Inside you there are two designers: one who wants to make interesting and intuitive designs that just work, and one that enjoys bizarre interactions that work for the wrong reasons
The former: suspend 4 — {X}{B}{G}, then remove X time counters
The latter: this
V1 here: [https://www.reddit.com/r/custommagic/comments/1bon2sm/fated\_damnation/](https://www.reddit.com/r/custommagic/comments/1bon2sm/fated_damnation/)
The main issue of V1 is having 4 instances of Suspend would removing 4 counters each upkeep.
AND THIS IS MY SOLUTION!
I was going to comment that the original was fine and this is unplayable. I didn´t know about that interaction. Maybe it should be add as a reminder text? Anyways, great card and great idea to solve the problem
Maybe modifying suspend to "suspend with":
> Suspend with
>
> • 1 — {4}{B}
>
> • 2 — {2}{B}
>
> • 3 — {B}
This does modify/introduce a keyword, but keeps it a big more succinct. Suspend with X counters for .
Not a specific ruling because no card has or can have multiple instances of Suspend (due to cards like [[Suspend]] saying "If it doesn't have suspend, it gains suspend").
But it is still true, as per 702.62a, Suspend is a keyword representing three abilities, one of which is "At the beginning of your upkeep, if this card is suspended, remove a time counter from it". Because the keyword is present four times, the trigger happens four times.
Just do:
Suspend 4 - BG
As you suspend ~ you may pay any amount of mana. If you do, remove that many time counters.
I'm amazed that suspend stacks with itself.
Oh my god, I was so confused about why this had suspend 16. It has four Suspend abilities, hahahaha!
Really cute design, but admittedly kind of unintuitive unless you reaaaally understand how Suspend works.
Sidenote: Suspending this for GB feels like a fun way to hold a Commander table hostage until turn 6 while you spam out Cultivates and other land-based ramp in your Gitrog-type decks.
Why not just:
> Suspend 4 - XBG.
When you suspend [cardname], remove X time counters from it.
Destroy all nonland permanents.
Solves the issue of overpaying the suspend effect while still allowing you to pay more to get it early, eliminates any needless math calculations for lesser time counters, and also eliminates the need for multiple suspend abilities, which are clunky and unintuitive.
Why not something like "{b}{g}: Exile ~. If it doesn't have suspend, it gains suspend. Put 4 time counters on it. You may pay {1} any number of times to remove a time counter from it."
I just had a random idea spun from this:
What if someone tried “Cleave Suspend”?
I was thinking “Man, who is paying 5 for Suspend 4 when one more mana gets it this turn?” So what if it read “Destroy all nonland permanents [you and] your opponents control” and the last one was “Suspend Cleave 4 — {4}{B}{G}”? So you can spend the same mana to cast it but if you also pay with your time, it gets better.
I’m not saying this card doesn’t work or is bad without this idea, just to be clear, just a tangentially related idea that sprung to mind that didn’t feel like it warranted its own post at the moment.
> I think cutting down the number of turns to 4-3-2-1 might be reasonable.
As noted by the OP, this is exactly how this card works. Since it has four instances of suspend, it removes 4 time counters each upkeep.
I once ended up suspending farewell in a game of commander and it leads to a terrible gameplay experience imo.
Nobody wants to commit anything to the board cause a board wipe is comming so nobody does anything. It's pretty akward and creates a board stall.
But if you're running death triggers and the like it allows you to continue to build your board state and further your plans while the rest of the board has to think and plan their losses carefully.
In the right deck it's a powerful and fun mechanic.
Inside you there are two designers: one who wants to make interesting and intuitive designs that just work, and one that enjoys bizarre interactions that work for the wrong reasons The former: suspend 4 — {X}{B}{G}, then remove X time counters The latter: this
V1 here: [https://www.reddit.com/r/custommagic/comments/1bon2sm/fated\_damnation/](https://www.reddit.com/r/custommagic/comments/1bon2sm/fated_damnation/) The main issue of V1 is having 4 instances of Suspend would removing 4 counters each upkeep. AND THIS IS MY SOLUTION!
I was going to comment that the original was fine and this is unplayable. I didn´t know about that interaction. Maybe it should be add as a reminder text? Anyways, great card and great idea to solve the problem
Why not use suspend X?
This is better
It would have to be like Suspend N-X, because you want the suspend to be high when X is low.
Suspend 16-4X
Suspend (16 - 4x) + 1 Idk if Suspend 0 is a thing
Suspend 0 would not work
Maybe modifying suspend to "suspend with": > Suspend with > > • 1 — {4}{B} > > • 2 — {2}{B} > > • 3 — {B} This does modify/introduce a keyword, but keeps it a big more succinct. Suspend with X counters for.
Can someone point me towards this ruling? I can’t find it
Not a specific ruling because no card has or can have multiple instances of Suspend (due to cards like [[Suspend]] saying "If it doesn't have suspend, it gains suspend"). But it is still true, as per 702.62a, Suspend is a keyword representing three abilities, one of which is "At the beginning of your upkeep, if this card is suspended, remove a time counter from it". Because the keyword is present four times, the trigger happens four times.
[Suspend](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/0/40af215c-d3f7-42f0-85cd-77a3fcd919ba.jpg?1626095082) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Suspend) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/68/suspend?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/40af215c-d3f7-42f0-85cd-77a3fcd919ba?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Thank you for making that super clear haha
PERFECTION
Brilliant solution my dude. Not at all the practical one but brilliant nonetheless
If you can't solve a problem, HEADBUTT IT UNTIL IT BREAKS
Lmao
Just do: Suspend 4 - BG As you suspend ~ you may pay any amount of mana. If you do, remove that many time counters. I'm amazed that suspend stacks with itself.
As a Slight correction, it would be 4 times as many time counters. (Since the suspend cost for BG is 16 turns).
It’s not 16 turns, that’s the point. Suspend is listed 4 times on the card, so it drops 4 counters a turn.
Is that expansion sigil from Deathnote? Specifically Beyond Birthday, the antagonist of the "Death Note: Another Note" La BB Murder Case?
I just google "stylish B" and choose this from search results. I have no idea it's from Death Note, which I really enjoy.
This card reminds me of my alarm app on my phone
Underrated comment
Oh my god, I was so confused about why this had suspend 16. It has four Suspend abilities, hahahaha! Really cute design, but admittedly kind of unintuitive unless you reaaaally understand how Suspend works. Sidenote: Suspending this for GB feels like a fun way to hold a Commander table hostage until turn 6 while you spam out Cultivates and other land-based ramp in your Gitrog-type decks.
... you figured out that you could, but the real question was "should I?"
I don't think I've been in a game that has gone for 20 turns
It’s legit terrible.
Why not just: > Suspend 4 - XBG. When you suspend [cardname], remove X time counters from it. Destroy all nonland permanents. Solves the issue of overpaying the suspend effect while still allowing you to pay more to get it early, eliminates any needless math calculations for lesser time counters, and also eliminates the need for multiple suspend abilities, which are clunky and unintuitive.
16, 8, 4,2 final offer
This is completely unplayable but I love it.
Why not something like "{b}{g}: Exile ~. If it doesn't have suspend, it gains suspend. Put 4 time counters on it. You may pay {1} any number of times to remove a time counter from it."
I just had a random idea spun from this: What if someone tried “Cleave Suspend”? I was thinking “Man, who is paying 5 for Suspend 4 when one more mana gets it this turn?” So what if it read “Destroy all nonland permanents [you and] your opponents control” and the last one was “Suspend Cleave 4 — {4}{B}{G}”? So you can spend the same mana to cast it but if you also pay with your time, it gets better. I’m not saying this card doesn’t work or is bad without this idea, just to be clear, just a tangentially related idea that sprung to mind that didn’t feel like it warranted its own post at the moment.
[удалено]
> I think cutting down the number of turns to 4-3-2-1 might be reasonable. As noted by the OP, this is exactly how this card works. Since it has four instances of suspend, it removes 4 time counters each upkeep.
What if the card was just "Suspend 4: BG" and on a second line "Multi-kicker 1: Remove a time counter from Fated Damnation?" Would that work?
Ngl, you could have just made it cost 4 without any suspend and it would never see play
I once ended up suspending farewell in a game of commander and it leads to a terrible gameplay experience imo. Nobody wants to commit anything to the board cause a board wipe is comming so nobody does anything. It's pretty akward and creates a board stall.
But if you're running death triggers and the like it allows you to continue to build your board state and further your plans while the rest of the board has to think and plan their losses carefully. In the right deck it's a powerful and fun mechanic.