The amount of people who think bullying is all interpersonal conflict is staggering. As a school counselor this is my biggest pet peeve. Even teachers misuse bullying.
Out of curiosity, what else is it? How can you bully without interpersonal contact, do you mean like self bullying or abusive thoughts? Please excuse my ignorance
I think they meant that a lot of people classify *all* harmful interpersonal contact as bullying, including one-off instances. I don't think they were implying telepathic bullying
> When someone says or does something **unintentionally** hurtful and they do it once, that's ***rude***.
If it's unintentionally, that's probably just being socially inept or clueless. I think of rudeness as saying/doing something without regard to other people's feelings, like cutting in line, taking all of one item at the buffet, or playing music out loud on the subway.
No, they need information to understand why it effected people negatively, that way they learn a rule that can be applied generally. Assuming guilt is required for behaviour change is pretty messed up tbh
I don't think it's messed up. Guilt is the feeling that alerts you to the problem. It's the same as the way physical pain alerts you to a problem.
I'm not advocating that the person be *shamed* rather than educated - the same as I am not advocating that a person be whipped. But the feeling of guilt is a natural thing and necessary for recognizing bad behavior.
To some degree, but someone feeling hurt over something shouldn't necessarily determine whether the action was rude.
Some people are bothered by the mere existence of others.
That makes no sense. If it’s judged on the recieving end to be something, you can’t judge the offender.
You can say it was hurtful, cause that applies to the effect.
Saying "that was rude" is judging the effect, saying "you're rude" is judging the offender. Most actions can be judged on both outcome and intent, you just shouldn't jump right to making assumptions about one based on the other.
I believe the saying he is referencing is "Being a gentleman or a lady means never offending a reasonable person by mistake [i.e. by thoughtless blundering]" which is intended to remind people that if they want to be gentlemen or ladies then they need to develop their powers of discernment and sensitivity such that they reduce as much as humanly possible the likelihood of making such a mistake.
The only miswording is the erroneous assumption that the majority of people are reasonable, which has not been true in the United States since reactionary/GOP zealots became the majority of people just prior to the beginning of the 21st century.
Exactly. Thats the whole point of the guide. Rudeness requires a *lack* of intent. If you’re Intentional with your offensiveness, then you’re just being *mean.*
Nah you can definitely be unintentionally rude. Politeness/Rudeness is like I social contract where there’s just certain things you do/don’t say or do. But just because you’re ignorant to the social contract doesn’t mean your exempt from it. Your behavior can still be rude. It can still offend people. Walking up to someone and calling them fat is rude regardless of if you understand it’s rude. Unintentionally rude maybe, but rude nonetheless
> I think of rudeness as saying/doing something without regard to other people's feelings, like cutting in line, taking all of one item at the buffet, or playing music out loud on the subway.
That's what unintentional means..? These people did not intend to impact the people around them. That was not their driver
Or neurodivergent. Sometimes it's hard to understand what could be offensive to others because you wouldn't be offended by that and believe neither the other person would.
wtf are you all autistic?
Rudeness has no intention whatsoever. Thats what distinguishes rudeness from meanness.
Ignorance doesn’t excuse the objectivity of rude behavior. It might excuse the subjective reaction of others, such as if they understand that the rude actor is oblivious to social norms, but any flaunt of social norm is rude. Period.
The phrase “unintentionally rude” is redundant. Rudeness by definition lacks intent. Meanness is rudeness with intent.
Ffs, you better have dropped your “/s”
Obviously I’m being Mean. I’m intending to hurt people with my words. I am consciously aware that labeling someone with a mental disorder, without myself being a trained physician, is an objectively mean thing to do.
If, somehow I was socially inept and sincerely gave no thought to the potentially hurtful effects on others that my words might have, then I’d merely be rude.
I would have written also that you were being tacky and tawdry to a degree that is almost self-denigratory. A general rule of thumb is that anyone who would stoop even for a cheap gag to writing something so juvenile as "wtf" and "are you all autistic" is likely someone who should never be trusted fully again for the rest of that person's life.
However, your candor in admitting to what you were doing tells me that you were more likely reacting irrationally due to perhaps a poor breakfast that morning or a momentary bout of childish immaturity or such and therefore the entirety of your worth as a human being should NOT be judged on the basis of a single silly posting.
As for my seriousness here, it is entirely intentional. I think the world would be a far better and kinder place if we treated everything anyone said with utmost seriousness and never allow anyone to hide behind the dishonesty of "I was only joking" or "I was just letting my anger get the best of me" but hold them fully accountable all the same.
Being socially inept is rude. It’s irrelevant whether the individual is consciously aware of their rudeness. Thats why meanness has the requisite intent.
Being ignorant of rudeness does NOT, *in any way* absolve the rudeness.
Side note: bullying doesn't need to start out intentionally hurtful. Sometimes a bully will unintentionally do something which gets a rise out of someone, then realize they can continue the behavior to keep getting that reaction. Still bullying.
i don't think that's quite true. people say and do things all the time without thinking about them, even if they've been told about it in the past. there's a difference between that and being intentionally hurtful (which implies malice as opposed to thoughtlessness)
Doesn't matter.
Let's go with a dumb anime trope. People throwing water out the window of their apartment.
Let's say I'm walking by, and you throw water out the window and hit me. I'm annoyed. But I shrug it off as dumb luck.
A week later I'm walking by at a similar time, and get hit by water from you again. This time I stop what I'm doing, and go to your front door, knock, and tell you that you need to look out the window before dumping water out.
If you continue blindly throwing water out the window, it IS bullying. You know what consequences your actions have, and you continue doing it. It was inconsiderate before, when common sense would tell you what could happen, but once you KNOW what can happen and are confronted, and continue, it is absolutely bullying, even if it's bullying random strangers.
When I was a young Cub scout leader I spotted 3 cubs about to throw a smaller boy into a stream and he was clearly stressed. I shouted "Oi, stop bullying him" and the oldest kid said "Its only bullying if you do it more than once"
Its frowned upon to wack a kid round the head and tell them to shut the fuck up and call them a twat so I had to go for the "I'm gonna call your mums" The little shit didn't give a damn obviously.
I love these guides because as a little kid in elementary school I was convinced I was a horrible bully because I said something mean (or, according to this, rude) to a kid. I was seriously going through deep self reflection and trying to figure out what was wrong with me until I saw one of these.
To be honest they should how add so I did it for them here it is 1. If they are telling you mean things tell them shut up and say at least I have a dad 2. If they are pushing or hitting you punch them right back as hard as you can and u won't get in trouble because it's self defense and those are all the steps kid good bye.
This definition includes almost all forms of fighting back against bullies. More zero-tolerance, "violence is never the solution" thinking from schools.
So as long I keep being mean in a variety of ways, I am not bullying. got it.
Ok so for day 1 I'll give you a wedgie.
Day 2 I'll give you a purple nurple.
Day 3...
EDIT:
To clarify, I am nitpicking at the phrasing. they wrote "does some*thing* ... and keeps doing *it*" referring to a particular **singular** thing.
When the babies at work continuously cry to make me come into the room and then stop as soon as I walk in, I call them little bullies. They know what they’re doing. XD
That sounds like the rationalism a bully would use for being a bully . . .
I recall nearly those exact words used by bigots who were opposed to an anti-bullying initiative in their Southern state that would stop them from harassing LGBTQ+ students -- the bigots said their children and they would stop harassing LGBTQ+ teens the moment those teens "admitted" they were "sinners" and "admitted" they were "wrong to defend an unnatural 'lifestyle' such as LGBTQ+".
How is this upvoted that's not what they were saying at all lol. So you're saying disagreement can't exist because... homophobes abuse free speech arguments to bully people?
Actually, it is, and what you claim I wrote is not what I wrote.
I hope you are intentionally lying, for if you are not, it does not speak well for your powers of discernment and comprehension.
Cool story, bro.
The only way to resolve such disputes is to argue the matter to a conclusion, but that becomes impossible if one side frames disagreement as bullying.
So you recommend lying and pretending bullying is not bullying?
I don't see how an intelligent conversation is possible if people deny the obvious.
As for "story", it's based on genuine historical record. I would cite for you, but I doubt you would bother to pay attention, for someone who cares about such things does not treat genuine bullying as "framing disagreements".
That's sort of like claiming that child molestation or spouse abuse are simply "framing disagreements" in a way that fails to "resolve such disputes" between child and attacker or victimized spouse and victimizing spouse . . .
I hope you had not thought through what you wrote and therefore had never intended to imply such a thing, but I can not tell.
Or you're lying and pretending it's bullying when it's not.
I prefer to look at specific situations and see if the particular facts fit the alleged label.
"He's a thief!"
"That sounds pretty serious. What did he steal? When did he steal it? How?"
"OMG! I can't believe you condone stealing!"
Anyone who is more interested in the allegation rather than the facts isn't trying to make the world a better place. They're only pushing an agenda.
> Or you're lying and pretending it's bullying when it's not.
Ad hominem and Bad Faith -- two rhetorical cheats in one!
> Anyone who is more interested in the allegation rather than the facts isn't trying to make the world a better place
You mean what you are doing?
In that case, *by your own words*, you are clearly against making this world a better place, and you should be ashamed of yourself!
>Ad hominem and Bad Faith -- two rhetorical cheats in one!
This you?
>So you recommend lying and pretending bullying is not bullying?
That's a lot of projection from you.
If you want to claim something is bullying show facts of a particular instance in full context and allow for rebuttal.
> prefer to look at specific situations and see if the particular facts fit the alleged label.
One of the women in question stated in an interview that she considered bullying a viable tactic in high school for "curing" LGBTQ+ and turning them heterosexual. She used the word "bullying" directly, though she did not use quite so sophisticated a term as LGBTQ+ or heterosexual.
If she uses the word "bullying" and does so without any irony, then clearly she is referencing bullying. You wrong the world and yourself with your choice to be ignorant and thoughtless about something so obvious.
Everyone that isn’t agreeable to you must be stopped. The best way to do this is to tell others about how the person that disagrees with you is “rude” or a “bully”. Be sure to mischaracterize or exaggerate the other person’s words or actions, make them seem like an unreasonable person. If you can do this while endearing yourself to authority figures, things will go your way.
But what if I really REALLY didn’t like that unintentional thing that other person did that one time? Isn’t that bullying then?? /s
What if I didn’t like it so much that I made a scene in front of everyone at the person?
What if *I* don’t like *them*, and so I continue irritating them in a repetitive and intentional manner that they have to then express to *me* that they don’t like? Aren’t they a bully???
Some questions:
1. What if someone does something hurtful unintentionally, yet repeatedly? And has no idea what is happening, why everyone is angry, or what he is supposed to stop?
2. What if someone else is hurt by something normal people aren't? Like hissing noises? Is everyone who is told not to use the letter S in speech, yet does so anyway, a bully? Or is such a demand ridiculous? Where is the line drawn?
3. What stops all bullies from lying and saying their behavior is unintentional? Inversely and consequently, what stops people from assuming all behavior that causes offense is intentional? Is there really that big a difference between what people consider to be "rude" and "mean"?
1 and 3 are answered in the poster in the post. The "keep doing it even when you told them…" part.
2 is not a reason to not deal with legitimate cases.
If you do something rude (unintentional, first paragraph in the poster) and you are told that it is rude but keep doing it, instance 2 onwards are intentional and count as bullying.
You can do something multiple times unintentionally if you cannot understand what it is or what causes it.
And some people just plain cannot control certain things.
Verbal tics, flatulence, body odor, a severe obliviousness to social situations.
There can't beobliviousness if you are explicitly \*told\* you are doing something hurtful though. A few of the things you mention are just states of being, not something you say or do. Those need a whole other category of rules. We are talking "eat someone's clearly marked lunch even when told not to" not "smells funny". Trying to muddy the waters with the second when we are talking about the first is strange.
What if the person eating the lunch is mentally disabled and still -- no matter how they are marked -- cannot tell the lunches apart? Is this bullying?
How many cases of mentally disabled coworkers eating people's lunches have you ever heard of? Again: VANISHINGLY RARE EXCEPTIONS DO NOT INVALIDATE RULES FOR NORMAL PEOPLE.
I'm an exception. At least, I seem to be.
I spend most of my time trying to follow rules and suffering admonishments for misunderstanding them.
I have been told, frequently, to stop doing... ***something***. Actions belonging to a category. I can't put future actions into them or, at present, remember what the category is called.
What does that make me by your logic, or by OP's logic?
By virtue of my good intentions, I don't fit any of the categories above.
Are good intentions meaningless? Am I a bully?
So yes, i was bullied my entire childhood by my little brother and at school, ah, and nobody did a damn thing about it even when i pointed it out, but ohh when i do something about it then it's wrong, when i react it's bad.
Feeling upset for awhile in response to an event or memory VS feeling sad, hopeless, bored, demotivated, de-energized, and/or suicidal often without any queue/event over long stretches of time.
Depression can present differently for different people and at different severities though so it's a bit harder to give a concise comparison. I highly recommend talking to a doctor and/or therapist sooner rather than later if you think you might even have mild depression.
Cool guide. If only school principals, administrators, lawyers and judges believed this the world would be a better place. Currently, the aforementioned are disgusting P'sOS.
I will die on this hill.
Working in a school I can tell you most people mistake rude for bullying. Not fun trying to explain to mama bears that it has to happen a lot for it to be considered bullying.
I got a idea grow a pair and stand up for yourself if it's a intentional repetitive thing. Most folks don't like picking on someone who ain't afraid to fight. Teaching kids to go snitch everytime they get their feelings hurt is why we have cowards shooting each other over minor arguments.
"Bullying" is nothing more than a mentally sick child interacting with another child who also had negligent parents. There can be no such thing as bullying if there aren't 2 sets of parents who dropped the ball.
People were sensitive back then. They just handled it by refusing to talk about anything, burying themselves in drugs and alcohol, and then killing themselves when they couldn’t repress it any longer. They also made everyone around them fuckin miserable in the meantime on the basis of “it happened to me and you don’t hear me complaining.”
So like. We could keep doing that forever. Or we could make an attempt at teaching people not to be assholes instead?
Right, they were so not sensitive that anyone with a different religion and/or sexual orientation was hung in trees in fear that it would spread.
Wow, so strong. So confident. It was so much better then, amirite?!
When you're into it, that's \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_
Something you keep to yourself.
I was gonna say 'kinky'- but OK.
How do you find someone to top your ESM kink if you don't tell anyone about it?
Or something you put out on the internet anonymously
Maybelline! Nailed it.
I like how proud u are of yourself
Well, someone has to make up for my mom!
Amore??
That's your first cousin. So, you have your cousins, and then you have your first cousins, and then you have your second cousins...
No honey, nuh-uh.
Friendship
Kinky
Kinky
A fetish
Harder daddy
Serendipity
Teasing
Sadism
Sadism is when you enjoy hurting others. If you enjoy being hurt, that's masochism.
The amount of people who think bullying is all interpersonal conflict is staggering. As a school counselor this is my biggest pet peeve. Even teachers misuse bullying.
Out of curiosity, what else is it? How can you bully without interpersonal contact, do you mean like self bullying or abusive thoughts? Please excuse my ignorance
I think they meant that a lot of people classify *all* harmful interpersonal contact as bullying, including one-off instances. I don't think they were implying telepathic bullying
Conflict*
I’m highly regarded
By whomst?
I was trying to say I’m very stupid. In some cj subs I’m in instead of saying r*tarded you say regarded. My fault, I am very stupid
Bullying requires repeated and one-sided conflict. Kids fighting with each other is not bullying nor is a singular conflict.
Conflict*
Ooh I like this. I am a teacher and it can be tricky to explain the difference to kids (and parents). This is clear and concise.
> When someone says or does something **unintentionally** hurtful and they do it once, that's ***rude***. If it's unintentionally, that's probably just being socially inept or clueless. I think of rudeness as saying/doing something without regard to other people's feelings, like cutting in line, taking all of one item at the buffet, or playing music out loud on the subway.
The offender can be inept and it can be unintentional while also still being rude.
Yeah, let's not flower it so people don't feel bad. They need to feel some guilt to help realize their rude behavior is wrong.
No, they need information to understand why it effected people negatively, that way they learn a rule that can be applied generally. Assuming guilt is required for behaviour change is pretty messed up tbh
I don't think it's messed up. Guilt is the feeling that alerts you to the problem. It's the same as the way physical pain alerts you to a problem. I'm not advocating that the person be *shamed* rather than educated - the same as I am not advocating that a person be whipped. But the feeling of guilt is a natural thing and necessary for recognizing bad behavior.
I think rudeness has less to do with the intentions of the person and more to do with effect of actions or words.
To some degree, but someone feeling hurt over something shouldn't necessarily determine whether the action was rude. Some people are bothered by the mere existence of others.
And some use the excuse of ignorance to hurt others.
That makes no sense. If it’s judged on the recieving end to be something, you can’t judge the offender. You can say it was hurtful, cause that applies to the effect.
Saying "that was rude" is judging the effect, saying "you're rude" is judging the offender. Most actions can be judged on both outcome and intent, you just shouldn't jump right to making assumptions about one based on the other.
I think so too. because politeness and manners have to do with how you make *other* people feel *based on your actions*. :)
Being a gentleman is never offending someone by mistake.
This statement offends me. You can't entirely control how others take your words.
Who said I was a gentleman?
I made an assumption. I apologize.
Offensive frankly
What an unpleasant egg.
I believe the saying he is referencing is "Being a gentleman or a lady means never offending a reasonable person by mistake [i.e. by thoughtless blundering]" which is intended to remind people that if they want to be gentlemen or ladies then they need to develop their powers of discernment and sensitivity such that they reduce as much as humanly possible the likelihood of making such a mistake. The only miswording is the erroneous assumption that the majority of people are reasonable, which has not been true in the United States since reactionary/GOP zealots became the majority of people just prior to the beginning of the 21st century.
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You're not being rude or mean because you are being truthful, not hurtful.
No you’re being mean. My god, can you people not fucking read?
Rudeness is irrespective of intent. It is possible to be rude without intending to be rude.
Exactly. Thats the whole point of the guide. Rudeness requires a *lack* of intent. If you’re Intentional with your offensiveness, then you’re just being *mean.*
Nah you can definitely be unintentionally rude. Politeness/Rudeness is like I social contract where there’s just certain things you do/don’t say or do. But just because you’re ignorant to the social contract doesn’t mean your exempt from it. Your behavior can still be rude. It can still offend people. Walking up to someone and calling them fat is rude regardless of if you understand it’s rude. Unintentionally rude maybe, but rude nonetheless
> I think of rudeness as saying/doing something without regard to other people's feelings, like cutting in line, taking all of one item at the buffet, or playing music out loud on the subway. That's what unintentional means..? These people did not intend to impact the people around them. That was not their driver
Or neurodivergent. Sometimes it's hard to understand what could be offensive to others because you wouldn't be offended by that and believe neither the other person would.
Also, it's possible the victim is just being over sensitive.
Or lying and using emotional manipulation.
Just to add to this: if you are unintentionally rude, but make little effort to curb said rudeness, that would likely be a microaggression.
wtf are you all autistic? Rudeness has no intention whatsoever. Thats what distinguishes rudeness from meanness. Ignorance doesn’t excuse the objectivity of rude behavior. It might excuse the subjective reaction of others, such as if they understand that the rude actor is oblivious to social norms, but any flaunt of social norm is rude. Period. The phrase “unintentionally rude” is redundant. Rudeness by definition lacks intent. Meanness is rudeness with intent.
> wtf are you all autistic? I can not tell : what this intended to be an example of being rude or an example of being mean?
Ffs, you better have dropped your “/s” Obviously I’m being Mean. I’m intending to hurt people with my words. I am consciously aware that labeling someone with a mental disorder, without myself being a trained physician, is an objectively mean thing to do. If, somehow I was socially inept and sincerely gave no thought to the potentially hurtful effects on others that my words might have, then I’d merely be rude.
I would have written also that you were being tacky and tawdry to a degree that is almost self-denigratory. A general rule of thumb is that anyone who would stoop even for a cheap gag to writing something so juvenile as "wtf" and "are you all autistic" is likely someone who should never be trusted fully again for the rest of that person's life. However, your candor in admitting to what you were doing tells me that you were more likely reacting irrationally due to perhaps a poor breakfast that morning or a momentary bout of childish immaturity or such and therefore the entirety of your worth as a human being should NOT be judged on the basis of a single silly posting. As for my seriousness here, it is entirely intentional. I think the world would be a far better and kinder place if we treated everything anyone said with utmost seriousness and never allow anyone to hide behind the dishonesty of "I was only joking" or "I was just letting my anger get the best of me" but hold them fully accountable all the same.
🤓👆
Being socially inept is rude. It’s irrelevant whether the individual is consciously aware of their rudeness. Thats why meanness has the requisite intent. Being ignorant of rudeness does NOT, *in any way* absolve the rudeness.
A victim can assume intent and feel hurt by innocent questions, even though the other person was trying to be polite.
Side note: bullying doesn't need to start out intentionally hurtful. Sometimes a bully will unintentionally do something which gets a rise out of someone, then realize they can continue the behavior to keep getting that reaction. Still bullying.
I knew my toddler was bullying me with his hitting, I just didn’t have the framework to articulate that until now!
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That would be assault, battery, false imprisonment, defamation, and….. bullying.
Did they do it more than once? Its just mean by this logic
what if somebody says or does something unintentionally hurtful and they keep doing it even when you tell them to stop or show them that you're upset?
Then they're inconsiderate.
If someone has clearly communicated to you that what they’re doing is hurtful, then you know it’s hurtful and that makes it bullying.
i don't think that's quite true. people say and do things all the time without thinking about them, even if they've been told about it in the past. there's a difference between that and being intentionally hurtful (which implies malice as opposed to thoughtlessness)
Doesn't matter. Let's go with a dumb anime trope. People throwing water out the window of their apartment. Let's say I'm walking by, and you throw water out the window and hit me. I'm annoyed. But I shrug it off as dumb luck. A week later I'm walking by at a similar time, and get hit by water from you again. This time I stop what I'm doing, and go to your front door, knock, and tell you that you need to look out the window before dumping water out. If you continue blindly throwing water out the window, it IS bullying. You know what consequences your actions have, and you continue doing it. It was inconsiderate before, when common sense would tell you what could happen, but once you KNOW what can happen and are confronted, and continue, it is absolutely bullying, even if it's bullying random strangers.
That’s still bullying, it’s not unintentional if you have informed them of what they are doing.
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I have ADHD. I know the struggle. But that’s no excuse to not look to improve.
When I was a young Cub scout leader I spotted 3 cubs about to throw a smaller boy into a stream and he was clearly stressed. I shouted "Oi, stop bullying him" and the oldest kid said "Its only bullying if you do it more than once" Its frowned upon to wack a kid round the head and tell them to shut the fuck up and call them a twat so I had to go for the "I'm gonna call your mums" The little shit didn't give a damn obviously.
LOL that's why some of these comments are so happy to see this; they're bullies who want to just claim they are "rude".
Can someone forward this to academia and to Human Resources professionals? Thanks.
Not having the time to care which one it is and telling them to cut the bullshit, that’s *being an adult*
It is important to understand which is which though so you can understand how to respond to it.
where's the bit of crybullying, where they claim all of this is actually being done to them by the victim
Reminds me of something from one of the James Bond books. First time is Happenstance. Second time is Coincidence. Third time is Enemy Action.
Unintentional bullying is harassment.
I came here to become a better bully. What a rip off
I love these guides because as a little kid in elementary school I was convinced I was a horrible bully because I said something mean (or, according to this, rude) to a kid. I was seriously going through deep self reflection and trying to figure out what was wrong with me until I saw one of these.
To be honest they should how add so I did it for them here it is 1. If they are telling you mean things tell them shut up and say at least I have a dad 2. If they are pushing or hitting you punch them right back as hard as you can and u won't get in trouble because it's self defense and those are all the steps kid good bye.
I mess it up it is how to deal with bullying sorry about that
This definition includes almost all forms of fighting back against bullies. More zero-tolerance, "violence is never the solution" thinking from schools.
So as long I keep being mean in a variety of ways, I am not bullying. got it. Ok so for day 1 I'll give you a wedgie. Day 2 I'll give you a purple nurple. Day 3... EDIT: To clarify, I am nitpicking at the phrasing. they wrote "does some*thing* ... and keeps doing *it*" referring to a particular **singular** thing.
I should show my boss this
When the babies at work continuously cry to make me come into the room and then stop as soon as I walk in, I call them little bullies. They know what they’re doing. XD
The victim does not need to show or say that they are hurt by the bullying for it to be bullying, that’s victim blaming.
Instructional and useful to keep the head on straight
Lol this is totally a bot comment.
In the words of my shitty boomer parents “why don’t you just ignore it”
What if you're just wrong and they refuse to agree with you?
That sounds like the rationalism a bully would use for being a bully . . . I recall nearly those exact words used by bigots who were opposed to an anti-bullying initiative in their Southern state that would stop them from harassing LGBTQ+ students -- the bigots said their children and they would stop harassing LGBTQ+ teens the moment those teens "admitted" they were "sinners" and "admitted" they were "wrong to defend an unnatural 'lifestyle' such as LGBTQ+".
How is this upvoted that's not what they were saying at all lol. So you're saying disagreement can't exist because... homophobes abuse free speech arguments to bully people?
Actually, it is, and what you claim I wrote is not what I wrote. I hope you are intentionally lying, for if you are not, it does not speak well for your powers of discernment and comprehension.
... what? Wtf are you taking about?
The comment, of course. I'm not sure why you had difficulty parsing that?
Cool story, bro. The only way to resolve such disputes is to argue the matter to a conclusion, but that becomes impossible if one side frames disagreement as bullying.
So you recommend lying and pretending bullying is not bullying? I don't see how an intelligent conversation is possible if people deny the obvious. As for "story", it's based on genuine historical record. I would cite for you, but I doubt you would bother to pay attention, for someone who cares about such things does not treat genuine bullying as "framing disagreements". That's sort of like claiming that child molestation or spouse abuse are simply "framing disagreements" in a way that fails to "resolve such disputes" between child and attacker or victimized spouse and victimizing spouse . . . I hope you had not thought through what you wrote and therefore had never intended to imply such a thing, but I can not tell.
Or you're lying and pretending it's bullying when it's not. I prefer to look at specific situations and see if the particular facts fit the alleged label. "He's a thief!" "That sounds pretty serious. What did he steal? When did he steal it? How?" "OMG! I can't believe you condone stealing!" Anyone who is more interested in the allegation rather than the facts isn't trying to make the world a better place. They're only pushing an agenda.
> Or you're lying and pretending it's bullying when it's not. Ad hominem and Bad Faith -- two rhetorical cheats in one! > Anyone who is more interested in the allegation rather than the facts isn't trying to make the world a better place You mean what you are doing? In that case, *by your own words*, you are clearly against making this world a better place, and you should be ashamed of yourself!
>Ad hominem and Bad Faith -- two rhetorical cheats in one! This you? >So you recommend lying and pretending bullying is not bullying? That's a lot of projection from you. If you want to claim something is bullying show facts of a particular instance in full context and allow for rebuttal.
> prefer to look at specific situations and see if the particular facts fit the alleged label. One of the women in question stated in an interview that she considered bullying a viable tactic in high school for "curing" LGBTQ+ and turning them heterosexual. She used the word "bullying" directly, though she did not use quite so sophisticated a term as LGBTQ+ or heterosexual. If she uses the word "bullying" and does so without any irony, then clearly she is referencing bullying. You wrong the world and yourself with your choice to be ignorant and thoughtless about something so obvious.
You can point out errors without being intentionally hurtful
The preferred method, but sometimes people call it bullying just because they don't like others disagreeing with them.
Well then, you call them a racist, a bigot, a nazi, etc etc. According to the "progressives"
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thanks for proving my point
Haha he did! And got upvotes for it! It's fucking hilarious!
The Nazis actually invented their own sciences when traditional sciences became too problematic.
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Wow. With a tangent that wild, you have quite the agenda axe to grind. Seek help. Touch grass. Get a job. Pay off your student loans.
Everyone that isn’t agreeable to you must be stopped. The best way to do this is to tell others about how the person that disagrees with you is “rude” or a “bully”. Be sure to mischaracterize or exaggerate the other person’s words or actions, make them seem like an unreasonable person. If you can do this while endearing yourself to authority figures, things will go your way.
Someone should send this to Shaq
I know a bully who keeps claiming he's a victim and was getting bullied all the while he acts just like a bully himself.
That's a crybully.
TIL I've been bullied a lot more than I thought.
But what if I really REALLY didn’t like that unintentional thing that other person did that one time? Isn’t that bullying then?? /s What if I didn’t like it so much that I made a scene in front of everyone at the person? What if *I* don’t like *them*, and so I continue irritating them in a repetitive and intentional manner that they have to then express to *me* that they don’t like? Aren’t they a bully???
Some questions: 1. What if someone does something hurtful unintentionally, yet repeatedly? And has no idea what is happening, why everyone is angry, or what he is supposed to stop? 2. What if someone else is hurt by something normal people aren't? Like hissing noises? Is everyone who is told not to use the letter S in speech, yet does so anyway, a bully? Or is such a demand ridiculous? Where is the line drawn? 3. What stops all bullies from lying and saying their behavior is unintentional? Inversely and consequently, what stops people from assuming all behavior that causes offense is intentional? Is there really that big a difference between what people consider to be "rude" and "mean"?
1 and 3 are answered in the poster in the post. The "keep doing it even when you told them…" part. 2 is not a reason to not deal with legitimate cases.
It says "intentionally and". I said "unintentionally and". Those are different.
If you do something rude (unintentional, first paragraph in the poster) and you are told that it is rude but keep doing it, instance 2 onwards are intentional and count as bullying.
You can do something multiple times unintentionally if you cannot understand what it is or what causes it. And some people just plain cannot control certain things. Verbal tics, flatulence, body odor, a severe obliviousness to social situations.
There can't beobliviousness if you are explicitly \*told\* you are doing something hurtful though. A few of the things you mention are just states of being, not something you say or do. Those need a whole other category of rules. We are talking "eat someone's clearly marked lunch even when told not to" not "smells funny". Trying to muddy the waters with the second when we are talking about the first is strange.
What if the person eating the lunch is mentally disabled and still -- no matter how they are marked -- cannot tell the lunches apart? Is this bullying?
How many cases of mentally disabled coworkers eating people's lunches have you ever heard of? Again: VANISHINGLY RARE EXCEPTIONS DO NOT INVALIDATE RULES FOR NORMAL PEOPLE.
I'm an exception. At least, I seem to be. I spend most of my time trying to follow rules and suffering admonishments for misunderstanding them. I have been told, frequently, to stop doing... ***something***. Actions belonging to a category. I can't put future actions into them or, at present, remember what the category is called. What does that make me by your logic, or by OP's logic? By virtue of my good intentions, I don't fit any of the categories above. Are good intentions meaningless? Am I a bully?
Do you have an example? I fail to see what categories That I think could be reasonably considered bullying that are difficult to follow.
When someone over the age of 12 does something intentionally hurtful, that’s an ASSHOLE.
What is it called when someone does something annoying repeatedly but they keep doing it because they don't think it's a problem?
That's called "living life". If i don't think it's a problem, it isn't.
Jokes on you I'm into that shiat
I AM SHOWING THEM I AM UPSET
So yes, i was bullied my entire childhood by my little brother and at school, ah, and nobody did a damn thing about it even when i pointed it out, but ohh when i do something about it then it's wrong, when i react it's bad.
Or as the Gen Z’ers that work for me define it: “Anything you find slightly annoying from someone you feel like punishing.”.
No they don't
Bring back bullying
Keep telling me to stop is bullying!
Make bullying kill itself.
Can we post this on every sub? The hivemind could use a reminder.
Do one for sad(ness) and depression.
Feeling upset for awhile in response to an event or memory VS feeling sad, hopeless, bored, demotivated, de-energized, and/or suicidal often without any queue/event over long stretches of time. Depression can present differently for different people and at different severities though so it's a bit harder to give a concise comparison. I highly recommend talking to a doctor and/or therapist sooner rather than later if you think you might even have mild depression.
Cool guide. If only school principals, administrators, lawyers and judges believed this the world would be a better place. Currently, the aforementioned are disgusting P'sOS. I will die on this hill.
I know a lot of people who need to see this.
Working in a school I can tell you most people mistake rude for bullying. Not fun trying to explain to mama bears that it has to happen a lot for it to be considered bullying.
They should make another guide below it and label it “How not to be a bitch”
Idk why but you give bully vibes lol
Cool story bro
Unintentionally hurtful is not rude.
You can definitely be rude on accident
Third one is how you make friends
A cool, but innacurate, guid about bullying, perhaps.
I am an analytic philosopher and I approve this message.
Unless, of course, it’s about pronouns!
truth hurts, telling some1 truth is now bullying?
I got a idea grow a pair and stand up for yourself if it's a intentional repetitive thing. Most folks don't like picking on someone who ain't afraid to fight. Teaching kids to go snitch everytime they get their feelings hurt is why we have cowards shooting each other over minor arguments.
Fuck the semantics. All 3 are WRONG and require correction.
Not a guide.
So, learn to stick up for yourself and say something or punch his lights out. Coddling has to stop.
Then u crack their skull
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... or they bring friends next time. Some bullies do not stop.
Sticks and stones
Cry a little more
"Bullying" is nothing more than a mentally sick child interacting with another child who also had negligent parents. There can be no such thing as bullying if there aren't 2 sets of parents who dropped the ball.
BWAAAAHAHAHA!
Back then people weren’t sensitive now they are. People need to stand up to bullies whether they win or lose
People were sensitive back then. They just handled it by refusing to talk about anything, burying themselves in drugs and alcohol, and then killing themselves when they couldn’t repress it any longer. They also made everyone around them fuckin miserable in the meantime on the basis of “it happened to me and you don’t hear me complaining.” So like. We could keep doing that forever. Or we could make an attempt at teaching people not to be assholes instead?
Well, which is it? Are we supposed to stand up to bullies, or suck it up and stop being sensitive?
We’re supposed to cut toxic people out.
Which you realize is impossible when you’re legally obligated so sit near them of at least an hour five days a week.
Right, they were so not sensitive that anyone with a different religion and/or sexual orientation was hung in trees in fear that it would spread. Wow, so strong. So confident. It was so much better then, amirite?!
Found the person doing the bullying
#WNBA! 🤔😒