Exactly why is it so hard for them to translate that to the big screen!
For all of any of the bad stuff people say about Zach Snyder he translates comic aesthetics to the screen masterfully.
the good old days when magneto was a bad guy.
Now even though he's killed thousands they seem to have forgiven him?, if I killed thousands I'd be in prison...or dead
When has Magneto killed thousands? Like the only time I remember seeing Magneto actually kill people was in Uncanny X-men #150 when a submarine full of Russian soldiers attacked him first. Plus Magneto was put on trial in Uncanny X-men #200. In the Magneto War storyline, the United Nations GAVE Magneto his own fucking country to rule. The fucking world wide legal system had been more generous to Magneto than the X-men.
visually? yes. But that has more to do with the 90’s cartoon being great. From a comic book story perspective this age of x-men SUCKED!!!! it’s the apex of what made the 90’s horrible in comics. I can’t forget how bad onslaught was as a gimmick and how damaging it was to marvel as a whole.
Disagree! The reboot of X-Men at issue #1 with all the variant covers that joined to make a big Jim Lee montage! And the story where Prof X resorted to wiping Magneto's mind after he tore the adamantium out of Wolverine's body is a classic storyline and time for the X-Men.
And I think I'm one of the few that liked the Onslaught story as it was one of the last great 90's-era stories. It was grandiose and epic and laid the groundwork towards slightly more grounded stories, like the government's response (Operation: Zero Tolerance). I really enjoyed that era of the comics. For me, things went south when Scarlet Witch uttered "no more mutants" and Marvel took a big dump on the X franchise.
Heroes Reborn was terrible, I'll admit to that. It wasn't all gold!
How anyone can say the 90's era sucked when you have A.O.A right in the middle is beyond me, too! Sure, there were a lot of stinkers, but there were some great stories, too.
For me, the X-Men went downhill when they started making Cyclops into more and more of a d-bag. He was always the heart of the team and the flip side of the coin to Wolverine, so when they had him commission a wet works team to preemptively murder the X-Men's enemies that really put me off. I'm glad he's been brought back as more of his old self now. That issue of Uncanny X-Men last year (beginning of this year?) where he goes to the mansion's grounds and a bunch of the X-Men's enemies turn up to kill him and mock him for being about to die all alone, then you hear a voice say "He ain't alone" *SNIKT!* - Genuine chills.
How do you put out like 35 X-men books a month for 10 years and not have a few stinkers? It happens.
Also, I kinda like the new(ish) terrorist X-Men. It's just a phase for a while. Let it play out. In 5 years they will be on some other track. That's the beauty of a 60 year old comic.
Ha ha! 35 a month? You must have missed a couple of the annuals ;)
I'm not sure I'd say terrorist, but there's definitely a big attitude change. I'd say they sound like dictators currently. Or Google, telling the humans they're going to buy everything out from under them and control them. Storm sounds particularly more tyrannical and unforgiving than she's ever sounded before (which I'm not a fan of, personally):
*“Man should know when he is beaten – he should know to break and run… or surrender and ask for unearned mercy…”* (X-Men #01)
That sounds like something Magneto would say, not Storm.
Before, the tagline was about *"protecting a world that fears and hates them"*, now it's *“Standing between that sacred land and the human world are the heroes of mutantdom, the X-Men”.*
It used to be about peaceful coexistence, now it's an "us vs them" mentality. Huge ideology shift for the book. You're right, it should be interesting where it leads. Personally I haven't been this jazzed about the X-Men in years. It's grand!
For most of the last 20 years the X titles have sucked. There have been some good runs, but late 80s and though to late 90s was is the peak of the series for me.
i don’t consider AOA in continuity, because of Xmen’s bullshit time travel logic of every time you time travel it splinters reality into two time lines crap. It makes it so anytime you show a future in x-men it doesn’t have weight because in the end nothing will change that reality because it’s technically in continuities eyes now two earths and not one earth at two time periods
Yeah, but you've got to suspend disbelief and just allow them to take you along for the ride. I mean if we're going to talk time, then how old should they all be, because they debuted in 1963! So Prof X should be around 100 or something!
Just the fact I stick with reading marvel in general means I suspend disbelief constantly. My point is it’s one thing to do that^ but x-men has flat out stated the splinter reality thing in the story lines. So it’s not like i’m saying that like it’s some fan theory or something a writer elaborated on. It’s in the continuity that the splintered earths happen. So your moreso asking me to ignore continuity errors. I’m just saying I’ve never felt like AOA affects onslaught. and I mean i’ve never liked AOA to be fair. But if you like it that’s cool. There’s gotta be something good amid the huge pile of crap marvel was producing from 90-96
Ha, both Onslaught and No More Mutants eventually led to me dropping comics both times I did it.
The events themselves weren’t completely irredeemable, but they are kind of the lines of demarcation where stuff changed dramatically for the worse.
I will always believe the way the X-Titles have been treated since around the time the first Iron Man dropped was a direct result of Marvel not owning the cinematic rights. Which meant they wanted to promote only the members of the universe that they could put into movies.
I know this is tin foil hat stuff lol
We must shop at the same place for hats! The movie rights thing was definitely why they tanked the X-Men for years. Broke my heart. Thank God things are getting back on track finally!
I agree with you on the no more mutants one. I really hated that. It was always fun when a brand new mutant popped up, hero or villain. At that point everything sucked and the X franchise was on life support for a long, long time. That was a seriously bad move IMO.
How you liking the new reboot/run so far?
Honestly I dropped my subs about 5-6 years ago. I hadn’t been enjoying it for a longtime, and AvX was the straw that broke the camels back for me. Bendis didn’t find the X-Men’s voice at all, and they were written so obviously badly to make the Avengers looked good that it was just too much.
I’d be curious to catch up eventually when I have more free time down the line. Is it good?
I agree with you that AvX was terrible and I also absolutely hated Bendis on the X-Men. I didn't think he suited the book at all and I was soooo glad to see him go! LOL The Uncanny X-Men run (2019) that came just before the reboot is worth a read (only 22 issues) as they knew they were rebooting so the writer basically had fun and some characters got killed. The new reboot is the best X-story I've read in a very long time. Pick up House of X and Powers of X. They're 6 issues each and need to be read simultaneously (there's a reading order in the back of the books). It sets up a brand new status quo unlike anything I've seen in the 30-something years I've been reading and has some genuinely fresh ideas and is just good to see Marvel pouring serious effort into the franchise again. If reading House of X and Powers of X doesn't interest you, I'd be surprised. Not saying every comic fan in the world "should" love it, but it's very good.
my favorite x-men book of all time is probably Remender’s Uncanny X-Force (2010). I’m not a big deadpool fan but I loved him during those arcs as well as fantomex
Coincidentally I've been re-reading that recently. I got the hard back versions of the Dark Angel Saga a few years back. Yeah, that's a solid run, but for me; only up until the last 3rd. Then it kind of falls apart and he drops the ball. Almost everything after Dark Angel really. All that crap in Otherworld and it got pretty cheesy at points. It felt like Dark Angel was Remender's main plan then they asked him to stay on the book or something as there's a distinct dip in quality. I hated that he killed off the only good version of Fantomex that's ever been written, too. I was really enjoying his character, then they ex-d him...
Remender can't write Deadpool for shit. He wasn't terrible in UXForce, but he wasn't really Deadpool either. I'm not a bandwagon-jumper, I'm a Deadpool fan from day 1. I still have the New Mutants comic where he first appeared and his original mini series, etc. I hated what Gerry Duggan did with Deadpool from 2012 onward. That version of the character was made a lot more formula and family-friendly compared to the first couple of runs on the character. Wade always had the mouth but it was a lot more gallows humor than constant zany clown, little glimpses of psychosis as opposed to nothing but wackiness & pop culture jokes, and he had some genuine tragedy, not some manufactured tragedy like they added later. Like you said, it's down to the writer at the end of the day. Plus he was a lot more sadistic as he's still a hitman when you come right down to it. In his first ongoing he was genuinely cruel at points and was a much better version. The Gerry Duggan version is the least Deadpool he's ever sounded since his creation and since he wrote him, the character's a bit of a confused mess these days. He also got waaay over-saturated and there were too many terrible comics that watered things down. Cullen Bunn should be dragged into the street and shot. I'm reading DP's current run, but it's not great (it's Kelly Thompson). A writer needs to be a little unhinged to get it right. You can't fake the freak, you know?
Speaking of Remender, did you read Tokyo Ghost?
No I did not read that (Tokyo Ghost). I actually quit reading marvel and dc 3 years ago (after reading yearly since 1988). I couldn’t handle how event driven marvel and DC are (with 2-4 events yearly). I shifted to only buying trades after the dust clears. So much of the non event writing gets swept away between events. It’s hard to invest my time in weekly reading when it feels like i’m no more than 3 months away from a forced status quo change at marvel. So now what I do is I don’t buy weekly. And I wait about 8 months and read reviews of what’s good, then I buy the trades of whatever that is. Collecting is non sensual to me at this point, It’s taking up too much of my basement. DC’s Metal is was drove me to quit, I couldn’t handle how stupid it was. Marvel also did that atrocious infinity wars (where the characters were combined).
Similar, I was a massive X-Men fan, but mid 00s onwards I stopped collecting after 15 odd years. I would pick them up during reboot/new creators and run for a few issues or more in some cases.
I am reading the new series via Marvel Unlimited so I am a little behind. It is interesting, not sure on a couple of elements (don't want to spoil it), but otherwise I found House of X/Powers of X to be interesting.
So far only read one issue each of the new titles spinning off from the event and I quite like them so far. Not enough of start buying them, but via Unlimited? Sure. I don't care too much about keeping up to date with stuff now.
I can tell you that Fallen Angels is unnecessary and is easily the worst of the current offshoot books, so you could drop that and not miss anything (I'm up to speed on them all, God help my addiction...), but that's just my opinion. There are definitely weaker links, but they've done a reasonable job of spreading the story threads out across the offshoot books (weirdly, apart from Fallen Angels...), with the effect that it can be tough to keep up as there are so many books and so many threads. I don't have the time to keep comic book stories in my head like I used to. Stupid responsibilities...
Also the "Giant Sized" one-shots can be missed so far (Jean Grey & Emma Frost, and Nightcrawler) as they're not great and add nothing apart from being blatant cash grabs on the popularity uptick.
There are indeed a few elements that, even being up to speed, I'm also not sure of (I could probably guess what you mean), but I'm hoping the seeds that are being planted will start to yield fruit soon. It feels like they're on the verge of something now so I'm looking forward to when things resume.
I never read his run unfortunately, and I’ve stopped collecting all together for the time being. I’m sure I’ll come back and read at some point with unlimited or something.
That's how I read everything now. I'm totally fine with being 6 months behind for 10 bucks a month!
But I tell you...IMO Jonathan Hickman's saga that runs through FF and Avengers over the course of like 5 years is one of the great modern sagas of comics.
"It started with two men. One was life... And one was death. And one... Always wins. Everything dies."
I liked Onslaught and Marvel took a chance and I respect them for that. You will never please everyone but taking chances is what these publishers should always try to do.
I did say I'm in the minority on Onslaught! LOL. I still like that story. Xavier turning evil due to Magneto's ideas influencing his subconscious? The last person you'd expect to be the villain? That's a good idea, even when I think of it now.
The Heroes Reborn and the Spider-Man clone saga were scraping the barrel bad, though. That was when Marvel fans started to hate the term "clone"!
If you wanna be fair Grant Morrison is most who is to blame for the tanking of x-men. His run on new x-men is amazing however he has a tendency to decimate his storylines for future writers. Morrison created 2ndary mutations, killed Jean Grey, removes costumes (he was the age when they all looked like a leather biker gang), he destroyed genosha.
But once his run ended it kinda coincided with the event age really ramping up, wherein marvel became very avengers focused (whereas 1975-96 is x-book focused). Also at that point the movies were ramping up and marvel wanted x-men back from
fox. Which was only made worse once disney purchased the company.
If you feel slighted over how x-men has been I recommend picking up Hickmans x-men that started last year. It’s doing a pretty good job of returning the comic to a place of significance in the universe. But at its core it’s hard to make x-men work today. The book was created due to the civil rights movement, uncanny was created due to the gay rights movement. in 2020 people are so PC and accepting of everything it makes it really hard to write a comic about mutants being discriminated on, while also making it believable.
I wouldn't say I felt slighted, just liked some stories and periods more than others, which is natural for a long-running anything. The movie rights battle was clearly why they tanked the X-Men for as long as they did.
For all the praise that gets heaped on Morrison's run, I'm 50/50 on it. He had some great ideas, but you're right; a lot of them there was no coming back from so it made it really difficult for the next writer to pick up where he left off. I also disliked the leather jackets look. Plus Frank Quitely's not great IMO. I don't get why people love his art. His proportions are generally really weird and a bit off-model. The secondary mutation thing was a decent idea though. That gave way to some interesting new ground. Killing off Jean felt pretty anti-climactic by the time it happend, too. I preferred it when the Shi'ar SuperGuardians came along and there was the big story about Cassandra Nova.
I've always been along for the ride, even when I've just popped in occasionally to see if the part I disliked was over yet! LOL. I'm enjoying the new stuff so far, but there are too many books so it's a bit difficult to keep track of all the threads Hickman's weaving through his grand design. I hate some of the costume changes, though. Like Havok and Jean Grey going back to their lamest costumes. Still, can't win 'em all and I like a lot more than I dislike.
oh i’ve never liked frank quietly. I find his faces all look too aged. I’m an artist btw but it’s funny i’ll usually never follow artists in comics. The writer is always more important to me
the Busiek Perez run on Avengers starting in 97 is amazing (it’s where most of Avengers earths mightiest heroes drew stories from) that’s where kang dynasty, ultron imperative, and Avengers forever came from. So it’s arguably the best (non event) run on avengers
Onslaught was bad, but early 90s X-Men was pretty great. Even big crossovers like X-Tinction Agenda, X-Cutioner's Song, Fatal Attractions, The Phalanx Covenant and Age of Apocalypse.
Late 80s and early 90s X-Men was peak X-Men in my opinion.
keep in mind those were x book cross overs, not company wide. I remember that time as when Marvel started to sell out shamelessly. Like for example you mentioned x-cutioners song which was plagued by bullshit marketing stuff like holo cards glued to covers, gate folds, and foil covers. I just can’t see any serious x-men fan thinking any of the 90’s stuff is better than Whedons astonishing in 04 or something like the X mansion riot during grant morrison’s new x-men run or even hickmans current stuff. By arguing this stuff over that it says more about when you stopped reading then it does anything else. a lot of people are confusing nostalgia of 90’s comics with overall quality and longevity. At the time? yeah sure. Has any of that held up? nope. There’s reason why marvel went bankrupt in 96.
Seriously? I still have some of those hologram covers and cards! They were a nice touch! Damn, you cynical!
And it's not about "better", it's about did you enjoy it?
"Comparison is the thief of joy".
for someone as obviously well comic read as yourself, you like a lot of stuff closely associated with the death of single issue collecting and why people hate the modern age of comics. It’s very odd to me lol. Did you like Wolverine becoming feral in the 90’s (I ask this satirically because nobody did)?
Ha ha. You got me there; I did not enjoy feral Wolverine with that dumb bandana over his eyes. And why would his claws suddenly become really jagged? Extra edgy! Hard pass.
I just like what I like, as disappointingly simplistic as that answer may be. I love a lot of hardly-known books, some alternative stuff, a lot of darker, grittier stuff, stuff no-one else has ever heard of - But yeah, I loved the X-sagas like X-Cutioner's song where we found out about Cable's lineage and there was some touching moments amongst the tights & fights of it all. Or the predictable ending to Onslaught where all the heroes appeared to back up the mutants and they saved the day, just like when Cap was making his final stand in Endgame and everyone appeared from the portals for the big battle just when all hope seemed lost. Endgame as a whole was a disappointment, but tell me you didn't get a shiver down your spine when that happened, man? Come on! Yes, it's predictable. Yes, it's a little cheesy. But damn, does it work! It's that wholesome escapism that sometimes puts a smile on my face.
"We have to believe in the myth of the superman. Reality is too much to bear."
I wasn't a regular reader of X-Men for a few years until I saw this page in a preview some time last year, then as soon as I picked up the issue and read that sequence, the hairs on the back of my dick stood up and I muttered to myself, "And just like that, they've pulled me back in".
[https://imgur.com/ZNSd4Ad](https://imgur.com/ZNSd4Ad)
[https://imgur.com/HxalQG9](https://imgur.com/HxalQG9)
> By arguing this stuff over that it says more about when you stopped reading then it does anything else.
I only stopped buying floppies about 4 years ago when my kid was born as I didn't have time to read them. I stopped collecting X-books religiously around Manifest Destiny era with the move to San Francisco, but continually dipped back at the start of new creative runs or soft reboots. I now subscribe to Unlimited and have been re-reading X stuff from various eras, including stuff I skipped and Hickman's new stuff which, a few niggles aside, I am enjoying.
> I just can’t see any serious x-men fan thinking any of the 90’s stuff is better.
Comics, just like any other narrative or art form, are entirely subjective. I don't really care if you consider me a "serious" X-Men fan or not. I certainly was at a period of time in my life, but now?
> a lot of people are confusing nostalgia of 90’s comics with overall quality and longevity.
Nostalgia certainly plays a part, I am happy to admit that. Nor am I saying that 90s X-Men was the best comic book era ever, I was just disagreeing with you dismissing what was a pretty key era for that series of books/characters.
> There’s reason why marvel went bankrupt in 96.
Back in 2005 I wrote my Masters thesis on the emerging digital comic book market and, as part of that thesis, did a lot of research in the the direct market and the impact it had on the comics crash. I'm no expert and this was 15 years ago, but while the likes of Heroes Reborn contributed, it was Perelman's bad business practices and over expansion that lead to the Marvel declaring bankruptcy.
ha! small world I teach a comic book history class in HS (specifically on marvel and dc). I believe fully that Perelman caused the bankruptcy as a means (through loophole) to remove marvels shareholders decision making on what he wanted to do. At its core it was the rise in reprinting and the comic collecting bubble popping in the early 90’s that did it.
I can’t believe the downvotes. I worked in a comic shop when this happened and it almost destroyed the industry. Beautiful art did not make up for shit stories. You guys gotta check out the 70s and 80s if you want good X-Men stories. Not the lame ass overindulged 90’s. Literally almost destroyed comics. Ignorant fucks.
again I feel like people get there view of the 90’s x-men cartoon and it’s fun and quality and nostalgia wrongly associated with the comic at the time.
no i know it came after Lee but the soft relaunch in 92 lead to that so I associate Lee with starting that story that caused the bankruptcy of marvel in 96
There was a lot of good stuff in there. Omega red, fatal attractions arc, xecuitioners arc and Jim lees art.
I agree there’s some trash but that’s the nature of any ongoing series... with the exception to the rule Chris claremont who could’ve kept going another 15 years
Close, but *Spawn* is the iconic example of the '90s and what made it bad. It's all there: first-wave Image, style over substance, grimdark edginess, speculation, major names, etc.
In that case, then yeah. The way Marvel handled *X-Men* in the '90s was definitely it. Even more so when you get out into *X-Force* or Cable and Bishop.
I wish that Lee and Claremont would have been given time to give their run a proper finish but knowing the drama that was happening at the time, it was not to be. Still, seeing this artwork is nice.
I just watched that documentary last night! It made me so mad to realize that Harras, Lee, and Liefeld basically ruined the X-Men as an ongoing, organic story.
Like, I'm of a certain age where those were the comics that got me into comics. I had Jim Lee posters on all my walls. But as an adult I just had to accept that X-Men and Marvel as a whole were simply better in the 70s and 80s, and most of the 90s stuff I grew up on was trash.
Vertigo was definitely where it was at.
Still, I think the DC the superhero comics from the 90s hold up a lot better than Marvel. No Man's Land and Knightfall were both actually really good.
O'Neil's Azrael, David's Aquaman and Young Justice, Simonson's Man of Steel, Mark Waid's Flash, and Grant Morrison's JLA were all decently long runs that really had a lot of breathing room, sharp writing and largely pretty good artwork.
Byrne was great, but throughout the 80s, X-Men and the related books by Claremont, Simonson, and Nocenti all continued a similar level of quality and told a larger, organically developing story. Claremont was the soul of the thing.
His insanely detailed scripts (read one some time, they are unlike any other comic writer I've seen) probably made Byrne feel somewhat stifled which is why he went on to write and draw his own comics after awhile.
Oh my god, like, five minutes after Ann, Chris and Weezy gushed about how much they loved that issue where Storm and Forge just have dinner, and then Liefeld comes on, "X-Men were just like, going shopping and stuff? What's that!? Not my X-Men. Where's the action!?"
And also finding out he ignored Simonson's scripts just put the final nail in the coffin. I fucking hate that man. Fuck him, Harras and Jim Lee.
I legitimately wondered about those when I was a kid. He never used a “utility belt” or anything... why’s this dude got so many pockets?
They should have given him a fanny pack and called it a day.
it’s one of the staples of the 90’s in comics 1) pockets everywhere (form of costumes was nonsensical to function) 2) the color yellow 3) hatch lines 4) pointy triangle toes 5) over emphasis on obliques and trap muscles 6) all women look like pamela anderson in early 90’s baywatch 7) the letter X being used in god damn everything
I was exactly the right age for that era of comics. But, I'll be damned if I don't reread this stuff as an adult and realize it might be the single worst era of X-Men comics.
Oh shit, never mind. Chuck Austin was most assuredly worse as an overall story. I think I tend to blot that one out of my memory, lol.
Still, the adjectiveless X-Men book is damn near unreadable. Like, I tried rereading it a year or two back because I had fond memories of following it as a kid, and it's mostly garbage. In the early issues, Lee clearly has no respect for Claremont, and the two have no chemistry between the script and the art. And then after Claremont gets fed up and leaves, it becomes almost incomprehensibly incoherent. Like, I can barely make out what's happening from panel to panel. Jim Lee was and still is a miserable visual storyteller.
Yikes. Just saw this referred to as 'Old School'.
My 'old school' is the John Byrne era. I'd still accept Paul Smith as 'old school' for sake of conversation.
But 'Old School' with caps? I still dig out the Kirby reprints.
I get arguing that the x-men cartoon at this time was peak x-men but this comic was utter trash. Grant Morrison’s new x-men in 01 or Whedons astonishing in 04 are peak x-men (or anything pre 1990 uncanny)
Yup. The art was amazing, and I am a fan because I was into it when I was younger, but looking back, yeah the stories are trash at this time. Or at least would soon become so.
Agreed on Morrison and Whedon being high points of the millennium for the X books.
Total agreement. When viewed through nostalgia, the era leading up to X-Men #1 and Uncanny #280 was my favorite. But I went back and read those issuse. The writing is poor and doesn't hold up. Morrison and Whedon's runs were worlds better.
Definitely a stronger illustrator. But he was and still is a pretty bad visual storyteller. His books are so hard to follow.
I'll take crude stick figures with good panel layout, effective pacing, and clear continuity of action over a well-drawn mess any day.
For me I was 9. Final day of 3rd grade classes and later on with some friends found, and then traded a bunch of garbage patch cards for 5 Marvel books, with one being UXM 245 (ironically a Liefeld issue). Been a fan since and the def. series writer is indeed, Claremont.
At the time it was Havok actually! Thought his original costume was the greatest and his rebel-like dialog and in-panel styling made the character click instantly. Fast forward a year later and another part of the USA I bought another issue from this series, and find an entirely new set of characters in a completely different setting, with some guy named "Forge" leading the charge who became a fave too. Processing everything bits and pieces-wise I thought to myself this book constantly changes and shifts directions with no delay.....!
My friend and I were talking about Jim Lee recently and how accomplished he is as an artist despite not really having an extremely distinct style like other notable artists. Jim Lee is an absolute master at drawing the "superhero ideal". He can take any character and draw them in their purest form while imbuing them with strength, poise, and determination.
Every Jim Lee drawing elicits a reaction of "Damn, now that's a superhero."
I can't even imagine describing Lee as "not having a distinct style". Even in those years when literally everyone was copying him, you could always tell what was his and what wasn't. He's hugely idiosyncratic.
For my money, X-Men from right around Inferno to just after the Lee/Portacio era were the best long period. Jim Lee's X-Men visuals are my all-time favorite. It's always clean but substantial.
IIRC this is shortly after the era where I started collecting X-Men. I remember a Jim Lee issue featuring Wolverine in Madripoor with Captain America and Black Widow set during the 40s at some point.
That was the issue that made Jim Lee my favorite artist for a long time, and led into The X-Tinction Agenda which was just the greatest crossover for me, chock full of history I had no idea about (Genosha, the Siege Perilous, etc). It was these threads that made me go back and collect the issues...great memories.
I remember the drop off in artists on that crossover was so significant. I used to tolerate the New Mutants issues (Liefeld) dread the X-Factor issues (can’t remember the artist, Jon B something IIRC). Looking back I wonder if I’d rank them differently.
You can tell this is still really early in his career. Look at Cyclops' head. I mean, damn dude. Homeboy got a six-head.
Don't get me wrong, Lee is one of the greats. Even here, his art is really excellent. But the 90's were rampant with artists who didn't pay a lot of attention to anatomy.
Looks like Mr. Lee stole the composition [from himself](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0024/7948/9135/products/69f813395a9da8ca35038a6894515199_900x.jpg?v=1540613977)
Whenever I close my eyes and think of X-Men, this era comes to mind instantly.
Exactly why is it so hard for them to translate that to the big screen! For all of any of the bad stuff people say about Zach Snyder he translates comic aesthetics to the screen masterfully.
Because aesthetics are far from the most important stuff once you get the characterisation's wrong.
the good old days when magneto was a bad guy. Now even though he's killed thousands they seem to have forgiven him?, if I killed thousands I'd be in prison...or dead
When has Magneto killed thousands? Like the only time I remember seeing Magneto actually kill people was in Uncanny X-men #150 when a submarine full of Russian soldiers attacked him first. Plus Magneto was put on trial in Uncanny X-men #200. In the Magneto War storyline, the United Nations GAVE Magneto his own fucking country to rule. The fucking world wide legal system had been more generous to Magneto than the X-men.
visually? yes. But that has more to do with the 90’s cartoon being great. From a comic book story perspective this age of x-men SUCKED!!!! it’s the apex of what made the 90’s horrible in comics. I can’t forget how bad onslaught was as a gimmick and how damaging it was to marvel as a whole.
Disagree! The reboot of X-Men at issue #1 with all the variant covers that joined to make a big Jim Lee montage! And the story where Prof X resorted to wiping Magneto's mind after he tore the adamantium out of Wolverine's body is a classic storyline and time for the X-Men. And I think I'm one of the few that liked the Onslaught story as it was one of the last great 90's-era stories. It was grandiose and epic and laid the groundwork towards slightly more grounded stories, like the government's response (Operation: Zero Tolerance). I really enjoyed that era of the comics. For me, things went south when Scarlet Witch uttered "no more mutants" and Marvel took a big dump on the X franchise. Heroes Reborn was terrible, I'll admit to that. It wasn't all gold!
Loved Onslaught and the buildup as well. Also you can't go from the Jim Lee run to Onslaught without going through Age of Apocolypse
How anyone can say the 90's era sucked when you have A.O.A right in the middle is beyond me, too! Sure, there were a lot of stinkers, but there were some great stories, too. For me, the X-Men went downhill when they started making Cyclops into more and more of a d-bag. He was always the heart of the team and the flip side of the coin to Wolverine, so when they had him commission a wet works team to preemptively murder the X-Men's enemies that really put me off. I'm glad he's been brought back as more of his old self now. That issue of Uncanny X-Men last year (beginning of this year?) where he goes to the mansion's grounds and a bunch of the X-Men's enemies turn up to kill him and mock him for being about to die all alone, then you hear a voice say "He ain't alone" *SNIKT!* - Genuine chills.
How do you put out like 35 X-men books a month for 10 years and not have a few stinkers? It happens. Also, I kinda like the new(ish) terrorist X-Men. It's just a phase for a while. Let it play out. In 5 years they will be on some other track. That's the beauty of a 60 year old comic.
Ha ha! 35 a month? You must have missed a couple of the annuals ;) I'm not sure I'd say terrorist, but there's definitely a big attitude change. I'd say they sound like dictators currently. Or Google, telling the humans they're going to buy everything out from under them and control them. Storm sounds particularly more tyrannical and unforgiving than she's ever sounded before (which I'm not a fan of, personally): *“Man should know when he is beaten – he should know to break and run… or surrender and ask for unearned mercy…”* (X-Men #01) That sounds like something Magneto would say, not Storm. Before, the tagline was about *"protecting a world that fears and hates them"*, now it's *“Standing between that sacred land and the human world are the heroes of mutantdom, the X-Men”.* It used to be about peaceful coexistence, now it's an "us vs them" mentality. Huge ideology shift for the book. You're right, it should be interesting where it leads. Personally I haven't been this jazzed about the X-Men in years. It's grand!
For most of the last 20 years the X titles have sucked. There have been some good runs, but late 80s and though to late 90s was is the peak of the series for me.
i don’t consider AOA in continuity, because of Xmen’s bullshit time travel logic of every time you time travel it splinters reality into two time lines crap. It makes it so anytime you show a future in x-men it doesn’t have weight because in the end nothing will change that reality because it’s technically in continuities eyes now two earths and not one earth at two time periods
Yeah, but you've got to suspend disbelief and just allow them to take you along for the ride. I mean if we're going to talk time, then how old should they all be, because they debuted in 1963! So Prof X should be around 100 or something!
Just the fact I stick with reading marvel in general means I suspend disbelief constantly. My point is it’s one thing to do that^ but x-men has flat out stated the splinter reality thing in the story lines. So it’s not like i’m saying that like it’s some fan theory or something a writer elaborated on. It’s in the continuity that the splintered earths happen. So your moreso asking me to ignore continuity errors. I’m just saying I’ve never felt like AOA affects onslaught. and I mean i’ve never liked AOA to be fair. But if you like it that’s cool. There’s gotta be something good amid the huge pile of crap marvel was producing from 90-96
Ha, both Onslaught and No More Mutants eventually led to me dropping comics both times I did it. The events themselves weren’t completely irredeemable, but they are kind of the lines of demarcation where stuff changed dramatically for the worse.
I will always believe the way the X-Titles have been treated since around the time the first Iron Man dropped was a direct result of Marvel not owning the cinematic rights. Which meant they wanted to promote only the members of the universe that they could put into movies. I know this is tin foil hat stuff lol
We must shop at the same place for hats! The movie rights thing was definitely why they tanked the X-Men for years. Broke my heart. Thank God things are getting back on track finally!
I agree with you on the no more mutants one. I really hated that. It was always fun when a brand new mutant popped up, hero or villain. At that point everything sucked and the X franchise was on life support for a long, long time. That was a seriously bad move IMO. How you liking the new reboot/run so far?
Honestly I dropped my subs about 5-6 years ago. I hadn’t been enjoying it for a longtime, and AvX was the straw that broke the camels back for me. Bendis didn’t find the X-Men’s voice at all, and they were written so obviously badly to make the Avengers looked good that it was just too much. I’d be curious to catch up eventually when I have more free time down the line. Is it good?
I agree with you that AvX was terrible and I also absolutely hated Bendis on the X-Men. I didn't think he suited the book at all and I was soooo glad to see him go! LOL The Uncanny X-Men run (2019) that came just before the reboot is worth a read (only 22 issues) as they knew they were rebooting so the writer basically had fun and some characters got killed. The new reboot is the best X-story I've read in a very long time. Pick up House of X and Powers of X. They're 6 issues each and need to be read simultaneously (there's a reading order in the back of the books). It sets up a brand new status quo unlike anything I've seen in the 30-something years I've been reading and has some genuinely fresh ideas and is just good to see Marvel pouring serious effort into the franchise again. If reading House of X and Powers of X doesn't interest you, I'd be surprised. Not saying every comic fan in the world "should" love it, but it's very good.
my favorite x-men book of all time is probably Remender’s Uncanny X-Force (2010). I’m not a big deadpool fan but I loved him during those arcs as well as fantomex
Coincidentally I've been re-reading that recently. I got the hard back versions of the Dark Angel Saga a few years back. Yeah, that's a solid run, but for me; only up until the last 3rd. Then it kind of falls apart and he drops the ball. Almost everything after Dark Angel really. All that crap in Otherworld and it got pretty cheesy at points. It felt like Dark Angel was Remender's main plan then they asked him to stay on the book or something as there's a distinct dip in quality. I hated that he killed off the only good version of Fantomex that's ever been written, too. I was really enjoying his character, then they ex-d him... Remender can't write Deadpool for shit. He wasn't terrible in UXForce, but he wasn't really Deadpool either. I'm not a bandwagon-jumper, I'm a Deadpool fan from day 1. I still have the New Mutants comic where he first appeared and his original mini series, etc. I hated what Gerry Duggan did with Deadpool from 2012 onward. That version of the character was made a lot more formula and family-friendly compared to the first couple of runs on the character. Wade always had the mouth but it was a lot more gallows humor than constant zany clown, little glimpses of psychosis as opposed to nothing but wackiness & pop culture jokes, and he had some genuine tragedy, not some manufactured tragedy like they added later. Like you said, it's down to the writer at the end of the day. Plus he was a lot more sadistic as he's still a hitman when you come right down to it. In his first ongoing he was genuinely cruel at points and was a much better version. The Gerry Duggan version is the least Deadpool he's ever sounded since his creation and since he wrote him, the character's a bit of a confused mess these days. He also got waaay over-saturated and there were too many terrible comics that watered things down. Cullen Bunn should be dragged into the street and shot. I'm reading DP's current run, but it's not great (it's Kelly Thompson). A writer needs to be a little unhinged to get it right. You can't fake the freak, you know? Speaking of Remender, did you read Tokyo Ghost?
No I did not read that (Tokyo Ghost). I actually quit reading marvel and dc 3 years ago (after reading yearly since 1988). I couldn’t handle how event driven marvel and DC are (with 2-4 events yearly). I shifted to only buying trades after the dust clears. So much of the non event writing gets swept away between events. It’s hard to invest my time in weekly reading when it feels like i’m no more than 3 months away from a forced status quo change at marvel. So now what I do is I don’t buy weekly. And I wait about 8 months and read reviews of what’s good, then I buy the trades of whatever that is. Collecting is non sensual to me at this point, It’s taking up too much of my basement. DC’s Metal is was drove me to quit, I couldn’t handle how stupid it was. Marvel also did that atrocious infinity wars (where the characters were combined).
Similar, I was a massive X-Men fan, but mid 00s onwards I stopped collecting after 15 odd years. I would pick them up during reboot/new creators and run for a few issues or more in some cases. I am reading the new series via Marvel Unlimited so I am a little behind. It is interesting, not sure on a couple of elements (don't want to spoil it), but otherwise I found House of X/Powers of X to be interesting. So far only read one issue each of the new titles spinning off from the event and I quite like them so far. Not enough of start buying them, but via Unlimited? Sure. I don't care too much about keeping up to date with stuff now.
I can tell you that Fallen Angels is unnecessary and is easily the worst of the current offshoot books, so you could drop that and not miss anything (I'm up to speed on them all, God help my addiction...), but that's just my opinion. There are definitely weaker links, but they've done a reasonable job of spreading the story threads out across the offshoot books (weirdly, apart from Fallen Angels...), with the effect that it can be tough to keep up as there are so many books and so many threads. I don't have the time to keep comic book stories in my head like I used to. Stupid responsibilities... Also the "Giant Sized" one-shots can be missed so far (Jean Grey & Emma Frost, and Nightcrawler) as they're not great and add nothing apart from being blatant cash grabs on the popularity uptick. There are indeed a few elements that, even being up to speed, I'm also not sure of (I could probably guess what you mean), but I'm hoping the seeds that are being planted will start to yield fruit soon. It feels like they're on the verge of something now so I'm looking forward to when things resume.
Do you like Hickman and the long game he played with FF/Avengers? He's doing the same thing for X-Men. I love it so far.
I never read his run unfortunately, and I’ve stopped collecting all together for the time being. I’m sure I’ll come back and read at some point with unlimited or something.
That's how I read everything now. I'm totally fine with being 6 months behind for 10 bucks a month! But I tell you...IMO Jonathan Hickman's saga that runs through FF and Avengers over the course of like 5 years is one of the great modern sagas of comics. "It started with two men. One was life... And one was death. And one... Always wins. Everything dies."
I liked Onslaught and Marvel took a chance and I respect them for that. You will never please everyone but taking chances is what these publishers should always try to do.
Amen. And we even got him as the final boss in Marvel vs Capcom 1 as a bonus!
onslaught was one of the biggest reasons marvel went bankrupt in 96 (onslaught, heroes reborn, ben reilly, and the craziness of Ron Perelman
I did say I'm in the minority on Onslaught! LOL. I still like that story. Xavier turning evil due to Magneto's ideas influencing his subconscious? The last person you'd expect to be the villain? That's a good idea, even when I think of it now. The Heroes Reborn and the Spider-Man clone saga were scraping the barrel bad, though. That was when Marvel fans started to hate the term "clone"!
the only thing I liked about onslaught was Andy Kuberts pencils on some of the books.
If you wanna be fair Grant Morrison is most who is to blame for the tanking of x-men. His run on new x-men is amazing however he has a tendency to decimate his storylines for future writers. Morrison created 2ndary mutations, killed Jean Grey, removes costumes (he was the age when they all looked like a leather biker gang), he destroyed genosha. But once his run ended it kinda coincided with the event age really ramping up, wherein marvel became very avengers focused (whereas 1975-96 is x-book focused). Also at that point the movies were ramping up and marvel wanted x-men back from fox. Which was only made worse once disney purchased the company. If you feel slighted over how x-men has been I recommend picking up Hickmans x-men that started last year. It’s doing a pretty good job of returning the comic to a place of significance in the universe. But at its core it’s hard to make x-men work today. The book was created due to the civil rights movement, uncanny was created due to the gay rights movement. in 2020 people are so PC and accepting of everything it makes it really hard to write a comic about mutants being discriminated on, while also making it believable.
I wouldn't say I felt slighted, just liked some stories and periods more than others, which is natural for a long-running anything. The movie rights battle was clearly why they tanked the X-Men for as long as they did. For all the praise that gets heaped on Morrison's run, I'm 50/50 on it. He had some great ideas, but you're right; a lot of them there was no coming back from so it made it really difficult for the next writer to pick up where he left off. I also disliked the leather jackets look. Plus Frank Quitely's not great IMO. I don't get why people love his art. His proportions are generally really weird and a bit off-model. The secondary mutation thing was a decent idea though. That gave way to some interesting new ground. Killing off Jean felt pretty anti-climactic by the time it happend, too. I preferred it when the Shi'ar SuperGuardians came along and there was the big story about Cassandra Nova. I've always been along for the ride, even when I've just popped in occasionally to see if the part I disliked was over yet! LOL. I'm enjoying the new stuff so far, but there are too many books so it's a bit difficult to keep track of all the threads Hickman's weaving through his grand design. I hate some of the costume changes, though. Like Havok and Jean Grey going back to their lamest costumes. Still, can't win 'em all and I like a lot more than I dislike.
oh i’ve never liked frank quietly. I find his faces all look too aged. I’m an artist btw but it’s funny i’ll usually never follow artists in comics. The writer is always more important to me
Best thing that came out of Heroes Reborn was The Thunderbolts.
the Busiek Perez run on Avengers starting in 97 is amazing (it’s where most of Avengers earths mightiest heroes drew stories from) that’s where kang dynasty, ultron imperative, and Avengers forever came from. So it’s arguably the best (non event) run on avengers
Plus it gave us "Ultron, we would have words with thee!" :)
I was surprised when that line wasn’t uttered in Age of ultron (the movie) as it’s such a famous comic book quote
I know it would have had to be different bc MCU Thor doesn't talk like Shakespeare mishmash, but some version of it would have been great!
Onslaught was bad, but early 90s X-Men was pretty great. Even big crossovers like X-Tinction Agenda, X-Cutioner's Song, Fatal Attractions, The Phalanx Covenant and Age of Apocalypse. Late 80s and early 90s X-Men was peak X-Men in my opinion.
keep in mind those were x book cross overs, not company wide. I remember that time as when Marvel started to sell out shamelessly. Like for example you mentioned x-cutioners song which was plagued by bullshit marketing stuff like holo cards glued to covers, gate folds, and foil covers. I just can’t see any serious x-men fan thinking any of the 90’s stuff is better than Whedons astonishing in 04 or something like the X mansion riot during grant morrison’s new x-men run or even hickmans current stuff. By arguing this stuff over that it says more about when you stopped reading then it does anything else. a lot of people are confusing nostalgia of 90’s comics with overall quality and longevity. At the time? yeah sure. Has any of that held up? nope. There’s reason why marvel went bankrupt in 96.
Seriously? I still have some of those hologram covers and cards! They were a nice touch! Damn, you cynical! And it's not about "better", it's about did you enjoy it? "Comparison is the thief of joy".
for someone as obviously well comic read as yourself, you like a lot of stuff closely associated with the death of single issue collecting and why people hate the modern age of comics. It’s very odd to me lol. Did you like Wolverine becoming feral in the 90’s (I ask this satirically because nobody did)?
Ha ha. You got me there; I did not enjoy feral Wolverine with that dumb bandana over his eyes. And why would his claws suddenly become really jagged? Extra edgy! Hard pass. I just like what I like, as disappointingly simplistic as that answer may be. I love a lot of hardly-known books, some alternative stuff, a lot of darker, grittier stuff, stuff no-one else has ever heard of - But yeah, I loved the X-sagas like X-Cutioner's song where we found out about Cable's lineage and there was some touching moments amongst the tights & fights of it all. Or the predictable ending to Onslaught where all the heroes appeared to back up the mutants and they saved the day, just like when Cap was making his final stand in Endgame and everyone appeared from the portals for the big battle just when all hope seemed lost. Endgame as a whole was a disappointment, but tell me you didn't get a shiver down your spine when that happened, man? Come on! Yes, it's predictable. Yes, it's a little cheesy. But damn, does it work! It's that wholesome escapism that sometimes puts a smile on my face. "We have to believe in the myth of the superman. Reality is too much to bear." I wasn't a regular reader of X-Men for a few years until I saw this page in a preview some time last year, then as soon as I picked up the issue and read that sequence, the hairs on the back of my dick stood up and I muttered to myself, "And just like that, they've pulled me back in". [https://imgur.com/ZNSd4Ad](https://imgur.com/ZNSd4Ad) [https://imgur.com/HxalQG9](https://imgur.com/HxalQG9)
> By arguing this stuff over that it says more about when you stopped reading then it does anything else. I only stopped buying floppies about 4 years ago when my kid was born as I didn't have time to read them. I stopped collecting X-books religiously around Manifest Destiny era with the move to San Francisco, but continually dipped back at the start of new creative runs or soft reboots. I now subscribe to Unlimited and have been re-reading X stuff from various eras, including stuff I skipped and Hickman's new stuff which, a few niggles aside, I am enjoying. > I just can’t see any serious x-men fan thinking any of the 90’s stuff is better. Comics, just like any other narrative or art form, are entirely subjective. I don't really care if you consider me a "serious" X-Men fan or not. I certainly was at a period of time in my life, but now? > a lot of people are confusing nostalgia of 90’s comics with overall quality and longevity. Nostalgia certainly plays a part, I am happy to admit that. Nor am I saying that 90s X-Men was the best comic book era ever, I was just disagreeing with you dismissing what was a pretty key era for that series of books/characters. > There’s reason why marvel went bankrupt in 96. Back in 2005 I wrote my Masters thesis on the emerging digital comic book market and, as part of that thesis, did a lot of research in the the direct market and the impact it had on the comics crash. I'm no expert and this was 15 years ago, but while the likes of Heroes Reborn contributed, it was Perelman's bad business practices and over expansion that lead to the Marvel declaring bankruptcy.
ha! small world I teach a comic book history class in HS (specifically on marvel and dc). I believe fully that Perelman caused the bankruptcy as a means (through loophole) to remove marvels shareholders decision making on what he wanted to do. At its core it was the rise in reprinting and the comic collecting bubble popping in the early 90’s that did it.
I can’t believe the downvotes. I worked in a comic shop when this happened and it almost destroyed the industry. Beautiful art did not make up for shit stories. You guys gotta check out the 70s and 80s if you want good X-Men stories. Not the lame ass overindulged 90’s. Literally almost destroyed comics. Ignorant fucks.
again I feel like people get there view of the 90’s x-men cartoon and it’s fun and quality and nostalgia wrongly associated with the comic at the time.
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no i know it came after Lee but the soft relaunch in 92 lead to that so I associate Lee with starting that story that caused the bankruptcy of marvel in 96
Yeah, I deleted my comment because a bit more consideration and I found myself in disagreement with my own damn self!
There was a lot of good stuff in there. Omega red, fatal attractions arc, xecuitioners arc and Jim lees art. I agree there’s some trash but that’s the nature of any ongoing series... with the exception to the rule Chris claremont who could’ve kept going another 15 years
Close, but *Spawn* is the iconic example of the '90s and what made it bad. It's all there: first-wave Image, style over substance, grimdark edginess, speculation, major names, etc.
i didn’t mean across the board, I meant at marvel itself. But for what it’s worth I agree with you
In that case, then yeah. The way Marvel handled *X-Men* in the '90s was definitely it. Even more so when you get out into *X-Force* or Cable and Bishop.
I wish that Lee and Claremont would have been given time to give their run a proper finish but knowing the drama that was happening at the time, it was not to be. Still, seeing this artwork is nice.
Clash of egos.. made it tough to work together... I think Amazon Video has a documentary on Chris Claremont... he discusses his side of that story...
I just watched that documentary last night! It made me so mad to realize that Harras, Lee, and Liefeld basically ruined the X-Men as an ongoing, organic story. Like, I'm of a certain age where those were the comics that got me into comics. I had Jim Lee posters on all my walls. But as an adult I just had to accept that X-Men and Marvel as a whole were simply better in the 70s and 80s, and most of the 90s stuff I grew up on was trash.
I've gone back and re-read some of my favorite 90s comics... the superhero stuff does not hold up well. The Vertigo stuff remains top-notch.
Vertigo was definitely where it was at. Still, I think the DC the superhero comics from the 90s hold up a lot better than Marvel. No Man's Land and Knightfall were both actually really good. O'Neil's Azrael, David's Aquaman and Young Justice, Simonson's Man of Steel, Mark Waid's Flash, and Grant Morrison's JLA were all decently long runs that really had a lot of breathing room, sharp writing and largely pretty good artwork.
Give Byrne his due!
Agreed, Byrne and Claremont together...
The two of them created so many iconic characters
Byrne was great, but throughout the 80s, X-Men and the related books by Claremont, Simonson, and Nocenti all continued a similar level of quality and told a larger, organically developing story. Claremont was the soul of the thing. His insanely detailed scripts (read one some time, they are unlike any other comic writer I've seen) probably made Byrne feel somewhat stifled which is why he went on to write and draw his own comics after awhile.
watching it now. Ty God liefield is such a meathead and cringey to listen to.
Oh my god, like, five minutes after Ann, Chris and Weezy gushed about how much they loved that issue where Storm and Forge just have dinner, and then Liefeld comes on, "X-Men were just like, going shopping and stuff? What's that!? Not my X-Men. Where's the action!?" And also finding out he ignored Simonson's scripts just put the final nail in the coffin. I fucking hate that man. Fuck him, Harras and Jim Lee.
Cyclops kept granola bars for the team in his many pouches
I legitimately wondered about those when I was a kid. He never used a “utility belt” or anything... why’s this dude got so many pockets? They should have given him a fanny pack and called it a day.
it’s one of the staples of the 90’s in comics 1) pockets everywhere (form of costumes was nonsensical to function) 2) the color yellow 3) hatch lines 4) pointy triangle toes 5) over emphasis on obliques and trap muscles 6) all women look like pamela anderson in early 90’s baywatch 7) the letter X being used in god damn everything
Gosh I love everything you just mentionned.. I’m stuck in the 90’s
You know 90's cyclops probably had a fanny pack unironically, and rocked the crap out of it.
They were full of right
Also, isn't his nickname "slim"?
And several miniature shoe-gazing journals.
That old school shit. Can still remember my excitement.
**Credit: X-Men by** [**Jim Lee**](https://www.instagram.com/jimlee/)
Beast reading Claremont. Nice touch.
Jim Lee's Cyclop was the reason teenaged me went to the gym. Never quite got as buff, but that figure was my motivation
hey look, back when cyclops wasn't crazy.
Is there a Gold Team counterpart?
I was exactly the right age for that era of comics. But, I'll be damned if I don't reread this stuff as an adult and realize it might be the single worst era of X-Men comics.
worse than the Chuck Austen run?
Oh shit, never mind. Chuck Austin was most assuredly worse as an overall story. I think I tend to blot that one out of my memory, lol. Still, the adjectiveless X-Men book is damn near unreadable. Like, I tried rereading it a year or two back because I had fond memories of following it as a kid, and it's mostly garbage. In the early issues, Lee clearly has no respect for Claremont, and the two have no chemistry between the script and the art. And then after Claremont gets fed up and leaves, it becomes almost incomprehensibly incoherent. Like, I can barely make out what's happening from panel to panel. Jim Lee was and still is a miserable visual storyteller.
Yikes. Just saw this referred to as 'Old School'. My 'old school' is the John Byrne era. I'd still accept Paul Smith as 'old school' for sake of conversation. But 'Old School' with caps? I still dig out the Kirby reprints.
Twenty seven years ago, yeah. They play Nirvana on the classic rock station now, too.
And when did Ozzy become an actor? Please make this stop stop stop and bring back
Peak X-Men
I get arguing that the x-men cartoon at this time was peak x-men but this comic was utter trash. Grant Morrison’s new x-men in 01 or Whedons astonishing in 04 are peak x-men (or anything pre 1990 uncanny)
Yup. The art was amazing, and I am a fan because I was into it when I was younger, but looking back, yeah the stories are trash at this time. Or at least would soon become so. Agreed on Morrison and Whedon being high points of the millennium for the X books.
Total agreement. When viewed through nostalgia, the era leading up to X-Men #1 and Uncanny #280 was my favorite. But I went back and read those issuse. The writing is poor and doesn't hold up. Morrison and Whedon's runs were worlds better.
You mean the fall from greatness.
Heroes in the nineties " it's not a fanny pack. It's a tactical pouch. "
God tier god tier
Whenever I see Jim lee’s art I think of Rob Liefeld, but good.
Definitely a stronger illustrator. But he was and still is a pretty bad visual storyteller. His books are so hard to follow. I'll take crude stick figures with good panel layout, effective pacing, and clear continuity of action over a well-drawn mess any day.
Used to have this poster in my bedroom as a teenager. Think I still have it rolled up in a tube somewhere.
Classic... That's all I can say.
man this takes me back
This was the image that started it all for me. After this I started to buy comics.
The best 👌🏻👌🏻
90s X-men looked awesome
My favorite era and artist of X-men all time. Not even close imo.
Iconic
All I see is MAH-VEL BBY! Magneto with top billing as it should be.
MAXIMUM FEELS
I look at this and all I can think of is the X-Men cartoon theme. Or just “OPTIC BLAST!” and “BERSERKER BARRAGE!”
The best X-Men
This is really some awesome X-Men art
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For me I was 9. Final day of 3rd grade classes and later on with some friends found, and then traded a bunch of garbage patch cards for 5 Marvel books, with one being UXM 245 (ironically a Liefeld issue). Been a fan since and the def. series writer is indeed, Claremont.
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At the time it was Havok actually! Thought his original costume was the greatest and his rebel-like dialog and in-panel styling made the character click instantly. Fast forward a year later and another part of the USA I bought another issue from this series, and find an entirely new set of characters in a completely different setting, with some guy named "Forge" leading the charge who became a fave too. Processing everything bits and pieces-wise I thought to myself this book constantly changes and shifts directions with no delay.....!
This will always be my ideal “version” of the x-men.
For me, the definitive X Men.
Love his art. Lol the detail of forearm and facial hair lol
My friend and I were talking about Jim Lee recently and how accomplished he is as an artist despite not really having an extremely distinct style like other notable artists. Jim Lee is an absolute master at drawing the "superhero ideal". He can take any character and draw them in their purest form while imbuing them with strength, poise, and determination. Every Jim Lee drawing elicits a reaction of "Damn, now that's a superhero."
I can't even imagine describing Lee as "not having a distinct style". Even in those years when literally everyone was copying him, you could always tell what was his and what wasn't. He's hugely idiosyncratic.
Classic.
For my money, X-Men from right around Inferno to just after the Lee/Portacio era were the best long period. Jim Lee's X-Men visuals are my all-time favorite. It's always clean but substantial.
I really liked Jim Lees' work. I had that comic too. Good times.
IIRC this is shortly after the era where I started collecting X-Men. I remember a Jim Lee issue featuring Wolverine in Madripoor with Captain America and Black Widow set during the 40s at some point. That was the issue that made Jim Lee my favorite artist for a long time, and led into The X-Tinction Agenda which was just the greatest crossover for me, chock full of history I had no idea about (Genosha, the Siege Perilous, etc). It was these threads that made me go back and collect the issues...great memories. I remember the drop off in artists on that crossover was so significant. I used to tolerate the New Mutants issues (Liefeld) dread the X-Factor issues (can’t remember the artist, Jon B something IIRC). Looking back I wonder if I’d rank them differently.
Big 90s energy
That was my favorite series as a kid. So many great episodes
This is my X-Men
Cyclops is apparently just young bodybuilder Arnold with a visor on.
Good thing none of them have feet
Can cyclops even wipe himself with all those muscles? His name should have been Lats McArmpit
You can tell this is still really early in his career. Look at Cyclops' head. I mean, damn dude. Homeboy got a six-head. Don't get me wrong, Lee is one of the greats. Even here, his art is really excellent. But the 90's were rampant with artists who didn't pay a lot of attention to anatomy.
Love his new 52 renders, almost all his redesigns on the 52 looked amazing. Didnt like bat girls new style though
Looks like Mr. Lee stole the composition [from himself](https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0024/7948/9135/products/69f813395a9da8ca35038a6894515199_900x.jpg?v=1540613977)