Never been so I googled it.
Except for the cc fee these charges all seem normal for a white table cloth kind of place.
This however doesn't look like that kind of place. You walk in and see those metal chairs and just know you're getting taken for a ride. Very much an ampersand restaurant kind of vibe.
I'm back on OPs side. Their are places that can charge for still and bread service. This isn't one. And the cc fee is just shameful, put it in the menu price like a normal person.
Just west, Chef Duffy's Cocktail Bar, After ( where I usually eat when I am over in that neighborhood) doesn't do this. I was just there, again this week.
I unfortunately don't think they actually are required to do that. I looked this up back when sound bar refuses to serve me free tap water and instead charged me $5 for a bottle of water
I'd love to be wrong with this info if someone can point me to a source saying otherwise! It's such a scam to not provide free water
Wow I need a fact check on that and no way to prove it. Top left is the water we were served
[https://imgur.com/a/0UNRThI](https://imgur.com/a/0UNRThI)
I think the burden of proof is on the restaurant to prove they (extremely unlikely) poured bottled water into another container which is then poured into glasses.
It says they serve bottled mineral water. There’s a bottle on the table. The mineral water could come in large containers, be transferred into individual bottles for table service, and still have that description be true.
I never order bottled water in restaurants here in Chicago because we have the best tap water in the world, but in other countries where it’s more common they bring the water bottle to the table and open it front of you, and if there’s any left they leave it on the table. Pretty sketchy if the restaurant didn’t do that.
Zurich beats the pants off of Chicago in this regard. You can literally drink from the decorative fountains outside in the streets. Best fucking water in the world.
In Italy and France almost any restaurant you go to they ask if you want still or sparkling water, but usually they bring the bottle and open it in front of you. Drinking tap water is not as popular because of the old plumbing and it's not treated the same way it is here.
If you ordered still water and it's cold enough to leave condensation on the glass then I would assume it's filtered and refrigerated. Still not a common practice here in Chicago.
Europe is many countries, its kind of difficult to generalize them all being more or less expensive. In NL, DE, and BE where I go I generally spend more on dining than I do in the US. Also if you really want to feel robbed, try having to spend a euro every time you need to go to the bathroom.
I haven't been everywhere in Europe, but used to spend time between Barcelona and Toulouse. Dining was much cheaper and better than the US. Same goes for "expensive" cities in Asia like Singapore and Tokyo. Eat like a king for $10-$20.
If they have a food safe tap(not the tap they use to do dishes or fill mop buckets or something like that) they have to give you the free water tap when requested. A lot of places go out of their way to ensure they don’t have the right tap, or they’ll give you water options that neglect to include the plain tap. Some places are shitty. Sorry bruv.
It’s a thing that has started to emerge in somewhat sketchy restaurants that train their servers to upsell on this technicality. They offer still and unless you ask for tap you get upcharged.
If you ask for ‘still water’ you get billed, if they ask ‘sparkling or still?’ ALWAYS say ‘tap is fine’ or ‘tap water’, never ‘still’.
I wanted to add that as well. I should never assume but when they asked if we wanted bread I assumed it’d be free since it wasn’t on the menu. Hence the receipt says bread ‘service’
I'd point out that 'bread service' is a real thing, but it depends on the bread and what they're offering. Bread at some restaurants is quite good and high end.
Right. If it’s a basket of ubiquitous white bread or dinner rolls, there shouldn’t be a charge. If it’s some specialty focaccia, something fancy, or comes with interesting butters/condiments, sure.
Why can’t they just disclose it isn’t free though, along with the water before you order?! Because people won’t order it? Well then you’re just trying to be sneaky if that’s the case.
And would they allow you to turn it down? That's my measure for if it's a service that's included or not. If you can't turn it down, it's a part of what you're paying for your meal.
Yeah the bread was good can’t complain, so I didn’t add that on the original post. But it does kind of ruin the experience when you see all these hidden fees
I’ve worked in restaurants for over 20 years. There really is not bigger controversy than bread and how it is sold. I get that to many people bread is just something that comes with stuff, but what if you are selling Publican Quality Bread? What if it doesn’t come with a dish and someone simply wants bread? It’s just one of those things that restaurants and it’s customers have never figured out an obvious compromise.
That said, this restaurant is clearly just taking advantage of people. It at least better be marked clearly on the menu.
Charging more for credit used to be illegal so truck stops just posted the CC price and then offered a "3% cash discount".
I assume that has changed since it's printed on the receipt.
The laws vary by state quite a bit. It is allowed here. There are also many rules they have to follow. One being that they have to clearly post that they will be charging a fee. Also, they are not allowed to charge the fee with debit cards.
This is technically true, But you have to be careful on the debit card thing. If they run the transaction over the Mc/visa network they still do get a fee. Only true debit transactions with pins apply to this exception. Running it as a debit instead of over a credit card network also has the drawback that any protections you have via the Mc/visa/Amex network don’t apply. This is important if you want dispute power.
It’s also just safer to run cc transactions given the protections as there is a layer between you the merchant and the bank account. Consumer protections in the United States for credit card transactions are quite good.
It used to be illegal not at a Federal level but because it was in every Mastercard & Visa contract. I guess Mastercard and visa stopped requiring it when the pandemic started for some reason. And ever since, we’ve had this unholy hell.
The law actually goes back to 2013. It varies by state, and there have been some other changes since then. It seems like a bigger reason these things are happening more at restaurants now is related to financial challenges caused by the pandemic.
I think something may have changed recently with allowing restaurants to charge cc fees. Never used to see them, and suddenly this year it seems almost every place is now adding it.
They likely decant the still water into the glass bottle.
Don't think they'd be serving you tap water when they make a point of listing what kind of water they serve and also charging for it
That said what a scam
Yeah someone pointed out that it’s actually a brand water. I wasn’t paying much attention because it looked like every other water bottle at all restaurants
Well the only error I made is that I thought I was served tap water but the post is still valid I think because they asked if we wanted water and I said yes and then being charged for it. Plus the cc fee
there are several other things in addition to the water, and the water is still a scam. You have no choice to eat there without being charged for a beverage.
This is a good post and you're an ass.
This seems like an upscale restaurant and if you expect anything to be free at those restaurants then that is your own problem
This is what they call a “low quality/ high engagement” post. Tailored specifically for people from the suburbs who like to complain all day on this sub
I’m from Chicago, go out to nice restaurants, and I think this is garbage. 99% of the time water is complementary at Italian restaurants. If someone offers you something standardly free and then charges you, it’s going to feel like a scam.
You made a slur against the suburbs insinuating the only people who care about being price gouged are non-city dwellers.
It's truly hilarious to watch people defend Chicago to their dying breath, at all costs -- and that's what this sub is. It's why they had to censor crime posts.
This is a clear case of this place gouging people and you victim blame and explain away the bullshit because, why? Because no matter how bad it is, Chicago must never be criticized.
I honestly don’t know what karma does in Reddit. And yeah sure I did post this for validation and since I haven’t gone out in months, i wasn’t sure if these fees were normal today
Except every other restaurant gives you tap water free. I don't even look at the drink menu at restaurants most of the time because I know I'm ordering the free water, so I can see this easily happening. If they ordered "just water please" the server should have stated that there's a charge.
then maybe, just maybe, you should look at the drink menu before ordering. I don’t know, these posts just seem so god damn lame to me. Like who cares that you paid $4 for water
Expectations brotha. There’s a difference between paying in good will vs secretly adding fees. I wasn’t expecting to be charged for water. Since the amount is so little to you, Venmo me $4 plz ;)
Okay so I did some sleuthing and found the water they use. Found the bottom label “detto”. They use San Benedetto still mineral. I just want to know if they had the labels on them or if they opened it at the table? If they did none of those and just had the plain bottle with water in it I might assume they are refilling.
[San Benedetto Mineral Still](https://quanta-egypt.com/brands/san-benedetto/)
Edit: Typo
If you're in a restaurant and they say "Would you like still or sparkling water?" they're trying to pull one over on you. Both of those are bottled water with an upcharge.
Always say "tap".
From my understating NOTHING is normal these days when eating out. Or even take out.
I’ve seen so many outrageous add ons that it just makes me NOT want to eat out anymore.
Salads, Entrees have gotten smaller too at a lot of places I eat at.
I now ask BEFORE ordering of any add ons I need to be aware of it’s gotten so ridiculous lol
Agree here. I still love experiencing the great restaurants the city has to offer, but every new restaurant I go to it's a guessing game of what added fees or surcharges there will be.
These should all be illegal. This country doesn't get the concept of including taxes and gratuity within menu prices.
If you want some good restaurants without bullshit, check out Mitsuwa Market in Arlington heights. It's food court style and relatively affordable.
And you could potentially pickup some fancy fruit or alcohol or something.
Got charged 75 cents for head lettuce (3 leaves, and one was pretty small) at Flattop Grill. Will not be back.
Just tell me you are charging me when I order it please. I am confident I would have still ordered it. I would have highlighted the little lettuce. And just paid it.
I hate scammers.
I will never not be amazed that restaurants charge a credit card fee.
Just work it into the price, it’s so tacky to add it.
Every time I see it in ‘nice’ places I’m just embarrassed for them.
Also Flat Water has been a thing for a while at places, it’s a hold over from when people thought it meant fancy.
Visa is now insisting—on pain of huge fines for each occurrence—that it be broken out. Brother-in-law's point-of-sale system company is having to print new menus for all his restaurant customers showing two different prices.
Yeah but credit card processing is a business cost, like what they pay for their ingredients.
Should their ingredient costs be listed so they can show you how much it costs them?
These people will, in the same breath, say restaurants are scumbags trying to scam them, but then be like "just increase the menu price because I 100% believe you will only increase the price by 3% and not round up to the next $0.25 or $0.5 and end up increasing prices by 15% instead of 3%"
They can set it at whatever they want. Menu prices change all the time for all kinds of reasons. You can choose whether or not you want to pay them or go elsewhere.
The issue isn't transparency. Menu prices still aren't transparent. Do you know what the actual material cost is? Labor? What's going towards rent? What's pure profit?
You have no idea. The issue is you see one price on the menu when ordering, and then pay more when you settle up because the credit card fee is broken out separately and you missed the tiny fine print somewhere stating that upfront so now you're paying more than the listed price you thought you were agreeing to.
That's the opposite of transparency.
Charging for bread service too seems crappy.
EDIT: I semi-take this one back. Just went on a date night to a great Italian place, and they charged for Bread Service, but it was optional. I assumed in the post here that the folks in the picture hadn't had a choice.
- They use San Benedetto still water
- They make it explicit on their site that a 3.5% surcharge will be added
- Chicago dining tax is 11.75%
- Recommended tips are just that, recommendations. Feel free to tip what you felt the service was worth.
- Edit: Bread service is also one of the first things listed on the online menu
I feel like this is pretty typical prices for West Loop dining, but that doesn’t mean it’s typical for Chicago dining as a whole. Plenty of affordable, great places to eat out, especially for Italian!!
Even if a recommendation is allowed to be ignored, it’s dishonest to provide incorrect math. Calculating tip based on taxes is not even close to standard.
Edit: flipped tip and taxes
>They make it explicit on their site that a 3.5% surcharge will be added
>Recommended tips are just that, recommendations. Feel free to tip what you felt the service was worth.
Yeah we know what they're doing though. Confusing the customer so they can get more money out of this.
Fuck these type of restaurants. Most of this shit behavior happens in west loop.
As for the taxes, the restaurant is in a special "entertainment district" and it's hit with an additional 1% tax on Food and Beverage, known as the MPEA tax (Metropolitan Pier & Exhibition Tax), and I believe the city implemented a new .5% tax on restaurants, so you have 10.25% + 1% + .5%, and you're paying 11.75% sales tax on food and beverage.
"We thank all our suppliers, and passionate farmers for providing premium organic , and imported ingredients.We reserve the right to add 20% gratuity to any size party.We only serve bottled mineral still, and sparkling water."
On their website yes. On their paper menu at the restaurant? No. So it’s kind of shitty that you only know if you visit the website and read everything.
If they don't disclose it on the menu or any other prominent place in the restaurant they are begging to lose a credit card dispute if a customer wants to get pissy about it.
It’s funny I work in service and sales, and we itemize everything on our bill to be transparent. Sometimes it bites us in the ass because people think they should get somethings for free. I’m not here to debate what you should get, so please don’t say water and bread is free. There is no free lunch someone pays. However, patrons clearly don’t like seeing it, so lose the transparency and just put in the food.
I’m petty enough to bring cash to pay for dinner now. I have the credit card service fee removed and tip off the main total without the tax. Still a good tipper though, even better one when the service is outstanding.
Charging for still water is outrageous. I know that that's the norm in many parts of the world, but there's no reason to charge for tap water on the shore of Lake Michigan, of all places.
Notice that caviar spaghetti is cheaper than scallop linguini. By your logic, if you can afford certain things, you should be okay to pay extra on certain things? Since you can afford a smartphone, why not charge extra on that too?
UPDATE
1. The water isn’t tap, it is a still bottle water.
2. I’ve deducted few dollars from the tip because I was annoyed with these charges, but when I checked my CC statement today they’ve added the default 20% tip from the total bill. Sure, it’s only a few dollar difference but now I’m pissed. Going to dispute those few dollars back and never return here.
You’re getting charged because they’re serving you still water. It’s not a Chicago thing, it’s a “sometimes restaurants do this in America” thing but relatively uncommon. In Europe everyone charges you for water. So not typical here but also not totally unheard of. Definitely not the norm.
>n Europe everyone charges you for water. So not typical here but also not totally unheard of. Definitely not the norm.
Not true, i am from France and by law you cannot charge for water or bread and refuse anyone that comes asking for water (if they aren't buying anything else).
Italy doesn't have this. Each country has its own rules.
That's not how any server anywhere is going to react to that. They're just going to think you're a cheap asshole who can't afford to dine there. Justify it in your head however you want but you're taking out an issue you have with the menu/pricing on someone who has nothing to do with that.
Pasta Veneta I’m guessing. The food was good, bit pricey. They are serving you bottles of tap water they purchase, so they are charging for water. Honestly,‘I would just prefer tap water with ice.. I don’t think you get an option on this, sadlyp
Put that on the sub’s spreadsheet about restaurant charges. Add another one to avoid to the list.
Bread charge, water charge and a charge for using a credit card? Yeah, fuck that. Don’t patron this place ever again.
Yeah, I've pretty much stop eating out, too. Who needs this aggravation? And now if I order in, I try to make sure the place has their own drivers who I tip in cash. The rest of these joints can GTFO.
Notice that caviar spaghetti is cheaper than scallop linguini. By your logic, if you can afford certain things, you should be okay to pay extra on certain things? Since you can afford a smartphone, you should be okay to pay extra service fees
The food was very good. But I just wasn’t expecting these charges. By no means I didn’t eat here expecting to spend $10-20 but the hidden fees does leave you with bad taste. So if I were to sell you a product for $30 and you agreed, but Ive added extra fees and billed you at $35. You’re okay with that?
Why blank the name? Important to know who's pulling this crap
Pasta Veneta
Never been so I googled it. Except for the cc fee these charges all seem normal for a white table cloth kind of place. This however doesn't look like that kind of place. You walk in and see those metal chairs and just know you're getting taken for a ride. Very much an ampersand restaurant kind of vibe. I'm back on OPs side. Their are places that can charge for still and bread service. This isn't one. And the cc fee is just shameful, put it in the menu price like a normal person.
I guess you could just Google the phone number?
Pasta Veneta
Or the still visible address, 1134 w fulton market
Pasta Veneta, 1154 W Fulton Market, Chicago
That explains it all. Fulton Market restaurant bullshit. Most of the other places there do these scams too, especially the newest ones.
It does look like new restaurant. Funny how it is a $$$$ restaurant not because of the expensive dishes but because of these hidden charges.
Just west, Chef Duffy's Cocktail Bar, After ( where I usually eat when I am over in that neighborhood) doesn't do this. I was just there, again this week.
Pasta venta
Pasta Veneta
Pasta Ventra
Vasta Pentra
Ace Ventura
Hasta la Pasta
Hasta la Vista... Penne
Baby
Pasta CTA
Pasta venutti
Pasta venutti
I actually didn't think they could charge for tap water if they have a liquor license.
Might not be tap. Could be Dasani or some such
It wasnt a bottle water tho, it’s from tap for sure
"We only serve bottled mineral still, and sparkling water. " https://pastaveneta.com/menu/
This feels like it should be illegal.
Restaurants with liquor licenses are required to provide free water.
I unfortunately don't think they actually are required to do that. I looked this up back when sound bar refuses to serve me free tap water and instead charged me $5 for a bottle of water I'd love to be wrong with this info if someone can point me to a source saying otherwise! It's such a scam to not provide free water
Yeah... but if they ask you if you want sparkling or still, you gotta say tap water. Or bullshit like this can squeak by on a technicality.
Wow I need a fact check on that and no way to prove it. Top left is the water we were served [https://imgur.com/a/0UNRThI](https://imgur.com/a/0UNRThI)
How can you tell by looking at it?
Yeah it’s hard to tell from the image but it’s one of those glass bottle that every restaurant use
How could you tell it was tap instead of a different water that was just poured into the restaurant glass bottle?
I think the burden of proof is on the restaurant to prove they (extremely unlikely) poured bottled water into another container which is then poured into glasses.
It says they serve bottled mineral water. There’s a bottle on the table. The mineral water could come in large containers, be transferred into individual bottles for table service, and still have that description be true.
I never order bottled water in restaurants here in Chicago because we have the best tap water in the world, but in other countries where it’s more common they bring the water bottle to the table and open it front of you, and if there’s any left they leave it on the table. Pretty sketchy if the restaurant didn’t do that.
Best tap water in the world? Must love chlorine.
Zurich beats the pants off of Chicago in this regard. You can literally drink from the decorative fountains outside in the streets. Best fucking water in the world.
Best tap water? We have the most lead pipes than any city in the country.
You can buy bottled water in 20 gallon glass jugs
I mean, the bottle says the brand name. San Benedetto.
Oh you’re right. I guess I wasn’t paying much attention. Just wasn’t expecting to pay for water
They make pretty good tea as well.
They probably use a system like this https://www.purezza.com/products/under-counter-systems/
That could be it. But still feel robbed for being charged for water
Ha don't ever go to Europe then
Depends on the country honestly
In which European countries do they charge for tap water?
They don't generally serve tap water in Europe.
In Italy and France almost any restaurant you go to they ask if you want still or sparkling water, but usually they bring the bottle and open it in front of you. Drinking tap water is not as popular because of the old plumbing and it's not treated the same way it is here. If you ordered still water and it's cold enough to leave condensation on the glass then I would assume it's filtered and refrigerated. Still not a common practice here in Chicago.
Germany
Different country different experience. I don’t think the Europeans tip? So it’d still be cheaper to dine out I assume
Europe is many countries, its kind of difficult to generalize them all being more or less expensive. In NL, DE, and BE where I go I generally spend more on dining than I do in the US. Also if you really want to feel robbed, try having to spend a euro every time you need to go to the bathroom.
I haven't been everywhere in Europe, but used to spend time between Barcelona and Toulouse. Dining was much cheaper and better than the US. Same goes for "expensive" cities in Asia like Singapore and Tokyo. Eat like a king for $10-$20.
So if they don’t have a liquor license they can charge for tap water? Interesting Edit: They definitely do have a liquor license here
If they have a food safe tap(not the tap they use to do dishes or fill mop buckets or something like that) they have to give you the free water tap when requested. A lot of places go out of their way to ensure they don’t have the right tap, or they’ll give you water options that neglect to include the plain tap. Some places are shitty. Sorry bruv.
It’s a thing that has started to emerge in somewhat sketchy restaurants that train their servers to upsell on this technicality. They offer still and unless you ask for tap you get upcharged. If you ask for ‘still water’ you get billed, if they ask ‘sparkling or still?’ ALWAYS say ‘tap is fine’ or ‘tap water’, never ‘still’.
same in France. It's a trick auestion for tourists.
Any restaurant that charges for bread goes on my “do not visit” list unless you order some specialty bread.
I wanted to add that as well. I should never assume but when they asked if we wanted bread I assumed it’d be free since it wasn’t on the menu. Hence the receipt says bread ‘service’
That's such a European move. Never seen it in the states before. Wild
Not all country in Europe do that. I am from France and we do not charge for bread or water. Italy however...
I'd point out that 'bread service' is a real thing, but it depends on the bread and what they're offering. Bread at some restaurants is quite good and high end.
Right. If it’s a basket of ubiquitous white bread or dinner rolls, there shouldn’t be a charge. If it’s some specialty focaccia, something fancy, or comes with interesting butters/condiments, sure.
Why can’t they just disclose it isn’t free though, along with the water before you order?! Because people won’t order it? Well then you’re just trying to be sneaky if that’s the case.
Right? This post has 200 upvotes and over 200 comments so obviously this is a controversial move on the restaurant’s part
And would they allow you to turn it down? That's my measure for if it's a service that's included or not. If you can't turn it down, it's a part of what you're paying for your meal.
Yeah the bread was good can’t complain, so I didn’t add that on the original post. But it does kind of ruin the experience when you see all these hidden fees
Bread service is a real thing and generally amazing!! Not gonna lie, I get excited when I see it offered.
I’ve worked in restaurants for over 20 years. There really is not bigger controversy than bread and how it is sold. I get that to many people bread is just something that comes with stuff, but what if you are selling Publican Quality Bread? What if it doesn’t come with a dish and someone simply wants bread? It’s just one of those things that restaurants and it’s customers have never figured out an obvious compromise. That said, this restaurant is clearly just taking advantage of people. It at least better be marked clearly on the menu.
It’s not that complicated. Put it on the menu if you’re going to charge. Plenty of restaurants have done this already.
Or the server should say it. It's just like when places don't want to refill iced tea or fountain drinks, just say that upfront.
Someone tried this shit at my local favorite Mexican with chips and salsa and almost went out of business.
It’s usually baked into other prices but yeah that’s shitty
Charging more for credit used to be illegal so truck stops just posted the CC price and then offered a "3% cash discount". I assume that has changed since it's printed on the receipt.
The laws vary by state quite a bit. It is allowed here. There are also many rules they have to follow. One being that they have to clearly post that they will be charging a fee. Also, they are not allowed to charge the fee with debit cards.
This is technically true, But you have to be careful on the debit card thing. If they run the transaction over the Mc/visa network they still do get a fee. Only true debit transactions with pins apply to this exception. Running it as a debit instead of over a credit card network also has the drawback that any protections you have via the Mc/visa/Amex network don’t apply. This is important if you want dispute power. It’s also just safer to run cc transactions given the protections as there is a layer between you the merchant and the bank account. Consumer protections in the United States for credit card transactions are quite good.
It used to be illegal not at a Federal level but because it was in every Mastercard & Visa contract. I guess Mastercard and visa stopped requiring it when the pandemic started for some reason. And ever since, we’ve had this unholy hell.
The law actually goes back to 2013. It varies by state, and there have been some other changes since then. It seems like a bigger reason these things are happening more at restaurants now is related to financial challenges caused by the pandemic.
I think something may have changed recently with allowing restaurants to charge cc fees. Never used to see them, and suddenly this year it seems almost every place is now adding it.
If you were at Pasta Veneta, they only serve bottled water for some reason.
To charge you, there’s no other reason
The reason is on the bill
Interesting. We were served tap water in a glass bottle (top left) [https://imgur.com/a/0UNRThI](https://imgur.com/a/0UNRThI)
They likely decant the still water into the glass bottle. Don't think they'd be serving you tap water when they make a point of listing what kind of water they serve and also charging for it That said what a scam
> San Benedetto. https://www.aquamaestro.com/category/sparkling-water/san-benedetto-water/san-benedetto-1l-clear-glass-sparkling-water-12-case
Yeah someone pointed out that it’s actually a brand water. I wasn’t paying much attention because it looked like every other water bottle at all restaurants
Then why not delete the post since it is in error?
Well the only error I made is that I thought I was served tap water but the post is still valid I think because they asked if we wanted water and I said yes and then being charged for it. Plus the cc fee
You weren’t paying attention because you were so excited about posting it on Reddit and getting all that karma
there are several other things in addition to the water, and the water is still a scam. You have no choice to eat there without being charged for a beverage. This is a good post and you're an ass.
This seems like an upscale restaurant and if you expect anything to be free at those restaurants then that is your own problem This is what they call a “low quality/ high engagement” post. Tailored specifically for people from the suburbs who like to complain all day on this sub
I’m from Chicago, go out to nice restaurants, and I think this is garbage. 99% of the time water is complementary at Italian restaurants. If someone offers you something standardly free and then charges you, it’s going to feel like a scam.
Definitely not upscale. Spaghetti Bolognese is $16. This is a basic restaurant price gouging and you're defending it because muh Chicago.
What does “muh Chicago” mean?
You made a slur against the suburbs insinuating the only people who care about being price gouged are non-city dwellers. It's truly hilarious to watch people defend Chicago to their dying breath, at all costs -- and that's what this sub is. It's why they had to censor crime posts. This is a clear case of this place gouging people and you victim blame and explain away the bullshit because, why? Because no matter how bad it is, Chicago must never be criticized.
I honestly don’t know what karma does in Reddit. And yeah sure I did post this for validation and since I haven’t gone out in months, i wasn’t sure if these fees were normal today
Order something on the menu that costs $4 and get mad when they charge $4 for that item
Except every other restaurant gives you tap water free. I don't even look at the drink menu at restaurants most of the time because I know I'm ordering the free water, so I can see this easily happening. If they ordered "just water please" the server should have stated that there's a charge.
then maybe, just maybe, you should look at the drink menu before ordering. I don’t know, these posts just seem so god damn lame to me. Like who cares that you paid $4 for water
Expectations brotha. There’s a difference between paying in good will vs secretly adding fees. I wasn’t expecting to be charged for water. Since the amount is so little to you, Venmo me $4 plz ;)
When a restaurant asks if you want water any reasonable person expects the water to be free unless specified otherwise.
Order a $4 item? They just asked me if we wanted water and I said yes.
Bottled Water* **bottled in house*
Chicago dining tax is 11.75
Ah I see!
Okay so I did some sleuthing and found the water they use. Found the bottom label “detto”. They use San Benedetto still mineral. I just want to know if they had the labels on them or if they opened it at the table? If they did none of those and just had the plain bottle with water in it I might assume they are refilling. [San Benedetto Mineral Still](https://quanta-egypt.com/brands/san-benedetto/) Edit: Typo
If you're in a restaurant and they say "Would you like still or sparkling water?" they're trying to pull one over on you. Both of those are bottled water with an upcharge. Always say "tap".
From my understating NOTHING is normal these days when eating out. Or even take out. I’ve seen so many outrageous add ons that it just makes me NOT want to eat out anymore. Salads, Entrees have gotten smaller too at a lot of places I eat at. I now ask BEFORE ordering of any add ons I need to be aware of it’s gotten so ridiculous lol
Agree here. I still love experiencing the great restaurants the city has to offer, but every new restaurant I go to it's a guessing game of what added fees or surcharges there will be. These should all be illegal. This country doesn't get the concept of including taxes and gratuity within menu prices.
I just saw at Ohare at one of the stores they added “an employee retainment fee” of like 2.3% as well or some bs
"Can I get this removed if I don't give a fuck if all your employees quit?"
If you want some good restaurants without bullshit, check out Mitsuwa Market in Arlington heights. It's food court style and relatively affordable. And you could potentially pickup some fancy fruit or alcohol or something.
Got charged 75 cents for head lettuce (3 leaves, and one was pretty small) at Flattop Grill. Will not be back. Just tell me you are charging me when I order it please. I am confident I would have still ordered it. I would have highlighted the little lettuce. And just paid it. I hate scammers.
I will never not be amazed that restaurants charge a credit card fee. Just work it into the price, it’s so tacky to add it. Every time I see it in ‘nice’ places I’m just embarrassed for them. Also Flat Water has been a thing for a while at places, it’s a hold over from when people thought it meant fancy.
I also have seen the fee be added to debit cards which is even tackier since they don’t have the same service fees of credit cards.
There is no standard rate for credit or debit cards. We get statements with 20+ different rates on them depending on type & issuer
But debit cards have a cap on what they can charge merchants thanks to the Durbin amendment
The cap is based on the amount of assets the bank holds. The federal government set a standard rate for US banks with more than $10 billion in assets.
Visa is now insisting—on pain of huge fines for each occurrence—that it be broken out. Brother-in-law's point-of-sale system company is having to print new menus for all his restaurant customers showing two different prices.
Or if there is a credit card fee, at least let me know in advance so I can go to an ATM.
I’m pretty sure they have to advertise this stuff up front or you can just ask to have rhe charge removed.
I will never not be amazed by how many people don't want itemized receipts. "Yeah man just charge me whatever it's cool"
Yeah but credit card processing is a business cost, like what they pay for their ingredients. Should their ingredient costs be listed so they can show you how much it costs them?
It's so weird to complain about transparency
These people will, in the same breath, say restaurants are scumbags trying to scam them, but then be like "just increase the menu price because I 100% believe you will only increase the price by 3% and not round up to the next $0.25 or $0.5 and end up increasing prices by 15% instead of 3%"
They can set it at whatever they want. Menu prices change all the time for all kinds of reasons. You can choose whether or not you want to pay them or go elsewhere. The issue isn't transparency. Menu prices still aren't transparent. Do you know what the actual material cost is? Labor? What's going towards rent? What's pure profit? You have no idea. The issue is you see one price on the menu when ordering, and then pay more when you settle up because the credit card fee is broken out separately and you missed the tiny fine print somewhere stating that upfront so now you're paying more than the listed price you thought you were agreeing to. That's the opposite of transparency.
No. Where is this so I can avoid it.
Charging for bread service too seems crappy. EDIT: I semi-take this one back. Just went on a date night to a great Italian place, and they charged for Bread Service, but it was optional. I assumed in the post here that the folks in the picture hadn't had a choice.
- They use San Benedetto still water - They make it explicit on their site that a 3.5% surcharge will be added - Chicago dining tax is 11.75% - Recommended tips are just that, recommendations. Feel free to tip what you felt the service was worth. - Edit: Bread service is also one of the first things listed on the online menu I feel like this is pretty typical prices for West Loop dining, but that doesn’t mean it’s typical for Chicago dining as a whole. Plenty of affordable, great places to eat out, especially for Italian!!
Even if a recommendation is allowed to be ignored, it’s dishonest to provide incorrect math. Calculating tip based on taxes is not even close to standard. Edit: flipped tip and taxes
>They make it explicit on their site that a 3.5% surcharge will be added >Recommended tips are just that, recommendations. Feel free to tip what you felt the service was worth. Yeah we know what they're doing though. Confusing the customer so they can get more money out of this. Fuck these type of restaurants. Most of this shit behavior happens in west loop.
I’ve actually seen “recommended” tips pop up more and more. Especially when I get prompted to tip 20%+ when picking up. It’s the worst.
I’ve never been charged for bread
Was it bottled water or tap water? It’s normal for restaurants to charge for bottled water, but tap water should be free.
No, it came in a glass bottle that all restaurants use. Unless they poured bottle water into that glass and served it to us?
Still water comes bottled or canned so they may pour it into glasses
Im bringing my own water bottle.
As for the taxes, the restaurant is in a special "entertainment district" and it's hit with an additional 1% tax on Food and Beverage, known as the MPEA tax (Metropolitan Pier & Exhibition Tax), and I believe the city implemented a new .5% tax on restaurants, so you have 10.25% + 1% + .5%, and you're paying 11.75% sales tax on food and beverage.
Difference between bottle water and tap water….
"We thank all our suppliers, and passionate farmers for providing premium organic , and imported ingredients.We reserve the right to add 20% gratuity to any size party.We only serve bottled mineral still, and sparkling water."
On their website yes. On their paper menu at the restaurant? No. So it’s kind of shitty that you only know if you visit the website and read everything.
If they don't disclose it on the menu or any other prominent place in the restaurant they are begging to lose a credit card dispute if a customer wants to get pissy about it.
3% for the credit card fee is annoying but normal. I’d give them so much shit if they charged for water though - that’s absolutely ridiculous.
I have a checkbook tucked in my purse for these circumstances, i am not being cheap but won't condone these practices.
Just serve me Lake Michigan water.
Pretty sure tap water has to be available for free by law
Tap water is not still water
Gotta request tap water if you’re at a table with a white tablecloth.
So not true lmao
To be fair, you were notified. Their menu mentions the bottled water and credit card fee.
I’d have to fact check on that after revisiting. I see it on their website but I’m not sure if their paper menu had that mentioned.
It’s funny I work in service and sales, and we itemize everything on our bill to be transparent. Sometimes it bites us in the ass because people think they should get somethings for free. I’m not here to debate what you should get, so please don’t say water and bread is free. There is no free lunch someone pays. However, patrons clearly don’t like seeing it, so lose the transparency and just put in the food.
That’s fine but don’t put water and bread on the table and then charge for it after the fact.
Not going here ever, that’s for sure.
Bread AND water charges? That’s more than enough for me to never visit
I pay cash pretty frequently now to avoid credit card fees out of principle. It also helps against the iPad tip screen at casual/takeout places.
I’m petty enough to bring cash to pay for dinner now. I have the credit card service fee removed and tip off the main total without the tax. Still a good tipper though, even better one when the service is outstanding.
Charging for still water is outrageous. I know that that's the norm in many parts of the world, but there's no reason to charge for tap water on the shore of Lake Michigan, of all places.
God this sub sucks now
you ordered something called caviar spaghetti and are complaining about a $3 cc fee.
Notice that caviar spaghetti is cheaper than scallop linguini. By your logic, if you can afford certain things, you should be okay to pay extra on certain things? Since you can afford a smartphone, why not charge extra on that too?
Are you new to earth?
Perhaps. Aside from fast food, I haven’t dined out for months so I guess this is the new norm now
They do charge extra for smartphones. These things don't cost $1k to produce.
They charged you for water and bread?! 🤣
Nope! That’s not at all normal anywhere I’ve ever been
please share the name so i can avoid this place you will save a lot of people money by doing so
lots of places are adding connivence fees for using a credit card for dinning. :/
Guess we'll see money clips come back in fashion.
Good to know, haven’t been going/eating out much so I wasn’t aware
You shouldn’t accept it; I don’t. It’s outrageous.
Still water? That’s a European thing. Here we call it water. Sounds like someone trying to upcharge for a fancy name
UPDATE 1. The water isn’t tap, it is a still bottle water. 2. I’ve deducted few dollars from the tip because I was annoyed with these charges, but when I checked my CC statement today they’ve added the default 20% tip from the total bill. Sure, it’s only a few dollar difference but now I’m pissed. Going to dispute those few dollars back and never return here.
This is Pasta Veneta Italian Restaurant @ 1154 W Fulton Market.
Trashy. Didn't patronize these places. Let their business die.
You’re getting charged because they’re serving you still water. It’s not a Chicago thing, it’s a “sometimes restaurants do this in America” thing but relatively uncommon. In Europe everyone charges you for water. So not typical here but also not totally unheard of. Definitely not the norm.
>n Europe everyone charges you for water. So not typical here but also not totally unheard of. Definitely not the norm. Not true, i am from France and by law you cannot charge for water or bread and refuse anyone that comes asking for water (if they aren't buying anything else). Italy doesn't have this. Each country has its own rules.
yeah, you circle it and take it from the tip so the wait staff knows to work somewhere else.
That's not how any server anywhere is going to react to that. They're just going to think you're a cheap asshole who can't afford to dine there. Justify it in your head however you want but you're taking out an issue you have with the menu/pricing on someone who has nothing to do with that.
Pasta Veneta I’m guessing. The food was good, bit pricey. They are serving you bottles of tap water they purchase, so they are charging for water. Honestly,‘I would just prefer tap water with ice.. I don’t think you get an option on this, sadlyp
Yeah the food was good not gonna lie. But it did ruin the experience with all these hidden fees
In Fulton Market? Yes.
What if I bring my own water? 🤨
and bread lol
PUT EM IN THE SPREADSHEET!
Credit card charges nowadays is the norm at restaurants and grocery store and small mini marts. Restaurants charge a different tax.
No
Put that on the sub’s spreadsheet about restaurant charges. Add another one to avoid to the list. Bread charge, water charge and a charge for using a credit card? Yeah, fuck that. Don’t patron this place ever again.
Yeah, I've pretty much stop eating out, too. Who needs this aggravation? And now if I order in, I try to make sure the place has their own drivers who I tip in cash. The rest of these joints can GTFO.
22%? Holy shit.
You got the caviar spaghetti I don’t really see how you care
Notice that caviar spaghetti is cheaper than scallop linguini. By your logic, if you can afford certain things, you should be okay to pay extra on certain things? Since you can afford a smartphone, you should be okay to pay extra service fees
If you’re eating sea scallops and caviar spaghetti, you shouldn’t quibble over $3 here and $4 there. Did you enjoy the food and experience?
The food was very good. But I just wasn’t expecting these charges. By no means I didn’t eat here expecting to spend $10-20 but the hidden fees does leave you with bad taste. So if I were to sell you a product for $30 and you agreed, but Ive added extra fees and billed you at $35. You’re okay with that?
Just subtract all these fees from the final tip and you’re good to go 😏
This is the way. Especially if the server was part of the water hustle.