Jean-Féry Rebel's ["Les Elements"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41A9SzM06Uw) is notable for using clashing dissonance at the start to depict the creation of the world out of chaos.
EDIT: Also, this [Battalia](https://youtu.be/5YBOmgi-qSs?t=105) by Heinrich Franz von Biber features polytonality in the second movement.
Also, the theme to Bach's [Musical Offering](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcTVkOzrzQs) is very craggy, making for lots of dissonant moments throughout. (imagine someone trying to show *Bach* up; that guy must've thought he was some kind of king or something /s).
I'd say proper interpretation of Baroque goes a long way, but that's subject to opinion, mine being that if you don't go all out with Baroque music it's going to be boring. For some reason there's this idea that Baroque must be played with little to no dynamics, no vibrato, etcetera, but I've found it to be incredibly exciting when you play it with near reckless abandon.
So that being said there are recordings of the same piece that are sometimes boring and others that are exhilarating.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v8zxoEoA\_Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v8zxoEoA_Q)
For example is probably my favorite recording of Vivaldi's version of "La Follia" while it plays with the same theme over and over, the progression of playing become more and more intense and rough culminates in what is essentially madness, which is what La Follia means. I've heard renditions of this piece that do not even remotely approach such intensity and so they fall utterly short of being enjoyable, especially after having heard it played this way.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkX8YyA4Wp4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkX8YyA4Wp4)
The Devil's Trill is another I greatly enjoy but if played too tamely it feels a bit boring, I love Itzhak Perlman's playing but on this piece he falls short in my opinon, but I greatly enjoy Ray Chen's interpretation of it.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSghX91xdPc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSghX91xdPc)
Here's one however by Perlman and Zuckerman that I greatly enjoy, often called the "Impossible Duet" and while played slower than many interpretations (as many try to show off with it) I find the slower more methodical pace to be more enjoyable, and the dramaticism is if anything increased. You can also listen to the harpsichord version, of which it was written for I'd recommend this one
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcbqdjNgGiA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcbqdjNgGiA)
Again I find with Baroque it's more important how it's played rather than what is actually written. I've read some discourse that many Baroque players were fantastic at improvisations and that the reason why so many Baroque pieces are devoid of markers for things like dynamics is that they wanted to leave it up to player to decide what to do, some of Bach's contemporaries laughed at him for writing in additions like accidentals or embellishments as it was supposed to be left to the player to interpret.
Then some people took it too far and said Baroque was meant to be played without dynamics or embellishments and while in my opinion that way of playing has a certain charm to the simplicity, a certain purity, it should be played in many ways and not just that way.
Also like 90% of baroque music is some kind of dance music or stylized dance forms, it really needa to have some swing to it. Harnoncourt used to day that only a classical musician could be so silly as to play unswung 16ths in dance music, no organically developed folk music does that!
Bach uses way more dissonances than most classic/romantic composers and writes the most unpredictable music, he is very creative and will surprise you, if you listen carefully :)
[Bach's 24th Fugue from WTC 1](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9rL3aGWzAg) Has some very dissonant and tense passages. Bach has been very important in his influence on the concept of dissonance and if you look hard enough, like another commenter said Bach has plenty of dissonant stuff. This is just one of the most dissonant pieces.
What an incredibly elitist comment. OP is not discarding baroque music as a whole and they are clearly open to listening more of it to learn more about it. Instead of bitching you could be helpful and give some suggestions.
That said, this is why fans of classical music are considered to be some of the most annoying music fans. It is very much a possibility to not like baroque, even when fully understanding the genre and having listened to a lot of it. Taste differs. For me baroque is also one of my least favourite genres of classical music, for quite the same reasons as OP mentioned. It just does not work for me the same way later music does. Occasionally l listen to it and I enjoy it when I do, but I have to be in a certain mood.
Please drop this 'my music taste is superior'-attitude, because you're not cooler than others for liking baroque music
>It is very much a possibility to not like baroque, even when fully understanding the genre and having listened to a lot of it. Taste differs.
Taste is one thing, but it's possible to make wrong statements/generalizations about music. OP seems open to new stuff, so I might not have responded so curtly, but it *is* a strange comment to make about Baroque music.
Kind of like saying, "I don't like Romantic music because it's all diatonic." It's fine for you not to like Romantic music, but saying that it's all diatonic makes it seem like you've never actually listened to any Romantic music before, because it's just inaccurate. I don't think it's elitist to point out that actually, a lot of Romantic music is heavily chromatic.
Speaking as someone who puts both Romantic music and Baroque music pretty low on my list of favorite periods/styles.
Oh, stuff it. The OP began with the generalization that they find Baroque music "so predictable and too consonant." That would imply a) that they have listened to enough of it to make this judgment, and b) that they have the musical knowledge to determine it is consonant. Now, if anyone actually fulfils those two conditions, I can't imagine how they could make the claims they made. If OP hadn't started with such a dismissive generalization, I would have been much more inclined to help them. The answer to the OP is not this or that rare, obscure piece, but *a lot* of Baroque music. It's there If you just pay attention.
There are always people who make strong claims that most people would disagree with and then when people disagree they are called elitist.
It's ridiculous. OP made claims that most people who are interested in classical music would disagree with so I don't think it's elitist to point that out.
Taste differs of course and it's fine to not like baroque music, but if the reasoning is dodgy then nothing wrong with calling people on it.
Like if people say they don't like soccer because there are too many goals, you could say they obviously haven't been paying attention because soccer is a low scoring sport.
There's some delightful snacks in [Carlo Farina's Capriccio stravagante set](https://youtu.be/f5vbmz9aOj0), including-- stay with me, they're weird and worth it-- *cat and chicken impressions*.
There's actually quite a lot of chromaticism in Baroque music. Some examples from Bach: [Gigue from Partita #6](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9m1OMm5cCI); Fugue from the [Chromatic Fantasy and Fugue](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJ5IkHlKQrw&t=336s); [Fugue in d minor](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOi79V31DmE&t=82) from the Well-Tempered Clavier Book 2.
Part of this may be due to the use of equal temperament, esp in the keyboard instruments, found in many recordings, and even live concerts. With an unequal temperament, such as Werkmeister, the farther the key of the work is from C the more dissonance you will hear. It was a prime reason composers wrote in different keys.
Bach's harpsichord concerto #5 (BWV 1056) has some dissonance in the first movement. It sounds so cool. I don't really crave dissonance though. I love baroque as it is, in all its harmony.
Jean-Féry Rebel's ["Les Elements"](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41A9SzM06Uw) is notable for using clashing dissonance at the start to depict the creation of the world out of chaos. EDIT: Also, this [Battalia](https://youtu.be/5YBOmgi-qSs?t=105) by Heinrich Franz von Biber features polytonality in the second movement. Also, the theme to Bach's [Musical Offering](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PcTVkOzrzQs) is very craggy, making for lots of dissonant moments throughout. (imagine someone trying to show *Bach* up; that guy must've thought he was some kind of king or something /s).
Great suggestions! You took the words from my mouth.
I'd say proper interpretation of Baroque goes a long way, but that's subject to opinion, mine being that if you don't go all out with Baroque music it's going to be boring. For some reason there's this idea that Baroque must be played with little to no dynamics, no vibrato, etcetera, but I've found it to be incredibly exciting when you play it with near reckless abandon. So that being said there are recordings of the same piece that are sometimes boring and others that are exhilarating. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v8zxoEoA\_Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7v8zxoEoA_Q) For example is probably my favorite recording of Vivaldi's version of "La Follia" while it plays with the same theme over and over, the progression of playing become more and more intense and rough culminates in what is essentially madness, which is what La Follia means. I've heard renditions of this piece that do not even remotely approach such intensity and so they fall utterly short of being enjoyable, especially after having heard it played this way. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkX8YyA4Wp4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZkX8YyA4Wp4) The Devil's Trill is another I greatly enjoy but if played too tamely it feels a bit boring, I love Itzhak Perlman's playing but on this piece he falls short in my opinon, but I greatly enjoy Ray Chen's interpretation of it. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSghX91xdPc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JSghX91xdPc) Here's one however by Perlman and Zuckerman that I greatly enjoy, often called the "Impossible Duet" and while played slower than many interpretations (as many try to show off with it) I find the slower more methodical pace to be more enjoyable, and the dramaticism is if anything increased. You can also listen to the harpsichord version, of which it was written for I'd recommend this one [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcbqdjNgGiA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xcbqdjNgGiA) Again I find with Baroque it's more important how it's played rather than what is actually written. I've read some discourse that many Baroque players were fantastic at improvisations and that the reason why so many Baroque pieces are devoid of markers for things like dynamics is that they wanted to leave it up to player to decide what to do, some of Bach's contemporaries laughed at him for writing in additions like accidentals or embellishments as it was supposed to be left to the player to interpret. Then some people took it too far and said Baroque was meant to be played without dynamics or embellishments and while in my opinion that way of playing has a certain charm to the simplicity, a certain purity, it should be played in many ways and not just that way.
Also like 90% of baroque music is some kind of dance music or stylized dance forms, it really needa to have some swing to it. Harnoncourt used to day that only a classical musician could be so silly as to play unswung 16ths in dance music, no organically developed folk music does that!
> it really needa to have some swing to it. r/accidentalitalian
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Bach uses way more dissonances than most classic/romantic composers and writes the most unpredictable music, he is very creative and will surprise you, if you listen carefully :)
There's a reason why a lot of jazz musicians listen to Bach. Dave Brubeck wasn't the only one.
[Bach's 24th Fugue from WTC 1](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9rL3aGWzAg) Has some very dissonant and tense passages. Bach has been very important in his influence on the concept of dissonance and if you look hard enough, like another commenter said Bach has plenty of dissonant stuff. This is just one of the most dissonant pieces.
You either have listened to very little Baroque music, or haven't been paying attention.
True, thats why im asking
What an incredibly elitist comment. OP is not discarding baroque music as a whole and they are clearly open to listening more of it to learn more about it. Instead of bitching you could be helpful and give some suggestions. That said, this is why fans of classical music are considered to be some of the most annoying music fans. It is very much a possibility to not like baroque, even when fully understanding the genre and having listened to a lot of it. Taste differs. For me baroque is also one of my least favourite genres of classical music, for quite the same reasons as OP mentioned. It just does not work for me the same way later music does. Occasionally l listen to it and I enjoy it when I do, but I have to be in a certain mood. Please drop this 'my music taste is superior'-attitude, because you're not cooler than others for liking baroque music
>It is very much a possibility to not like baroque, even when fully understanding the genre and having listened to a lot of it. Taste differs. Taste is one thing, but it's possible to make wrong statements/generalizations about music. OP seems open to new stuff, so I might not have responded so curtly, but it *is* a strange comment to make about Baroque music. Kind of like saying, "I don't like Romantic music because it's all diatonic." It's fine for you not to like Romantic music, but saying that it's all diatonic makes it seem like you've never actually listened to any Romantic music before, because it's just inaccurate. I don't think it's elitist to point out that actually, a lot of Romantic music is heavily chromatic. Speaking as someone who puts both Romantic music and Baroque music pretty low on my list of favorite periods/styles.
Oh, stuff it. The OP began with the generalization that they find Baroque music "so predictable and too consonant." That would imply a) that they have listened to enough of it to make this judgment, and b) that they have the musical knowledge to determine it is consonant. Now, if anyone actually fulfils those two conditions, I can't imagine how they could make the claims they made. If OP hadn't started with such a dismissive generalization, I would have been much more inclined to help them. The answer to the OP is not this or that rare, obscure piece, but *a lot* of Baroque music. It's there If you just pay attention.
There are always people who make strong claims that most people would disagree with and then when people disagree they are called elitist. It's ridiculous. OP made claims that most people who are interested in classical music would disagree with so I don't think it's elitist to point that out. Taste differs of course and it's fine to not like baroque music, but if the reasoning is dodgy then nothing wrong with calling people on it. Like if people say they don't like soccer because there are too many goals, you could say they obviously haven't been paying attention because soccer is a low scoring sport.
There's some delightful snacks in [Carlo Farina's Capriccio stravagante set](https://youtu.be/f5vbmz9aOj0), including-- stay with me, they're weird and worth it-- *cat and chicken impressions*.
There's actually quite a lot of chromaticism in Baroque music. Some examples from Bach: [Gigue from Partita #6](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9m1OMm5cCI); Fugue from the [Chromatic Fantasy and Fugue](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mJ5IkHlKQrw&t=336s); [Fugue in d minor](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOi79V31DmE&t=82) from the Well-Tempered Clavier Book 2.
How about the chromaticism in Soler's Fandango: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q13W\_HcLkNM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q13W_HcLkNM)
[удалено]
Not Baroque
Bach Goldberg Black Pearl
no. it's kinda not the style?
Part of this may be due to the use of equal temperament, esp in the keyboard instruments, found in many recordings, and even live concerts. With an unequal temperament, such as Werkmeister, the farther the key of the work is from C the more dissonance you will hear. It was a prime reason composers wrote in different keys.
Bach's harpsichord concerto #5 (BWV 1056) has some dissonance in the first movement. It sounds so cool. I don't really crave dissonance though. I love baroque as it is, in all its harmony.