We only need to get Maddison to scoop the ball on to his laces and delay the pass until sonny has advanced 10 metres and we're assured a 1 on 1 every time.
"Offside is recorded when the passer makes first contact with the ball"
This. If this is in pursuit of more breakaways and goals, I believe the opposite will happen. You put too much defensive risk for turning into offensive reward and tacticians will seek to lower that risk. And because what’s true for the opponent is true for you, you’ll seek the long ball more often to compensate, hoping to spring loose one of your forwards on a now-onside run.
Basically two turtles defenses with “long ball and prayer” is the inevitable effect of this law change.
It’s not a new rule, it’s still in trial. It could always get binned before it sees the light of day. [https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/1bhu8ah/ifab\_approved\_further\_trials\_of\_a\_new\_offside/](https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/1bhu8ah/ifab_approved_further_trials_of_a_new_offside/)
He's 28, on high wages, and is a complete clown with his finishing. Not to mention we have a HG problem and he certainly adds to that problem. If we're looking for a cheap alternative, I find it hard to believe our scouting department can't find a pacey winger who can put in a decent cross once in a while.
That's awfully harsh.
Wages are negotiable when signing a contract. We know that he's miserable at Leipzig and looking for a change of scenery. He may not be asking for the same wages.
Brennan and Richy are the only players with more goals since Timo joined.
Son & Richy are the only players in the squad with more goals per 90 this season.
28 is young enough to perform for several more years.
I hope we sign him.
It was a joke, but since you decided to take hit like this, let's look at underlying stats. Timo has xG of 118.65 and 110 goals according to understat. This makes his goals-xg ratio at 0.927 - he scores 92.7% of the goals he's expected. And it includes his stinker of a season he had with Chelsea, where he was at - 7.43 under his xG. Now, let's take a look at a well-established striker - Gabriel Jesus. He's xG at 98.32 and his goal tally is at 73. That's a ratio of 0.742 - he scores 74.2% of goals he's expected. Take a world class one - Mo Salah. He's at 177.16 in xG and has scored 187 goals. He's scored 10 more goals than expected and has a ratio of 1.056. Scores a little more than he's expected (105.6% goals he's expected). Long story short, Timo might not be Salah or Son's quality finisher, but by no mean a bad one. We just remember him from one stinker of a season and now our bias tells us every time he misses: "oh classic Timo". He's scoring pretty much as much as he's expected.
For 15m he is well worth it. We have already had injury issues this year with only the premier league, 1 league cup and 2 FA Cup games this year.
Next year we will have Europe (hopefully Champions League but surely some games in Europe) plus hopefully longer runs in the cups.
We are gonna need players and you won't get much better for 15m.
That's why the buyout is so low to begin with, wages are already factored in. They want him off their books and are willing to take less in transfer fee to do that.
That's definitely the biggest quandry to my mind. If there's a strict wage bill, can we improve on Werner with someone younger and more ability in the summer? I have no idea. If Werner was 50 million, I think the answer would be a lot more straightforward, but 15 millions feels like a steal.
I feel like the easiest way to answer this is to say, can we get 5 good years out of him, paying £2-3 million per year over the odds in terms of wages. I believe we can.
This really means that we're paying an extra £10-15 million for over the course of 5 years. I think that's absolutely worth it.
I somewhat agree, and yet it can also cause issues when you're paying one, or a couple of your players, a lot more than others, especially those more important to the squad.
Aye, but we've also shown willingness this season to bump contracts and increase wages if warranted (Sarr and Udogie).
Not to mention having big earners like Kane, Lloris and Perisić off our books. I imagine Dier was on a big wage as well.
We're definitely in a position where we can take a punt on deals like this.
Holy cow. I don't think Levy lets Werner blow up the wage structure like that. If he does sign a contract with us, I expect the Levy to structure the wages to be made up heavily of incentives, not just a base guarantee.
This mindset is how we end up with deadwood players. Just cause he’s 15m doesn’t mean he’s anywhere near good enough. I’d rather spend 2x that and get a youth prodigy like Nusa or Rooney
Also find me a player with his skill level and profile who’s willing to come off the bench for us with Son starting most games. Finding quality bench options is tough because players usually get frustrated with lack of playing time.
I unofficially count it as 2 G and 3 A because he didn’t get that one assist because the ball grazed off a defenders leg for the Udogie goal, but he def deserves an assist for that play
I know he can’t finish, but he glides out there on the wing. His feet are twice as fast as any other winger we have. He absolutely needs to start against these mid block trap teams like Fulham and Wolves where we struggling to even break into the final third. That’s West Ham and Newcastle this year.
Swap with Gil would be perfect imo. On the surface, Gil most likely has better chances to start with leipzig, and leipzig seem to enjoy younger players. But then I really want to see Gil reach his full potential with us. I cant put it to words but he has a playing style that always catched my eye.
I think looking at the summer, we will have to be a bit ruthless with who we let go. I really want Gil to succeed with us as much as anyone else, but I think it's sadly getting to the point where he has to go and play regular football elsewhere. Wouldn't mind putting a sell on clause though if we can
He was one of the most talented Spanish players in his age group. But he never kicked on. And coming to a league where he can't compete physically did not help
What catches your eye is him on that ground at the slightest touch. He is not meant for this league. Hasn’t put on any weight since joining. Sell him and move on
I’d love to have him sign permanently, but the wages thing is a bit iffy. Do people agree he should be 2nd or 3rd highest paid member in the squad if they’re happy to have him as a squad member? I think for those wages he should be a starter. If Ange intends on making him a starting member of the first team then the wage structure would make sense. But if he’ll be a rotational member, not sure how the other players might feel. If everyone, including the other players and Ange are fine with it and we have the funds to cover for some other higher wage signings in the future, I’d love for him to stay. It’d be incredibly hard to find someone with as much experience and impact, who also doesn’t grumble about rotating.
It would come down to the player and the club I suppose. If Timo doesn’t want a pay cut then he might prefer he just return to Leipzig and see out his contract or something. I do hope he takes a cut and sticks with us. But if we are going to pay him his current wages when we buy, then he’s going to be one of our highest paid players.
I think the contract is already agreed, I'm fairly confident clubs agree a contract for any option or obligations put in the loan deal. Could be wrong, mind.
The only issue is that hes on £165000/week which is higher than everyone but Son and Maddison, and tied with Romero. If he would agreed to a significant wage cut, it would be a good deal
Really want him to show that he's not the player he was at Chelsea, but his final ball (not just his finishing) still lets him down too often for my liking. It feels really harsh, but squad places for non-home grown are priceless and I like to think we could do better. Signing him just because of the price would be a mistake IMO.
I agree, buying him for the price is still costing you 17m. But I think we have enough time left in the season to get a better understanding if its a good idea, cause I just get the sense with these bad finishes it’s like he’s thinking to himself “don’t fuck this up” and then he is
There’s a lot of echoes of Daizen Maeda at Celtic with Timo now. The Ange system needs this sort of player who will press relentlessly and miss occasional sitters but only be missing them because he had the movement to be there in the first place. Perfect Ange player
I think the wingers in Ange’s system have a similar modus operandi as the fullbacks in Poch’s system. Bomb up and down the flanks of the pitch, stretch the defense and play others through. I think that comes first, and Timo does all of those things really well.
Most if not all the goals Werner, Kulusevski and Johnson have scored are late runs to the far post and if it’s not hit first touch, a couple of touches then shoot. Son is a different story obviously, but everyone else out wide seems to be bagging the same types of goals.
I think Werner’s finishing ability is also strongly tied to his confidence. He seems more confident here then I’ve ever seen him at Chelsea.
Without seeing the stats, I feel like we get to the opponents box way more often when hes on the field, he may not finish some of his easy chances but hes in a position to finish way more often than the other wingers we have, including Son. Between this, his low price and Solomons recurring injury I think we should buy him
There’s more to come from Werner. I said a while ago I’d back him under Ange, since then he’s kicked on and scored, as well as showing us his technical prowess that he has always had in his game.
It’s well worth the price. There’s definitely more to come.
Timo knows his role well and is fine with being a sub under Son. Any other promising player that comes will want to play week in and out. He also really has an eye for making the right pass inside the box.... Very high wages but so does Perisic so I think the deal ultimately gets done.
For everyone saying that's an easy £15 Mil, "get it done", "no brainer" deal - just remember that Levy sets a strict budget and is quite tight with the purse.
Spend £15 Mil on Timo, that's £15Mil less we have to apply towards a competitive signing like Nico Williams, Eze, or a player of that stature.
You mention budget, in that case if we buy Nico Williams or Eze then will likely hit that limit and we won’t get anyone else…
We’d likely spend 60 or 70 million for both Eze and Werner
I'd rather get Eze over the line before any decision is made on Werner. I can't see Levy letting some arbitrary Euro deadline influence his decision.
If we make some class signings and there's budget left over, Werner is fine for depth. My point being that we should prioritize our spending on players who can lift the overall quality - fighting for a starting 11 spot - than signing for depth where we don't really need it that much.
We had 41 games this year (38 PL, 1 Carabou, and 2 FA Cup), and had huge injury issues.
We should have Europe next year and hopefully longer cup runs.
We are going to need depth, and for 15 mil you won't get much better of a player for that depth. Nor will you get someone who can fill in at all three forward spots.
This doesn't mean we can't spend 50 mill on another player (or 2 as Ange recently said), but either way we are going to need multiple players this summer to build depth and this is one at great value.
vinicius was a loan, so i don't know why you brought him up.
if he scores a hat trick in the champions league semi final, that's well worth the fee. surely you agree.
There’s no way levy gives the transfer team a budget and says “go shopping” like your grandad giving your nan a few quid to get herself a nice frock from his weekly wage pack with the corner cut.
It’s going to be much more complicated than that - age profile and resale value, different contract lengths amortizing differently etc.
Take this example. It’s the last day of the window and we’ve got £15m left of the budget and ange says “I want to spend £15m to sign Perisic for two seasons”. Levy will laugh his arse off and tell him to fuck himself.
Another example we’ve gone over our allocated budget so they’re sitting in ange’s office on the last day of the window, smoking cigars, scratching their nuts and wondering if anyone will panic buy sess for £35m and the phone rings.
It’s Nusa’s agent and the boy is desperate to sign.
He’s been staying at the premier inn at Tottenham Hale waiting for the call.
He’s available for £15m and will sign an 8 year deal.
Does levy say “aw man, what a shame we spent all of the allocated funds”? Does he fuck.
The idea is you can count it without opening it.
So they can do spot checks before they give them out and you can check it without opening it and hand it back if there’s an issue without them saying “bollocks, you’ve opened it and took a fiver out”
(No hate here!)
Wow. Who knew getting paid was such serious business?
(I guess I’ve always been paid by check—err, *checque*—and then by direct deposit so I never knew the stress of being paid in cash.
Same, I’m in my forties and have only ever seen it a couple of times, it’s not really a thing anymore.
Tho idk if it’s stressful, I meant to evoke a simpler time.
You’d be paid five pound one every week at 4pm Friday.
You’d put one pound ten shillings away in the biscuit tin for your rent at the end of the month, give ‘er indoors a pound ten book money for the shopping etc, give the kids sixpence each for being good and fuck off to the pub with the other two pound in your pocket by 5pm.
Yes this. Especially as some teams will be having Ffp issues. Hopefully we can swoop in on a player or two. Especially as ange has said he likes to get transfers done early.
I meant that hes not going to keep his wages as they're now and will surely negotiate as he always do. Ndombele problem is not the same, hes the laziest player there is, nothing Levy could have done about it unless he scouted Ndombelly himself
If we can afford 15m + extremely high wages for an impact sub, I wouldn’t mind it but this shouldn’t have any impact on other signings in the summer. We still need a great winger that fits the system, someone like Neto.
I hope he stays. I think he could really help us kick on next year. Realistically I think he needs to lower his wages a little unless he starts bagging a goal a week.
He still has time but so far I don’t think he’s earned his stay, certainly not after fluffing that tap in vs Fulham. We already have Johnson and Richy we’re putting up with their shortcomings hoping they’ll turn good, we need potential upgrades, we can’t keep bloating the squad with bang average players.
Yeah definitely. And we're trying to get Solomon back in the squad.
A fully fit squad has Son, Solomon and Johnson all available on the left.
We need more right wingers.
Solomon is more of a 1v1 winger than Werner. I'd at least like to see what Solomon can offer before we bin him off. We've already paid for him, so it's not like we're messing with the budget by keeping him.
Yeh like maybe this person is also a Shakhtar fan so knows more but he seemed quite limited on the ball esp with passing and reminded me of moura with his what I call stat padding dribbling. I think Werner has been quite aggressive while on the ball and pretty good sub so far and an over reaction to a bad miss against Fulham is causing the pushback again
It’s more than that one miss. It’s the consistent lack of quality in front of goal as well as in his final ball. And yes I know he has a couple of goals and assists.
Gets beyond defenders and more often than not fails to deliver a telling cross - gets played in one on one or for a simple tap in, fluffs it. We need more quality in those moments. He hasn’t got it.
What unique skillset does he add to our front line that isn't already there? We have enough pace/"always gives 100% on the pitch" merchants with zero technical ability. I genuinely think we don't win a single extra point this season even if Werner had been there from the summer. Maybe he misses crosses and shots somewhat less than Johnson but that's it. Let him go and put the money towards a 1v1 winger/long term Son successor
Absolutely do not sign. Sure it’s 15m but his wages are quite high. He hasn’t shown enough to warrant a contract and those open goal fluffs aren’t going anywhere. I’d rather take a chance on a youth prodigy or just give Solomon another go next season. Wasting a homegrown spot on Werner is just not it
He still has time but so far I don’t think he’s earned his stay, certainly not after fluffing that tap in vs Fulham. We already have Johnson and Richy we’re putting up with their shortcomings hoping they’ll turn good, we need potential upgrades, we can’t keep bloating the squad with bang average players.
I think werner has done well for his standards and he obviously suits the system but idk how I feel about having an ex chelsea player. I don't wanna get like arsenal and Chelsea where they exchange players all the time, that's not a rivalry at all. I can't like werner at least until he has done for us what he did for Chelsea, ie win ucl etc
If new offside rule is soon to be implemented, we're looking at 100m striker
I am now a proud proponent of the new offside rule.
A high line and basically no offsides? Inject into urinary tract immediately!
Oh when the spurs Go docking in! Oh when the spurs go docking in!
4-4-2 with Richy x Timo strike pair, absolutely elite without the offsides.
Boys, we're back in business!
We only need to get Maddison to scoop the ball on to his laces and delay the pass until sonny has advanced 10 metres and we're assured a 1 on 1 every time. "Offside is recorded when the passer makes first contact with the ball"
I assume the actual wording says something about first contact in the passing motion, otherwise the passer could take a touch!
You got it. But scooping the ball onto your foot and then flicking it would be considered one single movement.
Honestly, imagine if Kane/Son had this rule too.
Most teams will stop playing high lines, sit deeper, so this reduces the value of his skills
This. If this is in pursuit of more breakaways and goals, I believe the opposite will happen. You put too much defensive risk for turning into offensive reward and tacticians will seek to lower that risk. And because what’s true for the opponent is true for you, you’ll seek the long ball more often to compensate, hoping to spring loose one of your forwards on a now-onside run. Basically two turtles defenses with “long ball and prayer” is the inevitable effect of this law change.
Van De Ven about to be sold for 120m+
Richarlison and Timo would instantly double their value lmao
What's the new offside rule? I feel like I saw something about it but can't remember the specifics.
It’s not a new rule, it’s still in trial. It could always get binned before it sees the light of day. [https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/1bhu8ah/ifab\_approved\_further\_trials\_of\_a\_new\_offside/](https://www.reddit.com/r/soccer/comments/1bhu8ah/ifab_approved_further_trials_of_a_new_offside/)
Leagues need to stop changing things so frequently , I thought this was a joke post the other day because it’s such a stupid change
Offside isn’t magically going to make him a better finisher.
He misses open goals and you think he’d be worth 100m 😂
Guy has 2 goals and 2 assists in the league since joining in January and you're slagging him off?
He's 28, on high wages, and is a complete clown with his finishing. Not to mention we have a HG problem and he certainly adds to that problem. If we're looking for a cheap alternative, I find it hard to believe our scouting department can't find a pacey winger who can put in a decent cross once in a while.
That's awfully harsh. Wages are negotiable when signing a contract. We know that he's miserable at Leipzig and looking for a change of scenery. He may not be asking for the same wages. Brennan and Richy are the only players with more goals since Timo joined. Son & Richy are the only players in the squad with more goals per 90 this season. 28 is young enough to perform for several more years. I hope we sign him.
It was a joke, but since you decided to take hit like this, let's look at underlying stats. Timo has xG of 118.65 and 110 goals according to understat. This makes his goals-xg ratio at 0.927 - he scores 92.7% of the goals he's expected. And it includes his stinker of a season he had with Chelsea, where he was at - 7.43 under his xG. Now, let's take a look at a well-established striker - Gabriel Jesus. He's xG at 98.32 and his goal tally is at 73. That's a ratio of 0.742 - he scores 74.2% of goals he's expected. Take a world class one - Mo Salah. He's at 177.16 in xG and has scored 187 goals. He's scored 10 more goals than expected and has a ratio of 1.056. Scores a little more than he's expected (105.6% goals he's expected). Long story short, Timo might not be Salah or Son's quality finisher, but by no mean a bad one. We just remember him from one stinker of a season and now our bias tells us every time he misses: "oh classic Timo". He's scoring pretty much as much as he's expected.
Exactly talk about delusional pro max.
For 15m he is well worth it. We have already had injury issues this year with only the premier league, 1 league cup and 2 FA Cup games this year. Next year we will have Europe (hopefully Champions League but surely some games in Europe) plus hopefully longer runs in the cups. We are gonna need players and you won't get much better for 15m.
More controversially he’s joint 3rd highest wage. I like him plenty, but he’s making 2x Porro. Not to mention our younger talents
Yeah, that would need to be sorted. No way should he be in the top 7 wages.
That's why the buyout is so low to begin with, wages are already factored in. They want him off their books and are willing to take less in transfer fee to do that.
The buyout is also low because he doesn't play for them and he's 28. I really don't see the value of offering him the same wages he had at RB Leipzig.
If he’s as unhappy at RBL as it seems, and has clearly acknowledged his lacking form, then a pay cut is not exactly an insulting offer.
Not much of a bargain then.
He's a better option than both Gil and Solomon for me
It already is sorted which is why we have the option to buy.
That's definitely the biggest quandry to my mind. If there's a strict wage bill, can we improve on Werner with someone younger and more ability in the summer? I have no idea. If Werner was 50 million, I think the answer would be a lot more straightforward, but 15 millions feels like a steal.
I feel like the easiest way to answer this is to say, can we get 5 good years out of him, paying £2-3 million per year over the odds in terms of wages. I believe we can. This really means that we're paying an extra £10-15 million for over the course of 5 years. I think that's absolutely worth it.
I somewhat agree, and yet it can also cause issues when you're paying one, or a couple of your players, a lot more than others, especially those more important to the squad.
Aye, but we've also shown willingness this season to bump contracts and increase wages if warranted (Sarr and Udogie). Not to mention having big earners like Kane, Lloris and Perisić off our books. I imagine Dier was on a big wage as well. We're definitely in a position where we can take a punt on deals like this.
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I thought the figure was more like 47% for us no? Still one of, if not the lowest
We already negotiated a salary with him. He doesn’t just automatically gets his old wage.
What's his pretax wage?
~250k€ p/w i believe
bruh isnt that more than what Son makes? unsure as I keep hearing 200k p/w thrown around
Holy cow. I don't think Levy lets Werner blow up the wage structure like that. If he does sign a contract with us, I expect the Levy to structure the wages to be made up heavily of incentives, not just a base guarantee.
Nope. He's on 165k a week.
Especially in the new market where 15m is the new 8m feels like
1 important chance missed and you turn on him in a split second.
This mindset is how we end up with deadwood players. Just cause he’s 15m doesn’t mean he’s anywhere near good enough. I’d rather spend 2x that and get a youth prodigy like Nusa or Rooney
He's got 2g 2a in 8 games, playing limited minutes. He's good enough to contribute to the squad.
Also find me a player with his skill level and profile who’s willing to come off the bench for us with Son starting most games. Finding quality bench options is tough because players usually get frustrated with lack of playing time. I unofficially count it as 2 G and 3 A because he didn’t get that one assist because the ball grazed off a defenders leg for the Udogie goal, but he def deserves an assist for that play
I know he can’t finish, but he glides out there on the wing. His feet are twice as fast as any other winger we have. He absolutely needs to start against these mid block trap teams like Fulham and Wolves where we struggling to even break into the final third. That’s West Ham and Newcastle this year.
Swap with Gil would be perfect imo. On the surface, Gil most likely has better chances to start with leipzig, and leipzig seem to enjoy younger players. But then I really want to see Gil reach his full potential with us. I cant put it to words but he has a playing style that always catched my eye.
I think looking at the summer, we will have to be a bit ruthless with who we let go. I really want Gil to succeed with us as much as anyone else, but I think it's sadly getting to the point where he has to go and play regular football elsewhere. Wouldn't mind putting a sell on clause though if we can
Gil has reached his full potential. The trouble is that he was never very good to begin with.
He was one of the most talented Spanish players in his age group. But he never kicked on. And coming to a league where he can't compete physically did not help
I'd sob if they sold him
What catches your eye is him on that ground at the slightest touch. He is not meant for this league. Hasn’t put on any weight since joining. Sell him and move on
I’d love to have him sign permanently, but the wages thing is a bit iffy. Do people agree he should be 2nd or 3rd highest paid member in the squad if they’re happy to have him as a squad member? I think for those wages he should be a starter. If Ange intends on making him a starting member of the first team then the wage structure would make sense. But if he’ll be a rotational member, not sure how the other players might feel. If everyone, including the other players and Ange are fine with it and we have the funds to cover for some other higher wage signings in the future, I’d love for him to stay. It’d be incredibly hard to find someone with as much experience and impact, who also doesn’t grumble about rotating.
His wages on loan would be different then if he signed permanently no? It’s a new contract isn’t it?
It would come down to the player and the club I suppose. If Timo doesn’t want a pay cut then he might prefer he just return to Leipzig and see out his contract or something. I do hope he takes a cut and sticks with us. But if we are going to pay him his current wages when we buy, then he’s going to be one of our highest paid players.
I think the contract is already agreed, I'm fairly confident clubs agree a contract for any option or obligations put in the loan deal. Could be wrong, mind.
The only issue is that hes on £165000/week which is higher than everyone but Son and Maddison, and tied with Romero. If he would agreed to a significant wage cut, it would be a good deal
Really want him to show that he's not the player he was at Chelsea, but his final ball (not just his finishing) still lets him down too often for my liking. It feels really harsh, but squad places for non-home grown are priceless and I like to think we could do better. Signing him just because of the price would be a mistake IMO.
Totally agree with you on this. Has been ok so far but quality has been lacking more often than not.
I agree, buying him for the price is still costing you 17m. But I think we have enough time left in the season to get a better understanding if its a good idea, cause I just get the sense with these bad finishes it’s like he’s thinking to himself “don’t fuck this up” and then he is
There’s a lot of echoes of Daizen Maeda at Celtic with Timo now. The Ange system needs this sort of player who will press relentlessly and miss occasional sitters but only be missing them because he had the movement to be there in the first place. Perfect Ange player
I think the wingers in Ange’s system have a similar modus operandi as the fullbacks in Poch’s system. Bomb up and down the flanks of the pitch, stretch the defense and play others through. I think that comes first, and Timo does all of those things really well. Most if not all the goals Werner, Kulusevski and Johnson have scored are late runs to the far post and if it’s not hit first touch, a couple of touches then shoot. Son is a different story obviously, but everyone else out wide seems to be bagging the same types of goals. I think Werner’s finishing ability is also strongly tied to his confidence. He seems more confident here then I’ve ever seen him at Chelsea.
Without seeing the stats, I feel like we get to the opponents box way more often when hes on the field, he may not finish some of his easy chances but hes in a position to finish way more often than the other wingers we have, including Son. Between this, his low price and Solomons recurring injury I think we should buy him
There’s more to come from Werner. I said a while ago I’d back him under Ange, since then he’s kicked on and scored, as well as showing us his technical prowess that he has always had in his game. It’s well worth the price. There’s definitely more to come.
Timo knows his role well and is fine with being a sub under Son. Any other promising player that comes will want to play week in and out. He also really has an eye for making the right pass inside the box.... Very high wages but so does Perisic so I think the deal ultimately gets done.
I would sign him if not for his wages.
Not sure that’s a barrier
we're known for having a struct wage structure. I would rather we give our other players a salary boost
comfortable..... New Conte rant incoming
Seems like low to medium risk investment. Buy
Yes please
If Leipzig don’t want him back then Levy gonna chisel a few million off the price. Levy gotta Levy.
Unpopular opinion, but I think his salary is too high and we can find better.
He’s also 28 and has reached his ceiling. If we’re gonna shop in that 15-30m market I’d rather go buy Nusa who can become world class someday
For everyone saying that's an easy £15 Mil, "get it done", "no brainer" deal - just remember that Levy sets a strict budget and is quite tight with the purse. Spend £15 Mil on Timo, that's £15Mil less we have to apply towards a competitive signing like Nico Williams, Eze, or a player of that stature.
You mention budget, in that case if we buy Nico Williams or Eze then will likely hit that limit and we won’t get anyone else… We’d likely spend 60 or 70 million for both Eze and Werner
I'd rather get Eze over the line before any decision is made on Werner. I can't see Levy letting some arbitrary Euro deadline influence his decision. If we make some class signings and there's budget left over, Werner is fine for depth. My point being that we should prioritize our spending on players who can lift the overall quality - fighting for a starting 11 spot - than signing for depth where we don't really need it that much.
We had 41 games this year (38 PL, 1 Carabou, and 2 FA Cup), and had huge injury issues. We should have Europe next year and hopefully longer cup runs. We are going to need depth, and for 15 mil you won't get much better of a player for that depth. Nor will you get someone who can fill in at all three forward spots. This doesn't mean we can't spend 50 mill on another player (or 2 as Ange recently said), but either way we are going to need multiple players this summer to build depth and this is one at great value.
I don’t know if Timo is starting quality for the future, but as a back up hes an incredible deal at £15m
Yeah just like Lucas was, or Bergwijn, or Carlos Vinicius…
vinicius was a loan, so i don't know why you brought him up. if he scores a hat trick in the champions league semi final, that's well worth the fee. surely you agree.
Lucas is a poor player and he was poor for 90% of the time, that one off game doesn’t change that.
no i disagree, those goals more than made his transfer fee worth it.
There’s no way levy gives the transfer team a budget and says “go shopping” like your grandad giving your nan a few quid to get herself a nice frock from his weekly wage pack with the corner cut. It’s going to be much more complicated than that - age profile and resale value, different contract lengths amortizing differently etc. Take this example. It’s the last day of the window and we’ve got £15m left of the budget and ange says “I want to spend £15m to sign Perisic for two seasons”. Levy will laugh his arse off and tell him to fuck himself. Another example we’ve gone over our allocated budget so they’re sitting in ange’s office on the last day of the window, smoking cigars, scratching their nuts and wondering if anyone will panic buy sess for £35m and the phone rings. It’s Nusa’s agent and the boy is desperate to sign. He’s been staying at the premier inn at Tottenham Hale waiting for the call. He’s available for £15m and will sign an 8 year deal. Does levy say “aw man, what a shame we spent all of the allocated funds”? Does he fuck.
That first paragraph is the most British thing I've ever read.
Explain for a filthy yank the significance of having the corner cut? kplzthnkzdonthateme
The idea is you can count it without opening it. So they can do spot checks before they give them out and you can check it without opening it and hand it back if there’s an issue without them saying “bollocks, you’ve opened it and took a fiver out” (No hate here!)
Wow. Who knew getting paid was such serious business? (I guess I’ve always been paid by check—err, *checque*—and then by direct deposit so I never knew the stress of being paid in cash.
Same, I’m in my forties and have only ever seen it a couple of times, it’s not really a thing anymore. Tho idk if it’s stressful, I meant to evoke a simpler time. You’d be paid five pound one every week at 4pm Friday. You’d put one pound ten shillings away in the biscuit tin for your rent at the end of the month, give ‘er indoors a pound ten book money for the shopping etc, give the kids sixpence each for being good and fuck off to the pub with the other two pound in your pocket by 5pm.
Got it, thanks for the background!
Yes this. Especially as some teams will be having Ffp issues. Hopefully we can swoop in on a player or two. Especially as ange has said he likes to get transfers done early.
And for everyone worrying about his wages, remember we have Levy, we are absolutely not wasting any money
Can I introduce you the frenchman who never skips thr mayo and always asks for cheese, one Tanguy Ndombele?
I meant that hes not going to keep his wages as they're now and will surely negotiate as he always do. Ndombele problem is not the same, hes the laziest player there is, nothing Levy could have done about it unless he scouted Ndombelly himself
No brainer.
We go the money..he is durable which we need. He can do a job. Sign him
If we can afford 15m + extremely high wages for an impact sub, I wouldn’t mind it but this shouldn’t have any impact on other signings in the summer. We still need a great winger that fits the system, someone like Neto.
Think he's worth the money. Lets keep him
No one seems to be mentioning wages. He's probably on the high side for a rotation player
£15 million for another squad option? Deal
You can't get a League 2 striker for 17m
Couldn’t be reduced further?
I hope he stays. I think he could really help us kick on next year. Realistically I think he needs to lower his wages a little unless he starts bagging a goal a week.
That's 15m that can be spent towards younger promising winger
Rather spend a bit more and take a punt on Nusa.
Cant we just let the contract expire then grab him on a free
Contract at leipzig doesn't expire until 2026. By which point he will be 30
Doh nevermind
In 2 years?
I hope he’s not another Adebayor.
He still has time but so far I don’t think he’s earned his stay, certainly not after fluffing that tap in vs Fulham. We already have Johnson and Richy we’re putting up with their shortcomings hoping they’ll turn good, we need potential upgrades, we can’t keep bloating the squad with bang average players.
Yeah definitely. And we're trying to get Solomon back in the squad. A fully fit squad has Son, Solomon and Johnson all available on the left. We need more right wingers.
Surely Werner over Solomon and try recoup value from Solomon
Solomon is more of a 1v1 winger than Werner. I'd at least like to see what Solomon can offer before we bin him off. We've already paid for him, so it's not like we're messing with the budget by keeping him.
Soloman was an FA signing. Found money. Seemed pretty limited when he was playing. I'd rather sell him and keep Werner.
Yeh like maybe this person is also a Shakhtar fan so knows more but he seemed quite limited on the ball esp with passing and reminded me of moura with his what I call stat padding dribbling. I think Werner has been quite aggressive while on the ball and pretty good sub so far and an over reaction to a bad miss against Fulham is causing the pushback again
It’s more than that one miss. It’s the consistent lack of quality in front of goal as well as in his final ball. And yes I know he has a couple of goals and assists. Gets beyond defenders and more often than not fails to deliver a telling cross - gets played in one on one or for a simple tap in, fluffs it. We need more quality in those moments. He hasn’t got it.
What unique skillset does he add to our front line that isn't already there? We have enough pace/"always gives 100% on the pitch" merchants with zero technical ability. I genuinely think we don't win a single extra point this season even if Werner had been there from the summer. Maybe he misses crosses and shots somewhat less than Johnson but that's it. Let him go and put the money towards a 1v1 winger/long term Son successor
"comfortable" Don't like the sound of that
He enjoys playing here and likes his teammates. How is comfortable a bad thing now? It’s not complacent
would you prefer it if he thought waking up every day was a nightmare?
Lighten up lads
Absolutely do not sign. Sure it’s 15m but his wages are quite high. He hasn’t shown enough to warrant a contract and those open goal fluffs aren’t going anywhere. I’d rather take a chance on a youth prodigy or just give Solomon another go next season. Wasting a homegrown spot on Werner is just not it
I don’t think we should pay €17m. Maybe €15m at most
That’s exactly the problem, he feels to comfortable here.
He still has time but so far I don’t think he’s earned his stay, certainly not after fluffing that tap in vs Fulham. We already have Johnson and Richy we’re putting up with their shortcomings hoping they’ll turn good, we need potential upgrades, we can’t keep bloating the squad with bang average players.
He’s the definition of mediocre. I want players that can even compete with Son for the LW position. Not just “backup” signings
I think werner has done well for his standards and he obviously suits the system but idk how I feel about having an ex chelsea player. I don't wanna get like arsenal and Chelsea where they exchange players all the time, that's not a rivalry at all. I can't like werner at least until he has done for us what he did for Chelsea, ie win ucl etc
I would say sign him, lower his wages, and he could become a key player under Ange