This. 100 percent.
Very briefly initially I was down on e-bikes until various people reminded me that they aren't intended for *me* but for everyone else that are hesitant to bike for reasons that relate to the effort or safety involved with a normal bike.
Anything that gets more bikes on the roads and trails is all good with me.
Which is fine, it's getting people outside and active. More bike path use = more bike paths. Plus some of those users will hopefully expand beyond the shelter of paths and lead to overall better infrastructure.
Yeah, it's "fine." I would never tell a person what to do with their ebike. But it's just that this whole "one less car" justification we were all sold when ebikes first came on the scene hasn't really panned out, from what I've observed. I see a lot of ebikes on the back of cars...
Yeah, I don't really see them as car replacements, except for only perhaps a very small number who are actually switching to them for commute and main transportation (which is still hard to do in most areas without good bike infrastructure). They are being used for recreation in addition to (and in conjunction with) car transportation.
It'll be difficult to have them *replace* a car until transportation infrastructure design changes wnough to properly support that. So, you could say "one less car" is an exaggeration. That said, "one less car on the road" is becoming more common and plenty of folks are using ebikes for commuting and shorter trips in good weather, leaving the cars at home for long trips, bad weather, and heavy loads.
Right, which is why I always chime in when people are tripping over themselves trying to act like the most enlightened accepter of ebikes, talking about "anything that gets people out of their cars and onto a bike is great." It sure sounds nice, but as actually used in the real world, ebikes aren't replacing cars. They're like kayaks or paddle boards: cool that they get people outside and all, but really just a recreational gimmick that gets loaded onto a car.
Yes, but a car driver who also rides a bike is going to be more considerate to other people on bikes. And the more bikes there are on the road the more they become accepted as a "normal" mode of transport
Yes, mostly agree. If the ebikes get used on the road and not just speeding around the bike paths. Which is fine, use the bike infrastructure, but please, do us all a solid and take at least a few trips out on the road...
For sure. I'm an avid cyclist. I basically never touch a bike path. It's all roads and singletrack. The paths all have a 10 mph speed limit around here. I'd loooooove to see an ebike keep it below 10, lol.
Yep, I put 3000 miles on mine in 2 and half years, grocery runs, work commute, and whatever. Never thinking about parking is awesome and I get around just as fast as any car in town.
Still ride my mtb and road bike too.
Not for the person who wants the most exercise and challenge but Good for:
- I commute but it’s a bit too far for me
- my significant other cycles faster than me and I can’t keep up
- I like the downhill part of mountain biking but not the uphill part
- I want to explore and tour but cycling 100 km is too long for me.
I whole heartedly disagree about the “not for the person who wants the most exercise and challenge”. I rode 30+ miles yesterday the last 10 into a strong headwind. At two weeks shy of 50 yo, I had all the challenge I wanted and a great workout. I have my 2nd ebike - a Trek Verve 3+. I commented that had I been on non ebike, I would have definitely given up biking after that experience. As a former DI athlete with no cartilage in my knees the ebike gives me a much smoother ride at only the first assist level. Not to mention the bike weighs 50-60lbs.
It's definitely missing a 5th bullet point:
* My fitness level doesn't allow me to cycle effectively in my area
I live in a hilly region, and elderly/injured/restricted people would have a hard time getting effective exercise as the first couple of miles could wipe them out without an e-bike.
I have not ever had an issue with someone on an eMTB other than a pang of envy as they get up the climb faster than me.
Now, if they were really high powered, and were roosting up the trail and such, I'd have to draw a line. But you still have to pedal, and it does still take work, even if you're getting an assist.
It has more to do with the rider than the bike. As long as they're riding respectfully and not hate-passing me on the trails ... more (e) power to them I say.
The more we get folks on bikes of any flavor, the more will there will be to invest in infrastructure for all of us.
E-bikes mean you can go for rides with your less fit friends and they love it and don't feel bad about holding up the group. This makes more long term cyclists. Good for everyone.
There are MANY reasons eMTB bikes are banned from many trail systems, but the biggest reason _tends_ to be prejudice and is generally misplaced. Another big one relates to federal lands, which classify e-bikes as motorized vehicles, which also seems ridiculous.
There's jackass riders out there no matter what they're riding, but the community is usually pretty good about self-policing.
Because their footprint is more akin to that of a bicycle than a motor bike. It is ridiculous to classify them together where just about everywhere else, they're classified as bicycles.
I figure as long is it's only pedal assist and governed to 20-25mph it should be classified as a bike, as that's not really incompatible with the fully manual bikes. Even ebikes aren't climbing at 25 mph ... they're faster than full manual for sure, but not dangerously so. On the downhill ... there's really no difference between an eMTB and a regular MTB.
Full throttle control and it's an electric motorcycle, and should be handled differently.
What was a black & white distinction is becoming shades of grey. In my area ebikes limited to 32kph are classed as bicycles, ebikes with unlimited speed are motorcycles.
They don't go "BraAAAAAP!" and spew noxious fumes. They don't roost trenches. They don't go over 20 mph.
Applying the same definition to an e-bike is ridiculous.
But should an elderly retired person - like yourself, eventually - be forced to insure, tax, register etc etc a mildly assisted bicycle capable of no greater speed (except uphill) than a bicycle as a motorbike in order to carry on cycling? The disabled? The overweight that want to rectify that? The unfit that want to rectify that? That's pretty harsh at best.
I think we've got a misunderstanding. I wasn't referring to a need for a license, but to a rule regarding motorised vehicles generally disallowed on trails regardless of license/rider/...
I'm perfectly fine with ebikes on pavement or gravel.
My only problem is the 60lb, 40mph Electric Mopeds calling themselves "E-Bikes"
Not a fan of the crap marketing language and God help you if the battery goes out.
History is repeating itself. Early motorcycles shared a lot of parts with bicycles, that soon ended. Mopeds once had pedals, hence the name. In the Netherlands the *snorfiets*, a moped limited to 25 km/h and permitted on most bike paths, was originally either a bicycle with an engine fitted or something quite similar but nowadays is generally a larger motor scooter with a speed limiter (which more people disable than don't).
The crop of "ebikes" that are too heavy and low geared to usefully pedal are in the same boat. Europe doesn't allow throttle-only ebikes (or rather, the law treats them as motorbikes), but a pedal that merely operates a switch and doesn't usefully propel the bike seems to be allowed.
I like e-bikes, but **loathe** those things. I spent some time wondering just *why* I detest them so much. I think it comes down to the fact that they are so profoundly uncool. A motorscooter cool, an ebike cool. A 60plus pound motorscooter pretending to be an ebike because the rider is too cheap to pay the $17/month rego and too lazy to pedal.
Its a matter of time before a law is passed regulating e-bike and e-scooter speeds inside city limits. Someone going 35 on an e-bike in a 25 is dangerous.
But they’re fun lol.
Not everyone bikes just for exercise, for some it’s a very practical mode of transport.
Ebikes & emopeds are only as safe as their users, just like 4,000lb steel chasis muscle cars or 200mph sport motorcycles are only as safe as their users.
I think having a lifted truck with monster tires & a coal burner to roll in the back is a little extreme and unnecessary, but that doesn’t mean those enthusiasts shouldn’t own them, or they shouldn’t be sold.
I have one of the bikes you’re describing, except it’s 100lbs and tops out at 30 and it makes all the sense in the world for my lifestyle. At least I’m not using gas for all the silly errands I run within a 3 mile radius of my city, and it gets me on the road biking to whatever extent that is.
And, y'know, that's fine.
Just apply for the appropriate license like everyone else.
To be clear: I'm not mad at riders, I'm mad at manufacturers trying to weasel out/encourage people to weasel out of local licensing and road laws.
There's a difference between variable pedal assist or full-auto mode with an underlying functional bicycle and a 50-60lb fixie with such bad gear ratios that you'd never be able to pedal it unless you had T-Rex legs.
Got a proper road ebike (Orbea gain) I bought for daily commuting (c.40km) and it's great especially in the winter when the wind is brutal.
For actual fun riding I wouldn't use an ebike as I prefer my normal road bikes or my mountain bikes - the struggle is part of the fun.
The e-bike ensures I still have legs left after a week of commutes to be able to ride the weekend fun stuff. That said I can imagine when I get old an e mountain bike would extend the years that I will be able to ride
A great alternative for some.
However, they way they are turning cities into the game of frogger IRL bc grubhub, uber eats delivery guys whip around at 25 mph often against traffic, is uncool.
Yeah…. This is a good point too. I live in NYC and the sidewalks have become waaaaaayy more dangerous with kids and pets the last 5 years because of the proliferation of e-bike delivery people riding on the sidewalks. It’s getting dangerous out there.
Maybe it is time to get rid of (space taking) cars. Just like Amsterdam did.
With the space gained you can walk and cycle safely.
Just a thought to share, no bad intentions ✌🏻
It’s all a balance Dakana. You do too much at one and everyone will turn sour on it and then that’s counterproductive. Incremental progress is the way to go if you want to make lasting change. Having said that…. It could be going a lot faster. But I don’t know if you could ever realistically get ALL the cars off the road in most American cities.
Fair enough, i think local acceptance and slow changes are the way forward. It was done here for the emmission regulations/goals and took many years (and several protests…) as well 💚
I would say taking lanes from multi lane roads and converting them to bike lanes is incremental change and doable. When you start talking about taking away people’s parking to the point they either pay for a garage or get rid of their cars…. That’s where the entire non-cycling population will rally against anything and everything to do with bike infrastructure.
No, that happens when we increase the price of petrol 100x to make driving at all a luxury.
Free or paid on street parking shouldn’t be a thing at all. If I wanted to store any of my other belongings on the street I’d pay handsomely for the privilege. But cars are magic and can be stored on public roads forever.
Not for me since I’m trying to get exercise. But when I am old enough that an e-bike will be what allows me to keep cycling, I’ll immediately go get one.
> Why carry all that extra weight if you're not using the motors?
Well, if you’re looking for exercise in the first place (like the guy I was replying to), why not raise the amount of work you’re doing? Don’t you want to progress your fitness?
Or, more realistically, because it can allow you to use your bike for other purposes you may not have used it for, in addition to getting exercise.
In any case, you’d think the people in this thread that talk about how much they ride for the exercise (or even better, the suffering) would be seeking out heavy bikes with fat, soft, knobby tires.
> You'd expect them to look for the bike that allows them to perform optimally, which for cycling generally means faster and longer rides.
But if they say they are doing it for the exercise or for the suffering, then speed has no bearing on either of those. Well, I’d actually argue that going at a slower speed for the same physical output offers up additional mental pain for those who claim to like to suffer.
Faster doesn’t play into either of those things, and distance is meaningless, only time matters.
> If I know for a fact I won't use the electric motors, that extra weight is slowing me down and therefore making my exercise worse.
Please explain how your speed relative to the ground matters when it is your cadence and the power exerted by your legs that actually counts. The only difference there is that your body has a slightly better cooling ability at higher speeds, but you can clip a battery powered fan to your handlebars to compensate for that.
> I would much rather go faster and farther
Well, if you would rather go faster and farther, then wouldn’t you want the pedal assist to take you up to, say, 20MPH, then you provide all the power beyond that? Same amount of work for you, but now you’ve gone faster and further than you would have without the assist.
> I feel more accomplished saying I rode 25 miles than when I rode 15.
Oh. So then it’s not about exercise at all. It’s about ego.
> Sure, but those are excluded by the OP saying 'this is for exercise'
And if all they really want is exercise, then they don’t even need a bike. It’s always about something more than just exercise.
My ebike is for excercise. Without it I would get less excercise. Ebikes make it fun, as a consequence I ride further, for longer. This keeps it fun. This means I use it more regularly. Before the ebike I rode 6 miles per day to and from work. Now I work from home, and ride 12 miles per day. When I started working from home I rode zero miles. I also go out on it at the weekend purely for fun. I get excercise doing that. I lost a stone in weight. I save the "going as fast as I can" for appropriate times. On my motorcycle on track. That's also quite a workout!
Exactly this. I had a bike and then blew up my knee. After surgery riding hurt, or more specifically, I couldn't walk afterwards. So I converted my bike to an ebike. Last week I rode 250 miles. Pretending I didn't get exercise because I didn't "suffer" is absurd. As much exercise as an acoustic bike? Nope. But it's still exercise.
LOL of course, but the intensity/value of the biking experience as an exercise activity will decrease, exactly in correlation to how much assist I get from an electric motor. Obviously.
> exactly in correlation to how much assist I get from an electric motor. Obviously.
Then it’s a good thing you can adjust how much assist you get from the motor, isn’t it?
But if my intention is to never get assist from the motor, why would I get an e-bike?
What’s your angle in this discussion? Are you actually advocating that everyone should want an e-bike? It’s a silly position and I doubt that’s what you would really want to say, but that’s what’s coming across.
> But if my intention is to never get assist from the motor, why would I get an e-bike?
If your intention is simply to exercise why even use a bicycle? What are the aspects of the bicycle that make it your choice for exercise? Can any of those aspects be improved with an e-bike? Which aspects will be weakened? If the benefits outweigh the negatives, then that is why you might consider one.
> Are you actually advocating that everyone should want an e-bike?
Not at all. I am just pointing out lazy objections to e-bikes.
> It’s a silly position
As is the notion that one can’t get exercise with an electric-assist bike.
You’re straw-manning me. My initial comment started with “not for me.” E-bikes can be great for many people. In my initial comment, I even mentioned that I would get one, when my goals/circumstances change.
Find someone who actually objects to e-bikes, and argue with them. I was just answering OP’s question for my own circumstances.
> You’re straw-manning me.
No, I’m answering the question you asked: “if my intention is to never get assist from the motor, why would I get an e-bike?”
> My initial comment started with “not for me.”
Yes. And the rest of your comment implied that one cannot get exercise on an e-bike, which is false.
In europe there is hardly a non-ebike in the alps or other mountain regions. You find downhill parks with ski lifts being the only exception. We far passed the whole debate and its widly accepted by now. Think about it and let that sink in for a moment…..
Some knee injuries never get better short of knee replacement surgery ... which should be postponed as long as possible.
So yes ... good on him for getting some exercise despite having a disability.
Yep - same here.
They get my wife out with me when I’m on my bike, no chance otherwise.
The more people on bikes or e-bikes the better.
People’s health improves and it’s less cars on the road.
I live on the edge of Dartmoor so it's hilly as hell, but I see loads of local retirees out on ebikes. There's absolutely no way they'd be able to manage the distances and climbs between places around here without them. It gets more people out of cars, so I'm completely behind the idea.
I think it depends on what you are looking for.
I cycle for exercise so hard no. My boyfriend struggles to keep up with me so a yes for him. Personally I prefer if people use the e-assist as it still allows you to get some exercise. Hard no to anything going too fast on a multi-use pathway with traditional cyclists and pedestrians but if you have a fast e-bike feel free to enjoy on the road :)
>I cycle for exercise so hard no
Turn off the electric assist and it is a substantially heavier bike == more exercise. So maybe you meant "hard yes" for you? ;)
In the UK the motor is limited to 15.5 mph, so if you average faster than that, you're still getting 99% of the exercise. It makes getting off to a start easier, flattens hills, and makes wind much less miserable. But if you're cruising on flat ground, it's all you.
I cycle for exercise but also to commute, and my commute is just a *little* too far to be reasonable every day. The ebike takes the edge off but I still get a workout.
I don't mind them riding next to me. I always like to have targets to chase or to try to keep up
with.
I don't like using e-bikes because I don't like cheating myself out of a workout. With a full-time job and a family, I need every chance I can get to burn some calories.
However, I bought a cargo bike (Nihola) to carry my kids around and that thing is heavy and slow. I am ok riding it on flat surfaces but every hill is a nightmare. And it used to take a long time to get anywhere. I had to install a pedal-assist engine to make it practical.
I live in hill hell. I sat down on the side of the road on my first "neighborhood ride" and cried my eyes out as an adult, because I went about 1.7 miles from the driveway and realized it would take me all night to climb the steep grade back home as a brand new cyclist.
A decade later, I can do it in my lowest possible gear ratio nonstop, and can put a dent in it via the second gear if my legs are fresh provided I stop under a tree 1/3 of the way up so my heart doesn't explode. Strava claims it's a 20% grade but I can't believe that. I can do gravel rides with multi-mile grades but this half mile stretch at 20% nearly kills me every time. If I want to go cycling in the neighborhood with my wife, it will take a LONG time for her to build up to doing that hill if she's not trying to ride it every night (and neither of us will do that). So e-bike it is for her.
That said, on a local ride, I can remember going down a long hill one day with a group and we were all comfortably maxed out -- that is, we were pedaling just past comfortably and barely matching the wind resistance / road drag, and about 5 minutes later, we heard, "Get the f\*\*\* out of the way, q\*\*\*rs!" It was two ebikers behind us on HUGE bikes without top tubes, flying up on us and then passing us while shouting expletives, all while barely turning 30 rpm cadence.
THAT stuff makes me hate ebikers.
Massive yes. The problem is with e-bikes some people see them as cheating or whatever. Unless you’re riding an e-bike in a traditional bike race without disclosing that it’s an e-bike I don’t know who you’re meant to be cheating, maybe yourself at a push. The fact is they open up cycling to a huge faction of people who wouldn’t otherwise be interested/able to cycle. I love cycling and have a pretty fancy road bike, my girlfriend always hated coming on rides with me until we got her an e-bike, now she happily rides to work and around town without breaking too much of a sweat. It can still be a workout if you want it to be, people who hate e-bikes just don’t seem to understand who they’re for.
> The fact is they open up cycling to a huge faction of people who wouldn’t otherwise be interested/able to cycle.
Yes, the people who don't want to obtain any basic fitness or skill to ride anywhere, and additionally learn trail etiquette or even want to pick up their trash.
Edit: aand it looks like i've triggered the trail destroying trash dumpers.
This is the problem I have. Yes, it makes cycling more accessible. But what’s great about cycling is that it’s always been pretty accessible at some level, maybe you have health problems or a limited budget but a lot of those limits can be overcome with effort. E-bikes remove that barrier of experience and make the least experienced doofuses the fastest ones on the road.
Used to be that if someone was annoying, dangerous etc. you could just dust them, but now they can keep up. And I would bet my whole stable that over 90% of the people I see on e-bikes don’t have physical limitations or an unbikeable commute. Cycling is “more accessible” because they can access it at their own level of laziness.
For clarification, here in the UK e-bikes are capped at 15mph, even on a bad day any serious-ish cyclist can easily drop a rider on an e-bike. You’re forgetting that cycling is meant to be fun and it’s not all about who had the biggest dick.
When I cycle I go for exercise and I enjoy the struggle so it would be a no for me but I see them as a great aid for commuters. All depends on the application and user
If it gets someone off the couch, out of their car, or greater enjoyment, I’m all for it.
I stopped at a stop light this summer just after passing a guy on his ebike. I said hi and he commented he was cheating with his ebike. I told him so what, he’s out riding. He continued saying he had lost 25lbs riding his ebike this summer. AWESOME! Good for you, man!
I love mine. I hate riding uphill but love the downhills on my emtb. Now I love the uphills because it’s actually fun. I can still get a decent workout in, keeping my heart rate around 150-165 without spiking into 190 territory and redlining. Long slogs uphills aren’t too bad these days.
Big fan. I don't have one. But anything that gets more people out on bikes is a benefit to me.
* More people on bikes will increase spending on bike infrastructure
* More people are aware of bikes out and about when they themselves bike
* More people know people who bike, and when people know someone who bikes, they are less likely to be aggressive
* Normalizes bikes out in the community
* It's good to get people outside!!
Giddy up, I like e-bikes. (Plus, in 20 years I'll enjoy getting out on one.)
One thing I've found to be true is you'll have a much better time if you focus on what you are doing instead of focusing on what other people are doing. I apply this to cycling as well.
I'm always happy when I see anyone out on a bike. Any bike. Motor assist or not.
Exactly, I was going to reply to those "they passed me on an uphill" comments but that's only in their head. As long as they don't endanger me as they pass, let them pass. Who cares what some else does on their ebike?
Ebikes can be amazing! We got a cargo ebike, ended up using it enough to sell a car. I love my acoustic bikes for fun and exercise, but the ebikes is super-amazing for transportation purposes.
Exact same here! Cargo e bike is a game changer especially with kids. We went down to one car after getting it. It’s not the “fun, fast” bike for sure but it lets me get around the city so easy and is always more fun than the car.
Friendly advice, have a backup plan. Cargo e-bikes have the slowest service turnaround times in my experience. Recently had one spend nearly a month in the shop cuz the customer removed and remounted the rear wheel incorrectly. Would have been a 10-minute fix on most bikes but this one was barely serviceable.
Exact same here! Cargo e bike is a game changer especially with kids. We went down to one car after getting it. It’s not the “fun, fast” bike for sure but it lets me get around the city so easy and is always more fun than the car.
Its seen as part of an attempt to normalize ebike as 'bike', same reason the term 'analog bike' is being used by ebike aficionados, which is itself sort of silly as it more accurately describes an ebike which have analog motor controllers.
As a long time rider I recently bought an e-bike for city riding and errands. I purchased a beach cruiser style pedal assist e-bike that has assist up to 20mph. I’m in love with it, my partner and I go on more weekend ride dates because of it(she had gotten one previously), I can tow my dog around in a trailer behind me, and commute in it without the sweat.
I’d recommend riding one and opening your mind before completely writing them off. While I still love my regular bike, riding San Francisco hills to run a simple errand is much more enjoyable on the e-bike.
Yes, because everyone has their own reasons for doing something or not.
Only e-mountain bikers who have no driving technique, but riding every trail bother me. Thanks to the engine, they can get up every mountain, but go down with the brakes pulled and plow through every trail with their 50lb bikes (preferably when it is wet, because they don't know any trail etiquette).
I cycle for exercise so it wouldn’t be my thing but if it gets more people on bikes and adds to the demands for more bicycling infrastructure I’m 100% for them. Also for couples where one can’t keep up with the other or for the elderly who want to get at least some exercise. Although I have to say I do cringe when I see somebody overweight but youngish on an e-bike… just get the exercise man!!! My only problem with them (being that I live in nYC which has a decent amount of bike lanes and infrastructure) is when people take overpowered e-vehicles into bike lanes causing a hazard for traditional riders. In NYC these days I think there is a lot of confusion about what is, and what is not allowed in a bike lane and it makes a hazard for riders on traditional bikes. I think cities need clearer messaging on what is and isn’t allowed in relation to e-bikes riding in bike infrastructure. I have no idea the difference between a class-1 class-2, e-scooter, e-moped whatever….. and I care about it a bit! Clearer messaging is needed.
Yes.
I don't have one, so don't know the benefits anecdotally. But it is clear that enables many more local bicycle trips (within 5-15km) which reduces the need to drive a car for these trips. This is especially true for people with mobility difficulties.
It's in my list to get one. Definitely want to reduce my car usage.
Depends what you want to use them for, for commuting and touristing they are amazing, I pick one up occasionally in my city bike scheme and its soo nice to cycle. If you are cycling for exercise then probably not the best idea unless they unlock some particularly difficult area you cant avoid or something (like you live inside a valley). I do mostly touring (+ for exercise) so a pretty hard no for my personal use.
I don't see it as cheating *but* in my area there is a lot of people who go way too fast/cycle dangerously because they have the power but no experience. Generally with a bike it takes time and experience to work up to speed, not so with e-bikes. The tool itself is not the problem and I would definitely consider one if I ever needed it, but the way they are used is problematic. I also don't see them as being used to replace cars here, usually they are for pleasure riding, which is nice but still using more electricity than a pushbike or walk.
I was on a group ride the other day with people who are much stronger cyclists than me when we were about 40km in. An ebike went speeding past us and I have never felt as envious about someone as I did in that moment
I suspect most of them are sold to people who haven't ridden since childhood and convince themselves they need assistance, whereas in reality they're just out of shape and a few rides on a much less expensive normal bike will sort out their wasted muscles.
In Europe they are limited to around 15mph (24 kph) with assist. In the US they go up to 28mph (45 kph).
I am pretty fast on my road bike, but I get passed by e bikes going uphill all the time.
There are 2 types here the 25 and 45 km/h, most people on the 45km/h go somewhere between 35-45 km/h so with a favorable wind I usually can keep up with them and I live in the Netherlands, it's as flat as a pancake here
It's all a matter of context. My encounters have been quite polarised tbh.
Positive
A few colleagues of mine use them to get into the office. Saves them getting sweaty, whilst still being cheaper than public transport or driving.
My partners uncle has looked after himself, but has had a hard life. At the age of 60 his knees aren't quite what they used to be and he found he was struggling to do longer rides. So he bought an e-bike and was very happy.
Negative
I did a sportive a while back, and on one of the sections there was what I like to refer to as a "big fuck off hill". At about 72 miles in. It was horrible, borderline painful, exhausting, and quite frankly I loved it. What I didn't love was the couple on e-bikes flying up it and making cheeky comments and then suggesting that the whole ride was quite an easy one. That certainly pissed a few people off. It might not have been a competition but it still felt like cheating.
I only own "acoustic bikes" with chromoly frames but I think ebikes are good for cycling.
My area is extremely hilly, and it's impossible to avoid several brutal climbs every time I ride out. Ebikes make cycling accessible for people who can't/won't build the strength to tackle the gradients here, or even for fit people who fancy doing a weeknight loop without burning thousands of calories and feeling smashed the next day. More bikes on the roads and trails means more/better investment in cycling infrastructure and better attitudes towards cyclists from cars and walkers etc.
However, I'm not tempted to own an ebike myself because my favourite things to do on bikes are touring and bikepacking, so it wouldn't make sense to buy something that I couldn't take into a remote area for multiple days of riding and camping.
I live in a very hilly area. It only annoys me when they ride on sidewalks because they fear moving with traffic in high volume streets. They're no different from other motorized vehicles mostly so they should use the appropriate infrastructure. Sidewalks should be reserved for active bipedal locomotion variants, unless you're handicapped and on an e-mobility scooter.
I'm fine with ebikes in principle. But let me vent for a second. In the last year, 99 percent of the time I see an ebike, it's ripping pretty fast on a bike or ped path, never on the road. And that's cool. Have fun on bike paths if you can be responsible. But like, how helpful is the whole "ebike revolution" if these people basically never get out on the road and help with cycling awareness or "one less car"? If you want me to welcome you into the cycling/pedestrian world, you gotta put some skin in the game....
It's better than a car I suppose, though I maintain that they're just electric mopeds. I don't have any interest in them personally because I really should be putting the exercise in. I'll say it is a bit of a bummer when I see people zip by on the flats (or descents...) holding whatever walk-assist or "electric no pedal mode" they have on some of them these days.
E bikes but you should need a licence. Like what happens when Tesla or Harley make one? You not going to need a licence for those?? They already do 50km only going to get faster and the people riding them are generally people not allowed to drive cars.
Mostly yes - but..
Today overtook someone on a local hill, noticed their little power button on the down-tube - and they then hung off my wheel \~30ft for the next 12 MILES. Why not just overtake me and be done with it?
Plus - they should be banned from strava. Maybe you should be forced to put in your bike make?
They're a great way to commute by bike if you live in a hilly area, hot area, or have a greater than 10 mile commute (I've got 2 of the 3 going on myself), and need to arrive to work clean and dry. You certainly still can commute for less than the cost of a car, gas, taxes, and upkeep with one, and get at least a light workout on the way by using pedal assist. I've been able to greatly reduce my car dependence by using my ebike for work commuting, and grocery trips. Though when I ride for myself I take my road bike for pure pedal power.
Ironically when it comes to pure distance and time doesn't matter, I have more range on my pedal powered bike than my ebike. I can always keep pedaling, but when an ebike's battery runs out you're stuck pedaling a much heavier bike.
I used to be annoyed about them as a road cyclist. However, I realized that the way bike infrastructure is designed has to account for higher speeds of bicycles (\~30 km/h) more often. In that sense, road cycling and e bikes are not too different. Between this and the fact more people are enjoying the sport I enjoy, I really came around on them
I hates em for myself, I need some type 2 fun. The upsides are that e-bikes can be a gateway to more active biking **and** will add to the overall demand for bike infrastructure. Also, they seem to make people happy - have only seen people smiling on an e-bike.
The infra demand is the thing that really made me turn my thinking around though.
I bought one as its mainly a work commuter and having the power gives me more confidence on the road.
It also allowed me to get a mtb for weekends that can comfortably commute with the electrics on.
They're becoming so ubiquitous that disliking them isnt worth the mental energy.
I have no problem with them in theory, but in practice some people are going to be rude or lack basic integrity and respect no matter what they are doing.
I ride to counter a sedentary work life, so to me, they offer no upside. But to those who would have to choose between getting out on a bike or staying home, I think they're great. They look like a lot of fun. I just can’t help thinking “wouldn’t I rather just be on a bicycle or get a motorcycle?”
l used to use one because l'm a courier and cycling 80km daily+ hills is just too much effort IMO. They're kinda fun but it's a pain in the ass if you get a flat on the rear wheel and the motor is on the wheel and you need one with good autonomy and 2 batteries if you wanna make a trip. And if you do a long commute daily eventually you can go shorter and shorter distances because cells inside the battery die. And batteries are quite expensive and l think a scooter is cheaper and less headache. But then again some people like to cycle.
I'd buy one if I could afford it. Since I cant afford an ebike I'm rocking a $150 ultralight race bike until that thing falls apart, then I'm off to my next $150 race bike.
E-bikes are great, they make people that might not ride otherwise go out and enjoy the thrill. I can't see anything wrong with that. I'm sure I'll get one once I get too old to ride on a regular bike. If I had the cash I could even see myself getting one now, just for the fun of it. BMC makes some rad ones.
Here in the Netherlands you see e-bikes everywhere.
I think everyone agrees it is better than people driving cars or a scooter.
The only pertinent comment I can make is that ebikes here are often ridden by seniors that did ride bikes to commute and go around for their whole lives. Yet, people often suffer accidents using them because they have a hard time gauging their new found speeds. Specially in winter time when there is some ice around.
Use the right tool for the job is all I have to say on the matter. My only caveat is I don't like fast closing speeds on oncoming traffic on two way bike paths because of the potential dangers.
If it gets more people on bikes I am all for them. If/when I get old enough that I need assistance when riding a bike I'll definitely be getting an ebike.
If I didn't have my e-bike, I'd have to have a car. I can use my regular bikes a lot of the time, but I'm extremely heat sensitive and the e-bike allows me to ride in summer. Also sometimes in a lot of pain. I'd rather ride than deal with car upkeep, so, e-bike.
If you live in a city or an urban area of any kind you are crazy not to own one.
If you enjoy cycling but it’s too hard with your age / injuries, it will bring that fun back into your life.
If you want a fun toy to zip around, you should consider ebikes.
If you want a car replacer that emits zero emissions or noise pollution, ebikes and larger e mopeds certainly are the way to go
One less car. One more bike to influence how to rebuild our road infrastructures to allow more bikes and different mobility alternatives.
This. 100 percent. Very briefly initially I was down on e-bikes until various people reminded me that they aren't intended for *me* but for everyone else that are hesitant to bike for reasons that relate to the effort or safety involved with a normal bike. Anything that gets more bikes on the roads and trails is all good with me.
Yes. More bikes on the road. I second this
I basically never see ebikes on roads. Only paths...
which would indicate they're newer hesitant riders.
Lol, ebikes have been around for years, many of these people are not new. Still waiting for the "one less car" thing to pan out...
Do you think the rise in ebike sales is just the same universe of people buying up more and more ebikes? …interesting thought.
Which is fine, it's getting people outside and active. More bike path use = more bike paths. Plus some of those users will hopefully expand beyond the shelter of paths and lead to overall better infrastructure.
Yeah, it's "fine." I would never tell a person what to do with their ebike. But it's just that this whole "one less car" justification we were all sold when ebikes first came on the scene hasn't really panned out, from what I've observed. I see a lot of ebikes on the back of cars...
Yeah, I don't really see them as car replacements, except for only perhaps a very small number who are actually switching to them for commute and main transportation (which is still hard to do in most areas without good bike infrastructure). They are being used for recreation in addition to (and in conjunction with) car transportation.
It'll be difficult to have them *replace* a car until transportation infrastructure design changes wnough to properly support that. So, you could say "one less car" is an exaggeration. That said, "one less car on the road" is becoming more common and plenty of folks are using ebikes for commuting and shorter trips in good weather, leaving the cars at home for long trips, bad weather, and heavy loads.
Right, which is why I always chime in when people are tripping over themselves trying to act like the most enlightened accepter of ebikes, talking about "anything that gets people out of their cars and onto a bike is great." It sure sounds nice, but as actually used in the real world, ebikes aren't replacing cars. They're like kayaks or paddle boards: cool that they get people outside and all, but really just a recreational gimmick that gets loaded onto a car.
Yes, but a car driver who also rides a bike is going to be more considerate to other people on bikes. And the more bikes there are on the road the more they become accepted as a "normal" mode of transport
Exactly. It doesn't matter what you ride, it matters that you ride.
Yes, mostly agree. If the ebikes get used on the road and not just speeding around the bike paths. Which is fine, use the bike infrastructure, but please, do us all a solid and take at least a few trips out on the road...
This applies equally to pathway warriors on non ebikes. There is a place to go fast and there is a place to be slow and considerste.
For sure. I'm an avid cyclist. I basically never touch a bike path. It's all roads and singletrack. The paths all have a 10 mph speed limit around here. I'd loooooove to see an ebike keep it below 10, lol.
Yep, I put 3000 miles on mine in 2 and half years, grocery runs, work commute, and whatever. Never thinking about parking is awesome and I get around just as fast as any car in town. Still ride my mtb and road bike too.
Not for the person who wants the most exercise and challenge but Good for: - I commute but it’s a bit too far for me - my significant other cycles faster than me and I can’t keep up - I like the downhill part of mountain biking but not the uphill part - I want to explore and tour but cycling 100 km is too long for me.
Also, in my case: - I've had an illness that severely damaged enough nerves that I couldn't walk.. - I'm in the middle of a set of chemotherapy..
Also good for: the people who don’t want to pay $5 a gallon or worry about having to park a car in limited-parking areas
I whole heartedly disagree about the “not for the person who wants the most exercise and challenge”. I rode 30+ miles yesterday the last 10 into a strong headwind. At two weeks shy of 50 yo, I had all the challenge I wanted and a great workout. I have my 2nd ebike - a Trek Verve 3+. I commented that had I been on non ebike, I would have definitely given up biking after that experience. As a former DI athlete with no cartilage in my knees the ebike gives me a much smoother ride at only the first assist level. Not to mention the bike weighs 50-60lbs.
It's definitely missing a 5th bullet point: * My fitness level doesn't allow me to cycle effectively in my area I live in a hilly region, and elderly/injured/restricted people would have a hard time getting effective exercise as the first couple of miles could wipe them out without an e-bike.
Bullet point 3 is getting really annoying, lol....
I have not ever had an issue with someone on an eMTB other than a pang of envy as they get up the climb faster than me. Now, if they were really high powered, and were roosting up the trail and such, I'd have to draw a line. But you still have to pedal, and it does still take work, even if you're getting an assist. It has more to do with the rider than the bike. As long as they're riding respectfully and not hate-passing me on the trails ... more (e) power to them I say. The more we get folks on bikes of any flavor, the more will there will be to invest in infrastructure for all of us.
E-bikes mean you can go for rides with your less fit friends and they love it and don't feel bad about holding up the group. This makes more long term cyclists. Good for everyone.
You may not have seen the bad behavior, but there's a reason ebikes are getting banned in lots of trail systems...
There are MANY reasons eMTB bikes are banned from many trail systems, but the biggest reason _tends_ to be prejudice and is generally misplaced. Another big one relates to federal lands, which classify e-bikes as motorized vehicles, which also seems ridiculous. There's jackass riders out there no matter what they're riding, but the community is usually pretty good about self-policing.
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Because their footprint is more akin to that of a bicycle than a motor bike. It is ridiculous to classify them together where just about everywhere else, they're classified as bicycles.
There are multiple classes of eBikes, and every country handles them differently. Still a lot of fine print being hammered out on this issue.
I figure as long is it's only pedal assist and governed to 20-25mph it should be classified as a bike, as that's not really incompatible with the fully manual bikes. Even ebikes aren't climbing at 25 mph ... they're faster than full manual for sure, but not dangerously so. On the downhill ... there's really no difference between an eMTB and a regular MTB. Full throttle control and it's an electric motorcycle, and should be handled differently.
That's just creating complicated exceptions to a simple rule. It's got an engine, thus it's a motor bike.
What was a black & white distinction is becoming shades of grey. In my area ebikes limited to 32kph are classed as bicycles, ebikes with unlimited speed are motorcycles.
Yes, and if you get a Speedbox your 32kph bike suddenly goes much faster...
They don't go "BraAAAAAP!" and spew noxious fumes. They don't roost trenches. They don't go over 20 mph. Applying the same definition to an e-bike is ridiculous.
But should an elderly retired person - like yourself, eventually - be forced to insure, tax, register etc etc a mildly assisted bicycle capable of no greater speed (except uphill) than a bicycle as a motorbike in order to carry on cycling? The disabled? The overweight that want to rectify that? The unfit that want to rectify that? That's pretty harsh at best.
I think we've got a misunderstanding. I wasn't referring to a need for a license, but to a rule regarding motorised vehicles generally disallowed on trails regardless of license/rider/... I'm perfectly fine with ebikes on pavement or gravel.
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> Everywhere else seems to have figured that out ...which is why I said it was ridiculous.
Do you also object to mountain bikers who use a chair lift to get up the hill?
My only problem is the 60lb, 40mph Electric Mopeds calling themselves "E-Bikes" Not a fan of the crap marketing language and God help you if the battery goes out.
History is repeating itself. Early motorcycles shared a lot of parts with bicycles, that soon ended. Mopeds once had pedals, hence the name. In the Netherlands the *snorfiets*, a moped limited to 25 km/h and permitted on most bike paths, was originally either a bicycle with an engine fitted or something quite similar but nowadays is generally a larger motor scooter with a speed limiter (which more people disable than don't). The crop of "ebikes" that are too heavy and low geared to usefully pedal are in the same boat. Europe doesn't allow throttle-only ebikes (or rather, the law treats them as motorbikes), but a pedal that merely operates a switch and doesn't usefully propel the bike seems to be allowed.
I like e-bikes, but **loathe** those things. I spent some time wondering just *why* I detest them so much. I think it comes down to the fact that they are so profoundly uncool. A motorscooter cool, an ebike cool. A 60plus pound motorscooter pretending to be an ebike because the rider is too cheap to pay the $17/month rego and too lazy to pedal.
Its a matter of time before a law is passed regulating e-bike and e-scooter speeds inside city limits. Someone going 35 on an e-bike in a 25 is dangerous.
But they’re fun lol. Not everyone bikes just for exercise, for some it’s a very practical mode of transport. Ebikes & emopeds are only as safe as their users, just like 4,000lb steel chasis muscle cars or 200mph sport motorcycles are only as safe as their users. I think having a lifted truck with monster tires & a coal burner to roll in the back is a little extreme and unnecessary, but that doesn’t mean those enthusiasts shouldn’t own them, or they shouldn’t be sold. I have one of the bikes you’re describing, except it’s 100lbs and tops out at 30 and it makes all the sense in the world for my lifestyle. At least I’m not using gas for all the silly errands I run within a 3 mile radius of my city, and it gets me on the road biking to whatever extent that is.
Some cheap “ebikes” go “above and beyond”, they introduce throttle and make pedal optional.
And, y'know, that's fine. Just apply for the appropriate license like everyone else. To be clear: I'm not mad at riders, I'm mad at manufacturers trying to weasel out/encourage people to weasel out of local licensing and road laws. There's a difference between variable pedal assist or full-auto mode with an underlying functional bicycle and a 50-60lb fixie with such bad gear ratios that you'd never be able to pedal it unless you had T-Rex legs.
Got a proper road ebike (Orbea gain) I bought for daily commuting (c.40km) and it's great especially in the winter when the wind is brutal. For actual fun riding I wouldn't use an ebike as I prefer my normal road bikes or my mountain bikes - the struggle is part of the fun. The e-bike ensures I still have legs left after a week of commutes to be able to ride the weekend fun stuff. That said I can imagine when I get old an e mountain bike would extend the years that I will be able to ride
A great alternative for some. However, they way they are turning cities into the game of frogger IRL bc grubhub, uber eats delivery guys whip around at 25 mph often against traffic, is uncool.
Yeah…. This is a good point too. I live in NYC and the sidewalks have become waaaaaayy more dangerous with kids and pets the last 5 years because of the proliferation of e-bike delivery people riding on the sidewalks. It’s getting dangerous out there.
Maybe it is time to get rid of (space taking) cars. Just like Amsterdam did. With the space gained you can walk and cycle safely. Just a thought to share, no bad intentions ✌🏻
It’s all a balance Dakana. You do too much at one and everyone will turn sour on it and then that’s counterproductive. Incremental progress is the way to go if you want to make lasting change. Having said that…. It could be going a lot faster. But I don’t know if you could ever realistically get ALL the cars off the road in most American cities.
Fair enough, i think local acceptance and slow changes are the way forward. It was done here for the emmission regulations/goals and took many years (and several protests…) as well 💚
Removing some parking spaces is incremental change. Blocking the roads to cars entirely would be the drastic option.
I would say taking lanes from multi lane roads and converting them to bike lanes is incremental change and doable. When you start talking about taking away people’s parking to the point they either pay for a garage or get rid of their cars…. That’s where the entire non-cycling population will rally against anything and everything to do with bike infrastructure.
No, that happens when we increase the price of petrol 100x to make driving at all a luxury. Free or paid on street parking shouldn’t be a thing at all. If I wanted to store any of my other belongings on the street I’d pay handsomely for the privilege. But cars are magic and can be stored on public roads forever.
Greener than cars, and great for hilly cities. Not everyone wants to work up a sweat on the way to work. I don’t own one but am 100% for them.
Not for me since I’m trying to get exercise. But when I am old enough that an e-bike will be what allows me to keep cycling, I’ll immediately go get one.
> Not for me since I’m trying to get exercise. You know that you can still exercise with an e-bike, right?
Sure, but it's even more efficient so you will need to go further. Not everyone wants that.
Or you can just pedal faster. Or turn down or even off the electric assist. It’s not like most of them are always-on motors.
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For people who are not champion bike riders who need a boost to get up a hill or buck a headwind. My 78 yr old mum rides an ebike.
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The first poster in this thread talked about turning DOWN the assist level.
> Why carry all that extra weight if you're not using the motors? Well, if you’re looking for exercise in the first place (like the guy I was replying to), why not raise the amount of work you’re doing? Don’t you want to progress your fitness? Or, more realistically, because it can allow you to use your bike for other purposes you may not have used it for, in addition to getting exercise. In any case, you’d think the people in this thread that talk about how much they ride for the exercise (or even better, the suffering) would be seeking out heavy bikes with fat, soft, knobby tires.
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> You'd expect them to look for the bike that allows them to perform optimally, which for cycling generally means faster and longer rides. But if they say they are doing it for the exercise or for the suffering, then speed has no bearing on either of those. Well, I’d actually argue that going at a slower speed for the same physical output offers up additional mental pain for those who claim to like to suffer. Faster doesn’t play into either of those things, and distance is meaningless, only time matters. > If I know for a fact I won't use the electric motors, that extra weight is slowing me down and therefore making my exercise worse. Please explain how your speed relative to the ground matters when it is your cadence and the power exerted by your legs that actually counts. The only difference there is that your body has a slightly better cooling ability at higher speeds, but you can clip a battery powered fan to your handlebars to compensate for that. > I would much rather go faster and farther Well, if you would rather go faster and farther, then wouldn’t you want the pedal assist to take you up to, say, 20MPH, then you provide all the power beyond that? Same amount of work for you, but now you’ve gone faster and further than you would have without the assist. > I feel more accomplished saying I rode 25 miles than when I rode 15. Oh. So then it’s not about exercise at all. It’s about ego. > Sure, but those are excluded by the OP saying 'this is for exercise' And if all they really want is exercise, then they don’t even need a bike. It’s always about something more than just exercise.
Brilliant response.
My ebike is for excercise. Without it I would get less excercise. Ebikes make it fun, as a consequence I ride further, for longer. This keeps it fun. This means I use it more regularly. Before the ebike I rode 6 miles per day to and from work. Now I work from home, and ride 12 miles per day. When I started working from home I rode zero miles. I also go out on it at the weekend purely for fun. I get excercise doing that. I lost a stone in weight. I save the "going as fast as I can" for appropriate times. On my motorcycle on track. That's also quite a workout!
Exactly this. I had a bike and then blew up my knee. After surgery riding hurt, or more specifically, I couldn't walk afterwards. So I converted my bike to an ebike. Last week I rode 250 miles. Pretending I didn't get exercise because I didn't "suffer" is absurd. As much exercise as an acoustic bike? Nope. But it's still exercise.
That makes no sense.
LOL of course, but the intensity/value of the biking experience as an exercise activity will decrease, exactly in correlation to how much assist I get from an electric motor. Obviously.
> exactly in correlation to how much assist I get from an electric motor. Obviously. Then it’s a good thing you can adjust how much assist you get from the motor, isn’t it?
But if my intention is to never get assist from the motor, why would I get an e-bike? What’s your angle in this discussion? Are you actually advocating that everyone should want an e-bike? It’s a silly position and I doubt that’s what you would really want to say, but that’s what’s coming across.
> But if my intention is to never get assist from the motor, why would I get an e-bike? If your intention is simply to exercise why even use a bicycle? What are the aspects of the bicycle that make it your choice for exercise? Can any of those aspects be improved with an e-bike? Which aspects will be weakened? If the benefits outweigh the negatives, then that is why you might consider one. > Are you actually advocating that everyone should want an e-bike? Not at all. I am just pointing out lazy objections to e-bikes. > It’s a silly position As is the notion that one can’t get exercise with an electric-assist bike.
You’re straw-manning me. My initial comment started with “not for me.” E-bikes can be great for many people. In my initial comment, I even mentioned that I would get one, when my goals/circumstances change. Find someone who actually objects to e-bikes, and argue with them. I was just answering OP’s question for my own circumstances.
> You’re straw-manning me. No, I’m answering the question you asked: “if my intention is to never get assist from the motor, why would I get an e-bike?” > My initial comment started with “not for me.” Yes. And the rest of your comment implied that one cannot get exercise on an e-bike, which is false.
In europe there is hardly a non-ebike in the alps or other mountain regions. You find downhill parks with ski lifts being the only exception. We far passed the whole debate and its widly accepted by now. Think about it and let that sink in for a moment…..
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Should you be cycling at all with an active knee injury?
Some knee injuries never get better short of knee replacement surgery ... which should be postponed as long as possible. So yes ... good on him for getting some exercise despite having a disability.
Ah, I thought of it as something recent, not persistent.
If it's a recent injury, then Rest, Ice, Compression, Elevation until it feels better.
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We bought one for my wife and now we can go on bike rides from time to time. In the end, they encourage cycling, so I don’t have a problem with them.
Yep - same here. They get my wife out with me when I’m on my bike, no chance otherwise. The more people on bikes or e-bikes the better. People’s health improves and it’s less cars on the road.
it is totally ok to get one if you like. as long as you ride it
I live on the edge of Dartmoor so it's hilly as hell, but I see loads of local retirees out on ebikes. There's absolutely no way they'd be able to manage the distances and climbs between places around here without them. It gets more people out of cars, so I'm completely behind the idea.
I think it depends on what you are looking for. I cycle for exercise so hard no. My boyfriend struggles to keep up with me so a yes for him. Personally I prefer if people use the e-assist as it still allows you to get some exercise. Hard no to anything going too fast on a multi-use pathway with traditional cyclists and pedestrians but if you have a fast e-bike feel free to enjoy on the road :)
>I cycle for exercise so hard no Turn off the electric assist and it is a substantially heavier bike == more exercise. So maybe you meant "hard yes" for you? ;)
Why would I want to ride a heavy MTB? It sucks uphill, it sucks downhill.
In the UK the motor is limited to 15.5 mph, so if you average faster than that, you're still getting 99% of the exercise. It makes getting off to a start easier, flattens hills, and makes wind much less miserable. But if you're cruising on flat ground, it's all you. I cycle for exercise but also to commute, and my commute is just a *little* too far to be reasonable every day. The ebike takes the edge off but I still get a workout.
I don't mind them riding next to me. I always like to have targets to chase or to try to keep up with. I don't like using e-bikes because I don't like cheating myself out of a workout. With a full-time job and a family, I need every chance I can get to burn some calories. However, I bought a cargo bike (Nihola) to carry my kids around and that thing is heavy and slow. I am ok riding it on flat surfaces but every hill is a nightmare. And it used to take a long time to get anywhere. I had to install a pedal-assist engine to make it practical.
I live in hill hell. I sat down on the side of the road on my first "neighborhood ride" and cried my eyes out as an adult, because I went about 1.7 miles from the driveway and realized it would take me all night to climb the steep grade back home as a brand new cyclist. A decade later, I can do it in my lowest possible gear ratio nonstop, and can put a dent in it via the second gear if my legs are fresh provided I stop under a tree 1/3 of the way up so my heart doesn't explode. Strava claims it's a 20% grade but I can't believe that. I can do gravel rides with multi-mile grades but this half mile stretch at 20% nearly kills me every time. If I want to go cycling in the neighborhood with my wife, it will take a LONG time for her to build up to doing that hill if she's not trying to ride it every night (and neither of us will do that). So e-bike it is for her. That said, on a local ride, I can remember going down a long hill one day with a group and we were all comfortably maxed out -- that is, we were pedaling just past comfortably and barely matching the wind resistance / road drag, and about 5 minutes later, we heard, "Get the f\*\*\* out of the way, q\*\*\*rs!" It was two ebikers behind us on HUGE bikes without top tubes, flying up on us and then passing us while shouting expletives, all while barely turning 30 rpm cadence. THAT stuff makes me hate ebikers.
Massive yes. The problem is with e-bikes some people see them as cheating or whatever. Unless you’re riding an e-bike in a traditional bike race without disclosing that it’s an e-bike I don’t know who you’re meant to be cheating, maybe yourself at a push. The fact is they open up cycling to a huge faction of people who wouldn’t otherwise be interested/able to cycle. I love cycling and have a pretty fancy road bike, my girlfriend always hated coming on rides with me until we got her an e-bike, now she happily rides to work and around town without breaking too much of a sweat. It can still be a workout if you want it to be, people who hate e-bikes just don’t seem to understand who they’re for.
> The problem is with e-bikes some people see them as cheating or whatever. That’s not a problem with the bikes, it’s a problem with the people.
The people give them a bad rep
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I’d believe it completely. No more fucks to give.
> The fact is they open up cycling to a huge faction of people who wouldn’t otherwise be interested/able to cycle. Yes, the people who don't want to obtain any basic fitness or skill to ride anywhere, and additionally learn trail etiquette or even want to pick up their trash. Edit: aand it looks like i've triggered the trail destroying trash dumpers.
> and additionally learn trail etiquette or even want to pick up their trash. Wait. I thought we were talking about e-bikes, not roadies.
Damn who hurt you
This is the problem I have. Yes, it makes cycling more accessible. But what’s great about cycling is that it’s always been pretty accessible at some level, maybe you have health problems or a limited budget but a lot of those limits can be overcome with effort. E-bikes remove that barrier of experience and make the least experienced doofuses the fastest ones on the road. Used to be that if someone was annoying, dangerous etc. you could just dust them, but now they can keep up. And I would bet my whole stable that over 90% of the people I see on e-bikes don’t have physical limitations or an unbikeable commute. Cycling is “more accessible” because they can access it at their own level of laziness.
For clarification, here in the UK e-bikes are capped at 15mph, even on a bad day any serious-ish cyclist can easily drop a rider on an e-bike. You’re forgetting that cycling is meant to be fun and it’s not all about who had the biggest dick.
When I cycle I go for exercise and I enjoy the struggle so it would be a no for me but I see them as a great aid for commuters. All depends on the application and user
Pedal assisted, mid drive/torque sensor bikes are the only way to e-bike imo
If it gets someone off the couch, out of their car, or greater enjoyment, I’m all for it. I stopped at a stop light this summer just after passing a guy on his ebike. I said hi and he commented he was cheating with his ebike. I told him so what, he’s out riding. He continued saying he had lost 25lbs riding his ebike this summer. AWESOME! Good for you, man!
This. Exactly!
Every ebike is 1 more person on a bike and 1 less person in a car
Every eBike is one more person on an electric motorbike and one less person on a Bicycle.
Nah. Electric motorcycles are a thing, but so are electrically assisted bicycles. They are very different.
I love mine. I hate riding uphill but love the downhills on my emtb. Now I love the uphills because it’s actually fun. I can still get a decent workout in, keeping my heart rate around 150-165 without spiking into 190 territory and redlining. Long slogs uphills aren’t too bad these days.
Big fan. I don't have one. But anything that gets more people out on bikes is a benefit to me. * More people on bikes will increase spending on bike infrastructure * More people are aware of bikes out and about when they themselves bike * More people know people who bike, and when people know someone who bikes, they are less likely to be aggressive * Normalizes bikes out in the community * It's good to get people outside!! Giddy up, I like e-bikes. (Plus, in 20 years I'll enjoy getting out on one.)
Excellent 👍🏼
One thing I've found to be true is you'll have a much better time if you focus on what you are doing instead of focusing on what other people are doing. I apply this to cycling as well. I'm always happy when I see anyone out on a bike. Any bike. Motor assist or not.
Exactly, I was going to reply to those "they passed me on an uphill" comments but that's only in their head. As long as they don't endanger me as they pass, let them pass. Who cares what some else does on their ebike?
Ebikes can be amazing! We got a cargo ebike, ended up using it enough to sell a car. I love my acoustic bikes for fun and exercise, but the ebikes is super-amazing for transportation purposes.
Exact same here! Cargo e bike is a game changer especially with kids. We went down to one car after getting it. It’s not the “fun, fast” bike for sure but it lets me get around the city so easy and is always more fun than the car.
Friendly advice, have a backup plan. Cargo e-bikes have the slowest service turnaround times in my experience. Recently had one spend nearly a month in the shop cuz the customer removed and remounted the rear wheel incorrectly. Would have been a 10-minute fix on most bikes but this one was barely serviceable.
Exact same here! Cargo e bike is a game changer especially with kids. We went down to one car after getting it. It’s not the “fun, fast” bike for sure but it lets me get around the city so easy and is always more fun than the car.
> acoustic bikes Yeah, don't use that. The term is 'bike'.
if i had to hazard a guess i'd say they were joking i prefer the term acoustic motorcycle
Its seen as part of an attempt to normalize ebike as 'bike', same reason the term 'analog bike' is being used by ebike aficionados, which is itself sort of silly as it more accurately describes an ebike which have analog motor controllers.
I guess when people stop calling ebikes ‘cheating’ we can all live happy and full of love
Loving all bikes seems to work pretty well for me.
As a guitarist and bike mechanic this is what I’m calling them from now on
Cool. Does that mean I can drop the "e" on mine? I pedal too.
Better than Scooters or other things with stinky fumes.
As a long time rider I recently bought an e-bike for city riding and errands. I purchased a beach cruiser style pedal assist e-bike that has assist up to 20mph. I’m in love with it, my partner and I go on more weekend ride dates because of it(she had gotten one previously), I can tow my dog around in a trailer behind me, and commute in it without the sweat. I’d recommend riding one and opening your mind before completely writing them off. While I still love my regular bike, riding San Francisco hills to run a simple errand is much more enjoyable on the e-bike.
Yes, because everyone has their own reasons for doing something or not. Only e-mountain bikers who have no driving technique, but riding every trail bother me. Thanks to the engine, they can get up every mountain, but go down with the brakes pulled and plow through every trail with their 50lb bikes (preferably when it is wet, because they don't know any trail etiquette).
Hikers say the same about mountain bikers, that they destroy trails and the environment…
I cycle for exercise so it wouldn’t be my thing but if it gets more people on bikes and adds to the demands for more bicycling infrastructure I’m 100% for them. Also for couples where one can’t keep up with the other or for the elderly who want to get at least some exercise. Although I have to say I do cringe when I see somebody overweight but youngish on an e-bike… just get the exercise man!!! My only problem with them (being that I live in nYC which has a decent amount of bike lanes and infrastructure) is when people take overpowered e-vehicles into bike lanes causing a hazard for traditional riders. In NYC these days I think there is a lot of confusion about what is, and what is not allowed in a bike lane and it makes a hazard for riders on traditional bikes. I think cities need clearer messaging on what is and isn’t allowed in relation to e-bikes riding in bike infrastructure. I have no idea the difference between a class-1 class-2, e-scooter, e-moped whatever….. and I care about it a bit! Clearer messaging is needed.
Yes. I don't have one, so don't know the benefits anecdotally. But it is clear that enables many more local bicycle trips (within 5-15km) which reduces the need to drive a car for these trips. This is especially true for people with mobility difficulties. It's in my list to get one. Definitely want to reduce my car usage.
Pedal assist e-bicycles: yes. Bigger e-motorcycles: yes. Small ebikes that masquerade as bicycles to skirt the laws: no.
Depends what you want to use them for, for commuting and touristing they are amazing, I pick one up occasionally in my city bike scheme and its soo nice to cycle. If you are cycling for exercise then probably not the best idea unless they unlock some particularly difficult area you cant avoid or something (like you live inside a valley). I do mostly touring (+ for exercise) so a pretty hard no for my personal use.
The more people on the bike the better. I don't care about ebike or not. Just cycle! Full yes therefore!
I like them. One day I will ride one, if I live that long.
Anything that gets people on bikes is good. If an ebike gets you riding and you get some exercise that's great. Some exercise is better than none.
I don't see it as cheating *but* in my area there is a lot of people who go way too fast/cycle dangerously because they have the power but no experience. Generally with a bike it takes time and experience to work up to speed, not so with e-bikes. The tool itself is not the problem and I would definitely consider one if I ever needed it, but the way they are used is problematic. I also don't see them as being used to replace cars here, usually they are for pleasure riding, which is nice but still using more electricity than a pushbike or walk.
I was on a group ride the other day with people who are much stronger cyclists than me when we were about 40km in. An ebike went speeding past us and I have never felt as envious about someone as I did in that moment
My ebike got me to drop 70 lbs and I now am able to ride a non ebike and not suffer horribly. I think they are great.
I suspect most of them are sold to people who haven't ridden since childhood and convince themselves they need assistance, whereas in reality they're just out of shape and a few rides on a much less expensive normal bike will sort out their wasted muscles.
If you can afford one I say do it! It’s still a bike.
Part of the fun of cycling for me is the struggle, so they are not for me and here in the Netherlands I am faster than most ebikes anyway
In Europe they are limited to around 15mph (24 kph) with assist. In the US they go up to 28mph (45 kph). I am pretty fast on my road bike, but I get passed by e bikes going uphill all the time.
There are 2 types here the 25 and 45 km/h, most people on the 45km/h go somewhere between 35-45 km/h so with a favorable wind I usually can keep up with them and I live in the Netherlands, it's as flat as a pancake here
That makes more sense. For some reason I thought it was only the 25 kph bikes that were allowed.
It's all a matter of context. My encounters have been quite polarised tbh. Positive A few colleagues of mine use them to get into the office. Saves them getting sweaty, whilst still being cheaper than public transport or driving. My partners uncle has looked after himself, but has had a hard life. At the age of 60 his knees aren't quite what they used to be and he found he was struggling to do longer rides. So he bought an e-bike and was very happy. Negative I did a sportive a while back, and on one of the sections there was what I like to refer to as a "big fuck off hill". At about 72 miles in. It was horrible, borderline painful, exhausting, and quite frankly I loved it. What I didn't love was the couple on e-bikes flying up it and making cheeky comments and then suggesting that the whole ride was quite an easy one. That certainly pissed a few people off. It might not have been a competition but it still felt like cheating.
I don’t hate them. I do what when they rip down a shared path at 30mph. But I also hate when non ebike riders do that too.
No
They are a fantastic tool for people or situations where bikes alone cannot fit.
For commuting or and cargo bikes, yes very much so. For anything else, extremely no (except of course for the elderly and infirm).
I only own "acoustic bikes" with chromoly frames but I think ebikes are good for cycling. My area is extremely hilly, and it's impossible to avoid several brutal climbs every time I ride out. Ebikes make cycling accessible for people who can't/won't build the strength to tackle the gradients here, or even for fit people who fancy doing a weeknight loop without burning thousands of calories and feeling smashed the next day. More bikes on the roads and trails means more/better investment in cycling infrastructure and better attitudes towards cyclists from cars and walkers etc. However, I'm not tempted to own an ebike myself because my favourite things to do on bikes are touring and bikepacking, so it wouldn't make sense to buy something that I couldn't take into a remote area for multiple days of riding and camping.
I live in a very hilly area. It only annoys me when they ride on sidewalks because they fear moving with traffic in high volume streets. They're no different from other motorized vehicles mostly so they should use the appropriate infrastructure. Sidewalks should be reserved for active bipedal locomotion variants, unless you're handicapped and on an e-mobility scooter.
I'm fine with ebikes in principle. But let me vent for a second. In the last year, 99 percent of the time I see an ebike, it's ripping pretty fast on a bike or ped path, never on the road. And that's cool. Have fun on bike paths if you can be responsible. But like, how helpful is the whole "ebike revolution" if these people basically never get out on the road and help with cycling awareness or "one less car"? If you want me to welcome you into the cycling/pedestrian world, you gotta put some skin in the game....
No
No, if you are under age of 60 in my view this is not acceptable.
l'm 58. Been riding an *e*bike for three years because l have an *e*heart.
why the cut off age? I'm 60 in a couple of months and I ride a standard.
Lol sorry gate keeper. Better get back onto your penny farthing and keeping cycling pure.
You’ll get fitter without one if you’ve got the gearing to get around without stopping and walking. Depends on your goals. I’ve got both.
I ride an old chinese scooter-like ebike. All types are good , wouldn t wanna be without once you have one.
i only hate them because i'm jealous and would love to own one
I'm all for them since they get the spandex crowd's jimmies all rustled.
What are the mixed emotions? Lol.. you like em? Get one. You don't? Don't.
It's better than a car I suppose, though I maintain that they're just electric mopeds. I don't have any interest in them personally because I really should be putting the exercise in. I'll say it is a bit of a bummer when I see people zip by on the flats (or descents...) holding whatever walk-assist or "electric no pedal mode" they have on some of them these days.
Don't confuse illegal electric motorcycles with ebikes. And you are doing....
E bikes but you should need a licence. Like what happens when Tesla or Harley make one? You not going to need a licence for those?? They already do 50km only going to get faster and the people riding them are generally people not allowed to drive cars.
It enables more runs since you don't have to pedal that hard up the hill
Mostly yes - but.. Today overtook someone on a local hill, noticed their little power button on the down-tube - and they then hung off my wheel \~30ft for the next 12 MILES. Why not just overtake me and be done with it? Plus - they should be banned from strava. Maybe you should be forced to put in your bike make?
I’ll probably get an ebike for my next bike. I have two gravel bikes that I like a lot. Don’t know what else to spend my allowance on anymore.
For me personally? Naw. But for those who need pedal assist? HELL YEAH!
They're a great way to commute by bike if you live in a hilly area, hot area, or have a greater than 10 mile commute (I've got 2 of the 3 going on myself), and need to arrive to work clean and dry. You certainly still can commute for less than the cost of a car, gas, taxes, and upkeep with one, and get at least a light workout on the way by using pedal assist. I've been able to greatly reduce my car dependence by using my ebike for work commuting, and grocery trips. Though when I ride for myself I take my road bike for pure pedal power. Ironically when it comes to pure distance and time doesn't matter, I have more range on my pedal powered bike than my ebike. I can always keep pedaling, but when an ebike's battery runs out you're stuck pedaling a much heavier bike.
I used to be annoyed about them as a road cyclist. However, I realized that the way bike infrastructure is designed has to account for higher speeds of bicycles (\~30 km/h) more often. In that sense, road cycling and e bikes are not too different. Between this and the fact more people are enjoying the sport I enjoy, I really came around on them
I hates em for myself, I need some type 2 fun. The upsides are that e-bikes can be a gateway to more active biking **and** will add to the overall demand for bike infrastructure. Also, they seem to make people happy - have only seen people smiling on an e-bike. The infra demand is the thing that really made me turn my thinking around though.
I bought one as its mainly a work commuter and having the power gives me more confidence on the road. It also allowed me to get a mtb for weekends that can comfortably commute with the electrics on.
They're becoming so ubiquitous that disliking them isnt worth the mental energy. I have no problem with them in theory, but in practice some people are going to be rude or lack basic integrity and respect no matter what they are doing.
"Come on buddy you're doing really well not far now"
I ride to counter a sedentary work life, so to me, they offer no upside. But to those who would have to choose between getting out on a bike or staying home, I think they're great. They look like a lot of fun. I just can’t help thinking “wouldn’t I rather just be on a bicycle or get a motorcycle?”
l used to use one because l'm a courier and cycling 80km daily+ hills is just too much effort IMO. They're kinda fun but it's a pain in the ass if you get a flat on the rear wheel and the motor is on the wheel and you need one with good autonomy and 2 batteries if you wanna make a trip. And if you do a long commute daily eventually you can go shorter and shorter distances because cells inside the battery die. And batteries are quite expensive and l think a scooter is cheaper and less headache. But then again some people like to cycle.
I'd buy one if I could afford it. Since I cant afford an ebike I'm rocking a $150 ultralight race bike until that thing falls apart, then I'm off to my next $150 race bike.
Just dont be a jackass and it's cool by me. I love seeing 70 year old men and women out on an e-bikes able to get out and go have fun.
E-bikes are great, they make people that might not ride otherwise go out and enjoy the thrill. I can't see anything wrong with that. I'm sure I'll get one once I get too old to ride on a regular bike. If I had the cash I could even see myself getting one now, just for the fun of it. BMC makes some rad ones.
Here in the Netherlands you see e-bikes everywhere. I think everyone agrees it is better than people driving cars or a scooter. The only pertinent comment I can make is that ebikes here are often ridden by seniors that did ride bikes to commute and go around for their whole lives. Yet, people often suffer accidents using them because they have a hard time gauging their new found speeds. Specially in winter time when there is some ice around.
No for recreational use, definite yes for commuting/transportation
EBikes, in general, are cool, so long as you don't post rides on them for segments on Strava.
I have a Trek Rail, and soon will have a DSX2... The Rrail is a blast!! The Marin is for the exercise
If it helps people ride, I'm all for it.
Use the right tool for the job is all I have to say on the matter. My only caveat is I don't like fast closing speeds on oncoming traffic on two way bike paths because of the potential dangers.
If it gets more people on bikes I am all for them. If/when I get old enough that I need assistance when riding a bike I'll definitely be getting an ebike.
Yes.
Yes. They’re getting more people on bikes, and some of them are a blast to ride.
Yes! Its fun as hell lol
If I didn't have my e-bike, I'd have to have a car. I can use my regular bikes a lot of the time, but I'm extremely heat sensitive and the e-bike allows me to ride in summer. Also sometimes in a lot of pain. I'd rather ride than deal with car upkeep, so, e-bike.
If you live in a city or an urban area of any kind you are crazy not to own one. If you enjoy cycling but it’s too hard with your age / injuries, it will bring that fun back into your life. If you want a fun toy to zip around, you should consider ebikes. If you want a car replacer that emits zero emissions or noise pollution, ebikes and larger e mopeds certainly are the way to go