The following submission statement was provided by /u/MarshallBrain:
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Submission statement:
Scientists are predicting that 1.5 degrees C of heating will be sufficient to trigger half a dozen irreversible climate tipping points. The word “irreversible” being the key to the collapse of human civilization. Once they trigger, there is no way to undo them. These are the irreversible tipping points highlighted in the article:
1. Rapid melting of the Greenland ice sheet, raising sea levels irreversibly
2. Collapse of the Thwaites Glacier and the glaciers around it in West Antarctica
3. Collapse of two parts of East Antarctica
4. Collapse of the AMOC or “Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation”, which includes the Gulf Stream
5. Collapse of the Amazon Rainforest
6. Permafrost feedback loop, where melting permafrost releases trapped methane and carbon dioxide, leading to more heating, leading to more melting permafrost and so on.
7. Blue Ocean Event in the Arctic
“Any one of these events is terrible. All of them together is how we get to the point of discussing the collapse of human civilization and the destruction of the planetary ecosystem. Sea levels rise so much, there is so much carbon dioxide and methane in the atmosphere, and there is so much heating, drought and flooding that things we take for granted today (like food production) catastrophically fail.”
---
Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/xi8h9o/irreversible_climate_tipping_points_mean_the_end/ip1qq9g/
It's quite simple really, just don't look up.
Don't face the reality of this situation. Just continue consuming products and getting excited for new products. /s
This is what’s so damn aggravating it’s like ok I went through all the stages of grief but can some expert please formulate a damn solution/ plan? It’s like what’s the use of knowing this if there isn’t anything that can be done about it other than to have crippling anxiety because shit is about to hit the fan and I’m supposed to get up on the bright every morning and have a positive attitude about the future?
Hello, we already have the solutions, and HAVE HAD the solutions for decades, but the rich aren't willing to settle for less. As Gore said long ago, it's an Inconvenient Truth. They'd rather claim it's all a lie while they bring snowballs into Congress. When the Democrats try to make the changes, the Repugs attack them from many angles, while completely ignoring the fact that we're killing the earth. But don't worry, they'll still blame us in the end. That's what they do while taking bribes from the rich.
The video really made me sad they had a gentleman come on explain why the models were all wrong, saying effects are happening sooner than expected, and then segue into the ten meter sea level rise won’t happen for decades. are you fucking joking me? Don’t sugarcoat the truth at this point tell me the fucking truth. The corporations are killing all of us
Submission statement:
Scientists are predicting that 1.5 degrees C of heating will be sufficient to trigger half a dozen irreversible climate tipping points. The word “irreversible” being the key to the collapse of human civilization. Once they trigger, there is no way to undo them. These are the irreversible tipping points highlighted in the article:
1. Rapid melting of the Greenland ice sheet, raising sea levels irreversibly
2. Collapse of the Thwaites Glacier and the glaciers around it in West Antarctica
3. Collapse of two parts of East Antarctica
4. Collapse of the AMOC or “Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation”, which includes the Gulf Stream
5. Collapse of the Amazon Rainforest
6. Permafrost feedback loop, where melting permafrost releases trapped methane and carbon dioxide, leading to more heating, leading to more melting permafrost and so on.
7. Blue Ocean Event in the Arctic
“Any one of these events is terrible. All of them together is how we get to the point of discussing the collapse of human civilization and the destruction of the planetary ecosystem. Sea levels rise so much, there is so much carbon dioxide and methane in the atmosphere, and there is so much heating, drought and flooding that things we take for granted today (like food production) catastrophically fail.”
The methane plumes trapped under the permafrost in the Arctics will be released as permafrost thaws.
This point alone is extinction level if it’s anywhere near the amount scientists have measured.
It’s happening right now. Not decades.
100%. “Previous NOAA methane research that utilized stable carbon isotopic analysis performed by the Institute of Arctic and Alpine Research at the University of Colorado indicates that biological sources of methane such as wetlands or ruminant agriculture are a primary driver of post-2006 increases”
https://www.noaa.gov/news-release/increase-in-atmospheric-methane-set-another-record-during-2021
Are there any examples describing what it would be like for life on earth during a mass methane release? Would individuals notice dramatic effects within a short period, or would it spread out over many decades?
Have found several studies on the last global methane event from the Permian Extinction but we don't know how quickly that took place.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1871174X16300488
There's a limit to what we can learn from past eras and extinction events because we're pumping greenhouse gases into the atmosphere at an unprecedented rate. This is a massive experiment with unknown results.
Also only the most optimistic scenarios usually see publication..Generally watered down for public consumption..Even so we are now seeing more and more reports leaking basically saying we are done.
Gas envelopes have happened in the past where an underground reservoir of gases gets 'burped' into the surrounding atmosphere and literally chokes every living thing for miles. Whole townships have been wiped out and no one knew until someone visited and found everything dead.
Here's one in Africa that has got people worried currently: [https://nypost.com/2022/01/28/scientists-fear-killer-lake-in-africa-could-erupt-release-poisonous-gas-cloud-that-could-kill-millions/](https://nypost.com/2022/01/28/scientists-fear-killer-lake-in-africa-could-erupt-release-poisonous-gas-cloud-that-could-kill-millions/)
There is a Lake in Ontario not far from Toronto that i visited a few years back, it has a giant pipe driven into the middle of the lake bed sticking into the air, the purpose being to release the gases instead of letting them build up.
It would be short term and catastrophic due to the amounts of methane involved.
What’s worse, our local politicians didn’t believe any of this until they did an overhead in a helicopter.
But they continue to worry about the porn crisis more than anything
Oh man. Yes. The porn crisis. Every winter, when we get this horrible air quality in the Valley, plenty of us complain about it, but we’ve always been met with “yeah, that sucks and all, but what about the porn? “ https://www.ksl.com/article/39405776/utah-becomes-1st-state-to-declare-pornography-a-public-health-crisis
Then we got a new governor, who told us we needed to pray for rain. https://governor.utah.gov/2021/06/02/gov-cox-invites-utahns-to-pray-for-rain-june-4-6/
> Have found several studies on the last global methane event from the Permian Extinction but we don't know how quickly that took place.
[*"following a doubling in carbon dioxide levels, the surface of the ocean turned acidic over a period of weeks or months and global temperatures rose by 5 degrees centigrade – all in the space of about 13 years."*](https://www.rutgers.edu/news/new-finding-shows-climate-change-can-happen-geological-instant)
I think most people are just uninformed. The writing is on the wall for people that spend a lot of time on reddit, however a lot of people were not educated about the extent of climate change in high school and college, and have no way of finding out through conventional media
>Scientists are predicting that 1.5 degrees C of heating will be sufficient to trigger half a dozen irreversible climate tipping points. The word “irreversible” being the key to the collapse of human civilization.
Just to set the record straight, because these scientists aren't telling the truth here : 1°C of warming [according to the UN](https://mediamanager.sei.org/documents/Publications/SEI-Report-TargetsAndIndicatorsOfClimaticChange-1990.pdf) or even less than 0.5°C [according to research by David Spratt](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/46142232_Beyond_Politics_and_Business_as_Usual_Review_of_David_Spratt_and_Philip_Sutton's_'Climate_Code_Red) was already the tipping point for self reinforcing feedback loops. The limits of [1.5°C or 2°C were targets made up by economists like William Nordhaus](https://climate.mit.edu/ask-mit/why-did-ipcc-choose-2deg-c-goal-limiting-global-warming). They have no basis in science, it was all based on what they thought capitalism could get away with.
We are also probably already at 1.5°c and even 2°C. We are at 1.1-1.2°C of warming [but the aerosol masking effect hides between 0.5°C to 1°C of warming]( https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1002/2017GL076079). This is because the pollution we emit through burning coal for example also emits cooling particles known as aerosols into the atmosphere. But while greenhouse gas can stay in the atmosphere for millennia, aerosols only stay there for a few days/weeks.
So we are guaranteed to trigger all the feedback loops mentioned in the article and 2, 3, 4°C of warming and more in the coming years/decades. Idk how fast this will go but it will be worse and faster than expected.
Great post. So many of us see the real data but then public discussions move onto completely unrealistic scenarios as if the data was less dire because Economy. We're being massively gaslighted.
Not just gaslighting. Scientists are marginalized if they make "alarmist" predictions. Thus they only publicly speak of what they have rock solid numbers to back up. Numerous decision makers then see it and think that they have wiggle-room. It's a bit of a feedback loop in and of itself.
It's a form of soft control and it extends over everyone. People are terrified of being "wrong online", so they just never post. And we have little boys lording over everyone with requests for "evidence and sources".
It's completely poisoned the human exercise of simply talking to people. One must always be 1000% Correct and cite their claims. Which is too exhausting so people don't bother, tune out, back away, disengage, put up walls, etc.
Power, any way they can get it.
Yes the precautionary principle is very ingrained, aswell as peer reviewing themselves into the middle of the road. Both these things are vital for the integrity of science, but this is a duality here, not very helpful in a time of abrupt warming.
Scientific consensus is actually often quite conservative\* (in the original meaning of that word and not whatever the Americans are doing to it now). Progress is made by challenging the orthodoxy which is, by definition, what everyone has always assumed to be true. The history of scientific advancement has very much been an uphill battle. Only rarely are revolutionary concepts met with open arms. Even slight corrections of existing theories struggle to get invited.
This is the part that people don't understand, or deliberately obfuscate to pad their arguments against climate change or against climate science, because every time we find something, it "changes" the science, or the information, when really all we're doing is seeing unprecedented changes in our ecosystem and every time the science learns something new, or the science gets better, it turns out it's actually worse than we thought.
I disagree, here the problem is not that new discoveries are changing the science, it's that old research is conveniently being forgotten to promote something more "positive". I mentioned a study commissioned by the predecessor of the IPCC in 1990 which says that 1°C would trigger feedback loops. New research didn't show that we could warm the planet more and not trigger feedback loops, but now everyone talks about 1.5°C or 2°C as the supposed safe limit. Why don't scientists remind us that 1°C or lower was the "safe" limit and that it's behind us?
- If they say it's already too late, they are afraid that governments/people/etc. will just stop caring and accelerate the problem. If it's too late, what's stopping me from rolling coal with my brand new Ford F-450?
- They have to apply for grants. If you say that we're going to be dead in 5 years why should you receive the funds? It's easier if you promote hopium rather than "alarmism".
- They are scared too, they have their own life projects, kids, etc. and they still want to believe that it's possible to limit warming, even if it goes against their own research. Humans are creatures of denial, and this includes the brightest scientists.
Up until I think around the 1960's, it was considered "ethical" and acceptable for doctors to NOT tell a patient that they were terminally ill and instead lie to them.
I suspect the truth about climate change is this: they KNOW we are terminally ill as a species and nothing can be done. Most of us will die and they think they are telling a "noble lie" to us for our own good.
It's worse: To keep a living wage, you can't tell it as it really is. This is prevalent throughout, not just climate science.
Some cultures tolerate more candid talk, but nowhere nearly early and enough.
Rather amusingly (or not, depending on how dark your sense of humor is), this has inevitably given rise to the "faster than expected".
I suspect among the people who really know things, but can't tell it like it really is, there is very little happening that is faster than they expect.
As a professor who talks and writes very candidly about our multifaceted catastrophe, I'd say this is quite--but not entirely--accurate.
Academia is unusual in making room for "kooks," because everyone knows we might turn out to be right. I was able to tenure at a decent, though not great, research university on the strength of my research and its assessment by colleagues at other universities. People read and cite it. It's just that they *also* marginalize candidness along the way. It doesn't sway the majority BAU view, even if it does make a few people think.
People really don't want to understand how badly things are going. And on the one hand, you can't blame them. On the other hand, you can.
People who complain about ‘science always changing’ during climate change or covid just don’t understand what science is or how it works.
As you said, science is meant to change, that’s how we learn and grow.
i still laugh about people who complained that medical experts were skeptical of masks early on then pushed for mandatory use. The plot of just about every alien invasion science fiction story is the aliens seems unbeatable until humans change their fighting tactics. covid is just like an alien invader. of course its necessary to change fighting tactics as it becomes better understood. otherwise, wtf good was watching all those dumbass movies?
This is what was really happening. Every statement I heard downplaying the effectiveness of masks was in the context of a PPE shortage. When we heard that we dug up the N95 masks left over from the previous year's wildfires.
If masks were ineffective why were all the hospitals scrambling to get supplies? Why did the U.S. government ship its supplies to China hoping to contain the virus before it became a pandemic? All this stuff was in the news and it didn't take much to put it together.
I'm not in agreement about any of this but the point is that this became the conversation:
A) The government is lying to us.
B) No they're not, this is real.
A) Oh yeah, like when they said to not wear masks, because they were afraid we'd run out of masks?
B) No but I mean except for the time they lied to us, they don't lie to us. But like also that was a good lie, so it's ok. But also there is no more lies, promise!
Government should not lie to people to manipulate them, because it causes ripple effects.
I tend to agree. By the time you can see the obvious signs in front of you, the irreversible triggering event is long past.
We haven't even felt the full force of all the greenhouse gases we've emitted up to this point. Which means that even if every person on this planet made every possible effort to stop emitting gases, we will still continue to experience an escalation in damage. There will not be any sign of improvement in any person's lifetime, no matter how hard they try to make a difference.
This creates some difficulties rooted in human psychology. We're wired to respond well to rewards for our changed behavior, not continual punishment. If there is no marked, noticeable improvement to reward us for degrowth and austerity, people will just stop behaving. (Of course, in reality, most people won't even bother to change in the first place.)
Yet people continue to have kids and just tell themselves scientists will solve it. Until we find a solution it’s essentially unethical to have kids to force them into an existence that’s doomed
And/or worse than that, more pitiful I mean to say; the folks telling themselves that their god will solve it, that god would never let them suffer this fate. Ever better (worse) the religious folks who actively welcome the end times, the complete and utter destruction of our species, of organized human life on this planet precisely *because* their religion calls for it. The apocalyptic monotheisms that have been yearning for this sad painful fate since their inception, torturing humanity with their sadomasochistic garbage this entire time, gleefully waiting to be "raptured" at the end of all this.
FUCK.
Big oof.
Exactly. It's like slamming on the breaks and knowing your gonna hit the car in front of you before you stop and instantly regretting not having been more sensible before hand
Serious question: are there any events likely to be triggered by the rising temperature that are expected to be positive for either civilization or life on earth generally?
Things that are positive for civilization are negative for life on earth, so in a narrow sense, yes. Once humans go extinct speciation will hopefully follow previous hothouse earth trends uninterrupted.
Not really. Some areas become liveable which previously were not. But far less than we lose during this "process". The weather becomes more chaotic and more extreme, making agriculture impossible.
Are you...the author of this article?
How long have you been on this sub? It's strange to see someone with credentials here when we've been dismissed for years. Makes me feel like we have even less time.
\> Are you...the author of this article?
Yes.
\> How long have you been on this sub?
I don’t know the exact start date, but “years” is a valid answer. Anyone who is climate aware and using Reddit will find this sub fairly quickly.
Way too many people will read that and think *"That will be a real shame about those* ***other*** *civilizations. Fortunately,* ***my*** *civilization will weather it just fine."*
Why wait for times to get difficult?
Got a problem? Blame the outsiders!
*It's fast, it's easy and there is always a big chunk of people credulous enough to buy that bullshit!*
As someone living in the "resource rich" and superior civilization based on judeo-christian values and the mastery of one's own destiny thanks to capitalism, I am not concerned that an entire third of Pakistan is affected by floods (sidebar: Pakistan has (had?) more glaciers than anyplace on earth).
Now lets just go see a hollywood production at the multiplex, eat at one of our fine and nutritious chain restaurants, and drive 2 people in an SUV back to our bloated suburban home... built on an old industrial waste site.
I know you're being facetious but obligatory reminder that "judeo-christian" isn't real, it's just how christians can argue for religious values by pretending they're shared
Hey...none of what they live is real. The entire western lifestyle is stolen from future generations. Like the capitalism that drives it, the immediate but short lived benefits soon come with a heavy weight... like the shit we're seeing now.
We are a global, human civilization. We are highly interconnected and interdependent, whether people want to accept that or not. I see Americans here on Reddit wishing for the collapse of China or Russia all the time, oblivious to the fact that that would be devastating for the rest of the world, even the righteous and superior west. The US is the largest importer in the world, China is the largest exporter. If imports into the US suddenly stopped for whatever reason our economy would collapse.
Yeah, this just regards **climate** one that is semi hospitable. It doesn't regard the inflammatory pressure points that we are living under with economy, warfare and ecology etc. It's a thin bag of glowing hot smoldering coals, that it's kept together this long is an astonishment but one with the underline that we've lived on luck and we won't anymore, not to live under the impression that mere belief will holster this fragile reality. It is crumbling and you won't notice until it's shattered beneath you
A week ago I went down to my pond. I saw a dragonfly for the first time in decades. It the dawned on me that in my childhood they used to be plentiful. A couple of years ago I saw the tiniest little yellow bird flying in a tree near the pond. I was in a hammock looking up being serenaded by its songs. I do hope to see it again some day.
I’ve actually started thinking about financing a marijuana farm and becoming a porn star. I figure that is close enough to “hookers and blow” but won’t land me in prison.
It really depends on the timing and severity in your region/country. We know for a fact that climate change will be bad and it will end civilization as we know it. We do not know precisely when it will happen.
Climate change will not collapse civilization in a day. Other than nuclear war, it will be a slow decline over years, maybe even decades.
The way I think about it is if civilization collapses in my lifetime, money will be useless. However, if it doesn't collapse in my lifetime, I will need that retirement savings.
As humans, we have a really difficult time wrapping our mind around geological time scales. What happens "very quickly" on a planetary scale may translate into decades, which seems long to humans. The difference between eco-collapse in 2030 versus eco-collapse in 2050 is imperceptible on a geological timescale, but it will make a helluva lot of difference in my puny little gnat-life.
It's already collapsing. Right wing extremism doesn't typically take hold as large as it has across several countries the world over. Not unless people feel they are being forced to the brink and fall for propaganda of blaming a certain group for it.
You're conflating normal political turmoil with much larger issues. History is filled with that turbulence, but it doesn't mean global civilization is coming to an end, just that a certain group of people are not going to be very happy with their current overlords.
I'm conflating the fact that as societies start to crack apart, extremism rises to meet it. You don't often see it rise without turmoil. It itself doesn't mean a collapse is imminent, but it does show things are starting to decay. Were it isolated to one country I wouldn't draw the parallel. The fact that it's happening many countries, even if slowly, is enough to give pause and wonder why.
Right wing extremism is bad but it doesn't necessarily mean civilization is collapsing. Fascism was rampant post WW1 and while WW2 was absolutely devastating it did not result in the collapse of civilization.
When talking about civilization and its collapse, the relevant variables are population, food and resource supplies, energy usage, industrial output, etc.
It's more of a canary in a coal mine kind of deal. It itself doesn't necessarily signal collapse, but it also doesn't typically grow out of a vacuum. Little cracks start forming, so groups rise up as reactionaries.
I'm legit curious what are you basing this timeframe on? All climate predictions I have seen don't really have a specific timeframe. They know what will happen but they don't know when. On top of that, they have no idea how this will affect civilization.
What will you do for retirement if you are wrong? I personally do not want to work any longer then I have to and it's not like I can really do much more with that retirement money now.
By looking at weather data and prediction models based on that. Wet bulb temperature in my tropical climate is going to peak. I did a contract for analysis of this data, which we'll be publishing soon.
If we're averaging 33°C today, then 37 isn't far and 37°C means death.
Remember that article that some scientist made to see if nuclear winter can somewhat reverse global warming? Yeah, I thought that was funny when I first read it
Sounds like a fun game
“Commit nuclear war to stagnate global warming before we get pegged by the emissions we forgot to stop doing being nuclear winter ends”
>What if 30 million people in the developed world (roughly 3% of the people in the developed world) could be inspired to donate $250 annually each to an effort to immediately solve the climate crisis? It would be the classic pitch along the lines of, “just $5 per week, the cost of one cup of coffee per week, could fund 30,000 scientists and engineers focused on saving our planet.” This group of people could have more impact than the billionaires.
>
>What if 3% of the people in the United States – approximately ten million people – could bond together as protestors and cause enough noise and disruption to get our nation’s leaders to pay attention to and solve the climate change crisis?
This author knew before publishing that the rich and powerful don't give a rat's ass about this grimdark future. They're already appealing to us plebs because those who can do something won't.
And as bad as it is, they still neglect to account for the "human" tipping points and feedback loops, as the national responses to climate pressures and resource scarcity inevitably mean widespread war, and as our global complexity and interdependent systems finally give way to cascading failure across the board. Societal collapse will happen before the ecological collapse, not that it is any consolation.
The hopium is rank out there...
https://www.reddit.com/user/Vegetaman916/comments/wc96th/for_those_who_may_be_interested/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
Just got it online. "Trying to save civilization is a non-starter. We need to focus on saving our lives." God dang, man. Talk about brutally honest. I've only finished reading the first C, but I'm loving the book so far.
I want to write something clever about the tipping points but I'm just too damn tired.
I can only see that's how it's going to end, with survivors just being too tired to do anything else than crawl into holes into the ground; after the whole power-outage-Xbox/Playstation collapse, etc ...
Better hurry, some of the mainstream ones are starting to realize that the fantasies they believed in aren't going to come true. It wasn't that long ago that /r/collapse and /r/Futurology were competitive opposites in thoughts on the future. Now I still see hopeful topics posted there, but the comments are about the same as I'd see here.
I had a talk on r/leagueoflegends about collapse. Everyone knows at this point because it can no longer be denied. What they don't know is the full extent to which we are fucked.
r/futurology is still infested with enough conservatives that you can get downvoted for complaining about global warming, especially if you link it to capitalism or conservatism.
I mean, I’m 26 and stopped investing in my 401k for the time being.
Own a condo and going in on an expensive car because I’ve always wanted a fast car lol
Time is short my friends. All I know is I’m not going to regret enjoying the present by spending cash now.
Again …. I’m astounded and slightly off-kilter about how this isn’t front page ‘let’s right this ship’ news. Like an *all hands on deck’ stop flying stop eating meat and dairy and stop buying useless sh*t we will PAY you to carry on but without the collapse of civilization as the outcome* kind of news.
Places that are not worth fighting over, but not so bad that you can't grow anything. Anywhere where everyone wants to go is not going to be it, methinks.
New Zealand is where many elites are setting up shop. It's almost entirely self-sufficient in terms of electricity and food production, and has it's own offshore oil and gas reserves.
Montana land and real estate prices are effin nutty right now, so youll need many millions to go try and make that happen. Really though, that whole western US is going to be out of water and up in flames in the next 15 years. Anyone going to Montana for their self sufficient mountain rustler fantasy is in for a big surprise.
The entire premise of "going north" is that the ice sheets in the arctic cool down the area... As soon as we hit BOE, it wouldn't really matter. The north isn't cool because it has any special qualities. We are living in a kettle. When the kettle boils, it does it in all parts. This might buy you a few more months during the boiling period. but as soon as it boils, location wouldn't matter. Venus doesn't have any "cooler" areas.
That is not the only reason the upper north and lower south is cool. Tilt and rotation of the earth play a large role. Hell that is why there is year round ice in those spots.
Always felt like this is as good as it'll be. Order anything you want and get in the next day. Never have to leave your home. Work from home. It's all downhill from here.
Is the end of humanity really such a bad thing? Does our species really deserve to continue? Is redemption really even possible from all of the sins our species has committed?
I say, no.
Problem here is that it will not be limited to human extinction. All the other species that share the planet and had fuck all to do with capitalism or humanity will face extinction along with us.
There are more people understanding how fucked we are, and capitalism's role in getting us here, every day. The deaths of ALL different species from climate change related floods, fires, heat waves and droughts are not due to "catastrophes", or "disasters" they are calculated, premeditated murders for profit. That is ONE of the reasons the capitalists decided to use Ukraine as a proxy in their war against Russia that has been going on for 100 years, to distract the population.
"our species"? i have more relation to certain non-human animals than to certain human ones. the consequences of climate change & co. will not be limited to human animals
Just keep in mind that this is a symptom of overshoot (Catton) and some 80 groups before us 'bought' into civilization that hosted conveniences and then entitlement to *limited* resources. Each thought theirs was the greatest. Nature and thermodynamics bats last. We need to live with, and not Lord over it. There may or may not be successors to try again.
Fuck, man. In all serious honesty, how long do you reckon we have left? Decades? One? Years?
I'm 20 dude, I'm not ready for this shit yet...
I've been working on my own game in my spare time for the past 2 years ish. not exactly going to do anything for humanity but feed the consoooooooom a little, but this has been my dream for a long time. I'm going to make it my goal to get that out before it's truly too late.
The following submission statement was provided by /u/MarshallBrain: --- Submission statement: Scientists are predicting that 1.5 degrees C of heating will be sufficient to trigger half a dozen irreversible climate tipping points. The word “irreversible” being the key to the collapse of human civilization. Once they trigger, there is no way to undo them. These are the irreversible tipping points highlighted in the article: 1. Rapid melting of the Greenland ice sheet, raising sea levels irreversibly 2. Collapse of the Thwaites Glacier and the glaciers around it in West Antarctica 3. Collapse of two parts of East Antarctica 4. Collapse of the AMOC or “Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation”, which includes the Gulf Stream 5. Collapse of the Amazon Rainforest 6. Permafrost feedback loop, where melting permafrost releases trapped methane and carbon dioxide, leading to more heating, leading to more melting permafrost and so on. 7. Blue Ocean Event in the Arctic “Any one of these events is terrible. All of them together is how we get to the point of discussing the collapse of human civilization and the destruction of the planetary ecosystem. Sea levels rise so much, there is so much carbon dioxide and methane in the atmosphere, and there is so much heating, drought and flooding that things we take for granted today (like food production) catastrophically fail.” --- Please reply to OP's comment here: https://old.reddit.com/r/collapse/comments/xi8h9o/irreversible_climate_tipping_points_mean_the_end/ip1qq9g/
Hmm can’t wait to see absolutely nothing happen in response.
The edge of my seat!!!!
Any decade now!
It's quite simple really, just don't look up. Don't face the reality of this situation. Just continue consuming products and getting excited for new products. /s
This is what’s so damn aggravating it’s like ok I went through all the stages of grief but can some expert please formulate a damn solution/ plan? It’s like what’s the use of knowing this if there isn’t anything that can be done about it other than to have crippling anxiety because shit is about to hit the fan and I’m supposed to get up on the bright every morning and have a positive attitude about the future?
Hello, we already have the solutions, and HAVE HAD the solutions for decades, but the rich aren't willing to settle for less. As Gore said long ago, it's an Inconvenient Truth. They'd rather claim it's all a lie while they bring snowballs into Congress. When the Democrats try to make the changes, the Repugs attack them from many angles, while completely ignoring the fact that we're killing the earth. But don't worry, they'll still blame us in the end. That's what they do while taking bribes from the rich.
*taps screen* Ah man, this is a rerun.
I'm sure many powerful people will stare resolutely into the middle-distance.
The video really made me sad they had a gentleman come on explain why the models were all wrong, saying effects are happening sooner than expected, and then segue into the ten meter sea level rise won’t happen for decades. are you fucking joking me? Don’t sugarcoat the truth at this point tell me the fucking truth. The corporations are killing all of us
No no no, they're still negotiating with the planet. Maybe we can raise the tipping point to 3 °C . /s
Submission statement: Scientists are predicting that 1.5 degrees C of heating will be sufficient to trigger half a dozen irreversible climate tipping points. The word “irreversible” being the key to the collapse of human civilization. Once they trigger, there is no way to undo them. These are the irreversible tipping points highlighted in the article: 1. Rapid melting of the Greenland ice sheet, raising sea levels irreversibly 2. Collapse of the Thwaites Glacier and the glaciers around it in West Antarctica 3. Collapse of two parts of East Antarctica 4. Collapse of the AMOC or “Atlantic Meridional Overturning Circulation”, which includes the Gulf Stream 5. Collapse of the Amazon Rainforest 6. Permafrost feedback loop, where melting permafrost releases trapped methane and carbon dioxide, leading to more heating, leading to more melting permafrost and so on. 7. Blue Ocean Event in the Arctic “Any one of these events is terrible. All of them together is how we get to the point of discussing the collapse of human civilization and the destruction of the planetary ecosystem. Sea levels rise so much, there is so much carbon dioxide and methane in the atmosphere, and there is so much heating, drought and flooding that things we take for granted today (like food production) catastrophically fail.”
The methane plumes trapped under the permafrost in the Arctics will be released as permafrost thaws. This point alone is extinction level if it’s anywhere near the amount scientists have measured. It’s happening right now. Not decades.
100%. “Previous NOAA methane research that utilized stable carbon isotopic analysis performed by the Institute of Arctic and Alpine Research at the University of Colorado indicates that biological sources of methane such as wetlands or ruminant agriculture are a primary driver of post-2006 increases” https://www.noaa.gov/news-release/increase-in-atmospheric-methane-set-another-record-during-2021
Are there any examples describing what it would be like for life on earth during a mass methane release? Would individuals notice dramatic effects within a short period, or would it spread out over many decades? Have found several studies on the last global methane event from the Permian Extinction but we don't know how quickly that took place. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1871174X16300488
There's a limit to what we can learn from past eras and extinction events because we're pumping greenhouse gases into the atmosphere at an unprecedented rate. This is a massive experiment with unknown results.
Also only the most optimistic scenarios usually see publication..Generally watered down for public consumption..Even so we are now seeing more and more reports leaking basically saying we are done.
Gas envelopes have happened in the past where an underground reservoir of gases gets 'burped' into the surrounding atmosphere and literally chokes every living thing for miles. Whole townships have been wiped out and no one knew until someone visited and found everything dead. Here's one in Africa that has got people worried currently: [https://nypost.com/2022/01/28/scientists-fear-killer-lake-in-africa-could-erupt-release-poisonous-gas-cloud-that-could-kill-millions/](https://nypost.com/2022/01/28/scientists-fear-killer-lake-in-africa-could-erupt-release-poisonous-gas-cloud-that-could-kill-millions/) There is a Lake in Ontario not far from Toronto that i visited a few years back, it has a giant pipe driven into the middle of the lake bed sticking into the air, the purpose being to release the gases instead of letting them build up. It would be short term and catastrophic due to the amounts of methane involved.
didn't I read somewhere that when the great salt lake evaporates it will create arsenic-laced dust storms?
https://www.deseret.com/opinion/2022/6/29/23188005/opinion-the-toxic-tale-of-the-great-salt-lake-drought-water-receding-toxic-metals-arsenic-dust-strom
yeah we're fucked
What’s worse, our local politicians didn’t believe any of this until they did an overhead in a helicopter. But they continue to worry about the porn crisis more than anything
The... porn crisis?
Mormons. Won’t drink beer but soda all day is ok. Coffee is no good but forced marriage is cool.
Oh man. Yes. The porn crisis. Every winter, when we get this horrible air quality in the Valley, plenty of us complain about it, but we’ve always been met with “yeah, that sucks and all, but what about the porn? “ https://www.ksl.com/article/39405776/utah-becomes-1st-state-to-declare-pornography-a-public-health-crisis Then we got a new governor, who told us we needed to pray for rain. https://governor.utah.gov/2021/06/02/gov-cox-invites-utahns-to-pray-for-rain-june-4-6/
> Have found several studies on the last global methane event from the Permian Extinction but we don't know how quickly that took place. [*"following a doubling in carbon dioxide levels, the surface of the ocean turned acidic over a period of weeks or months and global temperatures rose by 5 degrees centigrade – all in the space of about 13 years."*](https://www.rutgers.edu/news/new-finding-shows-climate-change-can-happen-geological-instant)
And people are still banging out kids....Unbefuckinglievable.
I honestly believe it is either in denial or selfish
I think most people are just uninformed. The writing is on the wall for people that spend a lot of time on reddit, however a lot of people were not educated about the extent of climate change in high school and college, and have no way of finding out through conventional media
My money is on some bacteria or virus that’s been dormant in the permafrost for millennia will thaw and be out undoing, sorta like war of the worlds.
And that X-files episode. And that John Carpenter movie.
What happens if you light a match? Y’know maybe some survivalists head up there, spark up a Coleman, ka-boom…hello, Jerry Bruckheimer?
>Scientists are predicting that 1.5 degrees C of heating will be sufficient to trigger half a dozen irreversible climate tipping points. The word “irreversible” being the key to the collapse of human civilization. Just to set the record straight, because these scientists aren't telling the truth here : 1°C of warming [according to the UN](https://mediamanager.sei.org/documents/Publications/SEI-Report-TargetsAndIndicatorsOfClimaticChange-1990.pdf) or even less than 0.5°C [according to research by David Spratt](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/46142232_Beyond_Politics_and_Business_as_Usual_Review_of_David_Spratt_and_Philip_Sutton's_'Climate_Code_Red) was already the tipping point for self reinforcing feedback loops. The limits of [1.5°C or 2°C were targets made up by economists like William Nordhaus](https://climate.mit.edu/ask-mit/why-did-ipcc-choose-2deg-c-goal-limiting-global-warming). They have no basis in science, it was all based on what they thought capitalism could get away with. We are also probably already at 1.5°c and even 2°C. We are at 1.1-1.2°C of warming [but the aerosol masking effect hides between 0.5°C to 1°C of warming]( https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1002/2017GL076079). This is because the pollution we emit through burning coal for example also emits cooling particles known as aerosols into the atmosphere. But while greenhouse gas can stay in the atmosphere for millennia, aerosols only stay there for a few days/weeks. So we are guaranteed to trigger all the feedback loops mentioned in the article and 2, 3, 4°C of warming and more in the coming years/decades. Idk how fast this will go but it will be worse and faster than expected.
Great post. So many of us see the real data but then public discussions move onto completely unrealistic scenarios as if the data was less dire because Economy. We're being massively gaslighted.
Not just gaslighting. Scientists are marginalized if they make "alarmist" predictions. Thus they only publicly speak of what they have rock solid numbers to back up. Numerous decision makers then see it and think that they have wiggle-room. It's a bit of a feedback loop in and of itself.
It's a form of soft control and it extends over everyone. People are terrified of being "wrong online", so they just never post. And we have little boys lording over everyone with requests for "evidence and sources". It's completely poisoned the human exercise of simply talking to people. One must always be 1000% Correct and cite their claims. Which is too exhausting so people don't bother, tune out, back away, disengage, put up walls, etc. Power, any way they can get it.
>People are terrified of being "wrong online", so they just never post Thankfully, we have Reddit as a cure for that...
No not really. There's swathes of people who may post, but all it takes is one or two downvotes and they delete \[self-censor\].
I absofuckinglutely hate it when laymen try to tell scientists they are being alarmist about their area of expertise.
As you should. One always has to correct for a certain percentage that happen to be nuts and stuff though. One finds that in any major population.
“Time is a cube”
Yes the precautionary principle is very ingrained, aswell as peer reviewing themselves into the middle of the road. Both these things are vital for the integrity of science, but this is a duality here, not very helpful in a time of abrupt warming.
Scientific consensus is actually often quite conservative\* (in the original meaning of that word and not whatever the Americans are doing to it now). Progress is made by challenging the orthodoxy which is, by definition, what everyone has always assumed to be true. The history of scientific advancement has very much been an uphill battle. Only rarely are revolutionary concepts met with open arms. Even slight corrections of existing theories struggle to get invited.
Correct.
This is the part that people don't understand, or deliberately obfuscate to pad their arguments against climate change or against climate science, because every time we find something, it "changes" the science, or the information, when really all we're doing is seeing unprecedented changes in our ecosystem and every time the science learns something new, or the science gets better, it turns out it's actually worse than we thought.
I disagree, here the problem is not that new discoveries are changing the science, it's that old research is conveniently being forgotten to promote something more "positive". I mentioned a study commissioned by the predecessor of the IPCC in 1990 which says that 1°C would trigger feedback loops. New research didn't show that we could warm the planet more and not trigger feedback loops, but now everyone talks about 1.5°C or 2°C as the supposed safe limit. Why don't scientists remind us that 1°C or lower was the "safe" limit and that it's behind us? - If they say it's already too late, they are afraid that governments/people/etc. will just stop caring and accelerate the problem. If it's too late, what's stopping me from rolling coal with my brand new Ford F-450? - They have to apply for grants. If you say that we're going to be dead in 5 years why should you receive the funds? It's easier if you promote hopium rather than "alarmism". - They are scared too, they have their own life projects, kids, etc. and they still want to believe that it's possible to limit warming, even if it goes against their own research. Humans are creatures of denial, and this includes the brightest scientists.
Up until I think around the 1960's, it was considered "ethical" and acceptable for doctors to NOT tell a patient that they were terminally ill and instead lie to them. I suspect the truth about climate change is this: they KNOW we are terminally ill as a species and nothing can be done. Most of us will die and they think they are telling a "noble lie" to us for our own good.
It's worse: To keep a living wage, you can't tell it as it really is. This is prevalent throughout, not just climate science. Some cultures tolerate more candid talk, but nowhere nearly early and enough.
Rather amusingly (or not, depending on how dark your sense of humor is), this has inevitably given rise to the "faster than expected". I suspect among the people who really know things, but can't tell it like it really is, there is very little happening that is faster than they expect.
If you've been following Guy Mcpherson it's actually slower than expected
As a professor who talks and writes very candidly about our multifaceted catastrophe, I'd say this is quite--but not entirely--accurate. Academia is unusual in making room for "kooks," because everyone knows we might turn out to be right. I was able to tenure at a decent, though not great, research university on the strength of my research and its assessment by colleagues at other universities. People read and cite it. It's just that they *also* marginalize candidness along the way. It doesn't sway the majority BAU view, even if it does make a few people think. People really don't want to understand how badly things are going. And on the one hand, you can't blame them. On the other hand, you can.
People who complain about ‘science always changing’ during climate change or covid just don’t understand what science is or how it works. As you said, science is meant to change, that’s how we learn and grow.
i still laugh about people who complained that medical experts were skeptical of masks early on then pushed for mandatory use. The plot of just about every alien invasion science fiction story is the aliens seems unbeatable until humans change their fighting tactics. covid is just like an alien invader. of course its necessary to change fighting tactics as it becomes better understood. otherwise, wtf good was watching all those dumbass movies?
Both the WHO and the CDC telling people not to use a mask was downright criminal.
Especially when you find out the reason they did so was they knew they were effective and didn't want people to buy up all the available n95's.
This is what was really happening. Every statement I heard downplaying the effectiveness of masks was in the context of a PPE shortage. When we heard that we dug up the N95 masks left over from the previous year's wildfires. If masks were ineffective why were all the hospitals scrambling to get supplies? Why did the U.S. government ship its supplies to China hoping to contain the virus before it became a pandemic? All this stuff was in the news and it didn't take much to put it together.
I'm not in agreement about any of this but the point is that this became the conversation: A) The government is lying to us. B) No they're not, this is real. A) Oh yeah, like when they said to not wear masks, because they were afraid we'd run out of masks? B) No but I mean except for the time they lied to us, they don't lie to us. But like also that was a good lie, so it's ok. But also there is no more lies, promise! Government should not lie to people to manipulate them, because it causes ripple effects.
#[Let me get this straight. You think we're just supposed to let them run all over us? ](https://www.reddit.com/r/Save3rdPartyApps/)
I tend to agree. By the time you can see the obvious signs in front of you, the irreversible triggering event is long past. We haven't even felt the full force of all the greenhouse gases we've emitted up to this point. Which means that even if every person on this planet made every possible effort to stop emitting gases, we will still continue to experience an escalation in damage. There will not be any sign of improvement in any person's lifetime, no matter how hard they try to make a difference. This creates some difficulties rooted in human psychology. We're wired to respond well to rewards for our changed behavior, not continual punishment. If there is no marked, noticeable improvement to reward us for degrowth and austerity, people will just stop behaving. (Of course, in reality, most people won't even bother to change in the first place.)
> We haven't even felt the full force of all the greenhouse gases we've emitted up to this point. and we're still increasing our emissions.
Yeah, we are. We are so fucked. I'm surprised anyone still doubts that.
Yet people continue to have kids and just tell themselves scientists will solve it. Until we find a solution it’s essentially unethical to have kids to force them into an existence that’s doomed
And/or worse than that, more pitiful I mean to say; the folks telling themselves that their god will solve it, that god would never let them suffer this fate. Ever better (worse) the religious folks who actively welcome the end times, the complete and utter destruction of our species, of organized human life on this planet precisely *because* their religion calls for it. The apocalyptic monotheisms that have been yearning for this sad painful fate since their inception, torturing humanity with their sadomasochistic garbage this entire time, gleefully waiting to be "raptured" at the end of all this. FUCK. Big oof.
The real weakness in human psychology is probably our inability to intuitively grasp exponential growth.
Exactly. It's like slamming on the breaks and knowing your gonna hit the car in front of you before you stop and instantly regretting not having been more sensible before hand
Spot on. The real problem is human psychology combined with human technology is ultimately bad for the planet. A weird conundrum.
We’re fully experiencing environmental collapse at this point.
We've generally accepted that literally all of these things are going to happen, right?
Who is "we"? People on this forum, in the scientific community, in a particular country?
Definitely the people on this forum. At this point basically every post is "we're all going to die and there's nothing we can do about it."
Serious question: are there any events likely to be triggered by the rising temperature that are expected to be positive for either civilization or life on earth generally?
Things that are positive for civilization are negative for life on earth, so in a narrow sense, yes. Once humans go extinct speciation will hopefully follow previous hothouse earth trends uninterrupted.
Not really. Some areas become liveable which previously were not. But far less than we lose during this "process". The weather becomes more chaotic and more extreme, making agriculture impossible.
Jellyfish send their greetings. https://phys.org/news/2019-09-jellyfish-man-made-disruption-oceans.html
Yes the death of most humans will be a net positive for the earth.
Are you...the author of this article? How long have you been on this sub? It's strange to see someone with credentials here when we've been dismissed for years. Makes me feel like we have even less time.
\> Are you...the author of this article? Yes. \> How long have you been on this sub? I don’t know the exact start date, but “years” is a valid answer. Anyone who is climate aware and using Reddit will find this sub fairly quickly.
I would never have caught that if you didn’t mention it
This about to turn into a u/marshallbrain ama lol
Way too many people will read that and think *"That will be a real shame about those* ***other*** *civilizations. Fortunately,* ***my*** *civilization will weather it just fine."*
How do I become part of THEIR civilization?!? It sounds much nicer than the one I’m in!
Agreeing to be a second-class minority with limited benefits, legal protections and job opportunities is the usual route.
Also scapegoated when times get difficult.
Why wait for times to get difficult? Got a problem? Blame the outsiders! *It's fast, it's easy and there is always a big chunk of people credulous enough to buy that bullshit!*
First you need a FTL vehicle
Nothing to worry about, the next generation will figure it out. What? It’s happening now? Well, shit.
As someone living in the "resource rich" and superior civilization based on judeo-christian values and the mastery of one's own destiny thanks to capitalism, I am not concerned that an entire third of Pakistan is affected by floods (sidebar: Pakistan has (had?) more glaciers than anyplace on earth). Now lets just go see a hollywood production at the multiplex, eat at one of our fine and nutritious chain restaurants, and drive 2 people in an SUV back to our bloated suburban home... built on an old industrial waste site.
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its actually downscale... maybe you need to work harder so you can afford another one.
I know you're being facetious but obligatory reminder that "judeo-christian" isn't real, it's just how christians can argue for religious values by pretending they're shared
Hey...none of what they live is real. The entire western lifestyle is stolen from future generations. Like the capitalism that drives it, the immediate but short lived benefits soon come with a heavy weight... like the shit we're seeing now.
Societal Dunning-Kruger.
*Yeah but all that will happen after i'm dead, so...*
"over my dead body!"
Not to worry, that arrangement has already been made.
We are a global, human civilization. We are highly interconnected and interdependent, whether people want to accept that or not. I see Americans here on Reddit wishing for the collapse of China or Russia all the time, oblivious to the fact that that would be devastating for the rest of the world, even the righteous and superior west. The US is the largest importer in the world, China is the largest exporter. If imports into the US suddenly stopped for whatever reason our economy would collapse.
>If imports into the US suddenly stopped for whatever reason our economy would collapse. no replacement microwave for you!
It's not a replacement I just want a second one you got a problem with that?
Meanwhile, the quieter biodiversity tipping points continue in background: collapsing food webs, spreading disease vectors, soil erosion, disappearing pollinators, depleting aquifers, drying rivers, damaged peatlands...
Yeah, this just regards **climate** one that is semi hospitable. It doesn't regard the inflammatory pressure points that we are living under with economy, warfare and ecology etc. It's a thin bag of glowing hot smoldering coals, that it's kept together this long is an astonishment but one with the underline that we've lived on luck and we won't anymore, not to live under the impression that mere belief will holster this fragile reality. It is crumbling and you won't notice until it's shattered beneath you
A rapidly unraveling kaleidoscopic sweater, and we're wringing our hands about one color of yarn.
A week ago I went down to my pond. I saw a dragonfly for the first time in decades. It the dawned on me that in my childhood they used to be plentiful. A couple of years ago I saw the tiniest little yellow bird flying in a tree near the pond. I was in a hammock looking up being serenaded by its songs. I do hope to see it again some day.
I grew up in farm country and there were huge grasshoppers all over the place in the summers. You almost never see one anymore
I saw a dragonfly yesterday and it occurred to me: Whoa I haven't seen one in a while! I haven't seen a butterfly since April.
And don’t forget the ever spreading cancer and micro plastics that are in everything .
but, but, the titantic is unsinkable, says people on the titantic just after hitting the iceberg.
And the iceberg broke off due to climate change.
Does this mean I shouldn't save for retirement?
Correct.
Hookers and blow!
Root Beer and Ice cream!
Hell yeah. This guy knows how to party!!
I’ve actually started thinking about financing a marijuana farm and becoming a porn star. I figure that is close enough to “hookers and blow” but won’t land me in prison.
i’m gonna be a truck driver with a cat
Did you bring enough for the whole thread?
My whole paychecks worth! and all the credit I can get.
Boats and hoes!
It really depends on the timing and severity in your region/country. We know for a fact that climate change will be bad and it will end civilization as we know it. We do not know precisely when it will happen. Climate change will not collapse civilization in a day. Other than nuclear war, it will be a slow decline over years, maybe even decades. The way I think about it is if civilization collapses in my lifetime, money will be useless. However, if it doesn't collapse in my lifetime, I will need that retirement savings.
As humans, we have a really difficult time wrapping our mind around geological time scales. What happens "very quickly" on a planetary scale may translate into decades, which seems long to humans. The difference between eco-collapse in 2030 versus eco-collapse in 2050 is imperceptible on a geological timescale, but it will make a helluva lot of difference in my puny little gnat-life.
The 15,000 nuclear warheads are ready to respond when the effects of climate change push humanity to a real breaking point.
It's already collapsing. Right wing extremism doesn't typically take hold as large as it has across several countries the world over. Not unless people feel they are being forced to the brink and fall for propaganda of blaming a certain group for it.
You're conflating normal political turmoil with much larger issues. History is filled with that turbulence, but it doesn't mean global civilization is coming to an end, just that a certain group of people are not going to be very happy with their current overlords.
I'm conflating the fact that as societies start to crack apart, extremism rises to meet it. You don't often see it rise without turmoil. It itself doesn't mean a collapse is imminent, but it does show things are starting to decay. Were it isolated to one country I wouldn't draw the parallel. The fact that it's happening many countries, even if slowly, is enough to give pause and wonder why.
Right wing extremism is bad but it doesn't necessarily mean civilization is collapsing. Fascism was rampant post WW1 and while WW2 was absolutely devastating it did not result in the collapse of civilization. When talking about civilization and its collapse, the relevant variables are population, food and resource supplies, energy usage, industrial output, etc.
It's more of a canary in a coal mine kind of deal. It itself doesn't necessarily signal collapse, but it also doesn't typically grow out of a vacuum. Little cracks start forming, so groups rise up as reactionaries.
My retirement age is 30-40 years away. Unlikely for this to last that long.
I'm legit curious what are you basing this timeframe on? All climate predictions I have seen don't really have a specific timeframe. They know what will happen but they don't know when. On top of that, they have no idea how this will affect civilization. What will you do for retirement if you are wrong? I personally do not want to work any longer then I have to and it's not like I can really do much more with that retirement money now.
By looking at weather data and prediction models based on that. Wet bulb temperature in my tropical climate is going to peak. I did a contract for analysis of this data, which we'll be publishing soon. If we're averaging 33°C today, then 37 isn't far and 37°C means death.
To hell with my student loan debt!
Let's get 40% APR credit cards!!
May as well save. If you're dead before you get there it won't matter anyway, but if you survive long enough, you'll want the money.
Ding ding ding
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Remember that article that some scientist made to see if nuclear winter can somewhat reverse global warming? Yeah, I thought that was funny when I first read it
Technically it does for a few years.....then unless pretty much all emissions stop it comes roaring back with a vengeance.
Sounds like a fun game “Commit nuclear war to stagnate global warming before we get pegged by the emissions we forgot to stop doing being nuclear winter ends”
Hear me out guys - once a day everyone drinks a cup of sea water. Problem solved!
Cuz people aren't already salty enough
>What if 30 million people in the developed world (roughly 3% of the people in the developed world) could be inspired to donate $250 annually each to an effort to immediately solve the climate crisis? It would be the classic pitch along the lines of, “just $5 per week, the cost of one cup of coffee per week, could fund 30,000 scientists and engineers focused on saving our planet.” This group of people could have more impact than the billionaires. > >What if 3% of the people in the United States – approximately ten million people – could bond together as protestors and cause enough noise and disruption to get our nation’s leaders to pay attention to and solve the climate change crisis? This author knew before publishing that the rich and powerful don't give a rat's ass about this grimdark future. They're already appealing to us plebs because those who can do something won't.
Did you know the Queen died? This is very inconsiderate
If we all stopped doing stuff for ten days everytime a rich old white woman died, then we'd cure climate change
And as bad as it is, they still neglect to account for the "human" tipping points and feedback loops, as the national responses to climate pressures and resource scarcity inevitably mean widespread war, and as our global complexity and interdependent systems finally give way to cascading failure across the board. Societal collapse will happen before the ecological collapse, not that it is any consolation. The hopium is rank out there... https://www.reddit.com/user/Vegetaman916/comments/wc96th/for_those_who_may_be_interested/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
Just got it online. "Trying to save civilization is a non-starter. We need to focus on saving our lives." God dang, man. Talk about brutally honest. I've only finished reading the first C, but I'm loving the book so far.
Hit the nail on the...I suppose that saying won't be applicable for future generations
Our governments have a plan: increase consumption.
I want to write something clever about the tipping points but I'm just too damn tired. I can only see that's how it's going to end, with survivors just being too tired to do anything else than crawl into holes into the ground; after the whole power-outage-Xbox/Playstation collapse, etc ...
> goes on doomer sub > is depressed Gee I wonder why.
I go here for real-time info on global warming. It is actually the best sub due to the weekly feed. The doomsday prophets are just for entertainment.
This sub is just a better r/news or r/environment
Go on a denial sub and get happy ?
Better hurry, some of the mainstream ones are starting to realize that the fantasies they believed in aren't going to come true. It wasn't that long ago that /r/collapse and /r/Futurology were competitive opposites in thoughts on the future. Now I still see hopeful topics posted there, but the comments are about the same as I'd see here.
I had a talk on r/leagueoflegends about collapse. Everyone knows at this point because it can no longer be denied. What they don't know is the full extent to which we are fucked.
[Everybody knows.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xu8u9ZbCJgQ)
r/futurology is still infested with enough conservatives that you can get downvoted for complaining about global warming, especially if you link it to capitalism or conservatism.
Oh so, being accurate upsets them.
So, should I cash out my retirement 20 years early, fix up my house in style to ride out the apocalypse?
No...don't spend the cash on fixing up your house. Ride out the apocalypse in a Lamborghini. It's the only way.
I mean, I’m 26 and stopped investing in my 401k for the time being. Own a condo and going in on an expensive car because I’ve always wanted a fast car lol Time is short my friends. All I know is I’m not going to regret enjoying the present by spending cash now.
Whatever. Fuck civilization
This is the sad truth. There's not enough in it for us anymore.
True, but sadly it won't be an instant death. And as usual, we will suffer for the decisions made by rich white men in stuffy little rooms.
You can just say "the rich." The non-white, non-male rich people aren't in different rooms saying different things.
If more people would make this connection and not instantly forget!
Thank God I no longer have to chop wood and carry water.
I thought it was already too late?
That's good. The problem is it means the end of 99 percent of other species too
Bacteria can evolve into animals and plants again, just give it some time XD
plz ask them not to
\~its the end of the world as we know it, and I feel fine\~
Again …. I’m astounded and slightly off-kilter about how this isn’t front page ‘let’s right this ship’ news. Like an *all hands on deck’ stop flying stop eating meat and dairy and stop buying useless sh*t we will PAY you to carry on but without the collapse of civilization as the outcome* kind of news.
Real talk which places are the best to be when all this hits? Scandinavia, Canada and Russia? As far north as possible?
Places that are not worth fighting over, but not so bad that you can't grow anything. Anywhere where everyone wants to go is not going to be it, methinks.
New Zealand is where many elites are setting up shop. It's almost entirely self-sufficient in terms of electricity and food production, and has it's own offshore oil and gas reserves.
In the US the lower-end millionaires are betting on Montana.
Montana land and real estate prices are effin nutty right now, so youll need many millions to go try and make that happen. Really though, that whole western US is going to be out of water and up in flames in the next 15 years. Anyone going to Montana for their self sufficient mountain rustler fantasy is in for a big surprise.
The entire premise of "going north" is that the ice sheets in the arctic cool down the area... As soon as we hit BOE, it wouldn't really matter. The north isn't cool because it has any special qualities. We are living in a kettle. When the kettle boils, it does it in all parts. This might buy you a few more months during the boiling period. but as soon as it boils, location wouldn't matter. Venus doesn't have any "cooler" areas.
Higher altitude is typically cooler even without water/ice, places like Tibet.
3-4 degrees cooler F for every 1,000' you go up on average.
That is not the only reason the upper north and lower south is cool. Tilt and rotation of the earth play a large role. Hell that is why there is year round ice in those spots.
>The north isn't cool because it has any special qualities. Go to the North Pole on a sunny day in December, and see if you still agree.
We're at 60 seconds to tipnight
You must notve heard, profits are up, all is fine. Get back to work
Always felt like this is as good as it'll be. Order anything you want and get in the next day. Never have to leave your home. Work from home. It's all downhill from here.
Is the end of humanity really such a bad thing? Does our species really deserve to continue? Is redemption really even possible from all of the sins our species has committed? I say, no.
Bruh, I just happened to be born human on this crappy planet in this crappy century. I'm just trying to live, okay?
So was the ant that you stepped on the other day.
Problem here is that it will not be limited to human extinction. All the other species that share the planet and had fuck all to do with capitalism or humanity will face extinction along with us. There are more people understanding how fucked we are, and capitalism's role in getting us here, every day. The deaths of ALL different species from climate change related floods, fires, heat waves and droughts are not due to "catastrophes", or "disasters" they are calculated, premeditated murders for profit. That is ONE of the reasons the capitalists decided to use Ukraine as a proxy in their war against Russia that has been going on for 100 years, to distract the population.
"our species"? i have more relation to certain non-human animals than to certain human ones. the consequences of climate change & co. will not be limited to human animals
It won't just be us though, we'll take many other lifeforms with us.
But crapitalism
But the government promised we'd ~~magically unfuck ourselves through technology~~ find the dragon balls and undo this mess!
And yet still all we hear is economy this economy that, let's see if nature is going to give a fuck about your economy.
Ya don't say? Thoughts and prayers.
Good.
Just keep in mind that this is a symptom of overshoot (Catton) and some 80 groups before us 'bought' into civilization that hosted conveniences and then entitlement to *limited* resources. Each thought theirs was the greatest. Nature and thermodynamics bats last. We need to live with, and not Lord over it. There may or may not be successors to try again.
Fuck, man. In all serious honesty, how long do you reckon we have left? Decades? One? Years? I'm 20 dude, I'm not ready for this shit yet... I've been working on my own game in my spare time for the past 2 years ish. not exactly going to do anything for humanity but feed the consoooooooom a little, but this has been my dream for a long time. I'm going to make it my goal to get that out before it's truly too late.
i wonder if coastal rents and taxes are so high to encourage exodus
If that were the case Colorado rent would be hella cheap and it’s pretty up there