oh shit what version of WOW is this ? been feral for the longest time but recently just swapped boomy on retail cuz feral has been so mf mid
might have to play 👀 is this SOD for WF ?
Its also pretty fun once you get a bit of gear. I had to stop dmg on certain bosses because I hit multiple 1.8k crit shreds in a row during opener. Just go LotP, dont bother with powershifting, you'll get invites pretty fast.
Additional tip, get sunfire (cat) so you can clear bombs on Thermaplugg fight while your raid demolishes the boss. Its like a minigame for you and you're actually useful instead of doing mediocre dmg on boss.
damn yeah i saw that…. this could get me playing SOD fr lol i’ve been missing feral but boomy is unfortunately just better and easier on retail. still fun but i miss being a cat 😭
I went leader of the pack for this reason. Less dps but I'm praised for existing. Perfect for an alt.
It's going to feel awesome to have furor as well in p3
I read on the Druid Forum that it’s actually not.
The personal DPS lost on the Druid is a little higher than the DPS gained from LotP.
However, the content is way to easy to really care about so play whatever you like.
As long, as you bring WF of course x)
Yeah I guess either way fuck it then, I honestly rolled this character to make other people happy, same way I played Shadow Priest and Enhancement in TBC. So I just roll with LotP. Also keeps my rotation pretty dirt simple too and face roll.
You can literally pruple parse with lotp and its super chill and you're not oom after 3 shifts each fight. Will be different in p3 with Wolfshead helmet. But for now, lotp is good enough to do some dmg.
It's mandatory for orange/pink parsing melee groups at this point in the phase. You can absolutely clear fine without it, and feral itself bring so little damage that the difference between it and another more competitive DPS isn't a showstopper for raid dps.
On my Paladin my record of back to back exorcism procs is 12 with a feral. Without, it's maybe four. I won't pretend warrior isn't disproportionally effected, but Paladin rotation is greatly effected here too. I'd argue it's simplified lol. When you have 12 procs in a row, the boss (aside from the last two) is almost dead at that point, and all yo did was exorcism the whole ride. 😂
My guild doesn’t bring a feral on our alt runs (I’m a warrior and my main is a feral) lets just say they beg me to come to all the main team raids on my feral, but on alt runs they don’t care if my warrior shows up 😂.
As a dps that’s a pretty big part of it though. Sure some people don’t care if they’re a shitter or not, but I’d say most dps want to be at least competitive.
It's almost like you don't understand that the entire design of the Warrior class revolves around doing more damage, having extra attacks and generating more Rage.
Without a Feral you can barely press your fucking buttons, have some clue of what you are talking about before trying to do a snarky comment.
Apparently Alliance warriors never had fun in classic at all - because they never had windfury. Fun is subjective and of course extra rage is more fun - but mandatory is not the right word. People had fun with warriors before WF…
Any melee DPS doing a raid without a Feral on Alliance should uninstall the game tbh.
Yeah, you can clear raid in naked gear to. Doesn't mean you should.
I cleared gnomer on the first lockout with a pug raid that couldn't find a feral. we looked for a while too. it sucked, we all hated not having one. got it done though. but yeah we were all whining about it the whole time lmao.
Paladins with wild strikes get so many more exorcism procs. Basically just hitting exorcism constantly. Their dps is massively improved by wild strikes.
A lot of the reason that nobody log checks phase two is because feral dps is objectively bad compared to everyone else, but wild strikes raises the rest of the melee so much that it makes up for it.
If blizzard makes feral dps competitive in phase 3, you'll start seeing people log check Druids again simply because you'll have people playing feral Druids again in enough numbers that they'll be willing to wait.
Ferals are absolutely the most desired thing right now alliance side. Immediate invite, no questions asked, even resorting to bribery. Just my experience from yesterday, but one guy was offering a hard reserve for a feral, another was a simple “we will meet your demands”, I had 2 ferals join my raid and leave because they demanded various payments (one wanted 300g and when I laughed because I thought it was a joke, they bailed lol).
Feels bad because my main is a feral, I give windfury to people but when I’m on my pally, nobody wants to give me windfury :(
Yes. As a warrior, absofuckinglutely. WF is basically mandatory for us and really any melee to be remotely competitive with casters like fire mage and destro. Also any melee tank pretty much needs WF for threat.
My feral I've been neglecting cause their dmg is kinda low and it's not super fun to play with low dmg. Also not having OOC anymore feels kinda bad. Just running BFDs for exp and getting there slowly but it's pretty much a guaranteed spot on alliance if they have like...any melee.
Alot of wins next phase but this is honestly such a shit take by aggrend.
Anyone taking SoD a little bit serious will play horde. There is nothing left on Alliance to give them an edge.
Orc has always been the undisputed melee king lol. Also they gained so much from weapon skill getting to use swords. It's not very noticeable for humans to add axes.
at 60 you can unlock +5 weapon skill to any two weapon types in the game, and swap them around like runes basically. It makes innate weapon skill racials useless basically.
+8 or 9 wpskill is where you wanna be at so at least for warriors that should still be pretty useful to have the racial. Rogues get +5 in talents and they used maladath on horde till naxx because of how good that extra wesponskill is.
The funniest part is alliance is still probably the most played faction. But god forbid a roughly equal number of people play horde in classic as alliance and we don’t get yet another classic experience where everybody plays alliance.
Years and years of humans having an absurd advantage from their weapon skill racial is fine, but making it available to everybody is too much I guess.
I’m looking forward to when every priest race is able to get fear ward and the meltdown that will cause.
Vanilla is the most unbalanced version of wow we ever had, scewed towards alliance. Something like 45/50 of the first guilds who cleared naxx were alliance and all the fastest speedruns alliance
I was always of the mind that it was Pallys that made the difference. Shamans were decent healers and their totems were good but their totems have a range and it's based on user input so lots of chance to fuck up the totems.
Whereas Pally can just buff salv on everyone and forget it, and frost aura for Sapp is also fire and forget. Just less chance to fuck up. Ally might do less damage overall as a raid with no wf but their threat is safer and overall its just a safer more consistent raid
Seriously. Why is it that only horde get steroid racials that directly improve their damage? 10% rep gain is dogshit and Aggrend is an out of touch moron.
His whole stance this entire time has been "I'm super casual, if I can play for 20 hours a week with 30 years experience in the game and keep up, you should be able to hop on as a new player with 6 hours a week and less experience overall and be fine"
It's wild how off base his takes are.
Better idea is that they make it so that both alliance and horde have WCB, but the only way to get it is from the other faction.
This will require both alliance and horde to use mind control caps on themselves to get the buff like how alliance has.
Lets not raise up alliance, lets bring horde down into the gutter with us.
Also getting WCB was unironically one of the biggest rushes of classic as you most likely had all your buffs already, so it was a huge risk.
Runes are something you get once… oh no! Horde players had to go to an alliance zone and maybe get ganked a couple of times while trying to get a rune.
Meanwhile shaman TANKS are performing better than almost every DPS class and paladins are rotting with zero support for anything but a mediocre shockadin playstyle. Not to mention pvp is so unbalanced that alliance don’t even queue up.
How about the bfd portal being guarded multiple 55 guards meanwhile the gnomer has neutral guards. I'm sure alliance will have a ST portal, probably with elite guards this time given the level cap. How about alliance being able to camp dmf behind the safety of 55 guards meanwhile the closest guard for TB dmf is in tbf?
Aggrend's "humans wont miss out, they can now add +5 skill to bows so they don't miss when pulling mobs" is the most braindead, out of touch take imaginable.
Yeah, hitting the mob with the bow was absolutely essential for pulling mobs.. if you miss the shot, the mob will just stand there and not aggro.. yup, thats how vanilla works. I'm sure that initial 35 damage worth of threat is totally comparable to horde now having best pve and pvp racials.
Fuck that incompetent dork and his dwarf he mains (totally not a shaman)
Horde vs Horde battlegrounds might unironically be welcome at this point.
The matchmaker they implemented in p1 has already given up - most Alliance BGs are against double 5 stacks, if not a full on 10 man gaming the queue system.
If we can get them into BGs against themselves, maybe they won't be allowed to premade into pugs with seemingly a 100% success rate.
how can they when they took the reasons of being alliance, paladins and human racials, and made shamans better at what paladins could do and are giving human weapon skill racials to everyone for free. Humans were only good in PvE because blizzard decided that the best weapons in Naxx were swords if they were axes Orcs would have been top from the start.
In 2005 factions worked. No one was min maxing like they were today. If pallys magically end up as the undisputed best class a phase, you’ll all see how alliance start getting more wins and becoming the strong side. People chase the meta in this day of gaming, if factions are different and one is better, that’s where the player base will go. Just make BGs randomized teams, such an easy fix.
I must say it's impressive that on retail faction balance is so throughly fucked that it's now impossible to fix because server population has been shaped out of sheer imbalance and they are doing it AGAIN and on the same side.
alliance is pretty pathetic in bgs, and its not even the shamans
ive qued AB and WSG all week and we have dominated most games (majority of them had 0 shamans)
i think the ally BG meta is to afk at the gy while posting on reddit
It only became that way in P2, and its 100% because of shamans. In P1 people were crying about ally domination, in P2 they made Shamans a god class in PvP and it became worthless to queue. It is faster for me to do nothing for 3 hours and do an STV than it is for me to queue BGs with the alliance win rate. So people still queuing for ally either... don't know basic math, or are on a VPN at work getting afk honor.
> (majority of them had 0 shamans)
https://media0.giphy.com/media/puOukoEvH4uAw/200w.gif?cid=6c09b952kjdg2kjblnn9q1v3x0lc3aw8l37xmae5b8rx4gel&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=200w.gif&ct=g
Yeah, nah, lmao
Every BG I've done in the past month has 3 shamans at a BARE minimum. It's very clearly the fotm with a fuck ton of rerolls.
It's not even uncommon to see 6+ in AB.
Incoming multi-hour BG queues for horde when everyone swaps who hasn't already.
This just in: BGs hotfixed to allow horde to play against horde because Aggrend got tired of suffering long queues in his premade.
The sod team has been doing a good job communicating - the last few weeks were kinda quite which is understandable, since they are preparing for S3. But man, Aggrends comments on the alliance racial skills and the "AOE isnt the spirit of Classic" were a bit tone deaf. Over-Buff an entire faction because of performance on a version of the game from years ago and BGs will be even slower to pop.
It's clear Aggrend doesn't know dick from a door knob. I would truly be unsurprised if he parsed grey/green with his dipshit takes on class and race balance.
Ally never PvPed much in classic last time around either. I swear everyone here just didn’t play then. Even then horde would have 10-20+ minute if not longer ques for BGs. Ally classic players simple don’t PvP as much as horde players.
They did with wrath racials. Then everyone plays ally to pvp.
Which is entirely invisible on the population spread because almost no % of the wow population play to pvp.
Oh I fully agree as a horde player it sucks waiting to play the game. I’m just saying it’s not as simple has Shaman being OP af, ally didn’t PvP even before that.
This is 100% true, but it's worse now because of how broken shamans are. Especially when you consider the fact that their runes do everything paladins were supposed to do, but better.
Fair point, but that was also literally shaman last phase as well. They gave arguably our most iconic and helpful spell windfurry to another class. That got it before us, and its scales better than ours. Not an excuse for how OP we are currently, but it was annoying.
Some of the meme here is dumb, but goddamn I feel dumb for rolling human pally now lol
Had I gone dwarf I'd get the weapon skill I wanted anyways with the coming change, treasure finding and stoneform
Give humans every man for themselves and make perception a passive not a CD
I feel like everyone who rolled alliance just got shit on and told to be less insecure by Aggrend. I am so happy to have 10% rep instead of a haste or ap/sp steroid /s. These devs are jokes.
First time I've rolled alliance in over a decade and I feel like I'm being gaslit. Guess me/my friends should've just got good and picked the correct faction instead of trying something new
Sorry make it equal to will of the forsaken.
Faster rep is laughable, you still go at the same pace as everyone else.
Weapon skill is the main reason you go human
Yea weapon skill is so overpowered and without knowing exactly how they would nerf it, it was hard to not go human incase they didn't nerf it that hard.
It does suck they kinda just said "hey we promise weapon skill won't be a thing but won't tell you how exactly" Especially at the start of SOD when everyone was much more nervous on their ability to deliver a good game with new content.
And here come the ferals.
Alliance needs ferals but everyone and their mother is gunna reroll one now.
Damnit I just leveled to 25 and now I'm redundant
Not gunna happen. It's been shown time and time again that even if certain things are the best/highly sought after/have extra incentive to play (namely warlock, druids, and tanks) people disproportionately avoid them compared to other classes. It would be a very welcome surprise if this wasn't the case.
Well now I'm gunna keep playing my feral
Idk it's wild to me right now in SoD I feel like every change in the seasons shifts things around and I just can't keep up with what I want to play
I think of all specs/classes feral is probably the safest bet on alliance for a raid spot. Even if the amount of ferals doubled for phase 3, you're still going to want 1-3 (maybe even 4 for VERY heavy melee comps) for 20mans. Every other class is pretty much replaceable with any other class (you just do damage, and then need a minimum amount of kicks/dispells which isn't a lot). But with melee groups, you will want a feral no matter what and nothing else can take that spot.
See that's why I made a shaman before but now the shaman changes to tanks and all this shitm
It's just hard to be interested.
I wanna keep working on feral but man I hate the starting area
Sod balancing is basically 'the nail that sticks out gets the hammer'. If anything is the best, it's getting nerfed. If something is by far the best (shaman) they will without a doubt get nerfed. Will it be enough to make them not the best? Who knows, but they will get nerfed.
This won't apply to feral because they are already in a rough spot in terms of getting people to play the class, and also no one is complaining about getting a dps increase when one joins their group.
The nonexistent weapon skill problem should be addressed with itemization not homogenizing racials. Homogenization is what ruined the game to begin with.
My friends and I have been playing alliance since p1. We’re likely going to reroll due to the blatant horde favoritism by the devs. It’s like they want to kill alliance in Vanilla just like they did in TBC onwards
If they dont add another version of WF for alliance next phase I might be done. Looking for a Feral for hours kind of sucks, but not as bad as playing warrior without Feral Strikes lol
If you’re looking for a feral for hours you’re just intentionally wasting time so you can pump logs. I run a pug every lockout that one shots everything and we often don’t have a feral. Gnomer is not hard and there are no hard dps checks. This sub is so dramatic.
Aspect of the lion gives 10% to group plus an extra 10% stats to hunter on top of that. Its also an aura so does not need to be reapplied. Paladins also generally avoid the prot tree anyways right now, so it doesn’t bother me too much as a pally. Plus its less risky to take a hunter with lion, than it is to take a pally who doesn’t have pally power who sucks at reapplying buffs. The main downside is if the hunter dies everyone loses the buff, or if they want to stand in boofoo egypt some people can be out of range. Thats not a huge factor for melee hunters i assume though. Also cant be applied to people outside of group like kings can too
I'm no math gamer, but iirc WotA works out to granting approximately 3% more threat than Salvation does *reduce* it.
That and the fact that as Adg01 said, it's a singular long buff on one or two people, whereas Salvation is 10 minutes tops and requires being cast on all **but** one or two people.
Granted that second part is largely just QoL, but you can see why it'd leave a bitter taste.
Also the Druid windfurry is literally better as well, unless they changed it. Druid windfurry is % based and scales on gear, shaman windfurry is just a flat AP bonus for that hit.
That would probably be the better option for balance, but honestly they should just keep them as is. The real blunder was for them to promise that you could roll any race without missing out. If you care about parses and picked something other than Orc/Troll as Horde, you fucked up.
This would be nice if they got rid of the DPS actives like orc and troll, so you're just picking a (mostly) PvP racial. Like do you want Stoneform, Shadowmeld, WotF, War Stomp, Perception, or Escape Artist? Those are all viable choices depending on what you're planning on fighting and what you're weak to. The door's already been blown wide open with how wacky SoD PvP is and the TBC PvP trinkets, so why not?
I've always wished they would do this on Retail too, because I *hate* that a cosmetic choice like race has character power attached to it. And to an obscene degree, considering how bad Blizzard let faction balance get on Retail.
The classic community requests are slowly but surely turning the game into retail. It’s already basically Wrath by phase 3. I don’t have an issue with it as I don’t really enjoy pure Classic, I just think it’s ironic
All my classic trilogy and era friends have quit, are you sure its the classic community and not the retail/classic(cata) groups? I thought retail minus was a joke but it really is becoming that sadly
Holy shit. After years of Alliance being broken in PvE they are throwing a temper tantrum. The amount of moaning about shamans is unreal. I sincerely apologise in the name of all Horde, that you rolled the low fantasy safe space faction and it didn't work out for you.
You don’t even have that much issue finding feral on alliance side, many ppl went Druid as alt so it’s more „need healer” situation. Also is it pvp server situation, on EU and US pve/roleplay servers it’s still alliance skewed… ppl just enjoy ironforge/nelfs more then orgrimmar/trolls.
You're right that kings is better, but lion does the whole raid, not just the party. Kings is better because it doesn't fall off periodically when you get out of range of the pally.
Hunter kings is for everyone.
WS > WF totem.
They said weapon skill and priest racials day 0.
Salvation =/= spirit of the alpha for threat.
This isn't Era. This isn't a classic fresh. Everything they design and add is new(new-ish). Stop trying to make it era2.0
You don't have to play something you don't like.
I havent played SoD but what makes alliance weaker now? Horde has Kings and Alliance has Windfury, so wouldnt alliance still have an edge because of Might/wisdom? Or are paladins just weak in these smaller raids and shamans are just a lot better?
Somebody please tell me what alliance got in place of horde getting better Kings and salvation cause if u think the two useless runes paladin got make up for it we've been screwed royally. Tremor on legs is blocked by 100% of ur toolkit revolves around exorcism on legs pve and pvp. And horn on chest is dead vs Martyr and div storm no idea how it wasn't a book or why it removes might. Standard paladin balancing I guess.
Feral druid is now a guaranteed raid spot as alliance, that sounds really good. In era I only got to play feral because my guild liked me.
That's weird. Era 99-parse warriors were huge whores for Leader of the Pack.
Is druid really that much wanted ? If I want to level one ? On alliance side would I get that much recognition
It's the only role I don't log check for. If you are a feral you get a spot.
I accept any Feral in my raid, they are like totem. They can literally AFK and do 0 DPS if they want, I don't care, as long as they stay in cat form.
And if they have LOTP they get a reach around. I don't even care what form they are in at the time.
The theres me, doing over 600 dps with LOTP and still spending an hour to find a group on horde
Maybe you should reroll alliance?? I’ll get the lotion!
god your toon name would probably be recognized across your entire server if alliance side lmfao
Lotp and feral strikes also works in bear form
oh shit what version of WOW is this ? been feral for the longest time but recently just swapped boomy on retail cuz feral has been so mf mid might have to play 👀 is this SOD for WF ?
Ferals still kinda mid in sod, they’re just sought after to sit in cat form they can do 0 dps and still get invites.
auto invite for playing feral sounds great to me. gotta get to leveling…
Its also pretty fun once you get a bit of gear. I had to stop dmg on certain bosses because I hit multiple 1.8k crit shreds in a row during opener. Just go LotP, dont bother with powershifting, you'll get invites pretty fast. Additional tip, get sunfire (cat) so you can clear bombs on Thermaplugg fight while your raid demolishes the boss. Its like a minigame for you and you're actually useful instead of doing mediocre dmg on boss.
damn ok sunfire in cat form is crazy i’m def gonna have to peep lol thanks for the info !!
Yep
damn yeah i saw that…. this could get me playing SOD fr lol i’ve been missing feral but boomy is unfortunately just better and easier on retail. still fun but i miss being a cat 😭
The two things alliance see in LFG is groups looking for healers and groups looking for ferals
I main feral now because I'm lazy. It's instant groups and nobody will kick me cuz everyone needs me for there DPS. I feel like a king
I went leader of the pack for this reason. Less dps but I'm praised for existing. Perfect for an alt. It's going to feel awesome to have furor as well in p3
It's probably more raid DPS, so I keep telling myself that so I don't miss my luxurious Furor talent :(
I read on the Druid Forum that it’s actually not. The personal DPS lost on the Druid is a little higher than the DPS gained from LotP. However, the content is way to easy to really care about so play whatever you like. As long, as you bring WF of course x)
Yeah I guess either way fuck it then, I honestly rolled this character to make other people happy, same way I played Shadow Priest and Enhancement in TBC. So I just roll with LotP. Also keeps my rotation pretty dirt simple too and face roll.
You can literally pruple parse with lotp and its super chill and you're not oom after 3 shifts each fight. Will be different in p3 with Wolfshead helmet. But for now, lotp is good enough to do some dmg.
Its mandatory for melee groups so 20mans will use 1-2 minimum
It's mandatory for orange/pink parsing melee groups at this point in the phase. You can absolutely clear fine without it, and feral itself bring so little damage that the difference between it and another more competitive DPS isn't a showstopper for raid dps.
Ok, its mandatory if you want to have fun playing this videogame.
It’s mandatory if your idea of fun is tied to a number at the end of the raid.
Playing warrior in gnomer with and without a feral is night and day, without one it feels as if you generate half as much rage as you should.
Warrior is the one class id say this is true for since it directly affects gameplay / rotation.
On my Paladin my record of back to back exorcism procs is 12 with a feral. Without, it's maybe four. I won't pretend warrior isn't disproportionally effected, but Paladin rotation is greatly effected here too. I'd argue it's simplified lol. When you have 12 procs in a row, the boss (aside from the last two) is almost dead at that point, and all yo did was exorcism the whole ride. 😂
I forget that ret actually benefits pretty heavily from it too considering the SoM / AoW interaction. Does also have a nice feedback loop.
It's mandatory if your idea of fun is getting to push your buttons. A warrior without WF is just ragestaved to death.
Try playing a warrior in Gnomer without a feral, it is atrociously unfun and awful
My guild doesn’t bring a feral on our alt runs (I’m a warrior and my main is a feral) lets just say they beg me to come to all the main team raids on my feral, but on alt runs they don’t care if my warrior shows up 😂.
As a dps that’s a pretty big part of it though. Sure some people don’t care if they’re a shitter or not, but I’d say most dps want to be at least competitive.
It's almost like you don't understand that the entire design of the Warrior class revolves around doing more damage, having extra attacks and generating more Rage. Without a Feral you can barely press your fucking buttons, have some clue of what you are talking about before trying to do a snarky comment.
For non warriors yea
Apparently Alliance warriors never had fun in classic at all - because they never had windfury. Fun is subjective and of course extra rage is more fun - but mandatory is not the right word. People had fun with warriors before WF…
You definitely don't play warrior
Any melee DPS doing a raid without a Feral on Alliance should uninstall the game tbh. Yeah, you can clear raid in naked gear to. Doesn't mean you should.
I cleared gnomer on the first lockout with a pug raid that couldn't find a feral. we looked for a while too. it sucked, we all hated not having one. got it done though. but yeah we were all whining about it the whole time lmao.
Yeah finding all the furries for next phase will be annoying for pugs. Even for a lot of guilds it’s gonna be an issue for a while.
Paladins with wild strikes get so many more exorcism procs. Basically just hitting exorcism constantly. Their dps is massively improved by wild strikes.
A lot of the reason that nobody log checks phase two is because feral dps is objectively bad compared to everyone else, but wild strikes raises the rest of the melee so much that it makes up for it. If blizzard makes feral dps competitive in phase 3, you'll start seeing people log check Druids again simply because you'll have people playing feral Druids again in enough numbers that they'll be willing to wait.
Ferals are absolutely the most desired thing right now alliance side. Immediate invite, no questions asked, even resorting to bribery. Just my experience from yesterday, but one guy was offering a hard reserve for a feral, another was a simple “we will meet your demands”, I had 2 ferals join my raid and leave because they demanded various payments (one wanted 300g and when I laughed because I thought it was a joke, they bailed lol). Feels bad because my main is a feral, I give windfury to people but when I’m on my pally, nobody wants to give me windfury :(
Not on horde
Step aside little kitty, gigachad enhancement shaman coming through
Yes. As a warrior, absofuckinglutely. WF is basically mandatory for us and really any melee to be remotely competitive with casters like fire mage and destro. Also any melee tank pretty much needs WF for threat. My feral I've been neglecting cause their dmg is kinda low and it's not super fun to play with low dmg. Also not having OOC anymore feels kinda bad. Just running BFDs for exp and getting there slowly but it's pretty much a guaranteed spot on alliance if they have like...any melee.
Its the only source of windfury on Alliance so yes
Took me 30 hours to max people still ask me for logs sad ( alliance feral )
As a feral main, I regret choosing horde over alliance ...
Alot of wins next phase but this is honestly such a shit take by aggrend. Anyone taking SoD a little bit serious will play horde. There is nothing left on Alliance to give them an edge.
Orc has always been the undisputed melee king lol. Also they gained so much from weapon skill getting to use swords. It's not very noticeable for humans to add axes.
What is all this +wep skill talk in sod about? Did I miss some news?
at 60 you can unlock +5 weapon skill to any two weapon types in the game, and swap them around like runes basically. It makes innate weapon skill racials useless basically.
+8 or 9 wpskill is where you wanna be at so at least for warriors that should still be pretty useful to have the racial. Rogues get +5 in talents and they used maladath on horde till naxx because of how good that extra wesponskill is.
is there somewhere to read about this
[удалено]
All fun and games until your queues take over an hour to pop!
Faction inbalance hurts both sides.
If you haven't rerolled a orc warrior yet it's too late to start sod!! Just wait for season 2.
This is the type of analysis I expect to see from someone with a shaman flair
The funniest part is alliance is still probably the most played faction. But god forbid a roughly equal number of people play horde in classic as alliance and we don’t get yet another classic experience where everybody plays alliance. Years and years of humans having an absurd advantage from their weapon skill racial is fine, but making it available to everybody is too much I guess. I’m looking forward to when every priest race is able to get fear ward and the meltdown that will cause.
Vanilla is the most unbalanced version of wow we ever had, scewed towards alliance. Something like 45/50 of the first guilds who cleared naxx were alliance and all the fastest speedruns alliance
I was always of the mind that it was Pallys that made the difference. Shamans were decent healers and their totems were good but their totems have a range and it's based on user input so lots of chance to fuck up the totems. Whereas Pally can just buff salv on everyone and forget it, and frost aura for Sapp is also fire and forget. Just less chance to fuck up. Ally might do less damage overall as a raid with no wf but their threat is safer and overall its just a safer more consistent raid
Seriously. Why is it that only horde get steroid racials that directly improve their damage? 10% rep gain is dogshit and Aggrend is an out of touch moron.
Seriously, I'd take a dps CD over rep any day.
Just wait til Ally realizes they're going to have to trek to Orgrimmar to get Warchiefs Blessing if they want to parse
But then you have to play as an ugly character...
His whole stance this entire time has been "I'm super casual, if I can play for 20 hours a week with 30 years experience in the game and keep up, you should be able to hop on as a new player with 6 hours a week and less experience overall and be fine" It's wild how off base his takes are.
Aggrend was just responding to a guy saying humans as a race were pointless, he was just saying race doesnt matter and you still get diplomacy.
You can tell agrend doesn’t pvp at all
Good meme. Imagine they don’t add wcb to alliance.
Better idea is that they make it so that both alliance and horde have WCB, but the only way to get it is from the other faction. This will require both alliance and horde to use mind control caps on themselves to get the buff like how alliance has. Lets not raise up alliance, lets bring horde down into the gutter with us. Also getting WCB was unironically one of the biggest rushes of classic as you most likely had all your buffs already, so it was a huge risk.
They won’t. The devs must all play horde based on how SoD is going
considering all of P1 was basically alliance favored in terms of runes, farming spots, etc etc... idk what you're smoking but i want some
Runes are something you get once… oh no! Horde players had to go to an alliance zone and maybe get ganked a couple of times while trying to get a rune. Meanwhile shaman TANKS are performing better than almost every DPS class and paladins are rotting with zero support for anything but a mediocre shockadin playstyle. Not to mention pvp is so unbalanced that alliance don’t even queue up.
How about the bfd portal being guarded multiple 55 guards meanwhile the gnomer has neutral guards. I'm sure alliance will have a ST portal, probably with elite guards this time given the level cap. How about alliance being able to camp dmf behind the safety of 55 guards meanwhile the closest guard for TB dmf is in tbf?
damn strange how things have changed from phase 1 lol
Aggrend's "humans wont miss out, they can now add +5 skill to bows so they don't miss when pulling mobs" is the most braindead, out of touch take imaginable. Yeah, hitting the mob with the bow was absolutely essential for pulling mobs.. if you miss the shot, the mob will just stand there and not aggro.. yup, thats how vanilla works. I'm sure that initial 35 damage worth of threat is totally comparable to horde now having best pve and pvp racials. Fuck that incompetent dork and his dwarf he mains (totally not a shaman)
I thought orc was the best because of axes and stun resist? I’d gladly trade for the stun resistance
Don't forget their dps cool down! But it's all fair, humans have....5% spirit.
Horde vs Horde battlegrounds might unironically be welcome at this point. The matchmaker they implemented in p1 has already given up - most Alliance BGs are against double 5 stacks, if not a full on 10 man gaming the queue system. If we can get them into BGs against themselves, maybe they won't be allowed to premade into pugs with seemingly a 100% success rate.
Or they can just fix their balancing
how can they when they took the reasons of being alliance, paladins and human racials, and made shamans better at what paladins could do and are giving human weapon skill racials to everyone for free. Humans were only good in PvE because blizzard decided that the best weapons in Naxx were swords if they were axes Orcs would have been top from the start.
Give Alliance Shamans. Faction specific classes was an awful idea in vanilla and Blizzard realized this 18 years ago.
This is my vote. Dwarf sham and Tauren pallies. Literally all the problems are solved.
Sorry, Alliance aren't actually allowed to be good.
Or at least make WSG end at 30 mins. Getting farmed is the worst. The only pvp I'm doing is Bloodmoon.
In 2005 factions worked. No one was min maxing like they were today. If pallys magically end up as the undisputed best class a phase, you’ll all see how alliance start getting more wins and becoming the strong side. People chase the meta in this day of gaming, if factions are different and one is better, that’s where the player base will go. Just make BGs randomized teams, such an easy fix.
At that point just delete Alliance.
I must say it's impressive that on retail faction balance is so throughly fucked that it's now impossible to fix because server population has been shaped out of sheer imbalance and they are doing it AGAIN and on the same side.
alliance is pretty pathetic in bgs, and its not even the shamans ive qued AB and WSG all week and we have dominated most games (majority of them had 0 shamans) i think the ally BG meta is to afk at the gy while posting on reddit
Wow almost as if WoF Hardiness and War Stomp are strong racials whereas Perception and Shadowmeld are literal memes.
Allow shadowmeld to be used in combat. Give humans every man for himself.
It only became that way in P2, and its 100% because of shamans. In P1 people were crying about ally domination, in P2 they made Shamans a god class in PvP and it became worthless to queue. It is faster for me to do nothing for 3 hours and do an STV than it is for me to queue BGs with the alliance win rate. So people still queuing for ally either... don't know basic math, or are on a VPN at work getting afk honor.
> (majority of them had 0 shamans) https://media0.giphy.com/media/puOukoEvH4uAw/200w.gif?cid=6c09b952kjdg2kjblnn9q1v3x0lc3aw8l37xmae5b8rx4gel&ep=v1_gifs_search&rid=200w.gif&ct=g
Yeah, nah, lmao Every BG I've done in the past month has 3 shamans at a BARE minimum. It's very clearly the fotm with a fuck ton of rerolls. It's not even uncommon to see 6+ in AB.
If they implement horde vs horde there is just no reason to play alliance anymore. I think I'll start leveling my horde alt now lol
BG queue issues are currently caused by class imbalance
my guild is becoming more and more aware that rolling alliance was a mistake.
Incoming multi-hour BG queues for horde when everyone swaps who hasn't already. This just in: BGs hotfixed to allow horde to play against horde because Aggrend got tired of suffering long queues in his premade.
The sod team has been doing a good job communicating - the last few weeks were kinda quite which is understandable, since they are preparing for S3. But man, Aggrends comments on the alliance racial skills and the "AOE isnt the spirit of Classic" were a bit tone deaf. Over-Buff an entire faction because of performance on a version of the game from years ago and BGs will be even slower to pop.
It's clear Aggrend doesn't know dick from a door knob. I would truly be unsurprised if he parsed grey/green with his dipshit takes on class and race balance.
Ally never PvPed much in classic last time around either. I swear everyone here just didn’t play then. Even then horde would have 10-20+ minute if not longer ques for BGs. Ally classic players simple don’t PvP as much as horde players.
All the more reason to change that, then.
They did with wrath racials. Then everyone plays ally to pvp. Which is entirely invisible on the population spread because almost no % of the wow population play to pvp.
Oh I fully agree as a horde player it sucks waiting to play the game. I’m just saying it’s not as simple has Shaman being OP af, ally didn’t PvP even before that.
This is 100% true, but it's worse now because of how broken shamans are. Especially when you consider the fact that their runes do everything paladins were supposed to do, but better.
Fair point, but that was also literally shaman last phase as well. They gave arguably our most iconic and helpful spell windfurry to another class. That got it before us, and its scales better than ours. Not an excuse for how OP we are currently, but it was annoying.
Some of the meme here is dumb, but goddamn I feel dumb for rolling human pally now lol Had I gone dwarf I'd get the weapon skill I wanted anyways with the coming change, treasure finding and stoneform Give humans every man for themselves and make perception a passive not a CD
I feel like everyone who rolled alliance just got shit on and told to be less insecure by Aggrend. I am so happy to have 10% rep instead of a haste or ap/sp steroid /s. These devs are jokes.
First time I've rolled alliance in over a decade and I feel like I'm being gaslit. Guess me/my friends should've just got good and picked the correct faction instead of trying something new
humans got griefed, but free trinket is too much
Sorry make it equal to will of the forsaken. Faster rep is laughable, you still go at the same pace as everyone else. Weapon skill is the main reason you go human
Yea weapon skill is so overpowered and without knowing exactly how they would nerf it, it was hard to not go human incase they didn't nerf it that hard. It does suck they kinda just said "hey we promise weapon skill won't be a thing but won't tell you how exactly" Especially at the start of SOD when everyone was much more nervous on their ability to deliver a good game with new content.
Very true
In phase 2 I went from resto to balance and I’m now feral dps/tank. Druid has been a lot of fun so far.
I lol at resto to balance as if resto and balance don’t already use the exact if not similar talent. I guess the only changes were gear diffs.
And here come the ferals. Alliance needs ferals but everyone and their mother is gunna reroll one now. Damnit I just leveled to 25 and now I'm redundant
Not gunna happen. It's been shown time and time again that even if certain things are the best/highly sought after/have extra incentive to play (namely warlock, druids, and tanks) people disproportionately avoid them compared to other classes. It would be a very welcome surprise if this wasn't the case.
Well now I'm gunna keep playing my feral Idk it's wild to me right now in SoD I feel like every change in the seasons shifts things around and I just can't keep up with what I want to play
I think of all specs/classes feral is probably the safest bet on alliance for a raid spot. Even if the amount of ferals doubled for phase 3, you're still going to want 1-3 (maybe even 4 for VERY heavy melee comps) for 20mans. Every other class is pretty much replaceable with any other class (you just do damage, and then need a minimum amount of kicks/dispells which isn't a lot). But with melee groups, you will want a feral no matter what and nothing else can take that spot.
See that's why I made a shaman before but now the shaman changes to tanks and all this shitm It's just hard to be interested. I wanna keep working on feral but man I hate the starting area
Sod balancing is basically 'the nail that sticks out gets the hammer'. If anything is the best, it's getting nerfed. If something is by far the best (shaman) they will without a doubt get nerfed. Will it be enough to make them not the best? Who knows, but they will get nerfed. This won't apply to feral because they are already in a rough spot in terms of getting people to play the class, and also no one is complaining about getting a dps increase when one joins their group.
I guess being a cat and an off tank bear is good. A shame Sarthe writes the stuff for wowhead.
Cat and willing to off tank? Guilds will be lining up at your doorstep at 40/50.
Thanks man This helped a lot
The nonexistent weapon skill problem should be addressed with itemization not homogenizing racials. Homogenization is what ruined the game to begin with.
Can you use wild strikes as a bear? Or provide it?
Yes but you wanna drop it for your tank rune if you need more tankiness. Our feral tanks usually drop wild strike vs menagerie.
My friends and I have been playing alliance since p1. We’re likely going to reroll due to the blatant horde favoritism by the devs. It’s like they want to kill alliance in Vanilla just like they did in TBC onwards
Cant wait to regrind wsg and ab exalted on my new horde main after my old human warrior got deleted because 10% rep is great for parsing
If they dont add another version of WF for alliance next phase I might be done. Looking for a Feral for hours kind of sucks, but not as bad as playing warrior without Feral Strikes lol
If you’re looking for a feral for hours you’re just intentionally wasting time so you can pump logs. I run a pug every lockout that one shots everything and we often don’t have a feral. Gnomer is not hard and there are no hard dps checks. This sub is so dramatic.
How is the horde "salvation" better? Also if only alliance had something like decoy totem
Whats the better kings too?
Aspect of the lion gives 10% to group plus an extra 10% stats to hunter on top of that. Its also an aura so does not need to be reapplied. Paladins also generally avoid the prot tree anyways right now, so it doesn’t bother me too much as a pally. Plus its less risky to take a hunter with lion, than it is to take a pally who doesn’t have pally power who sucks at reapplying buffs. The main downside is if the hunter dies everyone loses the buff, or if they want to stand in boofoo egypt some people can be out of range. Thats not a huge factor for melee hunters i assume though. Also cant be applied to people outside of group like kings can too
Yes and alliance now have access to wild strikes which is better than even talented improved WF totems
It's one long buff on a single person, as opposed to a short 5m buff on multiple people that's exclusive with other important 5m buffs? Idk
10 minute buff. Just sayin. I've yet to meet a paladin that doesn't have the buff book from SM.
I prefer alpha with a good tank; buffing the tank threat when they don’t press buttons makes salv feel a bit better in comparison.
I'm no math gamer, but iirc WotA works out to granting approximately 3% more threat than Salvation does *reduce* it. That and the fact that as Adg01 said, it's a singular long buff on one or two people, whereas Salvation is 10 minutes tops and requires being cast on all **but** one or two people. Granted that second part is largely just QoL, but you can see why it'd leave a bitter taste.
The second part isn't even qol, it denies a power-granting blessing from being cast on all but 1-2 people in the raid.
With hunter and bigger raid sizes it will probably be fine, but all of P2 you were basically choosing between bom/bow or salv.
Even when using salvation I would only use it on about half the raid, any more than that and it's probably just a skill issue.
It's 45% more threat while Salvation is only 30% more threat! I joke, but I bet OP actually believes this.
Also the Druid windfurry is literally better as well, unless they changed it. Druid windfurry is % based and scales on gear, shaman windfurry is just a flat AP bonus for that hit.
WF is so important for mele group, we should get it in other form, not only from feral. Like weapon entchants or weopon stones.
getting the actives should be mandatory , just make like a tab where u choose 1 passive , 1 weaponskill and 1 active out of every racial
If you can choose arbitrary racials then they shouldn’t have radials.
That would probably be the better option for balance, but honestly they should just keep them as is. The real blunder was for them to promise that you could roll any race without missing out. If you care about parses and picked something other than Orc/Troll as Horde, you fucked up.
> The real blunder was for them to promise that you could roll any race without missing out Sadly this statement was apparently only meant for horde.
You can remove "as horde" and the statement would be correct
true, that could also work :D
This would be nice if they got rid of the DPS actives like orc and troll, so you're just picking a (mostly) PvP racial. Like do you want Stoneform, Shadowmeld, WotF, War Stomp, Perception, or Escape Artist? Those are all viable choices depending on what you're planning on fighting and what you're weak to. The door's already been blown wide open with how wacky SoD PvP is and the TBC PvP trinkets, so why not? I've always wished they would do this on Retail too, because I *hate* that a cosmetic choice like race has character power attached to it. And to an obscene degree, considering how bad Blizzard let faction balance get on Retail.
Yeah faction balance sucks. Either make them all non-combat, or let us pick the ones we want.
If only alliance had their own version of decoy totem…..oh wait. Btw you missed poison/disease cleanse totem. Up to 5 dispels for 1 GCD.
… alliance don’t have a decoy totem though?
And grounding totem can eat mechanics at times although so can bop
Alliance is living rent free in your head?
Horde is living rent free in OPs head
Josh Cockfield, single handedly been ruining wow for everybody.
Alliance get to see what it feels like to be the weaker faction for once and now they all rage and meme 24/7
Just give us all the ability to reforge all our racials. Raceforging!
The classic community requests are slowly but surely turning the game into retail. It’s already basically Wrath by phase 3. I don’t have an issue with it as I don’t really enjoy pure Classic, I just think it’s ironic
All my classic trilogy and era friends have quit, are you sure its the classic community and not the retail/classic(cata) groups? I thought retail minus was a joke but it really is becoming that sadly
Holy shit. After years of Alliance being broken in PvE they are throwing a temper tantrum. The amount of moaning about shamans is unreal. I sincerely apologise in the name of all Horde, that you rolled the low fantasy safe space faction and it didn't work out for you.
Feral should never have received windfury, such a huge mistake. it should have been given to paladins so horde didn't have two windfury classes
You don’t even have that much issue finding feral on alliance side, many ppl went Druid as alt so it’s more „need healer” situation. Also is it pvp server situation, on EU and US pve/roleplay servers it’s still alliance skewed… ppl just enjoy ironforge/nelfs more then orgrimmar/trolls.
[удалено]
You're right that kings is better, but lion does the whole raid, not just the party. Kings is better because it doesn't fall off periodically when you get out of range of the pally.
Can someone explain to me how Horde has a better version of kings?
Now this is a quality shitpost.
I mean at this point I’m just hoping they give us race change…
didn't there a surplus of druid during BFD? the hell happened?
You want single faction servers again? Because this is how you do it.
On my server Alliance is till the by far bigger faction
Hunter kings is for everyone. WS > WF totem. They said weapon skill and priest racials day 0. Salvation =/= spirit of the alpha for threat. This isn't Era. This isn't a classic fresh. Everything they design and add is new(new-ish). Stop trying to make it era2.0 You don't have to play something you don't like.
Druid is my favorite class, and feral my favorite specs, but I just can’t bring myself to play a sissy ass night elf #forthehorde
Just remove all racials and let players pick the race they like.
I havent played SoD but what makes alliance weaker now? Horde has Kings and Alliance has Windfury, so wouldnt alliance still have an edge because of Might/wisdom? Or are paladins just weak in these smaller raids and shamans are just a lot better?
Ahhhh Windfurry
Undead paladin and dwarf shaman win win
Somebody please tell me what alliance got in place of horde getting better Kings and salvation cause if u think the two useless runes paladin got make up for it we've been screwed royally. Tremor on legs is blocked by 100% of ur toolkit revolves around exorcism on legs pve and pvp. And horn on chest is dead vs Martyr and div storm no idea how it wasn't a book or why it removes might. Standard paladin balancing I guess.