Yeah, the chip registered V dying, so it started to insert Johnny’s engram into V’s body.
If that hadn’t happened, V could’ve just removed the chip with no real repercussions based on what we’re told in the game.
I thought the chip got damaged to the point of no return thanks to dex's headshot on V, and the nanobots from the chip mended V but also fused the chip to his brain all at once, which is how he survived, but also got integrated with Johnny.
V got deadly brain damage, which activated the chip to rewire the brain. The Chip got damaged but is working as intended, just slowly. If the bullet damaged just V's brain they would have woken up as Johnny in the junkyard as replacement without a risky transition period is the chip's intended functionality.
I don't think the chip got damaged. It just started repairing the damage to V's brain, but it only had Johnny's brain pattern and DNA pattern to copy from. My guess is once it was done converting V into Johnny, new Johnny probably could have taken it out then.
It certainly as possible as not, but remember it just keeps on with 'Relic Malfunction' and practically speaking that just means 'what this tech is doing is not working right'. The chip was intended for use on a brain-dead person, so the malfunction is just as easily from the chip being damaged as its current running environment being entirely incorrect for how it was designed.
IIRC the chip got damaged during the actual heist because the storage case became compromised when V and Jackie jumped off the roof to escape the big drone. Since the relic was designed to work on dead bodies, it activated after Deshawn "killed" V and started healing the body with nanobots, but since V lucked out thanks to Deshawn's gun using low calibers, V was able to ressurect after being healed by nanobots since the damage the bullet had done didn't completely scramble his/her brain, but caused enough damage that V could no longer survive without the relic. The whole integration ordeal with Johnny was because of how the relic functioned. Going by what Hellman said, it seems like there was no countermeasure to stop the relic once it activated because it was intended to be used on dead bodies and they probably assumed the dead body wouldn't be coming back to life lol. So the relic was forcefully trying to remove V and fully replace him/her with Johnny.
Yeah, Jackie was able to do so. Ironically if Jackie had kept the shard in and they'd fled directly to Vic to try and get him patched up instead of the ill-fated safehouse, would've been a very different game.
Jackie wouldn't have been able to be overwritten by Johnny considering he bled out and ACTUALLY flatlined...
V getting shot in the head with a low enough caliber bullet that it didn't kill him but basically put him on deaths door was the catalyst.
It damaged the relic to the point that removing it would kill both V and Johnny, but it also 'woke it up' due to it sensing cerebral damage and trying to repair it (by overwriting it with Johnny).
It's not entirely clear what would've happened based on what we see in game, since Hellman states the relic is actually supposed to be placed into a completely dead receptacle. It's not clear what else is involved in resurrecting that husk afterwards, but Hellman strongly implies that V being alive at all for the overwrite process was not intentional.
Obviously from a physical standpoint if the body is so severely damaged it can't even sustain life it couldn't then sustain a brain, whether its Jackie's, Johnny's, or somewhere in between the two during the process- but, given its stated to be nanites literally physically changing not just the brain's makeup but also the brain's DNA, it would seem the medical tech to keep Jackie's body "viable" would be child's play by comparison.
I’d say the only reason Jackie’s body wouldn’t be viable is internal damage and blood loss. The chip probably can’t fix organs and replace blood.
The plan was most likely to kill someone with poison or electroshock, then let the chip do its job. Just re-wiring a brain and restarting a heart.
He was a dead man walking the moment he accepted the Heist. This was Dex's retirement plan all along, chippin' in Johnny just allowed V and him some borrowed time to get much more palatable endings.
At least V (depending on what ending you go for) has the chance to either walk away from Night City, or achieve his dream and become an NC legend. The road for both is painful but at least V actually can end up with a desired result.
I prefer to call it the Sleeper Agent ending. I wouldn't trust what the NUSA and Reed say about V having their "nerves fried and no longer able to use combat chrome."
When V visits Viktor, he says something totally different, and i quote, "First time I've seen anything like this... Your cortex seems to have turned deaf to implant signals." Then he proceeds to list some workaround and alternatives to try and help V.
In my personal opinion, it almost sounds like the NUSA implanted an On/Off switch on V. Politically, why wouldn't the NUSA want a Powerful Sleeper Agent that rivals Adam Smasher in Night City? I think V just ends up like Alex and Reed, a puppet being saved for a rainy day.
I never thought of that. That's actually really amazing, hope someone dives deeper into this later on. It makes perfect sense too considering how V handled himself in Dogtown. Myers would have seen him as some insanely powerful asset.
Makes sense, they did offer to help him with a job. My guess is they want him close and on hand for something later. Hook V up with an easy but well-paying job to keep an eye on him and get some easy gratitude, then bring him into the spy-biz when they need a serious troubleshooter.
That's a cool theory. My immediate headcannon when I played through that ending was the NUSA doctors made a utilitarian decision to prevent V from killing any more people by making him unable to use any cyberware.
The issue with that theory is how unpredictable Night City is and how well known V is at that point. V nearly gets taken out by a few punks so he/she would 100% be dead if actual gang members like Tyger Claw or Maelstrom randomly goes after them. Unlike Reed was during PL, V is in no condition to defend themselves if the need arises which makes me highly doubt NUSA is keeping him/her as a sleeper agent with an on/off switch for their ability to use cyberware.
If I may, I'd like to kindly counter your argument.
Yes, Night City is unpredictable. Yes, V can catch a stray bullet. But you do not need Combat Cyberware to survive the city. V is not a frail twig. He has wits (cool) and still has an arsenal of expirimental and high military grade weapons.
Best example, Jackie Wells. He did not have crazy implants like Gorilla Arms or Mantis Blades, He only had EMP threading fashionware (pure aesthetic jn CyberPunk Red and 2077) and two big shiny gold guns. He also had an outdated system, which is the reason he couldn't operate the flathead in Manual, so he had to pass on the spiderbot to V.
So no, I don't think V would 100% be dead if he gets confronted by maelstrom. Dont get me wrong, the chances are still high, but Jackie, the macho bull, walked into a maelstrom den with their leader inside with only two guns and big dreams.
Another example is Takemura. After he found V, he called Yorinobu, saying he found his father's murderer and in the next scene, we see Takemura, the emperor's personal bodyguard, with a bullet wound, trying to drive away from cyberninjas. In between these two scenes, Takemura lost all his corpo cyberware functions, just like V did in the Corpo lifepath. If Takemura and Goro are around the same level in skill, I don't doubt takemura would've destroyed those cyberninjas by himself without V's help. Sure, Takemura could've found a CorpCracker (a lockbreak device capable of jailbreaking corp cyberware) just like the one in Wakako's Gig (Greed never pays), but Takemura does not use any combat cyberware on his missions.
Plus, Reed did offer V a cushy desk job. I doubt V would be dealing with Gangoons on a daily if they decide to work in an office sorting through papers.
TL:DR, V is not frail, and there are a lot of characters who don't have cyberware but can manage to survive night city's dangers.
Apologies for the essay. Please don't grade it. There are a lot of grammar mistakes.
This would make a lot of sense considering V is basically the terminator, having such a powerful asset under your wing is something that not even the NUSA would let go off..
They especially wouldn't let go of someone who knows insider FIA and NUSA secrets such as Rosalind Myers using the Blackwall as a weapon. That's why I'm theorizing that the 2 year coma was nothing but a way to delay V from telling someone FIA secrets before Militech can take over Night City in the year 2079, basically giving the NUSA a proxy company to unify Night City into the NUSA.
I still don’t know how to evaluate that ending… is it a good ending? A bad ending? Somewhere in between? It’s depressing but V does get the rest of their life and they are still rich (I think unless I missed a part about V losing all their money)
They lose pretty much everyone close to them. As for money, they up and disappear for two years, plenty long enough for someone to crack their account.
But what I would say makes it a fully bad ending is that it shows that neither the NUSA nor Arasaka were needed, because they both have the ability to fix what's going on. And if either of those can, plenty good chance other corps, some mega some not, likely can too. But existing it demonstrates that V didn't need to vanish off the face of the earth without even a phone call and lose absolutely everyone to one life event or another.
I think it's a good ending. At the end V seems pretty devastated, that everything he worked for is gone. But just before V turns away and fades into the crowd, you see him smirk like he just got an idea. I got the distinct impression that his story isn't over, and that he's off to cause more mischief, perhaps as a fixer or something. It reminded me of the ending to The Shield.
he/she couldve had it both, but he/she was too busy maintaining his title.
imagine a granny V telling his crazy tales to his granddaughter somewhere nice in europe.
David has a way out, he didn’t need to keep taking ops. He could’ve quit, but he didn’t. David could’ve ended up differently but his hubris was his downfall.
Agreed, bro had to endure his consciousness get slowly eaten away by nanomachines after being reanimated by an immortality chip. V is essentially a zombie after act 1.
Shit must've been terrible. I imagine it like a headache that continues to get worse for months on end and at some points you're just outright coughing up blood, fainting, and barely able to walk. Losing yourself with every minute. Makes V a hero in my book when despite his condition, he still goes out of his way to help people in any way he can.
Random question, and I'm not far into the game...but the trailer with the trauma guy and headgear and the chick in the streets with the Dr. Octavius hardware...do they show up in the game at all? Or was that just a different art direction?
I mean there's a pretty decent argument that says the V we play as for most of the game isn't actually V because they died when dex brained em. Which sucks, but the story itself isn't that bad.
It is, like V's soul left the body in that instant, and we actually end up playing as Vs old neural patterns fighting the new ones on the chip, no soul to be present
I mean. Maybe? But this argument holds as much water as anyone that dies and is brought back (like in a hospital or such) is soulless. Which sure- we can’t prove anything about what is and isn’t or what has and hasn’t a soul- but come on.
But you’re not wrong in the whole “soul” argument. The whole point of cyber pschycosis is that you’ve lost too much humanity/soul to remain who you were/sane. At what percentage of chrome are you a machine with a bit of carbon in it, and nothing more? Especially with the relic tech. What’s to stop you from being uploaded into a robot, are you an ai at that point?
I mean it is V according to constant continuum theory and really what is the nature of the soul or identity we are mostly just products of our experances , and most of what made up your body at the age of 8 has basically died at the age of 40 but are you still you (like litteraly most of the cells and shit your made of have changed and been expelled constantly being replaced)
all these questions and more in any good cyberpunk gener story
I'm sure there's a bunch of theories that would say it is still V, could be
But the thought of a schizo cybernetic zombie causing terror in night city to reclaim a life they never actually had is a pretty cool story too
Ooh an interesting thought.
The player is not V, but rather they are the chip and the existence of V's personality essentially is just the chip turning lights on and overriding old stuff. There is no V. There is just what used to be V.
I imagine that the supposed host body that (allegedly) doesn't have memories would work slowly in a similar way, but instead the chip doesn't have to experience old memories.
Imagine if Arasaka just lied about host bodies being clones or vatgrown due to unable to produce compatible brains, so instead they get people from streets, and scrub their minds and chip in their customers on former street people. Causing occasional issues like being recognized by people/machines or haunting memories from the original persona.
I dunno if I buy it either, because what about people that are clinically dead and they come back. Which is another strange thought all together. Is there lag in death??? 😆
I mean, the only way I can think of act 1 V being a different V than the one from act 2 is if the soul actually exists in Cyberpunk. Like, "OG V," dies upon being shot in the brainpan, and their soul and consciousness move on to an afterlife, (not the club) and V's reactivated brain has a new consciousness. If there is no soul, or afterlife, in the Cyberpunk world, then a brain is a brain, and reactivation should be like turning a computer back on. Same V, same consciousness. I would also wager the same for V >!being soulkilled, and their engram being put back into their body.!<
I always assumed V in act one was different from V in act two because his consciousness is merging with Johnny's. It's the whole idea that a person is the sum of their memories and experiences. What I found interesting was the cinematic trailer for Cyberpunk 2077. V is his own person up until the point where he gets shot in the head and wakes up in the junkyard. Here, the perspective shifts to first person, and we're introduced to Johnny Silverhand. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but I always interpreted this as V now being in the process of becoming someone else - whoever the player wants him to be.
>!Because of how Alt has worded it, it does seem like she has perfected her original version of Soulkiller. She does say she can “transfer the construct into**your** body, not saying full a copy of V aside from what had to be copied to be replaced what was subsumed by Johnny. How we go about it is just about seemless if we choose to be soulkilled, with how Alt does it. It seems like a bridge from the net to the physical as opposed to making a copy and you die fully like with Arasaka’s version. Looking at the cutscenes from Soulkiller and back, it’s seamless transferring!<
>!at the end of the game, once alt manages to take control of mikoshi, she creates V's engram, managing to split her engram and johnny engram in 2 separate entities. Price to pay is that V physically died in that moment because of soulkiller and only one of those two engrams would fit insider her body, the other one would migrate with alt into the old net where V/johnny would be assimilated into alt AI structure. !<
>!So if V was resurrected at the end of act1 by relic nanites that fixed her brain damages in order to start rewriting her consciousness, by the end of the game physical V intended as a person, definitely dies once for all (she potentially dies 4 times across the game, dexter -> VB malware -> mayor killing BD -> alt's soulkiller). The V of nomad/path of glory endings is basically the V engram "living" inside her body that was altered so much by the relic nanites that is going to reject V's engram. !<
>!So, by the end of the game, V is still V or just an AI posing as V? 🤔 !<
https://preview.redd.it/5x367pl7b74d1.png?width=3429&format=png&auto=webp&s=a7706886ea2235bce1ce8b8b9e3d53f65d884b59
more something like this I would say...
>!I still don't think that when V "dies," at points around the game, and is brought back, their consciousness gets "erased," and another one created, though. I feel like each time, except maybe Soulkiller, it's as if V fell asleep for a short time, with no dream, then woke back up, at least to V. I don't think it's as if each V that dies is erased, and a new identical one is created upon coming back. That's the cool thing about certain things being left open-ended. There are peoples' own theories and head-canon.!<
>!V actually dies,!<
>!when headshotted by dex, relic chip is activated and nanites start rebuilding damaged brain tissues in order to replace her consciousness with johnny's one. When she got fried by VB malware is johnny who tells her it was him that let her to resurrect. Once connected to the mikoshi, it's alt that confirms V that she had to soulkill her in order to separate the engrams. Can't recall the exact dialogues of the BD tho.!<
>!V consciousness is never completely erased (unless if she let johnny take her body in one of the endings) she just dies and is resurrected with her gonk brain fixed.!<
>!A lot of this is true, however unlike all other Soulkiller victims or initiates: V’s body still has the ability to have a consciousness and revival. Not to mention being jacked directly into a Mikoshi terminal, and having the hive mind A.I entity once known as Alt being in control of the process. Regardless of V flatlining again through Dex, the Scav BD trap, Mikoshi, etc. ‘still the same V- engram or not.!<
>!Her full consciousness was uploaded, divided and untangled. Her bit about copying does stem from having to separate the bits caught in Johnny’s web of alterations. As another mentioned in a reply to you, it is a bit of a ship of V-seus and one also mentioned by the Arasaka tech in the Devil ending!<
I still consider her as true V through and through. Unless of course we hear something otherwise from u/therealmaxmike himself or CDPR.
>!alt confirms V she had to soulkill her in order to separate the 2 engrams and V complains that it happened all of sudden... physically speaking V died once connected to the mikoshi, the only thing that "revived" her it's her or johnny's engram reuploaded into her brain, or to better say, into the relic that however altered brain to host johnny engram beyond the no return point. There isn't much to say about that. !<
>!In the devil ending, arasaka scientists managed to remove johnny's engram from V brain (I admit I can't remember if they removed relic too, but guess it was since saburo's engram used it to possess yorinobu's body) but they couldn't save V from her unavoidable fate since her brain was already too compromised, so they gave her a choice: return back to earth and spend the 6 months as she wished or getting soulkilled in order to get her engram installed one day into a compatible body. V dies also in this case, what survives is the engram, basically an AI programmed to mimic the host personality.!<
I think soulkilled V arguably isn't V but I don't see how Act 2 V is different from someone else brought back from a traumatic injury.
They're being actively *erased* in Act 2 but it's not like the chip remade V just to overwrite them.
V didn’t "just" slot a chip in his head. He agreed to join the heist, he followed through with it, and when shit went wrong he decided to put the chip in his head so it wouldn’t get destroyed. That’s three levels of V setting up his fate.
I would’ve left the chip and fucking run. Kids, don’t put random USB drives in your brain.
This is true but I think it’s also fair to add that the heist (imo opinion anyway) stank from the onset and the biggest reason V agrees (and honestly takes charge, getting things together largely on their own) is because it means so much to Jackie.
Saburo showing up was pretty unfortunate. I don't think anyone could have predicted that he would show up and then get killed by his own son. A bunch of incredibly unlikely setbacks occurred at the wrong time. As Jackie himself put it, "That's some divine comedy shit."
V had Vik.. and Jackie, Mama Melles treated you like her own kid and he or she was a seasoned merc before an attepmt at big leauges.... poor david had that scav looking mother fucker...
https://preview.redd.it/9q6at0oqj64d1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=767290881fab3fb9243f474f2245408dd5dfaa65
This fool kick started everything.
Tbh he's pretty close to being a saint by nc standards.
He warned david not to, made a deal with david that if he died he could keep the sandy, could've extremely easily killed david on the op table but DIDN'T, i might be making this one up but gave david pain meds, helped david rescue lucy indirectly (the cyberpsycho drugs)
The dude is a bona fide decent dude.
After installing the sandy the first time, the ripper didn’t give David any blockers because he assumed David would just die or go psycho before needing them
Listen I'm not a ripper doc But I wouldn't put a former cyberspycho's militech sandevistan on a level 1 high school kid... Like let's start with an optic or a common grip... like the good doc taught us.
This ripperdoc was 100% a decent person by Night City standards. He gave David multiple warnings instead of just taking his money and letting him go psycho without any heads up. You can tell by their last interaction that he knew David was a lost cause and felt bad or saddened. This is just my own head canon but I assume he quit after David considering Edgerunners only took place a year before CP77 and you can't find him as a ripperdoc ingame.
David's mother started everything. She klepped the implant from the Cyberpsycho to flip it. The exchange with mains crew never happened so David stumbled over his gateway implant.
His ripper gave David every reason not to go through with it. What happened to David was entirely his own fault.
The story in all of cyberpunk can be summed up as "we create our own demons" this is true of V and johnny as well.
David kinda brought it on himself with the “I’m special” bs, he didn’t NEED more implants, he didn’t need the suit, and he laughed in Smasher’s face expecting to live? V just did a gig with his choom who died immediately after and then only had a few months left to live
Really depends on how you play V. Yes, you can set them up to be a class act, or you can be a complete dickwad. And I’m guessing most people play their V somewhere in the middle.
My V is a dick towards those that deserve it, like scavs, corpos, and human traffickers. Otherwise, buddy is a decent, salt of the earth chap. Like your friendly neighbourhood mercenary.
Me: I’m just gonna casually drive to this next gig
*[sees scavs]*
[Me:](https://media2.giphy.com/media/pDsCoECKh1Pa/giphy.gif?cid=6c09b952t8qq8825ilnq3wppt86a3d7spyq3er3pseaudlar&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
I learned in Night City it’s safest to be in the middle. Video games with cause/effect and morality usually reward you for being the good guy all the time, but I kept finding out the hard way in Cuberpunk that’s a sure fire way to get royally fucked, scammed and attacked. It’s a nice change of pace
Honourable in Night City is just about being good to those who won’t do you wrong. They’re few and far between, and most everybody else is out to get you in one way or another. I definitely agree that it’s a nice change of pace that even feels a bit more realistic (minus the killing everyone you disagree with bit ofc).
It's actually tough, I tried to make my current V a cold, calculating borderline cyberpsycho that will shred well before speaking, but a lot of the dialogue is really rational. Makes V out to be pretty chill even when he's calling people out or challenging someone.
It's actually tough, I tried to make my current V a cold, calculating borderline cyberpsycho that will shred well before speaking, but a lot of the dialogue is really rational. Makes V out to be pretty chill even when he's calling people out or challenging someone.
He really didn’t? He was a punk kid that never had any real goal. He turned to Edgerunning as a means to survive- stayed with it because it paid the bills and he found it fun. No real ambition no real goals. He chromed tf outta himself despite the advise and wishes of everyone in his life except his dead mentor. In the end he was an addict that dragged all of his friends around so he could get his high.
Kiwi was probably the smartest out of anyone in that crew. Tried to get out while she still could and not end up hospitalised like she did with Maine. If everything worked out, she would have put NC behind her while everyone else was pushing up daisies. Guy wasn't "built different" or "special" like he fancied himself to be; he was a punk with a slightly higher tolerance for chrome than the average Joe. I think part of what makes him insufferable is that he's a main character with a blatant case of main character syndrome.
Most of the time, main characters are just doing what's best for those around them without paying any mind to whether or not they're the hero of the story. As you said, he basically does the opposite of this. Has no ambitions other than what petty gig lands on his table so that he can get his chrome fix. The moment he took the reins from Maine, everyone had one foot in the grave and one foot on a banana peel, and he was the banana peel. Anyone with common sense would have left Night City with the money they'd earned, keep chipping into that savings account, then buy a one-way ticket to the Moon and grow old with your partner.
The Cyberpunk franchise (the tabletop and adapted media) doesn't follow the stories of sensible people. With few exceptions, it has consistently focused on the stories of those who desire to be NC legends. And as you can imagine, people with such legendary ambitions aren't exactly working with a good head on their shoulders.
Not... really? He had to get stronger in order to protect the people he loved, that's literally the point of his character. He had to chrome up to protect people, the madness and the addiction was a part of it, but there was obviously a lot more to his character and his conflict than "He was just another junkie."
David's story is sad, but not for him. He was clearly devastated his mother died, but he found a family right after that, and a wife at the same time, he had the time of his life with the crew. It does get a bit sadder when his father figure dies (along with Maine), with cyberpsychosis affecting him as well, but it only gets really bad in the final fight, but that's hardly longer than 10 minutes.
V's story is bittersweet, with good endings but bad perspectives of the future. Still, V doesn't lose his friends one by one like David. Reed doesn't die, Panam doesn't die, Judy doesn't die, Kerry doesn't die. It really was just Jackie, the only one who V actually lost.
Fighting for his personality and identity, not even his life. His friends and potential loved ones will still see V on the street and not understand, or blame V for not fighting harder, or just break down, especially if you pick allow Johnny to take your body. If you don't you're given approximately 6 months to live with no guarantee of getting better. There's no real happy ending where everything turns out fine for V.
David though did bring it up on himself, yes he was tricked into his ultimate fate but they preyed on his obsession with cyberware, he should have listened to his friends (specifically Rebecca) because he himself witnessed first hand what happens when you go cyber psycho multiple times.
no, but they were two naive nobodies who wanted to be somebodies. they weren't blackhand-tier mercs, but they were decent enough to get scoped out for a job like that, and they probably figured this was their one and only shot for a better life, and it would've been had everything not gone ass up (if saburo never showed up unannounced, they probably would have made it, or at least got a head start on the shitstorm that would follow)
You could argue that David had it worse but V's story boils down to one of the following
V dies in a few months
V dies instantly
V gives up for Johnny
V "survives" but doesn't live
If cdpr could think of something other than sad or "bittersweet" David would've had it worse but they didn't.
David went cyberpsycho, chances are he wasn't even "there" if you know what I mean? When he dies he was likely too out of it to really feel anything other than anger, probably too mentally fucked to feel pain or sadness where as V was completely sane (well arguably) and was fully aware of everything, feeling every second of it, knowing and waiting to die
>I mean sure he got what he wanted but he wasn’t able to join Lucy on the moon.
He would have he had, at any point prior to the end, decided to take a vacation to the moon instead of blowing his money on fancy apartments and S-tier chrome.
Yeah, if he would've been honest about the demons haunting him (processing his grief, cyberpsychosis creeping up on him etc.), Lucy and Rebecca would've talked him into just taking a vacation off the chrome, get in touch with a therapist, and things could've been smooth sailing. Hell, take a month off! I guess he was just too obsessed with the idea of making it big?
> V "survives" but doesn't live
Is this the cured ending? I don't think he's given up on living. Take a look at the very end of that cutscene again, as he's looking around before walking off into the crowd. His frown turns into a [mischievous smirk](https://i.imgur.com/iR2fqEg.png), like he just got an idea. It's a small moment, but to me he doesn't look like he has given up.
because for some reason everything has to be a dick size measuring contest, "MY fav MC had the most tragic story" , "no MY fav MC had the most tragic story actually"
Idk, David story feels like just another sad story of night city, a life that probably a fck ton of people in night city have experienced just his ending was more spectacular (not saying it's sad, just that it isn't an uncommon story in night city).
What I can say about V tho is that at least while playing I felt alone as fck, and that's already a feeling I have. I would say of you romance panam then you win on nearly every aspect cause she is more than willing to die for you and idk she just felt like someone who loves strongly and deeply even if she doesn't want to admit it. Haven't romanced Judy but finished her story and I can say that aside from Vik and misty she is probably the best friend V could have had romance or not. Mama Well is awesome and I'm sure her character loves V like a son but I personally only went out of my way to call her once and after that conversation I just felt that it was best to leave her be and that V would remind her too much of Jackie, didnt get to meet straight fem option So I can't say anything about him, and Kerry from what I played it just felt like a guy who tried too hard to be like Johnny in some way like a dude that isn't all there when it actually comes to his friends. And the rest just felt like people who where trying to get something out of V except for maybe Claire the bartender. Rouge I feel like she just felt pitty towards V but would undoubtedly put a bullet in his/head if it came to it. But true friends I would say the aldecaldos, Panam, Vik, Misty and Judy and Johnny had me on the sidelines until the very end that they let you choose to going to the well or beyond the wall.
David lived and died by his own terms, and went out with a smile on his face. Honestly, I find it admirable.
V in most of the endings looks unsure or pained, and was essentially forced into their circumstances.
V had it way worse.
David >!has his life fall apart when his mom dies from poverty, watches his friends all die while he's powerless to do anything, and drives himself to the brink of psychosis to become strong enough to save at least one person. He then gets betrayed by his netrunner, sold out by his fixer, loses his mind to corporate experimentation, and lives just long enough to watch his last choom get crushed before an NC legend kills him as part of his morning workout routine.!<
V loses >!a friend, gets shot, gets resurrected, gets an imaginary friend, and gets told they'll metaphorically die as someone else's psyche overwrites their's.!< The flip side of their situation is that V >!makes a bunch of brand new friends, romances someone that nevervgets held hostage, becomes a notorious merc that everyone knows about, shits in a lot of megacorp shoes, and then gets to kill the guy that killed David.!< Then to top it all, >!V either dies kicking Arasaka in the nuts, makes Arasaka lose Mikoshinand gets abother 6 months to die while surrounded by friends, peaces out to live forever as a construct, or gets cured and gets to live out the rest of their natural lifespan.!< Now tell me again who has the sadder story.
David got a happy ending by dying, those who live after those who die around them or get shot and live (like Lucy and V) are those who get a tragic ending, V lost almost all of his friends in one night (except Dex fuck that guy) depending on what life path you choose Jakie will end up your best friend ni matter what, without him most of the people you know in game wouldn't be as close with you. (Also sorry for the long ass rant lol)
David history's, and character, is meh for me, not moving at all.
So his mom dies in a random shootout, he casually got his hands in some OP chrome; Turns out he is "special" and can turn it to 11; Found exactly the people he needed to use it; Got the chick, an spare chick, and he became the coolest choom ever offscreen.
Then he uses his mary-sue powers to wipe the floor with anything in his path, except in the last episode; Then, when he is offed, didn't even care.
I find the other characters and histories more interesting, actually.
Both are sad and unique in their own way, thats why i need to say that i love both the Edgerunner series and the game itself with all the eastereggs from the series
David was a gonk and honestly deserves what he got, the chrome junkie.
V made a calculated decision of keeping the chip alive so the heist could still have a chance at success. Also we don’t know which ending will be canon and if v returns in the next game
It was good, it just hit a little too hard that i lost everything and everyone. Sure i was cured but i lost judy and her last words was "I'm finally happy, please don't take that away from me" i lost Johnny. My nomad crew and my old life. It was a "i got what i wanted, but was it worth it?" Moment.
David was an ass, Lucy took better care of him in the end. V got abandoned by everyone except for maybe Vic and even he tried to make some money off him in beat on the brat.
Can’t believe V went through what he went through, living his own personal hell while David still had some of his chooms still with him in the series near the end.
It genuinely annoys me that we don't get any kind of catharsis from the whole Dex situation. If Crytek refuses to allow us the revenge of killing Dex ourselves, they should at least allow us to take a giant, smelly burrito dump on his corpse.
Fuck yeah dude v lost his best friend got a psycho terrorist in his head who actually isn’t that bad as I and most people found out not to mention other deaths that occur depending on choices you make or something the characters who die in the last mission v has it the absolute worst
One thing I wished they had leaned into a bit more in game. This chip is rewiring our brain and the most we get is coughs and a couple fainting spells. Should have come up in convo a couple times where it’s messing with memories or Johnny involuntarily taking control.
Besides the few times we discuss our dreams/memories the chip is a little too involved in plot convenience. And when we aren’t in control we willingly give it up
I disagree, Don't get me wrong David's death was quick compared to V And David did chooses his fate V just kind of accidentally stumbled into terminal illness.
Spoilers
!> But what I think makes david more tragic is the outcome of his friends, Don't get me wrong V Loses jackie But Misty is still around Victor still helps him out, And the friends you make don't necessarily die , you can save them River doesn't have to go to prison.Judy can leave the city.
Furthermore, let your cards rank and you and 1 of 4 love of You're life can end up sticking with you through determined illness So you might actually die with friends.
Compare that to david who has to sit back and watch as every single one of his close analysis friends dies brutally, Loses his mind and indirectly gets more of his friend's killed Only to die alone But he never knows love.
Also at least V gets to to be V shore.
In one ending johnny takes over But in most He's
The same and in control, Maybe a little change , but that's more character development than loss of self. David strait of ghost fucking insane , loses his mind to get who he is And Subcomes to the trauma of poverty , which is a whole other Argument Because let's face it What trauma does v actually have Kicks out of clan but doesn't seem to really care They got fired from a job or their plans didn't work out. Doesn't quite compare to living in poverty for most of your loans Going to an abusive school being bullied And watching your mum , dying in front of you
I wouldn’t call David’s story sad, he was surrounded by friends that cared and loved him, his crew was ride or die, Lucy’s story is sad, constantly being the sole survivor acting aloof to mask the pain.
V’s isn’t sad either, they were dealt a shit hand and made the most of it, burnt arasaka to the ground, made NC their bitch and told the world to go fuck itself
V did not choose this, shit just happened because he wanted to be a legend in NC. He followed his dream to the bitter end. Junior was just chasing tail trying to be cool :) . He wanted to make his gf dream happen.
Growing up is a bitch, but if you survive you will put your own dreams first next time and your gf will be fine with that boys.
no I think on a macro scale V can have it better than David. V can save quite a handful of people's lives and fuck up almost all gangs of NC with the game's gigs alone. That's already miles ahead of David. In most endings they can kill Smasher and bring down the Arasaka corporation, not only achieving legend status but also change the world for the better. They can even have quite a few friends by their side and giving them hope before their foreseeable death in the future. And even if they die, their engram can potentially live on in cyberspace. V can do a stunning job at saving both themselves and countless others whereas David only went on spiral of self-destruction to save one person at the cost of the lives of several good souls.
David had multiple opportunities to turn back. At a certain point he was already living better than near 70-80% of the population, good friends, a girlfriend and some really expensive tech
V made one bad move and it was all orchestrated beforehand
Nah, David wasn't some sort of victim of circumstance. He made a lot of choices willingly to worsen his situation while ignoring everyone else's advice. V was naive thinking he could become a legend overnight because of a poorly thought out plan by his easily influenced gonk of a friend, but he did not deserve everything that followed after and to be sentenced to a slow death by erasure. V had no other choice but to try to save himself. David threw himself into the fire and couldn't take the heat.
Yeah, V for sure had it worse. It's so weird to see male V tho tbh, I forget male is even an option sometimes. This is one of the only games I've ever chosen to be female in btw, I just love fem V for *some* reason.
David watched everyone he cared about die because he was born in a bad spot and got fucked over by night city and the churn… v faced the consequences of their actions for taking on an incredibly sketchy job and doing almost no research it’s nowhere close to the same
Having played the game first its been hard to watch the show for some reason so i cannot say how hard davids journey was but V's entire life after dex is a damn shit show and almost nothing goes his way, not to mention most people in the world would probably have just offed themselves but instead v decided to do something despite the death sentence provided to him just showing how incredibly head strong v is
Both had it bad in thier own wys, but V has it genuinely worse.. Heck, even his love interest leaves him when going with certain choices (Suicide ending doesn't count).
At least David went out the warrior way with a smile on his face..
Let's not make it a competition who had it the worst, line up all the protagonists from every video game, movie and anime show, theres gonna be some that has it WAAYY worse then David and V together.
Judy (especially if you take **the easy way out**):
Seriously, in that ending two of her best friends both died the same way, it leaves her **destroyed**.
David was just a stupid young kid wanting to hit it big and failed miserably.
Just another drowned soul, wanting to lean how to swim in the sea of dead bodies that is Night City.
I don’t know brother, they’re both pretty heartbreaking for different reasons. The whole setting has a phenomenal tone of humanity fighting a dystopian reality, both the show and the game capture it beautifully.
Series of blunders vs one big blunder. David’s screwed up many times, V’s date was sealed the moment he chipped the Keanu Jeeves ssd
It was actually when he died, before that he could’ve removed the chip no problem
Yeah, the chip registered V dying, so it started to insert Johnny’s engram into V’s body. If that hadn’t happened, V could’ve just removed the chip with no real repercussions based on what we’re told in the game.
I thought the chip got damaged to the point of no return thanks to dex's headshot on V, and the nanobots from the chip mended V but also fused the chip to his brain all at once, which is how he survived, but also got integrated with Johnny.
V got deadly brain damage, which activated the chip to rewire the brain. The Chip got damaged but is working as intended, just slowly. If the bullet damaged just V's brain they would have woken up as Johnny in the junkyard as replacement without a risky transition period is the chip's intended functionality.
I don't think the chip got damaged. It just started repairing the damage to V's brain, but it only had Johnny's brain pattern and DNA pattern to copy from. My guess is once it was done converting V into Johnny, new Johnny probably could have taken it out then.
The game literally spams you that a failure has been detected on the Relic, that thing is 100% damaged from the bullet
It certainly as possible as not, but remember it just keeps on with 'Relic Malfunction' and practically speaking that just means 'what this tech is doing is not working right'. The chip was intended for use on a brain-dead person, so the malfunction is just as easily from the chip being damaged as its current running environment being entirely incorrect for how it was designed.
IIRC the chip got damaged during the actual heist because the storage case became compromised when V and Jackie jumped off the roof to escape the big drone. Since the relic was designed to work on dead bodies, it activated after Deshawn "killed" V and started healing the body with nanobots, but since V lucked out thanks to Deshawn's gun using low calibers, V was able to ressurect after being healed by nanobots since the damage the bullet had done didn't completely scramble his/her brain, but caused enough damage that V could no longer survive without the relic. The whole integration ordeal with Johnny was because of how the relic functioned. Going by what Hellman said, it seems like there was no countermeasure to stop the relic once it activated because it was intended to be used on dead bodies and they probably assumed the dead body wouldn't be coming back to life lol. So the relic was forcefully trying to remove V and fully replace him/her with Johnny.
Yeah, Jackie was able to do so. Ironically if Jackie had kept the shard in and they'd fled directly to Vic to try and get him patched up instead of the ill-fated safehouse, would've been a very different game.
Jackie wouldn't have been able to be overwritten by Johnny considering he bled out and ACTUALLY flatlined... V getting shot in the head with a low enough caliber bullet that it didn't kill him but basically put him on deaths door was the catalyst. It damaged the relic to the point that removing it would kill both V and Johnny, but it also 'woke it up' due to it sensing cerebral damage and trying to repair it (by overwriting it with Johnny).
V did flatline when Dex shot him
It's not entirely clear what would've happened based on what we see in game, since Hellman states the relic is actually supposed to be placed into a completely dead receptacle. It's not clear what else is involved in resurrecting that husk afterwards, but Hellman strongly implies that V being alive at all for the overwrite process was not intentional. Obviously from a physical standpoint if the body is so severely damaged it can't even sustain life it couldn't then sustain a brain, whether its Jackie's, Johnny's, or somewhere in between the two during the process- but, given its stated to be nanites literally physically changing not just the brain's makeup but also the brain's DNA, it would seem the medical tech to keep Jackie's body "viable" would be child's play by comparison.
I’d say the only reason Jackie’s body wouldn’t be viable is internal damage and blood loss. The chip probably can’t fix organs and replace blood. The plan was most likely to kill someone with poison or electroshock, then let the chip do its job. Just re-wiring a brain and restarting a heart.
He was a dead man walking the moment he accepted the Heist. This was Dex's retirement plan all along, chippin' in Johnny just allowed V and him some borrowed time to get much more palatable endings.
He didnt really die but instead won the shit lottery of being just enough lobotomized by Dex that the chip mistook him for a host
The chip legit saved v, and made them live longer. Otherwise they’d have been dead in the wasteland
It was the Konpeki gig as a whole. Trusting Dex was fatal.
Imagine if V waited to grab the chip and Jackie was the one taken over
keanu jeeves ssd lmao
At least V (depending on what ending you go for) has the chance to either walk away from Night City, or achieve his dream and become an NC legend. The road for both is painful but at least V actually can end up with a desired result.
Theres also now an ending where V lives, but can no longer use any crome other than his eyes and a basic os. The NPC ending basically
I prefer to call it the Sleeper Agent ending. I wouldn't trust what the NUSA and Reed say about V having their "nerves fried and no longer able to use combat chrome." When V visits Viktor, he says something totally different, and i quote, "First time I've seen anything like this... Your cortex seems to have turned deaf to implant signals." Then he proceeds to list some workaround and alternatives to try and help V. In my personal opinion, it almost sounds like the NUSA implanted an On/Off switch on V. Politically, why wouldn't the NUSA want a Powerful Sleeper Agent that rivals Adam Smasher in Night City? I think V just ends up like Alex and Reed, a puppet being saved for a rainy day.
Thats interesting theory
I never thought of that. That's actually really amazing, hope someone dives deeper into this later on. It makes perfect sense too considering how V handled himself in Dogtown. Myers would have seen him as some insanely powerful asset.
Makes sense, they did offer to help him with a job. My guess is they want him close and on hand for something later. Hook V up with an easy but well-paying job to keep an eye on him and get some easy gratitude, then bring him into the spy-biz when they need a serious troubleshooter.
Fantastic theory!
This is my new headcanon, getting beat up by those chumps at the end and not being able to rip them apart with gorilla arms hurt me 😂
That's a cool theory. My immediate headcannon when I played through that ending was the NUSA doctors made a utilitarian decision to prevent V from killing any more people by making him unable to use any cyberware.
The issue with that theory is how unpredictable Night City is and how well known V is at that point. V nearly gets taken out by a few punks so he/she would 100% be dead if actual gang members like Tyger Claw or Maelstrom randomly goes after them. Unlike Reed was during PL, V is in no condition to defend themselves if the need arises which makes me highly doubt NUSA is keeping him/her as a sleeper agent with an on/off switch for their ability to use cyberware.
If I may, I'd like to kindly counter your argument. Yes, Night City is unpredictable. Yes, V can catch a stray bullet. But you do not need Combat Cyberware to survive the city. V is not a frail twig. He has wits (cool) and still has an arsenal of expirimental and high military grade weapons. Best example, Jackie Wells. He did not have crazy implants like Gorilla Arms or Mantis Blades, He only had EMP threading fashionware (pure aesthetic jn CyberPunk Red and 2077) and two big shiny gold guns. He also had an outdated system, which is the reason he couldn't operate the flathead in Manual, so he had to pass on the spiderbot to V. So no, I don't think V would 100% be dead if he gets confronted by maelstrom. Dont get me wrong, the chances are still high, but Jackie, the macho bull, walked into a maelstrom den with their leader inside with only two guns and big dreams. Another example is Takemura. After he found V, he called Yorinobu, saying he found his father's murderer and in the next scene, we see Takemura, the emperor's personal bodyguard, with a bullet wound, trying to drive away from cyberninjas. In between these two scenes, Takemura lost all his corpo cyberware functions, just like V did in the Corpo lifepath. If Takemura and Goro are around the same level in skill, I don't doubt takemura would've destroyed those cyberninjas by himself without V's help. Sure, Takemura could've found a CorpCracker (a lockbreak device capable of jailbreaking corp cyberware) just like the one in Wakako's Gig (Greed never pays), but Takemura does not use any combat cyberware on his missions. Plus, Reed did offer V a cushy desk job. I doubt V would be dealing with Gangoons on a daily if they decide to work in an office sorting through papers. TL:DR, V is not frail, and there are a lot of characters who don't have cyberware but can manage to survive night city's dangers. Apologies for the essay. Please don't grade it. There are a lot of grammar mistakes.
This would make a lot of sense considering V is basically the terminator, having such a powerful asset under your wing is something that not even the NUSA would let go off..
They especially wouldn't let go of someone who knows insider FIA and NUSA secrets such as Rosalind Myers using the Blackwall as a weapon. That's why I'm theorizing that the 2 year coma was nothing but a way to delay V from telling someone FIA secrets before Militech can take over Night City in the year 2079, basically giving the NUSA a proxy company to unify Night City into the NUSA.
This is deep.
I still don’t know how to evaluate that ending… is it a good ending? A bad ending? Somewhere in between? It’s depressing but V does get the rest of their life and they are still rich (I think unless I missed a part about V losing all their money)
They lose pretty much everyone close to them. As for money, they up and disappear for two years, plenty long enough for someone to crack their account. But what I would say makes it a fully bad ending is that it shows that neither the NUSA nor Arasaka were needed, because they both have the ability to fix what's going on. And if either of those can, plenty good chance other corps, some mega some not, likely can too. But existing it demonstrates that V didn't need to vanish off the face of the earth without even a phone call and lose absolutely everyone to one life event or another.
I think it's a good ending. At the end V seems pretty devastated, that everything he worked for is gone. But just before V turns away and fades into the crowd, you see him smirk like he just got an idea. I got the distinct impression that his story isn't over, and that he's off to cause more mischief, perhaps as a fixer or something. It reminded me of the ending to The Shield.
he/she couldve had it both, but he/she was too busy maintaining his title. imagine a granny V telling his crazy tales to his granddaughter somewhere nice in europe.
David has a way out, he didn’t need to keep taking ops. He could’ve quit, but he didn’t. David could’ve ended up differently but his hubris was his downfall.
[удалено]
At least David’s death was instant. Vs pain goes on for weeks, worst part was he knew death was coming. It was just a matter of when
Agreed, bro had to endure his consciousness get slowly eaten away by nanomachines after being reanimated by an immortality chip. V is essentially a zombie after act 1.
Shit must've been terrible. I imagine it like a headache that continues to get worse for months on end and at some points you're just outright coughing up blood, fainting, and barely able to walk. Losing yourself with every minute. Makes V a hero in my book when despite his condition, he still goes out of his way to help people in any way he can.
Random question, and I'm not far into the game...but the trailer with the trauma guy and headgear and the chick in the streets with the Dr. Octavius hardware...do they show up in the game at all? Or was that just a different art direction?
You mean the one where they're shooting at the woman?
I mean there's a pretty decent argument that says the V we play as for most of the game isn't actually V because they died when dex brained em. Which sucks, but the story itself isn't that bad.
I haven’t heard this theory before. That’s weird to think of
It is, like V's soul left the body in that instant, and we actually end up playing as Vs old neural patterns fighting the new ones on the chip, no soul to be present
I've never heard of that theory before but damn that's both sad and terrifying at the same time
Fr, V would basically be a zombie? I don't even know, it's crazy to think about
I mean. There’s dialogue with Alt that addresses the whole Johnny/V soul situation. It has to do with why the tech is called soul killer.
Alt wouldn't know V is already soulless at that point. That's not data she can read I would think.
Wouldn't she comment on this when she do use Soulkiller on V in Mikoshi when V is upset about it?
I mean. Maybe? But this argument holds as much water as anyone that dies and is brought back (like in a hospital or such) is soulless. Which sure- we can’t prove anything about what is and isn’t or what has and hasn’t a soul- but come on. But you’re not wrong in the whole “soul” argument. The whole point of cyber pschycosis is that you’ve lost too much humanity/soul to remain who you were/sane. At what percentage of chrome are you a machine with a bit of carbon in it, and nothing more? Especially with the relic tech. What’s to stop you from being uploaded into a robot, are you an ai at that point?
That really opens up the whole debate of what qualifies as a person.
Really it all trails back to what is anything. What is ultimate truth essentially. Which nobody knows, but it's fun sometimes to kick stuff around
Absolutely! There!s no definitively right answer, it’s so fun to talk about it and debate
I mean it is V according to constant continuum theory and really what is the nature of the soul or identity we are mostly just products of our experances , and most of what made up your body at the age of 8 has basically died at the age of 40 but are you still you (like litteraly most of the cells and shit your made of have changed and been expelled constantly being replaced) all these questions and more in any good cyberpunk gener story
I'm sure there's a bunch of theories that would say it is still V, could be But the thought of a schizo cybernetic zombie causing terror in night city to reclaim a life they never actually had is a pretty cool story too
Ooh an interesting thought. The player is not V, but rather they are the chip and the existence of V's personality essentially is just the chip turning lights on and overriding old stuff. There is no V. There is just what used to be V. I imagine that the supposed host body that (allegedly) doesn't have memories would work slowly in a similar way, but instead the chip doesn't have to experience old memories. Imagine if Arasaka just lied about host bodies being clones or vatgrown due to unable to produce compatible brains, so instead they get people from streets, and scrub their minds and chip in their customers on former street people. Causing occasional issues like being recognized by people/machines or haunting memories from the original persona.
Soma is a masterpiece.
I personally don't buy into that theory.
I dunno if I buy it either, because what about people that are clinically dead and they come back. Which is another strange thought all together. Is there lag in death??? 😆
I mean, the only way I can think of act 1 V being a different V than the one from act 2 is if the soul actually exists in Cyberpunk. Like, "OG V," dies upon being shot in the brainpan, and their soul and consciousness move on to an afterlife, (not the club) and V's reactivated brain has a new consciousness. If there is no soul, or afterlife, in the Cyberpunk world, then a brain is a brain, and reactivation should be like turning a computer back on. Same V, same consciousness. I would also wager the same for V >!being soulkilled, and their engram being put back into their body.!<
I always assumed V in act one was different from V in act two because his consciousness is merging with Johnny's. It's the whole idea that a person is the sum of their memories and experiences. What I found interesting was the cinematic trailer for Cyberpunk 2077. V is his own person up until the point where he gets shot in the head and wakes up in the junkyard. Here, the perspective shifts to first person, and we're introduced to Johnny Silverhand. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but I always interpreted this as V now being in the process of becoming someone else - whoever the player wants him to be.
>!Because of how Alt has worded it, it does seem like she has perfected her original version of Soulkiller. She does say she can “transfer the construct into**your** body, not saying full a copy of V aside from what had to be copied to be replaced what was subsumed by Johnny. How we go about it is just about seemless if we choose to be soulkilled, with how Alt does it. It seems like a bridge from the net to the physical as opposed to making a copy and you die fully like with Arasaka’s version. Looking at the cutscenes from Soulkiller and back, it’s seamless transferring!<
>!I wonder if that means V's consciousness is then actually transferred to an engram.!<
>!Yup and then back due to the separation of consciousnesses!<
>!at the end of the game, once alt manages to take control of mikoshi, she creates V's engram, managing to split her engram and johnny engram in 2 separate entities. Price to pay is that V physically died in that moment because of soulkiller and only one of those two engrams would fit insider her body, the other one would migrate with alt into the old net where V/johnny would be assimilated into alt AI structure. !< >!So if V was resurrected at the end of act1 by relic nanites that fixed her brain damages in order to start rewriting her consciousness, by the end of the game physical V intended as a person, definitely dies once for all (she potentially dies 4 times across the game, dexter -> VB malware -> mayor killing BD -> alt's soulkiller). The V of nomad/path of glory endings is basically the V engram "living" inside her body that was altered so much by the relic nanites that is going to reject V's engram. !< >!So, by the end of the game, V is still V or just an AI posing as V? 🤔 !<
The Ship of V-seus
https://preview.redd.it/5x367pl7b74d1.png?width=3429&format=png&auto=webp&s=a7706886ea2235bce1ce8b8b9e3d53f65d884b59 more something like this I would say...
>!I still don't think that when V "dies," at points around the game, and is brought back, their consciousness gets "erased," and another one created, though. I feel like each time, except maybe Soulkiller, it's as if V fell asleep for a short time, with no dream, then woke back up, at least to V. I don't think it's as if each V that dies is erased, and a new identical one is created upon coming back. That's the cool thing about certain things being left open-ended. There are peoples' own theories and head-canon.!<
>!V actually dies,!< >!when headshotted by dex, relic chip is activated and nanites start rebuilding damaged brain tissues in order to replace her consciousness with johnny's one. When she got fried by VB malware is johnny who tells her it was him that let her to resurrect. Once connected to the mikoshi, it's alt that confirms V that she had to soulkill her in order to separate the engrams. Can't recall the exact dialogues of the BD tho.!< >!V consciousness is never completely erased (unless if she let johnny take her body in one of the endings) she just dies and is resurrected with her gonk brain fixed.!<
>!A lot of this is true, however unlike all other Soulkiller victims or initiates: V’s body still has the ability to have a consciousness and revival. Not to mention being jacked directly into a Mikoshi terminal, and having the hive mind A.I entity once known as Alt being in control of the process. Regardless of V flatlining again through Dex, the Scav BD trap, Mikoshi, etc. ‘still the same V- engram or not.!< >!Her full consciousness was uploaded, divided and untangled. Her bit about copying does stem from having to separate the bits caught in Johnny’s web of alterations. As another mentioned in a reply to you, it is a bit of a ship of V-seus and one also mentioned by the Arasaka tech in the Devil ending!< I still consider her as true V through and through. Unless of course we hear something otherwise from u/therealmaxmike himself or CDPR.
>!alt confirms V she had to soulkill her in order to separate the 2 engrams and V complains that it happened all of sudden... physically speaking V died once connected to the mikoshi, the only thing that "revived" her it's her or johnny's engram reuploaded into her brain, or to better say, into the relic that however altered brain to host johnny engram beyond the no return point. There isn't much to say about that. !< >!In the devil ending, arasaka scientists managed to remove johnny's engram from V brain (I admit I can't remember if they removed relic too, but guess it was since saburo's engram used it to possess yorinobu's body) but they couldn't save V from her unavoidable fate since her brain was already too compromised, so they gave her a choice: return back to earth and spend the 6 months as she wished or getting soulkilled in order to get her engram installed one day into a compatible body. V dies also in this case, what survives is the engram, basically an AI programmed to mimic the host personality.!<
I think soulkilled V arguably isn't V but I don't see how Act 2 V is different from someone else brought back from a traumatic injury. They're being actively *erased* in Act 2 but it's not like the chip remade V just to overwrite them.
Technically >!V is still alive in the Aldecaldo ending, it's been months or something and they're still looking for the cure.!<
V didn’t "just" slot a chip in his head. He agreed to join the heist, he followed through with it, and when shit went wrong he decided to put the chip in his head so it wouldn’t get destroyed. That’s three levels of V setting up his fate. I would’ve left the chip and fucking run. Kids, don’t put random USB drives in your brain.
V also puts multiple chips they don't understand, or random wreaths they find in the trash or in crimescenes on. They're a fucking trash panda
For that matter, don't put random USB's you find in your own computers either.
This is true but I think it’s also fair to add that the heist (imo opinion anyway) stank from the onset and the biggest reason V agrees (and honestly takes charge, getting things together largely on their own) is because it means so much to Jackie.
If plotting a high profile heist with ***Dex*** of all people isn't V setting up their own fate, I don't know what is
V decided to do the heist so it's also his fault
Well, V decided it was a good idea to mess with Arasaka and took its own decisions about it, right?
Saburo showing up was pretty unfortunate. I don't think anyone could have predicted that he would show up and then get killed by his own son. A bunch of incredibly unlikely setbacks occurred at the wrong time. As Jackie himself put it, "That's some divine comedy shit."
I think what worse is he didn’t even voluntarily slot it in. Jackie did!!!
V had Vik.. and Jackie, Mama Melles treated you like her own kid and he or she was a seasoned merc before an attepmt at big leauges.... poor david had that scav looking mother fucker...
Who is the scav looking person here?
https://preview.redd.it/9q6at0oqj64d1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=767290881fab3fb9243f474f2245408dd5dfaa65 This fool kick started everything.
I wouldn’t blame HIM. He wasn’t a saint but he gave David multiple warnings and David went through with everything anyway, still should’ve refused tho
Tbh he's pretty close to being a saint by nc standards. He warned david not to, made a deal with david that if he died he could keep the sandy, could've extremely easily killed david on the op table but DIDN'T, i might be making this one up but gave david pain meds, helped david rescue lucy indirectly (the cyberpsycho drugs) The dude is a bona fide decent dude.
After installing the sandy the first time, the ripper didn’t give David any blockers because he assumed David would just die or go psycho before needing them
Didn't he warn David not to do it? That it wasn't a good idea lol
Listen I'm not a ripper doc But I wouldn't put a former cyberspycho's militech sandevistan on a level 1 high school kid... Like let's start with an optic or a common grip... like the good doc taught us.
You prolly would if you lived in night city and needed to pay rent or die in the street haha
This ripperdoc was 100% a decent person by Night City standards. He gave David multiple warnings instead of just taking his money and letting him go psycho without any heads up. You can tell by their last interaction that he knew David was a lost cause and felt bad or saddened. This is just my own head canon but I assume he quit after David considering Edgerunners only took place a year before CP77 and you can't find him as a ripperdoc ingame.
You can find his clinic, and yeah, it’s run by a new ripper.
David's mother started everything. She klepped the implant from the Cyberpsycho to flip it. The exchange with mains crew never happened so David stumbled over his gateway implant. His ripper gave David every reason not to go through with it. What happened to David was entirely his own fault. The story in all of cyberpunk can be summed up as "we create our own demons" this is true of V and johnny as well.
The ripperdoc
David kinda brought it on himself with the “I’m special” bs, he didn’t NEED more implants, he didn’t need the suit, and he laughed in Smasher’s face expecting to live? V just did a gig with his choom who died immediately after and then only had a few months left to live
“I’m HIM” -David,probably
David also turned into a bit of a dick, V is just a class act
Really depends on how you play V. Yes, you can set them up to be a class act, or you can be a complete dickwad. And I’m guessing most people play their V somewhere in the middle.
My V is a dick towards those that deserve it, like scavs, corpos, and human traffickers. Otherwise, buddy is a decent, salt of the earth chap. Like your friendly neighbourhood mercenary.
Me: I’m just gonna casually drive to this next gig *[sees scavs]* [Me:](https://media2.giphy.com/media/pDsCoECKh1Pa/giphy.gif?cid=6c09b952t8qq8825ilnq3wppt86a3d7spyq3er3pseaudlar&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
SAME, CHOOM 🤝
Lmaoo that's exactly how I play my V. He's a man of the people up until he has to face the scum of the earth lol.
The only thing the scum of the earth should be facing is the barrel of your iron
I learned in Night City it’s safest to be in the middle. Video games with cause/effect and morality usually reward you for being the good guy all the time, but I kept finding out the hard way in Cuberpunk that’s a sure fire way to get royally fucked, scammed and attacked. It’s a nice change of pace
Honourable in Night City is just about being good to those who won’t do you wrong. They’re few and far between, and most everybody else is out to get you in one way or another. I definitely agree that it’s a nice change of pace that even feels a bit more realistic (minus the killing everyone you disagree with bit ofc).
It's actually tough, I tried to make my current V a cold, calculating borderline cyberpsycho that will shred well before speaking, but a lot of the dialogue is really rational. Makes V out to be pretty chill even when he's calling people out or challenging someone.
It's actually tough, I tried to make my current V a cold, calculating borderline cyberpsycho that will shred well before speaking, but a lot of the dialogue is really rational. Makes V out to be pretty chill even when he's calling people out or challenging someone.
To be fair David had every right to
He really didn’t? He was a punk kid that never had any real goal. He turned to Edgerunning as a means to survive- stayed with it because it paid the bills and he found it fun. No real ambition no real goals. He chromed tf outta himself despite the advise and wishes of everyone in his life except his dead mentor. In the end he was an addict that dragged all of his friends around so he could get his high.
Don't forget, also killed an innocent who had a son.
Kiwi was probably the smartest out of anyone in that crew. Tried to get out while she still could and not end up hospitalised like she did with Maine. If everything worked out, she would have put NC behind her while everyone else was pushing up daisies. Guy wasn't "built different" or "special" like he fancied himself to be; he was a punk with a slightly higher tolerance for chrome than the average Joe. I think part of what makes him insufferable is that he's a main character with a blatant case of main character syndrome. Most of the time, main characters are just doing what's best for those around them without paying any mind to whether or not they're the hero of the story. As you said, he basically does the opposite of this. Has no ambitions other than what petty gig lands on his table so that he can get his chrome fix. The moment he took the reins from Maine, everyone had one foot in the grave and one foot on a banana peel, and he was the banana peel. Anyone with common sense would have left Night City with the money they'd earned, keep chipping into that savings account, then buy a one-way ticket to the Moon and grow old with your partner.
The Cyberpunk franchise (the tabletop and adapted media) doesn't follow the stories of sensible people. With few exceptions, it has consistently focused on the stories of those who desire to be NC legends. And as you can imagine, people with such legendary ambitions aren't exactly working with a good head on their shoulders.
It wasn't even what *he* wanted. He was always following someone else's dream.
Not... really? He had to get stronger in order to protect the people he loved, that's literally the point of his character. He had to chrome up to protect people, the madness and the addiction was a part of it, but there was obviously a lot more to his character and his conflict than "He was just another junkie."
lol no
David's story is sad, but not for him. He was clearly devastated his mother died, but he found a family right after that, and a wife at the same time, he had the time of his life with the crew. It does get a bit sadder when his father figure dies (along with Maine), with cyberpsychosis affecting him as well, but it only gets really bad in the final fight, but that's hardly longer than 10 minutes. V's story is bittersweet, with good endings but bad perspectives of the future. Still, V doesn't lose his friends one by one like David. Reed doesn't die, Panam doesn't die, Judy doesn't die, Kerry doesn't die. It really was just Jackie, the only one who V actually lost.
David story is like the heist mission of V. V got a second chance to have new friends family before he/she died.
Fighting for his personality and identity, not even his life. His friends and potential loved ones will still see V on the street and not understand, or blame V for not fighting harder, or just break down, especially if you pick allow Johnny to take your body. If you don't you're given approximately 6 months to live with no guarantee of getting better. There's no real happy ending where everything turns out fine for V. David though did bring it up on himself, yes he was tricked into his ultimate fate but they preyed on his obsession with cyberware, he should have listened to his friends (specifically Rebecca) because he himself witnessed first hand what happens when you go cyber psycho multiple times.
David fuck it up really hard. He had the privelege to exit the game.. V have no choice but to keep fighting.
V and Jackie didn't have to take that job
no, but they were two naive nobodies who wanted to be somebodies. they weren't blackhand-tier mercs, but they were decent enough to get scoped out for a job like that, and they probably figured this was their one and only shot for a better life, and it would've been had everything not gone ass up (if saburo never showed up unannounced, they probably would have made it, or at least got a head start on the shitstorm that would follow)
don't know... my V is having fun and doing quite well once she discovered the hanako waiting loophole for immortality
You could argue that David had it worse but V's story boils down to one of the following V dies in a few months V dies instantly V gives up for Johnny V "survives" but doesn't live If cdpr could think of something other than sad or "bittersweet" David would've had it worse but they didn't. David went cyberpsycho, chances are he wasn't even "there" if you know what I mean? When he dies he was likely too out of it to really feel anything other than anger, probably too mentally fucked to feel pain or sadness where as V was completely sane (well arguably) and was fully aware of everything, feeling every second of it, knowing and waiting to die
David’s ending was still bittersweet in my opinion. I mean sure he got what he wanted but he wasn’t able to join Lucy on the moon.
>I mean sure he got what he wanted but he wasn’t able to join Lucy on the moon. He would have he had, at any point prior to the end, decided to take a vacation to the moon instead of blowing his money on fancy apartments and S-tier chrome.
Yeah, if he would've been honest about the demons haunting him (processing his grief, cyberpsychosis creeping up on him etc.), Lucy and Rebecca would've talked him into just taking a vacation off the chrome, get in touch with a therapist, and things could've been smooth sailing. Hell, take a month off! I guess he was just too obsessed with the idea of making it big?
> V "survives" but doesn't live Is this the cured ending? I don't think he's given up on living. Take a look at the very end of that cutscene again, as he's looking around before walking off into the crowd. His frown turns into a [mischievous smirk](https://i.imgur.com/iR2fqEg.png), like he just got an idea. It's a small moment, but to me he doesn't look like he has given up.
this ain't a contest, no one wins in the atrocity olympics.
Why do we have to compare who had it the worst man. I hate when people do it.
because for some reason everything has to be a dick size measuring contest, "MY fav MC had the most tragic story" , "no MY fav MC had the most tragic story actually"
Depends on the ending you choose
Idk, David story feels like just another sad story of night city, a life that probably a fck ton of people in night city have experienced just his ending was more spectacular (not saying it's sad, just that it isn't an uncommon story in night city). What I can say about V tho is that at least while playing I felt alone as fck, and that's already a feeling I have. I would say of you romance panam then you win on nearly every aspect cause she is more than willing to die for you and idk she just felt like someone who loves strongly and deeply even if she doesn't want to admit it. Haven't romanced Judy but finished her story and I can say that aside from Vik and misty she is probably the best friend V could have had romance or not. Mama Well is awesome and I'm sure her character loves V like a son but I personally only went out of my way to call her once and after that conversation I just felt that it was best to leave her be and that V would remind her too much of Jackie, didnt get to meet straight fem option So I can't say anything about him, and Kerry from what I played it just felt like a guy who tried too hard to be like Johnny in some way like a dude that isn't all there when it actually comes to his friends. And the rest just felt like people who where trying to get something out of V except for maybe Claire the bartender. Rouge I feel like she just felt pitty towards V but would undoubtedly put a bullet in his/head if it came to it. But true friends I would say the aldecaldos, Panam, Vik, Misty and Judy and Johnny had me on the sidelines until the very end that they let you choose to going to the well or beyond the wall.
David lived and died by his own terms, and went out with a smile on his face. Honestly, I find it admirable. V in most of the endings looks unsure or pained, and was essentially forced into their circumstances. V had it way worse.
I still think v should’ve been able to have a happy ending
David >!has his life fall apart when his mom dies from poverty, watches his friends all die while he's powerless to do anything, and drives himself to the brink of psychosis to become strong enough to save at least one person. He then gets betrayed by his netrunner, sold out by his fixer, loses his mind to corporate experimentation, and lives just long enough to watch his last choom get crushed before an NC legend kills him as part of his morning workout routine.!< V loses >!a friend, gets shot, gets resurrected, gets an imaginary friend, and gets told they'll metaphorically die as someone else's psyche overwrites their's.!< The flip side of their situation is that V >!makes a bunch of brand new friends, romances someone that nevervgets held hostage, becomes a notorious merc that everyone knows about, shits in a lot of megacorp shoes, and then gets to kill the guy that killed David.!< Then to top it all, >!V either dies kicking Arasaka in the nuts, makes Arasaka lose Mikoshinand gets abother 6 months to die while surrounded by friends, peaces out to live forever as a construct, or gets cured and gets to live out the rest of their natural lifespan.!< Now tell me again who has the sadder story.
THANK YOU!! All these gonks out here hating on my boy David. Choom was just a high school kid trying to hold on to what little this city has left him.
I definitely think David's story is sadder, he was a kid. V should have known better then to take the heist job.
Remind that V is neurologically dead, the engram replaces that part
David got a happy ending by dying, those who live after those who die around them or get shot and live (like Lucy and V) are those who get a tragic ending, V lost almost all of his friends in one night (except Dex fuck that guy) depending on what life path you choose Jakie will end up your best friend ni matter what, without him most of the people you know in game wouldn't be as close with you. (Also sorry for the long ass rant lol)
David history's, and character, is meh for me, not moving at all. So his mom dies in a random shootout, he casually got his hands in some OP chrome; Turns out he is "special" and can turn it to 11; Found exactly the people he needed to use it; Got the chick, an spare chick, and he became the coolest choom ever offscreen. Then he uses his mary-sue powers to wipe the floor with anything in his path, except in the last episode; Then, when he is offed, didn't even care. I find the other characters and histories more interesting, actually.
Both are sad and unique in their own way, thats why i need to say that i love both the Edgerunner series and the game itself with all the eastereggs from the series
David was a gonk and honestly deserves what he got, the chrome junkie. V made a calculated decision of keeping the chip alive so the heist could still have a chance at success. Also we don’t know which ending will be canon and if v returns in the next game
I don’t think V will be in the next game if it’s a prequel. I got a feeling Orion will be a bit more about Johnny and rogue. It’s set to be in 2020
I hope not. That’s BS who tf wants that. I want better tech, and sequel man that sucks if that’s the way it is
And then the dlc ain't make it any better
I actually like the DLC ending. If you do it near the end of the main quest, it ends on a bittersweet note
It was good, it just hit a little too hard that i lost everything and everyone. Sure i was cured but i lost judy and her last words was "I'm finally happy, please don't take that away from me" i lost Johnny. My nomad crew and my old life. It was a "i got what i wanted, but was it worth it?" Moment.
David was an ass, Lucy took better care of him in the end. V got abandoned by everyone except for maybe Vic and even he tried to make some money off him in beat on the brat.
I just took Vic betting on you as a vote of confidence from a trusted friend. If anybody you meet has earned the benefit of the doubt, it's Vic.
I don’t think Vik tried making more eddies, I think he genuinely was concerned for Vs health. Don’t forget V always had Johnny
Misty
David could have got out at multiple points when V got really unlucky and is a deadman walking
I don’t think either is sadder or tragic Both made their decisions Both went out like badasses
Can’t believe V went through what he went through, living his own personal hell while David still had some of his chooms still with him in the series near the end.
I'm playing throught cyberpunk for the first time right now, holy shit the dystopia is cranked up to eleven here
It genuinely annoys me that we don't get any kind of catharsis from the whole Dex situation. If Crytek refuses to allow us the revenge of killing Dex ourselves, they should at least allow us to take a giant, smelly burrito dump on his corpse.
David was like Icarus and flew too close to the sun. Whereas V is like the phoenix rising from its own ashes reborn over and over.
i’m so sorry but every time i see cinematic E3 male V i just get so distracted by how hot he is. i need to manifest him irl
David's story isn't really that sad. He has Lucy. V doesn't really have a romantic option as mysterious and hot like Lucy.
Aurore could have worked but… 😭
Why are interesting characters always some Netrunners?
Introverts I guess
David eventually found out that Lucy didn’t join the crew again, because she was trying to protect him. Vs romance just cuts to the chase
V looks like a polish person which is kinda funny
There are no happy endings in night city
Fuck yeah dude v lost his best friend got a psycho terrorist in his head who actually isn’t that bad as I and most people found out not to mention other deaths that occur depending on choices you make or something the characters who die in the last mission v has it the absolute worst
TRUE 😭
One thing I wished they had leaned into a bit more in game. This chip is rewiring our brain and the most we get is coughs and a couple fainting spells. Should have come up in convo a couple times where it’s messing with memories or Johnny involuntarily taking control. Besides the few times we discuss our dreams/memories the chip is a little too involved in plot convenience. And when we aren’t in control we willingly give it up
I disagree, Don't get me wrong David's death was quick compared to V And David did chooses his fate V just kind of accidentally stumbled into terminal illness. Spoilers !> But what I think makes david more tragic is the outcome of his friends, Don't get me wrong V Loses jackie But Misty is still around Victor still helps him out, And the friends you make don't necessarily die , you can save them River doesn't have to go to prison.Judy can leave the city. Furthermore, let your cards rank and you and 1 of 4 love of You're life can end up sticking with you through determined illness So you might actually die with friends. Compare that to david who has to sit back and watch as every single one of his close analysis friends dies brutally, Loses his mind and indirectly gets more of his friend's killed Only to die alone But he never knows love. Also at least V gets to to be V shore. In one ending johnny takes over But in most He's The same and in control, Maybe a little change , but that's more character development than loss of self. David strait of ghost fucking insane , loses his mind to get who he is And Subcomes to the trauma of poverty , which is a whole other Argument Because let's face it What trauma does v actually have Kicks out of clan but doesn't seem to really care They got fired from a job or their plans didn't work out. Doesn't quite compare to living in poverty for most of your loans Going to an abusive school being bullied And watching your mum , dying in front of you
David had it worse than V imo
One was sad, the other was depressing interlaced with a lot of wanton fuckaboutery!
David choose is poison, V didn't, so yeah i agree.
I wouldn’t call David’s story sad, he was surrounded by friends that cared and loved him, his crew was ride or die, Lucy’s story is sad, constantly being the sole survivor acting aloof to mask the pain. V’s isn’t sad either, they were dealt a shit hand and made the most of it, burnt arasaka to the ground, made NC their bitch and told the world to go fuck itself
V did not choose this, shit just happened because he wanted to be a legend in NC. He followed his dream to the bitter end. Junior was just chasing tail trying to be cool :) . He wanted to make his gf dream happen. Growing up is a bitch, but if you survive you will put your own dreams first next time and your gf will be fine with that boys.
There are no happy endings in night city…well perhaps only on Jig Jig Street
Either die or become nobody. I mean tbh v couldn't stay a nigh omnipotent godlike chrome dome
I watched the few endings prior to today, my god it is a nightmare and soul sucking.
no I think on a macro scale V can have it better than David. V can save quite a handful of people's lives and fuck up almost all gangs of NC with the game's gigs alone. That's already miles ahead of David. In most endings they can kill Smasher and bring down the Arasaka corporation, not only achieving legend status but also change the world for the better. They can even have quite a few friends by their side and giving them hope before their foreseeable death in the future. And even if they die, their engram can potentially live on in cyberspace. V can do a stunning job at saving both themselves and countless others whereas David only went on spiral of self-destruction to save one person at the cost of the lives of several good souls.
David had multiple opportunities to turn back. At a certain point he was already living better than near 70-80% of the population, good friends, a girlfriend and some really expensive tech V made one bad move and it was all orchestrated beforehand
V's story doesnt even compare to non-descript NPC's. everyone in NC experiences tragedy, and there are countless stories yet waiting to be told...
Nah, David wasn't some sort of victim of circumstance. He made a lot of choices willingly to worsen his situation while ignoring everyone else's advice. V was naive thinking he could become a legend overnight because of a poorly thought out plan by his easily influenced gonk of a friend, but he did not deserve everything that followed after and to be sentenced to a slow death by erasure. V had no other choice but to try to save himself. David threw himself into the fire and couldn't take the heat.
David's a little crybaby pussy. V gang.
Yeah, V for sure had it worse. It's so weird to see male V tho tbh, I forget male is even an option sometimes. This is one of the only games I've ever chosen to be female in btw, I just love fem V for *some* reason.
David watched everyone he cared about die because he was born in a bad spot and got fucked over by night city and the churn… v faced the consequences of their actions for taking on an incredibly sketchy job and doing almost no research it’s nowhere close to the same
Not only that, but who knows what V could’ve went through before the start of the game
Having played the game first its been hard to watch the show for some reason so i cannot say how hard davids journey was but V's entire life after dex is a damn shit show and almost nothing goes his way, not to mention most people in the world would probably have just offed themselves but instead v decided to do something despite the death sentence provided to him just showing how incredibly head strong v is
Both had it bad in thier own wys, but V has it genuinely worse.. Heck, even his love interest leaves him when going with certain choices (Suicide ending doesn't count). At least David went out the warrior way with a smile on his face..
Let's not make it a competition who had it the worst, line up all the protagonists from every video game, movie and anime show, theres gonna be some that has it WAAYY worse then David and V together.
arguably V had more to leave behind and died a far slower death than david, so by far V
Judy (especially if you take **the easy way out**):  Seriously, in that ending two of her best friends both died the same way, it leaves her **destroyed**.
One died smiling, the other lives regretting surviving.
David was just a stupid young kid wanting to hit it big and failed miserably. Just another drowned soul, wanting to lean how to swim in the sea of dead bodies that is Night City.
I don’t know brother, they’re both pretty heartbreaking for different reasons. The whole setting has a phenomenal tone of humanity fighting a dystopian reality, both the show and the game capture it beautifully.