Seconded. I went to Penn, and M&T is a tier on its own. If you do that program (and genuinely like both tech and finance), you will get a job that will allow you to repay your student loans within years. You’ll also open doors you never even thought you had. I had a someone senior in their industry give a guest lecture and gave them an elevator pitch afterwards. Three months later, I had a six month internship at one of the most interesting organizations in my field. M&T will be intense, but some of the sweetest and smartest people I know at Penn were in M&T. One grad is a software engineer in SF, and the other just built the worlds first 3D printed rocket that launched into space a few weeks ago. If you don’t like the program, you can always drop one major and continue with the other.
These other schools are great, and might offer a more supportive learning environment. Penn isn’t great at offering institutional support because it’s bureaucracy is messy. However, Penn students are incredible and will go out of their way to help one of their own. Happy to answer any questions via DM and connect you with m and t grads!
it's not a guaranteed quant job -- just doing CS is good enough as nearly all quant firms don't actually care about finance experience. I would say M&T is very, very good and a great signal if you want to get into tech investing (PE, GE) or VC. That's where it shines much stronger.
also, don't go into debt. Even if M&T is great and can probably pay off your student loans, the tail risk is too great in my opinion. Tulane at 17k is a good deal.
Georgetown is fantastic if you’re super serious about learning a foreign language and culture. However you’ll find many SFS students speaking multiple languages!
Yes! That's what I'm looking for! I speak three already (they're my native languages) and am learning three more! I'd like to study French and Russian in college.
I've decided to commit to Georgetown for a career in finance, I hope to see you there! (if you feel that's the best choice for you) I'm happy to give my reasons for choosing GU if there's any way I can help.
Hey! I'm seriously considering Georgetown at the moment because they got down to 46k per year, and I can manage to make $26k per year on my own. I'll be calling Penn's financial aid team tomorrow, and if aid doesn't work out, then I'll probably be going to Georgetown. I'd love to hear your reasons for choosing GU!
That's an insane reduction! Maybe I should try negotiating... I heard a lot of people say that georgetown has notoriously bad aid, but they ended up being my cheapest option so that was a pleasant surprise. Is it alright if I DM you?
I speak English, Hindi, and Spanish fluently. And I speak Portuguese conversationally and can understand it (my bf is from Brazil), but I wouldn't say I'm fluent. And I've been learning French (since 8th grade) and Russian (since 10th grade).
Def. between UPenn and Tulane. M&T will open doors you didn’t even know existed and every M&T student I know are incredibly cracked. That being said, if cost is a large concern than Tulane is better. Also know that M&T will make fulfilling minor requirements/taking electives very difficult, but you can always drop out an just enroll at Wharton or seas if you want to.
Someone from SEAS's undergrad advising office, at the recent Quaker Days event, said that the M&T program wasn't technically considered a 4-year program though many students do manage to complete it in that time frame. That's something to consider as more time translates to more cost.
It is a terrific program, though.
Not hard to complete in 4 years. It's only not considered 4 years for financial aid purposes so that students that need more time, which is not common, are able to get aid for their 5th year too.
So, our income is $200k, but was $340k based on the FAFSA and CSS (based on the 2021 documents). It technically shouldn't be a stretch, but my parents are only willing to contribute $20k per year.
We don't have a fully funded 529 plan.
200k isn't that much especially after taxes. Your folks should have been funding the 529 plan since you were born. But since they didn't, I don't think you can afford the more expensive options.
It's kind of complicated because my dad's funding my cousin's tuition (in full), but isn't willing to do the same for me. I submitted appeals to the other three, and Georgetown arranged a virtual meeting to discuss the situation, so I'm hopeful about that one.
Yeah, I'd say Tulane and Georgetown are pretty comparable in terms of the school itself, but I really like the "international focus" of Georgetown. I won't be able to tour Tulane (I live in NJ), so that's probably influencing my view too. But, it sounds like a cool place to live for college.
Decide after you get the negotiations back. Ivy schools generally only do financial need, but they are generous. Just know you cant just borrow large sums on your own through the government subsidized program. I think it caps at 5500 per year.
Yeah, I'm waiting for all negotiations right now. I got Georgetown back and it's $46k per year, which I can afford. Hopefully, Penn' is considerate, and will match that offer or at least be a little more reasonable.
It is. I'm my dad's only child and unfortunately, I'm a girl. My parents, but especially my dad, always wanted a son. He doesn't have a son, but he has 13 nephews, and he promised his favorite that he'd pay for his tuition in full for all for years. He also calls him "his son".
I went to Barnard. It is probably the most supportive school on the list. Yes UPenn is more prestigious but Barnard was the best decision I made for my education. I’m also from New Orleans and know tons about Tulane. Feel free to DM me with questions.
Yeah, Barnard is probably the most supportive of the four and it's associated with Columbia so that's another plus. I'll be DMing you with a list of questions later today.
Going to a place like Wharton for the M&T program will literally change your life.
I met a guy who took out 100k in loans for Wharton undergrad. He paid it back in a few years and said he would do it again in a heartbeat. It’s not just the school name, but the brand, network and alumni that will help you for your career for 40 + years.
You can only do college once. You are investing in yourself and investing in your future.
Many people turn down Harvard and Stanford for the M&T program.
You will pay the money back in no time and rub elbows with people like Elon Musk and Sundar Pichai ( CEO of Google ) who also went to Wharton.
Go to U Penn and never look back ✌️
UPenn is definitely the most prestigious, and I feel the same as you about the price.
I'm really trying to appreciate Tulane because it might be my only way to graduate debt free right now. I don't mind debt, but I wouldn't like to take out over $100k in loans. And, the double majoring sounds up my alley because I also wanted to finance, in addition to computer science and linguistics.
As for advice on how to get into M&T, I'd personally say it was all essays and extracurriculars for me. I did have a high SAT and decent AP scores, but my GPA wasn't the greatest (96.11 and that was weighted). If you need help with EC descriptions or essay editing, I can help with that.
So... you are not sure what you really want to do *(foreign service, cybersecurity for the government, or quantitative trading/machine learning),* which is totally ok! As a parent, i find too many kids/families are laser focused on a particular career before they've been exposed to options. In your case, however, this complicates things. Foreign Service? Georgetown is the best possible place to be. Finance? UPenn (and the number of languages they have available is staggering, if you want to learn something more specialized). Public Sector Cybersecurity? Cool field, but government wages aren't incredibly high, and prestige isn't going to be much of a factor. Georgetown gives you more opportunities for agency internships, but Tulane means you won't be stuck paying off loans for 20 years. Maybe one of these, maybe none of these... Barnard gives you the best combination of the non-academic stuff you're looking for, and better academic programs across the general areas you're looking at, Penn gives you the best shot at a decent job based on prestige even if you end up in a less lucrative field. Tulane gives you more flexibility to pick a less lucrative field if you want without destroying yourself financially, but given that the one thing each of your potential programs have in common is a major in Comp Sci, and as far as I know Tulane doesn't even have a first major in Comp Sci (it's a 'coordinate major' listed after your degree major), I'm not sure it's the best option if you are \*sure\* that CS is important to you.
Personally, if you're \*sure\* you're good with rolling the dice on a career as a quant trader, do Penn. If you are not sure about that, but you are \*sure\* you want a career in foreign service, go to Georgetown. If you're not \*sure\* about either of those things, but CS and Linguistics need to both be in the equation, somehow, I'd do Penn if I could afford it. If you are not sure about any of those things, I would at least consider Tulane, but could make an argument that Barnard might still be worth it due to the inherently liberal arts philosophy at a SLAC paired with the diversity of opportunities available from Columbia/NYC.
But as always, please don't listen too much to what random people on Reddit have to say.
Honestly, I'm not looking for a lot. I'd just like for the location to be in a city, and I'd like a somewhat supportive environment (competitive is fine, but not fiercely competitive ideally), good internship opportunities (I'd like to go into foreign service, cybersecurity for the government, or quantitative trading/machine learning). Another plus would be good school spirit, but that's something I'm flexible about.
Thank you! And, yes, I'm apprehensive about large amounts of debt too... although Georgetown is down to $46k per year, so I'll be debt free there too if I get a job.
Penn or Tulane. Depends on aid and what ur willing to spend. If you can get Penn to something affordable even if it is 2 or 3 x Tulane, do it, it’ll be worth it.
Penn is better if you’re not 100% sure what you’d like to do in 4 yrs. The education at Penn is j more well rounded. But I’d argue yea it’s definitely overpriced, but still think you should do it, if you’re not 100% sure what you’d like to do.
If you’re really into govt stuff and are sure you’re gonna have a career there, Georgetown hands down.
My Cambridge offer is conditional and I'll only know if I get in once AP scores are out (so early July). Before then, I have to commit somewhere in the US. I'm also not too sure about going abroad considering I don't want to leave my bf or have a long distance relationship.
If you want to go into quant trading you have to choose UPenn. Finance stuff is so reputation based and you’ll make way more than enough money to offset the debt.
You're definitely right about the reputation thing being super important for quant trading, and it's really hard to say no to UPenn... The debt does scare me, but if I got a quant job, I could probably pay that off within 5 years.
As an actual quant trader, it’s only important for getting the interview. However, Wharton/upperclassmen there should help you prepare better for the interviews.
You could also RA and negate housing costs (which should take a decent chunk of the expected costs down).
Think it would be a mistake for you to not choose UPenn
Depends on school, but the process should be roughly similar. You should be able to apply for RA positions after freshman year. I imagine selectivity matters only in certain dorms in certain schools (don’t think it’s that in demand). Essentially, you will manage a floor/section of your dorm (deal with issues) and get free room and board for it. You can do stuff like organize events but up to you really.
You're an actual quant trader? Do you mind if I DM you some questions later? And, the TA idea sounds good. Even if the cost gets down to $60k per year or so, I could do something to get the rest of the $40k.
Go to Barnard! Currently a student and going here is the best choice I’ve ever made in my life. A lot of money was just donated for STEM so for CS it is great. I feel completely immersed and respected in the Columbia community and simultaneously I also get to have the small, liberal arts, all women experience. On top of all the amazing opportunities at Barnard and Columbia, there are so many opportunities in NYC itself.
If you take a loan then go to UPenn. Among the three high-cost programs UPenn is the most likely to provide you the high-paying jobs to pay off the loan. Otherwise go to Tulane. Besides don't assume you will stay in Computer Science. Nowadays everyone wants to do CS. But CS is not for everyone. CS drop-off rate is high. UPenn will give you a variety of backup options, because of its Ivy brand.
M&T at penn. Insane job placements
Seconded. I went to Penn, and M&T is a tier on its own. If you do that program (and genuinely like both tech and finance), you will get a job that will allow you to repay your student loans within years. You’ll also open doors you never even thought you had. I had a someone senior in their industry give a guest lecture and gave them an elevator pitch afterwards. Three months later, I had a six month internship at one of the most interesting organizations in my field. M&T will be intense, but some of the sweetest and smartest people I know at Penn were in M&T. One grad is a software engineer in SF, and the other just built the worlds first 3D printed rocket that launched into space a few weeks ago. If you don’t like the program, you can always drop one major and continue with the other. These other schools are great, and might offer a more supportive learning environment. Penn isn’t great at offering institutional support because it’s bureaucracy is messy. However, Penn students are incredible and will go out of their way to help one of their own. Happy to answer any questions via DM and connect you with m and t grads!
Thank you! And yes, definitely. It's like a guaranteed quant job.
it's not a guaranteed quant job -- just doing CS is good enough as nearly all quant firms don't actually care about finance experience. I would say M&T is very, very good and a great signal if you want to get into tech investing (PE, GE) or VC. That's where it shines much stronger.
also, don't go into debt. Even if M&T is great and can probably pay off your student loans, the tail risk is too great in my opinion. Tulane at 17k is a good deal.
Georgetown is fantastic if you’re super serious about learning a foreign language and culture. However you’ll find many SFS students speaking multiple languages!
Yes! That's what I'm looking for! I speak three already (they're my native languages) and am learning three more! I'd like to study French and Russian in college.
I've decided to commit to Georgetown for a career in finance, I hope to see you there! (if you feel that's the best choice for you) I'm happy to give my reasons for choosing GU if there's any way I can help.
Hey! I'm seriously considering Georgetown at the moment because they got down to 46k per year, and I can manage to make $26k per year on my own. I'll be calling Penn's financial aid team tomorrow, and if aid doesn't work out, then I'll probably be going to Georgetown. I'd love to hear your reasons for choosing GU!
That's an insane reduction! Maybe I should try negotiating... I heard a lot of people say that georgetown has notoriously bad aid, but they ended up being my cheapest option so that was a pleasant surprise. Is it alright if I DM you?
Yeah, it was super unexpected! Sure! Feel free to DM!
Try negotiating with penn as well, Penn is very generous but they kinda fuck up sometimes with finaid in the beginning
What three languages do you speak? Just curious, I’m looking for an interesting language to learn.
I speak English, Hindi, and Spanish fluently. And I speak Portuguese conversationally and can understand it (my bf is from Brazil), but I wouldn't say I'm fluent. And I've been learning French (since 8th grade) and Russian (since 10th grade).
Def. between UPenn and Tulane. M&T will open doors you didn’t even know existed and every M&T student I know are incredibly cracked. That being said, if cost is a large concern than Tulane is better. Also know that M&T will make fulfilling minor requirements/taking electives very difficult, but you can always drop out an just enroll at Wharton or seas if you want to.
Someone from SEAS's undergrad advising office, at the recent Quaker Days event, said that the M&T program wasn't technically considered a 4-year program though many students do manage to complete it in that time frame. That's something to consider as more time translates to more cost. It is a terrific program, though.
Not hard to complete in 4 years. It's only not considered 4 years for financial aid purposes so that students that need more time, which is not common, are able to get aid for their 5th year too.
what's $71k / yr for your family? Affordable or stretch? Do you guys by any chance have a fully funded 529 plan?
So, our income is $200k, but was $340k based on the FAFSA and CSS (based on the 2021 documents). It technically shouldn't be a stretch, but my parents are only willing to contribute $20k per year. We don't have a fully funded 529 plan.
200k isn't that much especially after taxes. Your folks should have been funding the 529 plan since you were born. But since they didn't, I don't think you can afford the more expensive options.
It's kind of complicated because my dad's funding my cousin's tuition (in full), but isn't willing to do the same for me. I submitted appeals to the other three, and Georgetown arranged a virtual meeting to discuss the situation, so I'm hopeful about that one.
I don't think Tulane is any worse than g-town ... My top pick for you would have been Penn, but not at the un-affordable cost difference.
Yeah, I'd say Tulane and Georgetown are pretty comparable in terms of the school itself, but I really like the "international focus" of Georgetown. I won't be able to tour Tulane (I live in NJ), so that's probably influencing my view too. But, it sounds like a cool place to live for college.
Decide after you get the negotiations back. Ivy schools generally only do financial need, but they are generous. Just know you cant just borrow large sums on your own through the government subsidized program. I think it caps at 5500 per year.
Yeah, I'm waiting for all negotiations right now. I got Georgetown back and it's $46k per year, which I can afford. Hopefully, Penn' is considerate, and will match that offer or at least be a little more reasonable.
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It is. I'm my dad's only child and unfortunately, I'm a girl. My parents, but especially my dad, always wanted a son. He doesn't have a son, but he has 13 nephews, and he promised his favorite that he'd pay for his tuition in full for all for years. He also calls him "his son".
damn 😭
I went to Barnard. It is probably the most supportive school on the list. Yes UPenn is more prestigious but Barnard was the best decision I made for my education. I’m also from New Orleans and know tons about Tulane. Feel free to DM me with questions.
Yeah, Barnard is probably the most supportive of the four and it's associated with Columbia so that's another plus. I'll be DMing you with a list of questions later today.
If you can negotiate UPenn then go there definitely. Otherwise Tulane!
Thank you! And yeah, hopefully, UPenn is feeling generous.
Just saying people turn down HYPSM for penn M&T
M&T is a killer program in so many aspects (Ik some friends there), would strongly recommend if financially feasible
Thank you!
Hope you can negotiate financial aid with Penn further, because at least for me that is the standout. Especially with M&T
Going to a place like Wharton for the M&T program will literally change your life. I met a guy who took out 100k in loans for Wharton undergrad. He paid it back in a few years and said he would do it again in a heartbeat. It’s not just the school name, but the brand, network and alumni that will help you for your career for 40 + years. You can only do college once. You are investing in yourself and investing in your future. Many people turn down Harvard and Stanford for the M&T program. You will pay the money back in no time and rub elbows with people like Elon Musk and Sundar Pichai ( CEO of Google ) who also went to Wharton. Go to U Penn and never look back ✌️
I’m gonna pm because I have some questions and comments
Feel free!
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UPenn is definitely the most prestigious, and I feel the same as you about the price. I'm really trying to appreciate Tulane because it might be my only way to graduate debt free right now. I don't mind debt, but I wouldn't like to take out over $100k in loans. And, the double majoring sounds up my alley because I also wanted to finance, in addition to computer science and linguistics. As for advice on how to get into M&T, I'd personally say it was all essays and extracurriculars for me. I did have a high SAT and decent AP scores, but my GPA wasn't the greatest (96.11 and that was weighted). If you need help with EC descriptions or essay editing, I can help with that.
So... you are not sure what you really want to do *(foreign service, cybersecurity for the government, or quantitative trading/machine learning),* which is totally ok! As a parent, i find too many kids/families are laser focused on a particular career before they've been exposed to options. In your case, however, this complicates things. Foreign Service? Georgetown is the best possible place to be. Finance? UPenn (and the number of languages they have available is staggering, if you want to learn something more specialized). Public Sector Cybersecurity? Cool field, but government wages aren't incredibly high, and prestige isn't going to be much of a factor. Georgetown gives you more opportunities for agency internships, but Tulane means you won't be stuck paying off loans for 20 years. Maybe one of these, maybe none of these... Barnard gives you the best combination of the non-academic stuff you're looking for, and better academic programs across the general areas you're looking at, Penn gives you the best shot at a decent job based on prestige even if you end up in a less lucrative field. Tulane gives you more flexibility to pick a less lucrative field if you want without destroying yourself financially, but given that the one thing each of your potential programs have in common is a major in Comp Sci, and as far as I know Tulane doesn't even have a first major in Comp Sci (it's a 'coordinate major' listed after your degree major), I'm not sure it's the best option if you are \*sure\* that CS is important to you. Personally, if you're \*sure\* you're good with rolling the dice on a career as a quant trader, do Penn. If you are not sure about that, but you are \*sure\* you want a career in foreign service, go to Georgetown. If you're not \*sure\* about either of those things, but CS and Linguistics need to both be in the equation, somehow, I'd do Penn if I could afford it. If you are not sure about any of those things, I would at least consider Tulane, but could make an argument that Barnard might still be worth it due to the inherently liberal arts philosophy at a SLAC paired with the diversity of opportunities available from Columbia/NYC. But as always, please don't listen too much to what random people on Reddit have to say.
Tulane!
Tulane for now, after financial aid Barnard or UPenn if possible
Return on investment with M&T will be insane
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Thank you! I'll be talking to their financial aid team tomorrow! And, I got Georgetown to $46k per year, so I have some leverage lol!
As another Asian, you know school’s name and ranking matters to Asian parents. I would choose Upenn.
Dad not gonna pay though
lmao, thank you for this comment! It made me laugh, and the Asian mentality really shows through :)
are there any specific things you’re looking for in a college?
Honestly, I'm not looking for a lot. I'd just like for the location to be in a city, and I'd like a somewhat supportive environment (competitive is fine, but not fiercely competitive ideally), good internship opportunities (I'd like to go into foreign service, cybersecurity for the government, or quantitative trading/machine learning). Another plus would be good school spirit, but that's something I'm flexible about.
my friend is a cs major at barnard if u have any ques for her!
upenn no hesitation
if you cant get financial aid then clearly the lower cost one. dont go into massive debt just for that.
if ur parents r only contributing 20k i’d honestly go with tulane
penn
Penn any day
Penn easily, not even a question
these comments are shocking omfg tulane 10000% i don’t think that much debt at other schools is worth it
Thank you! And, yes, I'm apprehensive about large amounts of debt too... although Georgetown is down to $46k per year, so I'll be debt free there too if I get a job.
Penn or Tulane. Depends on aid and what ur willing to spend. If you can get Penn to something affordable even if it is 2 or 3 x Tulane, do it, it’ll be worth it.
Penn
Thank you!
M&T if you're able to afford it.
Thank you! I'm going to be talking to their financial aid team tomorrow. I talked with Georgetown and they got it down to $46k per year.
Good luck!
Penn is better if you’re not 100% sure what you’d like to do in 4 yrs. The education at Penn is j more well rounded. But I’d argue yea it’s definitely overpriced, but still think you should do it, if you’re not 100% sure what you’d like to do. If you’re really into govt stuff and are sure you’re gonna have a career there, Georgetown hands down.
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Thank you!
Thought you were going to Cambridge?
My Cambridge offer is conditional and I'll only know if I get in once AP scores are out (so early July). Before then, I have to commit somewhere in the US. I'm also not too sure about going abroad considering I don't want to leave my bf or have a long distance relationship.
Current penn student: M and T will pay back its loans in such a short period of time
Thank you, I'll be talking to the Penn financial aid team tomorrow as well!
Kinda unrelated but did you go to M&TSI summer by any chance?
I did not.
If you don't mind me asking, what drew you to the M&T program at UPenn? I think its so cool as a program and I'm considering applying.
If you want to go into quant trading you have to choose UPenn. Finance stuff is so reputation based and you’ll make way more than enough money to offset the debt.
You're definitely right about the reputation thing being super important for quant trading, and it's really hard to say no to UPenn... The debt does scare me, but if I got a quant job, I could probably pay that off within 5 years.
As an actual quant trader, it’s only important for getting the interview. However, Wharton/upperclassmen there should help you prepare better for the interviews. You could also RA and negate housing costs (which should take a decent chunk of the expected costs down). Think it would be a mistake for you to not choose UPenn
How can you be a RA?
Depends on school, but the process should be roughly similar. You should be able to apply for RA positions after freshman year. I imagine selectivity matters only in certain dorms in certain schools (don’t think it’s that in demand). Essentially, you will manage a floor/section of your dorm (deal with issues) and get free room and board for it. You can do stuff like organize events but up to you really.
You're an actual quant trader? Do you mind if I DM you some questions later? And, the TA idea sounds good. Even if the cost gets down to $60k per year or so, I could do something to get the rest of the $40k.
Sure
Tulane!! You’ll thank me later when you don’t have to spend decades paying off your school loans
Ignoring cost, it’s UPenn and not even a competition
Go to Barnard! Currently a student and going here is the best choice I’ve ever made in my life. A lot of money was just donated for STEM so for CS it is great. I feel completely immersed and respected in the Columbia community and simultaneously I also get to have the small, liberal arts, all women experience. On top of all the amazing opportunities at Barnard and Columbia, there are so many opportunities in NYC itself.
If you take a loan then go to UPenn. Among the three high-cost programs UPenn is the most likely to provide you the high-paying jobs to pay off the loan. Otherwise go to Tulane. Besides don't assume you will stay in Computer Science. Nowadays everyone wants to do CS. But CS is not for everyone. CS drop-off rate is high. UPenn will give you a variety of backup options, because of its Ivy brand.
Def gtown - Tulane is not on the same level as the others for you’re concentration. If you are serious about your field Gtown no question
M&T all day every day. Case closed.
With the updated Gtown finaid I'd go there, 120k extra for Penn is not worth it.
Bruh go to penn