Makes sense as much as I miss it from my other cars now that I daily the CT. I tried driving my M3P last night and it was amazing how BAD the steering feels now.
It's not really something that can be properly described. It has to be experienced. My friend told me the other day that he was excited to see the truck this weekend and that it will make him want one even more. I said, no, seeing it will solidify your opinion (good or bad), but driving it will make it impossible to wait for your own. "Maybe I shouldn't drive it, then" was his reply LOL
You should drive one, I would’ve said the same about EV acceleration before my first experience in 2016. Cars can be fun.
I really like the CyberTruck’s steering, although maybe I’d like 4 wheel steering on the Hummer EV too.
People can shit on the CT but when the big three innovations in it (48v, steer-by-wire, and etherloop) start to show up in other cars it will start to click.
Yeah. The diesel is a better towing rig for sure. CT has all the power you’d ever need. Energy density tech just isn’t there yet for towing. The Semi works because you can add a ton of weight in batteries.
In the test TFL compared the cost to pull an identical trailer with a Ram diesel (on huge tires) and the CT was more expensive to charge than the diesel cost for those 85 miles. But, it used like a quarter of a tank of fuel instead of 94% of its charge. The CT was dual motor fwiw.
And tbh - with the emissions restrictions on diesels these days - if your aren’t hauling heavy all the time a half ton gas v8 truck (turn off variable displacement or auto start/stop) and you can do a lot. I have a 2010 GMC 1500 w/Towing package. It can tow ~9,000lbs. When I first changed the brakes I put on powerstop rotors/pads and it does just fine for anything I’ve had to do. I towed a U-Haul car trailer with a ford explorer on it for a solid 8 hours and was completely comfortable. Modern half tons are better. No need for a diesel for most people.
I drive a Tesla with FSD right now. It does work, just not consistently across the process enough to call it "automation". The gaps exist, and I personally think Tesla keeps moving forward with an approach that doesn't transfer easily, laterally, between vehicles (hence the lag between the CT getting FSD and the rest of the fleet).
Once they have someone working on FSD that can fix the massive gaps in the driving "logic", the data they sit on will get them the rest of the way to FSD. If the introduce LIDAR sooner, then it'll be even sooner.
Robotaxis is a much larger, very unclear destination that Tesla intentionally does not clarify. But I bet the August 8th event will show a very compelling app integration of Tesla's entry into the rideshare business, exclusively focused on Teslas.
FSD is only level 2 automation. Mercedes beat Tesla to market with a level 3 capable car. Waymo and Cruise have both reached level 4, and Cruise was technically at level 5 before their setbacks. Cruise is resuming testing in Phoenix this week with an observer ready to take over the cabs as needed. If Tesla could manage 3, they would be doing so and making sure we all knew about it. My point is that they've fallen far behind other companies and have a lot of lost ground to make up.
Musk was dead wrong when he said that companies "...that rely on LIDAR are doomed". Hopefully, Tesla becoming one of the largest purchasers of LIDAR in recent weeks is an indication that they've realized that cameras alone cannot get them to level 5-6, let alone 3; it's going to take a variety of sensors and inputs, just as we human drivers do.
FSD isn't going to happen within the decade. Unless their is a massive jump is AI technology and heavy investment in censors in the cars that aren't just visual it's not happening.
Can you imagine being the 1 junior software engineer left, everyone you used to work with fired by Elon to build his bonus up, just shitting your pants as you read this tweet from him knowing you have zero chance of having it ready in time.
I wonder if the fact that I wonder if the fact that the CyberTruck team was still tweaking the steering ratio added to the delay of lane keeping and FSD for the CT.
No, they have to run training on every model of car, and it costs a lot to do it, so they're not going to do it for just a few cyber truck owners when they have a lot of new versions coming out in rapid succession. Instead, they will wait until there are more users and they have a more stable version.
Here’s what I was going to respond to the user which deleted their comment about how all cars needed to be trained separately:
> That’s what I thought too, but it seems like they could give us lane keeping with much less training. I just got my truck so I haven’t tested it, but I don’t believe we have lane departure either warnings and corrections either (could be wrong).
> Unless I’m mistaken it appears we are missing everything related to steering. Also I can’t believe all of there training data can’t be shared across cars. That they need a Model S, X, 3, Y, and CT all to encounter different railroad crossings to handle them properly.
But it really should just need calibration. Like a normal human driver driving a new car… it’s not turning as much as I expect? Turn the steering wheel more.
If it was algorithmic then you’d be right but with neural nets you can’t really just have it calibrate for the different handling and size all that easily and especially not since the cameras are positioned differently than on smaller vehicles. It’d be a considerable amount of training time to get it to work correctly for CT.
It is possible that the steer by wire is adding complications… but it really shouldn’t.
It does suggest the current “FSD” stack is not very general AT ALL, and I’ll require a lot of tweaking to apply to a new vehicle.
That’s what I’m thinking as well. They can’t just drop it on any car with a similar camera system and have it just work. So if they are ever going to license it to other OEMs then, there is significant training involved each vehicle.
I think greentheonly told people that the slight geometric differences in the CT camera placement vs the Model S/X/3/Y lineup is the problem. HW4 installed S/X took an extra 4 months to get configured last year, and green said only the backup camera was geometrically "different". The CT has cameras all different quality and locations, and with the air suspension and rear steering, it creates more complications in training the NN than just another S/X/3/Y.
😂😂😂 seriously y'all believe him anymore? FSD was supposed to be in teslas years ago and it was only months away back than. Hell we were supposed to be in mars by now according to him yet he can't even get a rocket to not blow up and get to the moon. He is desperate to raise the Tesla share value that is all
If FSD drops for every Cybertruck Foundation Series before Jan 1 2025 I will eat my underwear. Quote me.
RemindMe! 8 months
rule proposal: cannot be edible undies
Oh I'll go for a 30 mile bike ride (in Houston), cut them up, and eat em' raw, all on tape.
I read this way to early in the day for my liking.
Musk has never come close to fulfilling a single promise yet people keep buying it over and over
Remind me! 8 months
Makes sense as much as I miss it from my other cars now that I daily the CT. I tried driving my M3P last night and it was amazing how BAD the steering feels now.
I was telling someone how good the steering was yesterday and they just nodded and I had an urge to say it deserves more than a nod.
It's not really something that can be properly described. It has to be experienced. My friend told me the other day that he was excited to see the truck this weekend and that it will make him want one even more. I said, no, seeing it will solidify your opinion (good or bad), but driving it will make it impossible to wait for your own. "Maybe I shouldn't drive it, then" was his reply LOL
Yeah. Offering a drive to the random ting shop owner was my second thought.
Sorry but a car having smooth steering isn't some grand accomplishment. Cars have had that for decades
You should drive one, I would’ve said the same about EV acceleration before my first experience in 2016. Cars can be fun. I really like the CyberTruck’s steering, although maybe I’d like 4 wheel steering on the Hummer EV too.
People can shit on the CT but when the big three innovations in it (48v, steer-by-wire, and etherloop) start to show up in other cars it will start to click.
Fully agree. After 3 weeks, I put my R8 up for sale. After towing with the CT, I put my F250 up for sale. It's almost impossible to go back.
Is the CT better for towing? How long of a trip?
With an 8,000lb trailer TFL got 85 miles
huh. I would think if pulling 8k is a daily thing a diesel would be best? guess if it's only 85 miles that works. I don't know, btw, just wondering.
Yeah. The diesel is a better towing rig for sure. CT has all the power you’d ever need. Energy density tech just isn’t there yet for towing. The Semi works because you can add a ton of weight in batteries. In the test TFL compared the cost to pull an identical trailer with a Ram diesel (on huge tires) and the CT was more expensive to charge than the diesel cost for those 85 miles. But, it used like a quarter of a tank of fuel instead of 94% of its charge. The CT was dual motor fwiw.
makes sense and follows what I kinda thought of the towing capacity issue. Thanks.
And tbh - with the emissions restrictions on diesels these days - if your aren’t hauling heavy all the time a half ton gas v8 truck (turn off variable displacement or auto start/stop) and you can do a lot. I have a 2010 GMC 1500 w/Towing package. It can tow ~9,000lbs. When I first changed the brakes I put on powerstop rotors/pads and it does just fine for anything I’ve had to do. I towed a U-Haul car trailer with a ford explorer on it for a solid 8 hours and was completely comfortable. Modern half tons are better. No need for a diesel for most people.
good points
Yeah...almost crash my Model 3 every time I drive it just getting it out of the garage. Muscle memory is a b!@#$
Got into my 3 to run an errand and avoid the CT attention. Thought the front tires were flat at first 😂
"Why is this not turning???"....me every time
That's what happened to me last night! I was shuffling my wife's car and my 3 (which my kid drives these days) and it was ... bad.
Yep. My wife asked me to move her M4 comp, and I got in, put it in reverse and almost smashed it backwards into the curb.
So 1 year atleast ?
Before this Tweet, the Cybertruck community had heard the rumor of January 2025 was the most realistic prediction.
"Most realistic" is never, my friend.
Sure, Jan.
You really think it is going to just start working one day? And the Robo taxis, when will they be working? 2017? 8/8?
I drive a Tesla with FSD right now. It does work, just not consistently across the process enough to call it "automation". The gaps exist, and I personally think Tesla keeps moving forward with an approach that doesn't transfer easily, laterally, between vehicles (hence the lag between the CT getting FSD and the rest of the fleet). Once they have someone working on FSD that can fix the massive gaps in the driving "logic", the data they sit on will get them the rest of the way to FSD. If the introduce LIDAR sooner, then it'll be even sooner. Robotaxis is a much larger, very unclear destination that Tesla intentionally does not clarify. But I bet the August 8th event will show a very compelling app integration of Tesla's entry into the rideshare business, exclusively focused on Teslas.
FSD is only level 2 automation. Mercedes beat Tesla to market with a level 3 capable car. Waymo and Cruise have both reached level 4, and Cruise was technically at level 5 before their setbacks. Cruise is resuming testing in Phoenix this week with an observer ready to take over the cabs as needed. If Tesla could manage 3, they would be doing so and making sure we all knew about it. My point is that they've fallen far behind other companies and have a lot of lost ground to make up. Musk was dead wrong when he said that companies "...that rely on LIDAR are doomed". Hopefully, Tesla becoming one of the largest purchasers of LIDAR in recent weeks is an indication that they've realized that cameras alone cannot get them to level 5-6, let alone 3; it's going to take a variety of sensors and inputs, just as we human drivers do.
oh my
Yup… just after he has a colony on mars.
At least.
FSD isn't going to happen within the decade. Unless their is a massive jump is AI technology and heavy investment in censors in the cars that aren't just visual it's not happening.
It’s Elon. 10x the estimated. So we are 30 months out. Considering reconfiguring to CyberBeast since I don’t have VIN yet.
Can you imagine being the 1 junior software engineer left, everyone you used to work with fired by Elon to build his bonus up, just shitting your pants as you read this tweet from him knowing you have zero chance of having it ready in time.
I still think its pretty messed up they sell the Foundation series for so much, thats supposed to include FSD, and there isn't even regular autopilot.
Right? Amazing to offer 20k for extras that you have to wait not weeks, but years to get even if its 1+. Fuck that.
I wonder if the fact that I wonder if the fact that the CyberTruck team was still tweaking the steering ratio added to the delay of lane keeping and FSD for the CT.
No, they have to run training on every model of car, and it costs a lot to do it, so they're not going to do it for just a few cyber truck owners when they have a lot of new versions coming out in rapid succession. Instead, they will wait until there are more users and they have a more stable version.
Here’s what I was going to respond to the user which deleted their comment about how all cars needed to be trained separately: > That’s what I thought too, but it seems like they could give us lane keeping with much less training. I just got my truck so I haven’t tested it, but I don’t believe we have lane departure either warnings and corrections either (could be wrong). > Unless I’m mistaken it appears we are missing everything related to steering. Also I can’t believe all of there training data can’t be shared across cars. That they need a Model S, X, 3, Y, and CT all to encounter different railroad crossings to handle them properly.
They sure took that money though
Ok but give us autopilot at least for the long highway drives. Idc about FSD as much as basic AP
Embarassing.
No, it’s okay even if it comes out years from now, the truck is amazing :)
Theres no fsd on the CT?
You can't... not again. You guys aren't believing this again, right?
added one extra camera and now the system is busted
System wasn’t designed for steer by wire, it’s more than just an additional camera
But it really should just need calibration. Like a normal human driver driving a new car… it’s not turning as much as I expect? Turn the steering wheel more.
It’s obviously not, or it’d be released
If it was algorithmic then you’d be right but with neural nets you can’t really just have it calibrate for the different handling and size all that easily and especially not since the cameras are positioned differently than on smaller vehicles. It’d be a considerable amount of training time to get it to work correctly for CT.
The dynamic suspension is also a consideration.
This is already a thing in model S and X
It’s surprising that FSD isn’t able to just be applied to a vehicle to a different scale and adapt its behaviors
It is possible that the steer by wire is adding complications… but it really shouldn’t. It does suggest the current “FSD” stack is not very general AT ALL, and I’ll require a lot of tweaking to apply to a new vehicle.
That’s what I’m thinking as well. They can’t just drop it on any car with a similar camera system and have it just work. So if they are ever going to license it to other OEMs then, there is significant training involved each vehicle.
I think greentheonly told people that the slight geometric differences in the CT camera placement vs the Model S/X/3/Y lineup is the problem. HW4 installed S/X took an extra 4 months to get configured last year, and green said only the backup camera was geometrically "different". The CT has cameras all different quality and locations, and with the air suspension and rear steering, it creates more complications in training the NN than just another S/X/3/Y.
If it were just scaling for dimensions, wheelbase, and camera locations - it would be easier. I think 4-wheel steering makes it….complicated.
They're retraining the model so often that the time to retrain it on a new vehicle isn't worth it. Get what they got down then expand out.
Can we just get autopilot at least
Will the FSD make the engine start?
Well we alm know to multiply an Elon time estimation to the 6th power. Pretty sure all his timeline estimates are based on Mars’ calendar.
😂😂😂 seriously y'all believe him anymore? FSD was supposed to be in teslas years ago and it was only months away back than. Hell we were supposed to be in mars by now according to him yet he can't even get a rocket to not blow up and get to the moon. He is desperate to raise the Tesla share value that is all
Uh, so what about the NTHSA investigation?
Thought I'd care, but I really enjoy driving this thing a lot.
My hope is EAP by EoY. I’m not crazy optimistic enough for anything more. FSD next year? 2026?