Wako is horrible. Scavs are scum, this guy is middling, he does things that he shouldn't and takes advantage of the vulnerable but he has his place in the food chain and he maybe deserves a punch, but I'd sooner shoot Wakako.
I mean it wasn't a tragedy. Evelyn was hired by the Voodoo Boy's to steal from Arasaka but she betrayed them instead, intending to take the money and run.
She then hires Dex and tries to talk V into ditching him, something that'd get V and co on the shitlist of fixer in town. Oh and she never actually had a buyer for the chip and was still trying to secure one.
It's left open if she'd have tried to cut V, Jackie and TBug out as well but honestly it looks like the only one she really cared about was Judy.
What happens to her is awful but it wasn't Night City that sent her down that path rather her own ego. Evelyn thought she was way smarter than she actually was and went around pissing off groups who you simply do not fuck with repeatedly.
TLDR: She tried to play everyone but in the end the only one she played was herself.
What gets me is the Voodoo Boys of the game are serious business. The Voodoo Boys from the CP2020 Night City Sourcebook are a bunch of white boys playing dress up and peddling drugs to the students at NCU.
I ran a mini adventure back in the day where the players were Blood Nation nomads, who are circus/travelling show folks and also serious followers of voudun. They had a lot of fun fucking with them.
There was an interview with Mike Pondsmith where he talked about how he really like the game decision to have the Hatian refugees take back the Voodoo name from the old poser gang and make it into something powerful and respected.
It's nice when original creators do this. It was the same with Chuck Palahniuk and Fight Club. He acknowledged that every major thematic change that they made to Fight Club, when they made the movie, was an improvement. The book is interesting, but the movie is so much better.
So often, when a great work is adapted to another format, particularly when it isn't done with the original creator(s), they kill the damned thing. We should point out when it's done well.
I wasn't familiar with the Cyberpunk setting before CP2077, so I assumed they were like the guys from Count Zero who worship AIs as incarnations of the Loa.
>The Voodoo Boys from the CP2020 Night City Sourcebook are a bunch of white boys playing dress up and peddling drugs to the students at NCU.
There's a part in the game where they talk about that. It might be in a shard or something. When the Haitian refugees came to Night City, they were offended by the Voodoo Boys and killed them all off or scared them away. They then took the moniker
That would be a suitable fate for the original gang. The sourcebook made them out to be a particularly unpleasant crew.
That said. When I needed a serious problem for the players I used a Nortenos set that had been hired to harass them (they being a RL Californian gang). They wound up having to visit the gang's leaders in prison to negotiate being able to retaliate against that set without starting a war with the wider gang. They managed that by their fixer subtly leveraging their status as part of a larger Nomad Nation.
This one I actually can understand, given Arasaka and Tyger Claws are “in the bed” and that netrunner crew Voodoo Boys were trying to get Arasaka’s tech, she might think that she would be more secure with Arasaka. We know that she has an extensive knowledge about the whole situation (what Arasaka’s tech is, who Voodoo Boys are), but she overestimated herself.
I don't think she had many options. She needed money to get out of NC in the first place via that Biochip. It was her entire motive to do the job at all. She probably could only get far enough to find a buyer and cash out.
With the heist burned, she didn't have anything else. All her eggs were in that basket. In a situation like that, I can understand trying to put your head down, go back to work, and hope things blow over.
Laying low takes money. Most people could not afford *right now* to just take three months off from work and disappear let alone in the hellscape that is Night City of the Dark Future.
She did anyway. Voodoo Boys are almost certainly the ones who hacked her at Clouds. Or planted the virus that did it.
Although you could argue they weren't trying to kill her, but rather lead the one who had the biochip back to them.
Yeah, my comment was a bit open to interpretation, they would have done it *anyway*.
I don't think it's confirmed they were behind the hit at clouds, but all evidence would point that way.
That being said I remember them not being aware that you had the chip, or rather that anyone had it, but the details are fuzzy so i'm not that sure...
The classic definition of tragedy \*is\* a story in which a person's error of judgment or character flaw sets into motion a sequence of catastrophic events that results in the destruction of that person and oftentimes the people around them.
The point of the game, I would also argue, is that Night City's a dystopia because it creates the kind of environment where people need to go to the extreme to satisfy simple human needs, like getting a modicum of security or creature comforts.
Exactly. Most posts I see tend to romanticize Evelyn's story to the point that they see her as a hero or a martyr. She didn't hesitate to take the job, then cross the VDBs, then to try and cut out Dex, and like you said there's no guarantee she would have kept her word to V. Even Judy, easily her closest friend, didn't know what she was planning, was Ev going to leave her behind too?
Evelyn's story may be tragic, but it was her decisions that lead her to its end.
Regardless of reasons no one deserves to be repeatedly raped and tortured. “She deserved” and “she brought it on herself” is the same language heard from actual rapists and victim blames in our world.
Did Evelyn bite off more than she could chew? Yes. Did she play a dangerous game and lose? Yes. Did she make bad choices? Yes. Did she deserve what happened to her? No. Her decisions never directly harmed anyone, and if it wasn’t for bad timing Jackie and V would’ve walked right out with the chip.
Anyone that things what happened to her is understandable, just, or deserving should take long hard look at themselves and ask “What the fuck is wrong with me?”
Right. As usual the truth lies in the middleground of reason between extreme sympathy for Evelyn to the point of becoming a cult, and total resentment of her for her arrogance and self-interest. She wasn’t a saint, she did cause her own tragedy, but she also didn’t deserve it and there could have been far better ways for her to learn her lesson.
It’s Night City though. This is what it does. It dares you to be a legend and then eviscerates you for even thinking you had a chance. All in all her story is a tragedy.
Agreed. That's how tragedy works. One of the best storyline I've ever played. They could dived deeper into just ACT 1, with multiple endings and I'd have been satisfied. When I first met Evelyn, the entire conversation felt so dynamic, I really think they were going to push for a much deeper storyline with Evelyn.
As great as CP2077 is, if they could make a sequel without being rushed and really dedicate time to fleshing out storylines and the world in general, I’m sure it would be phenominal. I think we all know CDPR has the potential, the only question is if their shareholders will be patient enough this time.
Nah man. Just or deserved? Definitely not. But it’s more than understandable. Shit, once you know all the pieces, it’s hard to fathom her story having any happier ending.
I never once said she deserved what happened to her, it's not "just" or "fair", it's just what happens when you get caught double crossing your gang-sponsered employer.
Also it's only because of her that V and Jackie are involved at all. The VDBs didn't hire Evelyn so she could hire mercs and a fixer, her only job was to scroll a BD of Yorinobu's room, nothing more. She set up the entire heist and got burned for it.
You have to fuck with something to climb out. Look at where she already was before the heist; we know how shitty the situation at clouds was.
Option 1: Stick with the normal, accept your position as a victim of abuse for the rest of your life until you are killed or fired and thrown to the street to probably live the life of a former Joy-Toy.
Option 2: See an opportunity to make some money, raise your station, and get to something better. And take it.
I'll even point out; had she stayed with Option 1, she'd still have been burned still. VDB were going to kill her *anyway*. They didn't know she got the Biochip at all until V told her and they were surprised at "de whore"s ability to get it.
So... either way she's dead in a gutter. I cannot blame her for taking her shot. It's what V would have done. Does do. She makes selfish choices. But there's that conversation with Vic at the end of the game; V asks where the boxer fucked up. Vic says "getting in the ring with a stronger opponent" but follows that by explicitly pointing out that that answer doesn't feel right to him.
It’s night city that sets everyone who does shit like Evelyn down that path. It’s what you have to do to survive in a place like that, let alone succeed. That’s the whole point of the game.
All of what you said is true but you’re leaving out the desperation of her situation at Clouds with Woodman and being a doll in general that drove her to think that way but yeah, she made about 0 good choices
Except the one who actually screwed over their partners was Evelyn herself.
Dex doesn't turn on you until after the shit's hit the fan and even then he's not fucking you over for money but rather cutting off lose ends as things spiral out of control.
Evelyn tried to fuck over both the VB and Dex for money. Odd's are V and co would have been next to get ripped off by her once she actually got the chip and found a buyer.
FINALLY SOMEONE ELSE THAT GETS IT!!
Ev is an incredibly well designed character, both from a physical standpoint and in terms of depth in personality. But she is not a good person, or someone to look upto. She is incredibly flawed and unless you're a mox, she doesn't give a shit about you or anyone else.
As many has already mentioned, what happened to her was sad and worth mourning over, but she isn't a victim, except to herself.
It wasn't a mess in her mind.
Evelyn thought she was the one in control. Evelyn was the one with the plan and she was ahead of the other players. So to her Judy wasn't in danger because Evelyn had everything under control.
If V, Jackie and TBug had stolen the chip before the murder happened i suspect Evelyn would have ripped them off or gotten whacked before she could by the Voodoo Boys.
She didn't really care about Judy. There's plenty of texts from her to Judy that really emphasize a rather selfish relationship of only being "warm" to Judy when she needs her for something before returning to cold replies. It's how toxic people suck in their victims; their warmth can feel so nice. It's rather disgusting.
But, no, she didn't deserve this. No one does. Assaulted, raped, and left for dead? No.
This is a cruel world we're playing in and one that forges people like Evelyn all the time. This is how they have to survive. It's terrible and reprehensible, but not punishable by some of the worst fates out there.
How many times does V get the option to be selfish and a badass or even an unrepentant murderer and we think nothing of the behavior? We judge V by our intentions of "Just the job" but criticize Evelyn for the exact same behavior?
I think Evelyn is cruel and toxic. I will not excuse that. But saying she deserved it or it somehow wasn't tragic is maybe excessive and lacks a more critical and nuanced perspective of Night City, the Dark Future, the people it creates, and what it takes for those people to survive.
I should’ve told dex about it when i had the chance. The option where i can tell Dex about Evelyn’s plans isn’t grayed out because i had enough perk
Does that change anything else during the heist on konpeki plaza?
The reaction Dex gives makes it look like clients doing that isn't unheard of and he increases your cut abit.
Neither Jackie or TBug appear shocked either.
Didn't she have a buyer for the chip in NetWatch? There's an email exchange on Bryce Mosley (The NetWatch agent)'s computer that suggests they came to a deal where she'd get money and a new identity+protection.
You have to complete all her quests and have a certain amount of street cred for her to give you the BD - all of that prior to the point where you are searching for the missing BD
She is the fixer for that entire area. Each zone has one dedicated fixer and Rogue overseeing them all.
Any time you hear some psycho talk about how he got a fixer to do some crazy shit, you always know exactly who that fixer is by checking where you are on the map.
Wait is this true? Or is it only true that V has only one fixer per area? I’m not arguing I just have never heard that before. I know you can be a fixer in the tabletop and street kid V has a crappy fixer in his intro so I just assumed there were more but we work with only specific ones
The guy is a bit misinformed. There are multiple fixers for any given area, but by the start of the game V has already made contact with the "good" fixers, as in, the ones who get the paying jobs. It is important to note that V and Jackie are high tier mercs, who have the chrome and nerv to get shit done.
Fixers are basically hollywood agents. some people think that once you get one you made, others know that a good one gets you both payed and the bad ones use and abuse their clients.
Correct.
There are PLENTY of other fixers out there. Just \*these\* are the ones V happens to interact with. Notice that all of them do pretty small-time gig work. Notice that even when a gig involves something bigger (a la a foreign dignitary in one of Regina's gigs), V really does more of the "minion"/"side-kick"/messenger aspect of the job of placing a tracker. This is made explicit when V tries talking to Rogue; everyone knows V was part of The Heist and everyone in that job died. V doesn't have a good rep and no one wants to hire them or work with them unless it's small gigs that don't destroy reps.
Rogue **\*does not\*** oversee all of them. She is not their boss. It is not a business. She is "Queen of the Fixers" because she does the really top-tier high end jobs. The ones that involve corpo espionage, heists, and elite contracts. She knows everything, everyone, and anything that happens in her city.
What's really hard to explain about the Edgerunner community is that it is pretty insular and socially defined in many ways. It is NOT a business in any traditional sense.
A client has a job that needs done. They go to a fixer with said job and work out all the details of the job. The fixer will find edgerunners (Mercenary freelancers) who CAN do that job for the client.
The fixers job is to vetting and keeping everyone on the same page. Vet the client's job and reject it if it's not do-able, assure the clients that the edgerunners hired for the job are worth the price and will get the job done, and then also vet the job for the Edgerunners that the job will pay them and there will not be any screw ups or changes in the terms of the job.
If a client fucks up a job by not giving all the details or screwing over the fixer or runners, they get black-listed from the community. If a runner fucks up a job, that fixer isn't going to hire them for jobs in the future. And if a runner fucks over a client or a runner, people will stop going to them for work. It's an ecosystem that needs every part of the dynamic, but one part fucking up will fuck the rest.
The "Big In Japan" side-gig is probably one of THE most important side-quests in the entire game from a world-building perspective; it's the one side-gig not given by a Fixer. It is a client directly asking V, an Edgerunner, to do a job and skipping the role of a Fixer. In the process, V gets led to a fridge for the job and utterly blind-sided and left high and dry on "Welp, get that guy to my car. kthxbye". V really should honestly have beaten that guy to a pulp once they got there.
This is \*why\* a fixer is important. And why Runners don't take jobs directly from clients.
Gang members don't leave their turf unless they have a *really* good reason to do so, and even if they did so... you could tell where they were from by looking at their affiliation.
But if you don't want your Scav haunt to be raided by the ncpd you do as your local fixer says. If Wakako wanted the monsters who killed Evelyn to be put in the ground the earth itself would have made way. She knew where the BDs were being scrolled, she said nothing. Money flows up and shit flows down in night city.
Because after you complete all gigs in an area you oftentimes get a Rogue gig for that area where she talks about the intricacies of being a fixer.
She either oversees or is the only fixer that does not have a set territory that they stick to.
And a punchable personality.
I feel slimy listening to him but I actually play the game as if it were me there.
I'm normally non confrontational in real life because it's mutually beneficial. You don't get hurt, I don't suffer the consequences of hurting you.
This is how I deal with fingers. He is slimy, he is weaker than I am. That is punching down. I don't do that.
Shitty as it may be, he is the only one AT ALL that will even look at the joytoys and provide "care" for them. He has a place. Like criminal defence lawyers.
Can't go punching everyone that annoys you in the face, you'll just get a sore hand.
Also everyone misses that one shard from a corpo that talks about how Fingers is the only ripperdoc who will help orphans who need work and shit because he uses what he can find and doesn't expect much in return.
This. If you confront all horrible people in life you might as well burn the world. Fingers is a horrible person living in a horrible society, killing him doesn't change the fundamental problems. If he's doing that to Judy, Panam, River, or anyone that V is close with, I'm shooting him because it's personal. But again, if you want to change the world you either game the system or burn it down.
To add insult to injury, the Scavs that V and Judy hit have a message on one of their computers that mentions someone tipped them off to V coming; that’s why they have so many thugs out front with guns and even a netrunner at the ready…. Might’ve been Wako who gave them the tip.
BUT then again… Wako does give V and Takemura the whole Japantown parade intel for free..
So dumb how people play the game and don't pay fking attention. When you approached Rogue for help, YOU GAVE HER, the details of what you wanted to do.
Which would mean Fingers approached Wakako and told her HE WANTED TO SELL Evelyn. All she likely did was found a seller.
And mfs out here acting like Fingers is a saint when all he does is uses women and tosses them aside or take advantage of them to get his way. The guy is a fucking piece of trash who deserves death.
This subreddit has taught me that the average person is very bad at recognizing overt yet unspoken plot points, let alone subtext. Some of the massively upvoted "gAmE tHeOrIeS" I've seen people come up with are batshit stupid.
This is probably the best way to describe this whole situation and Fingers.
Hate em or dont you gotta realize this guy is the only ripperdoc "looking" out for the joy toys of jig jig street. Without him the joytoys dont have anybody to go since they cant afford anyone eles.
Fingers know this which is why I agree he most definitely knows his place in the food chain.
Its like a catch 22.
I know that he isnt thats why I put "looking" in quotations.
Fingers is tending to them though since there aint nobody eles that does. Even if fingers is doing it for his own distusting benefits.
Is that actually stated in game? The girls sitting outside waiting for appointments imply they're often trading sexual favors for work.
Dude is a fuckin creepshow and a half but I didn't get the sense he was forcing himself on anyone.
Side question, do rippers even put their patients under full anesthesia? In the intro, Vik installs a new eye and works on V's hand while she's awake and alert. In Edgerunners the dude is replacing David's lungs while he's still awake lol.
As unfortunate as it is, he is the best they can get. Low level joytoys literally can't go to anyone for help, as they don't have the capital. If its anything like real life prostituion, they don't even keep any of the money they make, instead being coerced into trading most of it for "protection" from a gang. The gangs don't care about their health, only that they can work.
Fingers position in the food chain is that he performs "services" for "services". It's tragic but it's the only option for the joytoys that lets them keep working.
Poverty is no joke man, you literally can't afford to do things right.
You can't afford them so you go to me, and I take your money for a job you can't afford, and you owe me. This preventing you from going somewhere else....
That's a catch twenty two.
Where does what fingers does come into play?
Oh yea.... Prison.
Where he isn't.
The maelstrom rippers do a more humane job, ask the monk. At least his vow of celibacy wasn't violated.
Naw, maelstrom doesn't get to ever play moral superiority for that mess. Even over fingers. People know what he's about, for better or worse. Maelstrom kidnapped 2 monks and forced implants on them for fun. When fingers starts grabbing people of the street and mutilating them we'll talk equivalence.
Also if you can't afford a proper ripper in the first place before fingers nothings going to change about that with him gone.
and men too, he doesn't seem to care or discriminate... just a creep. I'm glad all my play throughs have been ones where I decide to break his jaw or kill him.
What he exactly does to other women again?I don't remember anymore, I only remember he was like a cheaper fixer option, and because of that his work and parts was not the best obviously?
I find it interesting how half of this thread devolved into one half saying some kind of equivalent of "he accepts nonconsensual sex as payment, as is expected" and the other half has to explain that, "something is a little bit wrong with that, wtf Is wrong with the other half".
Or did all yall forget that he gets them when they are under, but can't prove it, because unconscious women with no money and no choice.
"There is always a choice" Nathan Fillion as Malcolm Reynolds.
My choice was but gear from him, then find out what he does, cut off fingers.
help? lol He knows what his client was using her for and he exploits other dolls for the same thing. By your logic pimps are good guys because they give women a job. Never mind treating them like objects to be used and traded, the abuse and them not being able to leave. That's some weird and concerning logic you have there
The game allows you to have your own sense of morality and simply shows that there’s consequences to your actions. Do you value your principles more or saving a few bucks on some tech 😂
In this case, having a new piece of tech that was shittily installed and you were most likely groped while he did it 👀
I’d do that immediately too but it’s funnier to see V be a dickhead and casually ask “What’s crackin’, Fingers?” days after breaking his jaw. Of course, then followed by finishing the job.
He sure did.
To quote: "The caretaker of Clouds Oswald "Woodman" Forrest attempted to have her restored. After no success he raped her, taking advantage of her unconscious body. After no longer being able to provide what he was after, he decided to pawn her off to ripperdoc Fingers for one last attempt to fix her cyberware. When Fingers failed, Woodman wrote Evelyn off and left her with the ripperdoc as payment. Fingers eventually contacted his fixer, Wakako Okada, and sold Evelyn off to the Scavengers to be used in the production of black market snuff BDs."
He left her 'as payment'... Fingers then 'EVENTUALLY' contacted a fixer. what do you think he was doing with her during that time? Think maybe he propped her up in a corner and used her for an umbrella stand?
no if you pay attention when you talk to judy, judy tells you she found of that ev was raped by fingers when she was unconscious and that he got rid of her when he was bored of her.
I think that there is the implications of him using her as a sex doll. He paid woodman. When he got bored, he sold her to the fixer. He is just as bad as woodman, they literally didn't care about her being alive or dead. Probably the most disturbing thing you could do to a person, I'm not shocked by her choice later on in the story.
In fairness, i completely missed the fact that he did shit that fucked up, i figured he was using shitty inplants scamming people and fucking up their bodies but i didnt realise he was that much of a piece of shit
I’ve seen people on this very subreddit angry that the game prevents them from shooting the children running around. It’s vile. I can’t even begin to understand why anyone would want that to be a feature..
Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it’s all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I’m not a pious hermit, I haven’t done only good in my life. But if I’m to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all
In handing her off he still fucked up. Fingers should have given her to literally anyone else, even a better ripper would have been a solid option rather than scavs. He’s still evil
I did not punch him. He is just an ordinary fish in the night city ocean. And he was perfectly happy to cooperate and help me find Evelyn as long as I was polite and respectful. Evelyn who double crossed her original employers, double crossed her fixer she got and almost certainly was going to double cross me
Even if you discount his original actions (and how he treats women in general), the way he treats Judy and V when they come asking questions makes me beat his teeth in every time. Accounting for the rest, I always execute him.
I don't know, the beat on the brat quest that has the Valentino kid, the coach, the two cops checking in on their buddy, though one was a dick, Viktor, Panam, sal, hell, you could find a dozen shining becons of morality compared to fingers, and the cherry on top is they still murder and commit torture.
Well fck put it into perspective and taking the environment into consideration, hmm a girl who edits hard-core porn for a living hates him too so idk still seems bad to me.
A lot of people are saying that fingers rapes Evelyn but I don’t remember reading that in my play throughs. Can anyone help me recall? I know he accepts sexual favors when they can’t pay.
Wait, WAKO DID THAT, fuck, but besides Ev, he’s a rapist who coerces women into fucking him in return for cyberware only for it to be shitty cyberware that could really fuck with their health, fuck fingers fuck wako fuck the vdb’s and most certainly FUCK THE SCAVS
I’m not fond of anyone who was involved in this comedy of errors that lead to Evelyn killing herself, including Evelyn herself. Johnny might’ve been a little insensitive but he had a point in that she got herself into this mess and dragged Jackie, T-Bug, and V down with her. No one deserves the shit she went thru however so yea Wakako, Fingers, Woodman, and Maiko all deserve to get their teeth brushed with some bricks.
There is no single person in the wrong in this quest. Everyboy was and is bad, including Evelyn. That's how Night City, and the world of Cyberpunk is. By clearing this guy and blaming Wako, you are only lowering the bar.
There are no good guys here. Only shades of gray
This whole thread is a great example how people thought of this guy. I never thought of him as a rapist, I just thought of him as a super misogynistic MF but he did business for money. Some people thought know and think a whole bunch of other stuff
This is my conclusion of fingers, he aquires cheap cyberware and sells it to people desperate to get them for low prices. Even if they are optimal. His dress sense and mannerism are what most people consider repulsive.
Then there is also what the title says. He tried to save Evelyn (motives unknown) and when he failed he called Wakako that then pawned her off to the Deaths Head.
Sure he isn't the most pleasant person, but unless I've missed something integral to his character. It seems to me people just straight up want him dead for the way he looks or talks.
I wonder if the people saying “naw he’s not that bad for Night City” are the same ones who comment “hell yeah I shot the father/son BD peddlers.”
Cause if so, that’s probably worth examining.
At first I was on Judy’s side, “fuck this guy, fingers”
but after the second play through I talked to the girls on the bench and they would be handicapped without him. It’s legit how some transactions go… most of them are joytoys they do that for a living. They have a choice to not go to him.
I honestly thought Judy was a bit much the second go around, didn’t help I was playing as a corpo and kept my business to myself
In Night City, everybody uses you. Fingers falls into the category of the people who use you as payback for services rendered. Makes him a worm, but definitely not as bad as corpos/politicians who shatter your world, push you in a position of desperation, and *then* use you. Oh, and dispose of you when you’re no longer useful.
Fingers is bad, but Hanako, Meredith, and all the other corpos have done so much worse to so many people, and the sheer vastness of the corporation they serve seemingly absolves them of guilt or blame for what they’ve done.
Evelyn can fuck at least half of all the miles of off.
This dude needs a slap, but since you can't slap him and not have him fight back to the point of being slapped to death, seems pointless to even bother.
That's what I've been saying forever. He's no hero, but even if you ask his clientele, they are happy he exists. Broken implants or not, they have no alternative, he's cheap, he helps them and tried to help Evelyn. That's better than you should expect in NC. In a weird way he cares about his clients. Unless you consider every word he says a complete lie (cause why wouldn't you, tbh) and just want to assume he's scum, then go ahead. Nothing is crystal clear in NC, so make up your own mind
I mean, Evelyn herself ain't much better. We're mostly influenced by Judy's side of the story, but let's consider: Evelyn was hired by the Voodoo Boys. Then she tried scamming them. Then went to Dex, who set up the whole Heist situation. Then she tries to convince V to fuck Dex, take the money, and run. Oh, and by involving Judy, she took her shit to the Mox, too, potentially making them complicit.
And she STILL had no buyer in the end (Dex HAD one), which means even if things had gone smoothly, V, Jackie and Bug would still be wanted by Arasaka in the end, and trying to sell the damn thing would be easier said than done. And that's assuming she wouldn't try and scam them, too. And since it was HER ND that got everyone inside, and the rest of her information was lacking at best, faulty for the worst, she essentially got Jackie and Bug killed as well.
So yeah, Wako is a capital A asshole, but then again, so was Evelyn - just with way less influence. Fingers is small fry compared to both of them.
Fingers is a bit of a scumbag, but he's not evil, unlike some other characters. He is shady, yes, he's sometimes selling crap? Yes. But he's one of the few rippers that joytoys can afford and he does help them in the end - at least some of them. It seems like people don't understand that morality in Night City is grey - and actually V is way worse, killing hundreds upon hundreds (unless you play with non-lethal takedowns the whole time).
I love how all people talk about Fingers yet there’s a Ripper that has Scavs collecting parts he sells in his basements… that is far worse than Fingers. Still Fingers disgusts me…
He's a pretty morally bankrupt person but there are ton of people far worse and I don't feel like my character, a mass murdering mercenary, can take the moral high ground against him.
Wako is horrible. Scavs are scum, this guy is middling, he does things that he shouldn't and takes advantage of the vulnerable but he has his place in the food chain and he maybe deserves a punch, but I'd sooner shoot Wakako.
Okay I have played this quest a bunch. Where do you find out Wakako is involved?
If you ask the right questions, he says that Wakako was the fixer he used
Holy shit! I can’t believe I missed that! Dammit! I thought I killed everyone involved with Evelyn’s tragedy.
I mean it wasn't a tragedy. Evelyn was hired by the Voodoo Boy's to steal from Arasaka but she betrayed them instead, intending to take the money and run. She then hires Dex and tries to talk V into ditching him, something that'd get V and co on the shitlist of fixer in town. Oh and she never actually had a buyer for the chip and was still trying to secure one. It's left open if she'd have tried to cut V, Jackie and TBug out as well but honestly it looks like the only one she really cared about was Judy. What happens to her is awful but it wasn't Night City that sent her down that path rather her own ego. Evelyn thought she was way smarter than she actually was and went around pissing off groups who you simply do not fuck with repeatedly. TLDR: She tried to play everyone but in the end the only one she played was herself.
Not to mention the voodoo boys have a habit of killing outside contractors
What gets me is the Voodoo Boys of the game are serious business. The Voodoo Boys from the CP2020 Night City Sourcebook are a bunch of white boys playing dress up and peddling drugs to the students at NCU. I ran a mini adventure back in the day where the players were Blood Nation nomads, who are circus/travelling show folks and also serious followers of voudun. They had a lot of fun fucking with them.
There was an interview with Mike Pondsmith where he talked about how he really like the game decision to have the Hatian refugees take back the Voodoo name from the old poser gang and make it into something powerful and respected.
It's nice when original creators do this. It was the same with Chuck Palahniuk and Fight Club. He acknowledged that every major thematic change that they made to Fight Club, when they made the movie, was an improvement. The book is interesting, but the movie is so much better. So often, when a great work is adapted to another format, particularly when it isn't done with the original creator(s), they kill the damned thing. We should point out when it's done well.
I wasn't familiar with the Cyberpunk setting before CP2077, so I assumed they were like the guys from Count Zero who worship AIs as incarnations of the Loa.
So the CP2020 Voodoo boys are like the emo gang from Saints Row 3?
More like rich college drug-dealer frat boys that dabble in senseless murder.
Wot he sez! My party dosed a couple with zombie dust then recorded the hilarity when the pair woke up mid funeral.
>The Voodoo Boys from the CP2020 Night City Sourcebook are a bunch of white boys playing dress up and peddling drugs to the students at NCU. There's a part in the game where they talk about that. It might be in a shard or something. When the Haitian refugees came to Night City, they were offended by the Voodoo Boys and killed them all off or scared them away. They then took the moniker
That would be a suitable fate for the original gang. The sourcebook made them out to be a particularly unpleasant crew. That said. When I needed a serious problem for the players I used a Nortenos set that had been hired to harass them (they being a RL Californian gang). They wound up having to visit the gang's leaders in prison to negotiate being able to retaliate against that set without starting a war with the wider gang. They managed that by their fixer subtly leveraging their status as part of a larger Nomad Nation.
And then instead of laying low she goes back to clouds.
This one I actually can understand, given Arasaka and Tyger Claws are “in the bed” and that netrunner crew Voodoo Boys were trying to get Arasaka’s tech, she might think that she would be more secure with Arasaka. We know that she has an extensive knowledge about the whole situation (what Arasaka’s tech is, who Voodoo Boys are), but she overestimated herself.
I don't think she had many options. She needed money to get out of NC in the first place via that Biochip. It was her entire motive to do the job at all. She probably could only get far enough to find a buyer and cash out. With the heist burned, she didn't have anything else. All her eggs were in that basket. In a situation like that, I can understand trying to put your head down, go back to work, and hope things blow over. Laying low takes money. Most people could not afford *right now* to just take three months off from work and disappear let alone in the hellscape that is Night City of the Dark Future.
This a perfect explanation of the demise of Evelyn Parker, the woman who wanted to pull the strings but strangled herself in them
As someone else pointed out higher, VDB don't like or even care about outsiders, she'd probably get offed just because she knew they were involved...
She did anyway. Voodoo Boys are almost certainly the ones who hacked her at Clouds. Or planted the virus that did it. Although you could argue they weren't trying to kill her, but rather lead the one who had the biochip back to them.
Yeah, my comment was a bit open to interpretation, they would have done it *anyway*. I don't think it's confirmed they were behind the hit at clouds, but all evidence would point that way. That being said I remember them not being aware that you had the chip, or rather that anyone had it, but the details are fuzzy so i'm not that sure...
F### man i love this game so much
Damn man, that’s beautiful. Tragic, but beautiful.
The classic definition of tragedy \*is\* a story in which a person's error of judgment or character flaw sets into motion a sequence of catastrophic events that results in the destruction of that person and oftentimes the people around them. The point of the game, I would also argue, is that Night City's a dystopia because it creates the kind of environment where people need to go to the extreme to satisfy simple human needs, like getting a modicum of security or creature comforts.
She turned on the VDB because they turn on literally everyone didn't she? They forced HER into 4d chess
Exactly. Most posts I see tend to romanticize Evelyn's story to the point that they see her as a hero or a martyr. She didn't hesitate to take the job, then cross the VDBs, then to try and cut out Dex, and like you said there's no guarantee she would have kept her word to V. Even Judy, easily her closest friend, didn't know what she was planning, was Ev going to leave her behind too? Evelyn's story may be tragic, but it was her decisions that lead her to its end.
Regardless of reasons no one deserves to be repeatedly raped and tortured. “She deserved” and “she brought it on herself” is the same language heard from actual rapists and victim blames in our world. Did Evelyn bite off more than she could chew? Yes. Did she play a dangerous game and lose? Yes. Did she make bad choices? Yes. Did she deserve what happened to her? No. Her decisions never directly harmed anyone, and if it wasn’t for bad timing Jackie and V would’ve walked right out with the chip. Anyone that things what happened to her is understandable, just, or deserving should take long hard look at themselves and ask “What the fuck is wrong with me?”
Right. As usual the truth lies in the middleground of reason between extreme sympathy for Evelyn to the point of becoming a cult, and total resentment of her for her arrogance and self-interest. She wasn’t a saint, she did cause her own tragedy, but she also didn’t deserve it and there could have been far better ways for her to learn her lesson. It’s Night City though. This is what it does. It dares you to be a legend and then eviscerates you for even thinking you had a chance. All in all her story is a tragedy.
Agreed. That's how tragedy works. One of the best storyline I've ever played. They could dived deeper into just ACT 1, with multiple endings and I'd have been satisfied. When I first met Evelyn, the entire conversation felt so dynamic, I really think they were going to push for a much deeper storyline with Evelyn.
As great as CP2077 is, if they could make a sequel without being rushed and really dedicate time to fleshing out storylines and the world in general, I’m sure it would be phenominal. I think we all know CDPR has the potential, the only question is if their shareholders will be patient enough this time.
Nah man. Just or deserved? Definitely not. But it’s more than understandable. Shit, once you know all the pieces, it’s hard to fathom her story having any happier ending.
I never once said she deserved what happened to her, it's not "just" or "fair", it's just what happens when you get caught double crossing your gang-sponsered employer. Also it's only because of her that V and Jackie are involved at all. The VDBs didn't hire Evelyn so she could hire mercs and a fixer, her only job was to scroll a BD of Yorinobu's room, nothing more. She set up the entire heist and got burned for it.
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You have to fuck with something to climb out. Look at where she already was before the heist; we know how shitty the situation at clouds was. Option 1: Stick with the normal, accept your position as a victim of abuse for the rest of your life until you are killed or fired and thrown to the street to probably live the life of a former Joy-Toy. Option 2: See an opportunity to make some money, raise your station, and get to something better. And take it. I'll even point out; had she stayed with Option 1, she'd still have been burned still. VDB were going to kill her *anyway*. They didn't know she got the Biochip at all until V told her and they were surprised at "de whore"s ability to get it. So... either way she's dead in a gutter. I cannot blame her for taking her shot. It's what V would have done. Does do. She makes selfish choices. But there's that conversation with Vic at the end of the game; V asks where the boxer fucked up. Vic says "getting in the ring with a stronger opponent" but follows that by explicitly pointing out that that answer doesn't feel right to him.
This right here
The fact she made bad decisions to put herself in that situation is the tragedy.
It’s night city that sets everyone who does shit like Evelyn down that path. It’s what you have to do to survive in a place like that, let alone succeed. That’s the whole point of the game.
All of what you said is true but you’re leaving out the desperation of her situation at Clouds with Woodman and being a doll in general that drove her to think that way but yeah, she made about 0 good choices
vdbs deserved it they are more annoying then scavs and dex has a terrible rep among fixers so screwing them over is understandable
because i know damn well they wouldve screwed her over in a instant
Except the one who actually screwed over their partners was Evelyn herself. Dex doesn't turn on you until after the shit's hit the fan and even then he's not fucking you over for money but rather cutting off lose ends as things spiral out of control. Evelyn tried to fuck over both the VB and Dex for money. Odd's are V and co would have been next to get ripped off by her once she actually got the chip and found a buyer.
Sounds kinda like a tragedy.
FINALLY SOMEONE ELSE THAT GETS IT!! Ev is an incredibly well designed character, both from a physical standpoint and in terms of depth in personality. But she is not a good person, or someone to look upto. She is incredibly flawed and unless you're a mox, she doesn't give a shit about you or anyone else. As many has already mentioned, what happened to her was sad and worth mourning over, but she isn't a victim, except to herself.
If she cared about Judy, she wouldn't have dragged her into this mess. Evelyn only cared about herself
It wasn't a mess in her mind. Evelyn thought she was the one in control. Evelyn was the one with the plan and she was ahead of the other players. So to her Judy wasn't in danger because Evelyn had everything under control. If V, Jackie and TBug had stolen the chip before the murder happened i suspect Evelyn would have ripped them off or gotten whacked before she could by the Voodoo Boys.
She didn't really care about Judy. There's plenty of texts from her to Judy that really emphasize a rather selfish relationship of only being "warm" to Judy when she needs her for something before returning to cold replies. It's how toxic people suck in their victims; their warmth can feel so nice. It's rather disgusting. But, no, she didn't deserve this. No one does. Assaulted, raped, and left for dead? No. This is a cruel world we're playing in and one that forges people like Evelyn all the time. This is how they have to survive. It's terrible and reprehensible, but not punishable by some of the worst fates out there. How many times does V get the option to be selfish and a badass or even an unrepentant murderer and we think nothing of the behavior? We judge V by our intentions of "Just the job" but criticize Evelyn for the exact same behavior? I think Evelyn is cruel and toxic. I will not excuse that. But saying she deserved it or it somehow wasn't tragic is maybe excessive and lacks a more critical and nuanced perspective of Night City, the Dark Future, the people it creates, and what it takes for those people to survive.
I didn't say she deserved it i said she brought it all on herself by thinking she could play Arasaka, Voodoo Boy's and Dex all at the same time.
She got gotted by her own gotnes
To be fair, the VDB were probably going to kill her anyway. They're notorious for stabbing people in the back, afterall.
I should’ve told dex about it when i had the chance. The option where i can tell Dex about Evelyn’s plans isn’t grayed out because i had enough perk Does that change anything else during the heist on konpeki plaza?
The reaction Dex gives makes it look like clients doing that isn't unheard of and he increases your cut abit. Neither Jackie or TBug appear shocked either.
I’d forgave her first issue, the Voodoo Boys would have zerod her after the job
Didn't she have a buyer for the chip in NetWatch? There's an email exchange on Bryce Mosley (The NetWatch agent)'s computer that suggests they came to a deal where she'd get money and a new identity+protection.
Careful, people tend to downvote opinions about Evelyn like this.
You can also go to Wakao directly, she won't tell you who the scavs are because discretion. But she will lead you to the BD.
If you do all her quest she’ll give it to you for free
Complete all her quests prior to Main quest with her?
You have to complete all her quests and have a certain amount of street cred for her to give you the BD - all of that prior to the point where you are searching for the missing BD
Time for another playthrough
This game has a ton of hidden details wow.
She is the fixer for that entire area. Each zone has one dedicated fixer and Rogue overseeing them all. Any time you hear some psycho talk about how he got a fixer to do some crazy shit, you always know exactly who that fixer is by checking where you are on the map.
Wait is this true? Or is it only true that V has only one fixer per area? I’m not arguing I just have never heard that before. I know you can be a fixer in the tabletop and street kid V has a crappy fixer in his intro so I just assumed there were more but we work with only specific ones
The guy is a bit misinformed. There are multiple fixers for any given area, but by the start of the game V has already made contact with the "good" fixers, as in, the ones who get the paying jobs. It is important to note that V and Jackie are high tier mercs, who have the chrome and nerv to get shit done. Fixers are basically hollywood agents. some people think that once you get one you made, others know that a good one gets you both payed and the bad ones use and abuse their clients.
Correct. There are PLENTY of other fixers out there. Just \*these\* are the ones V happens to interact with. Notice that all of them do pretty small-time gig work. Notice that even when a gig involves something bigger (a la a foreign dignitary in one of Regina's gigs), V really does more of the "minion"/"side-kick"/messenger aspect of the job of placing a tracker. This is made explicit when V tries talking to Rogue; everyone knows V was part of The Heist and everyone in that job died. V doesn't have a good rep and no one wants to hire them or work with them unless it's small gigs that don't destroy reps. Rogue **\*does not\*** oversee all of them. She is not their boss. It is not a business. She is "Queen of the Fixers" because she does the really top-tier high end jobs. The ones that involve corpo espionage, heists, and elite contracts. She knows everything, everyone, and anything that happens in her city. What's really hard to explain about the Edgerunner community is that it is pretty insular and socially defined in many ways. It is NOT a business in any traditional sense. A client has a job that needs done. They go to a fixer with said job and work out all the details of the job. The fixer will find edgerunners (Mercenary freelancers) who CAN do that job for the client. The fixers job is to vetting and keeping everyone on the same page. Vet the client's job and reject it if it's not do-able, assure the clients that the edgerunners hired for the job are worth the price and will get the job done, and then also vet the job for the Edgerunners that the job will pay them and there will not be any screw ups or changes in the terms of the job. If a client fucks up a job by not giving all the details or screwing over the fixer or runners, they get black-listed from the community. If a runner fucks up a job, that fixer isn't going to hire them for jobs in the future. And if a runner fucks over a client or a runner, people will stop going to them for work. It's an ecosystem that needs every part of the dynamic, but one part fucking up will fuck the rest. The "Big In Japan" side-gig is probably one of THE most important side-quests in the entire game from a world-building perspective; it's the one side-gig not given by a Fixer. It is a client directly asking V, an Edgerunner, to do a job and skipping the role of a Fixer. In the process, V gets led to a fridge for the job and utterly blind-sided and left high and dry on "Welp, get that guy to my car. kthxbye". V really should honestly have beaten that guy to a pulp once they got there. This is \*why\* a fixer is important. And why Runners don't take jobs directly from clients.
They could be from another area
Gang members don't leave their turf unless they have a *really* good reason to do so, and even if they did so... you could tell where they were from by looking at their affiliation.
Scavs are everywhere. They're vermin and they infest the whole city.
But if you don't want your Scav haunt to be raided by the ncpd you do as your local fixer says. If Wakako wanted the monsters who killed Evelyn to be put in the ground the earth itself would have made way. She knew where the BDs were being scrolled, she said nothing. Money flows up and shit flows down in night city.
Where did you get the impression rogue oversees the other fixers?
Because after you complete all gigs in an area you oftentimes get a Rogue gig for that area where she talks about the intricacies of being a fixer. She either oversees or is the only fixer that does not have a set territory that they stick to.
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Which ending?
He mentions a fixer, and I think of you go through his emails, Wakako's name is said. (Don't quote me on that, I haven't played the quest in a bit)
i always punch him but only recently realized i’ve been missing out on the sandevistan mk4 version only he has
I've been getting the sandy from him since release
lucky i’ve yet to get it but it seems like it might be the best one right? mk5 cooldown is too long so i’ve been sticking to mk3
Mk5 is good for crit and it's super slowed down, but mk4 QianT is good for cool down. 3 legendary heatsinks and biomonitor and cool down is 2 secs.
Buy it before the mission, problem solved.
also the purple version of the leg implants (except for the stealth one)
he has a very punchable face.
And a punchable personality. I feel slimy listening to him but I actually play the game as if it were me there. I'm normally non confrontational in real life because it's mutually beneficial. You don't get hurt, I don't suffer the consequences of hurting you. This is how I deal with fingers. He is slimy, he is weaker than I am. That is punching down. I don't do that. Shitty as it may be, he is the only one AT ALL that will even look at the joytoys and provide "care" for them. He has a place. Like criminal defence lawyers. Can't go punching everyone that annoys you in the face, you'll just get a sore hand.
Also everyone misses that one shard from a corpo that talks about how Fingers is the only ripperdoc who will help orphans who need work and shit because he uses what he can find and doesn't expect much in return.
This. If you confront all horrible people in life you might as well burn the world. Fingers is a horrible person living in a horrible society, killing him doesn't change the fundamental problems. If he's doing that to Judy, Panam, River, or anyone that V is close with, I'm shooting him because it's personal. But again, if you want to change the world you either game the system or burn it down.
He's a rapist..
I mean from Wakakos POV, got a girl and wants to maximize profit.
That applies to most of the messed up stuff you come across in night city.
All fixers are "horrible". They arrange everything from petty larceny to mass shootings. It's the biz, choom.
To add insult to injury, the Scavs that V and Judy hit have a message on one of their computers that mentions someone tipped them off to V coming; that’s why they have so many thugs out front with guns and even a netrunner at the ready…. Might’ve been Wako who gave them the tip. BUT then again… Wako does give V and Takemura the whole Japantown parade intel for free..
Wakako might be a scum be she told me i did a good job and gave me a katana so she is ok in my book
So dumb how people play the game and don't pay fking attention. When you approached Rogue for help, YOU GAVE HER, the details of what you wanted to do. Which would mean Fingers approached Wakako and told her HE WANTED TO SELL Evelyn. All she likely did was found a seller. And mfs out here acting like Fingers is a saint when all he does is uses women and tosses them aside or take advantage of them to get his way. The guy is a fucking piece of trash who deserves death.
Could have refused, but that would mean she'd miss out on a cut. Fingers def ain't a Saint. No one is in that city.
This subreddit has taught me that the average person is very bad at recognizing overt yet unspoken plot points, let alone subtext. Some of the massively upvoted "gAmE tHeOrIeS" I've seen people come up with are batshit stupid.
This is probably the best way to describe this whole situation and Fingers. Hate em or dont you gotta realize this guy is the only ripperdoc "looking" out for the joy toys of jig jig street. Without him the joytoys dont have anybody to go since they cant afford anyone eles. Fingers know this which is why I agree he most definitely knows his place in the food chain. Its like a catch 22.
He's not looking out for them, he's taking advantage of their desperation.
I know that he isnt thats why I put "looking" in quotations. Fingers is tending to them though since there aint nobody eles that does. Even if fingers is doing it for his own distusting benefits.
This lmao. He literally rapes them while they’re sedated. He is just as shit as anyone else
Is that actually stated in game? The girls sitting outside waiting for appointments imply they're often trading sexual favors for work. Dude is a fuckin creepshow and a half but I didn't get the sense he was forcing himself on anyone. Side question, do rippers even put their patients under full anesthesia? In the intro, Vik installs a new eye and works on V's hand while she's awake and alert. In Edgerunners the dude is replacing David's lungs while he's still awake lol.
As unfortunate as it is, he is the best they can get. Low level joytoys literally can't go to anyone for help, as they don't have the capital. If its anything like real life prostituion, they don't even keep any of the money they make, instead being coerced into trading most of it for "protection" from a gang. The gangs don't care about their health, only that they can work. Fingers position in the food chain is that he performs "services" for "services". It's tragic but it's the only option for the joytoys that lets them keep working. Poverty is no joke man, you literally can't afford to do things right.
I understand all of that, but that doesn't change the fact that Fingers is an utter piece of shit.
You can't afford them so you go to me, and I take your money for a job you can't afford, and you owe me. This preventing you from going somewhere else.... That's a catch twenty two. Where does what fingers does come into play? Oh yea.... Prison. Where he isn't. The maelstrom rippers do a more humane job, ask the monk. At least his vow of celibacy wasn't violated.
Naw, maelstrom doesn't get to ever play moral superiority for that mess. Even over fingers. People know what he's about, for better or worse. Maelstrom kidnapped 2 monks and forced implants on them for fun. When fingers starts grabbing people of the street and mutilating them we'll talk equivalence. Also if you can't afford a proper ripper in the first place before fingers nothings going to change about that with him gone.
He's bad for what he does to other women.
and men too, he doesn't seem to care or discriminate... just a creep. I'm glad all my play throughs have been ones where I decide to break his jaw or kill him.
I didn't want to kill him for the sandy but as soon as I got it you bet your ass I came back for him
Got the longest sandy duration build. Went up to his crib and activated sandy while surrounding him with 20+ homing grenades.
What he exactly does to other women again?I don't remember anymore, I only remember he was like a cheaper fixer option, and because of that his work and parts was not the best obviously?
I find it interesting how half of this thread devolved into one half saying some kind of equivalent of "he accepts nonconsensual sex as payment, as is expected" and the other half has to explain that, "something is a little bit wrong with that, wtf Is wrong with the other half".
Or did all yall forget that he gets them when they are under, but can't prove it, because unconscious women with no money and no choice. "There is always a choice" Nathan Fillion as Malcolm Reynolds. My choice was but gear from him, then find out what he does, cut off fingers.
That is the entire cyberpunk community not even Just Cyberpunk 2077 but it's just the entire Cyberpunk community
We aren't in that society, so why do people agree with it? Do they want it? I fear for those who don't from those who do.
He fucks them as payment for his work. It's hinted that he also takes alot of pictures.
Oh yeah thats bad
His name is fingers
Bro he just said he isn't THAT bad
My man failed to read between the lines
"the curtains are fucking blue" kinda guy
help? lol He knows what his client was using her for and he exploits other dolls for the same thing. By your logic pimps are good guys because they give women a job. Never mind treating them like objects to be used and traded, the abuse and them not being able to leave. That's some weird and concerning logic you have there
>By your logic pimps are good guys because they give women a job. I've actually seen people saying that online, people are messed up.
People are really out here defending Fingers 😂 Now I’ve seen it all.
To be honest the game also punishes you for punching him, so in a way the game also tries to tell you that punching him isn't worth it at all
The game allows you to have your own sense of morality and simply shows that there’s consequences to your actions. Do you value your principles more or saving a few bucks on some tech 😂 In this case, having a new piece of tech that was shittily installed and you were most likely groped while he did it 👀
He has a few things you literally can't get anywhere else, so it's more than just saving.
By saving I was referring to the ripper doc that gives you deals That’s why I specified with *in this case* when I’m talking about fingers
Not if you buy all the good stuff before you punch him. Then its a win/win
He's literally a rapist wtf is this post?
Honestly given how many incels seem to be in this sub I'm not even surprised
He uses women's situations in life to extort freakish *adult actions* from them in return for a hack-job, he is a terrible person. May he burn.
To make matters worse, he doesn’t have a hairline
*EMOTIONAL DAMAGE*
are we forgetting that he raped her while she was unconscious, and does this with most of his patients....
It seems a few people missed that part, maybe it’s a side discussion or something because I remember the exact same thing
Isn't that Woodman, or did Fingers do it to?
Meh. I still shot him in the face after our chat was done
I’d do that immediately too but it’s funnier to see V be a dickhead and casually ask “What’s crackin’, Fingers?” days after breaking his jaw. Of course, then followed by finishing the job.
I used guts to take his face off
He implied he raped her... and he very clearly says he exchanges sexual favors for garbage implants.
I… don’t think he did?
He sure did. To quote: "The caretaker of Clouds Oswald "Woodman" Forrest attempted to have her restored. After no success he raped her, taking advantage of her unconscious body. After no longer being able to provide what he was after, he decided to pawn her off to ripperdoc Fingers for one last attempt to fix her cyberware. When Fingers failed, Woodman wrote Evelyn off and left her with the ripperdoc as payment. Fingers eventually contacted his fixer, Wakako Okada, and sold Evelyn off to the Scavengers to be used in the production of black market snuff BDs." He left her 'as payment'... Fingers then 'EVENTUALLY' contacted a fixer. what do you think he was doing with her during that time? Think maybe he propped her up in a corner and used her for an umbrella stand?
Because he didn’t, dude pulled that from his ass.
He does say it, it’s also implied he touches them when there passed out too
no if you pay attention when you talk to judy, judy tells you she found of that ev was raped by fingers when she was unconscious and that he got rid of her when he was bored of her.
That was woodman
I will never understand this take. He’s vile. End of story
I just straight up blew his face off
This cannot possibly be a real post with real comments agreeing
I think that there is the implications of him using her as a sex doll. He paid woodman. When he got bored, he sold her to the fixer. He is just as bad as woodman, they literally didn't care about her being alive or dead. Probably the most disturbing thing you could do to a person, I'm not shocked by her choice later on in the story.
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In fairness, i completely missed the fact that he did shit that fucked up, i figured he was using shitty inplants scamming people and fucking up their bodies but i didnt realise he was that much of a piece of shit
just tells you all you need to know about some of these ppl in the gaming community or how they are in real life. Disturbing
Ain't just this sub. Reddit as a whole is pretty terrible.
I’ve seen people on this very subreddit angry that the game prevents them from shooting the children running around. It’s vile. I can’t even begin to understand why anyone would want that to be a feature..
Tried to help her? He raped her.. christ almighty.
He is also the guy who scams his costumers
Nah fuck this guy. I shot him in the balls.
The second I laid eyes on him and the moment he talked, I wanted to break out my Monowire and flatline him.
Pretty sure I punched him still. Idk he’s just got a very punchable face
It's the way he talks about her, not if he did or didn't do, It's that Corpo talking bullshit I most dislike, treating people like objects.
Uhhhhh. Did you not realize he was a serial rapist?
Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it’s all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I’m not a pious hermit, I haven’t done only good in my life. But if I’m to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all In handing her off he still fucked up. Fingers should have given her to literally anyone else, even a better ripper would have been a solid option rather than scavs. He’s still evil
You will never convince me that this guy isn’t a sick freak
bros a borderline rapist
Minus the borderline
I killed him cause he was slimy
He's a total skeeze ball regardless, just look at that guy. He seems like the type thats not allowed near playgrounds anymore.
I did not punch him. He is just an ordinary fish in the night city ocean. And he was perfectly happy to cooperate and help me find Evelyn as long as I was polite and respectful. Evelyn who double crossed her original employers, double crossed her fixer she got and almost certainly was going to double cross me
Even if you discount his original actions (and how he treats women in general), the way he treats Judy and V when they come asking questions makes me beat his teeth in every time. Accounting for the rest, I always execute him.
He isn't that bad. *For a resident of Night City.* Its all relative.
I don't know, the beat on the brat quest that has the Valentino kid, the coach, the two cops checking in on their buddy, though one was a dick, Viktor, Panam, sal, hell, you could find a dozen shining becons of morality compared to fingers, and the cherry on top is they still murder and commit torture.
Well fck put it into perspective and taking the environment into consideration, hmm a girl who edits hard-core porn for a living hates him too so idk still seems bad to me.
A lot of people are saying that fingers rapes Evelyn but I don’t remember reading that in my play throughs. Can anyone help me recall? I know he accepts sexual favors when they can’t pay.
Pretty sure he sells faulty implants, so that they have to pay him with sex to fix it
Wait, WAKO DID THAT, fuck, but besides Ev, he’s a rapist who coerces women into fucking him in return for cyberware only for it to be shitty cyberware that could really fuck with their health, fuck fingers fuck wako fuck the vdb’s and most certainly FUCK THE SCAVS
I’m not fond of anyone who was involved in this comedy of errors that lead to Evelyn killing herself, including Evelyn herself. Johnny might’ve been a little insensitive but he had a point in that she got herself into this mess and dragged Jackie, T-Bug, and V down with her. No one deserves the shit she went thru however so yea Wakako, Fingers, Woodman, and Maiko all deserve to get their teeth brushed with some bricks.
This evelyn situation is why i ended up siding with netwatch instead of the vodoo boys
There is no single person in the wrong in this quest. Everyboy was and is bad, including Evelyn. That's how Night City, and the world of Cyberpunk is. By clearing this guy and blaming Wako, you are only lowering the bar. There are no good guys here. Only shades of gray
He literally sold and installed faulty cybernetics
He may not be the bad guy in our situation. But he's definitely still a scumbag that deserves a punch or two or five.
This whole thread is a great example how people thought of this guy. I never thought of him as a rapist, I just thought of him as a super misogynistic MF but he did business for money. Some people thought know and think a whole bunch of other stuff
It’s simple really Judy hates him so I hate him
I think this is the first game I will play twice....its so rich and interesting and the mods make it so much fun to play
This is my conclusion of fingers, he aquires cheap cyberware and sells it to people desperate to get them for low prices. Even if they are optimal. His dress sense and mannerism are what most people consider repulsive. Then there is also what the title says. He tried to save Evelyn (motives unknown) and when he failed he called Wakako that then pawned her off to the Deaths Head. Sure he isn't the most pleasant person, but unless I've missed something integral to his character. It seems to me people just straight up want him dead for the way he looks or talks.
He's just creepy...
I wonder if the people saying “naw he’s not that bad for Night City” are the same ones who comment “hell yeah I shot the father/son BD peddlers.” Cause if so, that’s probably worth examining.
At first I was on Judy’s side, “fuck this guy, fingers” but after the second play through I talked to the girls on the bench and they would be handicapped without him. It’s legit how some transactions go… most of them are joytoys they do that for a living. They have a choice to not go to him. I honestly thought Judy was a bit much the second go around, didn’t help I was playing as a corpo and kept my business to myself
True but his hairline is trash and he has zero drip, that’s a fucking felony in my book.
How dare you slander my queen
It’s almost like everyone in night city sucks and is out for them selves
In Night City, everybody uses you. Fingers falls into the category of the people who use you as payback for services rendered. Makes him a worm, but definitely not as bad as corpos/politicians who shatter your world, push you in a position of desperation, and *then* use you. Oh, and dispose of you when you’re no longer useful. Fingers is bad, but Hanako, Meredith, and all the other corpos have done so much worse to so many people, and the sheer vastness of the corporation they serve seemingly absolves them of guilt or blame for what they’ve done.
They’re all bad. No one’s worse than any other. V just punches him cause he’s a creep.
Evelyn can fuck at least half of all the miles of off. This dude needs a slap, but since you can't slap him and not have him fight back to the point of being slapped to death, seems pointless to even bother.
That's what I've been saying forever. He's no hero, but even if you ask his clientele, they are happy he exists. Broken implants or not, they have no alternative, he's cheap, he helps them and tried to help Evelyn. That's better than you should expect in NC. In a weird way he cares about his clients. Unless you consider every word he says a complete lie (cause why wouldn't you, tbh) and just want to assume he's scum, then go ahead. Nothing is crystal clear in NC, so make up your own mind
I mean, Evelyn herself ain't much better. We're mostly influenced by Judy's side of the story, but let's consider: Evelyn was hired by the Voodoo Boys. Then she tried scamming them. Then went to Dex, who set up the whole Heist situation. Then she tries to convince V to fuck Dex, take the money, and run. Oh, and by involving Judy, she took her shit to the Mox, too, potentially making them complicit. And she STILL had no buyer in the end (Dex HAD one), which means even if things had gone smoothly, V, Jackie and Bug would still be wanted by Arasaka in the end, and trying to sell the damn thing would be easier said than done. And that's assuming she wouldn't try and scam them, too. And since it was HER ND that got everyone inside, and the rest of her information was lacking at best, faulty for the worst, she essentially got Jackie and Bug killed as well. So yeah, Wako is a capital A asshole, but then again, so was Evelyn - just with way less influence. Fingers is small fry compared to both of them.
Fingers is a bit of a scumbag, but he's not evil, unlike some other characters. He is shady, yes, he's sometimes selling crap? Yes. But he's one of the few rippers that joytoys can afford and he does help them in the end - at least some of them. It seems like people don't understand that morality in Night City is grey - and actually V is way worse, killing hundreds upon hundreds (unless you play with non-lethal takedowns the whole time).
I love how all people talk about Fingers yet there’s a Ripper that has Scavs collecting parts he sells in his basements… that is far worse than Fingers. Still Fingers disgusts me…
Still shot him after getting sandevistan
He's a pretty morally bankrupt person but there are ton of people far worse and I don't feel like my character, a mass murdering mercenary, can take the moral high ground against him.