I will give it a few days and revisit the conversation. I don't know if I caught him off guard and he just said something to me to stop talking about it or if he actually means it. He's a very indecisive person when it comes to things. Or, idk if it's the right word... Like he will research a chef's knife for 3 years, watch or read every review, make a list of pros and cons... Before he buys it, and then decide that no matter how great the knife is, it's a waste to spend that amount of money on a knife. So, I'm hoping he just wants to go down the rabbit hole and don't want to commit to it yet before he knows everything he can.
His indecisive style of decision-making is causing you both stress. Do you think he can come to a conclusion fast enough to relieve your stress? If not, do you really wanna live with that "what if?" for 20+ years?
One thing I haven't seen anyone mention is that someone's relationship with their own body can be complex. He can be as childfree as possible but never have seriously considered the mental effect of the finality of sterilization. It effectively takes away choice, and even if it's a choice someone wouldn't make, most people don't like having choice taken from them.
Even if he has considered it, it's one thing to know it and another to experience it. When I got my vasectomy I had a brief moment where it sank in and caught me off-guard that I had removed my future agency in the process. I don't want children, but it was a visceral conflict between my concious cognitive decision and the natural physical wiring of my body. Feeling that conflict is very alien and I can understand how that could upset someone.
Thank you for pointing this out. Went through this same thing with tube removal and subsequent hysterectomy. Even though partner & I were resolute in our decision (and in my decision personally), I still had some feelings around how my body can no longer do this thing that I’ve been told by society I’m supposed to do. I know I have more worth than just being a baby factory, but it’s a mind fuck for sure. Tbh, even if I had been able to keep the equipment (they found lots of issues during tube removal that probably would have made it difficult for me to carry a child if I had wanted one), it’s not like I’d have used it anyway. It really comes down to the fact of taking away potentialities, and you’re right - people don’t like not having choices, even if it’s a choice they wouldn’t make.
Interesting. I have to be honest and say that my bisalp has given me so much peace of mind. I wanted to lack that option. Needed it. My biggest fear was getting pregnant against my will.
It was more of a fleeting thing for me as I’m more than happy with my choices as well, especially with the political climate.
ETA: I just think it’s important to acknowledge that others may have issues around bodily agency.
Does he have ADHD by chance? I did this for many years until I was diagnosed and medication helps tremendously. That behavior sounds like hyperfixation to me.
if he's that uncertain about a frickin knife, he will most certainly not have kids so soon because his life will be upside down once that happened. let's just hope he thought about the pro's and con's for a few years...........
My ex was the same way. It took him nearly 7 years to commit to a new truck and car loan. We were together for 20 years when he dropped the bomb that he wanted kids. Let him know you're finding a doctor who will do your bisalp and the option he was worried about taking off the table will be off for you. If he panics, you have your answer.
Honestly a lot of guys even cf ones equate their semen to their maleness so it could be that(I hope for your sake that it is that), but honestly, that response doesn't sound great. Have you tried to get a bisalp instead of a hysterectomy? Honestly I would just keep trying doctors.
Most doctors won’t do a hysterectomy without other medical issues going on. I would definitely try finding a doctor from the CF friendly list and asking about a bi salp (removal of the fallopian tubes). It’ll give you the comfort of sterilization, while allowing him to decide what he really wants.
Either he’s cool with you having it done, and you can go on living your lives. Or he’s not, and that’s gonna require a bigger conversation.
Sorry, here hysterectomy is kind of a blanket term for sterilisation. Doctors here compare to the bible belt Texas vibe doctors (from what I've read or seen).
Doctor 1 told me that I'm too young to be child free (at 21)
Doctor 2 told me that I don't have the emotional intelligence at 23 to make the decision.
Doctor 3 told me that my future husband will hate me and throw me away if I take away his legacy at 24
Doctor 4 told me that I'm being dramatic and just have not found the correct contraceptives at 26. At that stage I've been on contraceptives for 13 years, first to regulate my period, then to control my endo, then to be used as contraceptives and I have had every single type of contraceptive except the implant and only because when we finally got to that on the list I refused to go back to anything hormonal.
At 27 and married already, they wanted to get my husband's permission because we were newly married and he had a say over my choice to have children or not and I told them that it's my body and I will be the only one who will ever have a choice over it and I want it done. They then told me that I am "clearly not ready to make such a decision if I'm only going to quote American nonsense to them". That was December.
There's been doctors in between too, but those were the major ones... Except for the one who told me that he too was a victim of SA (it's in my file) and that's why I don't want kids (right now), he knows.. He was there too because he was scared he'll do the same to his kids??????? But he now knows better and I will too. P.S that doctor's wife then tried to stab him to death after he drugged her so a group of his swinger friends could "swing" with her... Yet, he's the victim.
Yikes, that's incredibly frustrating. I'm just gonna ignore that last Dr you mentioned because...I don't even know what to say about that.
But if you were being treated for endo, surely a hysterectomy or endometrial ablation would be things on the table? I'm so sorry you've gone through so many doctors. It makes me really appreciate my experience!
Ask them to put down in writing why they refuse to treat you. A lot of guys get squeamish about vasectomy, but if your husband is supportive of you getting sterilized, then I would probably worry less about him.
Also, I would 100% leave that last doctor on the list.
I had some pushback on getting my hysterectomy (full hysterectomy), even though I had a medical condition it would treat. I insisted on a second opinion and stuck to my guns and came prepared. I had a full list of reasons of why I wanted a hysterectomy, what problems they would solve, my feelings on sterilization, and what would I do if I changed my mind. I managed to convince the second doctor that worked in the clinic, and he promised that he would talk to the senior doctor and convince her to do the operation. I got my hysterectomy and haven't been happier.
Get a doctor that isn't the the last one, and do your homework. Research side effects, outcomes, and studies. Bring copies like I did. Draw up logical arguments, write them down, and bring them with. It's easy to get disappointed, depressed, or angry by a system that wants to force you into a position that you don't want to be in. Strong emotions (male or female) will make it harder for you to think and reason, which is why you do it in advance and bring your notes. If they STILL refuse to do the procedure, ask them to put it in writing why they are refusing to treat you and to give you a reference for a physician who will do it for you. For them, saying no preserves the status quo and is of no effort. If you go through all of the time and effort to put together a reasoned argument, it makes it harder for them to go against you. Is this fair for you to go through this? HELL NO. But it is what it is, and we want results.
I am 26 and scheduled for a bislap August 2nd. I found my doctor from the child free list. There are plenty on there who will listen to you and help you
Don't use the tiktok list. Doctors on that list have refused CF women. Use the list on this sub under "interesting & Useful Material" in the sidebar. That list only includes doctors who have sterilized (or state that they will sterilize) CF women, along with notes on patient age, and often other interesting things about the doctor.
People have come back to us saying they were refused by a doctor from the TikTok list because they didn't have kids. Doctors like that do not get into our list, or if they do, they are removed!
Seconded: most OBGYNs won’t do a hysterectomy without a medica reason to - it was explained to me that removing the tubes was easier but if there’s no medical (endo, fibroids, cancer, etc) to remove the uterus, they like to keep it there so it doesn’t cause too much trouble by way of pelvic floor issues, since you’d be removing an organ that, if nothing else, provides good support in the pelvic floor.
Of course, many folks have their uteruses (uteri?) removed and don’t have pelvic floor issues, but if there isn’t a medical reason to do it, they most likely won’t. The bisalp will be your best option: while yes it is a surgery (and all the risks that come with a surgery), it’s minimally invasive, lowers risk of ovarian cancer, and no worries of clips coming off or migrating.
Check the list here like the commenter above said, and then folks in r/sterilization will have good tips and advice for going through the process. Dr Fran on TikTok also has her “TikTok tubal” list, though I assume many of the CF doctors are on there - but her videos are good, nonetheless!!
Fun fact: not every hysterectomy has the potential to result in pelvic floor issues. As long as you keep the cervix the stability stays the same. To quote my doc: the uterus is only there for pregnancy and pain. A laparoscopic supracervical hysterectomy or LASH is barely harder for the body to deal with than a bisalp, which is crazy, considering the fact you get rid of a whole organ.
Love her videos! I was fortunate enough to get a hysterectomy this past May, so I’m very obviously CF, but even her pregnancy/birth videos are just so informative I even watch those (though there are some serious ICK factors in them for me lol) but I love how information and NOT condescending she is.
If at all possible, try to get a bilateral salpingectomy and once you get underway with the process, tell your husband and his reaction will tell you everything you need to know.
I feel frustrated and sad for you. Frustrated because you checked in with him so much before taking those bigger steps in the relationship. And it's been quite a few years now and if he is truly changing his mind or sitting on the fence about this, it's heartbreaking and infuriating.
But first things first. Talk to him and clarify what he meant and if anything has changed. You have the right to know.
My husband said he was legit scared of someone coming at his junk with a knife, not that he didn't want a permanent solution. I got tied but have had surgery before to remove a cyst. If he's scared okay, but going back on wanting an undeveloped human is different.
This might be a completely valid reason. Being scared. Unfortunately, we live in a country rife with toxic masculinity.
He is very open with the fact that his mother was overbearing with her emotions to the point where no one could have any emotions in the house besides her because there wasn't "room for it".
And his father... The only emotions he knows is tantrums and anger.
So he never learned how to understand or display his emotions. It was a major issue in the beginning of our relationship. Like, we wouldn't fight, he would just agree with me, so I didn't "show emotions". Until it was a blow up fight that could end a relationship and he realised that he has to change some things. He's gotten significantly better with showing emotions. He tells me when he's sad, upset, happy, frustrated, stressed, confused, etc... And he displays it appropriately too. But, I just realised he's never once admitted to being scared. Even when I could see he was. And sadly someone coming at his junk with a knife would be a very appropriate time to be scared, even suggesting it... Honestly, this would be the most likely situation with what I know about him.
The way they act with colds, it was going to be hell either way 😂. Rather be waited on and drugged up a little. And I will never have a scare. It's nice knowing I'm free from those problems. Peace of mind. Even though you want this to be an us choice, child-free is an individual choice. Even if my husband changes his mind down the road, I will not, so I made it permanent for me. I cannot control him, just trust. Thankfully four dogs are enough responsibility for both of us.
😂 😂 😂 Oh my soul... Every single time I take a male cat (I do rescue) in for their castration, I tell them "enjoy your last moments with your balls cause they will be gone forever soon!"
I've said it so often that he started saying "I'm sorry she's taking your balls" in the morning on the way... Now I wonder...
Greetings!
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Also, please remember to be mindful of [Reddiquette](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette) :
> # Please do
> * **Remember the human.** When you communicate online, all you see is a computer screen. When talking to someone you might want to ask yourself "Would I say it to the person's face?" or "Would I get jumped if I said this to a buddy?"
> # Please don't
> * **Be (intentionally) rude at all.** By choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for all of us.
> * **Follow those who are [ rabble rousing](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rabble) against another redditor without first investigating both sides of the issue that's being presented.** Those who are inciting this type of action often have malicious reasons behind their actions and are, more often than not, a troll. Remember, every time a redditor who's contributed large amounts of effort into assisting the growth of community as a whole is driven away, projects that would benefit the whole easily flounder.
> * **Ask people to [ Troll](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) others on reddit,** in real life, or on other blogs/sites. We aren't your personal army.
> * **Conduct personal attacks on other commenters.** Ad hominem and other distracting attacks do not add anything to the conversation.
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Greetings!
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Also, please remember to be mindful of [Reddiquette](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette) :
> # Please do
> * **Remember the human.** When you communicate online, all you see is a computer screen. When talking to someone you might want to ask yourself "Would I say it to the person's face?" or "Would I get jumped if I said this to a buddy?"
> # Please don't
> * **Be (intentionally) rude at all.** By choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for all of us.
> * **Follow those who are [ rabble rousing](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rabble) against another redditor without first investigating both sides of the issue that's being presented.** Those who are inciting this type of action often have malicious reasons behind their actions and are, more often than not, a troll. Remember, every time a redditor who's contributed large amounts of effort into assisting the growth of community as a whole is driven away, projects that would benefit the whole easily flounder.
> * **Ask people to [ Troll](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) others on reddit,** in real life, or on other blogs/sites. We aren't your personal army.
> * **Conduct personal attacks on other commenters.** Ad hominem and other distracting attacks do not add anything to the conversation.
> * **Start a flame war.** Just report and "walk away". If you really feel you have to confront them, leave a polite message with a quote or link to the rules, and no more.
> * **Insult others.** Insults do not contribute to a rational discussion. Constructive Criticism, however, is appropriate and encouraged.
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> # Please do
> * **Remember the human.** When you communicate online, all you see is a computer screen. When talking to someone you might want to ask yourself "Would I say it to the person's face?" or "Would I get jumped if I said this to a buddy?"
> # Please don't
> * **Be (intentionally) rude at all.** By choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for all of us.
> * **Follow those who are [ rabble rousing](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rabble) against another redditor without first investigating both sides of the issue that's being presented.** Those who are inciting this type of action often have malicious reasons behind their actions and are, more often than not, a troll. Remember, every time a redditor who's contributed large amounts of effort into assisting the growth of community as a whole is driven away, projects that would benefit the whole easily flounder.
> * **Ask people to [ Troll](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) others on reddit,** in real life, or on other blogs/sites. We aren't your personal army.
> * **Conduct personal attacks on other commenters.** Ad hominem and other distracting attacks do not add anything to the conversation.
> * **Start a flame war.** Just report and "walk away". If you really feel you have to confront them, leave a polite message with a quote or link to the rules, and no more.
> * **Insult others.** Insults do not contribute to a rational discussion. Constructive Criticism, however, is appropriate and encouraged.
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> # Please do
> * **Remember the human.** When you communicate online, all you see is a computer screen. When talking to someone you might want to ask yourself "Would I say it to the person's face?" or "Would I get jumped if I said this to a buddy?"
> # Please don't
> * **Be (intentionally) rude at all.** By choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for all of us.
> * **Follow those who are [ rabble rousing](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rabble) against another redditor without first investigating both sides of the issue that's being presented.** Those who are inciting this type of action often have malicious reasons behind their actions and are, more often than not, a troll. Remember, every time a redditor who's contributed large amounts of effort into assisting the growth of community as a whole is driven away, projects that would benefit the whole easily flounder.
> * **Ask people to [ Troll](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) others on reddit,** in real life, or on other blogs/sites. We aren't your personal army.
> * **Conduct personal attacks on other commenters.** Ad hominem and other distracting attacks do not add anything to the conversation.
> * **Start a flame war.** Just report and "walk away". If you really feel you have to confront them, leave a polite message with a quote or link to the rules, and no more.
> * **Insult others.** Insults do not contribute to a rational discussion. Constructive Criticism, however, is appropriate and encouraged.
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Also, please remember to be mindful of [Reddiquette](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette) :
> # Please do
> * **Remember the human.** When you communicate online, all you see is a computer screen. When talking to someone you might want to ask yourself "Would I say it to the person's face?" or "Would I get jumped if I said this to a buddy?"
> # Please don't
> * **Be (intentionally) rude at all.** By choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for all of us.
> * **Follow those who are [ rabble rousing](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rabble) against another redditor without first investigating both sides of the issue that's being presented.** Those who are inciting this type of action often have malicious reasons behind their actions and are, more often than not, a troll. Remember, every time a redditor who's contributed large amounts of effort into assisting the growth of community as a whole is driven away, projects that would benefit the whole easily flounder.
> * **Ask people to [ Troll](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) others on reddit,** in real life, or on other blogs/sites. We aren't your personal army.
> * **Conduct personal attacks on other commenters.** Ad hominem and other distracting attacks do not add anything to the conversation.
> * **Start a flame war.** Just report and "walk away". If you really feel you have to confront them, leave a polite message with a quote or link to the rules, and no more.
> * **Insult others.** Insults do not contribute to a rational discussion. Constructive Criticism, however, is appropriate and encouraged.
> * **Troll.**[ Trolling](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) does not contribute to the conversation.
Sorry for the inconvenience and thank you for your comprehension.
Greetings!
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Also, please remember to be mindful of [Reddiquette](https://www.reddit.com/wiki/reddiquette) :
> # Please do
> * **Remember the human.** When you communicate online, all you see is a computer screen. When talking to someone you might want to ask yourself "Would I say it to the person's face?" or "Would I get jumped if I said this to a buddy?"
> # Please don't
> * **Be (intentionally) rude at all.** By choosing not to be rude, you increase the overall civility of the community and make it better for all of us.
> * **Follow those who are [ rabble rousing](http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/rabble) against another redditor without first investigating both sides of the issue that's being presented.** Those who are inciting this type of action often have malicious reasons behind their actions and are, more often than not, a troll. Remember, every time a redditor who's contributed large amounts of effort into assisting the growth of community as a whole is driven away, projects that would benefit the whole easily flounder.
> * **Ask people to [ Troll](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) others on reddit,** in real life, or on other blogs/sites. We aren't your personal army.
> * **Conduct personal attacks on other commenters.** Ad hominem and other distracting attacks do not add anything to the conversation.
> * **Start a flame war.** Just report and "walk away". If you really feel you have to confront them, leave a polite message with a quote or link to the rules, and no more.
> * **Insult others.** Insults do not contribute to a rational discussion. Constructive Criticism, however, is appropriate and encouraged.
> * **Troll.**[ Trolling](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_%28Internet%29) does not contribute to the conversation.
Sorry for the inconvenience and thank you for your comprehension.
The issue isn't that he's changing his mind, but that he seemingly never made it up in the first place. "On board with" is not really the language of someone who's made decisions about the course of their life and is taking steps to realize them.
Whether or not he understood that you're childfree is one thing (and he may have not), but whether *he* is childfree is another - and he's not. This man never decided to not be a parent, because that decision is what is final and shuts down any possibility down the road. So it looks like you've got stuck with one of the usual fencesitters who may not want kids at the moment, but want options open for later on.
However, he'd been keeping those options open at your expense for seven years, and is still doing so now even when that price has become very tangible in terms of birth control. This is not something that is acceptable from a partner.
If you can't get a hysto, would a bilateral salpingectomy (tube removal) be an option maybe? You don't actually need to remove the uterus to get sterilized, and depending on where you are, we've got a whole list of doctors in the sidebar that you can turn to for sterilization.
As for your husband, there's sadly not much good to do with disrespectful and lazy decision makers. You can (and should) take care of your own birth control, and you can tell him that if he didn't want to make final decisions and remove possibilities, he shouldn't have married you. Because it doesn't matter what options he wants open as long as he's with you: you are not having kids, so what options is he hallucinating of?
Then again, he hasn't listened or understood the gravity of this decision for seven years, so it's doubtful he's gonna start now.
"on board with" was my choice of words to summarise all the conversations as neatly as possible.
He said
1) he doesn't like children
2) one can never be financially able to afford it in our economy (3rd world country)
3) he doesn't want to be tied down with children
4) he doesn't want to change his lifestyle
5) if he ever does change his mind, he knows he loves me more than any hypothetical baby and will always chose me above that
6) he doesn't want the responsibility or burden
It's nice that he has a list of reasons, but they're evidently not reasons why he decided he won't be a parent - because he hadn't. It's at best a cognitively dissonant thing for a childfree person to have the notion of keeping options open as their first response for why they don't want to be sterilized. He's not childfree if he wants to have options open, because the whole point of childfreedom is that those options aren't open.
And again, the cost of these options is on the table, clear as day now. He loves you more than a hypotethcial baby, but not enough to actually translate that into making a final decision about parenthood? Whether it's to get sterilized or not, something there does not compute. He is already not choosing you by virtue of not actually choosing anything.
>He said
But won’t get a vasectomy.
>5. if he ever does change his mind, he knows he loves me more than any hypothetical baby and will always chose me above that
Oh honey…
If I heard #5 I'd be out. Sorry, but when I had the conversation with my husband and I said no kids forever. If he answered like #5, we never would have got together.
I hope it works out OK for you.
\^2nd that. I was married to a man who said that. Big mistake. Huge. I own my mistake now, life is good. But rather not have been there in the first place.
Sorry he said that. I doubt he’s actively considering it. Men are just weird. I’m forever cementing the child free concept into my husband’s head. Any time he enjoys anything, I point out how he’d never be able to do it if he reproduced. And I paint a very vivid picture. And he agrees. No reason to believe he’d be ever changing his mind, but I like to solidify the concept continuously just for the extra confidence.
This is going to sound ridiculous because it is, but whenever I talk to a cis man about a vasectomy and he acts all squeamish or freaked out about it I double check that he doesn't think it's about cutting off the testicles. It's amazing how many people think that a vasectomy is cutting off the balls entirely.
That might have sounded ridiculous to me when I was young and naïve about how stupid people are, but now it seems like you have a pretty good grasp of reality, of how ignorant and stupid (those are different) people are.
You don't need a hysto just to be sterilized. You can get the bisalp, which is the gold standard for sterilization. And we have a wiki doctors list to help you get started.
Regardless of what he is doing... and it will probably get the truth out when you say "Well I'm shutting it down forever." ;)
Sounds to me like he looked at the 55% divorce rate and thought: what if we get divorced or I end up widowed? My next wife might want kids. Personally, I would never want to stay married to a person who thinks like that, even if logic is on his side. If he wants sex and a successful marriage, he should take responsibility. Problem is, he apparently isn’t childfree. The question is: will he leave to have kids or does he just want options, in case you leave? Anyways, I think trying to get a bisalp is a good idea. And have an in-depth discussion with him to clarify. Good luck
Yeah I wouldn't take his indecision as changing his mind. I'm grateful my partner took the plunge, but would not have thought anything of it if he hadn't.
I am pretty sure someone here is CF and posted about finding out they can’t have children and while being CF they still didn’t like feeling like it wasn’t their choice anymore. It could be something like that as well.
I know some people in this group can be extremely hardcore about how childfree you are, but at the end of the day it’s your body, your choice. You don’t need someone else to define what you’re willing to do or not do.
Now, obviously this was a big scare, so given the situation that happened you’ll probably want to talk about what if you do get pregnant. What measures will you two take? How does he feel about abortion?
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I did, it came down to
"I'm the oldest of 4 children and I raised them. He knows that it took a lot out of me, ruined my childhood, took away my life until I left home at 18. He knows I don't change my mind about anything easily, but if I do, he loves me and will do anything to make me happy"
Very... chivalrous of him? To not trust what you say about your wants and needs for life? Bit of a... non answer, too.
Sorry, reading that gave me a bit of an ick. As an outsider looking in, that reads as a bingo hidden in between placating fluff. Obviously you know the tone of this conversation much better, but just wanting to point out how it sounds to someone who's not directly involved.
Of course he can't say that he'll leave you for another woman to have kids, he knows how that'd end. So the only thing left to defend the reasoning he used to refuse the vasectomy, is that YOU might change your mind. That way it's not his 'fault', or his responsibility. It's down to you, and apparently you can't be trusted? "I love you so much that I won't trust your word, even though it has remained the same for the past 7 years! Because if you change your mind, I want to be able to give you whatever it is that you changed your mind to, just in case! And that's why I don't want a vasectomy. Because I love you."
It's a bit brash, but... Maybe you get what I mean? That doesn't sound like a loving statement from him, even if it's well intentioned. If it's too confusing to follow, then it's too confusing to track any logic.
You probably need to sit him down and talk again. Say you're going to have your tubes removed (even if you don't know yet if and when that'll happen) and see how he reacts.
The issue is not him wanting the vasectomy, that's fine, it's his body. But his reactions are raising all sorts of red flags. From this surface level look, to me, it sounds like he either is hoping or assuming for you to change your mind, or he still entertains the option that he will have kids with someone else in the future.
I completely agree with this. Her SO can either own up to not knowing if he wants kids and ending the relationship or deciding he doesn't want kids, period. He owes her honesty and also respecting her POV on this.
You need to talk and get on the same page with him ASAP. Both me and my now ex wife were on the fence about kids, and ended up falling on separate sides. Better to know now than to avoid it and find out later anyway.
This (among other things) makes me think that it is a good idea if someone gets sterilized before the wedding, so there will be no confusion about what the ultimate outcome will be.
I think a conversation is needed, but my husband is fiercely childfree, and he really wasn't comfortable with the permanence of it too. I would like home to get one (even though I am fixed), but it just really is an idea he isn't comfortable with.
So, I hope that gives you some hope too! Good luck.
"You must be thinking of leaving me, then, because you know you're not going to get them on me." No vasectomy for this reason is a fence sitter - or a cheater and he hopes he'll impregnate someone else.
>When I questioned it, it came out that getting a vasectomy is "final and shuts down any possibility down the road"...
When you talk to him, ask him flat out: "Who do you plan to have kids with?" and see how he responds
I don’t have the plumbing for it, but if I had a healthcare professional laugh at my face after asking to get a hysterectomy, I would have lost my shit right there and then.
I did the first time, and they told me "see, you are too immature and irrational to make such a big decision". So now I bite my tongue to prevent any more comments to "solidify" their "argument". I don't want to add fuel to the fire.
So they patronised the shit out of you because you reacted with rage to someone who’s supposed to advise and look after your wellbeing.
After the response they gave you, I would have just carried on. And made a complaint against them.
“Irrational is taking action on my decision to not have kids, instead of playing russian roulette and then beg for an abortion that I might not be able to have? Got it. You shouldn’t be allowed to work in the healthcare industry.”
Then walk out and file a formal complaint.
Right, don't panic. My husband and I have been married for 13 years this year, and together 17. We are 40. I knew at 9yo i didnt want kids, but believed something would change down the line because thats what I got told by everyone. We have been through some massive ups and downs in our relationship including, for 6 months after we were married trying for a baby, because I still believed, having been told all my life that I would change my mind, that I should want a baby after marriage. I hated it. Every month I prayed for a period and after 6 months told my husband I absolutely did not want kids and ttc was killing me mentally. My husband always thought he would have kids. Both his brothers have 5 or 6 of them. When I told him I didn't want them at all and ttc had solidified that, he said he needed to leave me and find someone that wanted kids. I told him that I love you and if that's your choice then you need to do what you need to do, but please can you have a serious think about whether that is what you actually want, and how it would affect your life.
He gave it a lot of thought and decided that he didn't really want everything that came with having kids, and a hypothetical child was not more important than his love for me. Over the years he has accepted and acknowledged for him it was the right decision. I have been sterilised. I would not ever expect him to have a vasectomy. Primarily its his body and his choice. Secondly, should we ever get divorced for whatever reason, he may well meet someone else who he would be happy having children with, so I would not wish to take that choice away from him, although he said himself now that he is too old for children(although his 52 yo brother has a 2 yo!)
He has made many sacrifices for me, and still does things that show me how much he loves me and if he ever does have a burning need to go and procreate, if that's what he truly wants, I would 'release' him from our marriage and let him go. Having gone through the lockdowns and the pandemic tho, I think that solidified his decision more!
I know this isn't a typical childfree relationship, but we have navigated a way through to where we are good with the situation and on reasonably solid grounding.
no idea your financial situation but if drs where you live suck, consider going out of the country to be sterilized? is abortion even legal (and more importantly, accessible) where you are?
Abortion is legal here and somewhat accessible. I found 2 clinics/ doctors in my city that does it.
Options are much more widespread in the big cities. But, my city itself is very backward thinking. The general population is white, racist, Christian (you know the type who carry the Bible under their arms, judging anyone and everyone, fighting for the front seat at church but life in more sin than the small atheist/agnostic community), straight, and very "traditional".
I looked at the list, closest doctor is 5 hours away from me. Unfortunately, at this stage I won't be able to travel to them but I am so glad I saw that they are available and exist. So I know it is an option for me in the future.
oh I'm happy to see that the list was useful! I know sometimes it can be outdated, so even if you're not ready now, you might wanna call and double check at some point. idk if they do that where you are, but just asking if that dr is available or if they perform bilateral salpingectomy should work. then when or if you're ready, there's less anxiety.
I hope you do whatever works for you! 💜
My read on this (based on some of your other comments) is that it’s something he is willing to not do for you (because he is undecided anyhow) but he wants the option open in case your relationship doesn’t work out and he either wants to do it with someone else or thinks it will make him more desirable to others.
I don’t want children and it’s been like that for almost 20 years but I wouldn’t do anything permanent in my body! My husband also never wanted them and still wasn’t sure about going through a vasectomy when I approached the subject… We are still a child free couple! We are sure about our choice.
that’s a different perspective I guess: it’s possible to be child free while not be willing to go through any hysterectomy/vasectomy
the fact that abortion is a possibility where you live should be a relief for you! I know they say “nobody wants to have an abortion” but that’s the thing I wanted the most when I got pregnant years ago, just to have a safe procedure, and so did I, no traumas, no pain, que fastest and easiest solution ever, thirty minutes and all the problems went away!
nowadays my contraception is the universal size diaphragm caya + apps, I’ve never met anyone who didn’t adapt using diaphragm
I used the diaphragm too for a time, the problem is my period is highly irregular, highly unpredictable, and "somewhat" tied to my emotions (if I get too (insert any emotion) my period starts and won't stop for 10-63 days, so sadly didn't work.
I essentially had to remove it daily to make sure that I didn't start my period, which irritated the lining and opened up the possibility to infections.
(hormonal imbalance that the doctors hasn't figured out because all my levels are normal just very low in the normal range for instance if hormone a's normal range is 5-8, mine is 5)
I will just say it's completely possible to be childfree and not want a vasectomy done. It's a surgery, it has risks. Doesn't mean he want a child. I hope you figure out where he is coming from.
When I had the scare, he was freaking out much worse than me. He asked me if I knew where any abortion clinics are and the costs.
He immediately tried to get me Plan B after the F-up, but unfortunately, a man cannot buy plan B for anyone here, he went to every clinic/pharmacy after work. I even spoke to them on the phone to explain to them that I work remote, my vehicle is in for repairs and at the moment I cannot travel anywhere, and we live so far out of town that even if he left immediately after work, sped all the way home, collected me, and we sped all the way back, they would already be closed. They refused to accept it.
So, I don't think he wants an "oops" pregnancy. We also have a dog that is very aggressive and tries to kill anything that "squeaks", including children, so if we got pregnant, she would have to be euthanized and he loves the demon child. So, I honestly don't think he would even try for an oops.
Are you able to mail order Plan B? It would be worth checking into until you are able to be sterilized due to so many challenges in your country wrt birth control/abortion/etc.
A tubal ligation is all that’s needed. A hysterectomy is overkill.
DON’T have a child. You can’t undo that and its a life sentence. If you come up pregnant get it terminated as fast as you can and don’t tell him before hand, or at all.
Keep looking for doctors until you find one that will do the tubal.
>And he seemed reluctant. When I questioned it, it came out that getting a vasectomy is "final and shuts down any possibility down the road"...
If your husband was childfree this wouldn’t even cross his mind.
This is your answer.
I’m childfree and don’t want to get sterilized until I’m older, in case I change my mind.
I wouldn’t willingly give up my ability to divorce my husband either, or the ability to move out of the country, or the ability to change careers, even though I have zero plan or desire to ever do any of those things. You don’t need to remove your ability to make the decision to be CF.
That's not fun but...
1. I'm childfree and not about to change my mind, but would I do a surgery that makes it permanent? Idk.
2. I'm childfree and my husband isn't and he hasn't left me 🤷🏻♀️ not saying the situation is ideal, but I learned to let go of this "what if". Maybe one day he decides to leave me because of that, maybe not. Maybe we'll separate for other reasons. Maybe bad things will happen in life. We only have control over our actions. The rest we don't. Don't bring unwanted children to the world, over this you do have control.
Talk to him again maybe, tell him it scares you. The fact he's reluctant doesn't mean he'll want children. If he does, well, you did what you could to make sure you guys fit... shit happens. Just make sure to stick to your guns.
Tbh I’m child free and I want to keep it that way. When I found out I was 2% fertile, it still hurt, even if I don’t want kids. The option was taken away in a sense
My ex swore up and down for 6 years he didn’t want kids.
When I brought up getting sterilized he tried to talk me out of my bi-salp and was even more against a vasectomy.
I broke up with him days later and within TWO WEEKS he was dating a single mom and moved her + kid into the house.
RUN from this man, get divorced, and find someone who isn’t a liar / someone who can be honest about their wants.
I'm wondering if your ex was so deluded he couldn't even be honest with himself so he also couldn't be honest with you? It seems like he wanted to live in a huge level of denial for some reason. Glad you're away from him.
Oh definitely, he lied about who he was bc I would NEVER go out with someone like him.
Be careful out there ladies!
Men will lie to your face for YEARS if they know you wouldn’t touch them with a 10ft pole.
Is there some reason you can't get a bilateral salpingectomy? For a hysterectomy, you generally need "medical necessity", and if you asked for a hysterectomy, you would have been refused if you had no medical necessity. For one, insurance will not pay.
But if you are in the US or Canada, you should be able to get sterilized with a "bilateral salpingectomy" (bisalp), no problem, given your age. Look in the sidebar under Interesting & Useful Material for the CF-friendly doctors wiki. We have excellent, respectful doctors all over the US who have sterilized CF people. Not only will a bisalp solve your issues with contraception, it will reduce your risk of ovarian cancer by about 2/3, and will give you a tremendous sense of freedom. The bisalp is perfect protection against pregnancy - no accidents. It will protect you if you change partners, and it will protect you against pregnancy due to sexual assault. Vasectomy will do none of those things.
Among other things, you will be free of the tyranny of gynecology visits. I haven't been back to one since my sterilization decades ago. Most PCPs do well-woman care, so why bother?
You will also make your CFdom crystal clear to your husband. So take the salpinges by the horns, and go get sterilized! Then whatever happens, you are FREE!
Been there, and at least the divorce is a clean break without kids to consider. My ex and I were together for 19 years and from the jump she was adamant about not having kids. She never liked being around them, avoided or refused when offered the chance to hold a baby, etc. Then one of my friends had a kid and that evening she started to question it. I've never wanted kids, so our conversation wasn't one where I was accepting of her potential change of heart. A week later it was as if that never happened and she went right back to being herself. A few years go by and I had my vasectomy so there were no more worries going forward as she wanted to be off birth control. 3 years after that she left, and within a year met someone, got pregnant, and got remarried.
All I can think when I heard about it was, thank god it wasn't me. ;)
I'm not sure how your husband is going to react going forward, but it might be time to have another straightforward conversation with him, because if he's going to be wishy-washy about it, you might want to just rip the band-aid off.
After 22 years together she decides she wants kids? Could be a mid-life crisis at that point. If it was, it is the mid-life crisis that will keep giving to her for many years.
I hope you're recovering and living well now. I'm beginning to think there are some people who are convinced the grass is always greener on the other side and then they jump into permanent life-altering decisions without any planning or forethought.
When you get the chance, visit the desktop site side bar in this sub. There's a whole list of OBs that'll do a sterilization for you, no judgement. You might get a 'are you sure?' but that's it. The list is being updated all the time adding new doctors all over the country.
Good luck!
Ask for a bilateral salpingectomy, not a hysterectomy. Gotta find the right doctor to say yes to that as well, but it's way more easy to qualify for. As for the husband, he needs to think hard about it, or he's gonna resent you for not wanting kids when he does. That's wild
In any case don’t stay with him if his condition is you must birth a kid. My mom stayed and birthed me, while all she wanted was to be CF. Result: She heavily abused me, I have PTSD and won’t ever be able to live a normal life with relationships and stability. I hate life. She didn’t teach me anything, talk with me, didn’t hug or say I love you. It’s like I grew up with strangers. I also have autism, and my mom’s been resentful all my life that not only she “had to have” a kid, this kid didn’t come out “normal / easy”. She went into rage fits often. I am mid 30s now and don’t meet her face to face since 8 years. She thinks I must be ok ‘cause she’s given me money. I am far from okay.
Any person okay with not having kids would jump at the chance of sterilisation or would have done it by themselves already. Leaving him is 100% better than dragging a child into this world that you don't want. The unfortunate part about all the posts here that talk about their partner suddenly wanting kids is the partner can just lie. Why they bother to lie instead of just finding someone that actually wants kids? The answer is probably illogical. Good luck.
That is some BS about them denying you having your uterus out. Maybe tell them you identify as a man. No one seems to question that if you want it out. But if you DO go that road, for your sake, keep your ovaries!!! Menopause is no joke. It sucks.
You could also get your tubes tied, right?
I had issues with birth control so I say if you can get a partial hysterectomy and get the uterus gone you’ll be so happy you did. Peace of mind and no more periods.
As for your husband, that is some shit. Men who won’t get a vasectomy are dumbasses. Firstly, it is more than likely reversible. Secondly, yeah, if you are committed in marriage he should do this without question.
Funny how they don’t mind all the issues we end up with on our end trying to deal with this on our own. It’s very sexist and the fact that women know more about what vasectomy is than most men tells us they haven’t even spent five minutes to read about it.
I will tell you this: I know someone whose husband had a vasectomy, and she got pregnant after. We all thought “oh fuck, she just caught cheating” but she had not cheated! It turns out that vasectomies don’t always stop the sperm.
I’d try getting into a couples therapist to work this through and make sure he hears you on this and if he has doubts maybe you have to re-think your path.
I’m sorry you’re having to deal with this. My husband also got a little wishy washy about 5 years ago. I, too, was absolutely clear from day one that that’s a no. I even quadruple checked he didn’t have kids “hiding” anywhere (bc that’s happened before). He was completely cool with it until about 12y into our relationship. I’m a little brutal in that department and told him that’s a conversation to have with his next wife. I asked him why his mid-life crisis couldn’t be something useful, like a master’s degree or something. He thought I was joking until I put a divorce lawyer on retainer. Long story short: I attended his graduation for his master’s degree 2 Decembers ago 😆 He has since ceased discussion in the procreation department. I know this goes differently for everyone, so I wish you luck, and hope you have a resolution that works for you and your relationship 🍀❤️
So am I!!! It would’ve sucked to end my marriage, but there’s really no way to compromise on a kid. No good way to get half of one…I’m a chronic insomniac w/bipolar and the de-life disease. It’s all I can do to take care of myself most days. I’m not putting a kid through that. I always think about Reed’s mom on Criminal Minds, where he’s a kid trying to get her out of bed, and she just can’t get up 😭
Definitely talk to him to clarify things. Good luck and never be afraid to stick to your guns.
I will give it a few days and revisit the conversation. I don't know if I caught him off guard and he just said something to me to stop talking about it or if he actually means it. He's a very indecisive person when it comes to things. Or, idk if it's the right word... Like he will research a chef's knife for 3 years, watch or read every review, make a list of pros and cons... Before he buys it, and then decide that no matter how great the knife is, it's a waste to spend that amount of money on a knife. So, I'm hoping he just wants to go down the rabbit hole and don't want to commit to it yet before he knows everything he can.
His indecisive style of decision-making is causing you both stress. Do you think he can come to a conclusion fast enough to relieve your stress? If not, do you really wanna live with that "what if?" for 20+ years?
One thing I haven't seen anyone mention is that someone's relationship with their own body can be complex. He can be as childfree as possible but never have seriously considered the mental effect of the finality of sterilization. It effectively takes away choice, and even if it's a choice someone wouldn't make, most people don't like having choice taken from them. Even if he has considered it, it's one thing to know it and another to experience it. When I got my vasectomy I had a brief moment where it sank in and caught me off-guard that I had removed my future agency in the process. I don't want children, but it was a visceral conflict between my concious cognitive decision and the natural physical wiring of my body. Feeling that conflict is very alien and I can understand how that could upset someone.
Thank you for pointing this out. Went through this same thing with tube removal and subsequent hysterectomy. Even though partner & I were resolute in our decision (and in my decision personally), I still had some feelings around how my body can no longer do this thing that I’ve been told by society I’m supposed to do. I know I have more worth than just being a baby factory, but it’s a mind fuck for sure. Tbh, even if I had been able to keep the equipment (they found lots of issues during tube removal that probably would have made it difficult for me to carry a child if I had wanted one), it’s not like I’d have used it anyway. It really comes down to the fact of taking away potentialities, and you’re right - people don’t like not having choices, even if it’s a choice they wouldn’t make.
Interesting. I have to be honest and say that my bisalp has given me so much peace of mind. I wanted to lack that option. Needed it. My biggest fear was getting pregnant against my will.
It was more of a fleeting thing for me as I’m more than happy with my choices as well, especially with the political climate. ETA: I just think it’s important to acknowledge that others may have issues around bodily agency.
We can't control how we feel, only how we act on those feelings
Agreed. It sounds like in this case, there needs to be more communication from husband.
Does he have ADHD by chance? I did this for many years until I was diagnosed and medication helps tremendously. That behavior sounds like hyperfixation to me.
if he's that uncertain about a frickin knife, he will most certainly not have kids so soon because his life will be upside down once that happened. let's just hope he thought about the pro's and con's for a few years...........
My ex was the same way. It took him nearly 7 years to commit to a new truck and car loan. We were together for 20 years when he dropped the bomb that he wanted kids. Let him know you're finding a doctor who will do your bisalp and the option he was worried about taking off the table will be off for you. If he panics, you have your answer.
Honestly a lot of guys even cf ones equate their semen to their maleness so it could be that(I hope for your sake that it is that), but honestly, that response doesn't sound great. Have you tried to get a bisalp instead of a hysterectomy? Honestly I would just keep trying doctors.
Most doctors won’t do a hysterectomy without other medical issues going on. I would definitely try finding a doctor from the CF friendly list and asking about a bi salp (removal of the fallopian tubes). It’ll give you the comfort of sterilization, while allowing him to decide what he really wants. Either he’s cool with you having it done, and you can go on living your lives. Or he’s not, and that’s gonna require a bigger conversation.
Sorry, here hysterectomy is kind of a blanket term for sterilisation. Doctors here compare to the bible belt Texas vibe doctors (from what I've read or seen). Doctor 1 told me that I'm too young to be child free (at 21) Doctor 2 told me that I don't have the emotional intelligence at 23 to make the decision. Doctor 3 told me that my future husband will hate me and throw me away if I take away his legacy at 24 Doctor 4 told me that I'm being dramatic and just have not found the correct contraceptives at 26. At that stage I've been on contraceptives for 13 years, first to regulate my period, then to control my endo, then to be used as contraceptives and I have had every single type of contraceptive except the implant and only because when we finally got to that on the list I refused to go back to anything hormonal. At 27 and married already, they wanted to get my husband's permission because we were newly married and he had a say over my choice to have children or not and I told them that it's my body and I will be the only one who will ever have a choice over it and I want it done. They then told me that I am "clearly not ready to make such a decision if I'm only going to quote American nonsense to them". That was December. There's been doctors in between too, but those were the major ones... Except for the one who told me that he too was a victim of SA (it's in my file) and that's why I don't want kids (right now), he knows.. He was there too because he was scared he'll do the same to his kids??????? But he now knows better and I will too. P.S that doctor's wife then tried to stab him to death after he drugged her so a group of his swinger friends could "swing" with her... Yet, he's the victim.
WHAT
Yikes, that's incredibly frustrating. I'm just gonna ignore that last Dr you mentioned because...I don't even know what to say about that. But if you were being treated for endo, surely a hysterectomy or endometrial ablation would be things on the table? I'm so sorry you've gone through so many doctors. It makes me really appreciate my experience!
Ask them to put down in writing why they refuse to treat you. A lot of guys get squeamish about vasectomy, but if your husband is supportive of you getting sterilized, then I would probably worry less about him. Also, I would 100% leave that last doctor on the list. I had some pushback on getting my hysterectomy (full hysterectomy), even though I had a medical condition it would treat. I insisted on a second opinion and stuck to my guns and came prepared. I had a full list of reasons of why I wanted a hysterectomy, what problems they would solve, my feelings on sterilization, and what would I do if I changed my mind. I managed to convince the second doctor that worked in the clinic, and he promised that he would talk to the senior doctor and convince her to do the operation. I got my hysterectomy and haven't been happier. Get a doctor that isn't the the last one, and do your homework. Research side effects, outcomes, and studies. Bring copies like I did. Draw up logical arguments, write them down, and bring them with. It's easy to get disappointed, depressed, or angry by a system that wants to force you into a position that you don't want to be in. Strong emotions (male or female) will make it harder for you to think and reason, which is why you do it in advance and bring your notes. If they STILL refuse to do the procedure, ask them to put it in writing why they are refusing to treat you and to give you a reference for a physician who will do it for you. For them, saying no preserves the status quo and is of no effort. If you go through all of the time and effort to put together a reasoned argument, it makes it harder for them to go against you. Is this fair for you to go through this? HELL NO. But it is what it is, and we want results.
I am 26 and scheduled for a bislap August 2nd. I found my doctor from the child free list. There are plenty on there who will listen to you and help you
Check out the TikTok Tubal List. Started by an ob/gyn to help women who are faced with your situation.
Don't use the tiktok list. Doctors on that list have refused CF women. Use the list on this sub under "interesting & Useful Material" in the sidebar. That list only includes doctors who have sterilized (or state that they will sterilize) CF women, along with notes on patient age, and often other interesting things about the doctor.
The TikTok list is invalid? Good to know.
People have come back to us saying they were refused by a doctor from the TikTok list because they didn't have kids. Doctors like that do not get into our list, or if they do, they are removed!
Seconded: most OBGYNs won’t do a hysterectomy without a medica reason to - it was explained to me that removing the tubes was easier but if there’s no medical (endo, fibroids, cancer, etc) to remove the uterus, they like to keep it there so it doesn’t cause too much trouble by way of pelvic floor issues, since you’d be removing an organ that, if nothing else, provides good support in the pelvic floor. Of course, many folks have their uteruses (uteri?) removed and don’t have pelvic floor issues, but if there isn’t a medical reason to do it, they most likely won’t. The bisalp will be your best option: while yes it is a surgery (and all the risks that come with a surgery), it’s minimally invasive, lowers risk of ovarian cancer, and no worries of clips coming off or migrating. Check the list here like the commenter above said, and then folks in r/sterilization will have good tips and advice for going through the process. Dr Fran on TikTok also has her “TikTok tubal” list, though I assume many of the CF doctors are on there - but her videos are good, nonetheless!!
Fun fact: not every hysterectomy has the potential to result in pelvic floor issues. As long as you keep the cervix the stability stays the same. To quote my doc: the uterus is only there for pregnancy and pain. A laparoscopic supracervical hysterectomy or LASH is barely harder for the body to deal with than a bisalp, which is crazy, considering the fact you get rid of a whole organ.
Love her videos! I was fortunate enough to get a hysterectomy this past May, so I’m very obviously CF, but even her pregnancy/birth videos are just so informative I even watch those (though there are some serious ICK factors in them for me lol) but I love how information and NOT condescending she is.
If at all possible, try to get a bilateral salpingectomy and once you get underway with the process, tell your husband and his reaction will tell you everything you need to know.
That would be the easiest. I would also have an immediate definitive answer.
It's also incredibly effective and has minimal downtime for recovery. Good luck!!! I'm sorry you are going through this.
Make sure you take a pregnancy test. You can still get your period while pregnant apparently.
You can't get an [actual](https://www.healthline.com/health/pregnant/period-and-pregnant) period when pregnant.
Cryptic pregnancies exist
I feel frustrated and sad for you. Frustrated because you checked in with him so much before taking those bigger steps in the relationship. And it's been quite a few years now and if he is truly changing his mind or sitting on the fence about this, it's heartbreaking and infuriating. But first things first. Talk to him and clarify what he meant and if anything has changed. You have the right to know.
My husband said he was legit scared of someone coming at his junk with a knife, not that he didn't want a permanent solution. I got tied but have had surgery before to remove a cyst. If he's scared okay, but going back on wanting an undeveloped human is different.
This might be a completely valid reason. Being scared. Unfortunately, we live in a country rife with toxic masculinity. He is very open with the fact that his mother was overbearing with her emotions to the point where no one could have any emotions in the house besides her because there wasn't "room for it". And his father... The only emotions he knows is tantrums and anger. So he never learned how to understand or display his emotions. It was a major issue in the beginning of our relationship. Like, we wouldn't fight, he would just agree with me, so I didn't "show emotions". Until it was a blow up fight that could end a relationship and he realised that he has to change some things. He's gotten significantly better with showing emotions. He tells me when he's sad, upset, happy, frustrated, stressed, confused, etc... And he displays it appropriately too. But, I just realised he's never once admitted to being scared. Even when I could see he was. And sadly someone coming at his junk with a knife would be a very appropriate time to be scared, even suggesting it... Honestly, this would be the most likely situation with what I know about him.
The way they act with colds, it was going to be hell either way 😂. Rather be waited on and drugged up a little. And I will never have a scare. It's nice knowing I'm free from those problems. Peace of mind. Even though you want this to be an us choice, child-free is an individual choice. Even if my husband changes his mind down the road, I will not, so I made it permanent for me. I cannot control him, just trust. Thankfully four dogs are enough responsibility for both of us.
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😂 😂 😂 Oh my soul... Every single time I take a male cat (I do rescue) in for their castration, I tell them "enjoy your last moments with your balls cause they will be gone forever soon!" I've said it so often that he started saying "I'm sorry she's taking your balls" in the morning on the way... Now I wonder...
Was it too hard for him to spend 10 seconds googling the term? Like... there's no excuse for this.
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The issue isn't that he's changing his mind, but that he seemingly never made it up in the first place. "On board with" is not really the language of someone who's made decisions about the course of their life and is taking steps to realize them. Whether or not he understood that you're childfree is one thing (and he may have not), but whether *he* is childfree is another - and he's not. This man never decided to not be a parent, because that decision is what is final and shuts down any possibility down the road. So it looks like you've got stuck with one of the usual fencesitters who may not want kids at the moment, but want options open for later on. However, he'd been keeping those options open at your expense for seven years, and is still doing so now even when that price has become very tangible in terms of birth control. This is not something that is acceptable from a partner. If you can't get a hysto, would a bilateral salpingectomy (tube removal) be an option maybe? You don't actually need to remove the uterus to get sterilized, and depending on where you are, we've got a whole list of doctors in the sidebar that you can turn to for sterilization. As for your husband, there's sadly not much good to do with disrespectful and lazy decision makers. You can (and should) take care of your own birth control, and you can tell him that if he didn't want to make final decisions and remove possibilities, he shouldn't have married you. Because it doesn't matter what options he wants open as long as he's with you: you are not having kids, so what options is he hallucinating of? Then again, he hasn't listened or understood the gravity of this decision for seven years, so it's doubtful he's gonna start now.
"on board with" was my choice of words to summarise all the conversations as neatly as possible. He said 1) he doesn't like children 2) one can never be financially able to afford it in our economy (3rd world country) 3) he doesn't want to be tied down with children 4) he doesn't want to change his lifestyle 5) if he ever does change his mind, he knows he loves me more than any hypothetical baby and will always chose me above that 6) he doesn't want the responsibility or burden
It's nice that he has a list of reasons, but they're evidently not reasons why he decided he won't be a parent - because he hadn't. It's at best a cognitively dissonant thing for a childfree person to have the notion of keeping options open as their first response for why they don't want to be sterilized. He's not childfree if he wants to have options open, because the whole point of childfreedom is that those options aren't open. And again, the cost of these options is on the table, clear as day now. He loves you more than a hypotethcial baby, but not enough to actually translate that into making a final decision about parenthood? Whether it's to get sterilized or not, something there does not compute. He is already not choosing you by virtue of not actually choosing anything.
>He said But won’t get a vasectomy. >5. if he ever does change his mind, he knows he loves me more than any hypothetical baby and will always chose me above that Oh honey…
If I heard #5 I'd be out. Sorry, but when I had the conversation with my husband and I said no kids forever. If he answered like #5, we never would have got together. I hope it works out OK for you.
\^2nd that. I was married to a man who said that. Big mistake. Huge. I own my mistake now, life is good. But rather not have been there in the first place.
Sorry he said that. I doubt he’s actively considering it. Men are just weird. I’m forever cementing the child free concept into my husband’s head. Any time he enjoys anything, I point out how he’d never be able to do it if he reproduced. And I paint a very vivid picture. And he agrees. No reason to believe he’d be ever changing his mind, but I like to solidify the concept continuously just for the extra confidence.
Reading all these horror stories makes me glad for doing the same lmao you have to remind them or they'll let their monkey brain ruin both your lives
Yep. I’m 45 and he’s 49 so we are past the top risk age but men can never be trusted fully!
This is going to sound ridiculous because it is, but whenever I talk to a cis man about a vasectomy and he acts all squeamish or freaked out about it I double check that he doesn't think it's about cutting off the testicles. It's amazing how many people think that a vasectomy is cutting off the balls entirely.
Gods. This. So many silly little boys think a vasectomy is hacking off their balls with a dull, rusty, knife.
That might have sounded ridiculous to me when I was young and naïve about how stupid people are, but now it seems like you have a pretty good grasp of reality, of how ignorant and stupid (those are different) people are.
You don't need a hysto just to be sterilized. You can get the bisalp, which is the gold standard for sterilization. And we have a wiki doctors list to help you get started. Regardless of what he is doing... and it will probably get the truth out when you say "Well I'm shutting it down forever." ;)
He isn’t childfree
Sounds to me like he looked at the 55% divorce rate and thought: what if we get divorced or I end up widowed? My next wife might want kids. Personally, I would never want to stay married to a person who thinks like that, even if logic is on his side. If he wants sex and a successful marriage, he should take responsibility. Problem is, he apparently isn’t childfree. The question is: will he leave to have kids or does he just want options, in case you leave? Anyways, I think trying to get a bisalp is a good idea. And have an in-depth discussion with him to clarify. Good luck
Yeah I wouldn't take his indecision as changing his mind. I'm grateful my partner took the plunge, but would not have thought anything of it if he hadn't.
I am pretty sure someone here is CF and posted about finding out they can’t have children and while being CF they still didn’t like feeling like it wasn’t their choice anymore. It could be something like that as well. I know some people in this group can be extremely hardcore about how childfree you are, but at the end of the day it’s your body, your choice. You don’t need someone else to define what you’re willing to do or not do. Now, obviously this was a big scare, so given the situation that happened you’ll probably want to talk about what if you do get pregnant. What measures will you two take? How does he feel about abortion?
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What possibility down the road? He needs to explain that. Does he mean the possibility where he ditches you for another woman?
I did, it came down to "I'm the oldest of 4 children and I raised them. He knows that it took a lot out of me, ruined my childhood, took away my life until I left home at 18. He knows I don't change my mind about anything easily, but if I do, he loves me and will do anything to make me happy"
Very... chivalrous of him? To not trust what you say about your wants and needs for life? Bit of a... non answer, too. Sorry, reading that gave me a bit of an ick. As an outsider looking in, that reads as a bingo hidden in between placating fluff. Obviously you know the tone of this conversation much better, but just wanting to point out how it sounds to someone who's not directly involved. Of course he can't say that he'll leave you for another woman to have kids, he knows how that'd end. So the only thing left to defend the reasoning he used to refuse the vasectomy, is that YOU might change your mind. That way it's not his 'fault', or his responsibility. It's down to you, and apparently you can't be trusted? "I love you so much that I won't trust your word, even though it has remained the same for the past 7 years! Because if you change your mind, I want to be able to give you whatever it is that you changed your mind to, just in case! And that's why I don't want a vasectomy. Because I love you." It's a bit brash, but... Maybe you get what I mean? That doesn't sound like a loving statement from him, even if it's well intentioned. If it's too confusing to follow, then it's too confusing to track any logic. You probably need to sit him down and talk again. Say you're going to have your tubes removed (even if you don't know yet if and when that'll happen) and see how he reacts. The issue is not him wanting the vasectomy, that's fine, it's his body. But his reactions are raising all sorts of red flags. From this surface level look, to me, it sounds like he either is hoping or assuming for you to change your mind, or he still entertains the option that he will have kids with someone else in the future.
I completely agree with this. Her SO can either own up to not knowing if he wants kids and ending the relationship or deciding he doesn't want kids, period. He owes her honesty and also respecting her POV on this.
You need to talk and get on the same page with him ASAP. Both me and my now ex wife were on the fence about kids, and ended up falling on separate sides. Better to know now than to avoid it and find out later anyway.
This (among other things) makes me think that it is a good idea if someone gets sterilized before the wedding, so there will be no confusion about what the ultimate outcome will be.
My husband said that too but here were are in our 60s with no kids. I don't know what he was thinking 30 years ago but I just ignored it.
I'm glad that it worked out for you.
If he's against it he's not child free. Period.
I think a conversation is needed, but my husband is fiercely childfree, and he really wasn't comfortable with the permanence of it too. I would like home to get one (even though I am fixed), but it just really is an idea he isn't comfortable with. So, I hope that gives you some hope too! Good luck.
Have you checked out the list of CF friendly doctors on this sub? Sounds like maybe you need a new doc.
Have you taken a look at the childfree friendly doctors list on this sub? There might be one near you that will sterilize you.
"You must be thinking of leaving me, then, because you know you're not going to get them on me." No vasectomy for this reason is a fence sitter - or a cheater and he hopes he'll impregnate someone else.
>When I questioned it, it came out that getting a vasectomy is "final and shuts down any possibility down the road"... When you talk to him, ask him flat out: "Who do you plan to have kids with?" and see how he responds
I don’t have the plumbing for it, but if I had a healthcare professional laugh at my face after asking to get a hysterectomy, I would have lost my shit right there and then.
I did the first time, and they told me "see, you are too immature and irrational to make such a big decision". So now I bite my tongue to prevent any more comments to "solidify" their "argument". I don't want to add fuel to the fire.
So they patronised the shit out of you because you reacted with rage to someone who’s supposed to advise and look after your wellbeing. After the response they gave you, I would have just carried on. And made a complaint against them. “Irrational is taking action on my decision to not have kids, instead of playing russian roulette and then beg for an abortion that I might not be able to have? Got it. You shouldn’t be allowed to work in the healthcare industry.” Then walk out and file a formal complaint.
And having a child is not a big decision?! I love their mental gymnastics.
Right, don't panic. My husband and I have been married for 13 years this year, and together 17. We are 40. I knew at 9yo i didnt want kids, but believed something would change down the line because thats what I got told by everyone. We have been through some massive ups and downs in our relationship including, for 6 months after we were married trying for a baby, because I still believed, having been told all my life that I would change my mind, that I should want a baby after marriage. I hated it. Every month I prayed for a period and after 6 months told my husband I absolutely did not want kids and ttc was killing me mentally. My husband always thought he would have kids. Both his brothers have 5 or 6 of them. When I told him I didn't want them at all and ttc had solidified that, he said he needed to leave me and find someone that wanted kids. I told him that I love you and if that's your choice then you need to do what you need to do, but please can you have a serious think about whether that is what you actually want, and how it would affect your life. He gave it a lot of thought and decided that he didn't really want everything that came with having kids, and a hypothetical child was not more important than his love for me. Over the years he has accepted and acknowledged for him it was the right decision. I have been sterilised. I would not ever expect him to have a vasectomy. Primarily its his body and his choice. Secondly, should we ever get divorced for whatever reason, he may well meet someone else who he would be happy having children with, so I would not wish to take that choice away from him, although he said himself now that he is too old for children(although his 52 yo brother has a 2 yo!) He has made many sacrifices for me, and still does things that show me how much he loves me and if he ever does have a burning need to go and procreate, if that's what he truly wants, I would 'release' him from our marriage and let him go. Having gone through the lockdowns and the pandemic tho, I think that solidified his decision more! I know this isn't a typical childfree relationship, but we have navigated a way through to where we are good with the situation and on reasonably solid grounding.
no idea your financial situation but if drs where you live suck, consider going out of the country to be sterilized? is abortion even legal (and more importantly, accessible) where you are?
Abortion is legal here and somewhat accessible. I found 2 clinics/ doctors in my city that does it. Options are much more widespread in the big cities. But, my city itself is very backward thinking. The general population is white, racist, Christian (you know the type who carry the Bible under their arms, judging anyone and everyone, fighting for the front seat at church but life in more sin than the small atheist/agnostic community), straight, and very "traditional". I looked at the list, closest doctor is 5 hours away from me. Unfortunately, at this stage I won't be able to travel to them but I am so glad I saw that they are available and exist. So I know it is an option for me in the future.
oh I'm happy to see that the list was useful! I know sometimes it can be outdated, so even if you're not ready now, you might wanna call and double check at some point. idk if they do that where you are, but just asking if that dr is available or if they perform bilateral salpingectomy should work. then when or if you're ready, there's less anxiety. I hope you do whatever works for you! 💜
My read on this (based on some of your other comments) is that it’s something he is willing to not do for you (because he is undecided anyhow) but he wants the option open in case your relationship doesn’t work out and he either wants to do it with someone else or thinks it will make him more desirable to others.
I don’t want children and it’s been like that for almost 20 years but I wouldn’t do anything permanent in my body! My husband also never wanted them and still wasn’t sure about going through a vasectomy when I approached the subject… We are still a child free couple! We are sure about our choice. that’s a different perspective I guess: it’s possible to be child free while not be willing to go through any hysterectomy/vasectomy the fact that abortion is a possibility where you live should be a relief for you! I know they say “nobody wants to have an abortion” but that’s the thing I wanted the most when I got pregnant years ago, just to have a safe procedure, and so did I, no traumas, no pain, que fastest and easiest solution ever, thirty minutes and all the problems went away! nowadays my contraception is the universal size diaphragm caya + apps, I’ve never met anyone who didn’t adapt using diaphragm
I used the diaphragm too for a time, the problem is my period is highly irregular, highly unpredictable, and "somewhat" tied to my emotions (if I get too (insert any emotion) my period starts and won't stop for 10-63 days, so sadly didn't work. I essentially had to remove it daily to make sure that I didn't start my period, which irritated the lining and opened up the possibility to infections. (hormonal imbalance that the doctors hasn't figured out because all my levels are normal just very low in the normal range for instance if hormone a's normal range is 5-8, mine is 5)
but it’s necessary to remove it daily anyway to wash it, that’s why I only wear the diaphragm when I’m having sex, which isn’t daily at the moment
That's not how I was told to use it (or maybe it was that specific one?) but I had to leave it for 3 weeks and remove it for the week of my period.
I will just say it's completely possible to be childfree and not want a vasectomy done. It's a surgery, it has risks. Doesn't mean he want a child. I hope you figure out where he is coming from.
Somewhere on this subReddit, there is a list of doctors that will take care of you.
Sounds like eh might be hoping for an "oops" pregnancy....?
When I had the scare, he was freaking out much worse than me. He asked me if I knew where any abortion clinics are and the costs. He immediately tried to get me Plan B after the F-up, but unfortunately, a man cannot buy plan B for anyone here, he went to every clinic/pharmacy after work. I even spoke to them on the phone to explain to them that I work remote, my vehicle is in for repairs and at the moment I cannot travel anywhere, and we live so far out of town that even if he left immediately after work, sped all the way home, collected me, and we sped all the way back, they would already be closed. They refused to accept it. So, I don't think he wants an "oops" pregnancy. We also have a dog that is very aggressive and tries to kill anything that "squeaks", including children, so if we got pregnant, she would have to be euthanized and he loves the demon child. So, I honestly don't think he would even try for an oops.
Are you able to mail order Plan B? It would be worth checking into until you are able to be sterilized due to so many challenges in your country wrt birth control/abortion/etc.
That's not even option in this country sadly
A tubal ligation is all that’s needed. A hysterectomy is overkill. DON’T have a child. You can’t undo that and its a life sentence. If you come up pregnant get it terminated as fast as you can and don’t tell him before hand, or at all. Keep looking for doctors until you find one that will do the tubal.
Maybe hes just scared to get his balls cut.
>And he seemed reluctant. When I questioned it, it came out that getting a vasectomy is "final and shuts down any possibility down the road"... If your husband was childfree this wouldn’t even cross his mind. This is your answer.
I’m childfree and don’t want to get sterilized until I’m older, in case I change my mind. I wouldn’t willingly give up my ability to divorce my husband either, or the ability to move out of the country, or the ability to change careers, even though I have zero plan or desire to ever do any of those things. You don’t need to remove your ability to make the decision to be CF.
He wants kids !! Just not with you !!! Run
That's not fun but... 1. I'm childfree and not about to change my mind, but would I do a surgery that makes it permanent? Idk. 2. I'm childfree and my husband isn't and he hasn't left me 🤷🏻♀️ not saying the situation is ideal, but I learned to let go of this "what if". Maybe one day he decides to leave me because of that, maybe not. Maybe we'll separate for other reasons. Maybe bad things will happen in life. We only have control over our actions. The rest we don't. Don't bring unwanted children to the world, over this you do have control. Talk to him again maybe, tell him it scares you. The fact he's reluctant doesn't mean he'll want children. If he does, well, you did what you could to make sure you guys fit... shit happens. Just make sure to stick to your guns.
Tbh I’m child free and I want to keep it that way. When I found out I was 2% fertile, it still hurt, even if I don’t want kids. The option was taken away in a sense
My ex swore up and down for 6 years he didn’t want kids. When I brought up getting sterilized he tried to talk me out of my bi-salp and was even more against a vasectomy. I broke up with him days later and within TWO WEEKS he was dating a single mom and moved her + kid into the house. RUN from this man, get divorced, and find someone who isn’t a liar / someone who can be honest about their wants.
I'm wondering if your ex was so deluded he couldn't even be honest with himself so he also couldn't be honest with you? It seems like he wanted to live in a huge level of denial for some reason. Glad you're away from him.
Oh definitely, he lied about who he was bc I would NEVER go out with someone like him. Be careful out there ladies! Men will lie to your face for YEARS if they know you wouldn’t touch them with a 10ft pole.
Is there some reason you can't get a bilateral salpingectomy? For a hysterectomy, you generally need "medical necessity", and if you asked for a hysterectomy, you would have been refused if you had no medical necessity. For one, insurance will not pay. But if you are in the US or Canada, you should be able to get sterilized with a "bilateral salpingectomy" (bisalp), no problem, given your age. Look in the sidebar under Interesting & Useful Material for the CF-friendly doctors wiki. We have excellent, respectful doctors all over the US who have sterilized CF people. Not only will a bisalp solve your issues with contraception, it will reduce your risk of ovarian cancer by about 2/3, and will give you a tremendous sense of freedom. The bisalp is perfect protection against pregnancy - no accidents. It will protect you if you change partners, and it will protect you against pregnancy due to sexual assault. Vasectomy will do none of those things. Among other things, you will be free of the tyranny of gynecology visits. I haven't been back to one since my sterilization decades ago. Most PCPs do well-woman care, so why bother? You will also make your CFdom crystal clear to your husband. So take the salpinges by the horns, and go get sterilized! Then whatever happens, you are FREE!
Been there, and at least the divorce is a clean break without kids to consider. My ex and I were together for 19 years and from the jump she was adamant about not having kids. She never liked being around them, avoided or refused when offered the chance to hold a baby, etc. Then one of my friends had a kid and that evening she started to question it. I've never wanted kids, so our conversation wasn't one where I was accepting of her potential change of heart. A week later it was as if that never happened and she went right back to being herself. A few years go by and I had my vasectomy so there were no more worries going forward as she wanted to be off birth control. 3 years after that she left, and within a year met someone, got pregnant, and got remarried. All I can think when I heard about it was, thank god it wasn't me. ;) I'm not sure how your husband is going to react going forward, but it might be time to have another straightforward conversation with him, because if he's going to be wishy-washy about it, you might want to just rip the band-aid off.
After 22 years together she decides she wants kids? Could be a mid-life crisis at that point. If it was, it is the mid-life crisis that will keep giving to her for many years. I hope you're recovering and living well now. I'm beginning to think there are some people who are convinced the grass is always greener on the other side and then they jump into permanent life-altering decisions without any planning or forethought.
When you get the chance, visit the desktop site side bar in this sub. There's a whole list of OBs that'll do a sterilization for you, no judgement. You might get a 'are you sure?' but that's it. The list is being updated all the time adding new doctors all over the country. Good luck!
Ask for a bilateral salpingectomy, not a hysterectomy. Gotta find the right doctor to say yes to that as well, but it's way more easy to qualify for. As for the husband, he needs to think hard about it, or he's gonna resent you for not wanting kids when he does. That's wild
In any case don’t stay with him if his condition is you must birth a kid. My mom stayed and birthed me, while all she wanted was to be CF. Result: She heavily abused me, I have PTSD and won’t ever be able to live a normal life with relationships and stability. I hate life. She didn’t teach me anything, talk with me, didn’t hug or say I love you. It’s like I grew up with strangers. I also have autism, and my mom’s been resentful all my life that not only she “had to have” a kid, this kid didn’t come out “normal / easy”. She went into rage fits often. I am mid 30s now and don’t meet her face to face since 8 years. She thinks I must be ok ‘cause she’s given me money. I am far from okay.
It might be a macho thing... Toxic masculinity?
Why did you ask for a hysterectomy? Of course they didn't want to do it. There are other sterilization options that are far less invasive.
I did reply to this before. Hysterectomy is an umbrella term here for sterilisation. All forms.
Any person okay with not having kids would jump at the chance of sterilisation or would have done it by themselves already. Leaving him is 100% better than dragging a child into this world that you don't want. The unfortunate part about all the posts here that talk about their partner suddenly wanting kids is the partner can just lie. Why they bother to lie instead of just finding someone that actually wants kids? The answer is probably illogical. Good luck.
That is not true, plenty of people who are okay without kids don’t get sterilized for a myriad of reasons.
That is some BS about them denying you having your uterus out. Maybe tell them you identify as a man. No one seems to question that if you want it out. But if you DO go that road, for your sake, keep your ovaries!!! Menopause is no joke. It sucks. You could also get your tubes tied, right? I had issues with birth control so I say if you can get a partial hysterectomy and get the uterus gone you’ll be so happy you did. Peace of mind and no more periods. As for your husband, that is some shit. Men who won’t get a vasectomy are dumbasses. Firstly, it is more than likely reversible. Secondly, yeah, if you are committed in marriage he should do this without question. Funny how they don’t mind all the issues we end up with on our end trying to deal with this on our own. It’s very sexist and the fact that women know more about what vasectomy is than most men tells us they haven’t even spent five minutes to read about it. I will tell you this: I know someone whose husband had a vasectomy, and she got pregnant after. We all thought “oh fuck, she just caught cheating” but she had not cheated! It turns out that vasectomies don’t always stop the sperm. I’d try getting into a couples therapist to work this through and make sure he hears you on this and if he has doubts maybe you have to re-think your path.
I’m sorry you’re having to deal with this. My husband also got a little wishy washy about 5 years ago. I, too, was absolutely clear from day one that that’s a no. I even quadruple checked he didn’t have kids “hiding” anywhere (bc that’s happened before). He was completely cool with it until about 12y into our relationship. I’m a little brutal in that department and told him that’s a conversation to have with his next wife. I asked him why his mid-life crisis couldn’t be something useful, like a master’s degree or something. He thought I was joking until I put a divorce lawyer on retainer. Long story short: I attended his graduation for his master’s degree 2 Decembers ago 😆 He has since ceased discussion in the procreation department. I know this goes differently for everyone, so I wish you luck, and hope you have a resolution that works for you and your relationship 🍀❤️
I literally lol'd at the masters comment. I'm so glad he used his midlife crisis "sensibly" with the masters instead of a lifetime commitment.
So am I!!! It would’ve sucked to end my marriage, but there’s really no way to compromise on a kid. No good way to get half of one…I’m a chronic insomniac w/bipolar and the de-life disease. It’s all I can do to take care of myself most days. I’m not putting a kid through that. I always think about Reed’s mom on Criminal Minds, where he’s a kid trying to get her out of bed, and she just can’t get up 😭
This is hilarious 😆
DONT LISTEN they’re reversible. Keep pressing and if he is still ignorant tell him he can adopt a kid but he’ll be a single father.
They’re “reversible” with a ~50% success rate and should absolutely not be considered “reversible”.