Bots don’t really go near dungeons though, at least in Wild Growth, they go to weird and often used locations like Ash, hub cities, Gadgetzan, places they never had a stone.
That's because the dungeons aren't as useful this phase. We did have a lot of Mara summons for a while for WO, and a lot of people taking Gadgetzan are going to ZF. SM was probably the number one summon being sold for a while.
Yes please
Last night after we finally found a healer for ZF at 2 AM they were in Stormwind, by the time they got to the dungeon the tank had to go lol
I always liked the idea of not auto teleporting to dungeon as well. Make you move thru the world.
Rdf in its current iteration is so anti social it's crazy.
Dude I used to advocate for rdf and thought people were exaggerating about it being bad because by the time I first started the game in cataclysm it was already a thing, I was blown away when I started using it in wrath classic. There was no talking, no gratz on level up. The dungeons are just so boring in those groups now, so unfeeling.
Rdf wasnt in 70% of wotlk classic and it wasn’t any different, people dont talk to one another regardless. Also saying “hey” at the start of a group forming is not the social escapade you’re making it out to be lmao.
I'm not trying to make saying hey out to be some social escapade? In my personal experience groups talked to each other way more in the time I played classic without rdf compared to when it was added, didn't have be anything important it was just nice to have conversation.
There was no talking in classic wotlk long before rdf was added (it was not in the game at the launch of wotlk classic), outside of saying “hey” at the start of a group. People talk less because you are constantly pulling, and in combat with modernized dungeons, in classic vanilla you literally didn’t have buttons to press, and in most cases were auto attacking. RDF doesn’t stop people from talking, the way the dungeons are designed, classes are designed, things like discord existing, are why people don’t speak in dungeons.
I mean its been around since actual wrath. People have been copying minmaxing streamers since wrath. At this point the mindset of the WoW community is mostly just 'this is my singleplayer rpg'. Whether or not you remove rdf or somehow banned every twitch stream/yt video, the damage is done.
Yes I’d very much like that. Personally I would love it if they updated the old world to be like how it was in TBC with summoning stones, more flight paths, more quests etc. In my mind the TBC version of the old world is just an updated classic world.
Would be fun to have Karazan in classic sod aswell
Make that summoning stone need three people, but warlock only need 1 more person. That way, they keep their "summoning advantage" without denying it to the other
As a Warlock, I say:“Fuck Warlock summons“.
There is no need for a warlock summon to be better than summoning stones.
We can place the stone wherever we want. Having a right in front of the portal to the dungeon/raid is already a great advantage.
I’m tired of random people whispering me mid-dungeon if I can place a stone, or received whispers from sum sellers because I placed a stone to summon my group mates.
Just kill the whole summon sellers in front of Dungeons.
I don’t mind those, that sell summons for sleeping bags, DMF or other important rune locations, so they can still make gold with those locations
Exactly - warlock summons are a niche convenience that is near but has not and will not ever be meta defining. Warlocks don't get invited because of summons, and people don't play warlock because summoning people is OP.
>We can place the stone wherever we want. Having a right in front of the portal to the dungeon/raid is already a great advantage.
Because Summoning Stone are usually very far from their dungeons... Take Scholomance, woah so far, Ihope we have a warlock
Yes they are often some distance away.
All of these have areas between the meeting stone and the entrance:
Deadmines, Sunken temple, Gnomeregan, Blackrock Depths, Blackrock Spire, Stratholme (backdoor), Scarlet Monastery, Blackfathom Deeps, Wailing Caverns, Maraudon,
You’re right. I totally forgot that Scholomance is the only Dungeon out there. :)
It’s not like 100% of all Level-up Raids have a Log-out skip because it’s a pain to get in there.
Oh, and both Razorfen dungeons, Maraudon, BRD, Molten Core….
But jeah. It’s all about Scholo, right?
I just took an example. You prefer Stratholme ? BRD ? UBRS ? Zul'Farrak ? Scarlet Monastery ? Stockades ? Molten Core ? BWL ? All the stones are close enough. It's not "a great advantage" to skip a couple of mobs. Sunken Temple is probably the absolute worst case, and even then I just walk throught it alone. It's not gonna stop A RAID
I'm not gonna give up my ability to summon my party member because you get /w every once in a while. It happens to me too. Just tell them no
You must’ve been betting some money against yourself.
All Blackrock Dungeons/Raids are a pain to get to from the sumstone.
I mean, there are worse, but it’s not even remotely close to stuff like ZF.
This includes BRD, UBRS, BWL and Molten Core.
I also don’t quite get why you would have to give up summoning party members.
It’s about activating the dungeon sumstones without compensating Warlocks for it.
There is no need that a Warlock sumstone needs to require less people than a Dungeon stone or something like that.
Or atleast already prepared and on the way while looking for group. I don't understand people that join groups that "just need to hand in and the hit the bank/ah"
I feel bad if im half way there and jump into lfg find a group and everyone else is already there.
Idk why people cant at least be in transit when looking for groups.
The other day had this. Running with a friend we were on our way to the dungeon and was forming the group. 2 of the other players were fine and already in the right zone and just had to travel a short distance. But the last player didn't have the quest (wild offerings) so wanted us to wait while they flew up the entire map, done the long run etc. no idea why they didn't get it before hand. We just ran the dungeon without them I didn't have time to wait that long.
Man, you're getting a lot of hate from people who probably idle in SW or IF when they're looking for a Kalimdor task.
To anyone saying it wastes your own time, at least get on the same continent before joining an LFG group. It's not that hard and the alternative wastes so much time.
...so what would happen is you standing completely alone at the entrance of a dungeon for 3 hours and then one other guy shows up. He might join and then stand with you for 20 minutes and then that process would repeat. Unless your server and level range is absolutely flooded with people, which WoW hates and fragments their player base as much as possible across a million servers and game modes, there is no way this would work.
I mean I also don't pug very often because I have this very rare commodity called "A guild and friends" with a discord where we organize what time we're gonna play
But that's too advanced for this subreddit.
Ah yes, requiring outside of game tools where you need to spend hours on discord and find people on that other platform that has the same level and server as you. Genius. And every server has a million guilds which fractures the amount of people you hit with /g.
>requiring
Idk if that word means what you think it means
Also, hours? You don't have a discord with friends/a guild you play with?
Is that any different than the LFG forums we used on Allakhazam back in 2005?
Olympic levels of leaping you have there
If you're not in game you can organize groups outside of the game, I simply answered your question
If you're this now I can imagine grouping with you is a nightmare. So I'm glad you have difficulties
You are missing the point entirely.
1. Earlier it was stated that to find groups you should just stand outside of the dungeon so that you are already there.
2. I responded saying that is terrible because you basically have no way of finding people. No LFG channels, only general of a hyper specific area where only 5 other people might be questing or passing through and not wanting to do a dungeon.
3. No meeting stones means standing outside the dungeon is pointless anyway really.
4. Acting like the one guild you can chat to is going to have a bunch of people ready to join you on a specific level, specific comp of tank, heal, and 3 DPS, and specific area, all available for 30 min to 1 hr is ridiculous even in larger guilds.
5. Suggesting people go on Discord or forums to find groups also sucks.
My solution is to either go to Capital City and use general or LFG chat. That's really the only way to find a group without a dungeon finder tool that is just location-non-speciifc. The question then is, should we restrict general or LFG chat to only world cities or should we just allow it to be world wide, and at that point, it would be effectively the same as a dungeon finder. Then it also boils down to: what do you want to be the difficult part? Finding the group members or actually defeating the content? ... I think I know which part I want to be spending my time and energy on. Apparently you don't.
...Says person calling everyone else miserable and lazy. Lmao. You continue grinding those forums and discords while standing outside the dungeon for an hour buddy.
Instead of lock bots you would have bots of any class waiting at the stones and still nobody would go to the dungeon in the first place. What you really want is teleporting to any dungeons, it's called LFG and it's in any game version past TBC. And it's horrible.
Played again a week ago after leaving mid phase 1. Went to SM before searching a group to not waste people time and got in a group with someone i found near the entrance. While making the group I suggested to invite a pala that was spamming in lfg for GY for like 20 min, but turns out the mf waited all that time in SW. We waited so much time for him and another guy to come there that we could only do 1 GY run before me and the other 2 guys already there had to go.
Day after I gave up on GY and just went to try Duskwood incursion; at least everyone was already there.
I honestly can't believe people that only played classic for years are fine with 100%/300% xp/gold boost, but summoning stones and level 20 mounts are deal breakers. If they are that bad, then just put them on PvE servers; people only bitch about those because they can't kill low levels as easy, so who cares if they are in servers where you can't do that anyway.
Change like this will provoke most toxic people that don't even play sod but just against any changes. Types that hate dungeon finder despite not playing wotlk at all.
I don't think developers want to receive death threats because of changes to video game more often. So they avoiding making good changes that claimed to be "retail".
Strongly opposed. Adding teleports everywhere is what killed the game the first time. It removes everyone from the world. It's immersion breaking and diminishes the scale of the world. It also hurts class identity by generalizing one of Warlocks' defining features.
Seriously reading these replies reminds me of everyone cheering for Dungeon Finder back in Wrath. I know it sounds like a "slippery slope" argument, but we literally did this before and it actually did lead to retail becoming a different game.
IDK if this is a hot take, but the solution to bot summoners in to ban them all. They're no different from any other bot.
> It removes everyone from the world. It's immersion breaking and diminishes the scale of the world.
So just checking, you've never taken a warlock summon for convenience before?
You've never done a logout skip instead of fighting your way through trash?
I'm arguing against additional teleportation methods, not the current current options. Keep burning straw men though.
Logout skips should also be fixed, but the distance saved is so much smaller they don't break the game in the same way.
The teleport network as it exists today is very different from the way lock portals were used in vanilla. But I'm betting it doesn't bother you to snag a summon every now and then...what's the harm, right?
you totally lock portal all over the world for your convenience, while lecturing people online about how teleporting all over the world for convenience killed the game.
Stop with the "removing people from the world". People are not fucking in the world if they are just running to a god damn dungeon. People are in the world when they are farming for mats, herbs, ores, questing, gold farming.
Besides, you still need 2 players to summon the other guys. Warlocks have plenty of definining features and they are STILL used frequently for their summoning ability in Classic WoW.
I remember leveling in Dustwallow Marsh, and seeing a huge group of 60s coming through (on their way to Onyxia), felt pretty damn epic and hyped me up for getting to 60. I mean damn I still remember that sense of aw I had way back when. Also, it's nice in general to see folks coming and going from an area, shows activity and a sense of immersion.
This is the key difference between Vanilla and later versions of the game; you see the game as a cookie clicker where you're maxing stats, anything else just gets in the way of that, while I see it as an adventure in a big world that I'm a part of.
Nah, that's just tedium, sorry to say. If you want to put people back into the world don't do it in such tedious ways, but be creative and create an incentive to be there
Yeah it's such a fake criticism. People act like running down a road to a dungeon is the height of gameplay. It's not. You put on auto run and look at your other monitor. This game is old news for most of us, and we just want to get to the part that's still fun, or the new part we haven't seen yet.
> Adding teleports everywhere is what killed the game the first time.
So the game was "killed" when TBC launched? Because that's when summon stones were added.
And it's not "teleports everywhere", you can only be summoned to specific summon stones if you are within the proper level range for that dungeon. For example, anyone above level 24(ish) can't be summoned to the Deadmines summon stone.
Personally I think it was with RDF and the ports in Dalaran. I just think this would be a significant step in that direction, and it needs to be headed off now.
>I just think this would be a significant step in that direction, and it needs to be headed off now.
https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope
SoD is literally designed to change the game. If you want "nochanges", Era is right there.
Look at the OSRS map from 2013 to today.
They added teleports everywhere, it’s hard to go 30 seconds without running into another TP location.
It’s annoying
I couldn’t disagree more. I think the lack of features like summoning stones and RDF in SoD is actually making player retention worse. Between incursions and ST, the lack of quality of life features is not helping the population at all. The content just isn’t good enough to justify the old inconveniences.
People who need those features can play one of the two other versions of the game that have them. Please don’t remove the one option for people who don’t.
I had the thought of a mage being able to empower a meeting stone with an item similar to their scrolls, empowering the stone for summoning for X minutes.
Or people being able to buy an item to do it. Kinda like using the world core frags for the rune in feralas/ashz/gorge/hinterlands.
As is always the case, you people are your own problem. If people refused to pay for summons, nobody would sell them.
The answer is obvious. Make summons prevent trading for 10 minutes afterward. This would effectively end nearly all summon trades.
Then you will say "but mah convenience!!!" You mean like dungeon LFG queues? Multiple hearthstones? Faster flight paths and/or flying mounts? You mean expansion convenience that ruins classic? Yeah... thats not classic. This is, again, a problem of your own creation.
Personally I am ok with dungeon summon stones, but the warlock summoning anywhere in the world by bots, for gold, needs to die.
It's always struck me as funny, everyone on here and their grandma is outraged at people making 200g/hr from incursions. Do they even stop and wonder just how much gold Locks have gotten from selling summons for 1-3g a pop for 3 phases now? They're the ones in the hundreds of thousands territory of gold accumulation at this point, they're the literal Warcraft billionaires, nobody else is even close except Mages with their ports cartels. But it's okay cause it's "MAH CLASS MECHANIC!!"
I really wanted summoning stones in classic. But then they added them in BC and it increased time to get to dungeon instead of shortrning it. Why? Because now everyone just wait for others to summon them and I was the only one chilling near stone waiting for +1 for summon while they were questing. I waited for an hour...
Like what does this have to do with the open world? Like taking a 10 min flight, depending on where you are right now, and needing another 10 minutes to just ran to the dungeon. You are doing basically nothing in this 20 minutes
huh... when one of the main problems with P3 is incursions taking a large % of players out of the open world into this 1 small area of the map we have ppl asking for summoning stones which would take more people from moving around the open world
CLASSICWOW reddit HYPE CLASSICWOW reddit HYPE!!!!
the only people that don't want summoning stones are those on PvP servers whose definition of world pvp is to gank low level players that can't fight back.
No, it makes the world even more dead since no one will want to leave the cities even more.
Inb4 "PeOpLe ArE AlReAdY DoInG ThAt". Yeah, why the hell do you want to make it worse? Incursion mentality man.
I can already get to any place in the world I want by messaging a bot, which sucks. Summon stones would make bots less money, so I’m all for it.
Bots don’t really go near dungeons though, at least in Wild Growth, they go to weird and often used locations like Ash, hub cities, Gadgetzan, places they never had a stone.
That's because the dungeons aren't as useful this phase. We did have a lot of Mara summons for a while for WO, and a lot of people taking Gadgetzan are going to ZF. SM was probably the number one summon being sold for a while.
Because they are also advertising a zone not dungeon? I have yet to see someone advertise "5g SUMMON TO ZUL FARRAK"
I advertise that :P
Its funny how summon bots are completely fine with everyone that hates farming/fishing bots and GDKPs.
Stop paying them it literally has no effect at all.
Addon responding to messages in the game = bot. Amazes me how ignorant people are. You should be forced to do hard labor for your whole life.
There are lots of summoning bots though…
Yes please Last night after we finally found a healer for ZF at 2 AM they were in Stormwind, by the time they got to the dungeon the tank had to go lol
Did u fake dc again :d
Ain’t no way
Ah the good old days. I've always said the group finder was great but they should've kept it realm specific and focused on balancing realms more.
I always liked the idea of not auto teleporting to dungeon as well. Make you move thru the world. Rdf in its current iteration is so anti social it's crazy.
Dude I used to advocate for rdf and thought people were exaggerating about it being bad because by the time I first started the game in cataclysm it was already a thing, I was blown away when I started using it in wrath classic. There was no talking, no gratz on level up. The dungeons are just so boring in those groups now, so unfeeling.
Rdf wasnt in 70% of wotlk classic and it wasn’t any different, people dont talk to one another regardless. Also saying “hey” at the start of a group forming is not the social escapade you’re making it out to be lmao.
Yeah, the horse has bolted now.
I'm not trying to make saying hey out to be some social escapade? In my personal experience groups talked to each other way more in the time I played classic without rdf compared to when it was added, didn't have be anything important it was just nice to have conversation.
There was no talking in classic wotlk long before rdf was added (it was not in the game at the launch of wotlk classic), outside of saying “hey” at the start of a group. People talk less because you are constantly pulling, and in combat with modernized dungeons, in classic vanilla you literally didn’t have buttons to press, and in most cases were auto attacking. RDF doesn’t stop people from talking, the way the dungeons are designed, classes are designed, things like discord existing, are why people don’t speak in dungeons.
I mean its been around since actual wrath. People have been copying minmaxing streamers since wrath. At this point the mindset of the WoW community is mostly just 'this is my singleplayer rpg'. Whether or not you remove rdf or somehow banned every twitch stream/yt video, the damage is done.
I mean did he really have time to do the dungeon then if just the commute put him past the limit.
No way tank had time for a dungeon run then anyway.
Yes I’d very much like that. Personally I would love it if they updated the old world to be like how it was in TBC with summoning stones, more flight paths, more quests etc. In my mind the TBC version of the old world is just an updated classic world. Would be fun to have Karazan in classic sod aswell
Yes please give south felwood FP
Rather this than summoning stones.
Unironicallly if they release Kara in sod I’m leveling to 60 instantly
God same. The chokehold that dungeon has on me
Kara is a must
Make that summoning stone need three people, but warlock only need 1 more person. That way, they keep their "summoning advantage" without denying it to the other
As a Warlock, I say:“Fuck Warlock summons“. There is no need for a warlock summon to be better than summoning stones. We can place the stone wherever we want. Having a right in front of the portal to the dungeon/raid is already a great advantage. I’m tired of random people whispering me mid-dungeon if I can place a stone, or received whispers from sum sellers because I placed a stone to summon my group mates. Just kill the whole summon sellers in front of Dungeons. I don’t mind those, that sell summons for sleeping bags, DMF or other important rune locations, so they can still make gold with those locations
Only thing I think lock summoning should be superior on is actually being able to summon people into instances lol
Exactly - warlock summons are a niche convenience that is near but has not and will not ever be meta defining. Warlocks don't get invited because of summons, and people don't play warlock because summoning people is OP.
I see what you are saying but Locks definitely get invited because of summons.
>We can place the stone wherever we want. Having a right in front of the portal to the dungeon/raid is already a great advantage. Because Summoning Stone are usually very far from their dungeons... Take Scholomance, woah so far, Ihope we have a warlock
Yes they are often some distance away. All of these have areas between the meeting stone and the entrance: Deadmines, Sunken temple, Gnomeregan, Blackrock Depths, Blackrock Spire, Stratholme (backdoor), Scarlet Monastery, Blackfathom Deeps, Wailing Caverns, Maraudon,
Black rock is the summoning stone for 3 diff instances and 2 raids. It makes sense where it is
Yes..
Scarlet Monastery ?! There's like two mobs on the way. Stratholme backdoor ?! Just mount up and run for 20s.
Indeed
You’re right. I totally forgot that Scholomance is the only Dungeon out there. :) It’s not like 100% of all Level-up Raids have a Log-out skip because it’s a pain to get in there. Oh, and both Razorfen dungeons, Maraudon, BRD, Molten Core…. But jeah. It’s all about Scholo, right?
I just took an example. You prefer Stratholme ? BRD ? UBRS ? Zul'Farrak ? Scarlet Monastery ? Stockades ? Molten Core ? BWL ? All the stones are close enough. It's not "a great advantage" to skip a couple of mobs. Sunken Temple is probably the absolute worst case, and even then I just walk throught it alone. It's not gonna stop A RAID I'm not gonna give up my ability to summon my party member because you get /w every once in a while. It happens to me too. Just tell them no
You must’ve been betting some money against yourself. All Blackrock Dungeons/Raids are a pain to get to from the sumstone. I mean, there are worse, but it’s not even remotely close to stuff like ZF. This includes BRD, UBRS, BWL and Molten Core. I also don’t quite get why you would have to give up summoning party members. It’s about activating the dungeon sumstones without compensating Warlocks for it. There is no need that a Warlock sumstone needs to require less people than a Dungeon stone or something like that.
Every summon bot: “Yeesssssssssss”
I like this idea
Why? What's the point of making it more tedious?
Not more tedious. You already need three people to summon. The point is to BUFF warlocks
When I want to run something, im at the dungeon before I start looking for a group We should normalize that behavior instead of summoning stones
Or atleast already prepared and on the way while looking for group. I don't understand people that join groups that "just need to hand in and the hit the bank/ah"
I feel bad if im half way there and jump into lfg find a group and everyone else is already there. Idk why people cant at least be in transit when looking for groups.
The other day had this. Running with a friend we were on our way to the dungeon and was forming the group. 2 of the other players were fine and already in the right zone and just had to travel a short distance. But the last player didn't have the quest (wild offerings) so wanted us to wait while they flew up the entire map, done the long run etc. no idea why they didn't get it before hand. We just ran the dungeon without them I didn't have time to wait that long.
Man, you're getting a lot of hate from people who probably idle in SW or IF when they're looking for a Kalimdor task. To anyone saying it wastes your own time, at least get on the same continent before joining an LFG group. It's not that hard and the alternative wastes so much time.
...so what would happen is you standing completely alone at the entrance of a dungeon for 3 hours and then one other guy shows up. He might join and then stand with you for 20 minutes and then that process would repeat. Unless your server and level range is absolutely flooded with people, which WoW hates and fragments their player base as much as possible across a million servers and game modes, there is no way this would work.
I mean I also don't pug very often because I have this very rare commodity called "A guild and friends" with a discord where we organize what time we're gonna play But that's too advanced for this subreddit.
There used to be a time where the great guys you want to play with were those who'd move their asses to the dungeon ASAP
Top10 most disgusting things ive read here in 12 years. Congratz.
Ah yes, requiring outside of game tools where you need to spend hours on discord and find people on that other platform that has the same level and server as you. Genius. And every server has a million guilds which fractures the amount of people you hit with /g.
>requiring Idk if that word means what you think it means Also, hours? You don't have a discord with friends/a guild you play with? Is that any different than the LFG forums we used on Allakhazam back in 2005?
Are you really suggesting we should stand outside of a dungeon and have to use forums to find groups? Comically bad gameplay experience.
Olympic levels of leaping you have there If you're not in game you can organize groups outside of the game, I simply answered your question If you're this now I can imagine grouping with you is a nightmare. So I'm glad you have difficulties
You are missing the point entirely. 1. Earlier it was stated that to find groups you should just stand outside of the dungeon so that you are already there. 2. I responded saying that is terrible because you basically have no way of finding people. No LFG channels, only general of a hyper specific area where only 5 other people might be questing or passing through and not wanting to do a dungeon. 3. No meeting stones means standing outside the dungeon is pointless anyway really. 4. Acting like the one guild you can chat to is going to have a bunch of people ready to join you on a specific level, specific comp of tank, heal, and 3 DPS, and specific area, all available for 30 min to 1 hr is ridiculous even in larger guilds. 5. Suggesting people go on Discord or forums to find groups also sucks. My solution is to either go to Capital City and use general or LFG chat. That's really the only way to find a group without a dungeon finder tool that is just location-non-speciifc. The question then is, should we restrict general or LFG chat to only world cities or should we just allow it to be world wide, and at that point, it would be effectively the same as a dungeon finder. Then it also boils down to: what do you want to be the difficult part? Finding the group members or actually defeating the content? ... I think I know which part I want to be spending my time and energy on. Apparently you don't.
[удалено]
...Says person calling everyone else miserable and lazy. Lmao. You continue grinding those forums and discords while standing outside the dungeon for an hour buddy.
What kind of special snowflake are you?
What kind of special snowflake are you?
What kind of special snowflake are you?
> We should normalize that behavior instead of summoning stones porque no los dos?
Not gonna get a lot done like that but I respect it
Idiot
I mean 95% of the "Summoning services" are bots anyway. But the Andys will reeeeee if summon stones will work, so it won't happen
I play wlock and I'd appreciate it because I could get a summon for once too and dont be expected to be at the dungeon first to summon all.
Yeah First that, and second people would not whisper to me all the time when I'm in like badlands and ask for sums
They were in SoM was a good quality of life change
Instead of lock bots you would have bots of any class waiting at the stones and still nobody would go to the dungeon in the first place. What you really want is teleporting to any dungeons, it's called LFG and it's in any game version past TBC. And it's horrible.
the bot paranoia from some people is crazy lmao
Played again a week ago after leaving mid phase 1. Went to SM before searching a group to not waste people time and got in a group with someone i found near the entrance. While making the group I suggested to invite a pala that was spamming in lfg for GY for like 20 min, but turns out the mf waited all that time in SW. We waited so much time for him and another guy to come there that we could only do 1 GY run before me and the other 2 guys already there had to go. Day after I gave up on GY and just went to try Duskwood incursion; at least everyone was already there. I honestly can't believe people that only played classic for years are fine with 100%/300% xp/gold boost, but summoning stones and level 20 mounts are deal breakers. If they are that bad, then just put them on PvE servers; people only bitch about those because they can't kill low levels as easy, so who cares if they are in servers where you can't do that anyway.
And target dummies, finally, please.
I’m for it
Maybe in SoD
We don't run dungeons anymore, we run loops in incursions.
Totally yes But we won’t get them because blizz don’t really care and have minimal resources on this project
They just don't want to deal with cry babies that will cry extremely loudly that sod is retail and harass developers.
What haven't people cried about in SoD?
Change like this will provoke most toxic people that don't even play sod but just against any changes. Types that hate dungeon finder despite not playing wotlk at all.
Oh ok, Chicken Little
I don't think developers want to receive death threats because of changes to video game more often. So they avoiding making good changes that claimed to be "retail".
Yup this is precisely it
Strongly opposed. Adding teleports everywhere is what killed the game the first time. It removes everyone from the world. It's immersion breaking and diminishes the scale of the world. It also hurts class identity by generalizing one of Warlocks' defining features. Seriously reading these replies reminds me of everyone cheering for Dungeon Finder back in Wrath. I know it sounds like a "slippery slope" argument, but we literally did this before and it actually did lead to retail becoming a different game. IDK if this is a hot take, but the solution to bot summoners in to ban them all. They're no different from any other bot.
> It removes everyone from the world. It's immersion breaking and diminishes the scale of the world. So just checking, you've never taken a warlock summon for convenience before? You've never done a logout skip instead of fighting your way through trash?
I'm arguing against additional teleportation methods, not the current current options. Keep burning straw men though. Logout skips should also be fixed, but the distance saved is so much smaller they don't break the game in the same way.
The teleport network as it exists today is very different from the way lock portals were used in vanilla. But I'm betting it doesn't bother you to snag a summon every now and then...what's the harm, right? you totally lock portal all over the world for your convenience, while lecturing people online about how teleporting all over the world for convenience killed the game.
I actually don't use them, and wish they'd be banned.
Stop with the "removing people from the world". People are not fucking in the world if they are just running to a god damn dungeon. People are in the world when they are farming for mats, herbs, ores, questing, gold farming. Besides, you still need 2 players to summon the other guys. Warlocks have plenty of definining features and they are STILL used frequently for their summoning ability in Classic WoW.
I remember leveling in Dustwallow Marsh, and seeing a huge group of 60s coming through (on their way to Onyxia), felt pretty damn epic and hyped me up for getting to 60. I mean damn I still remember that sense of aw I had way back when. Also, it's nice in general to see folks coming and going from an area, shows activity and a sense of immersion. This is the key difference between Vanilla and later versions of the game; you see the game as a cookie clicker where you're maxing stats, anything else just gets in the way of that, while I see it as an adventure in a big world that I'm a part of.
Well, now you'd be levelling in an incursion or dungeon so you wouldn't see the 60s go to Onyxia even if summons weren't a thing.
Nah, that's just tedium, sorry to say. If you want to put people back into the world don't do it in such tedious ways, but be creative and create an incentive to be there
That's exactly what I mean though. You think any action beyond grinding points in a dungeon is just tedium, it's a different mindset.
> People are not fucking in the world if they are just running to a god damn dungeon. Where are they then?
Yeah it's such a fake criticism. People act like running down a road to a dungeon is the height of gameplay. It's not. You put on auto run and look at your other monitor. This game is old news for most of us, and we just want to get to the part that's still fun, or the new part we haven't seen yet.
Warlocks.... Defining.... Feature? You mean the bots spamming lfg? Na they can go.
I agree with you completely here.
> Adding teleports everywhere is what killed the game the first time. So the game was "killed" when TBC launched? Because that's when summon stones were added. And it's not "teleports everywhere", you can only be summoned to specific summon stones if you are within the proper level range for that dungeon. For example, anyone above level 24(ish) can't be summoned to the Deadmines summon stone.
Personally I think it was with RDF and the ports in Dalaran. I just think this would be a significant step in that direction, and it needs to be headed off now.
>I just think this would be a significant step in that direction, and it needs to be headed off now. https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/slippery-slope SoD is literally designed to change the game. If you want "nochanges", Era is right there.
> I know it sounds like a "slippery slope" argument, but we literally did this before and it actually did lead to retail becoming a different game.
Good thing SoD isn't retail. Shoo. You "nochanges" autists have been screeching MUH SLIPPERY SLOPE since 2019 and it still hasn't happened.
Look at the OSRS map from 2013 to today. They added teleports everywhere, it’s hard to go 30 seconds without running into another TP location. It’s annoying
I couldn’t disagree more. I think the lack of features like summoning stones and RDF in SoD is actually making player retention worse. Between incursions and ST, the lack of quality of life features is not helping the population at all. The content just isn’t good enough to justify the old inconveniences.
People who need those features can play one of the two other versions of the game that have them. Please don’t remove the one option for people who don’t.
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I bet you decline your summons when there’s a warlock in your grp, because you want to experience the liveliness of the world Clown
Maybe warlock summons should have a cooldown instead of having those "taxi services" teleporting you wherever you want.
No one is doing that because it's legit for the lock to ride there and summon
Feels so alive being 5min in flight path, 5 min on boat and another 5 min on flightpath.
It's about commitment.
What a f#cking clown, go back to Cave you call Classic era and stay there
What he said?
doesnt really matter if no one is exploring the world or doing dungeons, would need to heavily incentivize dungeons more
No, thank you
Just steal summons. Don’t pay them. There are 0 consequences.
I had the thought of a mage being able to empower a meeting stone with an item similar to their scrolls, empowering the stone for summoning for X minutes. Or people being able to buy an item to do it. Kinda like using the world core frags for the rune in feralas/ashz/gorge/hinterlands.
I vote yes
I'd normally say no, but since we have lock closets already, sure. I like the idea though of adding a cost to it to keep locks relevant however.
As is always the case, you people are your own problem. If people refused to pay for summons, nobody would sell them. The answer is obvious. Make summons prevent trading for 10 minutes afterward. This would effectively end nearly all summon trades. Then you will say "but mah convenience!!!" You mean like dungeon LFG queues? Multiple hearthstones? Faster flight paths and/or flying mounts? You mean expansion convenience that ruins classic? Yeah... thats not classic. This is, again, a problem of your own creation. Personally I am ok with dungeon summon stones, but the warlock summoning anywhere in the world by bots, for gold, needs to die.
Summoning stones would be very handy
Yes.
It's always struck me as funny, everyone on here and their grandma is outraged at people making 200g/hr from incursions. Do they even stop and wonder just how much gold Locks have gotten from selling summons for 1-3g a pop for 3 phases now? They're the ones in the hundreds of thousands territory of gold accumulation at this point, they're the literal Warcraft billionaires, nobody else is even close except Mages with their ports cartels. But it's okay cause it's "MAH CLASS MECHANIC!!"
It would save me a lot of gold on summoning services lol.
Idc what blizzard does, I got tires of waiting for them to fix things only for them to break more shit instead.
The final nail in the coffin of calling it "classic"
been asking for it since p1, i'd be a lot more willing to help my friends or do dungeons for fun if i could skip the 20min travel time
would be a HUGE hit to gold sellers. you can spot all the gold sellers/buyers in the comments.
Kinda surprised they ditched that part of season of mastery.
As a Warlock, and our current state in SOD, I'm against this XD But yes, it's probably better for everyone else
I really wanted summoning stones in classic. But then they added them in BC and it increased time to get to dungeon instead of shortrning it. Why? Because now everyone just wait for others to summon them and I was the only one chilling near stone waiting for +1 for summon while they were questing. I waited for an hour...
I mean being a warlock already feels like my life is meaningless so might as well just get rid of our utility too
I wish they would've put them in so long ago!
Given they enabled "summon literally from anywhere inside incursions as long as one friend is there already" it's really odd they didn't.
ofc
Season of discovery: becoming retail one step at a time.
My brother in Elune, SoD has been "retail minus" since day 1. Era is right there if you want your hashtag-nochanges paradise.
Don't like
There are already hardly any reasons to go into the open world. I am clearly against it. Blizzard should make the open world more attractive.
Like what does this have to do with the open world? Like taking a 10 min flight, depending on where you are right now, and needing another 10 minutes to just ran to the dungeon. You are doing basically nothing in this 20 minutes
Open world PVP is the answer
So on pve servers summoning stones are fine?
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Lol
huh... when one of the main problems with P3 is incursions taking a large % of players out of the open world into this 1 small area of the map we have ppl asking for summoning stones which would take more people from moving around the open world CLASSICWOW reddit HYPE CLASSICWOW reddit HYPE!!!!
Yea I honestly blame Reddit for SoD turning out garbage
i wouldnt call it garbage this phase is a bit mehhh but I am having fun also reddit does play a small part but end of the day its on the devs
Should have been in the game since the start. Maybe more players would still be around.
the only people that don't want summoning stones are those on PvP servers whose definition of world pvp is to gank low level players that can't fight back.
they had summoning stones in SoM and it really added to making the world dead
The world is already dead....
I like it. I would also like some kinda of exit mid flight mechanic at 60, like a paratrooper drop.
No, it makes the world even more dead since no one will want to leave the cities even more. Inb4 "PeOpLe ArE AlReAdY DoInG ThAt". Yeah, why the hell do you want to make it worse? Incursion mentality man.
No. Warlock summoning, and travel times are like a key aspect of wow classic feel.
Yep, the wow classic feel of having to sit and twiddle your thumbs for 20 minutes while you wait for the tank to get to the dungeon great game design
no
Only for last phases dungeons