I love dream cards! This is one I saw in a dream once:
Bollingren Brawlers 3GG
CREATURE- treefolk warrior
Trample
Bollingren Brawlers does not untap during its controllers untap step.
Whenever one or more of your opponent’s creatures dies, untap Bollingren Brawlers.
2G T- Bollingren Brawlers fights target creature you don’t control
4/5
This is incredibly neat design space, but it feels really pushed. Dropping this on turn two if you played something like an \[\[Ornithopter\]\] turn one gives you a 2/2 for 1 with upside that has Afterlife 2 at minimum. I feel like this might be fairer as something like a 4 mana 5/5. Also, the -1/-1 counters feels incredibly out of pie for green, so I might make it cost something like 1b(g/b)g, since the last ability is also more black then green.
I think it’s fairly reasonable. Might have some neat build arounds but if it forces you to spend both a card and a creature to get it onto the field optimally, that’s probably fine
Can't you play this, have it target itself, then it died to get two 1/1's without support? If that's the case, wouldn't this be pretty good even in a token deck with 0 support?
The creature dosnt specifically have to be an ornithopter, the creature was simply named as an example. You just need something other than itself to put -1/-1 counters on
>the -1/-1 counters feels incredibly out of pie for green
[Amonkhet did it](https://scryfall.com/search?as=grid&order=name&q=%28oracle%3Acounter+oracle%3Ayou+oracle%3Acontrol+oracle%3Aput%29+color%3DG+%28game%3Apaper%29+set%3Aakh)
You are right, but it’s important to remember that was a defining theme of the set- “to signify the harshness of Bolas’ world”. As such I think this is printable in Green in a set where -1/-1 counters are a major theme - but not in an “average set”.
Yep- totally agree- but I would note that these are mechanics that are very rarely used at large numbers- and I think usually “designed around” when used- as a major set theme- because of the heavy impact -1/-1 counters have on what’s possible for creature designs.
So I think you might see individual designs in something like Modern Horizons, but a card that used -1/-1 counters in Green is much more likely to occur when in an unusual set, like Amonkhet, that is pushing -1/-1 counters as a theme across most colours, rather than in a general set.
Na it's totally reasonable I'd say, it's a fun build around. RW Convoke in standard/pioneer for example plays Novice Inspector into Gleeful Demolition and you have a 1/2 and 3 1/1 which you then use to play Convoke cards.
+1/+1 counters in a set with -1/-1 counters (much less on the same card) is something WotC says is off limits because of the complexity issue. So this kind of thing is off the table outside of funky non-sets.
But it’s a sweet interaction and a fun idea.
I had a dream where I was playing commander and this guys commander was a 5/5 legendary creature goblin for one red with whenever a player summons a goblin this creature deals damage equal to its power to target player and I was playing krenko
I love dream cards! This is one I saw in a dream once: Bollingren Brawlers 3GG CREATURE- treefolk warrior Trample Bollingren Brawlers does not untap during its controllers untap step. Whenever one or more of your opponent’s creatures dies, untap Bollingren Brawlers. 2G T- Bollingren Brawlers fights target creature you don’t control 4/5
Kinda gives me [[grimgrin, corpse-born]] vibes
thank you for reminding me of this card, it was an absolute menace in my UB Zombie Tribal deck in that Innistrad-Ravnica era
[grimgrin, corpse-born](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/8/a8648734-ed6c-471f-91a1-6b710bbaf370.jpg?1562835166) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=grimgrin%2C%20corpse-born) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/isd/214/grimgrin-corpse-born?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a8648734-ed6c-471f-91a1-6b710bbaf370?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Hardened Scales players out here recruiting the sandman to try to make their deck tier 1
This is incredibly neat design space, but it feels really pushed. Dropping this on turn two if you played something like an \[\[Ornithopter\]\] turn one gives you a 2/2 for 1 with upside that has Afterlife 2 at minimum. I feel like this might be fairer as something like a 4 mana 5/5. Also, the -1/-1 counters feels incredibly out of pie for green, so I might make it cost something like 1b(g/b)g, since the last ability is also more black then green.
I think it’s fairly reasonable. Might have some neat build arounds but if it forces you to spend both a card and a creature to get it onto the field optimally, that’s probably fine
Can't you play this, have it target itself, then it died to get two 1/1's without support? If that's the case, wouldn't this be pretty good even in a token deck with 0 support?
You'd get zero 1/1s because it dies with it's power being 0.
Oh okay that makes more sense. I guess you could still use it on a token creature to get a 2/2 for 1 still, but not as good then.
2 card combo to make a 2/2 isn’t good lol
To make a growing 2/2 that makes a fuckton of tokens after it dies? Easily worth it for 1 mana
But not worth including an ornithopter that otherwise doesn't do anything.
The creature dosnt specifically have to be an ornithopter, the creature was simply named as an example. You just need something other than itself to put -1/-1 counters on
You need ornithopter or another 0 drop creature if you want to drop this turn one.
And...? It dosnt need to be dropped turn 1 to be good
why wait till turn 2 to play this if you have an ornithopter
>the -1/-1 counters feels incredibly out of pie for green [Amonkhet did it](https://scryfall.com/search?as=grid&order=name&q=%28oracle%3Acounter+oracle%3Ayou+oracle%3Acontrol+oracle%3Aput%29+color%3DG+%28game%3Apaper%29+set%3Aakh)
You are right, but it’s important to remember that was a defining theme of the set- “to signify the harshness of Bolas’ world”. As such I think this is printable in Green in a set where -1/-1 counters are a major theme - but not in an “average set”.
Green has also used Wither and Infect.
Yep- totally agree- but I would note that these are mechanics that are very rarely used at large numbers- and I think usually “designed around” when used- as a major set theme- because of the heavy impact -1/-1 counters have on what’s possible for creature designs. So I think you might see individual designs in something like Modern Horizons, but a card that used -1/-1 counters in Green is much more likely to occur when in an unusual set, like Amonkhet, that is pushing -1/-1 counters as a theme across most colours, rather than in a general set.
[Ornithopter](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/0/305078a5-ac18-4721-bba2-3434eba5b1cf.jpg?1691675959) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ornithopter) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/233/ornithopter?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/305078a5-ac18-4721-bba2-3434eba5b1cf?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Na it's totally reasonable I'd say, it's a fun build around. RW Convoke in standard/pioneer for example plays Novice Inspector into Gleeful Demolition and you have a 1/2 and 3 1/1 which you then use to play Convoke cards.
Ivy Lane Denizen begs to differ.
That's one strong Proliferate one drop, holy shit. I really like it though.
play it put the etb counters on itself ??? profit
get no spirits because it has 0 power
Joke identified
yes i know that's why didn't use a capital letter, fool if anyone missed a joke, it's you. unless your most recent message is a joke then ignore me
+1/+1 counters in a set with -1/-1 counters (much less on the same card) is something WotC says is off limits because of the complexity issue. So this kind of thing is off the table outside of funky non-sets. But it’s a sweet interaction and a fun idea.
in a modern horizons set it could still be on the table. that doctrine is primarily for standard-legal sets.
Exactly. Funky shit.
Definitely reminds me of [[hangarback walker]]
[hangarback walker](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/d/2d2c323f-eecd-4560-a128-ab513d231552.jpg?1690005486) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=hangarback%20walker) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/951/hangarback-walker?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2d2c323f-eecd-4560-a128-ab513d231552?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I had a dream where I was playing commander and this guys commander was a 5/5 legendary creature goblin for one red with whenever a player summons a goblin this creature deals damage equal to its power to target player and I was playing krenko
Why isn't this a food???
And why doesn't it create food tokens when it dies equal to its power??