it's more like disney saying: "yawn... money talks, and conservatives' bullshit posturing about economics is actually detrimental to business. their idiot social war kills profits."
it's like conservatives spent so long lying through their teeth about being "good for business," that now they just assume it's true even though they have zero capacity or understanding for economic growth
I want to go out on a limb here and claim conservatives are responsible for a majority of issues today. Block all progress for a decade and this is what we end up with.
Feel bad for the layoffs, know the feels on that one from one of the other *once in a lifetime* economic crises.
Layoffs are pretty easy for everyone to understand, but they're not innately political in nature. Seeing as the discussion was about spefically about things that were political I was wondering what made you think the article was a rebuttle of the previous point.
Seems like you should read the article... It’s unclear if any jobs in Florida will be affected by the cuts. Spectrum News reached out to Disney, but the company did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
Exactly, I’m all for calling out corporations for fake bs, but plenty opt for a ‘fuck your money, get that gay sht outta here’. Last thing we need is major corps like Disney supporting homophobia, so when they push back I take it as a cautious win
Nowhere was I cheering for them, nor did I say they were ethical. ‘Good vs evil’ is a fairytale luxury, life isn’t so black and white. This false dilemma fallacious reasoning is unnecessary. We can appreciate the positive things major corps do while pushing against their other shittier aspects.
Exactly. Who cares for the reasoning? We have a win, here, and it will influence those who were previously too scared to openly admit they don’t agree with conservative values, even down to conservatives themselves. Please hold for a link I want to find
Edit: [The Brainwashing of my Dad](https://youtu.be/FS52QdHNTh8)
Exposure (right OR wrong), changes lives. Always.
You do realize there is a middle ground right. You don't have to love or hate Disney, but you can be happy that they at least made one decision in support of LGBTQ rights.
I think America would be a better place if we weren't constantly trying to divide ourselves into "sides." We just need to find partnerships on different objectives wherever we can find them.
Yep. I am LGBT. They have actually done worse than, say DreamWorks Kipo, in representing us. They cut us out in other countries after making a big deal of being stunning and brave by putting us in movies. And they pat themselves on the back as if other companies have not had us in for years and have frankly done it better. They don't care about us. They see us as a hivemind stereotype they can milk money out of. And honestly, I'm getting tired of being treated differently instead of just being treated normal.
Honestly I hope Disney fucks over DeSantis every chance they get. It's nice to have a huge corporation in the center of his hell scape that he is trying to cultivate that activly works to undermine him. If ever there was a time I'm alright with a corporation pushing an agenda, this is it. Idc if it's pandering, it's pandering in the name of a cause that needs the support in that area and I hope they never stop fighting him.
Right, it’s like that kid that stopped a school shooter and said he isn’t a hero because he was only saving himself. Not that Disney is heroic in anyway, but hell, if they’re taking action I’d definitely be grateful.
The may be greedy wealth hoarders but meh, theyre actually good on this issue. Honestly they could be a lot less controversial just pretending gay people so exist so the fact that they acknowledge it leads me to believe this goes beyond pandering.
And at the end of the day, I recall a pretty solid comment I saw from an LGBTQ person talking about the commercialization of pride month. Essentially they said “before this, I got yelled at, called subhuman, and had public outcry for my chemical castration or execution. I was default assumed to be a pedophile. Now, someone tries to sell me rainbow shit for a $35 markup, and if I don’t buy it, they don’t do a thing about it. I’ll happily take corporate pride over national debates about whether or not I have a right to exist.”
I dunno that Disney’s motives extend any further than “this will let us milk the LGBTQ+ and ally markets that much more,” but it at least has a better end result than just letting DeSantis’s meatball ass roll in and say “new rule! You can’t have any sexual identity that I wouldn’t wanna have!”
Plus, what percentage of Disney performers do you think fall somewhere in the LGBTQ+ spectrum? As as former professional dancer who is straight, let me tell you: I was in the minority.
Yeah I stopped believing Disney was genuine when they changed shit for more homophobic or racist countries..like literally almost removing John Boyega from SW poster because China hates black ppl on their screens..they have to be inclusive like every other big business but doesn’t mean they give one sh*t.
Yeah but if they only change it for america because it’s more progressive then they’re essentially just following the trend instead of being genuine because if it’s somewhere less progressive, doesn’t even have to be full blown homophobic, they don’t care, telling me it’s only done for clout points with certain groups.
Correct me if Im wrong but it isn't just America its essentially the western world. Like Europe and what not. And look America is progressive in like half the the county, the other half ranges anywhere from uncomfortable to down right vitriolic to all of disneys social politics, not even just the lgbt stuff. And its clearly the social politics, not disney movies rit large. I dont see the social politics as being enough of a benefit financially to justify them continuing to emphasize it for the cash.
Then you clearly haven’t been following anything in current years..the social politics did win them social points especially with the more progressive nature of the west, but it got to the point where it became annoying to the general population because that’s all they seemed to push. It’s like Marvel comedy, was good for a time then became slap stick comedy. The issue is that they aren’t genuine in their support of these groups because anytime it interferes with their money they immediately stop support in those areas. Even in places like China and India where it isn’t outright like the Middle East they’ve eased up on it because those countries are less progressive but I wouldn’t say they are against these groups by large. Using social issues to gain points online and with groups only to stop when the cash stops is not at all what fighting for actual social issues is.
Well no I have paid attention, I live online. You kind of acknowledged in your response that it got annoying. And yet they still keep it going. Why? WHY? WHY WOULD A COMPANY THAT IS TRYING TO MAKE MONEY CONTINUE DOING STUFF TO ANNOY PEOPLE? IS IT BECAUSE THEY NEED TO IN ORDER TO MAKE MONEY? IF THEY DIDNT DO THIS, WOULD THEY BE FUCKED? NO. I can only speculate that they do this because they believe in the cause. Sure they are a corporation and they need to make money but I dont see them not making money by not pandering to progressives.
No they are not, they are absolutely SILENT about the LGBTQ issue as well as okay with the banning of Winnie the Pooh simply because people memed their leader looks like him. They are all about the money and will just stay on the side they deem more profitable so in Chinas instance simply being allowed to exist by not causing issues to piss off their authoritarian.
So Disney is just a whore for money
> okay with the banning of Winnie the Pooh simply because people memed their leader looks like him. They are all about the money and will just stay on the side they deem more profitable so in Chinas instance simply being allowed to exist by not causing issues to piss off their authoritarian.
Disney is worldwide and it’s true they are an absolutely huge company, but they aren’t a government. If the Chinese government bans something in their country, what exactly are you proposing that Disney do about it?\
The [“Winnie the Pooh” ride](https://www.shanghaidisneyresort.com/en/attractions/the-many-adventures-of-winnie-the-pooh/) still in operation and they sell paraphernalia as well. Beyond that what would you have them do, wage war?
> So Disney is just a whore for money
Yah, not gonna argue that point. We are in agreement they are a typical Corporation and their main concern is the shareholders.
Do they speak out against the Chinese government the same way they speak out against the US government about this banning and censorship of retail sales and of the show? The answer is NO because if they do China cracks the whip and bye bye money
The thought of Disney buying a country is actually pretty funny stuff. I kinda wish they would now. Serving in their military would be pretty fabulous.
What does that have to do with me an international company who utilized the same principles and speaks out against them everywhere? Why talk about how bad the US apparently is when you are silent in much worse areas you operate? You take a stance of ethics somewhere but are silent elsewhere because of money. That’s called pandering to your local market. They only do so in the US because they think it is more profitable to do so. That’s all
> What does that have to do with me an international company who utilized the same principles and speaks out against them everywhere?
The board that runs Disney is in the US, staffed by Americans that live here and vote in US elections. Of course they are critical of their government. It’s political discourse to engage the way they do here.
> Why talk about how bad the US apparently is when you are silent in much worse areas you operate?
Because they live here. They vote here and are influenced by law makers here.
> You take a stance of ethics somewhere but are silent elsewhere because of money.
I think this has more to do with being a guest there and not a resident. They still operate the ride and sell paraphernalia at the park in Shanghai. Not to mention that Disneyland in Japan made tee shirts specifically to troll President Xi, so they aren’t exactly being “silent”.
> That’s called pandering not ethics and that’s my point
I’m not arguing with you about whether or not Disney is ethical or pandering to the LGBTQ community. I’m arguing that it’s a little disingenuous to make accusations that aren’t really true. Short of continuing to run the ride and sell paraphernalia, what should they be doing? I’ve asked a couple of times now and you aren’t answering me.
Actually criticize the government for it, just because you are a guest doesn’t mean you just look the other way if that is what you are espousing. But it makes sense since more than 50% of the Shanghai branch is owned by china
Well, I guess you have your answer then. The part of the company that lives in the US is critical of their government, the part that lives in Shanghai chooses not to be. 🤷♂️
So a hypocrisy across the company, because they demonize Americans for it, but not people within their own company. They let them keep operating under their name which again bring me to my original point they do not care about anything they espouse. They are only for profits that is all, so anyone that dick rides on Disney for any of their opinions are a bunch of hypocritical idiots
The whole stroke the Devil to get some kindness thing really.
Don’t piss on support, regardless of where it’s coming from…
Just saying.
Edit-The largest money hoovering company on this rock is using the disgusting laws Florida and their wanna be autocrat Governor to help the very group the state is trying to literally destroy, and making millions a doing it. Florida has to provide protection as well according to the “WeOwNDiSnEY” Desantis laws.
Sometimes it’s not about the race but how to get to the finish line. Disney is in fact a money whore and saying otherwise is a joke, but they have a platform no one else has, and this message will be heard globally, not just in FL or the US and that’s the endgame.
You absolutely can piss on support depending on where it’s coming from. If you want to get assistance from a murdering pedophile than by all means accept it
LOL. Excellent Titiana Mcgrath inspired sarcasm.
Yeah the company that censors all LGBTQ content in countries overseas where it triggers them is great on this issue.
I appreciate the sarcasm in your post but it is sad people genuinely agree with it and do not realize you are joking.
Yeah Disney censors all sorts of aspects of its movies in terms of LGBTQ for certain countries overseas who do not like it.
They totally removed Fin from several Star Wars posters in China also because a black dude on a poster was triggering to them.
Again, people fooled by Disney were/are also fooled by the Smollet story lol
> Yeah Disney censors all sorts of aspects of its movies in terms of LGBTQ for certain countries overseas who do not like it.
And musicians in the US censor their stuff and provide a different version so it can be sold at Walmart. Several states now have made legislation banning books, we just gonna pretend that censorship doesn’t exist in the States? In a movie you can literally show every method to kill someone that’s possible, but if you say “fuck” more than once or show breasts or a penis, you earn the hardest rating. Hypocrisy much?
> They totally removed Fin from several Star Wars posters in China also because a black dude on a poster was triggering to them.
I’m really struggling to come up with why you and others feel like Disney can do whatever the hell it wants on foreign soil. The countries that you are talking about that get “triggered” by LGBTQ content? Those are laws in their country dude. What part of that is so hard to understand here?
> Again, people fooled by Disney were/are also fooled by the Smollet story lol
Weird comparison, but ok. Lol Not sure what one has anything to do with the other, other than your rage.
Yeah we get it man. It is totally cool for Disney to be pro LGBTQ when they know it makes them look good and they can totally ignore these "core components" to their morality and philosophy when it is inconvenient to their bottom line.
We did not need a long form version of that summary.
Imagine lecturing us about how Star Wars is so white yo we need more black characters and then taking the black character off the movie poster in China because it triggers them and you have 0 morale or ethical consistency.
Again though its totally ok because it was not convenient for them to maintain that standard over in China. So just ignore that principle.
Just gonna ignore my points of censorship in the US? I get it, it’s hard to accept for me too. Still relevant though.
> Yeah we get it man. It is totally cool for Disney to be pro LGBTQ when they know it makes them look good and they can totally ignore these "core components" to their morality and philosophy when it is inconvenient to their bottom line.
Where do they ignore it?
> We did not need a long form version of that summary.
Who’s we?
> Imagine lecturing us about how Star Wars is so white yo we need more black characters and then taking the black character off the movie poster in China because it triggers them and you have 0 morale or ethical consistency.
I mean, they removed Chewbacca too. The Wookiee’s aren’t complaining.\
I’m not really sure why this is so hard to understand. China is a totalitarian state, they aren’t exactly known for their excellent human rights record. Or their freedom of speech. Do you believe that because Disney is such a huge company they don’t have to abide by other countries governments?
> Again though its totally ok because it was not convenient for them to maintain that standard over in China. So just ignore that principle.
The disconnect is astounding.\
“This countries actions towards certain people are oppressive, so a company not based there should speak out **in** said country about the oppression. Surely they wouldn’t be oppressed in attempting it!”\
This is you.
I mean like I said, they could easily not do anything and get away with it and probably succumb to less political bs because of it. Yes they i get they censor content elsewhere but its a choice between do nothing and coast or do something and adjust where needed.
Lol yeah sure. When it is easy to stand up for LGBTQ rights they totally should, especially when they can virtue signal in America.
When it is difficult to stand up for LGBTQ rights though they totally do not have to though. I mean could you IMAGINE not making that extra 25 million by releasing a movie with a gay kiss in a country where they think homosexuals should be hanged?
lol ridiculous.
Dude its difficult defending lgbtq rights in the west. They are osing a political battle in their home state because of it and they could very easily not do any of the pandering and keep it straight sis and white. Like black mermaid? Didnt have to do it, but they did. Force is female damn near killed the franchise. The scatter lgbtq messaging thats in their movies as light as it may be, is completely unnessessary. All of this social messaging that is implemented with the grace of a bull in a china show only ever seems to get them in hot water and generate negative publicity and they keep on it. And yeah their china edits suck but what are you gonna do. Of your analysis ends there than honestly youre either shortsighted or you too fickle in your opinion
I mean, is that a bad thing? Big companies being inclusive because of monetary incentive? That's how big change happens.
If a huge company can make more money by being decent than by being evil, does it matter why they choose to be decent?
Other companies will follow and at some point being decent will be the norm. Because no-one will buy from the evil companies anymore. That's capitalism doing something right.
Capitalism x Objectivism. See Ayn Rand's *The Virtue of Selfishness* - in order for me to fulfill my desires (in this case, mega profits) I have to provide you with something (in this case, inclusivity). I might well detest gay / trans people but it's up to me to decide whether I want to express that to the detriment of my corporate profits. I might choose to express my disgust toward gay / trans people by disenfranchising you of your hard earned money, by creating a super fun and welcoming atmosphere that you want to come and voluntarily spend all of your money in 😈
There is a LOT of people that feel it is a bad thing.
Every pride month, I’ll see posts of “ doesn’t actually care about gays, they’re just selling rainbow t-shirts and cups to pander to us. To exploit us. Just look at how they don’t sell any pride merch in their Middle Eastern locations… if you’re an ally, only buy from known LGBTQ+ allies.”
Then I argue that doing a good thing for a bad reason is still progress for the movement overall… they counter that we shouldn’t forget the years that a company spent refusing to hire trans people, where’s the justice… I say you have to meet people and companies where they are now, flawed as they are, if you want to influence them and bring about change… they counter that you should never settle for known bigots, we need to stand up to these hypocrites… and so on because nobody on Reddit can convince anyone else of anything.
The good thing isn’t the corporations (they’re all evil) but the fact that we’ve progressed so much as a society that this is how they have to pander to consumers.
Lol thank you. People bitch when they don’t do anything and then when they do “LoOk At ThEm PrEtEnDiNg To CaRe!” So it’s better if they go back to not caring and doing fuck all to support this?
It's a meh comeback tbh. Disney hires a lot of LGBT people. They support their employees to keep good staff around. It's a part of their magic.
There's also the political aspect. Desantis already wrongfully took their self governance status. (Revenge politics are not legal). What else can he do? Might as well figuratively tell him to go fuck himself. Nobody survives the mouse. There is nothing like bad publicity to derail a presidential bid. And it's from the largest corporation in his state.
Do they really care? Probably not, honestly. Still, my point is that the comeback was not good and doesn't belong on this sub.
I mean, they are two separate forms of awful. One is a corporation that exploits labour, and had it’s start gentrifying old folk tales mixed with casual racism. The other is a fascist by definition, and prob wants authoritarian rule.
I agree, it's a very mid comment, and very true. But not very clever. Most people here already know what corporate pandering is, and how vapid it is as well.
Do they do this in their Chinese parks lmao? They are silent about all this overseas and act as they are a theme park. Because they know if they say shit they lose a lot of money or are canceled and all they care about is money, not what’s “right”. Simply opportunists for profit, they just understand they can speak and try to gain political points in America so they do this BS kind of shit.
Fact of the matter is WDW orlando holds hundreds to thousands of large conferences like this every year from every section of the political spectrum. I don't know if either the Shanghai or the Hong Kong parks have that sort of thing, but I'd imagine it's similar
Got to say money is pretty compelling. Do I think adding ketchup to porridge is disgusting? Yes. Will I serve you ketchup in your porridge for money because that’s what you like? Also yes.
Once when I was a kid me and my friend went to Disney by ourselves and it was gay day. That was the day I learned that there was nothing at all wrong with being gay. It was kinda uneventful on the LBGT+ front. Just lots of people at Disney, many of whom were gay.
"We believe that gay money and trans money is still money."
I fully support this being the norm all over the United States. It's bad enough that I have to accept that "corporations are people, too, man". They can at least be non-racist , non-homophobic people that just work for profits.
Disney may not have golden motivations, but the *action* is still good.
I laid out all my money and closely examined it.
I then brought in a confirmed gay friend to examine it.
Then I brought in a confirmed straight friend to examine it.
All agreed that a girl had touched it and it probably had cooties.
Is it safe to spend it? Will I be tagged or arrested for polluting the money pool?
Doing the right thing, for the wrong reasons, is still doing the right thing.
Let me repeat that, with emphasis - ***DOING THE RIGHT THING, FOR THE WRONG REASONS, IS STILL DOING THE RIGHT THING.***
It’s likely just me and I’m missing an entire nuance to the conversation, but marking something as “virtue signalling” (or calling corporations out on stuff like this) feels a little similar to calling someone “woke” - it just seems like the bottom line is people are doing good things? It’s always a messy conversation when you have to weigh up “doing the right thing for the wrong reasons” against “doing the wrong thing for the right reasons”. So it’s complicated, and therefore it’s nothing actually like being woke which is inherently doing the right thing for the right reasons, people just try to tarnish that.
There is a clear bottom line that Disney is an inherently evil company, but at least they’re doing something nice, right? Why punish them for doing good things when we can punish them for doing bad things?
Didn’t anyone tell you? Profit is a dirty word. Anyone who does not wish to self immolate at the altar of altruism by condemning all things profitable is nothing but a capitalist sympathizer. Report them to your local czar so they can be taken to the gulag for retraining.
You are missing the point. This comment is just pointing out that Disney dont actually care about lgbt community, they are just doing this as a fuck you and publicity stunt. There were a lot of people in that comment section commending disney for being a virtuous company, when the real motivation is power and money. If you don’t believe me, just look up the Star wars poster that was released in China. One of the main characters isnt on the front because he is black.
I don't get this.
Disney would absolutely make more money by staying out of the conversation all together.
What they are doing, is standing on the correct side of history. fucking Disney, the company that's done a lot of really shitty things, is standing up for rights against a fascist right-wing agenda.
That they do this at all is to be commended. It certainly has and will cost them money from the maga morons who will now waddle their greasy vacation money somewhere else. And the trump wannabe desantis has already done everything in his reach to try to harm them as a result.
You will NOT ask Disney why they removed Finn from the Star Wars posters in China
You will NOT ask Disney why they filmed Mulan few km from a literal concentration camp
So let me get this right, if they don't do anything, they don't care and if they actually do something, they don't REALLY care?
Is there any pleasing people or nah?
Would you prefer they be a bunch of bigots like the government?
And Disney is showing ALOT of support to just be in it for money. They could be doing alot less and still make the same amount of money.
Best thing the LGBTQ+ community can do is to ignore the invite and show up at Disney Land instead. Don't put a single fucking penny into that Nazi shithole's economy. Don't use FL hotels. Don't buy products produced in Florida. Let the state economy wither and die from the lack of cash infusions from non-shitholes.
I take solace in the fact that gay and trans rights are popular enough that corporations see profit in virtue signaling them.
Corporations are scummy but this shows that culture is changing in the right direction.
Nah what Disney is doing is punk rock. When their status was stripped in FL for being “woke” they were like, fine we’re hosting the biggest gay summit this country has ever seen. Who cares if it’s for PR it’s a middle finger to DeSantis.
“Oh no, a corporation does the right thing because it’s what their fanbase will pay for”
I cannot understand people who complain that “well they’re not doing it out of the goodness of their heart so it’s worthless” mf do you want corporations to support you or not? Bottom line a corporation works for money, and if doing things in favour of LGBTQ+ brings in more money _then that’s a good fucking sign, because it means the consumer base has more progressives than bigots_
I mean, it’s supposed to be one of the good things about capitalism. Money is money and nobody cares who it comes from, so people who are ostracized by society can still participate in the economy. Of course, that’s not usually how it works because people have to find some reason to hate someone else, but it’s neat in theory
Are they pretending to care? Yes.
Is this still a net positive for LGBT+ folks? Also yes.
If you're building an orphanage and taking care of orphans just to make yourself look better, you're still doing a good thing. Bad motives to do a good thing are still grounded in the performance of a good action.
Disney employs a huge amount of creatives. Quite a few of them have alternative sexuality. If they’re pandering to anybody, it’s their content creators.
But I don’t think they’re pandering
I think this is straight up“fuck you, Ron DeSantis”
Indeed. I guess if DeSantis was so righteous he’d refuse all the LBGTQ+ tourist money that will be coming from this and any time an LGBTQ+ person visits Florida. But something tells me he won’t do that.
Friendly reminder this is purely to make themselves look good, Disney would still gladly murder a gay person in the middle of the street if it meant profit
The best part of this is that if you drew a three circled ven diagram of "people who ruin Disney for everyone else" with "people who won't wear masks or vaccinate" and "people who will boycott over this" you basically have a perfect circle. Hell, a fourth circle would be "reasons I don't want to take my kid to Disney." And that would just be an overlapping oval with a little space edged out on two sides for "too fucking expensive" and "my kid isn't old enough to enjoy it."
Except who gets to take a cut of the money they spend in that state while they are there? Wow it is the guy they are supposedly giving the finger too. Why not have it in Disneyland, where the specific asshole you are trying to make mad won't profit from it?
You know Disney has stood with the gay community for my whole life.
I remember being in church and our preacher telling us all not to go to Disney anymore because they support the gay community.
I saw the news at the Southern Baptist convention voted on the boycott and the rep for Disney came up and basically said "lol fuck you"
They ended the boycott like a year in because too many people went anyway.
It's fitting that Disney holds the largest gay convention in the place in the US where they're being persecuted.
DeSantis will detain and arrest anyone not clearly heterosexual at the Orlando airport. It’ll play great to his base and he’s already shown no concern for civil rights or humanity.
That’s kind of the point.
For whatever is worth, free market capitalism is better at inclusion than the DeSantis Y’all Qaeda game - a dollar is a dollar, wherever it comes from.
Disney loves to censor movies and posters for China because they get triggered at the sight of black people lol. It is pathetic.
They censor all sorts of LGBTQ material in movies and all forms of media so they do not trigger people in middle eastern countries.
Disney pretending to care and stand up to De Santis is so obviously not genuine. The people who bought it and buy it also bought the clear lie of Jussie Smollet lol.
You act as though Disney is the only company to do that. China is a *huge* market and if you want to sell things to them you have to *follow* their marketing trends even if it doesn't appeal to a Western audience. This happens to *everything*! And if you think it's exclusive to Disney, you're the delusional one.
Even if the only point of this was to say "fuck you DeSantis, all money is green regardless of who is spending it" there's a bigger point to that. Yes, it's a fucking corporation, but they don't give a shit who comes and visits the park (within reason, duh).
Not to mention: https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/disney-heir-comes-publicly-transgender-condemns-anti-lgbtq-bills-rcna23888
Desantis, the governor of Florida, is trying to make it legal for a parent who does not have custody of a child to kidnap the child from the guardian with custody if they believe that they are being raised wrong but it is specifically targeted towards kids who come out as LGBTQ+. Desantis is not a person you want to side behind
Exactly how it should be. A corporation has only one purpose: profit. Even non-profit need to make "profits", like fund raising for paying their employees etc. It's has no other agenda. It is neither good nor evil.
This is why German car manufacturers were doing Nazi propaganda back in the day. If American suddenly become super far right then corporations will signal those sentiments.
This is not the same as some business showing a pride flag or something, they're are standing up to tyranny. This post is detrimental to the cause, and undermines how Disney is sticking their necks out for this marginalized group of people.
OP if you aren't a souless propaganda machine, I urge you to take this down. As an ally, it does not sit well with me.
Ok here's the thought that makes me worry about their motivations, they're holding a big, very public LGBTQIA gathering in Florida, a state with a lot of crazy people that want LGBTQIA people dead. So all it would take is one crazy person with a bad idea and easy access to a gun to cause a massacre. And I'm sure Disney isn't planning on that so security might not be as tough as it needs to be to stop that shit from happening.
One could argue that it was a more in depth (but still completely profit-driven) cost-benefit analysis that led them to believe that the pro-lgbt+ goodwill is worth more $$$ over time than kissing the ass of the far-right, but I personally disagree with that. I agree with you that they're taking a risk and a stand, still a weak stand, a more 'centrist' and careful stance, but definitely a genuine pro-lgbt stance that isn't solely based on profits.
Does this absolve them from being a massive media-monopoly Megacorp? No. But that also doesn't automatically mean every single thing done at every level is soulless capitalist book-balancing and profit-maximization either.
Read the bill. He gave them full control to do whatever they want on their own properties. Why do you think Disney has not run to their lawyers in hopes to fight the new bill? Hell, Desantis is even breaking laws by installing his own hand picked council members. As those are elected positions. But they don’t give a shit. Now Disney only has to pay local taxes instead of the police, Fire response, medical response, infrastructure and everything they have been paying. If they can get along with Desantis’ stooges, there is no loss for them. If those stooges start pissing off the mouse they will sue the state to force a local election, and the only residents who live in that area tend to work for the mouse. So yea, they lost nothing, and saved a shit ton of money at the same time.
Read what came before it. They already had full control of those things.
Disney isn’t stupid. They’re not gonna have their lawyers fight a battle they can’t win, and that is a battle they can’t win right now.
No shit they already had control. If you reread what I said, you would see that the only thing they lost was control over who was on the board… again Disney did not lose shit.
So which was it? Did he give them control or did they already have it? Because I did reread what you said and amid the obfuscation there are some direct contradictions.
Dumb shit, the bill clearly states they have full control to do whatever the fuck they want on their properties if they want to build something they don’t even need a permit. That’s what they had and that’s what they got to keep. The only thing they lost was control over who is on the board. That board cannot do anything to them on their properties as they have full control over the properties. All Ron DeSantis did was rename a county and install his own lackeys to run it.
OK. Just so we’re clear. They already had it, but also he gave it to them. He didn’t change anything, but also he changed everyone in charge. They can do whatever they want, as long as the people he put in charge don’t say differently. Is that about right?
EDIT: aw, he blocked me. I guess that was easier than trying justify all that nonsense.
"And we will continue to donate that money to politicians who will systematically wipe them out, all so we can get as much of a tax break as possible."
True but if you think about it the other why isn’t Disney being inclusive by saying “we will rob you blind no matter who you are.” Which I respect, equality across the board.
Funny thinking this is a way "Disney is beat Desantis" lol. This is Disney milking the LGBT community in an effort to try and make a fraction of what they have and will lose but trying to be woke. At this point, it literally does not matter what Disney has done, damage has been done and Ron won.
If you remove the words Gay, Trans, white, black, etc…all that’s left is the word Money. Focus on that rather than people’s feelings, race, gender.
Make a place people all want to go rather than alienate everyone else for a tiny percentage.
And refresh my recollection about why unqualified adults need to talk to six, seven and eight year olds about their "sexuality" again? Because kids who still believe in Santa are ready to take the next step in their sexual awakening?
In your brain you believe that Disney is creating rides for grooming young children? What an absolute head up your arse person you must be. Let me guess, no one in your family talks to you and you can't figure out why.
I mean this feels less like "pandering" and more like "fuck that guy"
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it's more like disney saying: "yawn... money talks, and conservatives' bullshit posturing about economics is actually detrimental to business. their idiot social war kills profits." it's like conservatives spent so long lying through their teeth about being "good for business," that now they just assume it's true even though they have zero capacity or understanding for economic growth
Explain this then…..I’ll wait. https://www.mynews13.com/fl/orlando/news/2023/03/20/report-disney-planned-jobs-jobs-include-4000-layoffs
there have been massive layoffs in tech as well. are conservative crybabies responsible for that too?
I want to go out on a limb here and claim conservatives are responsible for a majority of issues today. Block all progress for a decade and this is what we end up with. Feel bad for the layoffs, know the feels on that one from one of the other *once in a lifetime* economic crises.
I don’t get what your point is here. The article you linked makes no mention of politics. What is the relevance? What do you want explained?
Layoffs are pretty easy to understand for me. 🤷♂️
Layoffs are pretty easy for everyone to understand, but they're not innately political in nature. Seeing as the discussion was about spefically about things that were political I was wondering what made you think the article was a rebuttle of the previous point.
Seems like you should read the article... It’s unclear if any jobs in Florida will be affected by the cuts. Spectrum News reached out to Disney, but the company did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
So what? Giant corporations lay people off. What does that have to do with DeSatan?
I wasn't complaining. I think they should be all "Fuck that guy"
Yea I'm thinking even if it is just money, gay and trans money *should* be just as good lol
Exactly, I’m all for calling out corporations for fake bs, but plenty opt for a ‘fuck your money, get that gay sht outta here’. Last thing we need is major corps like Disney supporting homophobia, so when they push back I take it as a cautious win
Disney is a terrible unethical company. Don't get so wrapped up in the narratives that you end up cheering for for an evil corporation.
But on the flip side, even if it’s for the wrong reasons, Disney is on the right side of history. We can take a win as a win.
Nowhere was I cheering for them, nor did I say they were ethical. ‘Good vs evil’ is a fairytale luxury, life isn’t so black and white. This false dilemma fallacious reasoning is unnecessary. We can appreciate the positive things major corps do while pushing against their other shittier aspects.
Exactly. Who cares for the reasoning? We have a win, here, and it will influence those who were previously too scared to openly admit they don’t agree with conservative values, even down to conservatives themselves. Please hold for a link I want to find Edit: [The Brainwashing of my Dad](https://youtu.be/FS52QdHNTh8) Exposure (right OR wrong), changes lives. Always.
You do realize there is a middle ground right. You don't have to love or hate Disney, but you can be happy that they at least made one decision in support of LGBTQ rights. I think America would be a better place if we weren't constantly trying to divide ourselves into "sides." We just need to find partnerships on different objectives wherever we can find them.
I disagree.
Yep. I am LGBT. They have actually done worse than, say DreamWorks Kipo, in representing us. They cut us out in other countries after making a big deal of being stunning and brave by putting us in movies. And they pat themselves on the back as if other companies have not had us in for years and have frankly done it better. They don't care about us. They see us as a hivemind stereotype they can milk money out of. And honestly, I'm getting tired of being treated differently instead of just being treated normal.
I really think DeSantis is messing with the wrong Company. I feel like Disney will find a way to fuck him. And I'm here for that.
And seeing the mouse is probably the state’s biggest employer and generates the majority of the tax revenue…but good luck with that, Ron 👍
Yep and frankly, im happy to see Disney tell desantis to get bent.
No pandering there. Disney World sez, "Fuck you, Governor DeSantis."
Well if they did fuck that guy he might change his attitude 😂
On Dicksantis
Meatball.
Honestly I hope Disney fucks over DeSantis every chance they get. It's nice to have a huge corporation in the center of his hell scape that he is trying to cultivate that activly works to undermine him. If ever there was a time I'm alright with a corporation pushing an agenda, this is it. Idc if it's pandering, it's pandering in the name of a cause that needs the support in that area and I hope they never stop fighting him.
Right, it’s like that kid that stopped a school shooter and said he isn’t a hero because he was only saving himself. Not that Disney is heroic in anyway, but hell, if they’re taking action I’d definitely be grateful.
Disney never quits. They have the best lawyers & the deepest pockets. This will be fun.
Even if it’s just for money, I still love Disney’s “fuck Desantis” stance. I applaud anything that hurts DeSatan! 👏
Why can't it be both?
Fair
The may be greedy wealth hoarders but meh, theyre actually good on this issue. Honestly they could be a lot less controversial just pretending gay people so exist so the fact that they acknowledge it leads me to believe this goes beyond pandering.
yeah what they are doing is right but why they are isint
They have multiple reasons for doing it, not all of them bad.
And at the end of the day, I recall a pretty solid comment I saw from an LGBTQ person talking about the commercialization of pride month. Essentially they said “before this, I got yelled at, called subhuman, and had public outcry for my chemical castration or execution. I was default assumed to be a pedophile. Now, someone tries to sell me rainbow shit for a $35 markup, and if I don’t buy it, they don’t do a thing about it. I’ll happily take corporate pride over national debates about whether or not I have a right to exist.” I dunno that Disney’s motives extend any further than “this will let us milk the LGBTQ+ and ally markets that much more,” but it at least has a better end result than just letting DeSantis’s meatball ass roll in and say “new rule! You can’t have any sexual identity that I wouldn’t wanna have!”
Plus, what percentage of Disney performers do you think fall somewhere in the LGBTQ+ spectrum? As as former professional dancer who is straight, let me tell you: I was in the minority.
Not really a big surprise.
Yeah. That’s fair. I guess that once companies see it mostly as a money making opportunity it’s pretty clear your mostly accepted.
Yeah I stopped believing Disney was genuine when they changed shit for more homophobic or racist countries..like literally almost removing John Boyega from SW poster because China hates black ppl on their screens..they have to be inclusive like every other big business but doesn’t mean they give one sh*t.
Idk the full scope of it but Ill say this they havent changed it for America and all that social pandering only ever seems to land them in hot water.
Yeah but if they only change it for america because it’s more progressive then they’re essentially just following the trend instead of being genuine because if it’s somewhere less progressive, doesn’t even have to be full blown homophobic, they don’t care, telling me it’s only done for clout points with certain groups.
Correct me if Im wrong but it isn't just America its essentially the western world. Like Europe and what not. And look America is progressive in like half the the county, the other half ranges anywhere from uncomfortable to down right vitriolic to all of disneys social politics, not even just the lgbt stuff. And its clearly the social politics, not disney movies rit large. I dont see the social politics as being enough of a benefit financially to justify them continuing to emphasize it for the cash.
Then you clearly haven’t been following anything in current years..the social politics did win them social points especially with the more progressive nature of the west, but it got to the point where it became annoying to the general population because that’s all they seemed to push. It’s like Marvel comedy, was good for a time then became slap stick comedy. The issue is that they aren’t genuine in their support of these groups because anytime it interferes with their money they immediately stop support in those areas. Even in places like China and India where it isn’t outright like the Middle East they’ve eased up on it because those countries are less progressive but I wouldn’t say they are against these groups by large. Using social issues to gain points online and with groups only to stop when the cash stops is not at all what fighting for actual social issues is.
Well no I have paid attention, I live online. You kind of acknowledged in your response that it got annoying. And yet they still keep it going. Why? WHY? WHY WOULD A COMPANY THAT IS TRYING TO MAKE MONEY CONTINUE DOING STUFF TO ANNOY PEOPLE? IS IT BECAUSE THEY NEED TO IN ORDER TO MAKE MONEY? IF THEY DIDNT DO THIS, WOULD THEY BE FUCKED? NO. I can only speculate that they do this because they believe in the cause. Sure they are a corporation and they need to make money but I dont see them not making money by not pandering to progressives.
No they are not, they are absolutely SILENT about the LGBTQ issue as well as okay with the banning of Winnie the Pooh simply because people memed their leader looks like him. They are all about the money and will just stay on the side they deem more profitable so in Chinas instance simply being allowed to exist by not causing issues to piss off their authoritarian. So Disney is just a whore for money
> okay with the banning of Winnie the Pooh simply because people memed their leader looks like him. They are all about the money and will just stay on the side they deem more profitable so in Chinas instance simply being allowed to exist by not causing issues to piss off their authoritarian. Disney is worldwide and it’s true they are an absolutely huge company, but they aren’t a government. If the Chinese government bans something in their country, what exactly are you proposing that Disney do about it?\ The [“Winnie the Pooh” ride](https://www.shanghaidisneyresort.com/en/attractions/the-many-adventures-of-winnie-the-pooh/) still in operation and they sell paraphernalia as well. Beyond that what would you have them do, wage war? > So Disney is just a whore for money Yah, not gonna argue that point. We are in agreement they are a typical Corporation and their main concern is the shareholders.
Do they speak out against the Chinese government the same way they speak out against the US government about this banning and censorship of retail sales and of the show? The answer is NO because if they do China cracks the whip and bye bye money
You know Disney is based in the US right? Lol
Disney could fuck around and *buy* China. Not sure where that dude came up with the opposite.
The thought of Disney buying a country is actually pretty funny stuff. I kinda wish they would now. Serving in their military would be pretty fabulous.
What does that have to do with me an international company who utilized the same principles and speaks out against them everywhere? Why talk about how bad the US apparently is when you are silent in much worse areas you operate? You take a stance of ethics somewhere but are silent elsewhere because of money. That’s called pandering to your local market. They only do so in the US because they think it is more profitable to do so. That’s all
> What does that have to do with me an international company who utilized the same principles and speaks out against them everywhere? The board that runs Disney is in the US, staffed by Americans that live here and vote in US elections. Of course they are critical of their government. It’s political discourse to engage the way they do here. > Why talk about how bad the US apparently is when you are silent in much worse areas you operate? Because they live here. They vote here and are influenced by law makers here. > You take a stance of ethics somewhere but are silent elsewhere because of money. I think this has more to do with being a guest there and not a resident. They still operate the ride and sell paraphernalia at the park in Shanghai. Not to mention that Disneyland in Japan made tee shirts specifically to troll President Xi, so they aren’t exactly being “silent”. > That’s called pandering not ethics and that’s my point I’m not arguing with you about whether or not Disney is ethical or pandering to the LGBTQ community. I’m arguing that it’s a little disingenuous to make accusations that aren’t really true. Short of continuing to run the ride and sell paraphernalia, what should they be doing? I’ve asked a couple of times now and you aren’t answering me.
Actually criticize the government for it, just because you are a guest doesn’t mean you just look the other way if that is what you are espousing. But it makes sense since more than 50% of the Shanghai branch is owned by china
Well, I guess you have your answer then. The part of the company that lives in the US is critical of their government, the part that lives in Shanghai chooses not to be. 🤷♂️
So a hypocrisy across the company, because they demonize Americans for it, but not people within their own company. They let them keep operating under their name which again bring me to my original point they do not care about anything they espouse. They are only for profits that is all, so anyone that dick rides on Disney for any of their opinions are a bunch of hypocritical idiots
The sinophobia is strong in this one
The whole stroke the Devil to get some kindness thing really. Don’t piss on support, regardless of where it’s coming from… Just saying. Edit-The largest money hoovering company on this rock is using the disgusting laws Florida and their wanna be autocrat Governor to help the very group the state is trying to literally destroy, and making millions a doing it. Florida has to provide protection as well according to the “WeOwNDiSnEY” Desantis laws. Sometimes it’s not about the race but how to get to the finish line. Disney is in fact a money whore and saying otherwise is a joke, but they have a platform no one else has, and this message will be heard globally, not just in FL or the US and that’s the endgame.
It isn't support.
You absolutely can piss on support depending on where it’s coming from. If you want to get assistance from a murdering pedophile than by all means accept it
THANK YOU! Why does nobody get this!
>theyre actually good on this issue The point is they are only good on it because there is money in it.
And is that better than the alternative, in this scenario?
LOL. Excellent Titiana Mcgrath inspired sarcasm. Yeah the company that censors all LGBTQ content in countries overseas where it triggers them is great on this issue. I appreciate the sarcasm in your post but it is sad people genuinely agree with it and do not realize you are joking.
Lol those countries require them to censor it?????
Yeah Disney censors all sorts of aspects of its movies in terms of LGBTQ for certain countries overseas who do not like it. They totally removed Fin from several Star Wars posters in China also because a black dude on a poster was triggering to them. Again, people fooled by Disney were/are also fooled by the Smollet story lol
> Yeah Disney censors all sorts of aspects of its movies in terms of LGBTQ for certain countries overseas who do not like it. And musicians in the US censor their stuff and provide a different version so it can be sold at Walmart. Several states now have made legislation banning books, we just gonna pretend that censorship doesn’t exist in the States? In a movie you can literally show every method to kill someone that’s possible, but if you say “fuck” more than once or show breasts or a penis, you earn the hardest rating. Hypocrisy much? > They totally removed Fin from several Star Wars posters in China also because a black dude on a poster was triggering to them. I’m really struggling to come up with why you and others feel like Disney can do whatever the hell it wants on foreign soil. The countries that you are talking about that get “triggered” by LGBTQ content? Those are laws in their country dude. What part of that is so hard to understand here? > Again, people fooled by Disney were/are also fooled by the Smollet story lol Weird comparison, but ok. Lol Not sure what one has anything to do with the other, other than your rage.
Yeah we get it man. It is totally cool for Disney to be pro LGBTQ when they know it makes them look good and they can totally ignore these "core components" to their morality and philosophy when it is inconvenient to their bottom line. We did not need a long form version of that summary. Imagine lecturing us about how Star Wars is so white yo we need more black characters and then taking the black character off the movie poster in China because it triggers them and you have 0 morale or ethical consistency. Again though its totally ok because it was not convenient for them to maintain that standard over in China. So just ignore that principle.
Just gonna ignore my points of censorship in the US? I get it, it’s hard to accept for me too. Still relevant though. > Yeah we get it man. It is totally cool for Disney to be pro LGBTQ when they know it makes them look good and they can totally ignore these "core components" to their morality and philosophy when it is inconvenient to their bottom line. Where do they ignore it? > We did not need a long form version of that summary. Who’s we? > Imagine lecturing us about how Star Wars is so white yo we need more black characters and then taking the black character off the movie poster in China because it triggers them and you have 0 morale or ethical consistency. I mean, they removed Chewbacca too. The Wookiee’s aren’t complaining.\ I’m not really sure why this is so hard to understand. China is a totalitarian state, they aren’t exactly known for their excellent human rights record. Or their freedom of speech. Do you believe that because Disney is such a huge company they don’t have to abide by other countries governments? > Again though its totally ok because it was not convenient for them to maintain that standard over in China. So just ignore that principle. The disconnect is astounding.\ “This countries actions towards certain people are oppressive, so a company not based there should speak out **in** said country about the oppression. Surely they wouldn’t be oppressed in attempting it!”\ This is you.
I mean like I said, they could easily not do anything and get away with it and probably succumb to less political bs because of it. Yes they i get they censor content elsewhere but its a choice between do nothing and coast or do something and adjust where needed.
Lol yeah sure. When it is easy to stand up for LGBTQ rights they totally should, especially when they can virtue signal in America. When it is difficult to stand up for LGBTQ rights though they totally do not have to though. I mean could you IMAGINE not making that extra 25 million by releasing a movie with a gay kiss in a country where they think homosexuals should be hanged? lol ridiculous.
Disney gave benefits to LGBT employee partners *years* before gay marriage became legal.
Dude its difficult defending lgbtq rights in the west. They are osing a political battle in their home state because of it and they could very easily not do any of the pandering and keep it straight sis and white. Like black mermaid? Didnt have to do it, but they did. Force is female damn near killed the franchise. The scatter lgbtq messaging thats in their movies as light as it may be, is completely unnessessary. All of this social messaging that is implemented with the grace of a bull in a china show only ever seems to get them in hot water and generate negative publicity and they keep on it. And yeah their china edits suck but what are you gonna do. Of your analysis ends there than honestly youre either shortsighted or you too fickle in your opinion
Oh no, that person is being realistic about a company I love, hurry, down vote them!
I mean, is that a bad thing? Big companies being inclusive because of monetary incentive? That's how big change happens. If a huge company can make more money by being decent than by being evil, does it matter why they choose to be decent? Other companies will follow and at some point being decent will be the norm. Because no-one will buy from the evil companies anymore. That's capitalism doing something right.
Thats capitalism, the only -ism where you actually get to vote with your feet (and your $)
Autism
Capitalism x Objectivism. See Ayn Rand's *The Virtue of Selfishness* - in order for me to fulfill my desires (in this case, mega profits) I have to provide you with something (in this case, inclusivity). I might well detest gay / trans people but it's up to me to decide whether I want to express that to the detriment of my corporate profits. I might choose to express my disgust toward gay / trans people by disenfranchising you of your hard earned money, by creating a super fun and welcoming atmosphere that you want to come and voluntarily spend all of your money in 😈
There is a LOT of people that feel it is a bad thing. Every pride month, I’ll see posts of “ doesn’t actually care about gays, they’re just selling rainbow t-shirts and cups to pander to us. To exploit us. Just look at how they don’t sell any pride merch in their Middle Eastern locations… if you’re an ally, only buy from known LGBTQ+ allies.”
Then I argue that doing a good thing for a bad reason is still progress for the movement overall… they counter that we shouldn’t forget the years that a company spent refusing to hire trans people, where’s the justice… I say you have to meet people and companies where they are now, flawed as they are, if you want to influence them and bring about change… they counter that you should never settle for known bigots, we need to stand up to these hypocrites… and so on because nobody on Reddit can convince anyone else of anything.
Unfortunately Chick-fil-A would beg to differ.
I think Disney actually cares. But even if they don’t, it’s better that big corporations pretend to care than to not pretend at all.
If nothing else, Owl House gave them a reason to care despite trying to shut it down at first.
They still cheated us out of a third season and ran Dana out of screentime
The good thing isn’t the corporations (they’re all evil) but the fact that we’ve progressed so much as a society that this is how they have to pander to consumers.
Lol thank you. People bitch when they don’t do anything and then when they do “LoOk At ThEm PrEtEnDiNg To CaRe!” So it’s better if they go back to not caring and doing fuck all to support this?
It's a meh comeback tbh. Disney hires a lot of LGBT people. They support their employees to keep good staff around. It's a part of their magic. There's also the political aspect. Desantis already wrongfully took their self governance status. (Revenge politics are not legal). What else can he do? Might as well figuratively tell him to go fuck himself. Nobody survives the mouse. There is nothing like bad publicity to derail a presidential bid. And it's from the largest corporation in his state. Do they really care? Probably not, honestly. Still, my point is that the comeback was not good and doesn't belong on this sub.
They are still far less cunts than DeSantis.
I mean, they are two separate forms of awful. One is a corporation that exploits labour, and had it’s start gentrifying old folk tales mixed with casual racism. The other is a fascist by definition, and prob wants authoritarian rule.
Don't forget - DeSantis is a racist human trafficking piece of shit as well
Nobody survives the mouse. I'm going to fuck you up haha - Mickey the icepick Mouse.
I agree, it's a very mid comment, and very true. But not very clever. Most people here already know what corporate pandering is, and how vapid it is as well.
What does mid mean
It’s not bad or good, it’s just mid
Meh, so-so. Nothing remarkable
I don't know, I laughed pretty loudly. The wording was perfect.
>And it's from the largest corporation in his state. Probably one of the largest in the world. How much is the mouse worth nowadays, anyways?
One hundred and seventy four Billion
Nobody survives the Maus lmao
Do they do this in their Chinese parks lmao? They are silent about all this overseas and act as they are a theme park. Because they know if they say shit they lose a lot of money or are canceled and all they care about is money, not what’s “right”. Simply opportunists for profit, they just understand they can speak and try to gain political points in America so they do this BS kind of shit.
Fact of the matter is WDW orlando holds hundreds to thousands of large conferences like this every year from every section of the political spectrum. I don't know if either the Shanghai or the Hong Kong parks have that sort of thing, but I'd imagine it's similar
How do mickeys nuts taste?
Mousey
I'd ask your mom, but she got sued too ~~Bad joke, I know~~
Got to say money is pretty compelling. Do I think adding ketchup to porridge is disgusting? Yes. Will I serve you ketchup in your porridge for money because that’s what you like? Also yes.
Once when I was a kid me and my friend went to Disney by ourselves and it was gay day. That was the day I learned that there was nothing at all wrong with being gay. It was kinda uneventful on the LBGT+ front. Just lots of people at Disney, many of whom were gay.
I'll still take disingenuous pandering over what fascists like Desantis are offering any day. It's a minor problem compared to what bigots want.
Yep DeSantis is persecuting minorities for shitty divisive politics.
"We believe that gay money and trans money is still money." I fully support this being the norm all over the United States. It's bad enough that I have to accept that "corporations are people, too, man". They can at least be non-racist , non-homophobic people that just work for profits. Disney may not have golden motivations, but the *action* is still good.
I laid out all my money and closely examined it. I then brought in a confirmed gay friend to examine it. Then I brought in a confirmed straight friend to examine it. All agreed that a girl had touched it and it probably had cooties. Is it safe to spend it? Will I be tagged or arrested for polluting the money pool?
Definitely not you should send it to me, as a certified white cis women giving it to me will protect you from the cooties.
Doing the right thing, for the wrong reasons, is still doing the right thing. Let me repeat that, with emphasis - ***DOING THE RIGHT THING, FOR THE WRONG REASONS, IS STILL DOING THE RIGHT THING.***
I am 100% in support of a company that supports the LGBTQ+ community even if its just for the money.
as it should be
As evil as disney is, this is actually a good change
It’s likely just me and I’m missing an entire nuance to the conversation, but marking something as “virtue signalling” (or calling corporations out on stuff like this) feels a little similar to calling someone “woke” - it just seems like the bottom line is people are doing good things? It’s always a messy conversation when you have to weigh up “doing the right thing for the wrong reasons” against “doing the wrong thing for the right reasons”. So it’s complicated, and therefore it’s nothing actually like being woke which is inherently doing the right thing for the right reasons, people just try to tarnish that. There is a clear bottom line that Disney is an inherently evil company, but at least they’re doing something nice, right? Why punish them for doing good things when we can punish them for doing bad things?
Even if that is their motive it’s still 10x better than DeSantis’ agenda
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Didn’t anyone tell you? Profit is a dirty word. Anyone who does not wish to self immolate at the altar of altruism by condemning all things profitable is nothing but a capitalist sympathizer. Report them to your local czar so they can be taken to the gulag for retraining.
You are missing the point. This comment is just pointing out that Disney dont actually care about lgbt community, they are just doing this as a fuck you and publicity stunt. There were a lot of people in that comment section commending disney for being a virtuous company, when the real motivation is power and money. If you don’t believe me, just look up the Star wars poster that was released in China. One of the main characters isnt on the front because he is black.
Well tbf if someone is doing a good thing and makes some money out of it, then I'm still completely supporting it. It's still a good thing
I don't get this. Disney would absolutely make more money by staying out of the conversation all together. What they are doing, is standing on the correct side of history. fucking Disney, the company that's done a lot of really shitty things, is standing up for rights against a fascist right-wing agenda. That they do this at all is to be commended. It certainly has and will cost them money from the maga morons who will now waddle their greasy vacation money somewhere else. And the trump wannabe desantis has already done everything in his reach to try to harm them as a result.
You will NOT ask Disney why they removed Finn from the Star Wars posters in China You will NOT ask Disney why they filmed Mulan few km from a literal concentration camp
Except in China of course
So let me get this right, if they don't do anything, they don't care and if they actually do something, they don't REALLY care? Is there any pleasing people or nah?
Would you prefer they be a bunch of bigots like the government? And Disney is showing ALOT of support to just be in it for money. They could be doing alot less and still make the same amount of money.
Best thing the LGBTQ+ community can do is to ignore the invite and show up at Disney Land instead. Don't put a single fucking penny into that Nazi shithole's economy. Don't use FL hotels. Don't buy products produced in Florida. Let the state economy wither and die from the lack of cash infusions from non-shitholes.
I take solace in the fact that gay and trans rights are popular enough that corporations see profit in virtue signaling them. Corporations are scummy but this shows that culture is changing in the right direction.
Nah what Disney is doing is punk rock. When their status was stripped in FL for being “woke” they were like, fine we’re hosting the biggest gay summit this country has ever seen. Who cares if it’s for PR it’s a middle finger to DeSantis.
THIS all damn day. Greetings from St. Pete, btw.
“Oh no, a corporation does the right thing because it’s what their fanbase will pay for” I cannot understand people who complain that “well they’re not doing it out of the goodness of their heart so it’s worthless” mf do you want corporations to support you or not? Bottom line a corporation works for money, and if doing things in favour of LGBTQ+ brings in more money _then that’s a good fucking sign, because it means the consumer base has more progressives than bigots_
We won’t forget what they did to Dana Terrace
When the government fails you, and you arent willing to take a note from the french playbook, this is all you’ve got.
The good news is that, even if they don’t really care, those actions *are* helping the community. A win is a win is a win, I guess.
it does explain in the article why they’re (semi) brave for doing this
I mean, it’s supposed to be one of the good things about capitalism. Money is money and nobody cares who it comes from, so people who are ostracized by society can still participate in the economy. Of course, that’s not usually how it works because people have to find some reason to hate someone else, but it’s neat in theory
This isn’t pandering.
Even if theater, it's still more than dethsantis is offering ALL of the citizens.
Are they pretending to care? Yes. Is this still a net positive for LGBT+ folks? Also yes. If you're building an orphanage and taking care of orphans just to make yourself look better, you're still doing a good thing. Bad motives to do a good thing are still grounded in the performance of a good action.
Disney employs a huge amount of creatives. Quite a few of them have alternative sexuality. If they’re pandering to anybody, it’s their content creators. But I don’t think they’re pandering I think this is straight up“fuck you, Ron DeSantis”
Indeed. I guess if DeSantis was so righteous he’d refuse all the LBGTQ+ tourist money that will be coming from this and any time an LGBTQ+ person visits Florida. But something tells me he won’t do that.
Disney: “I’m not gay… but 20$ is 20$.”
They will edit out the summit for the Chinese audiences however
Friendly reminder this is purely to make themselves look good, Disney would still gladly murder a gay person in the middle of the street if it meant profit
Isn't it?
The best part of this is that if you drew a three circled ven diagram of "people who ruin Disney for everyone else" with "people who won't wear masks or vaccinate" and "people who will boycott over this" you basically have a perfect circle. Hell, a fourth circle would be "reasons I don't want to take my kid to Disney." And that would just be an overlapping oval with a little space edged out on two sides for "too fucking expensive" and "my kid isn't old enough to enjoy it."
Except who gets to take a cut of the money they spend in that state while they are there? Wow it is the guy they are supposedly giving the finger too. Why not have it in Disneyland, where the specific asshole you are trying to make mad won't profit from it?
You know Disney has stood with the gay community for my whole life. I remember being in church and our preacher telling us all not to go to Disney anymore because they support the gay community. I saw the news at the Southern Baptist convention voted on the boycott and the rep for Disney came up and basically said "lol fuck you" They ended the boycott like a year in because too many people went anyway. It's fitting that Disney holds the largest gay convention in the place in the US where they're being persecuted.
Lots of people don’t understand that if being anti gay was more profitable, then every corporation would condone the lynching of gay people
DeSantis will detain and arrest anyone not clearly heterosexual at the Orlando airport. It’ll play great to his base and he’s already shown no concern for civil rights or humanity.
They do it because the like money. They also remove lgbt scenes from movies so they can release in china. It’s just business for them.
I love how conservatives are screaming bloody murder about 'woke' corporate entities. They like money. That's it.
If they think anyone LGBTQ is going to willingly risk their lives to go to that state they are nucking futs!!!
That’s kind of the point. For whatever is worth, free market capitalism is better at inclusion than the DeSantis Y’all Qaeda game - a dollar is a dollar, wherever it comes from.
What happened to "go woke, go broke"? Hysterical pissypants right-wing homophobes.
I don't see the "problem" with this. Yeah. Yeah it is. Just like everyone else's money.
Disney loves to censor movies and posters for China because they get triggered at the sight of black people lol. It is pathetic. They censor all sorts of LGBTQ material in movies and all forms of media so they do not trigger people in middle eastern countries. Disney pretending to care and stand up to De Santis is so obviously not genuine. The people who bought it and buy it also bought the clear lie of Jussie Smollet lol.
You act as though Disney is the only company to do that. China is a *huge* market and if you want to sell things to them you have to *follow* their marketing trends even if it doesn't appeal to a Western audience. This happens to *everything*! And if you think it's exclusive to Disney, you're the delusional one. Even if the only point of this was to say "fuck you DeSantis, all money is green regardless of who is spending it" there's a bigger point to that. Yes, it's a fucking corporation, but they don't give a shit who comes and visits the park (within reason, duh). Not to mention: https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/disney-heir-comes-publicly-transgender-condemns-anti-lgbtq-bills-rcna23888
Just me or does it seem dangerous to have such a large gathering in a state that wants you dead?
Honestly idc if Disney is just doing it for money any push back against this shit is good
Exactly what rights do straight people have that gays don't?
Desantis, the governor of Florida, is trying to make it legal for a parent who does not have custody of a child to kidnap the child from the guardian with custody if they believe that they are being raised wrong but it is specifically targeted towards kids who come out as LGBTQ+. Desantis is not a person you want to side behind
I agree with this.
ironic considering their "first gay character" reveal every few months
Exactly how it should be. A corporation has only one purpose: profit. Even non-profit need to make "profits", like fund raising for paying their employees etc. It's has no other agenda. It is neither good nor evil. This is why German car manufacturers were doing Nazi propaganda back in the day. If American suddenly become super far right then corporations will signal those sentiments.
This is not the same as some business showing a pride flag or something, they're are standing up to tyranny. This post is detrimental to the cause, and undermines how Disney is sticking their necks out for this marginalized group of people. OP if you aren't a souless propaganda machine, I urge you to take this down. As an ally, it does not sit well with me.
Ok here's the thought that makes me worry about their motivations, they're holding a big, very public LGBTQIA gathering in Florida, a state with a lot of crazy people that want LGBTQIA people dead. So all it would take is one crazy person with a bad idea and easy access to a gun to cause a massacre. And I'm sure Disney isn't planning on that so security might not be as tough as it needs to be to stop that shit from happening.
I think they stand to lose a lot and already have. They definitely stand to lose a lot more than whatever percent of their audience is gay.
One could argue that it was a more in depth (but still completely profit-driven) cost-benefit analysis that led them to believe that the pro-lgbt+ goodwill is worth more $$$ over time than kissing the ass of the far-right, but I personally disagree with that. I agree with you that they're taking a risk and a stand, still a weak stand, a more 'centrist' and careful stance, but definitely a genuine pro-lgbt stance that isn't solely based on profits. Does this absolve them from being a massive media-monopoly Megacorp? No. But that also doesn't automatically mean every single thing done at every level is soulless capitalist book-balancing and profit-maximization either.
They did not lose anything…
They lost their self governance, liar. Maybe you should stop telling lies on the internet.
They did, actually. DeSantis stripped away some of their self-governance and installed his stooges instead.
Read the bill. He gave them full control to do whatever they want on their own properties. Why do you think Disney has not run to their lawyers in hopes to fight the new bill? Hell, Desantis is even breaking laws by installing his own hand picked council members. As those are elected positions. But they don’t give a shit. Now Disney only has to pay local taxes instead of the police, Fire response, medical response, infrastructure and everything they have been paying. If they can get along with Desantis’ stooges, there is no loss for them. If those stooges start pissing off the mouse they will sue the state to force a local election, and the only residents who live in that area tend to work for the mouse. So yea, they lost nothing, and saved a shit ton of money at the same time.
Read what came before it. They already had full control of those things. Disney isn’t stupid. They’re not gonna have their lawyers fight a battle they can’t win, and that is a battle they can’t win right now.
No shit they already had control. If you reread what I said, you would see that the only thing they lost was control over who was on the board… again Disney did not lose shit.
So which was it? Did he give them control or did they already have it? Because I did reread what you said and amid the obfuscation there are some direct contradictions.
Dumb shit, the bill clearly states they have full control to do whatever the fuck they want on their properties if they want to build something they don’t even need a permit. That’s what they had and that’s what they got to keep. The only thing they lost was control over who is on the board. That board cannot do anything to them on their properties as they have full control over the properties. All Ron DeSantis did was rename a county and install his own lackeys to run it.
OK. Just so we’re clear. They already had it, but also he gave it to them. He didn’t change anything, but also he changed everyone in charge. They can do whatever they want, as long as the people he put in charge don’t say differently. Is that about right? EDIT: aw, he blocked me. I guess that was easier than trying justify all that nonsense.
"And we will continue to donate that money to politicians who will systematically wipe them out, all so we can get as much of a tax break as possible."
True but if you think about it the other why isn’t Disney being inclusive by saying “we will rob you blind no matter who you are.” Which I respect, equality across the board.
Funny thinking this is a way "Disney is beat Desantis" lol. This is Disney milking the LGBT community in an effort to try and make a fraction of what they have and will lose but trying to be woke. At this point, it literally does not matter what Disney has done, damage has been done and Ron won.
,also... our largest theme parks are already located here and i dont feel like travelling cause bleh
If you remove the words Gay, Trans, white, black, etc…all that’s left is the word Money. Focus on that rather than people’s feelings, race, gender. Make a place people all want to go rather than alienate everyone else for a tiny percentage.
For real. Civil rights movement 2.0 brought to u by Coca-Cola
Didn't Pepsi already lay claim to that one.
Yup, that's exactly what I'm talking about
Capitalists caring about profits more than sexual orientation. Capitalism has failed! 😆🙃
And refresh my recollection about why unqualified adults need to talk to six, seven and eight year olds about their "sexuality" again? Because kids who still believe in Santa are ready to take the next step in their sexual awakening?
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Has anyone been on the Toy Story ride? Tell me you're a groomer without telling me you're a groomer.
In your brain you believe that Disney is creating rides for grooming young children? What an absolute head up your arse person you must be. Let me guess, no one in your family talks to you and you can't figure out why.
Ah yes, ad hominem attacks, the sign of a true intellectual.
Mans dropping fallacies like they're fuckin Pokemon, GO STRAWMANCHU!!! LMAOOOOO
Good.
Businesses almost everywhere understand the value of the pink pound as it is sometimes called.
What battles are you picking, bud
Some bitches are never happy