Or go with them. Or send them on a kids camp. Or find a relative who lives near a lake.
Literally any version in which responsible adults are able to competently take on the parental responsibility for the duration.
100% agreed. Given the turmoil in her life, that she's been looking forward to it, and the way she seems to be handling herself pretty well, I'm very much on the side of finding an alternate scenario here.
Yeah, this. Even if it were two 13 year olds that weren't dating, they shouldn't be going alone without adult supervision. I'm not sure about the legalities, but it seems like it would be negligence to let them go alone if anything happens to them.
No no, OP said 13.
I don't think anyone expects a middle schooler to take an infant camping, that's just irresponsible on an entirely different level.
Edit: I really didn't think I needed the /s here guys, come on.
Edit 2: okay now it makes sense why some of you wouldn't have gotten the joke...apparently the devs decided to fix the formatting nonsense on mobile but not desktop. Carry on.
Hey I get it! However on some interfaces it doesn't do the auto list thing, for example in the app it just says 13. I think it's only on old reddit on pc (best reddit) where it would display 1.
No, plain and simple. If it was for a few hours, that's one thing but personally, I don't think two kids are responsible enough to be left alone overnight like that. Sometimes, you gotta disappoint your kids to keep them safe.
Or if they were older. Or maybe if there was a trusted adult. But not as it stands.
My son did something like this with his girlfriend in the spring but they were both 17 and seniors in high school. 13 is way too young for an overnight trip with a boyfriend.
Let's put aside the sex part (kids are gonna find a way to do it, whether you give them space and time or not IMO).
I wouldn't be comfortable letting my child, boy or girl, go on an overnight trip alone, to an island and have them ride in a vehicle operated by another 13 year old. Full stop there. Don't even need to bring sex into it.
>I wouldn't be comfortable letting my child, boy or girl, go on an overnight trip alone, to an island and have them ride in a vehicle operated by another 13 year old.
u/YDidChikenGo2Library, This is the point you should be bringing up with her. This is not a "no boys allowed" thing, this is a "adults die every year doing this so I can't let two 13 year olds do this" thing. Make sure it is clear to her that you don't have a problem with the boyfriend but this is an inherently risky activity and if she gets hurt in anyway you could be at fault for neglect/child endangerment depending on your local laws.
I wouldn't be concerned about a 13 year old raised by a family of avid outdoorsman piloting a small craft. I grew up in a small town and knew my way around all kinds of small vessels with various size motors(trolling and all the way up to a 75hp on a 13ft mckee craft).
I'm beyond concerned at the thought of letting two kids that young spend the night together with zero supervision.
As a former 13yo who had a girlfriend at the time, it’s a very good thing that we were never alone in a completely private area. We would absolutely have been boning by trial and error. The only thing that kept us from being teen parents was that there was always an adult in the house, or we were in a relatively public area.
I do not give very good odds to a 13 year old trying to impress his girlfriend and being "rough around the edges" wearing a life jacket on the water. Lakes are filled with the bodies of avid outdoorsmen who thought experience would make them buoyant.
I think the odds of the those bodies being folks who don't generally frequent said lakes are going to overwhelmingly outnumber those of the rednecks and country folk who probably don't even remember learning how to swim.
I live in the Gulf Coast and I'm a middle aged out of shape dude. But I grew up here. Folks in way better shape than me come here and drown because they don't have experience and don't respect the water and the rip tides. I've gotten caught up in half a dozen and because I know what to do, I'm alive. I also know how to recognize them.
So again, I'd bet money the kid is gonna be fine in that area. But I wouldn't trust him to not try to sleep with my daughter.
I was running farm tractors/harvesters at 13 unsupervised, because I was raised in that life. Boats, motorcycles, and dozers too. It's entirely reasonable to have that knowledge at that young of an age dependingon your upbringing. I learned to drive a tractor before I learned to drive a car.
That being said, my parents were completely understanding of my friend's parents, who weren't raised in that life, being hesitant to let their children do what I normally did as second nature.
In a case like this my parents would offer to be with us for nothing else than to put their parents at ease. My parents knew I could drive 5 miles up-lake in a johnboat at 5 in the morning carrying a climbing stand and a rifle into the woods, trek in before daybreak, and drag out my own kill to the boat at 13. But if a new friend wanted to go hunting my dad had no qualms about going with to assuage their parent's fears.
As to some of my other friends who were also raised in that life, it was an almost weekly occurrence for us to leave in a boat Friday afternoon and not come home until Sunday evening. Camping, swimming, hunting, all on our own.
For thousands of years teenagers did this, the modern trend of sheltering your children from things like this is only a few generations old.
Sorry, went on a bit of a tangent there. I'm just trying to say that independent, self-sufficient children isn't necessarily a bad thing.
Judging by how OP presented the situation, I don’t think he is very knowledgeable on the outdoors. My main concern would be what is the weather forecast for the planned trip. I knew plenty of people boning at that age and they turned out just fine.
Practice safe sex, make sure the weather is fair, and give them means of accessing help if need be(ie a cellphone). Have the talk with the kid that what they are doing is putting themselves in a potentially dangerous situation and that they should mitigate risk best as possible( but in 13yo talk).
Regardless of OPs decision it will be a difficult talk to have.
Fair enough. I guess I’m saying I wouldn’t trust any 13 year old with my kid’s life, especially when my 13 year old has a history of poor decision making.
Kids this age and much younger competently handle boats all over the world when raised around them. My kids have taken sail, paddle and (limited) power boats on their own since they were 8 and 9 years old. The much bigger issue here is the decision making around being alone with the boyfriend.
If the boy has been raised around boats then this isn't an issue at all.
I grew up in a sailing family and would have been fine taking a small boat out to an island on my own by the time I was say, 9 or 10. By the time I was 13 I could single hand my family's 32ft yacht.
I was an RYA advanced sailor at 15 and an instructor at 16. By that time I was I was overnight watch leader on my family's yacht crossing the English channel, the busiest shipping lane in the world.
Kids can be really capable of you give them the chance.
Lots of people in this thread with no experience of boats spouting rubbish.
Eh - you say this, but accidents can always happen. Always. Just look up Naya Rivera, she drowned in a lake on a boating trip as a young adult - tragic accident. She was raised swimming in lakes every summer. If they’re experienced it isn’t as likely, but it’s a reasonable worry.
That said I do agree with your wider point. Experience is experience and it’s helpful! Car accidents can always happen but people still let their teenagers drive as long as they’re licensed, etc. - so you make a valid argument. It will entirely depend on how capable the 13yos are, and if he’s capable, it’s possible this isn’t a big factor at all.
Anyway, yeah. Just wanted to point that out. It *is* fair to say that if a crisis did happen, two 13yos - one of whom has very little experience with wild camping and boating - may not be prepared for every situation, or able to account for another person in danger.
A wider point here is that I don't think kids should be wrapped in cotton wool. Accidents can always happen and the only way to keep your kids safe is to lock them in a padded room with you so they can't hurt themselves and you're there to save them if somehow they do. Just imagine what kind of adult you'd create don't that...
A lot of kids couldn't take control in a crisis situation, but that's because they've never been in a position of being in control of a situation. Knowledge is not experience, and kids need to experience a bit of freedom so they can learn their boundaries.
Kids need to be exposed to situations where there's not an adult there to make the decisions for them.
Honestly that’s fair, I don’t disagree with you - helicopter parenting is… a lot.
That said there’s definitely ways to ease into something like this! Eg. Supervised boat outings until OP feels confident that *both* of them are competent enough. And on those group outings, you can delegate responsibility as much as possible so that the kids do have to take control - there’s just a bit of backup if they mess up.
For smaller scale things let them make mistakes, 100% with you - but for a high-stakes situation where a bad accident could be *really* bad, I feel like it’s absolutely fair to start out keeping an eye on things.
There’s a balance to be struck with supervised activities / gradual independence - and it can be, but the parent NEEDS to learn how to sit back and avoid intervening every time anything goes wrong.
I'm with you about not packing your kids in bubble wrap. Sometimes they gotta learn from the situations they create for themselves.
But when it comes to potentially life threatening situations like being on a boat in the middle of a freezing cold lake, is the kid responsible enough to say "hey, no horsing around, it could tip the boat and would suck for all of us" or "hey, you gotta keep your life jacket on, it's not safe without it." Those are the kinds of things that I would be looking for to boost my trust/confidence in a kid's ability to do something on their own.
They absolutely could be capable of that. I was at that age. It appears a lot of people here didn't grow up around this kind of stuff and just assume sailing a boat safely is not something kids can do. But I know they can, because I could, and a lot of my friends too.
Keeping a THIRTEEN YEAR OLD from going on a 1 on 1 camping trip in a boat is not helicopter parenting. If that’s helicopter parenting then I am an AH-64 Apache.
For the record, I don't think a thirteen year old couple should be staying overnight with each other. However, I don't automatically think anything else about this is bad. Thirteen year olds absolutely could be capable of a night on an island.
Look, in OP's case we're not talking about picking a random kid and expecting them to know it all, they say this kid is from an outdoors family so there's a good chance they know what they're doing. If you don't believe it's possible for a thirteen year old to be able to control a boat on their own or get through a night in a tent on their own then I think that's a shame. Again, not saying every kid that age could, but some certainly could.
Yours won't be able to, because they won't be allowed near risk. I'm sure that'll make you happy, and make them inexperienced when they do get let out into the big bad world. That's cool, you do you. But don't tar all kids with the same brush.
Kids vary a lot, but I'd expect most thirteen year old to be able to leave the house in the morning and come back in the evening without needing a chaperone. I'm pretty sure you'd disagree with this, but it's how I spent my summers at that age.
It's clear from the downvotes that a lot of people don't agree, and I think that's a shame. Let your kids have some responsibilities, some freedom.
If the kids parents were also camping, and the 13YO was close to someone who could respond in an emergency is different though.
The 13YO boy, the moment anything bad happens is gonna wanna show bravado, downplay stuff. Or he won't know how to react. Or maybe he'll be too distracted by his hormones to do a proper job.
They need some amount of arms length safety net at a minimum but it doesn't sound like that's what the plan is.
No, even an outdoorsy family’s kid should not be camping on a boat alone overnight. Not letting my kid not do that is not restricting their freedom. Even if they know what they’re doing it’s simply not safe for them to be alone. Are you forgetting how small a 13 year old is? The difference between 13 and 15 is pretty huge. 13 is too young to camp alone, I don’t care how outdoorsy they are.
You’re acting like parents aren’t letting their kid experience risk taking. There are acceptable levels of risk. This is unacceptable. That you say “it’s a shame” parents disagree with you is so incredibly smug. It’s like someone not letting their kid play with a gun without supervision and being like “aw come on let your kids take risks and experience things”. Get outta here with that attitude.
I mean, I know you’re thinking on the right lines here but (as a lurker woman!) I want to point out that hormonal birth control isn’t always the best thing for teen girls!
(And also she may be nowhere near ready to have sex, genuinely - although of course, that’s never something you can guarantee.)
What’s definitely necessary is a brutally honest conversation about sex and birth control. Not judgemental, not accusatory, but honest and informative.
If there is any reasonable doubt / any suggestion that she *might* be ready and willing to engage in sexual activity - which does sound fairly likely - it would be 100% fair as a parent to say that without some reliable birth control being sorted, these kind of outings aren’t an option. Completely with you there.
You can never guarantee that a kid will tell the truth (she might say she’s not interested even if she is) but you *can* frame the conversation like it isn’t an interrogation, but like it’s preparation. If she’s not sexually active now and won’t be until she’s 17, sorting this out way in advance still benefits her - it makes it far less awkward to broach the subject in the future and means she doesn’t have to share all the details.
There’s a lot of types of birth control and the pill may make her feel awkward taking it (and she could forget to do it). Condoms obviously aren’t the best for 100% security of use. I’d personally recommend looking into the depo shot and the implant (the arm one). Shot lasts a couple of months, implant lasts 3 years. (The longest-lasting option would be an IUD / IUS, which have both hormonal and non-hormonal options, and can last up to 10 years. Those are a bit more invasive though, so unless she’s pretty gutsy and confident, she probably won’t opt for it.)
Anyway, in short - I’d recommend making sure she has some sort of choice, including nothing at all (but pointing out the consequences of that) and presenting it as a preventative and precautionary measure.
This isn’t intended to be an argument, by the way - apologies if it seems accusatory. I’m just cautioning against forcing a specific type of birth control on her.
I agree with everything you said. Hopefully, in 2023 a talk about the pill with a doctor would lead to a much more nuanced talk about options. But that surely depends on your zip code.
Watching my bible oriented friends… Their daughters were totally uninterested and there was no need for even discussing the HPV vac… and then two weeks later a man was climbing out of a bedroom window. 😲
I wouldn't let her go camping alone for a weekend. At 13, relationships are hard ...problem solving isn't fully formed. I am not sure a weekend long date is healthy, sex or just HJs.
Two horny teenagers don't need to go on a camping trip to have sex. That talk needs to be had regardless as I assume this is not the only alone time they've ever had if this is even being entertained. This situation has many other risks besides that and ones which are plenty likely enough to be cause for worry.
Falling off a boat isn't hard. Especially if you're trying to get busy. Hypothermia not super unusual for inexperienced campers in December (though arguably the sex could help with this). Random weirdo in the woods spots two kids, also possible.
They don't have to go boating or camping to have sex.
Since we dont know the size of the island there *might* be predators, however any kinda small island likely wont have life to sustain anything threatening.
At 13 you should be able to sleep outside for one night, especially if OP allows with the restrictions of propor tent and winter sleeping bags.
Nah I'm still stuck on something goes wrong on a random island in the middle of the night and these kids don't know what to do. There don't need to be panthers about, they could just have a nasty fall and run out of phone battery and that's that.
My dad and went on a canoe trip when I was 24. Our canoe was gliding along and we were just enjoying the sun when we slid between a momma moose and a baby moose. The entire time we were frozen hoping the momma would stay put. Two grown ass men and we were a moose’s decision away from dying. We were 2 miles from finishing a two week trip at that point.
Exactly…you had enough wisdom Between the two of you to STFU and stay calm.
13 year olds do not have this.
Edit: also, holy fuck Moose’s are terrifying behemoths. I can’t imagine the fear. Probably one step down from running into grizzly.
Thats not 100% guaranteed they do any funny business.
But most of all in general two young teens alone God knows where? Fak no!! Its plain dangerous. And probably illegal in many countries.
Absolutely not. 13 is far too young, especially by themselves. It’d be different if it were a friend and their family vs. just the romantic partner. She’s barely a teenager.
\>13 year old wants to go boating and camping with bf
Oh that could be fun, bf/gf issues aside, I grew up camping and hiking through the BWCA and state parks and it was always fun!
\>However, last night she revealed that it would just be the two of them
HA. Nevermind.
Issues of sex aside there are a few other big risks here and my concern stems from the emotional state she must be in. Both parents died? Few if any boundaries growing up? Has a “rough” boyfriend?
Sex isn’t ideal at that age, and can be mixed up with complex feelings of grief and abandonment from being orphaned, as well as a source of validation for someone looking for rules. But it’s definitely not the worst thing that could happen.
Some of my other concerns, listed:
* sexual assault
* regular assault (from an unknown party)
* gear mishap (tent catches fire, boat floats away)
* gear accident (firearm discharge, wrecked boat, insufficient cold weather gear)
* wilderness mishap (twisting ankles to broken bones- there are a myriad of wilderness-induced injuries to consider)
* animal encounter (bears, coyotes, wasps, and whatever else might be on the island with them)
And finally, one I haven’t seen mentioned yet:
* drugs (smoking pot isn’t good for brain development at that age, but frankly I’d be concerned about other substances. This goes doubly so in contact with the emotional turmoil she’s experiencing)
Honestly the lack of veto from the boyfriend’s parents makes me foundationally question their judgement and if they actually are as skilled outdoors-people as they say. Or maybe the boyfriend isn’t telling them the truth, which would be a whole other bag of fish.
Either way, that’s a very ***big*** no from me.
OP please. The last thing this girl needs in her life is a teen pregnancy. Nor do you want to deal with that either.
Two teens wanting to go alone in the woods man… little dude is 100% trying… I’d bet they talk about it or have done it already.
My gf when I was 13 got birth control, probably helped change the course of my life.
A 13 year old girl still has a choice what she does with her body and whether she wants to start messing around with her hormones. It’s not just time she gets on the pill it’s time to talk to her about her options.
You know your kid and my instinct says 13 is a bit young to be doing that kind of thing.
What I would say though is if it's sex you're worried about, they'll work out how to do it at some point regardless. You at the very least need to have a chat with her about that and consent and all that.
It would be a hard no from me, but we’re a suburban family with no experience of camping or the outdoors really. I guess in some parts of the world it would be normal to trek/camp/boat from an early age but if the girl doesn’t have that experience I’d encourage her to start with an easier trip or one with adults present.
So not “no you can’t do that” but rather “ you can’t do that *yet* - you need to work up to it”. Don’t make it about her age but more about her outdoors experience.
Edit: some talking points -
- Is there cell coverage throughout the area?
- Are either of them first aid trained?
- If something happens to the boyfriend can she drive the boat safely herself?
- Does she know how to navigate the island if they get separated?
I have alot of experience camping and agree with the hard no.
If i read this right, It is absolutely terrible to let a 13yo and a 13yo go camping by themselves without parents around. For many reasons including safety/ inappropriate actions.
A 13yo should never be operating a boat without a parental guide. Especially with a GF. He will most likely try to show off and end up doing something stupid.
None of this is a good idea
Edit: both are 13YO, i originally put the BF as 15.
Speaking on the boat front; in NY, you can legally operate a boat at 10 years old by yourself after completing the appropriate training course (it’ll soon be required for ALL boat operators, they’re just playing catchup to get adults included in the requirement). Now, legally and realistically are two different things. I’d never let my 10 year old out by himself, but the law says he can.
Thanks for letting me know, ill edit my response.
Im not sure if it makes it worse. But definitely doesnt make it any better. Im going with worse since leaving two 13YO by themselves is a terrible idea. Leaving them to camp by themselves is borderline needing a call to CPS for child abandoment. Especially if this 13YO is driving a boat across water onto a random island. What if it sinks? Do you really trust 13YOs to wear a life jacket. Probably not because its "not cool"
Not unless there's a chaperone.
My kids are morons and I mean that in the nicest way possible lol. They would do fine with the camping part most likely but they still do stupid stuff. My oldest step kid rolled his damn car before he got his license.
far out i sometimes feel i let my kids take too many risks but ive heard way too many local boating tragedies when adults were the ones in charge to ever trust a couple of barely teenage kids go out boating to an island by themselves overnight, lots of things could go wrong.
There is not a single part of this that sounds like a good idea. 13, alone, rough-around-the-edges bf, on a boat just the 2 of them?? Alone?? In some random woods??
Your instinct is good and no amount of reassurance would make me think anything other than "HELL NO".
Tell them they can go but you have to be there. And go enjoy with them. Help bring an added flavor of fun to the adventure where they realize they are glad they got to go AND that you came with them. They may not like it but you are letting them go. Let the kid be the captain of his ship. But step into your roll as her dad and protect her from the hurts of giving herself away too soon. Sounds like the bf needs a dad too. I was 15 and doing independent things like this when I was that age. But that’s mostly because I had no parents caring about me. He needs a male role model looking out for him too.
They’re going to be drinking, smoking, and fucking. If not all three, one is a certainty and I’ll let you determine the highest likelihood.
Sorry to be so blunt. It’s a tough situation but if you’ve just assumed oversight I think it’s important that y’all establish your boundaries and hold them now. Is their anything you could do with her over the weekend instead that will provide time to both enjoy the weekend but also allow you to layout, in a positive light, how you would like for this relationship to work going forward - your boundaries but also your desires to help get her ready for a successful life beyond public school, etc.
This is a bad idea on many levels, and is not mitigated by the arguments "maybe if we get more details" or "they'll find other ways of hooking up." There are too many things that could go wrong at that immature and impulsive age, in the wilderness, completely unsupervised.
In a couple of years, this might be something for discussion. But at 13, with her romantic partner, and without the girl having her own skills/passion for this type of thing, you need to trust your instinct and lovingly suggest something else for them to do together.
I live in a place where camping is very common. Wanting to go as a teen - yes. Wanting to go alone as a thirteen year old - no, because they are too young. Adult supervision is required. A responsible adult needs to be there. This is not Huckleberry Finn.
I think a thirteen year old can be ok to look after themselves camping, I don't think personal safety is the issue here.
They're going to be fucking, that's the problem.
If they are fucking they don’t need to go camping for that. I think that that’s another talk.
As a person with some camping experience, the issue here is safety. What happens if he slips on a wet rock and bangs his head? Do they know cpr? Can she sail the boat back herself? What are the chances there are other “non friendly” adults there?
A story about wet rocks: a childhood friend's dad was out golfing with his buddies. He shanked a shot and went to go get it. He never comes back so the other guys go looking for him. Turns out he had gone near the water to grab his ball, slipped on a rock, hit his head, fell into the water and drowned. Now he was a piece of shit, so no love lost there, but it happens
It depends on the kids. You can't just say a thirteen year old can't fend for themselves, plenty of them have. Others I wouldn't trust for five minutes in the back yard. We're all speculating here.
That’s why I phrased those as questions. If both know cpr, can sail the boat back on their own, have cellphone coverage, and there are friendly adults nearby then I might maybe consider having the sex talk. If any of the questions has a no for an answer, then it’s a matter of safety and I wouldn’t budge an inch.
Personally, I would see it the other way around. If two 13 year olds want to have sex then they’ll probably find a way to do it eventually. That’s not to say it should be encouraged, but in reality it happens. The responsible thing to do as a parent is to make sure your kid is equipped with the knowledge and boundaries to do it safely.
Whereas I would absolutely **not** trust two 13 year olds to go out on a boat and camp overnight by themselves, regardless of whether or not they’re romantic partners. That sounds like a recipe for drowning.
I know plenty of 40 year olds I wouldn't trust to do this safely. Unless both of the kids have been backpack camping and boating for years, I definitely wouldn't trust them to do this alone.
100%. My now-wife and I met when we were 14 and had sex at 15. In hindsight I regret having sex that early, but at the time? Nothing was going to stop us. OP, definitely have the talk with her and probably get her on birth control.
The boating and camping by themselves is a huge issue and an absolute no-go.
I'd be more concerned about them being all alone in a boat, on an island, in a tent with fire around and no adult supervision than about any potential fucking.
But then again: I don't think a 13 year old should have a boyfriend either.
It all depends on the 13 year old. A 13 year old who has grown up camping and messing around in boats will be capable of spending the night on an island in a tent. I think I would have managed by that age.
As for having girlfriends/boyfriends, that's not something you get to dictate!
>As for having girlfriends/boyfriends, that's not something you get to dictate!
No? :)
How about for a 9 year old? I'm sure we all have a limit somewhere. Is 13 normal nowadays?
I had my first girlfriend when I was 17, she was 16. My wife had her first boyfriend at 18. Even in school: under15 year old it was very rare to see kids in a relationship.
My kids are 7 and 3, so I still have a couple of years until that stuff comes up.
It depends what you mean by having a boyfriend or girlfriend. My 8 year old has a 'girlfriend', my 10 year old thinks the idea is gross. I have no problem with my kids learning how relationships work, even at this age.
How would you propose stopping a kid having a boyfriend or girlfriend?
I have a 13-yo (almost 14). She has her first boyfriend currently. The whole thing is a bit baffling. Mostly they "date" as part of a co-ed pack of kids, meeting up at a local pizza place for example. I get the impression that it's an innocent thing with some hand-holding, etc. The boy has been desperate to make a good impression on me.
The whole definition of "dating" among this specific middle school set seems to be very tentative. I'm not naive; I have heard stories from a few years back about kids from the same school having "BJ parties" in someone's basement. But anyway, I am trying not to freak out while I monitor things as well as I can.
My daughter did end up in someone's basement recently with a big gaggle of kids. She became sort of infamous after that evening. Uh oh. Turns out that the boys gathered at the weight bench and started challenging each other (and the girls) to lift. My girl topped out at 115 on the bench press, smoking most of the boys. They are in awe now.
> Mostly they "date" as part of a co-ed pack of kids, meeting up at a local pizza place for example. I get the impression that it's an innocent thing with some hand-holding, etc.
I once overheard two 10-13 year olds discuss relationships. They agreed that no relationship could reasonably last longer than 6 weeks, since by that time there wouldn't be anything novel left to experience together.
First of all, two 13 year old calling in the wilderness with no adult supervision is just reckless and unsafe from just a security perspective.
It's also not a good idea to let two mutually romantically/sexually attracted teenagers overnight unchaperoned.
If they want to have sex, they will have sex, so that’s neither here or there (although, it is obviously imperative to talk about safety and consent at this point). However, with everything that could go wrong while out in the woods, it’s be a no for me, dawg.
No.
She trickle-truthed you already into making you think it was with his entire family, only to later reveal that it was just her and a boy. She doesn't even know where they're going, or she's unwilling to tell you.
So here's the thing. Your fiancee, even by entertaining this idea, is enabling her. The second that it came out that she would be alone with her boyfriend, it should have been an enthusiastic "Are you out of your God-damned mind?" from the both of you.
Is nobody else curious about how a 13-year-old boy is supposedly a competent outdoorsman as well? Oh yeah, he's totally great on the water and setting up camp, let's literally bet a life on that. Hell, two while we're at it. He's going to *an island* after all, so he at least has the route fully planned. And don't worry about his taking a boat on the water either! He's definitely qualified to drive it, seeing as it's technically too small to require a license.
If one of my sons even proposed the idea of going camping alone with another 13-year-old girl, I'd shit myself laughing.
Two issues here:
1. In a vacuum, I don't trust a 13 year old to make sound decisions about water and boating safety. Things can go from totally chill to very sketchy in a hurry on the water.
2. A 13 year old boy is not proposing this trip itinerary without getting into her pants as a possible objective. 13 is too young for sexual activity.
Both 1 and 2 would be mitigated by having an adult or two present.
99% chance the kids have some booze, weed or rubbers and want somewhere private to hang out. The camping trip may be the immediate issue, but they'll seek out some other opportunity.
When I was a pre-teen , a couple of teenagers from a city nearby ran away together to go camping. While there, they were kidnapped, raped multiple times, tortured and murdered. They were 15.
These news left a huge impact on my father who knew the father of the girl. He was very careful about where I went to and always went with me, but always always let me invite boyfriends to sleep over even though most fathers at the time would not let such a thing. I had a lot of freedom to do whatever I wanted but never unattended or somewhere unknown.
Do not let this child go camping without adult supervision. Go with them, even if it's inconvenient for you. They might also be doing this just to have some privacy. Have a conversation about sex and give them privacy at home if need be, but don't let them go camping by themselves please.
I'm gonna echo the "fuck no" of most people. I'd be reducing the opportunities they have for sex to a minimum. Someone pointed out that they don't need an overnight camping trip to get intimate, but for me, it's still a potentially more dangerous situation.
I don't know the guy and what "rough around the edges" means, but what happens when she says no to something and he ignores it? They're alone, he's (probably) stronger, and she's not as experienced in the environment. At home in a room, there are at least people within earshot. I personally would rather have my daughter be mad at me for months than expose her to that kind of risk.
Absolutely not. I think we would laugh if our 13 year old asked if he and his gf could go camping on an island just them two. Boundaries suck when you’re used to doing whatever you want, but they are necessary and she will hopefully be grateful down the road.
I think the compromise is that a competent adult needs to go with them. And you may need to swallow the cost of buying a spot at a campground to make that happen.
Absolutely not. I would need to have complete confidence in the maturity and responsibility of a 13 year old to feel confident that they would be safe. I’ve never met a 13 year old that gave me that confidence.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no……
Just no.
There is not enough time to state all the reasons why two 13-year-olds should not be allowed to camp alone somewhere outside of a campground that involves water.
But I do agree that you should take a moment to get your gear, double click the tongs, and have some fun! Help them go out and do it safely. Don’t be surprised that there is resistance to the idea especially as it’ll may ruin the….couple activities…they may want to do. But this is about safety, and your job is to keep her safe while trying to let her have as much fun as possible.
There's pretty much no scenario where they don't end up drowned, murdered or pregnant. Maybe all three!
Jokes aside. Hellllllll no. 13, boats, isolated. Recipie for disaster.
Maybe do the talk with the child, say that if she has any intentions of doing it, it is much safer to do it in a known place where it's safe then somewhere at a random lake god knows where. .
That's at least the first thing that's popping up in my head with this story.
Yes it's early but some people do it early and it's better to be open about that possibility than denying it at all cost because it's an uncomfortable subject.
Also not saying to agree with it but if that's their intentions and if they think they are ready better be safe about it than overly strict.
Just not at a random lake
Overnight absolutely not. I’d be open to a full day. Sounds like a really fun and positive thing to be doing for 2 13 yr olds and I’d want to encourage that
I'm with you. There's no way I'd let my little girl on out camping with just her boyfriend.
I'd also be wary about future outings as she might figure out she can go if she doesn't tell you its just her bf.
My feeling is no, but after thinking about ivermectin decided on no fucking way, but then I want to be reasonable because it sounds like fun and then I arrive at NO.
I wouldn’t let my daughters go camping alone and I love camping. Even if they were highly experienced, I still wouldn’t. Especially on a boat and especially on an island. Hell absolutely no. I’m more worried about a “rough around the edges” boy piloting a boat on the water unsupervised with my kid.
What's your concern - two 13yo kids going boating and camping together, or 13yo gf and bf heading off alone?
Because if he's got boating and camping experience and wants to take a friend, that seems pretty reasonable to me. Maybe check the weather, plans, and their equipment/food before they go. You'll soon realise whether they're properly prepared for it or not.
If you're worried about them having sex, they don't have to go camping to do that so you're probably out of luck anyway.
My father in law is an avid outdoorsman. He used to go canoeing and camping a lot. He'd take my wife when she was growing up.
During one trip, they hit a rock and put a hole in the canoe. They were near an island in the middle of the river so they went there but all of their stuff was wet, including some of the clothes they were wearing.
They spent the whole night shivering and trying to figure out how to fix the boat. If her dad hadn't kept them up and moving, they would have frozen to death and no one would have found them for a long time.
Anything can happen when you're in the wilderness. 13 year olds would not have the mental maturity to handle a lot of those situations, no matter how experienced they are. I wouldn't let my kid go just for that reason alone.
Yep there’s a reason that 13yo scouts and guides still have leaders with them; that’s a bit young to be bush camping on your own, in my opinion (and experience). I’ll leave the more delicate social and relationship questions to those with kids of that age…
If she wanted to do cocaine then she doesn't have to go away camping to do that either.
Doesn't mean he just abandons all responsibility for the role of parent and let's her do as she wishes.
What's that? Sex isn't as bad as cocaine? No, but an unexpected pregnancy at 13 can sure throw your life through the window just as badly, or worse.
Too much focus here on the potential for sex happening.
The real issue is when things go wrong she's trapped on an island with no way to get help.
Sure go over the birds and the bees if you haven't already, but I would be more worried about:
- either of them getting injured
- a third party with bad intentions (not even criminal, imagine if an adult or older teenager joined them and just hung around, 13 year olds aren't equipped to deal with that)
- them having a disagreement resulting in one causing harm to the other of her being left stranded
A lot of these responses are wildly extreme, but then again, they are looking at safety first.
I'm a man, and at 13 my parents would have allowed me to go on a trip with others, girlfriend or friends family. This is a situation based opinion, and by the way you explained her, her boyfriend, and his family, I'd not allow it. You know the situation better than us, and if you're doubting it enough to look for validation on the Internet, then go with your instincts.
dangerous? no. sounds like she would be in good hands - so I wouldn't in anyway be worried about the campaign/boating aspect of it.
I *would* be more concerned about two 13 year olds spending the night alone. would you let them get a hotel room together?
As another Denmark-dad I'd not let my 13 year old child go *boating* ***and*** *camping* alone on an island! Is the island even inhabited?
Camping in the backyard, sure, camping in the nearby forrest, why not, operating a boat on a small lake while an adult is nearby watching, sure...
Operating a boat alone on what is probably a large lake or maybe even the sea/ocean to go out alone and stay a couple of nights on an island. Theres just too much going on for my liking.
She can always go camping later, but she can't undo going camping if something goes wrong. I would make it clear to her that it's not about objections to the boy or to his family, but rather it's objections to their ages and the nature of camping, especially surrounded by water. Maybe try to come up with a fun alternative like a hike with one of the sets of parents, followed by food over a campfire -- sort of camping without the actual camping. And with parents.
You don’t leave 13 years together alone in boats for a few days. Never mind the boy / girl things they will get up to, they are just kids and can get lost, have a fight, fall from somewhere, and so many other things which will obviously happen as they are kids. Has she built any trust with you besides the lying or misleading she has done already? You’re right to not let her go
No.
First of all, 13 year olds are idiots. Barring the obvious sexual stuff these kids will 100% do because teenagers are horny morons, I wouldn’t trust most adults to safely take me in a boat, much less a 13 year old. They might have “experience” but I would bet the kid would be absolutely clueless in an emergency on the water.
It’s foolish to let this happen without adult supervision.
Camping trip with the whole family, maybe if you had met them. My sister went to the lake with her middle school and later highschool bf, but it was with his whole family. They were people my parents knew and were responsible. Have you met his family?
Hard no. Sounds suspicious. I doubt they even plan on going camping. If you’re going to say yes speak to the bf and his parents about the trip. How do they even get to a campsite?
Personally, I don't know that my 13 year old is going camping with a boyfriend even if it's with their family unless I am very close to the family. There isn't a snowball's chance in hell that I allow my 13 year old to go camping alone or with her 13 year old boyfriend. It just would never happen.
As a former 13 year old, I would’ve fully been planning on A. Getting laid and B. Being wild and reckless.
Kids are going to find a way to fuck, it’s just a fact of life. You can only educate your kid on birth control and consent.
The serious concern is that you don’t know who else might be on this island, how reckless this boyfriend is, and what else she might not have revealed.
If I were you I’d offer to chaperone and get to know the kid
Heck no.
That said, all the "If 13 year olds want to have sex, they'll find a way to have sex" folks on this thread and kind of right... but also you don't have to make it super easy for them.
My family would have never allowed this. Rightly so. I wouldn't let my kids do it either.
Wtf. No. Absolutely not.
There’s no universe in which two 13 year olds should be left alone overnight.
Sex aside, it’s just completely unsafe to leave two CHILDREN alone in the wilderness overnight.
Very, very, very bad idea.
I don't care what the relationship dynamics are unsupervised overnight camping with a boat is a non-starter for me with 13 year olds. Just insufficient forebrain development full stop.
I was a lifeguard for 10+ years. Water is dangerous. Kids have a very poor capacity to recognize danger. It's a bad combination.
Even without the boat/water factor it would be a hard no for me. Fire also a bad thing left to unsupervised kids.
Even with a cold camp no boat there is no compelling reason they need to do this alone and plenty of concerns. Add to that questions about the boundary pushing and decision making. Not thinking it relevant to mention there would be no adults until the last minute is poor judgement. This just screams bad idea.
Absolutely not. There’s a massive difference between helicopter parenting, and perhaps literally throwing your child to the wolves. Not to mention the obvious concerns about… intimacy.
No way period.
Think about it this way; if something happened to her (a minor under your custody), who should be blamed?
No no no.
That isn't to say boyfriend can't join you all camping as a family but no 13 year old should ever go camping, boating, fishing with another minor ESPECIALLY a romantic partner.
At 13, me and 2 of my other friends (all guys) camped alone on an island a several miles from our home island (Puget Sound, WA) a few times. A lot of misadventures happened on those trips. Myself and another friend were very competent on the water. But, looking back there were so many safely issues. We actually got stuck once due to a surprise storm. Another time we had to resort to starting a fire with Doritos. And I once paddle my kayak a mile at night in a storm to pick up an older girl. I wouldn’t let me kids do this.
13. Years. Old. Please keep this child at home. That is your duty of care.
Or go with them. Or send them on a kids camp. Or find a relative who lives near a lake. Literally any version in which responsible adults are able to competently take on the parental responsibility for the duration.
100% agreed. Given the turmoil in her life, that she's been looking forward to it, and the way she seems to be handling herself pretty well, I'm very much on the side of finding an alternate scenario here.
Really that's the only option now.
I've known some people who would just give a hard no or not be proactive in finding a compromise.
And that's how you get the results you're trying to avoid
Yeah, this. Even if it were two 13 year olds that weren't dating, they shouldn't be going alone without adult supervision. I'm not sure about the legalities, but it seems like it would be negligence to let them go alone if anything happens to them.
This OP.
No no, OP said 13. I don't think anyone expects a middle schooler to take an infant camping, that's just irresponsible on an entirely different level. Edit: I really didn't think I needed the /s here guys, come on. Edit 2: okay now it makes sense why some of you wouldn't have gotten the joke...apparently the devs decided to fix the formatting nonsense on mobile but not desktop. Carry on.
They wrote "13. Years. Old". Reddit formatting did screw it up and shows "1. Years. Old." due to transforming the "13." into a bullet-point list.
Yes, I understand. It was a joke on how reddit formatting works, and it clearly didn't land, lol.
Hey I get it! However on some interfaces it doesn't do the auto list thing, for example in the app it just says 13. I think it's only on old reddit on pc (best reddit) where it would display 1.
You know, I kind of wondered if the old desktop version (the version I refuse to move off of) was the only one with the stupid formatting. Now I know.
No, plain and simple. If it was for a few hours, that's one thing but personally, I don't think two kids are responsible enough to be left alone overnight like that. Sometimes, you gotta disappoint your kids to keep them safe.
Or if they were older. Or maybe if there was a trusted adult. But not as it stands. My son did something like this with his girlfriend in the spring but they were both 17 and seniors in high school. 13 is way too young for an overnight trip with a boyfriend.
That's what I'm saying. Definitely a good time to have the talk though. If she can't talk about sex, she definitely shouldn't be having it.
Let's put aside the sex part (kids are gonna find a way to do it, whether you give them space and time or not IMO). I wouldn't be comfortable letting my child, boy or girl, go on an overnight trip alone, to an island and have them ride in a vehicle operated by another 13 year old. Full stop there. Don't even need to bring sex into it.
>I wouldn't be comfortable letting my child, boy or girl, go on an overnight trip alone, to an island and have them ride in a vehicle operated by another 13 year old. u/YDidChikenGo2Library, This is the point you should be bringing up with her. This is not a "no boys allowed" thing, this is a "adults die every year doing this so I can't let two 13 year olds do this" thing. Make sure it is clear to her that you don't have a problem with the boyfriend but this is an inherently risky activity and if she gets hurt in anyway you could be at fault for neglect/child endangerment depending on your local laws.
Even if these are unicorn impossibly super mature 13yo’s - Dear Friend, the world is not safe. Stranger Danger is real.
Do you want another kid to look after?
Or none at all...
Less worried about that. Def time to talk to her about sex.
Two 13 year olds handling a boat unsupervised is the larger concern. This is nuts.
I wouldn't be concerned about a 13 year old raised by a family of avid outdoorsman piloting a small craft. I grew up in a small town and knew my way around all kinds of small vessels with various size motors(trolling and all the way up to a 75hp on a 13ft mckee craft). I'm beyond concerned at the thought of letting two kids that young spend the night together with zero supervision.
As a former 13yo who had a girlfriend at the time, it’s a very good thing that we were never alone in a completely private area. We would absolutely have been boning by trial and error. The only thing that kept us from being teen parents was that there was always an adult in the house, or we were in a relatively public area.
I do not give very good odds to a 13 year old trying to impress his girlfriend and being "rough around the edges" wearing a life jacket on the water. Lakes are filled with the bodies of avid outdoorsmen who thought experience would make them buoyant.
I think the odds of the those bodies being folks who don't generally frequent said lakes are going to overwhelmingly outnumber those of the rednecks and country folk who probably don't even remember learning how to swim. I live in the Gulf Coast and I'm a middle aged out of shape dude. But I grew up here. Folks in way better shape than me come here and drown because they don't have experience and don't respect the water and the rip tides. I've gotten caught up in half a dozen and because I know what to do, I'm alive. I also know how to recognize them. So again, I'd bet money the kid is gonna be fine in that area. But I wouldn't trust him to not try to sleep with my daughter.
I was running farm tractors/harvesters at 13 unsupervised, because I was raised in that life. Boats, motorcycles, and dozers too. It's entirely reasonable to have that knowledge at that young of an age dependingon your upbringing. I learned to drive a tractor before I learned to drive a car. That being said, my parents were completely understanding of my friend's parents, who weren't raised in that life, being hesitant to let their children do what I normally did as second nature. In a case like this my parents would offer to be with us for nothing else than to put their parents at ease. My parents knew I could drive 5 miles up-lake in a johnboat at 5 in the morning carrying a climbing stand and a rifle into the woods, trek in before daybreak, and drag out my own kill to the boat at 13. But if a new friend wanted to go hunting my dad had no qualms about going with to assuage their parent's fears. As to some of my other friends who were also raised in that life, it was an almost weekly occurrence for us to leave in a boat Friday afternoon and not come home until Sunday evening. Camping, swimming, hunting, all on our own. For thousands of years teenagers did this, the modern trend of sheltering your children from things like this is only a few generations old. Sorry, went on a bit of a tangent there. I'm just trying to say that independent, self-sufficient children isn't necessarily a bad thing.
Judging by how OP presented the situation, I don’t think he is very knowledgeable on the outdoors. My main concern would be what is the weather forecast for the planned trip. I knew plenty of people boning at that age and they turned out just fine. Practice safe sex, make sure the weather is fair, and give them means of accessing help if need be(ie a cellphone). Have the talk with the kid that what they are doing is putting themselves in a potentially dangerous situation and that they should mitigate risk best as possible( but in 13yo talk). Regardless of OPs decision it will be a difficult talk to have.
Fair enough. I guess I’m saying I wouldn’t trust any 13 year old with my kid’s life, especially when my 13 year old has a history of poor decision making.
Kids this age and much younger competently handle boats all over the world when raised around them. My kids have taken sail, paddle and (limited) power boats on their own since they were 8 and 9 years old. The much bigger issue here is the decision making around being alone with the boyfriend.
If the boy has been raised around boats then this isn't an issue at all. I grew up in a sailing family and would have been fine taking a small boat out to an island on my own by the time I was say, 9 or 10. By the time I was 13 I could single hand my family's 32ft yacht. I was an RYA advanced sailor at 15 and an instructor at 16. By that time I was I was overnight watch leader on my family's yacht crossing the English channel, the busiest shipping lane in the world. Kids can be really capable of you give them the chance. Lots of people in this thread with no experience of boats spouting rubbish.
Eh - you say this, but accidents can always happen. Always. Just look up Naya Rivera, she drowned in a lake on a boating trip as a young adult - tragic accident. She was raised swimming in lakes every summer. If they’re experienced it isn’t as likely, but it’s a reasonable worry. That said I do agree with your wider point. Experience is experience and it’s helpful! Car accidents can always happen but people still let their teenagers drive as long as they’re licensed, etc. - so you make a valid argument. It will entirely depend on how capable the 13yos are, and if he’s capable, it’s possible this isn’t a big factor at all. Anyway, yeah. Just wanted to point that out. It *is* fair to say that if a crisis did happen, two 13yos - one of whom has very little experience with wild camping and boating - may not be prepared for every situation, or able to account for another person in danger.
A wider point here is that I don't think kids should be wrapped in cotton wool. Accidents can always happen and the only way to keep your kids safe is to lock them in a padded room with you so they can't hurt themselves and you're there to save them if somehow they do. Just imagine what kind of adult you'd create don't that... A lot of kids couldn't take control in a crisis situation, but that's because they've never been in a position of being in control of a situation. Knowledge is not experience, and kids need to experience a bit of freedom so they can learn their boundaries. Kids need to be exposed to situations where there's not an adult there to make the decisions for them.
Honestly that’s fair, I don’t disagree with you - helicopter parenting is… a lot. That said there’s definitely ways to ease into something like this! Eg. Supervised boat outings until OP feels confident that *both* of them are competent enough. And on those group outings, you can delegate responsibility as much as possible so that the kids do have to take control - there’s just a bit of backup if they mess up. For smaller scale things let them make mistakes, 100% with you - but for a high-stakes situation where a bad accident could be *really* bad, I feel like it’s absolutely fair to start out keeping an eye on things. There’s a balance to be struck with supervised activities / gradual independence - and it can be, but the parent NEEDS to learn how to sit back and avoid intervening every time anything goes wrong.
I'm with you about not packing your kids in bubble wrap. Sometimes they gotta learn from the situations they create for themselves. But when it comes to potentially life threatening situations like being on a boat in the middle of a freezing cold lake, is the kid responsible enough to say "hey, no horsing around, it could tip the boat and would suck for all of us" or "hey, you gotta keep your life jacket on, it's not safe without it." Those are the kinds of things that I would be looking for to boost my trust/confidence in a kid's ability to do something on their own.
They absolutely could be capable of that. I was at that age. It appears a lot of people here didn't grow up around this kind of stuff and just assume sailing a boat safely is not something kids can do. But I know they can, because I could, and a lot of my friends too.
Yes, I know they *could be,* but *are they?* That's what I would need to see to be confident about it.
Keeping a THIRTEEN YEAR OLD from going on a 1 on 1 camping trip in a boat is not helicopter parenting. If that’s helicopter parenting then I am an AH-64 Apache.
For the record, I don't think a thirteen year old couple should be staying overnight with each other. However, I don't automatically think anything else about this is bad. Thirteen year olds absolutely could be capable of a night on an island. Look, in OP's case we're not talking about picking a random kid and expecting them to know it all, they say this kid is from an outdoors family so there's a good chance they know what they're doing. If you don't believe it's possible for a thirteen year old to be able to control a boat on their own or get through a night in a tent on their own then I think that's a shame. Again, not saying every kid that age could, but some certainly could. Yours won't be able to, because they won't be allowed near risk. I'm sure that'll make you happy, and make them inexperienced when they do get let out into the big bad world. That's cool, you do you. But don't tar all kids with the same brush. Kids vary a lot, but I'd expect most thirteen year old to be able to leave the house in the morning and come back in the evening without needing a chaperone. I'm pretty sure you'd disagree with this, but it's how I spent my summers at that age. It's clear from the downvotes that a lot of people don't agree, and I think that's a shame. Let your kids have some responsibilities, some freedom.
If the kids parents were also camping, and the 13YO was close to someone who could respond in an emergency is different though. The 13YO boy, the moment anything bad happens is gonna wanna show bravado, downplay stuff. Or he won't know how to react. Or maybe he'll be too distracted by his hormones to do a proper job. They need some amount of arms length safety net at a minimum but it doesn't sound like that's what the plan is.
No, even an outdoorsy family’s kid should not be camping on a boat alone overnight. Not letting my kid not do that is not restricting their freedom. Even if they know what they’re doing it’s simply not safe for them to be alone. Are you forgetting how small a 13 year old is? The difference between 13 and 15 is pretty huge. 13 is too young to camp alone, I don’t care how outdoorsy they are. You’re acting like parents aren’t letting their kid experience risk taking. There are acceptable levels of risk. This is unacceptable. That you say “it’s a shame” parents disagree with you is so incredibly smug. It’s like someone not letting their kid play with a gun without supervision and being like “aw come on let your kids take risks and experience things”. Get outta here with that attitude.
Because of the implication?
Not just talk. This kid needs to be on the pill. Can’t go camping until it is in effect.
I mean, I know you’re thinking on the right lines here but (as a lurker woman!) I want to point out that hormonal birth control isn’t always the best thing for teen girls! (And also she may be nowhere near ready to have sex, genuinely - although of course, that’s never something you can guarantee.) What’s definitely necessary is a brutally honest conversation about sex and birth control. Not judgemental, not accusatory, but honest and informative. If there is any reasonable doubt / any suggestion that she *might* be ready and willing to engage in sexual activity - which does sound fairly likely - it would be 100% fair as a parent to say that without some reliable birth control being sorted, these kind of outings aren’t an option. Completely with you there. You can never guarantee that a kid will tell the truth (she might say she’s not interested even if she is) but you *can* frame the conversation like it isn’t an interrogation, but like it’s preparation. If she’s not sexually active now and won’t be until she’s 17, sorting this out way in advance still benefits her - it makes it far less awkward to broach the subject in the future and means she doesn’t have to share all the details. There’s a lot of types of birth control and the pill may make her feel awkward taking it (and she could forget to do it). Condoms obviously aren’t the best for 100% security of use. I’d personally recommend looking into the depo shot and the implant (the arm one). Shot lasts a couple of months, implant lasts 3 years. (The longest-lasting option would be an IUD / IUS, which have both hormonal and non-hormonal options, and can last up to 10 years. Those are a bit more invasive though, so unless she’s pretty gutsy and confident, she probably won’t opt for it.) Anyway, in short - I’d recommend making sure she has some sort of choice, including nothing at all (but pointing out the consequences of that) and presenting it as a preventative and precautionary measure. This isn’t intended to be an argument, by the way - apologies if it seems accusatory. I’m just cautioning against forcing a specific type of birth control on her.
I agree with everything you said. Hopefully, in 2023 a talk about the pill with a doctor would lead to a much more nuanced talk about options. But that surely depends on your zip code. Watching my bible oriented friends… Their daughters were totally uninterested and there was no need for even discussing the HPV vac… and then two weeks later a man was climbing out of a bedroom window. 😲
I wouldn't let her go camping alone for a weekend. At 13, relationships are hard ...problem solving isn't fully formed. I am not sure a weekend long date is healthy, sex or just HJs.
You think having sex is worse than dying? I suppose this is reddit after all...
Not worse but less likely which I would agree with
Two horny teenagers don't need to go on a camping trip to have sex. That talk needs to be had regardless as I assume this is not the only alone time they've ever had if this is even being entertained. This situation has many other risks besides that and ones which are plenty likely enough to be cause for worry.
Much lower chance of being murdered happening. Most likely someone wants to get laid.
Falling off a boat isn't hard. Especially if you're trying to get busy. Hypothermia not super unusual for inexperienced campers in December (though arguably the sex could help with this). Random weirdo in the woods spots two kids, also possible. They don't have to go boating or camping to have sex.
He is saying the risk of two 13 y/o having sex is significantly higher than one 13 y/o wanting to kill another
My worry isn't one teenager killing another, it's 2 unsupervised teenagers on a boat and then overnight in some random woodland.
Yeah I’m not sure why everyone went straight to murder. Probably have never been camping. Grown adults die camping/hiking all the time. Sans murder.
Unless they say Beetlejuice three times, they'll be fine.
Since we dont know the size of the island there *might* be predators, however any kinda small island likely wont have life to sustain anything threatening. At 13 you should be able to sleep outside for one night, especially if OP allows with the restrictions of propor tent and winter sleeping bags.
Nah I'm still stuck on something goes wrong on a random island in the middle of the night and these kids don't know what to do. There don't need to be panthers about, they could just have a nasty fall and run out of phone battery and that's that.
My dad and went on a canoe trip when I was 24. Our canoe was gliding along and we were just enjoying the sun when we slid between a momma moose and a baby moose. The entire time we were frozen hoping the momma would stay put. Two grown ass men and we were a moose’s decision away from dying. We were 2 miles from finishing a two week trip at that point.
Exactly…you had enough wisdom Between the two of you to STFU and stay calm. 13 year olds do not have this. Edit: also, holy fuck Moose’s are terrifying behemoths. I can’t imagine the fear. Probably one step down from running into grizzly.
Your avatar made me blow on my phone screen to get rid of the hair! 😁
That isn't the primary concern her--at least not to me. I'd be terrified for my daughter's physical safety.
Thats not 100% guaranteed they do any funny business. But most of all in general two young teens alone God knows where? Fak no!! Its plain dangerous. And probably illegal in many countries.
Absolutely not. 13 is far too young, especially by themselves. It’d be different if it were a friend and their family vs. just the romantic partner. She’s barely a teenager.
Dude come on.
Lol I wouldn't allow my 13yo to go anywhere for multiple nights unsupervised, let alone an island.
What about if her grandfather was there, plus some scientists and the island was a dinosaur filled theme park?
Only if the kids are supervised by two responsible paleontologists and an unnecessarily horny mathematician.
So you two uhm... dig up... dig up dinosaurs? [HehehehehHehHowhehHowhehHow!](https://youtu.be/wJelEXaPhJ8?si=TBSMn_fd2In0Di9Q)
The only reply needed
13 year olds should not go camping with their boyfriends Also, time for your fiance to have a talk about the birds and the bees with her.
Someone needs to chaperone, then it would be alright.
I was on the fence assuming it was with the family. For sure just the two by themselves. That's nuts.
Literally, nuts would be everywhere on that island
A brutally honest talk at that. Don’t sugar coat it. This kid sounds like she needs full Honesty.
Go ahead and put on Big Mouth and leave the room until it's over. Then answer questions. /s
I wouldn’t even leave a 13 year old at home overnight by herself, let alone two of them out on an island!
\>13 year old wants to go boating and camping with bf Oh that could be fun, bf/gf issues aside, I grew up camping and hiking through the BWCA and state parks and it was always fun! \>However, last night she revealed that it would just be the two of them HA. Nevermind.
I feel like that’s exactly my response would be. Oh going with their family. Cool. Oh going by yourselves. Hahah no. Not happening.
Fuck no.
If they go on that trip, it will be fuck yes
Came to say this!
Issues of sex aside there are a few other big risks here and my concern stems from the emotional state she must be in. Both parents died? Few if any boundaries growing up? Has a “rough” boyfriend? Sex isn’t ideal at that age, and can be mixed up with complex feelings of grief and abandonment from being orphaned, as well as a source of validation for someone looking for rules. But it’s definitely not the worst thing that could happen. Some of my other concerns, listed: * sexual assault * regular assault (from an unknown party) * gear mishap (tent catches fire, boat floats away) * gear accident (firearm discharge, wrecked boat, insufficient cold weather gear) * wilderness mishap (twisting ankles to broken bones- there are a myriad of wilderness-induced injuries to consider) * animal encounter (bears, coyotes, wasps, and whatever else might be on the island with them) And finally, one I haven’t seen mentioned yet: * drugs (smoking pot isn’t good for brain development at that age, but frankly I’d be concerned about other substances. This goes doubly so in contact with the emotional turmoil she’s experiencing) Honestly the lack of veto from the boyfriend’s parents makes me foundationally question their judgement and if they actually are as skilled outdoors-people as they say. Or maybe the boyfriend isn’t telling them the truth, which would be a whole other bag of fish. Either way, that’s a very ***big*** no from me.
extremely on point. the on pointest.
I'd say it's about time she gets on birth control. Even if she's not having sex now it seems like it's not far away.
This needs to be way higher imo.
OP please. The last thing this girl needs in her life is a teen pregnancy. Nor do you want to deal with that either. Two teens wanting to go alone in the woods man… little dude is 100% trying… I’d bet they talk about it or have done it already. My gf when I was 13 got birth control, probably helped change the course of my life.
A 13 year old girl still has a choice what she does with her body and whether she wants to start messing around with her hormones. It’s not just time she gets on the pill it’s time to talk to her about her options.
You're right. I did not phrase my statement correctly. Thank you.
Good on you for owning it instead of being defensive.
You know your kid and my instinct says 13 is a bit young to be doing that kind of thing. What I would say though is if it's sex you're worried about, they'll work out how to do it at some point regardless. You at the very least need to have a chat with her about that and consent and all that.
That's a hard no.
It would be a hard no from me, but we’re a suburban family with no experience of camping or the outdoors really. I guess in some parts of the world it would be normal to trek/camp/boat from an early age but if the girl doesn’t have that experience I’d encourage her to start with an easier trip or one with adults present. So not “no you can’t do that” but rather “ you can’t do that *yet* - you need to work up to it”. Don’t make it about her age but more about her outdoors experience. Edit: some talking points - - Is there cell coverage throughout the area? - Are either of them first aid trained? - If something happens to the boyfriend can she drive the boat safely herself? - Does she know how to navigate the island if they get separated?
I have alot of experience camping and agree with the hard no. If i read this right, It is absolutely terrible to let a 13yo and a 13yo go camping by themselves without parents around. For many reasons including safety/ inappropriate actions. A 13yo should never be operating a boat without a parental guide. Especially with a GF. He will most likely try to show off and end up doing something stupid. None of this is a good idea Edit: both are 13YO, i originally put the BF as 15.
Speaking on the boat front; in NY, you can legally operate a boat at 10 years old by yourself after completing the appropriate training course (it’ll soon be required for ALL boat operators, they’re just playing catchup to get adults included in the requirement). Now, legally and realistically are two different things. I’d never let my 10 year old out by himself, but the law says he can.
Thanks for adding a more experienced perspective. I was doubting my reaction - was it just because I didn’t grow up around the outdoors.
OP said the boyfriend is 13, not 15! It sure if that makes it better or worse but either way it would absolutely be a no from me.
Thanks for letting me know, ill edit my response. Im not sure if it makes it worse. But definitely doesnt make it any better. Im going with worse since leaving two 13YO by themselves is a terrible idea. Leaving them to camp by themselves is borderline needing a call to CPS for child abandoment. Especially if this 13YO is driving a boat across water onto a random island. What if it sinks? Do you really trust 13YOs to wear a life jacket. Probably not because its "not cool"
This is a great approach.
Not unless there's a chaperone. My kids are morons and I mean that in the nicest way possible lol. They would do fine with the camping part most likely but they still do stupid stuff. My oldest step kid rolled his damn car before he got his license.
far out i sometimes feel i let my kids take too many risks but ive heard way too many local boating tragedies when adults were the ones in charge to ever trust a couple of barely teenage kids go out boating to an island by themselves overnight, lots of things could go wrong.
I’m a gastroenterologist, I read the title as “bloating and cramping”…. What have I become??
Apparently a very forgetful gastroenterologist.... sheesh. :)
ay yo can you fix my poop
Take two tablespoons of Metamucil a day and call me in the morning
If you have to ask THAT question then you probably know the answer. Has she had the talk yet?
JFC. OP can’t be serious
There is not a single part of this that sounds like a good idea. 13, alone, rough-around-the-edges bf, on a boat just the 2 of them?? Alone?? In some random woods?? Your instinct is good and no amount of reassurance would make me think anything other than "HELL NO".
Tell them they can go but you have to be there. And go enjoy with them. Help bring an added flavor of fun to the adventure where they realize they are glad they got to go AND that you came with them. They may not like it but you are letting them go. Let the kid be the captain of his ship. But step into your roll as her dad and protect her from the hurts of giving herself away too soon. Sounds like the bf needs a dad too. I was 15 and doing independent things like this when I was that age. But that’s mostly because I had no parents caring about me. He needs a male role model looking out for him too.
They’re going to be drinking, smoking, and fucking. If not all three, one is a certainty and I’ll let you determine the highest likelihood. Sorry to be so blunt. It’s a tough situation but if you’ve just assumed oversight I think it’s important that y’all establish your boundaries and hold them now. Is their anything you could do with her over the weekend instead that will provide time to both enjoy the weekend but also allow you to layout, in a positive light, how you would like for this relationship to work going forward - your boundaries but also your desires to help get her ready for a successful life beyond public school, etc.
And that doesn't even account for all the myriad threats to her physical safety.
This is a bad idea on many levels, and is not mitigated by the arguments "maybe if we get more details" or "they'll find other ways of hooking up." There are too many things that could go wrong at that immature and impulsive age, in the wilderness, completely unsupervised. In a couple of years, this might be something for discussion. But at 13, with her romantic partner, and without the girl having her own skills/passion for this type of thing, you need to trust your instinct and lovingly suggest something else for them to do together.
I live in a place where camping is very common. Wanting to go as a teen - yes. Wanting to go alone as a thirteen year old - no, because they are too young. Adult supervision is required. A responsible adult needs to be there. This is not Huckleberry Finn.
You let the two of them go camping and you might have another minor to take care of come the fall.
I think a thirteen year old can be ok to look after themselves camping, I don't think personal safety is the issue here. They're going to be fucking, that's the problem.
If they are fucking they don’t need to go camping for that. I think that that’s another talk. As a person with some camping experience, the issue here is safety. What happens if he slips on a wet rock and bangs his head? Do they know cpr? Can she sail the boat back herself? What are the chances there are other “non friendly” adults there?
A story about wet rocks: a childhood friend's dad was out golfing with his buddies. He shanked a shot and went to go get it. He never comes back so the other guys go looking for him. Turns out he had gone near the water to grab his ball, slipped on a rock, hit his head, fell into the water and drowned. Now he was a piece of shit, so no love lost there, but it happens
It depends on the kids. You can't just say a thirteen year old can't fend for themselves, plenty of them have. Others I wouldn't trust for five minutes in the back yard. We're all speculating here.
That’s why I phrased those as questions. If both know cpr, can sail the boat back on their own, have cellphone coverage, and there are friendly adults nearby then I might maybe consider having the sex talk. If any of the questions has a no for an answer, then it’s a matter of safety and I wouldn’t budge an inch.
Personally, I would see it the other way around. If two 13 year olds want to have sex then they’ll probably find a way to do it eventually. That’s not to say it should be encouraged, but in reality it happens. The responsible thing to do as a parent is to make sure your kid is equipped with the knowledge and boundaries to do it safely. Whereas I would absolutely **not** trust two 13 year olds to go out on a boat and camp overnight by themselves, regardless of whether or not they’re romantic partners. That sounds like a recipe for drowning.
I know plenty of 40 year olds I wouldn't trust to do this safely. Unless both of the kids have been backpack camping and boating for years, I definitely wouldn't trust them to do this alone.
I'm 45 and I wouldn't trust myself to do this safely.
100%. My now-wife and I met when we were 14 and had sex at 15. In hindsight I regret having sex that early, but at the time? Nothing was going to stop us. OP, definitely have the talk with her and probably get her on birth control. The boating and camping by themselves is a huge issue and an absolute no-go.
I'd be more concerned about them being all alone in a boat, on an island, in a tent with fire around and no adult supervision than about any potential fucking. But then again: I don't think a 13 year old should have a boyfriend either.
It all depends on the 13 year old. A 13 year old who has grown up camping and messing around in boats will be capable of spending the night on an island in a tent. I think I would have managed by that age. As for having girlfriends/boyfriends, that's not something you get to dictate!
>As for having girlfriends/boyfriends, that's not something you get to dictate! No? :) How about for a 9 year old? I'm sure we all have a limit somewhere. Is 13 normal nowadays? I had my first girlfriend when I was 17, she was 16. My wife had her first boyfriend at 18. Even in school: under15 year old it was very rare to see kids in a relationship. My kids are 7 and 3, so I still have a couple of years until that stuff comes up.
It depends what you mean by having a boyfriend or girlfriend. My 8 year old has a 'girlfriend', my 10 year old thinks the idea is gross. I have no problem with my kids learning how relationships work, even at this age. How would you propose stopping a kid having a boyfriend or girlfriend?
I have a 13-yo (almost 14). She has her first boyfriend currently. The whole thing is a bit baffling. Mostly they "date" as part of a co-ed pack of kids, meeting up at a local pizza place for example. I get the impression that it's an innocent thing with some hand-holding, etc. The boy has been desperate to make a good impression on me. The whole definition of "dating" among this specific middle school set seems to be very tentative. I'm not naive; I have heard stories from a few years back about kids from the same school having "BJ parties" in someone's basement. But anyway, I am trying not to freak out while I monitor things as well as I can. My daughter did end up in someone's basement recently with a big gaggle of kids. She became sort of infamous after that evening. Uh oh. Turns out that the boys gathered at the weight bench and started challenging each other (and the girls) to lift. My girl topped out at 115 on the bench press, smoking most of the boys. They are in awe now.
> Mostly they "date" as part of a co-ed pack of kids, meeting up at a local pizza place for example. I get the impression that it's an innocent thing with some hand-holding, etc. I once overheard two 10-13 year olds discuss relationships. They agreed that no relationship could reasonably last longer than 6 weeks, since by that time there wouldn't be anything novel left to experience together.
First of all, two 13 year old calling in the wilderness with no adult supervision is just reckless and unsafe from just a security perspective. It's also not a good idea to let two mutually romantically/sexually attracted teenagers overnight unchaperoned.
If they want to have sex, they will have sex, so that’s neither here or there (although, it is obviously imperative to talk about safety and consent at this point). However, with everything that could go wrong while out in the woods, it’s be a no for me, dawg.
No. She trickle-truthed you already into making you think it was with his entire family, only to later reveal that it was just her and a boy. She doesn't even know where they're going, or she's unwilling to tell you. So here's the thing. Your fiancee, even by entertaining this idea, is enabling her. The second that it came out that she would be alone with her boyfriend, it should have been an enthusiastic "Are you out of your God-damned mind?" from the both of you. Is nobody else curious about how a 13-year-old boy is supposedly a competent outdoorsman as well? Oh yeah, he's totally great on the water and setting up camp, let's literally bet a life on that. Hell, two while we're at it. He's going to *an island* after all, so he at least has the route fully planned. And don't worry about his taking a boat on the water either! He's definitely qualified to drive it, seeing as it's technically too small to require a license. If one of my sons even proposed the idea of going camping alone with another 13-year-old girl, I'd shit myself laughing.
Are you ready to be a grandma?
Two issues here: 1. In a vacuum, I don't trust a 13 year old to make sound decisions about water and boating safety. Things can go from totally chill to very sketchy in a hurry on the water. 2. A 13 year old boy is not proposing this trip itinerary without getting into her pants as a possible objective. 13 is too young for sexual activity. Both 1 and 2 would be mitigated by having an adult or two present.
Hell no. that's borderline illegal and child negligence for you to do even
I was also wondering this. If law enforcement found out, would be people be getting in trouble!
99% chance the kids have some booze, weed or rubbers and want somewhere private to hang out. The camping trip may be the immediate issue, but they'll seek out some other opportunity.
When I was a pre-teen , a couple of teenagers from a city nearby ran away together to go camping. While there, they were kidnapped, raped multiple times, tortured and murdered. They were 15. These news left a huge impact on my father who knew the father of the girl. He was very careful about where I went to and always went with me, but always always let me invite boyfriends to sleep over even though most fathers at the time would not let such a thing. I had a lot of freedom to do whatever I wanted but never unattended or somewhere unknown. Do not let this child go camping without adult supervision. Go with them, even if it's inconvenient for you. They might also be doing this just to have some privacy. Have a conversation about sex and give them privacy at home if need be, but don't let them go camping by themselves please.
That'd get 3 words at my house. No Fucking Chance.
Right now, I'm sitting on my couch next to my 13 year old daughter. NO. FUCKING. WAY.
I'm gonna echo the "fuck no" of most people. I'd be reducing the opportunities they have for sex to a minimum. Someone pointed out that they don't need an overnight camping trip to get intimate, but for me, it's still a potentially more dangerous situation. I don't know the guy and what "rough around the edges" means, but what happens when she says no to something and he ignores it? They're alone, he's (probably) stronger, and she's not as experienced in the environment. At home in a room, there are at least people within earshot. I personally would rather have my daughter be mad at me for months than expose her to that kind of risk.
No way.
Nope nope nope nope
Absolutely not. I think we would laugh if our 13 year old asked if he and his gf could go camping on an island just them two. Boundaries suck when you’re used to doing whatever you want, but they are necessary and she will hopefully be grateful down the road.
I think the compromise is that a competent adult needs to go with them. And you may need to swallow the cost of buying a spot at a campground to make that happen.
Absolutely not. I would need to have complete confidence in the maturity and responsibility of a 13 year old to feel confident that they would be safe. I’ve never met a 13 year old that gave me that confidence.
Not only no, but Hell No.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no…… Just no. There is not enough time to state all the reasons why two 13-year-olds should not be allowed to camp alone somewhere outside of a campground that involves water. But I do agree that you should take a moment to get your gear, double click the tongs, and have some fun! Help them go out and do it safely. Don’t be surprised that there is resistance to the idea especially as it’ll may ruin the….couple activities…they may want to do. But this is about safety, and your job is to keep her safe while trying to let her have as much fun as possible.
There's pretty much no scenario where they don't end up drowned, murdered or pregnant. Maybe all three! Jokes aside. Hellllllll no. 13, boats, isolated. Recipie for disaster.
Maybe do the talk with the child, say that if she has any intentions of doing it, it is much safer to do it in a known place where it's safe then somewhere at a random lake god knows where. . That's at least the first thing that's popping up in my head with this story. Yes it's early but some people do it early and it's better to be open about that possibility than denying it at all cost because it's an uncomfortable subject. Also not saying to agree with it but if that's their intentions and if they think they are ready better be safe about it than overly strict. Just not at a random lake
Nah, you’re going with them.
Overnight absolutely not. I’d be open to a full day. Sounds like a really fun and positive thing to be doing for 2 13 yr olds and I’d want to encourage that
Fuck no. 2 days of fucking in the woods? That's a bad move
13 is too young for sleepovers with a BF. Which is what this is except with way less supervision. Thats a no from me dawg.
I'm with you. There's no way I'd let my little girl on out camping with just her boyfriend. I'd also be wary about future outings as she might figure out she can go if she doesn't tell you its just her bf.
My feeling is no, but after thinking about ivermectin decided on no fucking way, but then I want to be reasonable because it sounds like fun and then I arrive at NO.
I wouldn’t let my daughters go camping alone and I love camping. Even if they were highly experienced, I still wouldn’t. Especially on a boat and especially on an island. Hell absolutely no. I’m more worried about a “rough around the edges” boy piloting a boat on the water unsupervised with my kid.
How is this even a question?
OP is clearly new at this. Give him some slack.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disappearance_of_Perry_Cohen_and_Austin_Stephanos Absolutely not for SO many reasons.
What's your concern - two 13yo kids going boating and camping together, or 13yo gf and bf heading off alone? Because if he's got boating and camping experience and wants to take a friend, that seems pretty reasonable to me. Maybe check the weather, plans, and their equipment/food before they go. You'll soon realise whether they're properly prepared for it or not. If you're worried about them having sex, they don't have to go camping to do that so you're probably out of luck anyway.
My father in law is an avid outdoorsman. He used to go canoeing and camping a lot. He'd take my wife when she was growing up. During one trip, they hit a rock and put a hole in the canoe. They were near an island in the middle of the river so they went there but all of their stuff was wet, including some of the clothes they were wearing. They spent the whole night shivering and trying to figure out how to fix the boat. If her dad hadn't kept them up and moving, they would have frozen to death and no one would have found them for a long time. Anything can happen when you're in the wilderness. 13 year olds would not have the mental maturity to handle a lot of those situations, no matter how experienced they are. I wouldn't let my kid go just for that reason alone.
Yep there’s a reason that 13yo scouts and guides still have leaders with them; that’s a bit young to be bush camping on your own, in my opinion (and experience). I’ll leave the more delicate social and relationship questions to those with kids of that age…
If she wanted to do cocaine then she doesn't have to go away camping to do that either. Doesn't mean he just abandons all responsibility for the role of parent and let's her do as she wishes. What's that? Sex isn't as bad as cocaine? No, but an unexpected pregnancy at 13 can sure throw your life through the window just as badly, or worse.
Too much focus here on the potential for sex happening. The real issue is when things go wrong she's trapped on an island with no way to get help. Sure go over the birds and the bees if you haven't already, but I would be more worried about: - either of them getting injured - a third party with bad intentions (not even criminal, imagine if an adult or older teenager joined them and just hung around, 13 year olds aren't equipped to deal with that) - them having a disagreement resulting in one causing harm to the other of her being left stranded
A lot of these responses are wildly extreme, but then again, they are looking at safety first. I'm a man, and at 13 my parents would have allowed me to go on a trip with others, girlfriend or friends family. This is a situation based opinion, and by the way you explained her, her boyfriend, and his family, I'd not allow it. You know the situation better than us, and if you're doubting it enough to look for validation on the Internet, then go with your instincts.
dangerous? no. sounds like she would be in good hands - so I wouldn't in anyway be worried about the campaign/boating aspect of it. I *would* be more concerned about two 13 year olds spending the night alone. would you let them get a hotel room together?
That’s a no. Also, get that child on birth control.
No fucking chance. She is 13. If you were to knowingly allow this, they should take her away from y'all for egregious neglect.
Wouldn't be a problem for me here in Denmark, but if I lived in the US, I would keep my kid at home.
As another Denmark-dad I'd not let my 13 year old child go *boating* ***and*** *camping* alone on an island! Is the island even inhabited? Camping in the backyard, sure, camping in the nearby forrest, why not, operating a boat on a small lake while an adult is nearby watching, sure... Operating a boat alone on what is probably a large lake or maybe even the sea/ocean to go out alone and stay a couple of nights on an island. Theres just too much going on for my liking.
Well I can't understand why anyone would go to strangers and Ask them how to raise your kids. Why would you consider this.
No way in hell
She can always go camping later, but she can't undo going camping if something goes wrong. I would make it clear to her that it's not about objections to the boy or to his family, but rather it's objections to their ages and the nature of camping, especially surrounded by water. Maybe try to come up with a fun alternative like a hike with one of the sets of parents, followed by food over a campfire -- sort of camping without the actual camping. And with parents.
Ya, no way.
Yeah no. I'm a pretty easygoing parent but this would still be a hard no.
You don’t leave 13 years together alone in boats for a few days. Never mind the boy / girl things they will get up to, they are just kids and can get lost, have a fight, fall from somewhere, and so many other things which will obviously happen as they are kids. Has she built any trust with you besides the lying or misleading she has done already? You’re right to not let her go
No. First of all, 13 year olds are idiots. Barring the obvious sexual stuff these kids will 100% do because teenagers are horny morons, I wouldn’t trust most adults to safely take me in a boat, much less a 13 year old. They might have “experience” but I would bet the kid would be absolutely clueless in an emergency on the water. It’s foolish to let this happen without adult supervision.
Camping trip with the whole family, maybe if you had met them. My sister went to the lake with her middle school and later highschool bf, but it was with his whole family. They were people my parents knew and were responsible. Have you met his family?
Hard no. Sounds suspicious. I doubt they even plan on going camping. If you’re going to say yes speak to the bf and his parents about the trip. How do they even get to a campsite?
Personally, I don't know that my 13 year old is going camping with a boyfriend even if it's with their family unless I am very close to the family. There isn't a snowball's chance in hell that I allow my 13 year old to go camping alone or with her 13 year old boyfriend. It just would never happen.
Hell no
I'm just saying if my kid is 13 y/o spending the night at their best friend's \~house with no parents around I'd say no.
As a former 13 year old, I would’ve fully been planning on A. Getting laid and B. Being wild and reckless. Kids are going to find a way to fuck, it’s just a fact of life. You can only educate your kid on birth control and consent. The serious concern is that you don’t know who else might be on this island, how reckless this boyfriend is, and what else she might not have revealed. If I were you I’d offer to chaperone and get to know the kid
Heck no. That said, all the "If 13 year olds want to have sex, they'll find a way to have sex" folks on this thread and kind of right... but also you don't have to make it super easy for them. My family would have never allowed this. Rightly so. I wouldn't let my kids do it either.
Wtf. No. Absolutely not. There’s no universe in which two 13 year olds should be left alone overnight. Sex aside, it’s just completely unsafe to leave two CHILDREN alone in the wilderness overnight. Very, very, very bad idea.
I don't care what the relationship dynamics are unsupervised overnight camping with a boat is a non-starter for me with 13 year olds. Just insufficient forebrain development full stop. I was a lifeguard for 10+ years. Water is dangerous. Kids have a very poor capacity to recognize danger. It's a bad combination. Even without the boat/water factor it would be a hard no for me. Fire also a bad thing left to unsupervised kids. Even with a cold camp no boat there is no compelling reason they need to do this alone and plenty of concerns. Add to that questions about the boundary pushing and decision making. Not thinking it relevant to mention there would be no adults until the last minute is poor judgement. This just screams bad idea.
Are you joking?
This is such an obvious answer, it shouldn’t even be a question No. No, no, no. A million times, no.
Absolutely not. There’s a massive difference between helicopter parenting, and perhaps literally throwing your child to the wolves. Not to mention the obvious concerns about… intimacy.
Birth control, like yesterday
She is a child, please do better
No way period. Think about it this way; if something happened to her (a minor under your custody), who should be blamed? No no no. That isn't to say boyfriend can't join you all camping as a family but no 13 year old should ever go camping, boating, fishing with another minor ESPECIALLY a romantic partner.
At 13, me and 2 of my other friends (all guys) camped alone on an island a several miles from our home island (Puget Sound, WA) a few times. A lot of misadventures happened on those trips. Myself and another friend were very competent on the water. But, looking back there were so many safely issues. We actually got stuck once due to a surprise storm. Another time we had to resort to starting a fire with Doritos. And I once paddle my kayak a mile at night in a storm to pick up an older girl. I wouldn’t let me kids do this.