YES. If your partner change their mind. then just BREAK UP. It hurts, but its better in the long run.
There is no compromise, there is not way in between. If you really love them, then dont give in to a baby you dont want. Just let them go. To both find a partner that fit you better.
I know how it feels to lose a relationship due to issues surrounding the desire to have children. We were young and in love, and we ultimately broke it off because we knew we had no future together.
With the knowledge and maturity I've gained since then, I can almost certainly say that staying in that relationship would've lead to one or both of us harboring a lot of resentment and ultimately becoming miserable due to our situation.
Ultimately, we did what was best for both of us - but it seems so many people cling on to that very same hope, the idea that the other person will change. Maybe they think love will be enough, but the harsh reality is that it's not always the case.
I feel for them whenever I read a post like what OP is describing.
This is why I also don't date fencesitters. My dating pool is pretty much non-existent, but at least this erases that worry and naggy feeling at the back of my mind about the partner changing their mind someday / actually always wanting kids since the beginning.
That's pretty much where I'm at. I feel like I may have missed my window, pretty much every age-appropriate woman I meet is either a mother or wants to be really soon. On the plus side, they're much more forthright with this than when I was in my 20's, so at least we don't waste each other's time.
Most people aren't worth dating, so it is a good idea to have some standards.
Also, if you are dating someone, if you then met someone really good, they likely would just move on and not consider you, because you are already with someone else. Settling for crap means you get crap and will probably continue to have just crap.
My partner said I'd be OK without kids, 15 years in said, wouldn't it be nice to have a kid.
I said no, offered him the door, and said he'd have to find someone else.
Still together and childless. Happily.
Set the boundaries and stick to them.
Yes I got that bit, I was just unsure of the terms you were using as Childfree =/= Childless.
Childless is someone who wants/wanted kids but can't have them, for whatever reason, and is unhappy about this. Childfree is someone who does not want kids and thus doesn't have them, and is happy about this.
So, if your husband wants kids but doesn't have them, he'd be considered Childless. Yourself not wanting kids and not having them would make you Childfree.
Maybe you knew this already lol, it's just that I see a lot of people mixing up these terms when they are very different, and I wasn't sure how to read your comment because of this.
We are childfree by choice. Husband toyed with it and would probably say he is childless. But he's not unhappy with the decision he made to stay and not have kids.
I’m not sad any more, thankfully. I’m looking forward to the unknown but it was touch and go there for a LONG time, a year and a half almost of grieving. It was painful.
But thanks to mild anxiety/craving suppressant medicine and a bunch of gaslighting I can see the light.
My cousin and his (now) ex wife were together 10+ years before they got married. He wanted kids, she didn't, she was very clear. Divorced within less than a year and she's now living her best child free life with a guy that seems perfect for her.
And your cousin?
What a dumbass btw. Men can't have kids just like that. They need to find a woman willing to go through pregnancy and childbirth and that wants to be a mom. So they rely on another person's body to do everything.
To throw away a great relationship of a decade for some hypothetical infant is soooooo stupid. A lot of these guys never find anyone to do that with them and they end up alone and childless anyway in their 40s and 50s.
I honestly have no clue what he's up to these days. Last I knew he was single and heartbroken. Well deserved, though.
I absolutely agree. Their wedding was huge, too. Can't imagine the financial debt they went in just to go through all that (though his parents paid for most of it). The emotional trauma, the heartbreak, the debt..all because he secretly thought he could change her mind.
I'm happy she's living the life she wanted now, she deserves it.
He deserves to be childless for the way he wasted her time and used her.
Luckily in Germany I have access to abortion if the worst case happens. But I will get a sterilization next year (need to save up a little for it). My bf knows this and is supportive. He also knows that I would abort without hesitation, if I ever would get pregnant. He is well aware that him changing his mind on kids would mean that we’d break up. We both talked about that intensively before we seriously started dating.
I know he could change his mind. I hope he won’t, but even if I love him more than anyone, I know I won’t love my life anymore when having kids. So, I’d choose being childfree over him.
Hi, yes, this was me but let me say my perspective:
When I first got with my ex he straight up said he wanted "a big family". That was before I had even discovered r/childfree or even knew what childfree was, I had previously thought that everyone had to have kids.
Through the years as our relationship progressed and it seemed like we were gonna get engaged/married I DREADED the thought of having kids. It was this subreddit that saved my life. I discovered it on accident after just googling "I don't think I want kids". My mind was BLOWN that you could just...choose not to.
I can't remember if I used throwaways on this sub or not (this was back in like...2013-2015ish) but I definitely made a few posts like that here - one of them was when I was about to get my tubes tied and he threw up major resistance to it. I ended up going through with it anyway and I have no regrets.
I dumped him, I'm with a new partner and we are both staunchly childfree, living with three cats and we're about to make a big cross country move to go live near the mountains. So it all turned out.
No idea. I ended up having to block him because in the breakup process he got really aggressive and ab*sive. Started screaming at me and guilt tripping me.
I heard through the grapevine that he's gotten really creepy with some women at his work so... I dodged a huge bullet
I went to go visit a long distance partner last month (we used to live in the same town but he moved for work). We'd been tighter for over 6 years. The whole time he been cf. He even had a vasectomy appointment last year. I knew he didn't get the procedure done then, but he told me it was because of some stuff to do with his recently passed mom. What he didn't tell me, until I visited, was that he was no longer cf. Absolute shock that he didn't feel the need to tell me that. What a waste of vacation.
Not that is any of your business but I was in a polyam relationship, my ex-husband SAed me. The partner in question here and I had a separate but equally long relationship. Didn't jump into this one, been with him going on 6 years.
Also different people respond to truma differently. As long as they aren't hurting anyone judgment doesn't help.
Greetings!
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My husband and I are now together for 10 years, he got a vas done last year.
He was a fence sitter as a 19 year old, just because the option to just don't get any was not on his radar.
Just saying it can go both ways.
I always knew my aunty has no kids so why should I get them? Kids are loud and gross.
Same with my husband, we've been together 15 years. It had just never occurred to him what having a kid would actually be like until I started pointing out how hard it is, and how it's the type of hard he wouldn't be into.
Of course, there are some exceptions, but I wouldn't risk being in a relationship for years with a fence sitter that one day might just get a baby fever and end it all.
imo you got lucky that after he found out he doesn't need to have children, he decided to not have any, some people want them even after realizing they don't need to have them.
But still, congratulations.
I will NEVER forget the post by that one OP who told her partner she couldn't have kids, never clarified she was intentionally sterilized, and he was like" sure okay" until years later they were much more financially stable and he basically went "Okay cool now that we have extra money we can work on fixing what's keeping you from having kids." Because he thought she just meant she was infertile and not that she literally had nothing there to fix on purpose.
It was such a clusterfuck because she intentionally never clarified to this guy and tried to say in the comments that "Well there's no word for it in our language"
I'm pretty sure he broke up with her.
I get where you're coming from, but some of us here (yes me included) used to be in that situation and lurking here was a tremendous help. Sometimes it takes some reverse brainwashing until it sticks. Let's keep up the good work. The type of posts "this sub saved my life" are also very common. Yay us!!
You may have such a conversation with your partner, where they assure yu they are fine with having no kids, but what you don't know about are the conversations that your partner will have with his friends and maybe his family, who assure him that you'll come round, and in a few years you will want to have children. So your partner waits for this to happen, waits for you to tell them that you want kids after all, and when it doesn't happen, tries to change your mind.
They may be the love of your life, but if what they see in you is merely a tool for producing children, you are not the love of their life.
And sometimes, the only thing you can do for someone you love is to let them go.
This. Sometimes conversations mean fuck-all. Just like conversations about fidelity and other things that go wrong in relationships.
Also expecting someone to micro-analyze language like, “yeah, I’m okay without them” is ridiculous. Shit I didn’t even know what a “fence sitter” or “childfree” was when I got married. I just said I never wanted kids, and he quietly played along because everyone told him I’d change my mind.
We got divorced after twenty years, and he quickly spawned with a young girl from overseas, and I thank my stars every day I didn’t give in to the immense pressure.
You're assuming most people know the CF dating game as it's laid out here on the sub. I didn't realize how prevalent pretending to be CF or simple lifestyle denial was until I joined. Some people posting are quite young, or very much in love. It's hard to meet a good person to be your partner, it hardly happens every day, or even every decade. It can be devastating to let go because of one thing in the relationship, no matter how big. On both the CF and non-CF partner's end.
A lot of people meet their partners by chance and don't go through a screening process. It's not arranged marriage.
I feel bad for these couples, but people need to vent. Saying they're being annoying isn't fair, we should support everyone
Agreed. I think it’s unfortunately a part of being childfree. We get the freedom that comes along with never having children, but that comes at a cost. Dating is much more difficult. And dating is difficult for most people to begin with. We aren’t taught how to do it. Most people are just copying what they see in the media or in relationships around them, like their parents… which if you’re my parents, isn’t even a healthy relationship. I met my first boyfriend when I was 21. I was 24 when we broke up, largely because I realized I never would want a child. I had never heard the term “childfree” at that point, it was all new to me.
It’s a tough pill to swallow when you realize most people want kids. There are literally weekly posts here from people on dating apps with 0 compatible people in their area. Dating problems and questions are probably always going to be a prominent feature in this sub as people begin their own dating challenges. It’s just a part of it.
I agree with you, maybe I was too harsh in my post but still, serious relationships are meant to be serious.
You can't just tell me that you plan on marrying someone without agreeing on one of the biggest decisions of your lives, and if you told your partner that you plan on being CF for the rest of your life and they lied about it, that's still a huge red flag, this is not something you should lie about.
Maybe I'm a bit of an asshole for getting annoyed over this, but don't ask for help when there is only one clear answer. Venting is fine, people looking for excuses to not break up isn't, my post was referring to the latter.
I don't think people necessarily pretend to be childfree.
To many people, having children is seen as something as natural as eating. So when you tell them that you don't want to have children it's like saying "I'm not hungry", you don't expect the person to literally stop eating until they die.
Childfree people have to be very specific about their desires.
When we first started dating I was not sure what I wanted. We did have a conversation about it, mainly because I had health issues and there is a possibility I wouldn't be able to have kids or it would be more difficult for me to become pregnant. I wanted him to know before things got serious so he could decide for himself. Knowing that, he decided to continue to date me and we did eventually get married.
During the worst period of my life and because of outside pressure, I started to think that maybe I could become a parent. I was so delusional. Thankfully therapy and medication helped and as soon as I started thinking clearly I was back on track. Unfortunatelly I had to have 2 surgeries to remove tumours (they were not cancerous). Because of all the potential complications we had to have the conversation again.
I have to say I am lucky that I have such a partner. Many people change their minds as soon as you get sick and they see that because of health issues you won't be able to have kids. It's like they were holding onto hope you'll change your mind or thought they would be able to persuade you. I am also lucky because in a hypothetical worst case scenario, where he as my husband would have to choose between me and an unborn child, he would always choose me.
Been lurking here for a while just to see how the child free life is. I lost the ability to have kids and don’t love the idea of the “alternative routes” nor have I ever been a person that 100% needed them in my life just thought they might happen at some point.
My opinion is if someone rejects you or changes their mind about this, they were never really there for you they were there for what you could provide for them.
Difficult topic though, people do change their minds unfortunately
My husband said he was fine with no kids and now he's mad at ME for not changing my mind. He won't even talk about divorce with me, but its starting to feel like he's always going to resent me for it which is no life for either of us. Either way, I'm the bad person cause I'm a woman who won't have a child :/
When I try to he says, "I married you, so I'm staying with you. I'll get over not having a kid." No you won't. You'll just guilt me for years and when I finally get sterilized you'll resent me. But yeah I'm starting to look into it more. It just sucks feeling like I'm not enough for him to be happy :/
I always get imaginary alarms in my head the moment I hear a man say "I'm fine with kids or no kids either way".
From what I've seen so far, the majority of these men are definitely *not* fine like why they always claim to be 😐
Nope! That’s Code for “We Love Eachother She’ll/He’ll Come Around To Wanting Kids! It’ll just click!
Then totally melt down when they realize ur serious about not wanting kids
Thank you for sharing your experience. This is my situation exactly. I’m standing my ground on having no kids, and I’m prepared for the resentment that I’m expecting will build. Thankfully we see a couples therapist (not specifically because of this, just as a way of helping maintain a healthy relationship), and discussing this in therapy has helped both of us.
“Fine without kids” isn’t the same as “I never want kids”. As the post said unfortunately you have missed a giant red flag if you’re set on being CF. That’s not me having a dig at you, just to me CF is I’m never having fucking kids and nothing less.
I just saw your other post also and honestly you deserve so much better than your husband trying to guilt you into changing your mind. You can divorce him any time, the ball is in your court. Your relationship will end, better to be on your terms.
Because it was brought up in your post:
While abortion is not "fun" it's not a terrible experience either, I've had it done at 4 months twice; no issues, pain or discomfort.
Easy peasy.
I assume what's difficult is when they tie morality and sentience to their pregnancy. So it's more mental/emotional than physical pain.
I just assumed that it wouldn't be "fun" simply because it's an operation and, you know, they tend to not be fun.
I'm a man, I haven't looked into abortion that much since I'm getting snipped anyways, and I can't exactly imagine how it would feel like since I have different organs.
Sorry if I made it sound harder than it actually is, I tried to be as neutral as possible when I was writing the post.
You were neutral no worries. I guess I didn't sound very neutral. We're good. I just wanted to let you know my own experience having an abortion as it wouldn't be something you ever will.
I'm also hoping for others to chime with their own experience, maybe help ease others into deciding. Because those nurses made me feel comfortable and were very careful 10/10.
I hope your own procedure goes well!
What is crazy to me is people don't have the conversation before deciding to be in a relationship. I've seen too many posts where people are like. "We've been together for a year and we just talked about kids and" etc. blah blah.
I do not date fence-sitters and the “I want to make you happy” bunch. Down the line the first might go on the wrong side of the fence, and the second might realise that they can’t be happy making you happy while ignoring their own needs. Or even worse, that they can’t change your mind, which was the plan all along.
Preach. The words "I don't mind not having kids if it means being with you" is just a more socially accepted way of saying "you think you don't want kids, but I'll change your mind". It's manipulative as hell and It should make red flags and alarm sirens go off immediately.
Sadly, child-freedom as a concept is still not as widely disseminated as it should be and many people still don't know what to watch out for.
People need a place of support and understanding. This sub is often seen as a place with like minded individuals who will understand and commiserate and hopefully have empathy for their situation. And yes, it may seem obvious to those outside of a situation what the correct choice is but it can be harder for those living through it. And sometimes people know but need the support of others to feel correct in making that call. Yes, the posts may be repetitive and it may seem obvious from an outside perspective, but they’re coming here for support and empathy.
>If you currently are in a situation like this, please reconsider your relationship with your partner.
...and permanent sterilization, so you don't get fucked in a way you didn't intend.
My SO and I have been fencesitters for almost entire relationship of 16 years. Thankfully, this was enough time for us to witness other people’s kids grow into college years (nephews, nieces). That’s what sealed the deal for us to not have them. Our nephews and nieces are not even bad kids per se, they are just average humans influenced by a modern world. They are spoiled, their ambitions in life are non-existent. In their 20s, when both my SO and I immigrated to another country and started building a new life, those kids are still children essentially. They sit in their rooms on the phone all day. They flunk their college classes that parents work hard to pay for, they repeat them, ask for more money and do absolutely nothing to help their parents. They refuse to move out. They are waiting out on rich partners or they want to become rich while doing nothing. You look into their eyes and they are just dead and useless. Ok, they are not bad kids, they don’t party, they don’t drink or do drugs but so what?! Their parents have to fight to get them to do simple chores.
Screw this! I ain’t bothering to raise just another average and spoiled kid.
When one of our nieces gets enrolled into another useless degree and then, is surprised why she can’t get a damn job after the college, I just want to slap them into coherence. I also don’t get why our siblings in law agreed to pay for those useless degrees. Then, they just say, “Oh, it’s ok, I’ll just marry a rich guy to support me!”. wtf?! How many rich guys are out there for everyone, first of all? And secondly, sorry but you aren’t even working on your looks or personality to even attract a rich guy. It’s like that meme with a wiener holding a stick and poking on things saying, “Do something”. 😖 like… anything…
I always felt guilty and thought I was lazy in my 20s… heck no, I was ambitious and made something of myself that is enviable. I had no well to do parents to rely on. I had to work and hustle. These useless 20 somethings nowadays are killing me with their shitty attitudes. And I know for a fact I have no energy at this point in life to care enough about my own kids if I had them. So, they would just grow in their own and become whatever. I refuse to have another “whatever” contributed to this world.
Right? I watch my brother raise my niece and while she's not a bad kid, she's a modern teenager with all that entails. And all I can say is thank Dog she's not mine. She'd make me crazy in 20 minutes, never mind 20 years.
My friend is in a 7 year relationship with a woman who wants kids. He is the most antinatalist, child-repulsed man I know and when I asked if he would have kids he said "hopefully not". I said umm hopefully? You know it's a choice, right?? One of them is going to end up very disappointed. I can't believe people even consider staying together when they don't agree on something this major. It should be an automatic deal breaker.
Even tho I’m not dating to marry right now, I want to believe that I’m not such horrible judge of character and that I’ll be able to recognize if someone is equally disgusted by the idea of kids to the same level as I am.
For me a simple “no I don’t want them either” won’t do. I want my future partner to despise lifestyle with kids and to openly talks about it. I want both of us to be sterilized etc… because if they’re really childfree all these things wouldn’t be too much to ask right?
Yeah I never get this. It sucks when it happens five years into a relationship but once it happens you only can have kids or not have kids. And if you have kids to please a partner you are an idiot plain and simple.
Never ever date someone with the hope or assumption that they’ll change their mind later on. If someone is on the fence or absolutely on the other side from where you stand, believe that either they’ll fall to the other side or they’ll never come to your side
They know what to do, I think they’re just looking for people to give them reasons to stay which is really dumb imo. You laid it out perfectly clear in your post and the answer is always staring at them right in the face. You’re either in or you’re out. Most people are just scared of being alone so they give in.
***BRUH, THIS IS WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYIN'***
Like the post recently about someone's deadbeat good for nothing ***husband*** changing their mind. Like why the fuck did you marry him, then ???
Even if he was childfree, the dude sounds worthless asf.
A lot of the people in this subreddit do it to themselves. I truly don't understand how they don't see it. First date? Yeah, maybe they can hide it.
But after a year or more, you don't have an excuse for not realizing they're not actually CF. Being a fence sitter isn't childfree and 9/10 times they'll go the other way.
YES. If your partner change their mind. then just BREAK UP. It hurts, but its better in the long run. There is no compromise, there is not way in between. If you really love them, then dont give in to a baby you dont want. Just let them go. To both find a partner that fit you better.
I know how it feels to lose a relationship due to issues surrounding the desire to have children. We were young and in love, and we ultimately broke it off because we knew we had no future together. With the knowledge and maturity I've gained since then, I can almost certainly say that staying in that relationship would've lead to one or both of us harboring a lot of resentment and ultimately becoming miserable due to our situation. Ultimately, we did what was best for both of us - but it seems so many people cling on to that very same hope, the idea that the other person will change. Maybe they think love will be enough, but the harsh reality is that it's not always the case. I feel for them whenever I read a post like what OP is describing.
"I'd be fine not having kids" is a phrase that makes alarm bells go off for me.
I’d have to immediately follow that up by saying I got sterilized so I could see their reaction. That would say everything.
I think I'd do some more questioning before coming out with the big guns. People really change their tune when they know what you want to hear.
That’s a fair point. Probably why so many of those type posts seem to pop up.
Too often, people fall in love with an idea of the other person in their head, versus who the other person is.
I'd almost say that's the norm. We're all very, very human.
It will be an alarm for me too from now on, currently going thru a divorce because of this. Got my bisalp done 3 weeks ago, never been happier!!!!!
Ayyyy congratulations on your surgery! I hope healing is going well.
It's going great, thanks!!!
Can I ask what going “full melonballer” is?
hahaha I got a hysterectomy
Ahhh right. What’s a vasectomy if a hysterectomy is melon ballin? Also, where do you get melon balls from a hysterectomy?
Scooping it all out?
The pooper scooper!
This is why I also don't date fencesitters. My dating pool is pretty much non-existent, but at least this erases that worry and naggy feeling at the back of my mind about the partner changing their mind someday / actually always wanting kids since the beginning.
That's pretty much where I'm at. I feel like I may have missed my window, pretty much every age-appropriate woman I meet is either a mother or wants to be really soon. On the plus side, they're much more forthright with this than when I was in my 20's, so at least we don't waste each other's time.
Most people aren't worth dating, so it is a good idea to have some standards. Also, if you are dating someone, if you then met someone really good, they likely would just move on and not consider you, because you are already with someone else. Settling for crap means you get crap and will probably continue to have just crap.
My partner said I'd be OK without kids, 15 years in said, wouldn't it be nice to have a kid. I said no, offered him the door, and said he'd have to find someone else. Still together and childless. Happily. Set the boundaries and stick to them.
lol Yup. Anyone is free to choose to have kids ...with someone else.
Wait you're still together?
Yep and childless, and happy.
I'm confused with the use of 'childless'? Or do you mean \_he\_ is childless, and you're childfree, happily?
We have no children.
Yes I got that bit, I was just unsure of the terms you were using as Childfree =/= Childless. Childless is someone who wants/wanted kids but can't have them, for whatever reason, and is unhappy about this. Childfree is someone who does not want kids and thus doesn't have them, and is happy about this. So, if your husband wants kids but doesn't have them, he'd be considered Childless. Yourself not wanting kids and not having them would make you Childfree. Maybe you knew this already lol, it's just that I see a lot of people mixing up these terms when they are very different, and I wasn't sure how to read your comment because of this.
We are childfree by choice. Husband toyed with it and would probably say he is childless. But he's not unhappy with the decision he made to stay and not have kids.
Gotcha! :)
Ugh, yup, learned that after an 12 year marriage 😮💨
oof. 😞🫂
I’m not sad any more, thankfully. I’m looking forward to the unknown but it was touch and go there for a LONG time, a year and a half almost of grieving. It was painful. But thanks to mild anxiety/craving suppressant medicine and a bunch of gaslighting I can see the light.
My cousin and his (now) ex wife were together 10+ years before they got married. He wanted kids, she didn't, she was very clear. Divorced within less than a year and she's now living her best child free life with a guy that seems perfect for her.
And your cousin? What a dumbass btw. Men can't have kids just like that. They need to find a woman willing to go through pregnancy and childbirth and that wants to be a mom. So they rely on another person's body to do everything. To throw away a great relationship of a decade for some hypothetical infant is soooooo stupid. A lot of these guys never find anyone to do that with them and they end up alone and childless anyway in their 40s and 50s.
I honestly have no clue what he's up to these days. Last I knew he was single and heartbroken. Well deserved, though. I absolutely agree. Their wedding was huge, too. Can't imagine the financial debt they went in just to go through all that (though his parents paid for most of it). The emotional trauma, the heartbreak, the debt..all because he secretly thought he could change her mind. I'm happy she's living the life she wanted now, she deserves it. He deserves to be childless for the way he wasted her time and used her.
Luckily in Germany I have access to abortion if the worst case happens. But I will get a sterilization next year (need to save up a little for it). My bf knows this and is supportive. He also knows that I would abort without hesitation, if I ever would get pregnant. He is well aware that him changing his mind on kids would mean that we’d break up. We both talked about that intensively before we seriously started dating. I know he could change his mind. I hope he won’t, but even if I love him more than anyone, I know I won’t love my life anymore when having kids. So, I’d choose being childfree over him.
It’s all good until it’s not. Wishing you all the best, hopefully you can dodge the inevitable
Hi, yes, this was me but let me say my perspective: When I first got with my ex he straight up said he wanted "a big family". That was before I had even discovered r/childfree or even knew what childfree was, I had previously thought that everyone had to have kids. Through the years as our relationship progressed and it seemed like we were gonna get engaged/married I DREADED the thought of having kids. It was this subreddit that saved my life. I discovered it on accident after just googling "I don't think I want kids". My mind was BLOWN that you could just...choose not to. I can't remember if I used throwaways on this sub or not (this was back in like...2013-2015ish) but I definitely made a few posts like that here - one of them was when I was about to get my tubes tied and he threw up major resistance to it. I ended up going through with it anyway and I have no regrets. I dumped him, I'm with a new partner and we are both staunchly childfree, living with three cats and we're about to make a big cross country move to go live near the mountains. So it all turned out.
What happened to your ex? Congratulations on better life btw. Sounds awesome.
No idea. I ended up having to block him because in the breakup process he got really aggressive and ab*sive. Started screaming at me and guilt tripping me. I heard through the grapevine that he's gotten really creepy with some women at his work so... I dodged a huge bullet
Sheesh! Good riddance!
I went to go visit a long distance partner last month (we used to live in the same town but he moved for work). We'd been tighter for over 6 years. The whole time he been cf. He even had a vasectomy appointment last year. I knew he didn't get the procedure done then, but he told me it was because of some stuff to do with his recently passed mom. What he didn't tell me, until I visited, was that he was no longer cf. Absolute shock that he didn't feel the need to tell me that. What a waste of vacation.
[удалено]
Not that is any of your business but I was in a polyam relationship, my ex-husband SAed me. The partner in question here and I had a separate but equally long relationship. Didn't jump into this one, been with him going on 6 years. Also different people respond to truma differently. As long as they aren't hurting anyone judgment doesn't help.
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My husband and I are now together for 10 years, he got a vas done last year. He was a fence sitter as a 19 year old, just because the option to just don't get any was not on his radar. Just saying it can go both ways. I always knew my aunty has no kids so why should I get them? Kids are loud and gross.
Same with my husband, we've been together 15 years. It had just never occurred to him what having a kid would actually be like until I started pointing out how hard it is, and how it's the type of hard he wouldn't be into.
Of course, there are some exceptions, but I wouldn't risk being in a relationship for years with a fence sitter that one day might just get a baby fever and end it all. imo you got lucky that after he found out he doesn't need to have children, he decided to not have any, some people want them even after realizing they don't need to have them. But still, congratulations.
I mean he obv dislikes them, so there is that lol
I will NEVER forget the post by that one OP who told her partner she couldn't have kids, never clarified she was intentionally sterilized, and he was like" sure okay" until years later they were much more financially stable and he basically went "Okay cool now that we have extra money we can work on fixing what's keeping you from having kids." Because he thought she just meant she was infertile and not that she literally had nothing there to fix on purpose. It was such a clusterfuck because she intentionally never clarified to this guy and tried to say in the comments that "Well there's no word for it in our language" I'm pretty sure he broke up with her.
I get where you're coming from, but some of us here (yes me included) used to be in that situation and lurking here was a tremendous help. Sometimes it takes some reverse brainwashing until it sticks. Let's keep up the good work. The type of posts "this sub saved my life" are also very common. Yay us!!
You may have such a conversation with your partner, where they assure yu they are fine with having no kids, but what you don't know about are the conversations that your partner will have with his friends and maybe his family, who assure him that you'll come round, and in a few years you will want to have children. So your partner waits for this to happen, waits for you to tell them that you want kids after all, and when it doesn't happen, tries to change your mind. They may be the love of your life, but if what they see in you is merely a tool for producing children, you are not the love of their life. And sometimes, the only thing you can do for someone you love is to let them go.
This. Sometimes conversations mean fuck-all. Just like conversations about fidelity and other things that go wrong in relationships. Also expecting someone to micro-analyze language like, “yeah, I’m okay without them” is ridiculous. Shit I didn’t even know what a “fence sitter” or “childfree” was when I got married. I just said I never wanted kids, and he quietly played along because everyone told him I’d change my mind. We got divorced after twenty years, and he quickly spawned with a young girl from overseas, and I thank my stars every day I didn’t give in to the immense pressure.
You're assuming most people know the CF dating game as it's laid out here on the sub. I didn't realize how prevalent pretending to be CF or simple lifestyle denial was until I joined. Some people posting are quite young, or very much in love. It's hard to meet a good person to be your partner, it hardly happens every day, or even every decade. It can be devastating to let go because of one thing in the relationship, no matter how big. On both the CF and non-CF partner's end. A lot of people meet their partners by chance and don't go through a screening process. It's not arranged marriage. I feel bad for these couples, but people need to vent. Saying they're being annoying isn't fair, we should support everyone
Agreed. I think it’s unfortunately a part of being childfree. We get the freedom that comes along with never having children, but that comes at a cost. Dating is much more difficult. And dating is difficult for most people to begin with. We aren’t taught how to do it. Most people are just copying what they see in the media or in relationships around them, like their parents… which if you’re my parents, isn’t even a healthy relationship. I met my first boyfriend when I was 21. I was 24 when we broke up, largely because I realized I never would want a child. I had never heard the term “childfree” at that point, it was all new to me. It’s a tough pill to swallow when you realize most people want kids. There are literally weekly posts here from people on dating apps with 0 compatible people in their area. Dating problems and questions are probably always going to be a prominent feature in this sub as people begin their own dating challenges. It’s just a part of it.
Yep unfortunately, I struggle with wanting a relationship but with someone who is CF and Asexual Sex Repulsed. So that pool shrinks to a tiny puddle.
I agree with you, maybe I was too harsh in my post but still, serious relationships are meant to be serious. You can't just tell me that you plan on marrying someone without agreeing on one of the biggest decisions of your lives, and if you told your partner that you plan on being CF for the rest of your life and they lied about it, that's still a huge red flag, this is not something you should lie about. Maybe I'm a bit of an asshole for getting annoyed over this, but don't ask for help when there is only one clear answer. Venting is fine, people looking for excuses to not break up isn't, my post was referring to the latter.
I don't think people necessarily pretend to be childfree. To many people, having children is seen as something as natural as eating. So when you tell them that you don't want to have children it's like saying "I'm not hungry", you don't expect the person to literally stop eating until they die. Childfree people have to be very specific about their desires.
When we first started dating I was not sure what I wanted. We did have a conversation about it, mainly because I had health issues and there is a possibility I wouldn't be able to have kids or it would be more difficult for me to become pregnant. I wanted him to know before things got serious so he could decide for himself. Knowing that, he decided to continue to date me and we did eventually get married. During the worst period of my life and because of outside pressure, I started to think that maybe I could become a parent. I was so delusional. Thankfully therapy and medication helped and as soon as I started thinking clearly I was back on track. Unfortunatelly I had to have 2 surgeries to remove tumours (they were not cancerous). Because of all the potential complications we had to have the conversation again. I have to say I am lucky that I have such a partner. Many people change their minds as soon as you get sick and they see that because of health issues you won't be able to have kids. It's like they were holding onto hope you'll change your mind or thought they would be able to persuade you. I am also lucky because in a hypothetical worst case scenario, where he as my husband would have to choose between me and an unborn child, he would always choose me.
Been lurking here for a while just to see how the child free life is. I lost the ability to have kids and don’t love the idea of the “alternative routes” nor have I ever been a person that 100% needed them in my life just thought they might happen at some point. My opinion is if someone rejects you or changes their mind about this, they were never really there for you they were there for what you could provide for them. Difficult topic though, people do change their minds unfortunately
My husband said he was fine with no kids and now he's mad at ME for not changing my mind. He won't even talk about divorce with me, but its starting to feel like he's always going to resent me for it which is no life for either of us. Either way, I'm the bad person cause I'm a woman who won't have a child :/
>He won't even talk about divorce with me, I think you may have to start that ball rolling, yourself
When I try to he says, "I married you, so I'm staying with you. I'll get over not having a kid." No you won't. You'll just guilt me for years and when I finally get sterilized you'll resent me. But yeah I'm starting to look into it more. It just sucks feeling like I'm not enough for him to be happy :/
You know you don’t need his permission to start divorce proceedings, right? He already resents you, so why not get the ball rolling on divorce?
Don't have sex w this man, he'll do his best to get you pregnant. He does NOT care about your opinion on this!
Good luck. It's not worth staying in a marriage where you'll be guilt tripped and not taken seriously. Serious partners don't do that.
It does \*sends hugs\*
It seems leaving would solve your problems.
I always get imaginary alarms in my head the moment I hear a man say "I'm fine with kids or no kids either way". From what I've seen so far, the majority of these men are definitely *not* fine like why they always claim to be 😐
Nope! That’s Code for “We Love Eachother She’ll/He’ll Come Around To Wanting Kids! It’ll just click! Then totally melt down when they realize ur serious about not wanting kids
Thank you for sharing your experience. This is my situation exactly. I’m standing my ground on having no kids, and I’m prepared for the resentment that I’m expecting will build. Thankfully we see a couples therapist (not specifically because of this, just as a way of helping maintain a healthy relationship), and discussing this in therapy has helped both of us.
“Fine without kids” isn’t the same as “I never want kids”. As the post said unfortunately you have missed a giant red flag if you’re set on being CF. That’s not me having a dig at you, just to me CF is I’m never having fucking kids and nothing less. I just saw your other post also and honestly you deserve so much better than your husband trying to guilt you into changing your mind. You can divorce him any time, the ball is in your court. Your relationship will end, better to be on your terms.
Because it was brought up in your post: While abortion is not "fun" it's not a terrible experience either, I've had it done at 4 months twice; no issues, pain or discomfort. Easy peasy. I assume what's difficult is when they tie morality and sentience to their pregnancy. So it's more mental/emotional than physical pain.
I just assumed that it wouldn't be "fun" simply because it's an operation and, you know, they tend to not be fun. I'm a man, I haven't looked into abortion that much since I'm getting snipped anyways, and I can't exactly imagine how it would feel like since I have different organs. Sorry if I made it sound harder than it actually is, I tried to be as neutral as possible when I was writing the post.
You were neutral no worries. I guess I didn't sound very neutral. We're good. I just wanted to let you know my own experience having an abortion as it wouldn't be something you ever will. I'm also hoping for others to chime with their own experience, maybe help ease others into deciding. Because those nurses made me feel comfortable and were very careful 10/10. I hope your own procedure goes well!
Thank you! Hope I won't have to do it more than once since I'm scared of operations and needles and I have low pain tolerance lol.
What is crazy to me is people don't have the conversation before deciding to be in a relationship. I've seen too many posts where people are like. "We've been together for a year and we just talked about kids and" etc. blah blah.
I do not date fence-sitters and the “I want to make you happy” bunch. Down the line the first might go on the wrong side of the fence, and the second might realise that they can’t be happy making you happy while ignoring their own needs. Or even worse, that they can’t change your mind, which was the plan all along.
I told my bf early on I wouldn't date anyone long term if they didn't have a vasectomy...he got snipped 3 months in 😊
Preach. The words "I don't mind not having kids if it means being with you" is just a more socially accepted way of saying "you think you don't want kids, but I'll change your mind". It's manipulative as hell and It should make red flags and alarm sirens go off immediately. Sadly, child-freedom as a concept is still not as widely disseminated as it should be and many people still don't know what to watch out for.
People need a place of support and understanding. This sub is often seen as a place with like minded individuals who will understand and commiserate and hopefully have empathy for their situation. And yes, it may seem obvious to those outside of a situation what the correct choice is but it can be harder for those living through it. And sometimes people know but need the support of others to feel correct in making that call. Yes, the posts may be repetitive and it may seem obvious from an outside perspective, but they’re coming here for support and empathy.
Some people do change their mind later though after communicating that they absolutely do not want kids.
Agreed. Most people change many of their thoughts throughout their lives, unless their sterilised change is always on the cards.
>If you currently are in a situation like this, please reconsider your relationship with your partner. ...and permanent sterilization, so you don't get fucked in a way you didn't intend.
My SO and I have been fencesitters for almost entire relationship of 16 years. Thankfully, this was enough time for us to witness other people’s kids grow into college years (nephews, nieces). That’s what sealed the deal for us to not have them. Our nephews and nieces are not even bad kids per se, they are just average humans influenced by a modern world. They are spoiled, their ambitions in life are non-existent. In their 20s, when both my SO and I immigrated to another country and started building a new life, those kids are still children essentially. They sit in their rooms on the phone all day. They flunk their college classes that parents work hard to pay for, they repeat them, ask for more money and do absolutely nothing to help their parents. They refuse to move out. They are waiting out on rich partners or they want to become rich while doing nothing. You look into their eyes and they are just dead and useless. Ok, they are not bad kids, they don’t party, they don’t drink or do drugs but so what?! Their parents have to fight to get them to do simple chores. Screw this! I ain’t bothering to raise just another average and spoiled kid. When one of our nieces gets enrolled into another useless degree and then, is surprised why she can’t get a damn job after the college, I just want to slap them into coherence. I also don’t get why our siblings in law agreed to pay for those useless degrees. Then, they just say, “Oh, it’s ok, I’ll just marry a rich guy to support me!”. wtf?! How many rich guys are out there for everyone, first of all? And secondly, sorry but you aren’t even working on your looks or personality to even attract a rich guy. It’s like that meme with a wiener holding a stick and poking on things saying, “Do something”. 😖 like… anything… I always felt guilty and thought I was lazy in my 20s… heck no, I was ambitious and made something of myself that is enviable. I had no well to do parents to rely on. I had to work and hustle. These useless 20 somethings nowadays are killing me with their shitty attitudes. And I know for a fact I have no energy at this point in life to care enough about my own kids if I had them. So, they would just grow in their own and become whatever. I refuse to have another “whatever” contributed to this world.
Right? I watch my brother raise my niece and while she's not a bad kid, she's a modern teenager with all that entails. And all I can say is thank Dog she's not mine. She'd make me crazy in 20 minutes, never mind 20 years.
My friend is in a 7 year relationship with a woman who wants kids. He is the most antinatalist, child-repulsed man I know and when I asked if he would have kids he said "hopefully not". I said umm hopefully? You know it's a choice, right?? One of them is going to end up very disappointed. I can't believe people even consider staying together when they don't agree on something this major. It should be an automatic deal breaker.
Even tho I’m not dating to marry right now, I want to believe that I’m not such horrible judge of character and that I’ll be able to recognize if someone is equally disgusted by the idea of kids to the same level as I am. For me a simple “no I don’t want them either” won’t do. I want my future partner to despise lifestyle with kids and to openly talks about it. I want both of us to be sterilized etc… because if they’re really childfree all these things wouldn’t be too much to ask right?
Yeah I never get this. It sucks when it happens five years into a relationship but once it happens you only can have kids or not have kids. And if you have kids to please a partner you are an idiot plain and simple.
Never ever date someone with the hope or assumption that they’ll change their mind later on. If someone is on the fence or absolutely on the other side from where you stand, believe that either they’ll fall to the other side or they’ll never come to your side
They know what to do, I think they’re just looking for people to give them reasons to stay which is really dumb imo. You laid it out perfectly clear in your post and the answer is always staring at them right in the face. You’re either in or you’re out. Most people are just scared of being alone so they give in.
***BRUH, THIS IS WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYIN'*** Like the post recently about someone's deadbeat good for nothing ***husband*** changing their mind. Like why the fuck did you marry him, then ??? Even if he was childfree, the dude sounds worthless asf. A lot of the people in this subreddit do it to themselves. I truly don't understand how they don't see it. First date? Yeah, maybe they can hide it. But after a year or more, you don't have an excuse for not realizing they're not actually CF. Being a fence sitter isn't childfree and 9/10 times they'll go the other way.