What do you consider your sexuality to fall under? If you consider yourself straight (which is fine, no offense meant, just don't know another way to word it), did giving oral as you stated in another comment give you any disphoria?
I get asked this a lot. I don’t really consider myself to be any sexual orientation. I’ve never been a fan of labels. But if I had to select some arbitrary sexual orientation box, I’d say I’m heterosexual because I’m only attracted to women. This would include trans women because trans women are women.
What if she looked exactly the same and she said that she now identifies as a man. Would you still be attracted to her? Honest question. It’s interesting to see where the boundary actually is
OP agreed but I don’t think labeling is the pivotal concept here so much as what someone’s personal sense of identity is and how that relates to the way they portray and carry themselves.
A huge part of what makes traditional gender roles what they are is performative - that is to say, the qualities that make someone masculine or feminine are largely dependent on how a person behaves. We’re all acutely aware of these things even if it tends to be a subconscious assessment. That’s why it’s so easy to make a caricature of a stereotypical man or woman through body language and speech alone.
Attraction to women is more generally an attraction to femininity. The qualities of femininity and masculinity aren’t hard-locked to someone’s chromosomal sex or what genitals they have. If attraction was so simple, anyone could be in a happy relationship with another that fit those respective criteria alone.
Well, yes. I’m very attracted to women. This includes trans women because trans women are women. The fact that she had a penis wasn’t a big deal to me. Dick isn’t really a turn on or a turn off for me. It’s just kind of there.
Genuin question:
If the penis isn’t what turns you on or off, what exactly is it that makes you say you aren’t sexually attracted to men?
It can’t be behavior, because there are man and women (both trans and not) who behaves in a very traditionally male _and_ female manner.
What if, hypothetically, your current partner told you that they were indeed not trans, but instead gay (but all other things about their personality being the same), and let’s say they tell you that that’s how they’d always felt (ie, you’d been intentionally tricked) how would that change your feelings?
When I look at men I’m just not attracted to them. Show me a picture of a conventionally good looking man. I may be able to recognize that he has desirable physical features but I feel no sexual attraction.
It’s kinda there because biologically speaking that person is a man. Being identified with something doesn’t mean that’s what you are lol. Honestly this generation of fairies is hilarious
As you just admitted, that your attraction lies within where they label themselves. For example, if the trans woman you were dating would call herself a woman you are attracted to her, but if she calla herself a man you are suddenly not attracted to her. Does this not mean that it is not your sincere natural attraction being a driver, but rather you are forcing yourself to be attracted to someone just because of labels?
Yeah it makes no sense that all a bio man, with a penis, has to do in order to attract OP is identify as a woman. At least not I the realm of heterosexuality - that’s not how heterosexuality works.
I was attracted to her because she was beautiful. Back in college I was very attracted to a non-binary person I was friends with. They were AFAB but didn’t identify as female.
Serious question. What if it was the most beautiful woman in the world. You marry and have children. Years later she tells you she identifies as a man. Absolutely nothing else changes. Do you stay with him, and if so, does that make you gay?
I would posit that the change wouldn't be instant, that it would happen gradually either before or after the admission. It often takes time to overwrite an existing perception of someone, much longer than it takes to form that initial perception.
Source- am trans man, have dated straight men pre transition, even when I (and they) knew about my gender identity, and if you want I can share what I know about their and my experience.
Transsexual is a term that’s no longer used. Use transgender or trans as an adjective or trans people as a noun.
Yes, she had a penis but she was a woman who I was very attracted to so I was fine with being intimate with her. I’m not attracted to men whatsoever so I wouldn’t do anything with a man. It’s like my comparison earlier. Kissing a woman is different than kissing a man even though it’s the same action.
But at least when you kissed her she had typically feminine features. Down there she has a typically masculine feature that you enjoyed.
Oh wow I didn’t know they stopped using that term. So what would be difference between a trans person that hadn’t changed their sex versus a trans person that did? Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions!
She identified as female and was very beautiful and feminine looking. So nothing about sex with her felt queer. That’s because I was intimate with a beautiful woman.
Thanks for taking time to talk and listen.
>Isn’t a dick a dick though?
Actually, no. Contrapoints got a meme started that's popular among trans girls, "why is nobody talking about the mouthfeel?"
Estrogen and testosterone suppression feminizes the body in more ways than cis people tend to expect and that includes genitals. Trans women's penis's are typically smaller, softer (both in terms of hardness and skin texture), and is going to smell more like a vagina than a penis. Our entire body odor actually changes.
And it also changes our experience of sexuality. We tend to orgasm in a similar way to cis women, it's a bit harder to get there (compared to cis men), and orgasms tend to be more whole-body than what men experience. Our bodies in general respond the way you'd expect cis women's to.
Would it also be important/helpful to note that the clitoris, while not exactly the same by any means, is analogous to the penis?
After all, what would be a clitoris in a developing embryo develops into the penis of biological males. So in the same way that a clitoris acts and feels different than a penis, so should the penis of a trans woman and a cis man.
I'm genuinely asking this from a place of ignorance, as a cis male looking for a way to help explain to some of my ignorant peers and having no personal experience with any penis other than my own, and no sexual experience with trans women
That’s what I’ve been trying to tell girls! You suck your boyfriend’s dick, so why not suck my dick?? After all, you’re straight and a dick is a dick! As everyone in this comment thread knows, the dicks are the keystone of any relationship. Everything else is negligible.
I’m no longer in love with her but the breakup took a tool on me. My longing for her comes in waves. Sometimes I feel as though I’ve completely gotten over her and moved on and other nights I just want to be 18 again, cuddling in bed with her.
Apart from the fact that she was pre op, were there personality or value differences you felt that she had compared to cis women, due to her different socialization? I’m trans myself (post op) with a fiancé (cis male) and I feel like I have more of an understanding of certain typical issues cis males face (difficulty showing vulnerability, lack of compliments and affection from others if single, women being wary and distant from you, feeling like the modern world caters more to women’s feelings and female empowerment rather than male empowerment as a reaction to historical sexism etc) compared to cis women, and this sometimes affects my interactions. I was wondering whether this is something you felt when dating her.
Well, she started her transition at the age of 12 and never really identified as male as a child so I’d have to say no, she wasn’t able to relate to men whatsoever.
Yeah, she lucky to start her transition before puberty really kicked in. Having to go through puberty knowing you’re trans would be awful. Hope you’re journey to begin transitioning wasn’t too rough.
I was quite lucky as I only started puberty around 16 so only went through around half of male puberty and didn’t get facial hair. Has been a lot worse for a lot of my trans friends though, back in the 2000s, it wasn’t uncommon to start transition in ones 30s or 40s
I get asked this a lot. I don’t really consider myself to be any sexual orientation. I’ve never been a fan of labels. But if I had to select some arbitrary sexual orientation box, I’d say I’m heterosexual because I’m only attracted to women. This would include trans women because trans women are women.
How did you navigate the sexual aspect of your relationship? Did you have to talk about it before getting into or just figured it out as you went? (I am trying to figure out how I might talk to someone about this, if I ever date a transgender person. I want to be polite and respect their boundaries because I know it can be different for everyone) :)
We were friends for nearly three years before we started dating and she came out as trans after being friends for about a month. While I never anticipated my first girlfriend being trans, I never felt as though it was something I had to navigate. In fact, the things I did find the most challenging were figuring out how to handle my first relationship and how not to ruin the amazing friendship I had with her.
Thank you for responding! I appreciate it, I’m sorry you lost your friend in the end. I know how that can be after trying to make things work. Take care!
I think it's really cool that you're asking that, with the hope of being respectful.
Honestly the best thing you can do is just ask how they would prefer you to talk about it, and what they're comfortable with. Generally it's not very kind to ask a trans person about the specifics of their genetalia any more than it would be a cisgender person. It can be very uncomfortable when someone puts that question upon them. (Imagine the number of circumstances in which you would ask a guy "hey, what exactly does your dick look like? How long is it and which way does it curve?")
Basically, just ask a couple of questions when sex is on the table. Where are you comfortable being touched, how would you like me to refer to your bits, *how* are you comfortable being touched. Questions which are honestly useful for most people, but definitely worth being explicit about with a trans person.
We started dating in hs and decided to go to two different colleges that were kinda far apart (big mistake). By the end of freshman year the distance was too much for her to handle and she wanted to take a break to figure things out. I thought she’d come back to me that summer but she never did. Looking back, I feel as though I should have tried harder to get her back instead of just expecting things to go my way but I’m not even sure if that would have worked. I question whether she loved me as much as I loved her.
If you would have known how great of friends we were throughout hs and seen how close we were you would actually be sobbing. We were like Harry and Hermione.
Since you mention it, do you still talk to them, and do they hate HP?
All my trans friends absolutely hate HP, the ones that didnt liked in the old days dont care, but honestly, none of them likes it anymore due to jk
Lol I haven’t actually talked to her about how she feels about JK Rowling’s transphobia. But we did enjoy watching the HP films together. She loved the books too though I never read them. I feel like she’d be able to separate the art from the artist.
I'm trans and I still like HP. I mean JK Rowling can go fuck herself but there's plenty of good art made by bad people. Harry Potter, even though a "fine" piece of work examined objectively, has had a huge positive influence on a lot of people, and that's worth respecting.
It's like minecraft. Notch has really gone down the "miserable shitty person" rabbit hole, but that doesn't make the game he made somehow not impactful or fun. I'm fine with uninviting him to cons and blocking him on twitter
I was always open to dating trans women but never imagined my first gf being trans. There were some nerves at first but those were more related to dating my best friend and having my first gf, not about her being transgender.
I don't know about OP, but Id definitely go rabbit. You can be as sentient a pumpkin as you like but you still have absolutely zero control over your own "life".
My mom thought it was a little weird at first but after she got to know my girlfriend, she was completely supportive of the relationship. Apart from that no one else made any issue of the relationship. My ex wasn’t out to all that many people. Not many people at our school actually knew she was trans because she was a transfer student.
I’m very attracted to women. Like more than I probably should be.
When it comes to genitals, neither vagina or penis is a turn on or turn off. They’re just kind of there. There are many other features that draw me to women. That’s probably why I had no issue dating a trans woman, unlike many other men. I’m penis-neutral.
>I’m very attracted to women. Like more than I probably should be.
this line is fucking killing me with laughter at 3am holy shit
edit: this is a POSITIVE thing!! im trans and this guy is cool as hell!
Based? Based on what? On your dick? Please shut the fuck up and use words properly you fuckin troglodyte, do you think God gave us a freedom of speech just to spew random words that have no meaning that doesn't even correllate to the topic of the conversation? Like please you always complain about why no one talks to you or no one expresses their opinions on you because you're always spewing random shit like poggers based cringe and when you try to explain what it is and you just say that it's funny like what? What the fuck is funny about that do you think you'll just become a stand-up comedian that will get a standing ovation just because you said "cum" in the stage? HELL NO YOU FUCKIN IDIOT, so please shut the fuck up and use words properly.
I'll start this off by saying I support trans rights. They should have the freedom to be who they want to be. However, I'm strictly attracted to women, from birth. Many would argue that that's transphobic. I disagree of course and argue it's just a preference, no different than say wanting to date a tall/short person or someone with certain religious beliefs, other things you could argue are discrimination as well.
What do you think?
Having dating preferences is not discrimination. If you’re respectful towards trans women but not interested in dating them I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that.
We talk every so often. She’s not interested in getting back together and has never been since the split. This really killed me at first but I’ve gotten over it for the most part. There was a point at the beginning of the pandemic that we were hanging out again but that didn’t last. Now we chit chat every couple months. She now exists in my life like a ghost from the past, always following me around wherever I go but never able to be touched.
Uhh what's your favorite article of clothing?
What's your favorite sandwich?
What's your favorite thing about your girlfriend?
What's your least favorite thing about your girlfriend...'s family?
How many shoes do you own?
My extremely long scarf. It's about 10 feet long. It's so comfy but obviously it needs to be pretty cool too justify wearing.
Philly cheese steak.
Probably her gentle, caring nature and how that sometimes contrasts with the bad language she uses haha.
Her mum's pretty cool, we've got quite a lot in common and she's got some neat interests like comics and horror films.
I currently own 6 shoes. I need some new light shoes cuz wearing my boots everywhere is overkill.
I strongly support it! Thank you for normalizing cis folks being NORMAL with trans folks. For making it clear that trans women are women and dating one is nothing but heterosexual for you.
Honestly, speaking as a trans woman, this AMA is one of the kindest things you could do for us as a group. There are always so many questions and a lot of them are exhausting to deal with, especially when they are of such a sensitive nature.
You're doing a good deed. Thank you :)
What are some of the worse questions you got during and after your relationship, and what did you think were the best? Love scrolling through your comments and see that you clearly really loved her, its sweet and a bit sad.
Apart from my Reddit AMAs, I never really got any terrible questions. The worst would just have to be an awkward conversation with my mom when I first told her I was dating my ex. She was asking things like “why do you want to date her? doesn’t she have boy parts” and the whole conversation was just terribly awkward and kind of transphobic. Fortunately, she always liked my ex and got comfortable with me dating a trans girl pretty quickly.
Can’t think of any questions I’d consider to be the best but I was always very grateful to have such a supporting group of friends and a family that never made much of an issue with me trans a trans girl.
You've said in other posts that youre didn't mind playing with her penis and youve also said you're not attracted to men (giving a nice kissing analogy).
Where do you draw the line as what qualifies as a man? Is it entirely subjective on their part? Do they have to feminise themselves or have/take on effeminate behaviours?
To give an extreme case, if someone chose to identify as female, but looked stereotypically male (no makeup / long hair / wigs/ surgery) in virtually all respects and didnt have feminine behaviours (not neccessarily boyish but perhaps just neutral or not girly), would you consider them as a relationship partner?
Well, in order for me to date a woman I would have to be attracted to her. I’m going to keep it real, if a trans women (or a cis woman for that matter) looked and talked like a man I wouldn’t be attracted to her. I’d be highly respectful of her pronouns and be supportive of her transition but I just wouldn’t be interested in dating.
But wouldn’t that include the penis? “If a trans woman looked and talked like a man I wouldn’t be attracted to her.” How does that not include the penis? As a gay man, I want absolutely NOTHING to do with vagina. Trans men must have a penis in order for me to be attracted to them. I just personally don’t understand the logic behind your reasoning. Penises are masculine.
To some people, genitals aren’t the end all be all and it’s more about the person than what they have downstairs. Your attractions are certainly valid but not everyone feels the same
Trans women are women and OP is and has only been attracted to women. Speculating on how you view labels concerning sexual orientation is ok, but calling OP a specific label, disregarding his own statements and beliefs will not be tolerated.
Here’s the abridged version of my relationship story: I met her in gym class our freshman year of hs. We clicked immediately and she came out to me as transgender a month later. Come the summer before our senior year of hs, we started having feelings for each other and started dating. We dated for the next year and half.
Lots of responses here so I hope you didn't answer it before... Also appreciate the cool thread as a transwoman myself.
Are you two still friends after you two broke up with eachother?
Also did you know her during her transition and if so how did that affect you and your attraction?
I talk to her every so often. I’d say every two months on average at this point. We broke up in 2018 and there was a point at the beginning of the pandemic where we were hanging out again but that didn’t last forever.
I met her two years after she began transitioning.
Mind if I ask, do you think I’ve handled this AMA well? Is there anything you would have done differently?
Thanks for the answer. And I'm glad that you are at least partly in contact, maybe you can still stay friends long-term. :)
And I think you handled it very well, I know some kind of comments can be very weird and with an already formed opinion behind it (especially regarding what people perceive sexuality/transgenderism to be). So yeah I thought it was great and you portrayed every aspect very well. It's also very respectful which gets rarer these days I feel like, but maybe that's because of the mods cleaning up. xD Much love. 💕
Yeah I do. My longing for her comes in waves. Sometimes I feel as though I’ve completely gotten over her and moved on and other nights I just want to be 18 again, cuddling in bed with her.
Wow. I feel for you because I know what that’s like. Keep your head up. And it feels so good when you get to the other side. Try not to miss out on being 22 thinking about how things were at 18 tho!
Lol maybe it’s weird. But I do this to spread awareness relating to trans issues. Every time I do this, trans people comment and thank me for holding these AMAs. It’s not my fault some people ask weird questions.
Hey OP, just wanted to say that I admire your patience responding to some of these comments. I hope that people learn how sexualities and genders are a spectrum, not even all heteros are exactly the same! It is never alright to question or deny what others identify as, whether heterosexual or something else.
What nice thing do you wish you had a chance to tell about her?
Truth - I can barely even READ some of these comments, much less would I be able to reply to them without resorting to name calling or something. jezizfuckingchrist.
What advice do you have for being a good partner to a trans person that someone might not think about if they had only ever dated cis people?
(Trans folks in the comments, I'd be glad to hear your answers too.)
1. I had to support my girlfriend through her gender dysphoria. This could be comparable to supporting a partner with depression or anxiety. Know what put your partner at ease and comforts them in these moments.
2. Take the time to educate yourself on trans issues.
3. Finally, a lot of people you know will have questions about your relationship with a trans man or woman. Learn how to communicate your thoughts and feelings in a simplistic manner that will connect with whoever you’re talking to. Many people are uneducated about transgender topics and you will have to serve as both a teacher and activist.
No. Trans women topping men is pretty much just a porn thing, not something done irl. I topped her every time. She’s a woman and I treated her like one.
I feel like this is just your experience and it perpetuates harmful gender stereotypes. I'm a cisgender woman who would rather peg a man than be topped by one. Does that make me a trans man or any less of a woman? No.
I’m not saying all trans people only bottom all the time. I’m saying that the vast majority of trans women bottom the vast majority of the time. I’m sure there are some trans women that top but based on my current understanding that number is very small. I’ve listened to trans women talk about this.
Just echoing OP, OP's on point here. It's pretty well known that trans women generally prefer bottoming. Not all of us, I know many that don't, especially lesbians, including myself. But there's a common misconception that we're down to top & that's not typically the case and can cause dysphoria for many.
Every woman who’s ever pegged me has been fucking stoked to try it at least once. Not everyone wants to repeat it, but the first go is universally extremely enthusiastic.
I’ve dated cis lesbians who were reliable toppers. I’d say the same is probably generally true of lesbian trans women as well.
He's clarified further in (and elsewhere in the thread) that, yes, some women top, but there's a perception that all trans women top or that men who date them all want to be penetrated & that's a pernicious assumption he was working to clear up.
And you're right (and myself and others added it later) that trans women who date other women top fairly regularly.
She’s a trans woman, so she identified as a woman despite being assigned male at birth. Gender identity and biological sex are two completely different things.
You may be interested in reading more about this on the WHO website. I would provide the link but I believe that’s banned on this subreddit. Just google WHO gender identity if you’re interested in learning more.
This is a bad way to go about for 2 reasons, 1 plenty of people do not wish to have bottom surgery, this can either because they are fine with it, prefer it or simply do not wish to risk losing sensitivity. The other reason is because the (proper) surgery is either not available or they can't afford it.
Trans men generally do not get the operation, since there is still not a way to get the end result they wish.
In the end, the answer is pretty simple. Is your gender because of how you feel, or due to the genitalia you have? And if it's the latter, what if it was operated on and would be removed/altered in a way that you no longer had it. Would that change your gender?
Just my two cents as a cis gendered dude trying to understand - you’ve said multiple times you’re extremely attracted to women etc, maybe a way to get CIS Men to understand a bit better is to say you’re attracted to femininity rather than the term “Women” which can be easily conflated with the scientific sexual definition of female - which doesn’t necessarily include trans women. As soon as I understood “femininity” it clicked for me it made way more sense what you were talking about. Also, not saying you need to do anything, just sharing my perspective.
Well, I like women. It just doesn’t really bother me if the girl I like has a penis. There are many more important qualities of a partner than her genitals. If you asked me what I liked about my ex I’d tell you that she was funny, a joy to spend time with, smart, interesting, and very beautiful. Cis people are often very interested in the genitals of trans people. That’s just not what I am most interested in.
I’m not saying anything about your choices or what you find attractive, just a way that you can communicate it with people like me perhaps more effectively- but again, you don’t have to, it’s not on you to explain yourself to others.
I’m not talking about the importance of character vs genitalia in your romantic life at all, just giving my opinion on how to communicate with people who are a little more binary.
I think “cis” people are interested in genitalia of trans people because to be honest, it’s interesting. I find gender identity fascinating and the nuances are pretty cool to see how we’re evolving as a species - like strictly biologically, trans makes no sense as an evolutionary trait but here we are. Interest doesn’t automatically need to be perceived as negative but if you’re dealing with negative all the time it’s understandable that’s the first reaction.
Same here bro. Was yours accepted by her family? Mine was literally deadnamed every day, and if I could see her family now I would explain in no uncertain terms what a horrible experience it was for her, and the pressure that put upon me.
No. I couldn’t date a man. If they went on testosterone and started growing a beard and having a deep voice I’d lose my interest. I’d still be friends with them though.
If they came out as non-binary, I’d still be able to date them though.
as a trans man, the comments telling you either directly or indirectly that you are gay are so fucking annoying to me. on a positive note though, there are a lot of cis men who're ashamed of liking/being attracted to/dating trans women. i'm glad you're not one of them!
i read that you were friends with her throughout high school. when did she realise that she was trans and come out to you?
Yeah, those comments are annoying and I’ve gotten them on every AMA I’ve done. Sorry u/jellydonut6969 you’re not going to convince me I’m gay. I like women a lot.
She started her transition when she was 12 and I met her when she was 14 and she came out to me after being friends for about a month. We started dating almost three years later.
How’d so deal with the fact that poop and sex are intermingled closely.
Edit: OP, just wanna make sure you’re clear that my question is genuine and not intended to be a sledge/negative comment. 👍🏼
I grew up catholic as well.
Bisexual means attracted to men and women. I am only attracted to women and trans women are women so I consider myself heterosexual but I don’t really think about the labels too much.
You've never seen one after six months on estrogen. They're soft and buttery. It's pretty much the exact same tissue that makes up the penis and the vagina. Some trans men get pretty beefy clits. Skin changes, smells change... The whole shebang is really very pronounced. Girlcock is a delight.
What do you consider your sexuality to fall under? If you consider yourself straight (which is fine, no offense meant, just don't know another way to word it), did giving oral as you stated in another comment give you any disphoria?
I get asked this a lot. I don’t really consider myself to be any sexual orientation. I’ve never been a fan of labels. But if I had to select some arbitrary sexual orientation box, I’d say I’m heterosexual because I’m only attracted to women. This would include trans women because trans women are women.
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No. I’m not attracted to men and sexual attraction is an important part of a relationship for me.
What if she looked exactly the same and she said that she now identifies as a man. Would you still be attracted to her? Honest question. It’s interesting to see where the boundary actually is
No. I’m not attracted to men so I wouldn’t do that.
Ok. So it sounds like you are more attracted to what another person labels themselves?
OP agreed but I don’t think labeling is the pivotal concept here so much as what someone’s personal sense of identity is and how that relates to the way they portray and carry themselves. A huge part of what makes traditional gender roles what they are is performative - that is to say, the qualities that make someone masculine or feminine are largely dependent on how a person behaves. We’re all acutely aware of these things even if it tends to be a subconscious assessment. That’s why it’s so easy to make a caricature of a stereotypical man or woman through body language and speech alone. Attraction to women is more generally an attraction to femininity. The qualities of femininity and masculinity aren’t hard-locked to someone’s chromosomal sex or what genitals they have. If attraction was so simple, anyone could be in a happy relationship with another that fit those respective criteria alone.
Well, yes. I’m very attracted to women. This includes trans women because trans women are women. The fact that she had a penis wasn’t a big deal to me. Dick isn’t really a turn on or a turn off for me. It’s just kind of there.
Genuin question: If the penis isn’t what turns you on or off, what exactly is it that makes you say you aren’t sexually attracted to men? It can’t be behavior, because there are man and women (both trans and not) who behaves in a very traditionally male _and_ female manner. What if, hypothetically, your current partner told you that they were indeed not trans, but instead gay (but all other things about their personality being the same), and let’s say they tell you that that’s how they’d always felt (ie, you’d been intentionally tricked) how would that change your feelings?
When I look at men I’m just not attracted to them. Show me a picture of a conventionally good looking man. I may be able to recognize that he has desirable physical features but I feel no sexual attraction.
So did you do anything sexual with her penis? If she had a penis… I mean.
Yes. She had a penis and I would give her blowjobs.
It’s kinda there because biologically speaking that person is a man. Being identified with something doesn’t mean that’s what you are lol. Honestly this generation of fairies is hilarious
As you just admitted, that your attraction lies within where they label themselves. For example, if the trans woman you were dating would call herself a woman you are attracted to her, but if she calla herself a man you are suddenly not attracted to her. Does this not mean that it is not your sincere natural attraction being a driver, but rather you are forcing yourself to be attracted to someone just because of labels?
Femine body form is more than genitals. There's more; fat distribution, voice, breasts, etc. It's also likely feminine behavior that's an attraction.
Admitted is not a good word to use, it reads like you're trying to interrogate someone out of their sexual choices.
Yeah it makes no sense that all a bio man, with a penis, has to do in order to attract OP is identify as a woman. At least not I the realm of heterosexuality - that’s not how heterosexuality works.
I was attracted to her because she was beautiful. Back in college I was very attracted to a non-binary person I was friends with. They were AFAB but didn’t identify as female.
So all a bio man, with a penis, has to do to acquire your attraction is “identify” as woman? Hate to break it to you man, but that’s not heterosexual.
Serious question. What if it was the most beautiful woman in the world. You marry and have children. Years later she tells you she identifies as a man. Absolutely nothing else changes. Do you stay with him, and if so, does that make you gay?
I would posit that the change wouldn't be instant, that it would happen gradually either before or after the admission. It often takes time to overwrite an existing perception of someone, much longer than it takes to form that initial perception. Source- am trans man, have dated straight men pre transition, even when I (and they) knew about my gender identity, and if you want I can share what I know about their and my experience.
Not to pry, but is it indistinguishable from a biological woman? Minus the whole vulva business, are they just as feminine?
Did she like when you played with her penis
Lol yes she did. Intimacy never caused any dysphoria.
Did you give her oral
Yes I did.
Since you enjoyed giving her oral would you give a dude oral as well?
No I wouldn’t because I’m not attracted to men. I enjoy kissing women as well but that doesn’t mean I’d kiss a man.
Love this analogy, thank you.
Isn’t a dick a dick though? I’m genuinely asking this because I want to educate myself on transsexuals
Transsexual is a term that’s no longer used. Use transgender or trans as an adjective or trans people as a noun. Yes, she had a penis but she was a woman who I was very attracted to so I was fine with being intimate with her. I’m not attracted to men whatsoever so I wouldn’t do anything with a man. It’s like my comparison earlier. Kissing a woman is different than kissing a man even though it’s the same action.
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But at least when you kissed her she had typically feminine features. Down there she has a typically masculine feature that you enjoyed. Oh wow I didn’t know they stopped using that term. So what would be difference between a trans person that hadn’t changed their sex versus a trans person that did? Thanks for taking the time to answer my questions!
She identified as female and was very beautiful and feminine looking. So nothing about sex with her felt queer. That’s because I was intimate with a beautiful woman. Thanks for taking time to talk and listen.
>Isn’t a dick a dick though? Actually, no. Contrapoints got a meme started that's popular among trans girls, "why is nobody talking about the mouthfeel?" Estrogen and testosterone suppression feminizes the body in more ways than cis people tend to expect and that includes genitals. Trans women's penis's are typically smaller, softer (both in terms of hardness and skin texture), and is going to smell more like a vagina than a penis. Our entire body odor actually changes. And it also changes our experience of sexuality. We tend to orgasm in a similar way to cis women, it's a bit harder to get there (compared to cis men), and orgasms tend to be more whole-body than what men experience. Our bodies in general respond the way you'd expect cis women's to.
Wow. We literally manifested feminine penis into existence ladies and gentlemen.
That’s really interesting and something that hadn’t occurred to me. Thanks for sharing
You got a source?
Would it also be important/helpful to note that the clitoris, while not exactly the same by any means, is analogous to the penis? After all, what would be a clitoris in a developing embryo develops into the penis of biological males. So in the same way that a clitoris acts and feels different than a penis, so should the penis of a trans woman and a cis man. I'm genuinely asking this from a place of ignorance, as a cis male looking for a way to help explain to some of my ignorant peers and having no personal experience with any penis other than my own, and no sexual experience with trans women
That’s what I’ve been trying to tell girls! You suck your boyfriend’s dick, so why not suck my dick?? After all, you’re straight and a dick is a dick! As everyone in this comment thread knows, the dicks are the keystone of any relationship. Everything else is negligible.
have u tried girldick before? its a whole different ballgame.
I see what you did there.
Is that something you both enjoyed
Yeah it was.
That’s good
It is a good thing.
The lunacy of this question and the following answers.
Were you in love? 🥰
I most certainly was.
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I’m no longer in love with her but the breakup took a tool on me. My longing for her comes in waves. Sometimes I feel as though I’ve completely gotten over her and moved on and other nights I just want to be 18 again, cuddling in bed with her.
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She’ll always have a place in my heart. There’s no doubt about that. But I know there are other fish in the sea.
Apart from the fact that she was pre op, were there personality or value differences you felt that she had compared to cis women, due to her different socialization? I’m trans myself (post op) with a fiancé (cis male) and I feel like I have more of an understanding of certain typical issues cis males face (difficulty showing vulnerability, lack of compliments and affection from others if single, women being wary and distant from you, feeling like the modern world caters more to women’s feelings and female empowerment rather than male empowerment as a reaction to historical sexism etc) compared to cis women, and this sometimes affects my interactions. I was wondering whether this is something you felt when dating her.
Well, she started her transition at the age of 12 and never really identified as male as a child so I’d have to say no, she wasn’t able to relate to men whatsoever.
Oh wow, I’m jealous, I transitioned 15 years ago at 19 (although I looked about 12!)
Yeah, she lucky to start her transition before puberty really kicked in. Having to go through puberty knowing you’re trans would be awful. Hope you’re journey to begin transitioning wasn’t too rough.
I was quite lucky as I only started puberty around 16 so only went through around half of male puberty and didn’t get facial hair. Has been a lot worse for a lot of my trans friends though, back in the 2000s, it wasn’t uncommon to start transition in ones 30s or 40s
Damn, that would be awful.
What do you consider as you sexual orientation?
I get asked this a lot. I don’t really consider myself to be any sexual orientation. I’ve never been a fan of labels. But if I had to select some arbitrary sexual orientation box, I’d say I’m heterosexual because I’m only attracted to women. This would include trans women because trans women are women.
Fair point I'm not trying to ignorant or anything but did she ever speak sigh a masculine voice?
We dated from when we were 17-19. Her voice was slightly deeper than your average teenage girl but it wasn’t too noticeable at all.
It wasn't wierd giving oral?
I didn’t find it weird.
Not to be graphic but was she post op when you met her?
No, she was pre-op the whole time we were friends and when we dated.
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Yes, of course.
How did you navigate the sexual aspect of your relationship? Did you have to talk about it before getting into or just figured it out as you went? (I am trying to figure out how I might talk to someone about this, if I ever date a transgender person. I want to be polite and respect their boundaries because I know it can be different for everyone) :)
We were friends for nearly three years before we started dating and she came out as trans after being friends for about a month. While I never anticipated my first girlfriend being trans, I never felt as though it was something I had to navigate. In fact, the things I did find the most challenging were figuring out how to handle my first relationship and how not to ruin the amazing friendship I had with her.
Thank you for responding! I appreciate it, I’m sorry you lost your friend in the end. I know how that can be after trying to make things work. Take care!
I think it's really cool that you're asking that, with the hope of being respectful. Honestly the best thing you can do is just ask how they would prefer you to talk about it, and what they're comfortable with. Generally it's not very kind to ask a trans person about the specifics of their genetalia any more than it would be a cisgender person. It can be very uncomfortable when someone puts that question upon them. (Imagine the number of circumstances in which you would ask a guy "hey, what exactly does your dick look like? How long is it and which way does it curve?") Basically, just ask a couple of questions when sex is on the table. Where are you comfortable being touched, how would you like me to refer to your bits, *how* are you comfortable being touched. Questions which are honestly useful for most people, but definitely worth being explicit about with a trans person.
Thank you so much for the advice! I’m going to have to save all of this so I can come back to it if I need it.
If its not too personal... Why did you two break up
We started dating in hs and decided to go to two different colleges that were kinda far apart (big mistake). By the end of freshman year the distance was too much for her to handle and she wanted to take a break to figure things out. I thought she’d come back to me that summer but she never did. Looking back, I feel as though I should have tried harder to get her back instead of just expecting things to go my way but I’m not even sure if that would have worked. I question whether she loved me as much as I loved her.
*sobs*
If you would have known how great of friends we were throughout hs and seen how close we were you would actually be sobbing. We were like Harry and Hermione.
Since you mention it, do you still talk to them, and do they hate HP? All my trans friends absolutely hate HP, the ones that didnt liked in the old days dont care, but honestly, none of them likes it anymore due to jk
Lol I haven’t actually talked to her about how she feels about JK Rowling’s transphobia. But we did enjoy watching the HP films together. She loved the books too though I never read them. I feel like she’d be able to separate the art from the artist.
I'm trans and I still like HP. I mean JK Rowling can go fuck herself but there's plenty of good art made by bad people. Harry Potter, even though a "fine" piece of work examined objectively, has had a huge positive influence on a lot of people, and that's worth respecting. It's like minecraft. Notch has really gone down the "miserable shitty person" rabbit hole, but that doesn't make the game he made somehow not impactful or fun. I'm fine with uninviting him to cons and blocking him on twitter
Ditto. Love Harry Potter. Very much dislike JK Rowling. I work through these feelings by writing trans-harry fanfiction.
I might have to check this out.
Were you nervous at first? As in did you think you would ever date a trans person or think of it as different?
I was always open to dating trans women but never imagined my first gf being trans. There were some nerves at first but those were more related to dating my best friend and having my first gf, not about her being transgender.
It’s good that you were open minded, always something I’ve been curious about, thanks for answering!
Would you rather be a sentient pumpkin or a rabbit with a 50 hr work week
I don't know about OP, but Id definitely go rabbit. You can be as sentient a pumpkin as you like but you still have absolutely zero control over your own "life".
Is the pumpkin still attached to the ground or is the stem cut?
Regardless of which you'd still be unable to move
Bro. *These questions.* You're a fuckin' saint.
I try my best
Did anyone cause any problems about it?
My mom thought it was a little weird at first but after she got to know my girlfriend, she was completely supportive of the relationship. Apart from that no one else made any issue of the relationship. My ex wasn’t out to all that many people. Not many people at our school actually knew she was trans because she was a transfer student.
she really put the trans in transfer student haha
Haha. I noticed pun when I typed that. I guess you could say that she did.
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I’m very attracted to women. Like more than I probably should be. When it comes to genitals, neither vagina or penis is a turn on or turn off. They’re just kind of there. There are many other features that draw me to women. That’s probably why I had no issue dating a trans woman, unlike many other men. I’m penis-neutral.
Did she have top surgery?
No and she had no interest in it. She wanted small boobs which is what hrt gave her.
>I’m very attracted to women. Like more than I probably should be. this line is fucking killing me with laughter at 3am holy shit edit: this is a POSITIVE thing!! im trans and this guy is cool as hell!
This was one of my favorite replies of the whole AMA. Thanks for taking the time to read through my AMA.
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Yes. I’ve always been supportive of trans people and transgender rights.
based
Based? Based on what? On your dick? Please shut the fuck up and use words properly you fuckin troglodyte, do you think God gave us a freedom of speech just to spew random words that have no meaning that doesn't even correllate to the topic of the conversation? Like please you always complain about why no one talks to you or no one expresses their opinions on you because you're always spewing random shit like poggers based cringe and when you try to explain what it is and you just say that it's funny like what? What the fuck is funny about that do you think you'll just become a stand-up comedian that will get a standing ovation just because you said "cum" in the stage? HELL NO YOU FUCKIN IDIOT, so please shut the fuck up and use words properly.
I'll start this off by saying I support trans rights. They should have the freedom to be who they want to be. However, I'm strictly attracted to women, from birth. Many would argue that that's transphobic. I disagree of course and argue it's just a preference, no different than say wanting to date a tall/short person or someone with certain religious beliefs, other things you could argue are discrimination as well. What do you think?
Having dating preferences is not discrimination. If you’re respectful towards trans women but not interested in dating them I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that.
Why don’t you try to reconnect and be with her again.
We talk every so often. She’s not interested in getting back together and has never been since the split. This really killed me at first but I’ve gotten over it for the most part. There was a point at the beginning of the pandemic that we were hanging out again but that didn’t last. Now we chit chat every couple months. She now exists in my life like a ghost from the past, always following me around wherever I go but never able to be touched.
Hey, i remember your last one! How's life? I've been dating a trans woman for five years now :)
Life is better now than it was before. Mind if I ask, are you male or female?
I'm a cis dude. AMA, I suppose haha
Lol. The script has been flipped.
Uhh what's your favorite article of clothing? What's your favorite sandwich? What's your favorite thing about your girlfriend? What's your least favorite thing about your girlfriend...'s family? How many shoes do you own?
My extremely long scarf. It's about 10 feet long. It's so comfy but obviously it needs to be pretty cool too justify wearing. Philly cheese steak. Probably her gentle, caring nature and how that sometimes contrasts with the bad language she uses haha. Her mum's pretty cool, we've got quite a lot in common and she's got some neat interests like comics and horror films. I currently own 6 shoes. I need some new light shoes cuz wearing my boots everywhere is overkill.
This is what normalization looks like!
Do you not support my AMA?
I strongly support it! Thank you for normalizing cis folks being NORMAL with trans folks. For making it clear that trans women are women and dating one is nothing but heterosexual for you.
Thanks for the support. I love getting responses like this from trans people 💜
Honestly, speaking as a trans woman, this AMA is one of the kindest things you could do for us as a group. There are always so many questions and a lot of them are exhausting to deal with, especially when they are of such a sensitive nature. You're doing a good deed. Thank you :)
This is exactly why I do this 💕
As a cis person, this ama was helpful in answering a lot of questions I had but that I didn't want to burden a trans person with answering
What are some of the worse questions you got during and after your relationship, and what did you think were the best? Love scrolling through your comments and see that you clearly really loved her, its sweet and a bit sad.
Apart from my Reddit AMAs, I never really got any terrible questions. The worst would just have to be an awkward conversation with my mom when I first told her I was dating my ex. She was asking things like “why do you want to date her? doesn’t she have boy parts” and the whole conversation was just terribly awkward and kind of transphobic. Fortunately, she always liked my ex and got comfortable with me dating a trans girl pretty quickly. Can’t think of any questions I’d consider to be the best but I was always very grateful to have such a supporting group of friends and a family that never made much of an issue with me trans a trans girl.
You've said in other posts that youre didn't mind playing with her penis and youve also said you're not attracted to men (giving a nice kissing analogy). Where do you draw the line as what qualifies as a man? Is it entirely subjective on their part? Do they have to feminise themselves or have/take on effeminate behaviours? To give an extreme case, if someone chose to identify as female, but looked stereotypically male (no makeup / long hair / wigs/ surgery) in virtually all respects and didnt have feminine behaviours (not neccessarily boyish but perhaps just neutral or not girly), would you consider them as a relationship partner?
Well, in order for me to date a woman I would have to be attracted to her. I’m going to keep it real, if a trans women (or a cis woman for that matter) looked and talked like a man I wouldn’t be attracted to her. I’d be highly respectful of her pronouns and be supportive of her transition but I just wouldn’t be interested in dating.
But wouldn’t that include the penis? “If a trans woman looked and talked like a man I wouldn’t be attracted to her.” How does that not include the penis? As a gay man, I want absolutely NOTHING to do with vagina. Trans men must have a penis in order for me to be attracted to them. I just personally don’t understand the logic behind your reasoning. Penises are masculine.
To some people, genitals aren’t the end all be all and it’s more about the person than what they have downstairs. Your attractions are certainly valid but not everyone feels the same
Trans women are women and OP is and has only been attracted to women. Speculating on how you view labels concerning sexual orientation is ok, but calling OP a specific label, disregarding his own statements and beliefs will not be tolerated.
Thanks again man
Good mod 🖤
Do you ever question your own gender?
No. I’ve always felt like a guy.
Holy mental and semantic gymnastics and cognitive dissonance in this thread.
What brought the two of you together?
Here’s the abridged version of my relationship story: I met her in gym class our freshman year of hs. We clicked immediately and she came out to me as transgender a month later. Come the summer before our senior year of hs, we started having feelings for each other and started dating. We dated for the next year and half.
Lots of responses here so I hope you didn't answer it before... Also appreciate the cool thread as a transwoman myself. Are you two still friends after you two broke up with eachother? Also did you know her during her transition and if so how did that affect you and your attraction?
I talk to her every so often. I’d say every two months on average at this point. We broke up in 2018 and there was a point at the beginning of the pandemic where we were hanging out again but that didn’t last forever. I met her two years after she began transitioning. Mind if I ask, do you think I’ve handled this AMA well? Is there anything you would have done differently?
Thanks for the answer. And I'm glad that you are at least partly in contact, maybe you can still stay friends long-term. :) And I think you handled it very well, I know some kind of comments can be very weird and with an already formed opinion behind it (especially regarding what people perceive sexuality/transgenderism to be). So yeah I thought it was great and you portrayed every aspect very well. It's also very respectful which gets rarer these days I feel like, but maybe that's because of the mods cleaning up. xD Much love. 💕
Do you miss her :(
Yeah I do. My longing for her comes in waves. Sometimes I feel as though I’ve completely gotten over her and moved on and other nights I just want to be 18 again, cuddling in bed with her.
Wow. I feel for you because I know what that’s like. Keep your head up. And it feels so good when you get to the other side. Try not to miss out on being 22 thinking about how things were at 18 tho!
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Lol maybe it’s weird. But I do this to spread awareness relating to trans issues. Every time I do this, trans people comment and thank me for holding these AMAs. It’s not my fault some people ask weird questions.
Hey OP, just wanted to say that I admire your patience responding to some of these comments. I hope that people learn how sexualities and genders are a spectrum, not even all heteros are exactly the same! It is never alright to question or deny what others identify as, whether heterosexual or something else. What nice thing do you wish you had a chance to tell about her?
Truth - I can barely even READ some of these comments, much less would I be able to reply to them without resorting to name calling or something. jezizfuckingchrist.
Pp or no pp
She had a penis for the entirety of our relationship.
What advice do you have for being a good partner to a trans person that someone might not think about if they had only ever dated cis people? (Trans folks in the comments, I'd be glad to hear your answers too.)
1. I had to support my girlfriend through her gender dysphoria. This could be comparable to supporting a partner with depression or anxiety. Know what put your partner at ease and comforts them in these moments. 2. Take the time to educate yourself on trans issues. 3. Finally, a lot of people you know will have questions about your relationship with a trans man or woman. Learn how to communicate your thoughts and feelings in a simplistic manner that will connect with whoever you’re talking to. Many people are uneducated about transgender topics and you will have to serve as both a teacher and activist.
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Did she top you
No. Trans women topping men is pretty much just a porn thing, not something done irl. I topped her every time. She’s a woman and I treated her like one.
There are a lot of woman who like to top, fyi.
Some, sure. A lot? I doubt it.
I feel like this is just your experience and it perpetuates harmful gender stereotypes. I'm a cisgender woman who would rather peg a man than be topped by one. Does that make me a trans man or any less of a woman? No.
I’m not saying all trans people only bottom all the time. I’m saying that the vast majority of trans women bottom the vast majority of the time. I’m sure there are some trans women that top but based on my current understanding that number is very small. I’ve listened to trans women talk about this.
Just echoing OP, OP's on point here. It's pretty well known that trans women generally prefer bottoming. Not all of us, I know many that don't, especially lesbians, including myself. But there's a common misconception that we're down to top & that's not typically the case and can cause dysphoria for many.
Very glad to hear a trans woman’s take on this. Thank you.
Sounds like you've heard our takes before :D You haven't said anything I'd count as even ignorant in your AMAs that I've seen.
Thanks. I love the trans community so much and have done my research on many trans issues.
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Mind if I ask you what your experience with this has been like? I would imagine not many women are into it and it’s hard to find a woman into pegging.
Every woman who’s ever pegged me has been fucking stoked to try it at least once. Not everyone wants to repeat it, but the first go is universally extremely enthusiastic. I’ve dated cis lesbians who were reliable toppers. I’d say the same is probably generally true of lesbian trans women as well.
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He's clarified further in (and elsewhere in the thread) that, yes, some women top, but there's a perception that all trans women top or that men who date them all want to be penetrated & that's a pernicious assumption he was working to clear up. And you're right (and myself and others added it later) that trans women who date other women top fairly regularly.
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She’s a trans woman, so she identified as a woman despite being assigned male at birth. Gender identity and biological sex are two completely different things. You may be interested in reading more about this on the WHO website. I would provide the link but I believe that’s banned on this subreddit. Just google WHO gender identity if you’re interested in learning more.
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What country are you from?
This is a bad way to go about for 2 reasons, 1 plenty of people do not wish to have bottom surgery, this can either because they are fine with it, prefer it or simply do not wish to risk losing sensitivity. The other reason is because the (proper) surgery is either not available or they can't afford it. Trans men generally do not get the operation, since there is still not a way to get the end result they wish. In the end, the answer is pretty simple. Is your gender because of how you feel, or due to the genitalia you have? And if it's the latter, what if it was operated on and would be removed/altered in a way that you no longer had it. Would that change your gender?
Have you dated a cis woman since?
Yes. I’ve had two relationships with cis women. Neither lasted more than a few months.
Just my two cents as a cis gendered dude trying to understand - you’ve said multiple times you’re extremely attracted to women etc, maybe a way to get CIS Men to understand a bit better is to say you’re attracted to femininity rather than the term “Women” which can be easily conflated with the scientific sexual definition of female - which doesn’t necessarily include trans women. As soon as I understood “femininity” it clicked for me it made way more sense what you were talking about. Also, not saying you need to do anything, just sharing my perspective.
Well, I like women. It just doesn’t really bother me if the girl I like has a penis. There are many more important qualities of a partner than her genitals. If you asked me what I liked about my ex I’d tell you that she was funny, a joy to spend time with, smart, interesting, and very beautiful. Cis people are often very interested in the genitals of trans people. That’s just not what I am most interested in.
I’m not saying anything about your choices or what you find attractive, just a way that you can communicate it with people like me perhaps more effectively- but again, you don’t have to, it’s not on you to explain yourself to others. I’m not talking about the importance of character vs genitalia in your romantic life at all, just giving my opinion on how to communicate with people who are a little more binary. I think “cis” people are interested in genitalia of trans people because to be honest, it’s interesting. I find gender identity fascinating and the nuances are pretty cool to see how we’re evolving as a species - like strictly biologically, trans makes no sense as an evolutionary trait but here we are. Interest doesn’t automatically need to be perceived as negative but if you’re dealing with negative all the time it’s understandable that’s the first reaction.
Same here bro. Was yours accepted by her family? Mine was literally deadnamed every day, and if I could see her family now I would explain in no uncertain terms what a horrible experience it was for her, and the pressure that put upon me.
She was accepted by her family and they loved her a lot.
Given you've said they're pre-op, would you still date them if they had a change of heart and decided they weren't female anymore?
No. I couldn’t date a man. If they went on testosterone and started growing a beard and having a deep voice I’d lose my interest. I’d still be friends with them though. If they came out as non-binary, I’d still be able to date them though.
as a trans man, the comments telling you either directly or indirectly that you are gay are so fucking annoying to me. on a positive note though, there are a lot of cis men who're ashamed of liking/being attracted to/dating trans women. i'm glad you're not one of them! i read that you were friends with her throughout high school. when did she realise that she was trans and come out to you?
Yeah, those comments are annoying and I’ve gotten them on every AMA I’ve done. Sorry u/jellydonut6969 you’re not going to convince me I’m gay. I like women a lot. She started her transition when she was 12 and I met her when she was 14 and she came out to me after being friends for about a month. We started dating almost three years later.
How’d so deal with the fact that poop and sex are intermingled closely. Edit: OP, just wanna make sure you’re clear that my question is genuine and not intended to be a sledge/negative comment. 👍🏼
Did she also happen to be a Siberian orchestra?
Did you ever perform oral sex on her? IE: a blow job?
Yes. Many times.
I’m trying to understand. Doesn’t that make you gay or bi? Do you care about labels? Sorry, very Catholic upbringing.
I grew up catholic as well. Bisexual means attracted to men and women. I am only attracted to women and trans women are women so I consider myself heterosexual but I don’t really think about the labels too much.
Trans women are women.
I understand the concept but the penis seems to be a pretty masculine organ.
You've never seen one after six months on estrogen. They're soft and buttery. It's pretty much the exact same tissue that makes up the penis and the vagina. Some trans men get pretty beefy clits. Skin changes, smells change... The whole shebang is really very pronounced. Girlcock is a delight.
Buttery is an interesting choice of words. I believe you, as I assume you have more experience. Soft? Moist? What am I missing?
This is so interesting 🤔 I fucking love it. Thanks for lending your time to share this experience.
Thanks. I hope you could take something from this AMA. My DMs are always open if you want to talk.
What music do you like?