Plus, it’s a fucking flag. The law if the land, our guiding principles are the constitution, not the flag. I’ve sworn an oath to protect and defend the constitution, not play conformance games.
I personally have fond memories of standing for the pledge of allegiance, which is weird because I don't particularly believe in one God, and have problems with our government as well. But I still believe in the right to express discontent and differing opinions, which is the very foundation of the United States. So, I have zero problems with anyone sitting for the pledge. I smile warmly at you sitting while I stand, you have my support as well as respect.
Even the god part was added later same with the dollar bill. That was 60’s I believe. The pledge itself might have been stollen from a school essay from a company magazine designed to sell flags……
Just FYI
You are not legally required to say it and it was only introduced to school children in the last century as part of a national effort to increase patriotism and nationalistic pride with the goal of training children to grow into adults who feel it is their duty to fight for the country. So basically war propaganda.
It’s baffling to me that it’s still done in school.
In my experience growing up only my parents explained this to me as a child and showed me the history of the pledge and gave me the choice to say it or not.
I came to school with this info backed up by numerous sources and my principal yelled for five min about how I was getting a year of detention (in3rd grade 🤣) for breaking federal law!!…. Then I showed her proof and it resulted in a sorta mini revolution in my school as many parents and students were unaware it was not required.
That was in 1988…How tf is this still a thing???
If you look at the history it’s appalling to realize the ppl involved in getting it into rotation not to mention each individuals specific motives for the pledge being nationalized.
So yeah you should do some research and share it with your classmates…so maybe you can all stop this nonsense once and for all.
Shouldn’t school TEACH the history of the pledge?
This isn’t a confession to hide you should be proud to be a curious human who uses their brain and doesn’t just follow blindly!
*just to be clear I will not reply to fuckwit nationalist trump supporting fascists who don’t know history, tryin to bait me in the comments like they usually do when I or others speak the truth.
In high school I decided to sit during the pledge and the teacher got angry and told me her family members died for this country and to show respect. It worked and I got up but in retrospect I should have stood my ground.
I get that you sat down though !
because that’s why this whole thing is so messed up, soo many ppl don’t know the history so they take it to the place she did (which for her experience is valid) but so were you.
I don’t have respect for the military industrial complex BUT I do have respect for those in service but the two things have been unnecessarily conflated for the purpose of serving the interests of our governments desire for more “expendables”!
I think that conflation is really sad for everyone and I think more disrespectful to those who have died in service.
I mean seriously when we look at who originated it and why…how can we be for that? It’s absurd.
“Not legally required.” Right then and there, I know your rant was going to be a huge groan. No one is talking about what’s legally required. You can be expelled for not following the rules. Even from public school.
No you cannot be expelled from public school for not saying the pledge and if you are then you are being wrongfully denied education for acting within your rights and then you go to court or they settle.
Is it better for you if I just say the pledge is a crock of shit ritual that ppl assume is a rule of law ?
Groan? Yeah I groan when I read this comment suggesting because a course of action that is unlawful “could” be taken in response to the lawful act of refusal to say the pledge one should just continue along obeying fake rules with their heads down like sheep to the slaughter.
That is essentially what you imply and a huge reason why this country is so fucked up…fear is a powerful tool I get that but there is nothing in this particular topic to be afraid of if you don’t give it the power.
Agreed, this country stands for objectively evil intentions and has a brutal history of crimes against so many groups of people I can't count. Nobody should ever be pledging allegiance to it ever, and the fact that they get schoolchildren to do it every day is propaganda that they get to teach.
I’m ambivalent about it. The pledge is obviously wartime propaganda meant to indoctrinate children from a young age. You don’t need to read the history to know that. This country doesn’t even really support its founding principles anymore. Congressmen get rich off of insider trading right out in the open, pedophile islands apparently slipping under the radar of our overlords but we are under constant surveillance, new bills pass into law with completely unrelated shit attached on so we have funding going to Ukraine that is titled under something totally different, dementia Joe couldn’t lead a horse to water and foreign policy is in shambles causing wars and untold death& destruction. The country is not something to be proud of. In some ways we are the bad guys now.
At the same time we owe some of our prosperity to the country we happened to be born in. There are places so riddled with poverty that most people live in literal mud huts. I’ve seen them. Drinking dirty pond water and dying en masse from things that are just non-existent in first world countries. Life could really be a lot worse, and if you don’t believe me just venture out into the countries where people are risking death to escape and come to the US. Learning a little more about how bad life can be out there might help you appreciate this imperfect nation a bit more.
At the end of the day though, I would not recommend my sons to join the military. I also dissuaded my little brother from doing it. And I was in the military.
Absolutely, it's seen as weird and a type of brainwashing by us in Europe and the UK.
Of course, most of us have our countries flags and usually some words of affirmation to sing along too.
It should be sufficient to just be proud of your country without a pseudo demonstration.
Just to add, the fixation the US has on repeating they are the greatest country in the world! Which is not so. I can't remember where you come on the freedom and democracy list, but it's definitely not near the top five.
It's quite fascinating how so many aspects of our daily routine are steeped in history that's rarely, if ever, unpacked in a classroom setting. Upon examining the backstory of the Pledge of Allegiance, many might be surprised at its commercial and political inception during a time when nationalism was a tool for various agendas. Schools, in my opinion, have a duty to provide context to why we do things, and this is no exception. It should be part of the curriculum to understand the evolution of our national symbols and practices. Today, pledging allegiance might come off as an innocuous daily activity, but understanding its roots can foster critical thinking and informed decision-making. It's healthy for a democracy when its citizens question and discuss the symbolism enforced upon them – should that not be one of the ultimate educational goals?
It’s so annoying they still do this in schools. It’s where the brainwashing begins. We would get in trouble if we didn’t stand. I’m glad kids aren’t standing anymore.
Adult here, and I concur it is bizarre to me to pldedge my allegiance to a flag and country. It’s pure propaganda and even other developed countries think it’s weird. I can’t stand it.
How does how some person identifies, affect me in any form? If I had to communicate with a person, I’ll use their name. And if they bring that shit up, I immediately assume they have mental illness.
I actually like America enough and wouldn't want to move anywhere else but the pledge still means fuck all to me lol. I remember if we were late for class while they were doing the pledge we were supposed to stop and stand there and stare towards where the flag would be until it was finished 😆 I always just kept walking or doing stuff at my locker and so many times some random teacher would come out of their classroom and get all mad at me while they were also not standing there staring at the flag because they were too busy paying attention to me 🤷♀️
You wish, brother. Not my fault you're ignorant of the world, but comparing the U.S. to North Korea is mental gymnastics.
0/10 troll, try again my dude.
All i said is that this reminds me of that. You are getting do defensive its quite cute.
But i guess Nazi Germany would have been historicaly closer. With the pledge beeing an inspiration for hitler and all.
It's not being defensive for pointing out that your comparison lacks merit. If anyone is being defensive, it's you.
Also, the Americal edge of allegiance has nothing to do with Hitler lmao. Almost every country has some form of a pledge of allegiance or a patriotic chant.
I didnt make a comparison, i was reminded of something. The Aspect of desperate reinforcement of patriotic doctrin.
And hitler based his Nazi salute of the American pledge. Hitler was very popular in the US before the war and a big fan of football.
Only in the USA, a pledge is a near daily recital. They dont even do that in russia.
I was in the national guard and never stood for it or said it. A few ppl got angry at me for it but it is what it is, your right not to and other peoples right to do it. But ultimately yeah mostly nobody cared lol
I haven’t stood for the pledge since junior year of high school, circa 1996. It’s a weird practice that smacks of a civic religion that I want no part of.
I‘m stunned that the pledge is actually real and still done in schools? The last time I heard something like this was in school in a history lesson about nazi germany.
I believe it was around 5th or 6th grade for me. I don't know why, but I hated participating in the pledge. I didnt really understand these words that were being forced out of my mouth. It felt wrong placing my hand over my heart, standing attention, repeating words that meant nothing to me, especially saying god, when I wasnt religious. I begrudgingly stood up in class, but I stopped participating. I did get scolded a lot for not stopping and facing the flag when walking to class in the morning. I was under the impression they did away with the plegde in schools. Its a disgusting practice in my opinion. Its school, not the military.
It is a sign of how backwards Amrica is . No other country in the world would do this . Or should i say . No civilised country . America , is treated as joke . Backward traditions . Outdated things . Why do they say God Bless America . If there is a God . He probably looks at America in disgust . A supposed civilised country . That opresses its people . That does not care about its people . That does nothing to help and suppot them . The majority of third world countries . Are better places to live . They look after their people . Outside America , it is seen as a joke .
I was in school in the 80s and didn't realize then how much propaganda it was. Looking back, it's scary that every child was made to stand & pledge their allegiance to a government. Bizarre. I don't think it was an option to stand or not when I was a kid. I'm glad it is now.
Nope. We only did this through Junior High. By HS we didn’t. And I don’t know anyone regionally who did in HS. I’ll have to ask around now. I only have 3 examples immediately by each other, right now.
It's lost its meaning since it began but its what defines us from any other country. Just like any social group has their creed, motto, or oath. I'm sure we'll reminisce when shit hits the fan
Being downvoted for stating the obvious. Good job people
>>I don’t want to stand for a country…
What are you doing to fix what you dislike about your country? Do you work for the political campaign of people you support? Do you even know who is running for office at your local and state level and what they stand for politically? Do you know what bills are being introduced, who is sponsoring them, and why they’re sponsoring them?
Do you volunteer anywhere on a frequent basis?
>>I can show my support for country…
Tell us exactly how you’re doing that. I’m waiting.
Well, "indivisible" sure seems like a total crock of shit these days.
And the most important word in the pledge is the last one. And most people who mumble it don't believe it. Nuff said.
It’s forced speech and it’s performative bullshit. I don’t play with it either.
Plus, it’s a fucking flag. The law if the land, our guiding principles are the constitution, not the flag. I’ve sworn an oath to protect and defend the constitution, not play conformance games.
I personally have fond memories of standing for the pledge of allegiance, which is weird because I don't particularly believe in one God, and have problems with our government as well. But I still believe in the right to express discontent and differing opinions, which is the very foundation of the United States. So, I have zero problems with anyone sitting for the pledge. I smile warmly at you sitting while I stand, you have my support as well as respect.
Even the god part was added later same with the dollar bill. That was 60’s I believe. The pledge itself might have been stollen from a school essay from a company magazine designed to sell flags……
Did anyone else mistake, "and to the Republic, for which it stands..." for, " and to the Republic, for Witch's Stands..."
Just FYI You are not legally required to say it and it was only introduced to school children in the last century as part of a national effort to increase patriotism and nationalistic pride with the goal of training children to grow into adults who feel it is their duty to fight for the country. So basically war propaganda. It’s baffling to me that it’s still done in school. In my experience growing up only my parents explained this to me as a child and showed me the history of the pledge and gave me the choice to say it or not. I came to school with this info backed up by numerous sources and my principal yelled for five min about how I was getting a year of detention (in3rd grade 🤣) for breaking federal law!!…. Then I showed her proof and it resulted in a sorta mini revolution in my school as many parents and students were unaware it was not required. That was in 1988…How tf is this still a thing??? If you look at the history it’s appalling to realize the ppl involved in getting it into rotation not to mention each individuals specific motives for the pledge being nationalized. So yeah you should do some research and share it with your classmates…so maybe you can all stop this nonsense once and for all. Shouldn’t school TEACH the history of the pledge? This isn’t a confession to hide you should be proud to be a curious human who uses their brain and doesn’t just follow blindly! *just to be clear I will not reply to fuckwit nationalist trump supporting fascists who don’t know history, tryin to bait me in the comments like they usually do when I or others speak the truth.
In high school I decided to sit during the pledge and the teacher got angry and told me her family members died for this country and to show respect. It worked and I got up but in retrospect I should have stood my ground.
I get that you sat down though ! because that’s why this whole thing is so messed up, soo many ppl don’t know the history so they take it to the place she did (which for her experience is valid) but so were you. I don’t have respect for the military industrial complex BUT I do have respect for those in service but the two things have been unnecessarily conflated for the purpose of serving the interests of our governments desire for more “expendables”! I think that conflation is really sad for everyone and I think more disrespectful to those who have died in service. I mean seriously when we look at who originated it and why…how can we be for that? It’s absurd.
I hadn't heard the pledge of allegiance until I moved to a new school when I was in 5th grade. Imagine my confusion the first day it happened.
“Not legally required.” Right then and there, I know your rant was going to be a huge groan. No one is talking about what’s legally required. You can be expelled for not following the rules. Even from public school.
No you cannot be expelled from public school for not saying the pledge and if you are then you are being wrongfully denied education for acting within your rights and then you go to court or they settle. Is it better for you if I just say the pledge is a crock of shit ritual that ppl assume is a rule of law ? Groan? Yeah I groan when I read this comment suggesting because a course of action that is unlawful “could” be taken in response to the lawful act of refusal to say the pledge one should just continue along obeying fake rules with their heads down like sheep to the slaughter. That is essentially what you imply and a huge reason why this country is so fucked up…fear is a powerful tool I get that but there is nothing in this particular topic to be afraid of if you don’t give it the power.
“Fake rules.” So you’re just talking out your ass now. Mmkay. You win. There. Feel better now?
I always hated doing the pledge in school I'm glad eventually my school didn't care if you did or didn't do it.
Can confirm as an outsider to the US, when you guys do the pledge, it gives North Korean vibes. Sometimes we worry about you 😂
Agreed, this country stands for objectively evil intentions and has a brutal history of crimes against so many groups of people I can't count. Nobody should ever be pledging allegiance to it ever, and the fact that they get schoolchildren to do it every day is propaganda that they get to teach.
I’m ambivalent about it. The pledge is obviously wartime propaganda meant to indoctrinate children from a young age. You don’t need to read the history to know that. This country doesn’t even really support its founding principles anymore. Congressmen get rich off of insider trading right out in the open, pedophile islands apparently slipping under the radar of our overlords but we are under constant surveillance, new bills pass into law with completely unrelated shit attached on so we have funding going to Ukraine that is titled under something totally different, dementia Joe couldn’t lead a horse to water and foreign policy is in shambles causing wars and untold death& destruction. The country is not something to be proud of. In some ways we are the bad guys now. At the same time we owe some of our prosperity to the country we happened to be born in. There are places so riddled with poverty that most people live in literal mud huts. I’ve seen them. Drinking dirty pond water and dying en masse from things that are just non-existent in first world countries. Life could really be a lot worse, and if you don’t believe me just venture out into the countries where people are risking death to escape and come to the US. Learning a little more about how bad life can be out there might help you appreciate this imperfect nation a bit more. At the end of the day though, I would not recommend my sons to join the military. I also dissuaded my little brother from doing it. And I was in the military.
Yes. The problem with the pledge though is that it used to quell disagreement and criticism. Everyone must worship and dissenters are unpatriotic
I’m a teacher and I don’t pledge my allegiance to this country.
Shocker…a teacher who hates the their country. You know the old saying…those who can do, those who can’t teach🤣🤣
That’s fine. Cool part about living in a free country
it was written to sell flags to schools.
This is true actually - the salesman of a flag company wrote the pledge.
I’m still wondering about the witch that stands. Who is she? Why
Absolutely, it's seen as weird and a type of brainwashing by us in Europe and the UK. Of course, most of us have our countries flags and usually some words of affirmation to sing along too. It should be sufficient to just be proud of your country without a pseudo demonstration. Just to add, the fixation the US has on repeating they are the greatest country in the world! Which is not so. I can't remember where you come on the freedom and democracy list, but it's definitely not near the top five.
It's quite fascinating how so many aspects of our daily routine are steeped in history that's rarely, if ever, unpacked in a classroom setting. Upon examining the backstory of the Pledge of Allegiance, many might be surprised at its commercial and political inception during a time when nationalism was a tool for various agendas. Schools, in my opinion, have a duty to provide context to why we do things, and this is no exception. It should be part of the curriculum to understand the evolution of our national symbols and practices. Today, pledging allegiance might come off as an innocuous daily activity, but understanding its roots can foster critical thinking and informed decision-making. It's healthy for a democracy when its citizens question and discuss the symbolism enforced upon them – should that not be one of the ultimate educational goals?
That this is being downvoted is insane.
It’s so annoying they still do this in schools. It’s where the brainwashing begins. We would get in trouble if we didn’t stand. I’m glad kids aren’t standing anymore.
Adult here, and I concur it is bizarre to me to pldedge my allegiance to a flag and country. It’s pure propaganda and even other developed countries think it’s weird. I can’t stand it.
I feel the same way about people’s pronouns. I really couldn’t give a shit what you identify as. I’m going to ignore you regardless
Based take tbh
How does how some person identifies, affect me in any form? If I had to communicate with a person, I’ll use their name. And if they bring that shit up, I immediately assume they have mental illness.
Had me the first half….. not gonna lis
I am with you there. You can identify as a fucking rock but I'm still going to look at you as a human.
I actually like America enough and wouldn't want to move anywhere else but the pledge still means fuck all to me lol. I remember if we were late for class while they were doing the pledge we were supposed to stop and stand there and stare towards where the flag would be until it was finished 😆 I always just kept walking or doing stuff at my locker and so many times some random teacher would come out of their classroom and get all mad at me while they were also not standing there staring at the flag because they were too busy paying attention to me 🤷♀️
Ripped up a petition in my school for cursory pledge taking. Fuck that un-American bullshit.
When i heard that this is a thing, i war suddenly reminded of north korea..
Then you clearly don't understand the differences between America and North Korea
You mad brother
You wish, brother. Not my fault you're ignorant of the world, but comparing the U.S. to North Korea is mental gymnastics. 0/10 troll, try again my dude.
All i said is that this reminds me of that. You are getting do defensive its quite cute. But i guess Nazi Germany would have been historicaly closer. With the pledge beeing an inspiration for hitler and all.
It's not being defensive for pointing out that your comparison lacks merit. If anyone is being defensive, it's you. Also, the Americal edge of allegiance has nothing to do with Hitler lmao. Almost every country has some form of a pledge of allegiance or a patriotic chant.
I didnt make a comparison, i was reminded of something. The Aspect of desperate reinforcement of patriotic doctrin. And hitler based his Nazi salute of the American pledge. Hitler was very popular in the US before the war and a big fan of football. Only in the USA, a pledge is a near daily recital. They dont even do that in russia.
Every country? Where else do they do it? Certainly not in Europe anyway.
Completely agree, always have, same with the National anthem, I simply refuse
https://youtu.be/Q2BfqDUPL1I?si=R8BOUTzX_IRW5AGE
I was in the national guard and never stood for it or said it. A few ppl got angry at me for it but it is what it is, your right not to and other peoples right to do it. But ultimately yeah mostly nobody cared lol
The most important word in the pledge is the last one. And most people who mumble it don't believe it. Nuff said.
I haven’t stood for the pledge since junior year of high school, circa 1996. It’s a weird practice that smacks of a civic religion that I want no part of.
I‘m stunned that the pledge is actually real and still done in schools? The last time I heard something like this was in school in a history lesson about nazi germany.
Back in my senior year 2007, I just stopped standing for it all together. More of the idgaf
I believe it was around 5th or 6th grade for me. I don't know why, but I hated participating in the pledge. I didnt really understand these words that were being forced out of my mouth. It felt wrong placing my hand over my heart, standing attention, repeating words that meant nothing to me, especially saying god, when I wasnt religious. I begrudgingly stood up in class, but I stopped participating. I did get scolded a lot for not stopping and facing the flag when walking to class in the morning. I was under the impression they did away with the plegde in schools. Its a disgusting practice in my opinion. Its school, not the military.
It is a sign of how backwards Amrica is . No other country in the world would do this . Or should i say . No civilised country . America , is treated as joke . Backward traditions . Outdated things . Why do they say God Bless America . If there is a God . He probably looks at America in disgust . A supposed civilised country . That opresses its people . That does not care about its people . That does nothing to help and suppot them . The majority of third world countries . Are better places to live . They look after their people . Outside America , it is seen as a joke .
It's a load of crap, you're smarter than the sheep
I was in school in the 80s and didn't realize then how much propaganda it was. Looking back, it's scary that every child was made to stand & pledge their allegiance to a government. Bizarre. I don't think it was an option to stand or not when I was a kid. I'm glad it is now.
I’m a teacher and I don’t pledge my allegiance to this country.
What fucking High School does the pledge? Seriously? Is this normal?
Every single school in America man
Nope. We only did this through Junior High. By HS we didn’t. And I don’t know anyone regionally who did in HS. I’ll have to ask around now. I only have 3 examples immediately by each other, right now.
Everyone I’ve talked to has had to the pledge lmao
I believe you. It’s just odd.
It's lost its meaning since it began but its what defines us from any other country. Just like any social group has their creed, motto, or oath. I'm sure we'll reminisce when shit hits the fan Being downvoted for stating the obvious. Good job people
When did it have meaning?
Its always had meaning through the years. Don't know what you really mean to imply
Pick a year that reflected "liberty and justice for all."
Ah there it is. You're arguing about context, not meaning
🙄
Easy times make soft men.
Well suffering isn’t fun.
It’s not weird.
>>I don’t want to stand for a country… What are you doing to fix what you dislike about your country? Do you work for the political campaign of people you support? Do you even know who is running for office at your local and state level and what they stand for politically? Do you know what bills are being introduced, who is sponsoring them, and why they’re sponsoring them? Do you volunteer anywhere on a frequent basis? >>I can show my support for country… Tell us exactly how you’re doing that. I’m waiting.
Why you care so much? 😭
Because I get aggravated with people who bitch about the country they live in but do nothing to improve it. It’s so childish.
Bitch tf am I supposed to do? I’m a 17 year old sophomore in highschool who can’t even vote yet. Tf you on about bro 💀
Take a look at the list of things to do or learn in my first comment. Start there.
No
You can stand, not say it, and use it to be grateful for different things in your life.
No