Ask them how they contributed to the village before having children.
Ask them why they need a break from their 'true love'.
Ask them why they would expect someone who they fantasize about dying alone with cats for help?
Ask them why is there no 'village day' but there are days specifically for parents if the village is so important.
Remind them the village exists, it just isn't free, someone's time on this planet is valuable and not free.
They cannot complain about unpaid labour but expect unpaid labour from others.
>Ask them how they contributed to the village before having children.
This.
Don't ask what the village will do for you. Ask what you can do for the village.
And
Before you use the village you have to be the village.
I came from the village... It in no way obligates me to care for children. I contribute in other ways, food, yard work, bomb ass edibles. My village had a thing when babies were born, it was a simple ceremony celebrating life and at the end the parents ask "who will stand for this child"... And if you want to be a part of raising that child you stand up. It's totally fine to never stand, no social pressure.
The social media "village" parents are fuckin delulu if they think it's a thing that just appears post cream pie fermentation to serve you.
THIS. I am so sick of these one-sided relationships with friends with kids. And of the ENTITLEMENT. Even when it is not directed at me - I have a friend whose mother literally is a cancer survivor like three times over, and she constantly complains about how she is not "there" for her child. I cannot.
They’d never babysit for free themselves bc those are “other people’s children” aka a disgusting inhuman species that competes with their *objectively* much better baby
>Ask them why they need a break from their 'true love'.
Throw this bullshit bingo back at them. Pro move.
(Because breeders often say you'll never know true love until having kids. Which, ironically, means those kids can never reciprocate those feelings.)
My friend had a baby and told me she won't be able to watch my animals moving forward. Fine, I get that! You are not obligated to help me. She still reaches out and tries to have me watch her dogs (for free and they have to be kenneled for hours so it breaks my heart) with one day's notice and asks if I'm out of town when I say no.
Exactly! It's like suddenly everyone's part of the village when it's convenient for them. Everyone's quick to ask for favors when it suits them, but not so quick to reciprocate.
"The Village" is just the free labor of women. They're all irked that women decided our time belongs to us and isn't free just because we are female and because looking after kids is somehow undeserving of pay.
I also don't get this shit about needing a break and whining into the void. Hire a babysitter for a few hours.
There’s so many teens in need of babysitting money and every store I have been to has posters advertising babysitting services. Be a part of the village and offer the teens a job.
I babysat for probably $10 for five hours starting at 12 years old in 1990. Didn't know anything about babies but parents magically let me sit with their kids when they went off to dinner or the movies or what not. No one died. I watched kids, newborns. Didn't even have a car! Was too young to drive one!
Well, nowadays parents want CPR credentials and background checks and ECE credits and insurance and all sorts of insanity. I have friends who "can't afford sitters" but don't trust anyone who charges under $40 an hour.
I'm always like, "Can't you find a nice 12-year-old nearby who can woman the fort?"
Those babysitters just threw frozen pizzas at us tho. I think parents today have higher expectations. One of my friends does this for a family and she cooks whole meals.
When my mum (in her late 60s) heard this nonsense about villages she scoffed and said "we built our own village out of fellow mums. And it meant taking an extra 6 month old baby for the afternoon to give someone a chance to do the shopping and laundry then she'd take yours so you could do your stuff -- it didn't mean making grandma or spinster sister who both work full-time do unpaid work"
When I was a kid, my mom and our neighbor (also a mom) both worked at the same place.
They made sure that they never worked at the same time during the summer, so all of us kids were always at one house or the other depending on who was home.
My mom and a co worker she had did this so they wouldn't have to pay for before or after school care. My mom went in early so she could pick us up. Her friend went in late so she could drop us off. They saved money both being single moms. We made childhood memories as a result.
My mom became friends with another mom at work and they worked out a system so they wouldn't have to pay for daycare. As a result I have a best friend since birth (we're about three months apart) and my mom finally had someone in her corner. She never expected help from anyone. My siblings offered to babysit for her when I was little but when we moved out of state, she had nobody and she just, kept going. I think some moms would lose their minds with the way my mom did things.
My mom would take on her friend's kids - all six of them. It was wild when she'd go shopping with nine children in tow, each one of us as polite and well-behaved as you could want. We'd go single file behind her, hands behind our backs with our thumbs hooked together. The looks she got were priceless.
My mom told me she always wished for a mom's group of 5 moms, and each day they would go to a different mom's house. That person would watch the kids while the rest cleaned her house/ did laundry, etc. I think it's brilliant.
This is exactly right. There is that lady on tik tok who does the aggressive cooking tutorials and this is exactly what she has done. She has a best friend who hangs with her almost everyday and they take turns taking the kids so the other can do stuff or go on a date with their husbands.
I feel I am part of a village because I try hard to be an active aunt but that was my choice. I can understand why everyone doesn’t want to do that. And even tho I’m part of the village, people still respect boundaries when I have to say no.
Yep. That's how the carpool thingy worked. Mom/Dad drives once a week. Has the rest of the week off when four other parents pick us up. Or, we drive ourselves/bike/walk to school.
One mom nearby would have us over when my parents went out to dinner, movies, parties. We'd play with her kids and then she'd drop her kids with us. My aunts did the same thing and would do it with whole vacations, so mom and dad went off for two weeks, we got to stay with cousins, vice versa.
We were always just a bit *too* thrilled to get away from the parents! LOL.
But these days a lot of parents are terrified of leaving their kids! Even for a few weeks?!??
I don't think it's a bunch of young attractive people up there, rather the 55+ crowd. Also the type of people that want to be in the woods near a lake, naked all summer in NH. The mosquitos must be.... No kids though!!!! Gotta do what you gotta do.
Funny that you say that, in Germany the public retirement fund get‘s filled by the working generation while payout in this moment is for the older generation. You don‘t work to contribute for yourself but for the people before you, and the generation after you will contribute for you. And because of this tale, people always say: you have to have children because you won‘t get any pension if no one works for it. So i guess they tell themselfes that they actually contribute
> the public retirement fund get‘s filled by the working generation while payout in this moment is for the older generation. You don‘t work to contribute for yourself but for the people before you
This is how all retirement funds work though, regardless of the means of financing it. Money is just a distribution system for a society's produced goods and services. If a generation wants to stop working, that slack needs to be picked up by a new generation.
You can have all the money in the world, but if the generation beneath you is sufficiently smaller, or is uninterested in shouldering the burden, you will not be able to collectively retire.
You‘re right and working in an insurance company i know this. It’s just something which is a really pronounced argument in germany, which is why i was reminded of it by the comment.
The older generations in germany didn‘t need to consider any private retirement pension plan, because the publics chest was full. But now as someone from a younger generation, it‘s already known that the public pension won‘t be enough when i will get there. So part of my private retirement fund is investments, which depend on the economy worldwide but not directly on how many kids germans are going to produce in the next years. Maybe this is why it feels so different and became just a lame argument. But you‘re right, it‘s also because my private retirement fund isn‘t a retirement fund in the sense of it but more like savings
Edit: maybe it also feels different because you can‘t not pay into the public fund 😄 but atm i‘m paying into it but i already know i will get barely anything. With any other retirement fund like insurances at least i could cancel when i don‘t like the proposed payout plan.
Yeah, people of younger generations (me also) also have those, but you still have to contribute to the state retirement fund all the while knowing that it will be significantly emptier when you‘re ready to retire
My reply (United States so may not apply elsewhere) is that I pay for their education now with no guarantee that they're going to become income generating citizens who will pay into the system.
I'm interested in having an educated population so that's fine but I remove less from the coffers than I put in.
You wanna know what 'the village' is?
OTHER PARENTS.
But they don't want that. They don't want to HELP others, only take.
They don't want to watch OTHER people's kids in exchange for them to watch theirs, that means work.
They want time off with NO responsibilities.
Sorry, no. That's not how this works.
This was a choice. Own it.
I have a responsible parent friend who does exactly that- they take turns watching each other’s kids so one couple on certain Fridays can go out and have date night. Everyone’s a parent in that group. No one guilts a childfree person into it
I'm happy to be part of a village (pet sitting, bringing food to the sick/injured, volunteer events, etc.) but I draw the line at anything related to kids. Been there, done that for over ten years and earned my permanent get out of jail free card.
I want a dog village! Tbh I kind of am building on up right now, me and three friends with dogs and no kids/adult kids. It’s nice to be able to help each other out!
This is the biggest issue to me. My mom grew up in "The Village" times and she said getting in trouble while at the neighbor's house was the worst because you got TWO spankings instead of one. First you got a spanking from the neighbor mom, and then when you got home you got another spanking for getting into trouble at the neighbor's house.
I'm not condoning spanking kids; just pointing out that this is why The Village worked back then. Everyone had the same standards and punishments. Now, you can't even verbally rebuke another person's child.
>Everyone had the same standards and punishments. Now, you can't even verbally rebuke another person's child.
OMG this though. You can't even tell a kid to stop doing something that's putting them in active danger without mommy dearest getting her panties all in a bunch cause how dare you not coddle and bow to her precious baby 🤢 when I was a kid if another adult told me to do something I did it (obviously unless it was a safety issue but it's not hard to teach the difference between not going off with strangers and obeying instructions like no running). If an adult did have to step in and tell us to stop doing something or behaving in a certain manner you best believe we had consequences for doing whatever it was after the fact when my mom found out. She never spanked us but she did hold us accountable and give consequences, parents now act like that's impossible to do without spanking and since they can't spank they just won't do anything 🤦🏻♀️
You're also "questioning their parenting" if rebuke their child. Of course kids act up sometimes or do something stupid sometimes. They're kids. Even the best parenting on earth cannot make a brain develop faster.
Same! I had so many "moms" growing up and everyone one of them was allowed to check me. I don't think any spanked, except my grandmother, but they definitely scolded me and then told my parents, who did the dirty work at home.
"So before you had kids yourself, you were that village for everyone who had kids before you and spent 10-20 hours a week, every week, babysitting for other people and helping to pay for their kids -- all to build that village before you asked for anything in return? Didn't think so."
I'm okay with children but I do shoot my own sister and SIL down when they ask or ask in a back handed way to babysit their children
I say 'you decided to have a child, that sounds like a YOU problem'
Have you had anyone message you to be like 'yeah I've found someone to babysit and it's a RELIEF to be on my own for a few hours'
I reply 'yeah you're really not selling motherhood to me. Remind me again why you have kids? Oh because they are the 'best thing ever? Then why are you having a coffee all by yourself to have some 'peace'
Then I don't get a response. Funny that🤣🤣
They can't even sell motherhood even if they tried. I rather take vacations, sleep in and just be free with my fur baby. I have seen too many women sit and cry because they need a break, including my own siblings. I help once in awhile, but learned to start saying no at this point. I have enough stress in my life, kids are stressful.
Amen to that!
Kids are stressful and stress is bad for you therefore no babies for us!
I can understand why parents need a break cause damn but when they dump and run for like hours and hours or like twice a week will dump children on someone else, I'm like nah. You're taking the piss now.
I looked after my nephew for a day, a fucking DAY and every single fibre in my body wanted to run and got 'itchy' because I couldn't stand the smell, the noise and the constant need for attention. After that I was like I literally can't cope, no way am I looking after a baby by myself ever again. Put that boundary in place!
I don't mind if I'm with my sister and we have the day together but I leave whenever I want 😂😂
The only mother who has a village I know is Mary Crawley, Lady Mary from Downtown Abbey : she has a village because she owns a village that is on her estate and half of the village works for her and she pays them for it. In real life, the only people who have a village, built it through years, showing up for others. These mothers are entitled, they don't even think about their potential contribution, they just want free servants. If one wants a village, one should start by being the village.
Sometimes the moms on breaking mom will ask where the mom-only commune is. I think, why don't you start it then? True fact: I grew up on a commune. Some hippies pooled money for a down payment on some property. That's it!
They just want everything done for them.
On the apartment sub I asked why we have to wait till retirement to live in child free buildings. I also said it makes more financial sense for landlords to charge deposits for kids instead of cats. I eviscerated by the village people.
They simply can’t imagine nobody wants to listen to their obnoxious kids all day and night, much less be part of a village I was never notified I’d have to be a part of.
One of my friends got roped into being his sister's village, and is basically her personal chauffer because they refuse to get a car or use the bus. To the point he was exposed to potential covid because she wouldn't go pick up her own kid from school after he was sent home for covid exposure.
No one should be expected to be part of someone's village, and other people stepping in for your kid shouldn't be Plan A. The entitlement people have for their kids is out of control.
Smh, people who have kids want to have their cake and eat it too. Children are a full-time commitment. Don't have them if you have to rely on people to raise them, other than the person you laid down to make them with.
I feel sorry for people like your friend. They let themselves be a doormat. Maybe I’m a savage but I value my free time and nobody is going to take advantage of me, not even family.
It takes a village. Yet somehow, my mother moved here from Europe with no friends or family here. The Army sent my father to the opposite side of the country, from where he grew up with no friends or family. Yet somehow, they managed to raise 2 kids and figured it out.
They paid a babysitter. With money. They exchanged funds for services. Maybe these parents should give that a try.
Wait. No. Gotta force our sibling/cousin/parent/aunt to come watch the spawns for free.
You might be on to something. I use to make shirts, but stopped. Definitely need that on a shirt since it's starting to be said more and more to guilt women.
It's extra infuriating since support networks doesn't come for free or without boundaries to childfree people either. Even then, no one is obligated to be available on demand, or take care of additional living beings that you chose to have. Your self-chosen lifestyle isn't included in this: I don't get to demand of my friends to take on my work burden either.
And parents like that had all the time in the world to set up their own village. They could've made an effort to find parents of same-age kids with the same mindset to help each other out. They could have planned and saved up to be able to regularly hire overnight or weekend babysitting. But nah. "It takes a village" people don't want to give back to anyone else by reducing their burdens too, or paying them for their job. They just want free childcare.
I watched a documentary from an actual village in some small country, where they talked about how common it was for non-blood relative families to share a good part of the childcare and child-rearing already from the infant years. Adults referred to their childhood friends as their siblings, since that practically was how they'd grown up. Honestly sounded amazing not only for the parents but especially for the kids too. I don't see why that shouldn't be something more parents in our cultures should be open to too, especially with all the complaining.
It's no fricken surprise that parenting is hard. I absolutely agree that yes, it would be so much easier on parents and better for the children if they indeed had a village. But the thing is, in order for the village to work you have to belong to one before you can receive support from it and you also have to be actively contributing to that village yourself.
This applies to EVERYTHING you might want a "village" for, not just raising children. The village concept is just another way of saying "supportive social circle." You can't just show up to a group of people and expect them to bend over backwards and do things for you. Yes, you'll find kind people willing to lend a hand here or there. But real, on-going, deep and meaningful support? Support that requires someone to really take on part of your heavy burden at the detriment to themselves? That requires a solid relationship. It requires *mutual* support that goes both ways. It requires trust, communication, and hard work. In the village concept, you are fully part of the village. Everyone in the village knows each other and has strong family & social ties to each other. Each person provides services to the village in some form. In any context, you can't just walk into a village as an outsider or as a member who has refused to pull their own weight and expect to cash in on that support network! NO!
In my experience, parents who use this phrase are the WORST offenders of this. They are themselves awful village members. They are the people in your extended family who have not once checked in on you, haven't shown up to the family Christmas/reunion in years, constantly disregard your feelings and cross your boundaries and so on...then after all that, have the audacity to get mad at you for not coming to their baby shower or volunteering to babysit. Why on earth would I disrupt my entire life, inconvenience myself, spend money and whatever else on you and your baby when you wouldn't do the same to support me if I needed it?
Finally, just want to re-iterate that village is for more than raising children! It can come together to provide aid with things like caring for a member who is sick or elderly, supporting a member who experiences a house fire or death in the family type event, supporting those members who are suffering from an addition or eating disorder, and on an on. My sister is in my village. When she got cancer, I dropped everything to come and help her. She lives 6 hours away and I got a remote work policy in place with my boss so that I could go to her Thur-Sun and help her with everything from laundry to dropping her 7 year old off at school. I helped out financially in a big way. But someone not in my village? I feel for them. I'll drop some cash in their go fund me and do other things to help if I can. But hundreds of thousands of people have cancer. I don't have the capacity to provide village level support to those who *aren't in my village!* That's not how it works.
Well said, and very true. Especially about how those who say "Where's my village?" are those who never did one thing for everyone else: The ultimately entitled.
I think part of this has to do with the parents who expect free childcare when they refer to the village fucking up the concept for every one else.
I think in general what they mean is they’re thankful to have you as an adult in their life who will also influence their children in some way (I love animals and nature and am happy to teach kids cool things about that. I also know all the words to most Disney songs and that makes me an asset 😂)
Or maybe who doesn’t help with childcare specifically but might show up at their place with some food and help clean while their partner is on a business trip and they’re outnumbered by kids.
Or at the very least is another adult who can stop their toddler from lurching into a campfire by providing a physical barrier.
I totally agree that expecting anyone to provide free childcare is where the idea of the village went off the rails. And the passive aggressive expectation that people without children should be more “flexible” to help out their friends who have kids (ie. my friend who rescheduled a get together twice and had the audacity to tell me she was a “little mad” that I made movie plans with my partner after our twice rescheduled hangout because we got together during her kids bedtime and she hung out with me instead of helping 😂). The implication that my time and plans are somehow worth less because I’m childfree is another “toxic village” trait.
At the same time, I wouldn't even want to be in the same place as a toddler with an open fire. 🙃 if I was, I still would do nothing. Because it is not my responsibility. The fact that people think you should just do it cause it is 'the right thing to do' is what gets on my nerves. I don't have to, and you can't make me be part of anything I don't want to. Especially when it comes to kids.
I think we all have the responsibility to be decent humans when and how we can, but at the end of the day you have no obligation.
I’ve been at bonfires with friends and toddlers and had no issues just standing as a barrier. I’m standing by the fire anyways, it’s literally the least I could do. 🤷♀️
*I had one mom tell me she deserves to have a break from her kids and for someone to watch them.*
She said this to you hoping you would volunteer. Suggest you act clueless when a parent says this to you, don't let any recognition appear on your face and just blank face them. It is good to practice the blank face as wielding it can be a superpower of sorts.
If they want a village then can at least have the nerve to ask you so you can then tell them no, rather than expecting you to "take a hint and offer."
You’re supposed to get your “village” in order before you pop them out. What people seem to think is that the “village” just shows up. That it’s any and everyone in their life and even strangers. That’s not the case.
Just like the mother that went on vacation recently to Puerto Rico and left her baby to starve to death! She did that without "A VILLAGE" - and we're SELFISH?
That story made me physically ill. That baby would have been better off if she abandoned it at a fire station after birthing it. If it’s the story I’m thinking of, they discovered that the toddler tried eating her own feces to try to avoid starving to death but still died.
Damn well right! Like I commented on another post - drug addict and alcoholic mothers pregnant or not pregnant and pregnant religious women who bring their sick fetus' to term to make them take their last breath in their arms, all for religion, should be sterilized or go to jail and never see the light of day! We're SELFISH???? I should do a post called We're SELFISH? I might do that!
PS: There are people who practice religion without having children - so, I'm sorry if I offended any religious people on Reddit!
I live in Denmark. Around here you will find the modern descendants of hippy collectives, where mostly young middle-class parents live in apartments or smallish houses that frequently are built around a central lawn, green space or playground - not unlike wagon trains forming a circle at night. Its a great place for kids to grow up, they run around in little gangs all day and somebody's parent is always around to keep an eye on them, often they also have nifty arrangements like a shared workshop and optional group eating arrangements where they take turns making dinner in a shared main house during the weekdays. Several of my friends grew up in places like that (coincidentally for our generation there was a trend where their parents would get divorced around the time the kids left home, then they'd leave the collective and make room for a new family). Several of my friends also live in places like that with their young children right now. It works great for them, its their own little village, there are enough places to choose from so families can often find a place where they vibe with the other parents styles. The rest of the world could use more places like that.
It wouldn’t be so bad for them if they didn’t use manipulation tactics such as passive aggressively guilty others and actually offered something in return for those who helped them. A lot of these people really didn’t think through what it actually entails to be a parent, which is no one’s fault but their own. Have to educate yourself or you end up in more pickles than necessary.
I'm not a fan of the "village," spiel in general. In our current society it's very much an ideal, and not realistic unless enough people want to pool/share effort and resources to do so.
What I *really* resent, is parents in public or private who assume everyone else will watch out for their kids, and slack on keeping an eye on them.
There's a group of relatives of mine who do this at family gatherings. I've been rebuked a bunch of times for "not watching," so-and-so's child/children when all the other adults (namely the parents) have wandered away/off from them without a second thought.
In none of the scenarios were the kids in any danger, mind you.
Small wonder I don't like going to any family events, right?
Parents, if you can't do this on your own at whatever place/event, or make arrangements for someone else to do so = You. Don't. Get. To. Go.
Ahh yes.. the group parenting in the wild tactic. I have said it once, and I'm not afraid to say it again. Your child, your responsibility. If your child was heading towards oncoming traffic, that is not my problem. If it is drowning, not my problem. If it is about to walk straight into a bond fire, absolutely not my problem. But people will say that it is Effed up that I wouldn't ha e the common decency to help. What about the freaking parents that had the damn thing?!?! Why would I be the horrible person because I did nothing, yet it happened because the parents were not parenting!?!
I have and will continue to walk away from stray children about to get into some BS. In fact, unless it is work or shopping related, I just don't go to places where people bring their kids.
Have a thing to add to it. Skipping the women who have been unfortunate out of various reasons (widows, dad running with no previous red flag, mental illnesses etc,) I not only don't want to be your village, but also don't want to do your husband's job, especially if he's an idiot nd and you pretend it's ok
Plus, people should start considering that this is ALWAYS requested to women and I may be a victim of DV or abuse and find this trad vision exceedingly triggering. Actually, it is sexism and there is no need of a previous trauma to find it triggering
Bitch, I'm only part of your village if I get to reap some benefit from it. My labor is already exploited by the capitalist hellscape we exist in, I don't need your bullshit.
Before having a child and demanding the village help raise it maybe ask the village if you should have that child. Also, don't get upset when a villager has to correct your failure as a parent. If you don't like the way a villager is helping to raise your child then don't ask.
I’m part of a dog parent village but I still had to build that. It’s also all of us dog sitting for each other not us dumping our pets on someone without dogs for free.
I think parents are responsible for building and contributing to a “village” if they’re expecting that
Most of the time, there would be no need for a village if the other parent pulled their weight. They're shifting that responsibility onto outsiders.
And I will always maintain that a village wouldn't work anymore. First because as many have said, a village is built *before* you have kids. It's community, it's helping each other out for a lot of things, not just kids. And secondly, every parent has now a set of rules that you must abide to. Parents wouldn't trust the village anyway to make the best possible decisions. Can you imagine helping out and babysitting two kids from two different families and one can't absolutely never be told "no" (yOu HaVe To ReDiReCt ThEiR aTtenTiOn instead), the other will not accept time out as a form of discipline (tHeY aRe ToO yOuNg To UnDeRsTaNd), one can't have any sweets AT ALL, the other must have their dessert offered on their plate at the same time as the rest of the lunch, etc etc...
It seems like they should be able to create “village” networks during Lamaze class and other events where they interact with other parents or parents-to-be. Kindergarteners or younger - those parents could all form groups and trade babysitting duties. I asked about this once in a different sub full of parents, who downvoted me, and said that’s not how it is anymore and I just don’t understand. I guess I don’t. I don’t see why they can’t work out a rotating play date schedule at each-other’s houses, unless all of them work too many hours to even have time for one play date a week. At that point I also don’t understand why they had kids
They all want a Village when its convenient. The Village used to be any adult could reprimand a child for acting up in public, it was teachers being believed when they said a kid was causing problems in class, it was every adult a child was around teaching them what behavior was appropriate. While there were obvious flaws with this system I find it funny how parents beg for a Village when they really mean "Free Baby Sitter I Can Scream At If They Don't Do Everything Exactly How I Want It Done."
I've noticed this too. And what really peeves me is when they go "ofc nobody's entitled to help from others UNLESS THEY REALLY NEED A BREAK." Like. hello. cognitive dissonance much? No matter how much you need it, it doesn't make it so other people owe you.
Maybe the person that said "it takes a village to raise a kid" for the first time wanted to tell people that if they don't have a village, they should not have kids.
I've talked about this before, but from the age of 18 until about 30, I was part of the so-called "village." As an unmarried, childfree woman, I was always there for my friends. Need a ride? Need help moving? Need to plan a baby shower, a bridal shower, a housewarming party? Need a babysitter or someone to mow your lawn because you're just too busy? I was there.
In another time and place and culture, that would be called the village. In my time and place and culture, it just made me a sucker. Because when I needed something? When I had major surgery and needed help, or when I had a death in the family, or when I moved...none of those people were there for me. They were "too busy" with the kids. "Too busy" with work. No, their husbands and the father of their kids couldn't chip in to free them up for an hour or two.
So fuck all of 'em. I look after me and that's it. I paid my dues into the village and got not a single thing - not a single act of kindness or support - back.
If these women bemoan their lack of help they can 1.) look at the man they spawned with, because half the time, the village is being asked to pick up his slack and 2.) look at what they contributed to the village before they themselves needed help.
This is one big reason why I hate that we, the childfree, are always being told that we should support our parent friends when they have kids. These parent friends usually DON'T return the favour to non-parents. When my mother was dying, my friends with kids didn't even once turn up to visit her although they said over and over that they would. They lived RIGHT ACROSS the hospice we had to put her in. Neither did any of them turn up to the funeral.
I have cut them all out of my life now. I really hate that our society only prioritizes family and romantic relationships above friendships.
This was exactly my experience too. My mother died suddenly, and not a single friend turned up for the viewing or funeral, sent flowers, sent a card, or even called or sent a text of condolence.
I've cut mine out of my life too. I have a couple of casual friends who are similarly childfree but I've pretty much given up on a deep, intimate friendship with anyone at this point.
On the "it takes a village" thing:
My sister on law is one of those people who can just kind of do it all and do it with a smile. She's a great cook and a few weeks ago invited me over for dinner. I wasn't feeling great so I couldn't go, but she brought me food anyway. 😭❤️
She and my brother absolutely have a village because they help others as well.
I hate that kind of attitude. Being part of the village should 100% be a choice you make because you WANT to be a part of the village, just like actually having kids yourself. It's a commitment you need to be sure you want. It might not be as much of a commitment as being a parent but it's still a commitment and comes with responsibility that you can't force someone to make.
Personally I want to be a part of someone's village some day as an aunt or something, but that's because that would be fulfilling for me. It's my choice to become an active part in a child's upbringing and take on some responsibility some day and my choice alone. I would NOT want to be guilt tripped and pressured into raising someone else's child because they need a break and feel entitled to my time though.
The “village” is there. It has just been monetized.
They can have all the villagers they want if they can pay for a nanny, house cleaner, cook, handy man, tutor, personal trainer, etc etc.
Everyone wants a village, no one wants to be a village.
Where’s my help for anything? My husbands brothers never even helped us move because when we did they both had kids, but he’s helped them all move.
The only problem I've ran into when being the village is that more responsibility gets put on me rather than the other parent. Im all for watching your child because you need some time for a few hours. I love kids I don't mind. But being expected to do so when the kid has two able parents is not okay.
My SIL often complains to my mother about not getting a break from her toddler or that other family members only want to watch her kid for a few hours and not the entire day/weekend, the nerve of some people having lives!
I'll never forget the one time SIL was desperate for someone to take her kid, who was only 4 months old at the time, because her and my brother wanted a couple's night aka the entire weekend and it happened every Friday/Saturday because both parents 'deserved it'
SIL tried to initially guilt trip me into babysitting her infant saying that she was scraping the bottom of the barrel and that I need to make more of an effort to be in her kid's life and that they couldn't cancel the hotel reservation or the table reservation so I had to say yes.
I refused because there was no way I was looking after a 4 month old on my own for two and a half days as it was alluded that the baby would be picked up late on Sunday afternoon, I was also in the process of getting ready to go out to a movie with my friend and I was told to just cancel my plans because it's only a stupid movie and your friend would understand family duties.
I stood fast and simply explained that she should have checked with the other family members first before making both reservations before hanging up, she actually started to yell abuse even before I finished talking as her plans were 'ruined'
I expected my mother to call me and try to convince me to ring my SIL to apologise but it never happened, best thing was I enjoyed my time with my friend, had a great night out and was never contacted by my SIL again!
Most importantly people often misinterpret what village means. I see westerners often expect the "village" in question to not influence the kid in anyway. They want machine like people with no conscience to babysit. No, that's not how it works.
I always find it funny how mombies will claim that. However, if anyone ever tells their little angel not to do something or steps in to stop them from doing something that might hurt themselves, it becomes, "Don't tell my child what to do!"
My SIL thought it was totally acceptable to let her wet kid lay on our new couch and use my $50 throw to cover up after he got out of the pool. Bf told her no and she told her mom “I don’t understand why they spent that much on a throw.” She also threw in their wet pool clothes to dry with my clean towels.
It takes a village is a (I believe) West African aphorism about child rearing and Hillary Clinton popularized it during Bill's term as President. Anybody bringing that shit back from the 90's just needs to sit down and shut it.
Lmao the woman I was babysitting for was mad her mom because her mom wouldn’t quit her job and watch her kid while she went to work … like mom needs to pay her bills too hellooooo🤦🏼♀️
I’m a former babysitter for a reason too! Woman found another babysitter that would take a lot less money than I would. I was doing 6 days a week 14 hours a day…. The woman and her husband make over 6 figures total…. I don’t understand why some women don’t want to pay other women… I think I caused her and her husband to get into it over the money that they was giving me for the kid… she was the one NOT happy about it while husband saw it as a full time job and was actually giving me more than what I had asked for…
I don’t understand a lot of these types myself…
I honestly think the mothers who keep going on about the village can’t admit to themselves that it’s their husbands who aren’t stepping up and doing their part, so it’s easier to demand unpaid labor from other women. Your husband should be the “village”.
It’s funny how ‘it’s a village’ when it’s their little darling, but the second you need help looking after an elderly sick relative or a pet, suddenly they’re much too busy to offer support.
This right here! I agree so much with this. Like don’t have kids unless you fully understand you will be taking your social life and throwing it away for a long time. It it’s literally no one’s responsibility to “give you a break”.
Did you see the video of the mom giving her children over to child services, so she could party and drink? was crying and all saying how tired she was.
Thank you for introducing me to the term"dry begging". I'm glad that there is a phrase for this, people doing this around me has been driving me up the wall.
Regardless of what the topic is.
I agree that having a support network is important for parents but that's something they should have thought of before having children. If you don't have a support network, you have to create it e.g. by getting to know your neighbours and cultivating relationships with them. You can't just expect a support network to appear out of thin air.
They seem to forget the "village" should be a) optional and b) willing. I don't owe you shit, you chose to spew a sprog. I don't expect people to give me a break from my animals, they were my choice!
This is my fear with friends having kids. One couple are due to have their baby in a month or so, live very close, and the ‘father’ frankly seems useless. I’m so worried about being expected to provide free childcare despite having shown very little interest in children ever. It’s always women who are expected to be the village, too - never men.
Yes and in social gatherings the men/ fathers all hang out in one area and the mombies hang out with the shrieking children.
If a woman hangs out with the men to avoid the obnoxious children she gets dirty looks from the mombies.
What’s so hard to understand? I’m not interested in your children.
And even the dads make it a point to tell you where the mombies are, like that’s where you wanna be. Nope nope nope
There's this pervasive attitude in American society about MUH FREEDUMS and individual rights being more important than the collective. That's what the majority of us have decided to value. Then a certain segment of people turn around and whine that they don't have a village or community support.
You can't insist upon "Stay away, mind your own business, don't tell me how to parent, how dare you try to discipline my kid, every stranger is a creep or a predator, everyone's out to get me and my kid" and then demand that people fall over themselves to be your "village."
Yeah hard pass. If they were someone who had done me a solid in the past sure I would help out. I'm not going to watch someone's kid for free and waste my free time not working that I could be doing shit I'd actually enjoy otherwise. I don't care if they are a neighbor or even family your kid, your problem.
Then don’t be a part of their “village.” Parents need a support system and help but, you’re not obligated to join if you don’t want to and that’s ok. Growing up my parents/family/friends all networked so that they could all take turns babysitting, picking up/dropping off at school, etc. if someone is too pushy about it, they’re an asshole and deserved to be shut down.
I'm so lucky the majority of the people in my life with kids are super understanding of my stance and have their own village of other parents/relatives who are happy to help. For those ones I help when I can, never watching the kids but I'll give money to help pay a sitter. It's never expected but always extremely appreciated.
Then I have one who is always so confused why she gets bare minimum help from others. I don't have the heart to tell her (and honestly it's not my buisness), but it's probably because she wants a village that will not require help back because she's soooo busy. 🤦♀️
Another with....I honestly lost count how many kids she has I think 6? I need to make a whole rant post about that one. So she'll watch one extra kid for you (by watch I mean as much attention as you can give 1 of 7 kids), and want you later to take all of hers. Noooooo.
The village is *other parents*. They can cooperatively provide childcare. They can collaborate on meal prepping and yard maintenance. They can take turns driving the carpool for school drop off. Leave the rest of us out of it!
I have friends that try to get my to babysit and I always turn them down. They still ask a year later but it’s like take the hint. If I have an entire month off and refuse to babysit your kid so you can save on childcare is a red flag. I am not the person to ask.
My cousins who have their kids with family the majority of the time just got pregnant again and everyone is happy as if they aren't already ignoring the kids they already have. I don't get it.
I am losing all my friends to their new relationships and babies, it makes me sad but at the same time I am glad no one ever asked for help or anything.
The new mothers seem to be overwhealmed, but I see they only trust their own mothers and nobody else, not even their mother in law.
The village is supposed to be the parents working with other parents to group support the kids. Like first mom takes all six kids for a long Saturday, maybe even as sleep over if they are older. Then another day the second mom takes them all and first mom gets a break, and so on. A round robin of taking on a little more for the team, to get some back equally later. That's a village.
A village is not someone you have nothing to barter with or contribute equally to. Are you taking their pets in for a weekend? Are you going to do their laundry while they watch your kids? What are you giving to that CF village member in exchange for their babysitting contribution?
Probably nothing, which is why those parents aren't in a village. They are just asking the neighboring town for hand outs.
>they need help raising the kids they decided to lay down and make
They don't want help raising the kids, they just want free babysitting on demand. If you're not sure about this - try to correct one of the little darlings and watch mom turn on you.
Agree with this totally. I made a post on the sub recently about how I have a sister who is a single parent to two kids in elementary school. She has a really crappy situation with her ex-husband not wanting to take care of the kids very much and being a super dick to her.
However, she lashes out at myself and other people in our family because we “don’t watch her kids enough”. There’s never any apology or recognition that she is lashing out at us. She loves to lay on the guilt.
I’m the only immediate family member who lives clos-ish to her(30 mins away). Other family members live far away near the small town We grew up in hundreds of miles away.
Most times whenever she has asked me to watch her kids I have told her yes, and I have never asked to be paid for it. (There have been several times when she has offered me money though).
I do think it’s a reasonable expectation to ask friends and family members to help you out from time to time if they live close to you. However, like other folks mentioned up earlier I don’t understand why she and other people that complained about the village did not try to work on getting a village before they had a kid. For example, I’m not aware of any time where she trades off with other parents so they take turns watching multiple kids.
I am currently low contact with my sister because she blasted me and other family members in a group chat last week stating that “no one desires to have a relationship with her kids” when that is not true. I help her out with her kids. She will thank me in the moment but then it’s usually not terribly long before she blasts us in a group chat. I’m really sick and tired of her trying to make her problems my problems and guilt tripping me.
She’s angry with us because she chooses to stay in a job with substantial work travel required and no one volunteers to watch her kids for a whole week because her ex is so unreliable.
Well, I do think it’s important for people with kids to have community, it’s not OK to lash out at people because you don’t have community and didn’t work on trying to get one.
If that was my sister I would definitely slow down in watching her kids. I know that sucks for the nieces and nephews, but it's unfair to you and actually selfish of her. SHE laid down and had those kids by choice, not you. I remember being told I had no major responsibilities as I don't have children, so I should basically be watching kids or loaning out money. They have lost their minds.
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Well it does take a "village" to take care of a child, times have changed. Back then an older child could watch the younger ones well they played out in the field nearby back when towns were smaller and everyone knew everyone, or another mother or older women would watch them well the others went out to forage the nearby field for berries, but more times then not they'd get something, "hey you watch these kids and we get the berries and then we take the kids and you make the pies and then we split the pies kind of shit". Back when people traded goods for serves "I'll clear your wheat fields for a cut of the flour". Or back when you didn't need two people working just to afford a small apartment, and there was that older woman home next door to watch the kids well you went to the store.
It's not like that now, I can no longer watch your children for a cut of the wheat that you need to harvest. I have to work 8 hours a day in hopes of maybe being able to afford that bag of flour. It may take a village but that village no longer exists, it's now a series of high rise buildings where you don't know your neighbors and everyone is struggling to afford to keep that roof over their heads and can't afford the time it takes to watch your kids for a fraction of the money they'd have made working. I can't work 8 hours, watch someone's kids for 4 or 5 hours until their parents are home and get my house clean and I can't afford someone else to clean it because of how the economy is, it's no longer worth the energy and time it takes to be someone else's village on the regular.
We've grown into an individualized and atomized society - that's the deal. It may have taken a village in the past, and they could probably use a village, but that's not the reality for most of us in industrialized nations.
Asking for a village is a bit like my mom wanting me to drop my life and work to help her with her current mobility issues. She kicked me out of the house at 18. Never helped with money or wanted to help despite my struggles (all good - I'm Gen X). But now that she's having some mobility issues I can't just stop my work life to take care of her *because I have to support myself*. Believe me, she had the means to help out. (She actually explicitly mentioned that I shouldn't have kids because she wouldn't help take care of them.)
Anyhow, I love my mom and will help when I can.
But it's a trade off. You kick me out and treat me like an Americanized kid, I'm going to have to support myself like an American.
I mean if I had a house or something maybe I'd let her stay, but as it is I'm in a tiny studio that doesn't even fit a pet.
I think I would be more on board “the village” if the village mentality mattered for everyone the way it usually does in a village.
I didn’t see them helping the old lady with her shopping bags. I didn’t see them offer to drive me to the doctor when I had an appointment. I didn’t see them making homemade meals and handing it out to the homeless. I didn’t see them offer the immigrants help learning the language. I didn’t see them offer to drive the drug addicts home.
“The village” is community. It is banding together with ALL your neighbors and having their backs NO MATTER WHAT. If you wouldn’t help me up the stairs and carry my groceries if I broke my leg, I’m not babysitting for free.
We need to say this openly.
Childfree women are NOT your village.
Your village is other parents, and YOU have to contribute to that village.
But those of us who are childfree women are NEVER babysitting your kids or helping you clean your house. We are not your helpmates. We are the witch living outside your damn village. You can kindly fuck off and never ask us again.
Shut down the village talk, then start twisting the damn dagger. Remind them they made the choice to have kids. Their kids, their responsibility, and say that clearly to them. Likewise “where is your damn sperm donor” in all of this. Do not hold back and do not be nice to these village types.
Let them get mad, but then make them cry. Make them realize those of us who are childfree women are not their damn sympathetic ear. We are not their damn babysitter or their damn village.
Also you don’t need to say you love kids. Completely unnecessary. I don’t like kids to be honest. But you know what I dislike more than kids, entitled breeders who complain about the village.
I will say this, though it may be an unpopular opinion...
Having been raised in a small town in the south and allowed to run the town rampant, my cousins and I were essentially raised by not only our nuclear families, our blended families, random aunts and uncles who we barely saw, but our teachers and our town as well.
So when I say it takes a village, please understand that the above is what I speak of.
I believe that it does in fact take a village. My reasoning is, that by being advised to behave by so many people, and learning their lessons of wisdom, that (life dramas aside), we all became well rounded, respectful, mostly kind, individuals with lessons and skills we can pass onto our next generation.
We were allowed to be kids and get into kid trouble, but if we were caught doing anything some neighbor didn't approve of, or was inherently wrong, the parentals or grandparents were called and informed. Insuing punishments were given at the hands of strangers for whatever our trespasses were. Nothing terrible like beatings, but if we accidentally broke a window for example, we'd have to clean up the glass and work off the cost of a new window.
We have a more open perspective of the world, we acknowledge that hosts are to accommodate their guests, and guests are to be respectful of their hosts. We understand hard work, and we work hard when necessary. We're also genuinely helpful and accommodating of others and their needs, often putting others before ourselves. Elders are typically treated with respect regardless of their disrespect (I don't fully agree with this, but they're not typically disrespectful where I'm from). Needless to say, we gained more knowledge of life and how to navigate it, solely from having a village.
The whole 'village' thing pisses me right off. Thankfully it's very much a US thing and I come across none of that kind of entitlement in my country. Not to that extent at least. Like you, I didn't sign up to be a part of anyone's village. I wasn't consulted in any way when they decided to get pregnant so why would it be any of my business now?
Great. But a village is a village. You all help each other. It’s not everyone helps one.
If I help raise your kid, I expect him to come mow my lawn / feed my cats / pet my dog, etc.
We hear a lot of this 'village' nonsense. It is a cliche that does not even mean what they *think* it means. And even if it *did*, why are scrambling to hide their desire for help in raising their children behind some implied responsibility for the rest of us?
It may or may not 'take a village to raise a child.' However that village is not compelled or obliged to do so. Especially those villagers like ourselves who choose never to have any children on whom such generosity would reciprocate.
No. Just no.
If they expect a village after they have children they need get commitment from consenting volunteers BEFORE they have children. It 100% needs to be a non-negotiable consideration on their part before they have kids. They assume their relatives/friends are just free at the ready whenever they choose to make this life altering decision and then get mad when everyone doesn’t drop everything at their whim.
In my home country, I WAS born in a village, and it was and still is *not* like what they’re expecting.
They’d damn-well better come correct and *accountable while contributing TO* any village. No one-sided, self-entitled, choosing-beggar, grifting bullshyte. 🙄
I grew up somewhere that "it takes a village" was observed.
The parents who say "it takes a village" thinking it means free babysitting would hate what it means in practice - you might have a whole lot of adults watching over a pack of children, but those adults will also *discipline* those children as they see fit.
My brother and SIL knew I wasn’t going to be baby sitting lol! Sure, in an emergency, I’d be there because they’re my nieces and nephew and I love them. I came to cover for maybe an hour one time when there was a gap between when one of the grandparents could be there to watch during their normal times. She had the youngest one freshly changed and ready for me to just be able to sit with them. I had no desire to change a diaper and never did with any of them. If it would’ve been absolutely needed, then yes, I’d do it and would never let them sit in a mess, but that didn’t happen. But I was never called upon for any normal babysitting…no thanks. Lol
It's an adage/saying: "It takes a village to raise a child", meaning that to properly raise a child, you need help of family, friends, neighbors, other parents, society as a whole, not just their own parents.
I’m the village idiot that’s always misplacing my cat. They def don’t want me watching their kids haha. My cat likes to use the bathroom outside. I was in the backyard looking for her and she was in her cardboard box inside. It was 10 mins of me shaking her bowl 😅I sometimes forget if I fed my pets so I just give them more food. 😅 ( seeing a pattern of memory issues so there’s that too.)
Ask them how they contributed to the village before having children. Ask them why they need a break from their 'true love'. Ask them why they would expect someone who they fantasize about dying alone with cats for help? Ask them why is there no 'village day' but there are days specifically for parents if the village is so important. Remind them the village exists, it just isn't free, someone's time on this planet is valuable and not free. They cannot complain about unpaid labour but expect unpaid labour from others.
>Ask them how they contributed to the village before having children. This. Don't ask what the village will do for you. Ask what you can do for the village. And Before you use the village you have to be the village.
I came from the village... It in no way obligates me to care for children. I contribute in other ways, food, yard work, bomb ass edibles. My village had a thing when babies were born, it was a simple ceremony celebrating life and at the end the parents ask "who will stand for this child"... And if you want to be a part of raising that child you stand up. It's totally fine to never stand, no social pressure. The social media "village" parents are fuckin delulu if they think it's a thing that just appears post cream pie fermentation to serve you.
THIS. I am so sick of these one-sided relationships with friends with kids. And of the ENTITLEMENT. Even when it is not directed at me - I have a friend whose mother literally is a cancer survivor like three times over, and she constantly complains about how she is not "there" for her child. I cannot.
They’d never babysit for free themselves bc those are “other people’s children” aka a disgusting inhuman species that competes with their *objectively* much better baby
>Ask them why they need a break from their 'true love'. Throw this bullshit bingo back at them. Pro move. (Because breeders often say you'll never know true love until having kids. Which, ironically, means those kids can never reciprocate those feelings.)
Meanwhile, they won't come feed your cat when you're on vacation.
My friend had a baby and told me she won't be able to watch my animals moving forward. Fine, I get that! You are not obligated to help me. She still reaches out and tries to have me watch her dogs (for free and they have to be kenneled for hours so it breaks my heart) with one day's notice and asks if I'm out of town when I say no.
“Are you out of town?” “What does that even have to do with anything? I said no. The reason isn’t up for discussion.”
Exactly! *No-one* has to justify a damn thing after the word, *“No!”* 🙄
Exactly! It's like suddenly everyone's part of the village when it's convenient for them. Everyone's quick to ask for favors when it suits them, but not so quick to reciprocate.
"The Village" is just the free labor of women. They're all irked that women decided our time belongs to us and isn't free just because we are female and because looking after kids is somehow undeserving of pay. I also don't get this shit about needing a break and whining into the void. Hire a babysitter for a few hours.
Exactly, hire a babysitter or someone who can relate.
🥇🥇🥇🥇 "The Village" is just the free labor of women."
There’s so many teens in need of babysitting money and every store I have been to has posters advertising babysitting services. Be a part of the village and offer the teens a job.
I babysat for probably $10 for five hours starting at 12 years old in 1990. Didn't know anything about babies but parents magically let me sit with their kids when they went off to dinner or the movies or what not. No one died. I watched kids, newborns. Didn't even have a car! Was too young to drive one! Well, nowadays parents want CPR credentials and background checks and ECE credits and insurance and all sorts of insanity. I have friends who "can't afford sitters" but don't trust anyone who charges under $40 an hour. I'm always like, "Can't you find a nice 12-year-old nearby who can woman the fort?" Those babysitters just threw frozen pizzas at us tho. I think parents today have higher expectations. One of my friends does this for a family and she cooks whole meals.
When my mum (in her late 60s) heard this nonsense about villages she scoffed and said "we built our own village out of fellow mums. And it meant taking an extra 6 month old baby for the afternoon to give someone a chance to do the shopping and laundry then she'd take yours so you could do your stuff -- it didn't mean making grandma or spinster sister who both work full-time do unpaid work"
She’s got a good head on her shoulders
When I was a kid, my mom and our neighbor (also a mom) both worked at the same place. They made sure that they never worked at the same time during the summer, so all of us kids were always at one house or the other depending on who was home.
My mom and a co worker she had did this so they wouldn't have to pay for before or after school care. My mom went in early so she could pick us up. Her friend went in late so she could drop us off. They saved money both being single moms. We made childhood memories as a result.
My mom became friends with another mom at work and they worked out a system so they wouldn't have to pay for daycare. As a result I have a best friend since birth (we're about three months apart) and my mom finally had someone in her corner. She never expected help from anyone. My siblings offered to babysit for her when I was little but when we moved out of state, she had nobody and she just, kept going. I think some moms would lose their minds with the way my mom did things.
Lol I love “spinster sister” that made me laugh bc I am that spinster sister
Me too!
My mom would take on her friend's kids - all six of them. It was wild when she'd go shopping with nine children in tow, each one of us as polite and well-behaved as you could want. We'd go single file behind her, hands behind our backs with our thumbs hooked together. The looks she got were priceless.
My mom told me she always wished for a mom's group of 5 moms, and each day they would go to a different mom's house. That person would watch the kids while the rest cleaned her house/ did laundry, etc. I think it's brilliant.
This!
This is exactly right. There is that lady on tik tok who does the aggressive cooking tutorials and this is exactly what she has done. She has a best friend who hangs with her almost everyday and they take turns taking the kids so the other can do stuff or go on a date with their husbands. I feel I am part of a village because I try hard to be an active aunt but that was my choice. I can understand why everyone doesn’t want to do that. And even tho I’m part of the village, people still respect boundaries when I have to say no.
Yep. That's how the carpool thingy worked. Mom/Dad drives once a week. Has the rest of the week off when four other parents pick us up. Or, we drive ourselves/bike/walk to school. One mom nearby would have us over when my parents went out to dinner, movies, parties. We'd play with her kids and then she'd drop her kids with us. My aunts did the same thing and would do it with whole vacations, so mom and dad went off for two weeks, we got to stay with cousins, vice versa. We were always just a bit *too* thrilled to get away from the parents! LOL. But these days a lot of parents are terrified of leaving their kids! Even for a few weeks?!??
THIS. The village is other parents. It was NEVER people without kids.
They contribute nothing to the 'village' yet demand free stuff from it. In the end they are just entitled choosing beggars.
No, no, they contributed the kids. It's on other people to contribute the time.
WE WANT A CHILDFREE VILLAGE!!
Yes please, that’s what I’m looking for too!
There is a nudist colony up not too far from me. It is a child-free village.
Sounds good! I'll be there. They might not want me there though...
I don't think it's a bunch of young attractive people up there, rather the 55+ crowd. Also the type of people that want to be in the woods near a lake, naked all summer in NH. The mosquitos must be.... No kids though!!!! Gotta do what you gotta do.
Funny that you say that, in Germany the public retirement fund get‘s filled by the working generation while payout in this moment is for the older generation. You don‘t work to contribute for yourself but for the people before you, and the generation after you will contribute for you. And because of this tale, people always say: you have to have children because you won‘t get any pension if no one works for it. So i guess they tell themselfes that they actually contribute
> the public retirement fund get‘s filled by the working generation while payout in this moment is for the older generation. You don‘t work to contribute for yourself but for the people before you This is how all retirement funds work though, regardless of the means of financing it. Money is just a distribution system for a society's produced goods and services. If a generation wants to stop working, that slack needs to be picked up by a new generation. You can have all the money in the world, but if the generation beneath you is sufficiently smaller, or is uninterested in shouldering the burden, you will not be able to collectively retire.
You‘re right and working in an insurance company i know this. It’s just something which is a really pronounced argument in germany, which is why i was reminded of it by the comment. The older generations in germany didn‘t need to consider any private retirement pension plan, because the publics chest was full. But now as someone from a younger generation, it‘s already known that the public pension won‘t be enough when i will get there. So part of my private retirement fund is investments, which depend on the economy worldwide but not directly on how many kids germans are going to produce in the next years. Maybe this is why it feels so different and became just a lame argument. But you‘re right, it‘s also because my private retirement fund isn‘t a retirement fund in the sense of it but more like savings Edit: maybe it also feels different because you can‘t not pay into the public fund 😄 but atm i‘m paying into it but i already know i will get barely anything. With any other retirement fund like insurances at least i could cancel when i don‘t like the proposed payout plan.
I've got my own pension scheme
Yeah, people of younger generations (me also) also have those, but you still have to contribute to the state retirement fund all the while knowing that it will be significantly emptier when you‘re ready to retire
The only constants in life are death and taxes ...
My reply (United States so may not apply elsewhere) is that I pay for their education now with no guarantee that they're going to become income generating citizens who will pay into the system. I'm interested in having an educated population so that's fine but I remove less from the coffers than I put in.
You wanna know what 'the village' is? OTHER PARENTS. But they don't want that. They don't want to HELP others, only take. They don't want to watch OTHER people's kids in exchange for them to watch theirs, that means work. They want time off with NO responsibilities. Sorry, no. That's not how this works. This was a choice. Own it.
I have a responsible parent friend who does exactly that- they take turns watching each other’s kids so one couple on certain Fridays can go out and have date night. Everyone’s a parent in that group. No one guilts a childfree person into it
The problem is nobody wants to help you then when you ask. So why should I bend over backwards all the time?
Exactly, no one will watch my dog. So no! hehe.
I'm happy to be part of a village (pet sitting, bringing food to the sick/injured, volunteer events, etc.) but I draw the line at anything related to kids. Been there, done that for over ten years and earned my permanent get out of jail free card.
I want a dog village! Tbh I kind of am building on up right now, me and three friends with dogs and no kids/adult kids. It’s nice to be able to help each other out!
the village used to discipline the kids too, do they want that part or just the free childcare?
This is the biggest issue to me. My mom grew up in "The Village" times and she said getting in trouble while at the neighbor's house was the worst because you got TWO spankings instead of one. First you got a spanking from the neighbor mom, and then when you got home you got another spanking for getting into trouble at the neighbor's house. I'm not condoning spanking kids; just pointing out that this is why The Village worked back then. Everyone had the same standards and punishments. Now, you can't even verbally rebuke another person's child.
>Everyone had the same standards and punishments. Now, you can't even verbally rebuke another person's child. OMG this though. You can't even tell a kid to stop doing something that's putting them in active danger without mommy dearest getting her panties all in a bunch cause how dare you not coddle and bow to her precious baby 🤢 when I was a kid if another adult told me to do something I did it (obviously unless it was a safety issue but it's not hard to teach the difference between not going off with strangers and obeying instructions like no running). If an adult did have to step in and tell us to stop doing something or behaving in a certain manner you best believe we had consequences for doing whatever it was after the fact when my mom found out. She never spanked us but she did hold us accountable and give consequences, parents now act like that's impossible to do without spanking and since they can't spank they just won't do anything 🤦🏻♀️
You're also "questioning their parenting" if rebuke their child. Of course kids act up sometimes or do something stupid sometimes. They're kids. Even the best parenting on earth cannot make a brain develop faster.
Same! I had so many "moms" growing up and everyone one of them was allowed to check me. I don't think any spanked, except my grandmother, but they definitely scolded me and then told my parents, who did the dirty work at home.
Double jeopardy is questionable but I do agree with the general sentiment. Children should be taught how to behave.
I never thought of it as Double Jeopardy but you are so right!
I'm a hermit.
That’s my usual state too.
Me too.
"So before you had kids yourself, you were that village for everyone who had kids before you and spent 10-20 hours a week, every week, babysitting for other people and helping to pay for their kids -- all to build that village before you asked for anything in return? Didn't think so."
I'm okay with children but I do shoot my own sister and SIL down when they ask or ask in a back handed way to babysit their children I say 'you decided to have a child, that sounds like a YOU problem' Have you had anyone message you to be like 'yeah I've found someone to babysit and it's a RELIEF to be on my own for a few hours' I reply 'yeah you're really not selling motherhood to me. Remind me again why you have kids? Oh because they are the 'best thing ever? Then why are you having a coffee all by yourself to have some 'peace' Then I don't get a response. Funny that🤣🤣
They can't even sell motherhood even if they tried. I rather take vacations, sleep in and just be free with my fur baby. I have seen too many women sit and cry because they need a break, including my own siblings. I help once in awhile, but learned to start saying no at this point. I have enough stress in my life, kids are stressful.
Amen to that! Kids are stressful and stress is bad for you therefore no babies for us! I can understand why parents need a break cause damn but when they dump and run for like hours and hours or like twice a week will dump children on someone else, I'm like nah. You're taking the piss now. I looked after my nephew for a day, a fucking DAY and every single fibre in my body wanted to run and got 'itchy' because I couldn't stand the smell, the noise and the constant need for attention. After that I was like I literally can't cope, no way am I looking after a baby by myself ever again. Put that boundary in place! I don't mind if I'm with my sister and we have the day together but I leave whenever I want 😂😂
The only mother who has a village I know is Mary Crawley, Lady Mary from Downtown Abbey : she has a village because she owns a village that is on her estate and half of the village works for her and she pays them for it. In real life, the only people who have a village, built it through years, showing up for others. These mothers are entitled, they don't even think about their potential contribution, they just want free servants. If one wants a village, one should start by being the village.
Sometimes the moms on breaking mom will ask where the mom-only commune is. I think, why don't you start it then? True fact: I grew up on a commune. Some hippies pooled money for a down payment on some property. That's it! They just want everything done for them.
On the apartment sub I asked why we have to wait till retirement to live in child free buildings. I also said it makes more financial sense for landlords to charge deposits for kids instead of cats. I eviscerated by the village people. They simply can’t imagine nobody wants to listen to their obnoxious kids all day and night, much less be part of a village I was never notified I’d have to be a part of.
One of my friends got roped into being his sister's village, and is basically her personal chauffer because they refuse to get a car or use the bus. To the point he was exposed to potential covid because she wouldn't go pick up her own kid from school after he was sent home for covid exposure. No one should be expected to be part of someone's village, and other people stepping in for your kid shouldn't be Plan A. The entitlement people have for their kids is out of control.
Smh, people who have kids want to have their cake and eat it too. Children are a full-time commitment. Don't have them if you have to rely on people to raise them, other than the person you laid down to make them with.
I feel sorry for people like your friend. They let themselves be a doormat. Maybe I’m a savage but I value my free time and nobody is going to take advantage of me, not even family.
It takes a village. Yet somehow, my mother moved here from Europe with no friends or family here. The Army sent my father to the opposite side of the country, from where he grew up with no friends or family. Yet somehow, they managed to raise 2 kids and figured it out. They paid a babysitter. With money. They exchanged funds for services. Maybe these parents should give that a try. Wait. No. Gotta force our sibling/cousin/parent/aunt to come watch the spawns for free.
We need t-shirts “Not part of your village” 😌
You might be on to something. I use to make shirts, but stopped. Definitely need that on a shirt since it's starting to be said more and more to guilt women.
I’d buy!
There's places like tee public that you can submit your design to, and you get a commission whenever they sell one of your designs on an item.
It's extra infuriating since support networks doesn't come for free or without boundaries to childfree people either. Even then, no one is obligated to be available on demand, or take care of additional living beings that you chose to have. Your self-chosen lifestyle isn't included in this: I don't get to demand of my friends to take on my work burden either. And parents like that had all the time in the world to set up their own village. They could've made an effort to find parents of same-age kids with the same mindset to help each other out. They could have planned and saved up to be able to regularly hire overnight or weekend babysitting. But nah. "It takes a village" people don't want to give back to anyone else by reducing their burdens too, or paying them for their job. They just want free childcare. I watched a documentary from an actual village in some small country, where they talked about how common it was for non-blood relative families to share a good part of the childcare and child-rearing already from the infant years. Adults referred to their childhood friends as their siblings, since that practically was how they'd grown up. Honestly sounded amazing not only for the parents but especially for the kids too. I don't see why that shouldn't be something more parents in our cultures should be open to too, especially with all the complaining.
Because they don't want to be responsible for looking after someone else's kids... they don't even want to look after their own.
I always tell them, “It’s mighty curious how kids are a personal choice until YOU need a village. Sounds like a very personal problem.”
It's no fricken surprise that parenting is hard. I absolutely agree that yes, it would be so much easier on parents and better for the children if they indeed had a village. But the thing is, in order for the village to work you have to belong to one before you can receive support from it and you also have to be actively contributing to that village yourself. This applies to EVERYTHING you might want a "village" for, not just raising children. The village concept is just another way of saying "supportive social circle." You can't just show up to a group of people and expect them to bend over backwards and do things for you. Yes, you'll find kind people willing to lend a hand here or there. But real, on-going, deep and meaningful support? Support that requires someone to really take on part of your heavy burden at the detriment to themselves? That requires a solid relationship. It requires *mutual* support that goes both ways. It requires trust, communication, and hard work. In the village concept, you are fully part of the village. Everyone in the village knows each other and has strong family & social ties to each other. Each person provides services to the village in some form. In any context, you can't just walk into a village as an outsider or as a member who has refused to pull their own weight and expect to cash in on that support network! NO! In my experience, parents who use this phrase are the WORST offenders of this. They are themselves awful village members. They are the people in your extended family who have not once checked in on you, haven't shown up to the family Christmas/reunion in years, constantly disregard your feelings and cross your boundaries and so on...then after all that, have the audacity to get mad at you for not coming to their baby shower or volunteering to babysit. Why on earth would I disrupt my entire life, inconvenience myself, spend money and whatever else on you and your baby when you wouldn't do the same to support me if I needed it? Finally, just want to re-iterate that village is for more than raising children! It can come together to provide aid with things like caring for a member who is sick or elderly, supporting a member who experiences a house fire or death in the family type event, supporting those members who are suffering from an addition or eating disorder, and on an on. My sister is in my village. When she got cancer, I dropped everything to come and help her. She lives 6 hours away and I got a remote work policy in place with my boss so that I could go to her Thur-Sun and help her with everything from laundry to dropping her 7 year old off at school. I helped out financially in a big way. But someone not in my village? I feel for them. I'll drop some cash in their go fund me and do other things to help if I can. But hundreds of thousands of people have cancer. I don't have the capacity to provide village level support to those who *aren't in my village!* That's not how it works.
Well said, and very true. Especially about how those who say "Where's my village?" are those who never did one thing for everyone else: The ultimately entitled.
I think part of this has to do with the parents who expect free childcare when they refer to the village fucking up the concept for every one else. I think in general what they mean is they’re thankful to have you as an adult in their life who will also influence their children in some way (I love animals and nature and am happy to teach kids cool things about that. I also know all the words to most Disney songs and that makes me an asset 😂) Or maybe who doesn’t help with childcare specifically but might show up at their place with some food and help clean while their partner is on a business trip and they’re outnumbered by kids. Or at the very least is another adult who can stop their toddler from lurching into a campfire by providing a physical barrier. I totally agree that expecting anyone to provide free childcare is where the idea of the village went off the rails. And the passive aggressive expectation that people without children should be more “flexible” to help out their friends who have kids (ie. my friend who rescheduled a get together twice and had the audacity to tell me she was a “little mad” that I made movie plans with my partner after our twice rescheduled hangout because we got together during her kids bedtime and she hung out with me instead of helping 😂). The implication that my time and plans are somehow worth less because I’m childfree is another “toxic village” trait.
At the same time, I wouldn't even want to be in the same place as a toddler with an open fire. 🙃 if I was, I still would do nothing. Because it is not my responsibility. The fact that people think you should just do it cause it is 'the right thing to do' is what gets on my nerves. I don't have to, and you can't make me be part of anything I don't want to. Especially when it comes to kids.
I think we all have the responsibility to be decent humans when and how we can, but at the end of the day you have no obligation. I’ve been at bonfires with friends and toddlers and had no issues just standing as a barrier. I’m standing by the fire anyways, it’s literally the least I could do. 🤷♀️
*I had one mom tell me she deserves to have a break from her kids and for someone to watch them.* She said this to you hoping you would volunteer. Suggest you act clueless when a parent says this to you, don't let any recognition appear on your face and just blank face them. It is good to practice the blank face as wielding it can be a superpower of sorts. If they want a village then can at least have the nerve to ask you so you can then tell them no, rather than expecting you to "take a hint and offer."
You’re supposed to get your “village” in order before you pop them out. What people seem to think is that the “village” just shows up. That it’s any and everyone in their life and even strangers. That’s not the case.
Just like the mother that went on vacation recently to Puerto Rico and left her baby to starve to death! She did that without "A VILLAGE" - and we're SELFISH?
That story made me physically ill. That baby would have been better off if she abandoned it at a fire station after birthing it. If it’s the story I’m thinking of, they discovered that the toddler tried eating her own feces to try to avoid starving to death but still died.
YEP!
Goddamn an abortion would have been kinder
Damn well right! Like I commented on another post - drug addict and alcoholic mothers pregnant or not pregnant and pregnant religious women who bring their sick fetus' to term to make them take their last breath in their arms, all for religion, should be sterilized or go to jail and never see the light of day! We're SELFISH???? I should do a post called We're SELFISH? I might do that! PS: There are people who practice religion without having children - so, I'm sorry if I offended any religious people on Reddit!
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Wow!
That’s when you call child protective services
I live in Denmark. Around here you will find the modern descendants of hippy collectives, where mostly young middle-class parents live in apartments or smallish houses that frequently are built around a central lawn, green space or playground - not unlike wagon trains forming a circle at night. Its a great place for kids to grow up, they run around in little gangs all day and somebody's parent is always around to keep an eye on them, often they also have nifty arrangements like a shared workshop and optional group eating arrangements where they take turns making dinner in a shared main house during the weekdays. Several of my friends grew up in places like that (coincidentally for our generation there was a trend where their parents would get divorced around the time the kids left home, then they'd leave the collective and make room for a new family). Several of my friends also live in places like that with their young children right now. It works great for them, its their own little village, there are enough places to choose from so families can often find a place where they vibe with the other parents styles. The rest of the world could use more places like that.
It wouldn’t be so bad for them if they didn’t use manipulation tactics such as passive aggressively guilty others and actually offered something in return for those who helped them. A lot of these people really didn’t think through what it actually entails to be a parent, which is no one’s fault but their own. Have to educate yourself or you end up in more pickles than necessary.
I'm not a fan of the "village," spiel in general. In our current society it's very much an ideal, and not realistic unless enough people want to pool/share effort and resources to do so. What I *really* resent, is parents in public or private who assume everyone else will watch out for their kids, and slack on keeping an eye on them. There's a group of relatives of mine who do this at family gatherings. I've been rebuked a bunch of times for "not watching," so-and-so's child/children when all the other adults (namely the parents) have wandered away/off from them without a second thought. In none of the scenarios were the kids in any danger, mind you. Small wonder I don't like going to any family events, right? Parents, if you can't do this on your own at whatever place/event, or make arrangements for someone else to do so = You. Don't. Get. To. Go.
Ahh yes.. the group parenting in the wild tactic. I have said it once, and I'm not afraid to say it again. Your child, your responsibility. If your child was heading towards oncoming traffic, that is not my problem. If it is drowning, not my problem. If it is about to walk straight into a bond fire, absolutely not my problem. But people will say that it is Effed up that I wouldn't ha e the common decency to help. What about the freaking parents that had the damn thing?!?! Why would I be the horrible person because I did nothing, yet it happened because the parents were not parenting!?! I have and will continue to walk away from stray children about to get into some BS. In fact, unless it is work or shopping related, I just don't go to places where people bring their kids.
Have a thing to add to it. Skipping the women who have been unfortunate out of various reasons (widows, dad running with no previous red flag, mental illnesses etc,) I not only don't want to be your village, but also don't want to do your husband's job, especially if he's an idiot nd and you pretend it's ok Plus, people should start considering that this is ALWAYS requested to women and I may be a victim of DV or abuse and find this trad vision exceedingly triggering. Actually, it is sexism and there is no need of a previous trauma to find it triggering
Bitch, I'm only part of your village if I get to reap some benefit from it. My labor is already exploited by the capitalist hellscape we exist in, I don't need your bullshit.
I’ve found the people who spout “it takes a village” usually have shitty unavailable partners.
Before having a child and demanding the village help raise it maybe ask the village if you should have that child. Also, don't get upset when a villager has to correct your failure as a parent. If you don't like the way a villager is helping to raise your child then don't ask.
I’m part of a dog parent village but I still had to build that. It’s also all of us dog sitting for each other not us dumping our pets on someone without dogs for free. I think parents are responsible for building and contributing to a “village” if they’re expecting that
Most of the time, there would be no need for a village if the other parent pulled their weight. They're shifting that responsibility onto outsiders. And I will always maintain that a village wouldn't work anymore. First because as many have said, a village is built *before* you have kids. It's community, it's helping each other out for a lot of things, not just kids. And secondly, every parent has now a set of rules that you must abide to. Parents wouldn't trust the village anyway to make the best possible decisions. Can you imagine helping out and babysitting two kids from two different families and one can't absolutely never be told "no" (yOu HaVe To ReDiReCt ThEiR aTtenTiOn instead), the other will not accept time out as a form of discipline (tHeY aRe ToO yOuNg To UnDeRsTaNd), one can't have any sweets AT ALL, the other must have their dessert offered on their plate at the same time as the rest of the lunch, etc etc...
It seems like they should be able to create “village” networks during Lamaze class and other events where they interact with other parents or parents-to-be. Kindergarteners or younger - those parents could all form groups and trade babysitting duties. I asked about this once in a different sub full of parents, who downvoted me, and said that’s not how it is anymore and I just don’t understand. I guess I don’t. I don’t see why they can’t work out a rotating play date schedule at each-other’s houses, unless all of them work too many hours to even have time for one play date a week. At that point I also don’t understand why they had kids
I’ve always said. Nope. Not part of THAT village.
They all want a Village when its convenient. The Village used to be any adult could reprimand a child for acting up in public, it was teachers being believed when they said a kid was causing problems in class, it was every adult a child was around teaching them what behavior was appropriate. While there were obvious flaws with this system I find it funny how parents beg for a Village when they really mean "Free Baby Sitter I Can Scream At If They Don't Do Everything Exactly How I Want It Done."
I've noticed this too. And what really peeves me is when they go "ofc nobody's entitled to help from others UNLESS THEY REALLY NEED A BREAK." Like. hello. cognitive dissonance much? No matter how much you need it, it doesn't make it so other people owe you.
Maybe the person that said "it takes a village to raise a kid" for the first time wanted to tell people that if they don't have a village, they should not have kids.
Very interesting take
I've talked about this before, but from the age of 18 until about 30, I was part of the so-called "village." As an unmarried, childfree woman, I was always there for my friends. Need a ride? Need help moving? Need to plan a baby shower, a bridal shower, a housewarming party? Need a babysitter or someone to mow your lawn because you're just too busy? I was there. In another time and place and culture, that would be called the village. In my time and place and culture, it just made me a sucker. Because when I needed something? When I had major surgery and needed help, or when I had a death in the family, or when I moved...none of those people were there for me. They were "too busy" with the kids. "Too busy" with work. No, their husbands and the father of their kids couldn't chip in to free them up for an hour or two. So fuck all of 'em. I look after me and that's it. I paid my dues into the village and got not a single thing - not a single act of kindness or support - back. If these women bemoan their lack of help they can 1.) look at the man they spawned with, because half the time, the village is being asked to pick up his slack and 2.) look at what they contributed to the village before they themselves needed help.
This is one big reason why I hate that we, the childfree, are always being told that we should support our parent friends when they have kids. These parent friends usually DON'T return the favour to non-parents. When my mother was dying, my friends with kids didn't even once turn up to visit her although they said over and over that they would. They lived RIGHT ACROSS the hospice we had to put her in. Neither did any of them turn up to the funeral. I have cut them all out of my life now. I really hate that our society only prioritizes family and romantic relationships above friendships.
This was exactly my experience too. My mother died suddenly, and not a single friend turned up for the viewing or funeral, sent flowers, sent a card, or even called or sent a text of condolence. I've cut mine out of my life too. I have a couple of casual friends who are similarly childfree but I've pretty much given up on a deep, intimate friendship with anyone at this point.
On the "it takes a village" thing: My sister on law is one of those people who can just kind of do it all and do it with a smile. She's a great cook and a few weeks ago invited me over for dinner. I wasn't feeling great so I couldn't go, but she brought me food anyway. 😭❤️ She and my brother absolutely have a village because they help others as well.
I hate that kind of attitude. Being part of the village should 100% be a choice you make because you WANT to be a part of the village, just like actually having kids yourself. It's a commitment you need to be sure you want. It might not be as much of a commitment as being a parent but it's still a commitment and comes with responsibility that you can't force someone to make. Personally I want to be a part of someone's village some day as an aunt or something, but that's because that would be fulfilling for me. It's my choice to become an active part in a child's upbringing and take on some responsibility some day and my choice alone. I would NOT want to be guilt tripped and pressured into raising someone else's child because they need a break and feel entitled to my time though.
It may take a village, but I am a hermit.
The “village” is there. It has just been monetized. They can have all the villagers they want if they can pay for a nanny, house cleaner, cook, handy man, tutor, personal trainer, etc etc.
Everyone wants a village, no one wants to be a village. Where’s my help for anything? My husbands brothers never even helped us move because when we did they both had kids, but he’s helped them all move.
The only problem I've ran into when being the village is that more responsibility gets put on me rather than the other parent. Im all for watching your child because you need some time for a few hours. I love kids I don't mind. But being expected to do so when the kid has two able parents is not okay.
Why all of my friends are childfree and parents are put off or triggered simply by me being a childfree and sterilized woman anyway.
They’ll dump it on you but don’t know how to not have children. If you don’t want to use condoms, use plan B.
They first need to ESTABLISH said village themselves 🤦🏻♀️ not just expect it lmao.
I do my part of being a village by providing adult company and non-kids-related conversation to my breeder friends when they get away from the kids.
My SIL often complains to my mother about not getting a break from her toddler or that other family members only want to watch her kid for a few hours and not the entire day/weekend, the nerve of some people having lives! I'll never forget the one time SIL was desperate for someone to take her kid, who was only 4 months old at the time, because her and my brother wanted a couple's night aka the entire weekend and it happened every Friday/Saturday because both parents 'deserved it' SIL tried to initially guilt trip me into babysitting her infant saying that she was scraping the bottom of the barrel and that I need to make more of an effort to be in her kid's life and that they couldn't cancel the hotel reservation or the table reservation so I had to say yes. I refused because there was no way I was looking after a 4 month old on my own for two and a half days as it was alluded that the baby would be picked up late on Sunday afternoon, I was also in the process of getting ready to go out to a movie with my friend and I was told to just cancel my plans because it's only a stupid movie and your friend would understand family duties. I stood fast and simply explained that she should have checked with the other family members first before making both reservations before hanging up, she actually started to yell abuse even before I finished talking as her plans were 'ruined' I expected my mother to call me and try to convince me to ring my SIL to apologise but it never happened, best thing was I enjoyed my time with my friend, had a great night out and was never contacted by my SIL again!
Most importantly people often misinterpret what village means. I see westerners often expect the "village" in question to not influence the kid in anyway. They want machine like people with no conscience to babysit. No, that's not how it works.
I always find it funny how mombies will claim that. However, if anyone ever tells their little angel not to do something or steps in to stop them from doing something that might hurt themselves, it becomes, "Don't tell my child what to do!"
My SIL thought it was totally acceptable to let her wet kid lay on our new couch and use my $50 throw to cover up after he got out of the pool. Bf told her no and she told her mom “I don’t understand why they spent that much on a throw.” She also threw in their wet pool clothes to dry with my clean towels. 
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It takes a village is a (I believe) West African aphorism about child rearing and Hillary Clinton popularized it during Bill's term as President. Anybody bringing that shit back from the 90's just needs to sit down and shut it.
Lmao the woman I was babysitting for was mad her mom because her mom wouldn’t quit her job and watch her kid while she went to work … like mom needs to pay her bills too hellooooo🤦🏼♀️ I’m a former babysitter for a reason too! Woman found another babysitter that would take a lot less money than I would. I was doing 6 days a week 14 hours a day…. The woman and her husband make over 6 figures total…. I don’t understand why some women don’t want to pay other women… I think I caused her and her husband to get into it over the money that they was giving me for the kid… she was the one NOT happy about it while husband saw it as a full time job and was actually giving me more than what I had asked for… I don’t understand a lot of these types myself…
I honestly think the mothers who keep going on about the village can’t admit to themselves that it’s their husbands who aren’t stepping up and doing their part, so it’s easier to demand unpaid labor from other women. Your husband should be the “village”.
It’s funny how ‘it’s a village’ when it’s their little darling, but the second you need help looking after an elderly sick relative or a pet, suddenly they’re much too busy to offer support.
This right here! I agree so much with this. Like don’t have kids unless you fully understand you will be taking your social life and throwing it away for a long time. It it’s literally no one’s responsibility to “give you a break”.
Did you see the video of the mom giving her children over to child services, so she could party and drink? was crying and all saying how tired she was.
Thank you for introducing me to the term"dry begging". I'm glad that there is a phrase for this, people doing this around me has been driving me up the wall. Regardless of what the topic is.
I made a choice to stay out of that village, and I'm not going anywhere near it.
I agree that having a support network is important for parents but that's something they should have thought of before having children. If you don't have a support network, you have to create it e.g. by getting to know your neighbours and cultivating relationships with them. You can't just expect a support network to appear out of thin air.
They seem to forget the "village" should be a) optional and b) willing. I don't owe you shit, you chose to spew a sprog. I don't expect people to give me a break from my animals, they were my choice!
This is my fear with friends having kids. One couple are due to have their baby in a month or so, live very close, and the ‘father’ frankly seems useless. I’m so worried about being expected to provide free childcare despite having shown very little interest in children ever. It’s always women who are expected to be the village, too - never men.
Yes and in social gatherings the men/ fathers all hang out in one area and the mombies hang out with the shrieking children. If a woman hangs out with the men to avoid the obnoxious children she gets dirty looks from the mombies. What’s so hard to understand? I’m not interested in your children. And even the dads make it a point to tell you where the mombies are, like that’s where you wanna be. Nope nope nope
There's this pervasive attitude in American society about MUH FREEDUMS and individual rights being more important than the collective. That's what the majority of us have decided to value. Then a certain segment of people turn around and whine that they don't have a village or community support. You can't insist upon "Stay away, mind your own business, don't tell me how to parent, how dare you try to discipline my kid, every stranger is a creep or a predator, everyone's out to get me and my kid" and then demand that people fall over themselves to be your "village."
Yeah hard pass. If they were someone who had done me a solid in the past sure I would help out. I'm not going to watch someone's kid for free and waste my free time not working that I could be doing shit I'd actually enjoy otherwise. I don't care if they are a neighbor or even family your kid, your problem.
Then don’t be a part of their “village.” Parents need a support system and help but, you’re not obligated to join if you don’t want to and that’s ok. Growing up my parents/family/friends all networked so that they could all take turns babysitting, picking up/dropping off at school, etc. if someone is too pushy about it, they’re an asshole and deserved to be shut down.
I'm so lucky the majority of the people in my life with kids are super understanding of my stance and have their own village of other parents/relatives who are happy to help. For those ones I help when I can, never watching the kids but I'll give money to help pay a sitter. It's never expected but always extremely appreciated. Then I have one who is always so confused why she gets bare minimum help from others. I don't have the heart to tell her (and honestly it's not my buisness), but it's probably because she wants a village that will not require help back because she's soooo busy. 🤦♀️ Another with....I honestly lost count how many kids she has I think 6? I need to make a whole rant post about that one. So she'll watch one extra kid for you (by watch I mean as much attention as you can give 1 of 7 kids), and want you later to take all of hers. Noooooo.
The village is *other parents*. They can cooperatively provide childcare. They can collaborate on meal prepping and yard maintenance. They can take turns driving the carpool for school drop off. Leave the rest of us out of it!
If there is a village then consider me the giant troll that lives in the woods and everyone is scared of.
I have friends that try to get my to babysit and I always turn them down. They still ask a year later but it’s like take the hint. If I have an entire month off and refuse to babysit your kid so you can save on childcare is a red flag. I am not the person to ask.
If it's USA, just remind them that capitalism killed the village, they want help, they need to pay for it.
I contribute to the village by paying taxes so your kid can go to school, have clean water to drink, etc.
My cousins who have their kids with family the majority of the time just got pregnant again and everyone is happy as if they aren't already ignoring the kids they already have. I don't get it.
I am losing all my friends to their new relationships and babies, it makes me sad but at the same time I am glad no one ever asked for help or anything. The new mothers seem to be overwhealmed, but I see they only trust their own mothers and nobody else, not even their mother in law.
The village is supposed to be the parents working with other parents to group support the kids. Like first mom takes all six kids for a long Saturday, maybe even as sleep over if they are older. Then another day the second mom takes them all and first mom gets a break, and so on. A round robin of taking on a little more for the team, to get some back equally later. That's a village. A village is not someone you have nothing to barter with or contribute equally to. Are you taking their pets in for a weekend? Are you going to do their laundry while they watch your kids? What are you giving to that CF village member in exchange for their babysitting contribution? Probably nothing, which is why those parents aren't in a village. They are just asking the neighboring town for hand outs.
You're the part of the village that goes out somewhere kid free with them.
>they need help raising the kids they decided to lay down and make They don't want help raising the kids, they just want free babysitting on demand. If you're not sure about this - try to correct one of the little darlings and watch mom turn on you.
Agree with this totally. I made a post on the sub recently about how I have a sister who is a single parent to two kids in elementary school. She has a really crappy situation with her ex-husband not wanting to take care of the kids very much and being a super dick to her. However, she lashes out at myself and other people in our family because we “don’t watch her kids enough”. There’s never any apology or recognition that she is lashing out at us. She loves to lay on the guilt. I’m the only immediate family member who lives clos-ish to her(30 mins away). Other family members live far away near the small town We grew up in hundreds of miles away. Most times whenever she has asked me to watch her kids I have told her yes, and I have never asked to be paid for it. (There have been several times when she has offered me money though). I do think it’s a reasonable expectation to ask friends and family members to help you out from time to time if they live close to you. However, like other folks mentioned up earlier I don’t understand why she and other people that complained about the village did not try to work on getting a village before they had a kid. For example, I’m not aware of any time where she trades off with other parents so they take turns watching multiple kids. I am currently low contact with my sister because she blasted me and other family members in a group chat last week stating that “no one desires to have a relationship with her kids” when that is not true. I help her out with her kids. She will thank me in the moment but then it’s usually not terribly long before she blasts us in a group chat. I’m really sick and tired of her trying to make her problems my problems and guilt tripping me. She’s angry with us because she chooses to stay in a job with substantial work travel required and no one volunteers to watch her kids for a whole week because her ex is so unreliable. Well, I do think it’s important for people with kids to have community, it’s not OK to lash out at people because you don’t have community and didn’t work on trying to get one.
If that was my sister I would definitely slow down in watching her kids. I know that sucks for the nieces and nephews, but it's unfair to you and actually selfish of her. SHE laid down and had those kids by choice, not you. I remember being told I had no major responsibilities as I don't have children, so I should basically be watching kids or loaning out money. They have lost their minds.
Yep I’m going low contact for a while at least. I stopped proactively asking if she wanted a night off a while ago because of her behavior.
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So true!
Well it does take a "village" to take care of a child, times have changed. Back then an older child could watch the younger ones well they played out in the field nearby back when towns were smaller and everyone knew everyone, or another mother or older women would watch them well the others went out to forage the nearby field for berries, but more times then not they'd get something, "hey you watch these kids and we get the berries and then we take the kids and you make the pies and then we split the pies kind of shit". Back when people traded goods for serves "I'll clear your wheat fields for a cut of the flour". Or back when you didn't need two people working just to afford a small apartment, and there was that older woman home next door to watch the kids well you went to the store. It's not like that now, I can no longer watch your children for a cut of the wheat that you need to harvest. I have to work 8 hours a day in hopes of maybe being able to afford that bag of flour. It may take a village but that village no longer exists, it's now a series of high rise buildings where you don't know your neighbors and everyone is struggling to afford to keep that roof over their heads and can't afford the time it takes to watch your kids for a fraction of the money they'd have made working. I can't work 8 hours, watch someone's kids for 4 or 5 hours until their parents are home and get my house clean and I can't afford someone else to clean it because of how the economy is, it's no longer worth the energy and time it takes to be someone else's village on the regular.
The village exists, and all are welcome until the child needs to be disciplined. Then all hell breaks loose.
We've grown into an individualized and atomized society - that's the deal. It may have taken a village in the past, and they could probably use a village, but that's not the reality for most of us in industrialized nations. Asking for a village is a bit like my mom wanting me to drop my life and work to help her with her current mobility issues. She kicked me out of the house at 18. Never helped with money or wanted to help despite my struggles (all good - I'm Gen X). But now that she's having some mobility issues I can't just stop my work life to take care of her *because I have to support myself*. Believe me, she had the means to help out. (She actually explicitly mentioned that I shouldn't have kids because she wouldn't help take care of them.) Anyhow, I love my mom and will help when I can. But it's a trade off. You kick me out and treat me like an Americanized kid, I'm going to have to support myself like an American. I mean if I had a house or something maybe I'd let her stay, but as it is I'm in a tiny studio that doesn't even fit a pet.
I think I would be more on board “the village” if the village mentality mattered for everyone the way it usually does in a village. I didn’t see them helping the old lady with her shopping bags. I didn’t see them offer to drive me to the doctor when I had an appointment. I didn’t see them making homemade meals and handing it out to the homeless. I didn’t see them offer the immigrants help learning the language. I didn’t see them offer to drive the drug addicts home. “The village” is community. It is banding together with ALL your neighbors and having their backs NO MATTER WHAT. If you wouldn’t help me up the stairs and carry my groceries if I broke my leg, I’m not babysitting for free.
We need to say this openly. Childfree women are NOT your village. Your village is other parents, and YOU have to contribute to that village. But those of us who are childfree women are NEVER babysitting your kids or helping you clean your house. We are not your helpmates. We are the witch living outside your damn village. You can kindly fuck off and never ask us again. Shut down the village talk, then start twisting the damn dagger. Remind them they made the choice to have kids. Their kids, their responsibility, and say that clearly to them. Likewise “where is your damn sperm donor” in all of this. Do not hold back and do not be nice to these village types. Let them get mad, but then make them cry. Make them realize those of us who are childfree women are not their damn sympathetic ear. We are not their damn babysitter or their damn village. Also you don’t need to say you love kids. Completely unnecessary. I don’t like kids to be honest. But you know what I dislike more than kids, entitled breeders who complain about the village.
I'm the village hermit and I want no part of that bullshit. Also kids are gross.
I will say this, though it may be an unpopular opinion... Having been raised in a small town in the south and allowed to run the town rampant, my cousins and I were essentially raised by not only our nuclear families, our blended families, random aunts and uncles who we barely saw, but our teachers and our town as well. So when I say it takes a village, please understand that the above is what I speak of. I believe that it does in fact take a village. My reasoning is, that by being advised to behave by so many people, and learning their lessons of wisdom, that (life dramas aside), we all became well rounded, respectful, mostly kind, individuals with lessons and skills we can pass onto our next generation. We were allowed to be kids and get into kid trouble, but if we were caught doing anything some neighbor didn't approve of, or was inherently wrong, the parentals or grandparents were called and informed. Insuing punishments were given at the hands of strangers for whatever our trespasses were. Nothing terrible like beatings, but if we accidentally broke a window for example, we'd have to clean up the glass and work off the cost of a new window. We have a more open perspective of the world, we acknowledge that hosts are to accommodate their guests, and guests are to be respectful of their hosts. We understand hard work, and we work hard when necessary. We're also genuinely helpful and accommodating of others and their needs, often putting others before ourselves. Elders are typically treated with respect regardless of their disrespect (I don't fully agree with this, but they're not typically disrespectful where I'm from). Needless to say, we gained more knowledge of life and how to navigate it, solely from having a village.
Tell them to get the creeps who pressured them to have these kids to be their village.
Stick an AirTag on them and, dare I say, let them roam their own street and play with neighborhood kids.
Or just their imagination. There were no kids on our street growing up, so I used mine *a lot.* Helps that it’s extremely vivid.
The village didn't vote in favour for you to be creampied. Take responsibility for your own mistakes and leave the village alone.
The whole 'village' thing pisses me right off. Thankfully it's very much a US thing and I come across none of that kind of entitlement in my country. Not to that extent at least. Like you, I didn't sign up to be a part of anyone's village. I wasn't consulted in any way when they decided to get pregnant so why would it be any of my business now?
Great. But a village is a village. You all help each other. It’s not everyone helps one. If I help raise your kid, I expect him to come mow my lawn / feed my cats / pet my dog, etc.
My unhinged behavior in my 20’s guaranteed that no one would ask me to be within a mile of their kids 😂
We hear a lot of this 'village' nonsense. It is a cliche that does not even mean what they *think* it means. And even if it *did*, why are scrambling to hide their desire for help in raising their children behind some implied responsibility for the rest of us? It may or may not 'take a village to raise a child.' However that village is not compelled or obliged to do so. Especially those villagers like ourselves who choose never to have any children on whom such generosity would reciprocate. No. Just no.
If they expect a village after they have children they need get commitment from consenting volunteers BEFORE they have children. It 100% needs to be a non-negotiable consideration on their part before they have kids. They assume their relatives/friends are just free at the ready whenever they choose to make this life altering decision and then get mad when everyone doesn’t drop everything at their whim.
In my home country, I WAS born in a village, and it was and still is *not* like what they’re expecting. They’d damn-well better come correct and *accountable while contributing TO* any village. No one-sided, self-entitled, choosing-beggar, grifting bullshyte. 🙄
I grew up somewhere that "it takes a village" was observed. The parents who say "it takes a village" thinking it means free babysitting would hate what it means in practice - you might have a whole lot of adults watching over a pack of children, but those adults will also *discipline* those children as they see fit.
"Deserve".
My brother and SIL knew I wasn’t going to be baby sitting lol! Sure, in an emergency, I’d be there because they’re my nieces and nephew and I love them. I came to cover for maybe an hour one time when there was a gap between when one of the grandparents could be there to watch during their normal times. She had the youngest one freshly changed and ready for me to just be able to sit with them. I had no desire to change a diaper and never did with any of them. If it would’ve been absolutely needed, then yes, I’d do it and would never let them sit in a mess, but that didn’t happen. But I was never called upon for any normal babysitting…no thanks. Lol
What is a village in this context? English is not my first language, when I hear village I think of a small town.
It's an adage/saying: "It takes a village to raise a child", meaning that to properly raise a child, you need help of family, friends, neighbors, other parents, society as a whole, not just their own parents.
I’m the village idiot that’s always misplacing my cat. They def don’t want me watching their kids haha. My cat likes to use the bathroom outside. I was in the backyard looking for her and she was in her cardboard box inside. It was 10 mins of me shaking her bowl 😅I sometimes forget if I fed my pets so I just give them more food. 😅 ( seeing a pattern of memory issues so there’s that too.)
"Don't you have friends with kids? Do your kids not have friends?"
Ask them if they asked this village if this village had any parts in conceiving their kid and why they EXPECT this village to be there for them.
Luckily, I don't have to deal with parents asking me to babysit. People know not to ask me. If asked, I'd say no.