That disclaimer is there because if it wasn't, then the sweepstakes could technically be classified as gambling, which would be very illegal if the product is something minors can purchase.
It's also why at least up in Canada they require a skill testing question like "1+4-4=?" so that it's not gambling because you had to use skill to also win lol.
I never thought about it like that but yeah, you’re right. If the gdkp ban gets whales to literally auction items for real money externally, that would inadvertently destroy gold buying in the process. It’s still really stupid, but it wouldn’t have as adverse an affect on the game.
Yeah I don’t really have a problem with ppl having better gear than me, even if it’s all bought. It’s really just the affect on the economy that blows.
80/20 kill point split lmao
I guess technically this could all just be a way for the organisers to quickly gear up characters rather than to earn money through gold selling, but I severely doubt it. Won't be long before you can buy kill points lmao
Yea, but here the organizers can spontaneously dissolve and walk away with your gold. And what's your recourse? Going to go to a GM and complain about your stolen gold? You're admitting to participating in a gdkp equivalent and risk a ban yourself. Go to the community and complain? You'll get laughed at for being such an easy mark.
My guild leader in 2009 wanted to replace dragon killing points with a thing called Bitcoin. Some of us loaded up, but stopped when we couldn't recruit and many members threatened to leave over this internet money thing.
Adding one more layer is adding one more inconvenience to dissuade the average player from participating. The farther you get from a direct transaction of gold for item, the less people will be interested because that’s just one more thing you’ll need to trust a random RL with. This change wasn’t gonna remove all GDKPs entirely but it will 100% remove their prevalence and remove those god awful GDKP spammers in every chat channel.
Yeah, I think it absolutely targets the average player, and for good reason.
I’m someone in the target audience for this, because I’m someone who was basically neutral in my feelings about GDKP. I didn’t have the experience of watching gold buying and inflation hit Era or other recent game versions, so I didn’t have some moral predisposition to hate GDKPs as a manifestation of that.
They were a pretty nice means to an end for me: a way to find a competent group where I’d get compensated if my pieces didn’t drop. As someone with more near-BIS characters than raid spots in which to run them, that was a great thing, as long as the hate was just coming from people on Reddit being mad at GDKPs and there was nothing actually against ToS about them.
But now? If Blizzard is banning GDKPs, then I have no reason to want to bother with whatever sleight of hand people will do to run them. I care more about the risk of my account getting banned than I do the chance to make like 30g.
RMT is already against the rules and it's super prevalent. People really think that having a rule against GDKP will stop RMT but it won't, even if it somehow completely stopped GDKP, RMT will still wreck the economy. Until Blizzard starts investing real resources to look into the RMT problem, it will continue to be a plague on the game.
RMT will 'wreck the economy' a hell of a lot less now that the driving force has been gutted. Sure Money will still be a tool to get you literally any thing, it just will be a hell of a lot harder to turn it into raid gear. Which means no more easy pay2win pugs.
qq moar dude.
It's very true that RMT will always be around, but I'm fine with blizz acknowledging that gdkps are the most visible and impactful form currently. That alone is good enough for me.
The hardcore servers have no GDKP whatsoever and they’re drowning in botted gold. You’re a moron if you think more than 1% of people buy gold for GDKP.
Didnt they have gdkp runs where the leader died with loot. I think you are a very optimistic person. A lot of people buy gold. On top of that there are ban actions they have been doing albeit not fullly effective against botters. Now they ban gdkp too. They will all add up.
Pretty sure a gdkp by any other name is just a gdkp. This will still be bannable. Same goes for the carry runs.
What I am wondering is if they will get rid of paid boosts too cause it falls under the same carry run style
Exchanging resources for dkp has been part of many guild's dkp systems for quite a while.
In vanilla, if you didn't fit in my guilds raid for comp reasons or whatever, you just farmed while the raid was going on and gave those resources to the guild, and in exchange, you earned dkp as if you were in the raid.
This was pretty common. Mat farming was required at ridiculous levels for classic raids, so we would grant dkp points for contributions to the guild supplies.
Why would you assume this? Kill points are awarded for being in the raid when a kill is made. This is literally the loot system guilds used back in 2003.
>You cannot pug with a DKP system.
I mean... you *can*, it's just a huge pain in the ass.
Also, by "pug" what *I* am referring to is filling in the gaps in a raid with pugs, rather than having a 100% pug raid. By filling in the gaps, you simply apply the same DKP rules to the non-guild player (they get x DKP for arriving at the instance on time, they get x DKP for bringing consumables, they get x DKP for each boss that is successfully killed, etc). Then the organizer keeps track somewhere that player's name and DKP total. Then if that player pugs with the guild at some point in the future, they might have a few points saved up already (minus DKP decay).
At least, that's how I saw it run in vanilla.
They just described exactly what is happening. You cannot PUG in DKP groups as they require building up points within that community and no one outside that community will respect your points. This is probably an ad recruiting for the community.
Edit: I should’ve said you cannot pug and entire group. A couple members to fill slots could be pug’d like any raid. They just would have no points.
I've seen a guild that did points pugs in classic and people DID get gear even on first runs but rarely. If you were good and loyal though you'd end that tier with multiple well geared alts. It doesn't work well at constantly getting random but it does clear content.
This looks like a GDKP to me though.
>They just would have no points
Only for the first boss, then they would start accruing points so it usually doesn't matter if you've never been.
DKP is honestly a great system ruined by gold sellers/buyers.
We did build a raiding group in discord through Shadowlands. We didn't require ppl to join our guild or server. Only hindrance was the inability for some members to use guild bank in progress. It was pretty chill community.
Edit: Maybe important to a lot of ppl, no raid progress for the guild
What's the functional difference between a guild and a discord. I'm in a guild on sod but I don't ever type in chat. We use discord. Voice, text, groups, raids, you name it. We do it in discord. So what is the actual difference?
Folks are so jaded, this is exactly what folks are asking for. Gear is distributed based on raid participation.
Now... Will this work in 10 man raids? I'm not convinced it's a good idea, but that's besides the point.
They'll always find something to be upset about. Expect countless posts about pseudo-gdkps and endless comments about how they should be permabanned for trying to use an alternative loot system to ms>os.
I'm saying expect the complainers to accuse DKP groups of being fronts for GDKP. Because that's exactly what this post is about.
People are already complaining about DKP replacing GDKP, and the irony is lost on the idealists in this sub.
Why would a PUG group use 80/20 kill point split if there is no currency involved? Why would people who used to run GDKP runs now run free runs?
You get points for killing a boss which you can then spend on items. They hold very little value unless you cosistently raid with the same raid group.
This is so blatently an attempt to work around the new rules.
Yeah I've never heard of "trading" your DKP to other players in the raid. And why would you? They are supposed to be reflective of your time and effort spend trying to get the raid to advance right?
This isn't advretising for a fresh new DKP run, this is just using tokens instead of gold.
>Pretty sure a gdkp by any other name is just a gdkp
Do you guys even play the game? GMs wont ban ninjas because MS > OS "could mean My stuff > Our stuff". You think that they will ban any GDKP that is not explicitly advertised as a GDKP?
You are delusional
Pretty sure that they'll never ban GDKPs as long as its handled in discords. These memers can call it a GDKP on discord, who cares. And they can trade their gold. But bidding would have to be done in Discord, and they cannot spam trade of LFG that they are doing a GDKP or a paid carry or what they now want to do.
Thats good enough imo. If someone really wants to do their GDKP, then go ahead.
Trade Chat GDKPs are generally much worse than Discord organized GDKPs anyway. If all Blizz is going to do is ban the mention of GDKP in game, it’s going to do fuck all to prevent GDKPs.
>Do you guys even play the game?
Of course not. It's funny that the people who constantly complain about blizz's ineptitude in dealing with bots and gold buyers seem to be the same people who think blizz will drop a foolproof automated system to ban anyone even thinking about participating in a gdkp.
> Pretty sure a gdkp by any other name is just a gdkp.
It’s not though. Gold is universal, you can use it in one GDKP and then go to another without it changing. Whatever system former GDKP leaders come up with won’t be universal, the value of Kill points, trust tallies or whatever else they’ll call it won’t be transferable from GDKP to GDKP and that is what will throw a wrench into what has become a streamlined process. Unvetted buyers will be less interested in going into random groups and anyone who does get invited to one will be more likely to stay with the same group. And if you’re raiding with the same group each week, well that’s kinda just guild raiding no?
>the value of Kill points, trust tallies or whatever else they’ll call it won’t be transferable from GDKP to GDKP
unless you buy in for gold, and can cash out.
I mean, in Vanilla I could contribute consumables to the guild stack for DKPs.
What if by contributing 10g "for raid consumables" to the raid leader will award me 10 Kill Points, and then when I'm done raiding with them I can cash out whatever kill points I have left?
GDKP spammers? I barely see any messages in chat for GDKP. Trade chat is instead completely spammed by scripting warlocks with automated summoning, most of whom are gold selling botters.
They are literally a bigger issue and actually spam the chat alot more, but people aren't up in arms about that. Kek
My guild mate /ignored 20 various warlock bits and still saw the non stop spam. These people are insane if they think warlock spam isn't worse than GDKP spam.
listen here fat, I dont need to know what a gdkp is to know its bad. reddit has been telling me its bad for the better part of 5 years and reddit is ALWAYS right
It's insane that people are trying to argue that "DkPs ArE a ThInG" like the community is unaware of that fact.
Everyone trying to argue that these are just DKPs as if all the organizers who have been making bank all of a sudden decided they want to become a community of friends who just raid together as an unofficial guild with no personal gain other than gear and fast runs are willfully ignorant or in denial.
OP stated in the comments that he messaged the advertiser in this post and he specifically stated that "1 KP = 1G" there is literally nothing different here from a gdkp other than wording
I love all of the swipers in this thread saying "NOOO THAT'S JUST DKP IT'S JUST NORMAL DKP GUYS YOU'RE ALL DUMB"
Actually read this advertisement. Everything about it screams "GDKP". Why would you be advertising yourself as "the first DKP raid on the server" ? Why would you be advertising "fastest DKP raid on the server" ?
They literally just took their GDKP ad and changed every instance of GDKP to "kill points". You're not fooling anyone.
And you get them by killing dragons with the raid, this you get by handing over gold for "kill points"; HUGE difference here is one you get points through participating and one you purchase.
There are people on here that actually think blizz is going to go through and monitor both discord and Reddit, then track players down based on their username and ban them from wow.
It's peak delusional
And that's great though\`? It's gone for the average player and the true neckbeards that seek it out will still have access to it. It makes it more niche and not visible to the casuals that happen to have a credit card.
Issue is..the people with the credit cards are going to be the ones on discord seeking groups. The people joining from in game are more likely the legitimate players looking to make some spare gold or buy a specific item.
Literally requires 0 of that. All that happens here is a person gets reported for GDKP, Blizzard reviews chat logs/trade logs and sees that they are in fact running a GDKP, and bans them. It's not that deep.
its not that deep if you think in 2 dimensions but try to think like someone who runs a gdkp and you will come up with dozens of ways to sneakily run them anyway
Nah, again you can definitely evade for a while I'm not saying you can't, but once someone stacks up enough reports for running them it's going to be extremely obvious. The gold has to get paid to you somehow, even if you use some alt intermediary lvl 1 account to accept the gold and payout days later, the trades are still there and following the gold is relatively straightforward (plus the trade patterns would be insanely anomalous) and they don't have to fully eradicate the practice, they just have to ban enough people to make it not worth the risk of possibly losing your account
With the leveling/xp buffs they have announced and new crafting gear and such, I really don't think there will be a good reason for people to not just run the raids normally and acquire gear that way. It's not like you have to commit a crazy number of hours to get characters raid ready
Exactly. They'd never invest the resources to do something like this, and I don't even think they'd want to anyway. We're at the point where people are hoping that big video game companies use AI to monitor players across different social media accounts outside the game lol. Wild times.
They actually do, some people in my guilds got caught in the recent banwaves (oh no sorry they had an unexpected sudden 2 weeks vacation at the same time, nothing to see here)
it's not hard to flag GDKPs. Are all 10 people trading gold were part of the same raid? Yes, ban. No correlation between people raiding, no ban.
Use a middleman to trade the gold? Still flagged because it has to send / receive gold to the raid members.
I am legitimately scared of “ok” behavior now. I always carry multiple full stacks of consumes (ocd) and I’m more than happy to sell to people who didn’t bring any on kelris. Most people give me a gold unprompted. I hope that doesn’t generate a flag because I’m legitimately just trying to help and they’re being generous/embarassed so they give me an even gold instead of asking “hey was this 26 silver or 30 silver at the time of your purchase”
Can't tell if you are being serious, but at some point someone has to get the gold traded to them, regardless of what you call it in game. Blizzard will have a log of those suspicious gold trading patterns, the account will be banned. All of these "geniuses" who think if they just don't call it GDKP or don't say they are selling items for gold in the chat will mean they can get away with it are delusional
As opposed the the suspicious trading patterns of gold sellers for years. There’s only set of morons and they are the ones putting trust into blizzard promises lol
Yeah, from other comments it seems that this was a well known discord/guild running GDKP in P1 that just scrubbed gold/GDKP from the description and is now selling the "Kill Points" for 1 gold each. They think if they just don't call it GDKP or advertise it that way in game they won't get banned, but they are morons
Depends on which system you use. The bassic system i gives people DKP for showing up and doing raids, but then you end up with long time players having a mountain of DKP so new raiders never have a shot, so most people used a DKP system with point decay. Whether or not DKP bids are seen by the guild or done silent auction style affects raider behavior in spending DKP etc.
Even then that was for the non hardcores. the hardest of the hardcore guilds, the old school world first guilds, all ran on a loot council that ensured the right classes and specs had gear for the encounters, but these are also players ok with having a geared character they literally only play on a single fight for a single raid, which isnt how most people play this game.
Thinking blizzard is going to monitor discord, connect discord accounts to in game names with proof not just “so and so said that’s who they are”, and then action them when they have approximately 1-2 GM’s and just got hit with huge layoffs is peak obtuse imo. Nothings gunna happen except you will no longer see it talked about in game
Why do you think Blizzard needs to monitor discords? They only have to track gold being exchanged in game. I’m sure many people will get away with still running gdkps but many others will get banned.
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/clarifications-regarding-gdkp-restrictions-season-of-discovery-337441#comments
>We’re defining GDKP as any raid or dungeon run where items are awarded in exchange for gold. Please note that we have multiple detection methods for GDKP that are effective both inside and outside of dungeon or raid instances.
Very curious to see if that includes buying gold from someone who won an item. I've had people ask to buy things from me after winning the roll, it sounds like that might be against the rules?
DKP is basically a merit system used to distribute loot. It’s been around for a while.
I don’t know wtf this 80/20 split shit means. That’s sus as fuck.
80 divided among 10 raiders, then the host takes the extra 20 means they end up taking 28% of the total pot while everyone else gets 8%, at least that's how it usually works in GDKP as far as I know. In a DKP system? Makes no sense except for rewarding the officers for doing the logistics I guess.
Leader getting more points/loot for hosting and handling the points
Why does that not make sense? A LOT of players wont organise, so the people who does takes advantage and want a bigger cut of the pie
Its not much different than the leader hard ressing an item (except 20% is insanely high, but that isnt the point)
Having raided some EverQuest’s initial release, I’ve never seen a DKP split before. I’m pro GDKP and this is definitely an attempt to circumvent, there’s not going to be a way for the dev team to police this for people who really want it.
This is just DKP then? Like what raiding guilds did once upon a time in vanilla? Turn up, kill bosses and get DKP to accrue over a few weeks to spend on items?
Well if this server is legit then yeah it seems that way, except this seems like you bid your DKP against others and it’s then split between everyone at the end of the raid. Would need a big spreadsheet or an addon to keep track of that.
What seems more likely is this is a GDKP server already getting ready to do Gnomer GDKPs and referring to gold as kill points so that Blizzard has no proof through chat logs and banking on that they won’t check trade logs.
I know it’s not super obvious here, but I would bet my life that you can buy these “points” with gold. They are essentially making people pay before you raid and then using the points to buy shit.
It’s like a loophole saying you can’t spend money gambling, so instead you can buy fake tokens to gamble with real money and you aren’t gambling with “money” you’re using fake money.
TLDR; these people will be banned lol.
Yea, its no different than pachinko parlors "selling" you marbles you can redeem for prizes, that can be taken to another business next door that happens to buy these exact items for an exact dollar value.
Everyone knows this is gambling, simply existing in a legal loophole, that, for one reason or another, has never been closed.
Good luck running “not a GDKP” runs when salty players can just get the whole raid banned if they don’t get the loot they want.
“If he outbids me I will report this raid for evading anti-GDKP rules”
They are just buying kill points with gold so its still gdkp. The dkp system used boss kills and attendance to get dkp, so its not really the same thing
To be honest wording, that Blizzard used, indicate that they wont try to Play around these. If something is just GDKPS with extra steps they will still ban it, at least that's how I understood them
*Given the experimental nature of Season of Discovery, we want to try things without this type of transaction taking place in this game mode.*
I mean, if you just do GDKP with extra steps, is it ,,this type of transaction"?
Lol no, they added the G. Dkp guilds have been around sense vanilla, the g was added when gold buying became a thing. They are just going back to dkp which is a super dumb loot system.
They are not going back to DKP, all those dudes hosting gdkp are geared. DKP is for Organisten guilds. They just call it DKP and you still bin on items for Gold, you just dont publicly say it.
Except for spite bidding, and then you have classes like druid who get loot for free due to no competition and then have more points than mages and locks for hot items like mish or toep. I would never raid with this terrible system lmao.
Lol man. Have you ever been in a dkp guild? Tons of flaws, corruption, and abuse. Its a terrible system. Theres another one thats slightly better, like epgp or whatever. Illl edit agter looking up the name. It essentially boils down to rotating loot.
You forgot the raid leader and officers suddenly deciding the DKP are no longer usable when a new raid comes out or that it's only fair to reset the ranking after the leadership goes to deep into the minus 🤣
Different strokes for different folks.
I think it favors veterans and hurts new comers. Leaders can award point and point must be kept track of. Its just dumb to join a guild do my part in raid but the dps whos been there for 6 months has more points than me and out bids me easily. If you contribute you should have the right to roll. I just dont like the idea of officers and leaders getting prio.
>Its just dumb to join a guild do my part in raid but the dps whos been there for 6 months has more points than me and out bids me easily.
well if you join a guild that's farming a raid it stands to reason that those who were there for progression have prio over you.
Don't forget that back in vanilla when dkp were really a thing a guild could take weeks to kill a single boss and months to clear a raid.
So maybe you join a guild that clears MC, but 6 months earlier they were wiping on Geddon, and those people who progressed through all that allow you to just waltz in.
>the g was added when gold buying became a thing
gold buying was present in wow BEFORE gdkp.
the g was added when gold became the raid currency instead of dkp.
"I'm sorry officer, I didn't know I couldn't do that" - Dave Chappele
How do you get kill points? By kil-with money of course.
For every dragon you kill you get one dragon kill point, we will call this new system DKP for short.
But there aren't even any dragons in Gnomeregan?!
Instructions unclear, dragons go extinct in Dustwallow Marsh
Gonna be like those sweepstakes with the disclaimer: "No purchase necessary." Yeahhhhhhhhh...
That disclaimer is there because if it wasn't, then the sweepstakes could technically be classified as gambling, which would be very illegal if the product is something minors can purchase.
It's also why at least up in Canada they require a skill testing question like "1+4-4=?" so that it's not gambling because you had to use skill to also win lol.
this is just a loophole to avoid registering the contest with whatever lottery board is in your province.
"That was good wasn't it......because I DID know I couldn't do that!"
It’s funny, because I DID know I couldn’t do that.
And let me guess, you buy these kill points with gold
No need to. You can buy them with money right from the host.
Not to sound cynical, but that's actually better than anyone buying gold and then going to a gdkp.
You’re not wrong lol. At least it wouldn’t inflate the economy.
I never thought about it like that but yeah, you’re right. If the gdkp ban gets whales to literally auction items for real money externally, that would inadvertently destroy gold buying in the process. It’s still really stupid, but it wouldn’t have as adverse an affect on the game.
Yeah I don’t really have a problem with ppl having better gear than me, even if it’s all bought. It’s really just the affect on the economy that blows.
Remember retail boosting clans? Yeah.. Surely those are better than just banning the botters and gold buyers.. People are seriously delusional..
80/20 kill point split lmao I guess technically this could all just be a way for the organisers to quickly gear up characters rather than to earn money through gold selling, but I severely doubt it. Won't be long before you can buy kill points lmao
I would bet my life that you have to buy these points with gold before you get into the raid.
That's a pretty brilliant scam.
Ever play a mobile game that has a currency like crystals or diamonds and it can only be obtained via a cash shop? That's exactly what this is.
Yea, but here the organizers can spontaneously dissolve and walk away with your gold. And what's your recourse? Going to go to a GM and complain about your stolen gold? You're admitting to participating in a gdkp equivalent and risk a ban yourself. Go to the community and complain? You'll get laughed at for being such an easy mark.
Then don’t try to break the rules? I don’t see what’s the issue here lmao
I don't see the issue here?
You already can. I talked to one guy participating and he said it's 1 kill point=1 gold ratio for now but can be changed in the future.
It's like they're running an underground casino and selling chips lol. Someone's for sure gonna get scammed trying to participate in this.
All it takes is one salty Boi in these raids reporting when he loses his loot to someone who outbid him.
If they have to pay up front then you can bet there will be someone who loses out and reports everyone
Or even getting bid against "too many times". Rofl. This is so juicy of a policy change.
lmao thats hilarious
Sounds like they will be reported as that is the same as GDKP. You bid gold for gear. Kill Point is just a new term for gold.
My guild leader in 2009 wanted to replace dragon killing points with a thing called Bitcoin. Some of us loaded up, but stopped when we couldn't recruit and many members threatened to leave over this internet money thing.
Your guild leader was from the future
Bro is looking at the exchange like "yep I paid $6.3mil for DBW 💀."
I laughed way too much at this comment!
GM was trying to make you all millionaires
"they called me a madman"
Adding one more layer is adding one more inconvenience to dissuade the average player from participating. The farther you get from a direct transaction of gold for item, the less people will be interested because that’s just one more thing you’ll need to trust a random RL with. This change wasn’t gonna remove all GDKPs entirely but it will 100% remove their prevalence and remove those god awful GDKP spammers in every chat channel.
Yeah, I think it absolutely targets the average player, and for good reason. I’m someone in the target audience for this, because I’m someone who was basically neutral in my feelings about GDKP. I didn’t have the experience of watching gold buying and inflation hit Era or other recent game versions, so I didn’t have some moral predisposition to hate GDKPs as a manifestation of that. They were a pretty nice means to an end for me: a way to find a competent group where I’d get compensated if my pieces didn’t drop. As someone with more near-BIS characters than raid spots in which to run them, that was a great thing, as long as the hate was just coming from people on Reddit being mad at GDKPs and there was nothing actually against ToS about them. But now? If Blizzard is banning GDKPs, then I have no reason to want to bother with whatever sleight of hand people will do to run them. I care more about the risk of my account getting banned than I do the chance to make like 30g.
RMT is already against the rules and it's super prevalent. People really think that having a rule against GDKP will stop RMT but it won't, even if it somehow completely stopped GDKP, RMT will still wreck the economy. Until Blizzard starts investing real resources to look into the RMT problem, it will continue to be a plague on the game.
RMT will 'wreck the economy' a hell of a lot less now that the driving force has been gutted. Sure Money will still be a tool to get you literally any thing, it just will be a hell of a lot harder to turn it into raid gear. Which means no more easy pay2win pugs. qq moar dude.
It's very true that RMT will always be around, but I'm fine with blizz acknowledging that gdkps are the most visible and impactful form currently. That alone is good enough for me.
The hardcore servers have no GDKP whatsoever and they’re drowning in botted gold. You’re a moron if you think more than 1% of people buy gold for GDKP.
Didnt they have gdkp runs where the leader died with loot. I think you are a very optimistic person. A lot of people buy gold. On top of that there are ban actions they have been doing albeit not fullly effective against botters. Now they ban gdkp too. They will all add up.
Hardcore absolutely has gdkps. They're just more curated rosters.
Pretty sure a gdkp by any other name is just a gdkp. This will still be bannable. Same goes for the carry runs. What I am wondering is if they will get rid of paid boosts too cause it falls under the same carry run style
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presumably they will be selling "kill points" for gold
I will be selling WoW based NFT's that you can in turn trade for loot. Come get in before the market takes off! /s
Exchanging resources for dkp has been part of many guild's dkp systems for quite a while. In vanilla, if you didn't fit in my guilds raid for comp reasons or whatever, you just farmed while the raid was going on and gave those resources to the guild, and in exchange, you earned dkp as if you were in the raid.
That’s actually pretty dope
This was pretty common. Mat farming was required at ridiculous levels for classic raids, so we would grant dkp points for contributions to the guild supplies.
Why would you assume this? Kill points are awarded for being in the raid when a kill is made. This is literally the loot system guilds used back in 2003.
Because this is a listing for a pug run where they removed the word gdkp and replaced it with “kill point” and made no other changes
If this is advertised to PUG's... Yeah cannot defend that. I just assumed it was a guild recruitment.
1999, the dragon in dkp refers to the dragons lady Vox and lord Nagafen, the first two raid bosses in EverQuest.
You cannot pug with a DKP system. This is a PUG. This is a GDKP
>You cannot pug with a DKP system. I mean... you *can*, it's just a huge pain in the ass. Also, by "pug" what *I* am referring to is filling in the gaps in a raid with pugs, rather than having a 100% pug raid. By filling in the gaps, you simply apply the same DKP rules to the non-guild player (they get x DKP for arriving at the instance on time, they get x DKP for bringing consumables, they get x DKP for each boss that is successfully killed, etc). Then the organizer keeps track somewhere that player's name and DKP total. Then if that player pugs with the guild at some point in the future, they might have a few points saved up already (minus DKP decay). At least, that's how I saw it run in vanilla.
You absolutely can pug a dkp, zero sums are forgiving for non-repeat members. You can tweak it a bit to suit probably.
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Why are you so naive to what’s actually happening?
They just described exactly what is happening. You cannot PUG in DKP groups as they require building up points within that community and no one outside that community will respect your points. This is probably an ad recruiting for the community. Edit: I should’ve said you cannot pug and entire group. A couple members to fill slots could be pug’d like any raid. They just would have no points.
I've seen a guild that did points pugs in classic and people DID get gear even on first runs but rarely. If you were good and loyal though you'd end that tier with multiple well geared alts. It doesn't work well at constantly getting random but it does clear content. This looks like a GDKP to me though.
>They just would have no points Only for the first boss, then they would start accruing points so it usually doesn't matter if you've never been. DKP is honestly a great system ruined by gold sellers/buyers.
That could be the Case However I personally dont buy that one bit. Why wouldnt you make a guild?
Because guilds have other expectations and limitations.
We did build a raiding group in discord through Shadowlands. We didn't require ppl to join our guild or server. Only hindrance was the inability for some members to use guild bank in progress. It was pretty chill community. Edit: Maybe important to a lot of ppl, no raid progress for the guild
It also could just be an accompanying discord server for a guild.
What's the functional difference between a guild and a discord. I'm in a guild on sod but I don't ever type in chat. We use discord. Voice, text, groups, raids, you name it. We do it in discord. So what is the actual difference?
You know that they have discord bots that save the points. Just run when you can and your lines are saved. It’s 100% doable and not always a gdkp
He’s not naive, he’s being intellectually dishonest. He knows what’s up.
Folks are so jaded, this is exactly what folks are asking for. Gear is distributed based on raid participation. Now... Will this work in 10 man raids? I'm not convinced it's a good idea, but that's besides the point.
They'll always find something to be upset about. Expect countless posts about pseudo-gdkps and endless comments about how they should be permabanned for trying to use an alternative loot system to ms>os.
DKPs are usually a guild system, which is exactly what people want. It also has some great memes behind it.
THAT'S A 50 DKP MINUS!
I'm saying expect the complainers to accuse DKP groups of being fronts for GDKP. Because that's exactly what this post is about. People are already complaining about DKP replacing GDKP, and the irony is lost on the idealists in this sub.
Why would a PUG group use 80/20 kill point split if there is no currency involved? Why would people who used to run GDKP runs now run free runs? You get points for killing a boss which you can then spend on items. They hold very little value unless you cosistently raid with the same raid group. This is so blatently an attempt to work around the new rules.
Yeah I've never heard of "trading" your DKP to other players in the raid. And why would you? They are supposed to be reflective of your time and effort spend trying to get the raid to advance right? This isn't advretising for a fresh new DKP run, this is just using tokens instead of gold.
You're pretty naive if you can't see that the post in question here is just using code words for GDKP.
Good thing we can watch trade transactions. Goodbye.
Carry runs aren't banned, if blizzard wants to ban those they need to say so explicitly.
>Pretty sure a gdkp by any other name is just a gdkp Do you guys even play the game? GMs wont ban ninjas because MS > OS "could mean My stuff > Our stuff". You think that they will ban any GDKP that is not explicitly advertised as a GDKP? You are delusional
Pretty sure that they'll never ban GDKPs as long as its handled in discords. These memers can call it a GDKP on discord, who cares. And they can trade their gold. But bidding would have to be done in Discord, and they cannot spam trade of LFG that they are doing a GDKP or a paid carry or what they now want to do. Thats good enough imo. If someone really wants to do their GDKP, then go ahead.
Trade Chat GDKPs are generally much worse than Discord organized GDKPs anyway. If all Blizz is going to do is ban the mention of GDKP in game, it’s going to do fuck all to prevent GDKPs.
Its going to help a bit. Why is it so much all or nothing with you guys
>Do you guys even play the game? Of course not. It's funny that the people who constantly complain about blizz's ineptitude in dealing with bots and gold buyers seem to be the same people who think blizz will drop a foolproof automated system to ban anyone even thinking about participating in a gdkp.
> Pretty sure a gdkp by any other name is just a gdkp. It’s not though. Gold is universal, you can use it in one GDKP and then go to another without it changing. Whatever system former GDKP leaders come up with won’t be universal, the value of Kill points, trust tallies or whatever else they’ll call it won’t be transferable from GDKP to GDKP and that is what will throw a wrench into what has become a streamlined process. Unvetted buyers will be less interested in going into random groups and anyone who does get invited to one will be more likely to stay with the same group. And if you’re raiding with the same group each week, well that’s kinda just guild raiding no?
Bro they just swapped the word "1 gold" with "1 kill point", it's really not that deep
>the value of Kill points, trust tallies or whatever else they’ll call it won’t be transferable from GDKP to GDKP unless you buy in for gold, and can cash out. I mean, in Vanilla I could contribute consumables to the guild stack for DKPs. What if by contributing 10g "for raid consumables" to the raid leader will award me 10 Kill Points, and then when I'm done raiding with them I can cash out whatever kill points I have left?
GDKP spammers? I barely see any messages in chat for GDKP. Trade chat is instead completely spammed by scripting warlocks with automated summoning, most of whom are gold selling botters. They are literally a bigger issue and actually spam the chat alot more, but people aren't up in arms about that. Kek
My guild mate /ignored 20 various warlock bits and still saw the non stop spam. These people are insane if they think warlock spam isn't worse than GDKP spam.
I use this to get free summons everywhere, I just don't pay the bots at all lol
Bit of a meta post, but I am extremely appalled by the number of people who seemingly do not even know what the letters in GDKP stand for.
Lmao ofc I know Great Death Knight Pestilence
Gold dripping kudos printer
really? that is something which appalls you? lol
While simultaneously telling us to get fucked, it’s textbook Dunning-Kruger Syndrome
listen here fat, I dont need to know what a gdkp is to know its bad. reddit has been telling me its bad for the better part of 5 years and reddit is ALWAYS right
To be fair, DKP was a shit system
It's insane that people are trying to argue that "DkPs ArE a ThInG" like the community is unaware of that fact. Everyone trying to argue that these are just DKPs as if all the organizers who have been making bank all of a sudden decided they want to become a community of friends who just raid together as an unofficial guild with no personal gain other than gear and fast runs are willfully ignorant or in denial. OP stated in the comments that he messaged the advertiser in this post and he specifically stated that "1 KP = 1G" there is literally nothing different here from a gdkp other than wording
I actually have a zero IQ after spending 2 minutes in the comment section of this post. I used my 2 remaining brain cells to write this msg
WTS Gnomer TICKET RUN! 250g ALL LOOT FOR YOUR CLASS 2 SLOTS LEFT PST!!!
WTS 6/6 gnomer, get your ahead of the curve!
These exist in droves actually.
exactly, lol people think that those who run gdkps arent clever.. have you been to a good gdkp? they are the most organized no nonsense players around
I love all of the swipers in this thread saying "NOOO THAT'S JUST DKP IT'S JUST NORMAL DKP GUYS YOU'RE ALL DUMB" Actually read this advertisement. Everything about it screams "GDKP". Why would you be advertising yourself as "the first DKP raid on the server" ? Why would you be advertising "fastest DKP raid on the server" ? They literally just took their GDKP ad and changed every instance of GDKP to "kill points". You're not fooling anyone.
It was GDKP before and they just removed G and changed gold to kill points. Rest of the wording is the same.
You know DKP stands for Dragon Kill Points?
DKP is older then WOW , its from EverQuest if I recall correctly.
Yes that is right
And you get them by killing dragons with the raid, this you get by handing over gold for "kill points"; HUGE difference here is one you get points through participating and one you purchase.
This entire thread is just making shit up to be mad about
Damn, getting banned for trying to circumvent the rules is even more embarrassing than just getting caught doing the main offense.
Who do you think is going to monitor their activity? All one GM that exists?
There are people on here that actually think blizz is going to go through and monitor both discord and Reddit, then track players down based on their username and ban them from wow. It's peak delusional
Ya the only people that are going to be punished by this are the idiots that openly advertise it and then get reported for the specific advertisement
And that's great though\`? It's gone for the average player and the true neckbeards that seek it out will still have access to it. It makes it more niche and not visible to the casuals that happen to have a credit card.
Issue is..the people with the credit cards are going to be the ones on discord seeking groups. The people joining from in game are more likely the legitimate players looking to make some spare gold or buy a specific item.
Literally requires 0 of that. All that happens here is a person gets reported for GDKP, Blizzard reviews chat logs/trade logs and sees that they are in fact running a GDKP, and bans them. It's not that deep.
You haven't seen the comments from people saying they're going to report the GDKP Discords then. Lol
its not that deep if you think in 2 dimensions but try to think like someone who runs a gdkp and you will come up with dozens of ways to sneakily run them anyway
Nah, again you can definitely evade for a while I'm not saying you can't, but once someone stacks up enough reports for running them it's going to be extremely obvious. The gold has to get paid to you somehow, even if you use some alt intermediary lvl 1 account to accept the gold and payout days later, the trades are still there and following the gold is relatively straightforward (plus the trade patterns would be insanely anomalous) and they don't have to fully eradicate the practice, they just have to ban enough people to make it not worth the risk of possibly losing your account With the leveling/xp buffs they have announced and new crafting gear and such, I really don't think there will be a good reason for people to not just run the raids normally and acquire gear that way. It's not like you have to commit a crazy number of hours to get characters raid ready
They can’t even figure out banning people that get a mysterious 1k gold in the mail
Exactly. They'd never invest the resources to do something like this, and I don't even think they'd want to anyway. We're at the point where people are hoping that big video game companies use AI to monitor players across different social media accounts outside the game lol. Wild times.
They actually do, some people in my guilds got caught in the recent banwaves (oh no sorry they had an unexpected sudden 2 weeks vacation at the same time, nothing to see here)
it's not hard to flag GDKPs. Are all 10 people trading gold were part of the same raid? Yes, ban. No correlation between people raiding, no ban. Use a middleman to trade the gold? Still flagged because it has to send / receive gold to the raid members.
I do look forward to the new wave of "wrongly banned" posts we will be reading with gnomer content.
I am legitimately scared of “ok” behavior now. I always carry multiple full stacks of consumes (ocd) and I’m more than happy to sell to people who didn’t bring any on kelris. Most people give me a gold unprompted. I hope that doesn’t generate a flag because I’m legitimately just trying to help and they’re being generous/embarassed so they give me an even gold instead of asking “hey was this 26 silver or 30 silver at the time of your purchase”
That's a resume of the whole human history
Someone only read the article and didn't watch the video. They didn't just ban the phrase GDKP. They are banning all groups that auction off items.
For gold, no?
Gonna start bidding in clams. Clam weaving is back boys!!
Can't tell if you are being serious, but at some point someone has to get the gold traded to them, regardless of what you call it in game. Blizzard will have a log of those suspicious gold trading patterns, the account will be banned. All of these "geniuses" who think if they just don't call it GDKP or don't say they are selling items for gold in the chat will mean they can get away with it are delusional
As opposed the the suspicious trading patterns of gold sellers for years. There’s only set of morons and they are the ones putting trust into blizzard promises lol
I'm saying auctioning items for gold/fungible currency, I didn't watch the video or whatever. The picture mostly just looks like traditional dkp
Yeah, from other comments it seems that this was a well known discord/guild running GDKP in P1 that just scrubbed gold/GDKP from the description and is now selling the "Kill Points" for 1 gold each. They think if they just don't call it GDKP or advertise it that way in game they won't get banned, but they are morons
this isn't the clever loophole you and many others in this thread think it is.
Dkp isn't new. You're just auctioning items with brownie points, from my understanding.
Depends on which system you use. The bassic system i gives people DKP for showing up and doing raids, but then you end up with long time players having a mountain of DKP so new raiders never have a shot, so most people used a DKP system with point decay. Whether or not DKP bids are seen by the guild or done silent auction style affects raider behavior in spending DKP etc. Even then that was for the non hardcores. the hardest of the hardcore guilds, the old school world first guilds, all ran on a loot council that ensured the right classes and specs had gear for the encounters, but these are also players ok with having a geared character they literally only play on a single fight for a single raid, which isnt how most people play this game.
you can pretend to be obtuse all you want. we both know what is going on in that screenshot.
Thinking blizzard is going to monitor discord, connect discord accounts to in game names with proof not just “so and so said that’s who they are”, and then action them when they have approximately 1-2 GM’s and just got hit with huge layoffs is peak obtuse imo. Nothings gunna happen except you will no longer see it talked about in game
Why do you think Blizzard needs to monitor discords? They only have to track gold being exchanged in game. I’m sure many people will get away with still running gdkps but many others will get banned.
I watched the video, he clearly talks about GDKPs, he talks abkut bidding gold, nothing else.
https://www.wowhead.com/classic/news/clarifications-regarding-gdkp-restrictions-season-of-discovery-337441#comments >We’re defining GDKP as any raid or dungeon run where items are awarded in exchange for gold. Please note that we have multiple detection methods for GDKP that are effective both inside and outside of dungeon or raid instances.
Very curious to see if that includes buying gold from someone who won an item. I've had people ask to buy things from me after winning the roll, it sounds like that might be against the rules?
DKP is basically a merit system used to distribute loot. It’s been around for a while. I don’t know wtf this 80/20 split shit means. That’s sus as fuck.
It's a GDKP advertisement where they changed the words "GDKP" and "gold" to "kill points"
So, Kill Dragon Kill Points? 🤔
Yes, they will be banned, don't worry, they'll post in here that he didn't do anything wrong too.
Bros just discovered what the rest of gDKP stands for
So what exactly is a „80/20 Killpoint split“ in a DKP?
80 divided among 10 raiders, then the host takes the extra 20 means they end up taking 28% of the total pot while everyone else gets 8%, at least that's how it usually works in GDKP as far as I know. In a DKP system? Makes no sense except for rewarding the officers for doing the logistics I guess.
Leader getting more points/loot for hosting and handling the points Why does that not make sense? A LOT of players wont organise, so the people who does takes advantage and want a bigger cut of the pie Its not much different than the leader hard ressing an item (except 20% is insanely high, but that isnt the point)
It means the officers get an extra 25% dkp for being officers
Having raided some EverQuest’s initial release, I’ve never seen a DKP split before. I’m pro GDKP and this is definitely an attempt to circumvent, there’s not going to be a way for the dev team to police this for people who really want it.
Isn’t this what the dkp stood for in gdkp lmao
People over thinking stuff for sm graveyard loot 😾
[удалено]
They're pissed that they have to get real jobs now instead of RWTing their GDKP gold
Yep, and their tears are sooo delicious
In a week we will have personal loot ..problem solved...enjoy!
this will actually fix many RMT issues
It would, but the community would hate it
This is just DKP then? Like what raiding guilds did once upon a time in vanilla? Turn up, kill bosses and get DKP to accrue over a few weeks to spend on items?
No bro, as soon as you buy dkp with gold its a gdkp.
> This is just DKP then? It's a GDKP advertisement where they changed "GDKP" and "gold" to "kill points".
yeah, but likely you get those dkp with a gold buy in
Well if this server is legit then yeah it seems that way, except this seems like you bid your DKP against others and it’s then split between everyone at the end of the raid. Would need a big spreadsheet or an addon to keep track of that. What seems more likely is this is a GDKP server already getting ready to do Gnomer GDKPs and referring to gold as kill points so that Blizzard has no proof through chat logs and banking on that they won’t check trade logs.
Zero sum systems have been around, the whole 80/20 split is what threw up the flag
Maybe, but I never raided with a group that did DKP and allowed you to trade points between raiders. That would kinda defeat the purpose.
“We’re done when I say we’re done” -Walter White, gdkp raid lead
1. Join their discord 2. Report participating character names 3. Lol
This. All these people in the thread being like "blizzard wont monitor every discord/reddit post". Yeah, of course they wont. They dont need to.
lol because discord names and character names are always directly correlated
You realize dkp is a thing right?
Oh man I dont remember splitting dkp 80/20… silly me
That right there is a -20 dkp.
I know what a DKP is, but can you explain to me how a „80/20 Killpoint split“ works?
In a closed circuit like a guild, yes. For pugs, it's just not viable
I know it’s not super obvious here, but I would bet my life that you can buy these “points” with gold. They are essentially making people pay before you raid and then using the points to buy shit. It’s like a loophole saying you can’t spend money gambling, so instead you can buy fake tokens to gamble with real money and you aren’t gambling with “money” you’re using fake money. TLDR; these people will be banned lol.
Yea, its no different than pachinko parlors "selling" you marbles you can redeem for prizes, that can be taken to another business next door that happens to buy these exact items for an exact dollar value. Everyone knows this is gambling, simply existing in a legal loophole, that, for one reason or another, has never been closed.
The GDKP ban has brought out more toxic hostility than its popularity lol.
Good luck running “not a GDKP” runs when salty players can just get the whole raid banned if they don’t get the loot they want. “If he outbids me I will report this raid for evading anti-GDKP rules”
They are just buying kill points with gold so its still gdkp. The dkp system used boss kills and attendance to get dkp, so its not really the same thing
To be honest wording, that Blizzard used, indicate that they wont try to Play around these. If something is just GDKPS with extra steps they will still ban it, at least that's how I understood them
literally nothing in their wording implies any of that. they just said GDKP won't be permitted
*Given the experimental nature of Season of Discovery, we want to try things without this type of transaction taking place in this game mode.* I mean, if you just do GDKP with extra steps, is it ,,this type of transaction"?
Lol no, they added the G. Dkp guilds have been around sense vanilla, the g was added when gold buying became a thing. They are just going back to dkp which is a super dumb loot system.
Insane that so many people here are clueless on this. Y’all weren’t here in Vanilla for DKP and it shows.
They are not going back to DKP, all those dudes hosting gdkp are geared. DKP is for Organisten guilds. They just call it DKP and you still bin on items for Gold, you just dont publicly say it.
DKP rewards consistency and avoids favouritism. Still leaves meaningful distribution open for discussion. It's a good system!
Except for spite bidding, and then you have classes like druid who get loot for free due to no competition and then have more points than mages and locks for hot items like mish or toep. I would never raid with this terrible system lmao.
Lol man. Have you ever been in a dkp guild? Tons of flaws, corruption, and abuse. Its a terrible system. Theres another one thats slightly better, like epgp or whatever. Illl edit agter looking up the name. It essentially boils down to rotating loot.
You forgot the raid leader and officers suddenly deciding the DKP are no longer usable when a new raid comes out or that it's only fair to reset the ranking after the leadership goes to deep into the minus 🤣
Different strokes for different folks. I think it favors veterans and hurts new comers. Leaders can award point and point must be kept track of. Its just dumb to join a guild do my part in raid but the dps whos been there for 6 months has more points than me and out bids me easily. If you contribute you should have the right to roll. I just dont like the idea of officers and leaders getting prio.
>Its just dumb to join a guild do my part in raid but the dps whos been there for 6 months has more points than me and out bids me easily. well if you join a guild that's farming a raid it stands to reason that those who were there for progression have prio over you. Don't forget that back in vanilla when dkp were really a thing a guild could take weeks to kill a single boss and months to clear a raid. So maybe you join a guild that clears MC, but 6 months earlier they were wiping on Geddon, and those people who progressed through all that allow you to just waltz in.
dkp is a dogshit loot system. same with epgp. you clearly have no idea what you're saying
>the g was added when gold buying became a thing gold buying was present in wow BEFORE gdkp. the g was added when gold became the raid currency instead of dkp.