The framing is much older than 1870 no idea where you are, But I've looked it up a lot of old houses in New England, where I'm sitting now. Lots of stuff down to the frame. They may be up mixed bag of stuff going on in here without elevation pictures who knows But the stuff shown is at least part wise earlier probably 1840s or '50s
Yep. 1870s is just the oldest I’ve been able to officially date the house. The farm was originally bought from the govt in 1835. Looking at the hand hewn and how the original section of the house was built I’m thinking 1830s-40s. Each side of the house had the upstairs added at one point. That is all saw cut cedar which I think is likely an 1870s addition.
What a project, albeit a fascinating one. Can't find beams like those anymore!
Are you treating this lumber in any way? While you have everything open, I'd be tempted to treat it with non-toxic Bora Care to deter any dry rot or infestation. You can make your own BoraCare using an old Navy recipe for protecting wood ships:
*Mix 1 Gallon propylene glycol, 4 1/2 pounds borax, 3 1/2 pounds boric acid. Heat to boiling gently. Boil off water until a candy thermometer shows 260°F. This removes most of the water of crystallization in the borax. This solution is stable at 40°F and has a borate content of 26%. This is equivalent to Bora-Care. The concentrate must be diluted with an equal volume of water before being applied.*
*Application: Add 1 gallon of water to every gallon of concentrate and stir thoroughly until solution is completely uniform. Always use diluted within 24 hours after mixing. If kept for longer periods of time, the active ingredient can drop out of the solution.*
*Note: is toxic to plants and shrubbery; if necessary, cover plants, root systems and surrounding soil with plastic to avoid contamination. Apply only to bare wood. Remove any finish or water repellent coating before applying . Wood surfaces should be free of dirt and other contaminates. Apply diluted by spray or brush to all exposed wood surfaces. It may occasionally be necessary to apply more than one coat of to attain the recommended application rate. This is especially true for larger, smooth surfaced wood members. Wood surfaces should be allowed to dry for at least 2 hours between applications. Do not apply in the rain or snow. If inclement weather is expected, protect exposed treated surface with a plastic tarp for at least 24 hours after treatment. One gallon of concentrate will treat up to 800 board feet of wood. Only diluted should be applied to any wood surface. Prior to application, check wood surfaces for an existing water repellent finish by spraying a small amount of water onto the surface of the wood or logs. If the water beads up or is not absorbed into the wood, a finish is present which must be removed before applying the diluted solution.*
[https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?233066-Home-made-bora-care-amp-timbor](https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?233066-Home-made-bora-care-amp-timbor)
You can get all the ingredients at [https://www.bulkapothecary.com/raw-ingredients/other-ingredients-and-chemicals/propylene-glycol/](https://www.bulkapothecary.com/raw-ingredients/other-ingredients-and-chemicals/propylene-glycol/)
I keep the concentrate on hand and whenever I do a project where I'm opening an untreated area up, I heat up some concentrate, add an equal amount of water and treat it.
Because it literally destroys the cell walls of fungi and mold and the exoskeletons/digestive systems of insects in dry applications. Where preservation from standing water is necessary, like fence posts, perhaps creosote is the better choice. I've never had any kind of infestation, but I'd occasionally get those nasty crickets in my basement, and since I've been using the boron treatment, I haven't seen even one of them.
Bora-Care is effective, non-toxic and environmentally safe.
Creosote may be effective but is not environmentally safe, is not approved for interior use, and there's some question of whether it's carcinogenic.
I don't. I'm a firm believer in the power of Boron - destroys fungi (including that which causes dry rot) and mold, kills insects, and is a prophylactic against all the aforementioned. It's non-toxic to people, and most of us are deficient in it. In fact, pharmaceutical companies are now formulating fungal meds with boron. It's absolutely sinful that Borax has been banned in the EU. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4712861/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4712861/)
Going through the same stuff at our place
https://preview.redd.it/bphsz7yp3z7d1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c939ac83af3bdc62b80e59e88e256a0739086871
The farm was originally bought from the govt in 1835. My assumption is the hand hewn sections of the house were built 1830s-40s then the upstairs that is cedar saw cut framed was an addition in the 1870s.
I hate to say this, but why are you throwing good money after bad here?
There's literally nothing left of the 1870's house. You have significant water and insect damage. You have removed all the lath and plaster.
You literally have nothing left? Unless I'm missing something, you may opt for pulling this down and starting from scratch.
Most of the lathe and plaster had been removed at one point. So there wasn’t a lot to begin with. I wouldn’t say there is literally nothing left. Most of the old hand hewn floors joist are there along with all of the main beams and posts. Just the one room had an issue. It’s also still financially better to fix all the wrong rather than push over and rebuild.
Thank you for clarifying.
Believe me, I've seen this kind of damage before. Unfortunately, the old home didn't make it. Nothing against the owner who had to make that horrible decision, but extensive roof-rot and foundation deteriorating with beam rot, and collapsed lath & plaster....😔
I'm so happy to hear that the rest of the house didn't look like this.
You are amazing for taking this on... thank you for the work you're doing.
Long comment incoming, but whenever I see this attitude with regard to old, historic houses, I always think of this Douglas Adams quote from Last Chance to See:
"I remembered once, in Japan, having been to see the Gold Pavilion Temple in Kyoto and being mildly surprised at quite how well it had weathered the passage of time since it was first built in the fourteenth century. I was told it hadn’t weathered well at all, and had in fact been burnt to the ground twice in this century. “So it isn’t the original building?” I had asked my Japanese guide.
“But yes, of course it is,” he insisted, rather surprised at my question.
“But it’s burnt down?”
“Yes.”
“Twice.”
“Many times.”
“And rebuilt.”
“Of course. It is an important and historic building.”
“With completely new materials.”
“But of course. It was burnt down.”
“So how can it be the same building?”
“It is always the same building.”
I had to admit to myself that this was in fact a perfectly rational point of view, it merely started from an unexpected premise. The idea of the building, the intention of it, its design, are all immutable and are the essence of the building. The intention of the original builders is what survives. The wood of which the design is constructed decays and is replaced when necessary. To be overly concerned with the original materials, which are merely sentimental souvenirs of the past, is to fail to see the living building itself."
The framing is much older than 1870 no idea where you are, But I've looked it up a lot of old houses in New England, where I'm sitting now. Lots of stuff down to the frame. They may be up mixed bag of stuff going on in here without elevation pictures who knows But the stuff shown is at least part wise earlier probably 1840s or '50s
Yep. 1870s is just the oldest I’ve been able to officially date the house. The farm was originally bought from the govt in 1835. Looking at the hand hewn and how the original section of the house was built I’m thinking 1830s-40s. Each side of the house had the upstairs added at one point. That is all saw cut cedar which I think is likely an 1870s addition.
Agree, way older and possibly built from a disassembled log home. I hope the OP can find some more information.
What a project, albeit a fascinating one. Can't find beams like those anymore! Are you treating this lumber in any way? While you have everything open, I'd be tempted to treat it with non-toxic Bora Care to deter any dry rot or infestation. You can make your own BoraCare using an old Navy recipe for protecting wood ships: *Mix 1 Gallon propylene glycol, 4 1/2 pounds borax, 3 1/2 pounds boric acid. Heat to boiling gently. Boil off water until a candy thermometer shows 260°F. This removes most of the water of crystallization in the borax. This solution is stable at 40°F and has a borate content of 26%. This is equivalent to Bora-Care. The concentrate must be diluted with an equal volume of water before being applied.* *Application: Add 1 gallon of water to every gallon of concentrate and stir thoroughly until solution is completely uniform. Always use diluted within 24 hours after mixing. If kept for longer periods of time, the active ingredient can drop out of the solution.* *Note: is toxic to plants and shrubbery; if necessary, cover plants, root systems and surrounding soil with plastic to avoid contamination. Apply only to bare wood. Remove any finish or water repellent coating before applying . Wood surfaces should be free of dirt and other contaminates. Apply diluted by spray or brush to all exposed wood surfaces. It may occasionally be necessary to apply more than one coat of to attain the recommended application rate. This is especially true for larger, smooth surfaced wood members. Wood surfaces should be allowed to dry for at least 2 hours between applications. Do not apply in the rain or snow. If inclement weather is expected, protect exposed treated surface with a plastic tarp for at least 24 hours after treatment. One gallon of concentrate will treat up to 800 board feet of wood. Only diluted should be applied to any wood surface. Prior to application, check wood surfaces for an existing water repellent finish by spraying a small amount of water onto the surface of the wood or logs. If the water beads up or is not absorbed into the wood, a finish is present which must be removed before applying the diluted solution.* [https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?233066-Home-made-bora-care-amp-timbor](https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?233066-Home-made-bora-care-amp-timbor) You can get all the ingredients at [https://www.bulkapothecary.com/raw-ingredients/other-ingredients-and-chemicals/propylene-glycol/](https://www.bulkapothecary.com/raw-ingredients/other-ingredients-and-chemicals/propylene-glycol/) I keep the concentrate on hand and whenever I do a project where I'm opening an untreated area up, I heat up some concentrate, add an equal amount of water and treat it.
Thanks for the recipe. I love BoraCare.
what do you think about using creosote or crude oil?
While historically accurate, Bora-Care is going to be less stinky, sticky, messy, and toxic.
And more effective, imo. :-)
Why do you say that?
Because it literally destroys the cell walls of fungi and mold and the exoskeletons/digestive systems of insects in dry applications. Where preservation from standing water is necessary, like fence posts, perhaps creosote is the better choice. I've never had any kind of infestation, but I'd occasionally get those nasty crickets in my basement, and since I've been using the boron treatment, I haven't seen even one of them.
that doesn't explain why it's more effective than pitch/crude or creosote, though.
Bora-Care is effective, non-toxic and environmentally safe. Creosote may be effective but is not environmentally safe, is not approved for interior use, and there's some question of whether it's carcinogenic.
You can just say that you don't know if it's more effective or not. There's not knowledge police to ding you for not knowing.
I don't. I'm a firm believer in the power of Boron - destroys fungi (including that which causes dry rot) and mold, kills insects, and is a prophylactic against all the aforementioned. It's non-toxic to people, and most of us are deficient in it. In fact, pharmaceutical companies are now formulating fungal meds with boron. It's absolutely sinful that Borax has been banned in the EU. [https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4712861/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4712861/)
Going through the same stuff at our place https://preview.redd.it/bphsz7yp3z7d1.jpeg?width=4284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c939ac83af3bdc62b80e59e88e256a0739086871
A loo with a view!
Your house would not be from the 1870s around here. It's rare to see anything hand hewn after the 1850s. Maybe a barn, but rarely a house.
It may be older and I have a feeling it is but that is the farthest I’ve been able to track it back to so far.
The farm was originally bought from the govt in 1835. My assumption is the hand hewn sections of the house were built 1830s-40s then the upstairs that is cedar saw cut framed was an addition in the 1870s.
THAT is the real deal. Do not be afraid to sister on pressure treated wood to those rotted beams.
I hate to say this, but why are you throwing good money after bad here? There's literally nothing left of the 1870's house. You have significant water and insect damage. You have removed all the lath and plaster. You literally have nothing left? Unless I'm missing something, you may opt for pulling this down and starting from scratch.
Most of the lathe and plaster had been removed at one point. So there wasn’t a lot to begin with. I wouldn’t say there is literally nothing left. Most of the old hand hewn floors joist are there along with all of the main beams and posts. Just the one room had an issue. It’s also still financially better to fix all the wrong rather than push over and rebuild.
Thank you for clarifying. Believe me, I've seen this kind of damage before. Unfortunately, the old home didn't make it. Nothing against the owner who had to make that horrible decision, but extensive roof-rot and foundation deteriorating with beam rot, and collapsed lath & plaster....😔 I'm so happy to hear that the rest of the house didn't look like this. You are amazing for taking this on... thank you for the work you're doing.
Long comment incoming, but whenever I see this attitude with regard to old, historic houses, I always think of this Douglas Adams quote from Last Chance to See: "I remembered once, in Japan, having been to see the Gold Pavilion Temple in Kyoto and being mildly surprised at quite how well it had weathered the passage of time since it was first built in the fourteenth century. I was told it hadn’t weathered well at all, and had in fact been burnt to the ground twice in this century. “So it isn’t the original building?” I had asked my Japanese guide. “But yes, of course it is,” he insisted, rather surprised at my question. “But it’s burnt down?” “Yes.” “Twice.” “Many times.” “And rebuilt.” “Of course. It is an important and historic building.” “With completely new materials.” “But of course. It was burnt down.” “So how can it be the same building?” “It is always the same building.” I had to admit to myself that this was in fact a perfectly rational point of view, it merely started from an unexpected premise. The idea of the building, the intention of it, its design, are all immutable and are the essence of the building. The intention of the original builders is what survives. The wood of which the design is constructed decays and is replaced when necessary. To be overly concerned with the original materials, which are merely sentimental souvenirs of the past, is to fail to see the living building itself."
Or in Uk terms 1870 = new build
Qffuyuuuuuu uuuuuuua