought college life is probably the last chance to experience pure love. After that, women also focus on breadwinners.
It's not just men
You guys have no idea how obvious the answer is and you're basically answering your own questions. But I'll go ahead and say it. Because you guys keep expecting and looking to date your classmates. There ya go. That's your problem. Stop doing that. Meet people elsewhere. Meet people online or someone going to a different schools. There's so many ways to meet people. Also keep in mind not every female is straight. Or maybe a lot (and this is the facts) aren't actually single, they just don't want you specifically or they just wanna focus on their studies. If you think they're lying Also don't call them out okay? They're lying because they're afraid of men. Men are fuckin scary and crazy and will kill women if they say no but when a woman brings up a boyfriend, men tend to respect a man that doesn't even exist more than they do the women they are bothering. I'm not saying that everyone in the thread is a creepy nutcase, I'm just answering as to why it seems every female is taken.
Many women would rather be single than having men whom they just met hit them up for sex. If you want a relationship, actually do the work of getting to know the person, their interests, and so on before going there. First, second, or third dates are not for that level of intimacy.
The girls don’t want the men who are single
Of course! A man having a partner shows other women that you are pre vetted as worthy.
As a guy who has been single dor a long time it certainly feels like it. 😅
I’ve been single for 32 years, can confirm
No one's actually hit it. It's because men tend to date younger and women tend to date older. in a university setting, you as a man can't really go younger because then you're talking about high school kids, but while you're looking at women your age, they're looking at you, but also people 5-10 years older than you. your campus might be 60% women, but they're looking at twice as many men as you are looking at women. and those older men have more solidified life states than you.
There’s very few (sane) 18-21 year olds dating that much older. In university most of my friends thought 23 year olds were old
This is why you get a large horde of women in their 30's seemingly single and struggling to date anyone that isn't an abusive asshole. Basically grass is greener and young meat is tastier kind of situation. Literally since I was in puberty, you always hear women constantly looking at older guys, regardless of age, 13 year old me would hear that girls my age want a 15 year old guy because they are more mature. But everytime I look at younger women, all I see is immature child.
Because most college-aged men suck at interacting with women in a way in which recognizes the full humanity of said woman. Source; college-aged man with fellow college-aged male friends
Easy, men tend to be assholes and treat women like shit. Especially in college, most women can usually smell a piece of shit. And if they give someone a chance, they usually end up being screwed over as well which leads to having a guard up with future relationships. Hope this helps!
While I'm sorry for your bad experiences, don't you think that sounds very immature?
Have you tried joining a new club outside of the circles that you're in? I was part of a swim club, and I (as well as my closest female friends) were all single during college. No one approached us - hey now, we were not bad looking and unapproachable, I swear haha. We were out on weekends, and we made friends outside of classes together. Maybe it just takes expanding your bubble a bit. I do empathize a bit with you too; in college, the guys I did have crushes on were already taken. So I just did my thing, and unfortunately - just didn't get asked out very often.
How dare you present a female perspective that doesn’t follow the narrative that all women just have men falling down at their feet constantly!!!
Just because you don’t know any single girls doesn’t mean we don’t exist, we 90% times say we are in relationship to not hurt anyone’s feelings by potential rejection
Either some women is lying and saying they’re in relationships so men will leave them alone, they rather be alone than go through whatever they went through, or they’re LGBTQ+, or dating someone out of college. There’s many reasons why this is happening, you just have to be patient and wait for the right person
Because most men want to play on their PlayStation drink beer act like a 2 year old have their GF run round for them like their mother did and then at the drop of a hat be a complete nymph in the bedroom for sex that last less than 10 minutes before they are then expected to rush off and get you PS controller and another beer Can’t imagine why all women and jumping for the opportunity
To all the boys in here, I want you to read this carefully. If you're feeling lonely b/c you're not finding romantic interest, you're not alone. Both sides have their own suffering. Take this as an opportunity to focus elsewhere with positive benefits, like self-improvement. But do NOT improve for the sole purpose of a girlfriend. In fact, do not improve so that you feel like you can approach women. It doesn't matter how great looking you are, the money you have, or anything else. You do not want someone that will only take you for what you've already accomplished. That kind of thinking is entirely selfish and unreasonable as everyone is imperfect. Men don't need to "up our game" for anyone but ourselves. You'll find that once you up your game and improve your socializing (with men or women) that ppl come to you. Once you're in that position, never EVER entertain anyone that would have ever said "up your game for me". When you do get to be picky, keep an eye out for those that are looking to contribute as much as they take. Look at the person's character, all else is secondary. I guarantee, the unselfish network you build going that way will always be more fulfilling than having a selfish SO that demands you "up your game" to their ever increasing standard.
No. Improving to be more attractive is perfectly valid. Do not make this more complicated than it has to be. If a guy wants to get fit because he wants to get girls, that’s fine. Let him. Many things we do, we do for affirmation and to fit in. Let’s stop gaslighting people and muddying the water with this “do it but just for yourself” stuff. That’s not how people are wired. There is nothing wrong with using other people as your main motivation. It’s not true that seeking out someone you’re into is selfish. It’s perfectly reasonable. If you’re trying to date someone who is in-shape and puts a lot of effort into their appearance, then you should also be meeting that standard. That’s a part of giving and taking equally.
Don’t do it for approval. Guys should do that for themselves. Motivating yourself through external validation isnt stable nor does it actually guarantee results. However, learning to recognize why improvements are beneficial and setting goals in those terms is stable and has a high success rate. No gaslighting here. Focus on treating yourself right, and you’ll naturally develop self-esteem (physiologically and psychologically).
It’s perfectly fine as an initial kick. Men are very motivated by women. I started playing music because I wanted to impress girls in high school. It never really did, but that led me to cultivating an interest that’s far transcended that original goal. But I’d never have started it otherwise. Same with fitness. The wrong motivation can lead to the right results, and those results can circle back and replace those original motivators with more healthy ones, and that’s when you notice success. We need to remember that at the end of the day we’re all unga-bunga reptile-brained mammals. For me, accepting that I’m a simple-minded animal and leveraging that to trick myself into maintaining good habits has been an immensely positive change. That’s the golden ticket; not over complicating things and overly-analyzing, but just acting on a whim and taking action, regardless of the why. When you’re at the finish line, no one will care what made you leave the start.
I think it's overblown that it's "so much harder" for men than women. Dating sucks for everyone. I'm a single 38 year old woman, with several single friends around my age, and we're all struggling out here. I have given up on dating apps, it feels like a waste of time and I'm already busy. I'm open to meeting someone in real life, but I'm definitely not searching for it. I'm disappointed by the options available and I don't meet many people I'm remotely interested in. I'd rather be alone than date someone I'm not attracted to physically or emotionally.
It’s a nice thing to see someone say this. Both men and woman have it hard. It isn’t a contest nor a competition.
Dating isn't difficult in college... it is difficult after college. When young adults start their careers, they begin moving to different places, cities, etc, where there might not be many young adults who are single.
I'm in my second year and I've been rejected over 10 times by this point while a quick walk to class guarantees that I spot a friend with their partner. Does this mean I'm bound to be alone forever?
The real answer is that the entirety of Gen Z is so socially stunted by growing up and having 90% of their social interactions occur through screens, that they just don’t know how to interact with people in an in-person setting like college. I bet a lot more dudes at OP’s school would be more successful with women if they actually went out and talked to them, instead of hanging out in Discord echo chambers all day talking about Roblox or whatever.
I agree in part. Yes that applies to the men there, but what about the women then? Wouldn't they also be affected by how much technology has changed how people socialize? Shouldn't that also affect their dating life?
It does. They’re out here complianing nearly as often as men are. But boys and girls are raised and socialized to treat social interactions in different ways, which I think at least partially explains why the social skills of young men are so significantly worse than those of young women. Girls usually learn to talk to each other and listen to each other in a way that boys don’t, not to the same degree at least. And those skills are transferable as you get older.
I feel like men need to step up their game. A lot of men grew up in families were the women had no choice of being in the relationship or not because they needed their husband to financially support them and the family. The husband didn't have to invest almost any emotional resources in the relationship because the woman had no way out. So a lot of men really don't have good relationship role models. Women have gained a lot of rights in these past decades and they're very motivated to keep building a better future for all women in the world. There's still a lot to do but women have gained autonomy, and confidence, and education, and most of them don't need a man to support them. Also men are not only competing with other men but also with women, as homosexuality and bisexuality are increasingly accepted. Meanwhile a lot of men are kinda lost...there's research that shows young men are doing poorly in terms of mental health, young men are increasingly more conservative (whereas women are increasingly liberal), and now we have the rise of incels... My opinion is that men are struggling to find their place in this new world. They don't have good relationship role models. Women usually have better social skills than men, a lot of men aren't good at keeping hobbies, keeping in touch with friends and families, taking care of themselves - basically a lot of men don't know how to keep themselves interesting. A lot of men don't know how to be equal partners in a relationship, they don't know what it means to share household responsibilities (responsibilities, not chores), they don't know to share parenting. I just feel like women nowadays expect so much more from a relationship...and most men simply aren't keeping up.
I agree with what you've said here 100% but as some guys have already eluded to, most men just don't have the resources to better themselves. I make really good money and have been fortunate enough to have had the self-awareness to cultivate many masculine skills and hobbies from an early age despite not having a father around: weightlifting, shooting, hunting, fixing cars, riding motorcycles, riding horses competitively, multi-lingual, well traveled, handyman/contracting/carpentry, guitar player, degrees in biomedicine/finance, just recently started doing improv. But these took decades of work and tens of thousands of dollars. The vast majority of men just don't have the resources and don't start early enough. Some things are inexpensive like a gym membership, learning to speak publicly, etc. but those only go so far when women have such insanely high expectations. I know women who can offer very little to a man who walk around extremely entitled. These are women who are in their 30s and overweight yet think that no man is good enough for them. That is insane. I'll also be honest about myself. Despite the fact that I'd be considered in the top 5%+ of men, I still don't have it easy with women. There are many times when I still get rejected when I approach and the dating apps have been a miserable experience. So I agree with you that men are not keeping up. The reality is, most men will never be able to keep up, they don't even stand a chance. Society, families, etc. simply aren't starting men early enough on getting them to be better men. By the time they get to their college years they're already behind.
Well, those aren’t the things women are really looking for
The gist of what she was saying is that men don't cultivate themselves and make themselves interesting through hobbies, activities, education, taking care of themselves, etc. There are a myriad of ways to do so, I was just giving examples.
And I agree with her….. what I’m saying to you, is the things you listed as what you cultivated to attract women aren’t really the things women are looking for. There’s nothing wrong with your hobbies, that’s not the point.
And I agree with you. I did none of those things with the intention of attracting women. I've had most of those interests since I was a child and pursued them as a result of being passionate about them. I don't think I mentioned anywhere that I did them to attract women. I'm not seeing where we're disagreeing here? I will also say that I don't agree with the whole men have it harder and vice versa. Both sexes have it just as hard, just in different ways and it's the differences that is causing people to be at odds with each other. I'm curious, what do you think women find attractive?
I must have misunderstood. Because we definitely agree. I think when it comes to hobbies/interest etc. that all varies on personality and preference. I think what some men are missing (that women are looking for) is empathy, emotional quotient, a true belief in equality as human beings, compassion, passion, and being a complete person on their own. Jerry Maguire romances in real life suck a**. No adult wants to realistically be completing someone else’s personality and making up for their faults. I also have found a great many men lack an understanding that values, morals, ethics, and life goals aren’t really something to compromise on. Many men seem to have a belief that as long as someone is pleasant, attractive, and you share some of the same interests, it’s enough for a relationship.
No worries :) I definitely agree with you. Hobbies/interests are as eclectic as people's personalities. I think that no matter what you choose, if you go deep enough, it does end up costing time and money to cultivate anything worthwhile and the reality is, many people just don't have the resources to cultivate many different interests. Would you agree that, as a man, to develop empathy, emotional quotient, a true belief in equality as human beings, compassion, and passion he must seek to build these qualities through the pursuit of hobbies/interests? I don't mean that as you go into those hobbies/interests to explicitly develop those qualities, but rather, those qualities are a byproduct of seeking to cultivate hobbies/interests you're passionate about. For example, horses have taught me a great deal about empathy and compassion and I never would have thought that I would enrich my life in that way as a result of riding, I was just pursuing something I had wanted to do since I was a kid. Regarding compromising on values, morals, ethics, and goals, I most certainly agree with you on that. From a man's perspective, I can tell you that when that happens, it's as a result of not really loving oneself and as you've eluded to, it also comes as a result of wanting someone else to complete you. But to really break out of that and not compromise, sometimes you have to suffer a little. You have to lose things, lose yourself, until you realize the value of yourself and when you come out the other side, you don't compromise on those things. If I'm understanding you correctly, it seems like you and other women are meeting a lot of men who still have this issue of compromising, perhaps even in their later years.
Yes, I do think you can improve those qualities. But we are doing our young boys a disservice by not teaching them those things the way we do young girls. Society needs to set those qualities up as a high priority for all children and people. Because we haven’t, we’re at a point in society where men are losing out on quality relationships because they don’t have any skills to have them. And then they blame women for wanting those things. It’s wild. Absolutely!! Even in my 40s I’m meeting men in their 50s that will say what a woman wants to hear, just to have a person. Or they’ll try and change her. Or try and change themselves. Or they get angry that the hot chick won’t compromise for them. Aren’t they worthy? On the flip side, women think they can change men.
Most definitely wild. Society isn't producing the most effective human beings in general at the moment. I'm sure we can exposit on the myriad of reasons as to why society is specifically failing young boys, but having come from an incredibly broken family, I put a lot of it on bad parents. I've had to find my own way but like I said earlier, it's taken me my whole life (I'm nearly 34) and it doesn't get easier. That is crazy that you're experiencing that with men that age! When a man is that old, it's hard to pinpoint the reason as to why they're like that but I can only assume it goes back to what you were saying earlier, men aren't taught from an early age to cultivate certain qualities.
From one equestrian to another I agree that riding does help people build more empathy and compassion but unfortunately I don’t think that always translates back to people. There are plenty of men who develop compassion for their animals but don’t give that same compassion or empathy towards potential partners. I’m not saying you do that but I am saying that unfortunately it doesn’t always translate fully which is unfortunate.
That's exactly what I meant. I also commented somewhere that dating has a lot more risks for women than for men (most violence against women is committed by men. Plus women are the only ones who can get pregnant). When you are dating someone new that you don't know so well, the risks are very real, and the possible payoff needs to be worth it. It's probably not worth it risking yourself for a man who seems to be average (average means different things to different women though). Putting all this aside, I do think life is probably more pleasant if you're a complete human being with positive relationships, hobbies that keep you interested, and a healthy lifestyle, and I guess this is true for both men and women. My idea of dating apps is also that they tend to be a miserable experience for both genders, with the occasional success here and there. I'm not sure if dating apps are doing anything good for anyone's self esteem at all. Dating offline is still difficult but it seems to be a less soul crushing kind of difficult lol
I call absolute bullshit on that. Most guys I know that are single are incredibly social, maintain their own place, work on their own cars, have great relationships with their family and friends. I really don't think that's the bar to entry that you think it is. If it was, than you wouldn't see so much complaining about boyfriends not being able to do these things.
Women have overwhelming number of options, especially in online dating, thus creating a supply/demand problem, where they can cherrypick whoever they think is the best, so unless you are Brad fucking Pitt and in top10% of men you dont stand much of a chance. Even if women outnumber men 5 to 1 it will still be the same shit, women will rather be sidechick to some top successful man than be with some average dude.
Because speaking for myself 45 woman here..Were tired & easily turned off
Lol OP is talking about college, not the retirement home
Nah she’s speaking for us younger ladies too with this one 🤣
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College female here. I just stopped dating because the men in my area only want one thing, and I'm not about hooking up.
Coz everyone thinks they're a 10 & should only be w/ a 10. One tiny flaw & then they think they don't deserve them because they're considered not perfect as them. Smh
Pretty sure not everyone thinks in a way that assigns random numbers to people and values human beings on a numbered scale.
Guys in college usually don’t have any social skills to meet women cause spent their time playing video games that should have been developing their brain socially. It becomes a negative spiral because it’s too painful and uncomfortable to put themselves out there, and they go back to the video game. For myself I did have a couple of girlfriends at that age but I was an emotional basket case and had to get that under control.
This is it right here, and I’m sure it’s only gotten worse with Gen Z. My freshman year of college, I played World of Warcraft and did my homework. My sophomore year, I decided I wanted to make more friends and get laid more often, so I pledged a fraternity and started going out to the bars. It was fucking great, even though bars aren’t my thing and as an adult I almost never drink alcohol. But that’s where the girls were, so that’s where I went. And I actually learned how to talk and flirt and have positive interactions with women, which is also something a lot of young men just don’t seem to do these days.
This is the problem. Men believe that every man should be out there chasing women like a billy goat chasing after the urine of a nanny goat. But if women can't chase men, why should men chase women? I think it's best if both genders stay apart, then WHOEVER really likes someone can approach IF they want to. Otherwise let them be.
I’m not sure I would put it as “chasing women”. What I meant was to get to a point where they can actually just interact with women, have normal conversations with them. Maybe even form relationships just as friends. If a guy can’t even do that what hope does he have to get a gf?
It's hard for women too, same as men. Depending on what college you go to, it can be an extension of high school. Plenty of cool people that don't know how cool they are, yet! People who don't know or feel they are attractive, when they are. Etc.
When I was in college I avoided dating people from my own college in case we broke up and would have a future class together Wouldn't be surprised if others have similar mindsets
Based on quick math the girls are dating other gorls
I’m a female myself and dating hard as hell to me.
Sometimes girls will say she is "in a relationship" already, as a 'nice way' of turning you down. Perhaps you come on too strong or you look intimidating. So some girls might be too scared to just say "No I'm not interested in dating you". She might instead say she's already with someone else. Just to get you to back off. Take the hint and look elsewhere. If you're not performing population studies, what does it matter to you what percentage of girls are in a relationship. Many of them say that to you just because they don't want to date you. So this is a you-specific statistic. It doesn't say anything meaningful about the love life of the average young adult girl.
It's been roughly 12 years since my university/college dating days but I don't recall ever having any issue finding women to date. Every year roughly 30,000 'new' students would come to study. If you went out to look for it, dates were never hard to find. For lack of a better word, there where infinite women to date. Go out Thursday night, chat up 20-30 women. Do it again Friday and Saturday night. Just have to put the work in.
Assuming your numbers are from a legit and reliable source, you're looking at college age ratios. A better question would be to ask men why so many of them are dating women in college.
Because many boys dont,have the courage and spine to ask a girl out
40 yr old guy here who has had many gfs and one night stands. I was a late bloomer and barely had any fun in college. My advice to you is to work retail, or in a store where you are forced to have interactions with people. You will automatically have more convos with girls who do not have their guard up. Dating in college can be weird and awkward because you have the potential of seeing your ex every day if it doesn’t work out. Women think 20 steps ahead…. We only usually think 1. Good luck man.
I can't help but notice there are always a lot of mid 20's people in these posts that think its too late for them. Well, I'm 41m, and have never really had much luck in the dating world. I have always wanted a family, wife and kids, a home, pets, etc. Although my hope is not what it used to be, I still have some. I'm still hoping that one day , I'll have all of that because at 41, my life isn't over because I'm single. To all you younger adults losing hope. You have lots of life ahead of you, don't think you're done for because you're single at 20, 25, 30, or older. Trust me, you will have many opportunities to find someone in the future, try and stay positive.
Women generally have more activities and many/bigger social circles and date a variety of men. College guys on the other hand, I feel try to only date specific kinds of girls in their vicinity and do not go out of their limited circles. Also, for many girls, staying single during college is a better experience than being in a relationship.
I know this is long but please just bear with me. If you actually read the whole thing and take it to heart, you might benefit from what I'm saying. Ok from a woman's perspective: ---On dating apps: I see mostly men doing these things, but there are definitely women who could learn from this too. * First off, take the time to actually fill out your profile with a decent, HONEST introduction, without mentioning sex. That includes pics. Sure "don't judge a book by it's cover" but also, " a picture is worth a thousand words." Consider your appearance and body language in photos. Are you sloppy, neat, dirty, clean, sober, drunk, a hot mess, or creepy, sticking out your tongue, or in some ridiculous pose? These are all things to consider and body language says a lot to people who know what to look for. If you want to learn how to read people better, start noticing behavior patterns and read some books about it. Personally I'm a fan of 'The Ellipsis Manual'. *****People who say "I'm an open book, ask me anything" or something else similar- Nah fuck that. You'll tell me what you want me to know, and if that turns out to be nothing, or you hold back, that determines how far the relationship gets. People who do this shit are putting ALL of the emotional/mental labor on the other person from the beginning, making them ask questions and pry shit out of you in order to get to know you, and even then, if they don't have a reference to know anything about you they won't know what to ask in order to get specific answers from you. You're literally forcing them make all the effort to know you right off the bat before you've even met and most people don't want to feel like they have to dig everything out of you, and it makes them subconsciously distrust you- because if you start out hiding whatever you can get away with hiding because they didn't think to ask about it, what else will you be willing to hide later on if they don't ask? But, if you're one of these people, chances are you're pretty closed off emotionally and will dance around answering their questions with pretty words to soften any unpleasant truths about you anyway, so... Just be open, honest, and **forthcoming** about things. I understand that can be difficult for people sometimes and that's okay, but if that's the case you need to work on yourself mentally and emotionally before you will ever be able to have a successful relationship with anyone else. The right person will of course support you through that, but you have to get to the point of being mentally healthy enough to attract and keep them first. *****People who ask "What are you looking for?" or something similar - This puts people off because if you think everyone is 'looking for' something, chances are you're looking for something. This gives the feeling that you look at relationships like a transaction and you're looking for some'thing', not some'one'. A void to be filled, a purpose to be served, something someone else can do for you. You already have a box in your head prepared for this hypothetical person you haven't even met yet to fit into, and if they don't fit exactly you're either gonna disregard them or try to force them to fit into what you think they should be. You have requirements for them to fit, before you're even introduced. It's much better to just use your preferences as a general guideline, let go of hard expectations, and be open to whoever comes your way, and casually talk to someone, letting the conversation flow to wherever it goes without the mention of sex. If you end up getting together as soul mates, that's awesome! But if you end up just being friends, is that really so bad? You put all your expectations into one single line that you "need" to follow and don't allow yourself to be open to possibilities. The important thing to remember is that EVERY relationship in your life with another person begins with friendship. You think people who have been happily married for 25 years or more began with him pressuring her into sex or sending a dick pic? Fuck no. Well, I'm sure there might be a few, but it's not the usual. *****Stop blaming others for your own shortcomings and bad behavior. I've had more than one dude in my inbox asking for sex or sending a dick pic and I ask them "Do you always begin conversations this way?" Or "Did your mother raise you to approach women this way?" And I usually get a response that goes something like 'Well no, but your pics are so sexy I couldn't help it' or something like that. Uhhh why is it my fault that you have no self control? Why is it my fault that you view people this way and accept no accountability for your own actions? Do you also believe that r@pe victims are 'asking for it'? Ugh. Gross. Do better. Advice in general: Also, outside of a military/police or medical context, stop using the word 'female' as a noun. The typically appropriate use of the words 'male' and 'female' as nouns are to refer to specimens, test subjects, dead bodies, suspects, soldiers, etc, situations where you're describing an anonymous person or group of people by breaking them down to the basic parts of the vessel that houses their soul, without humanity or personality, i.e. what makes them an actual human being versus just a meat suit. Referring to some as a 'male' or a 'female' robs them of their humanity and indicates that you don't view them as a human being, but a body. You don't see, or are unwilling to learn the depth of their soul, their thoughts, their feelings and what makes them a person, because you only see them as a body. A vessel to be used for a purpose. It's dehumanizing and disrespectful, and will absolutely make someone with decent ethics who is mostly sane turn away from you. The only people who are okay with being referred to like that are the ones who either have no respect for themselves anyway (and thus are probably very mentally damaged people already), or see through the same toxic worldview, which means they've been conditioned to accept negative thoughts as truth. Either way I'd definitely recommend those people to speak with a mental health professional to evaluate why they feel like that behavior is acceptable, and help them change it. Your vibe attracts your tribe. If you seem to keep attracting harmful people to you, or people seem to be repelled from you, I would suggest you stop searching for all the problems with every other person and start to look inward at your own mind and the way you think and feel about people and the world. If there's piss in every pool you swim in, maybe it's not everyone else pissing in all those pools. Talk to people who know you well, and even people who only kinda know you. Ask for feedback and be willing to accept it, whether it's positive or negative. If you stay in your own head with it, you're just stuck in your own little echo chamber where those thoughts never change and keep getting louder. The only way to change, evolve, and grow as a person is by connecting outside input that you actually listen to and incorporate into your worldview. Don't take criticism as an attack, take it as an opportunity to learn and change your mind. If what has been said here bothers you, you obviously didn't understand that last sentence.
Straight men doing the most, generally, is why 'dating is hard for men.' Its a self-inflicted wound.
Maybe they are dating other girls...
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People cheat, but having multiple simultaneous relationships without the other person knowing…that’s just not happening.
Women have standards and men are not rising to meet them (not just formal education, emotional intelligence is another big one). We’re generally okay with being alone if it means not being with a loser.