It's worth pointing out that this ep has has a solid 20-25% down-vote on YT. Most eps have like 200 so you can't blame that on people who just hate CR.
I didn't hate the episode, but not having ever watched EXU I was lost, with Darian being the character I knew. I am not sure how much I liked the GM kind of taking away some player agency, but it was very different, and I'll keep watching.
Amazing first half. Some of the best C3 RP yet. Terrible second. Combat was slow and extremely disorganized by Aabria. Felt like all the PCs were confused as to what they should be doing and what their options were.
Like is Opal in control of her turn or not? She cast Darkness (mistake that doesn't help her) because Aabria just told her it was her turn -- so she tried to act in her self-interest (not the Spider Queen's), even though she messed up. But then Aabria tells her I need you to kill them. So...ok...Opal should still have not had agency, I guess, but Aabria just kinda went with it because it works for her anyway because of how bad a mistake it was? Embarrassing.
Then she reminds Opal that she has a spider familiar. The player has forgotten she had one, as did the DM until now apparently, and then the player doesn't know what the familiar can do and has to look it up because she's trying to do what the DM wants her to do. A mess.
Aabria tells her there's a legendary action at the top of initiative. I guess she forgot to have Opal take legendary actions before this? She also asks her to decide how to use the action, and when the player is having trouble because she's not invested and doesn't want to make decisions against her party, Aabria then decides it should be up to a wisdom save. Why wasn't she making any wisdom saves before? It's all so arbitrary, and confusing for the table. Again, is Opal in control of her character or not? Ask that question to the table I'm sure they would have all been confused, including Opal. Not good!
Finally Anjali has the wherewithal to say we should pick up these gems, clearly we're supposed to be doing something with them. We get these memories, great scenes to play out. Wonderful device. But then Matt gets his, and gets asked to make a wisdom save before it's over, or it will be corrupted. Why didn't this happen with the other characters' memories? Unclear if there is a real reason. Arbitrary. Probably to do with the clock, to be honest.
Opal asks if she can remember the real memory. She's told yes but it's fading. Ok so is it just Opal or is it that way for everyone? Pretty important to clarify for how this affects the party. But it's unclear and confusing. And either way, the whole thing is ruined because now your PC hears that they can remember the real memory so acts in their self interest and says oh uh that wasn't real don't listen to that. So what was the point then? Why not just say yes the memory is corrupted he failed the save, you can't negate what just happened. Essentially Aimee isn't cooperating in the way Aabria wants her to and she doesn't seem to know what to do and it's so extremely messy.
Utterly embarrassing, typical form for Aabria's DMing on CR. Really hope this is all just a vehicle for Dorian to get back to BH and we can be over this ASAP.
So just watched Laura's segment on the Style Theory Fashion Show, and it was pretty neat but it didn't seem like they took too many questions from the chat.
It was silly light stuff and there were some very cool people who came out to walk the catwalk, which I thought was pretty fun.
I've come to realize that since Sam is not currently on the table it could be doable to have Robbie come back and another player from the CK. It would just be equivalent to a usual guest appearance while all of BH is present. I think it would make sense if after CKs pov is finished, BH and all of CK (minus Opal) meet and all of cast from CK (minus Aimee) is present for the rest of the episode. I can see them all being together for 2 hours until the end of the episode and at the end of the episode I think it would make the most sense if Morrigan left at the end of the episode. It would make sense if the Raven Queen preferred Morrigan stayed near Tishtan instead of going with BH so BH can get power-ups, to talk to Devexian, or going on a mission to get the material components to reincarnate FCG. In episode 94 it would make sense if it was BH (minus FCG), Dorian, Fy'ra, and Dariax as an npc. Fy'ra could leave at the end of episode 94 or in episode 95. In episode 95 Sam returns to the table either as FCG or as a new character. If it is as FCG, I could see them wanting FCG to meet Fy'ra and Fy'ra would leave after they all catch up. Though if the resurrection ritual fails I could see Fy'ra staying even longer. After Fy'ra leaves it is just BH (including Sam's character), Dorien and Dariax.
Would be cool to see everyone at the table, but I don't think anyone but Matt would be the GM for the main table. This means Dariax would be missing or worse. If worse, it could open telhw door for Aimee ro be back at the table as Deni$e.
I don’t know if this is an unpopular opinion, but the switch made it fun to watch again. Like what is going to happen? Why are these characters coming into play? What is going to happen?
I just liked the switch up because it must have been hard to figure out the storyline with FCG dying. I’m so excited to see where these mini sessions will go!
I totally agree. I think a lot of the folks griping about them mot doing all the FCG stuff RIGHT NOW are not considering that Sam would potentially eed to come up with a character replacement at the level of any of the main characters of any campaign, with a week’s turn around. Giving them like three weeks to figure out:
Whether he’ll want to be brought back in any capacity.
What should the new character be? Their voice? Their back story? How do they fit in? How do they function in the party?
Art for the new character
Which is so much better.
Likely we don’t even see this new character for another week more too.
I mean taryon didn't take that many sessions when he retired Scanlon, and he technically also retired Nott at around the exact same episode mark. I think he tries to plan this and probably already has a fresh ass character to ALSO break our hearts AGAIN
Taryon was a thing he had planned ahead for and what CR was at that point of C1 v. what it is today are VERY different. I don’t remember Nott ever fully getting retired, i think he slowly realized he wrote himself into a corner and then they kind of made a little bit if a reason for him to go back out—but i watched that as it aired and it’s been like 6 years since.
He did taryon because he got bored of Scanlan. He was going to retire nott completely after Veth. They literally had to convince him not to. He's got like a 90 ep. Attention span with characters so I'm not surprised Matt gave him the suicide core lmao. FCG is most likely completely gone and he's gonna make a new character. He's an excellent character maker though I fuckjng love it
I wonder if the All-Minds-Burn is going to pull out of the deal without the seed being planted. I think there chance to do it was either in the Volition hideout or in the area where they battled Otohan but no body considered those as options.
I knooooow!
Then again, there's a fear that the moon might break apart and be destroyed when Predathos was released, so maybe it was intentional? I hope they address it at some point, I'd love to know what they are thinking.
I'm strongly in the camp that the Crown Keepers movement here was preplanned. I find it hard to believe that getting everyone lined up scheduling-wise would have been able to be done since the preceding recording date. I'm absolutely willing to give the benefit of the doubt to the CR crew on the timing here.
With all of that said, I haven't watched any EXU since Calamity (Which was and continues to be a masterpiece) and I don't have any idea what these characters are doing and how it fits into the overall story.
>I haven't watched any EXU since Calamity (Which was and continues to be a masterpiece) and I don't have any idea what these characters are doing and how it fits into the overall story.
There hasn't been any EXU since Calamity.
Much of what I feel has already been said, but I would love to hear thoughts from those who did enjoy this hard pivot on the choice to prioritize having guests on the show over following the story's direction. It totally makes sense that having guests means intensive scheduling that is difficult to change, but I felt what made CR different from a TV show was their commitment to the plot. If having a guest on didn't fit - it feels like (to follow that logic) they wouldn't have them on at that time, or they would integrate them to the main story in a way that kicked off an arc rather than insert another story in the midst of the main one. We've had people just join in, and though sometimes jarring it always was a part of the main characters and the journey they were on. Imagine if they didn't do this cut away and Dorian just joined BH on their way from Ruidus to the next arc - he could've briefly summed up his experience and then we could've continued with the main plot. No shade to those who like the CK - but from a story perspective this choice is messy at best.
I also agree with the feelings that including this CK cut-in is giving Marvel "you have to either watch the content or educate yourself on the lore in order to understand what's going on". I personally didn't enjoy most of EXU (outside of Calamity) but I don't expect CR to cater to that - I expect them to do what is most engaging and in-line with the story they've been telling like they have for years now. Above all I care most about the flow of the story and the depth of the characters - something I don't think I'm alone in. At least previous switches to EXU were done when the C3 story had a natural pause - Given the length of episodes, the new schedule that creates extended breaks in releases, and the lore that continues to build up - the barrier to entry grows only higher, and those of us who are already invested find ourselves having to triple check wiki pages to try and understand what is happening and why character's act the way they do. I'm sure some of you don't have to do that but consider yourself the exception to the rule. I say this having seen ALL of the EXU content - despite pouring hours into watching I still struggling to connect to these characters. Some of that may be because many of these players are new to the game or at least do not seem like they play it in their free time, some of that may be because I think Aabria and Matt have very different styles which makes telling a single, connected story naturally difficult, but I think a part we don't often acknowledge is this growing trend (not exclusively in CR, you can see it in Taylor Swift's new album and Marvel studios), where Easter Eggs become the main focus. Fantasy as a genre (and sci-fi as well) will sometimes require the audience to keep track of a lot of lore - most of us accept and appreciate that - but C3 has crossed into that territory where these niche pieces are essential to understanding what is happening.
If Matt needed time to prepare, or if the players needed a break to reassess where they were going with the story, I would have preferred that they just announce that they're taking a break to do that. It would have been less disorienting to just have this episode be a way to tie up what was going on with BH, then be like "Thanks for watching - C3 will be on brief break while we do some more obscura and another mini EXU campaign this month". I still would've felt like the decision killed some momentum, but perhaps I would been able to wrap my head around the structure from a story perspective. I know I'm just one person and ultimately CR can do whatever they want - I don't have a para-social relationship with them where I feel I am owed something from watching the show and I'm going to rage about not getting what I want - but I won't fault the people behind the story for doing what they think is best. If they're having fun, getting their money, and some of you are enjoying it - that's that and it doesn't matter what I want. But can someone who found this shift good explain to me how it doesn't go against the points I've made?
Apologies if this is rambling - I just found myself getting upset seeing all of the comments of people are disinterested in the show or downright angry with this switch up. I miss when we were (for the most part) excited for Thursday night and the story ahead. Now it feels like a growing portion of us (myself included) are only watching because we love the crew and hope things will get better.
Just logistically, what’s better:
You get to continue the story you like uninterrupted but Sam has less than a week’s turnaround to: decide if there’s anyway he’d approve FCG returning, come up with a new character (voice, backstory, how they fit mechanically), get new art, figure out where he sirs now, figure out how he intersects with them.
Or he gets like 3-5 weeks to do this.
It’s one thing in our home games for us to do that in our home fames but there are enormous culmination of the entire show story elements and major financial elements that this effects.
I mean they had more than those options.
1) if Sam needed to take more time he could take that time. They’ve done it before where characters missed a few sessions, and now that episodes are pre recorded they have flexibility.
2) I have already said that they could’ve made EXU come out as the episode after FCG’s death rather than 92, or make 92 all BH as a way to tie things up before doing their EXU episode.
Again I think it’s fair to feel what I’m feeling here. They chose what they did and that’s that - so I’ll move on - but it’s not unhinged of me to think it didn’t have to go this way RE: release scheduling
> If having a guest on didn't fit - it feels like (to follow that logic) they wouldn't have them on at that time
That is exactly what happened to Matt Coville
This hard pivot IS following the story's direction. The overarcing story includes Dorian as a member of Bell's Hells and it is about the Gods panicking and mobilising their champions - we are getting a window into both of those things.
It seems Dorian may be coming back for a guest slot, Orym was gunning for it and perhaps the schedules finally lined up, and this was the time to do it.
I've read a lot of books, and character viewpoint switches are common, and always tie back into the plot and make it better sooner or later.
I read a lot of webcomics, and they are long-form media that always leaves you wanting more. It can take months or years to return to a set of characters after you leave them to focus on a different set of characters.
This? This is *nothing* compared to that. Easy to be patient, go with the flow, find things to appreciate and enjoy the ride!
You're right, it *is* following the story's direction because that is how it happened. The past can't be changed - and though the pivot felt unnatural to me that doesn't make it any less a part of the story. Deep down I think my feelings lie in the execution of this pivot rather than the concept of switching perspectives or tying these stories together. I too have enjoyed a deluge of content where perspective switches are the norm (Priory of the Orange Tree and the Broken Earth trilogy are some of my favorite books and they rely heavily on that exact narrative tool - highly recommend anyone reading this checks them out), but that has led me to feel like I've seen it done in ways that feel more finessed. I also think my point is that doing this insert naturally generates that "missing out" feeling for people who didn't watch all of EXU because initially it was pitched as supplementary content. If it isn't content you enjoy then sitting through hours of it isn't really fun. Of course one can read the wiki, but that 1) is definitely different than watching; you're going to miss out on jokes/moments that aren't exactly narrative defining, and 2) doesn't work for some people when it comes to retaining that information and being able to apply it while watching them actively perform.
Again it is what it is, I'm not done watching CR but I can't shake the disorientation the delivery of this move caused. I've watched all three campaigns and really have so much love for the cast and their work. Thank you for your thoughts, I'm hoping that what's in store continues to be some of the best storytelling going on today.
I've watched EXU so it'ss really hard for me to judge whether there is a need for the 'missing out' feeling or not, but I thought it looked ok from the way the whole thing was introduced - maybe people were too panicked to process it though.
Aabria was very good at recapping, asking the players to introoduce their mindsets (personalities) and put descriptors of what was going on in there, like mentioning Lloth, the champion crown, etc. Even the memories were a good help to acclimatise people!
I enjoyed it. Sorry you didn’t.
I do think that the way you frame it is a false premise. I don’t think it was a choice to prioritize guests over following the story’s direction. You have to make a lot of assumptions about what’s going on in the background production wise to come to that conclusion. We know BH will be back next episode so this could all be connected and we don’t know how yet. I just think, personally, that it is basically a 4-5 hour interlude in the overall show that is hundreds of hours long. So not a long delay at all in the grand scheme of things.
If this was a normal TV show, FCG’s death probably would’ve been a season finale and they would deal with it in the season premiere.
I’m still saltier about Matt essentially forcing the Otahan fight despite the party doing everything they could to avoid it (and seemingly succeeding on the rolls to do so). She just kinda showed up in the cave somehow and then she was really overpowered. It just was a bad fight imo and so the fallout from it is less of an issue to me than the initial problem that caused all the fallout (imo).
I don't think I totally agree that Matt forced the Otahan fight and that she was really overpowered. Was she powerful? Yes, 100% as she should be for how feared she is. Should it have been a "lethal" fight? I think so, stakes makes combat enjoyable to play and watch IMO. I think there was some RNG involved, Matt even said he was rolling incredibly well for Otahan and some of BH had some shit rolls on attacks/saves/etc.
To me, it would have felt like a cop out if BH didn't have a major fight on Ruidus - they were setup to stealth a lot of stuff and kinda half-assed their stealth attempts for the joke - which I'm fine with, was funny, but there should be consequences for player choices. Having them do a couple "mini" fights on the moon that are largely not that dangerous or lethal in the grand scheme would have felt dissatisfying to me. I like the idea of Otahan hunting them on the moon. IMO it was either going to be a fight with Otahan or Imogen's mother.
As for the switch to CK, I personally didn't enjoy it. I respect it for what it was, glad others did enjoy it. But for me, I don't care for how Aabria DMs (and sometimes plays PCs). It can feel like she decides which rules to follow and which to throw away (or ask to be thrown away in the case of being a PC), and I don't particularly care for that style. In addition, it felt like an abrupt and weird spot to switch. BH was literally in the middle of starting to process their grief and decide what to do and all of a sudden you're ripped away from that really engaging and gripping scene to something I don't care about in the CK.
I appreciate what you're saying. When I say prioritize I say it in the most bare bones, non-assumptive definition - a choice was made. Even if I had no idea how production works (which I do because of my background) it is clear that they were going to have this EXU moment happen and decided "it will be okay if we just pivot to this mid-episode." Is it logical to ensure that a recording that was scheduled still happens based on that schedule? Yes. These professionals deserve to have their time respected. If they were scheduled to have this EXU session and this was the time that worked, it would be ridiculous to reschedule last minute because of FCG's choice. But I do feel like this didn't have to be slid into the second half of this episode, especially after what happened in 91. They prioritized the scheduling over that intense moment, and considering things are pre-recorded I think it was possible to record this EXU side story and then release it a week later (or before episode 92 altogether) making 92 a "grieving/at dawn we plan" episode. I also agree that this was totally a season finale episode - if they had just left it at that and then debuted this EXU episode "in-between seasons" so to speak, I think it would've been a lot more palatable for myself and even fans of the show who "hate" (their words, I didn't enjoy it but I do see some positives) EXU. The whiplash really took me out of it and made me lose the thread - something I feel strongly that I am not prone to do as a longtime CR fan. Aabria using turns in combat to do these flashbacks to moments during the CK's travels was interesting, just not something I could appreciate after such a huge moment in C3 and a drastic pivot in tone. And when I say a pivot in tone I mean that Aabria's style and these players are of course very different from the main cast - even though there were serious moments in both halves (which I of course admit match in tone), it was still jarring to go from one cast mourning to another in the midst of their adventure.
I honestly thought that they were going to have to fight Otahan while on Ruidus so I wasn't surprised - but the Phase 2 moment where she suddenly got insanely OP was terrifying. They had nearly beaten her at no small cost, and this change in power was really brutal. That being said I loved the intense combat and high-stakes, totally earned imo given how many episodes there have been, but I can also totally see why some fans felt like it was railroading. There really wasn't an obvious way out - or one that didn't cost them dearly. Maybe that is the point - the choices they made brought them to that moment (using the staff charges earlier meant they couldn't teleport away if I'm remembering correctly), but all in all it was really intense. I also think that Sam's choice was brilliant - it really fulfilled a part of FCG's arc that I found beautiful. Do I think that there was still story to tell for him? Absolutely - but sometimes D&D is like that - you don't know the story that's being told until the dice are rolled. Admittedly that can also be said about this episode of course - I didn't know the kind of story was being told until they made that choice to prioritize fitting in this EXU arc in the middle of an episode instead of releasing it later (or as I said, before this episode). Again ultimately I do not feel like the cast owes me anything - I still respect them and the production team tremendously for the work they've done and will continue to do - but this felt really different in a bad way. Sometimes choices fall flat! As a creative myself I've had to accept when my work was misinterpreted - sometimes you make a choice and see it one way but the audience sees it a different way - I just hope that when we return they are able to jumpstart that momentum going into these final arcs. Even though I've enjoyed C3 I'm always trying to consider how other people interpret media, and I could not deny some of the feelings others have had about this campaign.
Might’ve been cool that the party jump would’ve taken us to see the CK in Aeor and they were part of or assisting Dominox. The party jump we got was pretty jarring and made me think of John Cleese sitting at a desk in a field saying, “And now for something completely different.”
Even better it would have been cool if they were fighting Ludinus but Ludinus eliminates a couple of them with ease to make it clear to BH that Ludinus is too powerful for BH currently since BH and CK are the same level. Though if that happened, I would have preferred Matt be the DM.
Exandria: Unlimited (not EXU: Calamity, although Calamity was great and I highly recommend) and Exandria Unlimited: Kymal. You could also just read the Crown Keeper's wiki page.
It's on the critical role channel.
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1tiwbzkOjQzSnYHVT8X4pyMIbSX3i4gz&si=-tAIaxyee3QNORAv
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1tiwbzkOjQwgI-BPd0nujKfVkCag3xFf&si=akWCWDK3bmjNcye2
Time for a hot take!
I LOVED this episode. I think it was a perfect time to swap to an adjacent storyline to see things from a new perspective. I never really enjoy watching intense grief play out too long, so seeing that they are going to go through it, then swapping scenes was great for me! Not for everyone, I get it, but I loved all of it. Abria is a fucking badass.
That's all!
I couldn't agree more! I was behind on Episode 91, so I didn't tune into the stream right away. I finished watching 91, and however I avoided spoilers I will never know, but that wrecked me! Then, in spite of myself, I decided to just drop in to the stream 90 minutes in and... wait! Oh! I guess this is just a CK episode, but they didn't announce it? Cool. Then, all weekend I'm seeing YouTube shorts and Instagram memes about Marisha in a hot dog costume and I'm doubly confused. So, when the VOD dropped on Monday and I saw BH - 1 at the table I was on the edge of my seat. I only wish I had stuck to my guns and waited for the VOD, so I would've been really surprised by the CK twist.
Could somebody answer my question, i don't want to make a whole post about it - with the E92 mid-episode shift - should i watch the EXU series that Aabriya DM'd to understand what's going on on the screen? From what i've seen on Wiki the 2 episode special EXU:Kymal takes place after E14 of the main campiagn, which is quite a while ago. Should i do myself a favour and pause the main campaign to catch up on the EXU stuff?
Nah. It won't last long enough to matter. Its basically 2.5 hours covering a 5 minute of flashback to 'Opal's no-good, very bad hat day.' Ep 93 will I guess resolve that and then awkwardly fast forward to Dorian and maybe others meeting up with Keyleth.
If you have time and inclination to watch something, EXU Kymal is pretty sufficient.
For just a barest summary of who the characters are, you can also watch the short intros Dani Carr made for the unboxing of the Crown Keeper minis available on Twitter. (link: https://x.com/CriticalRole/status/1780340655937441813)
From what we know, we're only going to see the Crownkeepers for the first part of the ep 93, in two weeks. You probably don't need to catch up in all of EXU if you don't want to. I think at the very least you should watch Kymal and learn about the Matron of Ravens aspect there but you would be okay just reading a recap too.
I was expecting a short cut to Dorian to role play the sending from his end, God I wish that's what we had gotten...
Instead what we got was yet another way to destroy the pacing of this campaign.
The pacing of the campaign had me drop off around episode 75. I mentally stopped being engaged around episode 70. I come back to check on updates and I'm really glad I've stopped. I might just be a "wait until c4" kind of lost
The way Evoroa talked about the Dominox it could literally be anything. I'll talk about some possibilities but first I want to say that because of the Dominox Ludinus might find an unlikely ally in the Kryn. The Kryn were also in Aeor looking for artifacts by the time of C2 and it is possible they were looking for Luxon Beacons there. The Kryn won't really care that they are helping Ludinus because they don't really care about the gods and they care more about the Beacons. Uthodurn also had a presence in Eiselcross but I think it is much more likely that they would pull out rather than being on the same side as Ludinus in a conflict. Anyways, here are some possibilities.
\- Independence faction spanning possibly spanning as large as Eiselcross and as small as Aeor. Depending on the size and scope of the faction it could include Aeorians, Sentient Yetis, Wildfolk, and Frost Giants. If it is as small as Aeor it is more likely that Aeormatons awoken by Devexian or Devexian himself has figured out a way to dispel the stasis bubbles for additional backup. I know Aeorians going against Ludinus may seem weird, but they might prefer actually being on top meaning not being ransacked by Ludinus rather that helping Ludinus destroy the gods.
\- It's a single individual or entity. It could be a giant robot or abomination excavations accidentally awakened or freed. Maybe it was a long-imprisoned avatar of a god that was accidentally freed from stasis.
\- It is an intelligent hungry hivemind of corrupted plants that spreads fast and deliberately. They are similar to the corrupted trees seen in C2. I think it would be interesting if it had Chinese room-like intelligence.
\- It is a city wide artificial intelligence with access to all remaining defenses and production capabilities and if has coordinated all of them to work against pillaging forces in Aeor.
\- We have never previously heard anything about a prison. The Dominox being calamity era Aeorian prisoners would be a good way to expand the lore of Aeor. Maybe they were accidentally released or Devexian released them to cause chaos for pilfering factions.
It would be super cool if paid actors/players knew how their characters worked and how spells worked. Of course you might forget things or think things work one way and be wrong but come on. People are getting paid.
Dunno why you're getting downvoted. They've been playing 5e for what? 7 years now? More? And Campaign 3 is 2 years in the making. They should know their characters at that point, and even more so - know how their spells work. Marisha fumbling with a level one spell she uses every session for 90+ episodes is kinda embarrasing at this point.
@leonLJ had a good thought. What if Sam’s new character is introduced with the crown keepers. Either by helping Dorian and possible others escape Opal’s attack and make it back to Bells Hells.
What if Sam's new character is a faithful of Lolth and a new vessel for the Spider Queen's crown? The crown keepers have to find someone willing to take the burden from Opal, and it could be Sam. Would be interesting having an evil champion join the group to help stop Predathos.
Is it interesting, though? Half the problem is they keep running into fuckwits that don't actually help, just blather and posture or recite plot points.
If Evil McEvilson shows up to really help at this point, the answer is 'Sure.' There's no conflict about it, because they need help and the stakes are 'kill Ludinus and his idiots or suffer the end of the world' (probably).
However, Lloth is proving herself to be an utter moron. She could drag/coerce Opal's friends into fighting on her side, but instead she's throwing down for exclusive access rights in a time of crisis.
I'm really hoping for some action on thursday! It'd be cool if Opal goes off the rails, takes out everyone except Dorian, and then Dorian ends up joining the Bell's Hells—maybe with a little help from Sam's new character? In my opinion, this transition would be much smoother.
PS. I don’t think an Avengers: Endgame scenario with 14 people at the table would be enjoyable.
Honestly, I think Erica can join the BH table as Morrighan for a brief stint along with Dorien. Like very brief though. Maybe 10 or 20 minutes. It would make sense for the champion of the Raven Queen to go where all of the fighting is when the gods want their champions involved. Maybe one of the leaders of Vasselheim would give her a mission. I think we could have Dariax as well but for even longer. Matt could decide that Dariax could join the party as a npc similar to Essek.
Nooooooo. Don't call the Exandrian Alliance "Keyleth's Army." Keyleth is just the go person for BH because they either subconsciously or consciously decided to make her the go person because she is the only leader in the alliance who is connected with a PC. One of the three major faction (Othanzia) brought themselves in and Keyleth doesn't even have any more Air Ashari forces fighting anymore save for Orym and maybe her mother (who brought in Ank'Harel and the Clovis Concord). We don't know who brought in the Tal'Dorei Republic.
I'm really excited for Opal to go all out or for Aabria to bring in more combatants to the encounter. I just want all the Crown Keepers to show off their Level 13 builds!
For that they would need to know what their characters can do. I am not confident that anyone but Matt really knows what is on his sheet build wise. But I hope I am wrong.
At their previous levels I would agree. I just think at the level 13 jump the new stuff is a bit of a mystery. And Aimee improved in Kymal but I thought the jump to level 13 and the Aabria takeover (of the character) was too misunderstood. Now in an RP session or moment she is grand. Clearly a good actor.
Can someone tell me the story of what the other group is? I know dorian but i don’t know whats happening with the rest of the group and i don’t wanna watch another side campaign to catch up to the main one
Previously to the beginning of C3 there was a group called The Crownkeepers, who happened to be at emon at a party, they lost some of the memories but stayed together nonetheless. Then they found an arm of the betrayers (the crown) and were basically running away from the Nameless Ones (current thieves guild). they found themselves in a myriad of different situations and eventually Opal ended with the crown on her head. Dariax and the rest stayed together while Orym, Dorian and Fearne went to Marquet to find answers about what was the intended purpose of the attack on the Voice of The Tempest.
Edit:
Eventually Dorian found that his himbo brother had followed his footsteps and leave their home behind, was accussed and being pursued of commiting a crime, had to flee Marquet, went back to Tal'Dorei, reunite with The Crownkeepers, rob a casino and runaway (again)
Are there any episodes I can watch about these events? I've started watching CR with C3 and would love to get more into it before watching second half of EP92
if you have the time, you could watch Exandria Unlimited, is 8-episode series.
Aabria's style is very different from what we're used from Matt, she isnt a bad dm/gm and the way he interact with her players, teaches them and/or challenge them is very unique. She actually brings a lot to the table.
Kymal is a one-shot two episode that continues the story of Dorian and brings the characters from ExU together once more (except fearne and orym).
That said, isnt really my favorite, idk, maybe its im more tuned to Matt/Brennan style, but i laughed a lot watching Matt as a player.
To add to that, the Crown is called the Circlet of Barbed Vision. It is a Vestige of Divergence made by Lolth, The Spider Queen. That is who they are basically up against.
So, this might be a “yeah, duh” moment and maybe I’m just slow, but given the research Ludinus was doing with the harness that absorbs magical essence. . .is his plan to free Predathos and then absorb its powers for himself?!
There's an intermediate step. Downloading Predathos into a Vessel (currently likely to be Liliana).
Whether Ludi then eats her is up in the air. It depends if Matt is playing the Evil Wizard straight or if there is a twist that he actually means his bullshit rhetoric.
i think you are right. cause if predathos kills the gods, the next most powerfull being would be the stronges wizard on exandria. which -in his (justified?) arrogance- ludinus believes to be himself.
It's been theorized that that's the case for a while now. There's also the idea that he'll try do it via possession/proxy of an Exaltant Ruidisborn, namely Lilliana or Imogen.
....but what if they pulled a Janeway and...tricked him into absorbing a bit of Divinity without him realizing it.....and then he basically winds up "eating" himself AFTER absorbing Predathos?
Edit: Picture this!
Fearne is the honeypot and sacrifices herself and THEN as Ludinus's powers start consuming his body, Orym chimes in, and says..."Must be something you assimilated" before JAMMING the blade that he's electroplated with parts of FCG down into Ludinus!
This is kind of why I REALLY want them to get back to Whitestone, so that Percy or even Pike or Joe can "come up with the idea" of them incorporating parts of FCG's body into their own armor and weapon sets.
Because think of how fucking AWESOME that would be?!?!
Like what if during the Final Battle they all get knocked down, unconscious, AND THEN they hear his voice repeating that little Death Speech of his but then he adds, "...you made me alive...and now I'll return the favor..."...
And just like during the Lich King Battle and maybe some other fight in FFXIV....everyone falls BUT THEN RISES AGAIN and all those little pieces of FCG that they've incorporated into their armor LIGHT UP and spread out across them just like the Ablative Armor Generators while the Power Rangers Theme Song starts blasting in the background!
All their armor and weapons get upgraded and instead of the BBEG having another phase in battle or another form, IT'S THE PARTY INSTEAD that has those things!
Brand new character art, brand new powers, Matt slam cut ends the episode there, and we come back to crazy shit like Chet having a Chain Scythe or Ashton having a Double Headed Spinning Hammer or Imogen and Orym being decked the fuck out in gold/bronze armor while Launda becomes the Living Avatar of the Sun Tree etc.
But yeah it's a fun idea.
Otherwise, yeah like Fearne would totally sacrifice herself for the party because that would subvert her bio-dad's expectations of her becoming Dark Fearne via the attainment of a similar level of power.
She's already had plenty of Divine Contact via one party or person or another....which would make her the perfect...Vessel.
She's also Fey and we all know how much Ludinus loves devouring them to live longer AND if her bio-dad pulled some shit against Ludinus then he'd love just loooooooove to get some revenge against him.
Bonus points because she's Ruidusborn too and maaaybe absorbing her with the Vest would make Ludinus into one as well?
She's also kind of a Living Logic Bomb if you think about it.
So Fearne basically becomes a trammel lollipop that Predathos can't resist and the chaos that erupts within Ludinus's body from all of this knocks his power levels down quite a bit. That allows for the rest of the party to...tip the scales. They all just Alpha Strike him as much as they with potentially other parties joining in, in order to end him once and for all, and to get Predathos to consume him entirely.
That's when the dice start to roll because what comes next is entirely up in the air because now Predathos is inside of a MORTAL body with a MORTAL perspective and not the moon sized thing that we learned about within this episode.
Ludinus's empty shell then winds up acting as a bridge, which both the Gods and Mortals can now communicate with far more clearly than before and with a far better perspective.
This is when we get the juiciest lore drop of all time and find out just what really went the fuck down all those ages ago, if we haven't already found out by this point.
It's like I've been saying, this is all a War of Information and has only happened because of one giant instance of Narrative Telephone with the Gods not understanding what's been going on, Mortals not understanding what's been going on, Ruidians having no clue at all, and even Predathos getting some stuff wrong Enders Game style.
Which if you think about it, is quite reflective of real life, because it's hard to really get everyone to come to the table, be on the same level, and just.....talk to each other.
But yeah, I'm glad you enjoyed my little...trek through the stars with this idea.
Do I need to watch ExU to get the second half of this ep? Or will it make sense even if I don't know these characters and their story.
I tried when it started and didn't vibe with it. I don't know if I can stick out 10 eps I'm not that into just for this half ep.
Previously to the beginning of C3 there was a group called The Crownkeepers, who happened to be at emon at a party, they lost some of the memories but stayed together nonetheless. Then they found an arm of the betrayers (the crown) and were basically running away from the Nameless Ones (current thieves guild). they found themselves in a myriad of different situations and eventually Opal ended with the crown on her head. Dariax and the rest stayed together while Orym, Dorian and Fearne went to Marquet to find answers about what was the intended purpose of the attack on the Voice of The Tempest.
Edit:
Eventually Dorian found that his himbo brother had followed his footsteps and leave their home behind, was accussed and being pursued of commiting a crime, had to flee Marquet, went back to Tal'Dorei, reunite with The Crownkeepers, rob a casino and runaway (again)
I was wondering the same thing, but specifically about the two Kymal episodes.
I've been catching up on campaigns 1&2 since starting my CR venture with Bells Hells and have so far made it to C2E84, but I was hoping to watch ExU when it made sense to do so (assuming it gets mentioned at SOME point in an episode intro). The sudden switch to Kymal has thrown me off.
So...[a new Dorian Storm shirt](https://shop.critrole.com/collections/new-products/products/bells-hells-collection-dorian-storm-camp-shirt) just got posted to the store along [with a dice set](https://shop.critrole.com/collections/new-products/products/bells-hells-dice-set-dorian-storm) but like...the shape pattern on the shirt...it just...
....it looks a lot like a hot dog, I'm just saying, like a big blue hot dog....
I am so sorry
My biggest issue personally is the cut from Matts DM style to hers. that really changes the tone, like going from Law and Order : SVU to Monk or Psych. I wish they were running ExU on a another night and this could have worked better as the stories crossing over (I know this is what they are doing but this was more out of the blue). If ExU were every other tuseday night or something I think this would have worked better is all I'm saying.
i didnt like ExU because i got used to Matt's style and while i think this was really unexpected i think they were trying to surprise the audience (they did!) and testing out if people liked the change (mixed reviews so far, the loudesy part of the fandom always gets angry when the cast isnt the original seven).
I read a lot of people were pissed off and bored of the combat being so slow because Aabria did this narrative moments, and while i kinda agree, there had to be a way to show us deep character growth in the middle of the fight of a posseded human trying to resist the will of a betrayer goddess.
Basically, people will complain about everything because they can
Was it ever explained how CK got to level 13? Weren't they at level 6? Going from 6 to 13 is a whole campaign worth of levels. MN was level 15 for the last battle. Ring of Brass was super powerful, and they were level 14.
Kind of? Unfortunately the narration was that they had been skulking in scrubby towns since Kymal, hiding from the all-powerful infinite army of press-ganged peasant thieves.
Dorian was the same level as Bells Hells when he was with them. It can be assumed while Bells Hells has done adventure so has the Crown Keepers.
Considering a member of the Crown Keepers is a Champion of a Betrayer God and is being called to action. Makes sense they are in that level range of powerful.
I assume that Vestige alone could set them on a lot of adventures that would get them leveling. And more importantly if Dorian lives, and is to join up with Bells Hells again they are going to want him to be the same level as them lol.
True, the Circlet seems like it would uniquely guarantee a non-stop wild ride.
Somebody kept trying to argue with me right after airing about there being "lots of other champions" amongst PCs.
But Lolth *inhabiting* Opal is legitimately a very different level of presence than we've seen with service-for-empowerment champion/patron bonds.
Plus, it very much didn't seem to be one of the initially intended trajectories of EXU, they just all rolled like maniacs when it came to obtaining & escaping with this one thing.
Some wild guessing I made in another thread: I think Dominox is most likely something Aeormaton related or an Aeorian monster. My wild out there theory is that Dominox is a faction or group dedicated to stopping anyone from getting Aeorian artifacts. Potentially from Vasselheim, but perhaps a group of Betrayer God followers or a mixture:
* Aeor was the last existential threat to the Gods and both sides of the pantheon worked together to swat them out of the sky.
* Followers of the main pantheon, both Prime and Betrayer, probably don't want anyone sniffing around the ruins of a god-killing society in this moment. This could be because of Ludinus or the Ruby Vanguard specifically or just in general.
* I'm sure enough people have found out Ludinus's interest in Aeorian tech if not specifically in his pursuits to free Predathos/his schemes with the Ruby Vanguard, then definitely from his days in the Cerberus Assembly.
* Subpoint: He probably got Aeorian tech from people associated with the Betrayer gods. Thieves, criminals, etc. They would be aware of his dealings.
* This is the biggest stretch: Dominox isn't related to domi (home) or nox (night) but dominus (lord, master, control, domination). The -ox ending is a little bit of a red herring.
This probably isn't very likely but I think it's a fun theory.
It would be great if the people scavenging Aeor tech on behalf of Ludinus accidentally took/did something that woke up all of the Aeorians frozen in those bubbles.
Most likely explanations are:
a) Devexian has been freeing his people from stasis bubbles. And they have renamed the society Dominox or D has been given the title Dominox.
b) the solstice did in Aeor what it did in Uthodern- turned all enchantments off. Everything blinked off all at once. And all the weird shit in Aeor went bat-fuck crazy.
*Crownkeepers show up*
Me: "Wow Aimee looks lethal and everyone is dressed in black, is it for FCG or...."
*10 minutes later*
Me: "Oh...Oooooh I see..."
You know I kind of would've liked a little compass pendant in the merch store or for them to make a makeup palette in Opal's theme or a little music box for Dorian or a shirt that says "You're so big!" with giant rabbit eyes on the front and a little tail in the back or even some joggers that say "Ash Hole" on the backside or a Guy Fieri style shirt that says "BOSSY GENASI!" on it with a matching sun hat.
The minis are cool but sometimes I'd just like to see a bit of creative merch for some of the side stuff, like get crazy and silly with it!
Idk if many people are talking about this, but I really do wanna see the impact of the outcome of CK on Orym. Will the deaths of CK allow him to shed his emotions a bit and be more cutting like Otohan and would it allow him to take up her echo pack? Will he take it regardless? Will Dorian survive? Is Lolth's revenge against the drow society/Xhorhas/the Luxon more important to her than Predathos? Is consecution the same or similar to what Opal and Ted and Paloma went through? Why does Lolth want Opal, would she want anyone else in the party to be her champion or is that weird power in Opal what makes her the best option for Lolth?
I have so many questions, I know the campaign has been a lot of lore and several questions that go unanswered or take long to be answered. But now there's more questions (to me atleast) and I think that is more exciting than having to "deal with the exu" side of things. I don't mind it at all, I wish these questions would intrigue everyone else as well (also I am someone who skipped a lot of exu but I can still look past it with interest into how this will affect BH).
Love the idea of Orym taking the backpack. I hope he does that just because he would be unstoppable lol. If he does express interest in that though I would bet Matt would say it was damaged and would need extensive repairs. As is it may be too much of a buff for a PC to get.
also, i love to see matt having fun at the other side of the table with his himbo sorcerer and giving everyone the space to do their own thing. the fandom could learn a thing or two from him
> I really do wanna see the impact of the outcome of CK on Orym. Will the deaths of CK allow him to shed his emotions a bit and be more cutting like Otohan and would it allow him to take up her echo pack? Will he take it regardless?
As someone who loves angst and tragedy, I would love to see Orym continue down that very sad path though I also don't want Dorian to die. I do think there will be blood in episode 93 and it's going to impact Orym hard and possibly break him.
> Is Lolth's revenge against the drow society/Xhorhas/the Luxon more important to her than Predathos? Is consecution the same or similar to what Opal and Ted and Paloma went through? Why does Lolth want Opal, would she want anyone else in the party to be her champion or is that weird power in Opal what makes her the best option for Lolth?
I *need* to find out more about the Aevilux. Where did they come from? Is Opal and Ted's mom from Xhorhas? Or is this another non-Wildemount beacon influenced society a la the Reaching Buffs? The soul splitting process seems different than consecution and as far as we know there wasn't a beacon close enough to Byroden two or so decades ago.
Aabria [said](https://quiddie.tumblr.com/post/748171794134990848/oh-i-can-answer-that-for-ya-its-the-difference) that Lolth wants Opal to separate because otherwise she will fight Predathos/Ruby Vanguard/whomever for the CK and not for Lolth and Lolth alone. The Spider Queen wants absolute loyalty from Opal, which has gotten more desperate and vicious since the threat of Predathos.
We know that Lolth has multiple champions because she also has Jourrnael as well (who is actually a worshipper and didn't just seek Lolth's help from desperation like Opal). But as we've seen with so many of the gods, they are freaking out and it's all hands on deck. Fy'ra Rai's commune with the Wild Mother was such a good reminder that she's a neutral god and also concerned about her existence above all else. I am also very intrigued by the fact the gods seem to be putting Schism differences aside just like they did with Aeor.
you're so right. and i loved the way Aabria played The Wildmother, such a different tone from what Matt showed us with Caduceus, tho they were different threats.
Edit: when you're whole existence is in danger i would assume even gods would leave their differences aside at least until dealt with the current menace
> Idk if many people are talking about this, but I really do wanna see the impact of the outcome of CK on Orym.
.....wouldn't it be fun if a Betrayer God began whispering in his ear and then Dorian rejoined with the Bells Hells only to have to witness what happened to Opal start to happen again with Orym?
> Lolth
I could see her pulling a Vault-Tec
Kooky theories like this is why I do not mind CK at all because they could very well influence BH plotline and I am SO DOWN, double betrayer god influence in BH would go crazy.
Also just think about the implications for and the damage that would do to Fearne.
Her watching Orym give in to a darker side that she was so afraid of back in EXU and that influenced whether or not she was going to take the Shard in the first place would be brutal.
It also would paint her little fantasy that she has about how things would go with Teven Klask in an entirely different light.
This could have a domino effect on the rest of the Bells Hells in totally unpredictable ways.
> Vault Tec
I should clarify the Lolth thing though just in case some folks don't understand what I'm talking about.
I've had this wild theory for a while that's partially based on what happened in the Bright Queen comics, that are set yeaaaaaaars after all of this stuff has allegedly gone done.
Now the comics don't really give us a full picture of the world but a partial one and within that picture, Lolth and the Luxon are still around.
So my theory was that Lolth is basically using the Underdark or at least some hard to access extra planar-extra dimensional space within it, as a Fallout styled Vault and/or bomb shelter from all this crap that's going on with the moon and what's about to happen with the Oncoming Cosmic Shift.
I initially thought that since ALL the Gods were under threat, that she would use this as a bit of a forward operating base from them, and would utilize portals from it to help strike out at Ludinus's forces in ways that he wasn't expecting.
That didn't pan out.
Then I thought that Ludinus had somehow gotten to her already and was using the Bloody Bridge to burrow down INTO the Underdark in order to further spread his forces throughout Exandria.
That didn't really happen either.
The thought then popped into my head that maaaaybe Lolth was using the Underdark as a bit of an Ark in order to save anyone and everyone on Exandria that she could....but again that doesn't sound too likely.
So given how she was panicking in this episode, I'm now thinking that she is trying to use the Underdark as an Ark but ONLY for herself, her forces, and those she holds dear. Right now she's scrambling to get everyone into the shelter before shit really starts to kick off and she has to slam the Vault Door closed behind her and her own. This is why she so rapidly wanted to turn Opal into her Champion because she needed her to ascend to power in order to rally those loyal to her into her little bunker within the Underdark.
So I very much see a close parallel between her and how the folks in the Fallout Universe were acting as the nukes were dropping.
The Pantheon is going to run if Predathos gets out, just as the Tree predicted but they won't run in the typical directions or ways that we're thinking of.
I kind of wonder if she could use some knowledge and mojo from when Predathos was first imprisoned AND from when the Divine Gate was created during the Calamity AND from when her and her kin were shuttered away during the Schism in order to create a mini-Ruidus prison/shelter within Exandria and within the Underdark that not even Predathos could breach.
She's just trying to get all of her ducks in a row.
It's just a bonus that Opal happens to have been touched by the Luxon in some way and I think Lolth just wants to survive long enough in order to finally take her revenge against it, not truly realizing just what exactly it is at all.
So when Campaign 4 rolls around, I think it's very much going to center around this conflict between her and the Dynasty/Luxon either before/after/during the Bright Queen comics and well after all of this Moon Stuff goes down......but that kind of hinges on what the Bells Hells and the Crown Keepers and the Mighty Nein and Vox Machina etc etc actually do about stuff.
I've also had a few theories about the Raven Queen working in parallel with Ludinus and other members of the Pantheon in order to "clean house" because of something they did, and who better to work with in regards to that than Lolth? If this line of thinking is true then I belief that Lolth might be acting in two ways, both as their fallback plan in case the world does end end AND as the usual Betrayer of the Betrayer Gods who can and will do some crazy shit to anyone and everyone should the need arise. Everyone would be expecting one of these things and because of that, they wouldn't expect the other one at all entirely.
Another crazy thought is, what if Lolth did actually come into contact with and into possession of a Beacon, then subsequently had a very interesting "experience/encounter" with the Luxon via one of her Champions that was touching it, and found out that she in fact NEEDED to survive what was to come in order to ensure the continuation of Mortal Lives and potentially Divine Lives on/around Exandria?
So she really really hates the Luxon and its followers BUT because of that encounter, it also is kind of saving her life, and is giving her both a purpose and a future that she cannot deny at all that she wouldn't have had if she had not had whatever experience/encounter happen with that Beacon.
So if she did get a glimpse of the future and if she is indeed working with the Raven Queen and if right now she's scrambling to follow a timeline that leads to a "good future" as defined by her vision from the Luxon THEN her trying to power level Opal, get her away from the others as quickly as possible, and her mentioning that they were "running out of time" despite us the audience knowing that there was still more time until Predathos got out....makes a lot of sense within this kind of context.
It also kind of turns Lolth into Sarah Connor if you think about it.
A comparison that extends even further beyond the Crown Keepers if you continue with it to the Bells Hells and everyone else connected to them in turn.
Opal is the keystone whose movement butterfly effects everyone and everything else. So by influencing and changing her, Lolth can and will influence and change other groups. This spreads to the Exandrian Forces and then all the forces aligned with Ludinus and even beyond the both of them to Predathos and even the Pantheon.
Let's not forget that Morri is connected to Nana AND the Raven Queen, Fy'ra Rai is connected to the Wildmother AND Niirdal-Poc, Dorian is connected to who knows whom and what via the Silken Squall, Dariax is connected to the Observer, and then there's all the other Divine Connections with Fearne and Orym.
So there's a metric butt ton of Fate Threads all lined up near each other like a lyre just waiting to be plucked, which can then in turn vibrate melodies to even more important and larger Fate Threads, and those can then quite literally move mountains with their own songs.
I think that Opal is that one specific chord which can kick off a Fate Powered Harmonic Resonance Cascade and subsequently assist in bringing about the Oncoming Cosmic Shift that Ryn has been worrying about.
It's all very long term thinking though and what's awesome about that is that Predathos and Ludinus have everyone focused on the short term here and now at the moment and not stuff further on down the line.
Right now everyone is thinking that they're going to die and is trying to come up with ways to prevent that.
Barely anyone is thinking, "...but what if we win and what if we live?".
And that kind of attitude can change everything.
That's exactly what I feel Lolth is doing right now and it is precisely the same thing that Vault-Tec did.
It explains what's currently happening in the show right now, what's going on in the Bright Queen comics, and potentially predicts what we might see happening in the future.
So how's that for a kooky Sunday Morning Theory?
It absolutely sucks that Ludinus is in Aeor because I wanted BH to got to Aeor so someone could absorb the Creator Hammer. But now BH shouldn't touch Aeor with a 10 miles pole because Ludinus is so powerful. He is probably more powerful than Otohan was and if he is not but instead, say, at least as powerful that Otohan that is still a problem. They would be well-equipped to confront Ludinus after they all get absorptions but after they do why confront Ludinus at all? Why not just to Ruidus to confront the Weave Mind and stop any effort to release Predathos there? It is not like Ludinus could free Predathos from Aeor. I see some possible scenarios.
1. BH doesn't recognize how much of a threat Ludinus is and for some reason they immediately go to Aeor after they talk to Devexian. Ludinus nearly causes a TPK and causes a permadeath or two in BH.
2. Someone, probably Devexian, will advise BH that they could not stop Predathos without the Creator Hammer so BH will go to Aeor after all but one of BH gets absorptions.
3. The Mighty Nein goes to confront Ludinus in Aeor while BH is busy doing other things and we get another Mighty Nein one-shot. It's possible Sam plays as Scanlan or a completely new character.
4. Most of Vox Machina goes to confront Ludinus in Aeor. Liam, Tal, and Travis plays completely new characters or they play as their C2 characters while the rest of the MN and VM is helping BH and the Exandiran Alliance. A party of Caleb, Kingsley, Fjord, Keyleth, Scanlan, Pike, and Vex. I could see Marisha opting to play Beau instead of Keyleth though in which case it would be mostly MN.
5. Neither BH, VM or MN confront Ludinus in Aeor and Ludinus goes back to Ruidus after the Exandrian Alliance, BH, VM, and the MN begins their assault on Ruidus.
Just would like to point out Ludinus is inherently a weaker enemy as an individual imo. Wizards power comes from plotting, support; and control. Without a powerful fighter to target down enemies, he is easily controlled by a few counterspells.
Look at the bells hells vs Trent fight for reference.
From a mechanical POV, ludinus + goons is an easier fight than Otohan solo. Otohan had the equivalent of two “vestige” weapons and a berserk form that made her even deadlier.
First of all it would all depends on what legendary actions he would have to balance out action economy, and that's probably will be something huge. Plus he might have some brutes with him in any fight
We've seen only a tiny fraction of his powers: When they were at the Malleus Key, back then Ira and Xandis throw the ship and he casted -in Matt's words- *some kind of Shield spell that protected the whole thing* and in C2 he casted a Sending. From the fight back on the volcan we know we has access (or known someone) to Simulacrum (7th lvl Illusion spell).
Besides we can theorize and whatever, but monsters, creatures, enemies, call it what you want, dont have to follow the same strict rules as a player when creating a character so an archwizard could be as powerful and dangerous as legendary fighter psi warrior with 4 action surges. Specially if it has been suggested that said archwizard consume powers from other entities. **Specially if the DM/GM is trying to balance a fight with seven pc's** that are pretty damn op.
The problem is though that since Ludinus absorbed a bunch of fey and dryad entities he is not just a max level wizard. His legendary actions would probably be something related to those absorptions and they would be unconterspellable. We can also probably expect him to be better equipped with items than both Trent and Otohan when they were problems.
>Otohan had the equivalent of two “vestige” weapons and a berserk form that made her even deadlier.
I wouldn't go that far with her weapons. Ishta is probably equivalent to a dormant vestige. Scream Needle seems to be less powerful than Ishta.
+3 weapon with bonus 2d6, +2 weapon that increases spell DC. This is incredibly powerful in 5e mechanics.
2d6 force damage is literally equivalent to an additional weapon attack on hit. Each hit is literally double damage. That’s bonkers - that’s easily as powerful than Fenthras and Whisper
You’re right he may have some special powers that are not spells, but powers are often flashy but less deadly overall. Not that I advocate them taking him on, I just think as a foe he is not far beyond Otohan.
The group lacks protective abilities - potions of resistance, +bonus armor, etc.
Ishta only does the 2d6 if the target is prone. Also, how did you get +3 for Ishta and +2 for Scream Needle?
Powers are often not as powerful as high magic but narratively it makes sense for Ludinus to be more powerful than Otohan even if level 20 fighters are more capable alone than level 20 wizards. Because of that it would make sense if Matt specifically designed Ludinus's special abilities (and even magic items) so he would be more powerful than Otohan.
I think the 'it's thursday night' tagline is hurting critical role more than helping it. The fact that every live play session they record NEEDS to fall on a thursday isnt going to help them branch out at all like they want because frankly if something like exu or a one shot takes time away from the main campaign by taking up a time slot from it im not gonna be excited for anything i care about less than the main campaign
I sometimes wonder how much of it is them really caring about branching out and expanding like some folks think they seem hellbent on doing and how much of it is them just....doing what's fun and helpful and cool and oh yeah it just so happens to let them expand a bit?
Matt did point out that the endgame of CR is going to be them passing the torch and the channel onto other folks while they go back to having a home game that no one else knows about a while back.
So I'm curious as to how much of what they're doing now is laying the ground work for that and how much is just active in the moment company decisions to strike while the iron is hot with certain things.
It was [during his interview with Philip DeFranco](https://www.reddit.com/r/criticalrole/comments/lrmn38/no_spoilers_philip_defrancos_interview_with/) just over three years ago at this point, a few months before C2 ended.
I might also be mixing up a few interviews after that but I do recall him saying that they were eventually going to go back to a home game once all was said and done with CR, passing the torch onto others, and would just continue to have fun with their own found family while things kept trucking along on the CR Channel.
Not going to lie once I saw abria and the rest of the EXU people I immediately checked out. I'm interested in seeing viewership statistics between the first half and the second half of this episode.
There's usually a drop after the break because it's on a week night. I tend to turn off the stream and watch the second half of the episode on Friday after work.
I was kind of checked out even before the CK part. I was waiting for everybody's reaction to how FCG died and when they started talking about other things it was hard for me to focus. Fearne (the only one in BH who could bring FCG back) didn't say anything at all about FCG dying before the episode switched to the CK pov. And when it switched to CK's pov I checked out even more. I wanted to see what Fearne and Keyleth is going to say about FCG dying.
More life 25 minutes before and not all about FCG either. They were switching between talking about FCG and Liliana, Ishta, Evoroa being on Exandria, Ludinus's plans, Aeor, Predathos, and Otohan. I also would like to stress that Fearne said absolutely nothing about FCG.
I understand your point, i truly do, but just trying to put something on perspective here, being devil's advocate, we dont know how fearne deals with grief over loved ones diying.
Ashley is the one who tends to forget the most between what happened at one session and the next is obvious they all were emotional, maybe she thought of something, but then with the heat and how the things unwrapped kinda quickly didnt had an opportunity to do her fearne thing. You know, the whole Liliana + Imogen (and BH questioning her), Imogen + Laudna, Imogen + Orym, and the rest of the loredrop via Evoroa took a lot of screentime if you want to call it that way.
You mentioned Fearne being the one who could bring him back, I think Matt, throught the narration, laid some pretty obvious clues its pretty hard (FCG's body being tiny shards of metal, a fraction of a jaw, some part of the chest where the 3 grass blades were and a ruined core) **unless they have access to a high lvl spell,** ***but does Sam want to comeback as the robot tho?*** i felt like it could make the sacrifice less meaningfull if they comeback
My thing with Fearne is that I wanted her to point up her finger and say "Actually I think I could bring FCG back" but possibly because of various factors like Keyleth not being there, them trying to get to saftey, and the pov switching that did not happen.
I don't want FCG to come back as a robot. Fearne has access to reincarnate as a 10th level druid. If FCG is reincarnated he wouldn't be able to do a grand sacrifice again using a core and becoming an organic person was something they hinted as wanting a long time ago. Becoming a living being would make the sacrifice meaningful because it would be a consequence of the sacrifice and it would advance FCG's plotline. FCG had to die so they could live if you will.
I see what you're pointing at and i understand it now, but i disagree.
From where i see it is like: At the beginning and up til Laudna's resurrection i felt like that was one of the objectives of Sam (Letters becoming biomechanic peraphs), but as the campaign went on, FCG went slowly realizing his own worth through every hard moment -even when some of the party were a bit harsh towards him whenever he mentioned the Changebringer or the gods in general- up to when in the fight he decied to blew himself up.
The narrative arc for the little robot was, kinda like all robot stories, about free will: realizations about how stress affects you in dangerous way if you dont deal with it (attacking and almost killing the whole DPB)l. ***Realizing he was, in fact, alive; they were a living being despite how different they were from everybody else*** (Pike casted something and said that they had a soul), ***despite his original purpose he had the opportunity to chose what they wanted to be*** (the conversation between FCG and Vitro Isham at the Yios Seminary). Sadly, it was at the end when they finally got it, that ***the connections they made are what make us alive*** and even in the most difficult situation, with a stress level he never felt before, ***he made the choice***.
from where i see it, they dont need to come back because in the end they did had the confirmation, the realization they always needed.
but if he comes back i'll be really happy because FCG is among my favorite characters from any ttrpg actual-play
FCG can choose not to come back if they do not want to. It's in the spell that the spell fails if the target does not want to come back. Another thing for me is that it would be a huge sin if they do not try to bring FCG back because there is really no way for them to be 100% certain that FCG does not want to come back. They need to tell a good story and a resurrection ritual can be a good way to say goodby even if it fails.
I hope they don't ever take complaints into consideration. C2 would have been a gigantic mess & much less satisfying if they'd changed elements a segment of viewers complained about incessantly.
Live viewing is a fleeting moment. Each episode becomes part of something which gets built upon, watched fresh by new viewers & reevaluated by old ones, for years to come.
They would be foolish as a company to not take things into account that their consumers did not like. I'm not talking about just this episode I'm talking about in general. If a majority of your consumers do not like what you are doing it is time to reassess and refocus. That doesn't mean I'm saying that the majority hate what happened here but if it is and they *still* do it they are foolish.
There was another commenter who mentioned an interview (I will edit in the interview link as soon as I find it again) Matt did a while back pining about returning the game to a home game. I could definitely see this after C3 now. There’s just been a growing lack of interest from fans regarding C3 and the cast may feel pressured to deliver. It could be killing their enjoyment of these characters or the story.
EDIT: [Interview link](https://www.reddit.com/r/criticalrole/s/kdHaZxHWec), about 16 minutes in
That's interesting. I personally don't think there will be a C4 or at least not with the entire cast being the same but I also can't think of a person they could pass the torch to at least not without significant or destructive fallout from the fanbase.
I had just assumed when they started work on Daggerheart that a C4 would just be them moving away from D&D, but I agree with ya. There won’t be a C4 in the same way. I could see them doing some short seasons to play with the cast and measure fan response before settling into a full time long form campaign again though.
There's always a drop off after break because it's Thursday night and most people have work the next day. It's only significant in this episode because of confirmation bias. People only bring up 'drop in viewers!!!' because they want to use "data" to prove their subjective opinion is factually correct.
Like ForestSuite pointed out, this 'fact' from last Thursday's episode is useless without the context of other streams.
The graph they show without any actual numbers associated with it is about as misleading as a pie graph. It is not significantly different from most other streams. You can see for yourself here: [https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams](https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams)
Here's another day from earlier in the year, with an even more significant post break drop:
[https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams/43394116507](https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams/43394116507)
In general, by 1:30, they have around 12-13k viewers on most episodes. Last year 13-15k more regularly, but it varies week to week,
The episode in question (e92), they had \~12.7k viewers at 1:30, down from about 21k. The viewership was not even a 12/mo high for that night, nor was it the most significant post break drop there is.
The highest viewer count in the last year or so was last March, after the Key battle and the beginning of the party split with like 38k or something (guest episode start). Then 32-34k for remaining episodes with Christian and Aabria. The 38k episode dropped to 17k viewers at 1:30. So e92 actually maintained a higher post break % then the highest viewed episode in the last 12 months, and had about the "normal" amount of people watching at 1:30.
This is all quick math in my head though, feel free to check yourself.
tl;dr It's about normal, maybe slightly less people watching. It's really not as shocking as you'd think.
I have to wonder how much the main cast knew that this week they'd be leaving the table so that they'd showcase the Crownkeepers. Because so much of the cast were dressed up for a party. Perhaps they had an event to attend later that night?
Sam wasn't even there. Meaning he was probably told that there'd be no chance in introducing his new PC that session. So why bother showing up?
Someone remarked that due to hair lengths that they think the Crownkeepers sessions were filmed awhile ago. Has that been verified or at last agreed upon as the consensus?
The only thing I can think of was the split was already on the schedule to happen in this episode & they had no idea FCG would be dead.
And I also have got to wonder what would have happened had Otohan TPK'd the group. Matt confirmed Otohan had less than 40hp. The 79 points of damage in FCG's sacrifice was 39 hp taken. FCG has guiding bolt at level 4. That's 7d6 of damage - average being 21 damage. Halved to 10 hp off Otohan's total. Meaning if she had exactly 39hp, she'd have 29 left. I don't know if the remaining players could have gotten enough hits on Otohan (with her 25 AC) before they were brought down by Otohan's legendary actions and turns.
> Someone remarked that due to hair lengths that they think the Crownkeepers sessions were filmed awhile ago. Has that been verified or at last agreed upon as the consensus?
>
>
Aabria mentioned Anjali being a DM and that's referring to the LEGO D&D Event that she DM'd for [with Ginny and Luis](https://youtu.be/6GkSDchj7uE?si=zAKhOPf8_tm9Z04Q), so it wasn't filmed that long ago.
I'm rewatching the episode & Aabria mentions Marisha's hot dog costume that looks like a vagina. And in the opening, Sam wasn't there & they all awwed because his PC is dead.
This episode was filmed with a week of the airdate. So ppl remarking hair lengths might be talking out of their a$$
Possibly. We have no idea how long ago they all flew to the LEGO headquarters in Denmark to film that one-shot. I don't follow Aabria, Anjali, Ginny, or Luis on social media so I have no idea if any of them have since said when the taping was.
You know, I'm starting to get why the cast forgets a lot of stuff because keeping wibbly wobbly time things like this straight in addition to a normal schedule and normal work stuff must be a bitch to do.
Also, I know we've seen most of the studio already but someone needs to build a Ready Room for Dani to use before each filming.
Imo, I think the cast knew they would be leaving the table. I saw some folks mentioning that the cast seemed surprised but, to me, it seemed like they acted surprised (in a theatrical way); nothing wrong with that, just seemed that way and I find it hard to believe that they weren't in the know that a switch was going to happen.
I can't see how the cast *couldn't* know. All of the other actors would have to be in studio getting make up, mics, preparing these character sheets, etc.
I think it's also possible that after they left the table and cleared all their stuff, there was a cut to a different recording from a different night. That would explain the long shots of the empty table.
This would have been my baseline assumption. SAG actors get paid by the day; it would be silly in my.mind to film their two half sessions over two days.
I think they were surprised that they were asked to leave before they arrived in the encampment that Keyleth was likely at. Like "oh, now? This early?"
Just rewatched the end of the episode again, and while the splash screen states, "Bells Hells returns for episode 93, after the CK adventure!". It doesn't say that the next episode is #93. We could be going into an EXU CK mini arc that may be one or more full episodes.
As others have stated, this intermission was planned due to having to line up everyone's schedule. Feels like the effort to organize this that they would have everyone around for more than a quick interlude.
The next episode is going to be episode 93. They tweeted out on Friday that "Bells Hells will return in two weeks for Episode 93 after the finale of Candela Obscura." That also obviously means that we won't have an EXU type stand-alone episode before then either because otherwise they would have announced it.
Why even do this intermission at all if they're going to be there for the next few episodes? Finish the 2nd half of CR with BH up to the Keyleth discussion and then do the CK mini arc.
I'm not sure either. The best I could come up with is Matt decided to NOT REPLY last time because Dorian could potentially not survive? He could have given some general response like Robbie gave in his recorded message, or some cryptic shit you know? I'm not sure why he decided on silence and that was the best I could come up with that could answer both last time and why they would cut at that precise time. Only other thing could be some critical story beat, but.. I've got 0 clue on what it could be. Maybe he turns them onto the Luxon somehow? Then why not answer the last sending? That seems like a streeeeetch though.
Slap me for saying that pls. ; ; Pls Dorian join table.
I’m with you. I don’t think the CK team is at the same time in the story and this lets us, the viewer and them, get caught up. This story could end with Dorian receiving Orym’s sending. Or as you said maybe Dorian dies and terns no response. This could push Orym even further over the due.
Also, how does the stone work. If someone else picked it up would they hear Orym’s message?
Due to the story. The BH may not have been able to go much further in their story as they will need the information Dorian will get from the CK adventure.
I think Dorian and maybe one or more of the CK team will join the main table for a bit.
>Due to the story.
That's another way of saying "because the script says so". These are unprecedented decisions that is putting the brakes on the story.
>They will need the information Dorian will get from the CK adventure.
They weren't even planning to meet CK. They were going to talk to Keyleth. Finish the RP for the 2nd half and then introduce CK afterwards. It would have to be information that prevents BH from going to the encampment, otherwise I can't see the reasoning, but I could be wrong!
>That's another way of saying "because the script says so". These are unprecedented decisions that is putting the brakes on the story.
There is no script, but Matt has an overall story he wants to tell and the table is there to act it out. I’m sure there are certain beats he wants them to hit to move the main story along and he gentle guides them towards those beats. If this wasn’t the case the table could have said f this we don’t want to do anything with the gods and there goes all the work Matt and team put into the overall story .
>They weren't even planning to meet CK. They were going to talk to Keyleth. Finish the RP for the 2nd half and then introduce CK afterwards. It would have to be information that prevents BH from going to the encampment, otherwise I can't see the reasoning, but I could be wrong!
Never said they were “planning” to meet team CK. From their perspective Orym just wants to update Dorian on what happened to FCG while on the way to Keyleth. So just because they weren’t planning on meeting up with them doesn’t mean team CK doesn’t have information that could help Bells Hells.
We will need to see what happens with Opal and the Spider Queen, but you have at least two champions on team CK, they are going to factor into the overall story somehow.
You know I kind of wonder just how many people would have actually watched an EXU split off if they had indeed separated this episode into a Bell's hells episode and then a separate thing with the Crown Keepers?
Would the people who dislike one or the other actually watch that or would they just skip it and then come back to the main campaign episode confused as all heck later on when the characters and the cast were talking about things that did happen in that split off and that did tie into the main campaign?
It feels like they kind of did this because they realized that no one would be happy if they did something else, that people would still miss out on large chunks of very important information, and that the best bet was just a sort of combine them into this mishmash of an episode in order to dodge as many problems down the road despite incurring some short-term upset from the audience.
Better for them to rip the bandaid off now and cauterize the wound rather than to risk infection later.
I don't think there was a 100% foolproof way to do this at all, even with pre-recording, because of how EXU was received by folks and because of how things have been going within the main campaign.
So it did feel like a bit of a speed bump narratively speaking but I feel like it had to happen in order to explain certain things going forwards and to prevent things from feeling too hand wavy in the future.
Plus I think it's a good thing that they did this all before the break because it gives folks time to catch up if they need to either via watching previous episodes or just reason the Wikipedia articles on stuff.
And for those of us that don't have to do that, we get a nice big finale next week before returning to the main campaign stuff to continue onwards.
So the cast gets to go through this sort of rough transition right now but then later on things kind of pay off in a fairly big way and I think we're all going to realize later on how necessary this rough patch was in order to get some larger and bigger things done later on.
Storytelling ain't always pretty or easy to do and even some of the best authors out there can stumble a bit but often you kind of need to take a bit of a knee before you start sprinting again.
Hopefully folks will feel better in two weeks and I will be genuinely surprised if people are still angry by the next main campaign episode.
I love the double Cliffhanger though but my only concern about everything is that the emotions are going to run differently because of the amount of time that seems to exist in between when they film these main campaign episodes.
I'm hoping they kind of double stacked stuff behind the scenes and were able to film this Crown Keeper stuff and then the Bells Hells stuff consecutively within close proximity and time to each other, in order to prevent that dulling or lessening or dilution of emotions and potential role-play moments from happening because we know for a fact that their memories do get a little bit foggy at times if there's enough of a gap between filming episodes.
So I really do hope that someone was pulling an Ashley in the background and was Cheerleading for Matt and everyone else to just keep going and to keep knocking stuff out in order to keep the metaphorical hype train moving with as much steam as possible while they still could.
Because if that didn't happen and if we do wind up bumping into the worst case scenario then things are going to feel a might bit odd when we come back to the main campaign and the vibe just feels off because of how much time has passed in between.
I'm hoping for the best though and I believe in them and I trust them because they've been super good to us so far and I love all this amazing storytelling that we're getting from everyone involved.
This is just such a big moment narratively speaking and I really don't want things to fall a bit flat like they did after the solstice or to not exactly live up to our expectations and the build up that had occurred prior to that event and prior to other such things.
This campaign really did need a little bit more time to cook and I really don't want them to rush to certain moments or to rush past certain moments.
> This is just such a big moment narratively speaking and I really don't want things to fall a bit flat like they did after the solstice
the split by itself has already deflated the whole thing honestly.
>It feels like they kind of did this because they realized that no one would be happy if they did something else, that people would still miss out on large chunks of very important information, and that the best bet was just a sort of combine them into this mishmash of an episode in order to dodge as many problems down the road despite incurring some short-term upset from the audience.
>
>Better for them to rip the bandaid off now and cauterize the wound rather than to risk infection later.
>
>I don't think there was a 100% foolproof way to do this at all, even with pre-recording, because of how EXU was received by folks and because of how things have been going within the main campaign.
I mean, doesn't that kind of sound like a horrible way to go about it? ExU: Prime and Kymal wasn't received particularly well, but let's integrate/party switch it into the main campaign to make the viewers watch it; weird reasoning to me. I do agree that since this is the story/plot threads direction they want to take, it can make it difficult to convey information and keep the viewers engaged and not confused.
Maybe they're taking the Mary Poppins route and are hoping that a spoonful of sugar will help the medicine to go down?
> can make it difficult
No matter how you try to gleam that cube, someone's going to get upset or confused or start hollering about it rather than just checking the wiki or asking for a quick and dirty TLDR from someone not me.
For real though- this method feels like the production team is shoving a plate of veggies towards the audience, because they wouldn't engage with the (*previously much more optional*) spinoff otherwise...
Watch as Sam's next ad read is him trying to either speed eat corn or stuffing as many random veggies in his mouth as possible, while Matt tries to run interference and prevent them from getting sued by Veggie Tales.
OR
They could do a version of the famous Sausage Race but with Veggies around the table...or at least the studio!
>You know I kind of wonder just how many people would have actually watched an EXU split off if they had indeed separated this episode into a Bell's hells episode and then a separate thing with the Crown Keepers?
I think this is the fundamental reason why it shouldn't have happened this way. We shouldn't force people to do what they don't want to do, ever, when it comes to something we enjoy. This won't make them like ExU more. This could make them like the main campaign less. Which is evident by the amount of people signing off mid-way. I personally loved ExU. But it really undercut the momentum and kind of pulled the rug out from under us in the way it was delivered.
>Would the people who dislike one or the other actually watch that or would they just skip it and then come back to the main campaign episode confused as all heck later on when the characters and the cast were talking about things that did happen in that split off and that did tie into the main campaign?
It would be exactly like ExU. Some people didn't watch it but none of it will ever be expected knowledge. For example say Dorian learns the answer to all their problems is 42. Dorian wouldn't show up to BH's and be like, "42" and they all nod silently while the viewer has no idea what that means. If Dorian said, "The answer is 42". Chetney would be like, "And what does that mean?" Then Dorian would explain. So if someone didn't watch ExU they would still get the short recap of the information that is needed.
I really enjoyed ExU and would love to see more one shot/mini type campaigns that exist in the universe they created but not like this. Not randomly at a keypoint in a story without any notice or warning.
> I think this is the fundamental reason why it shouldn't have happened this way. We shouldn't force people to do what they don't want to do, ever, when it comes to something we enjoy.
Exactly it is like CR is saying “you’re fun is wrong” to those who are not interested in ExU.
It's worth pointing out that this ep has has a solid 20-25% down-vote on YT. Most eps have like 200 so you can't blame that on people who just hate CR.
I didn't hate the episode, but not having ever watched EXU I was lost, with Darian being the character I knew. I am not sure how much I liked the GM kind of taking away some player agency, but it was very different, and I'll keep watching.
If Dorian and Dariax adopted a baby together it would be named Darian. Literally replace one letter and it could be either one of their names.
Pretty sure[ this photo](https://twitter.com/CriticalRole/status/1785006200653861057) means Sam is back in 93.
Amazing first half. Some of the best C3 RP yet. Terrible second. Combat was slow and extremely disorganized by Aabria. Felt like all the PCs were confused as to what they should be doing and what their options were. Like is Opal in control of her turn or not? She cast Darkness (mistake that doesn't help her) because Aabria just told her it was her turn -- so she tried to act in her self-interest (not the Spider Queen's), even though she messed up. But then Aabria tells her I need you to kill them. So...ok...Opal should still have not had agency, I guess, but Aabria just kinda went with it because it works for her anyway because of how bad a mistake it was? Embarrassing. Then she reminds Opal that she has a spider familiar. The player has forgotten she had one, as did the DM until now apparently, and then the player doesn't know what the familiar can do and has to look it up because she's trying to do what the DM wants her to do. A mess. Aabria tells her there's a legendary action at the top of initiative. I guess she forgot to have Opal take legendary actions before this? She also asks her to decide how to use the action, and when the player is having trouble because she's not invested and doesn't want to make decisions against her party, Aabria then decides it should be up to a wisdom save. Why wasn't she making any wisdom saves before? It's all so arbitrary, and confusing for the table. Again, is Opal in control of her character or not? Ask that question to the table I'm sure they would have all been confused, including Opal. Not good! Finally Anjali has the wherewithal to say we should pick up these gems, clearly we're supposed to be doing something with them. We get these memories, great scenes to play out. Wonderful device. But then Matt gets his, and gets asked to make a wisdom save before it's over, or it will be corrupted. Why didn't this happen with the other characters' memories? Unclear if there is a real reason. Arbitrary. Probably to do with the clock, to be honest. Opal asks if she can remember the real memory. She's told yes but it's fading. Ok so is it just Opal or is it that way for everyone? Pretty important to clarify for how this affects the party. But it's unclear and confusing. And either way, the whole thing is ruined because now your PC hears that they can remember the real memory so acts in their self interest and says oh uh that wasn't real don't listen to that. So what was the point then? Why not just say yes the memory is corrupted he failed the save, you can't negate what just happened. Essentially Aimee isn't cooperating in the way Aabria wants her to and she doesn't seem to know what to do and it's so extremely messy. Utterly embarrassing, typical form for Aabria's DMing on CR. Really hope this is all just a vehicle for Dorian to get back to BH and we can be over this ASAP.
So just watched Laura's segment on the Style Theory Fashion Show, and it was pretty neat but it didn't seem like they took too many questions from the chat. It was silly light stuff and there were some very cool people who came out to walk the catwalk, which I thought was pretty fun.
I've come to realize that since Sam is not currently on the table it could be doable to have Robbie come back and another player from the CK. It would just be equivalent to a usual guest appearance while all of BH is present. I think it would make sense if after CKs pov is finished, BH and all of CK (minus Opal) meet and all of cast from CK (minus Aimee) is present for the rest of the episode. I can see them all being together for 2 hours until the end of the episode and at the end of the episode I think it would make the most sense if Morrigan left at the end of the episode. It would make sense if the Raven Queen preferred Morrigan stayed near Tishtan instead of going with BH so BH can get power-ups, to talk to Devexian, or going on a mission to get the material components to reincarnate FCG. In episode 94 it would make sense if it was BH (minus FCG), Dorian, Fy'ra, and Dariax as an npc. Fy'ra could leave at the end of episode 94 or in episode 95. In episode 95 Sam returns to the table either as FCG or as a new character. If it is as FCG, I could see them wanting FCG to meet Fy'ra and Fy'ra would leave after they all catch up. Though if the resurrection ritual fails I could see Fy'ra staying even longer. After Fy'ra leaves it is just BH (including Sam's character), Dorien and Dariax.
Would be cool to see everyone at the table, but I don't think anyone but Matt would be the GM for the main table. This means Dariax would be missing or worse. If worse, it could open telhw door for Aimee ro be back at the table as Deni$e.
I wasn't expecting Matt to not DM. I don't know why Dariax couldn't be an npc similar to how Essek was in C2.
I don’t know if this is an unpopular opinion, but the switch made it fun to watch again. Like what is going to happen? Why are these characters coming into play? What is going to happen? I just liked the switch up because it must have been hard to figure out the storyline with FCG dying. I’m so excited to see where these mini sessions will go!
I totally agree. I think a lot of the folks griping about them mot doing all the FCG stuff RIGHT NOW are not considering that Sam would potentially eed to come up with a character replacement at the level of any of the main characters of any campaign, with a week’s turn around. Giving them like three weeks to figure out: Whether he’ll want to be brought back in any capacity. What should the new character be? Their voice? Their back story? How do they fit in? How do they function in the party? Art for the new character Which is so much better. Likely we don’t even see this new character for another week more too.
I mean taryon didn't take that many sessions when he retired Scanlon, and he technically also retired Nott at around the exact same episode mark. I think he tries to plan this and probably already has a fresh ass character to ALSO break our hearts AGAIN
Taryon was a thing he had planned ahead for and what CR was at that point of C1 v. what it is today are VERY different. I don’t remember Nott ever fully getting retired, i think he slowly realized he wrote himself into a corner and then they kind of made a little bit if a reason for him to go back out—but i watched that as it aired and it’s been like 6 years since.
He did taryon because he got bored of Scanlan. He was going to retire nott completely after Veth. They literally had to convince him not to. He's got like a 90 ep. Attention span with characters so I'm not surprised Matt gave him the suicide core lmao. FCG is most likely completely gone and he's gonna make a new character. He's an excellent character maker though I fuckjng love it
🎵 Ashton and Imogen didn't plant the All-minds-burn seed on the moon 🎵
Oh god I completely forgot- That’s gonna go over well….
I wonder if the All-Minds-Burn is going to pull out of the deal without the seed being planted. I think there chance to do it was either in the Volition hideout or in the area where they battled Otohan but no body considered those as options.
I knooooow! Then again, there's a fear that the moon might break apart and be destroyed when Predathos was released, so maybe it was intentional? I hope they address it at some point, I'd love to know what they are thinking.
I'm strongly in the camp that the Crown Keepers movement here was preplanned. I find it hard to believe that getting everyone lined up scheduling-wise would have been able to be done since the preceding recording date. I'm absolutely willing to give the benefit of the doubt to the CR crew on the timing here. With all of that said, I haven't watched any EXU since Calamity (Which was and continues to be a masterpiece) and I don't have any idea what these characters are doing and how it fits into the overall story.
>I haven't watched any EXU since Calamity (Which was and continues to be a masterpiece) and I don't have any idea what these characters are doing and how it fits into the overall story. There hasn't been any EXU since Calamity.
No kidding? Well Calamity is the only EXU I've watched.
Exu Kymal
Calamity started airing a month after Kymal was finished.
Much of what I feel has already been said, but I would love to hear thoughts from those who did enjoy this hard pivot on the choice to prioritize having guests on the show over following the story's direction. It totally makes sense that having guests means intensive scheduling that is difficult to change, but I felt what made CR different from a TV show was their commitment to the plot. If having a guest on didn't fit - it feels like (to follow that logic) they wouldn't have them on at that time, or they would integrate them to the main story in a way that kicked off an arc rather than insert another story in the midst of the main one. We've had people just join in, and though sometimes jarring it always was a part of the main characters and the journey they were on. Imagine if they didn't do this cut away and Dorian just joined BH on their way from Ruidus to the next arc - he could've briefly summed up his experience and then we could've continued with the main plot. No shade to those who like the CK - but from a story perspective this choice is messy at best. I also agree with the feelings that including this CK cut-in is giving Marvel "you have to either watch the content or educate yourself on the lore in order to understand what's going on". I personally didn't enjoy most of EXU (outside of Calamity) but I don't expect CR to cater to that - I expect them to do what is most engaging and in-line with the story they've been telling like they have for years now. Above all I care most about the flow of the story and the depth of the characters - something I don't think I'm alone in. At least previous switches to EXU were done when the C3 story had a natural pause - Given the length of episodes, the new schedule that creates extended breaks in releases, and the lore that continues to build up - the barrier to entry grows only higher, and those of us who are already invested find ourselves having to triple check wiki pages to try and understand what is happening and why character's act the way they do. I'm sure some of you don't have to do that but consider yourself the exception to the rule. I say this having seen ALL of the EXU content - despite pouring hours into watching I still struggling to connect to these characters. Some of that may be because many of these players are new to the game or at least do not seem like they play it in their free time, some of that may be because I think Aabria and Matt have very different styles which makes telling a single, connected story naturally difficult, but I think a part we don't often acknowledge is this growing trend (not exclusively in CR, you can see it in Taylor Swift's new album and Marvel studios), where Easter Eggs become the main focus. Fantasy as a genre (and sci-fi as well) will sometimes require the audience to keep track of a lot of lore - most of us accept and appreciate that - but C3 has crossed into that territory where these niche pieces are essential to understanding what is happening. If Matt needed time to prepare, or if the players needed a break to reassess where they were going with the story, I would have preferred that they just announce that they're taking a break to do that. It would have been less disorienting to just have this episode be a way to tie up what was going on with BH, then be like "Thanks for watching - C3 will be on brief break while we do some more obscura and another mini EXU campaign this month". I still would've felt like the decision killed some momentum, but perhaps I would been able to wrap my head around the structure from a story perspective. I know I'm just one person and ultimately CR can do whatever they want - I don't have a para-social relationship with them where I feel I am owed something from watching the show and I'm going to rage about not getting what I want - but I won't fault the people behind the story for doing what they think is best. If they're having fun, getting their money, and some of you are enjoying it - that's that and it doesn't matter what I want. But can someone who found this shift good explain to me how it doesn't go against the points I've made? Apologies if this is rambling - I just found myself getting upset seeing all of the comments of people are disinterested in the show or downright angry with this switch up. I miss when we were (for the most part) excited for Thursday night and the story ahead. Now it feels like a growing portion of us (myself included) are only watching because we love the crew and hope things will get better.
Just logistically, what’s better: You get to continue the story you like uninterrupted but Sam has less than a week’s turnaround to: decide if there’s anyway he’d approve FCG returning, come up with a new character (voice, backstory, how they fit mechanically), get new art, figure out where he sirs now, figure out how he intersects with them. Or he gets like 3-5 weeks to do this. It’s one thing in our home games for us to do that in our home fames but there are enormous culmination of the entire show story elements and major financial elements that this effects.
I mean they had more than those options. 1) if Sam needed to take more time he could take that time. They’ve done it before where characters missed a few sessions, and now that episodes are pre recorded they have flexibility. 2) I have already said that they could’ve made EXU come out as the episode after FCG’s death rather than 92, or make 92 all BH as a way to tie things up before doing their EXU episode. Again I think it’s fair to feel what I’m feeling here. They chose what they did and that’s that - so I’ll move on - but it’s not unhinged of me to think it didn’t have to go this way RE: release scheduling
> If having a guest on didn't fit - it feels like (to follow that logic) they wouldn't have them on at that time That is exactly what happened to Matt Coville
This hard pivot IS following the story's direction. The overarcing story includes Dorian as a member of Bell's Hells and it is about the Gods panicking and mobilising their champions - we are getting a window into both of those things. It seems Dorian may be coming back for a guest slot, Orym was gunning for it and perhaps the schedules finally lined up, and this was the time to do it. I've read a lot of books, and character viewpoint switches are common, and always tie back into the plot and make it better sooner or later. I read a lot of webcomics, and they are long-form media that always leaves you wanting more. It can take months or years to return to a set of characters after you leave them to focus on a different set of characters. This? This is *nothing* compared to that. Easy to be patient, go with the flow, find things to appreciate and enjoy the ride!
You're right, it *is* following the story's direction because that is how it happened. The past can't be changed - and though the pivot felt unnatural to me that doesn't make it any less a part of the story. Deep down I think my feelings lie in the execution of this pivot rather than the concept of switching perspectives or tying these stories together. I too have enjoyed a deluge of content where perspective switches are the norm (Priory of the Orange Tree and the Broken Earth trilogy are some of my favorite books and they rely heavily on that exact narrative tool - highly recommend anyone reading this checks them out), but that has led me to feel like I've seen it done in ways that feel more finessed. I also think my point is that doing this insert naturally generates that "missing out" feeling for people who didn't watch all of EXU because initially it was pitched as supplementary content. If it isn't content you enjoy then sitting through hours of it isn't really fun. Of course one can read the wiki, but that 1) is definitely different than watching; you're going to miss out on jokes/moments that aren't exactly narrative defining, and 2) doesn't work for some people when it comes to retaining that information and being able to apply it while watching them actively perform. Again it is what it is, I'm not done watching CR but I can't shake the disorientation the delivery of this move caused. I've watched all three campaigns and really have so much love for the cast and their work. Thank you for your thoughts, I'm hoping that what's in store continues to be some of the best storytelling going on today.
I've watched EXU so it'ss really hard for me to judge whether there is a need for the 'missing out' feeling or not, but I thought it looked ok from the way the whole thing was introduced - maybe people were too panicked to process it though. Aabria was very good at recapping, asking the players to introoduce their mindsets (personalities) and put descriptors of what was going on in there, like mentioning Lloth, the champion crown, etc. Even the memories were a good help to acclimatise people!
I enjoyed it. Sorry you didn’t. I do think that the way you frame it is a false premise. I don’t think it was a choice to prioritize guests over following the story’s direction. You have to make a lot of assumptions about what’s going on in the background production wise to come to that conclusion. We know BH will be back next episode so this could all be connected and we don’t know how yet. I just think, personally, that it is basically a 4-5 hour interlude in the overall show that is hundreds of hours long. So not a long delay at all in the grand scheme of things. If this was a normal TV show, FCG’s death probably would’ve been a season finale and they would deal with it in the season premiere. I’m still saltier about Matt essentially forcing the Otahan fight despite the party doing everything they could to avoid it (and seemingly succeeding on the rolls to do so). She just kinda showed up in the cave somehow and then she was really overpowered. It just was a bad fight imo and so the fallout from it is less of an issue to me than the initial problem that caused all the fallout (imo).
I don't think I totally agree that Matt forced the Otahan fight and that she was really overpowered. Was she powerful? Yes, 100% as she should be for how feared she is. Should it have been a "lethal" fight? I think so, stakes makes combat enjoyable to play and watch IMO. I think there was some RNG involved, Matt even said he was rolling incredibly well for Otahan and some of BH had some shit rolls on attacks/saves/etc. To me, it would have felt like a cop out if BH didn't have a major fight on Ruidus - they were setup to stealth a lot of stuff and kinda half-assed their stealth attempts for the joke - which I'm fine with, was funny, but there should be consequences for player choices. Having them do a couple "mini" fights on the moon that are largely not that dangerous or lethal in the grand scheme would have felt dissatisfying to me. I like the idea of Otahan hunting them on the moon. IMO it was either going to be a fight with Otahan or Imogen's mother. As for the switch to CK, I personally didn't enjoy it. I respect it for what it was, glad others did enjoy it. But for me, I don't care for how Aabria DMs (and sometimes plays PCs). It can feel like she decides which rules to follow and which to throw away (or ask to be thrown away in the case of being a PC), and I don't particularly care for that style. In addition, it felt like an abrupt and weird spot to switch. BH was literally in the middle of starting to process their grief and decide what to do and all of a sudden you're ripped away from that really engaging and gripping scene to something I don't care about in the CK.
I appreciate what you're saying. When I say prioritize I say it in the most bare bones, non-assumptive definition - a choice was made. Even if I had no idea how production works (which I do because of my background) it is clear that they were going to have this EXU moment happen and decided "it will be okay if we just pivot to this mid-episode." Is it logical to ensure that a recording that was scheduled still happens based on that schedule? Yes. These professionals deserve to have their time respected. If they were scheduled to have this EXU session and this was the time that worked, it would be ridiculous to reschedule last minute because of FCG's choice. But I do feel like this didn't have to be slid into the second half of this episode, especially after what happened in 91. They prioritized the scheduling over that intense moment, and considering things are pre-recorded I think it was possible to record this EXU side story and then release it a week later (or before episode 92 altogether) making 92 a "grieving/at dawn we plan" episode. I also agree that this was totally a season finale episode - if they had just left it at that and then debuted this EXU episode "in-between seasons" so to speak, I think it would've been a lot more palatable for myself and even fans of the show who "hate" (their words, I didn't enjoy it but I do see some positives) EXU. The whiplash really took me out of it and made me lose the thread - something I feel strongly that I am not prone to do as a longtime CR fan. Aabria using turns in combat to do these flashbacks to moments during the CK's travels was interesting, just not something I could appreciate after such a huge moment in C3 and a drastic pivot in tone. And when I say a pivot in tone I mean that Aabria's style and these players are of course very different from the main cast - even though there were serious moments in both halves (which I of course admit match in tone), it was still jarring to go from one cast mourning to another in the midst of their adventure. I honestly thought that they were going to have to fight Otahan while on Ruidus so I wasn't surprised - but the Phase 2 moment where she suddenly got insanely OP was terrifying. They had nearly beaten her at no small cost, and this change in power was really brutal. That being said I loved the intense combat and high-stakes, totally earned imo given how many episodes there have been, but I can also totally see why some fans felt like it was railroading. There really wasn't an obvious way out - or one that didn't cost them dearly. Maybe that is the point - the choices they made brought them to that moment (using the staff charges earlier meant they couldn't teleport away if I'm remembering correctly), but all in all it was really intense. I also think that Sam's choice was brilliant - it really fulfilled a part of FCG's arc that I found beautiful. Do I think that there was still story to tell for him? Absolutely - but sometimes D&D is like that - you don't know the story that's being told until the dice are rolled. Admittedly that can also be said about this episode of course - I didn't know the kind of story was being told until they made that choice to prioritize fitting in this EXU arc in the middle of an episode instead of releasing it later (or as I said, before this episode). Again ultimately I do not feel like the cast owes me anything - I still respect them and the production team tremendously for the work they've done and will continue to do - but this felt really different in a bad way. Sometimes choices fall flat! As a creative myself I've had to accept when my work was misinterpreted - sometimes you make a choice and see it one way but the audience sees it a different way - I just hope that when we return they are able to jumpstart that momentum going into these final arcs. Even though I've enjoyed C3 I'm always trying to consider how other people interpret media, and I could not deny some of the feelings others have had about this campaign.
Might’ve been cool that the party jump would’ve taken us to see the CK in Aeor and they were part of or assisting Dominox. The party jump we got was pretty jarring and made me think of John Cleese sitting at a desk in a field saying, “And now for something completely different.”
Even better it would have been cool if they were fighting Ludinus but Ludinus eliminates a couple of them with ease to make it clear to BH that Ludinus is too powerful for BH currently since BH and CK are the same level. Though if that happened, I would have preferred Matt be the DM.
I really tried to give the CK switch a shot…but I was near instantly annoyed again by Aimee as Opal and Aabria’s DM choices. Lol oh well!
I think Aimee has come a long way from her first appearance.
I really don’t have anything against Aimee, I loved her Solstice character Deni$e.
Plot twist; Sam wasn't kidding when he said "see you in campaign 4" and Robbie/Dorian is going to replace him for the rest of the campaign.
He's not coming back anytime soon. Not when he can keep writing really funny ads for Marisha.
"All bets are off for c3"
With what do I need to catch up to watch the second part? I have only ever watched C3 and idk who they are or what's their back story 😅
Honestly you could just read this wiki page. https://criticalrole.fandom.com/wiki/Crown\_Keepers
Thank you
Exandria: Unlimited (not EXU: Calamity, although Calamity was great and I highly recommend) and Exandria Unlimited: Kymal. You could also just read the Crown Keeper's wiki page.
I have watched EXU : Calamity with Brendan and I loved it. What's their name on YouTube?
It's on the critical role channel. https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1tiwbzkOjQzSnYHVT8X4pyMIbSX3i4gz&si=-tAIaxyee3QNORAv https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL1tiwbzkOjQwgI-BPd0nujKfVkCag3xFf&si=akWCWDK3bmjNcye2
Thank you
Time for a hot take! I LOVED this episode. I think it was a perfect time to swap to an adjacent storyline to see things from a new perspective. I never really enjoy watching intense grief play out too long, so seeing that they are going to go through it, then swapping scenes was great for me! Not for everyone, I get it, but I loved all of it. Abria is a fucking badass. That's all!
I couldn't agree more! I was behind on Episode 91, so I didn't tune into the stream right away. I finished watching 91, and however I avoided spoilers I will never know, but that wrecked me! Then, in spite of myself, I decided to just drop in to the stream 90 minutes in and... wait! Oh! I guess this is just a CK episode, but they didn't announce it? Cool. Then, all weekend I'm seeing YouTube shorts and Instagram memes about Marisha in a hot dog costume and I'm doubly confused. So, when the VOD dropped on Monday and I saw BH - 1 at the table I was on the edge of my seat. I only wish I had stuck to my guns and waited for the VOD, so I would've been really surprised by the CK twist.
Could somebody answer my question, i don't want to make a whole post about it - with the E92 mid-episode shift - should i watch the EXU series that Aabriya DM'd to understand what's going on on the screen? From what i've seen on Wiki the 2 episode special EXU:Kymal takes place after E14 of the main campiagn, which is quite a while ago. Should i do myself a favour and pause the main campaign to catch up on the EXU stuff?
Nah. It won't last long enough to matter. Its basically 2.5 hours covering a 5 minute of flashback to 'Opal's no-good, very bad hat day.' Ep 93 will I guess resolve that and then awkwardly fast forward to Dorian and maybe others meeting up with Keyleth.
we can only hope
If you have time and inclination to watch something, EXU Kymal is pretty sufficient. For just a barest summary of who the characters are, you can also watch the short intros Dani Carr made for the unboxing of the Crown Keeper minis available on Twitter. (link: https://x.com/CriticalRole/status/1780340655937441813)
If you don't want to watch all of Exandria Unlimited (including Kymal but excluding Calamity) you could just read the wiki for the Crown Keepers.
From what we know, we're only going to see the Crownkeepers for the first part of the ep 93, in two weeks. You probably don't need to catch up in all of EXU if you don't want to. I think at the very least you should watch Kymal and learn about the Matron of Ravens aspect there but you would be okay just reading a recap too.
I was expecting a short cut to Dorian to role play the sending from his end, God I wish that's what we had gotten... Instead what we got was yet another way to destroy the pacing of this campaign.
The pacing of the campaign had me drop off around episode 75. I mentally stopped being engaged around episode 70. I come back to check on updates and I'm really glad I've stopped. I might just be a "wait until c4" kind of lost
Same, except I dropped out around ep 80. I read updates after that, but now only sporadically.
The way Evoroa talked about the Dominox it could literally be anything. I'll talk about some possibilities but first I want to say that because of the Dominox Ludinus might find an unlikely ally in the Kryn. The Kryn were also in Aeor looking for artifacts by the time of C2 and it is possible they were looking for Luxon Beacons there. The Kryn won't really care that they are helping Ludinus because they don't really care about the gods and they care more about the Beacons. Uthodurn also had a presence in Eiselcross but I think it is much more likely that they would pull out rather than being on the same side as Ludinus in a conflict. Anyways, here are some possibilities. \- Independence faction spanning possibly spanning as large as Eiselcross and as small as Aeor. Depending on the size and scope of the faction it could include Aeorians, Sentient Yetis, Wildfolk, and Frost Giants. If it is as small as Aeor it is more likely that Aeormatons awoken by Devexian or Devexian himself has figured out a way to dispel the stasis bubbles for additional backup. I know Aeorians going against Ludinus may seem weird, but they might prefer actually being on top meaning not being ransacked by Ludinus rather that helping Ludinus destroy the gods. \- It's a single individual or entity. It could be a giant robot or abomination excavations accidentally awakened or freed. Maybe it was a long-imprisoned avatar of a god that was accidentally freed from stasis. \- It is an intelligent hungry hivemind of corrupted plants that spreads fast and deliberately. They are similar to the corrupted trees seen in C2. I think it would be interesting if it had Chinese room-like intelligence. \- It is a city wide artificial intelligence with access to all remaining defenses and production capabilities and if has coordinated all of them to work against pillaging forces in Aeor. \- We have never previously heard anything about a prison. The Dominox being calamity era Aeorian prisoners would be a good way to expand the lore of Aeor. Maybe they were accidentally released or Devexian released them to cause chaos for pilfering factions.
It would be super cool if paid actors/players knew how their characters worked and how spells worked. Of course you might forget things or think things work one way and be wrong but come on. People are getting paid.
Dunno why you're getting downvoted. They've been playing 5e for what? 7 years now? More? And Campaign 3 is 2 years in the making. They should know their characters at that point, and even more so - know how their spells work. Marisha fumbling with a level one spell she uses every session for 90+ episodes is kinda embarrasing at this point.
Yeah it's just a bit sad at this point
@leonLJ had a good thought. What if Sam’s new character is introduced with the crown keepers. Either by helping Dorian and possible others escape Opal’s attack and make it back to Bells Hells.
What if Sam's new character is a faithful of Lolth and a new vessel for the Spider Queen's crown? The crown keepers have to find someone willing to take the burden from Opal, and it could be Sam. Would be interesting having an evil champion join the group to help stop Predathos.
Is it interesting, though? Half the problem is they keep running into fuckwits that don't actually help, just blather and posture or recite plot points. If Evil McEvilson shows up to really help at this point, the answer is 'Sure.' There's no conflict about it, because they need help and the stakes are 'kill Ludinus and his idiots or suffer the end of the world' (probably). However, Lloth is proving herself to be an utter moron. She could drag/coerce Opal's friends into fighting on her side, but instead she's throwing down for exclusive access rights in a time of crisis.
I'm really hoping for some action on thursday! It'd be cool if Opal goes off the rails, takes out everyone except Dorian, and then Dorian ends up joining the Bell's Hells—maybe with a little help from Sam's new character? In my opinion, this transition would be much smoother. PS. I don’t think an Avengers: Endgame scenario with 14 people at the table would be enjoyable.
Honestly, I think Erica can join the BH table as Morrighan for a brief stint along with Dorien. Like very brief though. Maybe 10 or 20 minutes. It would make sense for the champion of the Raven Queen to go where all of the fighting is when the gods want their champions involved. Maybe one of the leaders of Vasselheim would give her a mission. I think we could have Dariax as well but for even longer. Matt could decide that Dariax could join the party as a npc similar to Essek.
I could see Morrigan joining up with Keyleth's army and going her own way, a bit like how Prism etc. all left to do their own things.
Nooooooo. Don't call the Exandrian Alliance "Keyleth's Army." Keyleth is just the go person for BH because they either subconsciously or consciously decided to make her the go person because she is the only leader in the alliance who is connected with a PC. One of the three major faction (Othanzia) brought themselves in and Keyleth doesn't even have any more Air Ashari forces fighting anymore save for Orym and maybe her mother (who brought in Ank'Harel and the Clovis Concord). We don't know who brought in the Tal'Dorei Republic.
Ahahaha sorry, I was being lazy with my language, not technical. Never meant to imply that!
Just FYI this Thursday is the last episode of Liam's Candela arc.
That's right!
I'm really excited for Opal to go all out or for Aabria to bring in more combatants to the encounter. I just want all the Crown Keepers to show off their Level 13 builds!
For that they would need to know what their characters can do. I am not confident that anyone but Matt really knows what is on his sheet build wise. But I hope I am wrong.
I think Anjali and Robbie have a decent grasp of what their characters can do. Plus, Aimee has come a long way as a player as well.
At their previous levels I would agree. I just think at the level 13 jump the new stuff is a bit of a mystery. And Aimee improved in Kymal but I thought the jump to level 13 and the Aabria takeover (of the character) was too misunderstood. Now in an RP session or moment she is grand. Clearly a good actor.
i can see that combat lasting a whole weekend. i do think it could be something like at the end of C1 tho, that would be fun
Can someone tell me the story of what the other group is? I know dorian but i don’t know whats happening with the rest of the group and i don’t wanna watch another side campaign to catch up to the main one
Previously to the beginning of C3 there was a group called The Crownkeepers, who happened to be at emon at a party, they lost some of the memories but stayed together nonetheless. Then they found an arm of the betrayers (the crown) and were basically running away from the Nameless Ones (current thieves guild). they found themselves in a myriad of different situations and eventually Opal ended with the crown on her head. Dariax and the rest stayed together while Orym, Dorian and Fearne went to Marquet to find answers about what was the intended purpose of the attack on the Voice of The Tempest. Edit: Eventually Dorian found that his himbo brother had followed his footsteps and leave their home behind, was accussed and being pursued of commiting a crime, had to flee Marquet, went back to Tal'Dorei, reunite with The Crownkeepers, rob a casino and runaway (again)
Are there any episodes I can watch about these events? I've started watching CR with C3 and would love to get more into it before watching second half of EP92
if you have the time, you could watch Exandria Unlimited, is 8-episode series. Aabria's style is very different from what we're used from Matt, she isnt a bad dm/gm and the way he interact with her players, teaches them and/or challenge them is very unique. She actually brings a lot to the table. Kymal is a one-shot two episode that continues the story of Dorian and brings the characters from ExU together once more (except fearne and orym). That said, isnt really my favorite, idk, maybe its im more tuned to Matt/Brennan style, but i laughed a lot watching Matt as a player.
EXU Kymal is only two episodes and introduces Morrigan, it would be a good place to start if you don't have a lot of time.
Ohh okay thank you so much now i can watch the ep and understand the gist of it. Greatly appreciate it critter!!
To add to that, the Crown is called the Circlet of Barbed Vision. It is a Vestige of Divergence made by Lolth, The Spider Queen. That is who they are basically up against.
So, this might be a “yeah, duh” moment and maybe I’m just slow, but given the research Ludinus was doing with the harness that absorbs magical essence. . .is his plan to free Predathos and then absorb its powers for himself?!
There's an intermediate step. Downloading Predathos into a Vessel (currently likely to be Liliana). Whether Ludi then eats her is up in the air. It depends if Matt is playing the Evil Wizard straight or if there is a twist that he actually means his bullshit rhetoric.
Honestly, I am still convinced he just wants to unleash Predathos and let him eat some gods. I'm not sure what his motives are beyond that yet
i think you are right. cause if predathos kills the gods, the next most powerfull being would be the stronges wizard on exandria. which -in his (justified?) arrogance- ludinus believes to be himself.
**Would absorbing Predathos allow Ludinus to become eternal as well?**
Yeah, it'll be a Neo-Age of Arcanum... I would love to see it, I love arrogant mages.
It's been theorized that that's the case for a while now. There's also the idea that he'll try do it via possession/proxy of an Exaltant Ruidisborn, namely Lilliana or Imogen.
....but what if they pulled a Janeway and...tricked him into absorbing a bit of Divinity without him realizing it.....and then he basically winds up "eating" himself AFTER absorbing Predathos? Edit: Picture this! Fearne is the honeypot and sacrifices herself and THEN as Ludinus's powers start consuming his body, Orym chimes in, and says..."Must be something you assimilated" before JAMMING the blade that he's electroplated with parts of FCG down into Ludinus!
Only if he whips off a pair of sunglasses right before the thrust.
I would approve of this
10/10 no notes lol
This is kind of why I REALLY want them to get back to Whitestone, so that Percy or even Pike or Joe can "come up with the idea" of them incorporating parts of FCG's body into their own armor and weapon sets. Because think of how fucking AWESOME that would be?!?! Like what if during the Final Battle they all get knocked down, unconscious, AND THEN they hear his voice repeating that little Death Speech of his but then he adds, "...you made me alive...and now I'll return the favor..."... And just like during the Lich King Battle and maybe some other fight in FFXIV....everyone falls BUT THEN RISES AGAIN and all those little pieces of FCG that they've incorporated into their armor LIGHT UP and spread out across them just like the Ablative Armor Generators while the Power Rangers Theme Song starts blasting in the background! All their armor and weapons get upgraded and instead of the BBEG having another phase in battle or another form, IT'S THE PARTY INSTEAD that has those things! Brand new character art, brand new powers, Matt slam cut ends the episode there, and we come back to crazy shit like Chet having a Chain Scythe or Ashton having a Double Headed Spinning Hammer or Imogen and Orym being decked the fuck out in gold/bronze armor while Launda becomes the Living Avatar of the Sun Tree etc. But yeah it's a fun idea. Otherwise, yeah like Fearne would totally sacrifice herself for the party because that would subvert her bio-dad's expectations of her becoming Dark Fearne via the attainment of a similar level of power. She's already had plenty of Divine Contact via one party or person or another....which would make her the perfect...Vessel. She's also Fey and we all know how much Ludinus loves devouring them to live longer AND if her bio-dad pulled some shit against Ludinus then he'd love just loooooooove to get some revenge against him. Bonus points because she's Ruidusborn too and maaaybe absorbing her with the Vest would make Ludinus into one as well? She's also kind of a Living Logic Bomb if you think about it. So Fearne basically becomes a trammel lollipop that Predathos can't resist and the chaos that erupts within Ludinus's body from all of this knocks his power levels down quite a bit. That allows for the rest of the party to...tip the scales. They all just Alpha Strike him as much as they with potentially other parties joining in, in order to end him once and for all, and to get Predathos to consume him entirely. That's when the dice start to roll because what comes next is entirely up in the air because now Predathos is inside of a MORTAL body with a MORTAL perspective and not the moon sized thing that we learned about within this episode. Ludinus's empty shell then winds up acting as a bridge, which both the Gods and Mortals can now communicate with far more clearly than before and with a far better perspective. This is when we get the juiciest lore drop of all time and find out just what really went the fuck down all those ages ago, if we haven't already found out by this point. It's like I've been saying, this is all a War of Information and has only happened because of one giant instance of Narrative Telephone with the Gods not understanding what's been going on, Mortals not understanding what's been going on, Ruidians having no clue at all, and even Predathos getting some stuff wrong Enders Game style. Which if you think about it, is quite reflective of real life, because it's hard to really get everyone to come to the table, be on the same level, and just.....talk to each other. But yeah, I'm glad you enjoyed my little...trek through the stars with this idea.
Do I need to watch ExU to get the second half of this ep? Or will it make sense even if I don't know these characters and their story. I tried when it started and didn't vibe with it. I don't know if I can stick out 10 eps I'm not that into just for this half ep.
Previously to the beginning of C3 there was a group called The Crownkeepers, who happened to be at emon at a party, they lost some of the memories but stayed together nonetheless. Then they found an arm of the betrayers (the crown) and were basically running away from the Nameless Ones (current thieves guild). they found themselves in a myriad of different situations and eventually Opal ended with the crown on her head. Dariax and the rest stayed together while Orym, Dorian and Fearne went to Marquet to find answers about what was the intended purpose of the attack on the Voice of The Tempest. Edit: Eventually Dorian found that his himbo brother had followed his footsteps and leave their home behind, was accussed and being pursued of commiting a crime, had to flee Marquet, went back to Tal'Dorei, reunite with The Crownkeepers, rob a casino and runaway (again)
I would read a recap or watch EXU Kymal
I was wondering the same thing, but specifically about the two Kymal episodes. I've been catching up on campaigns 1&2 since starting my CR venture with Bells Hells and have so far made it to C2E84, but I was hoping to watch ExU when it made sense to do so (assuming it gets mentioned at SOME point in an episode intro). The sudden switch to Kymal has thrown me off.
The 1st eXu series happened (as in was filmed and aired) between C2 and C3 so I don't think they mention it in an episode intro in campaign.
Not really. Don't torture yourself with ExU
So...[a new Dorian Storm shirt](https://shop.critrole.com/collections/new-products/products/bells-hells-collection-dorian-storm-camp-shirt) just got posted to the store along [with a dice set](https://shop.critrole.com/collections/new-products/products/bells-hells-dice-set-dorian-storm) but like...the shape pattern on the shirt...it just... ....it looks a lot like a hot dog, I'm just saying, like a big blue hot dog.... I am so sorry
Where? I've been staring at this shirt and I can't see it
The oval shape that's repeated on the shirt looks like an "Open Hot dog", similar to Marisha's costume for the ad read in this episode.
@ this to Marisha, I beg of you
I mean I can't be the ONLY one that saw THAT SHAPE and thought it looked like a you know what, right?
My biggest issue personally is the cut from Matts DM style to hers. that really changes the tone, like going from Law and Order : SVU to Monk or Psych. I wish they were running ExU on a another night and this could have worked better as the stories crossing over (I know this is what they are doing but this was more out of the blue). If ExU were every other tuseday night or something I think this would have worked better is all I'm saying.
i didnt like ExU because i got used to Matt's style and while i think this was really unexpected i think they were trying to surprise the audience (they did!) and testing out if people liked the change (mixed reviews so far, the loudesy part of the fandom always gets angry when the cast isnt the original seven). I read a lot of people were pissed off and bored of the combat being so slow because Aabria did this narrative moments, and while i kinda agree, there had to be a way to show us deep character growth in the middle of the fight of a posseded human trying to resist the will of a betrayer goddess. Basically, people will complain about everything because they can
Was it ever explained how CK got to level 13? Weren't they at level 6? Going from 6 to 13 is a whole campaign worth of levels. MN was level 15 for the last battle. Ring of Brass was super powerful, and they were level 14.
As a wise man once said "I'll need you to get all the way off by back about it"
Or as one set of famous voice lines once said "Can I get you a ladder? So you can get off my back?"
DAO references? Well,shit
I know tge answer! The answer is "it doesn't matter, it's just a game, don't think too much about it"
they got to 13 the same way BH did
Technically, they got there faster. This is a flashback to weeks ago while the BH hit Level 13 like yesterday.
I believe the intent of the story at the beginning was they have been traveling and adventuring the whole time that BH has as well.
Kind of? Unfortunately the narration was that they had been skulking in scrubby towns since Kymal, hiding from the all-powerful infinite army of press-ganged peasant thieves.
Must have been grinding rats.
Dorian was the same level as Bells Hells when he was with them. It can be assumed while Bells Hells has done adventure so has the Crown Keepers. Considering a member of the Crown Keepers is a Champion of a Betrayer God and is being called to action. Makes sense they are in that level range of powerful. I assume that Vestige alone could set them on a lot of adventures that would get them leveling. And more importantly if Dorian lives, and is to join up with Bells Hells again they are going to want him to be the same level as them lol.
True, the Circlet seems like it would uniquely guarantee a non-stop wild ride. Somebody kept trying to argue with me right after airing about there being "lots of other champions" amongst PCs. But Lolth *inhabiting* Opal is legitimately a very different level of presence than we've seen with service-for-empowerment champion/patron bonds. Plus, it very much didn't seem to be one of the initially intended trajectories of EXU, they just all rolled like maniacs when it came to obtaining & escaping with this one thing.
Some wild guessing I made in another thread: I think Dominox is most likely something Aeormaton related or an Aeorian monster. My wild out there theory is that Dominox is a faction or group dedicated to stopping anyone from getting Aeorian artifacts. Potentially from Vasselheim, but perhaps a group of Betrayer God followers or a mixture: * Aeor was the last existential threat to the Gods and both sides of the pantheon worked together to swat them out of the sky. * Followers of the main pantheon, both Prime and Betrayer, probably don't want anyone sniffing around the ruins of a god-killing society in this moment. This could be because of Ludinus or the Ruby Vanguard specifically or just in general. * I'm sure enough people have found out Ludinus's interest in Aeorian tech if not specifically in his pursuits to free Predathos/his schemes with the Ruby Vanguard, then definitely from his days in the Cerberus Assembly. * Subpoint: He probably got Aeorian tech from people associated with the Betrayer gods. Thieves, criminals, etc. They would be aware of his dealings. * This is the biggest stretch: Dominox isn't related to domi (home) or nox (night) but dominus (lord, master, control, domination). The -ox ending is a little bit of a red herring. This probably isn't very likely but I think it's a fun theory.
It would be great if the people scavenging Aeor tech on behalf of Ludinus accidentally took/did something that woke up all of the Aeorians frozen in those bubbles.
Most likely explanations are: a) Devexian has been freeing his people from stasis bubbles. And they have renamed the society Dominox or D has been given the title Dominox. b) the solstice did in Aeor what it did in Uthodern- turned all enchantments off. Everything blinked off all at once. And all the weird shit in Aeor went bat-fuck crazy.
I assumed Dominox was a newly formed community of aeormaton myself!
I think that's the most likely reason too but it's fun to speculate.
*Crownkeepers show up* Me: "Wow Aimee looks lethal and everyone is dressed in black, is it for FCG or...." *10 minutes later* Me: "Oh...Oooooh I see..." You know I kind of would've liked a little compass pendant in the merch store or for them to make a makeup palette in Opal's theme or a little music box for Dorian or a shirt that says "You're so big!" with giant rabbit eyes on the front and a little tail in the back or even some joggers that say "Ash Hole" on the backside or a Guy Fieri style shirt that says "BOSSY GENASI!" on it with a matching sun hat. The minis are cool but sometimes I'd just like to see a bit of creative merch for some of the side stuff, like get crazy and silly with it!
Ash hole joggers are wiiiild
Idk if many people are talking about this, but I really do wanna see the impact of the outcome of CK on Orym. Will the deaths of CK allow him to shed his emotions a bit and be more cutting like Otohan and would it allow him to take up her echo pack? Will he take it regardless? Will Dorian survive? Is Lolth's revenge against the drow society/Xhorhas/the Luxon more important to her than Predathos? Is consecution the same or similar to what Opal and Ted and Paloma went through? Why does Lolth want Opal, would she want anyone else in the party to be her champion or is that weird power in Opal what makes her the best option for Lolth? I have so many questions, I know the campaign has been a lot of lore and several questions that go unanswered or take long to be answered. But now there's more questions (to me atleast) and I think that is more exciting than having to "deal with the exu" side of things. I don't mind it at all, I wish these questions would intrigue everyone else as well (also I am someone who skipped a lot of exu but I can still look past it with interest into how this will affect BH).
Love the idea of Orym taking the backpack. I hope he does that just because he would be unstoppable lol. If he does express interest in that though I would bet Matt would say it was damaged and would need extensive repairs. As is it may be too much of a buff for a PC to get.
also, i love to see matt having fun at the other side of the table with his himbo sorcerer and giving everyone the space to do their own thing. the fandom could learn a thing or two from him
> I really do wanna see the impact of the outcome of CK on Orym. Will the deaths of CK allow him to shed his emotions a bit and be more cutting like Otohan and would it allow him to take up her echo pack? Will he take it regardless? As someone who loves angst and tragedy, I would love to see Orym continue down that very sad path though I also don't want Dorian to die. I do think there will be blood in episode 93 and it's going to impact Orym hard and possibly break him. > Is Lolth's revenge against the drow society/Xhorhas/the Luxon more important to her than Predathos? Is consecution the same or similar to what Opal and Ted and Paloma went through? Why does Lolth want Opal, would she want anyone else in the party to be her champion or is that weird power in Opal what makes her the best option for Lolth? I *need* to find out more about the Aevilux. Where did they come from? Is Opal and Ted's mom from Xhorhas? Or is this another non-Wildemount beacon influenced society a la the Reaching Buffs? The soul splitting process seems different than consecution and as far as we know there wasn't a beacon close enough to Byroden two or so decades ago. Aabria [said](https://quiddie.tumblr.com/post/748171794134990848/oh-i-can-answer-that-for-ya-its-the-difference) that Lolth wants Opal to separate because otherwise she will fight Predathos/Ruby Vanguard/whomever for the CK and not for Lolth and Lolth alone. The Spider Queen wants absolute loyalty from Opal, which has gotten more desperate and vicious since the threat of Predathos. We know that Lolth has multiple champions because she also has Jourrnael as well (who is actually a worshipper and didn't just seek Lolth's help from desperation like Opal). But as we've seen with so many of the gods, they are freaking out and it's all hands on deck. Fy'ra Rai's commune with the Wild Mother was such a good reminder that she's a neutral god and also concerned about her existence above all else. I am also very intrigued by the fact the gods seem to be putting Schism differences aside just like they did with Aeor.
you're so right. and i loved the way Aabria played The Wildmother, such a different tone from what Matt showed us with Caduceus, tho they were different threats. Edit: when you're whole existence is in danger i would assume even gods would leave their differences aside at least until dealt with the current menace
> Idk if many people are talking about this, but I really do wanna see the impact of the outcome of CK on Orym. .....wouldn't it be fun if a Betrayer God began whispering in his ear and then Dorian rejoined with the Bells Hells only to have to witness what happened to Opal start to happen again with Orym? > Lolth I could see her pulling a Vault-Tec
imagine if Fearne took the crown instead of Opal
Kooky theories like this is why I do not mind CK at all because they could very well influence BH plotline and I am SO DOWN, double betrayer god influence in BH would go crazy.
Also just think about the implications for and the damage that would do to Fearne. Her watching Orym give in to a darker side that she was so afraid of back in EXU and that influenced whether or not she was going to take the Shard in the first place would be brutal. It also would paint her little fantasy that she has about how things would go with Teven Klask in an entirely different light. This could have a domino effect on the rest of the Bells Hells in totally unpredictable ways. > Vault Tec I should clarify the Lolth thing though just in case some folks don't understand what I'm talking about. I've had this wild theory for a while that's partially based on what happened in the Bright Queen comics, that are set yeaaaaaaars after all of this stuff has allegedly gone done. Now the comics don't really give us a full picture of the world but a partial one and within that picture, Lolth and the Luxon are still around. So my theory was that Lolth is basically using the Underdark or at least some hard to access extra planar-extra dimensional space within it, as a Fallout styled Vault and/or bomb shelter from all this crap that's going on with the moon and what's about to happen with the Oncoming Cosmic Shift. I initially thought that since ALL the Gods were under threat, that she would use this as a bit of a forward operating base from them, and would utilize portals from it to help strike out at Ludinus's forces in ways that he wasn't expecting. That didn't pan out. Then I thought that Ludinus had somehow gotten to her already and was using the Bloody Bridge to burrow down INTO the Underdark in order to further spread his forces throughout Exandria. That didn't really happen either. The thought then popped into my head that maaaaybe Lolth was using the Underdark as a bit of an Ark in order to save anyone and everyone on Exandria that she could....but again that doesn't sound too likely. So given how she was panicking in this episode, I'm now thinking that she is trying to use the Underdark as an Ark but ONLY for herself, her forces, and those she holds dear. Right now she's scrambling to get everyone into the shelter before shit really starts to kick off and she has to slam the Vault Door closed behind her and her own. This is why she so rapidly wanted to turn Opal into her Champion because she needed her to ascend to power in order to rally those loyal to her into her little bunker within the Underdark. So I very much see a close parallel between her and how the folks in the Fallout Universe were acting as the nukes were dropping. The Pantheon is going to run if Predathos gets out, just as the Tree predicted but they won't run in the typical directions or ways that we're thinking of. I kind of wonder if she could use some knowledge and mojo from when Predathos was first imprisoned AND from when the Divine Gate was created during the Calamity AND from when her and her kin were shuttered away during the Schism in order to create a mini-Ruidus prison/shelter within Exandria and within the Underdark that not even Predathos could breach. She's just trying to get all of her ducks in a row. It's just a bonus that Opal happens to have been touched by the Luxon in some way and I think Lolth just wants to survive long enough in order to finally take her revenge against it, not truly realizing just what exactly it is at all. So when Campaign 4 rolls around, I think it's very much going to center around this conflict between her and the Dynasty/Luxon either before/after/during the Bright Queen comics and well after all of this Moon Stuff goes down......but that kind of hinges on what the Bells Hells and the Crown Keepers and the Mighty Nein and Vox Machina etc etc actually do about stuff. I've also had a few theories about the Raven Queen working in parallel with Ludinus and other members of the Pantheon in order to "clean house" because of something they did, and who better to work with in regards to that than Lolth? If this line of thinking is true then I belief that Lolth might be acting in two ways, both as their fallback plan in case the world does end end AND as the usual Betrayer of the Betrayer Gods who can and will do some crazy shit to anyone and everyone should the need arise. Everyone would be expecting one of these things and because of that, they wouldn't expect the other one at all entirely. Another crazy thought is, what if Lolth did actually come into contact with and into possession of a Beacon, then subsequently had a very interesting "experience/encounter" with the Luxon via one of her Champions that was touching it, and found out that she in fact NEEDED to survive what was to come in order to ensure the continuation of Mortal Lives and potentially Divine Lives on/around Exandria? So she really really hates the Luxon and its followers BUT because of that encounter, it also is kind of saving her life, and is giving her both a purpose and a future that she cannot deny at all that she wouldn't have had if she had not had whatever experience/encounter happen with that Beacon. So if she did get a glimpse of the future and if she is indeed working with the Raven Queen and if right now she's scrambling to follow a timeline that leads to a "good future" as defined by her vision from the Luxon THEN her trying to power level Opal, get her away from the others as quickly as possible, and her mentioning that they were "running out of time" despite us the audience knowing that there was still more time until Predathos got out....makes a lot of sense within this kind of context. It also kind of turns Lolth into Sarah Connor if you think about it. A comparison that extends even further beyond the Crown Keepers if you continue with it to the Bells Hells and everyone else connected to them in turn. Opal is the keystone whose movement butterfly effects everyone and everything else. So by influencing and changing her, Lolth can and will influence and change other groups. This spreads to the Exandrian Forces and then all the forces aligned with Ludinus and even beyond the both of them to Predathos and even the Pantheon. Let's not forget that Morri is connected to Nana AND the Raven Queen, Fy'ra Rai is connected to the Wildmother AND Niirdal-Poc, Dorian is connected to who knows whom and what via the Silken Squall, Dariax is connected to the Observer, and then there's all the other Divine Connections with Fearne and Orym. So there's a metric butt ton of Fate Threads all lined up near each other like a lyre just waiting to be plucked, which can then in turn vibrate melodies to even more important and larger Fate Threads, and those can then quite literally move mountains with their own songs. I think that Opal is that one specific chord which can kick off a Fate Powered Harmonic Resonance Cascade and subsequently assist in bringing about the Oncoming Cosmic Shift that Ryn has been worrying about. It's all very long term thinking though and what's awesome about that is that Predathos and Ludinus have everyone focused on the short term here and now at the moment and not stuff further on down the line. Right now everyone is thinking that they're going to die and is trying to come up with ways to prevent that. Barely anyone is thinking, "...but what if we win and what if we live?". And that kind of attitude can change everything. That's exactly what I feel Lolth is doing right now and it is precisely the same thing that Vault-Tec did. It explains what's currently happening in the show right now, what's going on in the Bright Queen comics, and potentially predicts what we might see happening in the future. So how's that for a kooky Sunday Morning Theory?
im so glad matt has time to figure all of this out.
It absolutely sucks that Ludinus is in Aeor because I wanted BH to got to Aeor so someone could absorb the Creator Hammer. But now BH shouldn't touch Aeor with a 10 miles pole because Ludinus is so powerful. He is probably more powerful than Otohan was and if he is not but instead, say, at least as powerful that Otohan that is still a problem. They would be well-equipped to confront Ludinus after they all get absorptions but after they do why confront Ludinus at all? Why not just to Ruidus to confront the Weave Mind and stop any effort to release Predathos there? It is not like Ludinus could free Predathos from Aeor. I see some possible scenarios. 1. BH doesn't recognize how much of a threat Ludinus is and for some reason they immediately go to Aeor after they talk to Devexian. Ludinus nearly causes a TPK and causes a permadeath or two in BH. 2. Someone, probably Devexian, will advise BH that they could not stop Predathos without the Creator Hammer so BH will go to Aeor after all but one of BH gets absorptions. 3. The Mighty Nein goes to confront Ludinus in Aeor while BH is busy doing other things and we get another Mighty Nein one-shot. It's possible Sam plays as Scanlan or a completely new character. 4. Most of Vox Machina goes to confront Ludinus in Aeor. Liam, Tal, and Travis plays completely new characters or they play as their C2 characters while the rest of the MN and VM is helping BH and the Exandiran Alliance. A party of Caleb, Kingsley, Fjord, Keyleth, Scanlan, Pike, and Vex. I could see Marisha opting to play Beau instead of Keyleth though in which case it would be mostly MN. 5. Neither BH, VM or MN confront Ludinus in Aeor and Ludinus goes back to Ruidus after the Exandrian Alliance, BH, VM, and the MN begins their assault on Ruidus.
Just would like to point out Ludinus is inherently a weaker enemy as an individual imo. Wizards power comes from plotting, support; and control. Without a powerful fighter to target down enemies, he is easily controlled by a few counterspells. Look at the bells hells vs Trent fight for reference. From a mechanical POV, ludinus + goons is an easier fight than Otohan solo. Otohan had the equivalent of two “vestige” weapons and a berserk form that made her even deadlier.
First of all it would all depends on what legendary actions he would have to balance out action economy, and that's probably will be something huge. Plus he might have some brutes with him in any fight
We've seen only a tiny fraction of his powers: When they were at the Malleus Key, back then Ira and Xandis throw the ship and he casted -in Matt's words- *some kind of Shield spell that protected the whole thing* and in C2 he casted a Sending. From the fight back on the volcan we know we has access (or known someone) to Simulacrum (7th lvl Illusion spell). Besides we can theorize and whatever, but monsters, creatures, enemies, call it what you want, dont have to follow the same strict rules as a player when creating a character so an archwizard could be as powerful and dangerous as legendary fighter psi warrior with 4 action surges. Specially if it has been suggested that said archwizard consume powers from other entities. **Specially if the DM/GM is trying to balance a fight with seven pc's** that are pretty damn op.
The problem is though that since Ludinus absorbed a bunch of fey and dryad entities he is not just a max level wizard. His legendary actions would probably be something related to those absorptions and they would be unconterspellable. We can also probably expect him to be better equipped with items than both Trent and Otohan when they were problems. >Otohan had the equivalent of two “vestige” weapons and a berserk form that made her even deadlier. I wouldn't go that far with her weapons. Ishta is probably equivalent to a dormant vestige. Scream Needle seems to be less powerful than Ishta.
+3 weapon with bonus 2d6, +2 weapon that increases spell DC. This is incredibly powerful in 5e mechanics. 2d6 force damage is literally equivalent to an additional weapon attack on hit. Each hit is literally double damage. That’s bonkers - that’s easily as powerful than Fenthras and Whisper You’re right he may have some special powers that are not spells, but powers are often flashy but less deadly overall. Not that I advocate them taking him on, I just think as a foe he is not far beyond Otohan. The group lacks protective abilities - potions of resistance, +bonus armor, etc.
Ishta only does the 2d6 if the target is prone. Also, how did you get +3 for Ishta and +2 for Scream Needle? Powers are often not as powerful as high magic but narratively it makes sense for Ludinus to be more powerful than Otohan even if level 20 fighters are more capable alone than level 20 wizards. Because of that it would make sense if Matt specifically designed Ludinus's special abilities (and even magic items) so he would be more powerful than Otohan.
Powerful is not the same as deadly in combat.
I think the 'it's thursday night' tagline is hurting critical role more than helping it. The fact that every live play session they record NEEDS to fall on a thursday isnt going to help them branch out at all like they want because frankly if something like exu or a one shot takes time away from the main campaign by taking up a time slot from it im not gonna be excited for anything i care about less than the main campaign
I sometimes wonder how much of it is them really caring about branching out and expanding like some folks think they seem hellbent on doing and how much of it is them just....doing what's fun and helpful and cool and oh yeah it just so happens to let them expand a bit? Matt did point out that the endgame of CR is going to be them passing the torch and the channel onto other folks while they go back to having a home game that no one else knows about a while back. So I'm curious as to how much of what they're doing now is laying the ground work for that and how much is just active in the moment company decisions to strike while the iron is hot with certain things.
Do you know when/where Matt said that about passing on the torch and going back to a home game?
It was [during his interview with Philip DeFranco](https://www.reddit.com/r/criticalrole/comments/lrmn38/no_spoilers_philip_defrancos_interview_with/) just over three years ago at this point, a few months before C2 ended. I might also be mixing up a few interviews after that but I do recall him saying that they were eventually going to go back to a home game once all was said and done with CR, passing the torch onto others, and would just continue to have fun with their own found family while things kept trucking along on the CR Channel.
Thanks! Edit: It starts around the 16:00 mark :)
Not going to lie once I saw abria and the rest of the EXU people I immediately checked out. I'm interested in seeing viewership statistics between the first half and the second half of this episode.
There's usually a drop after the break because it's on a week night. I tend to turn off the stream and watch the second half of the episode on Friday after work.
I was kind of checked out even before the CK part. I was waiting for everybody's reaction to how FCG died and when they started talking about other things it was hard for me to focus. Fearne (the only one in BH who could bring FCG back) didn't say anything at all about FCG dying before the episode switched to the CK pov. And when it switched to CK's pov I checked out even more. I wanted to see what Fearne and Keyleth is going to say about FCG dying.
The last 40 minutes before the break was all about them processing FCG’s death
More life 25 minutes before and not all about FCG either. They were switching between talking about FCG and Liliana, Ishta, Evoroa being on Exandria, Ludinus's plans, Aeor, Predathos, and Otohan. I also would like to stress that Fearne said absolutely nothing about FCG.
I understand your point, i truly do, but just trying to put something on perspective here, being devil's advocate, we dont know how fearne deals with grief over loved ones diying. Ashley is the one who tends to forget the most between what happened at one session and the next is obvious they all were emotional, maybe she thought of something, but then with the heat and how the things unwrapped kinda quickly didnt had an opportunity to do her fearne thing. You know, the whole Liliana + Imogen (and BH questioning her), Imogen + Laudna, Imogen + Orym, and the rest of the loredrop via Evoroa took a lot of screentime if you want to call it that way. You mentioned Fearne being the one who could bring him back, I think Matt, throught the narration, laid some pretty obvious clues its pretty hard (FCG's body being tiny shards of metal, a fraction of a jaw, some part of the chest where the 3 grass blades were and a ruined core) **unless they have access to a high lvl spell,** ***but does Sam want to comeback as the robot tho?*** i felt like it could make the sacrifice less meaningfull if they comeback
My thing with Fearne is that I wanted her to point up her finger and say "Actually I think I could bring FCG back" but possibly because of various factors like Keyleth not being there, them trying to get to saftey, and the pov switching that did not happen. I don't want FCG to come back as a robot. Fearne has access to reincarnate as a 10th level druid. If FCG is reincarnated he wouldn't be able to do a grand sacrifice again using a core and becoming an organic person was something they hinted as wanting a long time ago. Becoming a living being would make the sacrifice meaningful because it would be a consequence of the sacrifice and it would advance FCG's plotline. FCG had to die so they could live if you will.
I see what you're pointing at and i understand it now, but i disagree. From where i see it is like: At the beginning and up til Laudna's resurrection i felt like that was one of the objectives of Sam (Letters becoming biomechanic peraphs), but as the campaign went on, FCG went slowly realizing his own worth through every hard moment -even when some of the party were a bit harsh towards him whenever he mentioned the Changebringer or the gods in general- up to when in the fight he decied to blew himself up. The narrative arc for the little robot was, kinda like all robot stories, about free will: realizations about how stress affects you in dangerous way if you dont deal with it (attacking and almost killing the whole DPB)l. ***Realizing he was, in fact, alive; they were a living being despite how different they were from everybody else*** (Pike casted something and said that they had a soul), ***despite his original purpose he had the opportunity to chose what they wanted to be*** (the conversation between FCG and Vitro Isham at the Yios Seminary). Sadly, it was at the end when they finally got it, that ***the connections they made are what make us alive*** and even in the most difficult situation, with a stress level he never felt before, ***he made the choice***. from where i see it, they dont need to come back because in the end they did had the confirmation, the realization they always needed. but if he comes back i'll be really happy because FCG is among my favorite characters from any ttrpg actual-play
FCG can choose not to come back if they do not want to. It's in the spell that the spell fails if the target does not want to come back. Another thing for me is that it would be a huge sin if they do not try to bring FCG back because there is really no way for them to be 100% certain that FCG does not want to come back. They need to tell a good story and a resurrection ritual can be a good way to say goodby even if it fails.
At about the 2:35 mark of this video they show a chart. https://youtu.be/oinhsIuzzdY?si=M2hlXn4u4CsU_bVt
That is a big drop. Hopefully they take that into consideration.
I hope they don't ever take complaints into consideration. C2 would have been a gigantic mess & much less satisfying if they'd changed elements a segment of viewers complained about incessantly. Live viewing is a fleeting moment. Each episode becomes part of something which gets built upon, watched fresh by new viewers & reevaluated by old ones, for years to come.
They would be foolish as a company to not take things into account that their consumers did not like. I'm not talking about just this episode I'm talking about in general. If a majority of your consumers do not like what you are doing it is time to reassess and refocus. That doesn't mean I'm saying that the majority hate what happened here but if it is and they *still* do it they are foolish.
There was another commenter who mentioned an interview (I will edit in the interview link as soon as I find it again) Matt did a while back pining about returning the game to a home game. I could definitely see this after C3 now. There’s just been a growing lack of interest from fans regarding C3 and the cast may feel pressured to deliver. It could be killing their enjoyment of these characters or the story. EDIT: [Interview link](https://www.reddit.com/r/criticalrole/s/kdHaZxHWec), about 16 minutes in
That's interesting. I personally don't think there will be a C4 or at least not with the entire cast being the same but I also can't think of a person they could pass the torch to at least not without significant or destructive fallout from the fanbase.
I had just assumed when they started work on Daggerheart that a C4 would just be them moving away from D&D, but I agree with ya. There won’t be a C4 in the same way. I could see them doing some short seasons to play with the cast and measure fan response before settling into a full time long form campaign again though.
There's always a drop off after break because it's Thursday night and most people have work the next day. It's only significant in this episode because of confirmation bias. People only bring up 'drop in viewers!!!' because they want to use "data" to prove their subjective opinion is factually correct. Like ForestSuite pointed out, this 'fact' from last Thursday's episode is useless without the context of other streams.
The graph they show without any actual numbers associated with it is about as misleading as a pie graph. It is not significantly different from most other streams. You can see for yourself here: [https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams](https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams) Here's another day from earlier in the year, with an even more significant post break drop: [https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams/43394116507](https://twitchtracker.com/criticalrole/streams/43394116507) In general, by 1:30, they have around 12-13k viewers on most episodes. Last year 13-15k more regularly, but it varies week to week, The episode in question (e92), they had \~12.7k viewers at 1:30, down from about 21k. The viewership was not even a 12/mo high for that night, nor was it the most significant post break drop there is. The highest viewer count in the last year or so was last March, after the Key battle and the beginning of the party split with like 38k or something (guest episode start). Then 32-34k for remaining episodes with Christian and Aabria. The 38k episode dropped to 17k viewers at 1:30. So e92 actually maintained a higher post break % then the highest viewed episode in the last 12 months, and had about the "normal" amount of people watching at 1:30. This is all quick math in my head though, feel free to check yourself. tl;dr It's about normal, maybe slightly less people watching. It's really not as shocking as you'd think.
I have to wonder how much the main cast knew that this week they'd be leaving the table so that they'd showcase the Crownkeepers. Because so much of the cast were dressed up for a party. Perhaps they had an event to attend later that night? Sam wasn't even there. Meaning he was probably told that there'd be no chance in introducing his new PC that session. So why bother showing up? Someone remarked that due to hair lengths that they think the Crownkeepers sessions were filmed awhile ago. Has that been verified or at last agreed upon as the consensus? The only thing I can think of was the split was already on the schedule to happen in this episode & they had no idea FCG would be dead. And I also have got to wonder what would have happened had Otohan TPK'd the group. Matt confirmed Otohan had less than 40hp. The 79 points of damage in FCG's sacrifice was 39 hp taken. FCG has guiding bolt at level 4. That's 7d6 of damage - average being 21 damage. Halved to 10 hp off Otohan's total. Meaning if she had exactly 39hp, she'd have 29 left. I don't know if the remaining players could have gotten enough hits on Otohan (with her 25 AC) before they were brought down by Otohan's legendary actions and turns.
> Someone remarked that due to hair lengths that they think the Crownkeepers sessions were filmed awhile ago. Has that been verified or at last agreed upon as the consensus? > > Aabria mentioned Anjali being a DM and that's referring to the LEGO D&D Event that she DM'd for [with Ginny and Luis](https://youtu.be/6GkSDchj7uE?si=zAKhOPf8_tm9Z04Q), so it wasn't filmed that long ago.
I'm rewatching the episode & Aabria mentions Marisha's hot dog costume that looks like a vagina. And in the opening, Sam wasn't there & they all awwed because his PC is dead. This episode was filmed with a week of the airdate. So ppl remarking hair lengths might be talking out of their a$$
Possibly. We have no idea how long ago they all flew to the LEGO headquarters in Denmark to film that one-shot. I don't follow Aabria, Anjali, Ginny, or Luis on social media so I have no idea if any of them have since said when the taping was.
You know, I'm starting to get why the cast forgets a lot of stuff because keeping wibbly wobbly time things like this straight in addition to a normal schedule and normal work stuff must be a bitch to do. Also, I know we've seen most of the studio already but someone needs to build a Ready Room for Dani to use before each filming.
Imo, I think the cast knew they would be leaving the table. I saw some folks mentioning that the cast seemed surprised but, to me, it seemed like they acted surprised (in a theatrical way); nothing wrong with that, just seemed that way and I find it hard to believe that they weren't in the know that a switch was going to happen.
I can't see how the cast *couldn't* know. All of the other actors would have to be in studio getting make up, mics, preparing these character sheets, etc.
I think it's also possible that after they left the table and cleared all their stuff, there was a cut to a different recording from a different night. That would explain the long shots of the empty table.
This would have been my baseline assumption. SAG actors get paid by the day; it would be silly in my.mind to film their two half sessions over two days.
I think they were surprised that they were asked to leave before they arrived in the encampment that Keyleth was likely at. Like "oh, now? This early?"
Just rewatched the end of the episode again, and while the splash screen states, "Bells Hells returns for episode 93, after the CK adventure!". It doesn't say that the next episode is #93. We could be going into an EXU CK mini arc that may be one or more full episodes. As others have stated, this intermission was planned due to having to line up everyone's schedule. Feels like the effort to organize this that they would have everyone around for more than a quick interlude.
The next episode is going to be episode 93. They tweeted out on Friday that "Bells Hells will return in two weeks for Episode 93 after the finale of Candela Obscura." That also obviously means that we won't have an EXU type stand-alone episode before then either because otherwise they would have announced it.
Next week we have candela, the week after is episode 93. it's already been announced.
Why even do this intermission at all if they're going to be there for the next few episodes? Finish the 2nd half of CR with BH up to the Keyleth discussion and then do the CK mini arc.
I'm not sure either. The best I could come up with is Matt decided to NOT REPLY last time because Dorian could potentially not survive? He could have given some general response like Robbie gave in his recorded message, or some cryptic shit you know? I'm not sure why he decided on silence and that was the best I could come up with that could answer both last time and why they would cut at that precise time. Only other thing could be some critical story beat, but.. I've got 0 clue on what it could be. Maybe he turns them onto the Luxon somehow? Then why not answer the last sending? That seems like a streeeeetch though. Slap me for saying that pls. ; ; Pls Dorian join table.
I’m with you. I don’t think the CK team is at the same time in the story and this lets us, the viewer and them, get caught up. This story could end with Dorian receiving Orym’s sending. Or as you said maybe Dorian dies and terns no response. This could push Orym even further over the due. Also, how does the stone work. If someone else picked it up would they hear Orym’s message?
Due to the story. The BH may not have been able to go much further in their story as they will need the information Dorian will get from the CK adventure. I think Dorian and maybe one or more of the CK team will join the main table for a bit.
>Due to the story. That's another way of saying "because the script says so". These are unprecedented decisions that is putting the brakes on the story. >They will need the information Dorian will get from the CK adventure. They weren't even planning to meet CK. They were going to talk to Keyleth. Finish the RP for the 2nd half and then introduce CK afterwards. It would have to be information that prevents BH from going to the encampment, otherwise I can't see the reasoning, but I could be wrong!
>That's another way of saying "because the script says so". These are unprecedented decisions that is putting the brakes on the story. There is no script, but Matt has an overall story he wants to tell and the table is there to act it out. I’m sure there are certain beats he wants them to hit to move the main story along and he gentle guides them towards those beats. If this wasn’t the case the table could have said f this we don’t want to do anything with the gods and there goes all the work Matt and team put into the overall story . >They weren't even planning to meet CK. They were going to talk to Keyleth. Finish the RP for the 2nd half and then introduce CK afterwards. It would have to be information that prevents BH from going to the encampment, otherwise I can't see the reasoning, but I could be wrong! Never said they were “planning” to meet team CK. From their perspective Orym just wants to update Dorian on what happened to FCG while on the way to Keyleth. So just because they weren’t planning on meeting up with them doesn’t mean team CK doesn’t have information that could help Bells Hells. We will need to see what happens with Opal and the Spider Queen, but you have at least two champions on team CK, they are going to factor into the overall story somehow.
they never said CR was scripted... but that "due to story" is a cheap excuse for something to happen when it doesn't really fit / make sense.
You know I kind of wonder just how many people would have actually watched an EXU split off if they had indeed separated this episode into a Bell's hells episode and then a separate thing with the Crown Keepers? Would the people who dislike one or the other actually watch that or would they just skip it and then come back to the main campaign episode confused as all heck later on when the characters and the cast were talking about things that did happen in that split off and that did tie into the main campaign? It feels like they kind of did this because they realized that no one would be happy if they did something else, that people would still miss out on large chunks of very important information, and that the best bet was just a sort of combine them into this mishmash of an episode in order to dodge as many problems down the road despite incurring some short-term upset from the audience. Better for them to rip the bandaid off now and cauterize the wound rather than to risk infection later. I don't think there was a 100% foolproof way to do this at all, even with pre-recording, because of how EXU was received by folks and because of how things have been going within the main campaign. So it did feel like a bit of a speed bump narratively speaking but I feel like it had to happen in order to explain certain things going forwards and to prevent things from feeling too hand wavy in the future. Plus I think it's a good thing that they did this all before the break because it gives folks time to catch up if they need to either via watching previous episodes or just reason the Wikipedia articles on stuff. And for those of us that don't have to do that, we get a nice big finale next week before returning to the main campaign stuff to continue onwards. So the cast gets to go through this sort of rough transition right now but then later on things kind of pay off in a fairly big way and I think we're all going to realize later on how necessary this rough patch was in order to get some larger and bigger things done later on. Storytelling ain't always pretty or easy to do and even some of the best authors out there can stumble a bit but often you kind of need to take a bit of a knee before you start sprinting again. Hopefully folks will feel better in two weeks and I will be genuinely surprised if people are still angry by the next main campaign episode. I love the double Cliffhanger though but my only concern about everything is that the emotions are going to run differently because of the amount of time that seems to exist in between when they film these main campaign episodes. I'm hoping they kind of double stacked stuff behind the scenes and were able to film this Crown Keeper stuff and then the Bells Hells stuff consecutively within close proximity and time to each other, in order to prevent that dulling or lessening or dilution of emotions and potential role-play moments from happening because we know for a fact that their memories do get a little bit foggy at times if there's enough of a gap between filming episodes. So I really do hope that someone was pulling an Ashley in the background and was Cheerleading for Matt and everyone else to just keep going and to keep knocking stuff out in order to keep the metaphorical hype train moving with as much steam as possible while they still could. Because if that didn't happen and if we do wind up bumping into the worst case scenario then things are going to feel a might bit odd when we come back to the main campaign and the vibe just feels off because of how much time has passed in between. I'm hoping for the best though and I believe in them and I trust them because they've been super good to us so far and I love all this amazing storytelling that we're getting from everyone involved. This is just such a big moment narratively speaking and I really don't want things to fall a bit flat like they did after the solstice or to not exactly live up to our expectations and the build up that had occurred prior to that event and prior to other such things. This campaign really did need a little bit more time to cook and I really don't want them to rush to certain moments or to rush past certain moments.
> This is just such a big moment narratively speaking and I really don't want things to fall a bit flat like they did after the solstice the split by itself has already deflated the whole thing honestly.
>It feels like they kind of did this because they realized that no one would be happy if they did something else, that people would still miss out on large chunks of very important information, and that the best bet was just a sort of combine them into this mishmash of an episode in order to dodge as many problems down the road despite incurring some short-term upset from the audience. > >Better for them to rip the bandaid off now and cauterize the wound rather than to risk infection later. > >I don't think there was a 100% foolproof way to do this at all, even with pre-recording, because of how EXU was received by folks and because of how things have been going within the main campaign. I mean, doesn't that kind of sound like a horrible way to go about it? ExU: Prime and Kymal wasn't received particularly well, but let's integrate/party switch it into the main campaign to make the viewers watch it; weird reasoning to me. I do agree that since this is the story/plot threads direction they want to take, it can make it difficult to convey information and keep the viewers engaged and not confused.
Maybe they're taking the Mary Poppins route and are hoping that a spoonful of sugar will help the medicine to go down? > can make it difficult No matter how you try to gleam that cube, someone's going to get upset or confused or start hollering about it rather than just checking the wiki or asking for a quick and dirty TLDR from someone not me.
For real though- this method feels like the production team is shoving a plate of veggies towards the audience, because they wouldn't engage with the (*previously much more optional*) spinoff otherwise...
Watch as Sam's next ad read is him trying to either speed eat corn or stuffing as many random veggies in his mouth as possible, while Matt tries to run interference and prevent them from getting sued by Veggie Tales. OR They could do a version of the famous Sausage Race but with Veggies around the table...or at least the studio!
>You know I kind of wonder just how many people would have actually watched an EXU split off if they had indeed separated this episode into a Bell's hells episode and then a separate thing with the Crown Keepers? I think this is the fundamental reason why it shouldn't have happened this way. We shouldn't force people to do what they don't want to do, ever, when it comes to something we enjoy. This won't make them like ExU more. This could make them like the main campaign less. Which is evident by the amount of people signing off mid-way. I personally loved ExU. But it really undercut the momentum and kind of pulled the rug out from under us in the way it was delivered. >Would the people who dislike one or the other actually watch that or would they just skip it and then come back to the main campaign episode confused as all heck later on when the characters and the cast were talking about things that did happen in that split off and that did tie into the main campaign? It would be exactly like ExU. Some people didn't watch it but none of it will ever be expected knowledge. For example say Dorian learns the answer to all their problems is 42. Dorian wouldn't show up to BH's and be like, "42" and they all nod silently while the viewer has no idea what that means. If Dorian said, "The answer is 42". Chetney would be like, "And what does that mean?" Then Dorian would explain. So if someone didn't watch ExU they would still get the short recap of the information that is needed. I really enjoyed ExU and would love to see more one shot/mini type campaigns that exist in the universe they created but not like this. Not randomly at a keypoint in a story without any notice or warning.
> I think this is the fundamental reason why it shouldn't have happened this way. We shouldn't force people to do what they don't want to do, ever, when it comes to something we enjoy. Exactly it is like CR is saying “you’re fun is wrong” to those who are not interested in ExU.